Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
So it's been way too long since Rabbi Rafael Liban
has been on the show, and he's back with us today.
He is the executive director. He's the big macher at
the Jewish Experience THEJE dot com. If you want to
learn more about opportunities to learn more or express more
(00:21):
of your own Judaism in Denver THEJE dot com. Rabbi,
thanks so much for spending time with us. Appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Always a pleasure to be with you us.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
So I want to do two things with you today,
one of which I already emailed you about, and the
other I figure as long as I have you here,
and one's going to be more fun than the other.
So let's start with the one that's less fun. A
few days ago, a lunatic murdered two people in Washington,
d C. Because he thought they were Jewish. In fact,
only one of them was Jewish, but he thought they
(00:52):
were Jewish. And I've been slightly but only slightly, surprised
and more than slightly disappointed at how fast this story
has gone out of the news. And I'm very curious
as a rabbi, as a teacher, as somebody who your
(01:15):
congregation would look to for not just information, but wisdom
and support. I'm very curious if you have talked about
this at synagogue or outside of synagogue with the community,
and what's going through your mind about it as an American,
(01:36):
As an American Jew, You've always known there's little bits
of simmering anti Semitism here and there, but it just
feels like it has gotten so much worse in the
past couple of years. And I want to know your thoughts.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
It is a really painful event to have to comment on.
And there's really two things to say. One is that
we are I don't think this is news, certainly not
to you, not to any of the listeners. We are
entering what seems to be a shockingly shocking uptick in
(02:15):
incidents of anti senitism of the anti Jewish, you know,
both attacks, vitriol, uh and and it's coming to us
and it is perhaps one could even go back as
far as Pittsburgh where there was a lunatic shooting in
the synagogue there and Street of Life Synagogue many years ago,
(02:36):
and that was a kind of an eye opener for
many of the Jewish people in the in America that
we hadn't experienced things like that and suddenly we were
thrust into a very very very frightening and defensive posture.
And and and nothing has changed, cyt and it's only
gotten much much worse. And on the one hand, it's
(02:57):
it's uh, it's within the context of of I would say,
in general in America, even putting anti Semitism just to
the side for a second, shootings and crazies and mass
shootings became have become more and more and more common,
to the degree to which they don't even make the
front page news. They just they just there's just a
(03:19):
string of them, and they just they've become everyday occurrences.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
To us.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
We somehow absorbed that into the norm, which is unbelievable
in in and of itself.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
And within that the the there's the there's this upswell
of of of aggression, of of of derision, of criticism,
and and you know, that's to.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Take it lightly, of the of the Jewish, of the
Jewish people internationally and nationally, that is that is, it
is just shocking, and and all of that is as
I would say, that's on the one hand. On the
other hand, ross the the truth is that as a
member of the Jewish people, you know, for thousands of years,
going back really two thousand years. Really, this is not
(04:09):
the exception, This is not a shocker. This is actually
the norm. This is part of what we have experienced
in being in exile and being guests, sometimes more welcome
guests than other times, in nations around the world, that
whether it's a Pugram, or it's a Holocaust, or whether
(04:30):
it's just an uptick and anti Semitism, this is actually
what we've experienced rather more typically and in some in
some ways it shocks us here in America because maybe
we mistakenly thought that we were in some sort of
a bubble where this was not to happen. But I'll
tell you something. They also thought that that was the
case in Germany in the early part of the of
(04:51):
the twentieth century. They also thought they were the most safe,
welcoming society that they'd ever been in. That obvious was
in retrospect turned out very much not to be the case.
And I and I hate to make any kind of
a comparison, but here we thought we're in American safe space,
and uh and when that turns out not to be
the case, it may be shocking, but it's also typical
(05:15):
soo typical. Maybe we were mistaken. We thought that America
was going to somehow be the one exception of all
the countries we've lived in two thousand years, that America
was not going to ever turn on us. And I
hope that I hope that we're that that that will
will will turn out to be the case. That America
will will rise up and and and and this and
this uptick will will will come, but more likely and
(05:39):
just in terms of statistically and in terms of our history,
this is what we know to be the case, is
that we've been nation that's been by and large subject
to all kinds of uh, you know, ill treatment to
to put it nicely, Yeah, yeah, for a long long time.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
Not right. And I'm not going to drag you into politics.
I'm just gonna make a comment. I have found President
Trump to be the most pro Israel president, probably of
my lifetime, and certainly recently. It was American policy for
decades to move the embassy to Jerusalem, and nobody did
(06:19):
it until Trump. And I'm very grateful for Trump's strong
support of Israel's He's not always perfect. I think I
think he should give Bbe the green light to take
out Iran's nuclear stuff. But anyway, Trump's been very very good,
but he hasn't, I think, said enough in the United
(06:40):
States about the United States. I didn't really I don't
know if he said anything about that terrible killing, and
I wish he would. I wish he would say a
little more, although it seems like most of the people
who are doing this like, Okay, one more thing and
then you can you can comment on.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
It or not.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
You and I have long thought Jews have long thought
of people who are usually described as being on the
far right as being the primary enemy in modern history,
going back to Hitler right, even though Hitler was actually
a socialist, but he's thought of as being on the right.
And in the US, we think of neo Nazis and
(07:24):
skinheads and so on, even though we don't have that
many of them, but we tend to think of them
as the enemy. But these days, it seemed to me
that the primary enemy of Jews, and not just in America,
is the left. And so maybe maybe it wouldn't even
matter if President Trump said anything, because the people on
the far left hate him as much as they hate us.
(07:45):
And you know, I'm not defending neo Nazis. They're bad,
and I wish there weren't any of them. It just
doesn't feel to me. And they are a risk, but
I don't think they're the biggest risk right now.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
I would common to say that I do, I do
agree with you and that that we're we're we're even
maybe more shocked to find, uh, such a sense of
of aggression against the Jewish people and and you know,
partly couched and as anti Israel. But but it's really
boiled down to the same thing we've just we're shocked
(08:23):
to find that from the left also it was and
again just not not to lean into this comparison too much,
but but the you know, in in Germany in the
early part of the twentieth century, the the perpetrators of
the of the you know, the Nazi Holocaust were themselves
the the elite, the educated, the you know, these were
(08:47):
professors and and they weren't, you know, they weren't sort
of like low class, blue collar you know, skinheads and uh.
And here today we're shocked to find that we would
have thought that in you know, in what what purports
to be the realm of of academia, and uh, you know,
(09:09):
intellectualism and liberalism. We would have thought that there that
there would be utter support for the most uh liberally
you know, permissive culture and community and country in the
Middle East. We would have thought that that that the
academic world of the college campus in America would have
(09:29):
rallied behind Israel and without any without exception. And when
we see the we saw the utter opposite of that,
which is something that has very clearly been the case
where we were shocked to see uh and and and
I you know, story after story after story of of
my friends who sent kids to colleges who you know,
can't believe what, you know, how how terrified their their
their children are on the college campus over the past
(09:51):
you know, number of months. It's it's that that is
a shock, and that is new and and and it
is a type of maybe if if it's an anti
semitism we weren't concerned about in America previously, maybe it's
something we need to be more alerted and more aware,
more alerted to and more aware of more you know,
we need to recognize it. And I do think that,
you know, I appreciate some things about the president. I
(10:14):
appreciate that what he's done in that regard. I think
he's you know, striking at some funding and major universities
and things and the like and put them on the
defensive on this note. Whether I think they should be
things should be, they should be called on, should be
called out, and I do think he's doing that, so
I think he should be credited for that.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
All right, let's switch gears now and talk about the
thing that I asked you to come on to talk about.
I'm gonna you tell me if I'm wrong, but I
think the Jewish holiday that we are about to embark on,
which is early next week, but I'm having you on
today because I'm on vacation the first few days of
next week, so it is probably the least well known
(10:56):
and understood major Jewish holiday. I think you can tell
me if that's if that's wrong. So what's the holiday
and what's it about?
Speaker 2 (11:07):
I think again, I quite agree with you. Shavuos is
very much the least known and least celebrated major holiday
of the Jewish calendar. And it's and it's very shocking
that that's the case. I'll have my theories why, but
it is surprising because that as as my Monardi's famously
wrote that really the basis of Judaism, as as our
(11:31):
faith is, it stems from the events that we celebrate
in the holiday.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
She us.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
I'll just tell you briefly what that is, and I'll
give you my theory. We're probably many of you listeners
are familiar with with the idea of of this holiday
Passover being a celebration of the Exodus. The Jewish people
were an enslaved nation in Egypt uh and through a
series of incredible miracles, God drew the Jewish people out,
rescued them from that Egyptian bondage ten plagues well known
(12:01):
to many Christians and Jews alike, as well as splitting
the sea. And then the Jewish people marched out of
Egypt into the desert, and a short period later, seven
weeks they arrived at Mount Sinai. And then and there
was this incredible event for us, which was the Jewish people,
(12:23):
every man, woman and child of raid, arranged around Mount Sinai,
had the opportunity to hear God speak the Ten Commandments
to us, an incredible event of public mass prophecy, the
likes of which have never been even claimed, certainly never
occurred in human history before. Since it was an incredible event.
(12:45):
It is the basis upon which all communication of God
to manned to mankind relies. All prophecy relied on that,
and that is therefore the basis of Judaism, and frankly,
I'm sure any monotheistic religion, the Christian Christian Janity in
Islam that also fundamentally trace their their own roots to
communication between God and man. They have the revelation of
(13:11):
God now Sinai as their foundation as well. The word
shibuos that the holidays named is called weeks, which primarily
is the date seven weeks exactly from the Exodus is
when we stood a Mount Sinai, and it's the name
for that. It's called Pentecost. Interestingly, in Christianity, Pentecost means
(13:31):
the fiftieth day, the day after seventy after seven weeks,
forty nine days. It's the holidays in the fiftieth and
my Monodie says that really it all boils down to that,
that's how we know there's a God in the world.
That's when we all experienced it. It wasn't just one
person's prophecy. Someone didn't just come out of the forest
and say, hey, God spoke to me and I have
(13:51):
what to share with you.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
God spoke to.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
All of us, every single one of us in mass,
and we were all present, and we all experienced something
uh simultaneously, which is which is really not a uh
an event that could be falsified or that could be
made up. It it has its own internal, absolute uh
(14:15):
sort of clarity. It's proof. It's an entire nation doesn't
experience God's speaking to them all in one shot and
get it wrong. There's no way that if that hadn't happened,
someone could later on come to you and tell you, hey,
you know what happened to your your ancestors that they
(14:36):
had this? If if that weren't true, you'd never buy
it because it's such a powerful.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
So we're experienced just about out of time here. When
does Chivuos start? An end? This year?
Speaker 2 (14:49):
Sunday night at sundown and it's one day in Israel,
two days in the Diasterus. It goes through Tuesday nights,
so you're off for Chivus. It sounds like you will
be uh off the air for the holiday. Yes, and
and it's uh it is. You know, well, what can
people do to celebrate it? There's a there's events in
in in Jewish ennagogues, I'm sure, and I always tell
(15:10):
people that being being Jewish, the people of the book
and anyone who cares about the Bible, the Torah is
a sweet thing. It's a it's a source of sweetness.
And we celebrate it with with cheesecake and blintzes and
and sweet dairy foods and the like, and uh, you know,
we we should relate to it with even though as
as a teva one said and the fiddler on the roof,
(15:30):
you know, being the being chosen to receive the toa
is not always easy. And as we spoke about in
the beginning of our of our conversation there there, it's
not always easy, but it's still sweet. And that's what
was in a nutshell.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
And you'll you'll be pleased to hear that. The reason
I'm going to New York is for my nieces. Bought
Mitzvah tomorrow, Rabbi. Yes, Rabbi Raban runs the Jewish Experience
in Denver the j E dot Com. Thanks uh as always, Rabbi,
I have a wonderful chevalice and we'll talk soon.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Thank you and YouTube all right,