Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
This horrible situation. We've gone over and over and over
all of the different things surrounding it, and I think
at this point you would have to be living in
a cave to not know just about every type of
detail that is associated with this. But Charlie Kirk speaking
of course in Utah yesterday on a college campus, there
(00:20):
was there's no other way to say it. He was murdered,
he was assassinated. It was political violence. At least that's
the way it feels as of right now. But take
me through, Eric, are what were you doing yesterday and
then when you learned all of this and you started
kind of looking at this situation and the types of
things that you know, Eric's brain goes through, you know,
(00:41):
being the owner of Event Risk Security Services and having
such a successful business that is this, this whole security
thing is partly when you start watching this and looking
at it. So take me through you know what you
were thinking and feeling yesterday.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah. Actually I was in the middle of a conference
at the time when I got the initial call, and
it surprised me because you know, we've dealt with Charlie
Kirk in the past. The RNC, we ran security there,
dealt with his folks. His team is very impressive. A
lot of Tier one former military operators on that team,
his executive protection team even further back in twenty sixteen
(01:18):
to RNC and Cleveland when he was I think he
was twenty one at the time, twenty one or twenty two,
and he didn't have an EP team at that time.
So shocked obviously. And then once I actually got to
review the details and unfortunately did watch the video, it
was fairly apparent to me that this was an amateur
(01:40):
that acted. And again I assume and liken it to
that radical left actor, but there were some tell tale
signs that it was obviously inexperienced shooter and not a
professional hit. As I've heard.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Yeah, a lot of people thought they were speculating that
this was a professional hit of some sort. What was
telling you when you saw you know what you've seen
that you were going, Yeah, I don't know, I'm not
as convinced or were you convinced like everyone else kind
of straight away when you started seeing this.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yeah, I mean there's a few things. One, any professional
sniper and true hit. You know, that shot was from
two hundred yards away and that is nothing for a
sniper just to give reference to the Marine Corps for
a basic rifle and qualifies at five hundred yards with
a two two three or M sixteen a five five six.
So this is obviously you could tell by the sound
(02:34):
the impact that it was a much higher caliber, you know,
either seven sixty two or three h eight of nature,
which with something like that, a professional sniper could have
been literally one thousand yards back into the tree line
and made that shot. So that's one detail. The second
one is where the shot placement was, So that is
indicative nobody, no professional, no snipers aiming for a throat
(02:57):
shot ever, and so more than likely I willing to
guess when these details come out that it was a
headshot that you know, typically when somebody's nervous, inexperienced, you know,
and they're trying to not you know, pull the trigger,
but yet at the same time pull the trigger and
they jerk it and put a little bit too much
(03:18):
weight on the back of the stock that forces the
round to go down. And so I would even venture
to guess possibly he was left handed because of where
the shot placement went, that he was aiming actually for
the head and when he went to what we call
slap the trigger that forced it to go low and
to the left when making entry, so it was fairly obvious.
(03:38):
And again his placement where he was. Those are all
really amateur things to do. And then now that we
know the possible rifle was found in the woods, another
thing like they're not going to leave that behind. So
just there's a series of things that show that it's
probably some variant experience.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
And you under the impression and we're talking to Eric Rose,
owner Event Risk Security Services, and what is it? A
thirty odd to six is the weapon that they said
was the one that at least they found and they
believe that's.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
What was used.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Correct? Correct?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, And so then with regard to the velocity or
so on, you're saying something with that caliber is going
to have that has more power than say five five
six or two two three with an AR type.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah, significantly. And just just to give a frame of
reference from two undred yards an actual sniper, I mean,
as morbid as it sounds, they could pick which nostril
to put that round in, they're not going to hit
somebody in the throat at two hundred yards that that
is nothing two hundred yards for them is nothing. So again,
nobody's aiming for a throat shot.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
So it's roughly I was reading and seeing the report.
Roughly there was three thousand people in attendance. We saw
that as a you know, it's a the style like
an amphitheater type style. And then this this person, this
shooter was on the roof that was you know, kind
of this perch if you will, So he had kind
of a downward angle into the tent where Charlie was sitting.
(05:07):
Is that all your your understanding as well?
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah? And it really it was the only vantage point
that if you even an amateur would look at that.
So okay, higher ground elevation is the advantage. And the
way that enclosure was that it was really one opportunity
to face at the highest possible level directly into the
opening of that tent. So that's obviously where that person
went and where they took that shot from.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yeah, all right, So yeah, I know that you're pretty
connected with Like you said, you've worked with Charlie and
his team before. I did you also hear that there
were only six people as far as security goes in
that situation? Did you A hear that? And b if
you did hear that or you heard a different number
(05:53):
or whatever where you thinking, okay, well that was sufficient,
so there could have there should have been you know,
sufficient amount of people there or I mean, right now,
it seems like based on clearly the results and what happened,
that it wasn't enough that there needed to be more.
But what were what did you hear with regard to that?
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Yeah? Yeah, his staff is anywhere from six to eight
to a given time, which is actually a very robust
executive protection team and in comparison to some others that
only might have two to three. So in that detail,
you have a driver that's staged waiting, you have the
protection close end group that was with him that was visible,
and usually maybe one or two people that are out
in the immediate crowd that are more subdued blending in
(06:31):
with the crowd. In this case, you know, there were
six uniform police officers there as well. But for three
thousand people, obviously that's not enough. But what I would
have liked that too is again priorities, and so phase
one would be to have that close end protection team.
Phase two is probably what was missing, which is a
drone and then maybe what we'd call spotters that you
(06:54):
put the most highest elevated areas of an event or
location that could call out when they see somebody on
a roof, when they see suspicious activity, that they could
call it out to law enforcement. So from a security perspective,
again you got to remember his private security team has
no authority or jurisdiction to tell anybody anything, so they
can't do a perimeter check and tell people to get
(07:15):
off the roof. That's all you know, responsibilities of local
police or the university. So but but having a drone
detail obviously would have, you know, possibly prevented this. But
again cost is a factor. He had fourteen tour dates
on this same tour that he was doing, and then
I think another twelve appearances that he was doing all
(07:35):
the next thirty days. So you extrapolate that if you're
going to add a drone and you know folks that
you're going to blend in from from you know, high points,
that's another probably two hundred k of the detail. And
unfortunately corporations have to decide is there an ROI and
the security or is the team with him enough And
(07:56):
in this case, unfortunately it was not.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
To be disagreeable. But I think I do disagree as
far as the amateurish status here, I mean, this guy,
while it may not be picture perfect, likely not a
Marine Corps sniper. He was able to get on a
roof with a rifle, fire a shot to kill somebody,
get off the roof, leave the rifle in the woods,
and still at large. That's that's better than amateur. I
(08:23):
think this is somebody who, even if they are not professional,
if they are not officially trained, they put a lot
of work into preparing for this. And I think he
was a lot more organized that we're giving him credit for.
And I do think you're right. It's probably a head
shot gone astray. If it's a three zero eight bolt action,
as I think it is, that's at two hundred yards
(08:44):
not unusual for you. If you're not handling the weapon right,
you're going to drop a couple of inches. So he
was probably going for a headshot. As far as the
security went, the university police said they had six uniform officers.
They alluded to having an ununiformeds also in the crowd.
I think Charlie's people there were eight, if I'm not mistaken,
(09:05):
But honestly, with this scenario, you could add one hundred
people on the ground. I don't know how you could
have stopped that. If you didn't stop him from getting
to the roof with a rifle, I don't see you
stopping what happened. And it's it's a sad reality. Sometimes
they sneak up on you.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, obviously the motivation behind the shooter
is clear, and the intent was clear. What I would also,
you know, point out, is that on the extraction, right,
so it was again fairly obvious unfortunately watching the video
that he was likely dead there on the stage and
probably lost within two minutes all this blood supply. And
(09:42):
so if you notice the difference, we look at Butler
and what happened with President Trump, where there was a
moment where they froze and they were on top of them.
They weren't sure where to go, how to extract. You know,
this team had him out of there and in the
vehicle and gone in a moment's notice. So that again
the difference in the services and what was provided. But
(10:03):
again I would say a drone detail that was out
there would would obviously be surveying the rooftops and say, hey,
nobody's supposed to be up here. Why is this person
any person up there with or without a rifle?
Speaker 1 (10:14):
So, hey, did you also see the ammunition was engraved
with transgender and anti fascist ideology. I mean that that's
being reported now and some I read the Wall Street
Journal who even confirmed that. I don't know if you
saw anything with regard to that or whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Yeah, yeah, both with the ammunition and then also the
rifle itself. And again it goes back to I mean,
we can go there's so many instances just in the
past year of similar of nature and of a zealate
of some sort of some persuasion that is bound determined
to kill somebody and take their life. And you can
(10:54):
go from United Health shooting to the Minneapolis Catholic you know,
school shooting, the NFL office shooting, and York there was
another shooting in Virginia today. Just saw that come out.
So yeah, I mean, it's unfortunately where we're at today
in society, and people have to really prioritize, you know,
the big picture of security and layers of security, because
(11:15):
this is the reality of where we're at now. That
five percent of population that don't think like the rest
of us and don't have common values and sense is
who we have to defend against and we have to
be prepared for that in all levels.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
He's the owner of Event Risk Security Services, Eric Rose. Eric,
thanks for joining us and lending your expertise here your
thoughts on everything. This horrible, horrible, horrific thing that happened
yesterday and gosh, what a sad situation. But Eric, thank
you very much for joining us.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Appreciate you absolutely. Gentlemen, thank you for having us see.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
You brother all right, Yeah, Also, just make sure there's
one hundred thousand dollars reward to catch the killer that
has been offered as of right now, the FBI up
to hundred thousand dollars reward. So they are also saying
that it's developing quickly, rapidly, I believe was the words
that were used as far as the situation with regard
(12:12):
to the person who pulled the trigger yesterday. So we're
right on top of that. We will take if the
press conference if they you know something's coming, we will
definitely bring that to you live. So just just know
that we are staying right on top of this
This horrible situation. We've gone over and over and over
all of the different things surrounding it, and I think
at this point you would have to be living in
a cave to not know just about every type of
detail that is associated with this. But Charlie Kirk speaking
of course in Utah yesterday on a college campus, there
(00:20):
was there's no other way to say it. He was murdered,
he was assassinated. It was political violence. At least that's
the way it feels as of right now. But take
me through, Eric, are what were you doing yesterday and
then when you learned all of this and you started
kind of looking at this situation and the types of
things that you know, Eric's brain goes through, you know,
(00:41):
being the owner of Event Risk Security Services and having
such a successful business that is this, this whole security
thing is partly when you start watching this and looking
at it. So take me through you know what you
were thinking and feeling yesterday.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah. Actually I was in the middle of a conference
at the time when I got the initial call, and
it surprised me because you know, we've dealt with Charlie
Kirk in the past. The RNC, we ran security there,
dealt with his folks. His team is very impressive. A
lot of Tier one former military operators on that team,
his executive protection team even further back in twenty sixteen
(01:18):
to RNC and Cleveland when he was I think he
was twenty one at the time, twenty one or twenty two,
and he didn't have an EP team at that time.
So shocked obviously. And then once I actually got to
review the details and unfortunately did watch the video, it
was fairly apparent to me that this was an amateur
(01:40):
that acted. And again I assume and liken it to
that radical left actor, but there were some tell tale
signs that it was obviously inexperienced shooter and not a
professional hit. As I've heard.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Yeah, a lot of people thought they were speculating that
this was a professional hit of some sort. What was
telling you when you saw you know what you've seen
that you were going, Yeah, I don't know, I'm not
as convinced or were you convinced like everyone else kind
of straight away when you started seeing this.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yeah, I mean there's a few things. One, any professional
sniper and true hit. You know, that shot was from
two hundred yards away and that is nothing for a
sniper just to give reference to the Marine Corps for
a basic rifle and qualifies at five hundred yards with
a two two three or M sixteen a five five six.
So this is obviously you could tell by the sound
(02:34):
the impact that it was a much higher caliber, you know,
either seven sixty two or three h eight of nature,
which with something like that, a professional sniper could have
been literally one thousand yards back into the tree line
and made that shot. So that's one detail. The second
one is where the shot placement was, So that is
indicative nobody, no professional, no snipers aiming for a throat
(02:57):
shot ever, and so more than likely I willing to
guess when these details come out that it was a
headshot that you know, typically when somebody's nervous, inexperienced, you know,
and they're trying to not you know, pull the trigger,
but yet at the same time pull the trigger and
they jerk it and put a little bit too much
(03:18):
weight on the back of the stock that forces the
round to go down. And so I would even venture
to guess possibly he was left handed because of where
the shot placement went, that he was aiming actually for
the head and when he went to what we call
slap the trigger that forced it to go low and
to the left when making entry, so it was fairly obvious.
(03:38):
And again his placement where he was. Those are all
really amateur things to do. And then now that we
know the possible rifle was found in the woods, another
thing like they're not going to leave that behind. So
just there's a series of things that show that it's
probably some variant experience.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
And you under the impression and we're talking to Eric Rose,
owner Event Risk Security Services, and what is it? A
thirty odd to six is the weapon that they said
was the one that at least they found and they
believe that's.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
What was used.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Correct? Correct?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, And so then with regard to the velocity or
so on, you're saying something with that caliber is going
to have that has more power than say five five
six or two two three with an AR type.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah, significantly. And just just to give a frame of
reference from two undred yards an actual sniper, I mean,
as morbid as it sounds, they could pick which nostril
to put that round in, they're not going to hit
somebody in the throat at two hundred yards that that
is nothing two hundred yards for them is nothing. So again,
nobody's aiming for a throat shot.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
So it's roughly I was reading and seeing the report.
Roughly there was three thousand people in attendance. We saw
that as a you know, it's a the style like
an amphitheater type style. And then this this person, this
shooter was on the roof that was you know, kind
of this perch if you will, So he had kind
of a downward angle into the tent where Charlie was sitting.
(05:07):
Is that all your your understanding as well?
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah? And it really it was the only vantage point
that if you even an amateur would look at that.
So okay, higher ground elevation is the advantage. And the
way that enclosure was that it was really one opportunity
to face at the highest possible level directly into the
opening of that tent. So that's obviously where that person
went and where they took that shot from.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yeah, all right, So yeah, I know that you're pretty
connected with Like you said, you've worked with Charlie and
his team before. I did you also hear that there
were only six people as far as security goes in
that situation? Did you A hear that? And b if
you did hear that or you heard a different number
(05:53):
or whatever where you thinking, okay, well that was sufficient,
so there could have there should have been you know,
sufficient amount of people there or I mean, right now,
it seems like based on clearly the results and what happened,
that it wasn't enough that there needed to be more.
But what were what did you hear with regard to that?
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Yeah? Yeah, his staff is anywhere from six to eight
to a given time, which is actually a very robust
executive protection team and in comparison to some others that
only might have two to three. So in that detail,
you have a driver that's staged waiting, you have the
protection close end group that was with him that was visible,
and usually maybe one or two people that are out
in the immediate crowd that are more subdued blending in
(06:31):
with the crowd. In this case, you know, there were
six uniform police officers there as well. But for three
thousand people, obviously that's not enough. But what I would
have liked that too is again priorities, and so phase
one would be to have that close end protection team.
Phase two is probably what was missing, which is a
drone and then maybe what we'd call spotters that you
(06:54):
put the most highest elevated areas of an event or
location that could call out when they see somebody on
a roof, when they see suspicious activity, that they could
call it out to law enforcement. So from a security perspective,
again you got to remember his private security team has
no authority or jurisdiction to tell anybody anything, so they
can't do a perimeter check and tell people to get
(07:15):
off the roof. That's all you know, responsibilities of local
police or the university. So but but having a drone
detail obviously would have, you know, possibly prevented this. But
again cost is a factor. He had fourteen tour dates
on this same tour that he was doing, and then
I think another twelve appearances that he was doing all
(07:35):
the next thirty days. So you extrapolate that if you're
going to add a drone and you know folks that
you're going to blend in from from you know, high points,
that's another probably two hundred k of the detail. And
unfortunately corporations have to decide is there an ROI and
the security or is the team with him enough And
(07:56):
in this case, unfortunately it was not.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
To be disagreeable. But I think I do disagree as
far as the amateurish status here, I mean, this guy,
while it may not be picture perfect, likely not a
Marine Corps sniper. He was able to get on a
roof with a rifle, fire a shot to kill somebody,
get off the roof, leave the rifle in the woods,
and still at large. That's that's better than amateur. I
(08:23):
think this is somebody who, even if they are not professional,
if they are not officially trained, they put a lot
of work into preparing for this. And I think he
was a lot more organized that we're giving him credit for.
And I do think you're right. It's probably a head
shot gone astray. If it's a three zero eight bolt action,
as I think it is, that's at two hundred yards
(08:44):
not unusual for you. If you're not handling the weapon right,
you're going to drop a couple of inches. So he
was probably going for a headshot. As far as the
security went, the university police said they had six uniform officers.
They alluded to having an ununiformeds also in the crowd.
I think Charlie's people there were eight, if I'm not mistaken,
(09:05):
But honestly, with this scenario, you could add one hundred
people on the ground. I don't know how you could
have stopped that. If you didn't stop him from getting
to the roof with a rifle, I don't see you
stopping what happened. And it's it's a sad reality. Sometimes
they sneak up on you.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, obviously the motivation behind the shooter
is clear, and the intent was clear. What I would also,
you know, point out, is that on the extraction, right,
so it was again fairly obvious unfortunately watching the video
that he was likely dead there on the stage and
probably lost within two minutes all this blood supply. And
(09:42):
so if you notice the difference, we look at Butler
and what happened with President Trump, where there was a
moment where they froze and they were on top of them.
They weren't sure where to go, how to extract. You know,
this team had him out of there and in the
vehicle and gone in a moment's notice. So that again
the difference in the services and what was provided. But
(10:03):
again I would say a drone detail that was out
there would would obviously be surveying the rooftops and say, hey,
nobody's supposed to be up here. Why is this person
any person up there with or without a rifle?
Speaker 1 (10:14):
So, hey, did you also see the ammunition was engraved
with transgender and anti fascist ideology. I mean that that's
being reported now and some I read the Wall Street
Journal who even confirmed that. I don't know if you
saw anything with regard to that or whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Yeah, yeah, both with the ammunition and then also the
rifle itself. And again it goes back to I mean,
we can go there's so many instances just in the
past year of similar of nature and of a zealate
of some sort of some persuasion that is bound determined
to kill somebody and take their life. And you can
(10:54):
go from United Health shooting to the Minneapolis Catholic you know,
school shooting, the NFL office shooting, and York there was
another shooting in Virginia today. Just saw that come out.
So yeah, I mean, it's unfortunately where we're at today
in society, and people have to really prioritize, you know,
the big picture of security and layers of security, because
(11:15):
this is the reality of where we're at now. That
five percent of population that don't think like the rest
of us and don't have common values and sense is
who we have to defend against and we have to
be prepared for that in all levels.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
He's the owner of Event Risk Security Services, Eric Rose. Eric,
thanks for joining us and lending your expertise here your
thoughts on everything. This horrible, horrible, horrific thing that happened
yesterday and gosh, what a sad situation. But Eric, thank
you very much for joining us.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Appreciate you absolutely. Gentlemen, thank you for having us see.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
You brother all right, Yeah, Also, just make sure there's
one hundred thousand dollars reward to catch the killer that
has been offered as of right now, the FBI up
to hundred thousand dollars reward. So they are also saying
that it's developing quickly, rapidly, I believe was the words
that were used as far as the situation with regard
(12:12):
to the person who pulled the trigger yesterday. So we're
right on top of that. We will take if the
press conference if they you know something's coming, we will
definitely bring that to you live. So just just know
that we are staying right on top of this
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