Getting Real with Roman Alexander: A Midwest Soul with a Nashville Dream

From singing Johnny Cash covers in bars at just eight years old to racking up over 86 million streams, Roman Alexander has built his career on grit, faith, and heart. A grandson of Mexican immigrants and a true Midwesterner, Roman chased his dream to Nashville—enduring long days and dead-end jobs until his breakout duet “Between You & Me” made him one of Spotify’s longest-running independent country artists.

With his new EP Midwest Calling, Roman shares the stories of where he’s from, what he’s carried, and why he’ll never stop believing in the music that brought him here. For him, success isn’t about charts—it’s about connection, faith, and the small circle of people who make it all matter.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Adam Carol n she's a queen and talking and a song.
You know, she's getting really not afraid to feel its
episode and so.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Just let it blow.

Speaker 1 (00:22):
No one can do we quiet carryl Lyne his sound
of Caroline.

Speaker 3 (00:29):
Are we ready? Roman Alexander, it's a mighty name.

Speaker 4 (00:34):
Well, it's my middle name. Alexander's my middle name, so
I kind of guess. I also kind of thought it
from the standpoint of it's an a so it starts.
It starts with, you know, the top of the.

Speaker 3 (00:46):
Alphabet Roman Alexander.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
So like on a bill.

Speaker 3 (00:49):
I'm usually like you were thinking this true?

Speaker 4 (00:52):
Not really I like to think the so, but no,
I just it sounded it sounded cool. And my mom
always called me Roman Alexander, especially if I was in trouble.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
So but I mean, that's a strong name, like Roman Alexander. Well, thanks,
Where did your parents come up with this? And were
they like this guy is going to be a boss?

Speaker 2 (01:09):
I don't.

Speaker 4 (01:10):
I don't know if they ever thought that. But because
my schooling did not say, you know, said otherwise.

Speaker 3 (01:15):
What do you mean?

Speaker 2 (01:16):
I was terrible in school? How so?

Speaker 3 (01:18):
But maybe schooling is not your thing, like you were
not good at the learning part.

Speaker 4 (01:21):
Well, I just did a podcast the other day with
a guy it's called the Right Brain. They he's a
like a world renowned like psychologist or a neuro surgeon, okay,
and he was like dissecting, like when you talk to him,
he'll dissect parts of your brain, like he was on
the Rogan podcast, like dissecting Joe Rogan's brain, and it
was it was really interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:40):
Did you watch the Joe Rogan's Brain? When I did,
I want to know what's going on in his brain?

Speaker 2 (01:44):
I did say there's a lot. I'm sure. Actually sometimes
I don't know, but you know, it's like there was.
It was.

Speaker 4 (01:50):
It was interesting because I was like I had an
IEP in math, which is like a learning disability, so
I had to go to like a separate.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Class and like was that hard?

Speaker 4 (01:59):
It sucks when you got into your teen years because
I think I was labeled as like, you know, learning
impaired and like it said special needs on my PaperWorks.

Speaker 3 (02:08):
Does that play into your psyche?

Speaker 4 (02:11):
I think maybe it does. I'm sure there's some like
it shows through in some ways.

Speaker 3 (02:15):
But it's interesting how like a label, you know, it's
just like it's really just you're learning in a different way.
But it's like, especially when you're growing up, when you
hear something about yourself and you feel like it's different,
it makes it. It's just like processing that.

Speaker 2 (02:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (02:28):
Yeah, and well I think like, you know, you're creative,
you're you know, like you understand music and you've been
there and done that.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
You know. It's like.

Speaker 4 (02:40):
Daydreamings the most important part I think of our of
our brain because we work the right side of our brain.
So uh, I think like daydreaming was always a big thing.
Like I remember when I was like six and seven,
I'd be in school, like I'd be making like a
writer in like a stage plot from like my arena
tour one day and like, oh, I was.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
Super indivisualizing this very long for whatever you know, and.

Speaker 3 (02:58):
This has been your destiny for as long earliest.

Speaker 2 (02:59):
Man you can go to.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
So yeah, you just didn't really care about school, probably no.

Speaker 4 (03:05):
And it showed because whenever I went home, my mom
would be like, well, fast forward to high school.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
It was my senior year and she's like, Roman, you
just have to pass. I guess my you know.

Speaker 4 (03:15):
Principal called and was like, hey, we don't think he's
going to make it this year, like he's not going
to pass. Luckily, I had some friends who were teachers
like that, you know, church leaders and whatnot. And one
was a science teacher and that was like my worst subject,
science in math. And she knew like I wasn't going
to pass, so she like did her her absolute best
to make sure I could pass.

Speaker 3 (03:35):
So she kind of let things slide.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
She called my mom. She's like, look, if I can
just get him to pass with three d's, a C
minus in an A in history, which I love history,
then I'm good.

Speaker 3 (03:45):
So did school just like not make sense to you
or did you just absolutely have no desire to do it.

Speaker 2 (03:50):
I'm severely dyslexic, so everything just like I could.

Speaker 3 (03:53):
Really trying to read it, but you read it differently.

Speaker 4 (03:55):
So I can't if I read out loud, I can't
read out loud all day. I just can't retain the
information if I read it out loud, Like it's.

Speaker 3 (04:00):
Just that huh what I wonder what that is? What
is the transfer from the paper to the brain.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (04:06):
Things are jumbled, like if I read it out loud,
I will jumble words. But it's not terrible, you know,
like Will is my day to day, like she understands,
like whenever I do like liners and stuff for like
you know, Spotify or Apple Music or any of the platforms,
I have to reread it like a million times, and
sometimes I get like right away. It's because sometimes it's
just like you know, groundhog Day. But other times I

(04:29):
just I just can't do it. It just doesn't work
for me. So my brain just can't compute always. But
if I read it quietly and rehearsing, go over and
go over it, we're good. But you know, like through
the writing process, when you are there's a track guy
in there or producer and you know it's time to
do a demo. After you write a song, h I
have to take the song home and like learn it.

Speaker 2 (04:49):
Most of the time. I can't just do it day
of you know.

Speaker 3 (04:52):
Yeah that makes sense.

Speaker 4 (04:53):
So yeah, it takes me sometime, okay, but it works
in my advantage. I come back and knowing the song
better than I probably that's so true.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
So when did you figure all this stuff out about
it and then you reconfirmed it with your brain scan?

Speaker 2 (05:06):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (05:06):
I mean, like I just like talking to people, you know,
like like the guy did the podcast with the other
day or just you know, whether it's therapy, you know,
kind of dissect therapy.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
I haven't done a.

Speaker 4 (05:21):
Lot of it, but the ones I have done, it's
kind of interesting to dissect my childhood a little bit.

Speaker 3 (05:25):
What'd you find out? And how did you decide to
go to therapy? Because I love therapy. Now I'm actually
I've done so much therapy. I think I'm on a break.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
I need to go I need to go back.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
Oh you got to stay with it.

Speaker 2 (05:33):
Yeah. I like going to the gym and building a muscle.

Speaker 3 (05:36):
Yes, that's exactly what is. It takes forever and it's exhausting,
but it's like, what do they say, what's your heart?
The same thing with like going to the gym, like
dealing with your unresolved trauma yea, or just like getting
into it and figuring it out and sorting it out
and then releasing yourself of it.

Speaker 2 (05:49):
There's traumas you have you don't even know you have.

Speaker 3 (05:51):
Everybody's got them, you know, totally.

Speaker 4 (05:53):
Whether it goes from like being bullied in school or
are you bullied? I'm sure everybody is. You know, I
think we all are.

Speaker 3 (05:59):
Do you remember it?

Speaker 2 (06:00):
Yeah? I do?

Speaker 3 (06:02):
You know?

Speaker 4 (06:02):
My grandparents side of the family's all from Mexico, so
I'm Mexican Americans. So when my parents got divorced, Mom
moved to Texas. Dad, you know, was working a lot.
I stayed in Kansas City, where I'm from, and I
lived with my grandparents. They lived on like the west
side of Kansas City, which is very prominently like Hispanic.
So I did a whole summer school, actually two years
of it. During the school year, i'd go to a

(06:23):
Catholic school, which is like, was relatively high income. I
don't even know how we afforded to go because my
family was not that especially being on that side of
the city. And then summer school was at a place
called Primativo Garcia, which was primarily Spanish speaking school. A
lot of kids are you know, second generation parents came

(06:45):
from Mexico or their first generation Americans, and so it
was definitely interesting. I think I got bullied because I
didn't speak Spanish, because my parents didn't teach me that,
you know, And as I get older, I'm like, man,
I really wish I would have learned Spanish, but I
kind of just embrace it.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
You know. Selena didn't know Spanish.

Speaker 3 (07:02):
She didn't but she sang something.

Speaker 2 (07:04):
She sang in Spanish, but she didn't she didn't speak it.

Speaker 3 (07:07):
No, we were just talking about Selena this weekend and
what a tragedy that.

Speaker 2 (07:11):
Was come in. I think she would have gone on
to do.

Speaker 3 (07:14):
She's one of the greatest singers and performers of all time.

Speaker 2 (07:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (07:18):
Yeah, and Casey Musgraves did a there's one of my
favorite videos. It's like kind of like hard to hear,
it's kind of grainy, but like she does Colmo lafleur
by by Selena and she plays it at the Rodeo
Houston and it was like stunning, like where the stage
spins around or she was San Antonio and.

Speaker 2 (07:38):
Yeah, it was it was beautiful. Like Casey did like
her rendition a bit, and it was it was like
the crowd just freaking out, you know, because the crowd's
primarily Mexican. They come up from Mexico to come to that.
So yeah, it was really cool to see.

Speaker 3 (07:50):
So how does all that like trauma play out, Because
like for me, I've done so much therapy now that
I know my traumas and I know my deference mechanisms.
So I always was a people pleaser and I definitely
was always trying to make sure everybody loved me, that
they did everything correctly, that I didn't ruffle any feathers. Yeah,
and I just spent until thirty eight. I'm twenty forty

(08:13):
two and like a week and a half. Yes, and
I feel every.

Speaker 2 (08:17):
Body's not old.

Speaker 3 (08:19):
Sorry, forty two is old? Are you kidding?

Speaker 2 (08:23):
I think age is completely It's all basically how.

Speaker 3 (08:24):
You feel it's old in the fact that I just
have lived Like now at this point, I'm like, I
have got a bag of life on my shoulders in
a good way. But it's just like I understand so
many things in a different way, Like I understand what
my conditioning was because of circumstances I was born into.
You know, like you're kind of your personality is sort

(08:45):
of a defect default mechanism sometimes of just like just
navigating your childhood until you figure it out, like going
into therapy like oh my gosh, like I'm doing this,
this and this and this is why and I didn't
even know that. Have you had any of those like discoveries.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
Yeah, I have. And then you go into the music business.

Speaker 3 (09:04):
You know, it's like you really find out about yourself.

Speaker 4 (09:07):
All you're doing is people pleasing and oh gosh, you know,
dressed like this, talk like this.

Speaker 3 (09:12):
Oh, and they want you to conform because this is working.

Speaker 2 (09:14):
So if you disagree with us, then you don't care.

Speaker 3 (09:17):
Yes, and then yes, and like who are these people?
They don't know anyway. I mean they know something, but
they definitely are just trying to figure it out too well.

Speaker 4 (09:24):
And I always try to remind myself. And this isn't
a dig on anything at all. I mean, it's just
this is the general the industry as a whole. We
only get one shot to make.

Speaker 2 (09:34):
This really typically stick.

Speaker 4 (09:36):
I mean you can grant you get many shots, but
you get one sock to really shot to really make
your impression on the town because it's such a small city.
And they get as many as they want to try
over again and try.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
It out on.

Speaker 3 (09:49):
This is your whole life. You're just a product.

Speaker 2 (09:51):
Yeah, there was no there's no plane. Yeah, this is
all I have.

Speaker 4 (09:57):
I was never good at school, Like I said, I
had no other career pass. Obviously there's careers I think would.

Speaker 2 (10:02):
Be cool to try.

Speaker 3 (10:02):
You could be a race car driver.

Speaker 2 (10:04):
I could, which I do love racing. I know.

Speaker 3 (10:06):
Did you just casually decide to become a race car driver.

Speaker 2 (10:08):
So before my parents got divorced, I did.

Speaker 3 (10:10):
How old were they when they divorced?

Speaker 2 (10:11):
Seven?

Speaker 3 (10:12):
Do you remember it?

Speaker 2 (10:13):
Yeah? Oh yeah, I remember every bit of it.

Speaker 3 (10:15):
Some people, sorry, I'm all over the place. I'm like
their freaking bunny rabbit. I just homing down different tunnels
and we're just gonna circle back around. All But when
you were your parents are divorced. Some people say, I'm
so glad my parents got divorced because they would have
been terrible together. And other people say, it really like
affected me in maybe a negative way. How would you
How did your parents divorce affect you?

Speaker 2 (10:36):
I mean, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (10:38):
I think I'm starting to figure that out as I
get older. I think there's certain things that pop up
in my life as I as I get older, I
have sympathy for them because I'm twenty and you see it.

Speaker 3 (10:48):
From a different perspective.

Speaker 2 (10:49):
Now, Yeah, I look at it. They were young.

Speaker 4 (10:52):
They had my sister when she's five years older than me,
so they had her when they were nineteen and twenty.

Speaker 2 (10:57):
I guess there were just kids.

Speaker 4 (10:58):
There were kids, and then they got divorced in the thirties,
which still kids like there's still so much life to
live and they're just now really living their lives. So
I have so much sympathy for them, Like there's no
grudge held.

Speaker 2 (11:10):
There's no.

Speaker 4 (11:13):
And there wasn't at the time. I just I love
both my parents, and I love them differently because there's
different things to love about them. Yeah, you know, just
like I think parents say that there's not a favorite
but and maybe there's not, but they definitely love us differently.
There's different ways to yet to approach a certain kid,
like my sister and I have approach it differently, And now.

Speaker 3 (11:28):
How do they approach you? Do you need to be approached?

Speaker 4 (11:32):
I'm very I'm very warm. I feel like like I'm
very very affectionate. I wear my heart on my sleeve.
I'll tell you exactly how I feel about something. I
was like if I don't like something. And my sister,
you know, she's a combat veteran. She's served in the
Marine Corps for eleven years, and she's a firefighter's paramedic.
She did wild land firefighting. The girl's done it all, wow,

(11:53):
and she's really really inspirational. But I think she yet
approach her just a little differently. I think you know
she's not a prey to tell you how she feels. Yeah,
she's way more opinionated than I am, and I'm already
pretty opinionated.

Speaker 2 (12:07):
But you know, I think.

Speaker 4 (12:09):
She's she's just a zero bullshitter, Like if you want
me to bullshit, yell bullshit a little bit. I don't
like really feathers. Like we talked about it, I really don't.
I worry if people are mad at me.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
Sometimes.

Speaker 3 (12:21):
Oh, it used to make me debilitatingly sick.

Speaker 2 (12:23):
Yeah, are they mad at me? What am I? Like?

Speaker 4 (12:25):
I hope I don't burn that bridge. And sometimes it's like, okay,
it's okay to burn the bridge.

Speaker 2 (12:29):
It's okay.

Speaker 1 (12:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (12:30):
You know what I finally realized about myself is I
people please for so long that it was making me like, like,
finally I had a breaking point because I had a daughter,
and I was like, if I don't figure out how
to just like be content in my own skin without
trying to like song and dance for everyone else, what
am I going to pass on? I cannot pass that on.
And so now I've just realized if I am showing
up in my best version of myself, authentically trying my best,

(12:53):
not trying to hurt anybody's feelings, not trying to do anything,
but like, do the best I can with what I got,
with where I am. Then if someone happens to get
pissed me or like doesn't like me, doesn't like the
way I'm doing something, I really can't worry about it.
And that is free.

Speaker 2 (13:07):
Yep.

Speaker 4 (13:08):
Well, We're all human at the end of the day,
and I think we don't give ourselves enough credit for that.
So the other day, I, you know, I think I
offended some people. I maybe I think I came across wrong.

Speaker 3 (13:18):
I definitely just in life or like online in no, in.

Speaker 4 (13:21):
Life, and it was in a meeting. I I was
just frustrated, it was having a bad day.

Speaker 3 (13:25):
Did you let your temper out?

Speaker 4 (13:26):
Sometimes I don't let my temper out. I think I
just let my Like, if I'm annoyed at shows something you're.

Speaker 3 (13:32):
Gonna know, well, atleast people know how you feel.

Speaker 4 (13:33):
You know, Like, but you have to go back to
the drawing board and be like, because I'm always a
cool sixty eight degrees typically I'm always just.

Speaker 2 (13:39):
Kind of just running okay.

Speaker 3 (13:41):
When you're not a cool sixty eight degrees, where does
your timber spike to like when you're a hot what
is your hot spike too? You don't get you don't
even get to a hundred.

Speaker 2 (13:51):
I don't yet.

Speaker 3 (13:52):
Oh man, I can get to five. I could get
to one.

Speaker 2 (13:54):
Ten.

Speaker 3 (13:54):
I gotta calm that down. Yes I had. I've learned
how to comment down from I'm from Texas and I'm
ok Leoh that's why, Oh my god, when I was
an unresolved when I was an unresolved, unhealed leo, all
of my teens and twenties and early thirties, watch out,
crazy lion compan from Waco, Texas. Oh yeah, where are
you from?

Speaker 2 (14:13):
I'm from Kansas City.

Speaker 3 (14:14):
Oh yeah, you're in Midwestern? Uh you love the Midwest?

Speaker 2 (14:17):
I love it. I know you good people, but I
love text.

Speaker 4 (14:20):
I've been spending a lot of time in Texas recently,
so racing. The race team is based out of there.

Speaker 3 (14:26):
I was looking at your EP Midwest calling. You really
love the Midwest?

Speaker 2 (14:29):
I do, your heart, I love it. I'm proud of it.

Speaker 3 (14:31):
Good for you. It's good to be proud of where
you're coming.

Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah you know, and your Texan.

Speaker 3 (14:35):
So yeah, oh yeah, we love Texas are from?

Speaker 2 (14:37):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (14:38):
Yeah you know? Yeah I do so you've been spending
a lot of time in Texas race for driving Formula one.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
Well I tested F four? What does that?

Speaker 3 (14:45):
What does that even mean?

Speaker 2 (14:46):
So you got like F four, F three, F two
and the.

Speaker 3 (14:48):
Formula one, Formula one is the top, that's the top,
but you're in four.

Speaker 4 (14:51):
That's well, I'm not in it. But I was testing
and I and that's where I became addicted. And I
met one of my really good buddies who was my
race instructor, and I was like, I just he saw
my passion. His dad saw my passion for it because
his dad owns the team, and he was like, you know,
this is something you really want to do. I'm like
because they thought I was just some country singers coming

(15:12):
down for publicity, like it was just gonna make it
look cool.

Speaker 2 (15:14):
It's just wanted to get some footage.

Speaker 4 (15:15):
And this is all before the F one movie came
out too, And I was like no, no, no, Like
I genuinely like, this is all I care about. Like
if I got told I couldn't play music another day,
but I could race cars for us my life, I'd
be a happy man.

Speaker 3 (15:26):
This was a new love, though, Like you found it
and it was like true love at first sight.

Speaker 4 (15:29):
I've always loved racing, okay, I mean my dad. My
first Formula one race I went to was two thousand
and five at the US Grand Prix in Indianapolis.

Speaker 3 (15:36):
So when you fall in love, you fall in love.
Oh yeah, like you fell in love with music and
you've never let it go. Yeah, you fell in love
with racing and you never let it go.

Speaker 4 (15:44):
It's just a deep passion. Like I'm a very passionate
I think a lot of that comes from like Mebia Mexican.

Speaker 2 (15:48):
I think it's the Hispanic side. I'm very passionate person.

Speaker 4 (15:50):
I get like they call it like Latin anger sometimes,
Like if I do get angry, it's just because I'm
passionate about something and I have a hard time letting
it go.

Speaker 3 (15:59):
So so you can like ruminate, yeah, sometimes, oh, letting
it go. Not we're not talking negatively, sorry, I was
thinking back to your meeting when you said you're a
cool sixty eight, but you hit seventy seven.

Speaker 4 (16:10):
Yeah, and they like seventy five, seventy seven. You know,
you don't want to see me get to one hundred,
which I don't think of it that.

Speaker 3 (16:14):
Ever happened, never in your life.

Speaker 2 (16:16):
I think if somebody ever like hurt my dog.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
Yeah, oh well that's righteous anger.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
Yeah, you'll probably go to one ten.

Speaker 3 (16:22):
Yeah, totally. I think if it's if it's warranted, yeah,
then that's totally fair. It's just like when you fly
off the hinges and you hit one ten just because
you're pissed off.

Speaker 2 (16:33):
You know that's uhh yeah.

Speaker 3 (16:35):
I had to figure that one out.

Speaker 2 (16:36):
I've seen my mom get there.

Speaker 3 (16:37):
Oh she can get there.

Speaker 2 (16:38):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (16:39):
Do you think that's why you stay cool?

Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (16:42):
I mean, look, I don't always stay cool. I definitely
get to like eighty sometimes whatever that looks like, you know,
I'll yell, but it's more or less when I'm driving,
I get like really bad, like like road rage.

Speaker 2 (16:52):
In the car.

Speaker 3 (16:52):
You do you get pissed on the roads.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
Yeah. I would never like break check somebody, but I
definitely think about it. You know.

Speaker 3 (16:58):
Okay, it just likes you up.

Speaker 2 (17:00):
Yeah it does.

Speaker 3 (17:01):
Oh yeah, it's just like irritated to the max.

Speaker 2 (17:04):
Well, like the other day I got cut off and
you know.

Speaker 3 (17:07):
You like honking at somebody.

Speaker 2 (17:09):
Well because I did? You have a four runner?

Speaker 3 (17:11):
Okay, but the horn doesn't work.

Speaker 2 (17:14):
Sounds like a bones ink of Barbie are like RC car, So.

Speaker 3 (17:17):
Your ego is more important than how pissed you are.

Speaker 4 (17:19):
Yeah, it's like like I don't want to hit it
because it's they're gonna laugh.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
Like it was a woman and she was like in
this little.

Speaker 4 (17:25):
Tiny kiya and her horn, Like I heard her horn
conk at the person in front of her, which I
thought it was her. Her horn was loud, and then
I like thought about mine. I was like, don't hit
it because it's like meat meat, and I'll show you
when we get out of here.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
It's so embarrassing.

Speaker 3 (17:38):
So that keeps you in check.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
That does my horn? Does?

Speaker 3 (17:41):
God must have known?

Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, I think so.

Speaker 5 (17:45):
Yeah, Yeah, I think so.

Speaker 3 (17:57):
So I've taken you all over the place. I want
to kind of wrap up this formula one thing. So
what did it feel like when you got behind the
wheel and like this is dream come true because you've
always wanted to do it and now here you are
and it's dangerous.

Speaker 2 (18:08):
It is.

Speaker 4 (18:09):
It's not safe, I mean really nothing. I mean driving
on the highways in Nashville, the potholes aren't safe either,
So I mean it's just as dangerous.

Speaker 2 (18:15):
I think.

Speaker 3 (18:16):
I don't think so, I don't think I will.

Speaker 2 (18:18):
Tell you this. There's a it's kind of dramatic. I
go to this whole thing.

Speaker 3 (18:23):
Oh you're dramatic.

Speaker 2 (18:24):
I'm kind of dramat. I'm an arm for you.

Speaker 3 (18:25):
I'd love to be dramatic.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
We're a little dramatic.

Speaker 3 (18:27):
Oh, it's totally dramatic. I'm always dramatic. So let's hear it.

Speaker 4 (18:31):
So, okay, it's one hundred and five degrees. It's August
in Texas. You know how that goes?

Speaker 3 (18:36):
Yes, and then that's when everyone wants to drive race
cars on the.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Why And it's not a false sport black.

Speaker 4 (18:42):
I'm wearing a black fireproof suit with an undershirt, then
the fireproof mask, and then a black and silver helmet.
So it's already hot as can be. And it's carbon
fib or two so it just sits there and radiates.

Speaker 3 (18:54):
Is this good for you?

Speaker 2 (18:55):
No? Okay, but I love it and don't care.

Speaker 4 (18:59):
It's I think this isn't like. Women can do it too.
There's plenty of women who race in F four, F
three and women who are gonna go to F one
eventually an Indy car. There's been so many great women
in that. But I think that when a boy is born,
you know, like whenever I was whenever I was born.
I think we're built this curiosity to just be like

(19:20):
just daredevil's a little bit, and to get in trouble
with cars. You know, I don't know, because ever since
I was little, I've always wonted the race cars. So
my dad got me into go carts whenever I was
like six seven five six seven. When my parents got divorced,
you know, we got sixpensive sports, so they couldn't afford
to do that. So I've always in the back of
my mind, I was like, one of these days, I'm gonna.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
Get back in a race car.

Speaker 4 (19:40):
So I built my Instagram following a little bit, you know,
just being an artist, and then build connections that way,
and then sure enough, you know, I was able to
get in the race car.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
So to take you there, it's August last year. I
get in the car. I sit in there.

Speaker 4 (19:55):
It's very snug. You're basically laying on the ground, your
legs are a little elevated over your chest.

Speaker 2 (19:59):
You plug in this steering whel you hear click, and
then you flip on the switch and then they started
up and it's just like this low little rumble and
for instance.

Speaker 4 (20:08):
Okay, so like g G forces. You know, G forces
are like fighter pilots. Okay, yeah, yeah, it's kind of
like when you're on a roller coaster and you feel that,
like your gut comes up in your chest, so fun,
and you start to get like tunnel vision a little bit.

Speaker 2 (20:20):
Yes, that's called G forces.

Speaker 4 (20:22):
Blood is rushing against your it's rushing out of certain
parts of your body and pushing to others. Okay, so
it's about if you hit two and a half g's
to three g's, that's two to three times your body weight. Okay,
so I was pulling that for an extended period of time,
like the blood vessels in my arm were broken, like
my neck was swollen. But it's the most rewarding feeling
knowing that you win one hundred and seventy miles an hour.

Speaker 3 (20:45):
Why is this just like ultimate freedom? Like what's happening?
Are you having some sort of like release or some
sort of moment that you can't get otherwise? Like what
is that experience that you're getting that you can't have
in regular life?

Speaker 2 (20:54):
Well, I have an addicted personality, I think. Okay, why
do you think that because I couldn't I can't I
haven't thought, like stopped thinking about it. Yeah, it's all
I think about.

Speaker 3 (21:03):
And well, I mean, I guess there's worse things.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
There are worse things that be addicted to.

Speaker 4 (21:07):
But I it was just I got addicted to golf
during the pandemic, just like a lot of people. Did
you know, I'm like one of those when I go
all in like fall hard, Yeah, I'm gonna Yeah, I
dressed like a PGA golfer.

Speaker 2 (21:22):
You go the shot like like a WE golfer. It
was really bad.

Speaker 3 (21:26):
Did you get did you get your game up? Though?
You're pretty okay? So all the commitment didn't pay off
in that case, it wasn't worth it. Do you still
love it or you moved on.

Speaker 2 (21:34):
To love hay relationship?

Speaker 3 (21:35):
We're getting there, okay, So we're not You're not just
like I'm done with you next.

Speaker 2 (21:38):
Yeah, I've been saying I'm going to break a hundred
for the last four years and still haven't done it. Okay, Okay,
we're trying.

Speaker 3 (21:42):
So you go, you have some time to spend with golf.

Speaker 2 (21:44):
Still I do.

Speaker 4 (21:46):
But you know, I got into it because it was
the way my brain didn't think about anything else in golf. Right,
But then you start bringing your songwriter friends out there
and artist friends out there. You guys start talking business,
and then people start gossiping about this person. It becomes
like a like a shit talk conversation. I'm not that
kind of guy. I don't like shit talking. And then racing,

(22:07):
Like I felt harder for that. And you can't talk
to anybody, You can't think about thinking about talking about
thinking about anybody. It's like you're in the car, you're driving.
Any mistake you make, you're gonna feel it and you're
gonna see it, and it's gonna cost a lot of money.

Speaker 3 (22:22):
So you gotta say fully focused, fully focused. Every part
of your existence has to be.

Speaker 4 (22:26):
Focused in whatever worry is going on. Whether it's the
amount of streams you got or I didn't get this.
Look right, I didn't get this, or this person got
this tour and I didn't.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
It does not matter, and that's what I love about it.

Speaker 3 (22:38):
So it takes a lot for you to steal your
brain clearly.

Speaker 2 (22:40):
Yes it does.

Speaker 4 (22:41):
Yeah, yeah, And I'm I guess I'm a daydreamer, so
I'm always about something.

Speaker 3 (22:45):
So you are like so intense in your thoughts that
it takes one focus life and death death of racing
a car for you to get that brain streamline, I think,
so yeah. You know what though, that is what they
say about meditation, because everyone's like, you need to meditate,
you need to meditate, and like, for like so many years,
for like ten years, I've been trying to meditate, but I'm.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
Like, what, I get bored.

Speaker 3 (23:05):
But you know what the point of meditating is, and
I finally figured it out. It's not for any other
reason than to empty your brain. Because think about this,
if you never let your brain have a break, Like
if you keep this loop going twenty not you, anyone
keeps this loop going twenty four to seven. So we
have whatever life we've created, whatever we're focused on, whatever

(23:27):
matters to us, it's just looping in our brain. You know,
if you never find a pause button, it just keeps
staying intense, it keeps staying obsessive, it keeps like you
get all this energy on it that almost smothers it
to a degree. So then when you do something like
racing that actually stops your brain from the loop. It
loosens your grip, and then you come back and some

(23:49):
of the things you have let go of, whereas only
the things that really like matter you come back to
think of because you've given yourself enough time to like
have a break from it. Does that make any sense?
This is my own By the way, I'm not you meditate,
well now I under I do yoga. I finally have
found a way just through yoga. I have a hard
I'm just sitting and meditating.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
Well, I think all of us are a little eighty
h d. You know, It's like it's part of being focused.

Speaker 4 (24:13):
You're creative, and when there's so much to do when
you're creative, it's hard to not it's hard to just
want to sit there, yeah, or to like but at
least yoga you're moving and you're having to kind of
decompress and work different muscle groups and whatnot and.

Speaker 3 (24:28):
Stop thinking about whatever you were thinking about. So then
it's like, when you give your mind that break, you
can come back and you can feel excited about it
again instead of that obsessive feeling. You know, do you
feel that I do?

Speaker 4 (24:39):
But honestly, like, this is why I like podcasts, because
I like I like listening to him. Like I think
when your podcast was one of the first I heard,
no joke, it was you with Jimmy Harnin.

Speaker 3 (24:52):
And that's amazing.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
Yeah that was a long time ago too.

Speaker 3 (24:55):
Wow, were you trying to get information about the music industry?

Speaker 2 (24:58):
I think I just knowledge. I just like learn to
be like.

Speaker 3 (25:00):
A like Jimmy Hard And everyone is like he runs
a big machine. He's one of the head guys of
a big machine under Scot Wars shatup yep. Yeah, he's
got so much wisdom and knowledge.

Speaker 2 (25:10):
Yeah, he does really good storyteller to you know, you
know how that he is.

Speaker 3 (25:15):
The stories are insane with they as a major as
a major record guy for like, yeah, thirty years, what
they've seen yeah and lived through and the rock stars
that they have been a part of.

Speaker 2 (25:26):
Yeah, it sounds belable.

Speaker 4 (25:27):
Well and then and then I listened to one of
your podcasts the other day with with Naomi Oh yeah,
and she's got an incredible story, but no interest. Interesting
because you also hear the podcaster the interviewer grow too. Yeah,
like I can it can hear you know, the way
you communicate, and then you know it was great then,

(25:47):
but still it's a night and day different. So like
I get to hear like this like growth and like
I get to hear the stories evolve, and her story
evolved like it's it's really really cool. So that's why
I like podcasts, because you learn a lot about yourself
and then the person. Also that's you know, hosting podcast.

Speaker 3 (26:00):
So yeah, and it's another way to kind of pause
your brain maybe exactly.

Speaker 2 (26:03):
That's where I was kind of getting with them.

Speaker 3 (26:04):
Yeah, we we forgot because we were thinking.

Speaker 4 (26:06):
Together, Aray Sesson, because you're asking me questions I haven't
been asking a really long time.

Speaker 3 (26:12):
Well, it's so good to That's why I love podcasting too,
is because it's so good to realize that everybody's completely
fed up. You know, like literally everyone is a giant mess,
but we all just have to sort it out. Everyone's
doing the best they can. We all are born into
some sort of circumstance. We have to either like major
trauma as a kid or little trauma as a kid.

(26:33):
You base your personality on that trauma. Then you figure
out your dream, what's your escape, why you have these mannerisms,
and then you have to go like chase it and
then sort yourself out and come to terms. You have
to have a reckoning with yourself. And then a lot
of times you find that when you're an artist because
you're like truly like just getting so raw that you're
fully exposed, and then you have to just like actually

(26:55):
take a peek behind the mirror. And that's why I
feel like artists like they can they can combus, but
then they also are so enlightened because you really have
to do this hard work and look at yourself all
the time, and then everyone's judging you and people have
opinions about you, and it's just a lot to handle.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
You got to have a breaking point too. Yeah, Like
I used to take pride and not having a breaking point,
I thought I didn't right.

Speaker 3 (27:17):
I thought I was like, oh, you're han't broken yet,
you're holding it together.

Speaker 2 (27:20):
I've gotten there. No, I like I've hit it.

Speaker 3 (27:23):
But isn't that a relief to know you can break
and it's okay.

Speaker 2 (27:25):
Well, because you.

Speaker 4 (27:26):
Feel like the world's crumbling, you're like like, wait, my
career is over with and you're like, I'm twenty seven
years old, twenty eight years old, you know, like it's
not I'm fine, but yeah, I think for me, twenty twenty,
twenty one, and twenty.

Speaker 2 (27:41):
Two were really like like decent years for me.

Speaker 4 (27:43):
I was just once you'd yeah, everybody you know you
were you were the shiny You're the shiny object.

Speaker 3 (27:50):
You were the shiny object.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
I would like to think I was.

Speaker 3 (27:52):
But how cool that you got to be the shiny object.
Not everyone gets to be the shiny oe.

Speaker 4 (27:55):
No, And I didn't appreciate that, right, And honestly, I
think my uh, you let your ego get in the way.
I think especially its like a manic it gets in
the way. Well, you just feel like you're on top
of the world. Nobody, nobody can tell you otherwise, which
I didn't show that.

Speaker 2 (28:09):
I didn't. I didn't carry myself that way.

Speaker 3 (28:10):
Well, you felt like once so do you went viral?

Speaker 2 (28:12):
Right? Is that?

Speaker 4 (28:14):
I think a few not on TikTok necessarily. But my
song it got playlisted really.

Speaker 3 (28:19):
Early, okay, And that song was between you and me.

Speaker 4 (28:22):
It was cocktail conversations and between you and me. They
both playlisted at the same time.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
And that's before actually cook had really taken.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
Off too, right, Yeah, So my version came out first
of between you and me, and Ashley was already a friend.
She had a TikTok presence. I didn't. I had a
Spotify presence. She didn't. She didn't have music out, so
I was like, well, this is a perfect trade off.

Speaker 4 (28:39):
Yeah, so we both put that next version out, and
the first version had already gone, like done really well
on its own, so then her version just I mean,
she was already started. She pus released one song before
that and then blew up, and then this song was
perfect timing, and then cocktail conversations blown up. I was
on tour with you know, Old Dominion, Sam Hunt, Billy Carrington,

(28:59):
like I got do all the stuff that like you
always dream it, and it happened so fast.

Speaker 2 (29:03):
I wasn't like it.

Speaker 3 (29:04):
You're like, oh, that was easy.

Speaker 2 (29:05):
It was like a year. It was like, did you
think it was easy? I had no, no really, considering.

Speaker 3 (29:10):
You started when you were eight years old. It's not
like you hadn't been working hard towards this and focusing
on it. But finally it's like, oh it happened, and
then you're like, okay, well because I.

Speaker 2 (29:17):
Moved here ride after high school, so I didn't go
to college.

Speaker 4 (29:19):
So it was just like you've been I on the
price all I wanted to do. I didn't know that
you could even get paid to write songs.

Speaker 2 (29:24):
I thought.

Speaker 4 (29:24):
I was just like I'm just gonna him an artist,
and so to rewind a little bit, though, I was
a merch guy. So I sold t shirts for Shenandoah
Eastern Corbin, Jody Messina and like Marty stored a couple
of times, like I got Joe Dippy for a second,
Like I got to do some really cool merch gigs,
and I, you know, with Instagram was starting to pop off.

Speaker 2 (29:44):
TikTok wasn't a thing yet. This is pre pandemic twenty sixteen,
twenty seventeen. I got on the tour bus.

Speaker 4 (29:51):
I would keep my guitar on the under bay of
the tour bus and while they were in sound check,
I would go on the tour bus and like make
it look like it was my tour bus.

Speaker 2 (29:58):
And so I built this following topic. Think you're so
confident and made it.

Speaker 3 (30:01):
I would have been so. I would have been so
nervous to do that.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
I was, I was gonna get fired it. Every day.

Speaker 4 (30:06):
I was like, I'm gonna get fired for this. They're
gonna Easton's gonna come on this bus and see me
and like, dude, get off.

Speaker 3 (30:11):
So you would go sit on his bus and record
songs and sing and post it.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
Well, I rode his bus with them. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (30:17):
I love that confidence and just that like ability to
just seize a moment. You saw it and you're.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
Like, okay, that publishing deal actually.

Speaker 3 (30:24):
Because you presented yourself and so you what happens once
you When you were doing that, people were like, oh,
you're so awesome.

Speaker 2 (30:32):
Like, wait, you were in Michigan last night. I was
just there. I'm like, oh, yeah, you missed me and
I didn't play a show, was selling T shirt.

Speaker 4 (30:37):
But you're not lying, say I was with Eastern Corbyn
because I had pictures, but oh you guys missed the opener.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
I'm sorry.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
I guess I just so you got a little bus
going for yourself.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Oh I lied. I faked it.

Speaker 4 (30:47):
So I made it kind of thing and I got
a publishing deal and I and then from there it
kind of just all fell into place. I mean, I
just the fans were already there.

Speaker 3 (30:57):
How are the fans because you built them up on
your social media.

Speaker 2 (30:59):
Socials before I even had music out.

Speaker 3 (31:00):
Because the fans thought you were just like living this
cool life, which you are, because honestly, it's all just
how you present it. You're an interesting person to follow,
and so that's really all that matters.

Speaker 2 (31:09):
Well, so like, yeah, I mean, I guess I didn't.
I just I don't know. It happened so fast.

Speaker 4 (31:15):
And then twenty three we were negotiating with a label
and it was supposed to be a partnership because I'm
with a current label now as I'm with the independent,
smaller label, we're gonna go with a major label, okay,
And for about eight months we negotiated that deal fell through.

Speaker 2 (31:30):
On the last one.

Speaker 3 (31:31):
Was that a big bummer?

Speaker 4 (31:33):
No, Well, this is where trauma comes in, right, because
I didn't. I kind of bottled it up. I was like, whatever,
all right, eight months, lost a bunch of mom men,
I'm no big deal, We're going to put some music
out again, and didn't really like let I didn't really
grieve it.

Speaker 2 (31:46):
I guess is the best word for it.

Speaker 4 (31:48):
I just kind of was like I didn't want to
even like we're gonna keep going, yeah, yeah, because I
was like, I'm going to persevere and let people know
I'm tough and this doesn't stop me. And twenty four
was good. In this past here it started like kind
of creeping up and I was like, wait, I'm like
I'm worn out, I'm tired, of my brain front. You
got to post this many times a day. You gotta

(32:09):
gotta have a viral song.

Speaker 2 (32:10):
You gotta do this.

Speaker 4 (32:10):
If this doesn't work, then it's not successful. And people
move on so quick. If a song goes viral on Tuesday,
if it's not out by Friday, it's old news. And
it's just like this constant, like hamster wheel of stressing
yourself out. And I had to realize this is even
as as recently as last week, I'm the only person
who's letting this bother me, Like it's just me. It's

(32:30):
not anybody else, It's just me. And the longer and
the more I keep doing that to myself, the worst
office is going to get. And I might never hit
a breaking point until it's too late, and then you
hit a breaking point and then your whole world's crumbled
around you.

Speaker 2 (32:41):
So yeah, I think I had to realize that just
a little bit. And I still am, I mean exhausted.

Speaker 4 (32:47):
Yeah, I just couldn't keep up anymore. I was like,
I don't know, I can't keep up with myself at
this point. Yeah, and then I'm kind of this this
past month and whatnot in the past few months with
the EP coming out and like the songs releasing, I'm
like so good. I have such a good team, and
you know, people care about me and I care about them,
and you know, make it work in my advantage as

(33:07):
to like just keep doing what you do and just
do what you've been doing this whole entire time, which
is just releasing music and you know, using the resources
you have around you and leaning on those resources.

Speaker 3 (33:28):
But it's so interesting because like, you have to hustle
so hard to be seen in life in general, to
be anything, you have to.

Speaker 2 (33:35):
Yeah, specially these days, you have to be intense, you.

Speaker 3 (33:37):
Have to be focused, you have to grind, you have
to be strategic.

Speaker 2 (33:42):
You have to get to beyond all the time, beyond.

Speaker 3 (33:44):
All the time. You've got to be good. But then
you've got to be able to present it in a
way that people receive. Even if you are just like
great naturally, that really doesn't matter if you can't get
it across like digitally, and it's just it's so much
it never stops. And then finally, like you say, it's
like what am I even doing? But you have to

(34:05):
You feel like you have to hustle for so long
and then finally maybe you get to this point where
you're like, I just have to You're grateful for all
the work you put in, all the relationships you have,
but then you kind of just have to like figure
out how to be your real self or else you
can't survive it.

Speaker 4 (34:20):
Yeah, you know what was like the toughest thing. I'm
kind of like trying to think here without like going
too off the reservation.

Speaker 2 (34:28):
You know, the hardest part was.

Speaker 4 (34:31):
Thinking people like were my friends at one point? Oh yeah,
knowing that they weren't.

Speaker 3 (34:37):
I think that they are your friend and love you
so much. Yeah, but then, like you said earlier in
the interview, when it's such a business, when it is done,
it is done, and they are on to the next
and then they love that person and it's probably really
real because everyone's invested, but it's just like you are
a product. Yeah, and when it's not working or selling,

(34:59):
it's just done. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (35:00):
I had a business at manager. At business manager, I
had lawyer, I mean you name it. Everybody's on booking agent.
Everybody was on board, and then when not, when it's
not cool anymore to them, they jump off immediately and
they're onto the next thing, and you're like, wait, I
just for the last few years of my life, we
were wait, what's going on here?

Speaker 2 (35:20):
You know?

Speaker 4 (35:20):
So it's it was definitely it was like a lack
of part of my friends. But it's kind of like
a mindfuck a little bit.

Speaker 3 (35:29):
Is that What really kind of hit you is why
you need because you're realizing, oh, my gosh, I really
had invested so much and now they're just gone.

Speaker 4 (35:36):
Yeah, and then you have your artist friends, like you know,
who are still friends, but they have their own lives too.
You know, you're going to try to build their connections
and grow. So you're like, wait, why aren't we We
don't hang out anymore, We don't talk anymore like I
thought we were friends. Like so then you start getting
negative about them, and then you realize, wait.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
That's not the case at all. I think they just
they're all to business. That's exactly what you said.

Speaker 3 (35:55):
It's all strategic relationships, and it's not that people don't
respect you and admire you. And I think now that
I have been around for so long, I've seen a
full circle of like having even with my husband's band too.
It's like having the moment having it crash, being at
the top of the mountain, being at the bottom of
the valley, going through the depth of all this circle

(36:15):
to realizing then you come out on the other side,
and then you actually see it as a business too,
you know, and it's like you really can't invest in
those people as anything more than great people doing a job,
you know, and like you can love them and stuff,
but even the friendship you have to separate it because
if they can't make money, then they can't support their families.

(36:37):
And you know, it's like it's all the food chain
is so connected.

Speaker 2 (36:40):
You can't take it to person it is, you can't
take it personally.

Speaker 3 (36:45):
But then you realize you end up doing it to
someone because you have to end up letting people go
because they're not making you money or doing the job
you need them to do. And it's like, damn it,
but we were friends. But then you discipate this. The
whole thing is just so much. You have to see
it from such a higher perspective, but it's so hard.

Speaker 2 (37:02):
You know, you keep your circle really small.

Speaker 3 (37:04):
And you say that in your song I Do, Yeah,
which song is that? That's a life like that? You
know you're having success when your circle is small. Yeah,
tell me about that, because that's true.

Speaker 4 (37:13):
Well, it's like, if my circle's getting smaller, I must
be doing something right. And they came from like my
grandpa used to always tell me that, like, if your
circle is small, you're doing it right.

Speaker 2 (37:21):
Keep doing it.

Speaker 4 (37:23):
And it doesn't always mean like you're you're successful. It
just means that you can only count your best friends
on one hand. I truly believe that, I.

Speaker 3 (37:31):
Well, people who really know you, yeah, and who don't
need anything from you other than your love and your friendship,
and who will weather this, which is why.

Speaker 2 (37:39):
My dogs are like my best friends. They really are.
I mean, yeah, they truly are.

Speaker 3 (37:42):
Like there's not a true there's only a two a
few true blues. You're gonna weather every storm with you.
Just people don't have the bandwidth their life for that
many people. I don't have a bandwidth for that many people.
You know, you have, like you said, a handful of
people you can really give your all to. But then
otherwise you can't because you got to live, you know.

Speaker 4 (38:00):
Yep, Yeah, it was it's tough. I'm still thinking, like
I'm still like kind of like trying to process all
of that.

Speaker 3 (38:11):
I think, is your heart hurt right now?

Speaker 4 (38:12):
No?

Speaker 3 (38:13):
Did you just part ways? With somebody.

Speaker 2 (38:15):
No, no, no, no, no, everything's good.

Speaker 4 (38:17):
I just I'm just like thinking, like going back and
looking at the last few years, and it was just like, wow,
I think it's still I'm still trying to process.

Speaker 3 (38:23):
All that so much, so much this happens. How can
you like even comprehend everything that's happened so fast? Yeah,
including your racing cars. Now, I mean seriously, these are
like huge things that you're doing with your mind, your body,
your spirit, your energy. You're expanding so fast.

Speaker 4 (38:39):
Well, I do it to myself though, Yeah, like I
did do it to myself due degree, you know, Like,
how do you like it? I chose this life, I
chose this career. It's nobody's fault. But mind, you know,
if anything goes wrong, I choose the people I'm around,
you know, and they choose me sometimes too, But like
it's I don't know, it's life.

Speaker 2 (38:56):
I just I have a hard time comprehending that.

Speaker 3 (38:58):
Like you stretch so fast fast, Yeah, we're so fast.

Speaker 4 (39:01):
Yeah, And I think I'm just trying to play ketch up,
you know, like when your body grows too fast and yeah,
you know, like these days, I'm I guess my metasolism
is slowing down some going out rather than up. But yeah,
like I'm just trying to like, my body's trying to
play ketch up. I think my mind, my psyche's trying.

Speaker 3 (39:15):
To play ketch up totally with what you've just done.
So what have you just done? In the past four years?

Speaker 2 (39:21):
I toured a lot. You know, I had a lot
of things that weren't so healthy for me too mixed
in there as well. Well, alcohol, drugs.

Speaker 3 (39:28):
Did you give that up? Oh?

Speaker 2 (39:29):
Yeah, yeah, I know you gave it up your as recently.

Speaker 3 (39:32):
Yeah, you know, it was time.

Speaker 4 (39:34):
Well, alcohol was really never a problem for me. It's
it was never alcohol. By the way, my leg is
wanting to sleep. I'm so sorry, kick it out.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
Yeah, I'm trying not to laugh. It tickles so bad. Yeah,
so I'm so sorry. I what was I saying?

Speaker 3 (40:01):
You were saying?

Speaker 2 (40:02):
Yes, okay, so I remembering, Yeah, I was, I was,
I was. I was partying a lot on the road, right.

Speaker 3 (40:08):
Right, right, right, Yeah, Yeah, it's easy. It's it's every night's.

Speaker 2 (40:11):
A party there.

Speaker 4 (40:11):
Every night it's a party, and drinking was is not
a problem for me. I just I put it down momentarily.
We'll see if I ever decided to drink again. I
do miss beer. I kind of like beer. I miss
like a good cold beer. They don't do it for me.
I think there's just a certain little spice you get
with like a beer, like Anheuser Bush, you know. Yeah,

(40:32):
I miss the Saint Louis taste a little bit, some Missouri.

Speaker 3 (40:34):
Thing in Midwest.

Speaker 2 (40:35):
It does not Midwest.

Speaker 3 (40:37):
And I don't want We're not interested, no, okay.

Speaker 4 (40:40):
But yeah, I think that was just like some of
the people I was choosing to be around, like friend wise,
was not the healthiest, and I think I.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
Abused power a little bit in what way.

Speaker 4 (40:52):
Well, I mean, you know, you're when you're twenty one,
twenty two years old, you know, even before any like
success or like success, but like twenty one, twenty twenty
one and twenty two of the years, even before that,
like twenty eighteen, twenty seventeen, when I was still touring,
know where I was a merch.

Speaker 2 (41:10):
Guy and stuff. You know, I was.

Speaker 4 (41:15):
Look, there's girls around, and partying was the thing. And
I look back now, I'm like, man, I don't know
how I'm in bed by nine o'clock every night, you know,
ten o'clock at the latest. You know, so like, I've
definitely grown a lot, But I look back, I think
my body's just trying to play catch up. I think
I'm just trying my mind's trying to play catchup and
comprehend everything I've done. And you know, the things I've

(41:35):
you know, the places I've been, the things I've seen.

Speaker 3 (41:38):
You know, good for you having some retrospect really quick.
Not everyone takes the time to take inventory of their
life and their choices and how they made them feel
and how they want to evolve and expand. You know,
I think that's very like why is to start like thinking, Okay,
I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna evolve here.

Speaker 4 (41:56):
Yeah, you know, I wish I could be the guy
that say, like, well, I'm just gonna write about it
in songs.

Speaker 2 (42:03):
You know, I'm just gonna go.

Speaker 4 (42:04):
To a write and I sometimes I can't. I'll go
to write, like what do you want to write about today?
I'm like, I have no idea. I don't know what
I want to write about. I think I just want
to sit here and talk, and to me, that's more
important than the song. Sometimes it's just the therapy session
you have and then the next time you come in,
or sometimes they're like, hey, that's really good, let's write that.
But most of the time I like to talk so much,
and I'm kind of a squirrel. I kind of all
over the place when I write.

Speaker 3 (42:23):
Not like me in this interview or anything.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
Right, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (42:25):
I mean I'm the same way though, because I went
from having a dead leg to talk about racing to
talking about giving alcohol alcohol and.

Speaker 3 (42:31):
Oh we said it really wasn't alcohol. Was it like
weed or something?

Speaker 2 (42:35):
No, I mean it was just like adderall.

Speaker 3 (42:37):
Oh, adderall can sneak up on you. Yeah, because you
think you really do need it, and a lot of
people need it for focus?

Speaker 2 (42:42):
Why pack? I will never dog on it. Yeah, it
was the greatest, like drug, It was the great I
did it. It was a drug.

Speaker 4 (42:48):
I've used it, but that was the greatest thing ever.
I thought I could write all my best ideas, all
my favorite songs.

Speaker 3 (42:54):
What did it give you when you schog it?

Speaker 4 (42:57):
Well, I wasn't hungry all the time. Yeah, that's got
me in shape. I mean I would take it as
pre workout like I would take it heart. I would
take it before I go and go to the gym.
We'll fast forward twenty twenty. I started getting bad at
palpitations and so I couldn't figure out I was actually
I was working my producer that day. I walk in

(43:19):
and I was like, man, I'm like kind of antsy,
like my heart's pounding, and I like, oh my gosh,
I'm like, look, get your my Apple watch. It was
like one seventy my heart rate, which is like working out,
you know, that's like Hugh sprinting. And he's like, sounds
like you should get that checked out by a doctor.
I was like, you know what, man, I think I
go to the hospital on my arm and my face
are going numb.

Speaker 2 (43:38):
And so I'm in my Subaru baha at the time.
I'm driving like this old Subaru and I'm on I'm
on the road, and I started getting like tunnel visions
like call nine one one oh no. They come up.

Speaker 4 (43:50):
They're like, you know, they're like young kids, champion our
heart problems, like what's going on? Did you do any drugs?
And I'm like, no, no, I just took forty milligrams
of adroll this morning, like before I that was it,
you know, And they're like, oh my gosh. So went
to the hospital and they did a cat skin and
found like an a order aneurysm because I had I
think I had stretched so much blood flow had pushed

(44:11):
through my heart that it had stretched my a order
and it had made an order ganur.

Speaker 3 (44:16):
Did you have to have surgery or something?

Speaker 4 (44:17):
No, because it's not big enough yet. But I mean
if I kept doing it, you know who knows?

Speaker 3 (44:22):
So it's still in there.

Speaker 4 (44:23):
Oh yeah, yeah, It'll always be there, I think until
it decides the dissect and then I have to go
do something about that.

Speaker 3 (44:29):
But my dad had a.

Speaker 2 (44:31):
Really was it heart?

Speaker 3 (44:33):
Yes, they're scary, but at least you know about.

Speaker 2 (44:35):
It, is he? Is he still with those?

Speaker 3 (44:37):
Yeah? Can you keep it checked? Are you going to
check on it?

Speaker 2 (44:41):
So I'm only supposed to go once a year to
the cardiologist. I go twice a year. I'm kind of paranoid,
like yeah, I go. Yeah, that scared me. I mean like, wait,
is that when you?

Speaker 3 (44:48):
Did you stop at her?

Speaker 2 (44:49):
After that? I wish I could say, I did you know.

Speaker 3 (44:52):
To stop something like that?

Speaker 4 (44:53):
Well, because if you stop, it's I consider it like
it's like antidepressants, right, Yeah, you know I've been on
those and if you get off of them. Cold Turkey
you get these brain zapps and your heart starts pounding,
you get anxiety. So I had never experienced anxiety attacks
before I stopped. And the anxiety attacks, I still get them,
like they I think it kind of ruins you when

(45:14):
you are coming off of that or all like that.

Speaker 2 (45:16):
So I stopped cold Turkey.

Speaker 4 (45:17):
I didn't do it anymore. One day, it just decided,
I don't really want to do this anymore. Stopped and
I was like completely miserable for a while.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:26):
So have the anxiety attacks kind of subsided.

Speaker 4 (45:29):
Where in the music is industry? No, No, I mean
they're still there. It's learning to control it, you know.
I think sleep is a big thing, like sleeping, taking
care of your body. Fitness is a big thing for me.
Like I'll drink a Celsius, you know, or like a
red Bull, but primarily just black coffee does the job
for me to get a little bit of that stimulant

(45:51):
effect and go to the gym and stuff like that.

Speaker 3 (45:52):
It's so interesting, like when you start getting older, which
you are not old, You're still like so young.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
Are even twenty nine? This week Saturday? Happy birthday?

Speaker 3 (46:02):
Okay, we're almost Birthday Twins is July thirtieth.

Speaker 2 (46:05):
Are you still a cancer?

Speaker 3 (46:06):
No, I'm a leo.

Speaker 2 (46:07):
You're a leo. It's right, you said you're a leo.
So what are the characteristics of a leo?

Speaker 3 (46:11):
We are I'm tame now, I'm a tame lion.

Speaker 2 (46:14):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (46:14):
But when I was not in my youth, I would
just be so intense so I could get hot. Oh,
I could get hot so fast. And then but then
I was really nice in nurturing, kind of crazy person,
really just like a wild life, like.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
If your husband told you to calm down. Oh wow.

Speaker 3 (46:36):
And I quit drinking too. But like back in my
days when I was drinking, I could just fly off
the handles. I would just sob cry or yell at somebody.
I mean, it was really not good. I was a
little unhinged and not in a cool way. Nothing was
great about it. So age has been very good for me.

Speaker 2 (46:50):
You know what the beautiful thing is. You're a human.

Speaker 3 (46:52):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (46:53):
You're human.

Speaker 3 (46:54):
For your grace.

Speaker 2 (46:54):
You're allowed to you're allowed to fly, to grow.

Speaker 3 (46:57):
And then you realize that, okay, this is not working
for me, kind of like what you're talking about. You
start assessing your life, like, this is not working for me.
This is not good behavior. Why am I doing this?
You're hurting yourself physically, mentally, spiritually. You're also hurting others
with not being able to control your behavior because you
don't know why you're acting a certain way. So I

(47:17):
finally that's when I really got into therapy and started
like deep diving into myself and like because I knew
I was a kind, sweet, loving person. But then I
just have these extremes, which is I think normal of
being a human. But you got to work on it,
you know.

Speaker 2 (47:29):
So, what are like besides yoga? What are things you
do now?

Speaker 4 (47:33):
I'm asking like genuine advice, like what do you do
now to kind of I don't feel like yoga would
work for me?

Speaker 2 (47:40):
And when I'm not flexible, you don't have to be.
You can just start. And I've been so afraid of
like passing gas and yoga class.

Speaker 3 (47:46):
Oh just let it rh just rocket. Just try not
to make it too stinky or loud.

Speaker 2 (47:53):
I can't promise, But like, what are things you do
outside of those? You know what?

Speaker 3 (47:59):
I think? I've just stay in therapy for so so, so,
so so long, and life has hit me hard enough
that I've just had to keep diving into why I
got hit that like I've like we've gotten hit in
careers with like losing record deals. I've had three record deals,
having so many career changes, like my husband that with
the same way then just like just having to reis

(48:22):
having babies, I couldn't get pregnant and then like have
lots of miscarriages and just like you know, you kind
of just like get through your particular hard spells and
you live through enough of them, like and that you realize, Okay,
this is just life. I'm gonna and then doing this
podcast and hearing everyone going through stuff and then getting
to the other side of it. Finally, I think when
you get to the other side of things enough, you

(48:44):
know that you will get to the other side, and like,
but the traumas can get worse. So I don't know.
I I think when you're in it, it's awful, but
then you get to the other side and you're like, Okay,
I can live through this, and then you have this
whole new depth of perspective and things don't really bother
you as much. And then I think having a daughter
completely changed me because I was like, if I don't
figure out how to have self worth and like believe

(49:07):
that I am worthy and like amazing and and value.
How on earth am I going to parent her and
raise her into the woman that I want her to be? Like?
So I really I got hired like a life coach.
I really like dove deep into like why am I
a people pleaser? Why am I always? I found out
I was a high functioning codependent. Like once I realized

(49:27):
that like I was doing all these behavior things to
make people love me, and I realized the only person
that I really want to love me and like to
be a good example for a sunny and so I
just thank you. Yeah, it just put me a check.

Speaker 2 (49:39):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (49:40):
I think it's just such a long process of continuing
to always try to grow and it's exhausting.

Speaker 4 (49:59):
I want to done therapy and stuff like that. And
there's that place called Porter's Call.

Speaker 3 (50:03):
Oh that's where I go. It's great. Really, yes, it's
free for artists. It's amazing.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
I really want to go back.

Speaker 3 (50:08):
You should go.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
I need to go.

Speaker 3 (50:09):
You have to get once a week, Well just book it,
get on the.

Speaker 4 (50:12):
Counter and you know, it's kind of like I was
like a fair Weather fan when it came to like
it's like how it used to be with like church.
You know, it's like whenever I need help, I'll go
get it kind of thing.

Speaker 2 (50:21):
And then like I always need help.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
Like you always need to go to the gym, Like
you said, yes you got to keep that muscle?

Speaker 2 (50:26):
Yes, yeah, yeah, I don't.

Speaker 3 (50:29):
Did you not like having to talk about all this stuff?

Speaker 2 (50:32):
I don't know how to always And I think I
had a wrong perception of what a therapist was.

Speaker 3 (50:39):
Where'd you think it was?

Speaker 2 (50:40):
They're supposed to give you the answers. Oh, I didn't realize.
They just sit there and listen. And then you're like, Okay,
I'm done. Why am I pissed off? Right now? Why
am I sad? Like I don't cry?

Speaker 4 (50:49):
I think I have a really hard time crying, and
I can never understand why. I've only cried one time
and that was recently and it was, uh, that was
confusing too. I'm like, why am I crying?

Speaker 3 (51:02):
Why are you crying?

Speaker 4 (51:03):
Well understandably, but like, so rewind a little bit. My grandpa,
who I was very very very close to you, right, Oh, sorry, no,
not really. He was just a big rock in my life, right.
I think grandparents are super important. I come from an
amazing family. Both sides are equally amazing. But he was

(51:24):
just there during the hardest parts of my life, and
losing him in twenty one was really hard, but I
didn't cry. I was like, he was ninety one years old.
He lived a great life. You know, he's with the Lord.

Speaker 2 (51:39):
I can't.

Speaker 4 (51:40):
You know, that's amazing. But there's a kid I went
to high school with. I wasn't even super close with him,
hung out with him a few times and played sports
with him and so got to know him through that.
But my community back home in Missouri is super small.
It's called Park Film, Missouri, so it's outside Kansas City
about twenty minutes. So I went too with this kid

(52:01):
and then stayed in contact a bit. But he was
a firefighter paramedic. He was he was killed, you know,
a couple months ago, and my sister's a firefighter paramedics,
so there's a little bit of that correlation too. And
then going to his funeral and it was like the
whole like the last call they do on the radio
and then they play Amazing Grace, which the music always

(52:23):
gets me, and then you hear the bagpipes and you
see his family crying and all his friends crying, and
I was like, wait, why am I crying? This is like,
this is like all these emotions came out, and I.

Speaker 3 (52:33):
Think from like your whole life or just about him
in particular.

Speaker 4 (52:37):
Him in particular, but I think it's just it was
just really it was just it was also really beautiful too.
I think like it was so beautiful to see that
many people that like loved him and cared about him,
all the fire apartments from like even three hours a
way showed up, Like it was super incredible to see.
And that was like I left that funeral, which I
feel bad for saying this because I know that you know,

(52:58):
so many people that day didn't feel relief, but I
like I left that that funeral and I was like
I cried, like wow, Like I kind of like I
feel a little bit of relief today. Like I was like,
he was I got I got to know him.

Speaker 2 (53:12):
That was great.

Speaker 3 (53:13):
He was a good dude, and you could see its beautiful.
I celebrated with then the tragedy of it gone too soon.

Speaker 4 (53:17):
Yeah, but there's something, there's always a silver lining, and
I think the silver lining was like that many people
loved and cared about him.

Speaker 2 (53:22):
So that was that was a day that I definitely got.
That was in my last recent cry.

Speaker 3 (53:27):
So that's one of your only cries you've ever had.

Speaker 2 (53:30):
Yeah, I don't. I don't. I would like to. There's
days I know I want to, but I don't know
how to. It's really weird.

Speaker 3 (53:35):
You don't know how to get the tears out.

Speaker 2 (53:36):
I would like to, Like, you don't know how to let.

Speaker 3 (53:38):
Them flow, even if you want them to come out,
you don't know how.

Speaker 2 (53:42):
I not that.

Speaker 4 (53:43):
I don't know how it happens. I just I don't
get the pick and cheese when it happens.

Speaker 2 (53:46):
I don't know. I don't. It's weird.

Speaker 3 (53:48):
Yeah, so you feel the because I cry basically every day.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
That's good.

Speaker 3 (53:52):
So you feel the.

Speaker 2 (53:53):
You feel that relief every day.

Speaker 3 (53:54):
Probably I can't stop it. I just like get that
bubbly feeling coming up and like if I don't cry
it out, I it just has to come out. But yeah, okay,
so that's great, you're going to Putter's call and get
those tears out.

Speaker 2 (54:10):
I need to, Yes, I need to.

Speaker 3 (54:12):
Once you unleash it. Yeah, it might just be like.

Speaker 4 (54:15):
A I would I would, I would like to experience it.
I'm sure it's an amazing thing.

Speaker 2 (54:20):
I mean, I just would love for you just.

Speaker 3 (54:21):
To get a good sob in would you love that
just to like weep?

Speaker 2 (54:26):
Yeah, like a reality TV show, you unleash it, just.

Speaker 3 (54:29):
Get it out. I've done that before where I've been
doing different therapies and like hit something and just it's
almost like an exorcism. You're like, what is happening right now?

Speaker 2 (54:39):
I've seen that on TV. Yeah, I want to.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
Get that grief out, you know, all that stuff that
lopped in there. Yes, but I see this for you.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
It is relieving.

Speaker 4 (54:49):
Like I felt that and I was like, oh my god,
like there's so many emotions bottled up number one in
that day and obviously what happened my sister being in
that line of work, I was like, that could be
that could be my family and it's not.

Speaker 3 (55:01):
Yeah, you know, and it's a miracle. Every day is
a gift. It truly is. We are not promised every day.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
No keep saying performed like it was super. It was
just a crazy thing, you know. And so.

Speaker 4 (55:14):
Yeah, that that a good cry would be nice, you know.
I think that's that's well overdue at some point.

Speaker 3 (55:21):
But so what do you want with all this, what
is your goal? You've had this stream since you're eight,
but what is the dream? Like? What is success to you?
When you hit your six when you're like, oh my gosh,
my eight year old is so happy, we did it.
What have you done? What is the goal?

Speaker 4 (55:38):
I So it used to be like I used to
think about like I want to you know, if you
ask me year by year my plan, right, it's like
I'm going to go in an arena this year, I'm
gonna do this.

Speaker 2 (55:48):
And it's still always it's still a business. You shud
let that make projections for yourself and everything. But I
tend to I used to think about every all the
I think it's like an alphabet. There's a all the
way to Z and like I used to think of
a to Z and now I kind of like try
to think of everything in between, you know, which is
super important. I feel like, but whenever one day when

(56:08):
I look back, I just want to be able to say,
you know, all this was cool, I got to do
it all.

Speaker 4 (56:14):
I'm blessed. I'm happy. But you know, is my you know,
not married, but if I have, you know, it's like
you want to be married? Yeah, And as is my
wife happier, my kids healthy. I have an amazing family,
So I want to be able to like, they're not
always going to be here, like my grandparents aren't always
going to be here. How can I replicate that amazing

(56:34):
support system that I grew up with? How can I
do that for my children? So I think, more or less,
even from away from the career side of it, I'm
just like, how can I replicate and just be the
best person I can be for them? I think going
through some of the things I've I've gone through I'm
still going through is going to help pave that a
little bit. I just need to figure out a little
bit on how to articulate a bit of that and
make some buying tweaks in there.

Speaker 3 (56:54):
But but you're doing and you're you're like self examining,
you're digging in.

Speaker 2 (57:01):
Yeah, I overthink. I'm an overthinker who does overanalyze everything.
Oh yeah, yeah, man.

Speaker 3 (57:07):
I think you get to this point where I think
I'm finally almost there where I'm like, I don't even
care because I don't have these big dreams like I
used to. I still have dreams, but like now that
I've had my daughter, like She's like, honestly my only
dream and like, I love doing this podcast and I
know that in my heart, God has like his own
plan for it. But whereas I used to feel like
I had to map it out, now I'm like, God,

(57:28):
do you just take it where you want it? I'm
just hearing, right, you can ask you something.

Speaker 4 (57:31):
Yeah, you're just hearing you talk about your daughter and
your husband and the life you have, and you know
things you're doing. I feel like you also have to
make time for something that makes you truly happy. Aside
from those things, like what's something that you do, not
going to yoga or things? It's like, is there a
vacation you.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
Want to go on? Is there things you want to
do personally?

Speaker 3 (57:49):
Or I've been traveling my whole life like I traveled
as a kid my whole life. I did the Amazing
Race two times?

Speaker 2 (57:54):
You really yes?

Speaker 3 (57:55):
When I was in my twenties, I was I've been
a tea the host I've done like I worked for
a regional as a song promoter. I was in a
band for seven years and travel the country, Like I
have pursued myself so hard for so long that I
am just like I am in my like unwinding error.

(58:18):
I have been like slowly just trying to detangle my
brain and calm my nervous system. That is what I
have been trying to do for the past five years.
Is just like I have been so intense, so go go,
so focused, such a hustler, so obsessed, so like feeling
like I have to hit all these lines, these timelines,
these goals, all this stuff, and then realizing for what

(58:38):
because it all falls apart eventually, and then nobody gives
a shit, like we're talking about earlier, and I'm like,
what am I doing this for if I don't love
it and it's not bringing me joy? And obviously you
need it to have success so you can pay your
bills and stuff, but it's like nobody cares. Not one
person cares. And I think that I'm finally just at
that point where I know nobody cares. People can jump

(58:58):
on board, they can be support to, they can like
love love it and help it, but like nobody hears,
nor do I need them to care. You know, I
just need people to be excited to do their job
and then same for me. But it's like I don't know,
I just so many things have come together and fallen
apart in my life that I just am like, God,
Jesus take the wheel. I am here. They're a good
job though, because yeah, it's great.

Speaker 2 (59:20):
I've always always, but for years I followed what you've
been doing.

Speaker 4 (59:24):
And actually, funny enough with With with thousand Horses, like
I when I was a merch guy. I think they
were headlining some festival and it was like Maddie and
Tay and then Shannon Doo we were there that day.

Speaker 2 (59:42):
I was really cool. I get that.

Speaker 3 (59:43):
That's awesome. You've been connected a long time.

Speaker 2 (59:45):
A long time.

Speaker 4 (59:46):
Yeah, but yeah, I mean like listening to with with
Bobby will listen to you do a podcast with him
and like, uh yeah, it's just it's interesting how the
world's relatively small and like it is all conneccidentially and
everything it does.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:00:01):
That's what my old agent said, Brod Essex. He used
to Runda, you know right, Oh, I love Rod. He said.
If you are if you are good, like legit good,
and you don't give up, you will have success on
some level at some time. It's inevitable.

Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
It's a dark board.

Speaker 3 (01:00:20):
You're gonna if you keep staying great and you keep
doing the work and you keep showing up. It's going
to go somewhere eventually. That's successful. Like it's just you
can't not work out somewhere, you know, it just sometimes
takes a while. That's right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:37):
Day.

Speaker 3 (01:00:38):
So here we are Midwest calling It's coming out lifelike
as your like autobiography song out there. I love that.
And you're just on your own journey figuring it out,
like riding the waves and really at the end of
the day, like getting in touch with you and your
soul and who you are and what it all is for.
It's all just about you, and you're on that journey.
It's cool to see your soul journey as well as

(01:00:59):
your musical already unfolding.

Speaker 4 (01:01:01):
You know, I kind of feel like it. I used
to always say, like maybe I'm an old soul, but
I don't think so. I think it's just I had
to grow up really quick and this, you know, this
line of work, you kind of live so many lives
sometimes in one year, Like I've done so much. What
have I done this year? I don't think I've done
it enough. You're like, wait, no, my god, I've just
was gone for the last six months. You know, I'm

(01:01:23):
I'm like my body, I have bags under my eyes.

Speaker 3 (01:01:25):
Like your nervous system is shot, yes, all the time,
because nothing's consistent. Yeah, I know, it's hard to regulate
it is. So that's why, like, when you can get
a hold of this, you really become like a master
of regulating your emotions and stuff because you're dealing with
them on such a huge bandwidth and level and with
so much highs and lows that once you kind of

(01:01:47):
regulate it, you're like, wow, it's really it's such. It
ultimately is the journey of your life and not just
for the career, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:01:53):
Yeah, yeah, it's true.

Speaker 3 (01:01:55):
God so important to you.

Speaker 4 (01:01:56):
Oh yeah, absolutely, And I think the the harder things
have gotten, Even when the harder things are gotten, I've
leaned on it, and so when things get easier, I'm
much more like, Okay, there's a reason why, you know.
And so, yes, Christ is really important to me.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
Absolutely. Yeah, I take that. I take that seriously. And
there's I fall short every single day. Yeah, we all do.
We all have across to bear.

Speaker 4 (01:02:22):
Some crosses are heavier than others. But yeah, I just
try to carry it each day and just be happy
with who I am. And I come from a really
really strong family of a lot of women. My mom
and my sister, my grand my grandparents, my grandmothers are
really really really strong. I have all my grandparents, like
all my grandparents except for my grandpa. I have a

(01:02:44):
bunch on each side. I'm very blessed, and they've always
just kind of ran the family, and so I think
that's also really helped kind of keep me grounded because
I the men are very much of like my dad,
Like we like talked about race cars, you know, like
that's my I call him twice a day every day.

Speaker 2 (01:03:00):
I call my mom twice to day. She's a nurse.

Speaker 4 (01:03:03):
I try to call her twice a day every day,
but she's always working. But I think like with my dad,
it's like talk about racing and you know cars in general,
and you know guns or whatever it might be. And
then you know, with my grandpa, it's like he has
a long horn form, so we talked about cows. And
then with my sister, it's like I can talk about

(01:03:23):
life with her. She gets kind of decompressed to me
about some things that she's seen at work that she
can always make sense of whether she really knows that
she's doing that or not. And with my mom, I
can lean on her for advice even though she might
not always have the answer. She's just really good at listening.

Speaker 3 (01:03:37):
That's great.

Speaker 2 (01:03:38):
So that's really helpful.

Speaker 3 (01:03:39):
Yeah, well you're just crushing the game, Alexander.

Speaker 2 (01:03:43):
Yeah, thanks for Alexander, Caroline Hobby, thanks for having me, Thank.

Speaker 3 (01:03:47):
You for joining. Would you stick around for a few
little bonus episodes where you're all three questions and it's
called tell me more? So we're really going to get
to the depths of your soul? Okay, so we have
nt tell us one time everything that we need to
know about. We have Midwest Calling ep out August twenty second.
August twenty second. You're doing shows right now?

Speaker 4 (01:04:05):
Uh yeah, we got a few on the books right now.
We're getting we're getting more. So this year is a
year I'll be on the road, so.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
We just see next year.

Speaker 3 (01:04:10):
Yeah, okay, and then everyone just follows you at Roman Alexander.

Speaker 4 (01:04:13):
Yeah, Roman Exander Music usually Instagram and TikToker is usually
my go to. I have a website, but Instagram TikTok Okay.

Speaker 3 (01:04:18):
I always wrap up with leave your Light. It's just
super open ended. What do you want people to know,
drop some inspo.

Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
That you truly can do anything you want. You just
got to be persistent. Persistence is the key to everything,
I feel like. So I'm still being persistent.

Speaker 4 (01:04:35):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
Some days I want to be a race car driver,
some days I want to be an artist. That all
the time I really did. I'm an artist all the time.
But I'm persistent.

Speaker 3 (01:04:43):
Are you hard on yourself?

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
Oh yeah, I don't think if you aren't hard on yourself.

Speaker 4 (01:04:47):
You know. It's like when you look at Michael Jordan,
not even going to compare myself. That sounds really bad analogy,
but just just.

Speaker 2 (01:04:53):
Bear with me here.

Speaker 4 (01:04:54):
I think about Tiger Woods, Michael Jordan, Lewis Hamilton, the
formula driver, or you know Tom Brady. People always focus
on their wins and all the great accomplishes they make,
you know, PGA, whether it's the winning the Masters, or

(01:05:15):
winning a Formula one World championship or winning the Super Bowls.
People only focus on the wins, but the losses are
what made them and built them and growth, and you
only grow on your losses. And they've lost far more.
Same with Michael Jordan.

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
He missed more shots than he ever made, the ones
that made.

Speaker 3 (01:05:32):
So yeah, I love that Roman. Thank you so much. Okay,
loved it, y'all. Stick around, we're gonna do. Tell me
more Episode