Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I told you yesterday about a note I wrote on
my substack about free speech, and in that I called
on our Republican members of Congress here in Colorado to
stand up for free speech, to stand up for the
First Amendment, even if that meant taking the other side
of many other Republicans or even criticizing Republicans. And my
next guest is doing that, and I'm proud of them
(00:21):
for doing it.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Jeff Hurd is.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
The Republican member of Congress who represents Colorado's third Congressional District,
which is much of western and southern Colorado and almost
half of the land mass of the state of Colorado.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Jeff, it's been too long since we've spoken. Welcome back
to the show. It's good to talk to you.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Thanks Ross. Great to join you.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
A whole bunch of listeners wanted me because I told
them that you were coming on the show. A whole
bunch of listeners wanted me to ask you about your
vote against censuring ilhan Omar. You were one of four
Republicans who voted not to censure him, and because of
you and the three others, the censer failed by one vote.
(01:04):
So my listeners would like to know you why you
voted that way. Sure, you're right.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Nancy Mays from South Carolina brought a Central resolution in
the House last week. It would have condemned ilhan Omar
for comments she made in an interview about Charlie Kirk,
and she also retweeted some vile comments from somebody else
about Kirk's assassination. The resolution the Center would have stripped
ilhan Omar of her House committee. That would have forced
her to stand in silence in the House while the
(01:29):
Center was read. And my view is ilhan Omar's comments
were reprehensible. I condemned them. They were evil and wrong.
But I voted against the Center because I don't think
Congress should use his power to punish speech, even if
it's speech we despise. Now, the First Amendment means protecting
the right to speak and letting the voters hold this accountable,
not weaponizing the House or its procedures to silence members.
(01:52):
So that's why I voted the way I did. I
stand by it. I know it was not popular among
it was not an easy political vote, but I didn't
go to DC to make easy political votes. I went
there to do the right thing, and I felt like
I did that in this case and standing up for
free speech.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
So again I applaud you for that, and I admire
your courage, and I like to think I would have
voted the same way you did, even though I share
your view that what she said is reprehensible, and in
fact I find her reprehensible. I would note, just as
a parallel, when Alvin Bragg did his law fair lawsuit
against Donald Trump, it did immense good to Donald Trump's
(02:26):
political fortunes. When Brendan Carr said the easy way or
the hard way about Jimmy Kimmel. Kimmel was suspended for
a few days and then came back to four times
or six times his normal audience, So that helped. Now
you've got the Trump administration potentially looking to indict James Callmey,
who nobody cares about, but they're gonna make him a
hero of the left. And now I feel like this
(02:48):
kind of censure, if it had passed, would have just
been an enormous fundraising opportunity and sort of making not
quite a martyr but something a victim of ilhan Omar
when she's the perpetrator and not the victim. So I
think I think politically you're on the right side as well.
Why do you think so many Republicans just seem to
(03:09):
go along with Nancy Mace, who, by the way, used
to be very interesting and is now crazy.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Rust Listen, that's a great point that you're making that politically,
something like this only empowers ilhan Omar, and we're sort
of inadvertently making her a star and boosting her profile
in a way that she otherwise wouldn't have.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Look.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
The way to address a terrible, wrong, reperhensible speech like
what ilhan Omert is doing is either ignore her or
to beat her in the realm of ideas, which is
what I think we're doing. And her talking the way
that she does is self discrediting, and when we try
to silence her and censure her and remove her from committees,
it only heightens her profile in a way that I
think undermines the point that we're trying to get, which
(03:49):
is she's wrong, and we lose sight of that when
we engage in these theatrics and do things like this.
And that's why that's a great point. And I agree
with you why I voted for this, but you're right,
it would empower her. If we had passed the center resolution.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Also, I mentioned on the show yesterday that the political
left rarely even claims to care about the Constitution, and
when they do make the claim, it's usually just because
they think there's a political advantage that can hurt Republicans
by claiming it. Going back more than a century at
least to Woodrow Wilson, the Progressives have despised the Constitution,
(04:25):
but the Conservatives and the Republicans have claimed to revere it.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
And I would like to know. I want to be
careful because I don't.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
Like asking a politician of one party to explain and
defend every other member of their party or even the president.
But I would like you to help me understand why
you think so many Republicans have been okay with what
Brendan Carr said. Too many Republicans were okay with what
Pat Bond, what Pam BONDI said, and so on. It
(04:54):
just feels like folks are abandoning the Constitution out of
some short term anger or some other thing that I
hope you can help me understand.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Well, look, what happened with Charlie Kirk was a national tragedy,
and this assassination, I mean, it cuts at the heart
of free speech and the principles that we hold as
a country. And I think a lot of people, look,
it's a lot of people were close to him, to him,
I met him once. He was very impressive in person.
I think a lot of people are emotionally. It is
a tough issue, and we're in the immediate aftermath of it.
(05:25):
I understand why people are angry and upset. But for me,
this is the time for us to stand up and
have the political courage as conservatives, that people, as people
that swore oath to the Constitution, to say things like,
you know, look the easy way or the hard way
comment that came from the SEC chairman that is that
is especially troubling because it suggests the government pressuring broadcasters
(05:46):
based on viewpoint. You know, that runs headlong into the
first first Amendment and the government should never punish or
threaten threaten to punish broadcasters because of the content of
their political speech. It's something that is conservatives Republicans that
we've seen happen to us and weaponized against us in
the past. It's wrong when it happens then, and it's
wrong for us to do it on the other side.
(06:07):
And I worry about the precedent that we'd be setting
ross if we don't stand up and speak out against this.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Well, how much of the it could put you off
the air?
Speaker 3 (06:14):
I mean right, there could be a future administration where
they're not happy with you and and somebody calls you out,
and that would be a detriment to the First Amendment.
It would be the wrong thing. And that's why it's
important for you know, libertarians like yourself, for conservatives, for
liberal for everyone to stand up and say, hey, look,
no matter where this is coming from, it's the wrong
thing to silence speech. And this is core political speech.
(06:37):
It's not like you're threatening violence to somebody. It's not
like you're, you know, advancing pornography or indecency or something like.
This is core political speech. If we disagree with it,
if it's wrong, we need to beat it in the
realm of ideas. We should not use the government to
pressure broadcasters to take this speech off the air.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
We have about a minute left here, Jeff, and for
those just joining, we're talking with Congressman Jeff Hurd, who
represents color third Congressional district, which is most of western
Colorado and most of southern Colorado. I suspect that there's
an immense number of Republicans who you work with, who privately,
in conversations with you or just in their own brains,
(07:13):
are very upset with what Brendan Carr did, and maybe
with what Pam Bondi said as well, but haven't said
it in public.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
And I wonder how you see the dynamic there.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
It seems to me that many Republican members of Congress,
House and Senate are deeply afraid of the wrath of
Donald Trump.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
And you seem not to be.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
And I wonder how you are able as a Republican
in a Republican district. You're not immune from a primary challenge,
and yet you seem to be playing this differently, more
independently from Trump.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
How are you able to do that? And why?
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Well, look, I've got my principles that I ran on.
I've never been in politics before, a career politician. I'm
not afraid of losing my job. I do the right thing.
That said, Look, I understand it's tough for a lot
of my colleagues. And the tricky part when you're in Congress,
when you're an elected official, is having the courage, group
principles and standing up for them, but also being wise
and figuring out when and how to express those views.
(08:18):
And you know, another member of Congress wants put it
really wisely. ROSSI said, you can't make everything, Alamo, and
so I hesitate to You know, a lot of these Republicans,
they are friends, their colleagues, and they are good people.
They disagree with what's happening, but how and when they
voice that disagreement sometimes it's more effective behind the scenes,
also Ross. And so I don't fault any of my
(08:40):
colleagues for handling it differently than I do. But I
do what's right by by by what I think is best,
and the consequences will come. But fundamentally, I believe this
is an issue that I'm going to stand on, and
if it results in my losing a primary or getting blasted,
it's a good principle to stand on.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
And I'm and I'm okay that Jeff Heard is Colorado's
third congressional District Congressman, Republican from Grand Junction. Thank you, Jeff,
Thank you for your time, thank you for the courageous votes,
and and and keep it up. I feel like you
and I are a little bit in the minority of
our own sides right now on some of this stuff.
(09:19):
And but but in the long run, I think people
will look back and say, you know what, Jeff was right.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
I hope it's true.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Thanks, Thank you Ross, Thank you also for fighting for
the First Amendment as well.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Good talking to you, Jeff all right, Congressman Jeff Heard
I told you yesterday about a note I wrote on
my substack about free speech, and in that I called
on our Republican members of Congress here in Colorado to
stand up for free speech, to stand up for the
First Amendment, even if that meant taking the other side
of many other Republicans or even criticizing Republicans. And my
next guest is doing that, and I'm proud of them
(00:21):
for doing it.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Jeff Hurd is.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
The Republican member of Congress who represents Colorado's third Congressional District,
which is much of western and southern Colorado and almost
half of the land mass of the state of Colorado.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Jeff, it's been too long since we've spoken. Welcome back
to the show. It's good to talk to you.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Thanks Ross. Great to join you.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
A whole bunch of listeners wanted me because I told
them that you were coming on the show. A whole
bunch of listeners wanted me to ask you about your
vote against censuring ilhan Omar. You were one of four
Republicans who voted not to censure him, and because of
you and the three others, the censer failed by one vote.
(01:04):
So my listeners would like to know you why you
voted that way. Sure, you're right.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Nancy Mays from South Carolina brought a Central resolution in
the House last week. It would have condemned ilhan Omar
for comments she made in an interview about Charlie Kirk,
and she also retweeted some vile comments from somebody else
about Kirk's assassination. The resolution the Center would have stripped
ilhan Omar of her House committee. That would have forced
her to stand in silence in the House while the
(01:29):
Center was read. And my view is ilhan Omar's comments
were reprehensible. I condemned them. They were evil and wrong.
But I voted against the Center because I don't think
Congress should use his power to punish speech, even if
it's speech we despise. Now, the First Amendment means protecting
the right to speak and letting the voters hold this accountable,
not weaponizing the House or its procedures to silence members.
(01:52):
So that's why I voted the way I did. I
stand by it. I know it was not popular among
it was not an easy political vote, but I didn't
go to DC to make easy political votes. I went
there to do the right thing, and I felt like
I did that in this case and standing up for
free speech.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
So again I applaud you for that, and I admire
your courage, and I like to think I would have
voted the same way you did, even though I share
your view that what she said is reprehensible, and in
fact I find her reprehensible. I would note, just as
a parallel, when Alvin Bragg did his law fair lawsuit
against Donald Trump, it did immense good to Donald Trump's
(02:26):
political fortunes. When Brendan Carr said the easy way or
the hard way about Jimmy Kimmel. Kimmel was suspended for
a few days and then came back to four times
or six times his normal audience, So that helped. Now
you've got the Trump administration potentially looking to indict James Callmey,
who nobody cares about, but they're gonna make him a
hero of the left. And now I feel like this
(02:48):
kind of censure, if it had passed, would have just
been an enormous fundraising opportunity and sort of making not
quite a martyr but something a victim of ilhan Omar
when she's the perpetrator and not the victim. So I
think I think politically you're on the right side as well.
Why do you think so many Republicans just seem to
(03:09):
go along with Nancy Mace, who, by the way, used
to be very interesting and is now crazy.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Rust Listen, that's a great point that you're making that politically,
something like this only empowers ilhan Omar, and we're sort
of inadvertently making her a star and boosting her profile
in a way that she otherwise wouldn't have.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Look.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
The way to address a terrible, wrong, reperhensible speech like
what ilhan Omert is doing is either ignore her or
to beat her in the realm of ideas, which is
what I think we're doing. And her talking the way
that she does is self discrediting, and when we try
to silence her and censure her and remove her from committees,
it only heightens her profile in a way that I
think undermines the point that we're trying to get, which
(03:49):
is she's wrong, and we lose sight of that when
we engage in these theatrics and do things like this.
And that's why that's a great point. And I agree
with you why I voted for this, but you're right,
it would empower her. If we had passed the center resolution.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Also, I mentioned on the show yesterday that the political
left rarely even claims to care about the Constitution, and
when they do make the claim, it's usually just because
they think there's a political advantage that can hurt Republicans
by claiming it. Going back more than a century at
least to Woodrow Wilson, the Progressives have despised the Constitution,
(04:25):
but the Conservatives and the Republicans have claimed to revere it.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
And I would like to know. I want to be
careful because I don't.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
Like asking a politician of one party to explain and
defend every other member of their party or even the president.
But I would like you to help me understand why
you think so many Republicans have been okay with what
Brendan Carr said. Too many Republicans were okay with what
Pat Bond, what Pam BONDI said, and so on. It
(04:54):
just feels like folks are abandoning the Constitution out of
some short term anger or some other thing that I
hope you can help me understand.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Well, look, what happened with Charlie Kirk was a national tragedy,
and this assassination, I mean, it cuts at the heart
of free speech and the principles that we hold as
a country. And I think a lot of people, look,
it's a lot of people were close to him, to him,
I met him once. He was very impressive in person.
I think a lot of people are emotionally. It is
a tough issue, and we're in the immediate aftermath of it.
(05:25):
I understand why people are angry and upset. But for me,
this is the time for us to stand up and
have the political courage as conservatives, that people, as people
that swore oath to the Constitution, to say things like,
you know, look the easy way or the hard way
comment that came from the SEC chairman that is that
is especially troubling because it suggests the government pressuring broadcasters
(05:46):
based on viewpoint. You know, that runs headlong into the
first first Amendment and the government should never punish or
threaten threaten to punish broadcasters because of the content of
their political speech. It's something that is conservatives Republicans that
we've seen happen to us and weaponized against us in
the past. It's wrong when it happens then, and it's
wrong for us to do it on the other side.
(06:07):
And I worry about the precedent that we'd be setting
ross if we don't stand up and speak out against this.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Well, how much of the it could put you off
the air?
Speaker 3 (06:14):
I mean right, there could be a future administration where
they're not happy with you and and somebody calls you out,
and that would be a detriment to the First Amendment.
It would be the wrong thing. And that's why it's
important for you know, libertarians like yourself, for conservatives, for
liberal for everyone to stand up and say, hey, look,
no matter where this is coming from, it's the wrong
thing to silence speech. And this is core political speech.
(06:37):
It's not like you're threatening violence to somebody. It's not
like you're, you know, advancing pornography or indecency or something like.
This is core political speech. If we disagree with it,
if it's wrong, we need to beat it in the
realm of ideas. We should not use the government to
pressure broadcasters to take this speech off the air.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
We have about a minute left here, Jeff, and for
those just joining, we're talking with Congressman Jeff Hurd, who
represents color third Congressional district, which is most of western
Colorado and most of southern Colorado. I suspect that there's
an immense number of Republicans who you work with, who privately,
in conversations with you or just in their own brains,
(07:13):
are very upset with what Brendan Carr did, and maybe
with what Pam Bondi said as well, but haven't said
it in public.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
And I wonder how you see the dynamic there.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
It seems to me that many Republican members of Congress,
House and Senate are deeply afraid of the wrath of
Donald Trump.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
And you seem not to be.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
And I wonder how you are able as a Republican
in a Republican district. You're not immune from a primary challenge,
and yet you seem to be playing this differently, more
independently from Trump.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
How are you able to do that? And why?
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Well, look, I've got my principles that I ran on.
I've never been in politics before, a career politician. I'm
not afraid of losing my job. I do the right thing.
That said, Look, I understand it's tough for a lot
of my colleagues. And the tricky part when you're in Congress,
when you're an elected official, is having the courage, group
principles and standing up for them, but also being wise
and figuring out when and how to express those views.
(08:18):
And you know, another member of Congress wants put it
really wisely. ROSSI said, you can't make everything, Alamo, and
so I hesitate to You know, a lot of these Republicans,
they are friends, their colleagues, and they are good people.
They disagree with what's happening, but how and when they
voice that disagreement sometimes it's more effective behind the scenes,
also Ross. And so I don't fault any of my
(08:40):
colleagues for handling it differently than I do. But I
do what's right by by by what I think is best,
and the consequences will come. But fundamentally, I believe this
is an issue that I'm going to stand on, and
if it results in my losing a primary or getting blasted,
it's a good principle to stand on.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
And I'm and I'm okay that Jeff Heard is Colorado's
third congressional District Congressman, Republican from Grand Junction. Thank you, Jeff,
Thank you for your time, thank you for the courageous votes,
and and and keep it up. I feel like you
and I are a little bit in the minority of
our own sides right now on some of this stuff.
(09:19):
And but but in the long run, I think people
will look back and say, you know what, Jeff was right.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
I hope it's true.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Thanks, Thank you Ross, Thank you also for fighting for
the First Amendment as well.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Good talking to you, Jeff all right, Congressman Jeff Heard
The Ross Kaminsky Show News
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