Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Colorado State legislature passed and the governor signed a
terrible bill, Senate Bill three that adds a bunch of
requirements in an interesting time. I won't go through all
of it, but essentially educational requirements that you have to
go through before you can get permission to buy certain
types of firearms. Joining us to talk about what his
(00:22):
organization is trying to do about that particular law. Daniel Fenlissen.
Daniel is director of operations for the Colorado State Shooting Association.
Their website is CSSA dot or. Daniel. Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, so we've only got about five or six minutes here,
so I want to just jump in and tell us
about this lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Absolutely so, after the governor signed the Bill three straight
into law, we knew ats to say that we had
to make sure that this law is challenging the court
on its constitutionality and imposes a tremendous amount of fees,
beer cract nightmares, and a timeline for anyone to be
able to purchase the most commonplace in common use self
defense and home defense firearms that are on the market
(01:06):
today in both in Colorado and across the country, and
so we launched this lawsuit with Mountain State Legal Foundation
representing several of our members as plaintiffs, each of them
affected in different negative ways. But every Coloradan who wants
to protect themselves, protect others, protect our community, and our
freedoms are going to be vatively impacted by this bill.
(01:28):
And ultimately, you know, the Second Amendment is there and
I know you know this and your listeners know this,
to protect our other freedoms. It's not a second class right.
It's the right that protects all the other ones that
our founders wrote into the Constitution and into our founding documents,
and so we knew we had to challenge this. We
partnered with Mountain State Legal Foundation coming off of their
big wind down in New Mexico. They just overturned a
(01:48):
seven day waiting period down there, and we have a
window our backs here as we're walking into this next
fight in the courts.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah, you know what's interesting. I realized the seven day
way the New mex to go thing was at a
you know, a lower court, and I'm sure it'll get
appeeled and all, but that was that was an interesting
data point because you know, it seemed to me that
while the Supreme Court of the United States has been
upholding the rights of people generally kind of at the
macro level to be able to own guns, carry, concealed carry,
(02:19):
and so on, they have also either allowed or refused
to hear cases and thus by default allowing certain kinds
of limitations, of hurdles of stuff like that. And I wonder,
I'm not highly confident you're going to win this case,
but if there's more thinking along the lines of the
(02:41):
New Mexico case that said that, even a seven day win, like,
to me, this is very much in that same category
as a waiting period, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
And the seven day waiting period are getting overturned, is
in the same circuit that Colorado's in, and so that
is an important win for us to show. And in
that case winning, they showed there's a way to acquire firearms,
which is kind of them they're debating right now. Yeah,
a lot of people have said, you have the right
to keep them bear arms, but we don't have the
right to acquire it. Well, this ruling in our own
circuit shows that there's a right to acquire and say
(03:11):
that Bill three is not a seven day waiting period
we're talking about months that it would take for someone
to get through this process. Even when you get through
the process, you still have to wait three more days
actually get your firearm, because that three day waiting period
is selling the books here in Colorado. And so it
is an important win for us, and we are planning
to drive this as high up the court system as
we need to straighten the Supreme Court if that's what
(03:32):
it takes to be able to win this. And we're
not the only ones across the country that are doing this.
Your sister organization in New York, we're the ones that
won the Brewer case, right, and they're the sister association
for the NRA like we are here in Colorado.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
All Right, two quick things. Let me just jump in
here because we got we got two or three minutes.
So the New Mexico seven day waiting period thing just now,
was that at the district court level or was that
the tenth circuit?
Speaker 2 (03:54):
That was the tenth circuit?
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Okay, so that's that's very good. All right. Let me
play Devil's Advocate for a second with you, and for
listeners who are new to me, let me just say,
I enjoy my firearms. I have somewhere twenty five or
thirty firearms. I don't call myself a gun nut, but
I do like them, so I'm gonna play Devil's ad kid. Okay, Daniel, Sure,
(04:15):
you have to go through these hurdles to buy a
couple of particular types of firearms. And yes, it's true
they are popular types, but the law doesn't actually prevent
you from going to buy, you know, all the other
types of firearms. And if you need for some reason,
you want a firearm right away, then just buy one
of the other types. This isn't that big an infringement
(04:38):
on your Second Amendment rights?
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Well, first of all, but second of all, this is
all the common use firearms. The top ten subsfense firearms
for women, all of them would be included on this list.
Top ten home defense firearms right by the NRA, all
of them would be included in this list. Top ten
percent of competition firearms, all of them would be included
in this list. This is if you walk into a
gun store, ninety to ninety five percent of what you
(05:01):
see would be included in this list. And that's why
this is so dangerous. It's going to severely limit the
first time gun owner from knowing how to get through
this process, and it makes the price so high that
it's going to limit people from actually interacting with these firearms,
and it's going to be pushing people to use firearms
that malfunction at a higher rates, that are not as
safe and secure and don't have as many modern safety mechanisms, okay,
(05:25):
like internal safety.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
One quick follow up, then, So, when this bill was passing,
the people who were passing it were saying, well, this
applies to quote unquote assault weapons, which basically means black
guns that scare liberals, and they were claiming that it
won't apply to most pistols. Now, it sounds like you're
arguing that you think it will event end up being
(05:47):
applied to most pistols. If you're saying that almost everything
you see in the gun store, a lot of which
are the glocks in the springfields, and the Walthers and
czs and all these other pistols. So do you think
that when push comes to shove, the people implementing the
law are going to try to apply it to the
most common pistols.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Absolutely, they just should applied when they passed this anything
that is semi automatic has a removable Magazine's Bigger than
twenty two fits their definition all except one model of
the firearm that has been made since the seventies, and
so every gun that fits that model. So that's your glocks,
your springfields, your ars, your aks, everything in between. A
lot of shotguns fall into that category. They are going
(06:27):
to be negatively effected by this bill. And that's actually
why we're hosting the Shops or Freedom event down in
car Springs on the twenty to twenty first. Bring out
all these firearms so people can go out and try
and see what's getting removed from having easy access for
all of petting citizens to be able to purchase these firearms.
So people want to join that event, they can go
to see us in say dot org porge slash events.
We're even going to have a TV gun range run
(06:47):
by our sheriff down there to start introducing kids into
this into the shooting sports. Get comparative that we build
the next generation of freedom lovers, or else we're going
to lose the Second Amendment, and once the Second Amendment's gone,
all our others are at risk.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Actually, BB guns is how I got started shooting as
well as a little kid. Daniel Fenn listen as Director
of Operations for the Colorado State Shooting Association cs SA
dot org and if you go there CSSA dot org.
Actually right on the front page there's the link for
Colorado Shots for Freedom the range event and banquet that'll
(07:21):
be coming up September twentieth and twenty first.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Thanks for your.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Time and we will absolutely keep in touch with you
on the progress of the lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Perfect Thank you so much, sir,
The Colorado State legislature passed and the governor signed a
terrible bill, Senate Bill three that adds a bunch of
requirements in an interesting time. I won't go through all
of it, but essentially educational requirements that you have to
go through before you can get permission to buy certain
types of firearms. Joining us to talk about what his
(00:22):
organization is trying to do about that particular law. Daniel Fenlissen.
Daniel is director of operations for the Colorado State Shooting Association.
Their website is CSSA dot or. Daniel. Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, so we've only got about five or six minutes here,
so I want to just jump in and tell us
about this lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Absolutely so, after the governor signed the Bill three straight
into law, we knew ats to say that we had
to make sure that this law is challenging the court
on its constitutionality and imposes a tremendous amount of fees,
beer cract nightmares, and a timeline for anyone to be
able to purchase the most commonplace in common use self
defense and home defense firearms that are on the market
(01:06):
today in both in Colorado and across the country, and
so we launched this lawsuit with Mountain State Legal Foundation
representing several of our members as plaintiffs, each of them
affected in different negative ways. But every Coloradan who wants
to protect themselves, protect others, protect our community, and our
freedoms are going to be vatively impacted by this bill.
(01:28):
And ultimately, you know, the Second Amendment is there and
I know you know this and your listeners know this,
to protect our other freedoms. It's not a second class right.
It's the right that protects all the other ones that
our founders wrote into the Constitution and into our founding documents,
and so we knew we had to challenge this. We
partnered with Mountain State Legal Foundation coming off of their
big wind down in New Mexico. They just overturned a
(01:48):
seven day waiting period down there, and we have a
window our backs here as we're walking into this next
fight in the courts.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah, you know what's interesting. I realized the seven day
way the New mex to go thing was at a
you know, a lower court, and I'm sure it'll get
appeeled and all, but that was that was an interesting
data point because you know, it seemed to me that
while the Supreme Court of the United States has been
upholding the rights of people generally kind of at the
macro level to be able to own guns, carry, concealed carry,
(02:19):
and so on, they have also either allowed or refused
to hear cases and thus by default allowing certain kinds
of limitations, of hurdles of stuff like that. And I wonder,
I'm not highly confident you're going to win this case,
but if there's more thinking along the lines of the
(02:41):
New Mexico case that said that, even a seven day win, like,
to me, this is very much in that same category
as a waiting period, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
And the seven day waiting period are getting overturned, is
in the same circuit that Colorado's in, and so that
is an important win for us to show. And in
that case winning, they showed there's a way to acquire firearms,
which is kind of them they're debating right now. Yeah,
a lot of people have said, you have the right
to keep them bear arms, but we don't have the
right to acquire it. Well, this ruling in our own
circuit shows that there's a right to acquire and say
(03:11):
that Bill three is not a seven day waiting period
we're talking about months that it would take for someone
to get through this process. Even when you get through
the process, you still have to wait three more days
actually get your firearm, because that three day waiting period
is selling the books here in Colorado. And so it
is an important win for us, and we are planning
to drive this as high up the court system as
we need to straighten the Supreme Court if that's what
(03:32):
it takes to be able to win this. And we're
not the only ones across the country that are doing this.
Your sister organization in New York, we're the ones that
won the Brewer case, right, and they're the sister association
for the NRA like we are here in Colorado.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
All Right, two quick things. Let me just jump in
here because we got we got two or three minutes.
So the New Mexico seven day waiting period thing just now,
was that at the district court level or was that
the tenth circuit?
Speaker 2 (03:54):
That was the tenth circuit?
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Okay, so that's that's very good. All right. Let me
play Devil's Advocate for a second with you, and for
listeners who are new to me, let me just say,
I enjoy my firearms. I have somewhere twenty five or
thirty firearms. I don't call myself a gun nut, but
I do like them, so I'm gonna play Devil's ad kid. Okay, Daniel, Sure,
(04:15):
you have to go through these hurdles to buy a
couple of particular types of firearms. And yes, it's true
they are popular types, but the law doesn't actually prevent
you from going to buy, you know, all the other
types of firearms. And if you need for some reason,
you want a firearm right away, then just buy one
of the other types. This isn't that big an infringement
(04:38):
on your Second Amendment rights?
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Well, first of all, but second of all, this is
all the common use firearms. The top ten subsfense firearms
for women, all of them would be included on this list.
Top ten home defense firearms right by the NRA, all
of them would be included in this list. Top ten
percent of competition firearms, all of them would be included
in this list. This is if you walk into a
gun store, ninety to ninety five percent of what you
(05:01):
see would be included in this list. And that's why
this is so dangerous. It's going to severely limit the
first time gun owner from knowing how to get through
this process, and it makes the price so high that
it's going to limit people from actually interacting with these firearms,
and it's going to be pushing people to use firearms
that malfunction at a higher rates, that are not as
safe and secure and don't have as many modern safety mechanisms, okay,
(05:25):
like internal safety.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
One quick follow up, then, So, when this bill was passing,
the people who were passing it were saying, well, this
applies to quote unquote assault weapons, which basically means black
guns that scare liberals, and they were claiming that it
won't apply to most pistols. Now, it sounds like you're
arguing that you think it will event end up being
(05:47):
applied to most pistols. If you're saying that almost everything
you see in the gun store, a lot of which
are the glocks in the springfields, and the Walthers and
czs and all these other pistols. So do you think
that when push comes to shove, the people implementing the
law are going to try to apply it to the
most common pistols.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Absolutely, they just should applied when they passed this anything
that is semi automatic has a removable Magazine's Bigger than
twenty two fits their definition all except one model of
the firearm that has been made since the seventies, and
so every gun that fits that model. So that's your glocks,
your springfields, your ars, your aks, everything in between. A
lot of shotguns fall into that category. They are going
(06:27):
to be negatively effected by this bill. And that's actually
why we're hosting the Shops or Freedom event down in
car Springs on the twenty to twenty first. Bring out
all these firearms so people can go out and try
and see what's getting removed from having easy access for
all of petting citizens to be able to purchase these firearms.
So people want to join that event, they can go
to see us in say dot org porge slash events.
We're even going to have a TV gun range run
(06:47):
by our sheriff down there to start introducing kids into
this into the shooting sports. Get comparative that we build
the next generation of freedom lovers, or else we're going
to lose the Second Amendment, and once the Second Amendment's gone,
all our others are at risk.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Actually, BB guns is how I got started shooting as
well as a little kid. Daniel Fenn listen as Director
of Operations for the Colorado State Shooting Association cs SA
dot org and if you go there CSSA dot org.
Actually right on the front page there's the link for
Colorado Shots for Freedom the range event and banquet that'll
(07:21):
be coming up September twentieth and twenty first.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Thanks for your.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Time and we will absolutely keep in touch with you
on the progress of the lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Perfect Thank you so much, sir,
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