July 23, 2024 • 25 mins
From fun recommendations to vulnerable journal entries, Amy & Kat talk about all kinds of things! Amy found a journal documenting her first 8 days of being a mom when her kids arrived from Haiti and, well, after reading through them, she realized her experience was far more difficult than she recalls (case in point: the quote in the title of this episode about the desire to rip a face off...yep THAT is something Amy said to her then husband, Ben, at the time!) Kat shares with us a psychological phenomenon called rosy retrospection which is remembering something more positively than it was actually experienced. That was clearly a tough season for Amy...that led to some laughs with Kat during this episode. They also do a little show & tell sharing some items/things they've been into lately (see links below for some stuff mentioned!) + remember per Kat's things: cross the simple things off your list & if at first you don't succeed.....paint the canvas white and try again!
Have the day you need to have and come back Thursday for the 4 things episode! Bye!!
Oh & check out You Need Therapy Podcast when you're done listening to this!
Big Magic (today's quote was also from page 13 of this book and it's a list of the many ways in which we might be afraid to live a more creative life!)
Tissue Box Cover (this is the cutest thing that Amy only was attracted to finally order because she's sick & only $7.99)
Chic Toilet Bowl Brush & Holder (random but you may need this & it's so good/chic for $12.99)
Call us: 877-207-2077
Email: 4ThingsWithAmyBrown@gmail.com
HOSTS:
Amy Brown // RadioAmy.com // @RadioAmy
Kat Defatta // @KatVanburen // @YouNeedTherapyPodcast // YouNeedTherapyPodcast.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Happy Tuesday. Welcome to the Fifth Thing. I'm Amy and
I'm Kat, and we are on Zoom today because I
don't know, I have some virus that I don't want
to give to Cat, so we have not been able
to gather in person for the last few days. So
if I sound a little wonky with my voice, that
is why. So I couldn't really decide where to go
with a quote today because I just feel like there's
(00:27):
a personal quote for me that I found in an
old journal. I texted you a photo of it, and
it's from two thousand and seventeen, right after we adopted
the kids, and that adjustment period. You know, if you've
welcomed a newborn baby into your home, whether you birth
adopted it or you welcomed older children into your home,
(00:47):
whatever that looks like. When a dynamic is shifting, there's
a lot of adjustments. And it was a struggle, and
I just remember me personally spending a lot of time
in my closet crying, and I know Ben and I
were having different arguments, but I just remember myself a
little more composed. But journaling it's good because it's a
(01:14):
really awesome reminder that we can remember things differently, which
is good for him too, because I think I remember
some things about him in a more positive light than
it actually was, and I am certain I ask for
forgiveness for this before I share with you what I
wrote in my journal. It's one line. It looks like
it's from Oh Christmas Eve Eve, Oh no way, a
(01:38):
very jolly time, And I said, I may have told
Ben I was going to rip his face off, and
then after it I put question mark, question mark, question mark,
question mark, sad face.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
I like that was your way of like admitting it,
but I megan up done this. I'm not sure.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Obviously I said it. It just felt as though it
was out of body.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Do you ever have those moments where you're screaming something
and you don't know where that came from.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
I mean, I'm sure I do, but I feel like
more likely if I do that, I don't remember it.
Like I'm so overwhelmed, I really don't know what I said.
So then somebody says, you said xyz, and I'm like,
I did, whoops?
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah, why, I guarantee you if I had not journaled this,
you wouldn't remember it. But thankfully I wrote it down
that night. I was trying to journal the days because
I thought, oh, this will be really good to keep
track of for their entire adoption the journey. I think
I made it to day eight, and I'm pretty sure
(02:42):
at the bottom of that screen shot or I took
a picture of that particular quote, which is kind of funny.
I'm making it today's quote, but I'm also going to
have a more inspiring, encouraging quote. But I shared that
as a quote because I think sometimes looking back, we
even shock ourselves of what we are capable of saying
(03:03):
to where someone else could be quoting us. Obviously, Ben
and I were having some exchanges at the time, and
when you're with your partner or a parent, or a
sibling or a best friend, sometimes those are the times
where there's passion involved because there's so much love and
care that you say things that you wouldn't say to
a coworker or a casual friend. Like I'd be mortified
(03:25):
for someone to know that I said I was going
to rip his face off, And I can say it
now because years have passed, healing has happened, and I'm
willing to share that. If you've ever said anything like
that to somebody, well it happens.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
You don't like about having stuff like that to look
back on. I've never been the best journaler. It's something
that I've had to let go of, like that's just
not ever going to be me. And I can still
benefit from parts of writing. And I see this in
my own life, and it's something that I encourage a
lot of my clients, even if they aren't journalers, to
(04:01):
just when things happen, write them down, or when you
have a letter or something, keep that writing or make
a note in your phone, because we do have this
thing called rosy retrospect is what I call it. And
when you're just sitting there and you think back on time,
sometimes we can look more on the brighter side of things,
or excuse things, or not really see them in the
(04:22):
reality that it was, but in the reality that we
want them to be. But when we have that written word,
it does a couple things. One, it shows us the
reality of what our lives were like and how we felt.
And also it shows us, like in your case, like
how far you have come to where you might not
have realized, Oh I didn't realize I was to that
point and now look at where I am now. So
(04:43):
you can't see as much of the growth. And I
think also sometimes I think about this more with like
relationships in general. When we were thinking back on oh,
it wasn't that bad, or I should have tried a
little harder, or I don't remember feeling that way, we
look back and we say no, it was actually maybe
worse than I thought it was.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
I love all of that, especially the what do you
say rosy retrospect. We've talked about that before. You can
have a prettier past than it actually was. And that's
why I'm thankful for writing things down. And of course
i've journaled since then. I know I only made it
to day eight of them actually coming to America to
live with us, but I really wanted to document so
(05:22):
much more. And to your point about it being overwhelming,
I wasn't journaling pages like I do now, Like I
journaled this weekend and I wrote full pages, and I
was more full sentences, but sometimes not. But this is
just bullet points sort of, yeah, trying to remember the day.
So this was what I could handle at the moment,
and that's what it says here. Day three, twelve twenty three.
(05:44):
I guess we rented that movie and chanted so I
have I have that on here, and then I said
I may have told Ben I was gonna rip his
face off. Question marks that face. We rode scooters, which
I commented that that was the best thirty minutes of
the day. I have the word pethe underlined, So that's
potentially what we had for dinner. We went to target.
(06:05):
In parentheses, I put again, what's wrong with us? Because
I believe on day two we took him to target
and all I wrote after that was big mistake.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
You had to read your journal page from day two
on day eight, well day three, this was day three.
Oh that's why I think.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
I said, what's wrong with this? Because the first time
we took me to target it was so crazy and
they'd never been to a target before. I don't know
what I was thinking. So it says here the kids
called me Amy, not mom, and then they pointed and
laughed at me. Ben is convinced they hate him, And
then I put, oh, this must have to do with
(06:48):
the pizza. Cauliflower pizza. I think we did our own
homemade cauliflower pizza crusts. She hates it, he loves it.
But that's it. That's all I wrote for the day
because that's what I could handle.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
It wasn't like, dear Diary, you woke up at six
forty seven pm.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
And there's not a lot of feelings here or context.
It's just it is what it is.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Bullet journaling on.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Day four, Christmas Eve. It says Church, how we made it?
I'm not sure. I clearly did not have a lot
of faith in us. But what is funny about that
is Christmas Eve was a Sunday this year, and down
at the bottom of that page, I have no wine
sales on a Sunday, And then I just wrote they
(07:32):
hate us, and then I wrote we are eating our emotions.
That was Christmas Eve.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
Where's the one where you said I cried four times today?
Did I make that up? Oh?
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Let's see, that would be day eight. That would have
been December twenty eighth. Cried four times this day. Joined
at the YMCA and Stashira would not buckle up in
the car and I'm pretty sure she cursed me out
in Creole. Yeah, so that was bad day. But it's
a journal. Oh. I came across because of the move,
(08:02):
and I think it was just a reminder of how
we've showed up at times and yes, to be able
to look at how far we've come, how we've evolved,
and thank goodness for loved ones sticking by us, because
while Ben and I ended up not making it as
a couple, we're still really close to each other and
(08:22):
really good co parents together. And thankfully you didn't really
think I was going to rip his face off.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Here we are, I said it.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
Have you ever read Big Magic? Have you ever read
Big Magic?
Speaker 2 (08:43):
I have not read it. I have it, which is
the majority of the books in my life.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
So it's by Elizabeth Gilbert, and I'm going to do
a little show and tell with Kat while she's on zoom,
and this is one of the things I'm showing and
telling which is going to be the more encouraging quote
for people. And in the beginning of the book, it's
about page thirteen when she's talking about courage and fear
and creativity. She gives a list of many ways in
(09:08):
which we might be afraid to live more creative lives.
So I'm just going to run through the list, and
as I read this, whatever you're doing, walking, driving, while
you're getting ready for work, just take these in and
assess how many of these resonate with you. You're afraid
you have no talent. You're afraid you'll be rejected or criticized,
(09:31):
or ridiculed or misunderstood, or, worst of all, ignored. You're
afraid there's no market for your creativity and therefore no
point in pursuing it. You're afraid somebody else already did
it better. You're afraid everybody else already did it better.
You're afraid somebody will steal your ideas, so it's safer
to keep them hidden forever in the dark. You're afraid
(09:54):
you won't be taken seriously. You're afraid your work isn't politically, emotionally,
or artistically to change anyone's life. You're afraid your dreams
are embarrassing. You're afraid that someday you'll look back on
your creative endeavors as having been a giant waste of time, effort,
and money. You're afraid you don't have the right kind
(10:15):
of discipline. You're afraid you don't have the right kind
of workspace or financial freedom, or empty hours in which
to focus on an invention or exploration. You're afraid you
don't have the right kind of training or degree. You're
afraid you're too fat.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Now.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
I don't know what this has to do with creativity exactly,
but experience has taught me that most of us are
afraid that we're too fat. So let's put that on
the anxiety list for good measure. You're afraid of being
exposed as a hack or a fool. You're afraid of
upsetting your family with what you may reveal. You're afraid
of what your peers and coworkers will say if you
(10:50):
express your personal truth allowed. You're afraid of unleashing your
innermost demons, and you really don't want to encounter your
intermost demons. You're afraid your best work is behind you.
You're afraid you never had any best work to begin with.
You're afraid you neglected your creativity for so long that
now you can never get it back. You're afraid you're
(11:12):
too old to start. You're afraid you're too young to start.
You're afraid because something will well in your life once,
so obviously nothing can ever go well again. You're afraid
because nothing has ever gone well in your life, so
why bother trying. You're afraid of being a one hit wonder.
You're afraid of being a no hit wonder. So that
(11:33):
is a long list of things that we might be
afraid of, but some of those hit home with me
in such a big way that I thought, I just
want to read those, and I want to encourage people
to sit with some of them, any of them. Rewind it,
Listen to the list, take time to jot some down.
Grab Elizabeth's book if you want to have the book
(11:54):
for yourself, read it. I'm sure she's got the list
online somewhere as well. But I just thought, there's so
many things that hold us back from doing tiny things
to big things, and I'm tired of it. And it
may be how we've shown up in.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
The past that we're not proud of.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
Yeah, looking back in why journal like, how could I ever,
you know, give someone advice on adoption when I was
just journaling? They hate me, they hate me. I wanted
to rip my husband's face off. I cried all the time.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
I you know, to me, that makes you more qualified
because you've been there and you've been able to do
all that hard stuff. But you just said there's so
many reasons why we don't do something. As you were
saying that, I was thinking, okay, but what are the
reasons that we would do something. And it seems almost
like uneven where I think about the ideas in my
(12:44):
head that popped up as you were reading that, Like
the actual things that I have not done because I'm
afraid and the reason to do them would be because
I want to or because it sounds fun, Like they
seem smaller, but I think they're just as important as
as fears. But all those fears seem so overwhelming compared
to like the simple reasons that we would do something
(13:07):
because we want to do that in our lifetime.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Yeah, And I mean, obviously she'll probably touch on more
encouragement throughout the book. I think she's setting the stage
for what it can look like if you surrender yeahs
and move forward with courage and what we miss out
on in life when we let those fears take over.
(13:30):
And this book here, that was just my first show
and tell for you, big magic, what I'm reading. And
then my next show and tell for you would be
my tissue box, because I'm carrying it around me everywhere
I go because they keep having to blow my nose.
But look, while I was sick yesterday or maybe two
days ago, because I'd been sick for several days. Now,
all I know is it just arrived. It's a little leather,
(13:53):
well say, leather tissue cover for my tissues that now
makes it look really cute while it's out. And I
saw someone post it on Instagram and I thought, well,
that's just the cutest thing ever. And I'm laying in
bed sick, so I'm ordering it and it's like seven bucks.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
I have to be honest about something. I've seen people
show those before on there, like look what I got
from Instagram or from Amazon or whatever, and I've always
thought to myself, what a silly thing to spend money on. Yeah,
And as I'm watching you hold that, I'm thinking that
would look really cute in my office, Like I don't
(14:32):
really have tissues all around my house. But the tissue
box does kind of ruin the aesthetic.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
I'm telling you, it changes the vibe. This was me
before this arrived. So picture me three days sick, walking
around with my tissues so sad cardboard box. Boila. I'm
putting it inside its little new cute leather home, and
(14:57):
look at it. It's transformed.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
You look so chic. All of a sudden, you don't
look sad to be sick anymore.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Whoh I gave it courage. I no longer fear being
on the kitchen counter, or the nightstand or the side table,
exposed and naked. Now you have given me the courage
to be beautiful and bold, so I can live my
best life.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Honestly, why have we not been dressing our tissue boxes
all this time? Actually? I think we have. I think
my grandmother would have a tissue box for the tissue box,
but then it got lost in translation between my mom's generation,
and now we're bringing it back.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Maybe it's back. So anybody else who has previously thought
this was silly, All you need is one down day
of being sick or two, and then you're ordering random
things like my next thing that I'm going to show you.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
You're gonna say how much money did you spend for
being sick?
Speaker 1 (15:51):
What you bad?
Speaker 2 (15:53):
And guess what.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
I personally use an Amazon credit card, so get this.
I get cash back in Amazon points.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
And then you can get free stuff because it's girl.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Man, which Dave Ramsey. People that have been on my
show before, they're probably not pro this, but that's okay.
Everybody lives life differently. I am in a place, thankfully
where I'm able to pay off my credit card monthly.
But regardless wherever you are, your credit card should still
be working for you if you have one. This order
(16:26):
that I placed, I used my points, my Amazon points,
and I cashed out at zero.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
Dollars, so is free.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
So this tissue outfit is free.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
And honestly, you had to use the points else they
would be wasted, so you had to buy that.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
This is my new toilet bowl cleaner, which is very chic,
which is what I typed into Amazon chic toilet bowl cleaner,
and this was I believe eleven ninety nine, and I
thought it was going to come in and be like
really plastic and left looking, but I'm pretty sure that
it's been that's steel and it's very chic. I'm gonna
be excited to have it in my bathroom because I
(17:04):
was at home Depot the other day and I almost
bought like a ten dollars plastic one, and then I thought,
surely there's something else out there. So since this is
a fifth thing, I'm going to show and tell four
things Kat, and then you bring one thing that you
want to share. That'll equal five. Since I'm springing this
on you. But My first thing would be my big
(17:24):
magic book that I'm reading, my cute little outfit for
my tissue, my toilet bowl cleaner. I can link this
stuff in the show notes as well. And then my
next thing, and then my next thing.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Is your birth control.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
No, I'm not on birth control. The last time I
was on birth control, I was twenty six or twenty
seven years old, and I went crazy, so I got
off of it, and then Ben and I were never
able to get pregnant anyway, So I just never took
birth control. And then now I'm not dating. I mean
I'm supposed to be, but we're getting there. I'm not
doing that. So this is my steroid pack that I
(18:09):
got today, and apparently it's gonna change my life and
I'm gonna feel better by tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Like steroid for your sickness. Yeah, okay, not from a muscles.
I guess it's never too late. But I would have
thought you would have gotten that on like Friday.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Well one would think. On Friday, I was still in denial.
I believe there's stages of sickness. Thursday, my throat was
very sore, but I felt amazing, So I thought, well,
this is just some weird throat thing. Remember we had
our Mastermind meeting. My throat was a little itchy, but
I mean I felt great. I was having a great day.
And Thursday there was that, and then Friday, I think
(18:46):
I was in denial, like something's still off, not feeling
that great. And Saturday morning I was, you know, it's
my weekend. I have so much to do to get settled,
and I have this long list of things and I
love the weekend so I can conquer my lips. And
I was conquering the list and conquering the lists, and
I would say around two pm, I had to succumb
to my sickness and I went and got in bed,
(19:08):
and then that's the weekend. So I think the first
I was able to see the doctor was this morning
and today Monday, so I got my steroid pack today.
So you know, sometimes we like to deny that we're sick,
and it probably would have served me better if I
just went to the doctor Friday morning and was like,
something's off.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I get that putting that off. I don't want to
go to the doctor unless I know I really am
super sick and I need something because I'd like to
strip throat because I just hate the process of going
so I get that. I'd also have two things I
want to show and tell. One I can't really show
you because I don't have it yet, but I wanted
to tell you because speaking of the Mastermind, you had
(19:45):
us write some things down that we had been wanting
to do but haven't done, and one of them was
getting a new phone. My phone has been broken. I've
only been able to talk on speakerphone for at least
like a year, and weirdly so is Patrick. Our phone's
broke in the same way. Separately, on that call, I said,
I'm going to go get a new phone. I have
been putting it off for a year, and we went
(20:06):
yes yesterday. But I can't show you my phone because
I have to go back today because the one that
I need was out of stock. That's my speak show
and tell.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
I like that that's a show and tell because not
everybody listening may need a new phone, but they may
have something that they've had on their list for a
year that they need to do. And I want you
to share how it felt for you to finally cross
that off.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Well, I feel like I haven't really felt it yet
because I don't have the phone in my hands. But
I will say when we went to the store, I
was like, why have I not just done this? Giving
a new phone does seem I think, overwhelming to a
lot of people. But the way they do it now
is like seamless.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
What's the next thing?
Speaker 2 (20:43):
The next thing is three blank canvases. Because I went
on a journey of painting something that I found on
Instagram that looked really simple that I wanted to put
in my office, I bought all of this supplies. I
bought a saw, I bought a stable gun. I was
researching tutorials on how to do things, and I thought
(21:05):
to myself, I think art is gonna be my new hobby.
I probably even texted you that, like why have we
not been painting all our lives? And then when I
was finished with it, I sent you a picture of it,
and what did you tell me my painting looked like?
Speaker 1 (21:18):
Well, I thought it looked like filopian tubes and ovaries.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
So I googled what does a uterus look like? And
then I put the picture next to my painting and
it literally looked like I tried to paint a uterus.
So this morning I painted over it. I've done two
primer codes and now I'm gonna try again instead of
throwing it out or having to buy all new supplies,
so I said, I'm gonna try it again.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
I love that encouragement too, And for the record, I
also really liked it.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
It's a really good fillopian tube.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
I was proud of you, so as your friend, I
need to make sure to make that disclaimer. It's not
like I was like saying something like I was gonna
rip your face off.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
But it was funny because I posted a reel of
my process of making it on Instagram and one of
the people commented something like, and that's on female power,
and I thought to myself, honestly it is. I didn't
even mean to paint a uterus in the power of
the female just made me do it. I don't know.
So I did consider donating it to like an obgyn office,
(22:24):
but that felt like a lot of work. So we're
just going to try it again. And if it comes
out as a uterus again, that's a sign.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
You should now commission your work to obgyn offices and
be like, here's what I can offer you. It comes
in five different colors. Well, I was really proud of
you and I think that that's good encouragement too, that
because you're trying something new and you've done it all,
doesn't mean you just have to trash it if it
(22:53):
doesn't go the way you thought the first time. You
have something inside of you creatively, Kath, that you want
to do, and you're not going to let anything stop you.
Back to our all of our reasons from Elizabeth Gilbert
as to why we may hold ourselves back from doing something.
And you know, one day you're going to finish that
painting and it's going to be hanging up and seven
(23:15):
years are going to pass, and you're going to look
back and be like, look at that painting, and you're
going to remember all that you learn from it and
maybe even have a little laugh about the uterus. And
just like seven years later, I can look back at
my journey in my ear that I had around adoption.
Even Ben and I were terrified to become parents, and
(23:35):
we could have come up with every excuse known to man,
and we finally did it, and here we are, fast
forward and it's a beautiful thing. There's still hard days,
but I'm thankful now for this and these notes. Yeah,
I looked at one of the posts I believe I
had posted on Instagram. Speaking of posting things, all I
(23:57):
put here was day five, Christmas Day. My dad was
in town and we went to get Chinese food, and
all I put was Chinese food equals not pizza equals winning. Literally,
we had been eating a lot of pizza. And then
I put Instagram family pajama pick equals so fake because
now reaching pajamas on the floor decorating homemade cookies. And
(24:20):
I think my dad took the picture of me, been
and the kids, and it looked like we were the
cutest little thing you've ever seen, and clearly we were
just getting by. And all caps underlined I have hard day.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
That's such a good reminder for everybody, for you to
admit that and say I'd posted this and it looked
perfect and it was a hard day, and it felt fake.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
And I wrote here Dad was here, and I could
tell that he was like, have patience, daughter, So we
can do hard things, We can grow, We can start over,
starting over your canvas quite literally for you is painting
it white and starting over. But for somebody else that
might just be wiping a different sleep clean and starting over.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
And I will say one of the things that I
think I solidified learning in that experience was I still
really enjoyed myself even though it came out not what
I wanted at all. I had a lot of fun
making that. Like it was hard for me to do
anything else because all I wanted to do is paint.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
I'm excited for your artist journey.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
We'll see.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
Okay, Kat, where can people find.
Speaker 2 (25:24):
You on Instagram? At Kat van Buren and at You
Need Therapy podcast.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Van Buren just like our eighth President. Thanks for listening.
We appreciate y'all, and I'm apt radio Amy on socials you.
I'll link the stuff in the show notes, but have
the day that you need to have and I'll see
Thursday for four things. And then Kat has episodes for
her podcast You Need Therapy. They go up every Monday
and every Wednesday, so check them out. Bye.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
Hi,
Happy Tuesday. Welcome to the Fifth Thing. I'm Amy and
I'm Kat, and we are on Zoom today because I
don't know, I have some virus that I don't want
to give to Cat, so we have not been able
to gather in person for the last few days. So
if I sound a little wonky with my voice, that
is why. So I couldn't really decide where to go
with a quote today because I just feel like there's
(00:27):
a personal quote for me that I found in an
old journal. I texted you a photo of it, and
it's from two thousand and seventeen, right after we adopted
the kids, and that adjustment period. You know, if you've
welcomed a newborn baby into your home, whether you birth
adopted it or you welcomed older children into your home,
(00:47):
whatever that looks like. When a dynamic is shifting, there's
a lot of adjustments. And it was a struggle, and
I just remember me personally spending a lot of time
in my closet crying, and I know Ben and I
were having different arguments, but I just remember myself a
little more composed. But journaling it's good because it's a
(01:14):
really awesome reminder that we can remember things differently, which
is good for him too, because I think I remember
some things about him in a more positive light than
it actually was, and I am certain I ask for
forgiveness for this before I share with you what I
wrote in my journal. It's one line. It looks like
it's from Oh Christmas Eve Eve, Oh no way, a
(01:38):
very jolly time, And I said, I may have told
Ben I was going to rip his face off, and
then after it I put question mark, question mark, question mark,
question mark, sad face.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
I like that was your way of like admitting it,
but I megan up done this. I'm not sure.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Obviously I said it. It just felt as though it
was out of body.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Do you ever have those moments where you're screaming something
and you don't know where that came from.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
I mean, I'm sure I do, but I feel like
more likely if I do that, I don't remember it.
Like I'm so overwhelmed, I really don't know what I said.
So then somebody says, you said xyz, and I'm like,
I did, whoops?
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah, why, I guarantee you if I had not journaled this,
you wouldn't remember it. But thankfully I wrote it down
that night. I was trying to journal the days because
I thought, oh, this will be really good to keep
track of for their entire adoption the journey. I think
I made it to day eight, and I'm pretty sure
(02:42):
at the bottom of that screen shot or I took
a picture of that particular quote, which is kind of funny.
I'm making it today's quote, but I'm also going to
have a more inspiring, encouraging quote. But I shared that
as a quote because I think sometimes looking back, we
even shock ourselves of what we are capable of saying
(03:03):
to where someone else could be quoting us. Obviously, Ben
and I were having some exchanges at the time, and
when you're with your partner or a parent, or a
sibling or a best friend, sometimes those are the times
where there's passion involved because there's so much love and
care that you say things that you wouldn't say to
a coworker or a casual friend. Like I'd be mortified
(03:25):
for someone to know that I said I was going
to rip his face off, And I can say it
now because years have passed, healing has happened, and I'm
willing to share that. If you've ever said anything like
that to somebody, well it happens.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
You don't like about having stuff like that to look
back on. I've never been the best journaler. It's something
that I've had to let go of, like that's just
not ever going to be me. And I can still
benefit from parts of writing. And I see this in
my own life, and it's something that I encourage a
lot of my clients, even if they aren't journalers, to
(04:01):
just when things happen, write them down, or when you
have a letter or something, keep that writing or make
a note in your phone, because we do have this
thing called rosy retrospect is what I call it. And
when you're just sitting there and you think back on time,
sometimes we can look more on the brighter side of things,
or excuse things, or not really see them in the
(04:22):
reality that it was, but in the reality that we
want them to be. But when we have that written word,
it does a couple things. One, it shows us the
reality of what our lives were like and how we felt.
And also it shows us, like in your case, like
how far you have come to where you might not
have realized, Oh I didn't realize I was to that
point and now look at where I am now. So
(04:43):
you can't see as much of the growth. And I
think also sometimes I think about this more with like
relationships in general. When we were thinking back on oh,
it wasn't that bad, or I should have tried a
little harder, or I don't remember feeling that way, we
look back and we say no, it was actually maybe
worse than I thought it was.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
I love all of that, especially the what do you
say rosy retrospect. We've talked about that before. You can
have a prettier past than it actually was. And that's
why I'm thankful for writing things down. And of course
i've journaled since then. I know I only made it
to day eight of them actually coming to America to
live with us, but I really wanted to document so
(05:22):
much more. And to your point about it being overwhelming,
I wasn't journaling pages like I do now, Like I
journaled this weekend and I wrote full pages, and I
was more full sentences, but sometimes not. But this is
just bullet points sort of, yeah, trying to remember the day.
So this was what I could handle at the moment,
and that's what it says here. Day three, twelve twenty three.
(05:44):
I guess we rented that movie and chanted so I
have I have that on here, and then I said
I may have told Ben I was gonna rip his
face off. Question marks that face. We rode scooters, which
I commented that that was the best thirty minutes of
the day. I have the word pethe underlined, So that's
potentially what we had for dinner. We went to target.
(06:05):
In parentheses, I put again, what's wrong with us? Because
I believe on day two we took him to target
and all I wrote after that was big mistake.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
You had to read your journal page from day two
on day eight, well day three, this was day three.
Oh that's why I think.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
I said, what's wrong with this? Because the first time
we took me to target it was so crazy and
they'd never been to a target before. I don't know
what I was thinking. So it says here the kids
called me Amy, not mom, and then they pointed and
laughed at me. Ben is convinced they hate him, And
then I put, oh, this must have to do with
(06:48):
the pizza. Cauliflower pizza. I think we did our own
homemade cauliflower pizza crusts. She hates it, he loves it.
But that's it. That's all I wrote for the day
because that's what I could handle.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
It wasn't like, dear Diary, you woke up at six
forty seven pm.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
And there's not a lot of feelings here or context.
It's just it is what it is.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Bullet journaling on.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Day four, Christmas Eve. It says Church, how we made it?
I'm not sure. I clearly did not have a lot
of faith in us. But what is funny about that
is Christmas Eve was a Sunday this year, and down
at the bottom of that page, I have no wine
sales on a Sunday, And then I just wrote they
(07:32):
hate us, and then I wrote we are eating our emotions.
That was Christmas Eve.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
Where's the one where you said I cried four times today?
Did I make that up? Oh?
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Let's see, that would be day eight. That would have
been December twenty eighth. Cried four times this day. Joined
at the YMCA and Stashira would not buckle up in
the car and I'm pretty sure she cursed me out
in Creole. Yeah, so that was bad day. But it's
a journal. Oh. I came across because of the move,
(08:02):
and I think it was just a reminder of how
we've showed up at times and yes, to be able
to look at how far we've come, how we've evolved,
and thank goodness for loved ones sticking by us, because
while Ben and I ended up not making it as
a couple, we're still really close to each other and
(08:22):
really good co parents together. And thankfully you didn't really
think I was going to rip his face off.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Here we are, I said it.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
Have you ever read Big Magic? Have you ever read
Big Magic?
Speaker 2 (08:43):
I have not read it. I have it, which is
the majority of the books in my life.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
So it's by Elizabeth Gilbert, and I'm going to do
a little show and tell with Kat while she's on zoom,
and this is one of the things I'm showing and
telling which is going to be the more encouraging quote
for people. And in the beginning of the book, it's
about page thirteen when she's talking about courage and fear
and creativity. She gives a list of many ways in
(09:08):
which we might be afraid to live more creative lives.
So I'm just going to run through the list, and
as I read this, whatever you're doing, walking, driving, while
you're getting ready for work, just take these in and
assess how many of these resonate with you. You're afraid
you have no talent. You're afraid you'll be rejected or criticized,
(09:31):
or ridiculed or misunderstood, or, worst of all, ignored. You're
afraid there's no market for your creativity and therefore no
point in pursuing it. You're afraid somebody else already did
it better. You're afraid everybody else already did it better.
You're afraid somebody will steal your ideas, so it's safer
to keep them hidden forever in the dark. You're afraid
(09:54):
you won't be taken seriously. You're afraid your work isn't politically, emotionally,
or artistically to change anyone's life. You're afraid your dreams
are embarrassing. You're afraid that someday you'll look back on
your creative endeavors as having been a giant waste of time, effort,
and money. You're afraid you don't have the right kind
(10:15):
of discipline. You're afraid you don't have the right kind
of workspace or financial freedom, or empty hours in which
to focus on an invention or exploration. You're afraid you
don't have the right kind of training or degree. You're
afraid you're too fat.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Now.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
I don't know what this has to do with creativity exactly,
but experience has taught me that most of us are
afraid that we're too fat. So let's put that on
the anxiety list for good measure. You're afraid of being
exposed as a hack or a fool. You're afraid of
upsetting your family with what you may reveal. You're afraid
of what your peers and coworkers will say if you
(10:50):
express your personal truth allowed. You're afraid of unleashing your
innermost demons, and you really don't want to encounter your
intermost demons. You're afraid your best work is behind you.
You're afraid you never had any best work to begin with.
You're afraid you neglected your creativity for so long that
now you can never get it back. You're afraid you're
(11:12):
too old to start. You're afraid you're too young to start.
You're afraid because something will well in your life once,
so obviously nothing can ever go well again. You're afraid
because nothing has ever gone well in your life, so
why bother trying. You're afraid of being a one hit wonder.
You're afraid of being a no hit wonder. So that
(11:33):
is a long list of things that we might be
afraid of, but some of those hit home with me
in such a big way that I thought, I just
want to read those, and I want to encourage people
to sit with some of them, any of them. Rewind it,
Listen to the list, take time to jot some down.
Grab Elizabeth's book if you want to have the book
(11:54):
for yourself, read it. I'm sure she's got the list
online somewhere as well. But I just thought, there's so
many things that hold us back from doing tiny things
to big things, and I'm tired of it. And it
may be how we've shown up in.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
The past that we're not proud of.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
Yeah, looking back in why journal like, how could I ever,
you know, give someone advice on adoption when I was
just journaling? They hate me, they hate me. I wanted
to rip my husband's face off. I cried all the time.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
I you know, to me, that makes you more qualified
because you've been there and you've been able to do
all that hard stuff. But you just said there's so
many reasons why we don't do something. As you were
saying that, I was thinking, okay, but what are the
reasons that we would do something. And it seems almost
like uneven where I think about the ideas in my
(12:44):
head that popped up as you were reading that, Like
the actual things that I have not done because I'm
afraid and the reason to do them would be because
I want to or because it sounds fun, Like they
seem smaller, but I think they're just as important as
as fears. But all those fears seem so overwhelming compared
to like the simple reasons that we would do something
(13:07):
because we want to do that in our lifetime.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Yeah, And I mean, obviously she'll probably touch on more
encouragement throughout the book. I think she's setting the stage
for what it can look like if you surrender yeahs
and move forward with courage and what we miss out
on in life when we let those fears take over.
(13:30):
And this book here, that was just my first show
and tell for you, big magic, what I'm reading. And
then my next show and tell for you would be
my tissue box, because I'm carrying it around me everywhere
I go because they keep having to blow my nose.
But look, while I was sick yesterday or maybe two
days ago, because I'd been sick for several days. Now,
all I know is it just arrived. It's a little leather,
(13:53):
well say, leather tissue cover for my tissues that now
makes it look really cute while it's out. And I
saw someone post it on Instagram and I thought, well,
that's just the cutest thing ever. And I'm laying in
bed sick, so I'm ordering it and it's like seven bucks.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
I have to be honest about something. I've seen people
show those before on there, like look what I got
from Instagram or from Amazon or whatever, and I've always
thought to myself, what a silly thing to spend money on. Yeah,
And as I'm watching you hold that, I'm thinking that
would look really cute in my office, Like I don't
(14:32):
really have tissues all around my house. But the tissue
box does kind of ruin the aesthetic.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
I'm telling you, it changes the vibe. This was me
before this arrived. So picture me three days sick, walking
around with my tissues so sad cardboard box. Boila. I'm
putting it inside its little new cute leather home, and
(14:57):
look at it. It's transformed.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
You look so chic. All of a sudden, you don't
look sad to be sick anymore.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Whoh I gave it courage. I no longer fear being
on the kitchen counter, or the nightstand or the side table,
exposed and naked. Now you have given me the courage
to be beautiful and bold, so I can live my
best life.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Honestly, why have we not been dressing our tissue boxes
all this time? Actually? I think we have. I think
my grandmother would have a tissue box for the tissue box,
but then it got lost in translation between my mom's generation,
and now we're bringing it back.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Maybe it's back. So anybody else who has previously thought
this was silly, All you need is one down day
of being sick or two, and then you're ordering random
things like my next thing that I'm going to show you.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
You're gonna say how much money did you spend for
being sick?
Speaker 1 (15:51):
What you bad?
Speaker 2 (15:53):
And guess what.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
I personally use an Amazon credit card, so get this.
I get cash back in Amazon points.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
And then you can get free stuff because it's girl.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Man, which Dave Ramsey. People that have been on my
show before, they're probably not pro this, but that's okay.
Everybody lives life differently. I am in a place, thankfully
where I'm able to pay off my credit card monthly.
But regardless wherever you are, your credit card should still
be working for you if you have one. This order
(16:26):
that I placed, I used my points, my Amazon points,
and I cashed out at zero.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
Dollars, so is free.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
So this tissue outfit is free.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
And honestly, you had to use the points else they
would be wasted, so you had to buy that.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
This is my new toilet bowl cleaner, which is very chic,
which is what I typed into Amazon chic toilet bowl cleaner,
and this was I believe eleven ninety nine, and I
thought it was going to come in and be like
really plastic and left looking, but I'm pretty sure that
it's been that's steel and it's very chic. I'm gonna
be excited to have it in my bathroom because I
(17:04):
was at home Depot the other day and I almost
bought like a ten dollars plastic one, and then I thought,
surely there's something else out there. So since this is
a fifth thing, I'm going to show and tell four
things Kat, and then you bring one thing that you
want to share. That'll equal five. Since I'm springing this
on you. But My first thing would be my big
(17:24):
magic book that I'm reading, my cute little outfit for
my tissue, my toilet bowl cleaner. I can link this
stuff in the show notes as well. And then my
next thing, and then my next thing.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Is your birth control.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
No, I'm not on birth control. The last time I
was on birth control, I was twenty six or twenty
seven years old, and I went crazy, so I got
off of it, and then Ben and I were never
able to get pregnant anyway, So I just never took
birth control. And then now I'm not dating. I mean
I'm supposed to be, but we're getting there. I'm not
doing that. So this is my steroid pack that I
(18:09):
got today, and apparently it's gonna change my life and
I'm gonna feel better by tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Like steroid for your sickness. Yeah, okay, not from a muscles.
I guess it's never too late. But I would have
thought you would have gotten that on like Friday.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Well one would think. On Friday, I was still in denial.
I believe there's stages of sickness. Thursday, my throat was
very sore, but I felt amazing, So I thought, well,
this is just some weird throat thing. Remember we had
our Mastermind meeting. My throat was a little itchy, but
I mean I felt great. I was having a great day.
And Thursday there was that, and then Friday, I think
(18:46):
I was in denial, like something's still off, not feeling
that great. And Saturday morning I was, you know, it's
my weekend. I have so much to do to get settled,
and I have this long list of things and I
love the weekend so I can conquer my lips. And
I was conquering the list and conquering the lists, and
I would say around two pm, I had to succumb
to my sickness and I went and got in bed,
(19:08):
and then that's the weekend. So I think the first
I was able to see the doctor was this morning
and today Monday, so I got my steroid pack today.
So you know, sometimes we like to deny that we're sick,
and it probably would have served me better if I
just went to the doctor Friday morning and was like,
something's off.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I get that putting that off. I don't want to
go to the doctor unless I know I really am
super sick and I need something because I'd like to
strip throat because I just hate the process of going
so I get that. I'd also have two things I
want to show and tell. One I can't really show
you because I don't have it yet, but I wanted
to tell you because speaking of the Mastermind, you had
(19:45):
us write some things down that we had been wanting
to do but haven't done, and one of them was
getting a new phone. My phone has been broken. I've
only been able to talk on speakerphone for at least
like a year, and weirdly so is Patrick. Our phone's
broke in the same way. Separately, on that call, I said,
I'm going to go get a new phone. I have
been putting it off for a year, and we went
(20:06):
yes yesterday. But I can't show you my phone because
I have to go back today because the one that
I need was out of stock. That's my speak show
and tell.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
I like that that's a show and tell because not
everybody listening may need a new phone, but they may
have something that they've had on their list for a
year that they need to do. And I want you
to share how it felt for you to finally cross
that off.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Well, I feel like I haven't really felt it yet
because I don't have the phone in my hands. But
I will say when we went to the store, I
was like, why have I not just done this? Giving
a new phone does seem I think, overwhelming to a
lot of people. But the way they do it now
is like seamless.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
What's the next thing?
Speaker 2 (20:43):
The next thing is three blank canvases. Because I went
on a journey of painting something that I found on
Instagram that looked really simple that I wanted to put
in my office, I bought all of this supplies. I
bought a saw, I bought a stable gun. I was
researching tutorials on how to do things, and I thought
(21:05):
to myself, I think art is gonna be my new hobby.
I probably even texted you that, like why have we
not been painting all our lives? And then when I
was finished with it, I sent you a picture of it,
and what did you tell me my painting looked like?
Speaker 1 (21:18):
Well, I thought it looked like filopian tubes and ovaries.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
So I googled what does a uterus look like? And
then I put the picture next to my painting and
it literally looked like I tried to paint a uterus.
So this morning I painted over it. I've done two
primer codes and now I'm gonna try again instead of
throwing it out or having to buy all new supplies,
so I said, I'm gonna try it again.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
I love that encouragement too, And for the record, I
also really liked it.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
It's a really good fillopian tube.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
I was proud of you, so as your friend, I
need to make sure to make that disclaimer. It's not
like I was like saying something like I was gonna
rip your face off.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
But it was funny because I posted a reel of
my process of making it on Instagram and one of
the people commented something like, and that's on female power,
and I thought to myself, honestly it is. I didn't
even mean to paint a uterus in the power of
the female just made me do it. I don't know.
So I did consider donating it to like an obgyn office,
(22:24):
but that felt like a lot of work. So we're
just going to try it again. And if it comes
out as a uterus again, that's a sign.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
You should now commission your work to obgyn offices and
be like, here's what I can offer you. It comes
in five different colors. Well, I was really proud of
you and I think that that's good encouragement too, that
because you're trying something new and you've done it all,
doesn't mean you just have to trash it if it
(22:53):
doesn't go the way you thought the first time. You
have something inside of you creatively, Kath, that you want
to do, and you're not going to let anything stop you.
Back to our all of our reasons from Elizabeth Gilbert
as to why we may hold ourselves back from doing something.
And you know, one day you're going to finish that
painting and it's going to be hanging up and seven
(23:15):
years are going to pass, and you're going to look
back and be like, look at that painting, and you're
going to remember all that you learn from it and
maybe even have a little laugh about the uterus. And
just like seven years later, I can look back at
my journey in my ear that I had around adoption.
Even Ben and I were terrified to become parents, and
(23:35):
we could have come up with every excuse known to man,
and we finally did it, and here we are, fast
forward and it's a beautiful thing. There's still hard days,
but I'm thankful now for this and these notes. Yeah,
I looked at one of the posts I believe I
had posted on Instagram. Speaking of posting things, all I
(23:57):
put here was day five, Christmas Day. My dad was
in town and we went to get Chinese food, and
all I put was Chinese food equals not pizza equals winning. Literally,
we had been eating a lot of pizza. And then
I put Instagram family pajama pick equals so fake because
now reaching pajamas on the floor decorating homemade cookies. And
(24:20):
I think my dad took the picture of me, been
and the kids, and it looked like we were the
cutest little thing you've ever seen, and clearly we were
just getting by. And all caps underlined I have hard day.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
That's such a good reminder for everybody, for you to
admit that and say I'd posted this and it looked
perfect and it was a hard day, and it felt fake.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
And I wrote here Dad was here, and I could
tell that he was like, have patience, daughter, So we
can do hard things, We can grow, We can start over,
starting over your canvas quite literally for you is painting
it white and starting over. But for somebody else that
might just be wiping a different sleep clean and starting over.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
And I will say one of the things that I
think I solidified learning in that experience was I still
really enjoyed myself even though it came out not what
I wanted at all. I had a lot of fun
making that. Like it was hard for me to do
anything else because all I wanted to do is paint.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
I'm excited for your artist journey.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
We'll see.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
Okay, Kat, where can people find.
Speaker 2 (25:24):
You on Instagram? At Kat van Buren and at You
Need Therapy podcast.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Van Buren just like our eighth President. Thanks for listening.
We appreciate y'all, and I'm apt radio Amy on socials you.
I'll link the stuff in the show notes, but have
the day that you need to have and I'll see
Thursday for four things. And then Kat has episodes for
her podcast You Need Therapy. They go up every Monday
and every Wednesday, so check them out. Bye.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
Hi,
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