November 25, 2025 • 10 mins
Former Buckeye DL Matt Finkes breaks down what the Buckeyes need to do to knock off the Wolverines, ending a 4-game losing streak
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
On a legacy retirement group dot com phone line. Let's
welcome in. Matt finkis former Ohio State defensive lineman. Also,
he is the man behind the app called behind the Oh.
We'll talk about that in a minute. Matthew, it is
game week, my friend. How are you, sir?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I'm doing good. Guys, how you doing doing great?
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Doing great? Thanks for jumping on board of this. So
here we go. We're four days out, We've got the
game just off the top of your head. How do
you see this one going?
Speaker 2 (00:30):
You know, I'd love to tell you how I think
it's going to go or how it should go, but
that never really works out of this game. So you know,
you just have to come in and I know this
team is going to come in with a with a
different mindset, and you know you're on an unfortunately. I
know how it is to be on the end of
one of these losing streets where you're you know, perceived
better than the other team that you continue to lose.
(00:53):
You know, we went through that in the nineties. So
you know, I think that Ryan's going to take a
different approach mentally to this week into this game and
how the how to get his team prepared for it.
And you know that's that's the whole question of it.
I Mean, this isn't a question of you know, talent
or or physical illness or you know, the scheme. It's
(01:14):
really a mental challenge for these guys right now. I Mean,
this is there, undoubtedly, you know, by any measure, the
top team in the country, and they showed it weekend
and we weak out. I mean, you look at that
game last week and I don't even really know what
they were doing. You know, it was just like they're
you know, the scheme and the people who were playing
and how it was playing it was I mean, it
(01:36):
was almost like a spring game feel to it. And
they still you know, dominated another school forty two to nine.
So you know, you've got to be able to come
out in this game. And you know, and you know,
my advice and talking to some people over the weekend
was you know, you're you're the one team playing eighteen,
but you've got to come in with the mentality and
that you're the eighteen and and that's how you're going
(01:56):
to kind of get through this. You've got to try
to convince yourself that this is that the pressure is
not on you and that this is more of a
you know, of an underdog role for yourself and somehow
and then just come out and play fast and lose.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Yeah, it's that that that underdog mentality, no doubt and
you know, take nothing for granted whatsoever.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
You know.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
So you mentioned, you know, the the talent, the talent.
Clearly on paper, Ohio State has the better team than
the team up north. I don't think there's any question
to that, but you mentioned, you know, sort of the
mentality and you know, this year's team is better than
last year's team. Also, if you a b both Ohio
State teams this year, it just feels different. Specifically for me,
(02:36):
it looks like the defense with Matt Patricia, it's an
NFL style defense. And like you said, you were watching
the game and you're like, what is going on? What
what have you noticed about the defense that's different this year?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
You know, I think they're they're they're playing with with
with the ease and with the confidence that Matt brings
to the table. And I think that, you know, he's
very much from you know, from from the Bill Parcells
build a check tree and you know what those guys did,
I mean, going all the way back to the Giants
and then you know in the late eighties, early nineties,
and you know, they take the talent that's on the
field and they create a scheme and a defense around that.
(03:12):
Not they don't have a you know, very much diametric
to what Jim Knowles does. Jim Knowles has a system
and you have to fit into that system. You know,
Matt creates a defense with the within the system, with
the players that he had, and when you have guys
who with the football like you and I know we've
talked about this before with the Caleb and with with
Sonny especially, that can be an extension of coaches on
(03:33):
the field and you can do so much, you know,
with them and with disguises and with you know, different
coverages and different schemes and different blitz packages. It's just
it's a really dangerous combination when you have a guy
with with Matt's mind and the ability and the mind
of those two guys out there along with all the
other talent on the field. So I think that's the
real difference that you see with this, with this defense,
(03:55):
it just morphs into into something that's going to take
away what you want to do every Saturday.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
I know it's a cliche to say that these games
are won in the trenches, but I mean they're cliches
because they're true. And as a defensive lineman, I mean,
you are the guys that are in every play and
you're you're banging hats at the the O line. You know,
talk about the difference between you know, both Michigan and
(04:21):
Ohio State, especially when Ohio State's on d Michigan's O
line has I think. I think I read they've got
three freshmen on it and one of the one of
the older, more experienced guys I think got a little
dinged up last week, Brettison. I don't know what his
status is for this week, but talk about winning the
game in the trenches.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Yeah, I mean, no matter how much talent, I think
this goes back to, you know, any year that you
look at this game, whether whoever in the coach was,
I mean, if you don't stop the run, I mean,
as far as the highest state is concerned, you don't
stop the run, You're not going to win the game.
I mean, and that's that's been true since the thirties. Yeah,
I mean, in this just the way it is, and
that's how Michigan's going to play you know, highest States
(05:03):
offense has went through a ton of dynamic changes, and
you know, for a Highest State to win this game
on Saturday, they've got to put uh, you know, their
freshman quarterback in uncomfortable situations. I mean, that's how you're
going to win. If Michigan can. I mean, you saw,
you saw what happened last year. Michigan's allowed to shorten
the game and run out the clock and pound and
get first downs and keep this a low scoring game.
(05:24):
And you know, and then do those kinds of things
and keep our offense off the field. It's going to
be a long Saturday, So I mean, you've got to
be able to stop the run that you know, Haines
is probably out, we don't know if he's coming back,
but the other running back is just as good. Their
offensive line, for being young, is playing really well. You know,
they've had some big wins, they've converted some some times
when they've made it to and Bryce young not Bryce you,
(05:46):
but Bryce Underwood is you know, has done some good
things and he's shown some potential, but he's also you know,
made a lot of mistakes. You want to put him
in a position that's going to make him uncomfortable. Put
him in third and long. But he doesn't want to
be a drop back pass, so he wants to be
out on the edge and on the move. So I mean,
you've got to do those things to put him in
situations where he doesn't feel comfortable. And I think if,
(06:06):
if the if the defense is able to do that,
it's going to be a get outcome for him.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Matt as a former player, how do you harness anger?
How do you harness emotion? Last year following the game?
I mean, I hear it from fans all the time
about the flag planning thing, but high emotion and high
anger can cause mistakes. How do you how do you
harness that?
Speaker 1 (06:27):
As a player?
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Yeah, I mean that's a that's a really hard part
of this game. You know, the hardest part of this
game is the first five minutes, in the last five minutes,
because this is where you've got to come out and
really control, you know, all the things that have been
building up all week in those first five minutes, and
then you've got to finish the game in the last
five So you know, I know that Ryan works a
(06:50):
lot on the mental part of the game with these guys,
you know, this is a team that made you know, yes,
there was a lot of seniors that left last year,
but a lot of these guys playing right now have
had a lot of significant time in that in that
season last year and know about overcoming the adversity and
all that kind of stuff. So you know, I think
this is this is a good veteran leadership team that
(07:13):
I'll be able to do that. And yeah, I mean,
you can't come out out of control those first five
minutes of the game, and then you know, put yourself
in situations where you're you're out of your game plan.
So you've got to be able to come in and
control those emotions, you know, get get into your game plan,
get into your groove, and then you've got to finish
the game in the last five minutes because that's an
emotional time too, you know. I mean, that's that's where
(07:34):
you know that everything's on the line and you know
this is you hear it and you know it and
it's true. But it's a game that lives with you forever.
And and you know, guys, you know, you start to
realize that in the last five minutes, you've got to
be able to control that part of it too, So
you know, I know that that's something they'd work with
all year long, and it's just it's going to be
tested and put to test this this Saturday, and then
(07:55):
you know, you hope the training is paid off.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
I want to spend a quick minute speaking with Matt Thingez,
former Ohio State defensive linemen, on NIL coming to high
schools in Ohio that was all approved and voted on yesterday.
Can you imagine Matt, what it would have been like
at Pickwell High School and you were able to get
a brand deal with a power aid or something on
Nike or somebody coming in and saying, hey, this is
(08:19):
our guy. Is this a good idea for these young
men and women playing high school sports?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
I'm not in favor of it, and I think that,
you know, hopefully it's going to be rolled out a
little bit better than the Collins version was. Where now
I mean, we're in the we're in the realm of
it being what it was meant to be in college now.
But it took how many years to get here and
how much just pay for play? And so you know,
(08:50):
you hope the guardrails are in place. And I haven't
really looked at the ruling in depth. But I mean,
at the end of the day, okay, I mean, does
some of these kids have some opportunity here there? I mean,
it's just I feel like they're doing they're creating this,
especially at the high school level. You've created this, and
you voted on this, and you've allowed this to happen
for such a minority of players that this is going
(09:12):
to affect especially you know, it's just you know, how
many kids are going to get these huge deals or
deals that are going to be even significant. Yeah, and
then you know that opens up I mean, how many
how many how many recruiting violations in the past, you know,
ten years have have you know affected Ohio high school football.
I mean, you know what Ironton has just went through
(09:34):
that this year, right, I mean, they do, you know,
recruiting things. I know, you know there's Date and Dayton,
Maurice Douglass went through that. You know, the Catholic schools
always you know, getting you know, get accused of it.
I mean, so I think this is just something that
was you know, really unnecessary. And I hope that the
that they they put enough guardrails with structures in around
(09:55):
us to make sure that you know, maybe it's going
to benefit teen kids in the state of Ohio long term,
but I mean, I just hope that it doesn't turn
into what it turned into at the college level, which
was just a huge mess.
On a legacy retirement group dot com phone line. Let's
welcome in. Matt finkis former Ohio State defensive lineman. Also,
he is the man behind the app called behind the Oh.
We'll talk about that in a minute. Matthew, it is
game week, my friend. How are you, sir?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I'm doing good. Guys, how you doing doing great?
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Doing great? Thanks for jumping on board of this. So
here we go. We're four days out, We've got the
game just off the top of your head. How do
you see this one going?
Speaker 2 (00:30):
You know, I'd love to tell you how I think
it's going to go or how it should go, but
that never really works out of this game. So you know,
you just have to come in and I know this
team is going to come in with a with a
different mindset, and you know you're on an unfortunately. I
know how it is to be on the end of
one of these losing streets where you're you know, perceived
better than the other team that you continue to lose.
(00:53):
You know, we went through that in the nineties. So
you know, I think that Ryan's going to take a
different approach mentally to this week into this game and
how the how to get his team prepared for it.
And you know that's that's the whole question of it.
I Mean, this isn't a question of you know, talent
or or physical illness or you know, the scheme. It's
(01:14):
really a mental challenge for these guys right now. I Mean,
this is there, undoubtedly, you know, by any measure, the
top team in the country, and they showed it weekend
and we weak out. I mean, you look at that
game last week and I don't even really know what
they were doing. You know, it was just like they're
you know, the scheme and the people who were playing
and how it was playing it was I mean, it
(01:36):
was almost like a spring game feel to it. And
they still you know, dominated another school forty two to nine.
So you know, you've got to be able to come
out in this game. And you know, and you know,
my advice and talking to some people over the weekend
was you know, you're you're the one team playing eighteen,
but you've got to come in with the mentality and
that you're the eighteen and and that's how you're going
(01:56):
to kind of get through this. You've got to try
to convince yourself that this is that the pressure is
not on you and that this is more of a
you know, of an underdog role for yourself and somehow
and then just come out and play fast and lose.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Yeah, it's that that that underdog mentality, no doubt and
you know, take nothing for granted whatsoever.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
You know.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
So you mentioned, you know, the the talent, the talent.
Clearly on paper, Ohio State has the better team than
the team up north. I don't think there's any question
to that, but you mentioned, you know, sort of the
mentality and you know, this year's team is better than
last year's team. Also, if you a b both Ohio
State teams this year, it just feels different. Specifically for me,
(02:36):
it looks like the defense with Matt Patricia, it's an
NFL style defense. And like you said, you were watching
the game and you're like, what is going on? What
what have you noticed about the defense that's different this year?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
You know, I think they're they're they're playing with with
with the ease and with the confidence that Matt brings
to the table. And I think that, you know, he's
very much from you know, from from the Bill Parcells
build a check tree and you know what those guys did,
I mean, going all the way back to the Giants
and then you know in the late eighties, early nineties,
and you know, they take the talent that's on the
field and they create a scheme and a defense around that.
(03:12):
Not they don't have a you know, very much diametric
to what Jim Knowles does. Jim Knowles has a system
and you have to fit into that system. You know,
Matt creates a defense with the within the system, with
the players that he had, and when you have guys
who with the football like you and I know we've
talked about this before with the Caleb and with with
Sonny especially, that can be an extension of coaches on
(03:33):
the field and you can do so much, you know,
with them and with disguises and with you know, different
coverages and different schemes and different blitz packages. It's just
it's a really dangerous combination when you have a guy
with with Matt's mind and the ability and the mind
of those two guys out there along with all the
other talent on the field. So I think that's the
real difference that you see with this, with this defense,
(03:55):
it just morphs into into something that's going to take
away what you want to do every Saturday.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
I know it's a cliche to say that these games
are won in the trenches, but I mean they're cliches
because they're true. And as a defensive lineman, I mean,
you are the guys that are in every play and
you're you're banging hats at the the O line. You know,
talk about the difference between you know, both Michigan and
(04:21):
Ohio State, especially when Ohio State's on d Michigan's O
line has I think. I think I read they've got
three freshmen on it and one of the one of
the older, more experienced guys I think got a little
dinged up last week, Brettison. I don't know what his
status is for this week, but talk about winning the
game in the trenches.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Yeah, I mean, no matter how much talent, I think
this goes back to, you know, any year that you
look at this game, whether whoever in the coach was,
I mean, if you don't stop the run, I mean,
as far as the highest state is concerned, you don't
stop the run, You're not going to win the game.
I mean, and that's that's been true since the thirties. Yeah,
I mean, in this just the way it is, and
that's how Michigan's going to play you know, highest States
(05:03):
offense has went through a ton of dynamic changes, and
you know, for a Highest State to win this game
on Saturday, they've got to put uh, you know, their
freshman quarterback in uncomfortable situations. I mean, that's how you're
going to win. If Michigan can. I mean, you saw,
you saw what happened last year. Michigan's allowed to shorten
the game and run out the clock and pound and
get first downs and keep this a low scoring game.
(05:24):
And you know, and then do those kinds of things
and keep our offense off the field. It's going to
be a long Saturday, So I mean, you've got to
be able to stop the run that you know, Haines
is probably out, we don't know if he's coming back,
but the other running back is just as good. Their
offensive line, for being young, is playing really well. You know,
they've had some big wins, they've converted some some times
when they've made it to and Bryce young not Bryce you,
(05:46):
but Bryce Underwood is you know, has done some good
things and he's shown some potential, but he's also you know,
made a lot of mistakes. You want to put him
in a position that's going to make him uncomfortable. Put
him in third and long. But he doesn't want to
be a drop back pass, so he wants to be
out on the edge and on the move. So I mean,
you've got to do those things to put him in
situations where he doesn't feel comfortable. And I think if,
(06:06):
if the if the defense is able to do that,
it's going to be a get outcome for him.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Matt as a former player, how do you harness anger?
How do you harness emotion? Last year following the game?
I mean, I hear it from fans all the time
about the flag planning thing, but high emotion and high
anger can cause mistakes. How do you how do you
harness that?
Speaker 1 (06:27):
As a player?
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Yeah, I mean that's a that's a really hard part
of this game. You know, the hardest part of this
game is the first five minutes, in the last five minutes,
because this is where you've got to come out and
really control, you know, all the things that have been
building up all week in those first five minutes, and
then you've got to finish the game in the last
five So you know, I know that Ryan works a
(06:50):
lot on the mental part of the game with these guys,
you know, this is a team that made you know, yes,
there was a lot of seniors that left last year,
but a lot of these guys playing right now have
had a lot of significant time in that in that
season last year and know about overcoming the adversity and
all that kind of stuff. So you know, I think
this is this is a good veteran leadership team that
(07:13):
I'll be able to do that. And yeah, I mean,
you can't come out out of control those first five
minutes of the game, and then you know, put yourself
in situations where you're you're out of your game plan.
So you've got to be able to come in and
control those emotions, you know, get get into your game plan,
get into your groove, and then you've got to finish
the game in the last five minutes because that's an
emotional time too, you know. I mean, that's that's where
(07:34):
you know that everything's on the line and you know
this is you hear it and you know it and
it's true. But it's a game that lives with you forever.
And and you know, guys, you know, you start to
realize that in the last five minutes, you've got to
be able to control that part of it too, So
you know, I know that that's something they'd work with
all year long, and it's just it's going to be
tested and put to test this this Saturday, and then
(07:55):
you know, you hope the training is paid off.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
I want to spend a quick minute speaking with Matt Thingez,
former Ohio State defensive linemen, on NIL coming to high
schools in Ohio that was all approved and voted on yesterday.
Can you imagine Matt, what it would have been like
at Pickwell High School and you were able to get
a brand deal with a power aid or something on
Nike or somebody coming in and saying, hey, this is
(08:19):
our guy. Is this a good idea for these young
men and women playing high school sports?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
I'm not in favor of it, and I think that,
you know, hopefully it's going to be rolled out a
little bit better than the Collins version was. Where now
I mean, we're in the we're in the realm of
it being what it was meant to be in college now.
But it took how many years to get here and
how much just pay for play? And so you know,
(08:50):
you hope the guardrails are in place. And I haven't
really looked at the ruling in depth. But I mean,
at the end of the day, okay, I mean, does
some of these kids have some opportunity here there? I mean,
it's just I feel like they're doing they're creating this,
especially at the high school level. You've created this, and
you voted on this, and you've allowed this to happen
for such a minority of players that this is going
(09:12):
to affect especially you know, it's just you know, how
many kids are going to get these huge deals or
deals that are going to be even significant. Yeah, and
then you know that opens up I mean, how many
how many how many recruiting violations in the past, you know,
ten years have have you know affected Ohio high school football.
I mean, you know what Ironton has just went through
(09:34):
that this year, right, I mean, they do, you know,
recruiting things. I know, you know there's Date and Dayton,
Maurice Douglass went through that. You know, the Catholic schools
always you know, getting you know, get accused of it.
I mean, so I think this is just something that
was you know, really unnecessary. And I hope that the
that they they put enough guardrails with structures in around
(09:55):
us to make sure that you know, maybe it's going
to benefit teen kids in the state of Ohio long term,
but I mean, I just hope that it doesn't turn
into what it turned into at the college level, which
was just a huge mess.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.