10-22-25 - *FULL SHOW* Leland Vittert GOP Who Say They Like Nazis; Mental Health

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Zero sugar Italian sweet cream product from who was a
coffee mate?

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Channon, is that right? And I sleep product nest Lee product,
and I put it in my tea.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
And I usually add a little bit of spl Stevia,
either the liquid concentrate or the powder concentrate a liquid
I'm in.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Sorry a little bit, and today I.

Speaker 1 (00:21):
Didn't because I wanted to see whether the tea would
be sweet enough for my taste because of a bit
of a sweet tooth with only the coffee mate. And
I feel like it's just a hint below what I
a hint below what I need.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
So I'm gonna leave now.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
Shannon's gonna take over.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
For a while.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
I'm gonna go put some Stevie in my tea and
I'll be back in five minutes, just kidding. I'm gonna
go during a break though, and I will put some
more sweetener in my tea. So we have a ton
of stuff to do today. We got some interesting guests,
and I am a little bit later in the show
going to react quite a lot to the news story

(01:00):
Chad Bower covered in the eight thirty News broadcast in
some depth. In the eight thirty News broadcast about Colorado,
cattle ranchers being upset with Donald Trump for proposing to
increase imports of Argentinean beef.

Speaker 3 (01:16):
And it's a coincidence that Chad.

Speaker 1 (01:20):
Well, it's not exactly a coincidence because it's in the news,
but Chad covered the story in the news just earlier
this morning before I came to work, I wrote a
substack on this very topic, and I would sure appreciate
it if.

Speaker 3 (01:34):
You would go check it out.

Speaker 1 (01:35):
Ross Kaminski Kami n sk wife you don't know how
to spell mind the last name Rosskominsky dot substack dot.

Speaker 3 (01:42):
Com, and please do subscribe.

Speaker 1 (01:44):
It's free, and I'm really you know, I'm trying to
build this thing up and maybe make it into something
a little bit significant, So you know, why don't we
start with you trying to help me get to one
thousand subscribers for my substack. I would really appreciate that.
And again, Ross, do subtack dot com. It costs you
absolutely nothing, and I usually write once or twice a

(02:05):
week and hopefully you'll find it interesting. Anyway, the one
I wrote today is about Trump and beef imports, So
I'm going to come back to that a little bit
later in the show. Now, I did send out a
tweet yesterday that I thought was mildly amusing. That said,
so you probably heard in the news that Amazon Web
Services was down for a while yesterday. Amazon Web Services

(02:28):
kind of an Internet backbone, that an Internet infrastructure essentially
that lots and lots and lots of companies own web presence.
Is based on so United Airlines, the CIA, I mean thousands, millions,
millions of business I assume it's millions of businesses use

(02:51):
Amazon Web Services behind the scenes of their websites. So
when AWS goes down, it's a big deal. And what
I said on Twitter yesterday was AWS goes down for
maybe twenty one hours, and way more people notice and
are affected by it than who notice or affected by

(03:12):
the federal government being shut down for twenty one days.

Speaker 4 (03:16):
Right.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
And then, just as if you know, to prove my point,
I saw a story this morning that I thought was
hilarious and I wanted to share it with you. This
is from PC world magazine, and that doesn't stand for
politically correct but back in the days of personal computers,
but the magazine is still around PCWorld dot com. They

(03:40):
talk about a company called eight, like the number eight Sleep,
and it's a company that makes high end quote unquote
smart beds where you can control a bunch of things
about your bed from an app on your phone. So
you can control the angle of you know, the angle
of the of the bed or the foot of the bed.

(04:01):
You can control the temperature of the bed. And I'm
sure with higher models maybe they have like I don't know,
a massage feature.

Speaker 3 (04:10):
I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (04:10):
But you get the idea, right, It's a smart bed
that you can control various things about it from the app.
So from PCWorld dot com, owners of eight sleep smartbeds
got anything but a good night's sleep on Monday, as
the beds began heating up uncontrollably while also getting frozen
in position due to Amazon's worldwide server outage. The CEO

(04:34):
of eight Sleep took to x formerly Twitter to apologize
for the malfunctioning pod that's their brand name pod smartbeds.

Speaker 3 (04:42):
Which cost a minimum of twenty.

Speaker 1 (04:44):
Six hundred dollars, and he promised that the company would
work twenty four to seven to outage proof the beds
that fixes rolling out now, the company told tech Hive
magazine and Furious eight Sleep owners vented on Reddit describing
how their smart beds were overheating and they were stuck
in odd positions. One user said, my pod is at

(05:06):
plus five above room temperature. I don't know if that
just means five degrees or five setting or whatever, but
and I'm sweating because I can't turn it down or off.
Another listener and not listener, Well, maybe he's a show listener.

Speaker 2 (05:19):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
But another one of these bed people wrote.

Speaker 1 (05:21):
Just woke up at three am because I was sweating
and I realized the bed wasn't.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
Cooling and I couldn't log into the app.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
The side buttons on my pod won't even work to
control the temperature.

Speaker 3 (05:31):
So anyway, there you go.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
This this does show a little bit of the downside
of tying every single freaking thing under the sun to
the internet. Do we have to control everything in the world?
Buy an app? And let me just say that I
raised that question as a guy who loves controlling thing
with that. Things with that, you know, go on an
app to tell my stereo what to what to play, right,

(05:53):
and use an app to control my thermostat you know,
we go out of town for a week and I
forget to turn the heat down in the winter, right,
and I don't need to keep the house at seventy
two for that week while we're away. I could turn
it down to fifty eight and not gonna, you know,
burst any pipe.

Speaker 3 (06:10):
So I can get on the app and turn the
thing down.

Speaker 1 (06:12):
There are all kinds of smart devices, and I love them,
but at some point, oh my gosh. So anyway, there
you go, And that was I just shared that with
you to kind of prove my point that AWS being
down for twenty one hours seems to have had more
impact than the federal government being down for twenty one days. Okay,

(06:33):
another story we learned yesterday. Here's a headline from USA Today.
Trump's meeting with Putin and Budapest scrapped just days after
summit was announced. So here's how I understand the story.
Secretary of State Marco Rubio, who at this moment would
probably be my first choice for president next time around,

(06:53):
had a conversation with Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, who
is a terrible human being. Now they call the conversation productive,
but the result of the call and I'm sort of
reading between the lines. This is not in an article directly,
but I'm reading between the lines. The result of the
call was Rubio must have gone to Trump and said,

(07:15):
the Russians are not serious. They're not actually looking to
negotiate everything. They still want all of the crazy stuff
they wanted before. They are not changing their demands. And
if you and you, mister president, should not meet with
Vladimir Putin in Budapest, because at this point you are
just giving him another photo op and another chance to
play you, and because that's kind of what, at least

(07:37):
what he thinks he's doing.

Speaker 3 (07:39):
So they canceled.

Speaker 1 (07:40):
Trump the American side canceled the meeting with Putin in Budapest.
And I just want to say that is the right move,
Absolutely the right move. Putin is not serious, and he's
not gonna get serious until and unless Donald Trump gets
back on the path of offering Ukraine longer range weapons.
I don't see any way out of this war. I

(08:03):
don't see any good way out of this war. And
that is not a move without risk. As we talked
about with Doomberg yesterday, it is not a move without
risk to provide Ukraine, for the US to provide Ukraine
with long range weapons. But I think that that while
not being without risk may yet end up being the
best way to get this war to some kind of

(08:25):
end that doesn't end up in simply being a victory
for Vladimir Putin. Anyway, well done by Marco Rubio and
well done by Donald Trump to cancel that meeting.

Speaker 3 (08:35):
Ross great substack article this morning.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
Now, can you follow that up with the ridiculous and
we knew this was coming decision by Trump to bail
out farmers with billions of dollars because of his stupid
trade policies.

Speaker 3 (08:47):
We did know that was coming. They haven't announced that yet.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
Actually we don't exactly know what it's going to be,
but it's almost certain that it will because this is
what happened in the first Trump administration started some trade wars.
China said we're not going to buy American agricultural products anymore,
and so then Trump basically started writing checks to farmers
to offset their lost revenue. And they will probably have
to do that again. Why didn't they just unplug the bed.

(09:12):
That's an excellent question. That's an absolutely excellent question. Although
that would not have fixed the issue of the bed
being stuck in a wrong position where you couldn't sleep.

Speaker 3 (09:21):
It certainly would have fixed the heating issue.

Speaker 1 (09:24):
Ross, Where can I find your voter guide for twenty
twenty five?

Speaker 3 (09:27):
I can only find last year's.

Speaker 1 (09:30):
I have not done one, and I don't think I'm
going to this year, and I apologize for that. I
know a lot of people really look forward to my
voter guide. It's an immense amount of work, and frankly,
there just isn't that much state wide for me to
write about.

Speaker 3 (09:45):
There are a lot of local issues, and you.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
Know, for example, I would encourage you to vote for
Don Sheehan for mayor and Centennial just as one example,
and I'd encourage you to do your own homework on
whatever your own local issues are. At the state level,
thing I would be saying in a voter guide is
vote no on Proposition LLL and Proposition m M. Vote
on there as you know, vote no.

Speaker 3 (10:09):
As often as you can.

Speaker 1 (10:10):
Oh, it's funny, Ross, what do you think about mayor
of Centennial that we overlap there? I think Don Shehan
for Mayor of Centennial, So there you go. Ross, Why
would you prefer Marco Rubio instead of JD.

Speaker 3 (10:21):
Vance?

Speaker 2 (10:22):
To me?

Speaker 1 (10:23):
JD Vance, By the way, they're both very smart, Okay,
but JD.

Speaker 3 (10:27):
Vance, in my.

Speaker 1 (10:28):
Opinion, is socially conservative and fiscally kind of liberal. He
supports big spending, he has supported he has opposed tax cuts,
and he on economic policy he's too close to being
a Democrat. So I am not a social issues conservative

(10:51):
and I am not a fiscal liberal. Rights as a
libertarian leaning person but lowercase L not a member of
the Libertarian party.

Speaker 2 (10:59):
I want a smaller.

Speaker 1 (11:01):
Government that does fewer things and spends less money, right,
and I want government to stay out of our personal lives.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
And JD.

Speaker 1 (11:10):
Vance is, you know, broadly speaking, on the wrong side
of both of those things. I'm not saying Marco Rubio
is perfect, but I prefer I prefer Marco Rubio.

Speaker 3 (11:21):
So there you go.

Speaker 2 (11:22):
But we'll see.

Speaker 1 (11:23):
There's you know, there's but three years still, so let's
let's not get ahead of ourselves.

Speaker 2 (11:30):
There.

Speaker 1 (11:31):
You know, there's still there's still three years until that
election and close to three years until we get to
the primaries and the debates or whatever. And who knows
who else will run or maybe JD. Vance will get better,
or maybe Marco Rubio will get worse.

Speaker 3 (11:43):
I don't know. No, Mom domni no, mom.

Speaker 2 (11:47):
Donni no, no, no, no, no, No, What did I
want to mention here?

Speaker 3 (11:53):
Oh? This is a thing I had.

Speaker 1 (11:56):
This is the thing I had yesterday and I didn't
get to If I owned Tesla stock, I would vote
no on this thing, but I wanted to share it
with you because it's kind of remarkable. So Tesla is
proposing a pay package for Elon Musk that says that
if the market capitalization of Tesla, and in fact, let

(12:21):
me look up what the market capitalization of Tesla is
right now, one point three six trillion dollars. The market capitalization,
by the way, is a very simple concept.

Speaker 2 (12:32):
It sounds like a big term, but it's a very
simple concept.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
Market cap means simply the current stock price multiplied by
the total number of outstanding shares of stock. And so
what it really means is the current value of the
company as measured by the stock price. The total value
of the company as measured by the stock price. Okay,

(12:57):
so it's very very simple. So it's one point three
six trillion dollars right now. This proposal for Elon Musk
would give him up to twelve percent of the company's shares,
another twelve percent on top of whatever he already owns
of the company shares if the market cap goes to

(13:19):
eight point five trillion dollars.

Speaker 2 (13:23):
Okay, so eight point five.

Speaker 1 (13:24):
Trillion dollars is six and a half times the current
market cap, so.

Speaker 3 (13:30):
That would be an enormous increase.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
But think about that, if he were to get twelve
percent of an eight and a half trillion dollar company,
that would be are you ready a trillion dollars worth
of stock?

Speaker 3 (13:44):
A trillion. There's a very.

Speaker 1 (13:46):
Big company out there called ISS Institutional Shareholder Services, and
they recommend and sometimes vote on behalf of other companies,
other organizations that hold lots of stock and don't want
to deal with voting, and they are recommending a no
vote on this.

Speaker 2 (14:04):
I don't know whether it will pass or not. I
would vote no on this.

Speaker 1 (14:08):
I'm fine with rewarding Elon Musk with a lot of
money if the stock goes up like that, but not
that much, not twelve percent of the company. I will
also note that Elon Musk holds, according to CNBC, at
least thirteen and a half percent of the current voting
power within Tesla shares, and he does get to vote

(14:29):
on this pay package. So I think there's a decent
chance that it will pass, but can you imagine a
trillion dollar payday. I got a lot of little stories
I want to do with you for a few minutes,
and then we're going to have an interesting guest on
the show talking about mental health issues as we as
we head into the holidays, and it's not normally kind
of topic I do a lot of, but actually think

(14:50):
it's real importance. We're going to do that in about
ten minutes. But till then, let me do some other
things with you. So you have probably all heard of
open Ai, or at least you have heard of their
most fai.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
This product called chat Gpt.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
They've got a bunch of other products, including this Sora
SRA two that creates videos with.

Speaker 3 (15:08):
Audio that are shockingly.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
Realistic, and we've talked about that a little bit on
the show. But open Ai.

Speaker 1 (15:16):
Is is a company to be reckoned with. There's a
piece over at Axios. The headline is open AI's metamorphosis
from chat app to tech giant, and I'm gonna go
back to that piece in a second. But what I
wanted to tell you as far as news from chat gpt,
and so far this is only for Macintosh for mac

(15:37):
Os users, but it'll be, it'll be coming for the
rest of us pretty soon. Open Ai has released a
browser right to compete with Google Chrome and Safari and
Firefox and whatever else.

Speaker 2 (15:50):
Obviously, Chrome tends to be the tends to be the
dominant one.

Speaker 4 (15:52):
Well.

Speaker 1 (15:53):
Microsoft Ads is also a very big player, but they've
released their own browser and it's called Atlas.

Speaker 2 (15:59):
And it has chat GPT built into it. Now.

Speaker 1 (16:02):
Of course, some folks will have security and privacy concerns
about this sort of thing, especially if you're.

Speaker 3 (16:08):
An old person like I am.

Speaker 1 (16:10):
Like I'm somebody who's old enough to remember when the
Internet didn't know everything about me and I actually, no,
I won't say.

Speaker 3 (16:19):
That, because not even true.

Speaker 1 (16:20):
But I care about privacy and I believe that there
should be such a thing as privacy when I wanted
at least a little bit while maintaining a realistic perspective
about the way the.

Speaker 3 (16:31):
World really is.

Speaker 1 (16:32):
Right now, I'm trying to think what it was that
happened the other day.

Speaker 3 (16:35):
Something happened the other day.

Speaker 1 (16:37):
I was a few people have told me this has
happened to them, and I'm not sure if I believe
it or not.

Speaker 2 (16:41):
But I was talking about something, and then the next
time I opened my phone some app there was an
app for that thing, and I had never seen an
app for that.

Speaker 3 (16:51):
Thing, whatever it was.

Speaker 1 (16:52):
And I don't know if that's just a coincidence. And
I noticed it because as Shannon shaking his head like
he thinks, is not a coincidence.

Speaker 3 (16:59):
And I've heard plenty of people say, you know, or
or they.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
Even think, they even think that Alexa is listening, and
that they.

Speaker 3 (17:07):
Say something in front of that device.

Speaker 2 (17:09):
And then the next time they open Amazon, Amazon, you know,
is pushing that kind of thing.

Speaker 1 (17:13):
I wouldn't put it past any of them. It's entirely possible.

Speaker 2 (17:16):
Shannon.

Speaker 1 (17:16):
You act like you're quite certain, like you have a
strong opinion about this.

Speaker 5 (17:20):
Well, I've seen people test it by doing a video
where they will hold up something on a note and say,
I haven't said this ever, but I'm going to say it,
and let's check Google. Now it doesn't show up, and
then they say the thing dog treats. I'm really looking
for some good dog treats. I don't even own a dog,

(17:41):
but I need dog treats. Open up Google, they i'm
dog treats. Yeah, okay.

Speaker 1 (17:47):
The other thing I will say is that while Shannon
and I who are of a very similar age might
find that, you know, somewhere between interesting and creepy.

Speaker 3 (18:01):
I think most people the age of let's.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Say, my kids don't have a second thought about it
because they have not grown up in a world with
an expectation of privacy, and I think they don't care.
And also, just to be clear, it's possible that these
trade offs are worth it, at least some of the time. Right,
Maybe you just got a dog and you want dog
treats and you never shopped for dog treats before, and this.

Speaker 3 (18:26):
Thing picks up, picks that up based on you saying.

Speaker 1 (18:29):
To whoever you're talking to in your house, hey, we
need to get some dog treats, and then Google or
Amazon or whoever suggests particular dog treats to you. That
could be a win win. It makes it easy for
you to shop, it makes money for them. So there
are trade offs there that are legit, right, legit. Here's
the thing with the chat GPT browser, And this is
a function that you could turn off. Okay, but just

(18:51):
so you understand one of the things that it can do.
And I'm actually gonna quote from open AI's website, so
it's their own announcement about this Atlas browser. As you
use Atlas, chat GPT can get smarter and more helpful
too browser memories. Okay, and again they say you can
turn this off, but browser memories let chat GPT remember

(19:13):
context from the sites that you visit and bring that
context back when you need it. This means you can
ask chat GPT questions like find all the job postings
I was looking at last week and create a summary
of industry trends so I can prepare for interviews.

Speaker 3 (19:32):
Isn't that interesting right?

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Chat GPT can also do work for you using agent mode,
whatever that means, with improvements that make it faster and
more useful. By working with your browsing context. It's now
better at researching and analyzing, automating tasks, and planning events
or booking appointments while you browse.

Speaker 3 (19:53):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (19:53):
Okay, So my point in bringing this to your attention
is not just the development of brows their technology and
that sort of thing, but it's just to point out
that AI.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
I'm sorry, that open Ai, which.

Speaker 1 (20:08):
Is a company that probably most people had not heard of,
maybe even as recently as a year ago, and certainly
two years ago, most people wouldn't have heard of.

Speaker 3 (20:19):
This is becoming.

Speaker 1 (20:23):
A potentially massive player in the world. Shannon, I'm starting
to zoom zoom. If that's what that call is about.
They're gonna have a new browser right there. Their social
their their Sora too, is essentially a social media network,
and you know this is it's a company really keep.

Speaker 2 (20:44):
An eye on, all right, really keep an eye on.
So I just wanted to share that with you. I
think Shannon has a call here. Let's see hell on.

Speaker 3 (20:52):
Okay, then I'm gonna.

Speaker 1 (20:53):
Do that live radio, all right, Shannon, I'm getting the
zoom going.

Speaker 2 (20:57):
You can tell them I'm getting the zoom going, all right.
So I just wanted to share that with you.

Speaker 1 (21:00):
Other thing I want to do quickly before we before
we get to my guest. Interesting story about the about
the Denver Post, and that is well sort of it's
sort of about the Denver Post. So Denver bought this
huge building at one o one West Colfax Avenue that.

Speaker 3 (21:20):
Used to be the Denver Post building.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
Although the Denver Post essentially abandoned the building, I think
their name is still on it. Figure, you know, there's
still a sign that says the Denver Post. But the
Denver Post had moved out of the building some years
before the city bought the building. Now the city bought
the building for gosh, what's the number, some double digit
millions of dollars.

Speaker 2 (21:42):
And let's see.

Speaker 1 (21:45):
And the company, and the company that bought the Denver
Post has now stopped paying their rent on the lease
in that building. Now they do have a lease on
that in that building that goes until I think twenty
twenty nine or something like that, but they've stopped paying rent.
The Denver Post is not paid more than two million

(22:06):
dollars in rent because the and that adds up very fast.
The rent is six hundred and fifty thousand dollars a month,
and plus they're adding late fees and interest and so on.
So they're over two million dollars already. And I'll tell
you what, it sure does make the folks seem a
little bit smart. Who the members of the city council

(22:27):
who voted no, who voted, Hey, you know what, we
don't we don't want to buy this building. We don't
think this buying this building is a great idea. Eighty
eight and a half million dollars they paid for it.
Eighty eight and a half million dollars is approved by
a nine to four vote, and at the time, the
director of real estate for Denver said, this is going
to be revenue neutral because you know, we'll have this

(22:48):
interest expense, but we're getting rent for of six hundred
and fifty thousand dollars a month from essentially from the
Denver Post. But in August, now the Denver Post has
stopped paying rent, and so now there's a big fight.
And I think what's going on here. Here's the sort
of reading between the lines. I think what's going on
here is that the hedge fund that owns the Denver Post,

(23:12):
in a whole bunch of other newspapers and media outlets
and so on, they want to buy out their lease,
meaning they want to say, all right, we're gonna owe
something like eight million dollars in rent for the rest
of the time of this lease.

Speaker 3 (23:27):
We were not in the building.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
We don't want to pay that much, we don't want
to keep this going. We want to buy out our lease,
so we will pay you. I'm just gonna make up
a number. Okay, We're gonna pay you five million dollars
now to be out of the lease for the rest
of the four years. Where there would be a total
of eight million dollars owed. And I think the reason
they stopped paying rent is to try to force Denver

(23:51):
to negotiate, because what I'm getting reading between the lines
is that they've wanted to buy out the lease and
have made any progress on it. So what I suggest,
what I think this is is a way for them
to force the city to negotiate.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
So in any case, I mean, that's that's real money.

Speaker 3 (24:09):
Denver is already facing something.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
Like a two hundred million dollar budget shortfall in the
next year or maybe it's this fiscal year, right, and
that's why they're laying people off and that sort of thing.
Can you know, imagine adding another six hundred and fifty
thousand dollars a month loss on top of that. It's
just something Denver really really doesn't need. So we'll see,

(24:33):
we'll see how it plays out. But I thought I
would share that with you, all right, So I am,
I am.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
This is the world of live radio.

Speaker 2 (24:41):
Here.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
Let me see if I've got my guest, because at
the moment I don't see her. I just see something
that makes me think we're probably connected. So I think
I have doctor Robin Miller, who is a board certified
internal medicine doc and an author.

Speaker 3 (24:57):
Of quite a few books in gluting.

Speaker 1 (25:01):
Heel Now time to unsick yourself with the twenty first
Century Guide to Wellness. So, doctor Miller, do I have you?

Speaker 6 (25:09):
You have me?

Speaker 7 (25:11):
I am here?

Speaker 2 (25:12):
Yeah, all right, Sorry, I would have gotten you a
little sooner, I thought, I think in my brain I
was waiting to see a picture of you.

Speaker 1 (25:17):
But anyway, thank you so much for being here. And
from time to time I've mentioned on the show that
I think one of the excellent changes that has happened
in modern, very very recent cultural changes is that it's
been it's become okay to talk about.

Speaker 3 (25:35):
Mental health challenges. And you know, as we're.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
A month ish from Thanksgiving and the beginning of the
holiday season and all, I thought it would be really
interesting to have you on the show to talk about
mental health challenges heading into the holidays.

Speaker 3 (25:48):
And especially for older folks.

Speaker 1 (25:50):
Some of my listeners are older folks, and many of
my listeners have parents who are older folks whom might
fit into this conversation. So, with that overly long introduction,
why don't you jump in with how you're thinking about
this issue?

Speaker 8 (26:03):
Well, you know, older people have taken care of people
their entire life, and one of the reasons they may
not like talking about mental health issues is they may
feel the need to be strong for their elderly parents
and their adult children because we're often sandwiched between those.

(26:24):
In addition, some people feel as you get older it's
normal to feel depressed, which it is not. And the
older generation has trouble talking about their feelings, not their
physical problems, but their feelings.

Speaker 3 (26:40):
Oh believe me, I'm Jewish.

Speaker 2 (26:41):
I know about older people talking about their physical problems.

Speaker 4 (26:45):
Oh why.

Speaker 3 (26:48):
So I know what that's about.

Speaker 1 (26:51):
So I want to focus on We've got about eight
minutes here, and I want to focus on two main
strands with you.

Speaker 3 (26:57):
One is for the.

Speaker 1 (26:58):
Older folks who might be listening or or people whose
parents are you know who we're talking about here.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
What do we do to support.

Speaker 1 (27:04):
Them in a time where we think of this maybe
as a happy time and maybe your dad or mom,
who's maybe eighty years old right now, would be struggling.
So what can we do there? And then I want
to talk to you with you about gene site. But
let's do the first thing first.

Speaker 8 (27:20):
Okay, First of all, notice that they're struggling, if there's
change in appetite, change in sleep patterns, they're not getting
out as often as they used to. They're the same
clothes as the last time you saw them. Notice that
they may be struggling. And this generation, particularly women feel

(27:42):
often feel invisible, as if they don't matter, and that
people aren't noticing them or listening to them.

Speaker 7 (27:48):
So the most important thing we can do.

Speaker 8 (27:50):
Is listen to them, engage them, ask about their past history,
have them tell you stories, and then if they're depressed
and they want medication, get them to their providers and
look into gene site, which is genetic testing.

Speaker 1 (28:09):
So I know a little bit about gene site because
many years ago one of my kids was having an
issue where it seemed like this could help, and in
fact it did help, and I think it's a fascinating
thing overall. So can you explain gene site in the
macro and then talk about how it can help with

(28:31):
the issue we're talking about today.

Speaker 8 (28:34):
Yes, So, gene site is a genetic test. It's done
with a simple cheek swab, The results come back very
quickly and Medicare pays for it.

Speaker 7 (28:45):
And what it does is.

Speaker 8 (28:46):
That we all have genes that code for enzymes in
our liver where medications go through. And what gene Site
provides is information about how medications are metabolized. Medications are
metabolized slowly, and if that's the case, there will be
side effects.

Speaker 7 (29:04):
That it may not work.

Speaker 8 (29:06):
Others are metabolized quickly, so you may need more of
that medicine or the normal metabolizers may be a better
option for that patient. So it gives you a roadmap
on what medications may be best.

Speaker 7 (29:21):
And it's a great, great tool.

Speaker 6 (29:24):
You know.

Speaker 1 (29:25):
I was talking with a friend of mine who actually
it falls perfectly into this category. I was talking with
a friend of mine who has had some struggles with
depression and had gone to you know, a few different therapists, psychiatrists,
and had gone through a handful of different psychoactive, you know,

(29:47):
antidepressant medications that didn't help, and then took this gene
site test and the gene site said, you know, this
entire category like SSRIs or something, it probably won't work
very well for you. Try a whole different category of drug.
And he did and it worked and a pretty remarkable thing.

(30:10):
And I think this is very much what you are
getting at today, right.

Speaker 8 (30:15):
Yes, it is really remarkable, and it takes away some
of the trial and error and helps point you in
the direction where the person will achieve.

Speaker 7 (30:26):
The most benefit for medication.

Speaker 8 (30:28):
And it is amazing, you know how they can go
through the same category of medicines and they won't work.
And that's the reason. Genetically they're not programmed for it
to help.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
So who does the testing and how do you get
this testing done?

Speaker 8 (30:45):
So a provider will order it, the patient can do
it themselves and send it in.

Speaker 7 (30:50):
Results come back usually within forty eight hours.

Speaker 8 (30:53):
And as I said, Medicare pays for it, so it's
very quick.

Speaker 1 (30:59):
As you follow, as we head into the holidays, is
it sort of urban legend or a real thing that
somebody who might be prone to depression, let's say, an
alderly person who might be prone to depression maybe more
likely to be suffering at this time of year.

Speaker 3 (31:17):
Is that a real thing? And if so, why it's.

Speaker 8 (31:21):
A real thing, because you know, loneliness happens around the holidays,
especially if you're not with your family, or if you're
with your family, and it's stressful. It can be for
all kinds of reasons, but definitely the holidays will accentuate
depression and loneliness.

Speaker 1 (31:37):
Yeah, I mean, without intending at all to sound sarcastic,
because you know, I'm not making light of anything. I
often talk about social media or Facebook in particular, as
a whole bunch of people showing you how much fun
they're having without you, and do you is that kind

(31:58):
of the dynamic that can happen and around the holidays
where you know somebody is maybe alone in their home
or alone in their nursing home and they know that
all these parties are going on, but they're there, and
it accentuates the loneliness that way.

Speaker 7 (32:13):
Oh absolutely.

Speaker 8 (32:14):
And again it goes to that invisibility thing where you're
feeling invisible and no one cares about.

Speaker 7 (32:19):
You and you're.

Speaker 8 (32:20):
Watching on TV and everyone's happy, or you're looking outside
and everyone's celebrating and there you are. So it's really
important to talk about it, get help, and if with medications,
have that gene site test done.

Speaker 3 (32:36):
Yeah for sure.

Speaker 1 (32:37):
All right, we're about out of time, but I want
to end with a listener question. This is from a
listener and named Linda who just texted this in who says,
it seems like there's not much conversation about single, childless
older people and what they face at the holidays, and
Linda says that's me.

Speaker 8 (33:02):
Well, Linda, I mean one thing you could do is
start looking at groups, support groups that you can join,
something you enjoy doing. You could, you know, join a
church choir, you could join a group that does you know,
volunteer work in the community. You don't necessarily have to
have children or a family. You can create your own

(33:25):
and sometimes it's more fun to find your own and
choose your own than what you what you have.

Speaker 3 (33:32):
Yeah, I agree.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
I mean, Linda, I think the thing to do is
I mean we talked. I use this language more more
often talking about my kids. But you tell them to
find their tribe, and I think that's true of people
of people of any age.

Speaker 2 (33:48):
All Right, so.

Speaker 1 (33:49):
Doc, I'm out of time, but I'm gonna ask you
another question because there's another listener question. I think it's
really important this time of year. Anything you want to
say about seasonal effective disorder.

Speaker 7 (33:59):
Oh ye, start early. Light boxes help.

Speaker 8 (34:03):
Usually you start noticing it around August when the light changes,
so get on it quickly.

Speaker 7 (34:09):
And that's another thing.

Speaker 8 (34:10):
If you need medication, gene site can be quite helpful
to find the right medication for you. And seasonal effective disorder,
like anything else, could get worse around the holidays when
it gets particularly dark as well.

Speaker 7 (34:24):
So address it, don't ignore it.

Speaker 1 (34:27):
Doctor Robin Miller, Board Certified Internal Medicine DOC, author of,
among other things, Heal Now time to unsick yourself with
the twenty first Century Guide to Wellness. Doc, you're a
great guest. Thanks for being here. Really appreciate it.

Speaker 7 (34:41):
Thanks for having me.

Speaker 8 (34:41):
And if you have any questions go to gene site
dot com. G E N E s I g h
T dot com.

Speaker 1 (34:49):
Yeah, and folks, I will tell you that that test
actually made a difference for a member of my family.
Not this issue, but on an issue, and I'm a believer.
Gene site dot com. Thanks, doc, appreciate it.

Speaker 7 (35:02):
Welcome, Thanks for having me.

Speaker 2 (35:03):
All Right, we'll take a quick break. We'll be right
back on Kawa. I might need to drag this into
the next segment of the show.

Speaker 1 (35:09):
Okay, So now, Chad Bauer has at least twice this
morning talked about what is a very interesting and important story,
and that is that President Trump has made some comments
about the price of beef, and several days back he
said he's going to try to do something about the
price of beef. And you may recall that I had
on my show just a few weeks ago a guy
named Jordan Levy, who runs the largest cattle feed lot

(35:34):
operation in the United States, maybe in the world. All right,
so one of the biggest players in the beef industry.
And short version, one of the things he said is
beef prices are going up before they go down, and
the reason is herds.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
Cattle.

Speaker 3 (35:48):
Herds are really small for a variety of.

Speaker 1 (35:51):
Reasons, but essentially it comes primarily it comes down to
high price of feed and high price of some other things.
And anyway, herds are small, and so you've got supply demand, right,
and supply is going down faster than demand, so prices
are going up.

Speaker 3 (36:10):
And of course when prices go up, that does.

Speaker 1 (36:12):
Reduced demand, depending on the elasticity of demand. But in
any case, President Trump knows that one of the reasons
he got elected was cost of living and inflation, and
in particular because it's a thing we notice so often,
the cost of food. Right, you go to the supermarket.
I went to supermarket yesterday, and it's true, I'm a

(36:36):
little bit cheap. There's no doubt about that. Okay, I'm
not saying that's not true, but I think whether you're
a price sensitive shopper or not, you notice the price
of the food. You notice that. Just pick a small thing, right.
It used to be that the kind of fancy yogurts

(36:57):
were a dollar twenty five or a dollar fifty, like
the new Cey yogurt, and now it's two dollars if
it's not on sale.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Even this just a very.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
Macro kind of concept, not so much a supermarket, but
the dollar stores, right, Dollar Tree and so on. It's
all a dollar twenty five, right or more. There's some
things that are more now. But when you think about that,
you might think, you know, I was gonna buy something,
so I was gonna buy a box of Junior Mints
for a dollar, and now it's a dollar twenty five,
and you think, I don't care, it's twenty five cents.
I got quarters lying around doesn't mean anything to me.

(37:29):
But think about it in percentage terms, and think about that.
The billion dollars of stuff being bought at Dollar Tree
over the course of however long it takes them to
sell a billion dollars of stuff. But that's now a
one billion, two hundred and fifty million dollars. That's two
hundred and fifty million dollars extra coming out of the
pockets of shoppers, even if it's only twenty five cents

(37:51):
at a time, or you know you bought you bought
ten things at the dollar store, so it's two dollars
and fifty cents at a time.

Speaker 3 (37:57):
At some point you start to feel it.

Speaker 1 (37:59):
Now, in the grocery world, one of the most visible
things I think is beef. And again, if you weren't
listening earlier in the show, I mentioned that I wrote
a substack about this this morning before coming to work,
and then it turns.

Speaker 3 (38:13):
Out I hear Chad talking about it.

Speaker 1 (38:15):
So I hope you will go to Rosskominski dot substack
dot com and subscribe to my substack and read that note.
It's free to subscribe to my substack, and I think
it's worth a little bit more than that. So Ross
Kominski Kami n Sky dot substack dot com. Now Donald
Trump knows that food prices are a big deal. They
are important, even though he's not running for office. Again,

(38:37):
every little bit that sort of diminishes people's enthusiasm for
Republicans is bad for Donald Trump because he wants to
try to maintain a majority in both Houses of Congress
in the next election. So he's going to act almost
as if he is still running for reelection, or that
he is running for reelection, even though he's not. And
he says all the time food prices are down, they're not.

(38:59):
This is one of, you know, one of the things
that he says is that it's just an outright lie.
Food prices are not coming down. They're just going up
a little bit slower than they were before, but they're
still going up. Ground beef prices right now are the
highest they've ever been, well over six dollars a pound
for ground beef prices the highest they've ever been. So

(39:23):
Trump realizes this is a pain point for consumers and
he wants to do.

Speaker 3 (39:26):
Something about it.

Speaker 1 (39:26):
So he said, I'm going to try to do something
about beef prices. And I sent an email to Jordan Levy,
you know, this beef kingpin guy, and I said, it
seems to me the only thing that Trump could potentially
do to reduce beef prices would be to slash tariffs
so that we can import more beef into the United States,

(39:48):
and Jordan said, that's exactly right. That's the only thing
the president could possibly do is is that lower tariffs
and import more beef. And so then I asked, all right,
I know that the Trump administration and I was way
ahead of the curve on this, I have to say,
because this was before Trump ever mentioned Argentina.

Speaker 3 (40:07):
I said to Jordan, it's clear.

Speaker 1 (40:09):
That the United States government is trying to interact with
Argentina a lot. We are offering them a twenty billion
dollar bailout or a forty billion dollar bailout, it's unclear which.

Speaker 3 (40:19):
And we're trying to get them.

Speaker 1 (40:20):
To stop selling so many soybeans to China because they're
providing the competition for American soy or they're providing the
replacement for American soybeans, since China doesn't want to buy
American soybeans. And we want Argentina to start working more
cooperatively with US and less cooperatively with China, and the
United States is actually going to be trying to get
a whole bunch of South American countries to do that.

(40:44):
And then it turns out that's exactly what Trump is
thinking about, right, So now he's talking about lowering tariffs
on imported beef. Now, I got a lot to say
about this, a lot, So I'm gonna say, I'm gonna
say a little more here, just briefly, and then I'm
gonna go continue in the next segment of the show because
I have a very, very fundamental point to make that

(41:05):
is going to put me, maybe for the first time ever,
on the opposite side of an issue from Colorado cattle ranchers. Normally,
I'm with the Colorado cattle ranchers, you know, against Jared Polis,
let's say, against Mike Johnston, let's say against you know,
radical leftists who just want us to eat crickets and vegetables.

Speaker 3 (41:27):
But I think I don't think I.

Speaker 1 (41:32):
Am very much against the position being taken by the
cattle ranchers associations that Chad Bauer explained in the news broadcast.
He shared some of their statements, and I think their
statements are morally wrong.

Speaker 2 (41:48):
Now I don't.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
I mean, I would probably take the same position they
are if I were if I were in there, if
I were in their shoes.

Speaker 3 (41:56):
But I think what they're doing.

Speaker 1 (41:58):
Is something that everybody should actually oppose. And I say
that in addition to telling you that even if we
imported a lot more beef from Argentina, it would represent
such a small percentage of the American demand for beef

(42:19):
that it would barely move the price. Maybe you would
see a pound of ground beef go from six dollars
and thirty cents to six dollars and twenty cents because
American demand is so big. In Argentina as much as
it supplies isn't that much. But anyway, I have a
more fundamental economic and even moral point to make, And

(42:42):
I hate to say it, but I'm going to take
the opposite side from the cattle wrenchers.

Speaker 2 (42:47):
Was I supposed to ask what that music was for?

Speaker 3 (42:49):
Just the beef?

Speaker 1 (42:50):
What's for dinner? Oh right, where's the beef? Is what
My substack, by the way, is entitled where's the beef?
That's my substack note today. Okay, So here's what I
want to say about the reaction of the cattle industry
to President Trump suggesting he made lower tariffs to allow

(43:10):
more affordable beef to come into this country.

Speaker 3 (43:12):
First, as I said earlier, the amount of beef.

Speaker 1 (43:16):
That's available to import from Argentina, in terms of how
much more could come in than what already comes in
is not very much, and it is not you know,
we're talking about maybe one percent two percent of American
demand for beef, because America is a huge country. And yes,
Argentina produces lots of beef, but they eat most of
it in Argentina and they export it to plenty of

(43:38):
other places as well. So even if we could take
as much Argentina and Argentinian exports as possible, you're still
really only talking about, you know, impacting prices here very
very much on the margin.

Speaker 3 (43:52):
But here's the part that galls me about all of this.

Speaker 1 (43:56):
One of the major beef organizations in this country, the
National Cattleman's Beef Association, came out with a statement saying,
we don't want Trump to interfere with the free market. Wait,
what the tariffs are the interference with the free market.
If Trump would lower tariffs, all that's doing is allowing

(44:17):
a free market. And I this is what pisces me off.
For the record, I want our ranchers to be profitable.
That doesn't mean I want them to charge the highest
price they can they possibly can, because there's some number
of thousands of ranchers and there are some number of
you know, investors who own commodities and stuff like that,

(44:40):
and then there's a few hundred million Americans who probably
like to eat beef, and just in general, in this
entire conversation that we have on an ongoing basis about trade, I'm.

Speaker 2 (44:53):
Kind of.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
Frustrated with comments like this one I got by text Ross,
screw Argentina.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
We should be taken care of our own country.

Speaker 1 (45:05):
But you don't seem to understand that the victims here
of the tariffs are the Americans, not the Argentinians. If
we were to lower tariffs, yeah, Argentina would sell more
beef to the United States of America. Now they're gonna
sell that beef somewhere else anyway, So it's not a
big win for Argentina.

Speaker 3 (45:25):
It's maybe a small win.

Speaker 1 (45:27):
If they're selling the beef to us for a little
bit more, perhaps then they'll be selling to other people. Though,
the real people here you need to think about are
the American consumers, the people who want to buy a
steak or buy a burger. I got another listener, text Ross,
You're not with ranchers. You're tremendously anti agricultural. So that's

(45:49):
just a boneheaded ignorant comment because I've always taken the
side of agriculture against for example, Jared Polis and other
Democrats and stuff like that.

Speaker 3 (45:58):
But you've got to understand that you should.

Speaker 1 (46:04):
I want to encourage you. I don't like using the
term should. I want to encourage you to focus on
the American consumer. Are you Are you really saying and
some people will, by the way, let me just make
this clear, some people will answer yes.

Speaker 3 (46:21):
To the question I'm about to post. Are you really saying.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
That the ribbi steak that used to be nine dollars
that is now eighteen dollars and that's not an exaggeration?
Are you really saying you're okay paying eighteen dollars for
a ribbi.

Speaker 3 (46:40):
Because you care so much about American.

Speaker 1 (46:45):
Or Colorado ranchers maximizing their profits that you are willing
to spend more of your own hard earned money on
that steak so that that rancher has a higher profit,
even though it means now you have less money to
buy other food, to go on vacation, to save for retirement,

(47:06):
to save for your children's education, all this stuff. And
I want to be clear and just following. Actually, I
was just going to say what this listener said. The
ranchers aren't setting the prices. The market sets the prices.
But to have these ranchers out there saying that by
lowering tariff's Trump would be interfering with the free market

(47:29):
is incredibly Orwellian language. If we didn't have the government
making it so expensive to import beef, we would have
Americans voluntarily buying Argentinian beef, Brazilian beef, Australian beef.

Speaker 3 (47:45):
Wherever it comes from. That's the free market.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
You freely buying what you want to buy in the marketplace,
and prices would come down. It's true, ranchers don't set
the prices.

Speaker 3 (47:56):
The market does.

Speaker 1 (47:57):
That's true of pretty much every commodity diamonds right. But
the government is actively preventing a free market, and these
ranching cattle organizations have the balls to come out and
say that Donald Trump shouldn't lower tariffs that he raised

(48:19):
because somehow that would.

Speaker 2 (48:20):
Be an assault on free markets.

Speaker 1 (48:22):
That turns logic on his head, on its head, But
it also turns morality on its head because the losers
here are tens of millions of Americans.

Speaker 3 (48:34):
Oh I see what it is.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
Yeah there you go, all right, you want me to
talk about that now. I mean, you put it in
your show sheet at this time. Your voice sounds a
little hoarse. Are you are you? Did you stay up
too late? Are you all right? My wife's trying to
get me sick? Are you feeling a little bit sick?
You feel though outside of my throat? Yeah, I'm talking
through razor blades right now. I feel fine. Really, you
have a sore throat? Yeah, don't breathe on me.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
I hope you feel better. Which one of those things
came first? Yeah, look at that. He just breathed on me.

Speaker 1 (49:02):
If it could go through the microphone and into my ears,
it would have just it would have just done that.

Speaker 2 (49:08):
All right.

Speaker 1 (49:08):
So since Dragon played the bus music, let's let's do
this thing. Denver Post story OURTD ridership still falling as
state pushes transit oriented development.

Speaker 2 (49:19):
Quote, we're not moving the needle. There's a lot of
stuff going on here.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
It actually ties in a little bit to what I
talked about yesterday with the Colorado Energy Office and will Tour,
saying how changes to Colorado's potential rollout of renewable energies
would interfere with the state's climate goals and I said,
the state shouldn't have climate goals. The state can't influence
the climate, and probably even every state together in the

(49:46):
United States probably couldn't influence the climate, but certainly Colorado can't,
and we shouldn't have climate goals because.

Speaker 3 (49:51):
It makes us make stupid decisions.

Speaker 1 (49:54):
And we get And I also said that a lot
of that comes from the religious sort of opposition to
fossil fuels from certain folks. Some people actually just think
that fossil fuels are harmful.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
They just don't understand science very well.

Speaker 1 (50:11):
And other people make a living raising money scaring people
into thinking that fossil fuels are harmful, so they are
grifting off of people who just don't understand science very well.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
And you get a similar.

Speaker 1 (50:24):
Kind of dynamic when it comes to public transportation, right.
You know the crowd, the same crowd that removed traffic
lanes on Broadway so they could put in bike lanes,
and they're.

Speaker 2 (50:36):
Doing that on Callfax. They took out a lane. I
think they took out a lane to put in a
bike lane, and they're taking out another.

Speaker 1 (50:41):
Lane to put in a bus lane, I think. But
you know what I'm talking about anyway, Right, these people
who just want to force you out of a car. Now,
I'm not saying there's no use for public transportation. There
can be a use if you live very near public transportation,
and especially trains, which I think are much better than
buses conceptually. I'm not talking about economically right now, right

(51:04):
but you could get on a train and in a
you know, a few stops or eight stops or whatever,
it drops you off very near where you work.

Speaker 3 (51:11):
That can be pretty cool. But trains just go where
they go.

Speaker 2 (51:15):
The tracks are where they are, and if you don't
live near where the tracks are or work near where
the tracks are, on the other end, it's probably not
so great for you.

Speaker 3 (51:23):
But you still have.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
These quasi religious people who want to force you onto
the train or onto the bus, and so they spend
a lot of money in a sort of if we
build it, they will come kind of mindset.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
But it doesn't always work that way.

Speaker 1 (51:38):
And as part of the reason that light rail in
particular has tended to be a massive fiscal loser, a
massive boondoggle. In almost every place in America that it's
been tried, there may be a couple of places where
you know where the train is kind of sort of
close to break even. I don't think there's any place
where it's profitable. So this store in the Denver Post,

(52:01):
they start by talking about a guy who works in
Denver and he has to take or maybe he I
don't know where he works. He works in our vat,
I don't know where he lives. And he says he
takes a trip in buses and trains that takes.

Speaker 3 (52:20):
Ninety minutes each way on a good day.

Speaker 2 (52:21):
He's twenty two years old, young kids, trying to make
his way in the world.

Speaker 3 (52:25):
But he says it's inconvenient.

Speaker 1 (52:26):
And he was talking to a reporter for the Denver
Post on a recent rainy evening waiting for a nearly
empty train that was eight minutes late.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
Now, because he doesn't make much money and he's on Medicaid,
that qualifies him for very inexpensive a very inexpensive monthly
pass on URTD and he can ride this stuff for
very little money.

Speaker 3 (52:49):
And he says it lets him save money.

Speaker 1 (52:50):
For a car or an electric bike or something that
would let him get where he wants to go faster
and in a better way. But the bigger point of
this article is this, and I'm going to quote his
plight reflects a core problem of lagging ridership that RTD
directors increasingly run up against as they try to position
the transit agency as the smartest way to navigate Denver.

(53:12):
Most other US public transit agencies, too, are grappling with
a version of this problem.

Speaker 3 (53:17):
That's what I said a minute ago.

Speaker 1 (53:19):
In Colorado state, government driven efforts to concentrate the growing
population in high density transit oriented development around bus and
train stations a priority for legislators.

Speaker 3 (53:31):
It's really a priority for Democratic legislators.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
And Governor Jared Poulis Hinge on having a swift public
system that residents actually ride.

Speaker 3 (53:42):
Oh maybe they forgot that part.

Speaker 1 (53:44):
But transit ridership has failed to rebound a year after
RTD's havoc in twenty twenty four, when agency managers disrupted
service downtown for one hundred and fifty two million dollar
rail reconstruction following a system wide emergency maintenance blitz blitz
to smooth deteriorating tracks. So basically, they found that the

(54:07):
tracks were wearing out a lot faster than they thought
they would, so they had to massively slow down or
they had to reduce the number of trains that were running,
and they entirely closed some lines for a while, and
then they had these ten mile per hour slow zones
for the trains.

Speaker 2 (54:24):
Might as well be on.

Speaker 1 (54:24):
A bus if you're on it, right, if you're on
a ten mile hour So anyway, the latest ridership numbers
show ridership declining by about four four percent this year.
That's a real number. Okay, four percent with now, now listen,
listen to this number.

Speaker 3 (54:42):
Are you ready? I assume this is right.

Speaker 1 (54:44):
I haven't like contacted the reporter to say, are you
sure about this number? Forty million fewer rides per year
as compared to Actually it says riders, But I can't
be riders. It would have to be rides because they're
on't forty million people in Colorado, but with forty so
i'll call it forty million fewer rides per year as

(55:05):
compared with six years ago. And RTDs newly proposed record
high one point three billion dollar budget for next year
doesn't include any money to increase the frequency of bus
or trains to win riders back. In other words, riders

(55:25):
might say, you know, I'd be happy to take a
bus or train, but not if I have to wait
half an hour for it, because my time is worth
more than that, And I'll take the Uber, or I'll
buy a car, or I'll do some other thing because
my time is worth something. And so if you're unable
to have these things running at frequencies that will cause
people to ride them, then people aren't going to ride them,

(55:46):
and you're just going to be in this vicious circle
and stint. Rep Meg Frolick, I hope I'm pronouncing her
name right, but she's an Englewood Democrat. She's she's actually
the chair of the House Transportation, Housing and Local Government Committee.
She says, what's the point of transit oriented development if
it's just development?

Speaker 3 (56:06):
And what she means by that is, what if there's
no transit.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
Right, what's the purpose of passing these laws, passing these
zoning changes all around Colorado and trying to push people
to build you know, small error condos and apartments and
very you know, so you can get hundreds of people
in a few square blocks because it's right near the
train or right near some major bus thing, but especially

(56:30):
train if.

Speaker 2 (56:31):
You don't actually have functional train system.

Speaker 1 (56:33):
So Meg says, we need reliable transit to have transit
oriented development. We have cities that invested significant resources into
their transit oriented communities and RTD is not holding up
its end of the bargain. Now, there is a lot
more to this article. It is a very long article,
and they're not going to read more of it to you.
It is up on my blog at Roskaminsky dot com

(56:56):
with a gift link, so you don't need to have
a Denver Post subscription to read it. But what we
need to understand is this train and bus ridership. Train
and bus ridership is way way down, especially train and
I don't know how you fix this. I really don't.

(57:17):
This is a very very much of a horse versus
cart problem.

Speaker 2 (57:21):
Can you?

Speaker 1 (57:22):
Is there any point in building high density residential stuff
near train stations? In fact, I'm looking at some right
over here right what does that call like Bellevue Station?
I think I've never ridden it, which may be a
message there, But what's the purpose of building that if
the train system is so shoddy that people won't ride

(57:44):
the train? And then if you're so are you going
to build the development and push lots of people onto
the train that way and raise the funding for the
train system so that they can afford to run more trains,
or do you have to make the train system better
in order to get to people who live in the
apartments or condos that I'm looking at right now to
even be willing to take the risk of riding the train,

(58:06):
you know, or a bus versus car pooling or taking
an uber or just buying their own car and driving
to work. So this is an ongoing, huge issue. It's
going to be a huge issue in Denver for quite
a while. I'm going to come back briefly to this
issue of potential Argentinean.

Speaker 2 (58:25):
Beef imports into the United States because I think there's a.

Speaker 1 (58:29):
Fundamental economic lesson here, and I talked about it a
little bit already. I'm not going to go over this
too much, I will say in response, there was a
listener who asked a really really good question about margins,
meaning essentially profits in the beef industry.

Speaker 3 (58:44):
And I am not expert, but from what I gather, right.

Speaker 1 (58:47):
So, you've got this incredible supply chain. You've got the
people who are raising the cows, raising calves into cows.
Then you've got feed lots that are feeding the cows
the cows. You've got the slaughter houses and the packers
that are killing the cows and turning them into steaks
and ground beef and whatever else. You've got the rest

(59:10):
of the supply chain that delivers that stuff to the supermarket.
And I'm sure I'm and even and this is more tangential,
but you've got the people who supplied the feed right
whatever the cows are eating, to the feed lots and
to the ranchers who are raising them. From anyway, my
point is, profit margins are very different throughout that chain,
and I think the packers right now are kind of

(59:30):
suffering because demand at the margin. There is demand destruction.
When ground beef goes from three dollars to six dollars
and when rabbi goes from nine dollars to eighteen dollars,
there is some demand destruction there, and you want to
kind of keep volumes up to some degree. You're trying
to revenue maximize. So it's not consistent. So there could
be parts of that supply chain that have huge profits

(59:54):
right now and some part that have very small profits
right now. And I am definitely not expert on which
parts have which profits. It's a very very complex industry.
In fact, most industries are way more complex than most
people understand. You go to the supermarket and you buy anything,
there's so much that went into it. So, you know what,

(01:00:16):
here's the greatest thing of all time. I'm not going
to read it to you, but have you ever heard
of an essay called I, And that's the letter I
I pencil. Have you heard of this essay I comma pencil.
Just go look it up and read it. It is
arguably the greatest essay of all time about how even

(01:00:41):
a simple thing is incredibly complex to make, and how
specialization is really important, and how there may not be
more than a few people in the whole world who
actually know how to make a pencil. And I mean

(01:01:02):
every step of the way, right, know how to make
an eraser, starting back at the rubber plant. And I
mean the tree, right, not the fat And I don't
mean rubber factory. I mean the rubber plant, the rubber
tree of how to take zinc or and turn it
into that little metal piece that holds the eraser in.

(01:01:23):
And I'm having a brain cramp on what that piece
is called. You look that up, war me dragon, what's
the little metal piece called that holds an eraser? Anyway,
it's so there's probably nobody on earth who by themselves
could make a pencil, and yet there's billions of pencils
available and they're almost free. Isn't that amazing? And almost

(01:01:46):
every industry is so much more complicated. I'm sure that
your business, or whatever business you used to be in,
has so many intricacies that I don't understand, that even
your own customers don't understand.

Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
And I think that's an amazing thing about the world.
I really do, I really do, all right, Ross, you
raise steers for me, I was using cattle.

Speaker 1 (01:02:10):
You're right, cows for milk, but cattle was the word
I meant to use, rather than cows.

Speaker 3 (01:02:14):
But I get you with steers as well. What did
you find?

Speaker 2 (01:02:17):
The metal bit is called a feral feral? Okay, there
you go, so know it had a name that's fascinating.

Speaker 3 (01:02:24):
There you go.

Speaker 8 (01:02:24):
So you know.

Speaker 2 (01:02:25):
I think there was a particular.

Speaker 1 (01:02:28):
Listener text that I wanted to respond to, and and
I really think it raises an important economic point. And
I think I need to scroll down a little further
here because I'm getting a lot of texts and I
just so I want to make sure I can find

(01:02:48):
this one, and this listener said, Okay, here we go Ross,
what effect would.

Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
This change.

Speaker 1 (01:02:57):
Have on our farmers? And I think you know, really
we're talking about ranchers here, people raising cattle. And if
you missed the first part of the conversation, the effect
being discussed is what would the effect be of lowering
tariffs so that Americans could import more beef from Argentina
or Brazil or other places where the prices are for

(01:03:17):
the imports are artificially high because of government imposed sales
taxes called tariffs. And again this listener question is what
effect would this have on the ranchers if we allowed it.
I'm on the fence about this decision, and I'm going
to say something that's not going to be very popular
with everybody, especially the couple people who are already yelling

(01:03:40):
at me saying I'm not sufficiently pro agriculture.

Speaker 3 (01:03:43):
And I think you misunderstand me.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
It's not really that I'm pro or anti agriculture. I
am pro the American consumer. I don't really care about
the producer in a direct way. I care about the
producer in an indirect way. I care about the producer
in the sense that I care about the consumer, and
I want the consumer to have access to all kinds

(01:04:07):
of things in a you know, high quality if possible,
at a range of prices. And maybe it'll be a
lower quality at a lower price, but at least I
want the thing to be available at a lower price.
And that means that I want the ranchers and people
who produce everything anything you want to think about buying
a steak, a T shirt, a radio, microphone, what's just

(01:04:31):
in my radio studio? Here can of lysol that Gina
brought in, some earbuds that I'm wearing, some paper, some
tea that I'm drinking.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
I want all of these things. Yes, dragon, three ring binder, Yes,
a three ring binder.

Speaker 1 (01:04:46):
I want all of these things to be available to consumers,
and that means they must be producible by producers for
a profit. So I want producers to be profit but
that doesn't mean I'm going to focus my attention on

(01:05:06):
making sure they're profitable. Rather, I want the free market
to take care of that. So when the listener says,
what will the effect be on ranchers, I'm on And
the listener says, I'm on the fence about the decision
because of the effect on American farmers and ranchers, and
I say to you, I understand that concern, but our

(01:05:28):
focus should be on the American consumer and the American rancher.
If prices go down, the American rancher will, as they
always have, find a way to adapt, just as every
market finds a way to adapt. And I note that
beef prices have in the past been much lower than this,
and the margins can be typed because food for this

(01:05:49):
for the cattle is very expensive. Other inputs are expensive,
the labor to have people working on this stuff more
expensive than it used to be.

Speaker 2 (01:05:57):
I get it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:58):
Margins can be squeezed, fits can be squeezed, but over time,
the industry will adapt, just like it always has. And
I want to encourage you to not spend your time
focusing and this is not just about beef, now, this
about everything. Do not let the politicians who are trying
to buy the votes of cattle, ranchers or steel makers,

(01:06:20):
do not let them fool you into thinking that your
concern as a voter should be with the steel manufacturer
or the rancher or the farmer. There's thousands of them,
and there's a few hundred million Americans, all of whom
suffer from the higher prices caused by protectionism, and their
suffering means they have less money to spend on other things.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
From American companies.

Speaker 1 (01:06:43):
So you see a few winners and you don't see
the huge number of losers. And I just want to
tell you, in general, whatever gets lower prices for the
American consumer will in the long run be the best
thing for the United States. I care more for the
American worker than the consumer, which is the same people.

Speaker 3 (01:07:02):
Look, I get it, I get it, but.

Speaker 1 (01:07:05):
I think that's as a way to think about economics.
I think it's wrong in the sense that I think
you end up benefiting the American worker when you think
about the consumer. I think if you put your focus
on the worker, I think you harm the consumer. I'm
not going to spend more time on that today. I
do think that what this listener is saying, you know,

(01:07:27):
caring more for the American worker than the consumer, I
think it's a I think it's a common perspective, and
I don't share it for the reason. I'm not against
the American worker, right, I just believe.

Speaker 3 (01:07:42):
It's I it's what I said. I won't say it again.
That's enough, So all right, what else do I want
to do here.

Speaker 1 (01:07:49):
The The Washington Post picked up on a story that
I shared with you the other day about peanut allergies,
and I just think this is super interesting. I just
want to go back to it a little bit. So
on Monday, the journal Pediatrics published a study that said
that in some number of recent years, the number of
peanut allergies in the United States has dropped by more
than forty percent. And as we talked about last time,

(01:08:13):
this is almost certainly because some years ago doctors changed
federal guidelines and said that mothers should introduce foods containing
peanuts to babies in their first year of life, which
was kind of the opposite of what had been said before.

(01:08:34):
And I just want to share this Washington Post piece.

Speaker 3 (01:08:36):
With you a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:08:37):
I think it's really good. I think it's on target.
I think it's interesting.

Speaker 1 (01:08:40):
So the Post says this trend is worth celebrating on
public health grounds. It also represents a triumph of science
over hysteria, a cautionary tale about the harm that public
health advocacy can cause when experts fall prey to group think.

Speaker 3 (01:08:56):
By the way that happened.

Speaker 1 (01:08:58):
Experts falling great a group that prey to group think
happened very very much during COVID, right with the lockdowns,
with the six foot rules and all kinds of stuff
like that. So in any case, let me just keep
going with the peanut allergies. America's brought relationship with peanuts
began in the nineteen nineties, when the media started to

(01:09:18):
sensationalize tragic stories of children experiencing severe allergic reactions after
being exposed to peanuts.

Speaker 3 (01:09:25):
Sometimes resulting in death.

Speaker 1 (01:09:27):
Now, these accounts just follow this because it's interesting how
it developed into a thing that caused so much harm
in America. Okay, so these accounts produced a snowball effect.
More researchers started to study peanut allergies using self reported
incidents from parents, which reinforced the perception of a growing,

(01:09:51):
quote unquote epidemic that needed to be addressed. In fact,
there probably wasn't really any epidemic, and there probably wasn't
really an increase in the number of peanut allergies at
that time.

Speaker 3 (01:10:05):
You just start studying it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:06):
You start asking people, hey, anybody got a peanut allergy?
And then people who never disclosed it before raise their heads, Yeah,
I do, kind of like, what's going on with autism,
what may be going on to a degree with autism,
which is and we're gonna have actually Leland vinnerd on
the show in less than half an hour, and he
just wrote a book about growing up as an autistic kid,

(01:10:26):
and he talks frequently about how the rate of autism
among kids in America is.

Speaker 3 (01:10:33):
I don't know thirty times what.

Speaker 1 (01:10:34):
It used to be, but some part of that absolutely positively,
and maybe all of it, but at least a lot
of it comes from having changed the definition of autism
and asking about it more, looking into it, more looking.

Speaker 3 (01:10:48):
For cases of it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:50):
And it used to be that only very severe autism
cases would have been described as counted as autism, but
now things that are much lower down on quote unquote
the spectrum are counted as autism. And so you have
what appears to be a massive increase in the number
of cases of autism that might not represent any true

(01:11:14):
increase in the prevalence of autism in our country at all.

Speaker 3 (01:11:18):
I'm not saying for sure there's no increase.

Speaker 1 (01:11:20):
There could be an increase in autism from other causes,
but I would bet any amount of money that most
of the increase comes from changing the definition of autism
and looking for it more in any case, So going
back to this peanut thing.

Speaker 2 (01:11:37):
In two thousand, the year two thousand, the.

Speaker 1 (01:11:39):
American Academy of Pediatrics issued a recommendation that kids who
were at high risk of developing an allergy should avoid
peanuts entirely until they turn three, but was unclear what.

Speaker 3 (01:11:51):
Kids were high risk.

Speaker 1 (01:11:53):
So then many pediatricians and parents thought, all right, I'm
just gonna not expose my kids or my patients, you know,
or patients kids to peanuts. And it just turned into
this whole anti peanut thing. And I get it, right,
If the doctors are saying, well, if your kid is
high risk, don't expose them to peanuts, Well, if you're

(01:12:13):
not a doctor and you're not a scientist, what's going
to come into your mind. What's going to come into
your mind is exposing your kids to peanuts apparently is
a risk.

Speaker 3 (01:12:19):
So I won't expose my kids to peanuts.

Speaker 1 (01:12:22):
And of course what people missed is that not exposing
their kids to peanuts is actually the much bigger risk,
much much bigger risk. So the result of all that
was kids failed to have their immune systems trained to
recognize the proteins in peanuts, which is what our bodies
react to if you're allergic, to recognize those.

Speaker 3 (01:12:44):
Peanut proteins as not being dangerous.

Speaker 1 (01:12:46):
So instead of preventing peanut allergies, the number of peanut
allergies absolutely exploded. From two thousand and five to twenty fourteen,
the number of visits to emergency rooms for peanut reactions tripled,
and by twenty nineteen, according to one study, one in

(01:13:08):
eighteen American kids had an allergy to peanuts. Now, I
don't know if that number is right. Even if we're
off by a factor of ten. Even if it were
one out of one hundred and eighty American kids at
an allergy to peanuts, that would still be a stunningly
high number. That would be a much, much, much higher
number than what I understood to be the case in

(01:13:30):
the kids who I grew.

Speaker 3 (01:13:31):
Up around right.

Speaker 1 (01:13:34):
One in eighteen though, can you imagine this had a
profound impact on the country.

Speaker 3 (01:13:39):
Many schools, egged.

Speaker 1 (01:13:41):
On by overly protective parents, and I'm quoting from the
Washington Post here, began aggressively policing peanut containing products, some
even segregating kids at different tables during lunchtime based on allergies,
universities have created allergy free zones, airlines have largely eliminated
peanuts on flights, and as The Washington Post notes, maybe

(01:14:03):
the most striking aspect of this whole story is how
long it took the medical establishment to change course. Researchers
began recognizing the downside of peanut avoidance within just a
few years of the American Association of Pediatrics guidance in
the year two thousand, especially because other countries that did
not adopt that guidance had far far lower rates of

(01:14:27):
peanut allergies.

Speaker 2 (01:14:27):
But it took until twenty.

Speaker 1 (01:14:29):
Fifteen for public health experts at the federal government to
officially acknowledge what had been obvious for years. And even
then it took publication of a landmark paper that definitively
showed that feeding peanuts to babies dramatically reduces their chances
of developing an allergy when they grow up. And all

(01:14:50):
of this shows the risk of overreaction in the realm
of public health. Pediatricians did not intend to exacerbate peanut allergies,
but by draining from scientific evidence, they made things worse.
With trust and health agencies continuing this lie downward. These
are mistakes that the medical field cannot afford to keep making.

Speaker 2 (01:15:13):
I couldn't agree more. I hope you found that as
interesting as I did.

Speaker 1 (01:15:17):
During the break, I went to my desk and I
got it's not a granola bar, but it's in the
shape of a granola bar. And it was like a
peanut butter and jelly thing, very very sweet, very It
was like a skippy something with jelly.

Speaker 2 (01:15:31):
And crispy on the outside. It's quite yummy. So so
now we just need to know what flavor jelly. It
was just grape. It's grape.

Speaker 1 (01:15:38):
There you go, which is sort of the most juvenile
of jelly's delicious but delicious.

Speaker 3 (01:15:46):
Yeah, what's the best flavor of jelly?

Speaker 1 (01:15:48):
Text us at five six six n or jam or
marmalade or anything like that. What is the best thing
in that category of product?

Speaker 2 (01:15:57):
That?

Speaker 3 (01:15:57):
What's your favorite?

Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
Text us at five six six nine zero, and tell me,
and then all tell me and dragon we both want
to know, and also maybe tell us what do you
put it with?

Speaker 2 (01:16:06):
Right?

Speaker 1 (01:16:06):
Do you put it on peanut butter? My wife likes
almond butter. Here's one, here's one. I think this is
more of a jew thing. But I like bagel with cream,
cheese and.

Speaker 2 (01:16:17):
Jelly, English muffin butter, jelly, Yes, I think my wife
does that.

Speaker 3 (01:16:24):
Yeah, and I would do that.

Speaker 2 (01:16:25):
I toast it because just a regular cool English muffin. No no, no, no, no,
got to be toasted.

Speaker 3 (01:16:30):
Okay, you know that's an interesting thing too.

Speaker 1 (01:16:32):
I don't really toast my bread very often, but I
do think English muffins are much improved by toasting. And
there is one benefit, more than one probably, but a
benefit of toasting bread is that if you're going to
put something on it that's a little bit you know,
thick that you know, a good chunky peanut butter, if

(01:16:55):
you toast the bread, the bread is less likely to
be torn by the by the action of the knife
and the peanut butter being dragged across it.

Speaker 2 (01:17:03):
It's physics. It listens up the peanut butter as well,
just a low good point. Yeah, and it melts the butter,
which is more delicious. Melted butter is delicious. All right,
So text us at five six six nine.

Speaker 1 (01:17:13):
Zero and tell us the best flavors or a flavor
of jam or jelly or marmalade or something. Here's a
story that I have had for two weeks, and I
keep not getting to and I really want to get
to it today. So this has happened to me a
lot lately. And I don't remember exactly which streaming service.
I think it may be more than one where. You

(01:17:36):
know how these days, Netflix and Amazon, all these people,
they've got ads now unless you pay them like your
left arm or something. But it used to be you
pay them a monthly subscription and then you just watch
the movie or you watch the show. Now unless you
pay them the Bentley Rolls Royce or Mercedes Benz of subscriptions,
they interject ads.

Speaker 3 (01:17:57):
Right, it's super annoying. I get it, I get it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:00):
You know, we talked a little bit about capitalism already today.

Speaker 3 (01:18:03):
I get it. But it's annoying.

Speaker 1 (01:18:05):
But what what's especially annoying is that the commercials are
louder than the show, louder than the movie. Now, you
may say, but Ross, I heard that's illegal, and I
would say to you, it's illegal on broadcast television, but
not on streaming.

Speaker 3 (01:18:26):
Did you know that dragon? Did you even know it
was illegal on broadcast television?

Speaker 2 (01:18:30):
I knew it was on broadcast. Yeah, I didn't know
that it was that it didn't apply to stream I mean,
we have different rules streaming here and radios, so I
wouldn't see why they have different streaming rules on television exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:18:41):
Yeah, So if you're.

Speaker 1 (01:18:42):
Watching you know, ABC television, they can't make the commercials
louder than the show. But on streaming they do, and
and I've noticed it's much louder. Right, I actually have
to turn it down, and I find it very annoying.

Speaker 2 (01:18:55):
And I really struggle with.

Speaker 1 (01:18:56):
This as a as a as a capitalist, as a libertarian,
I really struggle with where do you draw the line
between permissible government regulation to let's say, protect consumers, whatever
that means, and impermissible government meddling in the affairs of
a private business.

Speaker 3 (01:19:15):
And its customers.

Speaker 1 (01:19:17):
So this actually comes out of California, and again I'm
really on the fence about it because I love the outcome,
but I'm not sure that that makes me okay with it.
I'm just throwing this out there to you. This is
from Politico from a couple of weeks ago. Governor Gavin Newsom.

Speaker 2 (01:19:35):
On Monday, and again this would have been you know,
about two weeks ago two and a half weeks ago,
signed a law banning excessively loud advertisements on streaming platforms
like Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon Prime, a law that could
become a de facto national standard. The California law.

Speaker 1 (01:19:52):
Is addressing what the Federal Communications Commission has called a
troubling jump in TV ad noise complaints fueled by stream
or is airing commercials louder than the shows and the
movies they accompany. It's modeled off of a federal law
passed in twenty ten that caps add volumes on cable
and broadcast, but not streaming television. Given the Golden State's

(01:20:14):
massive sway in the entertainment industry, the new law may
strong arm streamers into shushing commercials nation wide. And again,
I gotta say I love the outcome because they have
clearly been turning up the volume on commercials.

Speaker 3 (01:20:28):
It's really annoying. Not just a little annoying, it's really annoying.

Speaker 1 (01:20:33):
But is this a thing that's a proper role for
government to get involved with That I really struggle with.
When we come back, the fabulous Leland Viittert of News
Nation joins the show. Quick note for tomorrow, guys, I
want to let you know at ten thirty three ten
thirty four tomorrow, I'm I'm gonna be joined by David Zucker,

(01:20:55):
the writer and director of the movie Airplane and Naked
Gun and all that stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:21:00):
I am so excited about that.

Speaker 1 (01:21:02):
And almost as excited as I am to have Leland
Viderick back on the show My buddy. Leland hosts On Balance,
which is on News Nation weeknights at seven pm Our
Time and ten pm replay. His book Born Lucky has
been just an incredible success, and I have something to

(01:21:23):
say about that in a second. And also make sure
you go to warnoes dot com and subscribe to his
daily email.

Speaker 3 (01:21:28):
All right, Hi there, Leland, how you doing.

Speaker 6 (01:21:31):
Always find ross good to see it?

Speaker 3 (01:21:33):
I have many questions for you.

Speaker 1 (01:21:35):
I want to start with the question I just asked
my listeners, because you know, we only cover the most
important topics on this show. In the world of jams
and jelly's and marmalades, which one is the best and
what do you have it on?

Speaker 6 (01:21:55):
So, my mother.

Speaker 4 (01:21:56):
Makes homemade raspberry jam in northern Michigan, and having spent
time in Colorado, I understand people in Colorado don't unders
know this, but Michigan is the fruit basket of much
of America, the northern part of Michigan. The raspberries from
northern Michigan are extraordinary.

Speaker 6 (01:22:14):
So she makes fresh.

Speaker 4 (01:22:15):
Raspberry jam and I enjoy it on normally like you know,
white toast or are like toasted baguette with a little butter.

Speaker 1 (01:22:25):
Okay, very good switching gears. I want to share with
you a text that I got from a good friend
of mine here, former state senator, just an interesting guy,
and I quote Leland's book has been very encouraging to
I won't use his wife's name on the air, to
my wife and I as parents of a child who

(01:22:48):
is on the spectrum and who want him to develop
by being challenged rather than by being coddled. And then
he added what his dad, your dad Leland did for Leland,
reminds me so much of what my wife is doing
for our son.

Speaker 2 (01:23:07):
So I wanted to share that with you. That just
came in a few minutes ago.

Speaker 6 (01:23:09):
Well, thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:23:12):
The book is born, Lucky, we're back in the stock now.
I think the message of hope for every parent of
a kid having a hard time, not just on the
autism spectrum as I was or I am, and as
your friend is dealing with, but kids who are going
through bullying or ADHD or anxiety, any of these issues

(01:23:34):
that kids are having, any kid having a hard time
growing up.

Speaker 6 (01:23:37):
This is hope for their parents. But it's also proof.

Speaker 4 (01:23:40):
And I think this is what your friend is figuring
out and his wife is figuring out, proof of how
much good and difference parenting can make.

Speaker 3 (01:23:50):
No doubt.

Speaker 1 (01:23:52):
Okay, so answer this next question with absolutely zero false modesty,
not that that's ever really your thing. Are you surprised
by how successful this book has been?

Speaker 4 (01:24:06):
I am very surprised because I didn't understand how many
parents feel so alone. And that message that your friend
wrote is basically what my dad talked to me about
for so many years, which is number one, we're going
to adapt.

Speaker 6 (01:24:27):
You to the world, not the world to you. But
number two self esteem is earned, it is not given.

Speaker 4 (01:24:36):
And number three, anyway, the message of born Lucky that
parents can make such an enormous difference. And I didn't
realize how many parents feel so alone with a diagnosis
for their kid.

Speaker 3 (01:24:53):
I believe that. I believe that makes it makes perfect sense.

Speaker 1 (01:24:58):
If I weren't already traveling with my kid to go
look at colleges a week or so ago, I was
gonna fly down to Florida to go to go to
an event with you and another one of my friends,
Jack Carr, and I was and to me, I'm asking
you this because it's a very interesting pairing you two guys.

(01:25:20):
Can you since I didn't get to go, can you
tell me a little about what that event was like.
Jack has been on my show probably a dozen times,
so my listeners know him well.

Speaker 6 (01:25:29):
Well and they're better for it.

Speaker 4 (01:25:32):
This came to be because both Jack Carr and I
were doing events back to back at the same place
with the same bookstore in Orlando, and for this event,
they wanted someone to interview Jack and somebody to interview me,
so they had both of us interview each other and
it was so much fun. I never met Jack before

(01:25:55):
I had him on my show at your suggestion, What
a really great human being and to your point, somebody
who does not have any false modesty. After having I
think seven New York Times bestsellers, a n number of
number one best sellers, his books turned into movies. Just
the most thoughtful, real human being I've ever met. And

(01:26:18):
I just spent a lot of time backstage with him
just talking and you could just see the way he
related to everyone and the way he internalized information and
reacted to things. None of it is false modesty and
just really a spectacular human being.

Speaker 3 (01:26:36):
Yeah, I'm glad.

Speaker 1 (01:26:38):
I mean, obviously I had nothing to do with putting
that event together, but when when I heard that it
was happening, I was just very much encouraging both of
you because I thought you'd get along real well.

Speaker 3 (01:26:49):
All right, let's do some other things.

Speaker 2 (01:26:51):
Last night.

Speaker 3 (01:26:52):
You have a guest on your show quite.

Speaker 1 (01:26:54):
Frequently lately named Mike Nellis.

Speaker 3 (01:26:58):
Very interesting, very very interesting guy.

Speaker 1 (01:27:00):
He's trying to compete with you in terms of best hair,
but very interesting guy as a very much insider in
the Democratic Party, and I liked him a lot as
a guest.

Speaker 3 (01:27:12):
I think he's a great guest.

Speaker 1 (01:27:13):
He's frustrated me and you in the last couple of
days when you've asked him about this attorney general candidate
in Virginia and about what it takes to disqualify someone
from being in office or even being important politically, and
maybe what you could start at the macro of that question,
and then maybe if you want to talk about, you know,

(01:27:35):
how you think about Mike Nellis's Dodge.

Speaker 2 (01:27:37):
There because I really like the guy, But what are
your thoughts?

Speaker 4 (01:27:40):
Yeah, I think we're in an environment where neither side.
And to be fair to Mike, we had another partisan
on the other side, Steve Cortez, who's a very smart conservative,
talking about this current problem of people with really questionable
or awful whatever you want to call it, text messages

(01:28:03):
or tattoos or whatever it be in their past.

Speaker 6 (01:28:06):
Right, and you have the prime example of the Trump
nominee who's still working for the Trump administration, who.

Speaker 4 (01:28:12):
Talked about you that he has a Nazi streak and
you know, he's a little Hitler and all these kinds
of things.

Speaker 6 (01:28:20):
And then you have on the Democratic side the.

Speaker 4 (01:28:23):
Guy in Maine who has a Nazi tattoo that he
claims he got while he was drunk but has had
for twenty years.

Speaker 6 (01:28:31):
And then you have.

Speaker 4 (01:28:32):
The guy running for attorney general in Virginia with the
elections in a couple of weeks, who has text messages
where he's talking about killing his political opponents.

Speaker 6 (01:28:43):
These are the two Democrats.

Speaker 4 (01:28:45):
And what is interesting to me always is is that
when you ask a partisan about this on their side,
they will say, well, it's bad, but what the voters decide,
and what we really need to deal with is the
other sides problem. That doesn't work for me. I see
the world right verse wrong, not right verse left. I
think it's why you and I get along. I think

(01:29:06):
it's why news nation is growing so fast. Is if
you fantasize about being a little hitler, you should not
have a place in government period. I don't think you
have a place in the private sector either. I think
that is wholly disqualifying to have anyone associate with you.
And noteworthy that the guy in the Trump administration did

(01:29:29):
not apologize. And I think at the same time that
if you want to talk about political violence in America,
you should be able to say, if.

Speaker 6 (01:29:37):
Someone has.

Speaker 4 (01:29:39):
Fantasized about killing their political opponents, they shouldn't be the
attorney general.

Speaker 6 (01:29:44):
They should drop out. And as you noted, Mike did
not say that.

Speaker 4 (01:29:48):
To be fair, Steve Cortez didn't say that Paul Agrassia
should resign or Trump should fire him. So I think
that is the problem that we exist in right now,
is that supporting your own side is more important, and
I think this is a terrible situation. Then simply acknowledging

(01:30:09):
that someone with really terrible feelings and thoughts shouldn't have
a job.

Speaker 1 (01:30:16):
You studied a lot of economics, and so have I,
and so we both understand that the world is all
about incentives, which is really what economics is about. And
it seems to me that the behavior you're talking about
is not going to change soon because the incentives aren't
going to change soon, because the bases on both sides

(01:30:36):
are perfectly fine with the behavior that you and I
and the defense of the behavior that you and I
think is wrong. And I don't see how it changes
until the public in large numbers say we're just not
going to tolerate this, right, Like maybe maybe if J.
Jones loses in Virginia, a race that a Democrats should

(01:30:57):
definitely win.

Speaker 3 (01:30:58):
But I mean, you've got any thoughts on what's going
to change this?

Speaker 4 (01:31:04):
I think what changes it is the center rising up.
And by that I mean that the fringes of both
political parties, the extremes, whatever you want to call them,
mistake the center for being apathetic and take them for granted,
and they say, well, it doesn't matter if we're crazy,

(01:31:25):
because in the end, elections are binary choices, and people
even who are in the middle are going to be
forced to choose one side or the other. So so
long as we're not just a little less bad than
the other side, we're going to be okay. And to me,
the people in this center, who is the majority of Americans?
Because the American political spectrum is a bell shaped curve,

(01:31:46):
the extremes are the smallest percentage of people.

Speaker 6 (01:31:50):
The extremes in America have not been required by the
middle to moderate.

Speaker 4 (01:31:57):
In the middle of America, much like Congress has completely
given up all of their power because they're more interested
in other parts of life. And until the middle of
America demands and puts forth the need for change, nothing's
going to happen.

Speaker 1 (01:32:17):
A listener wants to know if you've ever spoken with
Elon Musk about autism, or if you know if Elon
Musk has read your.

Speaker 2 (01:32:26):
Book, A Note of Both.

Speaker 1 (01:32:31):
You put something in War Notes yesterday. I think it
was where you linked to a New York Times interview
of Democratic Senator Reuben Diego when you talked about democrats
and prosperity and here's what I want to ask you
about this. So, on the one hand, I think that
that way of thinking would be very much a positive

(01:32:54):
change for the Democrats. I don't think most of the
country wants to elect somebody like Mom Donnie, who would
be the extreme case, but even AOC and folks like that.

Speaker 2 (01:33:03):
But here's what I what I wonder about Leland.

Speaker 1 (01:33:06):
One of my maxims in politics is that Americans like
vote for whatever's the closest.

Speaker 3 (01:33:12):
Thing they can get to authenticity.

Speaker 2 (01:33:13):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:33:14):
Part of the reason that the Coca Cola, the Coca
Cola tagline it's the real thing, was so effective for
so long and so back in the day, like when
George H. W. Bush was president and raised taxes after
saying he wouldn't. In the voter's mindsets, they're like, all right,
if we're going to raise taxes and spend money, we're
going to vote for the people or the experts on that.

(01:33:34):
We're just going to vote for Democrats. And they made
George H. W. Bush a one term president and the
other way around. If Democrats start talking about things that
sound like fiscal conservatism, whether or not you think they
believe it, I think that voters are going to say,
all right, if that's what we're doing is fiscal conservatism,
we'll go with the people who we think are maybe
at least a little better and go with the Republicans.

(01:33:55):
So what I wonder when I'm asking you in this
very long winded way, is do you think Democrats and
prosperity or abundance in other words, they're using a lot recently,
is a brand change that they can achieve.

Speaker 6 (01:34:13):
Well, it's a great question.

Speaker 4 (01:34:15):
That word abundance, right, It comes from the Ezra Kline
book that came out a few months ago, and it
was the abundance theory that Democrats should start talking about.
You know, we're going to eliminate regulations on housing and
on and on and on.

Speaker 2 (01:34:31):
This.

Speaker 4 (01:34:31):
I think what you said at the beginning is the
most important thing. Ross is that Americans come to people
who they believe to be authentic. And I've had the
privilege of covering a number of presidents, and they are
the two transformational ones both by both Obama and Trump

(01:34:52):
have been exactly the same person in private as they
are in public.

Speaker 6 (01:34:56):
George W.

Speaker 4 (01:34:57):
Bush the same way, Bill Clinton the same way that
they were.

Speaker 6 (01:35:01):
HW. Bush not as much.

Speaker 4 (01:35:05):
But they all won the test of who would you
rather have a beer with? In all of their elections.
That idea, I think speaks to what you're saying, and
the problem for Republic for Democrats right now is they
don't have anybody who you'd want to have a beer with.

Speaker 6 (01:35:25):
Mom. Dommi is that guy.

Speaker 4 (01:35:27):
He is a generational talent of politician. People are drawn
to that magneticism, to that charisma.

Speaker 6 (01:35:34):
The rhiz is. I've heard kids now call it ross
and iron zoom.

Speaker 4 (01:35:39):
I'm trying to see if I can get him to
smile when I said the riz is the kids call it.
But I can't figure out you know, his Democrats are
now jockeying for position for the twenty twenty eight presidential race.
I've been to a lot of rallies. I've been to
a lot of speeches. I can't figure out a Democrat
who has right now that it component right. You saw

(01:36:02):
it when Donald Trump came down the escalator. You saw
it with George W.

Speaker 6 (01:36:05):
Bush.

Speaker 4 (01:36:06):
You certainly saw it with Barack Obama in two thousand
and four at the convention. Is there a Bill Clinton
like figure who we're not thinking about right now? Well,
in nineteen ninety that was possible because we didn't have
cable news. Now everybody's on cable news. We know who
all these candidates are. And you don't see anyone. I'll
go one point further. All of those people mom Dommy included,

(01:36:29):
have been willing to stand up to their own party.

Speaker 1 (01:36:33):
None of the Democrats are interesting. Folks were talking with
Leland Vindard. His show is on Balance. It's on News
Nation weeknights at seven pm. Mountain Time plays again at
ten pm.

Speaker 2 (01:36:47):
Okay, last question for you, Leland.

Speaker 1 (01:36:49):
What is something interesting you're covering on your show tonight
that we have not already talked about just now.

Speaker 6 (01:36:56):
That we've not already talked about.

Speaker 4 (01:36:57):
Yeah, Well, the thing that I keep going over and
over and over and over and have a real problem
with is the incredible silence by all the people who
were so concerned about the Palestinians. So you've got Hamas
now torturing and killing and imprisoning and killing or executing

(01:37:26):
Palestinians by the dozens, if not hundreds in the Gaza strip,
And all of the people who were marching with kafias
and banging pots and pans and talking about pushing the
Jews into the sea because they were so worried about
the poor Palestinians are now utterly silent about the Palestinians.

Speaker 6 (01:37:41):
And I think it is extraordinarily.

Speaker 4 (01:37:43):
Telling about what their motivations were.

Speaker 6 (01:37:48):
And I've used this before.

Speaker 4 (01:37:49):
I'll bring this all the way full circle for you
Ross that yes, there's a problem with anti Semitism jew
hatred on the left and on the right. On the
left it's a little bit like an avalanche, and on
the right it's a little bit about like being worried
about getting sunburned. And let me tell you, when you're
in an avalanche, which is what we'rerying about anti semitism

(01:38:10):
on the left, you don't really sit around and worry
about getting sunburned. And that's what I feel like the
left is is saying right now, They're like, oh, well,
you know, maybe we shouldn't dig ourselves out of this
avalanche because we might get sunburned after we do.

Speaker 6 (01:38:23):
Well, let's be clear what the real risk is right now.

Speaker 1 (01:38:28):
Leland Vinder's show on Balance News Nation seven pm. Go
to Warnoes dot com sign up for his daily email.
It arrives well time five oh five pm mountain time.

Speaker 2 (01:38:38):
Is that right? Is that right?

Speaker 4 (01:38:40):
So long as I make so long as I make
my deadline every day, Yeah, there you go, And it's
it's basically Leland's show preps so you'll know what he's
going to talk about, kind of what's in his brain
and you'll be smarter.

Speaker 1 (01:38:49):
And then Born luckybook dot com. If you haven't read
Leland's book, it is it?

Speaker 6 (01:38:54):
Does you want me to make an announcement for you? Raw?

Speaker 3 (01:38:56):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (01:38:56):
Sure, so we can do one better. Born Lucky Book
or burn Lucky dot com.

Speaker 3 (01:39:03):
WHOA, how'd you do that?

Speaker 6 (01:39:06):
Well, you know things are happening Born lucky dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:39:09):
Oh my gosh, yeah, my producer said that's because you
were born lucky, so you got it done. Born Lucky
dot Com. Fantastic. Thanks as always for your time, Leland.
I'll catch you on TV Tonight Talks and Ross. Hello, Mandy,
give me you.

Speaker 3 (01:39:25):
Do I have time for this. Let's do this real
fast because we haven't done it in a while.

Speaker 6 (01:39:28):
Ready.

Speaker 1 (01:39:29):
Jewelry store owner has two carrot diamond embedded into his
artificial eye. Giant fish tank explodes at Chinese restaurant. Helicopters
used to play world's biggest game of Ninja Guiden and
piercings for pet chickens are catching on as a trend
in China.

Speaker 9 (01:39:48):
Please tell me it's the piercings for pet chickens in China? Please,
I mean, is that your guests or you just want
to be the answer is it's my fervent wish that
that is the answer.

Speaker 3 (01:39:59):
All right, Dragon? If Mandy gets it right, where does
she win chickens?

Speaker 2 (01:40:02):
Of course stop it.

Speaker 1 (01:40:03):
I'm going to say a piercing but uh okay, the
actual fake headline, Mandy, you will be interested to hear
is piercings for pet chickens are catching.

Speaker 2 (01:40:11):
On as a trend in China. You are fake, You're good.
You're good, Mandy. What you got today?

Speaker 3 (01:40:16):
Hi at Lindsay Datko from Jeff co K.

Speaker 9 (01:40:18):
First, I have my friend Travis Backinstead and Lisa Fagan.
They're going to be in to talk about direct primary
care and direct specialty medical services. So if you're looking
for an affordable healthcare option that is not insurance, this
is going to be the interview for you. And we
are actually talking to one of the contestants from the
Denver edition of Love Is Blind.

Speaker 6 (01:40:38):
Don't say we don't cover everything on the.

Speaker 3 (01:40:40):
Mandy Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1 (01:40:42):
To everyone, stick around for Mandy's fabulous must listen show.

Speaker 3 (01:40:46):
I'll talk to you to morrow.