Pharmacological Quality GLoP

Yep, it's time for another romp through pop culture and (trigger warning) politics as the men of GLoP riff on college campus antics (one of the panelists is in college at the moment), possible election unrest, Game of Thrones v. Monty Python and The Holy Grail, the problem with liking Hitler's generals, the greatest Faye Dunaway story you have ever heard, ABC's Dr. Odyssey, who would win a Harris against Trump IQ test, and Rob makes a very mainstream recommendation.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Rob your your your sound is a little sharp, crackly.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
My two. Hold on.

Speaker 3 (00:06):
So I'm going to turn the game down.

Speaker 2 (00:09):
How about this probably better? Right? Just better?

Speaker 1 (00:11):
That sounds good.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
Yeah, just turn the game down. That's all I had
to do.

Speaker 1 (00:13):
Okay, you turned down the game.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Just turn down the game.

Speaker 1 (00:34):
I'm very violent and the mos better. Well it's twelve
days before the election, and this is block culture and
I'm John Podhorns in New York with an interesting introduction

(00:58):
of Rob Long in Princeton, New Jersey.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
I was here last time I was here. The last
block shows.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
You know, I'm just getting I'm just getting used to it.
I'm just getting used to the idea of you in Princeton,
New Jersey.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
I believe me. I have I have some thoughts. We
should talk about Princeton.

Speaker 1 (01:14):
New Jersey. Okay, I would I would like to have
And but as ever as he has been since the
mid nineties. Jonah Goldberg in Washington, d C.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Hi, Jonah, Hey, John, who were you before the mid nineties?
Has been he's been since the mid nineties.

Speaker 1 (01:31):
Jonah Goldberg, You moved to Washington.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
The early nineties, early nineties.

Speaker 4 (01:35):
I came back in Prague, visited my girlfriend who was
going to law school here and basically never left DC.

Speaker 1 (01:42):
So there we go. You know, swamp Rob, You know
that Jonah and I, Sariatum. I think I eight or
nine years before Jonah lived in the same apartment building
in in Adams Morgan, Is that right? We did eighteen
forty three? Mint would place you right? Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:04):
Did you find any weird stuff, Jonah when you moved in,
any kind of weird And.

Speaker 1 (02:07):
I don't think we lived in the same apartment.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
But the usual stain unusual, same story.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
That was amazing to me was that I had been
living in New York, living in this dump in Times
Square in nineteen eighty three, paying I don't know, four
hundred dollars a month or something, sharing the apartment with
my friend Todd Lindberg. And then I got this job
in Washington that paid the princely sum of I don't
know what, it paid, like thirty five thousand dollars a year,

(02:35):
which was like more money than I had ever thought
I would ever make. So I could rent an apartment
for five hundred and fifty dollars and I go to
this building and it's a duplex. When you go down
the stairs and there's the living room is downstairs and
the bedroom was upstairs. And I was like, I'm.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
Rich, I'm rich.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
I have I have two levels. I living in a
place with a with a with a hot plate, yeah,
and a half and a half fridge in a tenement
on West forty sixth Street. I have. I have hit
the lottery.

Speaker 3 (03:14):
You have and you can take should we repair upstairs
for DJ just Stief's You could say that if you
had people exactly know.

Speaker 1 (03:20):
But it was sort of like one of these New
York parochial New York experiences where you go anywhere else
in the country and it's like, oh, you don't have
to spend sixty percent of your income on rent.

Speaker 4 (03:32):
Now, my wife, my wife's absolute favorite real estate porn
thing is what like what a million dollars gets you
or whatever it is in the or the New York Times,
And like, you know, in New York City, it's a
refrigerator box with insulation and.

Speaker 2 (03:48):
Theoria it's an eight room Gothic mansion.

Speaker 1 (03:52):
Well, have you ever watched My Dream Lottery Home on HGTV.
So this is a show. The concept of it is
people win the lottery and then they're going to buy
the house of their of their dreams. And so the
guy who is covered in tattoos, the host, takes them
to see three different places. And so sometimes they have

(04:15):
a lot of lottery money. Sometimes they've wont you know,
like half a million dollars. Sometimes they have one hundred,
two hundred thousand dollars something like that. And he takes
them there in you know, North Carolina, Florida, Maine, wherever.
And it's always like, okay, and here is blue Bonnet Castle.
You know, they give names to these houses. And it's like,

(04:38):
how much do you think this house goes for? And
it's like got eight bedrooms and three acres I don't know,
and this and that, and it's like, I don't know
two hundred and ninety thousand dollars. And then the guy says, well,
actually it's two hundred and seventy eight thousand dollars. And
I'm like, I couldn't get a bathroom for two hundred

(05:01):
and seventy eight thousand dollars where I live like your.

Speaker 2 (05:05):
You also you require a certain opulence from your bathroom.

Speaker 1 (05:07):
To be fair, you have my bathroom. You've seen you've
been to my house for dinner.

Speaker 2 (05:13):
Rob I scrupulously avoided the bathroom. I have to be
honest with you. I made a point not to not to.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
I don't want, I don't want.

Speaker 3 (05:21):
I have a very I have a wonderful image of you.

Speaker 1 (05:24):
I have a sense of.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
Your your incredible nobility.

Speaker 3 (05:26):
I don't want to see your lot people, people who
I really admire and I like, whose bathrooms I do
not want to see, and yours is one of them.

Speaker 1 (05:34):
Nineteen o eight, apartment building bathrooms were tended not to be. Yeah,
opulent would not be a word I would use.

Speaker 3 (05:43):
Okay, Well, I'm experiencing this firsthand, as you know. I'm
as you mentioned, I recently moved to Princeton, New Jersey,
and it's it's a disconcerting. It's a disconcertingly lovely place.
It's weird. It's a it is like, you know, it's lovely,
but it's you walk around it and it's like Stepford.

(06:03):
It really is like Stepford, but Stepford if it was
done you know, by a DEI person, Because everything like
it's Richard Scary's Dei.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
Everything. Everything is a landing eye.

Speaker 3 (06:17):
People walking with ice cream cones and their families, multicultural,
there's seeks and turbans, and there's like a bunch of
like Africans and two shiki's.

Speaker 2 (06:25):
And other people wandering around, and everyon's got their dog.
It's the most pleasant.

Speaker 3 (06:30):
It's the place where, if you if you put it
this way, you know in colleges, where they have to
take you know, they take that picture and the picture
is absurdly multicultural, and you think the catalog Princeton, you.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
Don't need to arrange that.

Speaker 3 (06:45):
It's just it's just happening naturally in the little town
in front of the upscale stores. And Prince is one
of those places where if you see a disheveled, kind
of shabby looking old person mumbling, your first question is
I wonder what they teach.

Speaker 1 (07:09):
There? You go. So, I have been on college tour
now for months with my twelfth grader. So I have
seen colleges.

Speaker 4 (07:20):
All and you mean your twelfth grade age child, not
like your blood boy or anything.

Speaker 2 (07:24):
Right, he's not going to.

Speaker 3 (07:27):
Set his blood boy you very much like he worked
at a nonprofit something like that.

Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yes, yes, he is all shiny and chrome.

Speaker 2 (07:36):
Anyway, you said you'd said you said you'd educate me.

Speaker 3 (07:39):
Shut up your orange juice.

Speaker 1 (07:46):
So and had been on college tours with my daughter
who is now in her third year Williams. And so
I've now seen I don't know, you guys, Jonah like
speaks at colleges all the time, so he's probably seen colleges.
I haven't seen that many in my life, but I've
now seen all these schools up and down the Eastern
Sea ward. I think Princeton is the most strikingly beautiful

(08:11):
of them all. It's definitely okay. I mean I I
don't know that there is anything quite comparable to it
outside of Oxford and Cambridge.

Speaker 3 (08:22):
Well, just to be just to be yeah accurate, like
I'm at the seminary, so I'm at the Princeton Sements
Prince of Theological Semony across the street.

Speaker 2 (08:30):
They were.

Speaker 3 (08:32):
They began as the same university, your same institution, as
all these places did, and then they sort of gradually
one became secular and one became theological. The the so
there they have the same some of the buildings have
the same names on put it that way, it's like
just the same people gave the same building. The Prince

(08:52):
of Theological Seminary campus is the boiled down.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
Beautiful version.

Speaker 3 (08:59):
Just there's no straining as anything that's smaller and they
have tripled down somehow on.

Speaker 2 (09:07):
The only way I can describe.

Speaker 3 (09:08):
It is pharmaceutical ad quality trees. It's a it's a
pharmaceutical ad quality bottom right now.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
It's like insane.

Speaker 3 (09:20):
And so you're walking, you're walking to class and it's
like this giant red tree and or giant orange tree.
And in the spring it's I was here in the
spring or late spring, and it's this beautiful glush jungle
and you just think this is I mean, I don't
think it's wasted on my classmates, because my classmates are
here for a big purpose and there and they're they're graduateudents.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
But I think it's definitely wasted on the undergraduates.

Speaker 3 (09:41):
They to wander around Princeton University campus and they.

Speaker 2 (09:46):
They they really should be.

Speaker 3 (09:49):
I mean, like anything else here, I'm sound like an
old man, which is not for the first time of
this podcast. They really should appreciate what they have, and
I don't think they do.

Speaker 1 (09:57):
Okay, can I can I speak to this because my
daughter who is twenty and goes to Williams which is
in the northwestern the northwestern corner of Massachusetts right where.

Speaker 2 (10:10):
Right Williams very pretty right.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
So she daily is like she calls me and says,
this is the most beautiful day I've ever seen. She
sends a photograph of a turning tree or something like that.
So I don't know that it's necessarily the case that
the kids are not experiencing the beauty. At least I
have one who certainly does. I want to tell you

(10:34):
guys about my quickly about my visit to Brown, which
I had never seen with my daughter, because Brown also
a very beautiful and interesting campus because it is it
kind of precedes the city that was built up around it,
so it's kind of integrated into the neighborhood of Providence

(10:58):
in a way that I don't quite know that other
campuses are that I'm aware of. So you're kind of
in the city and you're on campus, and it kind
of there are different quads and different crossing the streets,
and so it's it's very striking. But two things about
the visit to Brown. One, we go in for the

(11:23):
tour and they have an information session before the tour,
and the first big slide at the tour of Brown
is a land acknowledgment, and they tell you that they
worked very, very hard in the land acknowledgment acknowledging that
the land that Brown sits on is the land of

(11:43):
the Narragansett Indians or I'm sorry, I'm suppose I'm not
supposed to say Indian, and that they acknowledge the land
and they and you know, I was reading this and
I was thinking, you know, if you really want to
go with the land acknowledgement, why don't you give it back?

(12:05):
Just give it back. You know, skid More, which is
in Saratoga Springs, actually bought an entire h you know,
like thousands of acres in the mid sixties and build
a new campus somewhere on land that had purchased. So
if Brown is so concerned about the asappropriation of land
from the narragans It's it could just you could just

(12:27):
give it back. It's got a huge downland. It could
just go buy stuff, tear build a new campus and
give it back to the Narraganza Indians.

Speaker 4 (12:36):
Or buy new parts of land and give that to them.
I mean, maybe they'd like something fresh.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
Right. Yeah, I'm just saying, like, you know, the acknowledgment's
a little chintzy because that couldn't afford to give it back.

Speaker 4 (12:47):
It's sort of like, you know, it's sort of like
driving around in a car with a sign that says
this is stolen property exactly.

Speaker 1 (12:56):
So that was number one.

Speaker 2 (12:57):
Number Well, I would saying, can we just.

Speaker 3 (12:58):
Maybe they should just I mean, I don't think they
need to give it back, but I think they should
just change it from atlant acknowledgment to a you know,
a land hat.

Speaker 2 (13:06):
Tip, the land hat tip. You'd like to give a
hat tip to the.

Speaker 3 (13:11):
Land ht colon maragans it Academic communities may just a
lands a land citation.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
Yes. The second landing I'll tell you about is walking
around campus with one of these very enthusiastic campus guides
who tells you that this is really super exciting and
this site on the campus is really instagrammable if you
want to take your picture, it's really instagrammable. It's the
first time I've actually heard someone use the word instagrammable
and ironically or maybe even actually spoken but again saying

(13:44):
this is very instagrammable over here like that, but passing
by the Ruth Simmons squad, who Simmons being the someone
who was President Brown for like eighteen years, first African
American to be president of an Ivy League University apparently
produced a report on Brown's shameful reliance on money that

(14:05):
had been earned from the slave trade. Right, and you are, now,
as a Brown student, obliged to read the Ruth Simmons
report before you come to school. And then I guess,
you know, you know, beat yourself with a palm frond
or whatever for the sin of going to the school
that was built on the back again once again. They
could give it back, or they could, you know, if

(14:26):
they want to pay reparations. They got an endowment, go
go pay reparations. Like I I, that's not my business
the private institution. But walking through the Ruth Simmons Quad,
there is a sign and the sign has an arrow
pointing to the symbolic slave garden.

Speaker 2 (14:49):
What wow.

Speaker 1 (14:52):
I don't know if you know this, but you know,
can be quite hard to cultivate, but apparently symbolic slaves
are really delicious.

Speaker 2 (15:00):
Yeah, well, you want to eat local, you gotta or.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
Or or they bloom, you know, they bloom in interesting ways.
You know, maybe in the spring you have to plant
them now, let them let them sort of get through
the tough winter. The symbolic slave garden. I don't know,
what it's symbolic. I didn't get to go into it
because we were passing by, not going through. But so

(15:26):
the symbolic slave garden the acknowledgment both indicate a level
of virtue signaling that I think is typifies why Donald
Trump they win the election in twelve days and that's
all I got for you.

Speaker 2 (15:46):
I like that.

Speaker 3 (15:46):
I think that it's the symbolic. It's a symbolic garden
for a symbolic feeling.

Speaker 1 (15:55):
Yeah, the symbolic how does it modify the slave for
the gardener? Not? I know, That's what I'm saying. A
garden is either real or I suppose you could have
The Garden of Eden is presumably symbolic.

Speaker 4 (16:10):
Yeah, I'm gonna say the garden of symbolic slaves really creepy,
extra vibe Mary.

Speaker 1 (16:18):
It's sort of like Poultergeist. It's like, you build this garden,
what did you do with the what did you do
with the people?

Speaker 3 (16:28):
I would just like to talk to the person who
who had to dig it and planted, who I I
think probably has a tenuous connection to the studies at
Brown and it probably is more often than not appalled
at what he or she sees.

Speaker 2 (16:46):
Brown would be if it was an unpaid intern.

Speaker 1 (16:51):
Yeah, of course. First, if I were really really going
to go politically and correct, I could say that, you know,
in the garden, they grow a lot of corn, but
we call it maize. Right. So but in terms of
beautiful colleges, it's it's pretty beautiful. I'm Colgate, Yeah, up

(17:14):
State New York, stunningly beautiful.

Speaker 3 (17:17):
Well, I mean, I mean, if if a college campus
is not beautiful in mid to late October, don't go well.

Speaker 4 (17:25):
I mean New England, a New England college campus that's
over one hundred and fifty years old. If it's not pretty,
they should just shut it down.

Speaker 2 (17:31):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (17:33):
It kind of reminds me like whenever I would visit
my daughter in summer camp. She went to summer camp
in Maine, and it's like this very camp Walden. It's
like where the parent Trap original camp was, and it's
over one hundred years old, and every time I visit it,
I would always be like, you know, the best real
estate advice you can get is, if you're buying real estate,
do it one hundred years ago.

Speaker 2 (17:55):
Yeah, because like it is really just a fantastic piece
a land. And if you but you can't can't do
that today.

Speaker 4 (18:03):
And like, but all those college campuses, I mean, I
I used to do a lot more college speaking, so
I've been to like Boden and all those kinds of things.

Speaker 2 (18:11):
All of them.

Speaker 4 (18:12):
Are are super pretty. I can't say that all of them.
I don't want to speak with too broad a brush,
but I can't say that all of the students at
all of those kinds of schools are all equally impressive.
I think there's a lot more variation than, certainly than
some of those schools would like you to discuss.

Speaker 1 (18:29):
So it's not like Lake Wobbegone Right, where all the
children are above average.

Speaker 2 (18:33):
Like that is that I would always say.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
Lived experience, I would.

Speaker 3 (18:38):
I would also say that despite their youth, uh many,
if not most, of the students at those campuses are
not attractive enough to be there in that setting.

Speaker 4 (18:55):
They are not pharma pharmacological ad quality.

Speaker 2 (19:00):
They are notesthtically pleasing. They are not. They are not,
and it's too bad.

Speaker 1 (19:03):
They So they are not Ryan O'Neill and Ali McGrath.

Speaker 3 (19:06):
No, they need to dress better, they need to spend
a little bit more time, you know, just put themselves
together before they leave the dorm or wherever they're they're staying,
or they're you know, they're polycule.

Speaker 2 (19:15):
I don't know. I don't know. I don't know how
the young people live, but they It does.

Speaker 3 (19:18):
Seem to me that just walking down I live, I
live a little bit from a from a. I mean,
I'm walking through a universal, big university campus every day.
You know, hey, come on, look at the look at
the trees and the buildings. Don't you think you need
to step it up a little bit?

Speaker 1 (19:33):
Just I would just like to say, that's the important point. Jonah,
this is you. You bring up an important point, which
is it? I'm not I don't focus on on on
the on the women or the girls or what they're wearing,
because I'm not struck by it. What I'm struck by
is this is the sartorial style of the male upper

(20:00):
future leader of America between the ages of like eighteen
and twenty two. Now, I dressed like crap in college.
I'm not going to tell you otherwise. I bought clothing
at the Woolworths in the Hyde Park shopping center. I
would buy flannel shirts that cost seven dollars, you know,
when I needed clothing and that sort of thing I

(20:22):
mean and jeans. I'm not praising my own forty five
year old look back in the late seventies and early eighties,
but they really do all look like their seven. And
the mail this thing about the thing going around in

(20:45):
marking the anniversary of October seventh, and people are saying
in Israel that, you know, one of the things that
happened on October seventh when the Nova Music the massacre
at the Nova Music Fessel happened, is that way fewer
people died that might have died otherwise, because all the
kids who were at the Nova Music Festival were veterans,

(21:08):
had been in the IDF and knew how to defend
themselves and had training. And there's an astonishing story about
the kid who was in a shelter with Hirsch goolber
poland the one who was just executed was one of
the six executed in September. And this kid's name was Honor,
and they they were in a he and Hirschgelberg and

(21:30):
others were in this shelter and Hamas kept throwing in
opening the door and throwing in a hand grenade, and
this kid, Honor would pick up the hand grenade, open
the door, and throw it back out at them. And
this happened seven times until Hamas realized that they were
not going to succeed.

Speaker 3 (21:49):
Seven times the seven times wisn took. I mean, you
think that after the first time they would have figured
it out, but I guess they weren't just sending their best.

Speaker 1 (22:02):
But get this kid. So this kid was level heading
a kid. I don't know how old he was, twenty
twenty one, but he had been through this experience, right.
So all these nova they were there at a rave
basically right, but they were had been through the Israeli
military and they are now in the Israeli military now.
And I have this this kind of weird feeling experience.

(22:25):
It's like you walk around these campuses and I wasn't
in the military. I wasn't you know, I wasn't conscripted.
I'm not talking about that, but man, there is an
age there is some kind of age life gap that
is very disheartening, it seems to me when you're talking
about it.

Speaker 4 (22:44):
I'll tell you so like, we're not going to say
where my daughter goes to school, because there are bad
people in the world.

Speaker 2 (22:50):
But and they let me know it, but my daughter
goes to a prestigious liberal arts college and her in Helsinki,
you can say it. You know, she got hit hard
by COVID.

Speaker 4 (23:07):
You know, so, like navigating social life in college is
a thing for everybody, but like particularly her cohort that
got kind of screwed out of their last year of
high school and all that. And she's telling me about
the kids and like how to and she's asking me
for like advice about social stuff, and but like two

(23:29):
boys in her dorm had emotional support dogs and not
like I don't mean like they spotted their seizures or
anything like that, right, I mean like just straight up
they feel anxiety and they need emotionals wortrud And I'm
not trying to make too much light of that. But
like I was like, sweetie, and then she had all

(23:51):
the other stories like that, and I was like, look, honey,
I want to be helpful as I can and giving
you advice in all this.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
But when I went to.

Speaker 4 (23:59):
College, if you needed an emotional support dog to get
through the night, you would got would have gotten mercilessly
made fun of, even if everyone liked your dog. And
I went to an all women's college, and the idea
that like I like, so like is what passes for

(24:22):
acceptable levels of sensitivity? I mean, like the number of
stories my daughter had when she first went to school
about boys complaining constantly about hurt feelings for the mildest
of criticisms. Will It's just really kind of remarkable and
I and that's something that I think is very new

(24:44):
in our experience. Like I just don't and I don't
know if it's receded post COVID in a certain way,
but it's definitely a thing.

Speaker 2 (24:52):
Mm.

Speaker 3 (24:53):
Well, here's what I don't see on campus. Then, now
that I'm the glob campus correspondent, I feel like I
could say this, I don't see a lot of you
are Princeton stringer, I am, Yet I don't see I
don't see a lot of protests here. I mean, I
see there's kids walking around, a few have the CAFIA,

(25:15):
and you know, there's a lot of free Palestinas in that.
But it also feels to me a little bit like
it's embedded now in the sort of university apparatus that
there's a lot of posters for teachings and conversations and
all that stuff, and not so much dialogue. Not peom
Be screaming on the quad, which I mean is actually

(25:35):
kind of good. It kind of in a way, it's
sort of like I think everybody kind of woke up.

Speaker 2 (25:42):
I hope anyway around here.

Speaker 1 (25:44):
This is not I am very nervous that this is
the calm before the storm. But go ahead, Jones.

Speaker 4 (25:49):
But yeah, I was just gonna say, I mean, I
don't want to trigger John to start talking about anti
Israel protests on college campuses, but I do think like
Columbia is a special case. And as they talked about
a lot on the commentary podcasts at the time, part
of the problem was Columbia's on the subway line, and
you had a lot of outside horrible people coming and
it was just sort of so Columbia was on a

(26:09):
special case. There a couple of other schools that were
special cases. But I think one of the incredible screw
ups of a lot of elite schools was that they
liked the coverage to a certain extent that the whole
campus was overwhelmed with protests when in reality, like I

(26:29):
know for a fact that like at UCLA or USC
or USA I can't remember which, the area that was
like super protesting was like you know, a half acre
that was cordoned off, and everyone else kind of walked
around it for the most part. At I have a
friend whose kid is at Notre Dame, and like, Notre

(26:53):
Dame handled all that stuff very well. But the end
of that Protestant is like, oh, yeah, they're doing that
from one to four over the but like the cameras, yeah,
make it look like, you know, campus in flames, kind
of yeah. And I think it's so many of these
sort of aging boomer type administrators. They're so invested in
the idea that protest is part of the campus experience,

(27:15):
part of the educational experience, that they they wanted to
highlight it like it was a new friggin gym.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
Also, I feel like.

Speaker 3 (27:23):
They it was exciting to them to to like watch
this happen again to validate all of their legitimate misgivings
of a have any about the sixties, which was a
complete loser decade, And if you're an overworked graduate student,
it's like irresistible not to want to cancel class and
exams for this. But I still maintain my point, which

(27:43):
is I feel like people woke up after that long
the way you might wake up after a night out
with drinks, and I think we've all had that experience.
So I got to tell you about this game changing
product that I used before a night out with drinks.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
It's called z biotics pre alcohol.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
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Speaker 1 (29:55):
Okay, so I want to go to speculate. Now, twelve
days the election, a couple of things have happened on
campus that seemed to be morphing the protests into something
a little different. There have been a couple of occupations
of buildings on campus. So this did happen once at

(30:16):
Columbia in the spring, right at Hamilton Hall got occupied.
But at the University of Minnesota there was building occupied,
and I think at some other college in California building
was occupied. That this is what's really relevant of the
nineteen sixties, when college campus radicals occupied administration buildings, moved

(30:38):
into the president's office, you know that kind of thing.
That was a big trope. So twelve days from now,
let us say Trump wins the twenty twenty four election,
this would not be the anti semitism outbreak tests that

(31:00):
I am now talking about. But having been marinated in
that and trained in it for a year, and having
had this capacity to learn how to disrupt, I don't
know what's going to happen. Because the president Wesleyan has
a piece in Slate today yesterday today saying, I don't

(31:22):
like this Michael Roth, who is a terrible person and
a terrible college president, terrible public intellectual in every possible way.
I don't like this viewpoint neutrality stuff. I don't like it.
I don't like viewpoint neutrality because.

Speaker 2 (31:40):
I can't tell from the rants yet.

Speaker 3 (31:41):
No, he's saying, he's saying that I don't terrible person
because JD.

Speaker 1 (31:45):
Vance and and Donald Trump are evil and they want
to just destroy free expression in the university, and we
need activism more than ever. So the president of Wesleyan
is now essentially implicitly calling for campus protest against an
election result that he doesn't like. And that's a It's

(32:07):
not that he's that's a small school and in northern Connecticut.
So maybe that's not really going to be it's not
a harbinger of things to come. But I don't know
what's going to happen in this country if Trump wins
between now and January twentieth, and I don't think it
could be very not pretty. And so I'm just speculating

(32:31):
that the very not prettiness may start on campuses and
explode outward from there, because that's because there has been
a kind of a prologue to that in twenty twenty
three early twenty four.

Speaker 2 (32:44):
But to use your language, I think not prettiness is
baked into the cake. No matter who wins it just
where does it manifest itself?

Speaker 1 (32:52):
Right? But right? Well, so the not prettiness. If Paris wins,
we at least have a dry run of that, right,
which is claims of fraud, stupid electoral lawsuits. Trump winning

(33:15):
also given the rhetoric that is going to be dominating
the discussions over the next two weeks since Kamala Harris's
Cilly decided to go with the he's a fascist and
is going to destroy democracy as we know it. That's
her closing message. Apparently they've decided that all the other
stuff isn't working and this may be the one thing

(33:35):
that works. So maybe she'll win and then it won't really,
But if he wins and America is over, then the
use of violence against the Blues brother the use of
excessive violence against the Blues Brothers has been approved by
the establishment somehow, right, I mean, what are you going

(33:57):
to do? If Trump wins, you are you are. Basically
it's nineteen thirty three and the Reichstag fire is coming,
and what do you you know if you went back
in time and knew the Reichstag fire was coming, what
would you do. That's what a lot of people in
this country are going to be thinking. I don't I
don't know. I had no way to game it out. Yeah, No,

(34:23):
am I being hystero.

Speaker 2 (34:25):
I don't mean I don't know. I mean a little
to me, A little bit, I guess it. I mean
I might. You're my priors that I was.

Speaker 3 (34:35):
Appalled by the post twenty twenty election behavior of the president,
the then president. I felt it's disqualifying for him. I
was not a fan to begin with, so it's your
you know, you can get.

Speaker 1 (34:49):
Me on that.

Speaker 2 (34:53):
And he was terrible.

Speaker 3 (34:54):
January sixth was terrible, but it was you know, it
wasn't a game of capture the flag where they had
got If that guy with the horns had gotten in,
had gotten the Golden Gabble, well he would have been.

Speaker 2 (35:04):
The President of the United States by definite. Like it's
not what it is, right, So it's like I I bad,
and then they'll be bad, and then they're gonna be fine.

Speaker 1 (35:15):
He's sat the iron throwne right, the goblet, Mike Pence
is iron throne.

Speaker 3 (35:21):
I know, so all that's possible. But maybe I'm a Pollyanna.
I you know, I think I think it's going to
be horrible for those of us who don't like this
kind of thing to live through. I think the next
four years of a Trump presidency is going to be
repellent and grotesque in a way that the Kamala Harris
for presidency will be in some way grimly deliciously satisfying,

(35:44):
because she's so awful and so incompetent. But I I
I don't think it's going to be the end of anything.

Speaker 2 (35:52):
Maybe it'll burn itself out. Maybe you got to have it.
I don't know, But to me, it doesn't seem like
it's going to be the end of anything.

Speaker 1 (36:00):
The end of anything, as a question is other people
are going to think it's the not a bunch of
people on either side are going to think it's the
end of everything, and therefore they they will be activated
to do could be activated to do radical and extreme things.

Speaker 4 (36:16):
Mm hmmm, I mean I think that's that's baked in
no matter what, and and you know, the only thing
that gives me solace is knowing that Donald Trump is
capable of the kind of sober, responsible rhetorical restraint that
can reassure people in times of excess that we've come

(36:41):
to expect from him.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
No, I mean like the I mean I.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
Like all of us.

Speaker 2 (36:50):
We think and talk about this stuff a lot. I mean,
maybe maybe not Rob because he's still doing the big ats,
but POT and I do, and I float above these questions.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
Yeah, I flowed.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
I'm sorry. I float above your little questions. I got
to say.

Speaker 4 (37:04):
I think if I was going purely by my own
mental health and my own satisfaction and my own best
interest reputationally and professionally, it would be better for Trump
to win, because then I would get to say I
told you so for four years. And if Harris wins,
which I think would be better for the country, I'll

(37:24):
just be honest and I think better for conservatism. But
my life will be pretty friggin miserable because people will
be like, you wanted this, this is what you wanted,
You got what you wanted, and and so look, I
think she'll be a failed, mediocre. Most likely scenarios shes

(37:45):
gonna be a failed, mediocre president and that would actually
be good for the Republican Party and good for conservatism
and better than you know, the worst case scenarios but Trump.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
But like.

Speaker 4 (37:55):
I agree with Rob, I mean, when you're talking about
like must get the Golden gabble, Count reminds me of
James the Second and the Glorious Revolution. He takes the
seal of the Realm, the seal, the Seal of the
King right, the seal of the Goblet, and he throws
it in the river and he's like, ah, yeah, yeah,

(38:17):
and then they go to get in and what was it,
William or whatever it says, to make a new seal.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
I was trying to explain this.

Speaker 1 (38:26):
I was explaining this to my son that for some reason,
you know this famously or notoriously or whatever, the most
complicated period in history has been a judge to be
the period of the false Dmitries that followed the death
and the Terrible Yeah, because in I think the space

(38:48):
of seven years, so there were like one hundred and
fifty six different pretenders to the throne, all of whom
claimed that they were Ivan's son Dimitri, and there was
because it was whatever century was sixteenth, fifteenth.

Speaker 2 (39:04):
I don't know how how how could you know.

Speaker 1 (39:09):
Literally, how could you know that somebody wasn't There were
no photographs.

Speaker 2 (39:13):
I really have to know.

Speaker 3 (39:14):
Only about twelve people had to know, right, I mean
right right, And if you were like you sitting around
in your ste or you're like the steps, or you're
like eating dirt or something or boiling harble bark tee,
didn't really matter who was the legitimate air well, that's right, But.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
That's what one of the reasons. So there were I
don't know there were there were two pokes around one
hundred changes of government. Because nobody actually knew who anybody was.
There was no way you could say, I'm Henry the Eighth.
How do you know he wasn't Henry the Eighth?

Speaker 2 (39:41):
I am, I am?

Speaker 1 (39:41):
I mean unless yeah, exactly. So that's the seal thing, right,
that that was the that was that was James, That
was James the second, not really understanding that we had
progressed beyond that kind of thing into Yes, the fact
is that the seal was not the The seal was not.

Speaker 2 (40:01):
It wasn't a magic sister that.

Speaker 1 (40:04):
Yeah, it was Calimber.

Speaker 2 (40:06):
Yeah, that guy was going to get rubber stamping.

Speaker 1 (40:10):
Its hard, flying in ponds, handing out swords. Well, that is.

Speaker 3 (40:16):
For a proper moist and bince is what it was.
I have to say that that that that does bring
I cannot believe I'm asking this. Oh wait, I cannot
believe I'm.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
Asking this question.

Speaker 3 (40:27):
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I know Shopify as.

Speaker 2 (40:38):
A customer of Shopify.

Speaker 3 (40:39):
In fact, if you look at the blurred behind me
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and I needed it for my all my books because
you don't have many books now and I need to
buy my desk. I bought it and it's a Shopify.
They use Shopify, and boy are they selling these things
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(41:01):
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(41:46):
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Speaker 2 (41:58):
Here's my question. Tell us his life.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
Is, or politics, or contemporary culture, or contemporary politics, or
even the Great Republic of the United States. Is it
more like Game of Thrones? Or is it more like money?

Speaker 2 (42:16):
Python and the Holy Grail.

Speaker 3 (42:18):
Well, and John is laughing, but I'm sort of semi serious.

Speaker 2 (42:22):
You mean life right now? Or do you mean like
on this mortal coil, perous time?

Speaker 1 (42:27):
Existence?

Speaker 3 (42:28):
The nature of existence? I think I think my theory
is that it is right now, like the Holy Grail.
And if we were back then, in the time of
the two Popes or the twenty seven Victors or whatever
it is, it would smell worse, but it would still
feel a little like the Holy Grail.

Speaker 1 (42:45):
I would like to think that it was, of course
the Holy Grail. I would not want to live in
the world of Game of Thrones, and I do not think,
in fact that we live in the world of Game
of Thrones. I don't even think that in the worst

(43:09):
parts of the world that they live in the world
of Game of Thrones, because that's not how power struggles
work in the twenty first century. The kinds of things
that are portrayed in Game of Thrones are since they
were in fact reflective of the Wars of the Roses.
That's what George R. Maarten was basing Game of Thrones on.

(43:33):
Power has a different kind of valence. The way people
legitimize their authority has a different method, and we live
in a different and it's not that funny unless Tyrian
is speaking, it's really not that funny. And of course
in Monty Python you do have the Holy Hand Graandy
of Antioch, you have Timny Enchanter, you have the French

(43:56):
guys with the on the on the castle top, you know,
like every five minutes.

Speaker 2 (44:04):
You get yeah, some funny, I have another theory, but
I want to hear killing you.

Speaker 4 (44:10):
Yeah, okay, So I disagree because I look, I love
Montypython on the Holy Grail. The problem with thinking that life,
if we were around back then, we would think it's
more like that than Game of Thrones is that part
of the joke of Moneypython on the whole Holy Grail

(44:32):
is that the violence isn't taken really seriously. But in
real life, like when people are cutting off your arm,
you know they are killing your kids, the crucifying people,
the humor washes away really really quickly, and different parts
of your brain kick in.

Speaker 3 (44:50):
And you call what Twitter did a Laura Lumer exactly.

Speaker 2 (44:55):
And so I think the.

Speaker 4 (45:01):
I do think that the world operates closer to the
way Game of Thrones does, particularly in the bad parts
of the world, less so in the United States. I
think that liberal democratic capitalism was the great invention that
got us out of the zero sum Game of Thrones

(45:22):
way of looking at power and politics and economics. And
the problem is is that our brains are wired to
want to live more in a Game of Thrones world
than the world that we live in, and so you
have Jabbroni's and Jackwads and Poltroons all over the place
who are always fantasizing about how that they were a

(45:42):
Roman general in the Roman Empire and not thinking about
how they were probably they probably would have been a
slave who died young, thinking that we need to restore
that old way of organizing things. And someone should write
a about how that kind of choice is like pretty
much suicidal. But it really it spells like the Suicide.

Speaker 1 (46:05):
Of the West.

Speaker 2 (46:06):
Yeah, something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, interesting.

Speaker 3 (46:09):
I guess what I say, but I would just kind
I just I guess what I would say. Is the
only I mean, yes, one is comedy, one isn't. But
the only difference is that in the Game of Thrones world,
or even in the world of history when you're reading it,
there's not they're not those moments of spectacular clumsy incompetence
because it all kind of makes sense, right, because it

(46:30):
can't not make sense because it's you're living in the
future that this this past event brought out, So that
that is the part of the of the comedy, part
the holy grail. Part that I think is interesting is
that we do live in a time where we were
watching incompetence happen that will kind of be justified or

(46:52):
rectified or airbrushed or in some way ignored or memory hold.
In fifty sixty seventy hundred years, you forget all sorts
of mistakes that people made, and we just don't keep
track of them. I mean, but since we brought it up,
I mean you should have brought up there is that
there is a story this week that you know that

(47:13):
that corroborated I think by by John Kelly, he was
chief of staff for President Trump. He President Trump said
he want.

Speaker 2 (47:23):
He wished he had those.

Speaker 3 (47:24):
He wish he had Hitler's generals because they were loyal,
And I thought, well, that's a very strange thing. They
were yes man, and they gave they told you what
you wanted to hear, and you eventually shot yourself to
death in a bunker.

Speaker 1 (47:38):
Like that.

Speaker 2 (47:38):
Seems like a guy who doesn't quite get the history.
How that story ended as that tried to kill ye.

Speaker 1 (47:46):
Yes, yes, generals and colonels. That was one number two. Yes,
you ended up So I wish he had them too, well,
I mean to us, The Kelly story suggests a paucity

(48:06):
of understanding about history on the part of Donald Trump
that I know, I know comes as a great shock too,
because you know that Donald Trump is a student of history.
For example, there were five families and to Talia was
a pimp yea and Tony soprano.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
No, always gloried. That was always a glorified crew.

Speaker 1 (48:35):
Yeah, okay. So my interpretation of this entire John Kelly
story is that Trump decided Trump's Trump's personal perversity is
a desire constantly to keep everybody who is in his

(48:55):
ambit off kilter and off balance and in a state
of dizziness and confusion. And he intuits what it is
that is the worst thing that he could say to
somebody to see how they are going to react and
respond to him. And the fact that mostly they just

(49:17):
go along and don't say anything is part of his
power over them. And I think he said to John
Kelly something like, you suck. I need a German, I
need a Nazi general. What kind of crappy general are you?
Was like, I'm saying this to you, okay, now are
you going to quit? As every second that you stay

(49:39):
in my company? After I say this to you, I
own your.

Speaker 2 (49:44):
Ass that I have humility is true, way, which is true.

Speaker 1 (49:51):
I'm here to save America from you. That's why I'm staying.

Speaker 3 (49:55):
Yeah, I mean LBJ would drag you into the bathroom
while he said on the toilet. That is about I mean,
you gotta.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
Talk about a land acknowledgement to LBJ. You got to
give him a little bit of a hat tip for that.

Speaker 1 (50:11):
That was.

Speaker 2 (50:14):
He shows And I've never done that. I've I mean,
I I have, I mean, I I don't have.

Speaker 5 (50:24):
The math.

Speaker 2 (50:25):
Even Chuck Laurie wouldn't make you do that.

Speaker 3 (50:27):
And he's really he's a fantastically spectacular and successful showrunner.
And he would even he would say, you know, just
give me five minutes, just give me. You know what,
Why don't you guys just wait in the office.

Speaker 2 (50:39):
I'll be right back. Well, you know, I have a
friend who worked for John McLaughlin. I think, Uh, it's
it's past time where we can speak ill of John McLaughlin. Uh.

Speaker 4 (50:51):
One of his favorite things to do was they had
a bullpen at the McLaughlin Group. Were all the producers
and associate producers and you know, writers and researchers, whatever
had their desks all facing each other, and and what
McLaughlin would do was use the intercom system on his
phone and bellow into it. JM needs coco, meaning he

(51:17):
needed his hot chocolate, but he never designated the person
he wanted to bring him hot chocolate because he liked
the humiliation of everybody looking at each other, like in
the prison yard, being like are you going to do
it this time? Or are you going to do it
this time? And uh, And I think there is something

(51:38):
to that about Donald Trump too. It's like the thing
I always remember. It's the tiniest example, but was the
first interview that he and Mike Pence did after he
picked Mike Pence. And at one point Trump just turns
to Mike Pence and says, it's okay, you can answer,
like answer the question that the interviewer asking. And it

(52:02):
was such a yeah kind of like, well, okay, little Timmy,
it's your turn.

Speaker 2 (52:08):
Now you can go ahead and do it.

Speaker 3 (52:09):
There was a great story about showrunner of a couple
of hit shows and she is stuck on a rewrite
and she doesn't know what she got to write. It's
something she's not quite sure what she wants to do.
She's got to write a couple episodes.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
I think.

Speaker 3 (52:28):
I'm not quite sure where she was, but she was
a little under the gun. She decided she wanted to focus.

Speaker 2 (52:32):
So she went to.

Speaker 3 (52:35):
Some fancy hotel in Las Vegas where they had a
you could get a suite. We had its own pool
on the pool deck, and so she got one of there.
She brought her assistant in an adjoining room or something.
It got to the morning, they had breakfast and they
went out into the pool when the shade was there

(52:55):
still was a tree putting shade on the pool where
the pool was, and so she would lay about in
the pool a little in the sun, little in the shade,
while the assistant, who was a larger, plump young woman,
would have to sit there in this desert sun baking.

Speaker 2 (53:16):
While she wrote down every pitch.

Speaker 3 (53:20):
And at one point the showrunner floating lazily as I imagine,
maybe even drinking a muggerite or something in her floating chair,
she said, it's okay, if you want to put your
feet in the water, it's okay, just don't get the
keyboard wet.

Speaker 1 (53:41):
My favorite humiliation story involves an actress whom I will
not name, because she is still living, though she is
a very elderly and has become someone that no one
will work with any longer, despite having been enormously world
famous fifty years ago. At some point in the nineteen nineties,

(54:02):
this actress became the star of a sitcom, and as
Rob knows, I was a TV critic. Rob went there.
There's an an annual event called the TV Critics Press
Tour where people I Okay, I didn't say it, you

(54:23):
said it.

Speaker 2 (54:23):
Well, I got to think that a story. I got
to add to this.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Okay, anyway, she's starting a sitcom.

Speaker 2 (54:32):
I'm if you're listening, you did some wonderful work. We
were big fans. Thank you for thank you for being
a glop fan. Say anyway, go ahead, John, I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (54:40):
Sitcom And she comes to do her panel at the
press tour where people are there to interview her and
the showrunner and stuff like that. And she arrives at
this at the Universal City. Sheardon and has to use

(55:01):
the bathroom, and the publicist who has been CBS publicist
who has been there's job it is to squire her around,
bring her in, take her through the hotel, take her
to the Okay, uh, Faye down away says, I have
to go to the bathroom. So uh, they go into
the bathroom. She shows her in the bathroom and uh,

(55:25):
my friend, the publicist, is standing outside waiting for her
to come out of the bathroom. Ah or is it
going to wait outside? Then Fay says, no, come in
the bathroom, come in, come in with come in, not
not a into a not into an individual bathroom, into
a you know, hotel ballroom bathroom with lots of stalls
and stuff. And so my friend is standing outside the

(55:48):
stall and then Faye opens the door and says, I
need you to come in, And my friend says, what
do you mean. She says, well, I'm in a very
very tight dress and I need you to wipe me.

(56:08):
I can't if I reach around, I might tear the
scene under my arm. So I need you to wipe me.
And my friend who left the business that long after, like,
really wonderful.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
Your friend left the business that moment.

Speaker 5 (56:29):
I got to be in his head, in her, in her,
in her spirit, just like John Kelly left public service
the minute that Trump said I want you know, you
should be in Nazi general And she in fact had
to fulfill the band aid of her job, and yeah,
wipe another person's.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
But a star. She was a star. That's another person
who's not their toddler who you're potty training. Yes, yeah, yes,
and even then I can can't we outsource this?

Speaker 1 (57:01):
Yes? Yes, So when you read stories about this star
in her behavior and there was actually a very good
documentary about her being a monster that she participates in
that's on HBO Max. Anyway, I wasn't going.

Speaker 3 (57:16):
I will say she was in the show you're talking about.
Was the show I forget the name of it was
she did?

Speaker 2 (57:21):
No, she was like she was the age.

Speaker 3 (57:23):
Played the literary the grandee literary agent to Rob Bob Yurick,
who was an author and he had moved to a
small town and he was a novelists. He was like
a Stephen King or John Grisham something like that, hugely
successful novels. She was the eighth of the editor or
the agent that she was always trying to get him
to finish his book. And uh, and so it was

(57:44):
like that was the story and they did all this,
all of this like testing for it because everybody loves
Bob Yurick. Robert Yuick was a genuine TV star and
the show was just tanking, and no one could figure
out why. And then they really tested and they focus
grouped it, and they just discover that the reason that
the show wasn't working is because everybody universally hated hated

(58:06):
Fade down Away so much they didn't want to watch
the show.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
And so they were trying.

Speaker 3 (58:10):
The studio doing it was trying desperately to come up
with numbers that made her look better. So they did
is they they actually did. They did a bunch of
different episodes, but one episode they tested was basically a
fool proof episode where you her character somehow, somehow encounters
or takes possession of, or now take care of a

(58:31):
box of puppies, like twelve adorable lab puppies running around
in a big crate and Fade down Away. And they
tested the episode to see if they could bring Fade
Downaway's numbers up, because obviously, you know you're surrounded by
puppies that you're going to expire good feelings. And the

(58:52):
story is that the guy that the research, the vice
priad of research for the studio, was left the focus
group and the tabulation room and the showrunners were there.

Speaker 2 (59:01):
They said, how'd she do and he says, shook his head.

Speaker 3 (59:07):
He said, wait, they didn't like her with the puppies,
and then they said and then he said, no, they
also didn't like the puppies. It's the first time in
show business that she brought down the puppies.

Speaker 1 (59:23):
I just looked it up. The show was called it
had to be You, It had to be You, And
you know, to get fade down away to do a sitcom,
it's a huge amount of money. Like this was Oscar
winning actress, right, Like he's.

Speaker 2 (59:36):
Great, I mean it was great. By the way, she's great.

Speaker 1 (59:39):
He is a great actress. Not really somebody want on
a sitcom, but a pretty great actress.

Speaker 2 (59:43):
And it's so great that she was on Mommy, that
she was John Crawford and Mommy dearst right, I.

Speaker 1 (59:47):
Mean, according to according to the documentary, that is what
destroyed her career because she was so convincing as this
psychotic monster that nobody ever liked her.

Speaker 2 (59:58):
Again connected with that role. Your friend could write up
that story with like called.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
They canceled her series after four episodes. They they filmed nine,
did not air five and it has it has vanished
into the ether.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
And vanished into the ether, but you know what has
not vanished into the ether?

Speaker 1 (01:00:21):
What is that?

Speaker 3 (01:00:22):
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Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
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Speaker 4 (01:02:12):
Hey, I got an on brand and relevant to the
conversation topic for glad you're talking about canceled shows. The
other night, my wife and I were watching the We
just caught the tail end of Tropic Thunder, which we
do not have to talk about again. We've talked about
many times, but I had mentioned about. I mentioned to
her the Ben Stiller Show, which famously got canceled before

(01:02:38):
it got an Emmy for Best Comedy Show, and and
she'd never seen it. I had not watched all of them.
I only watched a few of them, but like again
thirty years ago, because it was like ninety one ninety
two when that show came out, and so we bought
it on iTunes or whatever, like twelve bucks of the
whole season and.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
The pilot.

Speaker 4 (01:03:02):
The second episode much more hit or mis but the
pilot is really pretty amazing. And the It's also such
a time capsule thing because you know, Stiller's about my age,
you know, somewhere around there and.

Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
A little older maybe, and.

Speaker 4 (01:03:21):
Uh, all of his cultural reference points are clearly and
entirely the product of someone who grew up watching the
TV shows that we did, right, I mean, the the
most brilliant bit in it is they keep doing this
sort of like behind the music thing with Bono and
Bono is you know right, and they keep and they

(01:03:43):
go to his agent and you guys remember who played
his agent and Rubin Kincaid, and he's telling these stories
about how he booked them bar Mitzvahs and they cut
to Bono at the bar Mitza and it's really well done.
And then like they sell out and they do Lucky Charms.
You two is the pitch band form Lucky Charms and

(01:04:06):
the ad is really really funny. But like the the thing,
I guess he had a recurring bit like this on
the on Satay Live where, but he does this whole
spoof on Cape Fear the Robert the Genera Cape Fear,
where it's Eddie Munster released from prison who's pissed that

(01:04:28):
his show is canceled, and it's really well done. I
mean Eddie Munster playing Robert de Niro and Cape Fear
was really well done.

Speaker 1 (01:04:36):
That show was so good and it has this kind
of astonishing cast, so it's him. It was a sketch
comedy show but so it was like SNL but it
was half an hour long and everything was filmed so
that so that it's more like he and Peel later
or something like that, so you could actually refine it,
you know, and edit it and stuff like that. Him,

(01:04:57):
Andy Dick, Janine Garofo, Bob Odenkirk, who ends up you know,
twenty five years later, is thirty years later in Betterhole, Saul,
and I can't remember a couple of other people. The
thing that I remember that was so brilliant was remember

(01:05:20):
the discussions of TV violence And it was so late
early nineties Nightline there were always like panel discussions at
TV violence and vulgarity on TV. After Tipper Gore made
a whole thing and there was a they did a
parody of Alf, and Alf is a sock puppet, literally

(01:05:42):
a sock puppet called Skank. So it's like, oh, Skank,
you're such a scaley wag and then just a sock
is like, you shut your stinking track. That was his catch, trains,
you got your stinking trap. And then so it turns
out Alf is being played by an actor named Thurston

(01:06:06):
Howell the Third or something like that, who is a
sock puppet but has glasses. And so when he goes
on Nightline to defend himself against the idea that he
is lowering the standards of American culture. Speaks in a
voice like this, but has has a sock puppet with glasses,

(01:06:27):
and he's like fighting the head of Action for children's television,
and the person on action says at some point, you
shut your stinking trap, and then he and then the
sock puppet with glasses like no, you shoot your stinking
cry yelling at each other.

Speaker 3 (01:06:47):
It was so skank surreal, right, Well, a mister show
the show that Bob Odenkirk did David Cross maybe I'm
just remember that was Bob Odenkirk played it in the
Ben Stiller's show.

Speaker 2 (01:07:01):
I can't remember.

Speaker 3 (01:07:02):
Uh, they did a bizarre parody of Lassie, except Lassie
the dog was played by Bob Odenkirk. I think is
Bob Odenkirk who was playing Charles Manson. And so the
idea was that Charles Manson was the family pet. And
they would say, Manson, Manson, where's Timmy.

Speaker 2 (01:07:22):
Timmy, He's well, he's gonna die.

Speaker 3 (01:07:26):
I would like do that laughter thing that he's in
the well, and then oh Manson. It was just it
was bananas, but it was pretty funny, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
What's interesting, so and then we can sort of. I
was just gonna say, I've been watching a lot of
the new season of broadcast television.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
Wow, it's amazing thing to even here, you see.

Speaker 1 (01:07:53):
Because there have been three or four shows that looked
mildly intriguing.

Speaker 4 (01:07:56):
To me which I started watching because, yeah, discuss Kathy
Baker is Matt Locke.

Speaker 1 (01:08:01):
That is a good show. Kathy basis right, Kathy Baker
another good actress who should be on something. But there's
a show called High Potential, which stars Caitlin Olsen from
It's All in Philadelphia as a as a sort of
genius who becomes a police sort of consultant. That's a procedural.
But there is the single most bosire show. It's pretty good,

(01:08:23):
it's not great, show called Brilliant Minds, the same show.
These are all like house derivatives, genius person with strange
qualities that makes them socially inept. So this is Zachary
Quinto from Heroes essentially playing Oliver Sachs at a hospital
in the Bronx, and you know is able to diagnose

(01:08:44):
things because he's so brilliant. But there's a show called
Doctor Odyssey and it's Ryan Murphew's this one man TV studio, right,
who made Glee and then he made Get whatever that
show is about plastic surgery, and now his bread and

(01:09:05):
butter is making constantly making shows for Netflix about the
Menendez brothers, about Jeffrey Dahmer, right, that that's his big thing,
or these fictionalized murder stories. But this show is called
Doctor Odyssey, and it is a combination of the Love
Boat and Gray's Anatomy, and so it's this. Every week

(01:09:30):
is a cruise with Don Johnson as the captain and
Jeremy Jackson as the doctor. And he's got two nurses,
and that's the entire cast, is the four of them.
And then one week is the plastic surgery cruise, one
week is the wellness cruise, one week is something else.
And if you go on this, these guys on the
ship in the forty eight minutes of the episode are

(01:09:53):
performing appendectomies, they're performing cancer surgeries, they're doing they're doing
like their brilliant diagnoses of people having strange diseases. You
do not want to go. We have all been on cruises.
I've been on several, and you've been on way more
than I have. We've been on these cruise ships. There

(01:10:16):
are more. It turns out there are morgues they're performing,
they're cryogenic chambers. They're performing twelve hour surgeries below decks.
I'm not quite sure. The show is a huge. Apparently
it is getting like eleven twelve million viewers once they
add in the streaming services. So it's a huge hit.

(01:10:36):
And it is so bananas, and you've watched, like I've
watched watching it with myself, I watched like four episodes up.
It is like it is like watching something on shrooms.
They are and then in fact, in an episode, they're
in the middle of a hurricane, the Wellness crew on

(01:10:56):
the Wellness cruise and someone has gives slip these sistant
captain psilocybin.

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
Uh, well, psilocybin ahead.

Speaker 1 (01:11:07):
Psilocybin, excuse me, And so as they're trying to navigate
this hurricane, the co captain is like high on shrooms
on the deck and it's forty eight minutes and they
basically do a huge surgery on somebody and then the
show is over. And so I think, you know what
net network television is like going down the tubes. Everyone

(01:11:28):
says it's not going to exist in interesting five years.
But somehow they seem now to have decided that a
they want to have a cop show or some kind
of straw or doctor show in which everything is wrapped
up in the first.

Speaker 3 (01:11:43):
Is done but for GM and you know, uh, Chrysler
except for Chrysler got better after Competition is good.

Speaker 2 (01:11:51):
Competition is good. They just need to get their head.
And speaking of yes, please watchable shows.

Speaker 3 (01:11:59):
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Speaker 1 (01:13:28):
All right, so do we have anything to recommend to anybody.
I'm not really recommending Doctor Odyssey. I can recommend Matt Locke.
I can also kind of recommend the show El Smith,
which is on CBS, which is about a kind of
again a brilliant lawyer who is a consultant for the
police department. This is now a new thing where you're
not really a cop, but you're kind of a cop,

(01:13:50):
and you're sort of a cop.

Speaker 2 (01:13:51):
Well they had to do that because cops had some
pr cops were bad.

Speaker 1 (01:13:55):
Yeah, cops are bad, so you can be a cop, Jason. Yeah,
cop adjacent. I like else with because it seems to
be filmed all over my neighborhood and full of stage
on New York show. Very enjoyable. But anyway, so there
is weird stuff to watch. But I uh, I I don't.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:14:15):
I got something to recommend. I mean, I don't. I mean,
as you know, I don't.

Speaker 3 (01:14:18):
I don't recommend a lot of pop culture. But I've
just been reading this great book and I can't put
it down. It's Athanasius on the Incarnation, and it's just
really kind of fun, interesting take, unique take on that
whole thing. So I recommend, my recommend you the CBS

(01:14:39):
shows very very more tasteful than you actually want. But
but I you, I know that some great stuff on broadcast,
I know. But I'm just saying, if you're if you're
if you're looking for something else, something a little different
but still fun. Athanasius on The Incarnation he had a creed, right, Yeah,
they all did.

Speaker 2 (01:15:00):
Yeah, it was more like a mono. It was brand,
had a personal brand.

Speaker 1 (01:15:04):
A video game like Assassin's Creed like.

Speaker 2 (01:15:07):
The Yeah, he had a personal brand.

Speaker 1 (01:15:09):
John, Okay, there we go.

Speaker 2 (01:15:10):
It's like a rule of a creed. Yeah, fair enough.

Speaker 1 (01:15:15):
Okay, Well, so that's a that's an excellent recommendation. I
think the last time we were on, I recommended the iLiads.
So you're just trying to trump me here as it worked, Yes,
as it were. Can I point out that Kamala Harris
the other day said that, uh, Donald Trump's policies would
exasperate inflation?

Speaker 2 (01:15:35):
True? Now is that is that good like a yogism?

Speaker 1 (01:15:42):
Or is that bad? Like like the incredible malapropism?

Speaker 2 (01:15:46):
Well, we all want to exasperate inflation. It does sound
like does I won't say what it sounds like, but you.

Speaker 1 (01:15:53):
Know, Jonah, you said that you think it would be
better for America. I Trump, if Harris wins and all that,
and I'm not gonna I don't even.

Speaker 2 (01:16:03):
We're not going to do this now. I wrap it
up here, but I do want to.

Speaker 1 (01:16:10):
Say that of all the candidates who have ever run
for office, now that Harris has come out of hiding
and is giving interviews relatively constantly in the last couple
of weeks, of all the candidates that have that have
run for higher office, she is one of them, and

(01:16:33):
I believe may go down in history if she wins
as our dumbest president. I was going through the presidents
in the nineteenth century. We had some very mediocre president.

Speaker 2 (01:16:49):
But they were they were educated, had education.

Speaker 1 (01:16:51):
They like new three languages. They sat around translating things
from the Greek to amuse themselves.

Speaker 2 (01:16:58):
I mean, like literally the iliot or something, right.

Speaker 1 (01:17:02):
Yeah, yeah, at night, to keep himself, you know, to
keep himself coming.

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
It's not a good translation though, it's really.

Speaker 1 (01:17:08):
Well yeah, yeah, you know, you're a little too literal anyway.
But I mean, like you go through the history of
the American presidency, and there were terrible presidents at her
big disasters and failures and all that, but I I
think she's kind of dumb and and I I really

(01:17:30):
That's where I'm going with this.

Speaker 4 (01:17:31):
Okay, So I look, I agree with you. I think
she's a bad candidate, would not be a very good president.
But I'm honestly curious about this because I think, you know,
we hear constantly about how this or that or whatever
is already priced into Trump.

Speaker 1 (01:17:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:17:49):
Do you think there is an academic or IQ type
test that if you sat both Harris and Trump down
right now and had them take that, Harris wouldn't outscore
Trump a p history, math whatever like. Do you think
that there is a test and she look and she

(01:18:09):
you know, she failed to bar the first or second time, right,
I mean, I'm not saying she's super smart, But do
you think there is some sort of objective metric about
knowledge or intelligence that Trump would do better on?

Speaker 2 (01:18:21):
Yes, what like an IQ test?

Speaker 1 (01:18:25):
You think? Yes? Yes, I don't. I don't think so.

Speaker 4 (01:18:28):
I I think he's very dumb, I really do. I
think he has a cunning, lizard brain, cunning and all
that kind of stuff, and he may have been, you know,
smarter ones you watch it in his interviews in the
nineteen eighties, and all that. But like, I think he's
affirmatively a dumb person, and he has bullied people into
like thinking there's a genius there that, and there is

(01:18:49):
a kind of genius there.

Speaker 1 (01:18:50):
Okay, so you're so you're saying there's a genius there.

Speaker 2 (01:18:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:18:53):
No, Look, I'm saying there's a cunning there is longer
than she. So he if you gave her some, if
you gave them I'm kind of general knowledge exam. He
would have eighteen years on her to know things that
she she doesn't know.

Speaker 4 (01:19:09):
No, do you think he she think You think she'd
be worse on like twentieth century history, You think she'd
be worse on?

Speaker 2 (01:19:15):
Yes, I don't, don't. I was not familiar with Rommel.

Speaker 1 (01:19:24):
He wants Rommel. That's selling John Kelly, he wants Rommel.

Speaker 2 (01:19:29):
No, no, no, no, if you read the actual.

Speaker 1 (01:19:30):
Object, I know, I know, I'm joking. I'm joking.

Speaker 2 (01:19:33):
If you do, if you read the exchange, that's not
what happened. He wanted German generals, and.

Speaker 1 (01:19:37):
He saw Pat, and everybody saw Pat, and Kelly brought
up Rommel. Robel, you magnificent bastard. I read your book.
That's what it is.

Speaker 4 (01:19:46):
I think their scores would be both bad. But I
think that Kamala Harris would beat Trump on most objective
knowledge tests, and that kind.

Speaker 2 (01:19:55):
Of thing becomes a law. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:19:58):
And whether you whether you can whether you could use
the US military to strike US civilians, that's another one
of the probably passed the California bar I think that's
one of them.

Speaker 2 (01:20:08):
I think it's a question hold on.

Speaker 1 (01:20:09):
Just just to be fair, Anderson Cooper asked her how
she was going to get legislation through the House, and
she said, we need to look at the filibuster. That
literally happened.

Speaker 2 (01:20:25):
Yeah, but that's I mean, that's not the House.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28):
But she's a filibuster has a simple majority, so you're
asking how a bill becomes law. She failed that test
on national television. You asked me the question, I win.

Speaker 4 (01:20:40):
That speaks to her being a bad politician. I don't
think that if she sat down, she would actually make
that mistake. As a former US.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
Senator, I don't know anyway. I do think that she's
she went to the eighty seventh rank law school in
the United States. I am not a big ranking person,
but that's not good after college.

Speaker 2 (01:20:59):
For somebodyho's not a big ranking person.

Speaker 4 (01:21:00):
You sound like, Look, I have very few affirmative defenses
of Kamala Harris other than the fact that she's not
Donald Trump.

Speaker 1 (01:21:07):
Yeah, okay, fair enough. I am not And you know
I'm not defending Donald Trump, but I do I am
saying you're saying, you're saying that we already had the
dumbest president in history in Donald Trump, according to Yum okay,
and you're but you're now saying that if Trump wins,
he would he would continue in that got mold ha.

(01:21:30):
He would still be the dumbest person today because she's
smarter than he is. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:21:34):
Look, it's sort of like when we're talking about stuff
within the margin of error.

Speaker 2 (01:21:42):
Okay, fair enough, I just.

Speaker 1 (01:21:45):
I don't even look, I'm not even I just think
it's startling how pedestrian a candidate she is.

Speaker 2 (01:21:54):
I just like I I you know, she that's all.

Speaker 3 (01:21:57):
Like.

Speaker 1 (01:21:57):
I keep thinking she can't be as bad at this
as she is, and then she gives another interview and
she's worse than the one she did before. So they
knew what they were doing when they weren't letting her
be interviewed.

Speaker 4 (01:22:11):
Although I have a little push could win, so I
generally agree, But like her best moment in like the
Brett Baer interview, which did not go great for her,
also did not matter nearly as much as everybody freaking
out on either side of that thought at the time.
But when she gets angry, she's actually better right when

(01:22:31):
she the softball interviews where like And that's why I
thought Anderson Cooper was remarkably effective, because he just sort
of asked these very seemingly banal questions and just sort
of handed them to her like a cotton puff and said.

Speaker 2 (01:22:47):
Do whatever you want with this, and she didn't do
very well often.

Speaker 1 (01:22:53):
Anyway. Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:22:55):
I think they're both just doing their best and they're
having a on out there, and that's the most important thing.
I wish they could both win. I I think that
we should give it to them both. That'd be great sitcom.

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
That's somebody pitched.

Speaker 2 (01:23:13):
A Yeah, somebody pitched. Yesterday.

Speaker 3 (01:23:17):
I saw on Twitter that the two women who have
who sued successfully sued Rudy Giuliani and are now they're
liquidating all of his assets, including his apartment. They should
live there with him. That should be the sho butler.

Speaker 1 (01:23:36):
Well, with that commonality, I think we're not going to
top that so I think we should we should call,
we should uh reconvene. I think our next conversation will
happen after the election, So either we'll be in bunkers
or we will not be in bunkers, and we'll see
where we are.

Speaker 2 (01:23:53):
Then it's all gonna be fine.

Speaker 1 (01:23:58):
People belove.

Speaker 4 (01:24:23):
England.

Speaker 3 (01:24:34):
W