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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
So I want to just spend a couple minutes focusing
in on today's employment report, which I will say is
not a five alarm fire, but it's at least a
lot of smoke at this point, and it's going to
be interesting thing to watch because.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
In recent so I'm going to tie this. I'm going
to kind of.

Speaker 1 (00:19):
Go back and forth between markets and economics, and for
those who are kind of new to my show, I'll
just I'll let you know that my previous line of
work before I got into this radio thing is that
I used to be a professional financial markets trader. I
was in Chicago most of the time. I lived in
Europe for a while as a trader as well, but
mostly in Chicago, waving my hands and yelling. Also, I

(00:43):
did not work for a big bank. I was not
trading other people's money. Well, I had one investor, but
essentially I was working for myself, trading my own money. Right,
So I wasn't collecting commissions. I was paying commissions, and
I was making a living by understanding markets and understanding
how to trade and not you know, just collecting a

(01:04):
salary from a big bank and doing whatever a bank
was wanting me to do. It was am I good
at this or not? And so I like talking about markets,
and I like talking about economics, and I do think
I have a little bit more relevance experience in this
stuff than probably most people on radio. So I hope
you find it interesting. And that's the context for all this, Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
So.

Speaker 1 (01:29):
It's been really interesting to watch the stock market kind
of grind its way higher, not today, today's down modestly,
not massively modestly, but grind its way higher in the
last few months as the economic numbers have weakened a
little bit, and a couple of the key economic reports
like GDP and employment, when you look at the headline numbers,

(01:51):
the headline numbers for GDP were all right. The headline
numbers for employment for the last few months have not
been very good. But actually if you look underneath at
the actual data and what these what combines to give
you the final number in the report, the reports are actually,
in my opinion, quite a bit worse than the headline

(02:12):
numbers appear. Now, I'm not trying to, you know, say
stuff bad because I want to bash the government or
anything like that. I'm just talking purely economic and market analysis.
So why why do I say, I think the numbers.
I think the reports were actually worse than the headline
when you look at the GDP number, which had something
like up three percent, more than all of the number,

(02:32):
and I'll explain that in a minute if it doesn't
make sense, But more than all of the gain was
accounted for by a let me make sure I get
this right, and increase in imports.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
I always get this backwards because it's.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
But it had to do with trade and it didn't
have to do with actual economic activity, and it was
essentially an artifact of the way GDP is calculated. Right, Okay,
let me make sure I have this right, and import
reduces GDP.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
It's okay.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
So there was a huge decline in imports once the
trade once the trade wars really started, there was a
big increase in imports earlier, and that lowered GDP artificially
as people raced to.

Speaker 2 (03:12):
Get ahead of the tariffs.

Speaker 1 (03:13):
And then when the tariffs actually arrived, there was a
huge drop in imports and that raised GDP. But if
you look at actual economic activity, actual production of stuff
in America, it was down. So in other words, if
if GDP was up by three point three percent, just
the change in imports by itself would have raised GDP

(03:37):
by something like four percent. So the rest of the
report was a negative. Now, let's talk about the employment report.
We had a big employment report this morning, and it
was it was bad. Right. The estimates were for something
like seventy thousand new jobs, and it came in at
twenty two thousand new jobs. And not only did it
only come in at twenty two thousand new jobs, but

(04:00):
the jobs for June and July were revised down by
combined twenty one thousand new jobs. Right, So basically, if
you right, the new jobs in August added to the
revisions in June and July means no changing jobs. These
are very weak numbers. These are very weak numbers. And actually,

(04:24):
I think again my opinion that the report is worse
than it seems, because if you look at where the
jobs were actually created, more than all of the jobs,
more than all of the total number of jobs created
were in healthcare and related social services.

Speaker 2 (04:46):
And it was that way last month too.

Speaker 1 (04:48):
Manufacturing jobs have been down three months in a row,
as have construction, as have mining and logging, as have
wholesale trades. Retail trade was up a little. It was
down in June and up a little bit after that.
But what you find, just as an example again when
I say more than all, and I'm making up these

(05:10):
numbers now because I'm not looking at them, but imagine
that there were twenty two thousand jobs in total created
in the month of August, and that is the number.
Twenty two thousand created in the month of August. Something
on the order of thirty or forty thousand jobs were
created in healthcare and related quote unquote social services that
are tied to healthcare, like maybe people taking care of

(05:35):
elderly patients at home, that kind of thing. So the
rest of the economy outside of that, outside of healthcare,
lost jobs. And frankly, I don't want there to be
more jobs in healthcare. I mean, if people need healthcare, okay,
I'm glad there's people doing it. But it reminds me
of the broken window thing, right, Bastiat's broken window. If

(05:56):
if a window gets broken and then you have to
spend money to fix it. Yeah, of course the glass
company made some money.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
And some people think of that as good.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
Economically, but at the end of it, what do you have.
You have just the situation you had before, nothing has improved. Really,
it would be much better if instead of spending the
money to replace a piece of glass, the businessman who
had to spend that money got to spend it on
some kind of new machine for his factory or another employee,
or something that's actually advancing the world, rather than just
bringing the world back to where it was before the

(06:25):
window was broken. And that's how I feel about healthcare.
It's not really productive, right, It's not. I mean, it's
probably not as unproductive as government, but it's not really productive.
It's not like manufacturing or so many other jobs. And
so when we are having all of the growth in
a non productive part of the economy and actually very

(06:45):
little growth even including that, these are very difficult. Now
what I was gonna last quick thing? I want to say,
The market has been grinding its way up as we've
been seeing news like this, in anticipation of a FED
rate cut at some point, I think, and it seems
like that's happened today, but this is just one day.
At some point the market's going to say, you know what,
all right, having a FED rate cut is nice, and

(07:07):
generally you don't want to fight the FED, but are
we actually going to have a recession here. I do
think it's coming, but I have no idea when trying
to time a recession is impossible.

Speaker 2 (07:17):
If anybody tells.

Speaker 1 (07:18):
You when a recession is going to happen, then it happens.

Speaker 2 (07:20):
Then they just got lucky, although.

Speaker 1 (07:22):
They will cash in on it for the rest of
their professional lives.

Speaker 2 (07:25):
I would just say the economic.

Speaker 1 (07:27):
Data is not strong right now, and I do think
that the primary cause is tariffs. After the last employment
report had some bad news in it that Donald Trump
didn't like. Doesn't like hearing bad news, he fired the
head of the Bureau of Labor Statistics as if she
has anything whatsoever to do with what's in that report,

(07:48):
and she doesn't. The head of the department has nothing
to do with what comes out in those reports. So
he fired her, installed his own lackey, and then this
month gets a report that was every bit as bad
as last month's report. But of course now he can't
come out and blame leadership. And it is kind of amusing.

(08:10):
And you know, I don't want bad news, but you know,
I think I said enough. I think I said enough
about that. Who's he going to fire now?

Speaker 2 (08:17):
Right?

Speaker 1 (08:18):
Here's a silly little story from the Lowry neighborhood of Denver.
There used to be a smash burgher up there in
the Lowery neighborhood. It opened in twenty twenty two, and
this is from let's see, this is from the Denver
Post from their business section. It earned national headlines at
the time as the first Smashburger location to have a

(08:41):
bar in cocktail menu.

Speaker 2 (08:43):
And so it's not there anymore. And here's why.

Speaker 1 (08:48):
Apparently there have been noxious odors coming into the restaurant
smashburg there's a lawsuit about this now starting in May
of last year. Smashburger claimed that sewer odors we're emanating
into the premises from the common areas of the shopping
center that it's located in. Two is it two hundred,
two hundred Quivec Street is the address? So whatever shopping

(09:11):
center is there, I think it's called Lowrytown Center anyway,
smash Burger is being sued by a company called Kimco
KM Kimco Realty, which is their former landlord over there
at Lowrytown Center, and they're accusing Smashburger of breaching their
tenure lease by closing after just three years and not

(09:32):
paying forty eight thousand dollars in rent this spring, and
of course Smashburger says, we couldn't stay. The place stinks
and that's a breach of the landlord's duty to take
care of the premises. And kim Ko says that that
smash Burger is just sort of making that stuff up
because they weren't doing as much business as they expected,
and they weren't making as much money as they expected,

(09:54):
and they were looking for a way to get out
of the lease. The landlords lawsuit, which was filed about
two weeks ago in Denver, claims that, and I'm quoting
again from the Denver Post, either the sewer oders didn't exist,
or if they did, they were due to Smashburger's Greece
interceptor and changes that Smashburger themselves made the plumbing, and

(10:16):
that there was no smell coming from a common area
according to the landlord, Shannon, did you want to say something?
You were you were looking like you wanted to say something. No,
I just didn't.

Speaker 3 (10:26):
I thought maybe Greece Interceptor was an unrecognized character in
that new Maverick movie.

Speaker 1 (10:35):
All right, hey, San, and let me just put you
on the spot here for thirty seconds. I didn't have
you yesterday because you were doing the thing that you
do during CU football season on Thursdays where you get
to hang out and maybe you don't talk much with
coach Prime, but you certainly get to listen in on
the conversation kind of be around all that. How was
your how was your coach day experience yesterday?

Speaker 2 (10:55):
Anything? Anything particularly fascinating? Just a couple of feet away.

Speaker 3 (10:58):
He's great of being in the room with him, and
there's about six of us in the room, and he's
just great.

Speaker 1 (11:06):
As a guy who is I mean, you do lots
of stuff around sports, but I wouldn't call you a
huge sports fan. But as a guy who does lots
of radio and has been doing this with coaches for
how many decades?

Speaker 2 (11:19):
I go back to.

Speaker 3 (11:19):
New Heisel with CEU, and I go back to Shanahan
with Broncos.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
So would that have been what early nineties first for CU? Right?

Speaker 1 (11:29):
So just quickly, just give me a couple of seconds here,
not as a sports analyst, but just as a guy
who does what you do. What makes Prime special for
you compared to other coaches?

Speaker 3 (11:39):
The charisma is off the charts interesting. He is just captivating.
You hang on every word because he does. He speaks
quite eloquently. The flow and the rhythm is fascinating, and
then the stories unbelievable. There's one dom Bo Jackson said
to me, and you're like, what.

Speaker 2 (11:58):
Did Bo say? Say? That's fantastic, all right, that's producer Shannon.

Speaker 1 (12:04):
He gets to do a really fun gig on Thursdays
during cu football season. We got a very interesting Yes, exactly,
we got a very interesting guest.

Speaker 2 (12:12):
When we come back, keep it here on KOA.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
I'll be at the Broncos game on Sunday holding the
microphone for the KOA broadcast on the sidelines. I'm very
excited about that. You know I'm a finance nerd, and
you also know that I'm fascinated with the real estate market, commercial, land, residential,
and I saw a piece over at the Denver Post
entitled apartment landlords facing the fallout from too much supply.

(12:37):
And actually over recent years we have talked about this
on the show. Just as you know myself growing up
as somebody who loves markets, generally speaking, you really you
tend to find the same behavior in one market after another,
and that is you will have a shortage. It causes
prices to go up, and in an effort to capture

(12:59):
the potential outsized gains available, the outsized profits available from
those high prices, a lot of people jump in to
try to produce whatever that thing is, and it ends
up overshooting and you end up with too much supply,
and you go from a situation where the market is

(13:20):
tight and prices are high to where the market is
oversupplied and prices are low. And that kind of seems
to be happening in the in apartments in Denver. What
this particular article gets into that I'm really fascinated by
is the.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
Financing behind all that.

Speaker 1 (13:38):
Because you got to have money to build an apartment building,
and most people who build an apartment building don't have
that money sitting in there checking account.

Speaker 2 (13:46):
They got to go to.

Speaker 1 (13:48):
Either directly or indirectly to investors who are willing to
fund these projects.

Speaker 2 (13:54):
So joining us talk about a lot of this stuff
is Amy Love.

Speaker 1 (13:57):
Amy is a principle at Essex, which is a commercial real.

Speaker 2 (14:01):
Estate finance firm based in Denver.

Speaker 1 (14:03):
Their website says, and I trust them that they're right
that they are the largest privately held mortgage banking company
in Colorado, and the website is Essex RCA dot com.

Speaker 2 (14:15):
Amy.

Speaker 1 (14:15):
Welcome to Kowa. Thanks for joining me on short notice.
I appreciate it.

Speaker 4 (14:20):
Hi Ross, I'm happy to be with you today.

Speaker 2 (14:23):
So can you can you describe to us?

Speaker 1 (14:25):
I want to start really macro before we get to
what's going on in Denver. What is a typical finance
process for somebody who wants to build an apartment building?

Speaker 2 (14:37):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (14:37):
Sure, well, and I'll just start too. I think you
completely nailed it with the supply demand issue and what's
going on in Denver right now, and we'll get into
that later. But the typical finance process someone wanting to
build apartments, you know, they obviously have to select their site,
go through permitting process and everything with the city, which

(15:00):
it is an issue to you know over the past
couple of years in Denver getting through that process is
quite difficult for a lot of developers. But then to
get the financing, you know, you'll find your equity source
that can be through you know, raising money from friends
and family to invest in your project, or finding a

(15:24):
more institutional capital partner to supply you with the equity
and then find.

Speaker 1 (15:31):
So let me just jump in for a second, just
so folks, understand the terminology when you're using the term
equity here in terms of a comparison that most people
would understand. I think what that would be like is,
what's the source of your down payment? Because you can't
borrow one hundred percent of the money from the bank
or whoever you're going to get the debt part from.

(15:53):
You need equity part that's hard cash, so that you
can borrow then eighty percent or sixty percent or whatever.

Speaker 2 (15:59):
Is that right? That's right?

Speaker 4 (16:01):
Ross, Yeah, that's a great comparison. And you know the
down payment portion or the equity portion, people view that
as an investment into the project. So that's another way
of investing. You know, you can invest in the stock market,
you can invest in bonds. Commercial real estate investing is
another really popular way to invest your money.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
Okay, So they raise the equity and then they want
debt for the rest, which is usually the majority I assume.
So they come to someone like you and then and.

Speaker 2 (16:31):
What do you do?

Speaker 4 (16:34):
So they come to someone like me. My role in
this is to find the best debt out there for
their projects. So we work with our clients on understanding
their objectives. That's really important for them and their project,
and then we align that with the best lender out there.

(16:56):
So that could be a bank, that could be a
life insurance company, a debt fund, and there's you know
a lot of other lenders out there as well.

Speaker 1 (17:06):
So typically when you get these first loans, would this
be would this be the same as a construction loan
or is it? Or is it a different thing? And
what happens if you get to what's supposed to be
the end of a construction loan and the building isn't
finished yet, which does seem like there's some of that
going on in Denver.

Speaker 4 (17:27):
Yeah, there's some of that going on. So so yeah,
you get your construction loan, you use those funds to
you know, build your project, and then there's normally kind
of a tail on that loan, you know, term wise,
so maybe it takes two years to build the project

(17:48):
and then you have another year to lease it up
and stabilize the property. What's been going on here is
that most of these projects got built and they're just
taking a lot longer to lease up and stabilize. And
even if they do get you know, ninety five percent leased,
which we consider stabilized, the rents and expenses and kind

(18:11):
of a lot of different hail winds operating against these developers.
They're just not getting to the numbers that they had
thought they would.

Speaker 2 (18:21):
Okay, so let's really get into the nuts.

Speaker 4 (18:23):
Like the loan is overleveraged in a lot of cases.

Speaker 1 (18:26):
Okay, that makes sense, So all right, so let's get
into the nuts and bolts of Denver. So on the
on the residential side, typically people think about twenty percent
down payment at least to not have to pay PMI,
not have to pay mortgage insurance. Is that number similar
on the commercial side, No.

Speaker 4 (18:44):
It's it's typically lower. So kind of in the in
the heyday, the last couple of years or well in
twenty one twenty three, that was really plentiful. Banks were
kind of overloaded with this that's liquidity from COVID stimulus,
so that was really easy to come by and it

(19:05):
was very cheap. So kind of in that period was
sort of the best financing period that we've seen in
a long time. And the kind of the maximum debt
on a you know, an apartment project might have been
I would say about seventy percent lounch to value, So
you need to come up with thirty percent down payment.

(19:25):
Or equity.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
Okay, so you everybody goes into this in some particular
market condition where the average rent for the for the
average apartment of the type that's going to be in
that building is fifteen hundred dollars a month. And you
do your pro rat as based on fifteen hundred dollars
a month, and you put a little wiggle room like

(19:46):
maybe it'll drop two percent and and you know, so
then you look at fourteen hundred and seventy dollars a
month and say, all right, everybody's going to get paid
back and this loan will be fine. And then by
the time you get to to act, not you, but
the builder or the developer gets to filling up the building.
Instead of fifteen hundred dollars a month, they're getting fourteen

(20:11):
hundred dollars a month.

Speaker 2 (20:12):
And now the numbers don't look so good. And now they're.

Speaker 1 (20:15):
Also if you revalue the building, if they were at
seventy percent loan to value, in terms of the loan,
now the loan is a bigger percentage of what the
new value is. So what happens then? Do they have
to put up more cash?

Speaker 4 (20:30):
Oftentimes yes, So we're working on a lot of it's
called a cash in refinance. So in that situation where
the loan now today feels overleveraged because of the dynamics
that you were just talking about, they're having to refinance
the loan either with the existing bank or a new

(20:51):
lender and putting additional passion, additional equity into the property.

Speaker 1 (20:57):
At that point, does the lender really have a ton
of leverage in the you know, like, Okay, you're out
of you're out of compliance with the covenants of the loan,
so you better do what we say or else, or
in the sense does a lender of risk too of
some sort where where the negotiating power between the both

(21:18):
sides is kind of equal.

Speaker 2 (21:20):
What does that look like?

Speaker 4 (21:22):
So the lenders do have a lot of leverage in
this situation because they're you know, for the most part,
in multifamily today. Yeah, there's there's an issue as we're describing,
but most of the lenders aren't at risk of losing
their money because of that down payment, and so, you know,
we're not in a situation where these loans are one

(21:44):
hundred percent of the value anymore. Maybe it's eighty and
that just feels a little bit too risky. They want
to correct that. The lenders, you know, do have the
power in this, and especially as we approach like a
maturity date on the lawn, these borrowers are going to
be pretty forced to do something with the loan either,

(22:07):
you know, work out a modification with the lender, refinance it.
But we've been seeing most banks are really patient with
the borrowers. Banks tend to lend money to strong customers
of theirs and they don't want to you know, they
want to play ball, play nice with them, and so

(22:28):
there's been a lot of patients with that, especially because
they're really not at risk of losing a lot of
money on these projects.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
That makes sense. We're talking with.

Speaker 4 (22:36):
Thought this is a different story.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
But multifamily, oh for sure.

Speaker 4 (22:41):
You know it's it's not easy, but it's not dire
for the lenders.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Or we're talking with Amy Loves she's a principal at Essex.

Speaker 2 (22:51):
The website is Essex.

Speaker 1 (22:52):
R e c A. They are a very large commercial
real estate finance firm based in Denver, but they finance
projects around around the country. What is the scale of
the problem in Denver right now?

Speaker 4 (23:07):
That's a great question. I think in general, there's I've
heard a lot of landlords saying, like describing the leasing
as a knife fight. I keep hearing that coming up,
where all of these projects that are getting delivered, they're
trying to get leased up. They're trying to solve these
problems as far as like getting their property stabilized and

(23:30):
keeping their investors and their lenders happy. So there's a
lot of competition for tenants. So they're offering a lot
of concessions, which is a free rent period which can
be anywhere from four to twelve weeks depending on the market,
so maybe four in Denver in twelve and like a
market like Colorado Springs to try to fill up these buildings,

(23:54):
they're not getting even close to their rents in general
that they you know, anticipated they would. And then we
have another issue kind of operating against these projects is
that expenses have grown significantly since these projects were penciled out. Taxes, insurance, utilities,

(24:15):
everything has has gone up very significantly. So you kind
of have that issue as well, and so.

Speaker 2 (24:23):
Have interest rates.

Speaker 1 (24:24):
Right, it wouldn't surprise me if a refi interest rate
would be a lot higher than the initial construction loan
interest rate. If that was done like early COVID or
something that's right.

Speaker 4 (24:36):
So, yeah, you're describing all these issues kind of operating together.
You know, it all kind of works together like a puzzle,
and a lot of the pieces just aren't aren't fitting.
So yeah, the cost of capital, the cost of debt.
You know, if you originally did your loan a couple
of years ago at four and a half or five percent,

(25:01):
eight or seven depending on yeah, or eight, depending on
where things stand with the property, that that's a very
big difference. And can also you know, cause a scenario
where you're needing to put a lot more cash.

Speaker 2 (25:16):
In, right, and as if that is of a lot of.

Speaker 4 (25:19):
Headwinds against against multifamily right now, right, and as if
that all isn't enough.

Speaker 1 (25:24):
It also appears that the demographics have changed a little
bit and that there's less demand of people moving into
Denver than there was five years ago. All Right, one
real quick thing before I let you go, since since
you mentioned it, I'm also super interested in office. It's
just a funny thing. You're probably aware of this. I
think it's four buildings right next to I twenty five,

(25:46):
west side of I twenty five, near Spear, there's an office,
an older office thing called Diamond Hill.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
Yes, I own some of that.

Speaker 1 (25:56):
I have owned some of that through a syndicated real
estate deal for twenty years, and we should have sold
it a hell of a long time ago. And I
don't know if it's worth anything now. And I'm not
asking you to tell me anything about Diamond Hill. I'm
just using that to introduce the subject here, right. I mean,
Denver has a much lower percentage of people coming back

(26:16):
to work in the office than most cities in America,
in part because we have such a high tech workforce.
Tell me a little bit about the status of the
office market and the and the and office real estate
finance in Denver.

Speaker 2 (26:30):
Sure, so.

Speaker 4 (26:34):
The office is different than multifamily, and that it was
a much bigger issue you know nationwide. Obviously today it
is just pretty it's a broad basis reset essentially. So
you know a lot of lenders had to take back
office buildings and sell them for you know, as close

(26:56):
to the loan amount as they could possibly get. A
lot of a lot of office owners and you might
be able to speak to this too. You know, have
have their building and they have to put a lot
of money into it to keep and attract new tenant
and to keep the property you know, up to good standards.

(27:20):
And that's really difficult to do, and you feel like
the value is half of what you paid for it
and keep putting money into it. Right, So that's been
really difficult for existing office owners to do, and so
a lot of the time they let the property go.
So it's a really great opportunity for new investors to

(27:41):
come in and pick up these buildings at a really
low basis in you know, with the thought that eventually
the office market is going to normalize and they'll make
some money on those those deals.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
Amy Love principle at essex Essex r e c A.
Thanks for doing the same. That was fascinating conversation. Love
to have you back.

Speaker 4 (28:05):
Okay, thanks so much, Rov, all right.

Speaker 1 (28:07):
Thank you, all right. Yeah, So I think that's fascinating.
I love all that stuff, right, I love finance. I
think the real estate market is fascinating. That the multifamily
thing in Denver is really not a surprise. Right, Everything
is working against that market right now. I want to
be very clear about something. I'm not rooting against them.
I'm just talking about what's going on. Just like when

(28:28):
the stock market is going down, I'm not rooting against
the stock market. If I'm talking about a down stock market,
it doesn't make me happy, you know I. So I'm
just noticing this. The Denver Post says Denver has the
sixth weakest market for apartment rent appreciation among major US
cities and has a vacancy rate approaching nine percent in August,

(28:51):
well above the five percent ish vacancy rate range that
most people would consider a balanced market. So it's a mess,
and it's not just Denver proper, by the way, if
you look at the actual amount that is being charged
for rent, which is always a function of supply and demand. Again,

(29:11):
according to this piece in the Denver Post, rents and
Denver are down more than five percent over the past year.
Thornton is seven percent, Aurora is eight percent, North Glenn
and Glendale, right and kind of in the heart of Denver,
but it's its own thing, almost nine percent. So this

(29:32):
is going on in a lot of places, and I
find it very interesting. But the thing with Denver in
particular has been so much building because rents exploded in
Denver for several years, and then everybody wanted to jump
in and try to catch the high rents forgetting or
at least not sufficiently recognizing the risk that, yeah, they're

(29:55):
building an apartment building, and if they were the only ones,
then they're additional supply would not likely be enough to significantly.

Speaker 2 (30:03):
Change rents in Denver.

Speaker 1 (30:05):
If they're you know, one hundred or two hundred thousand
apartments in Denver or whatever the number is, and you're
building seventy five apartments, right, you're not going to change
the rents in Denver. But if you and a whole
bunch of other people are building, and you're building thousands
of new units a year, and you don't have more
people moving into Denver, you are going to create your

(30:28):
own problem. One more thing from the Denver Post. In
the years since the pandemic, apartment construction in Metro Denver
has greatly outstripped the region's historic average of about ten
thousand units a year, with about twenty three thousand apartments
added in twenty in twenty twenty three and about twenty
thousand apartments added last year, according to the Apartment Association

(30:51):
of Metro Denver. So what's happened is you have had
a flattening of demand or even a d increase in
demand along with a massive increase in supply, and then
you add on to that that the expenses of building
and running a building have gone up. The cost of
capital has gone up, whether it's whether it's money for

(31:14):
your equity from somewhere or whether it is a loan
from a bank or a company like Essex. Every single
thing is working against the developers of these apartments, and
I imagine some of them are in a world of
hurt right now. And I wish them well, partly because
if Denver does better, they will do better, and I

(31:34):
would like to see our most important city do better
as well.

Speaker 2 (31:38):
We're giving away a lot of stuff today.

Speaker 1 (31:41):
At some point during the show today, I'm gonna give
away a pair of Broncos tickets for this Sunday's Broncos
Titans game. If you win the tickets and you go
to the game, look for me on the sidelines holding
the parabolic microphone. If you're doing this game. Yeah, well,
I wasn't supposed to. One of the other people who
was supposed to do it ended up having to cancel,
and today ask me if I wanted to jump in

(32:01):
kind of at the last minute, and I said sure.
I said sure, So I'm gonna do that. So look
for me on the sidelines holding that looks like a
either clear up or clear yellow plastic satellite dish. So
yell at me if you see me, if you're at
the game, and we do.

Speaker 2 (32:16):
Know who to blame. Now, if the Broncos lose, they're
not gonna lose.

Speaker 1 (32:18):
And so we've got the so we're giving away a
pair of Broncos tickets. Also, we're gonna do at some
point in today's show the last entries into the Flatirons
Fire giveaway for this twenty six hundred dollars Napoleon Gas grill.
So at some point during the show I'll be doing
the on air giveaway, and at noon today.

Speaker 2 (32:40):
Is the deadline for the social media giveaways.

Speaker 1 (32:43):
X dot com slash koa Colorado, Instagram dot com slash
koa Colorado.

Speaker 2 (32:49):
Go there.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
You'll see the pinned posts right at the top with
the instructions on how to enter. So there will be
a total of three entries given away today, one over
the air by me, two on social media by a
rod that.

Speaker 2 (33:00):
Will finish all our entries.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
We will have twelve entries at that point, and then
at some point next week we will do the final
drawing completely random, drawing one out of twelve chance if
you've got an entry to win one of those, to
win a twenty six hundred dollars gas grill. And then
toward the end of the show, I'm very excited him
to have Kevin Fitzgerald with me and he's he is
a veterinarian who is a stand up comedian. I've seen

(33:26):
him a couple of times that comedy works Downtown, including
opening for Craig Ferguson. Really really funny dude who just
had an unbelievable interesting life, like doing security for the
Rolling Stones and the Who and as you Do, as
You Do, and it is such a fascinating guy. And
he's got a new book out called It Started with

(33:46):
a Turtle. It Started with a turtle. That was his
first pet, with a little turtle Ninja. No, this was
well before there were the teenage mutant ninja turtles. They
came around later. He probably would I had one of
them as a pet as well if he could have. Anyway,
Kevin's gonna join me in studio for the last segment
of the show, and we're also going to then give
away a pair of tickets to see him at comedy

(34:09):
works downtown on Sunday evening.

Speaker 2 (34:13):
I know not everybody goes to Sunday.

Speaker 1 (34:15):
Evening shows, but at seven o'clock it's not a late show,
and we'll have some free tickets to give away. So
we're giving away a lot of stuff on today's show. Now, earlier,
when I wasn't doing my show, I overheard some new
host doing a show and he was talking about somebody
in Canadia holding a canithe and I was very confused

(34:35):
about all this, and so joining me to talk about
his own radio hosting is a man who is wearing
a Denver Broncos number thirty seven jersey, which must be
for our first round draft pick RJ.

Speaker 2 (34:51):
Hard Oh was he first round?

Speaker 1 (34:53):
No, he might not have been first round, but our
draft pick running back RJ. Harvey, who you will see
in the Broncos game on So who wears number thirty seven.
So this new radio host that I'm very very pleased
to interview for a minute or two here and learn
about the canife in Canadia. His name is Dragon Redbeard.
Welcome host, Dragon, Hi there, Hi there. Why are you

(35:15):
wearing an RJ. Harvey number thirty seven jersey?

Speaker 5 (35:18):
Well, it's a thirty seven just happens to be my number.
Oh that's your number, not R. J. Harvey's number.

Speaker 2 (35:23):
Well, I mean sure he can copy you from time
to time.

Speaker 5 (35:26):
Yeah, he can have it every Sunday for the next
you know, eighteen weeks, hopefully twenty weeks, twenty one.

Speaker 2 (35:32):
So whose name is on the back of the jersey
that you're wearing? My name? Turn around? Let's it.

Speaker 1 (35:36):
Yes, it says dragon on the back of So what
that's just a number. When people ask you.

Speaker 2 (35:41):
Like a random number, you'll say thirty seven. Thirty seven.

Speaker 5 (35:44):
Yep, really, I have to whenever we do the timed
texting contest, yeah, and I this for my head goes
first and I have to stop pause, pick a different
number because we may not be passed. We may be
passed it, we may not be remotely.

Speaker 1 (35:59):
Okay, right, And usually for me, even though it's not
a I either pick a prime number or I pick
forty two because it's the answer to the ultimate question.
My number in college, for the brief time that I
was on the football team in college, was ninety four.

(36:19):
But I don't really use that number for anything. It's
not like thirty seven for you. So what is up
with a canithe in Canadia.

Speaker 2 (36:25):
Well, I was.

Speaker 5 (36:26):
Filling in for our friend and neighbor and co host
Michael Brown for the situation with Michael Brown on six
thirty K How Plug Plug Plug.

Speaker 2 (36:35):
Did we do well?

Speaker 5 (36:36):
On Friday's a segment called taxpayer relief Shots. It's a
defensive use of firearms, right, if a bad guy is
breaking into your home, you kill said bad guy with firearm.
It doesn't seem to be in the media as much
as it should, these defensive uses, so we decide to
create an entire segment out of it, taxpay relief Shots.

(36:57):
And apparently this one was an international taxpayer leaf shot
from Canadia where a guy was breaking in with a canife.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
I thought everybody in Canadia was super nice. I didn't
know that anybody in Canadia would ever do anything mean,
not all of them. Apparently not all of them? And
how many? So you weren't just going back and forth
with Brownie over there? Brownie wasn't there? You were hosting,
correct while you were sitting in the control room running
the board at the same time.

Speaker 2 (37:26):
Yeah, how many times have you done that? A couple
of half a dozen? Maybe?

Speaker 1 (37:30):
Do you dislike it? Tolerate it? Like it or love
it along that spectrum.

Speaker 5 (37:38):
Unlike some hosts which I'm not going to name or
dog or anything on this, but it's something down on
the third floor in the FMS that we learned to do.
Run your own show, and you run your own board.
That's just the nature of the beast down there on
the FMS. Granted, we do get more breaks quote unquote
with the songs plus the commercial blocks, and then we

(37:58):
do our talk segments, so it is a little bit
more difficult to do a full eighteen to twenty minute
talk segment, sure, on your own, but it's possible and
it's it's done. But that wasn't You didn't answer my question,
how much do you like it? It's fine, it's fine. So
you wouldn't necessarily want to do it every day, but
you don't mind doing it once in a while. Is

(38:19):
that about right?

Speaker 1 (38:20):
Yeah? Okay, very very interesting, and I will I don't
I don't know whether you were like slightly insulting me there,
but I would like to say that I don't know
how to run a board, and I would like to right,
you would like I would like to back here. Yeah,
I'm not saying that I want every day to be
running a board and doing the show. But this serious now, Like,

(38:42):
what if there's a some issue, whether traffic something where
I'm here to do a show and my producer is late.
Now we have a few we're kind of a big
operation here, and there's usually enough people around to kind
of help and cover. But I would like to be
able to.

Speaker 5 (38:57):
Or what if there's a worried about Shannan killing over Yes,
out of all of us, yeah, he's probably the nearest
one then, or or a Rod lives quite far away. True,
So what if it's going to be a rod and
he gets stuck on I twenty five right because he's
got the deafeit the longest drive.

Speaker 1 (39:16):
So I would like to learn to run to run aboard.
So maybe you can train me up on that one day.

Speaker 5 (39:20):
You push that button right there, whish one, that one
right there, that one, and then that one right there.

Speaker 2 (39:26):
Okay, I think I can do that. You're good, all right,
I'll tell you what. We've got a ton of stuff
to do still on the show. One thing I want
to talk to you about when we come back is
a lawsuit.

Speaker 1 (39:37):
Against a law that bans cultivated meat. Here's a fun
listener text Ross it took me four days to reply
to the Gill Grill giveaway sweepstakes on X, I replied
about ten minutes ago. I'm wondering if I lost my
entry because I took four days to reply. I don't
really know what you mean. All I know is if
you go to X dot com slash koa Colorado or

(39:58):
instagram dot com slash k away Colorado, you can do
whatever the instructions say to do to try to qualify.

Speaker 2 (40:05):
For an entry.

Speaker 1 (40:06):
The deadline is noon today and producer A Rod will
randomly pick one on X and one on Instagram too,
And so I don't think you've missed anything, if that's
what you change.

Speaker 5 (40:19):
Diving a little bit deeper into a Rod's little list
of winners that we have, there is a blank space
for last week's X winner, so that maybe you Okay,
So he just hasn't updated yet because you didn't reply
until just now.

Speaker 2 (40:33):
The other thing is, and I this is funny. A
listener says r J.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
Harvey is actually changing as Jersey to number twelve, And
that's true. I actually said that I told that story
on the air the other day, that r J Harvey
is changing from thirty seven which he's been borrowing from
Dragon to number twelve. And I think now I understand
that Dragon has the number. I think it's because r. J.
Harvey felt bad about infringing on a number that Dragon
has has kind of felt proprietary about, probably for longer

(41:01):
than r J.

Speaker 2 (41:01):
Harvey has been a lot.

Speaker 5 (41:02):
I won't say that he didn't pay me for it,
so that's why he had to change his number.

Speaker 1 (41:06):
That makes sense, That makes perfect sense. Let me tell
you about a lawsuit. Was trying to get the lawyer
on this thing, but I was unable to get I've
had him on the show a couple times before. Actually,
a guy named Paul Sherman from Institute for Justice. I
absolutely love Institute for Justice. So I actually I had
someone from I think it was Upside Foods on the
show a year or two ago about their cultivated meat.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
They're doing cultivated seafood, by the way.

Speaker 1 (41:33):
So basically what they do is they take actual cells
from whatever animal they're trying to create the meat of,
and then they reproduce them using whatever you know biological
process within a lab to grow chicken meat or beef
or shrimp or fish or whatever it is that the
seafood is that they're doing, they're actually working on producing.

(41:53):
And this is from the Institute for Justice's website that
they have the company called there's a company called wild
Type as one word wild Type, that wild Type is
focused on seafood. And apparently these guys have succeeded in
producing sushi grade cultivated salmon, and they had to put

(42:17):
all their food through all kinds of safety assessments, and
both companies got approval from the FDA to distribute their
cultivated meat products across the country. Now, I'm not looking
to debate with you whether you want to eat it
or not. I will just say I am happy to
try it, and if it's very good, then I'm happy

(42:39):
to eat it at least as long as it's cheaper
than the other stuff. I will not pay more for
like a virtue signal or whatever else it might be
to have cultivated chicken instead of regular chicken. And I
say that as somebody who likes animals, and there is
some upside for me. There is legitimately some upside for
me in thinking, hey, I'm eating this without killing an

(43:01):
animal that has value.

Speaker 2 (43:02):
Really, I'm not being sarcastic. That has some.

Speaker 1 (43:04):
Value to me, but not enough value that I'm willing
to pay more than one percent more or something like that.
It's just money is too hard to come by. I
need money to put my kids through school. I need
money for my retirement. Again, I mean totally serious, none
of this sarcasm. So while there is some psychological upside
for me to eat something without killing an animal, it's

(43:26):
really not enough upside that I'm willing to pay more
for it.

Speaker 5 (43:29):
But for clarification, you would pay more for it once
to try it, but not continuously.

Speaker 2 (43:33):
Yeah, yeah, okay, yeah you what about you? Yeah, I'll
try it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:37):
So anyway, so Texas passed a law and let me
just go go find this thing here. So remember so
Texas has lots and lots and lots of cattle all
right in Texas Longhorns, that's their state, you know, college
football team, So lots of cattle, and they don't want
the competition from this cultivated meat. So in Texas they

(43:58):
passed a law banning cultivated meat. And let's see, I
don't know if you're you're certainly not allowed to make
it there, but I think you're not allowed to sell
it there. Yeah, you're not allowed to sell cultivated meat
in Texas. So this is a law that is obviously unconstitutional. It's,

(44:20):
in my opinion, completely obviously unconstitutional. They aren't making, as
far as I can tell, a safety argument, and even
if they were to try to make it, they would
lose because of federal preemption because the FDA has already
said this stuff is safe. So in any case, the
Institute for Justice is fighting back. They filed a lawsuit

(44:44):
along alongside these two companies, Wild Type and Upside Foods.
They're suing Texas to end the ban on the sale
of cultivated meat. I assume they're going to win this lawsuit.
I just don't know how long it's.

Speaker 2 (44:55):
Going to take.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
I do think that the Attorney General Texas, who is
a guy who I think is quite corrupt actually, and
I really don't like Ken Paxton, but he's and also,
this is a guy who's been for years just bashing
people who are getting divorced, and then in the meanwhile
he was cheating on his wife and then they I
think they got divorced. So I just don't like Ken

(45:18):
Paxton at all. But he's running for Senate, so I
don't think he's going to back down because he's gonna
want to get the hardcore conservative base in Texas to
support him over the incumbent Senator John Cornyan when it
comes to the Republican.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
Primary in Texas for US Senate.

Speaker 1 (45:33):
In any case, I wish the Institute for Justice lots
of luck in destroying the stupid Texas law as quickly
as possible. When you eat something that was either expectedly
or unexpectedly disgusting, sometimes you'll lead a disgusting thing just
to say you did, just to like on a dare,
and then you'll want to have something to wash that
flavor out of your mouth. And so that is as

(45:55):
Dragon said, that was kind of the musical version of
the palette cleanser to try to get Neil Young out
of our brains. I would just like to point out
one really unimportant thing, but since we're all friends, I
need to mention this to you. When the internet's very smart,
the internet tracks you when it knows what you want
and knows what you're thinking about. It knows what you're shopping,

(46:16):
and knows everything. The internet knows everything about you, and
in a very creepy way, really and so quite frequently
when you are online in almost any place online. It
will serve up and add to you based on something
that it thinks you want, it thinks you're thinking about,
it thinks you might need.

Speaker 2 (46:34):
And I noticed that on my kind of.

Speaker 1 (46:37):
Usual homepage here on the computer that I use in
the studio, well, on my laptop, I mean that I
bring into the studio, and usually the page that just
opens when I open a new tab and my web
browser is MSN, and it's that's fine. It's got a
lot of different news articles and I kind of just
use that as a launching whatever. And at the top left,

(46:59):
they have this rectangular thing that just scrolls through various
news stories and then every once in a while puts
up an AD, and of course it's an AD for
something that they think you want. And I would just
like to tell whoever in the Internet is listening to
me right now and putting these ads in my feed.
I'm not exactly sure why this ad has shown up,

(47:22):
and it is.

Speaker 2 (47:23):
I'll just read it to you.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
Granger, you know, like Granger is a big industrial supply company.
Granger handheld dust pan metal twelve inches wide, twelve inches deep,
black model SW three six nine, and it's a picture
of a black dust pan.

Speaker 5 (47:40):
It could possibly be that you're on the same ip
as the rest of the building, which might be Irbie
could have been searching for something.

Speaker 2 (47:48):
Maybe yeah, okay, it does connect. It does connect to.

Speaker 1 (47:52):
The iHeart wireless while I'm here, And certainly somebody in
this building might have been looking for a dustpan at
some point.

Speaker 5 (47:59):
That could be I'd be less shocked if it was
something to clean your legs.

Speaker 1 (48:05):
Usually in the last few weeks, I have done the
giveaway for the Flatirons Fire Barbecue grill entry in the
eleven o'clock hour. I think I would like to do
it in the ten o'clock hour today, meaning I would
like to I would like to do it now and
give some folks who live listened in the ten o'clock
hour a chance to win the last on air entry.

(48:26):
And there will only be twelve entries given away in total.
So this is and today is the last three one
I'm going to do right now. Another two at x
dot com slash koa Colorado, Instagram dot com slash Koa Colorado.
Those have a deadline of about an hour and twenty
minutes from now at noon today.

Speaker 2 (48:42):
So I want to do the on air giveaway now,
in the.

Speaker 1 (48:45):
Eleven o'clock hour, I will actually be giving away a
pair of tickets to this Sunday's Broncos game, the Broncos Titans.
I heard Chad Bauer mention that the Broncos are somewhere
around a touchdown favorite, so I went to look it up.
There eight and a half right now, at least on
the one. I forget which app it was that I
looked on about eight and a half right now. So
I'll give away Broncos tickets in the next hour. But

(49:05):
right now, what I want to do is give away
one entry of the There will only be total of twelve.
We've done nine already, so three today, one on the
air right now.

Speaker 2 (49:15):
The winner in the eventual drawing.

Speaker 1 (49:18):
Which we will do next week, will get thanks to
Flat Irons Fire, the winner will win a twenty six
hundred dollars Napoleon barbecue grill. This thing is absolutely gorgeous.
Napoleon is a high end brand of barbecue that I
like a lot. In fact, when I was doing my
own research into barbecue grills several years ago, I found

(49:38):
Napoleon and I bought one. So this is the same
brand of barbecue grill that I have. I think they're
really really good. Now, Dragon, since here the boss, how
do you want to give away these tickets?

Speaker 5 (49:47):
We'll do a text because that seems to be pretty
easy and everybody likes to do it at a delayed time. Okay,
the people that are on the stream, we'll be able
to get to it. Since you've put me on the spot.
Here will do your first and last name, your email,
and your favorite grilled food.

Speaker 1 (50:03):
Nice, all right, So that's all you're gonna need. So
here's the deal. As I'm speaking, it's ten forty Why
don't we say ten forty three and forty three snow
and thirty seven seconds? Because Dragon has a jersey number
thirty seven, ten forty three and thirty seven seconds text
number on three Text number three at five six six

(50:24):
nine zero, and you need to include your full name,
first and last name, your email address, and your favorite
grilled food. Remember there are no wrong answers. There's a
right answer, but there's no wrong answers. Ten forty three
and thirty seven seconds textra number three at five six
six nine zero. With all that stuff will win the

(50:47):
last on air entry into the Flatirons Fire giveaway.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
All right, let me move away.

Speaker 1 (50:52):
From politics and economics and stuff for a little bit
and talk about something else.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
I think Dragon sent.

Speaker 1 (50:57):
Me this story maybe, and and I thought it was
quite interesting. It relates to a survey done by a
group called Talker Research, and it's about overthinking, and in particular,
it's it's about overthinking during shopping decisions. And I'm just
going to kind of throw myself under the bus here
for a minute, kind of sorta. And much of this

(51:18):
is about how much time people spend at the supermarket. Now,
I probably spend much longer at the supermarket than I should.
And for me, I will say I enjoy it because usually,
not always, but usually when I'm at the supermarket, I
remember to bring earbuds and I just walk around listening

(51:38):
to something, so half my brain is on whatever I'm
listening to. When half my brain is on whatever I'm
shopping for, the other thing is that And my wife
understands this, And my wife is not like this at all,
all right, And neither is the kid who still lives
at home, not like this at all. My goal when
I go to the supermarket is that unless there's something

(52:03):
that my wife tells me she must have that day.
And also excluding milk, because if you need milk, you
need milk, and milk is not always on sale. My
goal is to be able to get out of the
supermarket without.

Speaker 2 (52:20):
Having bought anything that was not on sale.

Speaker 1 (52:25):
Right, every I want everything I buy at the supermarket
to have been on sale, everything, except if you need milk,
or if the wife says I must have this now,
and it's a particular thing that isn't on sale, but
it's not worth the brain damage of having the wife
saying should have bought it anyway.

Speaker 5 (52:43):
I mean, I give you credit for trying to do that,
and most I'm sure you mostly succeed.

Speaker 2 (52:46):
Yes, I do.

Speaker 5 (52:47):
If you go to King Supers, yeah, nearly everything has
that King Supers card discount.

Speaker 2 (52:52):
So I wouldn't say nearly everything, but a lot of
a lot of things, a lot of things.

Speaker 1 (52:57):
And that, by the way, you know, well sells and
I think more food than any other chain in America.
I think they even sell more than Kroger's, which owns
King Supers. But what I find is that if you
catch something on sale at King Supers, for example, breakfast cereal, right,
it's much cheaper than Walmart, much cheaper. And I don't

(53:18):
really understand why Walmart sells so much stuff because.

Speaker 2 (53:23):
I don't find their prices that good.

Speaker 1 (53:25):
On some things they are, but overall, I guarantee you
that I would spend more at Walmart than I did
at King Supers because so little goes on sale at Walmart,
and the regular prices at Walmart are well, they're probably
a little bit lower than the non sale King Supers prices,
but a lot higher than the sale King Supers prices anyway.

(53:45):
So I'll be walking down the aisle and I'll be
looking for this thing or that thing, and I will
take some time to find the thing that is, you know,
what I want to eat or what I think my
family wants to eat, but also on sale.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
But what I found in this survey that drove me
kind of crazy. One more quick question. Yeah, sure.

Speaker 5 (54:01):
Now do you only purchase things that are on your
list that are on sale or do you buy something
that's on sale because it's on sale because now you're
actually spending more you don't need it, Okay, like you're
Olive Oil.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
Had a fabulous question. Yeah, fabulous question. I will absolutely positively.

Speaker 2 (54:18):
Buy something that's not on my list if it's.

Speaker 1 (54:21):
On sale as long as I am highly confident that
it will be used.

Speaker 5 (54:25):
Oh, be used. Not that you need, but will be used. Right,
you're olive oil. You don't need a thirteenth bottle of
olive oil.

Speaker 1 (54:33):
Oh no, no, if I already have twelve, I'm not
going to keep loading up like that. Okay, all right,
but let's say there was some Let's say I know
I only have one bottle of pasta sauce left at home.
Pasta sauce is not on the list, and there's some
fancy schmancy pasta sauce that's eight dollars a bottle, but
they've got buy one, get one free. I'll get two

(54:54):
bottles because I know we'll use it.

Speaker 5 (54:57):
And because you're always searching for the thing that's on sale,
you're not very brand loyal.

Speaker 2 (55:04):
No, I'm not.

Speaker 1 (55:05):
Okay, so at least not on There's probably some things
where I'm kind of brand loyal, but I'm trying to
think what that would even be.

Speaker 2 (55:13):
So no, we'll take your pasta sauce.

Speaker 5 (55:14):
For example, your normal pasta sauce is three ninety nine,
and you find something that's the fancy schmancy one on
sale for four fifteen.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
Well, it's on sale, it is cheaper than what it
normally is.

Speaker 5 (55:25):
Yeah, you're gonna get the fancy smancy one since it's
on sale, you're going to get your regular one, which
is sixteen cents cheaper.

Speaker 2 (55:31):
I'll buy the fancy one for sure every time. Now
you're spending more.

Speaker 1 (55:35):
I know, I know, but I do think that stuff
is better and worth more. Okay, but it's not worth
twice as much, gotcha. Yeah, So anyway, in this survey.
In this survey, they talk about people at the supermarket
spending and this is really hard for me to fathom.
An average of four minutes per item that they buy
at the supermarket, and I cannot imagine that.

Speaker 2 (55:56):
Now.

Speaker 1 (55:56):
Look, I am a much slower supermarket shopper than I
am a shopper of almost anything else.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
Like dude, I will.

Speaker 1 (56:05):
I will take almost as long to figure out which
okay olive oil to buy as I would take to
buy a freaking car.

Speaker 2 (56:13):
I'm slow in the supermarket in general.

Speaker 1 (56:16):
In life, I'm a pretty fast decision maker, and part
of that comes from what I used to do for
a living.

Speaker 4 (56:21):
Right.

Speaker 1 (56:21):
I used to be an options trader on the trading
floor in Chicago. And you have to make a decision
about whether you want a trade or not typically within
about two seconds, right, a multi multi thousand dollars decision,
And you don't really think about it that way when
you're making the trade, even though when you know you
buy twenty options at two dollars each two dollars means

(56:44):
two hundred dollars, you buy twenty of them, you're you're
paying four thousand dollars for those options, or you're selling
options for four thousand or six thousand or eight dousand.

Speaker 2 (56:52):
You never really think about the nominal cost of that, but.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
Still you really are spending four thousand dollars. And that's
a decision you have to make in a second or
two seconds.

Speaker 2 (57:01):
When I'll spend much longer than that.

Speaker 1 (57:04):
Deciding whether I want to buy the sixteen ounce thing
of olive oil for such and such a price or
the twenty four ounce thing of olive oil for some
other price. And then I will think, all right, which
is cheaper per ounce? And then if are they really
the same? And if in which case I'll just buy
the one the cheaper per ounce, And if they're if
they're really different in terms of quality, how much more
am I willing to pay. I'm telling you way too

(57:25):
much about me, because I want to ask you about you.
Do you consider yourself an overthinker in the supermarket? Do
you consider yourself an overthinker when it comes to shopping generally? Like,
I'm not an overthinker when it comes to clothes, right,
I'll go in, I'll find a shirt I like, and
I'll buy it and I leave because I hate clothes shopping.
I don't find it relaxing. I write, I actually find

(57:46):
supermarket shopping kind of relaxing, it says, I don't know why.

Speaker 2 (57:50):
But do you consider yourself an overthinker.

Speaker 1 (57:54):
When it comes to the supermarket specifically shopping more generally?
This survey by Talkers found that the average person spends
four minutes deliberating each item at.

Speaker 2 (58:07):
The grocery store.

Speaker 1 (58:08):
So I gotta say, I don't believe that. I don't
believe it. Because if you need milk or eggs, well,
eggs are hard these days because they're so expensive and
there's a lot of different kinds, so you might spend
a little time there. But milk, what do you have
to think about? You got to think about are you
buying one skim one percent, two percent or whole milk.
And just for the record, please don't ever buy skim milk.

Speaker 2 (58:34):
What's wrong with you? It's just just hoigh water.

Speaker 1 (58:39):
Just buy water and put a little like white paint
in it and you're done and you save yourself a
bunch of money. Don't ever buy skim milk anyway. Uh,
you got that decision? And then what else you and
you already know what you want. It's not like you're
gonna go to the supermarket and think about it when
you're there. You know you're gonna buy two percent milk
because you always buy two percent mil So what's your decision?

(59:01):
Then you're going to buy this the supermarket brand or
the fancy brand or the organic and don't you know what,
don't don't waste your money on organic either.

Speaker 2 (59:10):
It's not as bad as skim uk. But this is
another thing.

Speaker 1 (59:13):
So in this in this survey, most shoppers, they say,
recognize well known labels like organic and then and to
a lesser degree but still a decent percent recognize fair trade.
But do you search for that? Thirty six percent of
people consider themselves to be product detectives when researching the

(59:33):
items they purchase. Off in scrutinizing labels, packaging, and certifications.
So that to me, this is another interesting thing. There
are people who will go search out, you know, organic.
For me, when I see organic, it's not an absolute
no that I won't buy it, but it's one strike
against them because I don't care about organic and I'm

(59:54):
definitely not.

Speaker 2 (59:55):
Willing to pay more for it. Fair trade. Look, fair trade,
I don't come across it very often.

Speaker 1 (01:00:00):
You see it from time to time in chocolate. You
see it very often in coffee, But I don't buy
coffee because I don't drink coffee, so I leave all
that stuff to my wife. So I don't really care
about that too much either. You know, Am I gonna
help people out and you know some poor people in
Brazil a little bit more by buying fair trade?

Speaker 2 (01:00:15):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
I guess I would, but again not if it costs
me a lot more. But what about you?

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
Okay?

Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
So I got two questions for you now at five
six six nine zero, do you consider yourself an overthinker
when it comes to supermarket shopping?

Speaker 2 (01:00:27):
And then I'll ask you the second question, are.

Speaker 1 (01:00:30):
You willing to pay more for either organic or fair trade?

Speaker 2 (01:00:35):
I would like to.

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
Know and I have this article and the survey and
stuff up on the website at Rosciminsky dot com so
you can go read more about it. I think I've
wasted enough of your time with it. Dragon, Do we
have a first name on a window?

Speaker 5 (01:00:46):
Just gonna say yes, we do have a winner here
for our entry. Carrie is our winner and the favorite
world food lobster tail.

Speaker 2 (01:00:54):
Ooh, fancy fancy. Pinky's up grilling? Right, Pinky's up grilling?

Speaker 5 (01:01:02):
Now?

Speaker 2 (01:01:02):
I need to know are.

Speaker 5 (01:01:02):
You doing the grilling for the lobster tail or are
you having somebody else do it? Because for me, that's
a big expensive item that I'm not going to risk
me grilling because if I ruin it, I'm gonna be
pissed because I wasted that money.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
So I would prefer somebody else to do it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:17):
Every once in a while, Dragon, you can find lobster
tail on sale at King Supers or at Sprouts or
at Sprouts, so they do sell individual lobs jails. They're
not very big, but every once in a while you
can find them on sale.

Speaker 5 (01:01:30):
And grilling is a lovely way to cook a lobster tail. Yeah,
if you know what you're doing, If.

Speaker 1 (01:01:34):
You know what you're doing right, and you definitely don't
want to ruin a lobster tail because you didn't know
what you were doing.

Speaker 2 (01:01:39):
What about you, dragon?

Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
Are you an overthinker at the supermarket? And are you
a bargain shopper at the supermarket?

Speaker 5 (01:01:43):
And more like you at the bargain if the thing
that I'm I'm pretty brand loyal, Okay. I know those
products and I know how they taste. Yeah, if the
like you said, if the more expensive thing is on sale,
I'll think about it, and that's probably what takes me
a little bit longer. But yeah, I just whatever's on
my list, I'm going for it. I'm a hunter, you know.
I write it down, I eat it, I get it,

(01:02:05):
I'm gone, all right.

Speaker 1 (01:02:08):
Yeah, So you don't want to spend more time in
the supermarket than you have to, now, I get that.
I get that, and for me, I do it fully admit.
I would probably go faster in the suit, a little
bit faster in the supermarket if I weren't listening to
a podcast while I was shopping. But I do tend
to listen to podcasts while I'm shopping because it's it's
nice for me.

Speaker 5 (01:02:26):
I don't normally block people on the text line Yeah,
I mean, in fact, my profile has zero people blocked
on it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:31):
Right, this guy may deserve it, man or woman. I'm
not sure.

Speaker 5 (01:02:36):
Yeah, skim milk is the drink of champions. What Yeah blocked?
That's ridiculous. That's ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (01:02:46):
Ron Swanson text to Ron Swanson says the only thing
I like less than liars is skim milk. Skim milk
is just water that is lying about being milk. That's
exactly right. Ski milk is water with a little bit
of white color, and it doesn't taste like anything. It's
not good for you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
Ross.

Speaker 1 (01:03:04):
I will not pay more for organic, but my wife will.
That's probably the same for my household. Oh well, but
I will pay more for a good steak. And that's
about it. Yes I will. I will do that too, Ross.
I'm not an overthinker with regards to grocery shopping. Yes,
I'm willing to pay more for organic, not willing to
pay more for fair trade. Ross held to the no
on organic and fair trade.

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
Ross.

Speaker 1 (01:03:26):
Organic means to me that I need to be in
a rush to eat it or it'll go bad quickly.
My organic English muffins lasted three days before going moldy.
Holy bleep Ross, that was the most massive waste of
my time. You've ever done. Well done, As Dragon would say,
You're welcome. We'll be right back on KOA. I am

(01:03:47):
joined by producer Dragon.

Speaker 2 (01:03:49):
Hi. There. He is wearing jersey number thirty seven, which RJ.

Speaker 1 (01:03:53):
Harvey of the Denver Broncos was wearing during preseason. But
r J Harvey is going to be changed his number
from thirty seven to twelve.

Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:04:04):
Interesting, huh. So when you're looking for r J. Harvey
on Sunday, whether on TV or at the game, and
you might be at the game, because I'm going to
give away some Broncos tickets in a moment instead of
instead of looking for number thirty seven, look for number twelve.

Speaker 2 (01:04:19):
I'm going to give away those Broncos tickets in a moment.

Speaker 1 (01:04:22):
Now, those folks who are careful listeners to the show
and pay attention to our little on air texty contests
from time to time are probably well aware of the
Kevin Rule, which is named for somebody named No, it's
named for somebody named Kevin. Arguably the Kevin Rule name

(01:04:44):
yes is new yes month or two?

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
Maybe? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (01:04:48):
Yeah, The rule itself has been in place for right ever.
The rule has been there for as long as we've
been doing this. We didn't call it the Kevin rule
until recently, but we like calling it the Kevin rule
because kind of that's just it's the Kevin rule, and
you don't have to explain anything else, at least for
those who are in the know. He called Kevin rules, yes,
and Kevin asked for it to be called that. And

(01:05:09):
and the Kevin rule is when we do a texty
contest you're trying to win an entry for a gas
grill from Flat Irons Fire, or you're trying to win
Broncos tickets, you're only allowed to text in once.

Speaker 2 (01:05:21):
You are not allowed to text in more than once.

Speaker 1 (01:05:25):
If you do text in more than once, we ignore
all of those texts.

Speaker 2 (01:05:28):
So why would you bringing this up? Ross?

Speaker 1 (01:05:30):
Well, you said, hey, Ross, we need to have a
little talk on air about Lois. And I asked you,
what did Lois do? What did Lois do? So here's
what I did. So Lowis texted in more than once
to try to win seven times, to try to win
the entry in for the Flatirons Fire thing. So here's

(01:05:54):
if you do the little control F like for fined
search feature in a way web browser and type in
a term, it will tell you how many instances of
that term it finds on the page. So I did
on my text page here, I did control le F,
and I typed in Lois, And so I was gonna

(01:06:21):
ask you, what do you think if we make the
over under Broncos Dragon's current jersey number of thirty seven,
how many times Lois and and just Lois as the
first name, not even Lois as part of the email address.
If you were to include Lois as part of the
email address, it's more but just Lois.

Speaker 2 (01:06:38):
Writing her own name.

Speaker 1 (01:06:42):
More or less than the thirty seven that is on
Dragon's jersey. Dude, I've never seen anything like this before.
It's oh, it's amazing. I've got it at forty eight. Yeah,
I've got it at forty eight, Lois.

Speaker 2 (01:06:56):
That's as far as is. Our text line will go back.

Speaker 1 (01:06:59):
Tech died in forty eight times to try to win
the entry forty eight times, and I think that's all.

Speaker 2 (01:07:10):
I think her.

Speaker 1 (01:07:11):
I think we've caught all of them. I don't think
there's forty nine, MANU forty eight. Wow, that's a lot,
Lois and I want to I want to just.

Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
I mean, flatir inspires.

Speaker 1 (01:07:24):
Thanks you, yeah, and I want to appreciate you for
being the best ever the most egregious violation of the
Kevin rule of all time. But don't do that again,
because that is just a massive waste of your time
and hours. And maybe maybe Lois is new. Oh look
at that here, away, let's see what. Let me let
me do the lowest thing. Let me let me check something. Okay,

(01:07:45):
so we got another text from Lois.

Speaker 2 (01:07:47):
Hey, I'm new to your station. Really wanted to get
Hubby to a game.

Speaker 1 (01:07:51):
Sorry, have a lovely Friday, all right, Lois, That explains
that and so, but congratulations on the most egregious violation
of all of all time. And since you didn't know
the rule, you still don't win. But it's understandable. There's
a slight bit of good news here. Yes, the contest
she tried to enter in for it was the Flatirons

(01:08:13):
Fire Grill. Right, that wasn't the Broncos contest, so she
can still you can still try to win the Broncos tickets.

Speaker 2 (01:08:19):
In fact, in fact, to.

Speaker 1 (01:08:22):
Listeners, you got to hear a listener text, you got
to admire her tennacity and another listener, I appreciate Lois's
dedication ross. If I text twice, those will be thrown
out meeting. My third text will be a brand new
one and count right. No, if you text more than once,
all of them will be disregarded entirely. Okay, So, Lois,
I hope you're listening. You want to get your husband

(01:08:43):
to a game? All right, So we're gonna give away
a pair of Broncos tickets right now, and don't do
anything yet. I haven't told you just how. But what
you're gonna win if you win, and Lois, you might win,
just only text once if you want to have a
chance to win, is a pair of tickets to this
Sunday's Broncos season opener against the Tennessee Titans at Empower

(01:09:05):
Field at Mile High. You can also win a pair
of tickets on our X feed Koacolorado x dot com
slash koa Colorado.

Speaker 2 (01:09:15):
And also on our Instagram page Instagram.

Speaker 1 (01:09:17):
Dot com slash koa Colorado. And this is of course
because we are the official home of the Denver Broncos. Now,
in order to win this pair of Broncos tickets, you
need to be Texter number, what Dragon ten? Tex Wow,
Texter number ten at I'm going to say eleven fourteen

(01:09:42):
and thirty seven seconds, eleven fourteen and thirty seven seconds
by our clock, not yours.

Speaker 2 (01:09:49):
And here's what you need to have in your text.

Speaker 1 (01:09:54):
Your first and last name, your email address, and the
answer to this question. If you take the jersey number
that RJ. Harvey war during preseason, that Dragon is wearing today,
and you subtract from it the jersey number that RJ.

(01:10:15):
Harvey is going to wear during the regular season, what's
the answer?

Speaker 2 (01:10:19):
What's that number? What's that number?

Speaker 1 (01:10:22):
We've talked about both of those numbers a few times
on the show, and I talked about him a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:10:25):
Just to give you a clue that it might be
a hint. RJ.

Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
Harvey's preseason jersey number, jersey number, same number Dragon's wearing
right now, minus RJ. Harvey's number that he's changing to
that he will wear for the regular season.

Speaker 2 (01:10:40):
What is that number on that mathematical equation?

Speaker 1 (01:10:43):
So what time did I say eleven fourteen and thirty
seven seconds that is correct, Texter number ten at five
six six nine zero, with your full name, your email address,
and the answer to that mathematical equation.

Speaker 5 (01:10:54):
I was told there would be no math. But it
is the first game of the season. Yeah, home, it's
the open game. This is a big deal, worth it,
This is a big deal. Lois wasted your time and
you're upset.

Speaker 1 (01:11:05):
Come on, man, no, I'm actually not upset now that
I know that Lois. First of all, the fact that
Lois is a new listener to the show, that's great,
and joined in to try to win something. And furthermore
that she's trying to win for her husband. So sweet,
that is. That is pretty fantastic. Wouldn't it be something
if if Lois ended up winning.

Speaker 5 (01:11:25):
Wouldn't it be We'll see, we'll see a few minutes
left to go.

Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
That's right, that's right. So again, you you all have
the instructions.

Speaker 1 (01:11:33):
You know what to do, you know what to do,
all right, I'm looking I'm looking forward to that. Let
me do this for literally one minute. This is from
the Washington Post.

Speaker 2 (01:11:41):
The health risk linked.

Speaker 1 (01:11:43):
To scrolling too long while on the toilet. So here's
the thing. Basically, what this says is, don't bring your
cell phone into the restroom with you when you're gonna
go do a number two, especially if it's gonna make
you sit there for longer than you otherwise. What A
cross sectional announces of one hundred and twenty five patients
undergoing screening colonoscopies found that the smartphone users in the

(01:12:05):
group spent significantly more time on the toilet. According to
the study published in Medical Journal from Beth Israel Deaconess
Medical Center in Boston. That's a serious hospital, by the way,
about thirty seven percent of people who were part of
the study and reported using smartphones on the toilet spent
more than five minutes per bathroom visit, compared with seven
percent of non users. After adjusting for age and a

(01:12:28):
bunch of other things.

Speaker 2 (01:12:29):
That I won't bother you.

Speaker 1 (01:12:31):
With, smartphone use was associated with a forty six percent
increased risk of hemorrhoids. One of the study authors, who
specializes in gastro intestinal motility and why wouldn't you specialize
in that, said hemorrhoids are off and overlooked because they're
not taking as seriously, even though millions of dollars of

(01:12:51):
healthcare expenditure go to treating hemorrhoids. Quote, no one really
wants to talk about something that's in there, but this
is incredible human all right, So there you go. A
twenty twenty two study, by the way, found that sixty
five percent of Americans say they use their phones on
the toilet, and of course that leads to longer toilet sessions,

(01:13:13):
which leads to the increased risk of hemorrhoids.

Speaker 2 (01:13:16):
So in case you.

Speaker 1 (01:13:18):
If you don't want to have to add expense for preparation,
hdear budget, don't go do the doom scrolling and the
playing of wordle and all the other stuff while you
go to the bathroom. Leave the phone out there so
you don't get the hemorrhoids. That's our public service announcement
for the day. Auditory pellet cleanser from the brain damage
that Dragon and I went through on Monday going to

(01:13:40):
that Neil Young.

Speaker 2 (01:13:41):
Concert that was even worse than I thought it was.

Speaker 1 (01:13:44):
Yeah, yeah, this is a little inside baseball thing here.
But I want to respond to this listener text hi
Ross quick request for you. When you give the specific
time to text in, will you please let your listeners
know what time it is on your clock. I really
appreciate that your mindful of the delay for those of
us who stream, and I wish other shows would do
the same. However, it's hard to know what the delay

(01:14:06):
is on any given day if we don't know what
time you are showing, I rarely participate participate because of this,
and would like to participate if I knew what the
difference is.

Speaker 2 (01:14:17):
Thanks, And that is signed Joe.

Speaker 1 (01:14:19):
So Joe, that is a perfectly legitimate request conceptually, but
based on how radio works, and especially on the stream,
it's impossible.

Speaker 5 (01:14:30):
It can't because we could sit there and say it's
eleven twenty one, twenty seven, eight twenty nine right now.
But the reason we give the delayed time is so
you don't have to worry about what time it is
right now, right, And it's it's not just that, Joe.

Speaker 2 (01:14:44):
But so here, here's the thing.

Speaker 1 (01:14:46):
I'm probably our clock is very aligned with any accurate
clock that you have. If you have a slightly inaccurate
watch or whatever, you'll be off by a few seconds.

Speaker 2 (01:14:56):
But here, let's try this.

Speaker 1 (01:14:58):
Let's do what Dragon just said, and I'll explain to
you why what you're saying won't work. All right, So
right now, at this very moment, it's eleven twenty.

Speaker 2 (01:15:05):
Two one two three oh four.

Speaker 1 (01:15:10):
Look at your clock as I'm talking now, and tell
me what time it is on your clock as you
are hearing me say this eleven twenty two, twelve thirteen, fourteen, fifteen. Now,
if you're listening over the air, you're probably hearing it
somewhere around twenty seconds after I say it.

Speaker 5 (01:15:28):
Depending on which air signal you're listening on as well,
the AM signal or the FAY are different. Ye are
different by four, four or five seconds?

Speaker 1 (01:15:36):
Yes? Yeah, yeah, so the FM and AM signals are different.

Speaker 2 (01:15:39):
I don't think they used to be different.

Speaker 1 (01:15:40):
I think we change something in the transmitter and now
the AM and FM are off set. But if you're
listening on the stream, I have no idea what your
delay is in the past minute. I think some years ago,
like when I was across the hall at k how,
I think the delay on the stream was more like
ninety seconds, And now I think it could be thirty seconds,

(01:16:01):
forty seconds, fifty seconds.

Speaker 5 (01:16:03):
Your Internet signal as well, right, and then it wouldn't
surprise me if the delay is different between now.

Speaker 1 (01:16:09):
I haven't tested this, but it wouldn't surprise me if
the delay is different. Listening let's say on a desktop
computer versus the iHeartRadio app might be a little bit different.
Versus and I would never do this. I just want
to be very clear. I would never say Alexa play
koa on iHeartRadio, or I would never say that over
the AAR. I would only do that if I turn

(01:16:30):
the mic off. So here, I'm gonna hit the button
and turn the mic off, and now we'll just say
it just with the mic off, so that this can't
possibly cause any issues.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
Here, let me hit the button. Okay, wait, hold on, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:16:43):
Alexa play koa on iHeartRadio right now, turn the mic
back on.

Speaker 2 (01:16:48):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:16:49):
So that also could have an entirely different delay. So
again eleven twenty three and forty nine fifty fifty one
fifty two fifty three. So in fact, why don't you
folks text in and tell me how much your delay
is and how you're listening. Let's do that just for
a second. How much is how much is the delay?

(01:17:10):
And how are you listening right now? Eleven twenty four
oh eight nine, ten, eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen, fifteen. So, Joe,
the point is that this is great. You If I
told you what the time was at the moment, it
wouldn't help you at all. It doesn't affect what time

(01:17:31):
you're supposed to text. Yeah, it wouldn't help you at
all unless you knew precisely to the second.

Speaker 2 (01:17:36):
How much your delay was, and you won't know. You
just won't know.

Speaker 1 (01:17:40):
Uh, Dragon, How do you think this rates in terms
of scale? With like ten being the ultimate of wasting
people's time? Not quite there yet, probably a seven or eighth.

Speaker 2 (01:17:51):
Yeah, I'm with you, Okay, I think that's about right
kind of the time.

Speaker 5 (01:17:53):
A little bit more to make it, you know, eight
point three at eleven, twenty four, fifty two, fifty three,
fifty four, fifty five, fifty six.

Speaker 1 (01:18:03):
To make it a ten, we'd probably have to count
like for two minutes without stopping or something, Carol, that
would be really bad radio. All right, We're done with
wasting your time. Coming up, Oh, the winner of the Uh, Jesus,
Jesus won, could be Jesus could be Hazu, could be
Jesus won the Broncos tickets, Lois, I'm very sorry you

(01:18:24):
didn't win tickets for your hobby, but keep listening. Most
weeks that we have home games, we have tickets to
give away, and not just on my show. Usually we
will give away tickets on multiple shows during the day.

Speaker 2 (01:18:37):
And on social media.

Speaker 1 (01:18:39):
So keep an eye on x dot com slash Ka
Colorado and Instagram dot com slash koa Colorado.

Speaker 2 (01:18:46):
When we come back.

Speaker 1 (01:18:47):
A dude who is really funny and really interesting, Kevin Fitzgerald,
joins me in studio right after this. Just one of
the most interesting people and unbelievably funny as well. I've
seen I've seen Kevin and two or three times at
Comedy Works. I think I've only seen you at the
Downtown Club. I don't know if you've played this club,

(01:19:08):
but I think every time I've seen you has been Downtown,
including opening for Craig Ferguson, which was just unbelievable. And
and Kevin is doing his h's He's the headliner this
Sunday evening at seven pm at Comedy Works Downtown in
Larimer Squares. You can go to Comedyworks dot com for
tickets to see that, and I will have a couple
of pairs of tickets to actually give away here in

(01:19:29):
a little bit before.

Speaker 2 (01:19:29):
The end of the show. And Kevin has a new book.

Speaker 1 (01:19:31):
It started with a turtle, and you might want to
remember that, actually that's just a hint. You might want
to remember that it started with a turtle, Kevin, thanks
for joining in studio. Thanks for bringing me this signed book.
It's fantastic. I've actually read a bunch of the book already,
and dude, what an interesting life.

Speaker 6 (01:19:50):
Well, if you live long enough for us, you can
do things, you know, and if you don't get married,
you know, you could say you.

Speaker 2 (01:19:55):
Never got married. Huh.

Speaker 6 (01:19:56):
I didn't married your work. I didn't mean to be
an old bachelor, you know, but happened there.

Speaker 1 (01:20:00):
There are just so many stories I want to I
want to talk to you about. I think I guess
I'll start with something that everybody always wants to talk
to you about.

Speaker 2 (01:20:09):
We'll do it briefly, and then we'll talk about other things.

Speaker 1 (01:20:11):
But your career is a bouncer, including bouncing for the
Rolling Stones and the.

Speaker 2 (01:20:16):
Who and so on.

Speaker 1 (01:20:17):
And by the way, I'm not going to talk about
this a lot, but I had. I had a nightclub
in Chicago with a couple other folks, and the Rolling
Stones came to my club and I was singing with
jim Jimmy Buffett. So it was like almost kind of
sort of tiny bit close to some of the stuff
you did, except I was never big enough to be
a bouncer.

Speaker 2 (01:20:32):
How did you become a bouncer?

Speaker 6 (01:20:34):
And when you were singing with you know, I could
I could cure cancer. Oh anybody want to know is
what was it like to work for the Rolling Stone? Huh,
but I just I'm a dead guy, and and uh,
you know, I I worked for Chuck Morris and Barry Faye.
You know, we did security and and uh work the

(01:20:54):
door with the sink for Chuck. He said, I'm gonna
give you a buck thirty nine an hour and a
hamburger every shift.

Speaker 2 (01:20:59):
Are you gonna meet me more girls? And Frank Sinatra?
You know.

Speaker 6 (01:21:02):
So then we moved down to Gilgi's, then to EBITs
Field with Barry and and then they started doing tours.
And then then oh, I got a guy that's pretty
good at security, and he's you know, not a total
knuckle ahead, and we'll send you off. And so the
first one they ever did was, uh was herb Albert
and the Tijuanna breast. They didn't need much bounce, but

(01:21:23):
but you know, and then the Flying Brito Brothers and
the different things that we did that that they did,
and and they got into management of some of the
bands and some of the tours and and you know,
in the in the beginning, tours were every city had
its own promoter. So there was you know, there was
a brutal thing in in the in the settlement room
every night, you know, about in the accounting room about

(01:21:45):
how many bus.

Speaker 2 (01:21:46):
Were in seats.

Speaker 6 (01:21:47):
And then Barry was listen, I'm gonna sell every ticket
in the United States. Okay, don't worry, They'll just be
one accounting one thing. And then tours became. It became
in the beginning was maybe more fun. It was the
seat of the pants, you know, didn't know what happened. Yeah,
you know, I remember working for the Brido Brothers and
asking Chris Hillman, how do I eat? You know, they
didn't have a per diemer and he goes, oh, you

(01:22:08):
just just I don't know, just just charge things. And
so the charges must still be going through. You know,
your your eighteen year old bouncer, and you look at
the menu. Let's say that surf and turf. What's that?
That sounds pretty good?

Speaker 2 (01:22:20):
Oh? Hey, surve pie? Can I get a whole pie?

Speaker 4 (01:22:23):
You know?

Speaker 2 (01:22:24):
Can I just like put it on their bill? Yeah? Yeah,
and so and so. Then then he.

Speaker 6 (01:22:28):
Came like, oh wait, a minute, Wait a minute, you
gonna get a twenty five dollars, you know, a lunch thing,
you got a dinner thing, and you know in the
in the hospitality room. There's food at the show, so
he eat there. But so, you know, but being a
little boy from Denmer and getting to be on a
rock and roll tour, running away with the circus, you know,
and the music was great, you know what I mean.
I never got to play in this and I'd rather

(01:22:50):
sing than eat. Most people rather hear me eat, you know.
But so I think that uh, you know, to be
to be close to it, you know, that close. And
it was amazing. And Keith Richies always said, ask him
who's the best band in the world, And he said,
whoever was playing live tonight? You hear that ross like

(01:23:10):
live music. There's something about it. There is it's it's
it doesn't come across on the record, you know, the
sweaty place and the drum hitting in the chest and
watching the you know, the the drummer sweat and trying
to keep up with the singer, you know, and and yeah,
you know.

Speaker 1 (01:23:24):
Live music is the best. Except for Neil Young. Live
music is the is the best. Dragon and I had
the misfortune of going to Neil Young on Monday night
and we sent ourselves there because it's a running thing
on the show how much I don't like Neil Young.
And I have to say I said this before, like
you know, I was really worried that the concert would
be bad.

Speaker 2 (01:23:42):
And we got there and we went and it was.
It was worse. So but I love concerts, I just
I do. I love like what I did to Neil
Young too.

Speaker 1 (01:23:52):
I bet you would have. And the woman se, uh
seventy eight, Oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 (01:23:59):
We went.

Speaker 6 (01:24:00):
We went and uh we just had come off of
stones to anyway. We went and uh we sat down,
everybody sat down, his management people and and I'm Barry
and and he said, Kevin's gonna come and and he said,
who's the opening act? And he said, you're not having
an opening act. He's just going to be a piano
and a guitar. It's going to be an acoustic thing.
But we found a comic in Santa Cruz. He's going

(01:24:21):
to be the opening act. And it was. It was
Robin Williams before Windy and it was it was so incredible.

Speaker 2 (01:24:27):
Wow, he was he was on all the time.

Speaker 6 (01:24:30):
It was like, you know, you're eating dinner with him,
and he was like, hey, you don't have to you know,
I'm just eating a sandwich.

Speaker 2 (01:24:37):
You don't have to tell me. But he was so cold.

Speaker 6 (01:24:39):
You tell something's going to happen. Yeah, but uh, yeah,
I think you know, it's some some if you go
in with a preconceived notion. But uh, if you don't
like a band, you know, I just you know, I
listen to the country if I'm being punished, you know,
all right.

Speaker 1 (01:24:58):
One more and then we I get so many things
I want to talk to about. Only one more Rolling
Stones thing. But it's not probably the usual kind of
Rolling Stones question, you get. I love the story about
Keith Richards's influence on the rest of your life.

Speaker 6 (01:25:13):
Well, a lot of the bands were, you know, haphazard
and stuff. The Stones are so organized and nothing happens
by accident, you know, and they wouldn't still be doing
it if they had been you know, you know, a
slipshod thing. And so he's he's he's like the hippest
guy in the world. And if he says something, he listened,
you know, and he said, you know, what are you doing?

(01:25:34):
I can't be doing this? He was in charge of
the bouncers, and he goes, why don't you go to school?
You know, you've been with us, you know, the sixteen nine,
seventy two, seventy five, seventy eight. What are you gonna do.
You can't be a bouncer when you're fifty, you know.
So you know I'll help you. So he wrote my letter,
you know, for he wrote you.

Speaker 2 (01:25:49):
A recommendation letter for veterinarians school esprobably on a wall someplace,
you know. Wow.

Speaker 6 (01:25:55):
But I mean he's the kindest guy in the world,
you know. And then you get to see him later
and he goes, you know, I got him into Vesico.

Speaker 2 (01:26:02):
He remembers that. Sure, when's the last time you talked
with him?

Speaker 6 (01:26:05):
The last time I talked to him was one of
the last times they were here. I got to have
supper with him, and I asked him, I said, how
long can it go on? You know, how long can
you do it? And he goes, you know, as long
as we're not just like a caricature of ourselves, you know,
and we got more to do, he goes, but he goes,
the blues guys played into their eighties.

Speaker 2 (01:26:22):
Sure, yeah, yeah, So he said, why couldn't we do that? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:26:24):
Right, and then they actually those guys have a lot
of blues influence in there and their early background too.

Speaker 2 (01:26:29):
For sure.

Speaker 1 (01:26:30):
We're talking with doctor Kevin Fitzgerald and he's got just
so much fun. His new book is called It Started
with a Turtle. His first pet a turtle. I don't
know if we'll get to that story, but you can
buy the book and Started with a Turtle and read
the turtle story. And he's playing Sunday night at seven
pm at Comedy Works Downtown at Larimer Square. Comedyworks dot

(01:26:52):
com for tickets, and I'll have some tickets to give
away in a few minutes as well. I I love
this bit. I don't think i'll read from the book.
I'll just mention and then you can go. So, uh,
I'm Jewish. I always go to a Chinese restaurant on Christmas.

Speaker 2 (01:27:13):
And early in your book had mel too.

Speaker 1 (01:27:16):
Early in your book you talk about your best friend growing.

Speaker 2 (01:27:19):
Up was a Jewish kid. Uh, So just take the
story wherever you want to take it with. You know,
your best friend growing up being a Jewish kid.

Speaker 6 (01:27:26):
My best friend was was was earl Stein and it
still is.

Speaker 2 (01:27:29):
And you know, Earl is the best guy ever.

Speaker 6 (01:27:31):
And so his father would cook, you know, and make
these Jewish dishes. And he yelled out the back door, boys,
Papa's made a kishka.

Speaker 2 (01:27:39):
So we went, it's kind of like a Jewish brito.
It's kind of horrible.

Speaker 6 (01:27:42):
It's got all this stuff and the guts and stuff
and sweet meets wherever they call it, right brain or
where brain try wherever they call it. And so it
is Intestine, so geez, you know. So I went back home,
and you know, my father heard him meill out the
back door. He goes, why did mister Stein announce a
dad a bowel movement? I go, no, know, he made
a keisha, he did. And so in our family, if

(01:28:02):
you have to go to the John, you say, I
gotta make a kishka, you know. But the thing about
the Jewish people, and I grew up in a Jewish
neighborhood here in Denver, and on Christmas, everybody went to
the Chinese restaurants, and right, my Irish people, my Irish parents,
they never had Irish food, you know, Chinese food. So

(01:28:22):
we finally went to a place and my father was
in and he goes, you know, these he Brews they're
onto something, this is this is great, this is great food.

Speaker 2 (01:28:32):
Did your dad have an Irish accent?

Speaker 6 (01:28:34):
Well, yeah, yeah, they're they're Irish people, you know, so yeah,
they were nice.

Speaker 2 (01:28:38):
Were they were What generation of your family was born
in Ireland? Well? My parents?

Speaker 1 (01:28:43):
Yeah, oh yeah, wow, okay, so your first generation born
born here.

Speaker 2 (01:28:46):
Let's talk about animals a little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:28:49):
I liked this ice bear chapter, all right, And obviously,
and I didn't mention this when I was just talking
about Kevin a moment ago. But you know, he's been
a veterinarian for how many years? Forty three? Forty three
years at the same practice.

Speaker 6 (01:29:02):
It's hard to say. People don't retire in the same
jersey anymore. Yeah, but yeah, yeah, I'll a media east.
You know where I cut my teeth, you know, unbelievable
twenty four hour place and we see river the streets
of dem you can throw up at us.

Speaker 1 (01:29:15):
Yeah you ever have you ever worked on a sugar glider?
Used to have one.

Speaker 2 (01:29:20):
They were so popular right early. You know, whenever I
have one, it's probably when they were popular.

Speaker 6 (01:29:25):
Things go in fads, you know, Yeah, remember poppelly pigs.
Early I had one of those two and then when
we came with a pipelin. He makes a pretty good pet.
But whoo, what a smell? Well, he's a pig in
your living room? Yeah, no, I had one, did you think?

Speaker 1 (01:29:37):
So? I lived in a I lived in a high
rise building where you weren't allowed to have cats or dogs.
So I figured out right, I'll get a pig. There
didn't seem to be a rule about that. And so
and I named him. And I named him Peter Paul
Rubens because he had kind of a Rubenesque figure about him,
with that big old pot belly going on. So tell
me about But you've done, separate from being in your

(01:29:59):
practice and take care of animals on a day to
day basis, you go out in the world and you've
done a lot of conservation kind of stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:30:05):
I've been real lucky, I think, you know.

Speaker 6 (01:30:07):
I was against you know when I first got a
fiscal animals and cages and stuff in zoos. But I
grew up here going to Denver Zoo and a wonderful place.
And until I realized that more children visit the Denver
Zoo every year, you know, then go to the Broncos Avalanche,
Rockies and Nuggets combined two point three million kids in there,

(01:30:28):
so these little minds get turned on and on for
conservation the ross. There's ten million other forms of life
on the planet besides us and all these other animals.
We're given this wonderful biodiversity intellect, and all the other
animals are waiting for us to use our intellect and
save the place. But I'm optimistic. You know, it's working
with young people, working with children. You're going to be
conscious about it, you know, And so you know it's

(01:30:51):
the one we have to win, you know, we have
to We can't lose this this thing.

Speaker 2 (01:30:55):
And we can't.

Speaker 6 (01:30:56):
I would hate for your grandchildren to only be able
to see a pole little bear in a book, you know,
those types of things. Tell me a little about your
polar bear experience. Well, I was really lucky in it,
doctor Dave Kenny. You know, with the Godfather is a Klondike,
and snow and and and the polar bears that were
born here in Shanna, the city, the little baby bears,

(01:31:18):
and and so he uh did some things with up
to northern Canada, and I got to go with him,
and then later with the North American Veteran Convention Society,
and and and putting radio transmitters in in some and
releasing them and they break into the town and they
grab them and sedateum. And then we put in a
transmitter and then you can follow them and see how

(01:31:39):
far they go and range. And it'd be a little
boy from them would be standing next to a sedated
polar bear.

Speaker 2 (01:31:45):
Is that's amazing? Yeah? And you did what ten years
on on TV?

Speaker 6 (01:31:51):
We did eleven seasons eleven years on Animal Planet. You know,
we had we had emergency vets and and so it
was very beginning an Animal Animal Planet when it's spun
out of Discovery and and so you know, we were
the only other show on with a crocodile hunter, you know,
And and he was incredible in the night that he
was showing we were showing our pilot to the network executives.

Speaker 2 (01:32:11):
He was showing his pilot.

Speaker 6 (01:32:13):
His pilot was him and his wife in the darkest
marsh of Australia snagging crocodiles and throwing the back of
the boat. And the way he started was he pushed
his wife out of the boat into the water. Crocs
are attracted vibrations, using me wife as a decoy, and you.

Speaker 2 (01:32:29):
Know, and then using your wife as a decoy. Unbelievable.
Did you meet him a bit?

Speaker 4 (01:32:33):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:32:33):
Yeah, yeah, he seems like very interesting.

Speaker 6 (01:32:36):
Steve every when he came in filmed Rattlesnake study for
his show, and it was two weeks before he was killed.
And if he would have lived, what he could have
done for yeah, because you know we weren't given you
know this, this uh, this wonderful world. You know, we
borrowed it from our grandchildren. And you know, when the
species becomes extinct, the world becomes a less interesting place.

Speaker 1 (01:32:57):
I'll tell you what I want to do, just to
make sure we have time to do it, and dragon
we should, you should be ready with.

Speaker 2 (01:33:01):
The others because we're gonna play.

Speaker 1 (01:33:02):
We're gonna play Name that tune with Kevin because if
anybody should be able to name that tune, it's a yeah,
and you will need headphones for that. Kevin, if anybody
should be able to do this, guy who's been on
tour with band after band after band. But what I
want to do, just real quick, I'm just if you
would like to see Kevin as the headliner at Comedy
Works downtown in Larimer Square, that is Sunday night, all right,

(01:33:25):
Sunday night at seven p m.

Speaker 2 (01:33:29):
We will take let's just I'm gonna do.

Speaker 1 (01:33:31):
Make this really easy, Dragon, how about texters one and
two at eleven fifty four and thirty seven seconds, eleven
fifty four and thirty seven seconds, Texters number one and
two at five six, six nine zero, And your text
needs to include your full name, your email address, and

(01:33:52):
the answer to this question, what kind of animal was
Kevin Fitzgerald's first pet? All right, I've said it probably
at least three times on the show already today, and
it's in the title of his book. So your full name,
your email address, and what kind of animal was Kevin's
first pet? Texters number one and two at whatever time
I just said, and and Dragon will get back in

(01:34:15):
touch with you.

Speaker 4 (01:34:15):
You forgot to ask elementary school, where what is mom's maid?

Speaker 3 (01:34:18):
Name? Is any?

Speaker 2 (01:34:20):
It's right on the cover of the book.

Speaker 1 (01:34:21):
And I've said it a bunch of I've said it
a bunch of time, Sir.

Speaker 6 (01:34:26):
Has incredibly unnecessarily complicated contesting on this program.

Speaker 1 (01:34:30):
Yeah, but when you're giving away prize this good, you
got to make it a little bit hard.

Speaker 2 (01:34:34):
Good grief, Dragon show is easy peasy, man.

Speaker 3 (01:34:37):
Here's the prizes.

Speaker 1 (01:34:38):
Hey folks, if you're listening on the podcast right now,
that's the end of today's show.

Speaker 2 (01:34:43):
Thank you so much for listening.

Speaker 1 (01:34:45):
Don't forget you can catch us every day on the
podcast as you are right now, on your smart speaker,
on your iHeartRadio app, even on the computer at Koa, Colorado,
and the good old fashioned way on your radio.

Speaker 2 (01:34:57):
Thanks so much for listening to the show.