4-10-24 *INTERIVEW* Owner of Lukas Liquors Joe Brunner on Hard Liquor In Grocery Stores

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Joe Brunner and I were just shootingthe you know what just during the break
here, and I could talk tohim all day long. Joe owns Lucas
Liquors. That's Lucas with a K, and it's in Loan Tree and it's
very very near the home depot that'snear Park Meadows Mall. But you could
just look it up. Lucas Lickerswith a K and Lucas and Joe is

(00:25):
my whiskey including all subcategories of whiskeyguru. And Joe has forgotten more about
whiskey than I will ever know inmy entire life. And he's never steered
me wrong. And I always lovetalking to him about whiskey and about the
alcohol, the liquor business. Soit's good to see you again, my

(00:45):
friend. Welcome to studio. Thanksfor having me, and I appreciate it.
I will just tell listeners right nowif you have a question about either
the liquor business or anything whiskey related, because I'm not going to claim that
Joe is as expert on rum.Would that be fair? Or are you?
Are you super expert on that?You know? I say my categories

(01:07):
are really tequila, scotch, andbourbon. Those are where I really have
my passion and vodka. But Iknow you know I have a passion for
alcohol. Yeah, so please,okay, yeah, I mean you could
call the store. I'll I'll putmy cell phone out there, which is
three oh three nine four nine sixthousand. You could call me at any
time. I'd love to answer yourquestions. I love also how you said

(01:29):
vodka, because then you don't youkind of aspirate the d because you're from
Chicago and that's where your accent comesout. Well, you have an accent.
That's the reason. Uh huh uhhuh. All right, So I
want to talk about alcohol, butI also want to talk about the alcohol
business. Why don't we start withthe business side, because this conversation came

(01:51):
up because I asked you what youthought about a bill that's in front of
the state legislature that I'm gonna tryto get going on my browser here so
I know what I'm talking about.But a bill in front of the state
legislature that would that would re restricttell me if I have this right,
that would re restrict the sale ofhard liquor back to liquor stores so that

(02:13):
other store, other kinds of storescouldn't sell it? Is that right?
Almost right? Almost right? Yes, okay, so tell us exactly what
it is. What they're trying todo is take anything under seventeen proof and
allow everybody to sell it seventeen proofor seventeen percent seventeen yeah, thank you,
you correct, no more than Ido. So they want to stay

(02:37):
with multi brotheragers and wine and soforth, to keep in all grocery right,
okay, and then have liquor stores. Okay, so anything stronger than
seventeen percent would only be available ina liquor store. Correct? Are they
doing this because they believe correctly thatliquor stores are struggling right now? Why
do you think this is coming up? Well, a couple things. I

(02:59):
think all liquor stores are struggling,including the grocery stores. Liquor consumption and
wine consumption are down dramatically, especiallyin Colorado. But when you look at
it, you know, when wechange the last law, what we've seen
take place, and these are theseare my observations. But when corporations come
in and take wine and put itin grocery stores, you end up with

(03:21):
sixty skews two hundred and fifty productsand they're all priced higher. So the
consumer I think, gets hurt.They get convenience through distribution, but they
pay more for the same product.They were able to get a liquor store
and have less choice and have lesschoice. So okay, but that's the
way our society is going. There'snothing wrong with that. We got to
what society wants they get liquor?Should we have liquor everywhere? I can

(03:45):
tell you my store, I havea significant amount of crime. I have
tough stuff going on. And whatdo you mean in the store. Oh
yeah, we have all shopliftings.Atrocious we have. I don't want to
some of the crime is tough,Okay. I mean as we had two
people behind our store with illegal firearmsthat were arrested. You know, I'm

(04:11):
having crime that Park Meadows Mall.We're not talking about yeah, and downtown
Baltimore, right. I don't wantto be disrespectful to anything, but I
have vagrants that command. I haveproblems in my store quite often. Alcohol
is a it's a control substance.There's a reason it's a controlled substance.
Now we want to put it everywhere? You know, we are, in

(04:33):
my opinion, as a dad,we're having tons of problems with crime.
We see all this stuff going on, and we're just going to add to
it. And I think that's afactor no one's taken into account. Once
you put alcohol everywhere, you willrestrict the brands. Our prices will go
up. We've already seen that withthe wine. Same thing will happen,
and you'll get rid of your liquorstores. That's a model common throughout the

(04:56):
United States. It's not like it'suncommon. It's okay. So I don't
know. I mean, I thinkwe just need to understand as a society,
what do we want in Colorado.Do we want access to liquor everywhere.
If that's the case, then youshould vote the build down. If
you think you should control that substance, then we shouldn't so in your mind.

(05:17):
And I appreciate how open minded youalways are in these political conversations,
because whenever you and I have talkedabout this stuff on or off the air,
you're really open to the argument.It doesn't mean you agree with it,
but you're open to the argument ofthe side whose position might hurt your
business. And I appreciate that honestyabout you. Well, I have to

(05:41):
be. I mean, the societyis changing. I'm an old dog now,
right, Yeah, and as yousee things change, you know this
is we have a model. Ithink our model we look very much like
California. Colorado's turning into California,at least for me in my visual if
I say, we're leaning more towardsthat type of model, and you could

(06:01):
see how that system works, andthen you can see how that system works
here. Okay. And I'm nottalking about the negative stuff. I'm not
getting into that stuff. That's there'speople, I could pick a negative in
any place on the planet, Okay, I'm just talking about you know,
corporations are going to dominate Colorado.I was against that because I'm a small
business guy. Okay. But inthe same token, people, I use

(06:24):
Amazon right two three times a weekbecause I don't want to go to the
store. So you know, Idon't I always won't know the answer.
That's why I'm willing to hear it. But I think with alcohol, because
it's a controlled substance, and Ibelieve we have a problem with crime.
I do not believe we should putalcohol everywhere. That would be my main
objection to it. Interesting, Okay, and we really should be thinking about

(06:47):
that. Your main objection to alcoholbeing everywhere, which would be your main
reason to support this bill. Yeah, there's things in the bill I think
are unique that they're hidden, andI was trying to find them so I
can bring them up on a show. But they got something on private label,
which I think is very nefarious tothe consumer, where we just relabel
product and charge them whatever, soyou don't know it's a corporate product.

(07:08):
It's very nefarious. It happens.Wow, a lot of stores do it,
and I'm not going to mention astore doesn't matter. Yeah, but
these are corporate stores and get youpay way too much for something. Well,
they're trying to outlaw that too,so I don't know how that's gonna
go. Wait, so they takelike a box wine and put it in
a bottle and put a label onit where you would buy it in the

(07:31):
box for seven dollars for that quantity, but they're going to charge you twelve
to fifty because it's in a bottle. Is that the kind of thing you're
talking about. Yeah, it's moregregiousthan that, though, Oh my gosh,
it's I would say it's a fifteendollars bottle that I make full markup
and they sell it for forty Sothat's a why do you know? Again
without naming names, because if you'rea consumer, how do you recognize that

(07:54):
bottle when you walk in? Youcan't. That's the problem. So see,
I carry some of them, andthen I explain it to my customers
so they know. You know,the thing is, I'm not going to
get a beef over this. Itry and explain it to everybody. Sure
it's a nefarious part. This isnationwide. Okay, we're either going to
have corporations we're gonna buy our businessfrom, or you're gonna have small business,

(08:15):
right, and we're in a transition. We're talking with Joe Brunner.
He is the proprietor of Lucas LiquorsLucas with a kl Ukas near Park Metow's
Mall in Loan Tree. So let'stalk macro for a moment. You mentioned
that alcohol sales are down, Soone obvious thing is that a lot of

(08:39):
people cut back when they're drinking afterCOVID, Like drinking kind of exploded during
COVID. You're home alone, you'reboard, you're sad and whatever. So
there's that. But you mentioned somethingto me, and you might have even
mentioned it just now, but abouta generational change in drinking. Yeah,
there's a couple of things going onright now. The wine industry is totally

(09:00):
collapsing, so they're trying to getwine out of the US and to other
countries. The United States has itselfhas dropped to thirty fifth of countries where
the thirty fifth ranked country consumer ofalcohol. What did it used to be?
It was twenty six, twenty seven, twenty eight, never dropped out
of the top thirty. It isthirty fifth last time I looked. Okay,

(09:20):
eighty five percent of the consumers underthe age of thirty no longer drink
wine. That's the biggest loss ofconsumers ever. So that generation stopped drinking
wine. That's our biggest challenge inthe wine industry. So what the grocery
store has got was the worst partof the liquor business, right, which
is funny. Yeah, I meanI'm not saying funny. I mean I
just like, they invest all thismoney with all these bills and stuff.

(09:41):
Yeah, but we knew this washappening, right, everybody said wine's going
down. I believe they just tendays ago destroyed eight hundred thousand gallons of
wine in New Zealand. There's toomuch wine. I'm buying great wine for
fifty cents on a dollar. Imean, I'm buying wine a twenty dollars
bottle. I'm selling for ten bucksnow, just because wine sales have gone

(10:03):
down, alcohol consumptions down. Notalcoholic is up, but the overall liquor
business in Colorado is down, frommy understanding, from distributors, anywhere from
twenty to fifty percent. Okay,And if you're talking about the distributor level,
then that it's everybody. It's notjust your losings to a supermarket,
which is true, but it goesway beyond it, right, And a

(10:24):
supermarket is still comedian store. I'ma destination store. I'm a big liquor
store. Yeah. When you're adestination store, people come to buy alcohol
from me. When you're in thegrocery store. You know, maybe your
spouse said, hey, can yougive me a bottle of wine? I
don't want to go somewhere else,and I pay a little bit more for
it. I'm okay with it.Let me get to a couple of listener
questions. This one listener says,I have a very early bottle of Blanton's.

(10:45):
You didn't specify early what early is, but where could I take it
to sell it? And I knowthis is a tricky thing an individual trying
to sell alcohol is. I thinkthere's some legalities around it. Yeah,
you know, it's alcohol is illegalto rease out, but everybody does it.
I mean, I see it happenall the time. I would tell
you if you have a really earlybottle, I would drink it because it's

(11:07):
really good. I would give itup. It's worth a little bit more
than a regular one, but thatwould be a that's a that's a really
good bottle to drink, you know. I would maybe put a post out
I want to hear one of thelike Craig's List or something, until it
gets taken down buy it. Imean, they all want those. But

(11:28):
the early ones are really good.I don't know that How old is early?
How old is how old? Ican't remember. It's pretty it's pretty
old. No, no, no, no. It was sold to a
Japanese company in the late eighties.I believe SO isn't even owned by sazarak
So. But the early ones areseventies sixties. I don't remember the year,

(11:50):
and I apologize for that, butI would say I've had the early
ones. I drink the are theones that have a few at my house.
I would definitely drink that bottle.Listener question, why is non alcoholic
beers expensive? Process? Right?Because they have to make regular beer right,
and they take the alcohol out ofit. There's a few there some
other way. That's the way youdo it mostly, but we got to

(12:11):
be careful when we're talking about nonalcohol. We're talking about product that has
zero alcohol or most of the productthat has zero zero point two or zero
point two or point one because it'salcohol removed. Okay, So that's the
extra space that pops up the alcohol. They also they they kind of double
still it. Okay, and it'snot a spirit, but the double they

(12:33):
do it twice. They don't letthe sugars go all the way. Groovy
is an example of that. Soit's never has alcohol in it. If
you have an alcohol problem, ifyou're if you're recovering alcoholic, make sure
you talk to someone if you're inmy liquor store to make sure we get
you the right product. Also,when it gets to wine, we got
ninety point wines now that are nonalcoholic. I mean they're really good expensive.

(12:56):
If you remember the first in awine, it was terrible. Oh
yeah, there's a lot that arestill terrible. Wow, but there are
some good ones. You were tellingme before we were on the air about
that you just tasted a how manythousand dollars bottle of scotch? Thirty thousand,
thirty thousand dollars bottle of scotch.Yeah, so tell us a little
bit about the bottle twenty four carrotgold. It was a Highland Park fifty.

(13:22):
You know, the thing is iswhen you get into these big bottles,
okay, I mean the presentation thatcomes with white gloves and everything,
and then I have you know,I'm lucky enough to have consumers that want
this stuff and that are willing toopen it so I could have a little
or a little taste. I wouldtell you that they're stunning. You know.
The thing is is that's exorbitant.You know, I can never think
of spending that money, but tothat particular person, it's three hundred dollars.

(13:46):
Yeah. Yeah, it's just different. Wow. Okay, So this
is a funny story that I mighthave told listeners one time before. But
I was having a friend over aguy who I met recently and we were,
you know, kind of new friends, and he knew I liked bourbon,

(14:07):
and he wanted to get a bottleof bourbon for me, a sort
of a housewarming thing, and sohe went to find a bottle of bourbon
and he goes to the dude atthe store he he likes to buy his
bourbon at and says, I needa bourbon gift for a friend of mine.
He happens to be on the radioand it turns out it's Joe,

(14:28):
and Joe says to this guy,is it Ross Kaminski? And guy said,
as a matter of fact, itis. And then Joe said,
I, well, I know whathe likes, and so you gave him
something to give me, which Iwant to say. It's the like,
oh, what's the name of it. It's a it's a special release of

(14:52):
this particular brand. It's aged insome kind of spa. It'll come to
me. It's a French name.It's like the Lebaud edition of some Bartstown
labas. Yes, that's a greatbottles that, yes, tell me we
only about three minutes here. Yeah, what is it like, how do
you think about what one of yourclients likes? How do you how do

(15:13):
you know that? How do youhow do you think about it? Well,
it's really you know, I studyit. You know, I taste
about five thousand spirits a year.I go to distilleries, I go everywhere.
You learn about it. Once westart to talk about it, once
you tell me what you like,I have a profile. I know I
should keep you in this particular range. You know, we were just talking
about Rise earlier. Three different typesof Rise. Yeah, and how they

(15:35):
carry the palette, how they gofront to back. That's all I need
to know, and that I cankeep you. Or I could say,
hey, you want to stretch alittle bit. Yeah, we're going to
have one a little more spicy,and then I just come up to chain
a little bit. Wow. Onelistener wants to know if you sell an
alcohol free vodka called Usco Usko.Do you know anything. I don't think
I sell it now the top ofmy head now, I but it's will

(15:58):
order anything. If it's in thestate, we'll get it. Uh is
the A listener wants to know ifthere's some new push and they're asking this
because they're seeing some commercials now towardssaki. I don't think it's a new
push. I mean, Saki's beenaround for a long time. I definitely
like well, I like unfiltered sakifor me personally. Yeah, that goes
best what I'm having. You know, saki is a great spirit for what

(16:22):
it is, right for one year, I love it with sushi. Yeah,
okay, And I like unfiltered.Never pour your own sake, by
the way, it's bad. That'sa good bad luck. Yeah, you're
not supposed to. So if youand I go to have sushi, poor
mine, I pour yours. Wow. We're talking with Joe Brunner from Lucas
Lickors. That's l u k AsLiquors over just near the Home Depot that's

(16:45):
near Pork Meadows Mall in lun Tree. And we only got about two minutes
here. I want to I wantto do a thing just to just to
see what happens. You were tellingme before we went on the air about
a particular relatively inexpensive bottle that you'vegot at the store. So give us
just you said, it's like afifty something dollars bottle. Tell us what
this is and then fu and thenlisteners. If you want to get a

(17:06):
really good, affordable bottle of bourbon, you can go to Lucas Liquors and
just say I heard Joe talk aboutthis. I want this thing, so
what is it? Yeah? TheRepresentative is fifty six ninety nine. Now,
and take in mind it's this bottleof the Representative, it's not the
next one. So if you lookat the World Whiskey Awards, this is
the number one bourbon. It's afour year MGP. It's absolutely fabulous.

(17:30):
It's a front to back bourbon.It's got a beginning, middle, and
an end. That's how we wantto describe bourbon. It's got an extremely
clean palate. It's just a wonderfulbottle and it is the bourbon of the
year according to World Whiskey Awards.Just get checked that we actually got these
cases from Ayow where we sold outthe first time. We got them virtually
instantly. I have six cases left. So yeah, I would love I'd

(17:51):
love you guys, tell me youheard me on the show, Come on
in. I'd love to hear it. Yeah, head over to Lucas Liquors.
Not very often you're going to buythe winner of the World Whiskey Awards
for fifty seven bucks, and havea delicious bourbon. And is this a
you know, my taste palette.So do you think that bourbon will fit
my taste pallet? Absolutely? Yeah, all right, Well save everybody save

(18:12):
one of those for me. Wegot it, and I'll get down there
soon. Joe Brunner is the proprietorof Lucas Liquors and he is my my
whiskey guru and also my liquor industryguru. I love having these conversations.
Really grateful for your time and yourfriendship. Joe, thanks for being here,
you got it, Thanks for havingme. Glad to do it.