Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
But I'm not Eric, Are you Ariy could be? Are
you Eric?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I am not?
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Are you aeric?
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (00:08):
None of us are Eric.
Speaker 4 (00:09):
All of us are counting our blessings for that. Welcome
to on Target nine ninety nine Bethel Road is the
address of l EPD Firearms and Range and Training Facility.
Most Saturdays at noon. This happens here and Eric is
doing something joyous with his life this weekend. So I
get a chance to come up. You know, I just
(00:30):
telling ed before we went on not a bad day,
but a stressful day. And it's sad to have a
stressful day when it's so beautiful, right Bruce Sky's sunshine.
It's not ridiculously hot yet, and in case you haven't heard,
it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
So that's I don't know.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
I was looking through Facebook memories today and I had
a October fifteenth of last year where I did a
video of the sleet.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Falling at my house. So I'm good with heat.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well that was October, so I mean you would expect
something like that in.
Speaker 4 (01:04):
October, well not October so early for that. Yeah, So anyway,
I have missed you guys. It's good to be back
up here. You're doing well. You look both look healthy.
You both look relatively happy. Well, I mean as happy
as you get. But John looks happy.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
I don't know where I get this. I'm not happy guy.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
Yeah, I didn't say you weren't happy. I just said
you don't normally have a happy grin on your face.
You're a very stern faced person.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I don't think that's true.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
You're is that true? Crowd?
Speaker 5 (01:34):
No?
Speaker 2 (01:34):
No?
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Never, Okay, yes he is.
Speaker 4 (01:36):
Oh, they're complaining about the sound again. Which one of
these controls?
Speaker 1 (01:39):
They're not screen?
Speaker 4 (01:41):
All the little marking things are gone from that's up.
That's up. We'll try to figure that out. How about
that one? Nothing, Well, we'll try to figure it out
at some point. I don't know what it is. All
the little markings that he usually has on here are gone. Anyway,
this week we'll be discussing some new products, include after
the bottom of the hour news, the CEO president of
(02:03):
Berner scheduled to join us, and I am looking forward
to that because I don't have you fired to Berner yet,
either one of you. I want to know all kinds
of stuff, including you know, practice rounds are there cheaper
kinetic practice rounds? Because I would want to get as
good with something like that as I would be with
a pistol.
Speaker 6 (02:21):
Yeah, a lot of yeah practice shuns. Yeah, they come
and you can buy them at ninety five at.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
A time, so you can by practice runs.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Oh yeah, yeah, Okay, that's good, Larry.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
And I'd love to know what the force that you know,
the contact forces is this like bean bag force?
Speaker 5 (02:35):
Is it? What? That?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Good news?
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Yeah, we got that all covered.
Speaker 4 (02:38):
It's a it's a good invention and I think very
very practical and hopefully we'll learn a little bit here
after the bottom of the hour, we'll discuss that, as
well as some training tips other things. Political topics of course,
surrounding the Second Amendment, like there are any of those.
Our commitment is always to bring you the facts about
the industry and ultimately help listeners and customers with safe,
responsible ownership of firearms. So again, uh Burner CEO joining
(03:00):
US Brian Gantz just after the twelve thirty news, big
big newsy Week apparently Oh we're twisting buttons were moving knobs?
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Did she get it? Bless your heart?
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (03:14):
Can I just say publicly right now, your husband does
not deserve you just she came up here and knew
right with the fix right off the bat. That's wonderful.
That's wonderful. Lots of newsy, newsy newsy stuff this week, John.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Not that it doesn't say up their local speaker volume.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
That's I turned that and it didn't do anything for him.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
I don't think you did. I think you did the
one below it did?
Speaker 1 (03:37):
I mention you were grumpy?
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (03:39):
Okay, So anyway, John, you've got sheets and sheets of
hot How much do you spend on highlighters every year?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
I go through a lot. Yeah, so you.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
Got enough colors on that page. You need a pride
parade just for your news.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
That's what I probably do.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Yeah, Holy Holy.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Didn't get them all, but got most of them.
Speaker 4 (03:57):
What's the biggest the biggestory you're going to talk about
this week? Which one is like, oh, I got to
let everybody know.
Speaker 6 (04:03):
Well, okay, probably for the first time, the Department of
Justice in the United States for the first time formally
opposed a ban on modern sporting rifles. So this is
formal from them, So you know, they've been keeping their
mouth shut obviously in the past. So that's a big deal.
So you know, it's a it's a start and there.
(04:25):
They have submitted a letter to basically the Seventh Circuit
Court of Appeals saying, Hey, before you decide this case,
I want to let you know Department Adjustment Justice says
that you know ms rs are common, they are here,
they're covered by the Second Amendment, and so before you
make your decision, consider that. So also supported by thirty
(04:49):
five of the of the states counties. The counties have
state attorney general like assistance, you know, for every county
in Illinois, and thirty five of them said, yeah, it's
uncom institutional to do whatever it is done.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Just affected, just one, just the fact that the d
o J chimed in on something like this, that's a
big deal. That's a shot across the bow, which is
a wonderful thing. And I'm very happy to see government,
uh uh, not just government, but all kinds of officials
that are starting to actually speak out and say things
that made that sheriff Did you guys? I didn't the
(05:23):
sheriff in Florida, did you guys? Oh my god, you
come after one of my guys, We will kill you.
Graveyard dead. I'm like, it's as dead as.
Speaker 6 (05:32):
It gets, baby, like that, we will graveyard.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
That's yes, Edward. How have you been?
Speaker 4 (05:42):
What's going on in your life? Are you promoted or
you like chief of police or anything yet? Because I
know how you are. I'm okay, well, I'm hello. What
are you whispering?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I just said you have a caller?
Speaker 1 (05:54):
No, we don't. Oh my god, a very important No,
he's not. How do you know.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
It?
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Is it really?
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Eric?
Speaker 4 (06:06):
Oh my gosh, we got you're gone? Why are you
on the phone?
Speaker 5 (06:10):
Hi? Guys?
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Hey, who's this?
Speaker 5 (06:15):
Guys?
Speaker 7 (06:16):
You sound great. It kind of makes me feel bad
because I'm not sure even needed you're not.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Just know, we've taken your name off the sitting arrangement.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Knows what all the buttons do? We're good man?
Speaker 7 (06:28):
Well, I know, hey, I won't keep you guys. But
there was one piece of news this week that I
jumped up and down for and I wanted to deliver
it personally. I know JC has it in his stack.
You guys, remember the last couple of years, we got
thrown into an ATF program that ultimately led us on
the front page of USA today. Remember that one nice.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
Because you were selling all those guns to all those
criminals exactly.
Speaker 7 (06:54):
It was that program, and we fought and kicked and
said that the whole thing was fraudulent and how they
had it set up and we got drug into it. Well,
under this new administration, I'm happy to announce this week
they have done away with that program at the ATF excellent.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Yeah, so silliness and.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
So the program's gone, but we're still got a black eye.
Speaker 7 (07:18):
Uh well, of course. But the thing is, I mean,
it's it is the direct correlation between the administrations. You
talk about, you know, the importance of elections. We are
feeling it firsthand and I know JCS some mother ATF
News this week, but we're feeling it firsthand, the benefit
of a new administration in there, and it's so it's
it's it's it's refreshing to know that that vote, that
(07:41):
vote counted.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Is there any possibility of some sort of class action
litigation that would take all the people that were in
your position and get that stuff expunge so you don't
have that any kind of record of.
Speaker 7 (07:52):
That, you know, I would like to think so, But
as always, it's time and money and it's up against
the government, and you know, we kind of did a
good job of explaining ourselves and why the you know,
we will put on it erroneously, but still it was
you know, it took up so much time in the
last couple of years. But we're just happy to see.
Speaker 5 (08:10):
It go away.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
No, that's wonderful. No, no more of it.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
But if they get rid of the stuff from get
rid of the stuff from the past, that would be
even better.
Speaker 7 (08:19):
That's right, guys. I will let you guys go have
a great show. I'll be listening to Brian Gant from
Bernha All.
Speaker 4 (08:26):
Right, stay cool out there, Yes, hydrate in case you
haven't been watching anything on television or listening to anything
on the radio.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
Hydrate Eric, good jobs of water.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
He doesn't period?
Speaker 7 (08:37):
Yes, right, all right, you guys have a good one.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
See yuh.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
And while you're at it, turn around, don't drown. That's
important too. I don't take any advice if it doesn't.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Behind you there, all right.
Speaker 4 (08:47):
So I want to thank sponsors of the show US
law Shield. If you don't have US law Shield to
protect you, you need to look at why you don't.
Jackson Egress Windows. Have you ever wanted to turn the
basement into a living space? Black Wing Shooting Centers Suppressor
Fest is going on today and car shows on July
twenty six Ridgers rivers Edge Cutlery. If you've not seen
their new building, you should. It's unbelievable. According to Eric,
(09:10):
and of course l EPD Training facility. You got to
get the sponsors. And don't give me the face.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
Okay, I won't say no.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
You can say something, so not with the face.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
I'm not gonna say what is it? Nothing?
Speaker 4 (09:21):
See now I'm worried. Is there is there anything about
my nose? I just get when you look at me
like that?
Speaker 1 (09:28):
All right?
Speaker 4 (09:29):
So, so Ed and JC both here and uh me
instead of Eric because he's uh he's making phone calls
and enjoying his life today and the beautiful weather. If
you don't catch the show live at noon on six
ten double UTV, and you can always catch the podcast
at six ten double utv in dot com or check
us out on Facebook or YouTube.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Are we still up on Facebook and YouTube?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Well we're up, but I'm not seeing anybody checking in.
But we have some viewers, but they're nobody's checking in yet.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
Well they don't. They don't want to check in.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
That's fine.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
They don't talk to they're not.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
They're not checking. They don't need to talk to me.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Stah I'm gonna argue with him off the air while
jac tells us all the important Newsy stuff going on,
what's up chasing Well.
Speaker 6 (10:07):
And Eric was so happy you called me last night
about that ending that program, which was just immense. Plus Also,
they were leaking it against the law of the Democrats
last administration. We're leaking this information to all the news media,
to a name and shame, like ooh this this dealer
has sold more than twenty five guns that were used
in the crime. The crimes can be as simple as
(10:28):
you sold a gun three years ago in their car
and the guys moved out of state, their car got stolen,
the gun was in the car, and we get danged
as selling guns to in a criminal situation.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
So yeah, there was ridiculous.
Speaker 4 (10:41):
So anyway, that was the leftist battle plan for everything.
It's they're like five year olds. I'm gonna tell that's
that's always We're gonna leak it. We're gonna remember when
we got concealed carry in Ohio. What was the first
thing we heard? We need to publish the names and
addresses of all concealed carry holders. Do you remember that?
It's like if we tell every because everybody believes us
they're on our side. Unfortunately they're finding out they're not.
Speaker 6 (11:02):
So yeah, well, another good one involving the ATF. And
part of the deal, you know, is to cut back
government spending. And what they were doing with their operations
investigators under the last administration was trying to find a
T that wasn't dotted. Something happened that they could just
revoke your FFL and then let you go to court
(11:24):
and try to try to find it and over three
hundred percent increase the number of revocations. Well they are
now there's a budget proposal that is going to be
cutting two thirds of the operations investigators from the ATF.
So it's going to they're cutting five hundred and forty
one investigators out of the eight hundred that currently exist.
(11:47):
And so said, why are they're doing that, Well, it's
going to save right now an overall cost of the
year four hundred and sixty eight million dollars by doing that.
But they're still considering taking the ATF and merging it
with a dea to kind of buying some of the investigators.
Speaker 3 (12:01):
A lot of the FFLs are not for that because.
Speaker 6 (12:05):
We reuse in the old days, we use the ATF
as a helper, as a finder, we give them information,
we get information. They were not the we they were
not the enemy, but Biden made them the enemy. So anyway,
they're going to cut two thirds of the of the
operations investigators and it's going to save a bunch of money.
So that's another thing that's happening down the line with
(12:27):
the ATF. Okay, big stories. We talked about the one.
We kind of glazed over it. But again the first
time the Department of Justice has formally opposed a ban.
So in this particular case, we have now several states going,
you know what, let's just be in. You can't manufacture
sout And they're going, well, well, if you can't make yourself,
why not just ban the ownership. That's what Illinois did,
(12:49):
and that's what the support of the DOJ said. Illinois said, Nope,
turn them in. You can't own them the state of Illinois.
You can't own It's just not ars. When you go
down the list, if it has a pistol, if it
takes a if it takes a magazine and has a
pistol grip, what doesn't do that, Well, it's an assault weapon.
You can't have those of the band at lug. You
(13:11):
know how dangerous those are on the gun. Oh, now
it's an assault weapons because it's got a banet LUG.
And so they just said, enough is enough. This is
just simply unconstitutional. In the letter that the DOJ submitted
to the Seventh Circuit, court concluded that militaristic firearms are
not protected by the Second Amendment. Is what the Illinois
(13:34):
court said, and so therefore it was constitutional to ban
them because they weren't protected. But the DOJ said no, no, no, no, no,
no no. They said that is not the case. They
are nothing in the Second Amendment says that the firearms
have to appear non militaristic. But yet that's what their
(13:55):
judges said, Well it looks like it's military, then we
guess you can't own this. So anyway, that was that's
that's pretty important. Uh so uh thirty five Illinois county
state attorneys that they have also smith advocacy UH supporting
uh this lawsuit calling the band unconstitutional because it bans
an entire class of firearms. Not is widely popular, but
(14:19):
it's the most popular rifle in America, and yet they
want to say you you.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Can't own them.
Speaker 4 (14:26):
I wonder how that might affect things like cities with
thirty round magazine bands.
Speaker 6 (14:31):
Well, this is this is where we're going with that
is this is just out another another state, Connecticut wants
the Second Circuit Court in the case just to ignore
what what Scotis says. We don't want you to pay
attention to them. Uh and briefly, so cannac cannecut Connecticut
sorry past the law that bans all MSRs and all
(14:54):
large capacity magazines. So the National Association of Gun Rights
challenged the constitutionality of and it is deployed for an injunction.
So the Second Court of Appeals is going to hear
the case. But in between times when the Supreme Court
just hearted this case we were talking about and issued
an unanimous decision supporting Smith and Wesson and gun manufacturers
(15:15):
against Mexico. That's where Mexico wanted ten billion dollars because
our firearms were what the cartels like. But not only
it was it unanimous, but the justice one of the justices,
Alena Kagan, wrote an opinion in the Smith and Wesson case.
In her opinion, she referred to what the so called
you assault weapons. She said the quote was in her
(15:36):
opinionship because they're widely legal and purchased by ordinary customers,
ordinary citizens. The AR fifteen is the most.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Popular rifle of the country, she wrote.
Speaker 6 (15:45):
In this decision on Smith and Wesson. So the appealers went, Hey,
here's the Supreme Court just wrote on this second Circuit.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Take a look at this.
Speaker 6 (15:53):
And here's what they implied, saying, Hey, court versus Heller
the government, the court held that the Supreme Court held
that the government may not be in firearms and in
common use by lawful biting citizens, and the Smith and
wasn't case. They happened to mention there that the Air fifteens,
(16:15):
Air fifteens and AK forty sevens are in common use
by ordinary citizens, and that the Court previously had held
that the mere of fact the criminal iss use of
the firearms has no bearing on the analysis. And the
Smith and Wesson brands doesn't address the issue of whether
aak's and AR fifteens are protected by the Second Amendment.
(16:36):
But because they're in common use by ordinary citizens, they
are protected.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
Well.
Speaker 6 (16:42):
When they submitted this letter, Connecticut Attorney General William Tong
saw that one I've better send a letter to saying
don't bother. Just ignore that language. It really really isn't important.
So he's requesting that in the case coming up, that
the Second Circuit does not even look at that. He's
(17:03):
saying the fact that they mentioned that the Supreme Court
said that they are protected arms. That's utterly incorrect. So
don't even bother.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
He knows better than Yeah.
Speaker 6 (17:13):
Yeah, so we'll see where that one.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
Good.
Speaker 4 (17:15):
All right, we get some more positive news, hopefully on
the water.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (17:19):
Yeah, well this is the other big one.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
We got to take a break here.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
You'll get another couple of stories in here before we
get to the bottom of the hour, at which point
we'll do the news and then Brian Gans, the CEO
of Burno, will be joining us. This is on Target
from l e PD Firearms and Range, nine ninety nine
Bethel Road on six to ten WTV in heats all
the way. That's all, that's all you really need.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
And I'm just gonna say it's going to be sunny
and hot today tomorrow and enjoy it.
Speaker 4 (17:46):
On target from l e PD Firearms and Range and
welcome back. Chuck Douglass in for Eric this week with
Ed to the right, JC to the left, and a
couple more fairly important news stories we want to get
to here before the bottom of the hour.
Speaker 6 (17:58):
Yeah, this is one that we've had a lot of
requests about, like what's happening with this.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
There was the.
Speaker 6 (18:04):
Short Act which was put up, So the Short Act,
that was actually what it was called, but it stood
four short barreled rifles and it would stop harassing the
owners of rifles, and that was what the Act was called.
And so what has happened. The Usentate Finance Committee has
released its first draft of their reconciliation bill called It's
(18:27):
part of the big beautiful bill out there, and it
would remove suppressors short build rifles and short build shotguns
from the nineteen thirty four National Firearms Act. So that's
a really really big deal. It would do away with
the two hundred dollars tax stamp registration requirements through the
Acohol Tobacco on Firearms Division, and it would also would
(18:49):
remove the NFA category for any other weapon and shotguns
would be removed from the definition of destructive devices, which
it is in there right now. So this is exciting
that at that is good news. So they're putting it
in their member. This is the first draft the cautionary
news is this is the Senate Finance Committee bill. That's
(19:11):
where they put this in, and unfortunately there may be
some significant hurdles because the anti gun politicians in the
Senate can still object to the language because some of
the stuff they believe does not really affect money. And
then the whole thing that there's what the look at
is just looking at things that can save money or
(19:32):
cost money, and that's what they're looking at. So they
were fearing that they may just require the State Parliamentary.
The Senate Parliamentarian there's a single person who reviews these
and decides whether or not they're going to be included
in Finance Committee or whether or not that kick them out.
And it's a one person vote, and she is pretty
much a stickler right on the line of what should
(19:54):
and should not be. So we will find out. But
the fact that they included the short aspect of it
is really, really, really well.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
Is ten millions of people.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Difference between a short barrel rifle and something like an
ar pistol.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Is it strictly barrel length as it is.
Speaker 6 (20:08):
Real length, it's bare length and overall length. So it's
bare length and overall length, so you know, so you
can have you know, sixteen inch barrel in it, but
if it's like really really short, you know it has
it could have a different definition. Under the ATF they
scrutinize everything, and so basically a pistol has to be
under sixteen inches, so you know, fifteen point nine inches
(20:31):
would still be a considered a pistol, and if it's
reaches sixteen or above, it's considered a rifle.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
Carbing however you get you I want to take a
look at it. But we all know.
Speaker 6 (20:41):
About these pistols that they have out there with the
pistol braces, and the ATF it said, oh.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Really that's a short barreled rifle.
Speaker 6 (20:48):
Because if you're not attaching the brace to your arm
and you happen to be holding it up like this,
you've now converted a pistol with a with an extended
stock on there to a rifle. So that's been the big.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
What was the regular for the ATF to ban short
barreled rifles or make you get a tax staff to
begin with? I mean, what's what's what's so wrong with
a short bailed rifle?
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Concealability? You know, you can may be convenienced in use
of crime. I mean back in the Bonnie and Clyde days.
Speaker 6 (21:16):
Honestly, they buy bars to the magazine and they would
cut off the stock and make them into pistols. And
that really bothered the FBI that was chasing them since
they were getting their radiators engine shot a shot out
by people shooting these short barreled rifles, and that's what precipitated.
Remember that was roaring twenties and thirties, and then thirty
four that came up with this act saying Nope, that
(21:39):
should be illegal. If you get one, you have to
apply for it, get fingerprints, name everything else, pay a
two hundred dollars tax stamp, and be registered with it.
So you could still have those. But now with the
pistol braces, that was a big big deal because you
could have a fifteen inch barrel in one and hold
it with your hand. But if what was supporting it
was mounted to your shoulder, then they're saying it, really
(22:00):
it's a short belt rifle.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
So they're trying to clean up stuff.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
What you just just described as to why they banned it,
and what you're talking about a pistol and if you
put an arm brace on it. It's okay, and it's
not considered a short barrel rifle, but that's concealable more
so than a shorten barel rifle, isn't it, even if
you don't put an arm brace on it?
Speaker 5 (22:21):
No?
Speaker 4 (22:21):
I mean yeah, so, I mean coming out of the
Old West, when everybody had a six shooter on their hip,
they what needed to differentiate, and you said tax stamp.
At that phase of the game, the twenties, the government
started becoming money hungry and it was a way to
create a new tax on people.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
So it was money more than anything.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
I think that's pretty much as you And.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
Also the registration. You could arrest.
Speaker 6 (22:44):
Somebody out a new charge against them. Back then, I
was looking for everything to stop the bit leggers on.
Speaker 4 (22:48):
All there was some good stuff to talk about. I'm
glad to hear about all that. Brian Gan's coming up
here after the bottom of the Art news. He is
the CEO at Berna. If you have not heard of Berna,
you apparently are enjoying like under a rock. But they're
making a wonderful device. A lot of people are buying
and carrying and utilizing them. It allows you to defend
yourself without the prospect of taking a life, and I
(23:12):
think that's appealing to a lot of people. We'll talk
to him next. Out of the art break right now.
This is on target from l E PD on six
to ten WTVN. We are at LHED Firearms and Range.
Erica is probably attempting to look like he's not goofing.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Who's that guy that just said your host?
Speaker 1 (23:29):
He yeah, you know those say he's spot labor.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
So anyway we spot something.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
This is all target from LBED Firearms and Range again,
nine ninety nine Bethel Road. We want to invite you
to come out and be part of the studio audience.
By the way, on Saturdays, we've got a pretty loyal
group of folks that show up, one of them and
even brings doughnuts, and a couple of them smell pretty good,
so it's it's always it's nice to have them out here,
but you are invited to come and enjoy it as
(23:56):
well and be a part of what we do here.
The idea that it is it's mandatory for anybody with
a couple of brain cells in twenty twenty five to
be prepared to defend themselves. I don't care what neighborhood
you're in, whether you're pumping gas, taking the dog for
a walker, sitting on your front porch, there's danger everywhere.
People that didn't used to be dangerous are more dangerous
(24:18):
because the repercussions from being dangerous no longer exist in
our court system. They do what they want to do,
but at the same time, a lot of people are
very uh, are are very cautious about how they would
do that, and the concept of pointing a gun, firing
and taking a life is not something many of them
can handle.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
But something came out I'm going.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
To say probably three years ago, two and a half,
three years ago the first time I heard about this company,
Berna that had what they called a launcher, and I thought, okay,
watch a burn a launcher, and I have been pretty
impressed with what the product is. Their CEO Brian Ganes,
joining us right now. Brian, First of all, where did
the idea of the a launcher come from? Was this
(25:01):
just something that popped out of somebody's head or is
this kind of a development from other things in the
past that came together into this product.
Speaker 5 (25:09):
Well, first of thank you so much for having me
on the show. It was very nice to be with
you guys. I was on this show, as you mentioned,
a couple of years back, when we were just getting started.
At the time, you know, I got the question of
how many launchers had we sold and how often had
this been used? I think, you know, the number of
(25:30):
launchers sold were less than one hundred thousand, and the
uses were measured in one hundreds. Today we have sold
more than six hundred thousand burners and there have been
more than five thousand real world uses of the burner.
And the question that you asked, where did this come from?
You know, like all of your audience, I've been a
(25:52):
gun owner my entire life. But if I were really
honest with myself, I don't know how quick i'd be
to pull the trigger. And I and I wondered, you know,
if I hesitated, would that be a fatal you know,
hesitation for me? If I didn't hesitate, would I be
making an irrevocable mistake? And about a decade ago I
(26:13):
got the answer. I was in a road rage incidents.
You know, I like fast cars, and I was, you know,
admittedly probably driving like a jerk, and somebody really took
offense and they got right on my bumper, and I
sped up, and they sped up, and I slowed down,
and they slowed down, and I got scared. I pulled
(26:33):
over to the side of the road, thinking they go
around me, but they didn't. They pulled it right behind me,
and I yeah. The guy gets out of his car
and I have my block nineteen, my nine millimeter in
the glove box, and I'm thinking do I get out
of the car with my gun or not? And I
can see him in the side view mirror. He's coming
(26:54):
up the car. He doesn't have anything in his hands.
So I decided, nothing good can happen if I get
out of the car with my gun. So I get
out without my gun, and nothing good happened. I mean,
this guy bum rushed me. He threw me to the ground.
You know. Fortunately, what he really injured was just my pride.
But it drove home the point to me that if
I wasn't ready to use my firearm, and I wasn't
(27:17):
ready to fire against an unarmed person, it was of
no value to me. It was not a prop that
I was going to use to scare them away. What
I needed was something that I was willing to use
that could have stopped him, that could have put him down,
And that was the burner, and that was really the
genesis of BURNA. I wanted something in my continuum of
(27:38):
force that I could use to stop somebody, sort of
lethal force.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
I'm glad that that came from your experience because I
think it makes it a lot a lot more acceptable
for people that I've been actually talking to my queen
about one, because she is one of these people that
may not be able to do it, and of course
I want her to be able to protect herself at
all times. So thinking that this is you know, for
(28:04):
the week, or for women or whatever, I'm glad it
was such a personal experience that led to this development,
because you are a normal American man who saw a
need for something as opposed to trying to compensate for anything.
And people need to know that kind of thing.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
Yeah, and look, I still carry, you know, it's not
like I got rid of any of my firearms. And
in every one of my vehicles, I've got a burner
in the side pocket, and I've got you know, probably
a nine millimeters or thirty eight in the glove box.
And if I'm facing lethal force, I will use lethal force.
But if I'm not facing lethal force, I will use
less than.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Lethal force now Berners.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
As I said, I think it's been about three years
ago since I first heard the name of the company.
You were pretty much exclusive. Not so much now. But
you know, from what I have seen, read and the
experiences I've heard, I mean, burn is still the superior product.
Point out some of the differences, if you would, between
the standard features of a Burda launcher versus some of
the other stuff that's out there now.
Speaker 5 (29:04):
Well, this category really developed from paintball guns. And what
happened is people took existing paintball guns which fired a
sixty eight caliber rounds, and they developed either a hard
plastic round of kinetic rounds which used pain compliance to
stop somebody, or a frangible round that was filled with powder,
(29:29):
either tear gas or pepper spray. And that was really
the genesis of this product category. What we decided to
do was build a launcher from scratch that was a
self defense launcher rather than repurposing a paintball gun. And
the reason for that was several reasons. One, these paintball
(29:52):
guns are big, they're unwieldy. You know, they're not designed
for concealed carry I want in something. Frankly, that was
the size of my Glock nineteen. And we developed the burner,
the original burn of the Burna HD and then later
the Burna SD that was exactly the size of my
Glock nineteen. Down the barrel. It was the same size
(30:14):
down the grip. It was a little bit wider because
we were shooting a sixty eight caliber projectile. So my
Block nineteen is about an inch wide. The Burner HD
and SD was about an inch and a half wide.
That was a big half inch. That made it, you know,
more difficult to conceal carriers, certainly to carry inside the waistband.
(30:36):
And although we sold over six hundred thousand of these launchers,
the number one complaint we got is that it was big.
So the last couple of years we've been working on
developing a smaller, more compact launcher, and we introduced a
month ago to the burn At CL for compact launcher.
(30:58):
It was designed after six P three sixty five or
the Glock forty three X, so it is a micro
compact launcher. Our Burna FD is already the smallest launcher
on the market. The Burnet CL is thirty eight percent smaller,
thirty six percent lighter, and weighed three quarters of a pounds,
(31:19):
and yet it is more powerful and has more stopping
power than any other launcher on the market today. So
that's the first issue, which is it's small, it's easily concealable.
I can put it in my gene pocket, I can
put it in my sport code, I can easily wear
it inside the waistband. The other issue is that with
(31:40):
most of these launchers, when you put the CO two in,
and they all use CO two for propulsion, you pierce
the CO two and it leaks out in about twenty
four hours, which means every time you go out you
need to put it in a new CO two. What
Burna developed and patented was this pull year mechanism where
(32:02):
when you put the CO two in the launcher, it
is not pierced. It is not pierced until you pull
the trigger, and when you pull the trigger, it fills
up the chamber and fires simultaneously, so that you can
carry this with you in your car and your glove
box for a day, a week, a year, for ten years,
(32:24):
and it will be ready to fire with the first
pull of the trigger. And those are probably the two
biggest distinctions between Berna and the other similar types of
products that are on the market.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
Brian, this lad is the CEO. This is Brian Ganz,
by the way, he's CEO at Berner. The CEL the
small compact model what I was intrigued by. You got
a little smaller projectile.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
But you got more power.
Speaker 4 (32:49):
I now, my first thing is so for the big boys,
are we going to see an increase in empower? It's
because obviously you're able to harness something with this newer technology.
Four hundred feet per second. That's that's traveling for project
that'll hurt. And I want to ask you too with
the magazine, how would you load the magazine a kinetic
(33:10):
round first to get attention, followed by a gas round
or what is there a method or a standard of
the way you'd load up first?
Speaker 5 (33:18):
Of that's a great question. Let me just address this
issue of sixty one caliber versus sixty eight. The reason
we went to sixty one caliber is, as I said before,
the Berna SD was, in my opinion, a little wide
at an inch and a half made it a little
bit more difficult to conceal carry. Not a big deal
(33:38):
if you're putting it in your nightstand or you're putting
in your glovebox, but if you're carrying on body, it
is a big deal. We couldn't get narrower without going
down to a smaller projectile, and we settled on sixty
one caliber because it was small enough to let us
go down to an inch wide, but it was big
(33:59):
enough to give us the stopping power that was necessary.
Both stopping power in terms of duel energy the force
that it hit somebody with, and stopping power in terms
of the payload how much pepper or tear gas does
it carry. We will likely convert our entire range of
(34:19):
products to sixty one caliber over the next several years,
and my guest is the industry will convert to sixty
one caliber is it is the optimal thighs round. The
other thing that it does is it stops people from
using your launcher a to shoot paintballs out of it,
because every year we get one hundred launchers back that
(34:40):
are filled with paint because you know, this is a
paintball got on steroids. It's you know, paintball is not
going to last inside a burna. And it also stops
people from using you know, cheap Chinese ammo in the launcher.
It will take a long time for other people to
catch up with us and produce sixty one caliber ammo.
(35:03):
In terms of the way you loaded, as you pointed out,
there are two different types of AMMO. One is just
a hard kinetic round pain compliance and I can assure
you this hurts like hell. This is not a toy.
You do not want to get hit with this. In fact,
when you see somebody getting hit with it, it is
(35:24):
cringe worthy. I mean you kind of recoil. We've done
a lot of human effects testing. We've not had anybody
take more than two shots before they kind of, you know,
throw up their hands. The other projectile carries pepper or
tear gas. The way I fill my magazine and the
way I encourage others to fill their magazine is that
(35:47):
the first one or two rounds out of the launcher
are the kinetic rounds. Because for the vast majority of people,
this is all that you need to stop them. You know,
it's extraordinarily painful. A lot of people actually think they've
been shot by a firearm, strangely enough, so most people
(36:09):
will stop after being hit with a kinetic round. But
if you've got, you know, truly motivated a sale and
who wants to power through the pain. The third, fourth, fifth, sixth.
Shots can be tear gas or pepper spray. Because I
don't care how tough you are. If you can't see,
if you're in respiratory distress, if you're temporarily blinded, you're
(36:31):
not going through with the attack.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Appreciate your time today.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
The company burn Up by r NA is the website
just burna dot com.
Speaker 5 (36:39):
Yeah, because by RNA dot com. And again, it's legal
in fifty states. There's no background checks, no waiting period,
no permits required. It shifts right through the mail.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
Well you it looks like a gun. You don't have
to be twenty one to own one of these. So
you know, somebody who's eighteen years old and feels the
need to protect themselves, you can carry this without having
to go through a bunch of legal hassles. And I
think that's probably good news for most America too.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
So touching on the legal aspect of it, and this
is something that kind of makes me wonder, and I'm
sure you've probably thought about this and talked to attorneys
and got the answers. What about the mirror. Pulling this
weapon and brandishing it. If it's a real gun, you're
looking at aggravated menacing with this one.
Speaker 5 (37:27):
The same thing is true with this. I mean, you know,
we tell people this is for legitimate cases of self defense.
If you brandish a knife or a hammer or a
baseball bat, you're breaking the law. So you know, we
have helped a lot of people where they've gotten, you know,
charged with a crime for pulling this out. If it's
(37:47):
a legitimate case of self defense, we've got your back,
and nobody has been charged and convicted for aggravated assault
if it was a legitimate case of self defense. But
like everything, you know, these are not toys. You shouldn't
be brandishing the weapon for effect. You should be using
it when you're threatened.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
I understand what you're saying, but I mean in a
sin scenario like what you pointed out where you were charged,
I mean, where the gentleman was following you, he got
out of his car, You got out in that two
three second time before he rushed you had you pulled
that out and scared the living daylights out of him,
and he retreated and then he told the police you
(38:34):
pulled a gun. On him. I mean, folks are still
looking at a scenario where it's going to be investigated
and they're going to be tied up for a while.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
Yeah. Look, you have the right to use lethal force,
a non lethal force against non lethal force. This guy
was bigger, faster, stronger, angrier than me. I was perfectly
within my rights to use a non lethal weapon to
stop him. Again, there have been over five thousand real
(39:02):
world cases and to date, nobody has been convicted of
a crime for using the burner in a legitimate case
of self defense. All right, well, yeah, I mean having
you you've got to be smart about it, you know,
and you know you can't be threatening some kids that
(39:22):
are walking across your lawn by pulling out a burna.
But if you feel threatened, and again it's it's whether
you have a reasonable cause to feel threatened, This is
an appropriate response.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
He is the CEO.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
His name is Brian Gan's product you might want to
check into b y r NA dot com, burna dot com. Brian,
Thanks very much, got to roll into a break here,
but we do appreciate your time and hopefully we'll talk
to you again in the future.
Speaker 5 (39:49):
You guys are the best. Thank you very much, Thank.
Speaker 4 (39:51):
You much for your afternoon. Yeah, let's get into this
final break. We'll come back and wrap up this edition
of On Target on six to ten WTVN back for
the final segment of this edition of All on Target
on six n w TV. And during the break there,
we were all just discussing the the burn of launchers
here and uh, John's holding one like he's Clinton Eastward
or something. Is it comfortable in your hand? Is it
does a field?
Speaker 6 (40:11):
No, it's it's very very very filip that a great
job in designing these and really care crazy about the collar. Yeah,
well it comes in that in black and I think
they probably have the tan too.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
And I'm guessing for that scenario you were talking about
exactly why it looks like this so that you can't
go he had a gun?
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Well, you know they make real firearms that Yeah, I know,
I know, and I just I just that's a scary
situation for me, one because of the ramifications of somebody
saying that he menaced me with the weapon, two pulling
it out, and the other subject pulling out a real
gun there.
Speaker 3 (40:46):
Yeah there shoot first many times there.
Speaker 6 (40:50):
If it's blind and can't breathe, you have a better
chance to running away.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
That's a lucky try it or.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
Pull them both out.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
But this is this is something.
Speaker 4 (40:59):
Not only you know for the Queen's access, but you know,
I've got grandsons in the house and uh they've been
out here on the range at LPD and the oldest.
While I think he is confident he did well on
the range, I don't know at his age, he's thirteen
years old, that he would be able to actually do
something with a gun in the house in that real
life situation something like this, I think he would stand
(41:22):
tall and protect and so that's that's why it's something
I would.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
God help him. The guy coming in the house isn't armed.
Speaker 4 (41:29):
And if the guy comes in the house armed one there,
they're in way more trouble unarmed than they would be.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
Trying bring both to the party.
Speaker 4 (41:37):
Yeah, if you're crazy enough to try to bust into
somebody's house armed your you're dangerous to the point where
anything works.
Speaker 6 (41:43):
The beauty is they have the patent on that you
can keep it loaded for twenty years.
Speaker 3 (41:47):
And I've been part fact in the first pall pierces out.
Speaker 6 (41:50):
I don't less philoscoity out of that first pole. But
they even say in there, don't don't just shoot once
you shoot and then you keep shooting to stop it.
So if you hit him a couple of times with
that the kinetic ones, so you can watch that they
shoot those through car windows. I mean, I mean, yeah,
you go look at the video some of the folks
out here. Yeah, they're standing back, not like right here,
they're standing back and pulling it out and they're shooting
(42:11):
through the back windows and the side windows with the
kinetic version.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
That'll bruise up.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
You'll see the window. Yeah.
Speaker 6 (42:17):
The Texas Special Police that they had that, you know,
the like they're swat teams. Three guys volunteer to be
shot with both a sixty eight caliber.
Speaker 3 (42:26):
In the by happenstance.
Speaker 6 (42:28):
Every one of them said that the sixty one caliber
stung more.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
Well, it's smaller, so the velocity is greater.
Speaker 6 (42:34):
It holds twenty seven percent less CS and cassian than
the sixty eight, so just by volume ones bigger ones there,
so it's twenty eight percent less. However, when you watch
people getting shot with them, there's nobody who you know,
they hurt, they get your attention in this in the
gas just puts you down.
Speaker 3 (42:53):
Just watch the real videos, not ones made by the company.
Speaker 4 (42:56):
Firing and that tear gas round in your house will
also get you out of the house to see every Yeah,
real quick, everybody.
Speaker 6 (43:01):
But they said knock you down for you know, you know,
about thirty minutes, fifteen thirty minutes, and you get to
watch people who just cannot you know, get up and
recover from it.
Speaker 3 (43:09):
Just speak of it.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
They're taking the gas.
Speaker 6 (43:12):
Yeah, well that's the gas they make. One of their
their MACS cartridge has both gas and pepper spray, so
it's a combination, so you get peppered and gassed at
the same time.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
From the criminal perspective, I think I would rather have
an officer hit me with one of these than the
tongs on the taser I just because it would hurt.
Speaker 6 (43:32):
Less and one call to your attorney. You can buy
probably four or five of those things. People said they're expensive,
but it can hold a red dot, it's got a
place for a light on the back.
Speaker 3 (43:42):
It's got a lot of great features, So.
Speaker 4 (43:45):
So cool, and it's wonderful when we come to the
table for an hour and actually get to talk about something.
All three people up here are to some degree excited
about what this is or could be, which is great,
so go forth, try to stay cool. Remember hydrate a hydrate,
hydrate
But I'm not Eric, Are you Ariy could be? Are
you Eric?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I am not?
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Are you aeric?
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (00:08):
None of us are Eric.
Speaker 4 (00:09):
All of us are counting our blessings for that. Welcome
to on Target nine ninety nine Bethel Road is the
address of l EPD Firearms and Range and Training Facility.
Most Saturdays at noon. This happens here and Eric is
doing something joyous with his life this weekend. So I
get a chance to come up. You know, I just
(00:30):
telling ed before we went on not a bad day,
but a stressful day. And it's sad to have a
stressful day when it's so beautiful, right Bruce Sky's sunshine.
It's not ridiculously hot yet, and in case you haven't heard,
it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
So that's I don't know.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
I was looking through Facebook memories today and I had
a October fifteenth of last year where I did a
video of the sleet.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Falling at my house. So I'm good with heat.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well that was October, so I mean you would expect
something like that in.
Speaker 4 (01:04):
October, well not October so early for that. Yeah, So anyway,
I have missed you guys. It's good to be back
up here. You're doing well. You look both look healthy.
You both look relatively happy. Well, I mean as happy
as you get. But John looks happy.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
I don't know where I get this. I'm not happy guy.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
Yeah, I didn't say you weren't happy. I just said
you don't normally have a happy grin on your face.
You're a very stern faced person.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I don't think that's true.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
You're is that true? Crowd?
Speaker 5 (01:34):
No?
Speaker 2 (01:34):
No?
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Never, Okay, yes he is.
Speaker 4 (01:36):
Oh, they're complaining about the sound again. Which one of
these controls?
Speaker 1 (01:39):
They're not screen?
Speaker 4 (01:41):
All the little marking things are gone from that's up.
That's up. We'll try to figure that out. How about
that one? Nothing, Well, we'll try to figure it out
at some point. I don't know what it is. All
the little markings that he usually has on here are gone. Anyway,
this week we'll be discussing some new products, include after
the bottom of the hour news, the CEO president of
(02:03):
Berner scheduled to join us, and I am looking forward
to that because I don't have you fired to Berner yet,
either one of you. I want to know all kinds
of stuff, including you know, practice rounds are there cheaper
kinetic practice rounds? Because I would want to get as
good with something like that as I would be with
a pistol.
Speaker 6 (02:21):
Yeah, a lot of yeah practice shuns. Yeah, they come
and you can buy them at ninety five at.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
A time, so you can by practice runs.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Oh yeah, yeah, Okay, that's good, Larry.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
And I'd love to know what the force that you know,
the contact forces is this like bean bag force?
Speaker 5 (02:35):
Is it? What? That?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Good news?
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Yeah, we got that all covered.
Speaker 4 (02:38):
It's a it's a good invention and I think very
very practical and hopefully we'll learn a little bit here
after the bottom of the hour, we'll discuss that, as
well as some training tips other things. Political topics of course,
surrounding the Second Amendment, like there are any of those.
Our commitment is always to bring you the facts about
the industry and ultimately help listeners and customers with safe,
responsible ownership of firearms. So again, uh Burner CEO joining
(03:00):
US Brian Gantz just after the twelve thirty news, big
big newsy Week apparently Oh we're twisting buttons were moving knobs?
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Did she get it? Bless your heart?
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (03:14):
Can I just say publicly right now, your husband does
not deserve you just she came up here and knew
right with the fix right off the bat. That's wonderful.
That's wonderful. Lots of newsy, newsy newsy stuff this week, John.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Not that it doesn't say up their local speaker volume.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
That's I turned that and it didn't do anything for him.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
I don't think you did. I think you did the
one below it did?
Speaker 1 (03:37):
I mention you were grumpy?
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (03:39):
Okay, So anyway, John, you've got sheets and sheets of
hot How much do you spend on highlighters every year?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
I go through a lot. Yeah, so you.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
Got enough colors on that page. You need a pride
parade just for your news.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
That's what I probably do.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Yeah, Holy Holy.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Didn't get them all, but got most of them.
Speaker 4 (03:57):
What's the biggest the biggestory you're going to talk about
this week? Which one is like, oh, I got to
let everybody know.
Speaker 6 (04:03):
Well, okay, probably for the first time, the Department of
Justice in the United States for the first time formally
opposed a ban on modern sporting rifles. So this is
formal from them, So you know, they've been keeping their
mouth shut obviously in the past. So that's a big deal.
So you know, it's a it's a start and there.
(04:25):
They have submitted a letter to basically the Seventh Circuit
Court of Appeals saying, Hey, before you decide this case,
I want to let you know Department Adjustment Justice says
that you know ms rs are common, they are here,
they're covered by the Second Amendment, and so before you
make your decision, consider that. So also supported by thirty
(04:49):
five of the of the states counties. The counties have
state attorney general like assistance, you know, for every county
in Illinois, and thirty five of them said, yeah, it's
uncom institutional to do whatever it is done.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Just affected, just one, just the fact that the d
o J chimed in on something like this, that's a
big deal. That's a shot across the bow, which is
a wonderful thing. And I'm very happy to see government,
uh uh, not just government, but all kinds of officials
that are starting to actually speak out and say things
that made that sheriff Did you guys? I didn't the
(05:23):
sheriff in Florida, did you guys? Oh my god, you
come after one of my guys, We will kill you.
Graveyard dead. I'm like, it's as dead as.
Speaker 6 (05:32):
It gets, baby, like that, we will graveyard.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
That's yes, Edward. How have you been?
Speaker 4 (05:42):
What's going on in your life? Are you promoted or
you like chief of police or anything yet? Because I
know how you are. I'm okay, well, I'm hello. What
are you whispering?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I just said you have a caller?
Speaker 1 (05:54):
No, we don't. Oh my god, a very important No,
he's not. How do you know.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
It?
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Is it really?
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Eric?
Speaker 4 (06:06):
Oh my gosh, we got you're gone? Why are you
on the phone?
Speaker 5 (06:10):
Hi? Guys?
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Hey, who's this?
Speaker 5 (06:15):
Guys?
Speaker 7 (06:16):
You sound great. It kind of makes me feel bad
because I'm not sure even needed you're not.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Just know, we've taken your name off the sitting arrangement.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Knows what all the buttons do? We're good man?
Speaker 7 (06:28):
Well, I know, hey, I won't keep you guys. But
there was one piece of news this week that I
jumped up and down for and I wanted to deliver
it personally. I know JC has it in his stack.
You guys, remember the last couple of years, we got
thrown into an ATF program that ultimately led us on
the front page of USA today. Remember that one nice.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
Because you were selling all those guns to all those
criminals exactly.
Speaker 7 (06:54):
It was that program, and we fought and kicked and
said that the whole thing was fraudulent and how they
had it set up and we got drug into it. Well,
under this new administration, I'm happy to announce this week
they have done away with that program at the ATF excellent.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Yeah, so silliness and.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
So the program's gone, but we're still got a black eye.
Speaker 7 (07:18):
Uh well, of course. But the thing is, I mean,
it's it is the direct correlation between the administrations. You
talk about, you know, the importance of elections. We are
feeling it firsthand and I know JCS some mother ATF
News this week, but we're feeling it firsthand, the benefit
of a new administration in there, and it's so it's
it's it's it's refreshing to know that that vote, that
(07:41):
vote counted.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Is there any possibility of some sort of class action
litigation that would take all the people that were in
your position and get that stuff expunge so you don't
have that any kind of record of.
Speaker 7 (07:52):
That, you know, I would like to think so, But
as always, it's time and money and it's up against
the government, and you know, we kind of did a
good job of explaining ourselves and why the you know,
we will put on it erroneously, but still it was
you know, it took up so much time in the
last couple of years. But we're just happy to see.
Speaker 5 (08:10):
It go away.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
No, that's wonderful. No, no more of it.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
But if they get rid of the stuff from get
rid of the stuff from the past, that would be
even better.
Speaker 7 (08:19):
That's right, guys. I will let you guys go have
a great show. I'll be listening to Brian Gant from
Bernha All.
Speaker 4 (08:26):
Right, stay cool out there, Yes, hydrate in case you
haven't been watching anything on television or listening to anything
on the radio.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
Hydrate Eric, good jobs of water.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
He doesn't period?
Speaker 7 (08:37):
Yes, right, all right, you guys have a good one.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
See yuh.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
And while you're at it, turn around, don't drown. That's
important too. I don't take any advice if it doesn't.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Behind you there, all right.
Speaker 4 (08:47):
So I want to thank sponsors of the show US
law Shield. If you don't have US law Shield to
protect you, you need to look at why you don't.
Jackson Egress Windows. Have you ever wanted to turn the
basement into a living space? Black Wing Shooting Centers Suppressor
Fest is going on today and car shows on July
twenty six Ridgers rivers Edge Cutlery. If you've not seen
their new building, you should. It's unbelievable. According to Eric,
(09:10):
and of course l EPD Training facility. You got to
get the sponsors. And don't give me the face.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
Okay, I won't say no.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
You can say something, so not with the face.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
I'm not gonna say what is it? Nothing?
Speaker 4 (09:21):
See now I'm worried. Is there is there anything about
my nose? I just get when you look at me
like that?
Speaker 1 (09:28):
All right?
Speaker 4 (09:29):
So, so Ed and JC both here and uh me
instead of Eric because he's uh he's making phone calls
and enjoying his life today and the beautiful weather. If
you don't catch the show live at noon on six
ten double UTV, and you can always catch the podcast
at six ten double utv in dot com or check
us out on Facebook or YouTube.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Are we still up on Facebook and YouTube?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Well we're up, but I'm not seeing anybody checking in.
But we have some viewers, but they're nobody's checking in yet.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
Well they don't. They don't want to check in.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
That's fine.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
They don't talk to they're not.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
They're not checking. They don't need to talk to me.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Stah I'm gonna argue with him off the air while
jac tells us all the important Newsy stuff going on,
what's up chasing Well.
Speaker 6 (10:07):
And Eric was so happy you called me last night
about that ending that program, which was just immense. Plus Also,
they were leaking it against the law of the Democrats
last administration. We're leaking this information to all the news media,
to a name and shame, like ooh this this dealer
has sold more than twenty five guns that were used
in the crime. The crimes can be as simple as
(10:28):
you sold a gun three years ago in their car
and the guys moved out of state, their car got stolen,
the gun was in the car, and we get danged
as selling guns to in a criminal situation.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
So yeah, there was ridiculous.
Speaker 4 (10:41):
So anyway, that was the leftist battle plan for everything.
It's they're like five year olds. I'm gonna tell that's
that's always We're gonna leak it. We're gonna remember when
we got concealed carry in Ohio. What was the first
thing we heard? We need to publish the names and
addresses of all concealed carry holders. Do you remember that?
It's like if we tell every because everybody believes us
they're on our side. Unfortunately they're finding out they're not.
Speaker 6 (11:02):
So yeah, well, another good one involving the ATF. And
part of the deal, you know, is to cut back
government spending. And what they were doing with their operations
investigators under the last administration was trying to find a
T that wasn't dotted. Something happened that they could just
revoke your FFL and then let you go to court
(11:24):
and try to try to find it and over three
hundred percent increase the number of revocations. Well they are
now there's a budget proposal that is going to be
cutting two thirds of the operations investigators from the ATF.
So it's going to they're cutting five hundred and forty
one investigators out of the eight hundred that currently exist.
(11:47):
And so said, why are they're doing that, Well, it's
going to save right now an overall cost of the
year four hundred and sixty eight million dollars by doing that.
But they're still considering taking the ATF and merging it
with a dea to kind of buying some of the investigators.
Speaker 3 (12:01):
A lot of the FFLs are not for that because.
Speaker 6 (12:05):
We reuse in the old days, we use the ATF
as a helper, as a finder, we give them information,
we get information. They were not the we they were
not the enemy, but Biden made them the enemy. So anyway,
they're going to cut two thirds of the of the
operations investigators and it's going to save a bunch of money.
So that's another thing that's happening down the line with
(12:27):
the ATF. Okay, big stories. We talked about the one.
We kind of glazed over it. But again the first
time the Department of Justice has formally opposed a ban.
So in this particular case, we have now several states going,
you know what, let's just be in. You can't manufacture
sout And they're going, well, well, if you can't make yourself,
why not just ban the ownership. That's what Illinois did,
(12:49):
and that's what the support of the DOJ said. Illinois said, Nope,
turn them in. You can't own them the state of Illinois.
You can't own It's just not ars. When you go
down the list, if it has a pistol, if it
takes a if it takes a magazine and has a
pistol grip, what doesn't do that, Well, it's an assault weapon.
You can't have those of the band at lug. You
(13:11):
know how dangerous those are on the gun. Oh, now
it's an assault weapons because it's got a banet LUG.
And so they just said, enough is enough. This is
just simply unconstitutional. In the letter that the DOJ submitted
to the Seventh Circuit, court concluded that militaristic firearms are
not protected by the Second Amendment. Is what the Illinois
(13:34):
court said, and so therefore it was constitutional to ban
them because they weren't protected. But the DOJ said no, no, no, no, no,
no no. They said that is not the case. They
are nothing in the Second Amendment says that the firearms
have to appear non militaristic. But yet that's what their
(13:55):
judges said, Well it looks like it's military, then we
guess you can't own this. So anyway, that was that's
that's pretty important. Uh so uh thirty five Illinois county
state attorneys that they have also smith advocacy UH supporting
uh this lawsuit calling the band unconstitutional because it bans
an entire class of firearms. Not is widely popular, but
(14:19):
it's the most popular rifle in America, and yet they
want to say you you.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Can't own them.
Speaker 4 (14:26):
I wonder how that might affect things like cities with
thirty round magazine bands.
Speaker 6 (14:31):
Well, this is this is where we're going with that
is this is just out another another state, Connecticut wants
the Second Circuit Court in the case just to ignore
what what Scotis says. We don't want you to pay
attention to them. Uh and briefly, so cannac cannecut Connecticut
sorry past the law that bans all MSRs and all
(14:54):
large capacity magazines. So the National Association of Gun Rights
challenged the constitutionality of and it is deployed for an injunction.
So the Second Court of Appeals is going to hear
the case. But in between times when the Supreme Court
just hearted this case we were talking about and issued
an unanimous decision supporting Smith and Wesson and gun manufacturers
(15:15):
against Mexico. That's where Mexico wanted ten billion dollars because
our firearms were what the cartels like. But not only
it was it unanimous, but the justice one of the justices,
Alena Kagan, wrote an opinion in the Smith and Wesson case.
In her opinion, she referred to what the so called
you assault weapons. She said the quote was in her
(15:36):
opinionship because they're widely legal and purchased by ordinary customers,
ordinary citizens. The AR fifteen is the most.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Popular rifle of the country, she wrote.
Speaker 6 (15:45):
In this decision on Smith and Wesson. So the appealers went, Hey,
here's the Supreme Court just wrote on this second Circuit.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Take a look at this.
Speaker 6 (15:53):
And here's what they implied, saying, Hey, court versus Heller
the government, the court held that the Supreme Court held
that the government may not be in firearms and in
common use by lawful biting citizens, and the Smith and
wasn't case. They happened to mention there that the Air fifteens,
(16:15):
Air fifteens and AK forty sevens are in common use
by ordinary citizens, and that the Court previously had held
that the mere of fact the criminal iss use of
the firearms has no bearing on the analysis. And the
Smith and Wesson brands doesn't address the issue of whether
aak's and AR fifteens are protected by the Second Amendment.
(16:36):
But because they're in common use by ordinary citizens, they
are protected.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
Well.
Speaker 6 (16:42):
When they submitted this letter, Connecticut Attorney General William Tong
saw that one I've better send a letter to saying
don't bother. Just ignore that language. It really really isn't important.
So he's requesting that in the case coming up, that
the Second Circuit does not even look at that. He's
(17:03):
saying the fact that they mentioned that the Supreme Court
said that they are protected arms. That's utterly incorrect. So
don't even bother.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
He knows better than Yeah.
Speaker 6 (17:13):
Yeah, so we'll see where that one.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
Good.
Speaker 4 (17:15):
All right, we get some more positive news, hopefully on
the water.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (17:19):
Yeah, well this is the other big one.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
We got to take a break here.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
You'll get another couple of stories in here before we
get to the bottom of the hour, at which point
we'll do the news and then Brian Gans, the CEO
of Burno, will be joining us. This is on Target
from l e PD Firearms and Range, nine ninety nine
Bethel Road on six to ten WTV in heats all
the way. That's all, that's all you really need.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
And I'm just gonna say it's going to be sunny
and hot today tomorrow and enjoy it.
Speaker 4 (17:46):
On target from l e PD Firearms and Range and
welcome back. Chuck Douglass in for Eric this week with
Ed to the right, JC to the left, and a
couple more fairly important news stories we want to get
to here before the bottom of the hour.
Speaker 6 (17:58):
Yeah, this is one that we've had a lot of
requests about, like what's happening with this.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
There was the.
Speaker 6 (18:04):
Short Act which was put up, So the Short Act,
that was actually what it was called, but it stood
four short barreled rifles and it would stop harassing the
owners of rifles, and that was what the Act was called.
And so what has happened. The Usentate Finance Committee has
released its first draft of their reconciliation bill called It's
(18:27):
part of the big beautiful bill out there, and it
would remove suppressors short build rifles and short build shotguns
from the nineteen thirty four National Firearms Act. So that's
a really really big deal. It would do away with
the two hundred dollars tax stamp registration requirements through the
Acohol Tobacco on Firearms Division, and it would also would
(18:49):
remove the NFA category for any other weapon and shotguns
would be removed from the definition of destructive devices, which
it is in there right now. So this is exciting
that at that is good news. So they're putting it
in their member. This is the first draft the cautionary
news is this is the Senate Finance Committee bill. That's
(19:11):
where they put this in, and unfortunately there may be
some significant hurdles because the anti gun politicians in the
Senate can still object to the language because some of
the stuff they believe does not really affect money. And
then the whole thing that there's what the look at
is just looking at things that can save money or
(19:32):
cost money, and that's what they're looking at. So they
were fearing that they may just require the State Parliamentary.
The Senate Parliamentarian there's a single person who reviews these
and decides whether or not they're going to be included
in Finance Committee or whether or not that kick them out.
And it's a one person vote, and she is pretty
much a stickler right on the line of what should
(19:54):
and should not be. So we will find out. But
the fact that they included the short aspect of it
is really, really, really well.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
Is ten millions of people.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Difference between a short barrel rifle and something like an
ar pistol.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Is it strictly barrel length as it is.
Speaker 6 (20:08):
Real length, it's bare length and overall length. So it's
bare length and overall length, so you know, so you
can have you know, sixteen inch barrel in it, but
if it's like really really short, you know it has
it could have a different definition. Under the ATF they
scrutinize everything, and so basically a pistol has to be
under sixteen inches, so you know, fifteen point nine inches
(20:31):
would still be a considered a pistol, and if it's
reaches sixteen or above, it's considered a rifle.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
Carbing however you get you I want to take a
look at it. But we all know.
Speaker 6 (20:41):
About these pistols that they have out there with the
pistol braces, and the ATF it said, oh.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Really that's a short barreled rifle.
Speaker 6 (20:48):
Because if you're not attaching the brace to your arm
and you happen to be holding it up like this,
you've now converted a pistol with a with an extended
stock on there to a rifle. So that's been the big.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
What was the regular for the ATF to ban short
barreled rifles or make you get a tax staff to
begin with? I mean, what's what's what's so wrong with
a short bailed rifle?
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Concealability? You know, you can may be convenienced in use
of crime. I mean back in the Bonnie and Clyde days.
Speaker 6 (21:16):
Honestly, they buy bars to the magazine and they would
cut off the stock and make them into pistols. And
that really bothered the FBI that was chasing them since
they were getting their radiators engine shot a shot out
by people shooting these short barreled rifles, and that's what precipitated.
Remember that was roaring twenties and thirties, and then thirty
four that came up with this act saying Nope, that
(21:39):
should be illegal. If you get one, you have to
apply for it, get fingerprints, name everything else, pay a
two hundred dollars tax stamp, and be registered with it.
So you could still have those. But now with the
pistol braces, that was a big big deal because you
could have a fifteen inch barrel in one and hold
it with your hand. But if what was supporting it
was mounted to your shoulder, then they're saying it, really
(22:00):
it's a short belt rifle.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
So they're trying to clean up stuff.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
What you just just described as to why they banned it,
and what you're talking about a pistol and if you
put an arm brace on it. It's okay, and it's
not considered a short barrel rifle, but that's concealable more
so than a shorten barel rifle, isn't it, even if
you don't put an arm brace on it?
Speaker 5 (22:21):
No?
Speaker 4 (22:21):
I mean yeah, so, I mean coming out of the
Old West, when everybody had a six shooter on their hip,
they what needed to differentiate, and you said tax stamp.
At that phase of the game, the twenties, the government
started becoming money hungry and it was a way to
create a new tax on people.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
So it was money more than anything.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
I think that's pretty much as you And.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
Also the registration. You could arrest.
Speaker 6 (22:44):
Somebody out a new charge against them. Back then, I
was looking for everything to stop the bit leggers on.
Speaker 4 (22:48):
All there was some good stuff to talk about. I'm
glad to hear about all that. Brian Gan's coming up
here after the bottom of the Art news. He is
the CEO at Berna. If you have not heard of Berna,
you apparently are enjoying like under a rock. But they're
making a wonderful device. A lot of people are buying
and carrying and utilizing them. It allows you to defend
yourself without the prospect of taking a life, and I
(23:12):
think that's appealing to a lot of people. We'll talk
to him next. Out of the art break right now.
This is on target from l E PD on six
to ten WTVN. We are at LHED Firearms and Range.
Erica is probably attempting to look like he's not goofing.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Who's that guy that just said your host?
Speaker 1 (23:29):
He yeah, you know those say he's spot labor.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
So anyway we spot something.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
This is all target from LBED Firearms and Range again,
nine ninety nine Bethel Road. We want to invite you
to come out and be part of the studio audience.
By the way, on Saturdays, we've got a pretty loyal
group of folks that show up, one of them and
even brings doughnuts, and a couple of them smell pretty good,
so it's it's always it's nice to have them out here,
but you are invited to come and enjoy it as
(23:56):
well and be a part of what we do here.
The idea that it is it's mandatory for anybody with
a couple of brain cells in twenty twenty five to
be prepared to defend themselves. I don't care what neighborhood
you're in, whether you're pumping gas, taking the dog for
a walker, sitting on your front porch, there's danger everywhere.
People that didn't used to be dangerous are more dangerous
(24:18):
because the repercussions from being dangerous no longer exist in
our court system. They do what they want to do,
but at the same time, a lot of people are
very uh, are are very cautious about how they would
do that, and the concept of pointing a gun, firing
and taking a life is not something many of them
can handle.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
But something came out I'm going.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
To say probably three years ago, two and a half,
three years ago the first time I heard about this company,
Berna that had what they called a launcher, and I thought, okay,
watch a burn a launcher, and I have been pretty
impressed with what the product is. Their CEO Brian Ganes,
joining us right now. Brian, First of all, where did
the idea of the a launcher come from? Was this
(25:01):
just something that popped out of somebody's head or is
this kind of a development from other things in the
past that came together into this product.
Speaker 5 (25:09):
Well, first of thank you so much for having me
on the show. It was very nice to be with
you guys. I was on this show, as you mentioned,
a couple of years back, when we were just getting started.
At the time, you know, I got the question of
how many launchers had we sold and how often had
this been used? I think, you know, the number of
(25:30):
launchers sold were less than one hundred thousand, and the
uses were measured in one hundreds. Today we have sold
more than six hundred thousand burners and there have been
more than five thousand real world uses of the burner.
And the question that you asked, where did this come from?
You know, like all of your audience, I've been a
(25:52):
gun owner my entire life. But if I were really
honest with myself, I don't know how quick i'd be
to pull the trigger. And I and I wondered, you know,
if I hesitated, would that be a fatal you know,
hesitation for me? If I didn't hesitate, would I be
making an irrevocable mistake? And about a decade ago I
(26:13):
got the answer. I was in a road rage incidents.
You know, I like fast cars, and I was, you know,
admittedly probably driving like a jerk, and somebody really took
offense and they got right on my bumper, and I
sped up, and they sped up, and I slowed down,
and they slowed down, and I got scared. I pulled
(26:33):
over to the side of the road, thinking they go
around me, but they didn't. They pulled it right behind me,
and I yeah. The guy gets out of his car
and I have my block nineteen, my nine millimeter in
the glove box, and I'm thinking do I get out
of the car with my gun or not? And I
can see him in the side view mirror. He's coming
(26:54):
up the car. He doesn't have anything in his hands.
So I decided, nothing good can happen if I get
out of the car with my gun. So I get
out without my gun, and nothing good happened. I mean,
this guy bum rushed me. He threw me to the ground.
You know. Fortunately, what he really injured was just my pride.
But it drove home the point to me that if
I wasn't ready to use my firearm, and I wasn't
(27:17):
ready to fire against an unarmed person, it was of
no value to me. It was not a prop that
I was going to use to scare them away. What
I needed was something that I was willing to use
that could have stopped him, that could have put him down,
And that was the burner, and that was really the
genesis of BURNA. I wanted something in my continuum of
(27:38):
force that I could use to stop somebody, sort of
lethal force.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
I'm glad that that came from your experience because I
think it makes it a lot a lot more acceptable
for people that I've been actually talking to my queen
about one, because she is one of these people that
may not be able to do it, and of course
I want her to be able to protect herself at
all times. So thinking that this is you know, for
(28:04):
the week, or for women or whatever, I'm glad it
was such a personal experience that led to this development,
because you are a normal American man who saw a
need for something as opposed to trying to compensate for anything.
And people need to know that kind of thing.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
Yeah, and look, I still carry, you know, it's not
like I got rid of any of my firearms. And
in every one of my vehicles, I've got a burner
in the side pocket, and I've got you know, probably
a nine millimeters or thirty eight in the glove box.
And if I'm facing lethal force, I will use lethal force.
But if I'm not facing lethal force, I will use
less than.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Lethal force now Berners.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
As I said, I think it's been about three years
ago since I first heard the name of the company.
You were pretty much exclusive. Not so much now. But
you know, from what I have seen, read and the
experiences I've heard, I mean, burn is still the superior product.
Point out some of the differences, if you would, between
the standard features of a Burda launcher versus some of
the other stuff that's out there now.
Speaker 5 (29:04):
Well, this category really developed from paintball guns. And what
happened is people took existing paintball guns which fired a
sixty eight caliber rounds, and they developed either a hard
plastic round of kinetic rounds which used pain compliance to
stop somebody, or a frangible round that was filled with powder,
(29:29):
either tear gas or pepper spray. And that was really
the genesis of this product category. What we decided to
do was build a launcher from scratch that was a
self defense launcher rather than repurposing a paintball gun. And
the reason for that was several reasons. One, these paintball
(29:52):
guns are big, they're unwieldy. You know, they're not designed
for concealed carry I want in something. Frankly, that was
the size of my Glock nineteen. And we developed the burner,
the original burn of the Burna HD and then later
the Burna SD that was exactly the size of my
Glock nineteen. Down the barrel. It was the same size
(30:14):
down the grip. It was a little bit wider because
we were shooting a sixty eight caliber projectile. So my
Block nineteen is about an inch wide. The Burner HD
and SD was about an inch and a half wide.
That was a big half inch. That made it, you know,
more difficult to conceal carriers, certainly to carry inside the waistband.
(30:36):
And although we sold over six hundred thousand of these launchers,
the number one complaint we got is that it was big.
So the last couple of years we've been working on
developing a smaller, more compact launcher, and we introduced a
month ago to the burn At CL for compact launcher.
(30:58):
It was designed after six P three sixty five or
the Glock forty three X, so it is a micro
compact launcher. Our Burna FD is already the smallest launcher
on the market. The Burnet CL is thirty eight percent smaller,
thirty six percent lighter, and weighed three quarters of a pounds,
(31:19):
and yet it is more powerful and has more stopping
power than any other launcher on the market today. So
that's the first issue, which is it's small, it's easily concealable.
I can put it in my gene pocket, I can
put it in my sport code, I can easily wear
it inside the waistband. The other issue is that with
(31:40):
most of these launchers, when you put the CO two in,
and they all use CO two for propulsion, you pierce
the CO two and it leaks out in about twenty
four hours, which means every time you go out you
need to put it in a new CO two. What
Burna developed and patented was this pull year mechanism where
(32:02):
when you put the CO two in the launcher, it
is not pierced. It is not pierced until you pull
the trigger, and when you pull the trigger, it fills
up the chamber and fires simultaneously, so that you can
carry this with you in your car and your glove
box for a day, a week, a year, for ten years,
(32:24):
and it will be ready to fire with the first
pull of the trigger. And those are probably the two
biggest distinctions between Berna and the other similar types of
products that are on the market.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
Brian, this lad is the CEO. This is Brian Ganz,
by the way, he's CEO at Berner. The CEL the
small compact model what I was intrigued by. You got
a little smaller projectile.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
But you got more power.
Speaker 4 (32:49):
I now, my first thing is so for the big boys,
are we going to see an increase in empower? It's
because obviously you're able to harness something with this newer technology.
Four hundred feet per second. That's that's traveling for project
that'll hurt. And I want to ask you too with
the magazine, how would you load the magazine a kinetic
(33:10):
round first to get attention, followed by a gas round
or what is there a method or a standard of
the way you'd load up first?
Speaker 5 (33:18):
Of that's a great question. Let me just address this
issue of sixty one caliber versus sixty eight. The reason
we went to sixty one caliber is, as I said before,
the Berna SD was, in my opinion, a little wide
at an inch and a half made it a little
bit more difficult to conceal carry. Not a big deal
(33:38):
if you're putting it in your nightstand or you're putting
in your glovebox, but if you're carrying on body, it
is a big deal. We couldn't get narrower without going
down to a smaller projectile, and we settled on sixty
one caliber because it was small enough to let us
go down to an inch wide, but it was big
(33:59):
enough to give us the stopping power that was necessary.
Both stopping power in terms of duel energy the force
that it hit somebody with, and stopping power in terms
of the payload how much pepper or tear gas does
it carry. We will likely convert our entire range of
(34:19):
products to sixty one caliber over the next several years,
and my guest is the industry will convert to sixty
one caliber is it is the optimal thighs round. The
other thing that it does is it stops people from
using your launcher a to shoot paintballs out of it,
because every year we get one hundred launchers back that
(34:40):
are filled with paint because you know, this is a
paintball got on steroids. It's you know, paintball is not
going to last inside a burna. And it also stops
people from using you know, cheap Chinese ammo in the launcher.
It will take a long time for other people to
catch up with us and produce sixty one caliber ammo.
(35:03):
In terms of the way you loaded, as you pointed out,
there are two different types of AMMO. One is just
a hard kinetic round pain compliance and I can assure
you this hurts like hell. This is not a toy.
You do not want to get hit with this. In fact,
when you see somebody getting hit with it, it is
(35:24):
cringe worthy. I mean you kind of recoil. We've done
a lot of human effects testing. We've not had anybody
take more than two shots before they kind of, you know,
throw up their hands. The other projectile carries pepper or
tear gas. The way I fill my magazine and the
way I encourage others to fill their magazine is that
(35:47):
the first one or two rounds out of the launcher
are the kinetic rounds. Because for the vast majority of people,
this is all that you need to stop them. You know,
it's extraordinarily painful. A lot of people actually think they've
been shot by a firearm, strangely enough, so most people
(36:09):
will stop after being hit with a kinetic round. But
if you've got, you know, truly motivated a sale and
who wants to power through the pain. The third, fourth, fifth, sixth.
Shots can be tear gas or pepper spray. Because I
don't care how tough you are. If you can't see,
if you're in respiratory distress, if you're temporarily blinded, you're
(36:31):
not going through with the attack.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Appreciate your time today.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
The company burn Up by r NA is the website
just burna dot com.
Speaker 5 (36:39):
Yeah, because by RNA dot com. And again, it's legal
in fifty states. There's no background checks, no waiting period,
no permits required. It shifts right through the mail.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
Well you it looks like a gun. You don't have
to be twenty one to own one of these. So
you know, somebody who's eighteen years old and feels the
need to protect themselves, you can carry this without having
to go through a bunch of legal hassles. And I
think that's probably good news for most America too.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
So touching on the legal aspect of it, and this
is something that kind of makes me wonder, and I'm
sure you've probably thought about this and talked to attorneys
and got the answers. What about the mirror. Pulling this
weapon and brandishing it. If it's a real gun, you're
looking at aggravated menacing with this one.
Speaker 5 (37:27):
The same thing is true with this. I mean, you know,
we tell people this is for legitimate cases of self defense.
If you brandish a knife or a hammer or a
baseball bat, you're breaking the law. So you know, we
have helped a lot of people where they've gotten, you know,
charged with a crime for pulling this out. If it's
(37:47):
a legitimate case of self defense, we've got your back,
and nobody has been charged and convicted for aggravated assault
if it was a legitimate case of self defense. But
like everything, you know, these are not toys. You shouldn't
be brandishing the weapon for effect. You should be using
it when you're threatened.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
I understand what you're saying, but I mean in a
sin scenario like what you pointed out where you were charged,
I mean, where the gentleman was following you, he got
out of his car, You got out in that two
three second time before he rushed you had you pulled
that out and scared the living daylights out of him,
and he retreated and then he told the police you
(38:34):
pulled a gun. On him. I mean, folks are still
looking at a scenario where it's going to be investigated
and they're going to be tied up for a while.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
Yeah. Look, you have the right to use lethal force,
a non lethal force against non lethal force. This guy
was bigger, faster, stronger, angrier than me. I was perfectly
within my rights to use a non lethal weapon to
stop him. Again, there have been over five thousand real
(39:02):
world cases and to date, nobody has been convicted of
a crime for using the burner in a legitimate case
of self defense. All right, well, yeah, I mean having
you you've got to be smart about it, you know,
and you know you can't be threatening some kids that
(39:22):
are walking across your lawn by pulling out a burna.
But if you feel threatened, and again it's it's whether
you have a reasonable cause to feel threatened, This is
an appropriate response.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
He is the CEO.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
His name is Brian Gan's product you might want to
check into b y r NA dot com, burna dot com. Brian,
Thanks very much, got to roll into a break here,
but we do appreciate your time and hopefully we'll talk
to you again in the future.
Speaker 5 (39:49):
You guys are the best. Thank you very much, Thank.
Speaker 4 (39:51):
You much for your afternoon. Yeah, let's get into this
final break. We'll come back and wrap up this edition
of On Target on six to ten WTVN back for
the final segment of this edition of All on Target
on six n w TV. And during the break there,
we were all just discussing the the burn of launchers
here and uh, John's holding one like he's Clinton Eastward
or something. Is it comfortable in your hand? Is it
does a field?
Speaker 6 (40:11):
No, it's it's very very very filip that a great
job in designing these and really care crazy about the collar. Yeah,
well it comes in that in black and I think
they probably have the tan too.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
And I'm guessing for that scenario you were talking about
exactly why it looks like this so that you can't
go he had a gun?
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Well, you know they make real firearms that Yeah, I know,
I know, and I just I just that's a scary
situation for me, one because of the ramifications of somebody
saying that he menaced me with the weapon, two pulling
it out, and the other subject pulling out a real
gun there.
Speaker 3 (40:46):
Yeah there shoot first many times there.
Speaker 6 (40:50):
If it's blind and can't breathe, you have a better
chance to running away.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
That's a lucky try it or.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
Pull them both out.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
But this is this is something.
Speaker 4 (40:59):
Not only you know for the Queen's access, but you know,
I've got grandsons in the house and uh they've been
out here on the range at LPD and the oldest.
While I think he is confident he did well on
the range, I don't know at his age, he's thirteen
years old, that he would be able to actually do
something with a gun in the house in that real
life situation something like this, I think he would stand
(41:22):
tall and protect and so that's that's why it's something
I would.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
God help him. The guy coming in the house isn't armed.
Speaker 4 (41:29):
And if the guy comes in the house armed one there,
they're in way more trouble unarmed than they would be.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
Trying bring both to the party.
Speaker 4 (41:37):
Yeah, if you're crazy enough to try to bust into
somebody's house armed your you're dangerous to the point where
anything works.
Speaker 6 (41:43):
The beauty is they have the patent on that you
can keep it loaded for twenty years.
Speaker 3 (41:47):
And I've been part fact in the first pall pierces out.
Speaker 6 (41:50):
I don't less philoscoity out of that first pole. But
they even say in there, don't don't just shoot once
you shoot and then you keep shooting to stop it.
So if you hit him a couple of times with
that the kinetic ones, so you can watch that they
shoot those through car windows. I mean, I mean, yeah,
you go look at the video some of the folks
out here. Yeah, they're standing back, not like right here,
they're standing back and pulling it out and they're shooting
(42:11):
through the back windows and the side windows with the
kinetic version.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
That'll bruise up.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
You'll see the window. Yeah.
Speaker 6 (42:17):
The Texas Special Police that they had that, you know,
the like they're swat teams. Three guys volunteer to be
shot with both a sixty eight caliber.
Speaker 3 (42:26):
In the by happenstance.
Speaker 6 (42:28):
Every one of them said that the sixty one caliber
stung more.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
Well, it's smaller, so the velocity is greater.
Speaker 6 (42:34):
It holds twenty seven percent less CS and cassian than
the sixty eight, so just by volume ones bigger ones there,
so it's twenty eight percent less. However, when you watch
people getting shot with them, there's nobody who you know,
they hurt, they get your attention in this in the
gas just puts you down.
Speaker 3 (42:53):
Just watch the real videos, not ones made by the company.
Speaker 4 (42:56):
Firing and that tear gas round in your house will
also get you out of the house to see every Yeah,
real quick, everybody.
Speaker 6 (43:01):
But they said knock you down for you know, you know,
about thirty minutes, fifteen thirty minutes, and you get to
watch people who just cannot you know, get up and
recover from it.
Speaker 3 (43:09):
Just speak of it.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
They're taking the gas.
Speaker 6 (43:12):
Yeah, well that's the gas they make. One of their
their MACS cartridge has both gas and pepper spray, so
it's a combination, so you get peppered and gassed at
the same time.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
From the criminal perspective, I think I would rather have
an officer hit me with one of these than the
tongs on the taser I just because it would hurt.
Speaker 6 (43:32):
Less and one call to your attorney. You can buy
probably four or five of those things. People said they're expensive,
but it can hold a red dot, it's got a
place for a light on the back.
Speaker 3 (43:42):
It's got a lot of great features, So.
Speaker 4 (43:45):
So cool, and it's wonderful when we come to the
table for an hour and actually get to talk about something.
All three people up here are to some degree excited
about what this is or could be, which is great,
so go forth, try to stay cool. Remember hydrate a hydrate,
hydrate
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