NICOLLE GALYON: From First Born to Second Wife, Nicolle Galyon, is writing her life even if it goes against the grain!

This week on GET REAL Podcast...NICOLLE GALYON!

NICOLLE is a hit songwriter with a long running list of number ones. She has written for artists like, Keith Urban,  Miranda Lambert, Carrie Underwood, Dierks Bentley, and so many others.

IN THIS EPISODE, we talk:
• Her brand new EP, “Second Wife”
• Finding and having the confidence to be great
• How her narrative has shifted over the years being married to another hit songwriter, Rodney Clawson
• The power of authentically and unapologetically following your soul

You can listen to Nicolle’s new EP, “Second Wife,” here! *link in email*

Listen to NICOLLE GALYON on GET REAL Podcast...NOW! 

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See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Cary Lounde.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
She's a queen and talking and you live, so you
know she's getting really not afraid to feel the episode soul.
Just let it flow.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
No one can do. We quiet that Carey Loune is
sounding care lound.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
I'm thrilled to be here. Nicole Gallian, you are amazing.
This is your second time on my podcast, and I
feel like, now wow, like you you're such a special individual.
And I know you probably know this about yourself because
you're so intentional, But the way that you have made

(00:49):
your choices, the way that you have your confidence, the
way that you write your life, the way that you
live your life, the way that you are putting our
art into the world and creating opportunities for other women
with your record label and publishing company, Songs and Daughters,
just the songs that you write, and it's just it's

(01:11):
just so cool to see you as this fully blossomed woman.
And I love this album, this EP that you've just created,
your first your first album, Firstborn, was amazing. I feel
like that was such an introspective look at you as
a person and what made you and all the questions
that you're grappling with in life and now like Second

(01:35):
Wife the surprise EP that you just are dropping out
of the blue for all of us, which is so exciting.
It's just like it's so good. Michael and I were
listening to it last night and I was like, damn.
We were like, oh, this is just so good. I'm like,
you are truly. I feel like you're like a Patti Griffin,
Laurie McKenna like you, but you're like an artist, but

(01:56):
you're a songwriter. You're like everything. You're like one of
those unicorns that you're just all of it, and you're
just so good. It's so well done. It's so thoughtful.
You're asking such big questions and you're answering them so simply,
like simply like Tom Petty would, but it's so profound.
You're just great, Nicole. I mean truly, like you are
such a gift.

Speaker 1 (02:17):
I'm so glad of recording this because I can go
back and listen to this, this intro monologue that you
just did. It's every morning to like this will be
puffyff like fid myself much affirmation for the Wow. Thank
you so much. I mean, I feel I feel so

(02:37):
I feel in some ways like really proud to hear
you say all of those kind things, but then also
like tired because I'm like, gosh, I've been working for
a long time and growing up for a long time
in the business and you know, grinding it out and
trying to continually evolve, not even trying to. It's just
like part it's like natural for me to evolve. Evolution

(03:00):
always comes with like work and change and all of that.
And so then when to hear you like say all
of that, I just kind of feel like I see,
like twenty years in Nashville just like kind of takes
my breath away a little bit.

Speaker 2 (03:13):
Well, you didn't casually grow up, you know, like some
people get to get into their life and they just
kind of like fumble through it and they kind of
get drunk a lot, or they're going through some trauma
and they get lost in all their emotions and they
just like figure it out. They like bump into walls
and figure it out. You have focused, and like that

(03:35):
was your word for this year, was focused. But like you,
when I think about you, and I've always felt this
way about you because I feel like I've known you
now for I've known you most of your time in Nashville,
if not all of it. Maybe we met one time
back in the day day like day day. I don't
even remember where we met, but it was like back
in the day when it was just everybody was just
now it was we were the new class, you know,

(03:57):
everyone was just coming to Nashville, fresh out of it of
being a teenager, into the big world of the dreams.
But you are focused, and you have always had this
determination and this confidence and this ability to just do
what you came here to do. Like not everyone has
the confidence just to do what they came here to do.

(04:18):
And listening to your album Second Wife, the one that
got me, well, all of them got me, but like Rooms,
that one was just so powerful because like even dating Rodney,
your husband, you were twenty three, you're his second he
had already been married, had kids before, hit songwriter, huge,
huge presence in Nashville, and like just seeing that perspective,

(04:41):
it took me back to like the beginning days of
like coming into Nashville and all those feelings of everyone
looking at you and judging you and talking about you
because you're twenty three dating this older man who's already
been married, he's already successful. Who are you you know,
everyone's got their thoughts about you, and now look at
who who you are. You know, it's almost like look

(05:03):
at who you are? Like that song started off at
the beginning, everyone like coming at you. You know, what'd
you say, like the side eye or the rolling of
the eyes, and like, oh my god, it was this
twenty three year old. But now it's like, look at
the love story y'all built. You know, It's like it's
so cool. It's just such a cool evolution to see
who you have become.

Speaker 1 (05:24):
Thank you. That was what was so fun. I think
about the process of making Second Wife was that we
we just spent time, like the two of us sitting
on a couch at our farm, just like talking through.
Really it's like the first time we'd ever like put
a mirror on our relationship, you know. Firstborn was like

(05:44):
the first time that I had ever taken that mirror
up to my own face and said, Okay, what do
you want to say? What do you want to create
and put out into the world. And so then when
we put that mirror up to us as a couple,
it just started a lot of conversations and one of

(06:05):
you know, the conversations that came up where Rooms is
concerned is we were just talking through but we were
playing this you know, that game. We're not really strangers
that card game. It's like it's basically like I get
to know somebody game. It's not even a game you win.
You just like ask people questions and have to answer them,
and it's a way to connect. And so we were

(06:26):
just like drinking and playing that game, the two of us,
and whatever the card was. I don't remember the question,
but the answer to it was me saying, well, that
time at the BMI Awards and I told him like
I was in. He was like, what do you mean.
I told it. I explained like kind of how it
felt going to be my awards for the first few

(06:48):
years and stuff, and I remember him saying like, well
you've wow. I didn't really know that at the time.
And so at that point it's like whatever comes of
like Second Wife, the project doesn't it's like pales in
comparison to like us getting to have that process together
of like rehashing and like looking back through all of

(07:08):
these years. But Rooms was really like the muse for
Rooms was being my awards because we talked through how
differently it has felt over the last. I don't know.
We've been going to be and my awards for maybe
like seventeen or eighteen years now again, and how differently
it's felt through the years, like going.

Speaker 2 (07:29):
Like me, okay, yeah, because give me the for everyone
listening to BMI Awards or where songwriters, like hit songwriters
are honored for their songs, so like the songs that
are the biggest songs of the year, all the artists,
all the writers get in a room and you get
award sport. So it's a really big, like who's who
of the industry event. So you started going when you

(07:50):
were twenty three with Rodney when he was the big writer,
but you hadn't had anything yet.

Speaker 1 (07:55):
Yeah, I have not had anything yet, and I remember, like,
you know, I would be like, oh, this is Rodney's wife,
which you know, or Rodney's spiance or whatever, and I
was so proud to be that, but you know, it
also was who was she a little bit or you know,
that room is such a it's such a hard ticket
to get to get into the VMI Awards. So if

(08:17):
you're there and someone doesn't you know, that doesn't know
who you are, it's kind of like, well, how did
they get in here. Oh well, she's with Rodney. And
then over the years and it was never everyone is
always kind to me. I'm not trying to play a
victim at all. Like it was just we we got
to like observe over the years how that energy shifted
and like how our posture changed. My posture changed confidence

(08:39):
wise into like, now he's Writer of the Year, and
I'm winning my first BMI Award, and now I'm a
VMI Award winner, and then like we're both winning a
bunch and then like I'm winning some but he just
he's not even there that year, you know, And so
then I'm one writer and so it's just dang houses

(08:59):
that that that event was almost like a benchmark for
where our careers and our personal lives have gone to
just like and to me, if you judge it by
like what's going on internally, rooms is special to me
because I have gotten to outgrow you know, I didn't

(09:20):
get stuck in that kind of meek oh you know,
insecure era you know that I was in maybe when
I was twenty two or twenty three. I just kept
my head held high, whether I was confident deep down
or not, and just continued to walk forward. And you

(09:41):
know last year I went to the BMI Awards by
myself and won a bunch of awards by myself, and
I just I was like, wow, I'm not even walking
in here with him anymore. It's then the only reason
he didn't go is because he was deer hunting and
I wanted him to be there. But I thought, the irony.

(10:01):
You know that we've gotten to this point, so that's
what crazy.

Speaker 2 (10:07):
Isn't that crazy? Do you think that that that tension
of walking into those rooms, especially in the beginning and
how you started this song off. Do you feel like
that pushed you even harder to focus harder? Like did
you want to prove even more that? Like, yes, you're
proud to be with him, but like y'all just wait
because like I got it, I got so much in

(10:29):
here that is about to come out. Like was that
did that push that even more?

Speaker 1 (10:35):
Yeah? For sure. I remember in the early years before
people maybe when people only knew about us but didn't
know us personally. I remember Rodney, who's very a man
of few words, he was just like, well, we just
bet on ourselves, and so we bet on ourselves, and

(10:57):
time always tells who the people.

Speaker 2 (10:59):
Are, and.

Speaker 1 (11:01):
So I think there is. So there's so much just
like content, contentment now and knowing like we continued to
bet on ourselves and each other over all of the years,
and now we get to see the fruit of that,
you know, and and which the fruit of that for
us is just peace and then like being ourselves and

(11:24):
obviously we have these incredible kids in this life and
Kansas and all of this stuff now. But it was
really like him saying that was a lot more about like, wait,
it doesn't matter what anybody else thinks. What do we think?
That's what we live with, and that's who we're married to,
is who we know. So we just can't continue to
bet on each other and and we still do. I mean,

(11:47):
I think even in these recent life decisions that we've
made relocating to Kansas, we weren't looking at anybody else.
We look to each other and we go, okay, what, okay,
what do we what do we want to bet on?
You know, we don't have so many days in this life,
and I would gamble those days on this. So I

(12:07):
think we've just always been pretty confident in our relationship
with each other and trust each other so much that
it's almost confusing sometimes to other people.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
Well, I feel like y'all kind of started your relationship
off on betting on yourself. Because even just going back
to and I Love the Grain, that one's so good.
I feel like that is such a great song describing
a relationship. But even starting off in the beginning, you
being younger, the second wife, all of this, like it's
like everyone else was kind of betting against you or
like placing wages, like is it going to work out?

(12:40):
She's just young, he's already been mayor you know, all
the things people like to do. People just love to talk.
People love to talk. And y'all are y'all been a
good story since the start, you know. And and I
just feel like y'all immediately in the beginning just blocked
the noise. You know, y'all got strong real fast. You
knew from the beginning that this was this was it.

(13:02):
And I love that you put that into a song
form in the Grain kind of tell me about the Grain,
because that one's such a I feel that way about
Michael and I too. It's like we're not we're not
a pretty Christmas paper, but we are a great love story,
you know. But it's like it's not it's it's so
great the way, of course, two perfect songwriters wrote this
perfect love song. So tell me about The Grain.

Speaker 1 (13:23):
Oh well, I'm like, I'm kind of a title horror.
I just get like really stuck if I have a
title and I don't even know what it is. I
just am like almost bullheaded about it, Like we have
I have to figure out a way to write this title,
because there's something about the essence of the title that
like I connect with. And the Grain was probably one

(13:43):
of the first titles that I came up with for
Second Life, and it was it really came from like
Rodney's previous life as a farmer.

Speaker 2 (13:52):
Bad He was a farmer and a coach in Texas.

Speaker 1 (13:54):
Right, Yes, so yeah, he's like he's like he's his
second act. He's already lived his second act. He's like
on his fourth act. You know it's wild. But no,
he was like the most still human ever. He's so happy,
he's not tired, so easy, all the energy. So ea, no,

(14:17):
he and somehow he just keeps getting younger. I don't know,
but he with him. The Grain came from like an
Odesu Midwest, you know, growing from me, like growing up
like you know, wheat fields all around, and him being
a farmer, and then also like the tie in of
just us maybe not being the obvious, you know, the

(14:41):
status quo. And I think that, like our relationship gave
me so much empathy and understanding for other people and
their relationships because before, before Rodney, everything in my life
kind of made sense on paper, and and he was
the thing that was a bit of a curveball, like

(15:04):
for people in my family or friends who are like, oh,
did not see this coming. But now so many years later,
everyone's like, now, I mean, it makes completely perfect sense.
And so that's what the grain is about, is that
just because it might come with some tension or some challenges,

(15:27):
or it doesn't make sense to everybody else, doesn't mean
that it's not the right thing for you.

Speaker 2 (15:32):
If I've learned anything, if it's like perfect on paper,
is always like it's not really perfect. I nothing is
perfect on paper.

Speaker 1 (15:43):
You know.

Speaker 2 (15:44):
It's like when you get to those places where you
have the decision in your heart to take the jump
and it's what you're supposed to do, and nope, it
always feels like everyone else thinks it's not the right
thing to do. Because when you take these big risks.
Most people are scared of really big risks. They're always
thinking of the things that can go wrong, because of
course a million things can go wrong, but also a

(16:05):
million things can go wrong when it looks perfect on
paper too. So it's like at the end of the day,
it all comes back to you and like trusting yourself,
which I feel, and now seeing your life play out
over these years, you are someone who has just always
known your north star, Like I don't know how you've
had that kind of confidence, Like you have known what

(16:26):
is right for you, and you have done what is
right for you, especially like as a woman, like you
have put yourself out there in big ways always like
you're not scared to do what you want to do.
How have you known? How have you known what you
wanted to do so clearly?

Speaker 1 (16:43):
Oh goodness, I don't know. I got a lot of things,
like a lot of I think I have a really
strong relationship with myself.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
Did that stem from your upbringing?

Speaker 1 (16:57):
Yeah? I think so. I think I've always when I
was a kid, I was I wasn't super loud. I
was like more of like a quiet leader, just like
in the corner doing my work, figuring out what I
just quietly like wanted what I wanted to do. And
I think that that's something that I think you learn

(17:17):
it at a young age. Like nobody told me to
play piano, and no one told me to move to Nashville.
No one told me to start a record but you know,
it's like all those things were just like actually, Stephanlyn
did tell me to start a record label, but most
of the things that I like the biggest, most important

(17:38):
things in my life like came from right here.

Speaker 2 (17:42):
And you know how to listen and follow that though,
Like that's a big difference, is like you feel it
and you know how to listen and follow it.

Speaker 1 (17:48):
Yeah, I think it's just staying connected to yourself. And
for me, like on a spiritual level, the more I'm
connected to myself, the more I'm connected to the creative
swirl that is happening above us, within us, higher power God.
You know. All of that to me is like is
if I can stay connected to me, then I'm tapping

(18:10):
into all of that too. So it's not that I'm
taking credit for knowing what any of this stuff is.
It's more just like tapping into something bigger than me. Honestly,
that's guiding me, and that's I think what gives me
the confidence to just put myself out there. And I'd
be lying if I said sometimes I don't feel vulnerable

(18:30):
like of like maybe what other people might think about it.
But when you assess the risk of well, do I
want to never know what it feels like to try this,
or do I maybe want to put myself out there
and have some people have opinions about it like this,
it's I'd always rather just like put myself out there because.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
Ultimately, I just you just have confidence, so you've.

Speaker 1 (18:55):
Always had or I'm crazy. Maybe I'm just crazy, I
don't know.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
But even starting back in the beginning, I mean I
remember you and ray Lynn y'all were both on the
Voice together, like you made it to the finals and
we're like singing on the Voice. I mean you were
putting yourself out there. You've just gone for it forever.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
Well, I think like being scared is just the beginning,
you know, like being brave, Like being brave is the
next thing. It's not you don't get stuck and scared.
You like you pass through it and something you know
you something makes you scared because it's kind of like
a nerve. You hit a nerve and you're like, ooh,

(19:38):
is that something like hitting your hand on the stove
on a hot stove. It's like it's a nerve. It's
like Ooh, is that hot because I need to go
toward that? Or is that hot because it might burn me?
And I think when I get scared of something, it
just makes me pay it's more attention to it and
go ooh, is that something I should be drawn toward?
Because why do I even have a response to it?

(19:59):
Like I'm very indifferent about the things that I shouldn't
be doing, you know.

Speaker 2 (20:06):
Most feeling about something that's a big sign for you.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
Yeah. I also just like I just love making things.
I am a builder. I think I love making things.
And whether it's like making a moment like making a
party for my kids, or making merch or making a record,
or making a brand or a company, or I don't know,
I just making a list good at that too. I

(20:35):
just like making things. I'm a creative and I think
if you're creative, you you create and it's not that complicated.
It doesn't and it always doesn't have to fit within
an industry's box, you know. I think that's where sometimes
people's eyes cross when they like see that I'm like
doing another project, or like but what a fit? And
I'm like, but why not? Like it's so fun to me.

Speaker 2 (21:03):
What leads you? Because I feel like you are not
like I keep saying this in a million different words,
but I'm going to say it again, but like you're
not scared to be great, And I feel like a
lot of people get afraid to be great. I feel
like I've even feel like I'm just not coming into
like accepting that I can be great at podcasting and

(21:26):
interviewing has taken me so long. I've always struggled with
like my worth and insecurity. But like, if you have,
you haven't let that deter you from your greatness. Like
you've known your greatness, you've been guided by it, Like
you have a deep relationship with yourself, like you've been
talking about earlier. But I feel like a lot of
people don't believe that they can be great, or they

(21:48):
have a feeling that they're great at something, but they're
too scared because they don't have any proof in their
life yet that they're worthy of it. And they have
all these stories that they've accumulated in their life that
have also given them proof that they're not worthy to
be great, but you are never scared to be like, Okay,
I feel this. I'm gonna do this, and I'm gonna
be great at it, and I'm just gonna put it
out there. I mean that it's like it's so nonchalant

(22:10):
for you. But like that is like a really hard
that's a hard ticket to put out there, Like people
have a hard time standing in that. And I feel
like that, to me is like one of the greatest
attribute attributes that you have is like you like aren't
afraid to be great at stuff, at something.

Speaker 1 (22:29):
Oh well, that's kind I don't think of it in
terms of being great because I don't really even think
of myself as great. It's more of like be as
authentic and go as big as possible as I can
with the time I have, you know here, and and
sometimes like going in And I also think, like I
think I have a style where like I'm not really

(22:51):
looking for I like to go about things quietly and
make things quietly and then show them. Like to me,
like making a record like Second Wife or something was
very It's an inside job for me. It wasn't I
didn't go talk to anybody really about it. I was
just like, I mean, obviously I talked to Rodney because
he was part of it, but it was done before

(23:12):
I really started showing it to people. You know, it's
not I like to be quiet and sacred and precious
with the process because that's like the gift. The greatest
gift that has come with success for me is that
I can now do things from the most pure standpoint.
I don't have. My livelihood does not revolve around whether

(23:33):
anyone ever listens to second wife or firstborn. To me,
the success of it is that I can be as
creative and have as much fun with the process as
I can, and I don't live with that pressure or
weight of the sas tomic money or I have to
build business around it or any of that. So I

(23:54):
think that sometimes can hit people like in a way
where they're like they feel the power. There's something powerful
about not needing others validation to just go do what
you're doing. And I think that that's a bit of
my style. It is just like, go make it and
then show it to the class. And and but I'm

(24:16):
not really advertising that I'm doing it. I'm just kind
of doing it. And I think a lot of people,
if I'm honest, like need a lot of validation external
along with the way to get them to finish a project,
or to get them to give themselves permission to even
do it, or to have the confidence to like hold
their head high and show it to the world. And
for me, I'm just like, gosh, imagine being eighty years

(24:39):
old and these opportunities aren't on the table. You're not
going to go make a record at ninety or you know,
like imagine like that's I think where my bravery comes
from is just the sense of urgency that you only
get one shot to make the things you know in
this life that you want. And I'm only going to
be you know, Rodnie and I are only going to
be this age right now for a very short amount

(25:02):
of times. So I don't I'm like, there's a sense
of urgency, like we got to do this now because
I want when our kids watch these music videos or
our grandkids them to see us at this age. And
I don't want to wait because on any idea I have,
because there's another idea on the other side of that,
And the longer I put off this idea, the longer
I'm putting off all the other creative things that will

(25:24):
come later if I don't just get this out, put
it out in the world. Like would I have ever
gotten to would never gotten a second wife had I
not done firstborn and whatever's coming next. I wouldn't have
gotten to songs and daughters had it not been for
me doing random things along the way that led to that.
And so it's just kind of like, hurry up and

(25:45):
hurry up and be you as fast as you possibly can,
I think is really the race. It's not to be successful,
it's just to like, do you as much as you
can do you, because I just know, like times of
the essence.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
How do you know that? Have you known that?

Speaker 1 (26:03):
I don't know. I've always felt like when I was
twenty one, I was like when I got to college
at Bahmah, I was like hit the ground running like
the clock sticking.

Speaker 2 (26:11):
You have to hurry up, yeah you, and such intensity
and focus on doing you like you've known.

Speaker 1 (26:19):
Well now now it's kind of flipped because now the
sense of urgency for me is actually a lot more
about my kids' childhoods, like their childhoods are. It's like,
hurry up and be as present as you can be
for them, because you really won't get that back. So
I'm not as in a hurry as I used to be.
I'm more just like focused, I guess to use the

(26:42):
word on what are the few things that really will
matter at the end of the year or at the
end of five years. If you only have a few
things to show for, what do you want those things
to be? And so I'm pretty pretty you know, urgent
about making sure that those get completed. But I don't know,

(27:03):
I'm entering into a new era.

Speaker 2 (27:06):
What is it? Well, you kind of knocked off a
ton of big checklist like ten number one songs, one
song of the Year like twice right with Miranda Lambert,
Automatic and Tequila Dan and Shay. Plus you've had a
slew of number one's hits, Triple Play awards, be a
My Songwriter of the Year right like all this stuff.
I mean it started your own record label, championing, championing women,

(27:31):
being a champion for women songs and daughters. I mean
you kind of like crushed it out there. There's not
really much more to like check off other than just
keep accumulating more wonderful accolades. But like you've literally you
have done it. So I love that your new era

(27:52):
where you're like wanting to be focused on your kid's childhood.
I think that is so admirable.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
Well, you know, you know, writing songs and being creative
isn't purely about money for me, you know, but there
does come a time where you have to have a why.
Like for me, I have to, you know, And I
had a why for why I was gone a lot
working when the kids were younger, and why I was

(28:23):
well for me, it was I had goals, and I
had dreams, and I had I had things that I
was committed to for myself too. And but once those
have been achieved and those things are not done anymore,
I still have other things. They just look different. But
the why of like it got to a point where
just more wasn't more. It's like, why do I I

(28:46):
think I'm a very experiential person, And like I'm not
saying I don't want to be Songwriter the Year again,
or wouldn't love, wouldn't be like thrilled and exhilarated to
win Song of the Year again or any of that.
I really do hope that I get more moments like that.
But if I looked at my kids and said, well,

(29:07):
I'm gonna always be gone for your childhood because I
just want more. That's not good enough. Why? And I
just feel like to who much is given, much is required,
and we've been given so much that I'm like, if
I don't live my most authentic life and my life
doesn't represent my values, then whose will you know? Like

(29:31):
that's good because because I've been given like all of
the free passes now in life, I have true agency
over my life. And without being judgy. I see a
lot of other people that I've looked up to that
like have the freedom to maybe go with a life

(29:52):
that they dream of still, you know, and they're not
giving themselves permission to And I think I took note
of that at a pretty young age in the music
business that like some people continue to just never like
get off the I don't know the hamster wheel simply line,
I don't know what I should call it, but I

(30:12):
just really this was this new era is probably like
me being like letting my curiosity guide me still, like
I've always been very curious, like, well, what happens if
I do go on the voice? What happens if I
do make a record, what happens if I do. I'm
curious to find out what happens if I do start
a record label, Just curious. I don't know now, I'm like,

(30:35):
I'm curious about what it feels like and what my
life can feel like when I wake up in Kansas
and have time to make dinner for my kids and
challenge myself. I guess in a way to really lean
on my identity outside of who I am in the
music business. That really sparks my curiosity more than and

(31:00):
I know what it feels like to win Song of
the Year, and it's amazing, But I'm not as curious
about it anymore. So I'm not above it or below it.
I'm just like, this feels like a new thing.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
Y'all just a trial run with Kansas, right, Like you've
lived here before you did it, like the first off,
you built a house here that you've just had to
like split time with right for years.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
Yes, I had a sense you knew it was six
or seven year ago. I also think it's like everything,
it's like we all know, really, we all know who
we are, and we all know what we want deep down.
It's just remembering and it's not new information. This isn't
like plot twist. Nichole's always wanted to live in camp.

(31:45):
I've always wanted to do this, but it just was.

Speaker 2 (31:49):
Allowing yourself to do it, really.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
Feeling back the layers and getting to my core and
being honest about what I really wanted.

Speaker 2 (31:56):
And the timing to be right because you had to
knock off these you had these things you had to
knock off for yourself. And I am a firm believer
in doing what your heart desires. Like you had big
dreams that you needed to had, you know, hit the
pavement in Nashville every day to accomplish them, probably, and
then you did it. And then the timing opened up too,
like you've trusted all of it, You've let the magic happen. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (32:21):
I also think we have a lot more power over
our lives. Then we get realized, like you can just
do it. You can just figure it out and make
it what you wanted to be, Like, you know, you
can just go build, you know, go. It's like I
felt like our life this year was like a Lego
house that we had our life and it was made of

(32:41):
legos and we took all the pieces apart and then
using all the same pieces, rebuilt the house. It's just like,
it's just it's not like we've left Nashville, or we're
not songwriters or like all that, or Songs and Daughters
is still like that. It's better than it's ever been.
It's just I reframed the house a little bit. You know,
the first floor of my house is family in Kansas,

(33:03):
and then built the other things around it. It had
gotten to a point where it was like our family's
life was built around my career. Like when we like
what league of football would Ford play in? Was based
on will win? What makes more sense for me? Am
I gone on the weekends? Am I here? And I
was just like, wait a minute, this we got to

(33:25):
restructure this. We got to go back to the drawing
board a little bit, because it's not about me anymore.
It's about them. And they get to be the main
characters in the story for a while, like because they
won't in look in ten years, they're going to be there.

(33:46):
You know, I'll be the main character again because they'll
be a college and they'll you know, they'll pick up
the phone every once in a while. But for right now,
like they get to be main I'm more of like
the supporting supporting actor in this story because at this
point and that's like that's the new era.

Speaker 2 (34:09):
It probably feels really good.

Speaker 1 (34:12):
Oh it is. It's a relief. It's it's amazing, like
when you give yourself what you really want and that
you're just like, it's like, why do we wait so
long to give ourselves what we want? Why do we
you know, look, we have to take care of business,
you know, we have pair bills and we you know,
but I think we all really know what we really

(34:33):
want deep down, we just don't always we overcomplicate it.

Speaker 2 (34:38):
Yeah, so how did what was the moment, Like, what
was the moment where you're like, because during COVID, y'all
moved to Sterling, lived there for a year, you got
your kids enrolled in the school, and then you came back.
I feel like you like built a dreamhouse in Nashville.
Did y'all sell that? Do you still have it?

Speaker 1 (34:52):
We still have it? We won't be keeping it. I
don't know.

Speaker 2 (34:57):
I mean it was like the dream house, right, everything
you ever wanted just from pictures that looks phenomenal.

Speaker 1 (35:02):
It's ideal and everything it's very ideal.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
Hey, at least built it created it lived and it
had it. It's like the curiosity, like you said, now
the curiosity is gone. You've been there, done.

Speaker 1 (35:14):
Now the house is. The house is phenomenal and it
is just an incredible piece of property and an incredible home.
We I think in that house, like we first of all,
we had to live in that house, I think to
have the peace that we have now because for the

(35:35):
rest of my life, I will like I will never
scroll through Instagram and see some incredible property and be like, oh,
I wonder what it's like. You know, I know, and
I as amazing as it was to have that amazing house,
which we still own and I'm going to stay at
next week. It's not like it's gone, but I know

(35:57):
the things that you can't that a big house doesn't
you can't replace.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
Tell me I love this. This should be a song.
I love this. I feel there's sometimes with houses, like
you go into a beautiful house, but it's tell me,
I want to I want to hear this. This is great.

Speaker 1 (36:13):
Well, like it was so ideal, like we could all
have our own space, right, So kids would come home
from school, they would go up in their bedrooms and
it was like, oh, we've built it's so great. But
then I was like, wait, we come here for the
summer and we're all on top of each other in
this much smaller house and you almost can't get away
from each other. And I don't know, we you can

(36:36):
just feel the connection in that and I and you know,
like you can't put a wheat field in a house.
You can't put a dirt road in a house. You
can't put the kids' ability to ride their bikes to
school and have like neighborhood friends just riding up all
the time. You know, like are you know, it was

(36:58):
a bit of like castle esque being in like a
big fancy house that like everybody was like, oh, the
house is amazing, but what about the life? You know,
It's like what is where are we getting? We get
more life? I think here, And you know, it's like
as I've had, you know, as my life has grown

(37:22):
and we've built, we just continue to build and it
just continued to turn into more and more and more
and more houses and more things. And I am so grateful,
Like that's not a complaint, but really, like at the
end of the day, all that stuff's just material. Like
there's nothing like watching your child run through the sprinkler
in a some suit and with all their friends right

(37:44):
outside your kitchen window. And we didn't have that there.
That wasn't the kind of neighborhood we lived in. That
wasn't the like, you know, we had a gate at
our house. I'm like, I would just like to focus
on what a simple and what is true. And look,
I've written all these songs for all these years about
small town life and family and values and being a mom.

(38:07):
And I was eventually like, I'll be the first to say,
like I had to call a little bullshit on myself
and go like, but are you living that life? You could?
You know, you're like, you know, dressed up, going fancy places,
dressed out of your mind half the time, you know,
going to it looks it really looks cool on Instagram.

(38:28):
But you know what I valued and what I was doing, Like,
we're always matching up, and I feel like they are
right now.

Speaker 2 (38:38):
That's that, and that's why you keep saying you have peace.
That is peace is when you are truly in alignment
with your heart's desires, which I feel like all of
it has been for you, honestly, Like you probably wouldn't
change any of the journey, I wouldn't think looking back
on it.

Speaker 1 (38:54):
No, no, no, no, it's like all you know, it's
an arc and it's all seasons and nothing's forever too,
you know. It's like we might not live here forever,
but this is like the right thing for this is
the next right thing. And and this town actually was
called peace like it was originally named peace Kansas, which
is wild.

Speaker 2 (39:15):
Why do you love it so much? Tell me why
you love this town? Because I feel like a lot
of people love their hometowns, but like you like love
your hometown like you like love. It's like sacred and
a lot of your family lives there. Cousins live there,
like siblings live here too, like who all lives here?
And tell me why you love it? And tell me

(39:35):
what your days are like?

Speaker 1 (39:36):
Now, well my day? Oh that's a shit. Okay. Those
are two questions why I love it? On a big
picture that sounds like all woolu, but I swear this
place is anointed. It is the most peaceful like plot
of land. Something just happens to me my like on

(39:57):
a cellular level, when I'm pulling into the city limits,
I love that I'm a near family. I love that.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
You live like next door to your mom.

Speaker 1 (40:10):
We live like fifteen feet away from my mom and dad,
which everyone's always like, how, And I like it just works.

Speaker 2 (40:18):
I don't know you and I love being with your parents.

Speaker 1 (40:21):
I do. We have boundaries, Like we have these like
little systems, like like my mom like just doesn't she
just locks the back door and that's just her way
of saying, like, nobody come over, you know, And I'll
lock my side door, and it's like not rude. We
just like have a boundary with each other.

Speaker 2 (40:35):
It's really just so healthy.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
Yeah, but yeah, I have brothers and nieces and nephews,
and like I grew up with like fifty cousins here
and a lot of them don't live here anymore, but
they come back all the time. And three of my
grandparents are still alive. And so I think there's also
such a sense of I think we're giving our kids

(40:59):
a gift in the sense that they know where we
came from. Because I'm the older I get, I really
latch on and want to know more and more about
where my parents came from. Because it just start as
you peel back the layers on who you are, a
lot of it goes back in generations, and I think,
like my kids are getting to be here with three

(41:22):
great grandparents, two great two grandparents, cousins. And I also
think there's like very much like a village mentality of
like for my kids especially like to just you know,
we all have that need to be like seen and
understood and known, and everywhere they go they're seen and known,

(41:45):
and they see and know others everywhere they go, and
they go to school with the same people that they
you know, see at the grocery store, that they play
sports with, that they go to church with, and just
like that just gets it just really like mixed. I
think it brings like a deep sense of belonging and
that was what my experience was here and there's no

(42:09):
everything here is you know, is very family oriented in community.
You have a true sense of community. And that was
something that like my sense of community in natural was
like the music business, which was amazing. I love our
music business community, but in terms of like that doesn't
apply to my kids. They're not growing up in the
music business community like they I wanted to give them

(42:31):
their own community to grow up in. So that's there.
I could go. I could go on and on, but
they yes, they love it. My son said, you're so,
you're telling me all my dreams are coming true when
we told them we were moving here.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
You know, so he always wanted to live there.

Speaker 1 (42:52):
Probably, And I really believe in what you name things,
like there is something to what you name things. And
his middle name is Sterling, so I think he probably
feels extra connected to being in a town that's full
of four trucks and says Sterling everywhere you go.

Speaker 2 (43:12):
So you know, it was Rodney just along for the ride,
like he's like cool, Like I don't need to live
in Nashville, Like I've already written so many number ones
I've done at all, Like what is he just what's
his vibe?

Speaker 1 (43:29):
Oh? Well, he you know, he got to raise his
older children's childhood. They were raised in small town just
like this when he was farming, and so it's kind
of like a full circle almost like a completion of
that cycle. I think for him as a dad, but
as a person, I just think our values are like
that's ultimately like the first time we ever had a conversation,

(43:52):
you know, to bring it back to second wife, but
it is like the first time we ever had a
conversation we just couldn't stop talking, and we were talking
about hometown and like what happened to the fellowship Paul
at the church, and the fact that he even knew
what a fellowship Paul was was like, oh, you're my people.
Like immediately felt that way that he was my people,
like I didn't. I knew it was my people, and

(44:14):
then I figured out he's my person and he you know,
I remember being speaking to that knowing like I've had
a lot of time to think about this this year
because we made this record. It was s finished in April,
and I knew I wanted to put it out in
the fall on our anniversary. So I've just lived with
the music for a while the summer, especially over the

(44:34):
summer where I have lots of time to think. And
I remember being like Charlie's age, like ten years old,
and having this knowing almost like a fear of like, well,
if I knew I was going to leave, I didn't
know what for, but I knew I would leave my hometown.
And I remember being afraid that I would never meet

(44:55):
somebody that would want that would like appreciate where I
came from. And like then as I got older into
high school. I really knew I was leaving, and I
just I started imagining like going to the big city
and like meeting city guys and then bringing them home
here and then being like sticking their nose up and
being like what is this? And so I must have

(45:19):
like manifested or just had a deep knowing that that
was a really high like on the value system for
me and I. I mean, it's so real because he
loves it here more than I do, so I oh, yeah,
oh yeah, he's I mean, we're going to my you know,

(45:41):
my nephew's soccer game tonight. You know, we go to
high school football games. He knows all the neighbors, he
knows everybody here, and it's been fun over the years
to have people like kind of adopt him into Stirling too.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
He's going to be like president of the PTO. Before
you know it, he is.

Speaker 1 (46:00):
Coaching a frog football team. So he's he's a football coach,
right Yeah, well but yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (46:06):
Mean what if she starting at high school?

Speaker 1 (46:12):
Oh man, can you imagine?

Speaker 2 (46:14):
I feel like you're spending a lot of traa. I
feel like you're spending a lot of time at football stadiums,
Like I see a lot of your pictures and you're
like on the track at a football stadium, like I
feel like that half of my hometown. You wrote that
with Kelsey Valeri. Yeah, you're you're and you said this,
like you're you're living that song now, like you're not
having to have half of your hometown. Like if you're here,

(46:36):
your heart's in your hometown, like you're in You're living
that hometown Friday night lights like true nostalgia. But you're
like it's not just in your dreams, like it really
is playing out in real life form for you.

Speaker 1 (46:51):
It is. And you know what, I'm not the only
one that has returned home. And I think I think
like my very best friend from all growing up, like
we would run matching like featshirts and sunglasses and we
were always like twinning. We actually moved back here with
her family as well, so like Friday night at the
football game, like we're doing gto events together. We threw

(47:14):
like a little back to school bashed together with other
people as well. But she's the PTO president. It's like,
so I.

Speaker 2 (47:22):
Friendships stronger than ever.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
Yes, it's so, and it's just deeper because now our
kids are all growing up together and having sleepovers and
we're going to all their sporting events and it's like
it's like the two girls that like we're decorating for
prom like it never ended. Now we're like helping do
classroom things and it's it's really fun. But we sat,
you know, Friday night, we sat in the rain at

(47:46):
the football game and just watched our girls just like
run around and like cheering with the cheerleaders.

Speaker 2 (47:51):
And like you just, yeah, did you get like a moment? Oh?

Speaker 1 (47:57):
I get moments like this all day, every day right now.
And I know I'm probably in the honeymoon the honeymoon phase,
or maybe not. Maybe it's just like this is kind
of my Disney world. But I just sat there and
just thought, this is like you can't you asked about
the house. It's like the house is amazing. Yeah, we'll
miss our big dream house, but I trade the dream

(48:17):
house for the dream because I really feel like this
is the dream, because I at that moment that you
get sitting in the stands watching your kids run around
completely safe and knowing everyone knows them and high fives
them and asks them detailed questions about themselves because there's
some known I'm like you can't fit that. There's no
house big enough to fit all that in.

Speaker 2 (48:38):
And you know, have you written this?

Speaker 1 (48:44):
I've probably written like four versions of it, but maybe
I'm sure there's gonna be like a lot more small
town songs in the works.

Speaker 2 (48:54):
So what is your day to day now?

Speaker 1 (48:56):
Like?

Speaker 2 (48:56):
What do you do?

Speaker 1 (48:57):
Like?

Speaker 2 (48:57):
Because before in Nashville, you're like writing hardcore. You got
a lot of big industry hardcore like executive, top of
the ladder, cool shit to do every day. And so
what's happening now that you have peace and time and
you're on your own agenda.

Speaker 1 (49:15):
And I still have a self structure, and I still
have it just looks a little different. Like I, you know,
wake up and instead of waking up at like five
point thirty in the morning books, I'm already running by.
I wake up with the beautiful sunset and to make eggs.

(49:36):
And the kids, I watch them ride their bikes down
the street to school. It feels very cinematic. And then
to school, yes, and that still happens in a lot
of places in this world. And then I go over
to like the little community wellness center, and I brought
my pilates machine here and I've put it over there,

(49:56):
and so I do pilates over there. But it's just
so funn and it's just so different. And then I,
you know, I'm still very much involved on all the
Songs and Daughters stuff with Lauren Watkins and Haley Witters
and so like yesterday, for instance, I had like two
zoom meetings, like a marketing meeting and like a social

(50:17):
like a digital social meeting, and and then like I
hit the grocery store and the post that like my
favorite thing is that I can take our little our
little UTV like the side by side and you can
basically drive a golf cart around this town. And I
hit the downtown and I get my groceries, and I
go to the post office and I you know, I

(50:38):
see people. I go to the coffee shop, and you know,
I can do all of that in like eight minutes,
and you know, I come cooking a lot of dinners.
And you know, a lot of the social life here
is around church and sports. And every night there's a
sporting event to go to, whether that's a flag football game,
or our friends or kids are playing junior high football

(50:59):
or high school foot or volleyball. And it's it's strangely
like it's just as full. It's just filled with different
things and things that don't make my nervous system go.
Like that's really the main difference. I'm I'm working, I
feel like just as much. I'm just working smarter and all.

(51:24):
And I've focused on, like on the things like I've
gotten to talk to Lauren Watkins and Haley Whitters more
on the phone in the last few months than I
had did the first six months of this year because
I'm not going to every little event that Nashville has
to has to offer, And I'm really enjoying watching people

(51:45):
that are ten years younger than you go go to
every event and be like, this is your time to
do that, you know, And some day my kids are
going to be in college and you're going to have
kids my age, and it might be my turn to
be at all that stuff again because all this stuff
is just seasonal.

Speaker 2 (52:03):
Tell me how you know the flow? Like, because I
believe in that so much, Like, how do you know
when it's time? What does your body tell you? What
does your system say when it's time to go make
that big move, when it's time to do it? What
does the system say? How does it communicate with you.

Speaker 1 (52:25):
A lot of ways. Lack of sleep, whether that's just
out of stress or like something's gnawing at me, like
waking me up because I'm not at peace, Like I
pay attention when I'm not sleeping. Well, when happy hour
just keeps getting earlier, I'm like, why why you know?

(52:50):
Why am I wanting to drink wine every day? And
then I see you know and why? Like how connected
honestly to like how much I can remember from my
day is like me like if I'm if I'm doing
too much or if I'm stressed, I'm a lot more
disconnected and I don't remember as much. And like I feel,

(53:13):
I feel really like present right now with what's in
front of me, And I haven't felt that way to
this degree for a while. It's been more of just
like next, next, next, and there are and that there
are times for that, like I'm like, I won't make
you know, I won't say that there's not like that's

(53:34):
if you're building company, if you're building career, like there
are times to grind also, like if I'm irritated, you know,
if it's if I'm if I'm short with Rodney or
the kids, it's it's like Okay, well, either you pack

(53:54):
too much into this life or you're doing things that
are not fueling you, they're just depleting you. And I
think that was a big eye opener for me over
the last few years, is just realizing like them, I
didn't have margin, you know, like like there are surprises

(54:15):
that come, you know, like I remember this year on
I think it was Ford's birthday, a birthday cake got dropped,
like on his birthday, and you know, like with a
kid's birthday, like your real life is still happening, but
you're also trying to execute like making the most special
day and a birthday cake got dropped and he was

(54:35):
in tears, and I it's like the moments like that,
if you don't have anything left in the tank, you
won't handle it correctly, like I want to, like I
need to have enough margin to be able to be
a healthy version of myself for everybody. When those surprises happened,

(54:55):
you know, so wise like all I hadn't built in
them margin for Oh, maybe this kid needs extra help
and reading at school. Okay, well that's going to be
another thirty minutes every night. Do you have that and
also do you have it with a joyful spirit. I
mean like, and I still don't always, but it just

(55:18):
was not sustainable for me to do all of the
things that I was trying to do. And I could feel,
I could feel the times that I was like, I'm
probably gonna implode at some point. And it's it's just
all of those signs that I just talked about, like
I don't I don't know. I just wake up and

(55:40):
I'm excited for like really small things here that I'm like, Oh,
I get to go to the post office today. I
don't know why that brings me so much joy, And
it's probably because I've had a really like a really
cool operational life where I had someone else going to

(56:02):
the post office for me, and I wanted to take
that part of my life packed. But I'm definitely my
favorite version of myself here, and so I'm glad that
my kids are getting that that version of me at
least from here on out.

Speaker 2 (56:18):
Do you feel like it has something to do with
being forty turning forty? I know you're thirty nine. Yeah,
it just turned forty, and like something happened to me
on a deep, deep level, like I, well, it happens
to me every decade like I feel like every decade
I do a examine what's going on with me, Like
like when I was twenty nine turning thirty, I had

(56:39):
struggled with like eating disorders. I was super insecure all
these things, and I was like, I'm not carrying that
into my thirties. And so that's when I started therapy
and started like clearing out the baggage from my twenties.
When I was thirty, I was like, I'm not going
in with my thirties have been great, but I'm not
going in with the problems I've accumulated or the debris
that I've acumue related Like I'm clearing that before I

(57:03):
enter a new decade and being a mom and you know,
entering into the back half of your life. I feel
like I just something like profoundly happened to me at forty,
Like and I started prepping for forty when I was
thirty eight because I was like, I know it's coming.
I want to be ready for this. I want to
feel solid and strong. But I feel like you are
like so ready for forty. In the back half. It's

(57:25):
like you prepped, like you took, you examined, you took inventory,
and you made the adjustments to create the life that
your body and nervous system was communicating to you that
you needed.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
Ah, well, you're so insightful. Because I had told my
best friend Betsy this summer, like in confidence, before we
had really told many people the decision we were making.
I was just crying, like releasing it, hearing myself say
out loud, really for the first time, like this is
what we're deciding to do. And I just said, I said,

(57:59):
I want to be as wholesome as possible when I
turn forty. I don't want to be reactive to turning
forty and say, okay, well I'm forty, Now what do
I now? What change do I need to make to
make my fort It's like I want to already be
I want to be there. Why am I waiting? You know?
And I'm it's almost like I feel like I'm setting

(58:22):
the scene to wake up when I turn forty and
to feel like, oh, I could want for nothing more
because I've you know, made me cry, like you.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
Set yourself up for You set yourself up for what
you so you don't have to have the big life
melt down at forty, the big freak ow you knew
what could.

Speaker 1 (58:42):
I don't want to have to be editing my life.
You know you're constantly editing, But I don't want to
have to do a huge renovation myself. I want to
literally wake up in the proverbial metaphorical house that I'm
living in and go I like it here, you know.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
Peace, wake up in peace, which you're doing every day
in Sterling, Kansas, which was formerly known as Peace.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
I know, thank you God.

Speaker 2 (59:10):
Roney's take on all of it, what's his sake? I
feel like he's just what's his take on the album?
What did he feel like? When you guys started diving
in Jail's love story and breaking it down and putting
in these beautiful, romantic but real I mean, one of
the songs, it's called Prenup because once again he had
he had the Bundy and the success when y'all got

(59:31):
married and you were a vision and a dream, but
it hadn't come into its fruition yet.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
So well, it was kind of funny because when we
got married, like you know, obviously honest, like he definitely
had more than me, but he you know, we were
by no means rich, and you know, he had gone
through a divorce and was really definitely like restructuring his life.
And we joke that what we brought into our marriage

(59:57):
financially was probably more of a liability, been an asset
from both of our ends. It's like the line in
there like like better keep digging if you're digging for gold,
because we're not there yet. But Rodney, you know, Rodney
like through the writing of this, like I've always wanted
him to make a record because he's one of the
best voices in Nashville and he's just such a true artist,

(01:00:21):
but he doesn't like the attention, and so I'm hoping
that this is kind of a way to like get
him warmed up to that idea. But we wrote you
know it, really it didn't really start off like that.
We just wrote five year Plan for the for Firstborn,
and that was like the first song we had ever
really written about us, and I was just like, can
we do more of that please? And then the idea

(01:00:43):
for Second Wife came and so through the process, he
was very much like, well, this is what do you want.
This is your record, but I'm gonna help you, like
him write me writing the songs with him, because it's
not a duets record. You know, it's definitely it's my project,
but it's writing it with him to show the side
of myself that I really that I don't show to

(01:01:05):
many people, which is like the side of myself that
I am when I'm with him and he. It's been
cute though, because like he Kee's kind of that personality
that like doesn't He's obviously doesn't force anything. He kind
of acts like he doesn't care. Real Texas cool, and
but then he'll be like, so, uh, what's going on
with the record? How are we we're doing in the interviews?

(01:01:30):
What's going on with that? Is it gonna come out
like on Spotify? So he's it's adorable, and I know
he's really proud of it. And we had so much
fun making it because we went to this place in
Texas called Sonic Branch, so cool, and we gave ourselves
five days and what the what was done in five
days was the project?

Speaker 2 (01:01:49):
Oh God, this is fun. You're just having fun with
your career now.

Speaker 1 (01:01:53):
Oh, it was just so fun. We took Jim.

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
Robbins, You're like, the magic will be what it will be, Willy,
and then we will move on. That is exciting.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
Well, isn't that kind of like what marriage is too,
Like sometimes you just got to go like it is
what it is. Yeah, you can dress certain things in
life up like, but reality is it just is what
it is sometimes. And I think we kind of went
about this whole thing like we went to the farm
two weekends. We're like, what songs we write? That's project, like,
it is what it is. And what we got at

(01:02:24):
Sonic Grant was it is what it is. But we
I felt like he kind of came to life when
we were down the are We were just like snipping
bourbon like wearing cowboy hats, like trying to knock out
a whole record and our project in five days, and
we took our producers were Jimmy Robbins and King Henry
who did Firstborn, and we just videoed the whole thing.

(01:02:45):
Claire Shaper, who did all of the content for Firstborn,
basically shot this docu style series basic music videos of
all of the songs, and we just had I don't know,
I think we leaned in into like it not being
We weren't trying to like change anybody's life. We're trying
to have fun, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
And to write a true representation of your life.

Speaker 1 (01:03:11):
Yes, and he said, like you know, he said the
other day, he was like, maybe we He was like,
we should go back down there, like maybe once a
year we should just go like record a bunch of
songs that's on a cranch. And I was like, okay,
so you're liking this, Okay, you're kind of like letting
me lead the way here and like put my face
in front of it. But maybe we should go make

(01:03:32):
your record on a branch.

Speaker 2 (01:03:34):
Okay, So you have firstborn, second wife, what would the
third be?

Speaker 1 (01:03:39):
I know what it is, you do, I know what
it is.

Speaker 2 (01:03:43):
Yeah, so you're going to keep that locked up until
you release it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:46):
I'm sure to be content to be announced.

Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
So you have the third already, Okay, I'm now just
be on pins and needles for years waiting for this
to come out. Hopefully you do it soon. Is it
can happen soon?

Speaker 1 (01:04:00):
I think? I hope too. You know, I'm not getting
any younger, I you know, And also, like I said earlier,
it's like I want to get I want to make
the next idea that I have a reality quickly or
swiftly so that I can then see once I get
that out, then something else will come into my heart

(01:04:21):
and mind, or maybe it won't, and then I get
to sit in that piece, which is like, Okay, I
don't have to do anything, do anything. I don't have
to do anything that might.

Speaker 2 (01:04:29):
Be a relief. If the calling stop urgently knocking, then
maybe you can just not have to because you got
to answer them. You're one of those people that has
to answer them. I feel the same way. I have
not had the confidence that you've had in answering them,
but I have always answered them, and I feel that
same way when it's on my heart, it will I've
tried to ignore them, but it will like physically make

(01:04:51):
me sick or like take me down to my knees
until I respond to the calling, which I feel like
is God communicating and that's the only guiding life that
any of us really can follow because we all have
a different journey in a different roadmap, and I feel
like the only guidance is that that calling, it really
is a calling, and it just like consumes your existence

(01:05:13):
until you answer it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:14):
So you got to give but you got to give
yourself credit for listening, like for for not detaching from that,
because it would be really easy to just like push
that stuff down you know, I like.

Speaker 2 (01:05:25):
People so happy when they are when they do and.

Speaker 1 (01:05:29):
I like that, and then they judge, and then they
judge you when you do your when you do you
because they didn't do them. They're kind of mad at
themselves because maybe they wanted to.

Speaker 2 (01:05:39):
But they didn't feel like they had the ability, or
that they didn't have the resources, or they didn't have
the opportunity. But I truly believe everyone has what it
takes in their life to make their callings come true
or to push them forward. I really do believe that
with my entire being, because it's from God, and God
didn't put anything on our heart incident, and so if

(01:06:01):
you have that on your heart, it will. There are
ways to make it come to fruition. You just have
to be brave and follow it and go for it.
I feel like, do you feel that way?

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
Yes, at least you got you know, at least take
the steering wheel and point the car in that direction.
It doesn't have to come fast and you're not even
I've never even felt like a goal for me. I
never felt like the goal was to make it as
a songwriter. I only felt compelled to try. That was
what I couldn't leave on the table was the trying

(01:06:35):
and that's that's I've now continued to apply that Like
now it's like I'm only compelled to make this. I
don't feel compelled to make its like a massive success
or like that I you can from And I think
that's confusing sometimes for people because they're like, how do

(01:06:56):
you feel about how Firstborn did? I'm like, are you kidding?
I did it. I'm on top of the world.

Speaker 2 (01:07:03):
I'm like, so happy you created the art to represent
your life. That was the masterpiece that you needed for yourself,
and so whatever anyone else does or takes from it
is fine. But like that was for your soul, just
like this is for your soul and I can feel that,
And that's such a cool place to be in that

(01:07:25):
you aren't like, you know, your number one job isn't
a recording artist.

Speaker 1 (01:07:29):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:07:29):
It's like you don't have to have a number one
single to keep your career going, to keep the machine running.
It's like you have so many legs to your stool,
and so this is your talent and expression and creativity
and soul and passion at its finest, and you're doing
it for the actual reason that art should be created
to create what is in your heart and to tell

(01:07:50):
your story authentically. So what a moment to be able
to be the talented person that you are, to combine
with your husband who's also so talented, be able to
write your story in such a poetic way that only
a songwriter and craftsman can do to get it out there.
I mean, what a gift to yourself to allow yourself
to do all that work and go inward and create it.

(01:08:14):
I understand exactly what you're saying, like you don't care
what happens, because what happens is you did it and
you made it. Yeah, you made the treasure.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
Yep, I'm having a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 (01:08:26):
Well, Nicole, it's so exciting to see you here better
than ever, Like such an inspiration that you are being
led by your higher guidance always You've always been led
by that, You've always had the confidence to trust it.
That is an example that we need to see. People
need to see women, especially who are courageous enough to

(01:08:49):
follow their soul and they're calling and to do it.
And it's not always easy. A lot of times people judge,
people have opinions, but you've always done it anyway, Now,
like here you are twenty years later, after sticking to
your guns and following your heart and once again taking
a move back to Sterling, Kansas and making a bold

(01:09:11):
move to walk away from Nashville and the height of
your glory as a songwriter and artist and producer and
all the things. But it's not about any of that
for you. It's about fulfilling your sole purpose. And that's
so awesome that you are living that way and you're
letting it. You are letting your life. You're letting yourself
have the best life because you're letting your soul lead.

(01:09:32):
And so many people don't have the balls to do that.
And it's so inspiring to see you doing that.

Speaker 1 (01:09:37):
Thank you, and right back at you, you are glowing.

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
Hey, thank you so much doing what you're doing. I
always wrap up with leave your light. So what do
you want people to know? It's just super open ended
that you.

Speaker 1 (01:09:51):
Can give yourself what you really want and that's okay,
So love it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:56):
Drop the mic on that, Nicole, You're awesome. So this album,
this comes out October sixteenth, thirteenth, thirteenth, and that's your
sixteenth wedding anniversary. Everybody, You're so like everything is so
meaningful to you, like you played the grand old Opry
like your tenth year Nashville or something right funny, yeah,
funny it like I love that you're always It's so meaningful.

(01:10:18):
You are a meaningful soul.

Speaker 1 (01:10:20):
Cool.

Speaker 2 (01:10:20):
Thank you so much for joining me, so inspiring and
this is a beautiful work of art, this album that
you've done about your marriage with Rodney. It's so cool.
And thank you for sharing your gifts with us.

Speaker 1 (01:10:32):
Thank you right back at you.

Speaker 2 (01:10:34):
Bye bye.