July 8, 2025 • 54 mins
Amy and Kat are feeling tired and in need of a reset. Enter: Sky Journaling! It’s a creative exercise that blends mindfulness with doodling and ends in some very honest cloud-inspired poems. They also break down the difference between pop psychology vs actual psychology, unpacking commonly used (especially on social media) terms like trauma bonding, gaslighting, and being triggered. And finally, inspired by a school activity Amy’s son is doing, they invite you to “find a win” (big or small) because sometimes, showing up at all is the victory.
If you do the Sky Journaling homework assignment and you don’t mind if it gets shared on an upcoming episode then email it in: HeyThere@FeelingThingsPodcast.com
Call and leave a voicemail: 877-207-2077
HOSTS:
Amy Brown // RadioAmy.com // @RadioAmy
Kat Van Buren // @KatVanburen
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
All right, break it down. If you ever have feelings
that you just won't mayby a cat, got your cob
and locking no.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Brother lady's and felts, do you just follow ann the
spirit where.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
It's all the front over real stuff to the chill
stuff and am but Swayne. Sometimes the best thing you
can do it just stop you feel things. This is
feeling things with Amy and Cat.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Happy Tuesday. Welcome to feeling things. I'm Amy and I'm Cat.
And my feeling of the day, well, I guess we
both have them. I have a question about mine though.
It's tired of feeling like I know that. Like physically
I feel tired, but it's.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
Not a are you feeling emotion?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
No, I'm just tired.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Oh so that's my feeling, the physical feeling.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Yeah, it's a physical So physically I feel tired. I
did not sleep last night.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Do you know what I do? Oh? Do you want
to share?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Sure? But no judgment.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I'm not judging.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
This is a safe space. Yes, okay, you know how
I've been adderall free for all year.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Did you take one?
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Took one? I took one yesterday because it was strategic.
I had a lot to do and of course I
have other tools I can implement, but this is a
tool that I have. Like I've had that bottle all
year and I haven't dipped into it. But I dipped
in yesterday and guess what, I got it all done.
But then I couldn't go to sleep because my body
just wasn't used to it. Once I got used to adderall,
(01:28):
I could take it and sleep, no problem.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
It's also okay, you prescribe that medication.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
I am prescribed that message, so it's not like you're.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
A drug addict right now. Dipped into your stash like
that's a medication.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Year. When I opened up my drawer and I pulled
it out, I was like, okay, here goes nothing. And
then I took it and then it was interesting. I
don't know exactly what it's doing, not a doctor, but
whatever's during to my neurotransmitters. I liked it and I
felt just capable of doing. And while I was doing it,
(02:00):
I was thinking, is this what some people just do?
Like they just take the thing outside and finally rinse
that off. I had a thought of cleaning the basketball
goal that popped into my mind, like it needs a
new net, and then the glass the basketball goal, the
on the driveway, the glass part is a little dirty,
and I did have a thought that this is where
(02:20):
I'm also proud of myself, and I was like, that's
not why we took out all. We didn't take out
all to clean the basketball goal. Would it look better, yes,
but you took it for a purpose. And we're prepping
for a vacation and getting everybody packed and I normally
pack the night before a trip or the morning.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Of yeah, right before you leave.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
So part of my planning and awareness was I'm gonna
get as much done as possible a week ahead of time,
and that was my day to do it. So I
did it and I'm not using again today. Okay, can
you say that in different now. I was just making
a little joke. I know, Kathy Derakis, so we need
(03:02):
to take this seriously. I know that I had permission
to take it, and I wanted to make sure I
could share because I know I've been candid about my journey,
and I guess part of me feels a little bit
of shame if I'm being honest, of like, why can't
I just function this way without it? And I will
set that aside because there's nothing wrong with me. This
is the brain that I have, and some days naturally
(03:22):
I'm able to tap into it, and I have other
tools that will get me there. But yesterday I knew
I needed the extra help and so I took it
and it helped me. Like I got it done and
I'm thankful.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
I just think it's interesting. I feel this too, that
for whatever reason, some people who have ADHD or anything
it can be depression, anxiety, or whatever, would feel like
they're cheating by taking a medication that puts them on
the even playing field with other people. Like hearing you
say that, I get it. I relate to that too.
(03:54):
Sometimes it feels like me taking the medication that is
prescribed to me to help me function normally feels like cheating,
when in reality it's just putting you on an even
playing field. There's a lot of I think rhetoric around
talk that I think helps people feel that way. But
it's just when you put it that way, it's like
you are working harder. I'm gonna say this, and you
(04:15):
tell me what you think. Most days you have to
work harder to function the way a neurotypical person functions,
and you don't complain about it. You do it. I
think sometimes you get down on yourself because you don't
perform the same way, But like you're working harder, So
why would there be a need for you to feel
(04:36):
shame to just like have a day that everybody else has.
Like it's almost like give myself a break, but it's
not even a break, it's just normal. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
No, thank you for saying that that helps, like the
even playing field. I have heard that before, but obviously
hadn't thought of it in a while, and certainly not
in this case. So that already is helping me. Like
hearing you say that, I'm sure it's helping others, whether
it's acation for anything. It doesn't even have to be
ADHD could be for whatever it is that you need
to have it. I guess it's just you know, you
(05:06):
kind of go. I went six months. It's not like
I was on some streak. I didn't plan on breaking
it at all. It was sort of a Saturday night decision.
When I wake up tomorrow, I think I'm going to
take it, because.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
It's almost like self care. Tell take yes.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
I know that I will get everything done with ease.
And it wasn't like I was running around some energizer, Bunny.
I was just moving from one thing to the next
with flow and purpose and ease, like it just felt
good and nothing was like a big deal. It was like, Okay,
now I'm going to go do this. And I was
completing tasks because I can do a bunch of things.
(05:43):
But I go and I start a task and then
I'm like, oh, now I'm in the kitchen doing the dishes.
I was doing a load of laundry and the laundry
hasn't started yet, but.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Oh I didn't switch my laundry before I came over here, damn.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
So how are you feeling? So that's my feeling, you know, Yeah, which,
thank you for talking me through that.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
I relate to all you're saying because also, I'm not
taking medication right now, not because I don't want to,
but because I'm trying to do other things that that
medication does not mix well with. So I've been feeling
kind of down on myself for not doing things with
ease the way that I normally, well not even normally do,
(06:22):
but the way that I had been operating, Like a
phone call takes a lot of energy. But outside of that,
I texted you this morning and said, I'm feeling SIB.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Which do you want to explain to any new listeners
what SIB means? Sorry, I beatchy in case we have
small ears listening. Yeah, sorry, I witchy with a B.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
That's our new code.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
It's our code for I guess we developed it when
I was being you and I said, well, you can
just say if you need to warn me, sib. Yeah,
and then I can say to you SIB yeah, And
it helps just cut the edge, like there's no it's
like this is a safe space.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I am feeling a little bit of that. But I
think really what I'm feeling is like melancholy, like just low.
And I was feeling that before I started working on
podcast stuff this morning and I found something. I want
you to explain it because it's yours that I use,
and I did. That was really helpful that I thought
we could talk about, you know what I'm trying.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Yeah, so a little behind the scenes baseball. We have
a Google doc with different things like cats ideas, Amy's ideas,
and I know you did the exercise and you haven't
shown me. So just because we have this Google doc
doesn't mean we always know exactly what the other person's
going to say it's just a general prompt or idea
or activity like this is an activity and listeners can
(07:47):
do it too, Like, for example, you had no idea
I took out roll yesterday. You didn't know I was
going to say that. I didn't even know I was
going to say that. Honestly, I was going to keep
it to myself.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
But then I thought, I then I didn't take my
medication today, so it just came out right.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
But then I thought, I know exactly why I'm tired. Yeah,
and I've been telling you since you got to my
house that I'm tired.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
I did our honesty circle.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Right, and so then but it's like, well, why didn't
I sleep. It's not like I'm perplexed by it. I
know exactly why. So I thought I would just finally
tell you, which you didn't know that. So some stuff
is we try to keep as organic as possible, which
is why Kat hasn't shared her activity with me. My
activity was already in the Google docs, so you could
see my example. But it's called sky journaling. And this
(08:28):
is an exercise that you can do if you're wanting
to process feelings. So you can go outside with your
journal and find a cloud, look into the sky and
draw a cloud, and.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Then take an actual cloud and you draw, you.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Draw the cloud, and I mean, I'm not an artist,
so like I want to see yours. Yeah, my cloud.
These are some days my journal I just write, like, really,
there's money in there.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Yeah, I know, I found that.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
I found that.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
The other days I.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Have no idea. Okay, there's my cloud.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Oh did you draw better? Look very different?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Okay, well, well I don't know how else to draw
a cloud.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Cloud look, okay, this is how I interpreted the assignment
to go and try to sketch the cloud as it
looks in the sky.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That is like it looked to me.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Okay, because that looks like a cloud. If you were like,
draw a cloud, I would just draw that. But that's
what the cloud looked like. Okay, okay, like a puffy okay.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
A little like a perfectly puffy.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
See my cloud, You're gonna understand what I mean.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
It was a perfectly puffy, fluffy white cloud. And the
sun was out, so I have the sun.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Yeah, I guess sky Journal. Show that to the camera
so the camera can see if you're watching on YouTube, I.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Don't know what this page says, so, so there's my puffy,
my cloud, my puffy fluffy. It kind of makes me
want to go see what I wrote, what this last
journal injury was, because I have a classic ADHD. I
have like five journals that I bounce around, journal through
good times. Okay, so, oh my poem. What you do
(10:02):
is you sketch the cloud and then you write a poem.
And poetry is gonna look different for everybody. There are
no rules. I chose to rhyme.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Yeah, I follow suit.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Okay, cat followed suit. Can't wait to hear yours. Feeling
all puffy up in the sky perimenopause making me want
to die. Just kidding, it's not that bad. I'm just
tired of randomly feeling annoyed and sad. No, that makes
me want to cry. Yeah, because I know where I
was when I wrote this. At least I get to
(10:35):
sit here next to the sun. I wonder what life
would be like as a nun. Never mind, I don't
think that'd be fun. And so it was a sky
journaling activity. I had no idea where it was going
to take me, but I love the concept because there
was emotion there, Like I felt sad that then I
(10:55):
also was able to laugh. And it doesn't have to
be long, it doesn't have to be overhel But after
I journaled that, I felt better, and so it's I
think you did it and you felt better from what
I know, But I just don't know what the poem is.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
I don't know that I would I would say I
felt better, and I don't want to give people false hope.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Here.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
It helped me give myself compassion for where I was,
and I was able to better understand what was going
on because I knew, like I know why I feel
this way, Like right now, I feel on the verge
of tears. I told you that when I got here,
Like I just feel that today nothing's going nothing's wrong,
everything is fine in my life, Like nothing has changed
from yesterday today, nothing has changed from the week when
(11:37):
I was like I feel so energized. I think that
was like two weeks ago. Nothing has changed in my life.
Just some things that I'm doing in my life have changed.
In that sense, I know why this is happening, but
I just like feel like I'm on the verge of
like I could just go lock myself in the room
in my room for a week. I feel like so
I think me doing this, which I'm thinking about this,
(11:59):
I've never gone and looked at your ideas. I think
I've done that once. And I don't know what made
me do that today, and I like how to scroll?
This was not like one of the top ideas. This
was kind of maybe in the middle. I don't know.
So I'm kind of curious of what made me do
that and why today did I see that? Because if
I saw that on another day, I might have been like, oh,
that's stupid, like you know, like sky Darling Jay, and
(12:22):
like I don't I don't know, but like there's something
about that that I was like, wait a second. And
I read your poem and it didn't make me laugh,
and I was like, okay, I'm giving you the play
by play that I was gonna sit down and I
got some paper and I have a journal. I found a
pad of paper and I was about to draw a cloud,
and I was like, no, you're supposed to go outside
and find the cloud and draw the cloud that you see.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Yeah, well I can't wait to see because I'm like,
what I just I just drew a cloud. Okay, show
me tell me it looks like a it looks like
a peanut or a dragon or a lizard. Oh, it
looks like a whale. It's a whale. Wow. You know
(13:08):
how sometimes clouds look like yeah, it looks it looks righted?
Speaker 1 (13:15):
Are it just loo? Okay? I didn't see any of
those things. But I also didn't put into a perspective.
I made it dark. I thought I was just like,
this is so telling of what because like with my mood, like,
why did I have to draw it color it in
like that?
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Because you were doing then a dark cloud was white.
But this is that you were coloring in the white
you didn't have if you had white paint, yeah, a
white and colored in.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
But you thought that the shading was going to make
me feel like, oh this is soothing. Maybe.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I mean that's what's the beauty of sky journaling. I
think we're learning is that everyone's gonna have their own
interpretation of how to draw or what to draw. I
guess now we're giving details, which I would love our
listeners to do this for homework and if they could
eat em us their poems, that would be great, Like
how fun.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Would that be?
Speaker 2 (14:03):
That would be just what comes out? Yeah, can you
scan it or take a picture and attach it in
the email because I think reading those back on Eric
would be fun and therapeutic for listeners. So if you
do send us your poem, also attach permission to share,
because who knows what may come up for you. If
(14:24):
it's too personal, you don't have to share it, but
you never know, and you know earlier I was saying
it made me feel better, which I like that you
put like.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
I felt compassion for myself.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I felt changed, right, your mood necessarily didn't change. I
think mine did because whenever I name that my wild
hormones or my behavior that just feels really wonky to
me is likely perimenopause. I feel better, and so doing
that poem helped me name it. Who knows what it'll
(14:57):
do for you, but it could be that, yeah, you
just have compassion for yourself, or maybe you do feel
a little bit better. It's information. Yeah, maybe it'll tell
you something. The poem is now going to speak to
you based on what comes out, which I don't think
I have any plans of being a nun. It just
rhymed your limited on your words.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Yeah, yeah I did. I will say I didn't feel better,
I felt compassion, but it gave me an idea of
where I was, like it helped me. It did help me.
I think the point of this was like, help you
slow down and be and it was like, okay, yes,
take a second for yourself so you can recognize where
you are. So then I don't go around projecting this
feeling on other things, because what I'm going through I
(15:36):
just have to sit it out, like wait it out,
like it just I'm going to be here for a
little bit, so I'd like to be able to know
where to put this energy. So help me read you
my poem.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
I cannot wait. I'm ready.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Oh little cloud, you look much like an alligator as
you float through the sky. I imagine you yelling, I
hope I don't see you later. I get it. Sometimes
you just want to be alone. It is going to
make me cry with nothing to do, no one to
answer on the phone. Is it exhausting to float through
the sky all day? Does it feel like a job
(16:07):
or does it feel like play? It sounds nice, but
I guess lots of people are staring at you, judging
what you look like and if you're blocking their view,
if you're giving the sun enough space to shine or
creating the right amount of shade so we can have
a good time. Some people might think you haven't made
but that's a lot of pressure and I don't think
(16:29):
you even get paid. Well this is this is long,
but I love it. I was really into it.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
This is warming my heart.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
I guess what I want you to hear from me is,
if you are tired of being a good cloud all day,
maybe you should just be I feel like doctor Seuss.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
So what I hear it as someone receiving what you're
saying is that maybe during this time you just need
to let what it is be. Yeah, and it's gonna suck, yeah,
but it just has to be.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Yeah, I'm gonna name another feeling. I feel silly because
that poem is like silly. Like as I was writing it,
I was kind of like.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
Oh really, you don't even get paid, like relate to
it a lot, and it was interesting where your mind
just went, Like why did my mind just go like
I hope that O or I bet you're saying I
hope you.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
I don't see you later, like because I want to
just like lock myself in a room for a couple hours, yeah,
maybe by myself. And I can't do that. I mean,
I can't later, but it just was right after this.
It just was interesting to me that like my brain
went there because I could have I mean same with you.
You could have written about anything. So it's very telling.
(17:48):
And also it did bring a little levity. But at
the end it was like, yeah, I'm writing this about
this cloud, but like I just want to like give
myself the grace that I'm not going to be as
fun or like energized or silly or breezy or whatever
right now. I just I'm gonna this is what I'm
working with right now. Alligator Cloud, I love it.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Thank you for sharing that with us. With both of us,
we got emotional when we were reading ours, and then
we also laughed. So I don't know that that will
happen for everybody, but I think it's kind of neat though.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Yeah, I think part of my laughter is avoidance of vulnerability.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Well yeah, it's kind of funny though when you made
like the other you don't even get paid. Yeah, there's
there's levity in it. And also, yes, what's going on
with you could be like, oh, let's avoid this, let's
laugh so I don't cry. But I just I think
it's could be a neat activity for people. I don't
know what's going to come up for people, but if
(18:50):
you need to laugh and cry or just tap into
whatever you're feeling, then it also takes the pressure off
of it being about you because it's about the cloud.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
Yeah, and I'm not good with just random journaling. You
need to prompt, so it was helpful to have like
a prompt, and it was like a simple prompt. I
didn't I just wrote that poem. I didn't write anything
else in there of like, how what's that was just
a cough? Well, oh, I meant like I didn't expand
on my feelings after that. I feel like you are
(19:20):
good at like writing about your day when you do it,
yeah pages, Yeah, and you even reward yourself with money,
seems if that's.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Just I'm keeping it. I found it in there. And
then also I don't know why this ripped out, but
maybe I was angry. But that was August twenty twenty four,
so you never know when I'm gonna grab what journal.
I need to just go around the house and collect them,
and then I need to finish each journal because I
would like to see it through.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
Yeah, So thanks for that tip.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
You're welcome. Hey, there at Feeling Things podcast dot com
is where you can email us your poems and your permission, right,
your consent.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
For like I your release of information.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Yeah, because we're hip hop and here where you are
are therapist, hippa. Is that what y'all fall under? Are
therapist zippa? Is that what y'all fall under? Hippa?
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Can you say that fall under? You can say hip hop?
Speaker 2 (20:27):
I don't know. I always feel what we were talking
about things that like, because I don't want you to
get in trouble, but I know doctors and nurses health
information is yours?
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Like do y'all take is it? The hippoph Yeah, okay,
the hip Yeah. We can't release information of people without
their consent, right for sure, we protect their privacy. See yeah,
but we just have different information than a doctor would have.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Well, something I saw you throw in the doc that
I'm very curious about is pop psychology versus actual psychology.
And I'm very very curious to see what this is about.
My guess is the pop psychology is a lot of
what we see online, sort of the TikTok or Instagram
version of something like therapeutic that's going on in somebody's
(21:14):
life or I don't even know the proper word or
what it would be, but something. But it's like, is
that actually the real definition or what that is? Or
you know, it gets it gets overused and then it
gets muddy and you don't really know what it means.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Well, and then the word the meaning changes. So I
actually found this from the therapists Uncensored podcast posted this
on their Instagram, and I talked a lot about this
when I did unique therapy of like what these things
are and what they are in the pop culture world.
And so this just took four popular terms and talked
(21:50):
about what people think they mean and then what they
actually mean in a clinical setting. And I want to
preface this with something about language. Is that language changes,
Like that's why there's some words we don't need use anymore.
There's some words that meant this and now they mean this,
and like your grandma might say it meaning this, but
you say it meaning this, And that's true for these
things too, and I think it's important to be intentional
(22:13):
about how we use certain words. I also saw I
didn't say this because I didn't fact check it, but
I'm sure there's some truth to it. It was a
research study that talked about how truthful the information you're
getting on TikTok and Instagram is when it comes to
mental health information. And I think what they said is,
I'm going to preface this with I don't actually know
(22:34):
that actual, but it was something like sixty to seventy
percent of the information you're getting on social media platforms
about mental health can be incorrect. Also, I didn't read
the whole article, so I want to say what I imagine
is part of that probably is like it's not completely false,
but it's not completely true.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Well, and then people are left to kind of figure
it out from themselves and then they can kind of
take from that without further conversation or thinking around it.
Something I noticed about myself since we've become closer the
last few years is working on my critical thinking because
I tend to well, first of all, it's exhausting for me. Well, yeah,
(23:16):
I mean I liked a critical thinking. I can and
I want to think for myself, but it can be
you just want to trust hiring to Yes, I rather
trust a source. And when I find somebody that I
like or they seem to be popping off as a kids, say,
I will follow and start to listen and want to
take in everything that they're saying, like you know this,
I had this with Mel Robbins, which I think just
(23:40):
I'm also prefacing that Kat and I might do a
deep dive on smiling because that like, and Cat's been waiting.
She you know, you mentioned like a month ago something
used to do on couch talks when you had you
Need Therapy podcast was deep dives and or wor deep
dives and you miss them. And I thought, okay, well,
(24:00):
let's do a deep dive into Mel Robbins and let
them because I think as a therapist you see some
confusion around that which as a whole, like it's parts
of the idea that are not harmful. But if you're
just kind of taking a snippet from social media, maybe
you're not even reading the whole book, or you do,
but then you're not doing some inner work to figure out, okay,
how does this really apply to me? You're just sort
(24:21):
of starting to throw around let them, let them, let them.
Then it can be harmful and you can speak about
any clients. I feel, like you said, you've had some
people that have been confused by it, but I don't know,
if you can say that hippa hippa, I.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Want to save it for when we do. But in
general is a confusing idea and there's just like what
I'll say about And I have to watch this for
myself because we do post things on social media and
even doing unique therapy, I had to constantly like check
myself of the things that go viral and the things
that do really well on the Internet are the things
(24:57):
that are the most shocking, and the truth is not
that shocking most of the time when it comes to
some of this mental health stuff. Thanks Shannon, and she
just found the actual post and it said analysis of
five hundred TikTok videos with the hashtag mental health or
mental health tips found that more than eighty percent were misleading.
Yeah that's scary, So like, yeah, that's the issue. And
(25:20):
misleading doesn't mean that they were bad, doesn't mean that
they're toxic, doesn't mean that they were like completely wrong.
It's that they weren't completely true. And that I think
the problem is with social media and mental health and
even what we're doing is there is so much nuance
in it that most of the interesting conversations can get
watered down. If we're really sitting there and talking about
(25:42):
all the nuanced because nuance is like not that interesting,
nuance is boring, and nuance is exhausting. But it's there
for a.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
Reason well, and a lot of it gets our attention
because sometimes it's prefaced with and mel will do this,
and this is what I had to realize. I often
was like sucked in by like this thing will change
your life. Do this, and everything will change or be
this way, and it's like it's not that simple, but
it's there's something shocking that like draws you in. And
(26:11):
so then I was hooked and not that And by
the way, the deep dive is not going to be
like a slam No, it's not like it's critical thinking
getting more information and thinking of like some of these
really huge influencers that or she's not even influence her
she is now, but like she started off as like
(26:32):
self help and coach and a lot of people in
that space. There's a lot we could name in the
group the category she falls into, and you just have
to like be aware. And I think I just bought
into it all right away, and Kat had a little
more just you're more hesitant with those people than I
and so I started to use more critical thinking and
(26:52):
then it's like once I wasn't. So it's sort of
like the veil was lifted a little bit and I
start to notice things and I'm like, oh, that doesn't
seem right. And Kat and I even struggle with like
sometimes when we're coming up with titles, we're like, well,
we want people to click and listen, but also we
don't think that this is going to change every single
thing might change your life. Now have we used that before?
Speaker 1 (27:12):
Maybe I don't.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
I don't know, but there might be one little thing
that we feel like, this could be a game changer
for you. But then you're gonna have to try it
for yourself and see what works. And we'll circle back
to the mail thing later.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
But it's a hard to fit. Yeah, it's a hard
dance of Obviously, this is part of our job, and
we have jobs in order to make money and be
an ethical it's hard and that also I was as
I'm saying this, We're always open to feedback. So if
we do something that feels misleading, I would love to
know that. Oh I want to know y. Yeah, And
(27:46):
I could talk about this all day. So let's get
into these this will be like a precursor to the
mail Robins Deep Dive. And again, this is not to
like hate on her. It's more to examine things so
then you can take that information and apply it to
the other things you're seeing. One thing I'll say before
I get into these what I tried to do with
(28:07):
mel because I feel like sometimes I'm such a Debbie
downer with you, because I'm like, oh, come on, like like.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
Because other people I'm a fan of, yes, and I'm
you're be honest. I'm glad you can be honest and
be like Amy, you don't need to fall for every
single person you see on And I'm like, no, no,
no, no no, I just did a ten minute meditation and
it's going to change my life. And you're like, oh
my gosh.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
But like what works for you? Like I don't want
to like what is it? Like? Yuck? You're yum, Like
if it works for you, isn't that the same? Yeah,
I don't know, yuck, You're I like it, Okay, yeah,
don't yuck my young Yeah. Maybe I'm like taking a
different saying, but I think that's a thing. But I
don't want to constantly feel like I'm like taking things
away from you that like you really like he and
you're really interested in and help you. So with Mel,
(28:53):
I feel like I held back a little bit and
like we talked about her a good bit. I feel
like on the fifth thing when we were doing that,
you kept your mouth shut, I kept my mouth shut,
and like there because not everything I'm getting ahead of myself,
but like, not everything she says is like ad or wrong,
Like some of it's I'm like, yeah, I agree with that.
So when you finally said something, I was like, okay,
let's talk about it.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
When I finally said, like, oh, I'm not sure how
I feel about this now, or I couldn't even my
sister gifted me her last book and I couldn't even
finish it.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
But you came to that conclusion on your own my own,
So I, in my own time, like it is not
my job to police what other people believe and think
and do and pay attention to. But what I do
like to do is stuff like these deep dives because
it helps people critically think. And you might not even
know who Mel Robbins is, but because you hear this
conversation about this, you take the ideas we're talking about
and you apply them to the other things you're seeing.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
So yeah, puse and think about I guess too, Like
for anybody that might be a big mel fan. Again,
we keep saying her because it's the example. It's the
first deep dive we're going to do. There will be
multiple deep dives that show up. I'm sure. Should we
decide to do more than just a few that we've
talked about, well, I think there's plenty we could do.
But it's also not to persuade anybody to like, oh,
(30:08):
don't be a fan of her, because also I don't
want to bash anybody or I want to lift people up,
like she's doing her job and she's helping, and she's
helping lots of people. It's just I think I get
frustrated for you now because I see your point as
to like you went to school and you're a therapist
and you have all this work, and you have this oath,
(30:29):
Like therapist taken.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
Take an oath. I don't know we're take an oath,
but like we have an ethical we've ethical guidelines we
have to abide by, and if somebody thinks that we're
breaking those, they can report us to a board. We
have to report to that board, and we might. I mean,
they can suspend our license. They can just give us
some kind of yeah something we can have to do
continue education.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
But where are some of these coaches They don't have
an ethical board can do they don't. They can do
whatever they want and it's fine. And I do think
she has a lot of really amazing guests. This isn't
even so much about her podcasts because the guest she
has like a lot of times, they're brilliant. Yes, that's
the word I was gonna say they are, and the
word wasn't kind of up to me. Remember, I'm tired.
(31:08):
They're brilliant and they have a lot of insight and
they can help, and you know, they're reaching lots of people.
But then sometimes I hear like little tactics that hear
her doing or I'm like, wait, is this genuine or
are you just doing a manipulative tactic which we're all
trying to grow and do things. So then I'm like,
well should we be trying that? You know, we've even
joked on the podcast, like you know, I know you
want to send this to your sister right now, I'll
(31:31):
send this to one person that you know just one
person just like spread it. And it's like, do we
have to say that if people want to send it
to their sister, they'll send it to the sister. Yeah,
not like it's necessarily bad. But but she's done an
episode before where she's talking about little ways you can
get people to do what you want them to do,
and that was sort of one of the examples. And
then I hear her doing.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
It and I'm like, you can't.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
It just feels weird because I'm like, oh, am I
now doing this just because I'm being brainwashed to like
do this. So anyway, moving on popsycleology versus actually psychology.
Speaker 1 (32:01):
Se we could talk about that for the whole podast Okay,
this again comes from the Therapist Uncensored podcast. It's a
great podcast. I will say it's very academic. They have
great guests as well. They're two actual I think they're
both have PhDs. But great podcasts if you want to
just learn about stuff. But they posted the pop psychology definition.
Speaker 3 (32:21):
And what the actual clinical definition or like idea behind
these things are part of me wants to ask you
what you think these mean to say?
Speaker 1 (32:38):
Are you okay?
Speaker 2 (32:39):
I'm a perfect candidate because I am pop culture.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
You might be right because you might know some of
these like clinical term because you also are in therapy.
And okay, yeah, so I think this could be interesting.
So the first one is trauma bonding. So when you
hear the word trauma bonding, what do you think.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
It is when, well, I have two things popping in
my head right now. When you are bonded with somebody
through a trauma that you experienced together, not necessarily if
it happened to both of you, but like I think
of in a relationship, if one person is doing something
to the other person, like maybe they're emotionally abusive, do
you have a trauma bond relationship with that person?
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Like me?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Sometimes it's why you stay. That pops into my head.
And then also when you trauma bond with someone like
you you tell each other you're trauma okay, Like you
meet somebody at a bar and you're like, oh my gosh.
Which when I was in the thick of things, I
wasn't meeting someone at a bar, but I had a
lot going on. And one time I was at a
birthday party and my husband had stuff going on. My
(33:38):
son like my life, my dad died, like my life
was falling apart, but I went to this birthday party
because it was someone close to me. And then at
the party, I just randomly start telling someone there like
everything going on with me, and I left there mortified,
and I was like, what did I just do? But
I just like trauma dumped and they shared some stuff
back too about their life, So I felt like that
was a trauma bond situation.
Speaker 1 (33:58):
No.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
I mean, I've seen them since then, but I have
brought any of it up, and I've been I've left
there the whole drive home, like what did I just do?
Like why did I just unload that? It's not necessarily
wrote a party.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
So perfect actually because you answered the So the pop
psychology definition, like what people I think when they say
I trauma bonded with them, I think they're thinking that
they're what they wrote in this post is when you're
bonding with someone over shared trauma or similar past experiences. Okay,
so that's not in clinical settings when I'm talking to
somebody about trauma bonding, that's not generally what I'm I
(34:29):
understand when they're saying that, that's what they think it means.
But it's what you said at the beginning I am
going to add to what they say because I think
trauma bonding can act you can it can be healthy,
and it's going to sound weird, but it can be
good in a sense. So the actual definition what they
put is a situation where someone develops a strong sympathy, loyalty,
(34:51):
or dependence or attachment towards their abuser. So you bond
with somebody who's you're like, you're in that trauma with them.
I'm blanking on it. But what's the syndrome where you
like fall in love with you capter. Yeah, Stockholm syndrome.
It's like that would a form of trauma.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
Like Stockholm syndrome.
Speaker 1 (35:13):
But also if you go through a trauma with somebody,
you're going to be trauma bonded with them.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
So I see like my sister, like walking through cancer
with our mom and our dad, Like there were certain
things we went through that nobody else would understand, Like
I mean other people that walked through it with their parents.
Maybe that's what I'm talking about, just like in our
family it was like, ah, you wouldn't get it, And
I feel like we're trauma bonded in that way.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Yeah, So that I think there's there's two ways you
can look at that. But that's what that is. It's
not just sharing stories. It's like going through the experience. Gotcha, okay,
so good job a flus.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
I didn't think about the sister part though, that that
makes sense now. So you can be trauma bonded if
you both like a sibling, like if you and your
siblings were raised in an alcoholic home or something, that
could be trauma bond.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
And also, it doesn't even have to be an abuser.
But let's say you walk through, like in your relationship,
one of your partners has a lot of mental health issues,
whether that is addiction or I mean, any other mental
health issue. They might not be abusing you, but you're
going through this very difficult time with them and it
might be hard to separate because you've been through all
(36:16):
that together. You can be it's like a codependency, you know.
So there's trauma bonding. Next one is a fun one. Gaslighting.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
What I know it to be is someone telling you
their truth but it's not the truth. They're trying to
convince you that that's the truth, and like you know
that it's not that they are living in their own world.
It seems and it doesn't matter. Their way is the
truth and they're not going to ever back down from that.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
And it makes you kind of feel crazy.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
Yes, yes, you feel crazy. I have been gas lit before.
It feels crazy.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
Yeah, I mean that's pretty common. People have exaggerated it.
Where the pop term is like they're just lying to you.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
Oh well yeah, like I hear my daughter and her friends,
like teenagers will just be like, oh, stop gaslighting me. Yeah,
I'm like okay, which that's what I'm it's lying, Okay,
it is, but that that seems probably more the more
pop way, but it's still lying, but it's it's more
lying but trying to condense somebody else that they're nuts.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, so the pop way would be the pop way
in popular culture, it's lying or just like sometimes people
just like disagreeing with somebody, they're like, oh, you're gaslighting me.
That's just like disagreeing, or like maybe sometimes you just
lie because you're like lying. It doesn't mean that you're
manipulating somebody in an abusive way or a toxic way.
(37:37):
I mean, line is pretty toxic. The actual clinical term,
or actual clinical way it's viewed is an abuse tactic.
Where are where you are manipulated to question your reality,
memory or sanity, not just disagreeing over what happened. So
this is like blatant, like we're looking at the sky
and it's blue, and that person is saying, what are
(38:00):
you've seen the sky is yellow? And you're sitting there
being like, I see it blue, but like have I thought?
Now you're starting to question, like have I thought blue
is yellow? And yellow is blue? My whole life? Like
what were there? Blatant things in front of you? And
it's to make you feel crazy. So you start questioning
everybody everything, and you start to feel.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
Weak, and if there's a power dynamic, then you definitely
do and you'll eventually just be like, okay, fine, it's yellow.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Versus versus like your daughter being like no, I was
home at curfew because they don't want to get in trouble,
you know, Yeah, that's just lying. Yes, Okay, next one,
This one grinds my gears sometimes triggered yum's my yucks.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
This one really this really yucks my yums?
Speaker 1 (38:47):
Okay, wait, triggered triggered. Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
I just have one thing that's coming to mind, and
it's when you are having an emotional of this even
a visceral like a physical You're so smart, shut up. Okay,
thank you, Paul. No, I mean you're having a response
to something that has happened because of something that has
(39:12):
happened to you in the past.
Speaker 1 (39:13):
Okay. Yes, So pop psychology says someone makes you uncomfortable
or annoyed, like oh, she triggered me.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
Okay, So it doesn't always have to because of something
in the past.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
Well that's the pop psychology. Oh sorry, the actual ding
ding ding amy. A trigger is something that causes a
sudden increase in symptoms like flashbacks in PTSD or compulsions
like in OCD, not just a source of general discomfort.
So yeah, it's something's happening. It's bringing up this actual
visceral use up, big word visceral experience that's creating not
(39:48):
just like oh I was angry or annoyed or bothered me,
but like it's bringing up symptoms that have to do
with your trauma or OCD or something like that. So
good job. You're three for three girl, Are you ready
to go.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
For four seventy five? So far?
Speaker 1 (40:04):
Hit me up.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
I'm gonna get a.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Hundred, Okay, But if you don't get a hundred. It's
also okay, thank you. Intrusive thoughts, thoughts that are intruding.
This one's probably your fartest.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
Well, but here's how I see it again, with my brain,
thoughts that are taking over. They're interrupting what I have
going on.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
And are they thoughts that you really want to happen?
Speaker 2 (40:34):
No, okay, they're not welcome necessarily. I haven't invited them there.
I'm not trying to think them. They're just there, and
I want to make them stop, like I think of
I don't know if this falls into it's the right thing,
but I when I was in the throes of my
eating disorder, I felt like I had a lot of
intrusive thoughts, like about everything. Yeah, like what kind of
(40:57):
workouts I was doing if I walked enough, like what
was on the menu? Like you can't eat that?
Speaker 1 (41:02):
Oh you're as a why'd you eat that? You idiot?
Speaker 2 (41:04):
I mean, I guess that's negative self talk. But they
felt very intrusive in that, like it was ruling my life.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
Yeah, part of that is true. So pop psychology intrusive thoughts,
random thoughts or impulses that you might actually want to
act on. So sometimes like people will say, this is
what I think a lot of people are saying, like
in their tiktoks and stuff, I had this intrusive thought,
and like it's something you might want to do, Like
I had this intrusive thought, so I went and spent
five hundred dollars on makeup, like it was an intrusive
(41:32):
thought that I had to give into, or like I
wanted to eat cake and so then I wouldn't got
a piece of cake versus what intrusive thoughts actually are
unwanted or involuntary thoughts that go against your real values
and desires. You don't want to act on them, and
them coming true would be your worst nightmare. They can
be very prominent in distressing and disorders like PTSD or OCD.
(41:53):
OCD is a big one, Like they have all these
intrusive thoughts that they just like it makes them cringe
when they think about it, or it's like some it
can sometimes be like harm harm, some kind of harming
to themselves and it's like, no, I don't want to
actually do this, but I'm thinking about it, and then
there's comes shame with it and it's very problematic. It's
not just like oh, I had this thought of like
going to buy the skirt, so I had to go
(42:14):
buy it. You know that sounds like an impulsive thought. Well,
the impulse would be doing it right, but it's in truth, Okay,
it's coming in and.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
So they have the thought and then they go buy
the skirts.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
That's just oh yeah, what you're saying, that's an impulsive thought.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Ye yeah, because I'm like, that's not as bad as
like I have a thought of like I can't believe it,
just ate that now I need to throw it up.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
Yes, yes, but like part of you, like I don't
really want to be purging, not like I have this
intrusive thought that I can't get rid of. And sometimes
with OCD is like it feels like you can't get
rid of the thought until you yeah, then have the impulse.
But a lot of those impulses you don't actually want
to happen. So it can be very confusing because you're like,
what does this mean? Does this mean that I want this?
(42:52):
Does it mean you can ask yourself? This mean I'm bad?
Does this mean there's something wrong with me? And it's
not true? Like you can't help those things. That's the
like higher level and I think sometimes when we're talking about,
like I had this thought that I wanted to dye
my hair, so I would and dye my hair. That's
a little different, so.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
You wouldn't put that as a real like an intrusive eye.
Speaker 1 (43:14):
Like and I think, well, that's what I'm saying. With
how words are changing, meaning is it? It kind of
waters down so we have to clarify that this is
this and this is this. Now those thoughts can also
be distressing depending on who you are, So I don't
want to use any of this as a blanket statement
of you might not want to dye your hair and
(43:34):
you do it and you feel like you didn't want
to do that, or like it's something that maybe you
loved your blonde hair, and.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
Like I want to get banks. Yeah, so is that
I woke up with that? That's kind of vermple though thought.
And when I say woke up, I barely slept. So
when I woke up from my little nap last night,
I woke up, should I get Banks? Because I have
a hair appointment tomorrow, no Wednesday, and I want to
get banks.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Now what I would wonder with some of those things
a lot of times because I have that stuff where
I'm like, I mean, I almost got to adopted a
dog yesterday. That's an impulse and that comes from more
so my anxiety and ADHD and me just being kind
of an impulsive person and or me needing some kind
of I mean, we all know how I'm feeling right now.
(44:22):
I need some kind of like high to hold on to.
I had to bet, Catherine, if you're going to get
a dog, you got to sit on it for at
least a week versus if you were going to make
the change like bangs. Is that really just an intrusive
thought or is that this like desire for like some
feel good and change? Yeah, yeah, got it. So again,
like we were saying, there's nuance in everything, So this
(44:43):
conversation is bigger, but generally I wanted to highlight like
there's a difference in how we use some of these
words and what they really mean. And that doesn't mean
that like this stuff over here doesn't matter, but sometimes
it can be confusing for people thinking about like when
people this is something that again grinds my gears is
(45:04):
when the way we talk about bipolar when they're like,
oh that she was so bipolar or she was being
so bipolar that's not what people think bipolar disorder is,
isn't that You're you're thinking A lot of times we
say that when somebody's hot and cold, and that's not
a lot of times what somebody with bipolar disorder even
(45:25):
looks like. And also that's something that they can't help,
and it's an actual mental health disorder.
Speaker 2 (45:31):
That Yeah, I think that I've been guilty years back
in the past of being like, oh so bipolar right now,
like using that word flippantly, but.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
I think, no, shame to you. That was normal.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
No normal, I think so. But I think we also
then have a responsibility once we learn. I personally, in
the last several years, I feel insensitive saying that now.
So I wouldn't say that because and maybe that's because
I had an experience with someone for the first time
that was and I hadn't before, and then I had
a new found respect for what they were going through.
(46:04):
And I don't want to minimize what real people with
bipolar are. And it's like kind of mean are dealing
with yeah, because it's like okay, yeah, no, that's actually
not bipolar. Let me, I'll show you what is. And
you don't want it. I mean it's it's hard and yeah.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
And it's like you're saying that as an insult. So
it's like if if somebody and people do that too,
like oh they're so ADHD, it's like, okay, it's kind
of mean I have that and like that. I don't
want you to talk about my behavior that I can't
help like that or things are hard for me. And
it's also bigger than that that there's.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
A straight on social media like everybody has ADHD.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
There's there's phase, like we're going through the phases of
every disorder. At some point, I feel like like it's
everybody has ADHD, everybody has autism, everybody has OCD, everybody.
I see that in my office as like a constant,
revolving But I.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Don't think I have any of those other things.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
But I think this is part of that too, is
we all can relate to symptoms of all of those things,
like we can all I mean even we can bring
in personality disorders, worderline personality disorder, narcissistic personality disorder. We
all have traits of those. I have traits of both
of those. That doesn't mean that I have those disorders.
And so that's also part of the issue with people.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
How do I say this, Maybe just seeing on social
media if someone's like, oh, if you can't find your keys,
you misplace things all the time, you have time blindness,
you can't ever be on time. Then it's like people like, oh,
my gosh, I have ADHD, but they've never actually gone
and been tested, yeah, to figure out if they really
have it. Because I've been tested once in college and
(47:44):
then later probably in the last five years from someone
you connected me with, because I kind of thought, well,
maybe I've outgrown it.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
It's some wishful thinking, and I was like, I.
Speaker 2 (47:54):
Haven't still the same, But I think if some of
those things sounding familiar with you, then yeah, and you
have the resources try to do the steps to go
get tested, so then.
Speaker 1 (48:05):
Well, it can feel when you see those videos, it
can feel like like a relief to have an answer
to some things that you might not like about yourself
or some things that you've been struggling with. So I
think that's one of the reasons we grab onto that,
like I must have this. But also it causes panic
and other people of like I've had clients coming to
my office and be like, why haven't you told me
(48:25):
that I have this, and I'm like, because you don't.
And also sometimes in diagnos scenes specifically like more so
personality disorders, there is a nuance in giving that diagnosis
also in like really figuring it out, because it's over diagnosed,
and I mean under it's misdiagnosed all the time. So
(48:46):
I can't just know somebody for a couple sessions and
be like, this is what you have for sure, So.
Speaker 2 (48:52):
And you're knowing the version that's showing up in your office.
Speaker 1 (48:55):
Oh yeah, yeah so and over time, yeah, over time,
hopefully you start to see like the cracks and the
presentation versus the reality. And as a client, I show
up try to show my best self as well in
the therapy room. So I think that that's that has
created some difficulty in being a therapist because of the stuff.
And again I am saying that as I am hosting
(49:19):
a podcast talking about mental health, so I know that
I have to monitor that too, and I want to
be open to that feedback to if I'm presenting things
in a way that feels too overarching or too I
wanted to say simpleized, that's not a word plistic, sure,
but anyway, my whole point in doing this and reading
this is just giving us again a way to critically
(49:42):
think more and opening our eyes to the bigger picture
of what some of these things mean. And it's not
to shame anybody, because if I didn't work in this field,
I would be on the pop culture part of all
of this. Like how why else?
Speaker 2 (49:56):
Why wouldn't I welcome, welcome to our side? I guess yeah,
being so close to you, it's helped me and I
appreciate it, and I think others listening will appreciate this too.
It just gives you a different perspective when you're doom scrolling,
which pro tip set a timer. Doom scrolling in itself
not totally bad, but if you're doing it for a
long period of time, stop it'll change your life. Just kidding.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Set this timer. It'll change your life in five minutes.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
That's all you need. Let's close with a win, big
or small. So my son is in summer school and
something that the principal said they're doing is encouraging the kids,
Like they have a big poster board and they're writing
down their wins of the day or wins of the week.
Big or small, doesn't matter, but each kid has to participate,
(50:46):
and he was just sending out an email to the
parents talking about how it's really cool to see them
be able to look at their day and look at
their life and come up with something like a win,
big or small. So for both of us, today's been
you more so than me, Like I'm just tired of
other things going on and you're feeling melancholy and like
an unpaid cloud.
Speaker 1 (51:08):
But I showed up.
Speaker 2 (51:09):
But you're here and you showed up, and I guess
let's just find a win. Like what's a win for you?
Speaker 1 (51:14):
Oh, you shut up? Yeah, that's why I was. Oh,
that was your wind.
Speaker 2 (51:18):
Yeah, you're doing it.
Speaker 1 (51:20):
I feel like that's big. No, you showed up.
Speaker 2 (51:23):
That's your win.
Speaker 1 (51:24):
And I'll do too, because it was a win for
me to do that exercise, because I don't usually do journaling,
so for me to actually stop and be like, Okay,
I can stop and do this and I'll get back
to my work in a second.
Speaker 2 (51:35):
I needed to go home and read your poem to Patrick,
your husband.
Speaker 1 (51:40):
He's already been so sweet today, so I wonder if
he'll be like, oh my gosh, like, let's frame it's
you can quit your job, stay home, right, I'm just kidding.
I don't want to quit my job.
Speaker 2 (51:52):
You need to keep that, I know. But we all
have those moments where it's like I'm done. Yeah, I'm
moving to Mexico.
Speaker 1 (51:59):
Is that where you would me?
Speaker 2 (52:00):
No, I don't know why I said that. I think
it's my cousin is moving there. Oh yeah, I don't
know if she said that publicly yet, so I won't
say which cousin.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
Yeah, you have so many cousins. Who can so many
cousins I do?
Speaker 2 (52:12):
I have lots of cousins on my dad's side, my
mom's side.
Speaker 1 (52:15):
What's your win?
Speaker 2 (52:16):
My wind is by Mexico, though I did mean like
more of like the Pacific side. Maybe I could see
myself going there, not like no way of a Larido. Oh,
I never haven't heard of that city. Oh it's the border. Okay,
let me let me think of a win. I've been
good about drinking my water today. I have my measuring cup,
and that is what I'm gonna do because I've been
(52:37):
getting headaches and I know it's because I'm dehydrated. So cheers.
Speaker 1 (52:44):
I have all my water bottles and you have your
measuring cup.
Speaker 2 (52:47):
This is my favorite thing to drink out of I
will drink all my water if I have my measuring cup,
and I know it's made of plastic, and I don't
know if it's giving me microplastics in my brain, but
it's fine.
Speaker 1 (52:55):
Do you really want me to cheers to you? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (52:57):
Okay, let's just close with the cheers because we both did.
This is our wins. We're winning cheers winning. Who used
to say that, Charlie Sheen? Oh you don't remember, right
when hashtagging you were coming in, they didn't drink. Oh
do you have to drink after cheers?
Speaker 1 (53:11):
And you have to make eye contact?
Speaker 2 (53:13):
Oh my gosh. Alex, my boyfriend, he told me that
exact same thing. He said, I cheers and look away.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
Do you want to know where cheers came from? Did
I tell you this already?
Speaker 2 (53:20):
You don't know.
Speaker 1 (53:22):
I learned this when I went to Italy, So cheers
came from back in the day, the Romans, the whoever?
Speaker 2 (53:27):
Oh yes, yes, I've told us.
Speaker 1 (53:29):
They would all cheers their glasses to make sure and
they would clink them so a little bit would go
into other people's and it would make sure that nobody
poisoned each other. So I was like I'm not going
to poison you because you're going to clink my glass
and then I would be poisoning myself.
Speaker 2 (53:42):
Bam. You know that is a fun fact. Thank you
for letting us know. People can use that this weekend.
Speaker 1 (53:48):
Wait, I think that was from the Romans or was
that from the Boston? Do I learn that in Boston?
Speaker 2 (53:55):
I feel like you would come back from overseas. When
you told us that, it was like on the fifth thing.
Speaker 1 (53:59):
No, huzza is from Boston. They would cheers and go, huzza.
Speaker 2 (54:04):
There you go. It's okay.
Speaker 1 (54:06):
We're not We're not here to get You're not facts.
Speaker 2 (54:10):
We're not a history podcast. Yeah, we're a therapy podcast
because Cat's a therapist and we hope you have the
day you need to have.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
Bye. Bye,
All right, break it down. If you ever have feelings
that you just won't mayby a cat, got your cob
and locking no.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Brother lady's and felts, do you just follow ann the
spirit where.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
It's all the front over real stuff to the chill
stuff and am but Swayne. Sometimes the best thing you
can do it just stop you feel things. This is
feeling things with Amy and Cat.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Happy Tuesday. Welcome to feeling things. I'm Amy and I'm Cat.
And my feeling of the day, well, I guess we
both have them. I have a question about mine though.
It's tired of feeling like I know that. Like physically
I feel tired, but it's.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
Not a are you feeling emotion?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
No, I'm just tired.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Oh so that's my feeling, the physical feeling.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Yeah, it's a physical So physically I feel tired. I
did not sleep last night.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Do you know what I do? Oh? Do you want
to share?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Sure? But no judgment.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I'm not judging.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
This is a safe space. Yes, okay, you know how
I've been adderall free for all year.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Did you take one?
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Took one? I took one yesterday because it was strategic.
I had a lot to do and of course I
have other tools I can implement, but this is a
tool that I have. Like I've had that bottle all
year and I haven't dipped into it. But I dipped
in yesterday and guess what, I got it all done.
But then I couldn't go to sleep because my body
just wasn't used to it. Once I got used to adderall,
(01:28):
I could take it and sleep, no problem.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
It's also okay, you prescribe that medication.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
I am prescribed that message, so it's not like you're.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
A drug addict right now. Dipped into your stash like
that's a medication.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Year. When I opened up my drawer and I pulled
it out, I was like, okay, here goes nothing. And
then I took it and then it was interesting. I
don't know exactly what it's doing, not a doctor, but
whatever's during to my neurotransmitters. I liked it and I
felt just capable of doing. And while I was doing it,
(02:00):
I was thinking, is this what some people just do?
Like they just take the thing outside and finally rinse
that off. I had a thought of cleaning the basketball
goal that popped into my mind, like it needs a
new net, and then the glass the basketball goal, the
on the driveway, the glass part is a little dirty,
and I did have a thought that this is where
(02:20):
I'm also proud of myself, and I was like, that's
not why we took out all. We didn't take out
all to clean the basketball goal. Would it look better, yes,
but you took it for a purpose. And we're prepping
for a vacation and getting everybody packed and I normally
pack the night before a trip or the morning.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Of yeah, right before you leave.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
So part of my planning and awareness was I'm gonna
get as much done as possible a week ahead of time,
and that was my day to do it. So I
did it and I'm not using again today. Okay, can
you say that in different now. I was just making
a little joke. I know, Kathy Derakis, so we need
(03:02):
to take this seriously. I know that I had permission
to take it, and I wanted to make sure I
could share because I know I've been candid about my journey,
and I guess part of me feels a little bit
of shame if I'm being honest, of like, why can't
I just function this way without it? And I will
set that aside because there's nothing wrong with me. This
is the brain that I have, and some days naturally
(03:22):
I'm able to tap into it, and I have other
tools that will get me there. But yesterday I knew
I needed the extra help and so I took it
and it helped me. Like I got it done and
I'm thankful.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
I just think it's interesting. I feel this too, that
for whatever reason, some people who have ADHD or anything
it can be depression, anxiety, or whatever, would feel like
they're cheating by taking a medication that puts them on
the even playing field with other people. Like hearing you
say that, I get it. I relate to that too.
(03:54):
Sometimes it feels like me taking the medication that is
prescribed to me to help me function normally feels like cheating,
when in reality it's just putting you on an even
playing field. There's a lot of I think rhetoric around
talk that I think helps people feel that way. But
it's just when you put it that way, it's like
you are working harder. I'm gonna say this, and you
(04:15):
tell me what you think. Most days you have to
work harder to function the way a neurotypical person functions,
and you don't complain about it. You do it. I
think sometimes you get down on yourself because you don't
perform the same way, But like you're working harder, So
why would there be a need for you to feel
(04:36):
shame to just like have a day that everybody else has.
Like it's almost like give myself a break, but it's
not even a break, it's just normal. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
No, thank you for saying that that helps, like the
even playing field. I have heard that before, but obviously
hadn't thought of it in a while, and certainly not
in this case. So that already is helping me. Like
hearing you say that, I'm sure it's helping others, whether
it's acation for anything. It doesn't even have to be
ADHD could be for whatever it is that you need
to have it. I guess it's just you know, you
(05:06):
kind of go. I went six months. It's not like
I was on some streak. I didn't plan on breaking
it at all. It was sort of a Saturday night decision.
When I wake up tomorrow, I think I'm going to
take it, because.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
It's almost like self care. Tell take yes.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
I know that I will get everything done with ease.
And it wasn't like I was running around some energizer, Bunny.
I was just moving from one thing to the next
with flow and purpose and ease, like it just felt
good and nothing was like a big deal. It was like, Okay,
now I'm going to go do this. And I was
completing tasks because I can do a bunch of things.
(05:43):
But I go and I start a task and then
I'm like, oh, now I'm in the kitchen doing the dishes.
I was doing a load of laundry and the laundry
hasn't started yet, but.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Oh I didn't switch my laundry before I came over here, damn.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
So how are you feeling? So that's my feeling, you know, Yeah, which,
thank you for talking me through that.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
I relate to all you're saying because also, I'm not
taking medication right now, not because I don't want to,
but because I'm trying to do other things that that
medication does not mix well with. So I've been feeling
kind of down on myself for not doing things with
ease the way that I normally, well not even normally do,
(06:22):
but the way that I had been operating, Like a
phone call takes a lot of energy. But outside of that,
I texted you this morning and said, I'm feeling SIB.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Which do you want to explain to any new listeners
what SIB means? Sorry, I beatchy in case we have
small ears listening. Yeah, sorry, I witchy with a B.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
That's our new code.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
It's our code for I guess we developed it when
I was being you and I said, well, you can
just say if you need to warn me, sib. Yeah,
and then I can say to you SIB yeah, And
it helps just cut the edge, like there's no it's
like this is a safe space.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I am feeling a little bit of that. But I
think really what I'm feeling is like melancholy, like just low.
And I was feeling that before I started working on
podcast stuff this morning and I found something. I want
you to explain it because it's yours that I use,
and I did. That was really helpful that I thought
we could talk about, you know what I'm trying.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Yeah, so a little behind the scenes baseball. We have
a Google doc with different things like cats ideas, Amy's ideas,
and I know you did the exercise and you haven't
shown me. So just because we have this Google doc
doesn't mean we always know exactly what the other person's
going to say it's just a general prompt or idea
or activity like this is an activity and listeners can
(07:47):
do it too, Like, for example, you had no idea
I took out roll yesterday. You didn't know I was
going to say that. I didn't even know I was
going to say that. Honestly, I was going to keep
it to myself.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
But then I thought, I then I didn't take my
medication today, so it just came out right.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
But then I thought, I know exactly why I'm tired. Yeah,
and I've been telling you since you got to my
house that I'm tired.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
I did our honesty circle.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Right, and so then but it's like, well, why didn't
I sleep. It's not like I'm perplexed by it. I
know exactly why. So I thought I would just finally
tell you, which you didn't know that. So some stuff
is we try to keep as organic as possible, which
is why Kat hasn't shared her activity with me. My
activity was already in the Google docs, so you could
see my example. But it's called sky journaling. And this
(08:28):
is an exercise that you can do if you're wanting
to process feelings. So you can go outside with your
journal and find a cloud, look into the sky and
draw a cloud, and.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Then take an actual cloud and you draw, you.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Draw the cloud, and I mean, I'm not an artist,
so like I want to see yours. Yeah, my cloud.
These are some days my journal I just write, like, really,
there's money in there.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Yeah, I know, I found that.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
I found that.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
The other days I.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Have no idea. Okay, there's my cloud.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Oh did you draw better? Look very different?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Okay, well, well I don't know how else to draw
a cloud.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Cloud look, okay, this is how I interpreted the assignment
to go and try to sketch the cloud as it
looks in the sky.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That is like it looked to me.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Okay, because that looks like a cloud. If you were like,
draw a cloud, I would just draw that. But that's
what the cloud looked like. Okay, okay, like a puffy okay.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
A little like a perfectly puffy.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
See my cloud, You're gonna understand what I mean.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
It was a perfectly puffy, fluffy white cloud. And the
sun was out, so I have the sun.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Yeah, I guess sky Journal. Show that to the camera
so the camera can see if you're watching on YouTube, I.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Don't know what this page says, so, so there's my puffy,
my cloud, my puffy fluffy. It kind of makes me
want to go see what I wrote, what this last
journal injury was, because I have a classic ADHD. I
have like five journals that I bounce around, journal through
good times. Okay, so, oh my poem. What you do
(10:02):
is you sketch the cloud and then you write a poem.
And poetry is gonna look different for everybody. There are
no rules. I chose to rhyme.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Yeah, I follow suit.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Okay, cat followed suit. Can't wait to hear yours. Feeling
all puffy up in the sky perimenopause making me want
to die. Just kidding, it's not that bad. I'm just
tired of randomly feeling annoyed and sad. No, that makes
me want to cry. Yeah, because I know where I
was when I wrote this. At least I get to
(10:35):
sit here next to the sun. I wonder what life
would be like as a nun. Never mind, I don't
think that'd be fun. And so it was a sky
journaling activity. I had no idea where it was going
to take me, but I love the concept because there
was emotion there, Like I felt sad that then I
(10:55):
also was able to laugh. And it doesn't have to
be long, it doesn't have to be overhel But after
I journaled that, I felt better, and so it's I
think you did it and you felt better from what
I know, But I just don't know what the poem is.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
I don't know that I would I would say I
felt better, and I don't want to give people false hope.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Here.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
It helped me give myself compassion for where I was,
and I was able to better understand what was going
on because I knew, like I know why I feel
this way, Like right now, I feel on the verge
of tears. I told you that when I got here,
Like I just feel that today nothing's going nothing's wrong,
everything is fine in my life, Like nothing has changed
from yesterday today, nothing has changed from the week when
(11:37):
I was like I feel so energized. I think that
was like two weeks ago. Nothing has changed in my life.
Just some things that I'm doing in my life have changed.
In that sense, I know why this is happening, but
I just like feel like I'm on the verge of
like I could just go lock myself in the room
in my room for a week. I feel like so
I think me doing this, which I'm thinking about this,
(11:59):
I've never gone and looked at your ideas. I think
I've done that once. And I don't know what made
me do that today, and I like how to scroll?
This was not like one of the top ideas. This
was kind of maybe in the middle. I don't know.
So I'm kind of curious of what made me do
that and why today did I see that? Because if
I saw that on another day, I might have been like, oh,
that's stupid, like you know, like sky Darling Jay, and
(12:22):
like I don't I don't know, but like there's something
about that that I was like, wait a second. And
I read your poem and it didn't make me laugh,
and I was like, okay, I'm giving you the play
by play that I was gonna sit down and I
got some paper and I have a journal. I found a
pad of paper and I was about to draw a cloud,
and I was like, no, you're supposed to go outside
and find the cloud and draw the cloud that you see.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Yeah, well I can't wait to see because I'm like,
what I just I just drew a cloud. Okay, show
me tell me it looks like a it looks like
a peanut or a dragon or a lizard. Oh, it
looks like a whale. It's a whale. Wow. You know
(13:08):
how sometimes clouds look like yeah, it looks it looks righted?
Speaker 1 (13:15):
Are it just loo? Okay? I didn't see any of
those things. But I also didn't put into a perspective.
I made it dark. I thought I was just like,
this is so telling of what because like with my mood, like,
why did I have to draw it color it in
like that?
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Because you were doing then a dark cloud was white.
But this is that you were coloring in the white
you didn't have if you had white paint, yeah, a
white and colored in.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
But you thought that the shading was going to make
me feel like, oh this is soothing. Maybe.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I mean that's what's the beauty of sky journaling. I
think we're learning is that everyone's gonna have their own
interpretation of how to draw or what to draw. I
guess now we're giving details, which I would love our
listeners to do this for homework and if they could
eat em us their poems, that would be great, Like
how fun.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Would that be?
Speaker 2 (14:03):
That would be just what comes out? Yeah, can you
scan it or take a picture and attach it in
the email because I think reading those back on Eric
would be fun and therapeutic for listeners. So if you
do send us your poem, also attach permission to share,
because who knows what may come up for you. If
(14:24):
it's too personal, you don't have to share it, but
you never know, and you know earlier I was saying
it made me feel better, which I like that you
put like.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
I felt compassion for myself.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I felt changed, right, your mood necessarily didn't change. I
think mine did because whenever I name that my wild
hormones or my behavior that just feels really wonky to
me is likely perimenopause. I feel better, and so doing
that poem helped me name it. Who knows what it'll
(14:57):
do for you, but it could be that, yeah, you
just have compassion for yourself, or maybe you do feel
a little bit better. It's information. Yeah, maybe it'll tell
you something. The poem is now going to speak to
you based on what comes out, which I don't think
I have any plans of being a nun. It just
rhymed your limited on your words.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Yeah, yeah I did. I will say I didn't feel better,
I felt compassion, but it gave me an idea of
where I was, like it helped me. It did help me.
I think the point of this was like, help you
slow down and be and it was like, okay, yes,
take a second for yourself so you can recognize where
you are. So then I don't go around projecting this
feeling on other things, because what I'm going through I
(15:36):
just have to sit it out, like wait it out,
like it just I'm going to be here for a
little bit, so I'd like to be able to know
where to put this energy. So help me read you
my poem.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
I cannot wait. I'm ready.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Oh little cloud, you look much like an alligator as
you float through the sky. I imagine you yelling, I
hope I don't see you later. I get it. Sometimes
you just want to be alone. It is going to
make me cry with nothing to do, no one to
answer on the phone. Is it exhausting to float through
the sky all day? Does it feel like a job
(16:07):
or does it feel like play? It sounds nice, but
I guess lots of people are staring at you, judging
what you look like and if you're blocking their view,
if you're giving the sun enough space to shine or
creating the right amount of shade so we can have
a good time. Some people might think you haven't made
but that's a lot of pressure and I don't think
(16:29):
you even get paid. Well this is this is long,
but I love it. I was really into it.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
This is warming my heart.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
I guess what I want you to hear from me is,
if you are tired of being a good cloud all day,
maybe you should just be I feel like doctor Seuss.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
So what I hear it as someone receiving what you're
saying is that maybe during this time you just need
to let what it is be. Yeah, and it's gonna suck, yeah,
but it just has to be.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Yeah, I'm gonna name another feeling. I feel silly because
that poem is like silly. Like as I was writing it,
I was kind of like.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
Oh really, you don't even get paid, like relate to
it a lot, and it was interesting where your mind
just went, Like why did my mind just go like
I hope that O or I bet you're saying I
hope you.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
I don't see you later, like because I want to
just like lock myself in a room for a couple hours, yeah,
maybe by myself. And I can't do that. I mean,
I can't later, but it just was right after this.
It just was interesting to me that like my brain
went there because I could have I mean same with you.
You could have written about anything. So it's very telling.
(17:48):
And also it did bring a little levity. But at
the end it was like, yeah, I'm writing this about
this cloud, but like I just want to like give
myself the grace that I'm not going to be as
fun or like energized or silly or breezy or whatever
right now. I just I'm gonna this is what I'm
working with right now. Alligator Cloud, I love it.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Thank you for sharing that with us. With both of us,
we got emotional when we were reading ours, and then
we also laughed. So I don't know that that will
happen for everybody, but I think it's kind of neat though.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Yeah, I think part of my laughter is avoidance of vulnerability.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Well yeah, it's kind of funny though when you made
like the other you don't even get paid. Yeah, there's
there's levity in it. And also, yes, what's going on
with you could be like, oh, let's avoid this, let's
laugh so I don't cry. But I just I think
it's could be a neat activity for people. I don't
know what's going to come up for people, but if
(18:50):
you need to laugh and cry or just tap into
whatever you're feeling, then it also takes the pressure off
of it being about you because it's about the cloud.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
Yeah, and I'm not good with just random journaling. You
need to prompt, so it was helpful to have like
a prompt, and it was like a simple prompt. I
didn't I just wrote that poem. I didn't write anything
else in there of like, how what's that was just
a cough? Well, oh, I meant like I didn't expand
on my feelings after that. I feel like you are
(19:20):
good at like writing about your day when you do it,
yeah pages, Yeah, and you even reward yourself with money,
seems if that's.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Just I'm keeping it. I found it in there. And
then also I don't know why this ripped out, but
maybe I was angry. But that was August twenty twenty four,
so you never know when I'm gonna grab what journal.
I need to just go around the house and collect them,
and then I need to finish each journal because I
would like to see it through.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
Yeah, So thanks for that tip.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
You're welcome. Hey, there at Feeling Things podcast dot com
is where you can email us your poems and your permission, right,
your consent.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
For like I your release of information.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Yeah, because we're hip hop and here where you are
are therapist, hippa. Is that what y'all fall under? Are
therapist zippa? Is that what y'all fall under? Hippa?
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Can you say that fall under? You can say hip hop?
Speaker 2 (20:27):
I don't know. I always feel what we were talking
about things that like, because I don't want you to
get in trouble, but I know doctors and nurses health
information is yours?
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Like do y'all take is it? The hippoph Yeah, okay,
the hip Yeah. We can't release information of people without
their consent, right for sure, we protect their privacy. See yeah,
but we just have different information than a doctor would have.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Well, something I saw you throw in the doc that
I'm very curious about is pop psychology versus actual psychology.
And I'm very very curious to see what this is about.
My guess is the pop psychology is a lot of
what we see online, sort of the TikTok or Instagram
version of something like therapeutic that's going on in somebody's
(21:14):
life or I don't even know the proper word or
what it would be, but something. But it's like, is
that actually the real definition or what that is? Or
you know, it gets it gets overused and then it
gets muddy and you don't really know what it means.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Well, and then the word the meaning changes. So I
actually found this from the therapists Uncensored podcast posted this
on their Instagram, and I talked a lot about this
when I did unique therapy of like what these things
are and what they are in the pop culture world.
And so this just took four popular terms and talked
(21:50):
about what people think they mean and then what they
actually mean in a clinical setting. And I want to
preface this with something about language. Is that language changes,
Like that's why there's some words we don't need use anymore.
There's some words that meant this and now they mean this,
and like your grandma might say it meaning this, but
you say it meaning this, And that's true for these
things too, and I think it's important to be intentional
(22:13):
about how we use certain words. I also saw I
didn't say this because I didn't fact check it, but
I'm sure there's some truth to it. It was a
research study that talked about how truthful the information you're
getting on TikTok and Instagram is when it comes to
mental health information. And I think what they said is,
I'm going to preface this with I don't actually know
(22:34):
that actual, but it was something like sixty to seventy
percent of the information you're getting on social media platforms
about mental health can be incorrect. Also, I didn't read
the whole article, so I want to say what I imagine
is part of that probably is like it's not completely false,
but it's not completely true.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Well, and then people are left to kind of figure
it out from themselves and then they can kind of
take from that without further conversation or thinking around it.
Something I noticed about myself since we've become closer the
last few years is working on my critical thinking because
I tend to well, first of all, it's exhausting for me. Well, yeah,
(23:16):
I mean I liked a critical thinking. I can and
I want to think for myself, but it can be
you just want to trust hiring to Yes, I rather
trust a source. And when I find somebody that I
like or they seem to be popping off as a kids, say,
I will follow and start to listen and want to
take in everything that they're saying, like you know this,
I had this with Mel Robbins, which I think just
(23:40):
I'm also prefacing that Kat and I might do a
deep dive on smiling because that like, and Cat's been waiting.
She you know, you mentioned like a month ago something
used to do on couch talks when you had you
Need Therapy podcast was deep dives and or wor deep
dives and you miss them. And I thought, okay, well,
(24:00):
let's do a deep dive into Mel Robbins and let
them because I think as a therapist you see some
confusion around that which as a whole, like it's parts
of the idea that are not harmful. But if you're
just kind of taking a snippet from social media, maybe
you're not even reading the whole book, or you do,
but then you're not doing some inner work to figure out, okay,
how does this really apply to me? You're just sort
(24:21):
of starting to throw around let them, let them, let them.
Then it can be harmful and you can speak about
any clients. I feel, like you said, you've had some
people that have been confused by it, but I don't know,
if you can say that hippa hippa, I.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Want to save it for when we do. But in
general is a confusing idea and there's just like what
I'll say about And I have to watch this for
myself because we do post things on social media and
even doing unique therapy, I had to constantly like check
myself of the things that go viral and the things
that do really well on the Internet are the things
(24:57):
that are the most shocking, and the truth is not
that shocking most of the time when it comes to
some of this mental health stuff. Thanks Shannon, and she
just found the actual post and it said analysis of
five hundred TikTok videos with the hashtag mental health or
mental health tips found that more than eighty percent were misleading.
Yeah that's scary, So like, yeah, that's the issue. And
(25:20):
misleading doesn't mean that they were bad, doesn't mean that
they're toxic, doesn't mean that they were like completely wrong.
It's that they weren't completely true. And that I think
the problem is with social media and mental health and
even what we're doing is there is so much nuance
in it that most of the interesting conversations can get
watered down. If we're really sitting there and talking about
(25:42):
all the nuanced because nuance is like not that interesting,
nuance is boring, and nuance is exhausting. But it's there
for a.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
Reason well, and a lot of it gets our attention
because sometimes it's prefaced with and mel will do this,
and this is what I had to realize. I often
was like sucked in by like this thing will change
your life. Do this, and everything will change or be
this way, and it's like it's not that simple, but
it's there's something shocking that like draws you in. And
(26:11):
so then I was hooked and not that And by
the way, the deep dive is not going to be
like a slam No, it's not like it's critical thinking
getting more information and thinking of like some of these
really huge influencers that or she's not even influence her
she is now, but like she started off as like
(26:32):
self help and coach and a lot of people in
that space. There's a lot we could name in the
group the category she falls into, and you just have
to like be aware. And I think I just bought
into it all right away, and Kat had a little
more just you're more hesitant with those people than I
and so I started to use more critical thinking and
(26:52):
then it's like once I wasn't. So it's sort of
like the veil was lifted a little bit and I
start to notice things and I'm like, oh, that doesn't
seem right. And Kat and I even struggle with like
sometimes when we're coming up with titles, we're like, well,
we want people to click and listen, but also we
don't think that this is going to change every single
thing might change your life. Now have we used that before?
Speaker 1 (27:12):
Maybe I don't.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
I don't know, but there might be one little thing
that we feel like, this could be a game changer
for you. But then you're gonna have to try it
for yourself and see what works. And we'll circle back
to the mail thing later.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
But it's a hard to fit. Yeah, it's a hard
dance of Obviously, this is part of our job, and
we have jobs in order to make money and be
an ethical it's hard and that also I was as
I'm saying this, We're always open to feedback. So if
we do something that feels misleading, I would love to
know that. Oh I want to know y. Yeah, And
(27:46):
I could talk about this all day. So let's get
into these this will be like a precursor to the
mail Robins Deep Dive. And again, this is not to
like hate on her. It's more to examine things so
then you can take that information and apply it to
the other things you're seeing. One thing I'll say before
I get into these what I tried to do with
(28:07):
mel because I feel like sometimes I'm such a Debbie
downer with you, because I'm like, oh, come on, like like.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
Because other people I'm a fan of, yes, and I'm
you're be honest. I'm glad you can be honest and
be like Amy, you don't need to fall for every
single person you see on And I'm like, no, no,
no, no no, I just did a ten minute meditation and
it's going to change my life. And you're like, oh
my gosh.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
But like what works for you? Like I don't want
to like what is it? Like? Yuck? You're yum, Like
if it works for you, isn't that the same? Yeah,
I don't know, yuck, You're I like it, Okay, yeah,
don't yuck my young Yeah. Maybe I'm like taking a
different saying, but I think that's a thing. But I
don't want to constantly feel like I'm like taking things
away from you that like you really like he and
you're really interested in and help you. So with Mel,
(28:53):
I feel like I held back a little bit and
like we talked about her a good bit. I feel
like on the fifth thing when we were doing that,
you kept your mouth shut, I kept my mouth shut,
and like there because not everything I'm getting ahead of myself,
but like, not everything she says is like ad or wrong,
Like some of it's I'm like, yeah, I agree with that.
So when you finally said something, I was like, okay,
let's talk about it.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
When I finally said, like, oh, I'm not sure how
I feel about this now, or I couldn't even my
sister gifted me her last book and I couldn't even
finish it.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
But you came to that conclusion on your own my own,
So I, in my own time, like it is not
my job to police what other people believe and think
and do and pay attention to. But what I do
like to do is stuff like these deep dives because
it helps people critically think. And you might not even
know who Mel Robbins is, but because you hear this
conversation about this, you take the ideas we're talking about
and you apply them to the other things you're seeing.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
So yeah, puse and think about I guess too, Like
for anybody that might be a big mel fan. Again,
we keep saying her because it's the example. It's the
first deep dive we're going to do. There will be
multiple deep dives that show up. I'm sure. Should we
decide to do more than just a few that we've
talked about, well, I think there's plenty we could do.
But it's also not to persuade anybody to like, oh,
(30:08):
don't be a fan of her, because also I don't
want to bash anybody or I want to lift people up,
like she's doing her job and she's helping, and she's
helping lots of people. It's just I think I get
frustrated for you now because I see your point as
to like you went to school and you're a therapist
and you have all this work, and you have this oath,
(30:29):
Like therapist taken.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
Take an oath. I don't know we're take an oath,
but like we have an ethical we've ethical guidelines we
have to abide by, and if somebody thinks that we're
breaking those, they can report us to a board. We
have to report to that board, and we might. I mean,
they can suspend our license. They can just give us
some kind of yeah something we can have to do
continue education.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
But where are some of these coaches They don't have
an ethical board can do they don't. They can do
whatever they want and it's fine. And I do think
she has a lot of really amazing guests. This isn't
even so much about her podcasts because the guest she
has like a lot of times, they're brilliant. Yes, that's
the word I was gonna say they are, and the
word wasn't kind of up to me. Remember, I'm tired.
(31:08):
They're brilliant and they have a lot of insight and
they can help, and you know, they're reaching lots of people.
But then sometimes I hear like little tactics that hear
her doing or I'm like, wait, is this genuine or
are you just doing a manipulative tactic which we're all
trying to grow and do things. So then I'm like,
well should we be trying that? You know, we've even
joked on the podcast, like you know, I know you
want to send this to your sister right now, I'll
(31:31):
send this to one person that you know just one
person just like spread it. And it's like, do we
have to say that if people want to send it
to their sister, they'll send it to the sister. Yeah,
not like it's necessarily bad. But but she's done an
episode before where she's talking about little ways you can
get people to do what you want them to do,
and that was sort of one of the examples. And
then I hear her doing.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
It and I'm like, you can't.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
It just feels weird because I'm like, oh, am I
now doing this just because I'm being brainwashed to like
do this. So anyway, moving on popsycleology versus actually psychology.
Speaker 1 (32:01):
Se we could talk about that for the whole podast Okay,
this again comes from the Therapist Uncensored podcast. It's a
great podcast. I will say it's very academic. They have
great guests as well. They're two actual I think they're
both have PhDs. But great podcasts if you want to
just learn about stuff. But they posted the pop psychology definition.
Speaker 3 (32:21):
And what the actual clinical definition or like idea behind
these things are part of me wants to ask you
what you think these mean to say?
Speaker 1 (32:38):
Are you okay?
Speaker 2 (32:39):
I'm a perfect candidate because I am pop culture.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
You might be right because you might know some of
these like clinical term because you also are in therapy.
And okay, yeah, so I think this could be interesting.
So the first one is trauma bonding. So when you
hear the word trauma bonding, what do you think.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
It is when, well, I have two things popping in
my head right now. When you are bonded with somebody
through a trauma that you experienced together, not necessarily if
it happened to both of you, but like I think
of in a relationship, if one person is doing something
to the other person, like maybe they're emotionally abusive, do
you have a trauma bond relationship with that person?
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Like me?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Sometimes it's why you stay. That pops into my head.
And then also when you trauma bond with someone like
you you tell each other you're trauma okay, Like you
meet somebody at a bar and you're like, oh my gosh.
Which when I was in the thick of things, I
wasn't meeting someone at a bar, but I had a
lot going on. And one time I was at a
birthday party and my husband had stuff going on. My
(33:38):
son like my life, my dad died, like my life
was falling apart, but I went to this birthday party
because it was someone close to me. And then at
the party, I just randomly start telling someone there like
everything going on with me, and I left there mortified,
and I was like, what did I just do? But
I just like trauma dumped and they shared some stuff
back too about their life, So I felt like that
was a trauma bond situation.
Speaker 1 (33:58):
No.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
I mean, I've seen them since then, but I have
brought any of it up, and I've been I've left
there the whole drive home, like what did I just do?
Like why did I just unload that? It's not necessarily
wrote a party.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
So perfect actually because you answered the So the pop
psychology definition, like what people I think when they say
I trauma bonded with them, I think they're thinking that
they're what they wrote in this post is when you're
bonding with someone over shared trauma or similar past experiences. Okay,
so that's not in clinical settings when I'm talking to
somebody about trauma bonding, that's not generally what I'm I
(34:29):
understand when they're saying that, that's what they think it means.
But it's what you said at the beginning I am
going to add to what they say because I think
trauma bonding can act you can it can be healthy,
and it's going to sound weird, but it can be
good in a sense. So the actual definition what they
put is a situation where someone develops a strong sympathy, loyalty,
(34:51):
or dependence or attachment towards their abuser. So you bond
with somebody who's you're like, you're in that trauma with them.
I'm blanking on it. But what's the syndrome where you
like fall in love with you capter. Yeah, Stockholm syndrome.
It's like that would a form of trauma.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
Like Stockholm syndrome.
Speaker 1 (35:13):
But also if you go through a trauma with somebody,
you're going to be trauma bonded with them.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
So I see like my sister, like walking through cancer
with our mom and our dad, Like there were certain
things we went through that nobody else would understand, Like
I mean other people that walked through it with their parents.
Maybe that's what I'm talking about, just like in our
family it was like, ah, you wouldn't get it, And
I feel like we're trauma bonded in that way.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Yeah, So that I think there's there's two ways you
can look at that. But that's what that is. It's
not just sharing stories. It's like going through the experience. Gotcha, okay,
so good job a flus.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
I didn't think about the sister part though, that that
makes sense now. So you can be trauma bonded if
you both like a sibling, like if you and your
siblings were raised in an alcoholic home or something, that
could be trauma bond.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
And also, it doesn't even have to be an abuser.
But let's say you walk through, like in your relationship,
one of your partners has a lot of mental health issues,
whether that is addiction or I mean, any other mental
health issue. They might not be abusing you, but you're
going through this very difficult time with them and it
might be hard to separate because you've been through all
(36:16):
that together. You can be it's like a codependency, you know.
So there's trauma bonding. Next one is a fun one. Gaslighting.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
What I know it to be is someone telling you
their truth but it's not the truth. They're trying to
convince you that that's the truth, and like you know
that it's not that they are living in their own world.
It seems and it doesn't matter. Their way is the
truth and they're not going to ever back down from that.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
And it makes you kind of feel crazy.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
Yes, yes, you feel crazy. I have been gas lit before.
It feels crazy.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
Yeah, I mean that's pretty common. People have exaggerated it.
Where the pop term is like they're just lying to you.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
Oh well yeah, like I hear my daughter and her friends,
like teenagers will just be like, oh, stop gaslighting me. Yeah,
I'm like okay, which that's what I'm it's lying, Okay,
it is, but that that seems probably more the more
pop way, but it's still lying, but it's it's more
lying but trying to condense somebody else that they're nuts.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, so the pop way would be the pop way
in popular culture, it's lying or just like sometimes people
just like disagreeing with somebody, they're like, oh, you're gaslighting me.
That's just like disagreeing, or like maybe sometimes you just
lie because you're like lying. It doesn't mean that you're
manipulating somebody in an abusive way or a toxic way.
(37:37):
I mean, line is pretty toxic. The actual clinical term,
or actual clinical way it's viewed is an abuse tactic.
Where are where you are manipulated to question your reality,
memory or sanity, not just disagreeing over what happened. So
this is like blatant, like we're looking at the sky
and it's blue, and that person is saying, what are
(38:00):
you've seen the sky is yellow? And you're sitting there
being like, I see it blue, but like have I thought?
Now you're starting to question, like have I thought blue
is yellow? And yellow is blue? My whole life? Like
what were there? Blatant things in front of you? And
it's to make you feel crazy. So you start questioning
everybody everything, and you start to feel.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
Weak, and if there's a power dynamic, then you definitely
do and you'll eventually just be like, okay, fine, it's yellow.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Versus versus like your daughter being like no, I was
home at curfew because they don't want to get in trouble,
you know, Yeah, that's just lying. Yes, Okay, next one,
This one grinds my gears sometimes triggered yum's my yucks.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
This one really this really yucks my yums?
Speaker 1 (38:47):
Okay, wait, triggered triggered. Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
I just have one thing that's coming to mind, and
it's when you are having an emotional of this even
a visceral like a physical You're so smart, shut up. Okay,
thank you, Paul. No, I mean you're having a response
to something that has happened because of something that has
(39:12):
happened to you in the past.
Speaker 1 (39:13):
Okay. Yes, So pop psychology says someone makes you uncomfortable
or annoyed, like oh, she triggered me.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
Okay, So it doesn't always have to because of something
in the past.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
Well that's the pop psychology. Oh sorry, the actual ding
ding ding amy. A trigger is something that causes a
sudden increase in symptoms like flashbacks in PTSD or compulsions
like in OCD, not just a source of general discomfort.
So yeah, it's something's happening. It's bringing up this actual
visceral use up, big word visceral experience that's creating not
(39:48):
just like oh I was angry or annoyed or bothered me,
but like it's bringing up symptoms that have to do
with your trauma or OCD or something like that. So
good job. You're three for three girl, Are you ready
to go.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
For four seventy five? So far?
Speaker 1 (40:04):
Hit me up.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
I'm gonna get a.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Hundred, Okay, But if you don't get a hundred. It's
also okay, thank you. Intrusive thoughts, thoughts that are intruding.
This one's probably your fartest.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
Well, but here's how I see it again, with my brain,
thoughts that are taking over. They're interrupting what I have
going on.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
And are they thoughts that you really want to happen?
Speaker 2 (40:34):
No, okay, they're not welcome necessarily. I haven't invited them there.
I'm not trying to think them. They're just there, and
I want to make them stop, like I think of
I don't know if this falls into it's the right thing,
but I when I was in the throes of my
eating disorder, I felt like I had a lot of
intrusive thoughts, like about everything. Yeah, like what kind of
(40:57):
workouts I was doing if I walked enough, like what
was on the menu? Like you can't eat that?
Speaker 1 (41:02):
Oh you're as a why'd you eat that? You idiot?
Speaker 2 (41:04):
I mean, I guess that's negative self talk. But they
felt very intrusive in that, like it was ruling my life.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
Yeah, part of that is true. So pop psychology intrusive thoughts,
random thoughts or impulses that you might actually want to
act on. So sometimes like people will say, this is
what I think a lot of people are saying, like
in their tiktoks and stuff, I had this intrusive thought,
and like it's something you might want to do, Like
I had this intrusive thought, so I went and spent
five hundred dollars on makeup, like it was an intrusive
(41:32):
thought that I had to give into, or like I
wanted to eat cake and so then I wouldn't got
a piece of cake versus what intrusive thoughts actually are
unwanted or involuntary thoughts that go against your real values
and desires. You don't want to act on them, and
them coming true would be your worst nightmare. They can
be very prominent in distressing and disorders like PTSD or OCD.
(41:53):
OCD is a big one, Like they have all these
intrusive thoughts that they just like it makes them cringe
when they think about it, or it's like some it
can sometimes be like harm harm, some kind of harming
to themselves and it's like, no, I don't want to
actually do this, but I'm thinking about it, and then
there's comes shame with it and it's very problematic. It's
not just like oh, I had this thought of like
going to buy the skirt, so I had to go
(42:14):
buy it. You know that sounds like an impulsive thought. Well,
the impulse would be doing it right, but it's in truth, Okay,
it's coming in and.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
So they have the thought and then they go buy
the skirts.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
That's just oh yeah, what you're saying, that's an impulsive thought.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Ye yeah, because I'm like, that's not as bad as
like I have a thought of like I can't believe it,
just ate that now I need to throw it up.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
Yes, yes, but like part of you, like I don't
really want to be purging, not like I have this
intrusive thought that I can't get rid of. And sometimes
with OCD is like it feels like you can't get
rid of the thought until you yeah, then have the impulse.
But a lot of those impulses you don't actually want
to happen. So it can be very confusing because you're like,
what does this mean? Does this mean that I want this?
(42:52):
Does it mean you can ask yourself? This mean I'm bad?
Does this mean there's something wrong with me? And it's
not true? Like you can't help those things. That's the
like higher level and I think sometimes when we're talking about,
like I had this thought that I wanted to dye
my hair, so I would and dye my hair. That's
a little different, so.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
You wouldn't put that as a real like an intrusive eye.
Speaker 1 (43:14):
Like and I think, well, that's what I'm saying. With
how words are changing, meaning is it? It kind of
waters down so we have to clarify that this is
this and this is this. Now those thoughts can also
be distressing depending on who you are, So I don't
want to use any of this as a blanket statement
of you might not want to dye your hair and
(43:34):
you do it and you feel like you didn't want
to do that, or like it's something that maybe you
loved your blonde hair, and.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
Like I want to get banks. Yeah, so is that
I woke up with that? That's kind of vermple though thought.
And when I say woke up, I barely slept. So
when I woke up from my little nap last night,
I woke up, should I get Banks? Because I have
a hair appointment tomorrow, no Wednesday, and I want to
get banks.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Now what I would wonder with some of those things
a lot of times because I have that stuff where
I'm like, I mean, I almost got to adopted a
dog yesterday. That's an impulse and that comes from more
so my anxiety and ADHD and me just being kind
of an impulsive person and or me needing some kind
of I mean, we all know how I'm feeling right now.
(44:22):
I need some kind of like high to hold on to.
I had to bet, Catherine, if you're going to get
a dog, you got to sit on it for at
least a week versus if you were going to make
the change like bangs. Is that really just an intrusive
thought or is that this like desire for like some
feel good and change? Yeah, yeah, got it. So again,
like we were saying, there's nuance in everything, So this
(44:43):
conversation is bigger, but generally I wanted to highlight like
there's a difference in how we use some of these
words and what they really mean. And that doesn't mean
that like this stuff over here doesn't matter, but sometimes
it can be confusing for people thinking about like when
people this is something that again grinds my gears is
(45:04):
when the way we talk about bipolar when they're like,
oh that she was so bipolar or she was being
so bipolar that's not what people think bipolar disorder is,
isn't that You're you're thinking A lot of times we
say that when somebody's hot and cold, and that's not
a lot of times what somebody with bipolar disorder even
(45:25):
looks like. And also that's something that they can't help,
and it's an actual mental health disorder.
Speaker 2 (45:31):
That Yeah, I think that I've been guilty years back
in the past of being like, oh so bipolar right now,
like using that word flippantly, but.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
I think, no, shame to you. That was normal.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
No normal, I think so. But I think we also
then have a responsibility once we learn. I personally, in
the last several years, I feel insensitive saying that now.
So I wouldn't say that because and maybe that's because
I had an experience with someone for the first time
that was and I hadn't before, and then I had
a new found respect for what they were going through.
(46:04):
And I don't want to minimize what real people with
bipolar are. And it's like kind of mean are dealing
with yeah, because it's like okay, yeah, no, that's actually
not bipolar. Let me, I'll show you what is. And
you don't want it. I mean it's it's hard and yeah.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
And it's like you're saying that as an insult. So
it's like if if somebody and people do that too,
like oh they're so ADHD, it's like, okay, it's kind
of mean I have that and like that. I don't
want you to talk about my behavior that I can't
help like that or things are hard for me. And
it's also bigger than that that there's.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
A straight on social media like everybody has ADHD.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
There's there's phase, like we're going through the phases of
every disorder. At some point, I feel like like it's
everybody has ADHD, everybody has autism, everybody has OCD, everybody.
I see that in my office as like a constant,
revolving But I.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Don't think I have any of those other things.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
But I think this is part of that too, is
we all can relate to symptoms of all of those things,
like we can all I mean even we can bring
in personality disorders, worderline personality disorder, narcissistic personality disorder. We
all have traits of those. I have traits of both
of those. That doesn't mean that I have those disorders.
And so that's also part of the issue with people.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
How do I say this, Maybe just seeing on social
media if someone's like, oh, if you can't find your keys,
you misplace things all the time, you have time blindness,
you can't ever be on time. Then it's like people like, oh,
my gosh, I have ADHD, but they've never actually gone
and been tested, yeah, to figure out if they really
have it. Because I've been tested once in college and
(47:44):
then later probably in the last five years from someone
you connected me with, because I kind of thought, well,
maybe I've outgrown it.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
It's some wishful thinking, and I was like, I.
Speaker 2 (47:54):
Haven't still the same, But I think if some of
those things sounding familiar with you, then yeah, and you
have the resources try to do the steps to go
get tested, so then.
Speaker 1 (48:05):
Well, it can feel when you see those videos, it
can feel like like a relief to have an answer
to some things that you might not like about yourself
or some things that you've been struggling with. So I
think that's one of the reasons we grab onto that,
like I must have this. But also it causes panic
and other people of like I've had clients coming to
my office and be like, why haven't you told me
(48:25):
that I have this, and I'm like, because you don't.
And also sometimes in diagnos scenes specifically like more so
personality disorders, there is a nuance in giving that diagnosis
also in like really figuring it out, because it's over diagnosed,
and I mean under it's misdiagnosed all the time. So
(48:46):
I can't just know somebody for a couple sessions and
be like, this is what you have for sure, So.
Speaker 2 (48:52):
And you're knowing the version that's showing up in your office.
Speaker 1 (48:55):
Oh yeah, yeah so and over time, yeah, over time,
hopefully you start to see like the cracks and the
presentation versus the reality. And as a client, I show
up try to show my best self as well in
the therapy room. So I think that that's that has
created some difficulty in being a therapist because of the stuff.
And again I am saying that as I am hosting
(49:19):
a podcast talking about mental health, so I know that
I have to monitor that too, and I want to
be open to that feedback to if I'm presenting things
in a way that feels too overarching or too I
wanted to say simpleized, that's not a word plistic, sure,
but anyway, my whole point in doing this and reading
this is just giving us again a way to critically
(49:42):
think more and opening our eyes to the bigger picture
of what some of these things mean. And it's not
to shame anybody, because if I didn't work in this field,
I would be on the pop culture part of all
of this. Like how why else?
Speaker 2 (49:56):
Why wouldn't I welcome, welcome to our side? I guess yeah,
being so close to you, it's helped me and I
appreciate it, and I think others listening will appreciate this too.
It just gives you a different perspective when you're doom scrolling,
which pro tip set a timer. Doom scrolling in itself
not totally bad, but if you're doing it for a
long period of time, stop it'll change your life. Just kidding.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Set this timer. It'll change your life in five minutes.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
That's all you need. Let's close with a win, big
or small. So my son is in summer school and
something that the principal said they're doing is encouraging the kids,
Like they have a big poster board and they're writing
down their wins of the day or wins of the week.
Big or small, doesn't matter, but each kid has to participate,
(50:46):
and he was just sending out an email to the
parents talking about how it's really cool to see them
be able to look at their day and look at
their life and come up with something like a win,
big or small. So for both of us, today's been
you more so than me, Like I'm just tired of
other things going on and you're feeling melancholy and like
an unpaid cloud.
Speaker 1 (51:08):
But I showed up.
Speaker 2 (51:09):
But you're here and you showed up, and I guess
let's just find a win. Like what's a win for you?
Speaker 1 (51:14):
Oh, you shut up? Yeah, that's why I was. Oh,
that was your wind.
Speaker 2 (51:18):
Yeah, you're doing it.
Speaker 1 (51:20):
I feel like that's big. No, you showed up.
Speaker 2 (51:23):
That's your win.
Speaker 1 (51:24):
And I'll do too, because it was a win for
me to do that exercise, because I don't usually do journaling,
so for me to actually stop and be like, Okay,
I can stop and do this and I'll get back
to my work in a second.
Speaker 2 (51:35):
I needed to go home and read your poem to Patrick,
your husband.
Speaker 1 (51:40):
He's already been so sweet today, so I wonder if
he'll be like, oh my gosh, like, let's frame it's
you can quit your job, stay home, right, I'm just kidding.
I don't want to quit my job.
Speaker 2 (51:52):
You need to keep that, I know. But we all
have those moments where it's like I'm done. Yeah, I'm
moving to Mexico.
Speaker 1 (51:59):
Is that where you would me?
Speaker 2 (52:00):
No, I don't know why I said that. I think
it's my cousin is moving there. Oh yeah, I don't
know if she said that publicly yet, so I won't
say which cousin.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
Yeah, you have so many cousins. Who can so many
cousins I do?
Speaker 2 (52:12):
I have lots of cousins on my dad's side, my
mom's side.
Speaker 1 (52:15):
What's your win?
Speaker 2 (52:16):
My wind is by Mexico, though I did mean like
more of like the Pacific side. Maybe I could see
myself going there, not like no way of a Larido. Oh,
I never haven't heard of that city. Oh it's the border. Okay,
let me let me think of a win. I've been
good about drinking my water today. I have my measuring cup,
and that is what I'm gonna do because I've been
(52:37):
getting headaches and I know it's because I'm dehydrated. So cheers.
Speaker 1 (52:44):
I have all my water bottles and you have your
measuring cup.
Speaker 2 (52:47):
This is my favorite thing to drink out of I
will drink all my water if I have my measuring cup,
and I know it's made of plastic, and I don't
know if it's giving me microplastics in my brain, but
it's fine.
Speaker 1 (52:55):
Do you really want me to cheers to you? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (52:57):
Okay, let's just close with the cheers because we both did.
This is our wins. We're winning cheers winning. Who used
to say that, Charlie Sheen? Oh you don't remember, right
when hashtagging you were coming in, they didn't drink. Oh
do you have to drink after cheers?
Speaker 1 (53:11):
And you have to make eye contact?
Speaker 2 (53:13):
Oh my gosh. Alex, my boyfriend, he told me that
exact same thing. He said, I cheers and look away.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
Do you want to know where cheers came from? Did
I tell you this already?
Speaker 2 (53:20):
You don't know.
Speaker 1 (53:22):
I learned this when I went to Italy, So cheers
came from back in the day, the Romans, the whoever?
Speaker 2 (53:27):
Oh yes, yes, I've told us.
Speaker 1 (53:29):
They would all cheers their glasses to make sure and
they would clink them so a little bit would go
into other people's and it would make sure that nobody
poisoned each other. So I was like I'm not going
to poison you because you're going to clink my glass
and then I would be poisoning myself.
Speaker 2 (53:42):
Bam. You know that is a fun fact. Thank you
for letting us know. People can use that this weekend.
Speaker 1 (53:48):
Wait, I think that was from the Romans or was
that from the Boston? Do I learn that in Boston?
Speaker 2 (53:55):
I feel like you would come back from overseas. When
you told us that, it was like on the fifth thing.
Speaker 1 (53:59):
No, huzza is from Boston. They would cheers and go, huzza.
Speaker 2 (54:04):
There you go. It's okay.
Speaker 1 (54:06):
We're not We're not here to get You're not facts.
Speaker 2 (54:10):
We're not a history podcast. Yeah, we're a therapy podcast
because Cat's a therapist and we hope you have the
day you need to have.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
Bye. Bye,
Feeling Things with Amy & Kat News
Host
Amy Brown
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