The Troubleshooter 9-26-25

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yeah, ripped up, so you don't have.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Come running.

Speaker 3 (00:13):
Just as fas as you can.

Speaker 4 (00:16):
Shoot's gonna help come.

Speaker 5 (00:18):
Ma Dix's The Troubleshooter Show.

Speaker 6 (00:22):
No, Tom Martinez need I say more than this. This
is the only show in the world to solve problems. Really,
you know, you don't just call and bitch about things.
You call and we try to get on them and
change them if we can, or prevent other people from

(00:42):
having the same problems. If you're streaming the show, you
see in my video. I have a big man to
my right, Kevin Calkins shared an auto tech and we'll
be talking about cars today Friday's Car Day.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
But that's not all we talk about.

Speaker 6 (00:58):
Anything you call about we talk about, but we do
primarily put a message on cars. And today I want
to talk about cars and people buying cars and how
they buy cars. And Kevin is here to talk about
any problems you might have with your car and service
and all of that. He's on shardanautotech dot Com on

(01:19):
Wadsworth on Colfax West of Wadsworth. I should say, let
me just say I had a rant on the state
of retail and I've had some people agree with me
and some people disagree with me.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
I said, basically, retail is in trouble.

Speaker 6 (01:38):
Retail is in trouble because you can go to Amazon
or Walmart and some other select online stores. But Amazon
really encompasses everything. But you can go online and get
almost anything you need delivered to your door the next day.
And I did. I went yesterday for some supplements. I'm

(02:01):
starting a new regimen. And what I did was ordered
the supplements. They were here in the morning, at eight
in the morning. I ordered them five o'clock last night. Now,
when I go to Whole Foods, they don't have what
I want. There, when I go to Vitamin Cottage, they

(02:22):
don't have what I have. They don't always have what
you want, and they're more expensive. Now that's just one example.
I can give you literally hundreds of examples where I've
been disappointed by retailers. And now the thought of getting
in my car, going to a retailer, parking, making my
way inside, finding trying to find someone who knows what

(02:47):
the hell they're talking about, or trying to find the inventory,
getting the product, taking it to the cashier. I mean,
if they do have the product, I don't know. And
the same with supermarket shopping. I'll venture to say that
we are in a new error where we're not going
to see retail stores much longer. I don't see how

(03:07):
they can survive. So I'd like to take your temperature
on retail. Now. Some people say I want to buy
clothes retail, and I understand that.

Speaker 1 (03:20):
You want to try them on, see how they fit
and all that.

Speaker 6 (03:23):
I suggest that there will be places where you can
try things on and then order them online and have
them delivered. It's getting to be too expensive to try
to inventory everything consumers want. You can't compete with Amazon,
you can't compete with all of these other retailers online.
So instead of trying to compete, you can do the

(03:45):
same thing but offer them a tactile experience. So, for example,
picture a clothing store that has a number of different
sizes and styles, and when you see what you want,
it's delivered to your home the next day.

Speaker 1 (04:01):
How about that, I.

Speaker 6 (04:02):
Mean, do you think it's that important for retail to
have stuff immediately available? I think with hardware and a
few household items. I just don't know where the economy
is going, but I know this retail is dying. If
you have a retail store. It better be very, very special.

(04:23):
So people said I was very selfish for this. Some
of the negative comments I got very selfish that I
would go online and cost people their jobs. I'm just
doing what's convenient to me. Why not, it's cheap, it's convenient,
it's delivered. Why would I do anything else. The same

(04:45):
with getting food. I mean, you can have food delivered,
you can have retail delivered. Now let's go to the
art of buying cars. This is where things are getting crazy.
To excuse myself, I have sniffles today, and uh so listen,

(05:07):
here's the deed. Yeah, okay, thank you, But okay, if
you must know, since I've had chemo and went through
a year of chemo and surgery and all that, it
has left me with a chronic cold type thing. They
say will go away eventually, but some days it's worse

(05:27):
than others. So that's what I'm dealing with, So deal
with it. I'm alive, I fought off cancer, and I'm
not going to apologize too much for having the sniffles,
but that's what I have. So in any case, it's uh,
it's a it's a terrible state of affairs for cars,

(05:48):
right now, I don't know how what would be a
clean way to buy cars. You know, the car Vana
that that gimmick, that vending machine.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
That's stupid.

Speaker 6 (05:59):
That's just had a kick out of it though.

Speaker 1 (06:01):
Yeah, but it's stupid it is.

Speaker 6 (06:02):
There's really no I mean, when you go to Carvana,
do you go to take a test driver or do
you go to buy the car?

Speaker 7 (06:08):
You know a lot of them you don't even see
the car. You're buying a sight unseen with a ten
day return policy and things like that. So they're shipping
cars all over the country.

Speaker 6 (06:17):
I think Tesla has one of the greatest car buying experiences.
You know, you just go to a showroom, you pick
what you want, you order it, you have it, or
if they have the inventory, you buy it. It's direct
from the manufacturer. You don't have any dealer games used
cars Now this year the two top complaint getters used

(06:42):
cars and contractors.

Speaker 1 (06:45):
Those are the two, I mean the worst.

Speaker 6 (06:49):
When it comes to contractors, you're going to have to assume,
and I mean this, You're going to have to assume
that when you go to high or a contractor, you
cannot trust them. Do not pay contractors upfront. I don't
care who they are. I'll never pay a down payment something.

(07:12):
I won't pay a down payment for them to go
out shopping. I just won't do it. No down payments,
no money upfront. Too many contractors are liars, cheaters.

Speaker 1 (07:23):
And thieves.

Speaker 6 (07:24):
They don't even intend to be in all cases, they
just don't know how to manage money. So that money
you're paying them probably is paying for a previous job
or previous supplies they bought. They don't know how to
They don't know how to use money. According to the
Contractors Trust Act, which means nothing.

Speaker 1 (07:42):
In Colorado, we have a trust Act.

Speaker 6 (07:44):
They're supposed to take the money and put it.

Speaker 1 (07:48):
In trust for a job.

Speaker 6 (07:49):
Really, if I gave him ten grand and Kevin gave
him ten grand, those are supposed to be two separate accounts,
or at least if they're in the same account. They
have to be demised or delineated per job. They cannot
be used for regular day to day stuff. But I'm
going to tell you contractors take money up front mostly

(08:12):
because they're broke, because they spent the previous money they
took up front already and they have to finish that job.
And sometimes they have to finish jobs two or three
jobs before you, and that's why they want money upfront. Now,
I say, if you're going to do work on my
place and you need money upfront, I'll dole out the

(08:33):
money materials, plans.

Speaker 1 (08:37):
I don't want you holding the money. I'm sorry, I don't.

Speaker 6 (08:40):
And you know, if this costs me every retailer I have,
or every contractor I have on the referral list, so
be it. I am so goddamn tired of lying, cheating, scum,
sucking pigs who take money from consumers.

Speaker 1 (08:55):
I am tired of them.

Speaker 6 (08:58):
Now. I don't think we have to worry about that
on the referral list. I mean, you know, something can
befall them. That's not their fault. But I know my contractors.
They're wonderful people and if you can trust anyone, you
can trust them. But still you shouldn't give them money
either for nothing, not for nothing. It's got to be

(09:21):
for something, whether it's plans, estimates, pay for an estimate, plans,
materials delivered, or work begins. But the notion of just
paying money like these roofers, what nerve they have to
come out to your house.

Speaker 1 (09:40):
They look at your roof, they give you an estimate.

Speaker 6 (09:44):
Or even worse, they say I will do whatever your
insurance company wants. That's the first roof where you throw out.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
You throw them out.

Speaker 6 (09:50):
You never want a roofer who says I'll do whatever
the insurance company wants. Ever, because the insurance company doesn't
want what's best for you, so they say we'll pay
for whatever the insurance company covers.

Speaker 1 (10:03):
Throw them out.

Speaker 6 (10:04):
You want a roofer that's going to give you a
complete and thorough and a detailed estimate, no per insurance.
Throw them out. Now you get this detailed contract. One,
no penalty clauses. Two, no money down. If they want
money down, don't use them. It's that simple. If you
have a roofer who wants your first check or wants

(10:27):
money down to put you on the schedule, don't use them.

Speaker 1 (10:32):
I don't care who.

Speaker 6 (10:32):
Don't use them. When materials are delivered. It's okay to
pay something when work begins, it's okay to pay something
as work progresses.

Speaker 1 (10:41):
It's okay to pay something.

Speaker 6 (10:43):
But we have to we have to do something to
protect consumers.

Speaker 1 (10:49):
I don't know, we just have to.

Speaker 6 (10:50):
This money down and money being used is becoming an epidemic.
An epidemic. The next one used cars people. I am
almost ready not to take phone calls from people who
buy a used car with one hundred and fifty thousand
miles on it and they never get it checked and

(11:12):
they're surprised when they have a problem with a used car.

Speaker 1 (11:16):
You must assume, you must assume.

Speaker 6 (11:20):
The car is a piece of junk until you get
it checked out. You can't buy a used car without
getting it checked out. If a car dealer will not
let you completely and thoroughly check the car out, do
not buy it. I don't care who you're dealing with.

(11:42):
I don't care who you're dealing with. Don't buy the car. Now,
you would think it would get tiring me, tiring me
talking about the same stuff over and over. I've been
doing this show listen for forty five years and nothing
has changed. Nothing. You have a bunch of YouTube morons

(12:05):
who listen. They're smart. Then you have the biggest add up,
the IQs, and you may get You may get what
an IQ of twenty five or thirty. I mean, these
people are the stupidest people that ever walk the face
of the earth. Now, I don't think they're all individually
that stupid but somehow when they get on that next

(12:27):
store for him. Have you ever read of Kevin? Have
you ever read the advice they give.

Speaker 7 (12:34):
And the recommendations and everything. Yeah, it's it's challenging.

Speaker 6 (12:37):
So I go on there and warn people of scams.
Do you think people would be grateful for that? I
stop doing it. When I went on next door and
I'd warn people of scams, here's what I would get
as a return. Here's my replies. Oh, you're exaggerating. That
never happens. I'm a contractor, no one ever does that.

(12:58):
I have a mover, does that. I'm a plumber, no
one ever does that. Or I've hired so and so
fifty times. And I don't believe in the way you're
giving recommendations. Or Tom Martino, you don't know anything. You
know what. What's amazing to me is the the I

(13:20):
don't care. I'm gonna use the word retard. And you
it's the blind leading the blind. Next to that Facebook,
the blind leading the blind. If you want some quality information,
then you need to you need to listen to this show.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
I swear to God. I mean I even watch show.

Speaker 6 (13:39):
I even watch our local TV reporters and they do
a pretty good job of reporting consumer scams, but they
don't know what the hell they're talking about. I'll give
you an example coming back that this was on Channel
seven and it wasn't inaccurate.

Speaker 1 (13:54):
By the way, Channel seven was not inaccurate.

Speaker 6 (13:57):
But they did not add tech mixture and depth to
their story, and it's a dumb, stupid story without that.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
I'll talk about it coming back. I'm Tom Martine.

Speaker 6 (14:13):
Go with a sure thing Denver's best rufer excel roofing
dot com. You don't pay a cent until you're content.
Time for an insurance checkup free, no obligation. In comparison,
call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at dozens
of insurance companies find out now three all three, seven
to seven to one help. You'll think you're his only

(14:34):
customer when you choose Frank durand the real estate Man
dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance three
oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two. I'm Tom Martino.
You're a troubleshooter. I'm gonna read the article from Channel
seven coming up and.

Speaker 1 (14:53):
Tell you the flaws and the story.

Speaker 6 (14:55):
Now, when I say flaws, it's not inaccurate, not dishonest.
It just is incomplete, and I believe journalists do a
disservice when they report things that are incomplete.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
I'm serious.

Speaker 6 (15:10):
This is a really, really good example of journalism that
went halfway, and that's Channel seven KMGH. Look, I think
our local news all around Denver, I think they do
a pretty good job. I really do. I think though
in some areas they actually don't educate their listener and

(15:34):
so what they and they don't do it on purpose
in order for their story to have more impact. I'll
explain that to you. You'll understand what I mean in
a minute here. And if I was at Channel seven
right now, I'd call my assignment editor or my news
director or assistant news director or executive producer and I'd listen.

Speaker 1 (15:53):
It's not like I come to the party with no experience.

Speaker 6 (15:56):
I've been in I've been in local TV news for
thirty two years, then I retired from that. I've been
in local radio for fifty years, forty five years. I've
been in journalism in general for fifty years. And I'm
not sold in some old fart curmudgeon who says, oh,
these kids don't know anything. No, No, I acknowledge that

(16:18):
we have some really good reporters. I really mean. I
like Steve Sager.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
I like him.

Speaker 6 (16:23):
He's a consumer reporter, good guy, he does a good job.
But I want to point out to a story. This
is really really important that I bring out the story
that they did and why it's incomplete, and how local
news can be improved if you care.

Speaker 1 (16:42):
First, James has.

Speaker 6 (16:44):
An issue with an hoaa. James, what is on your
mind today? How can we help you?

Speaker 8 (16:52):
Well, long story short. I live in a community up
in Erie, Colorado, Blue Sky. It's in Vista Ridge, and
there's an HOA involved.

Speaker 6 (17:03):
And okay, is.

Speaker 1 (17:04):
The name of the subdivision?

Speaker 6 (17:06):
Is the name of the subdivision Vista Ridge or Blue Sky.

Speaker 8 (17:10):
It's in Vista Ridge. It's part of Vista Ridge. Okay,
this guy is the name of the There's a couple
of different sections in the Vista Ridge.

Speaker 1 (17:18):
Gotcha one of them?

Speaker 9 (17:19):
Bases?

Speaker 1 (17:19):
Yeah, I got you?

Speaker 6 (17:20):
Go ahead, sir, Sorry, Oh.

Speaker 9 (17:23):
No, you're fine.

Speaker 8 (17:24):
And so there was a leak that had affected a
unit that was below my unit back in December, and.

Speaker 10 (17:32):
So I got a phone call saying, hey.

Speaker 8 (17:33):
We need to get into your unit and you know,
make sure the leak is not coming from your unit
because it was coming from the ceiling in the unit below.

Speaker 6 (17:40):
And how many units? How many units in your particular building.

Speaker 8 (17:46):
I think there's eight to twelve okay, and the second
floor unit and it was affecting the first floor.

Speaker 6 (17:56):
Okay, so you are which one? Are you the second floor?

Speaker 8 (18:00):
I am the second floor, yes, sir.

Speaker 6 (18:02):
And they wanted to see where the leak was coming from. Okay,
sounds good. What else?

Speaker 8 (18:08):
And so I talked to the contractor and I said,
that's great. You know, once you guys do a leak
test and determine it was in my unit. Because they
spoke about wanting to open.

Speaker 11 (18:17):
Up the walls.

Speaker 8 (18:18):
Yeah, but I have no problem with that as long
as you do a leak test and conferment's coming from
my apartment, because obviously I don't want you to cot
open my walls. Right, figure out it's just a leaky
pipe below the floor floor.

Speaker 1 (18:28):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 6 (18:30):
So far that sounds pretty reasonable to me, Like, don't
just willy nilly go digging into walls, exactly.

Speaker 8 (18:38):
And so they waited six months to do anything.

Speaker 6 (18:41):
Wait a minute, Wait a minute, wait a minute. During
this six months, you had a leak or somebody had
a leak for the whole six months. Yes, sir, wait
a minute, they knew of a leak and they waited
six months.

Speaker 8 (18:57):
I have an email from the manager of at Advanced
HOA who manages the TA.

Speaker 6 (19:04):
Why did they wait? Why did they wait six months?

Speaker 8 (19:08):
I couldn't tell you.

Speaker 9 (19:10):
You know, there was no.

Speaker 6 (19:12):
You know, Okay, let's get right to it. After six months,
what did they do?

Speaker 8 (19:17):
So they finally hired a contractor asr is the name
of the contractor, to come in and they determined that
the leak was coming from my apartment. So then we
went through about two weeks worth of repairs.

Speaker 6 (19:29):
Okay, And where in your apartment was it coming from?
If you don't mind telling me, like where specifically?

Speaker 8 (19:37):
Well, so that's where the gray area is. It's a
pipe that was going down the wall, which I've been
told by you know, contractors that it's event pipe. So
I'm suspecting that there was something done. You know, there's pictures,
and I have pictures, and you know, I documented the
whole event, and they're saying that there was I've been

(19:59):
told by a another contractor that it was event pipe,
but they're saying it was a drain pipe that was
going did.

Speaker 6 (20:04):
They say it was Did they say it was coming
from your apartment or it was leaking from your apartment.

Speaker 1 (20:10):
There's a big.

Speaker 8 (20:11):
Difference leaking leaking from this pipe in the wall that
had no water damage. There was no water damage in
my apartment.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
Okay.

Speaker 8 (20:21):
But then they opened up the wall and basically said
that there was a little bit of mold which they mitigated,
and there was a leaky pipe and that was the
source of.

Speaker 6 (20:28):
The repair and they fixed it, the source.

Speaker 8 (20:30):
Of the leak, I should say, they did fix it.
I let them in the unit, you know, over and
over again for two weeks until it was.

Speaker 10 (20:36):
Got it, you know.

Speaker 1 (20:38):
Now, So now what's going on?

Speaker 6 (20:39):
Bro?

Speaker 1 (20:40):
What's going on now?

Speaker 8 (20:42):
So now the problem is is they're saying that I
broke you know, HOA regulations because I wouldn't let them
in the unit alone because I felt like something shady
was going on. And there was a period of time
that was over forty eight hours where they weren't able
to enter the apartment to keep working on the repair.
So now two months later, after the repairs them complete,
they're saying that I am now responsible for the repair

(21:04):
downstairs and the repair upstairs, and they put a bill
in my h are.

Speaker 1 (21:09):
Yeah, and I get it.

Speaker 6 (21:10):
James, James, I'm going to tell you they're on solid footing,
except there's a way to fight it. But I think
you aired here, but I think I can give you
some ammunition. Hang on, okay, and then Glinda, you hang
on too. This is really important. By the way, water
is primary.

Speaker 1 (21:31):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (21:31):
You look at after my fight of cancer. I looked
at my supplementation, my food. My doctors say water is
the primary nutrient, not really a nutrient, but primary in
your life. And if you don't have good water going
into your body, it literally can cause serious problems. We

(21:52):
don't even know what the microplastics and forever chemicals can do.
I am a firm believer that every home should at
least have reverse osmo is at the kitchen sink for
drinking water for you and your kids, and bottles and formulas.
You can get it cheaper and better than anywhere else
with waterpros dot net. That's it. Twelve hundred bucks. You

(22:13):
cannot beat that. That is an investment in your health.
You'll never have to buy bottled water again, which by
the way, also has plastic.

Speaker 1 (22:21):
So you see what I'm saying.

Speaker 6 (22:23):
Waterpros dot net three O three eight six two five
five five four Go with a sure thing Denver's Best
roofer Excel Roofing dot com. You don't pay a cent
until you're content. Time for an insurance checkup free, no obligation.

(22:44):
In comparison, call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage
at dozens of insurance companies find out now three oh
three seven seven to one help. You'll think you're his
only customer when you choose Frank Durand the real estate
Man dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance
three oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two. Hi

(23:06):
Tom Martine, you're a troubleshooter. The show within the show,
that's what I call it. If you're watching on YouTube.
By the way, I'm going back to this other problem
here James and is his condo thing?

Speaker 1 (23:22):
Is he still there? I don't see him? Did he
hang up?

Speaker 6 (23:25):
James is gone? He had to go? Why is some
really information? Okay, I'm gonna give the information anyway. Okay,
because this happens to a lot of people. Okay, you
have to give unfettered access to your unit when the
HOA determines it's an urgent repair. Anything that happens after that,

(23:53):
anything you're responsible for, not the original problem, but the
additional damage. They do have a right to pop you
for any additional damage. So, James, if you're listening, they
can't get you for the whole problem. But at which
point they said they needed access? If you hindered them

(24:13):
in any way, I don't care what your excuse is,
it doesn't matter. They have a key and you could
have said yes, okay, you could have. Now I know
you're going to have a million reasons why you didn't
want to. Something screwy going on, right as they say.
But here's the problem is, you can't deny them. You can't,

(24:35):
and it's up to them to determine when it is
okay to do it. It's not up to you, it's
up to them. So when you deny coverage, they're allowed
to take the damage that happened after that, and then
they're allowed to charge you for any subsequent damages. You're

(24:58):
never going to win the fight. I'm telling you that
we've seen this over and over again. Now we have
a comment on Amazon from Bill. Bill, what is your comment?

Speaker 11 (25:07):
Hey, how's it going?

Speaker 6 (25:08):
Hey?

Speaker 11 (25:08):
Listen, I agree with you one hundred percent. I got
tired of going to the store and they go, well,
we can have it here in two days, this stuff
and that stuff, and so I just thought of buying
the stuff on animal.

Speaker 6 (25:22):
Now think about Think about that, Bill, Think about that.
You're at a store and they say to you, well,
we can order that. I mean, it is so moronic.
I can't believe it. Why would you even tell someone
of that? Everybody in the world can order it on
their own right.

Speaker 11 (25:39):
And then seeing then about I think it's been about
ten years ago, I bought two thousand dollars worth of
Amazon stock. I'm looking at my account now, it's sixty
three thousand dollars.

Speaker 6 (25:51):
How much did you spend for it? Two grand Oh
my god, that's pretty cool, Okay.

Speaker 11 (25:59):
Bill, ridiculous, Like especially for my wife with her work clothes.
Well you get here in a couple of days or whatever.

Speaker 6 (26:06):
Bill, May I mention something. I recognize voices, and of
course I recognize you from a long time ago, and
I'm going to make an observation. I have no idea
where it's coming from, but it just you sound for
some reason younger and healthier than you used to sound
on the radio. Does that make sense to you. Now,

(26:27):
I'm not trying to be like some soothsayer here or
some psychic radio.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
But something in you changed.

Speaker 6 (26:35):
I mean that Bill, I just yeah, whatever, Yeah, I
take a million supplements and pills. Yeah, but were you
let me ask you this, were you last year? Let's say,
were you under the weather for something? Did something change
for the better?

Speaker 11 (26:52):
Nic problems that you know. I wonder sometimes if I
didn't have insurance, if I would even have those problems.

Speaker 6 (27:00):
Oh, I see as you're saying, yeah, when they see
you have insurance, like doc, the doctor says you have
six months to live, and you say, oh, but my
insurance coverage runs out in three months, he says, okay,
I'll give you three months to live anyway, three or no, no,
the other way around. You're gonna die in three months. Oh,

(27:22):
I have insurance coverage for six months.

Speaker 1 (27:24):
Okay, you can have six months.

Speaker 6 (27:26):
Speaking to that, Glenda wants to talk about medical bills.

Speaker 1 (27:29):
That was a failed attempt at a at a joke.

Speaker 6 (27:32):
So please forgive me, and thanks Shannon for not for
not beeping me. You see, I've given I've given Shannon
the authority to bleep me when he thinks I'm not
going anywhere. Go ahead, Glenda. What's going on with you?

Speaker 12 (27:47):
Hi?

Speaker 6 (27:47):
Tom, Hi Glenda.

Speaker 13 (27:50):
Yeah, my doctor insurance company is not paying for a
hospital bill. They say they've run out of fun And
wait a minute.

Speaker 6 (28:01):
Wait a minute, your insurance company said, and we ran
out of funds.

Speaker 13 (28:07):
Yeah, my daughters, she got insurance through her work and
it's a on her card. It's called corporate plan management.

Speaker 6 (28:19):
Oh, wait a minute, are they self Are they self insured?

Speaker 1 (28:22):
Glinda correct?

Speaker 13 (28:25):
I believe yes.

Speaker 1 (28:27):
Wait a minute.

Speaker 6 (28:28):
I gotta get I got to get Integra to talk
about this. Plus, we have open enrollment starting soon. I
want to get them on. I want them to weigh
in on these corporate plans. I thought to be self
insured there had to be a certain amount of money
put up and then you had to have an independent
plan administrator explain to me what her health problem is.

Speaker 13 (28:50):
Well, she had knee surgery in October, and the on
her car through Southwest Kansas chain of Commerce is what's
on the card also, And that's the telephone number and
a email they gave me after I spoke to want.

Speaker 6 (29:07):
I want to I want to google it, man, I
want to google it. What is the actual name of it.
That the plan.

Speaker 13 (29:14):
The well, there's the car says corporate CPM, Corporate Plan Management,
and up in the.

Speaker 6 (29:21):
C PM, Corporate Plan Management. Okay, And and it's it's
how does it work? Tell me how it works?

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Normally?

Speaker 6 (29:31):
She submits her bills like any insurance and they pay it.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
Correct.

Speaker 13 (29:38):
And they paid her physical therapy that was paid. And
she's been in contact with the hospital up in Greeley and.

Speaker 6 (29:48):
Saying it, so what you said, there was something else
that was on there, something with the Chamber of Commerce.
What was that?

Speaker 13 (29:55):
Yeah, that's who I guess has it? I talked to, uh, well,
what's Chamber of what?

Speaker 1 (30:00):
Chamber of Commerce?

Speaker 13 (30:03):
Southwest Kansas, Chamber of.

Speaker 1 (30:05):
Commerce, so this is Southwest Kansas, Okay.

Speaker 6 (30:08):
And is this through her employer to her employer, yees?

Speaker 14 (30:12):
Correct?

Speaker 6 (30:13):
And does she work for the Chamber of Commerce?

Speaker 13 (30:17):
No, she works for this doctor who has the insurance,
who had it. They've since given it up since January
and she's with someone else now. But she's still trying
to get this bill.

Speaker 1 (30:28):
And how much is the bill?

Speaker 13 (30:31):
Well, the hospital center a bill fifty two thousand that's
not paid and they the hospital sent her a letter
or called her and said that they were sending her
to collections and.

Speaker 6 (30:42):
You know, they're never going to get anything. They're never
going to get anything medical bills. Medical bills don't even
hardly affect your credit even though they put them on
your credit.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
People give you a pass for those.

Speaker 6 (30:54):
From what I can find on their website, Southwest Kansas
Chamber Alliance for Health and Wellness, they actually put together
a plan called CPM, Inc.

Speaker 1 (31:04):
And it says that.

Speaker 6 (31:08):
It's it's a they're a planned administrator. But I just
don't understand what they do.

Speaker 13 (31:14):
So on that card is called six six degree Health,
So I don't know if that's the company AM got them.
But anyway, I did call this and talked to a
person yesterday with this corporate Plan Management, and she said
that my daughter was correct that the Southwest Kansas Chamber
of Commerce has run out of funds. They are going

(31:36):
they are trying to get funds to pay these bills.
One of the doctors that my daughter works for also said, hey,
I'm not paying he had surgery and they weren't paying
his either.

Speaker 6 (31:46):
You know, this is it's a self insurance plan that
was formed during Obamacare when everyone had to have it,
and they allowed people to have it, So hold on
a second. I want to get one of our experts
on from Integra Insurance to talk about this.

Speaker 1 (32:05):
All right, I'm Tom Martino.

Speaker 6 (32:12):
Go with a sure thing Denver's best roofer Excel Roofing
dot com. You don't pay a cent until you're content.
Time for an insurance check up free no obligation comparison
call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at dozens
of insurance companies find out now three O three seven
to seven to one help. You'll think you're his only

(32:33):
customer when you choose Frank durand the real estate Man
dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance three
oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two. Hi Tom
Martino here, welcome. Okay, we are trying to get an
answer on this medical coverage Glenda, there will be you know,

(32:56):
this is weird. I the self insured program is hard
to understand going to their website and just reading in
between breaks. But we're working on getting one of our
experts on, so we're going to have to call you back,
but we're working on that diligently to get an expert on,
and they really are experts.

Speaker 1 (33:16):
Also, there is a little known kind.

Speaker 6 (33:20):
Of battle you can do with medical bills in bad faith,
but I'm not sure how it works with self insured entities.
Back when Obama mandated that everyone have insurance, there were
two kinds of weird insurance as they allowed. One was
the Christian Share, and I call it Christian Share, but

(33:43):
it could have been any kind of a faith based
plan where people shared. Then there was another one, which
was self insurance, self administered through the companies, but there
were very strict guidelines. Now those guidelines right now now
under Obamacare we're lifted, So I don't know what happens

(34:04):
now to plans that were mandated under Obama. But Obama
no longer has those mandates, so I don't know what
happens if you're mistreated by one of those plans. We
need to explore that. And Michelle, you have a question
on movers, and I'm going to tell you something right now.
This is an important call I will take because ripoffs.

(34:26):
If I had to make a list of ripoffs, it
would be in the top ten.

Speaker 1 (34:30):
And I am right now coming up with.

Speaker 6 (34:33):
A list of my top ten complaints, and one of
them definitely would be moving. Here's the problem. The moving
industry is mostly liars, cheaters, and ripoffs. Usually it's the
other way around, but the moving industry is not mostly
good people with a few bad. It's mostly bad people

(34:54):
with a few good. We'll talk about that and more
coming up on the Troubleshooter Show. Go with a sure
Thing Denver's Best Roofer Excel Roofing dot com. You don't
pay a cent until you're content. Time for an insurance
check up free, no obligation comparison call Compass Insurance. Pay

(35:15):
too much your coverage at dozens of insurance companies find
out now three oh three seven seven to one help.
You'll think you're his only customer when you choose Frank
durand the real estate Man dot com to list your
home with Remax Alliance three oh three nine two zero
sixteen twenty two, ripped of news, deleed advice.

Speaker 9 (35:39):
You don't have.

Speaker 4 (35:42):
Run anxious as can show. Shooter's gonna help.

Speaker 14 (35:47):
Come man.

Speaker 3 (35:49):
This is the Troubleshooter Show. No Tom Martine, Hi.

Speaker 6 (35:54):
Tom Martina here. This is the consumer Show, the help Show,
the kickass Show. But let's get it in the hopper
and discuss it show. We talk about everything every day,
Aches and pains, and this is the only place to
really kick that stuff around. We only get political when
it has to do with policies for personal finance and

(36:16):
that kind of stuff and responsibility and really on policy
for consumers. And we've had this issue come up time
and time again. Health insurance. John Jones Junior. He is
with Integer Insurance, our health insurance experts. They're brokers and

(36:40):
they help people buy insurance or direct them toward medicare
excuse me, Medicaid when they are applicable and when they qualify.
So anyway, open enrollments coming up soon, which is really important.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
That's not why I have them on the show.

Speaker 6 (36:58):
I have them on to talk about the weird problem
with Glenda, but in general we will also touch upon
open enrollment in a second here. But Glenda, you have
medical bills and you I want John to listen to this.

Speaker 1 (37:15):
The CV can add anything.

Speaker 6 (37:17):
So you worked for a company, Glenda, which had this
a kind of insurance, health insurance or your daughter? I
mean so, and had your daughter used this so called
health insurance?

Speaker 1 (37:36):
Had she used it previously?

Speaker 6 (37:39):
No? Okay? And what where did she work? What's the
name do you mind saying? Where she works?

Speaker 13 (37:47):
I'm not sure she would want it.

Speaker 1 (37:49):
Okay, Okay, that's fine.

Speaker 6 (37:51):
Is it a private is it a private corporation or
a private company, or is it a government or some
kind of public agency.

Speaker 13 (38:00):
It's a private okay, doctor, Okay.

Speaker 6 (38:04):
So she works for a private eye doctor. And she
was told recently, John, this is weird that their plan
ran out of money. Explain it, Glinda, as the best
you can. What was she told?

Speaker 13 (38:20):
So on her card it is corporate plan management, and
I think six Degrees might be the insurance company that
they I don't know, it's on the card too, But
they paid for her physical therapy, and then they weren't
paying the hospital bill for her knee surgery, which was
like fifty two thousand dollars. Said that they were working

(38:41):
on it, working on it. She just got a letter
from him saying that this Southwest Kansas Chamber of Commerce
had run out of funds.

Speaker 6 (38:50):
Okay, but here's what I'm so confused. You're you're mentioning
corporate plan management, You're mentioned six degrees, and you also
mentioned this Chamber of Commerce. I don't understand what the
Chamber of Commerce has to do with it.

Speaker 13 (39:10):
I'm not sure either, Tom. But I'm looking at her
insurance card. The front of it says in the top
left hand corner, Southwest Kansas Chamber of Commerce, and then
it has her member and ID number. To the right
of that, it says provider network is six Degree Help.
And then in the bottom left it says CPM, which

(39:34):
is that Corporate Plan Management, And that's the telephone number
that when you call the number on the back of
the card, that's who it reaches.

Speaker 6 (39:42):
So, my god, I don't know how to explain this,
So help me, John Jones. I don't know if you've
ever heard of these self funded plans like this, but
apparently it is through six Degree Health Insurance and somehow
Southwest Kansas Chamber of Commerce has something to do with it,
and then something called Corporate Plan Management. It's making my

(40:04):
head spin. Can you shed any light on it?

Speaker 9 (40:08):
No, I'm not, Yeah, I'm not.

Speaker 15 (40:09):
I mean I six Degrees Health.

Speaker 10 (40:12):
I believe when I look at six.

Speaker 15 (40:13):
Degrees Health, it says championing championing fairness and accuracy and
healthcare payments. So it doesn't even sound like that has
anything to do with UH payment integrity, claim claim reviews,
things like that.

Speaker 6 (40:24):
Okay, tell tell us this, then John, are there?

Speaker 1 (40:28):
Okay?

Speaker 6 (40:29):
When Obamacare came into existence, I know there were a
few weird plans that that allowed people to get away
with the requirement. One of them was Christian Share and
Faith Shared plans, and I believe another one was self
funded corporate plans.

Speaker 15 (40:52):
Well, I mean, you'd have to work for a large
company that does self funded corporate plans. They're not just
available out there to individual rules and families. So primarily,
I mean the vast majority of policies health insurance policies
that exist in our state, whether it's individual and family
or even small group, they're affordable CARECT even large group

(41:13):
to a degree, affordable care, qualified health insurance plans, best
health stream exists and they still exist.

Speaker 6 (41:20):
But how can this She got a mess, They got
a message saying basically, we ran out of money, we
can't pay the bills.

Speaker 9 (41:28):
Yeah, no, I hear that.

Speaker 15 (41:31):
And it's a private eye doctor, So I assume that
that's a small business. Am I correcting that?

Speaker 13 (41:39):
They've got several locations. They've got a couple in Kansas.

Speaker 10 (41:44):
And two or three Okays.

Speaker 13 (41:47):
Colorado, so it's not just one.

Speaker 15 (41:51):
So and then you you did mention here, so the
Southwest Chamber of comm Commerce Kansas Chamber of Commerce.

Speaker 9 (41:58):
Here, so is the is the group.

Speaker 15 (42:00):
Domiciled in Kansas?

Speaker 6 (42:02):
Like?

Speaker 15 (42:02):
Is that where the original location is?

Speaker 14 (42:05):
Do you know?

Speaker 13 (42:06):
Correct? I believe so? Okay, So when I called the
Corporate Plan Management and SO to a very nice person,
she said, yes, there were several people that weren't getting
their bills paid.

Speaker 6 (42:19):
She and what corporate Plan Management sounds like to me,
John is simply an administrator for claims.

Speaker 1 (42:27):
I don't think they have anything to do with the funding.

Speaker 15 (42:30):
When I look at Corporate Plan Management, it's an insurance
broker in Topeka, Kansas.

Speaker 6 (42:36):
Right, So they're the ones that probably sold this plan.
But I don't know what part Southwest Kansas Chamber of
Commerce has. Here's what I'm surmising that or concluding that
this eye doctor or hit the company is a part
of Southwest Kansas Chamber of Commerce, and as such the

(43:00):
Chamber is kind of offering this plan.

Speaker 13 (43:08):
And that could be when I talk to this. She
gave me the website to the Southwest Kansas She said
that's the ones that's run out of funding and that
they will pay the bills when the funds come in.
She gave me the name of a person at the
Southwest Kansas Chamber of Commerce and their email address to
email her I haven't called for yet.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
Okay, here's what I found out.

Speaker 6 (43:33):
The CPM is nothing more than a benefit administrator. So
what that means is this, if you have a pot
of money through your self funded insurance company, when an
employee puts in a claim, it goes through CPM and

(43:53):
they track down the validity of the claim and the
provider and they match it to your benefits and pay accordingly.

Speaker 1 (44:03):
So all they.

Speaker 6 (44:04):
Are is an administration arm. That's all they do. So
they're out of it. Okay, they have nothing to do
with it. The Southwest Kansas Chamber has an alliance and
it's literally their health plan for members of the Chamber
of Commerce. So John, they're calling it the Southwest Kansas

(44:29):
Chamber Alliance Health Plan.

Speaker 14 (44:31):
Yeah, I'm looking at the PDF right now.

Speaker 1 (44:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (44:35):
So this must be where they have offered their members.
And we've had other situations like this in the past, John,
where groups got together and chipped in so to speak,
for a group plan because it was beneficial to its members.
And so we had in this case a Chamber of Commerce.

(44:55):
In other cases we had professional associations doing it, you.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Know, like like you know, like.

Speaker 6 (45:01):
The Brotherhood of this or that, or there were professional
associations that offer this as well. Do you know the
structure of those john, how they work?

Speaker 15 (45:12):
I don't, But I wonder though if they are regulated
by and subject to the Division of Insurance in Kansas.

Speaker 1 (45:22):
Well, wouldn't they have to be, wouldn't they really have
to be?

Speaker 15 (45:25):
Yeah, it's a health plan, so they should have to be.
And so that might be where you need to start
taking this.

Speaker 6 (45:35):
Okay, So, by the way, it looks like I'm finding
it already here. So from what I can find out,
the structure is this. The CPM is simply a claims
administrator or a claims processor. And the people supplying the

(45:55):
money is this alliance from Southwest Kansas Chamber and they
are the ones that purchase from the sixth degree.

Speaker 1 (46:08):
So it's very convoluted.

Speaker 6 (46:11):
But Glenda, I'm going to tell you something right now,
they probably I'm gonna I'm looking at worst case scenario here.
Let's look at worst case if they don't pay. How
much are your kids? How much are your daughter's bills
right now?

Speaker 13 (46:27):
What hospital is billing or fifty born or two thousand.

Speaker 6 (46:32):
Okay, Now, John Jones will tell you this as well.
When people are stuck with astronomical medical bills and there
is a failure in the system to pay. John, very
seldom do they literally go after judgments against individuals anymore.
Isn't that true? Anyway I can answer for him. Yes,

(46:57):
it is very rare. They do not go after individuals
with judgments. They just don't because.

Speaker 13 (47:04):
It's easy collection.

Speaker 16 (47:07):
Because she is okay, okay, Well, when they go after
her from collections, she's going to say, I don't have
the money and I'm going to have to file bankruptcy.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
That might be her only way out. But I have not.

Speaker 6 (47:23):
I have very seldom seen people forced into bankruptcy.

Speaker 1 (47:29):
The health.

Speaker 6 (47:30):
Okay, medical bills are almost in a category by themselves.
Yes they go on the credit report, and yes they're
counted against people technically. But if she went to buy
a car, or if she went to do something to
get credit and the only bad thing on her account

(47:54):
was a medical bill, I'm not talking about like an
X ray bill of one hundred and twenty five bucks
talked about. When there is a massive medical debt, many
creditors give these consumers a break, they don't count it
against them. That's just the way it's been so and

(48:14):
and this happened under the Biden administration. They thought it
was unfair that people are caught up in the muck
and meyer of medical bills. John Jones, have you heard
any rumblings about this in the industry since you are
in the business.

Speaker 1 (48:31):
I guess, I.

Speaker 6 (48:33):
Guess he got he got disconnected.

Speaker 15 (48:35):
No, yeah, I could hear you guys for a while,
but you guys couldn't hear me, And so I don't know, okay, And.

Speaker 6 (48:40):
That that that's Shannon's problem.

Speaker 1 (48:42):
Which but.

Speaker 6 (48:46):
With them, John Jones, medical bills, they're not handled like
they used to be. You don't hear a lot of
people having wages garnished and big judgments against them.

Speaker 1 (48:59):
Do you agree?

Speaker 10 (49:00):
I mean, I personally have it, no serve.

Speaker 6 (49:03):
And one of the reasons is they understand people can't
pay them and if you have a breakdown in coverage.
Glenda or your daughter, did I think she's overthinking it?

Speaker 1 (49:17):
What she says is.

Speaker 6 (49:19):
I don't Well, it actually will technically be a black
mark on her credit, but they will not most creditors
will not hold it against them.

Speaker 13 (49:34):
Can they send her to bankruptcy if she's making monthly payments,
I don't well.

Speaker 6 (49:38):
Well, first of all, no one sends No one sends
anyone to bankruptcy. Bankruptcy makes it go away. And there
are ways to bankrupt. There are ways to go bankrupt
to get rid of one debt.

Speaker 1 (49:54):
And and let's put it this.

Speaker 6 (49:56):
Way, if they really did go far enough to get judgment,
let's say they get a judgment for let's say sixty thousand.

Speaker 1 (50:04):
Dollars with interest and penalty.

Speaker 6 (50:06):
Let's just say they get that and they start garnishing
her wages for sixty thousand dollars. She's going to be
in debt for a very long time, and one of
the only ways to get out of it would be
a bankruptcy. People think of bankruptcy as being immoral or
some something wrong. It is something wrong, and there are

(50:27):
some cases where bankruptcies are a bit immoral and people
engineer them. But when it comes to medical bills, creditors
look at those in a whole different light. In fact,
what I'd like to do, Kaschina, Let's get Mike wink On.
I'd like to talk to him about medical bankruptcies.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
Okay, so right now, what's that?

Speaker 13 (50:56):
And they sent her to collections if she's paying her
monthly b of course they can.

Speaker 6 (51:02):
Of course they can. They can send her collections. I mean,
anyone can send anyone to collections. If she's making monthly payments,
she'll be making monthly payments the rest of her life.
I'm trying to tell you how to get out of it. Okay, Now,
if she's too proud to do a medical bankruptcy for
medical debt and she wants to make payments the rest

(51:24):
of her life, more power to her. It's ridiculous and
it's wasteful because, first of all, the medical bills in
and of themselves are exaggerated to begin with, because they're
billing insurance. Everything is exaggerated when it comes to medical bills.
That's why people don't hold medical bills against you when

(51:47):
they're evaluating your credit. I don't even know if you're
listening to what I'm saying, because you keep asking the
same question. But no one sends anyone to bankruptcy. People
go to bankruptcy on their own to escape debt. And
I would like to talk to our attorney, Mike Wink
about bankruptcy specifically for medical debt okay three zero three

(52:10):
seven one three talk seven one three A two five five.

Speaker 1 (52:13):
And by the way, while.

Speaker 6 (52:16):
We're talking about insurance, this is regular insurance. Compass Insurance
will do an evaluation. You see we add this condo
guy on about his insurance and some other people. Here's
what you need to know insurance.

Speaker 1 (52:29):
Right now.

Speaker 6 (52:30):
They're being very sneaky and they're withholding coverages or diminishing
coverages and charging you more premium. You need to know
the state of your insurance right now. They're sneaking in
higher deductibles, and they're sneaking in all kinds of terms
and conditions that you get this notice in the mail

(52:51):
and you might think it's junk mail. What I suggest
you do is get an insurance review of exactly what's
cover and what's not so you're not surprised. And Compass
will do that free of charge, and they'll let you
know if there's anything better on the market. It's really true.
An objective three oh three nine ninety six nine thousand,

(53:18):
Go with a sure thing Denver's Best roofer Excel roofing
dot com. You don't pay a cent until you're content.
Time for an insurance checkup free no obligation comparison call
Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at dozens of
insurance companies find out now three oh three seven to
seven to one. Help. You'll think you're his only customer

(53:40):
when you choose Frank durand the real estate man dot
com to list your home with Remax Alliance three oh
three nine two zero sixteen twenty two. Hey, I'm Tom Martinez.
You're a troubleshooter. All right, let's go back to the phones.
Three oh three seven one three talks one three eight
two five five.

Speaker 1 (54:01):
Mike Wink is with us.

Speaker 6 (54:02):
He is a bankruptcy attorney and we use him as
our expert.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
Mike Wink and that's Wink Law Firm dot com.

Speaker 6 (54:09):
And Mike, I heard, and I just wonder from your
experience I've heard, especially since COVID, but I hear that
creditors don't likely go after people whose insurance didn't pay something.

Speaker 1 (54:27):
Or who racked up a massive medical bill.

Speaker 6 (54:30):
Glenda's daughter, for example, with surgery and stuff, racked up
fifty grand and her insurance company ran out of money.
Her health insurance company literally said they ran out of money.
So I guess we should just confine this conversation to collections,
how aggressive do companies? How aggressive our companies when it

(54:55):
comes to medical debt, I would.

Speaker 14 (54:59):
Say, there's definitely trying to collect debts that are owed
to them. And you know, I don't know from what
you just described. I'm not going to say I firsthand
have knowledge of the insurance company sort of.

Speaker 9 (55:13):
I don't know.

Speaker 14 (55:13):
You said running out of money. That sounds, but people
often incur you know, deductibles and portions of a bill
that are not covered. And in general, the hospitals are
not the most aggressive in pursuing that. They will certainly try,
and then eventually the debt gets sold to a collector

(55:36):
who will be much more aggressive and likely to sue.

Speaker 6 (55:41):
So I have also heard that large medical debts on
a credit report does not do the harm as let's
say a car repossession or a credit card that's late.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
Is that true?

Speaker 9 (55:56):
Yeah?

Speaker 14 (55:56):
So I know there's there's new rules about medical that's
being reported to credit bureaus and they have to wait
and it has to be of a certain size before
it can show up on your credit report. In terms
of how that's interpreted, I you know, I would defer
to like a mortgage broker, or somebody, you know, it's
certainly okay, you know, I don't know, but I mean,

(56:19):
obviously unpaid that on your credit is not a good thing.

Speaker 6 (56:24):
Okay, So really she has a Here's what I said.
Even if they did come after her for fifty grand
and she listens, she's like working her ass off, just
trying to make ends meet. Is there such thing as

(56:44):
a medical bankruptcy or bankrupting just on that if she
didn't want to mess up everything?

Speaker 1 (56:51):
How do you handle that?

Speaker 6 (56:52):
Mike?

Speaker 1 (56:52):
Let's say someone has great.

Speaker 6 (56:54):
Credit and their whole life is in order, but they
have this damn medical bill and it's like fifty or
one hundred grand.

Speaker 1 (57:02):
How do you handle something like that?

Speaker 9 (57:05):
Right?

Speaker 14 (57:05):
So, to answer your first question, there is no there
is no sort of specifically targeted bankruptcy, all right. So
every single bank right of an individual is going to
include all of their debt and all their assets, and
that's required by law. So even though the medical bill,
maybe the driver, you know, a small credit card that
she would otherwise pay, still has to go into the

(57:27):
bankruptcy now, okay, right, right, So, but there are some options,
certainly if she's you know, there are discounts available if
she's indigent, and hospitals typically have.

Speaker 17 (57:42):
Programs for submitting financial information to try to get reliefs.
So while a lot of debt can be settled, you know,
I think we've talked about that on the show, you know,
for roughly half, sometimes the discount one can get on
medical can be.

Speaker 14 (57:58):
A lot more than that, Okay, establish the inability to pay.
So if I were her, I think that's where I
would start. If this is, you know, based on what
you're telling me here.

Speaker 6 (58:10):
So in other words, you would you would go for
you you would literally go for a negotiation and say, look,
I don't have money, yep. And and you're saying that
when it comes to medical bills. I mean, obviously they're
going to look in to you. But how much information

(58:32):
do you have to give them when you start these negotiations?
Do they want to see each and every bill you're
paying and what your financial condition is?

Speaker 14 (58:41):
I think I think you can get by with a
recent tax return and a PASTEP Okay.

Speaker 6 (58:46):
So Glinda, Glinda, I want to ask something. Does your
daughter own a house.

Speaker 2 (58:54):
Now?

Speaker 6 (58:55):
Okay? And does she have anything of great value? Big
savings stuff, Akka counts or anything like that?

Speaker 3 (59:02):
No?

Speaker 6 (59:05):
And how much are the bills totaling right now? Have
you total them all up?

Speaker 13 (59:14):
She's got you know that fifty two with the hospital,
and then we're probably a credit card yeah, and a
horse payment. I'm not okay how much?

Speaker 6 (59:28):
Oh way, so she's into horses. Yeah, well, now I
know she's broke.

Speaker 13 (59:35):
Yeah, very that's for sure.

Speaker 6 (59:38):
Oh yeah, no, no, no, I've been into horses my
whole life. I mean I never met Uh, there's a
joke you want to make a small fortune and horses
start out with a big fortune. Anyway, anyway, And and
also was it Warren Buffet or someone says never never
buy anything that never invests.

Speaker 1 (59:58):
In anything that eats.

Speaker 6 (59:59):
When you see, in any case, Glenda, here's the deal.
It's I think what Mike wink is saying is, look,
you know, you can do a bankruptcy, and sometimes even
the threat of a bankruptcy can force them into a
negotiated settlement. I mean, if they truly know her financial
condition isn't the greatest, they're likely to make a very

(01:00:22):
reasonable settlement for the debt. Is that what you're saying, Mike?

Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
Basically that is that is and.

Speaker 14 (01:00:28):
I mean this is really her only debt that's worth exploring,
and then you know, if you know, depending on the
results of that, she can decide if bankruptcy will be required.

Speaker 6 (01:00:39):
And also in addition to bankruptcy, Mike does do debt
settlement negotiations. When you are sadly in debt and then
you're charged basically on the production and debt, it's like
a contingency feel most of of I mean, you have
to pay it, but what I mean is it's based
on the amount he gets. It's taken off the books,

(01:01:01):
So you may want to check with him or have
your daughter really call him and talk to him. And
you know, as I said, I don't know if I'm
too relaxed when it comes to medical debt Mike, but
I thought, and maybe I just maybe it's just I'm
reading the wrong stuff. I thought there was a real

(01:01:23):
de emphasis or relaxing on the collection of medical debt when.

Speaker 1 (01:01:29):
It comes to going after the consumer.

Speaker 6 (01:01:32):
But you're saying you're still seeing some pretty aggressive collections.

Speaker 9 (01:01:38):
Correct.

Speaker 14 (01:01:39):
I think there's slower probably to sue you than maybe
a credit card lender would be. But we definitely see
lawsuits based on medical unpaid medical bills.

Speaker 6 (01:01:48):
Okay, So Glinda again, I'm going to give out for
your daughter. I'll give out this number for Wink. It's
seven to zero five two three zero six two zero
so uh and it's Wink Law Firm dot com. And

(01:02:10):
I wish you the best on this. You know, medical
bills can can ruin somebody. All Right, this moving problem, Michelle,
I need to take this break. I'll give you then
I can give you more time. I don't want you
to make any big mistakes, so we'll talk about that
coming up. Go with a sure thing Denver's best roofer

(01:02:33):
Excel Roofing dot com. You don't pay a cent until
you're content. Time for an insurance checkup free no obligation
comparison call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at
dozens of insurance companies find out now three o three
seven seven to one help. You'll think you're his only
customer when you choose Frank durand the real estate Man

(01:02:54):
dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance three
oh three nine two zero sixteen t Hi Tom martinro here. Look,
there is a big controversy on reporting medical debt. Okay,
First and foremost, it's voluntary on the part of the

(01:03:16):
medical provider, and it's voluntary on the credit bureau.

Speaker 1 (01:03:20):
On their policy.

Speaker 6 (01:03:23):
The credit bureau can decide not to report it or
to report it based on internal policies.

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
There was a law proposed that would.

Speaker 6 (01:03:34):
Make it illegal to report it, in other words, and
that was struck down before well not struck down, it
was not allowed to go through. So really, right now
the state of medical bills is this, if the provider
wants to put it on your credit report, they can.

(01:03:56):
The credit reporting agency can then decide whether to show
it or not. And some credit reporting agencies on their
own will not show a medical debt unless it's passed
one year or more than a certain amount. So really,
there is not a PAD answer. There's no PAD answer

(01:04:18):
when it comes to medical bills. They can show up
on your report or not. You don't have any special
right not to have them on there, and there's no
mandatory law saying.

Speaker 1 (01:04:30):
They must be on there.

Speaker 6 (01:04:32):
So it's in a state of flux right now. One
thing I can tell you from everything I know, creditors,
those granting credit are not putting as much weight on
major medical bills as they do on let's say a
car repossession or delayed rent. A delinquent rent or credit cards.

(01:04:57):
They put way more weight on the those kinds of
debts than medical bills because they they know that it
wasn't because someone was.

Speaker 1 (01:05:08):
Lax right, or that they ran.

Speaker 6 (01:05:11):
Up a bunch of credit card bills and now saying
screw you, I'm not going to pay it. Medical bills
fall into a different category. They're not so much characteristic
of someone's behavior, whereas credit cards can be. So I
hope that's making some sense. Three oh three seven one

(01:05:31):
three eight two five five. Tell me about the movers, Michelle,
what's going on?

Speaker 12 (01:05:36):
Okay, I'm coming from San Diego to them. Yes, yes,
so I have a two tim by twenties with all
my stuff in it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:47):
Okay, so I call.

Speaker 6 (01:05:50):
Now now you're moving from You're moving from San Diego.

Speaker 12 (01:05:54):
Right to den for Catala.

Speaker 1 (01:05:55):
Yeah, right, got it? And what's going wrong?

Speaker 12 (01:06:00):
What's going wrong? Is these close to just outrageous. So
I was calling Mayflower and then his other moving company
came in, was called safe Shift, and I said, look,
I'm not paying no more than no.

Speaker 14 (01:06:15):
You told me.

Speaker 12 (01:06:15):
Mayfi gonna cost me twenty thousand. I said, I'm not
paying on more than twelve. So then he kept coming back.

Speaker 14 (01:06:21):
Give me more than.

Speaker 6 (01:06:22):
Lord, Michelle, I want to say something to you. Okay, Michelle,
who did you end up signing a contract with.

Speaker 3 (01:06:32):
Him?

Speaker 12 (01:06:32):
Faring contract with anyone yet?

Speaker 6 (01:06:34):
Oh? Good, good, because here's what I want to tell you.
When you said you called Mayflower and then got a
call from another mover, you did not talk to Mayflower.
Let me explain what's going on in the movie industry.
A lot of these, a lot of these lying, cheating,
good for nothing companies. These scams they use names similar

(01:06:58):
to Mayflower or North American Van Lines or other names,
and then they trick you into thinking you're dealing with
one of these big movers. But then what they really
do is they move in and take care of the
move and they cheat you. Now, if you haven't signed
a contract with anyone yet, you're lucky. We can help you. Okay,

(01:07:23):
But I'm going to tell you something. You need to
call a national mover and only work with their qualified
local agents. But half the problem is getting a legitimate
number for the national movers because so many scammers have
gone on the internet.

Speaker 1 (01:07:42):
To trick you. So where's your stuff right now?

Speaker 12 (01:07:47):
My stuff has been a San Diego I'm in Gimber right.

Speaker 6 (01:07:50):
Now, Okay, good, I want you to call. I'll tell
you who I would qualify you. I would call let's see,
let me find I'm trying to find the damn the
people we use, not use, but people that.

Speaker 1 (01:08:07):
I know are are Cowboy or Johnson.

Speaker 6 (01:08:11):
No, no, Johnson would be one for sure. Thank you
for that, bo Johnson, Johnson moving in storage.

Speaker 5 (01:08:20):
Johnson is good.

Speaker 6 (01:08:21):
I around more than one hundred years and we have
never had a complaint.

Speaker 1 (01:08:25):
Now, think about this.

Speaker 6 (01:08:26):
In my entire forty five years here, we have never
had a complaint about Johnson moving in storage.

Speaker 1 (01:08:34):
Not one, not one complaint.

Speaker 6 (01:08:36):
And that's in an industry that's usually loaded with complaints.

Speaker 5 (01:08:40):
Who are you going to say, Well, I know the
owner of the local ginormous Mayflower franchise, which is buell
Or Mayflower in Aurora, Okay, and I've known him for
about twenty five years, so.

Speaker 1 (01:08:53):
You know him so good.

Speaker 6 (01:08:54):
So we have two movers that come as a result
of personal direct contact. Okay, but you must make sure
you call them. So many scammers now when you go online,
we ad another do you remember the other person said
they thought they were calling Mayflower. Yeah, and then another

(01:09:14):
company called them back. Okay, I gotta take this break
hold on and I'll have Kaschina give you numbers off
the air. Go with a sure thing Denver's best roofer
Excel Roofing dot com. You don't pay a cent until
you're content. Time for an insurance check up free, no obligation.

(01:09:38):
In comparison, call Compass Insurance. Pay too much your coverage
at dozens of insurance companies find out now three O
three seven to seven to one help. You'll think you're
his only customer when you choose Frank durand the real
estate Man dot com to list your home with Remax
Alliance three oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two.

(01:10:00):
Hi Tom Martino here, Welcome to the show. Let's continue.
We're running out of time right now. We gave Michelle
the recommendations for movers, so right now we have Kevin.

Speaker 1 (01:10:15):
Colkin with us.

Speaker 6 (01:10:16):
We're taking car questions as well. I have not forgotten
about that story on Channel seven that I want to
go over as an example of reporting, specifically consumer type
reporting that doesn't go far enough and doesn't give you
the true report of what's happening, and it's not in

(01:10:38):
depth enough. We got more of that coming up on
the Troubleshooter Show. Go with a sure thing Denver's Best
roofer Excel Roofing dot com. You don't pay a cent
until you're content. Time for an insurance check up free,
no obligation. In comparison, call company insurance paying too much

(01:11:01):
your coverage at dozens of insurance companies find out now
three all three seven to seven to one help. You'll
think you're his only customer when you choose Frank durand
the real estate Man dot com to list your home
with Remax Alliance three all three nine two zero sixteen
twenty two.

Speaker 5 (01:11:17):
Yea ripped up.

Speaker 4 (01:11:24):
New needs who you don't have.

Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
Come running as fast as we can.

Speaker 4 (01:11:32):
Show Shooter's gonna help.

Speaker 3 (01:11:34):
Come man, This is the Troubleshooter Show. Now Tom Martine.

Speaker 6 (01:11:41):
Hey, I'm Tom Martino. This hour brought to you by
one Clear Choice Garage Doors for all your garage door needs.
These guys are excellent. It is car day, so it's apropos.
We talk about garage doors. Whether you need the whole door,
they do the door, they do sections of the door,
They do the opener, parts of the opener, or both
the door and the opener. At the same time, here's
the great part. Get their prices online right now. Everything

(01:12:05):
they do and what the and what you pay is online.
They have available service twenty four to seven, seven days
a week, of course, twenty four hours a day seven
to zero three seven zero, thirty nine eighty seven. Here's
the website one clear choice doors dot com. This is
a show where we talk about your problems, questions and complaints,

(01:12:29):
and we also talk about solving them. So let's go
right to uh, let's go right to Philip. Philip, Welcome
to the show. Three zero three Martino. You can call
twenty four seven three oh three six two seven eight
four sixty six. What's going on with debt collections? Sir?

Speaker 1 (01:12:43):
How can we help you?

Speaker 9 (01:12:46):
Wel sir? And looks like May of two thousand and eight,
my business was robbed and I owed credit card. This
company Virgo and Jens and bought my debt from.

Speaker 6 (01:13:03):
Now now, what is being robbed? I'm confused. You said
your business was robbed and you owe some debt.

Speaker 9 (01:13:13):
All of my equipment was on credit cards, so anyway,
the credit card companies dropped the charges or the fees,
and this company Margol and Jensen bought my debt from
visa in two thousand.

Speaker 6 (01:13:32):
Okay, what debt? Explain to me. I'm confused. So you
had credit card debt that was purchased by a collector, Yes, sir, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:13:45):
And how much credit card debt? Are we talking about.

Speaker 9 (01:13:49):
The original debt? The original amount oed was eleven thousand, okay,
two thousand and eight faid over fifteen thousand, But they
keep racking up.

Speaker 6 (01:14:02):
Now now why let this is what I don't understand.
You got to help me here, Philip. What what did this?
What did this burglary? Or this this your store was?
What does that have to do with this problem?

Speaker 9 (01:14:17):
Nothing? It was just uh, my.

Speaker 10 (01:14:20):
Equipment was purchased with this credit card.

Speaker 6 (01:14:24):
Okay, I got That's why it was so much. You
purchased equipment and you had a debt of eleven grand.

Speaker 1 (01:14:33):
Yes sir okay.

Speaker 6 (01:14:34):
And why Here's what happens with credit card debt. You
make payments and they never sell your credit card debt
unless you default. So was your credit Were you in default?
Is that why you they sold your debt?

Speaker 1 (01:14:51):
Yes, sir okay. Why were you in default?

Speaker 9 (01:14:57):
Because at that point I had no no the means
of income Okay, it was stolen that I.

Speaker 10 (01:15:04):
Used to make a living with. I see, steals your money.

Speaker 9 (01:15:08):
That's bad. So many steals your ability to make money.
That's even worse.

Speaker 6 (01:15:13):
Now, did you have a number of other debts that
went into default.

Speaker 9 (01:15:18):
A couple and they were written off by the credit
card companies?

Speaker 6 (01:15:23):
Okay? That okay, but they can still sell that too.
So you're eleven thousand dollars credit card debt was purchased
by a collector, and are they being pretty aggressive.

Speaker 9 (01:15:36):
Over ten years worth? It's the the amount of interest
and accruing at ten percent plus their attorney fees and
court costs is more original debt?

Speaker 6 (01:15:51):
Well, Philip, that's not unusual. That's not unusual at all.
That's why people buy the debt. I mean, I'm not
telling you I'm in favor of all of that, but
I mean that that's water under the bridge.

Speaker 1 (01:16:01):
I mean, you know, that's just the way it is.

Speaker 6 (01:16:03):
So right now, that eleven thousand dollars in debt is
how much.

Speaker 9 (01:16:09):
Twenty eight thousand?

Speaker 6 (01:16:13):
Okay, twenty eight thousand, so twenty eight thousand plus? So
what are you calling about today? How can we help you?

Speaker 9 (01:16:25):
Isn't that original debt? Past the statute of limitations.

Speaker 6 (01:16:31):
They okay, good question. Here's what happens. First of all,
when you say statute of limitations in you're in Colorado,
I assume yes, sir, okay. And when was this when?

Speaker 1 (01:16:50):
When was it sold to the collector?

Speaker 9 (01:16:57):
June twenty one of twenty two thousand and eight.

Speaker 6 (01:17:03):
And two?

Speaker 1 (01:17:03):
Okay? And when was the debt incurred.

Speaker 9 (01:17:08):
Before that?

Speaker 6 (01:17:11):
Okay?

Speaker 10 (01:17:11):
Somewhere playing two thousand times in two thousand and seven.

Speaker 1 (01:17:15):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (01:17:16):
The law is that they have six years I understand,
I understand, I mean, okay, the law is they have
six years to pursue a judgment for collection or they
lose their ability to collect it by judgment. That doesn't

(01:17:36):
mean they can't come after you, but it's toothless. I mean,
in other words, the only thing that really is in
their arsenal is judgment, and they only have six years
to pursue it from the time you made the last
payment or the last charge.

Speaker 1 (01:17:57):
But here, here's what I don't understand.

Speaker 6 (01:18:00):
You said they sold the debt in two thousand and
eight to this collector, and now the debt's twenty eight grand.
Now I assume that during this time they've been actively
trying to collect it.

Speaker 1 (01:18:15):
Is that true?

Speaker 9 (01:18:18):
Yes? Or through several of my different jobs and I've
paid them. They made a deal with me for if
you paid ten thousand dollars, we won't charge you any
more interest.

Speaker 6 (01:18:30):
You understand why they keep tricking you, right, Philip? Why
don't you tell him d what they did? They're tricking him.

Speaker 5 (01:18:38):
Yeah, so Tom, if you don't mind, I have just
two quick questions for Philip, just to get my head
around this problem. Philip, When was the last time you
made any payment at all, even a dime?

Speaker 6 (01:18:48):
That's what he was telling you about that tricking? When
did they trick you into making a payment? One was
the last payment?

Speaker 9 (01:18:56):
Last payment was about four months ago?

Speaker 6 (01:18:59):
Oh you see, so what Dea is getting at years?

Speaker 9 (01:19:03):
I've been Philip for ten.

Speaker 6 (01:19:05):
Years, Philip, had you stopped paying on it, you would
have been better off. The statute of limitations starts over
again every time you resurrect it.

Speaker 1 (01:19:19):
That's why they make deals with you.

Speaker 6 (01:19:22):
They're trying to get you to make a payment so
they get another six years to pursue it.

Speaker 5 (01:19:28):
It sounds like they already did it. Sounds like they
already have a judgment against Philip because Philip mentioned that
through a couple of his jobs, they've been collecting.

Speaker 6 (01:19:35):
Do you have it? Do they have a judgment and
a garnishment right now?

Speaker 9 (01:19:39):
They have an exparte motion for a reviver of judgment.
That was just right, So there's a jugement this week.

Speaker 6 (01:19:47):
Yeah, and most likely, Philip, they'll get it because you've
been keeping it active all this time. You even admitted it.
You say you've been paying on it since so eight,
so you you're kind of your word enemy on this
right now. The bottom line is this, you probably owe
the debt. But the good news is a very simple

(01:20:10):
Chapter seven bankruptcy will get you out of the debt. Okay,
I mean what else you know?

Speaker 1 (01:20:21):
First of all, the debt's legit.

Speaker 6 (01:20:23):
Okay, they're allowed to take that eleven grand, and they're
allowed to pursue it with all penalties and with all
default interest, and they're allowed to compound it and do
whatever the note says, and they're allowed to pursue you
and to trick you into making payments. Had you known this,
see see if there was ever a six year period

(01:20:44):
where it went uncollected, they would have been out of luck.
But when did they actually get their first judgment.

Speaker 1 (01:20:51):
On this.

Speaker 9 (01:20:56):
Two thousand and eight, the court branded judgment in fail.

Speaker 6 (01:20:59):
Oh okay, so see, and that's a whole new ball
of ACTE.

Speaker 1 (01:21:03):
Let me explain this to you.

Speaker 6 (01:21:05):
Once the judgment is granted, there is no statute of limitations.
That judgment runs for the length of the judgment, not
by any statute of limitations, and it can be revived
and renewed every single time. So, in essence, once a
creditor gets a judgment, it's a forever debt if they

(01:21:26):
do the procedure properly. That's why they went for their revival.
So so the idea that that six years is to
pursue a judgment. Once the judgment is granted, it could
be a twenty year judgment. I mean, it depends on
the debt and the judgment. So right now, your best

(01:21:50):
bet would be a bankruptcy. Is there a reason you
would not do a bankruptcy to get rid of it?
Or do you have the money to pay it?

Speaker 9 (01:22:00):
I don't have the money to pay it, and there's
no reason that I couldn't do a bankruptcy.

Speaker 6 (01:22:06):
The only time a Chapter seven bankruptcy would hurt you
is if you have a pile of money somewhere because
they'll just come after that pile of money or equity
and property. Do you have any equity and property?

Speaker 1 (01:22:21):
You're an excellent candidate.

Speaker 6 (01:22:23):
Did you hear the bankruptcy attorney on the show earlier?

Speaker 1 (01:22:26):
If not, he's a really good guy.

Speaker 6 (01:22:29):
His name is His name is Mike Wink Kashina can
get you his number. Yeah, She'll get you the number
off the air, so we don't have to do that
on the air.

Speaker 1 (01:22:38):
It's the Wink Law Firm.

Speaker 6 (01:22:40):
Okay, And I think that's your best bet. See, collections
are very tricky. Collections go by two things, the collections
before judgment and the collections after judgment. They're two very
different things, and too many times creditors trick people into

(01:23:04):
keeping the statute of limitations fresh. Normally in Colorado six
years six years to collect a judgment. There are some exceptions.
There are some exceptions, but there's so few and far between.
I won't get into that. One of them would be
if you were in military service and overseas, they get

(01:23:28):
a chance to put that in suspend, to suspend collection efforts.
But anyway, bottom line is they have six years to
pursue a judgment. Once the judgment. Once they get the judgment,
then they have the time of the judgment to collect

(01:23:48):
the judgment, and they can revive that judgment over and
over again. We have more coming upon the Troubleshooter Show
three zero three seven to one to three Talk seven
one three eight two five five. Frank Rand the real
estate Man, will give you an evaluation of your home
if you want an ortal self forth. This is a
tricky marker right now. We have a glut of inventory

(01:24:09):
and we have not many buyers, and it's it's changing.
If you want to know what will my house self
or Frank will do it free of charge. Frankdran the
Realestateman dot com a full analysis with no obligation three
oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two. Go with

(01:24:32):
a sure thing Denver's Best roofer Excel Roofing dot com.
You don't pay a cent until you're content. Time for
an insurance check up, free, no obligation. Comparison call Compass
Insurance paying too much your coverage at dozens of insurance
companies find out now three oh three seven seven to
one help. You'll think you're his only customer when you

(01:24:54):
choose Frank durand the real estate man dot com to
list your home with Remax Alliance three nine two zero
sixteen twenty two. Hi Tom Martino, you're a troubleshooter. Three
h three seven to one three talks. I got some clarification,
okay on the leans and the debts and the judgments. Okay,

(01:25:16):
In Colorado, you have six years to pursue a judgment.
If the debt goes is older than six years old,
then you can't get a judgment anymore.

Speaker 1 (01:25:29):
So it's kind of useless.

Speaker 6 (01:25:31):
If you do get a judgment in county court, it's
a six year judgment. In district court it's a twenty
year judgment.

Speaker 1 (01:25:41):
But those judgments.

Speaker 6 (01:25:43):
Can be renewed over and over and over and over,
so it can stay.

Speaker 1 (01:25:48):
With them for life.

Speaker 6 (01:25:49):
Basically, there is no statute on the statute, so once
you get a judgment, you just keep reviving it. And
so many times people get a note that a judgment
is being revived and they say, oh, my goodness, now's
my chance to fight it. No, it's not to fight
the original judgment. That original judgment was fought and lost.

(01:26:13):
That's why they got the judgment. Okay, if you didn't
lose the case, they would have never gotten a judgment,
or you didn't show up, then it's a default judgment.
But a default judgment and a regular judgment are just
as good. So once there is a judgment against you,
the creditor, all they have to do is revive it. Now,
if they somehow screw up reviving it, then they have

(01:26:37):
a problem. Okay, so just be careful. The only question
I have d you were looking over there, is it
the six years to get a judgment from the time
a last payment was made? Or is this six years
from the date of the original bill?

Speaker 5 (01:26:52):
It's six years from the last time they collected any
payment at all?

Speaker 1 (01:26:57):
Okay, okay, not so, okay.

Speaker 5 (01:26:59):
Yeah, the date of the indebtedness makes no difference.

Speaker 6 (01:27:02):
Okay, good, all right? Three oh three seven one three
two five. I have a question, yes, oh both, yes,
go ahead.

Speaker 18 (01:27:09):
What about the pursuit of a judgment in small claims court?

Speaker 6 (01:27:14):
Is that six years or yeah? That's that's considered county
court yet okay, for purposes.

Speaker 18 (01:27:21):
Of when the collector goes to court to renew the judgment,
like for another six.

Speaker 1 (01:27:27):
Years, they call it reviving it.

Speaker 5 (01:27:29):
Yeah, Well, don't they.

Speaker 18 (01:27:30):
Have to send notice to who they're trying to collect
the debt so they can come to court.

Speaker 6 (01:27:36):
They just can't they they do get served, okay, they
do get served. But here's the deal. I've never heard
once in my forty five years of doing this someone
being denied a revival of judgment. I've never heard, I'm

(01:27:57):
I'm telling you. And so many people think they can
fight the judgment at that time. That fight was done
at the original time they got the judgment. Most judgments
in small claims court, by the way, bo most of
them are default judgments. People just don't show up, Okay,
and that's that's a problem. So uh, but you know,

(01:28:23):
one of the biggest problems too, is the hassle of
filing the small claims. I mean, you know, you you
have to you have.

Speaker 1 (01:28:30):
To literally hoof it by foot to the court.

Speaker 6 (01:28:34):
Right, you've done enough small claims right to meetreat?

Speaker 5 (01:28:37):
Yeah, so yeah, you have to file in person, which
isn't the big deal. You download the forms online for.

Speaker 6 (01:28:43):
It's a big deal. You got to go and wait
in line.

Speaker 9 (01:28:45):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (01:28:45):
In my case, I mean, I've never had a weight
and line more than five or ten minutes. Really, you
go pretty quickly. I guess it depends on what time
you get there, right, so at eight am, it's probably packed.

Speaker 6 (01:28:54):
So so you you fill it out the forms and triplicate.

Speaker 5 (01:28:59):
That's correct.

Speaker 6 (01:29:00):
One for the court, one for you, one for the
person you serve.

Speaker 5 (01:29:03):
But the PDF automatically makes itself into a triplicate, so
they make it really convenience.

Speaker 6 (01:29:07):
So you file one with the court before or after
you serve the person.

Speaker 5 (01:29:11):
Oh no, so you have to file first, okay.

Speaker 6 (01:29:13):
So now listen, you go online, you can fill it
out online, and then one.

Speaker 1 (01:29:18):
But you don't submit it online.

Speaker 6 (01:29:20):
You just fill it out and then you print it
and then you print it out and triplicate it or
as d says, it might be automatically triplicated. So then
you get one and you file it with the court
and you pay the filing thing, and you bring all.

Speaker 5 (01:29:32):
Three copies because they need a stamp, all three of them.

Speaker 6 (01:29:35):
Okay, So you bring all three to the court and
you pay the filing fee and they stamp it. Yep.

Speaker 5 (01:29:40):
And then what I've found that's very.

Speaker 1 (01:29:43):
With the other two copies. One has to be.

Speaker 5 (01:29:45):
Served, yes, So one copy is for you, one for
the court, one for the defendant. What I've found in
all so I have small claims actions in both Adams
County and Denver County, and both of those jurisdictions offer
service by mail for only fifteen bucks, So that will
actually mail the defendant's copy for an extra fifteen bucks
to the defendant and then they're considered served.

Speaker 6 (01:30:07):
They are. I wonder if that's the same in Douglas County.

Speaker 5 (01:30:09):
I know, I mean, I've no experience in that one.

Speaker 6 (01:30:12):
Yet Mark has experienced in Douglas County.

Speaker 1 (01:30:14):
I want to ask him.

Speaker 6 (01:30:15):
I'm actually filing a small claim.

Speaker 5 (01:30:17):
What, Oh, let's hear about it?

Speaker 6 (01:30:19):
Well, is it against Mark? No, it's a very personal thing.
On a kid's car. Somebody ran into my kid's car.
I'm sorry to hear that, But listen to this. This
is what's funny about it. Somebody ran into my kid's car,
and the girl's father said, because she's a minor, we'll
take care of it.

Speaker 1 (01:30:40):
Get it repaired. I'll pay for it.

Speaker 6 (01:30:43):
So I got it repaired, and he says, we got
to submit a claim to my insurance and I said,
I don't have to submit anything.

Speaker 1 (01:30:50):
I said, yeah, you can, I said, you know.

Speaker 6 (01:30:54):
So then I figured, okay, if all I have to
do is send it to his insurance say well, then
his insurance start fighting with me, like like I have
to defend it, And I said, I don't have to
defend this. I don't care if you pay it or not,
because guess what he owes me the money, not you.
I don't care about you. I mean, in other words,

(01:31:15):
how dare somebody say you got to It's like, here's
my big brother, go fight with my big I don't
have to fight with your big brother. So they said,
well we finally got the estimate and blah blah, and
I said, listen, I'm done talking to you. There's no
contractual arrangement between me and you. Don't pay it, I
don't care. I'm going to get it from him. So

(01:31:38):
I'm filing a small claim against him. Now I was
going to be really nice about this and not file
for loss of use in the rental car, But now
I am going to file for that because if I
have to go through the trouble of going down to
Douglas County and standing in line. But in Douglas County,
I wonder if there's going to be a long line,

(01:31:58):
you have to go to the clerk of the courts
to do it, right.

Speaker 5 (01:32:01):
Yeah, yeah, you show up, just don't show up like
first thing in the morning when everybody else is there.
And I have a feeling that, I mean, I don't
know why their line would be any longer than the
one in Denver, of all places.

Speaker 6 (01:32:12):
Yeah, so Mark stelt with, I think MAKS dealt with
Douglas County because you have to go where the person
works or lives, or where the transaction took place, where
the damage occurred. Anyway, fix it twenty four to seven,
get them to your home while you're still enjoying relatively
mild weather, and they will do a refurbishment of your
furnace for thirty nine bucks.

Speaker 1 (01:32:34):
This is unheard of.

Speaker 6 (01:32:35):
I mean that they take it apart to the extent
they can. All the parts are spread out and cleaned individually,
plus the blower motor itself, and everything is done as
if you are refurbishing that furnace for just thirty nine bucks.
The only caveat is if you've not had it done
before and three oh three five excuse me, it's seven

(01:32:57):
to zero five two, six thirty nine th nine fixmihome
dot com book Now go with a sure thing Denver's
Best Roofer Excel roofing dot com. You don't pay a
cent until you're content. Time for an insurance checkup free,

(01:33:20):
no obligation comparison call Compass Insurance paying too much your
coverage at dozens of insurance companies find out now three
oh three seven seven to one help. You'll think you're
his only customer when you choose Frank durand the real
estate Man dot com to list your home with Remax
Alliance three oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two

(01:33:42):
by Tom Marchino. You're troubleshooter three O three seven one
three talk seven one three A two five five. All Right,
so I'm going to talk about this thing I told
you I would talk about the Channel seventh story that
I thought was incomplete and really was not. It wasn't inaccurate,

(01:34:03):
nor was it you know it was.

Speaker 1 (01:34:05):
It was accurate. But here's the thing.

Speaker 6 (01:34:09):
The headlines, and by the way, this was done on
the air as a broadcast report, but I'm reading from
their broadcast report from Denver seven dot com. The headline
says Colorado Springs residents protest paying twenty thousand dollars to
their HOA for hail damage. And that's technically correct. But

(01:34:31):
the Colorado Springs residents are the hoa. They are literally
they're not paying it to some HOA separate and apart
from them. It says the amount oed was a loss
assessment notice tied to a hailstorm that happened on August first.

(01:34:55):
Residents were given a certain amount of time to pay
the assessment, so they had to pay a literally twenty
grand why because of the deductible. The group of residents
in Colorado is fighting back after their homeowners' association, it's
their homeowners' association for which they're part of, told them

(01:35:19):
to pay twenty thousand dollars for damage from the hailstorm.
The residents of Soaring Eagle Town homes located Blah Blah
Blah said they received the letter from an attorney on
behalf of their HOA stating they have to pay this
amount within a couple of months. And by the way,

(01:35:40):
I'm paraphrasing some of this, the amount owed was the
loss assessment tied to the hailstorm. The letter provided okay,
It says it read in part, the association insurance policy
has an applicable deductible of three million, one hundred, twelve thousand,
eight hundred and seventeen dollars as permitted by the Declaration

(01:36:03):
of covetence. We basically can collect this from homeowners the
association as elected to do to assess the deductible. Okay, now,
how else let me just say, I mean, yes, this
is accurate, but it makes it sound like the big
bed HOA is trying to make money on this insurance claim.

(01:36:26):
This is literally going straight to the roofer. The roof
costs a certain amount of money, and then there's going
to be a deductible and or lack of coverage whatever
it is. It's going for the roof. It's not like,
oh my god, how dare this HOA want money for
their coffers. It's not for their coffers. The money is

(01:36:49):
for a roof that and you live there and you
have to pay your share. There's nothing wrong with it
that you might be upset with it, but you're upset
with yourself. Okay. If there are one hundred homeowners, or
two hundred homeowners or three hundred homeowners, you all make
up the HOA. I think there should be some kind

(01:37:11):
of at least a clause or not a clothes but
a paragraph or an explanation Okay, it says here we
have about one third of our members who are elderly
and single family parents won't be able to pay the.

Speaker 1 (01:37:24):
Cover the difference.

Speaker 6 (01:37:25):
Well, guess what, then, they shouldn't own a condo, because
if this was a house, they'd have to pay their deductible.
The fact that you put all these homeowners together and
the deductible is bigger doesn't make it any less valid.
It's amazing to me. Channel seven tried to make a
story about well, they did make a story about this,

(01:37:47):
as if the HUA is doing something wrong. For God's sakes,
the HOA is made up of those homeowners who are
complaining that the board, the HA board just happens to
be the unfortunate dupes that are in office at the
time this happened. Let's just say there was no HOA
at all. Let's say there's no HOA at all, and

(01:38:08):
this happens to the complex and there is a three
million dollar bill. You're not going to get the roof
done unless you pay it. And if there are this
many homeowners, you're going to divide it up. I mean,
it's amazing to me how HOA members or people who

(01:38:29):
belong to a condo or town home association believe that
the HOA is somehow separate and apart from them.

Speaker 8 (01:38:39):
It's not.

Speaker 6 (01:38:40):
It's not separate and apart from them. It is them.
They are part of it. That bill is not owed
to the HOA. It's owed to the roofer. It's the
part that is not being covered by your insurance. It says,
it says here it's a humane issue, right. We have

(01:39:04):
people who literally cannot afford this and will lose their homes.
It's not fair, of course, it's not fair for God's sakes.
And for Channel seven to make it look like the
HOA is taking advantage of these poor people is absolutely absurd.

(01:39:24):
I would have done a stand up in this story.
I would have done something to explain. By the way,
condo owners and town homeowners all over the area are
facing the same dilemma. Insurance companies are not covering roofs
the way they used to, or had these people owned

(01:39:45):
a home, they'd have the same problem. You know the
fact that we have elderly people who can't afford this
and will lose their homes. I'm going to give it
to you in dollars and cents perspective. If they can't
afford to live there. They can't afford to live there,
and yes, they will lose their home. They'll lose their
home the same way if they didn't pay their mortgage.

(01:40:07):
It's not the ha's problem. It's not the ha's problem.
Insurance companies all over the state are denying full coverage roofs.
They have giant deductibles or no coverage at all. There
are some condo associations right now that have no insurance
for their roof. The insurance covers everything else, but will

(01:40:31):
not cover the roof because they've had such incredibleness. So
if a hailstorm hits this condo building and it doesn't
cover the roof the insurance, the homeowners in the building
will have to pay their share of the roof. And

(01:40:53):
if you can't afford it, it would be the same
thing as if you had a home and you couldn't
afford it. You're gonna you're gonna borrow it, or you're
gonna lose your house. I this is oh my god,
it's just amazing. They making the HOA out to be
like a bad guy. It says here while serving as

(01:41:16):
the board president in the past of the HUA.

Speaker 1 (01:41:19):
This guy says.

Speaker 6 (01:41:21):
He said, also had to handle insurance issues, uh like
tied to a hailstorm. Things were a little different back then,
Dahmer said about his time serving as an HA president,
All homeowners would come together. We'd let them know what
was going on and how much it was gonna cost everybody.

Speaker 1 (01:41:42):
We kept everybody informed.

Speaker 6 (01:41:44):
You know what, if you have an insurance policy that
doesn't cover your roof, you're gonna have to come up
with a scratch or you lose your home. What I
what I'm trying to say is the h OA is
doing nothing wrong. The HUA happens to be there unfortunate dupes.
They're just a representative of the homeowners. The fact that

(01:42:06):
the roof is not being paid for in full is
not the hoa's fault now, and how would it have
been different? What they could have done is sent out
a letter. They could have done this, dear homeowner, our
insurance is no longer covering the roofs the way they

(01:42:30):
used to.

Speaker 1 (01:42:31):
If we have our roofs destroyed, we're.

Speaker 6 (01:42:35):
Going to have to come up with X amount of
dollars and that's going to mean a very large assessment
against you. That the assessment is not like the board
members are going to Tahiti.

Speaker 1 (01:42:50):
They're paying for the roof.

Speaker 6 (01:42:51):
And I'm telling you, all over the metro area right now,
all over the state, there are people living in condos
and it's a time it's a time bomb. You will
eventually have to pay a whole crapload of money for
the roof because there's not one policy covering roofs the

(01:43:12):
way they used to, not one. Some of them have
stopped coverage altogether of roofs. All I'm saying, the only
thing I'm saying is is that these homeowners all owe
this money and it's not the evil HOA trying to

(01:43:33):
collect it. That the whole tenor of the story is inaccurate.
It's supposed to be done for the homeowner. If you
read into this story, and I'm so tired of journalists,
so called journalists, doing stories and not telling the whole story,
it should have read something like this. Due to the

(01:43:55):
crackdown of insurance or due to the lack of coverage
of insurance coverage, homeowners in this community are facing giant
bills for their roofs. It's not the hoa's problem. Take
the ha out of it. They would have still had
to pay for their roof. If they owned a home,
they would have still had to pay.

Speaker 1 (01:44:16):
For their roof.

Speaker 6 (01:44:17):
It doesn't matter who's in charge at the time. They
just happened to be holding office with the HOA and
they look like bad guys who are trying to get
twenty grand? Are they supposed to put it up out
of their pocket? Look? And here's what's really funny is
the pictures in the video from Channel seven and also

(01:44:38):
Channel five KOAA in the Springs, they're showing homeowners protesting.
What are they protesting? What are they actually? What are
you protesting when you have an insurance policy that doesn't
cover all of your roof? Why would you protest against
the HOA?

Speaker 1 (01:44:56):
What the hell?

Speaker 6 (01:44:57):
I mean, what can they do about it? Well, you
better pay for this roof. You have the coverage that
you pay for right. The reason I'm emphasizing this is
this is just a tip of the iceberg. I am
telling you now that thousands and thousands of people will
be caught with their pants down the next time the

(01:45:17):
roof is destroyed by hale because the HOA won't have
the money to pay the giant new deductibles that are
out there, and in some cases no roof coverage at all.
And you can't blame the HOA for wanting everyone to
chip in for the roof. It's not like it's their problem.

(01:45:38):
They just happen to be elected to the board right now.

Speaker 1 (01:45:42):
This is a major crisis.

Speaker 6 (01:45:43):
In fact, you're crazy to own a condo or a
town home because you are at the whim of insurance
companies and as a result, you will not if you
will have to come up with giant capital assessments soon.

(01:46:06):
Go with a sure thing Denver's Best roofer Excel Roofing
dot com. You don't pay a cent until you're content.
Time for an insurance check up, free no obligation comparison
call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at dozens
of insurance companies find out now three oh three seven
to seven to one help. You'll think you're his only

(01:46:28):
customer when you choose Frank durand the real estate Man
dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance three
oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two.

Speaker 9 (01:46:41):
Ripped of.

Speaker 18 (01:46:44):
News.

Speaker 4 (01:46:45):
You need advice, You don't have to.

Speaker 6 (01:46:49):
Come.

Speaker 4 (01:46:49):
Run anxious as fast as we can. Shooter's gonna help. Come, man,
this is.

Speaker 1 (01:46:57):
The Troubleshooter Show.

Speaker 3 (01:46:59):
No Tom Martino.

Speaker 6 (01:47:01):
Hello Tom Martino here, welcome to the show. Here to
help you solve your problems, answer questions, take complaints. We
love making your life easier if we can. Tony's got
a comment on a hailstorm. I had made some comments
about a story that Channel seven did. What's funny is
these homeowners are outside of their condo project where they live,

(01:47:25):
saying stop. The signs say stop illegal assessments, illegal, illegal assessments.
Now here's the thing. I'm trying to explain this in
really a very simple way. It's just shocking to me
how many people believe that when they move into a

(01:47:46):
condo or a town home let's just say condos condominimized housing,
that the association is somehow apart from them.

Speaker 1 (01:47:59):
It is not. They are part of the association.

Speaker 6 (01:48:04):
And all of the expenses for the condo association for
the condos must be shared among condo owners. The HOA
is simply three or four people from the owners who
do the administration work. They don't profit from this. It

(01:48:29):
is such a stupid story when Channel seven starts talking
to these homeowners as if they're being ripped off by
the HOA.

Speaker 7 (01:48:37):
Dos pay their members. I mean, if you work for
the AA, do you get paid or is it no?

Speaker 6 (01:48:42):
It's usually voluntary to be on the board. Ye, here's
the point I'm making. In a condo, you're responsible for
your share of expenses no matter what. It doesn't go
into the pockets of the HOA. It doesn't go into
anything but your expenses. Now, let me explain this. Insurance

(01:49:07):
companies do not cover roofs like they used to. Sometimes
the deductibles are into the millions. Sometimes there is no
coverage at all for a hailstorm or for roof damage.
That means that the condo association they have to hire

(01:49:29):
a roofer. The roofer comes in and does the roof,
they want to be paid. So let's say the roofing
bill is three million dollars. No matter how you look
at that, it has to be paid, and you're part
of it. Now, if you say, well, I'm going to
lose my home I can't afford to pay it, well,

(01:49:52):
then okay, then you can't afford it. If you can't
afford it, you shouldn't be living there. You should only
live in houses you can and afford. Because if this
was your private residence, you would be faced with the
same exact bill.

Speaker 1 (01:50:08):
Actually it would be more.

Speaker 6 (01:50:10):
Twenty thousand dollars for a roof is pretty cheap for
a house. So these condo owners in the Springs were
upset that they had to pay their share of roof damage.

Speaker 1 (01:50:23):
That's what it is.

Speaker 6 (01:50:24):
It's not the hoa's fault that they had to come
up with three million dollars. They can't find insurance to
cover their roofs. Insurance companies are pulling out of condo
coverage altogether, some of them. It is a bad time
to be living in a condo or a town home,

(01:50:47):
a very bad time because you have to be ready
to pay assessments. These assessments can be five, ten, fifteen,
twenty thousand dollars. So someone texted me and said, what
about loss assessment coverage. This is something that again is misunderstood.

(01:51:10):
Loss assessment coverage is when you have an assessment, you
have to pay to the HOA, but it's only for
covered insurance events. So let's say you do not have
roof coverage because your insurance company refuses to cover the roof.

(01:51:37):
Let's say as a result of that, there's a three
or four million dollar bill, your lost assessment coverage won't
cover you because there was no underlying insurance. It will
only cover you to pay the deductible. So and it
only goes up to like twenty five thousand dollars. So

(01:52:00):
if you had a deductible that was a lot of money,
and you were assessed a capital assessment that you had
to pay, your loss assessment coverage would cover that part
up to twenty five grand only if there was underlying insurance.
It will not help pay if you have no insurance.

(01:52:24):
And many condos right now you're living in a condo,
you may not even know it. You don't have coverage
for the roof. Many condos have no coverage for the roof.
So when that roof is destroyed by hail or wind,
it's going to be divided amongst the homeowners, and it
could be a lot of money, a lot of money.

(01:52:46):
But you can't blame the HIA. There's three or four
people on the HIA. It's not like they're charging you
this money. They have to pay it too. I mean,
so saw that sign stop, I would have gone on
said what's illegal about this assessment?

Speaker 1 (01:53:02):
Exactly?

Speaker 6 (01:53:03):
The money is going to pay for the roof and
you live here, So how is that illegal?

Speaker 1 (01:53:09):
Exactly? How is that illegal?

Speaker 6 (01:53:12):
You see? I know what Channel seven did. They send
people out because people are bitching and moaning, and they say, oh,
we got a story. It's a story, but tell the
whole story that all over Colorado, condos and town homes
are facing this dilemma, and even more homeowners are going

(01:53:32):
to be hit with assessments in the future, and many, many,
many people will lose their homes. It's not the hua's problem.
It's the fact that insurance companies are refusing to cover
condos the way they used to because they took too
many losses. And once you learn that, once you understand that,

(01:53:55):
then it becomes an insurance problem and you can't force
insurance companies to cover a losing proposition. So again, to
explain this to a broadcast journalist would be like teaching
maths your dog, Tony, what is your comment.

Speaker 19 (01:54:15):
I actually have someone, a friend that lives down in
those townhouses. The issue is their documentation. For HOA said
they are capped at ten thousand dollars. He has an insurance.
His insurance will cover it to ten thousand dollars in assessments. Okay,

(01:54:37):
so his issue is now he's out an additional ten thousand,
seven dollars, right, because the HA is going to against
their declarations.

Speaker 6 (01:54:51):
Okay, Tony, Tony, I'm glad I have you on the phone.
I'm glad to have you on the phone. So what
you're saying is, according to the declaration to their bylaws,
they could only charge up to ten thousand. Is that
right correct?

Speaker 19 (01:55:06):
And that didn't channel seven story?

Speaker 8 (01:55:09):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:55:10):
I know that. So here's what I want to ask you.

Speaker 6 (01:55:13):
If the roof is going to cost what it's going
to cost, and it's going to take more than ten
thousand dollars each, then what are they supposed to do?

Speaker 20 (01:55:23):
I agree with you there, Tom No, I'm asking.

Speaker 6 (01:55:26):
You, Tony. Even if the bylaws say, if the bylaws
say that the HOA members can't be assessed more than
ten thousand dollars, let's say it does say that. Okay.
So now I'm on an HOA board with two other
people or three other people, and we see that our

(01:55:48):
insurance will not cover the roof, and in order to
pay for the roof, everyone will have to chip in
twenty grand. But wait a minute, that's ten thousand more
then the bylaws say so, is the roofer supposed to say, Oh,
then forget it. We won't charge you as much. We

(01:56:11):
don't want to violate your bylaws. The roofer is not
bound by the bylaws. The insurance company isn't bound by
the bylaws. So now tell me this. Then, if you
just happen to be an unfortunate dupe who is a president,
a vice president, a secretary, or a treasurer of an
HOA and you inherited these bylaws, I'm asking you, Tony.

(01:56:36):
If you were on the board and you knew that
the roof was going to take twenty thousand dollars from
each owner, but the bylaws only allowed you to collect
ten what would you do?

Speaker 19 (01:56:49):
I agree with you, tom Wait, there's nothing.

Speaker 6 (01:56:52):
To agree with. There's nothing to agree with. There is
no other answer. You either pay for the roof or
the roof doesn't get done. So these homeowners go home saying, wow,
we won that fight. Thank you Channel seven for bringing
this up. We won that fight. We only have to
pay ten grand. But if each of them paid the

(01:57:13):
ten grand as allowed by the HOA or as dictated
by the HOA, it's not like the roofer is going
to discount the roof, or it's not like insurance is
going to pay more than they said they would pay.
You See, it doesn't matter what the bylaws say. I
don't give a damn what your bylaws say. If the
bylaws say you only have to pay ten grand, I'm

(01:57:36):
asking you what happens then? If something happens there and
it takes more than ten grand each who pays it?
Who should pay it? The way the Channel seven report
and the way those homeowners are talking, it's like the
HOA is some separate entity that can somehow come up
with the extra money. It's not. It's ridiculous. So, Tony,

(01:58:01):
I get what you're saying. The HOA board went against
the bylaws, right, But can we.

Speaker 8 (01:58:07):
Agree with Tom?

Speaker 21 (01:58:08):
They didn't, but they did tell people that the insurance
a couple of years ago would do that, or my
friend would have bought higher insurance for the assessment. The
bylaws that said it's cat that ten thousand dollars okay.

Speaker 6 (01:58:25):
Now that I can get, Now that I can hold on.
If they were not properly informed, I'm going to ask
you something, Tony. Your friend who did not know about this?
Did your friend attend meetings?

Speaker 8 (01:58:39):
He just moved there about a year and a half ago.

Speaker 1 (01:58:42):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (01:58:42):
Did he attend any meetings, Yes, he has, Okay, then
it would have been discussed at a meeting, and.

Speaker 19 (01:58:51):
They didn't discuss the new insurance.

Speaker 6 (01:58:53):
You see here. Here's what's funny is what's funny to
me is I'm not sticking up.

Speaker 1 (01:58:58):
For this HOA.

Speaker 6 (01:58:59):
It really could be that they didn't inform their people.
And you said he would have bought higher assessment coverage,
but higher assessment coverage would mean a higher premium, and
a lot of people don't want to pay a higher premium.
And by the way, loss assessment coverage only goes up
to twenty five thousand dollars and that's only for an

(01:59:19):
insurance loss. I don't know in this case. Did they
have any insurance on the roof? Was this just the
deductible they were assessing for?

Speaker 19 (01:59:30):
Yeah, so.

Speaker 21 (01:59:32):
He had an ho sixth policy.

Speaker 19 (01:59:36):
He could have bought more by his insurance agent said
you're only allowed to be charged ten thousand dollars.

Speaker 8 (01:59:43):
Could have only been a couple of dollars more a month.

Speaker 1 (01:59:46):
Okay, Well, Tony, Tony, that's too bad.

Speaker 6 (01:59:49):
But it doesn't erase the fact that they can't Okay,
so they decide not to have the roof done, then
there's dam image to the condos and to the structure.
I mean, what I'm saying is, don't live in a condo.
What happens if you live at home in your roof
is destroyed. I mean the idea that they're accusing the

(02:00:13):
hoa of violating the covenants or the bylaws is so
stupid because if there's ten of you and you have
to chip in one hundred bucks each to make one
thousand dollars, you have to chip in one hundred dollars each.
If the laws say you only have to pay fifty dollars,
who pays for the rest. It doesn't matter what the

(02:00:33):
bylaws say. Now, I will say this, perhaps they should
have maybe informed the homeowners of this impending danger because
that's what it is. And everyone who lives in a
condo in town home right now, you better get to
meetings and find out what assessment you're in for when

(02:00:54):
the roof is destroyed, because it will be destroyed. What
is your comment, John, go ahead, what's your comment?

Speaker 2 (02:01:00):
Thanks for taking my call, but listening almost forty years
to thank you. My question is do you keep saying
condos or bad tunnels are bad. I'm getting ready to
start looking to buy a condo. Do I just keep
the heads up on the condition of the roof it
like I would a house.

Speaker 6 (02:01:15):
It's more than that, John, What I'm saying is this.
A lot of the condos out there right now, unless
they're new, they have a lot of deferred maintenance. It's
not just the roof, but the roof is one of
the main issues. And you can't buy insurance to cover everything.
What if the parking lots need to be repaved, What

(02:01:35):
if the place has to be painted? Insurance doesn't cover that.
And most hoa's keep what's that?

Speaker 2 (02:01:44):
Do all condos have has?

Speaker 1 (02:01:46):
Well?

Speaker 6 (02:01:47):
You hope they do. Who else would manage it? I mean,
how else would you manage it? You see? An HOA
is nothing more than an association of owners. You're all
living together. If you're going to buy a condo. If
you're gonna buy a condo and the condo building needs
to be painted, who's gonna pay for it? The people
who live there? You see, here's the problem. Condo associations

(02:02:11):
try to keep the fees low. They try to keep
them low so people don't bitch when they keep the
fees low, and then they need to do something like
paint or repave or redo a swimming pool or redoce something,
and insurance doesn't cover it. Then they have to assess

(02:02:31):
the owners. Then the owner's bitch because they're being assessed.
So they're either gonna bitch because they're paying higher fees
or they're gonna bitch because they're being assessed. And what
I say is these people should not own to begin with,
because they don't have the money to own.

Speaker 1 (02:02:48):
If you have a comment, I got to take a break.

Speaker 6 (02:02:51):
We got more.

Speaker 1 (02:02:51):
It could just wait. We got more coming up.

Speaker 6 (02:02:58):
Go with a sure thing Denvers Best Roofer, Excel Roofing
dot com. You don't pay a cent until you're content.
Time for an insurance checkup free, no obligation. In comparison,
call Compass insurance paying too much your coverage at dozens
of insurance companies find out now three oh three seven
seven to one help. You'll think you're his only customer

(02:03:20):
when you choose Frank durand the real estate Man dot
com to list your home with Remax Alliance three oh
three nine two zero sixteen twenty two. Hi Tom Martino
here three O three seven one three talk seven one three,
eight two five five. I want to put this in
very plain facts, things that I've actually seen over the years.

(02:03:44):
So you get a homeowners I've done fourteen subdivisions. Okay,
I haven't done condos, but I've done subdivisions, and I
remember the meetings you would have and people will say,
I'm not going to pay that much money a month
to be part of this HOA. So the HU, in
an effort to make people happy, they're established at a

(02:04:05):
reasonable monthly payment. So let's say thirty dollars a month.
Then there's one hundred of you. Okay, I'm gonna put
this in really easy numbers. There's one hundred of you
each paying thirty dollars a month because that's what you
can tolerate, that's what you demand. You don't want to
pay sixty dollars a month. You don't want to pay
one hundred dollars a month. You want to pay thirty. Okay,

(02:04:27):
So you pay thirty dollars a month. That's three thousand
dollars for the HA and the coffers. At the end
of a year, if there are no expenses, the HA
has thirty six thousand dollars. At the end of three years,
you have one hundred and eight thousand. Let's say at
the end of three years there's a big storm or

(02:04:47):
you have to repave or something that comes up and
you have to pay two hundred thousand dollars. That leaves
you ninety two thousand dollars short. That's if there are
no other expenses. But I'm trying to make this really
easy to understand. So now the huay, in an effort
to keep people happy and charge thirty dollars a month.

(02:05:08):
At the end of three years, they have a two
hundred thousand dollars expense and they are short ninety two
thousand dollars. Now divide that by the original one hundred
and guess what happens. They each now have to come
up with nine hundred twenty dollars, and they're bitching up

(02:05:28):
a storm, saying, wait a minute, wait a minute, what
is nine twenty four? You don't have the right to
collect that nine funny? So what do they do? Not
repair the roof, not repave the parking lot, not paint.
Do they just let it become dilapidated and then your
investment goes down the drain? What exactly do they do.

(02:05:52):
So if you take that nine hundred and twenty bucks
that homeowner doesn't want to pay, and you you backdated
for three years, it would have been an extra twenty
five dollars a month. But remember they didn't want to
pay fifty five dollars a month. They only wanted to
pay thirty dollars a month. They got their wish and

(02:06:15):
now they don't want to pay the assessment. What I'm
getting at is math never lies, whether or not you
like it or not. When you belong to a community
of condos, you will be assessed or you will pay
an outrageous monthly HOA. You're gonna have it either way.

(02:06:40):
So if your HOA fees are low, it's gonna come
back to bite you in the ass. And then you're
gonna bitch about it and get Channel seven to do
a story. Jay Bretz is on the line. What did
you want to say?

Speaker 20 (02:06:53):
Jay, John, I'm about one of these exact situations going
on in Wayomi claims are brokey broke, they need it
new riff and they don't have the money to do it,
and then they bitchet me when when the thing's leaking.
But you're so on point about everything you're saying. But
what I want you to tell the homeowners also how
this relates to them is that that roof, after it's

(02:07:15):
ten years old, most of the insurance companies are not
paying replacement cost insurance anymore. It's actual cash value. So
a lot of the individual homeowners are going to get
a rude awakening when they get their next claim. You
know about the insurance company is not going to pay
the whole thing.

Speaker 6 (02:07:32):
What I find funny is where the one guy called
and said, well, their bylaws say they can't be assessed
more than ten grand. Okay, then what so? Okay? So
let's say you Evan, Let's say you're in an hoa
and it says you can't be assessed more than ten grand,
but the expense calls for twenty grand. What happens? Do

(02:07:52):
you not get it done? And then you then your
investment goes down the hill. This example I gave was
a perfect example, using smaller numbers, that they paid thirty
dollars a month, they accumulated with no other expenses, one
hundred eight thousand dollars. If they had to pay out

(02:08:13):
two hundred thousand, which is minuscule for one hundred unit condo.
So let's say they had to pay out two hundred.
That leaves them short ninety two thousand, which is in
essence what they would have been paying. They would have
been paying fifty five dollars a month to cover it. Again,
you have people bitching about their monthly payment, and then

(02:08:35):
you have them bitching about their assessments. You can't have
it either way. Math is going to catch up with
you one way or another. It's going to catch up
with you. There's no free lunch, you know. And these stupid, stupid,
stupid people who live in condos and bitch about their
monthly payment do not understand. You either pay it monthly

(02:09:00):
or pay it all at once, but you're not gonna
get away without paying it. And if you can't afford it, somehow,
I'm supposed to feel something for people who can't afford it.
It means you can't afford it. You shouldn't have been
living there. If you can't afford to live somewhere, don't
live there. Rent. That's right, Because when someone scratches together

(02:09:25):
enough money to get into a condo and they barely
make their monthly premium, they have their monthly payments of
gas and electric and HOA and everything else that is
probably too much for them. It's too much for them,
and it's going to catch up. But to stand outside
and call it illegal because your bylaws. My bylaws say

(02:09:49):
I only have to pay ten grand in assessments, so
I want that roof done for ten grand. That's the problem.

Speaker 20 (02:10:00):
It's just not going to happen if you don't tell
them the thing you're not saying, like my DL in Wyoming,
it's a flat roof and that there's all this damage
happening inside, and it just makes me it's compounding their problem.
They're probably getting mold and other stuff.

Speaker 6 (02:10:15):
Oh no, I know, I know right now. Here's the problem.
Here's the problem. People are uneducated living in condos and
town homes. Unfortunately, it attracts people who can't afford a
single family home and they buy a condo as a
lower cost alternative. But what they don't understand is it's

(02:10:39):
going to take the same amount of money and upkeep
for a condo as it will for a home. They
just call it an assessment instead of here's your plumbing bill, ma'am,
here's your roofing bill. If that person owned a home
and had the roof done, Jay, how common what it

(02:11:00):
have been for them to have a twenty thousand dollars
deductible They could very well if you have a single
family home nowadays, with the way policies are being written,
you could very well be hit with twenty thousand dollars
on a hailstorm. People need to know how much it
costs to live places. And the sad fact is some

(02:11:21):
people shouldn't be living there. And I predict the price
of condos and town homes are going to hit the skids,
really hit the skids. Jay. We've only seen We've only
seen the tip of the iceberg here. I mean, I
really mean this. It is very expensive to live in

(02:11:43):
a condo and a town home. It's just that expense
doesn't show itself right away. There's no such home. That's right.

Speaker 20 (02:11:56):
They're not managed properly, just like you laid out for everybody.
When these things happen. They don't have the money to
deal with.

Speaker 6 (02:12:02):
It, that's right, they don't have them. And all the
bylaws in the world doesn't mean a thing, you idiot.
If the bylaw says you can only charge ten grand
to the owners, what happens when something costs twenty grands
of each. I mean, it's not like your bylaws mean anything.
They don't mean anything. Does it mean that you don't
well with those homeowners? Instead of paying the twenty grand

(02:12:24):
with those homeowners, rather not have the roof fixed, Then
what happens to their investment? It goes down the tubes.
So here's what I tell people looking for condos and
town homes. You better look at that entire development. When
you have a home inspector to look at the condo,

(02:12:44):
that's just again the tip of the iceberg. They need
to look at the parking lot. When will that parking
lot need repaving? They need to look at a swimming pool,
when will that need maintenance? They need to look at
the exterior painting and gutters and spaces, because guests, what
insurance doesn't pay for all that, All of that outside
maintenance and all of the common areas are your responsibility

(02:13:10):
as a single owner, your responsibility, that's right, and so
if you can't afford to pay it, then you need
to move. So many people are buying these condos and townhomes.
They're demanding low monthly HOA payments. It doesn't get you anywhere,
doesn't get you anywhere. You know what, I belong to

(02:13:32):
a condo association, the only one I ever belonged to
that assessed properly. You won't do. You know what, what
do you think the monthly HOA was? What do you
think it was? It was around twelve hundred dollars a month.
It was a luxury townhome building. And guess what that
barely met all of the things that come up in

(02:13:54):
the future because when they have a surplus, it goes
for the next year in case they need to do
the roof, or in case they need to do painting,
or in case they need to do repaving. You need
you need to look at this entire situation, absolutely, not
just the condo you're buying, because you will be hit
with assessments more coming up. Go with a sure thing

(02:14:17):
Denver's Best roofer Excel roofing dot com. You don't pay
a cent until you're content. Time for an insurance checkup free,
no obligation. In comparison, call Compass insurance paying too much
your coverage at dozens of insurance companies. Find out now
three O three seven seven to one help. You'll think
you're his only customer when you choose Frank durand The

(02:14:39):
real estate Man dot com to list your home with
Remax Alliance three oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty
two