January 29, 2025 • 23 mins
The government has announced a raft of speed limit changes around the country, bringing some speed limits back to what they were before the last government changed them. But will this cause more harm on our roads?
Also, both David Seymour and Prime Minister Christopher Luxon have raised the prospect of asset sales, with Luxon hinting National may take an asset sales policy to the next election. Does it make sense to sell assets?
To answer those questions, Labour's Wairarapa-based MP Kieran McAnulty and National's Otaki MP Tim Costley joined Nick Mills in the studio for Politics Thursday.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk said b focusing in on the issues
that matter politics Thursday on Wellington Mornings, news Talk said Bilian,
can you make your decision? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Joining us for politics Thursday. This week is Labour's Housing
spokesperson Karen mcanautic Careen, Good morning mate. How are you great?
Have a good holiday or hered you went skiing and
had a bit of fun.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
Yeah, yeah, first winning anniversary so you might as we
pushed the boat out.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Oh oh absolutely, so all good? Happy to be back, Yeah,
I am.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Actually it's a sign of a good break when you're
actually pleased to get back to.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Wik Yeah, or you missed did you miss it?
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Not?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Really? Don't push it on please be back? Nice balance
right and National's o techy mp Tim cost Terms. Do
you have a break to get away keep your family away?
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
We we just had a little book a match at
the beach. It's fantastic actually, but the Times Ken sayd
surfing lesson that kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
You're abouts regular?
Speaker 4 (01:14):
Actually I never been dragging for it and it was
it was great cool spot up there.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Was it was it really that good good coffee? Regular roast,
great coffee.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
You know, I don't drink coffee. So there you go,
breaking news. Yeah, and outrageous, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Well you've done better than me. Something weird about So
I never used to drink coffee, and now I have
difficult Only one a day though, only one in the morning.
Speaker 4 (01:33):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
That's good.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
Yeah, sleep, If I have another one.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
I'm exactly the same. I have the seat seeing my
coffee from this morning, and I go to put it
in the microwave and heat it up, but I just
keep it going and then that's it. It's one coffee
a day. Good on you. Yeah, start the day with
the coffee and that's That's a cup of tea after that. Right,
let's talk politics. I don't talk about the fact that
Tim doesn't drink coffee. The governments. Interesting, It is a
bit interesting about dark one. Why what about when you
(01:59):
were in the Air force. You know, you're a pilot
in the Air Force. Clearly they'd live on coffee.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
They live on they live on jet plane lollies. That's
what they live on. Go through kilograms of the stuff.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Terrible, All right, bookmakers at the tab live on coffee.
So that's my only trade that I can speak to
you or drink coffee.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
It's interesting I ran into No, that's a different story.
I've been not talking about that. We'll talk about that
off here. The government has announced the raft of speed
limit changes around the country, a bunch of them and
the wire Rapper, bringing the speed limits back to what
they were before the last government changed them. Karen, that's
your electorate, and I know from doing an hour the
show this morning, and I know when you reduced them
(02:38):
how much there was some angst about it. Your people
are going to be happy, Well, I'm happy.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
The streets between Greytown and Featherston should never have been reduced.
It didn't fit the criteria. It wasn't done on safety,
it was done for quote consistency. So when we asked
NZTA why they made that decision, they said, oh, well
we're reducing the speed elsewhere, so we're going to reduce
it there.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
And that just infuriated people.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
It made no sense at it. You're technically you're allowed
to go one hundred kilometers on the rim Attuckers and
then you get to Featherston and you're doing forty and
then on a.
Speaker 5 (03:13):
Straight wide piece of road you had to do eighty.
I was a.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Firefighter in Greytown for a number of years and though
the designated crash unit for South Wided Upper and I
don't remember getting called out for a serious crash on
that road, but there were regularly crashes between Carton and
Mast and so the two needed to be looked at
differently and treated differently. And what I found frustrating about
the whole thing is that I was made Associate Transport
(03:39):
Minister and I thought, oh, here's my chance to do something.
And I sat MZTA down in the office and I said,
I want you to review that, and they looked me
in the eye and said no, but absolutely refuse. We
went back and forth, back and forth the over a
long period of time and they just refused to budge.
And now they're doing it. So I'm pleased that's happened.
But I'll be completely honest with that, I'm pretty frustrated
with MZTA because we could have avoided this whole thing.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
To me, were you worried by this or do you
think it's a good idea? Does there anything that concerns you?
You've got young kids. I mean they're going to open
up speed limit a little bit. Are you have you
got any preservation. No, no, I don't.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Look it's fantastic And I drove to Mastend twice and
the same thing. Why is the speed limit one hundred
of them attackers and then eighty on the safe spit
of road there. It's outrageous and I think it shows
the job that our government has done and actually not
accepting no. We need to move away from this culture
of people saying no and actually drive some things through
and get it done. This is all part of our
plan to grow the economy right, and we've got to
(04:30):
get things moving. This is great. And on the other
side of the hills, on the Company Coast and Judea Fenawa,
there are four roads that are impacted. One is automatically
having an increase, it's only a ten kilometer change from
sixty back to seventy. But the other three that will
be consulted on are currently at eighty ks consulting on
going back to one hundred. My impression from feedback I've
(04:51):
had is some of them might change. But across the
country there's what thirty eight that are definitely changing and
another almost fifty week consulting on. I don't know that
all fifty will necessarily change. I think there's a genuine
opportunity for the community to have the essay here because
some roads are no brainers, like the one in Waupa,
like some of our roads, say between Livid and Shannon.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Like Cobbon Drive, Well, hang out to the airport.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Okay, Okay, but I'm probably more familiar with the hut
of fenermal Ones. But there are also some issues which.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Can I just ask you one. Sorry to interrupt, and
that was really rude of me, and I apologize, right.
A lot of talk, a lot of talk about why
Transmission Gully isn't one hundred and color all the time. Now,
do you know what the extull answers? Because I've been
telling you it hasn't been signed off yet.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Correct, There's some stuff that they have to finish. They'll
call it consenting issues. There's some legal stuff, some consenting stuff,
some work around the sides that sort of feed into that,
and a tool that's done and it's officially all signed off.
The speed can't speed limit can't change. And the other
question you'll get immediately after that is, well, what about
the bit between Poplar ev Auto Mutty and the bit
that go runs along the bottom of the hills next
(05:56):
to the train track to get to TG. But that's
slightly different because it's not actually part of the expressway.
There's no separate road that cyclists could go on. There's
some issues around the words some of the side barriers.
As I understand the safety, do we know the timing
that have to get No. Look, that's a great question,
but I don't have a definite and I don't want
to start crystal ball gazing t I can actually just
tell people what it is. But the new one that
(06:18):
we're building up Sillivan will be one hundred and ten
k's from the day it opens, and there's a lot
of excitement about construction starting on that this year.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
When that seemed to be safe.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
It should be one hundred and ten. There were highways
that were put up to one hundred and ten under us.
It should always be determined by how safe the road is,
what the speed is, for no other reason really, And
I'm pleased that there are fifty odd roads that are
being put up for consultation now for public submissions.
Speaker 5 (06:42):
That's how it should be. While I'm very pleased about.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
The stretch between Greytown and Featherston, I am concerned about
the speed at which had happened, because if there was
an opportunity to consult. There's a particular strip just north
of Carterton. I don't know if you're familiar, it's called Clevil.
There's the bakery there, there's a few manifesturers. That's actually
a really busy stretch, which if they just stopped and
took a breath, they actually could see the sense and
(07:05):
keeping the.
Speaker 5 (07:05):
Speed limit that little bit lower.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
There quite a lot of on and off in that
area that's just blanket down to one hundred, and so
there was obviously political reasons why they did it. Tried
to make it splash and tried to make a political point,
and that's just the rough and tumble of politics.
Speaker 5 (07:21):
But I think the guts of.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
It here is that there are some roads that without
doubt should be one hundred. There's also some roads that
should be a little bit lower for really genuine safety reasons,
and you've got to look at it and listen to
the community. So at least start doing it for these
fifty other roads. It would have been nice if they
just looked at that little bit round Clevel and timing.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Why did it take so long? I mean know that
this is one of the big things at the election,
wasn't it.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
We're going to we're going to paint on this and
the great thing is we're delivering on it. I mean
you heard from Kieran before, you know that he wasn't
able to get NZTA to do this. But our minister
Simi Brown and now Chris Bishop have You've got Mike
Butterack and y Rappa that's been fighting hard as the
local mp there and it's great to see this happen.
Thirty eight roads that have changed, now another almost fifty
to consult on. Does it take six months, Well that's
(08:09):
a lot better than never, right, Yeah, But.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
It's not straightforward.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
I mean they made it out that this was going
to be a really simple fix and it's not.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
It is not.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Straightforward because you get a stretch of road, say, for example,
from Featherston to say Pahir Tour, there are a lot
of communities, there are a lot of busy stretches that
it's one state highway, but there are a lot of
things to take into consideration. They're obviously on the local roads.
There's schools, there's madai, there's old folks homes, there's hospitals.
(08:37):
All of these things need to be taken into consideration.
It's not as simple as they made it out to
be that we're just going to simply reverse it, because
they've found actually in some communities that just by announcing
that they're going to reverse it up to one hundred,
some communities have gone, well, actually, hold on, we don't
want it to one hundred. So they should take their
time and make sure they get it right because what
we don't want actually is things like road safety to
(09:00):
become a political issue like at has.
Speaker 5 (09:01):
Over the last couple of years.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
There's been a lot of talk about privatization and asset sales.
This week Chris Prime Minister Chris Luxe and said National
may run on a platform of assets sales next election,
while David Seymour has suggested we privatize the entire health system.
Karen Labor has come out swinging on this. Why is
the idea of asset sales bad?
Speaker 3 (09:24):
Well, we've got numerous examples as to why it hasn't
worked in this country. You look at the Railways that's
been sold and bought back a couple of times now,
and it's been stripped of its assets and the taxpayers
have had to bail it out. Exactly the same for
in New Zealand. The partial privatization of the power companies
have led to a significant increase in prices and a
(09:47):
reduction of investment in renewable energy. When you're driven by
a return to your shareholders as opposed to providing a
common and public good in this country, you're going to
get different outcomes. So we are fundamentally opposed to privatization.
And look, let's be honest, let's front up. The Labor
Party did this in the eighties and we've learned the lesson.
(10:10):
It's a shame that Act and potentially National haven't learned
that lesson. I frankly shocked that the Prime Minister has
indicated that they may campaign on this. We saw the
public opinion when there was a referendum, a citizen's initiated
referendum on asset sales, which John Key ignored. New Zealanders
don't want this.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
And the issue that I have is what have you
got to sell? That's the thing. What is there really
to sell?
Speaker 4 (10:36):
Oh, I've got some great news for you. Then we're
not selling anything. So this is people talking about what
they may or may not want to run on in
future campaigns, but we are not selling anything. Is there
a time coming in the future when kew we are
going to want to talk about well, if we've got
limited right, we want to grow economy. If we've got
limited munds, funds, limited capital that we can invest, do
(10:57):
we want to invest that in a partially privatized electricity
sector or do we want to invest that in new
roads or schools or hospitals. Right, So we've got to
make some decisions about how we spend money in the future.
So I think the Prime Minister said, look, we're open
to having that discussion, but for right now, we're not.
We're not doing it.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
He's the Prime minister, he's your boss, and he's saying
that he's when it gets time for the next election,
and he's definitely going to run on it. So he's
saying it's coming, it's just not right now.
Speaker 4 (11:24):
I don't think he said he's definitely going to run
on it. I think he said we're open to a conversation.
I'm happy to be corrected on that, but that's for
future elections. What are we doing now as a government.
We're not selling anything. We're focused on growing the economy
and delivering the kind of quality of public services that
I think every care we want.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
If you spoiled down what just said. We're not selling anything,
but here's the reasons why we should consider selling something.
And we're not selling anything. But they can't guarantee that
that will always be the position. We can.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
They can't. We're not selling anything yet.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Is there anything to sell?
Speaker 5 (11:56):
Well, absolutely there is.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
There are a number of state owned things that deliver
either a public good or a core service in this country.
Now we still have fifty one percent in many of
the energy companies. It's our firm view that we should
never have reduced our share down to that. We've still
got a significant share in in New Zealand. Now if
we relinquish those we will get an injection of revenue
(12:19):
into the government coffers, but we will relinquish all the
dividends that come back to the government, and we will
the security that comes with knowing that a New Zealand
will always operate as long as the government is a
majority shareholder. Now that's a pretty important service for this country.
If that gets run down by the private sector and
hopped off, we don't.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
Have that security. So everybody that lives outside.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Are the main centers your team it Oo's or your
Hamilton's or whatever. The smaller centers Parmersan North, you can
expect your regular services to reduce significantly because they have
a different framework.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
I don't think they can reduce. I mean, we had Max,
our news boss, and here saying that he's tried to
get to Timuru three times, and all three times it's
been a complete screw up and he hasn't got there
on the day that he was supposed to get there.
I don't think the services for me and zeal And
can get any worse if private enterprise owned them.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
Do you to well, I certainly I know that the
locally imp down there, James Meaga would love to see
the service to Timuru improve, not like I mean, I
think this is sort of broadline skier hungering. Right, let's
focus well, no.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
No, no, no, no, hold hold off so that when
you've got the Prime Minister that's come out to set it.
I mean, come on, but you guard you we're ski buggery.
When you got your boss, the Prime Minister of New
Zealand actually standing up and saying we're going to talk
about it, just before the next election and if we
one will have the mandate to sell and you're telling me, now,
oh no, this is ska mungry.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
So what we're hearing as a prime minister saying we'll
campaign on some stuff at the next election and that
and if we won't, we'll have a man.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
How we skim it, how we ski bungering.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
By asking questions that are going to decrease because the
whole bunch of stuff is happening right now. What we're
focused on is growing the economy. You're seeing and you
plan for drinking investment into New Zealand, you're seeing reforms
of that science technology innovation sector. You're seeing the digital
no mad Visa come out as all the ways that
we're focused on. What we're focused on as a government
is looking for ways to grow the economy, to increase
opportunities for key we still have a better quality of
(14:13):
life and in the future, is there going to be
a discussion about what we campaign on. Sure, But I
don't think that's something we need to be scared of
right now.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
I mean, that's frankly a pathetic response. It's a response
for someone who doesn't want to front up to something
that the Prime Minister has said. It's like they're saying, oh, well,
the Prime Minister said that we're going to campaign on this,
but we don't want you to talk about it until then,
So please don't open your mouth get stuffed this that
we're talking about privatization. This is a serious issue that
(14:42):
New Zealanders care about. And let's be frank the only
reason they're talking about it is because they've buggered the
books leading into the last election. The National Party, we're
the only ones that said their.
Speaker 5 (14:51):
Tax plan headed up.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
Everyone including economists, said it didn't add up, and love
and behold, here we are in a situation where it
doesn't add up. They're borrowing more than the previous government
except for that one COVID year when we spent money
to save businesses. Their approach to the economy is got
holes all through it. They need revenue, so they're looking
and lining up. You can look at the work that
(15:15):
Nichola Willis is doing with Treasury at the moment they
are assessing what the government owns. They are going to
campaign on this, and to say it's skimong Greek, I
think is frankly ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
I'm a little bit taken back by it too, because
it's his own Prime minister telling us that, not me
and you making up Karen?
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Is it?
Speaker 3 (15:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (15:32):
But we're responding to what the PM said, and so
am I and I think that's absolutely fine that in
future elections will campaign on what we campaign on. But
right now that's not our focus. It's not something we do,
and we're focused on growing the economy. It's like, I mean,
five minutes ago, Karen sat here and said, well, he
asked to change the speed limit and they said no,
and that's it. I mean, how is that an acceptable answer?
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Right? Let's move on. Government has announced the new visa
for digital nomads, allowing them to stay in New Zealand
and work remotely from their computers up for up to
nine months. Tim, is this really the answer to the
economic growth? Surely these digital nomad's already in New Zealand
and I know that they are because you know, I've
seen them in cafes working away and online. How does
Immigration even know if they're working or sending emails to families?
(16:15):
I mean, how do we actually know all this stuff?
Speaker 4 (16:18):
I think this is a great thing, right. What we're
saying is the doors open, come on and we need
to revitalize our sort of tourism sect do we need
to get more people into the country. What we're saying
is where there was a barrier before, we're moving it.
It's something that other parties, including Labor, have spoken about
previously and supported. Let's open the door to them. Let's
encourage people to come in here and they can spend
(16:38):
some money while they're here, they're having a holiday, they
can keep their business back home, tickn over or do
what they do. I think this is a great thing,
and we've seen reaction overseas that shows that it's pretty popular.
Every bit counts right now, right we landed in the
worst recession in thirty years. Every bit counts. This is
a great thing.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Yeah, surprising me that you want to wind part companies up,
But that's another story, Karen. Do you actually think that
label would support this or not.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
We do support it. It's a logical thing that would
have happened anyway. But we've got to look at this
in the broader picture.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Here.
Speaker 3 (17:11):
The government says that they are all about growth and
have been since day one. They've done a reshuffle, they've
announced the Minister for Economic Growth, and this is their
big thing. So it's a good thing, but it's not
the silver bullet, and it certainly shouldn't have been the
first idea off the plankt If this was a government
that really was focused on economic growth, wouldn't you expect
(17:32):
their first announcement to be something significant and substantial, not
extending a three month visitor visited nine months for those
who want to work, because let's be honest, they've been
doing it anyway. There's been nothing to stop them doing
Anybody that's visited here for three months and has the
capacity to work remotely has been doing it, and we
should encourage it absolutely. But let's actually look at things
(17:55):
in the broader context. These guys have not got a
big idea.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Right, well, let's hope they have got some big ideas.
Let's talk about banking. You see on first Shane Jones,
and really quickly because I know you guys have got
to go talking on what he calls woke banks who
are debanking some mineral companies, farm as an independent petrol
station owners because of their climate change commitments. He's talking
about bringing in a member's bill to prevent banks from
making these decisions. Karen, is it okay? In your eyes,
(18:21):
for these banks to be making these decisions based on.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
That, it's totally appropriate for banks to make commercial decisions.
No one's forcing them to do this. This is the
decision that they have made. They've made the choice that
they want to be associated with business practices that are
taking the climate crisis that we are facing very seriously.
And if banks are choosing this, given the size of them,
(18:45):
and given them amount of money that they deal with,
and the importance of banks in our economy or frankly
the reliance of banks for our economy, this is a
decision that they have made. It's a decision that is
inconvenient to the platform of New Zealand first, who incidentally
seem to have decided that they are just going to
try and make as many headlines as they can by
saying the most outrageous what.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Do you think of out the poor guy that's bought
the independent petrol station though that can't get refinanced. Don't
you care about him?
Speaker 5 (19:11):
Of course I do, But that wasn't the question.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Well, it is because the bank. The banks are actually
making that moral high ground stand on it. They're not
going to refinance them or her.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Precisely, but This is a decision that the banks have made.
It's not for the government to come in and force
the banks to make commercial decisions that they wouldn't and
their shareholders and their board want to do. Let's also
think about this. The government promised that they would reduce regulation.
(19:41):
Now the government is threatening to impose regulation. They are
completely all over the shop.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Tim, what are your thoughts on it? I mean, should
banks really be the more moral arbiter of what's right
and wrong in business? I mean that we heard about
a sex shop not being able to open a bank
account because they didn't want brothels fully legal can't open
bank account you know, farmers, you know that's your people.
Speaker 4 (20:07):
Well every key with our people. But this is why
we've got a Select committee looking at banking right, the
lack of competition, support for as you mentioned, rural areas,
rural banking giving kiwis a fore you go. I think
there are absolutely some issues that we want to have
a look at, and we want to make sure that
petrol shop owner has the ability to run. We still need,
you know, cars in this country that run on petrol.
(20:28):
Where we're a long way away from being able to
get rid of that completely, so we have to be
giving Kiwi's if you go with banking. I am concerned
about the lack of competition. I'm concerned about Australian banks
coming in and dictating to Kiwis. And I think it's
entirely appropriate that that Select Committee in quiry is doing
what it's doing. Have a look at this making sure
Keiwis get a fair shop.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
It was it interesting for you when you're talking about
that select committee that TSB said that refinancing or giving
Kiwi Bank a whole lot of money would make no
difference at all? Did that concern either of you? I
mean not.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Just well you know this is we take a different view.
The advice is certainly very different to that other banks
saying I don't give Kiwibank a bunch of money. We
don't want more competition maybe wouldn't be a surprise, but
actually I think competition in the market for Kiwis is
what we need and we don't want to see you know,
Kiwi's getting rates height and money going offshore. We want
(21:21):
to see it back here in New Zealand giving Kiyis
a shot.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Karen, did you get a frightmen? Did you see that
article where the TSB said, financing a Kiwi bank, give government,
give them a whole lot of money, won't make any
difference at all.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
I mean, what do we expect them to say? They
don't want that to happen. They don't want another large
competitor in the market. But the country does, the consumers do,
and the more competitive the more options business people like
the ones you mentioned will have. And that's exactly the
scenario that we need. The solution to these challenges is
(21:53):
not to impose more rules on the big banks. It's
to impose more competition. And in this instance, why should
someone who operates a sex shop be judged morally by
a bank? That which was not posted to me in
the question that one is totally inappropriate.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Mean, but that you basically said to be fair, you
said that the banks could make their own decisions.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
They can make their own business decisions looking at the market.
So actually what the banks are doing here is no
different to what Fonterra are doing with their farmers. Now
they've identified that Nesle, that Tesco and other major buyers
of Fonterra's products have signaled that unless they make changes
in their production so that they are meeting climate objectives,
(22:37):
they won't buy them. That is a business decision looking
at the markets and that's all that the banks are
doing in terms of the climate stuff. But placing moral
judgments on people that's out for something that's legal. I
don't support that.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
Supporting Carey Bank.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
Supporting supporting Kiwi Bank to be competitive by giving it
the capital that it requires to do so will be
a massive injection into the competition of the banks. Selling
Kiwi Bank in order to be able to do there
is not something we would support.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Okay, thank you both very much. I know you've got
to run off and go to select committees and go
to stuff, so I appreciate around if you want to
assure you, I appreciate both of you coming in. It's amazing.
Have a great new year. I mean it's a start
of it. How's it feeling. What's Parliament feeling? One quick word,
give me one quick word, e to how it's feeling
to be parliament.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
How it's exciting, it's great, focus on growth, It's going
to be a great year.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
We're enjoying watching the government argue makes themselves so we're
we're happy.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Thank you both for coming in.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills. Listen live
to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk said b focusing in on the issues
that matter politics Thursday on Wellington Mornings, news Talk said Bilian,
can you make your decision? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Joining us for politics Thursday. This week is Labour's Housing
spokesperson Karen mcanautic Careen, Good morning mate. How are you great?
Have a good holiday or hered you went skiing and
had a bit of fun.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
Yeah, yeah, first winning anniversary so you might as we
pushed the boat out.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Oh oh absolutely, so all good? Happy to be back, Yeah,
I am.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Actually it's a sign of a good break when you're
actually pleased to get back to.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Wik Yeah, or you missed did you miss it?
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Not?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Really? Don't push it on please be back? Nice balance
right and National's o techy mp Tim cost Terms. Do
you have a break to get away keep your family away?
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
We we just had a little book a match at
the beach. It's fantastic actually, but the Times Ken sayd
surfing lesson that kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
You're abouts regular?
Speaker 4 (01:14):
Actually I never been dragging for it and it was
it was great cool spot up there.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Was it was it really that good good coffee? Regular roast,
great coffee.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
You know, I don't drink coffee. So there you go,
breaking news. Yeah, and outrageous, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Well you've done better than me. Something weird about So
I never used to drink coffee, and now I have
difficult Only one a day though, only one in the morning.
Speaker 4 (01:33):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
That's good.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
Yeah, sleep, If I have another one.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
I'm exactly the same. I have the seat seeing my
coffee from this morning, and I go to put it
in the microwave and heat it up, but I just
keep it going and then that's it. It's one coffee
a day. Good on you. Yeah, start the day with
the coffee and that's That's a cup of tea after that. Right,
let's talk politics. I don't talk about the fact that
Tim doesn't drink coffee. The governments. Interesting, It is a
bit interesting about dark one. Why what about when you
(01:59):
were in the Air force. You know, you're a pilot
in the Air Force. Clearly they'd live on coffee.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
They live on they live on jet plane lollies. That's
what they live on. Go through kilograms of the stuff.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Terrible, All right, bookmakers at the tab live on coffee.
So that's my only trade that I can speak to
you or drink coffee.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
It's interesting I ran into No, that's a different story.
I've been not talking about that. We'll talk about that
off here. The government has announced the raft of speed
limit changes around the country, a bunch of them and
the wire Rapper, bringing the speed limits back to what
they were before the last government changed them. Karen, that's
your electorate, and I know from doing an hour the
show this morning, and I know when you reduced them
(02:38):
how much there was some angst about it. Your people
are going to be happy, Well, I'm happy.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
The streets between Greytown and Featherston should never have been reduced.
It didn't fit the criteria. It wasn't done on safety,
it was done for quote consistency. So when we asked
NZTA why they made that decision, they said, oh, well
we're reducing the speed elsewhere, so we're going to reduce
it there.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
And that just infuriated people.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
It made no sense at it. You're technically you're allowed
to go one hundred kilometers on the rim Attuckers and
then you get to Featherston and you're doing forty and
then on a.
Speaker 5 (03:13):
Straight wide piece of road you had to do eighty.
I was a.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Firefighter in Greytown for a number of years and though
the designated crash unit for South Wided Upper and I
don't remember getting called out for a serious crash on
that road, but there were regularly crashes between Carton and
Mast and so the two needed to be looked at
differently and treated differently. And what I found frustrating about
the whole thing is that I was made Associate Transport
(03:39):
Minister and I thought, oh, here's my chance to do something.
And I sat MZTA down in the office and I said,
I want you to review that, and they looked me
in the eye and said no, but absolutely refuse. We
went back and forth, back and forth the over a
long period of time and they just refused to budge.
And now they're doing it. So I'm pleased that's happened.
But I'll be completely honest with that, I'm pretty frustrated
with MZTA because we could have avoided this whole thing.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
To me, were you worried by this or do you
think it's a good idea? Does there anything that concerns you?
You've got young kids. I mean they're going to open
up speed limit a little bit. Are you have you
got any preservation. No, no, I don't.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Look it's fantastic And I drove to Mastend twice and
the same thing. Why is the speed limit one hundred
of them attackers and then eighty on the safe spit
of road there. It's outrageous and I think it shows
the job that our government has done and actually not
accepting no. We need to move away from this culture
of people saying no and actually drive some things through
and get it done. This is all part of our
plan to grow the economy right, and we've got to
(04:30):
get things moving. This is great. And on the other
side of the hills, on the Company Coast and Judea Fenawa,
there are four roads that are impacted. One is automatically
having an increase, it's only a ten kilometer change from
sixty back to seventy. But the other three that will
be consulted on are currently at eighty ks consulting on
going back to one hundred. My impression from feedback I've
(04:51):
had is some of them might change. But across the
country there's what thirty eight that are definitely changing and
another almost fifty week consulting on. I don't know that
all fifty will necessarily change. I think there's a genuine
opportunity for the community to have the essay here because
some roads are no brainers, like the one in Waupa,
like some of our roads, say between Livid and Shannon.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Like Cobbon Drive, Well, hang out to the airport.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Okay, Okay, but I'm probably more familiar with the hut
of fenermal Ones. But there are also some issues which.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Can I just ask you one. Sorry to interrupt, and
that was really rude of me, and I apologize, right.
A lot of talk, a lot of talk about why
Transmission Gully isn't one hundred and color all the time. Now,
do you know what the extull answers? Because I've been
telling you it hasn't been signed off yet.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Correct, There's some stuff that they have to finish. They'll
call it consenting issues. There's some legal stuff, some consenting stuff,
some work around the sides that sort of feed into that,
and a tool that's done and it's officially all signed off.
The speed can't speed limit can't change. And the other
question you'll get immediately after that is, well, what about
the bit between Poplar ev Auto Mutty and the bit
that go runs along the bottom of the hills next
(05:56):
to the train track to get to TG. But that's
slightly different because it's not actually part of the expressway.
There's no separate road that cyclists could go on. There's
some issues around the words some of the side barriers.
As I understand the safety, do we know the timing
that have to get No. Look, that's a great question,
but I don't have a definite and I don't want
to start crystal ball gazing t I can actually just
tell people what it is. But the new one that
(06:18):
we're building up Sillivan will be one hundred and ten
k's from the day it opens, and there's a lot
of excitement about construction starting on that this year.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
When that seemed to be safe.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
It should be one hundred and ten. There were highways
that were put up to one hundred and ten under us.
It should always be determined by how safe the road is,
what the speed is, for no other reason really, And
I'm pleased that there are fifty odd roads that are
being put up for consultation now for public submissions.
Speaker 5 (06:42):
That's how it should be. While I'm very pleased about.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
The stretch between Greytown and Featherston, I am concerned about
the speed at which had happened, because if there was
an opportunity to consult. There's a particular strip just north
of Carterton. I don't know if you're familiar, it's called Clevil.
There's the bakery there, there's a few manifesturers. That's actually
a really busy stretch, which if they just stopped and
took a breath, they actually could see the sense and
(07:05):
keeping the.
Speaker 5 (07:05):
Speed limit that little bit lower.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
There quite a lot of on and off in that
area that's just blanket down to one hundred, and so
there was obviously political reasons why they did it. Tried
to make it splash and tried to make a political point,
and that's just the rough and tumble of politics.
Speaker 5 (07:21):
But I think the guts of.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
It here is that there are some roads that without
doubt should be one hundred. There's also some roads that
should be a little bit lower for really genuine safety reasons,
and you've got to look at it and listen to
the community. So at least start doing it for these
fifty other roads. It would have been nice if they
just looked at that little bit round Clevel and timing.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Why did it take so long? I mean know that
this is one of the big things at the election,
wasn't it.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
We're going to we're going to paint on this and
the great thing is we're delivering on it. I mean
you heard from Kieran before, you know that he wasn't
able to get NZTA to do this. But our minister
Simi Brown and now Chris Bishop have You've got Mike
Butterack and y Rappa that's been fighting hard as the
local mp there and it's great to see this happen.
Thirty eight roads that have changed, now another almost fifty
to consult on. Does it take six months, Well that's
(08:09):
a lot better than never, right, Yeah, But.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
It's not straightforward.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
I mean they made it out that this was going
to be a really simple fix and it's not.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
It is not.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Straightforward because you get a stretch of road, say, for example,
from Featherston to say Pahir Tour, there are a lot
of communities, there are a lot of busy stretches that
it's one state highway, but there are a lot of
things to take into consideration. They're obviously on the local roads.
There's schools, there's madai, there's old folks homes, there's hospitals.
(08:37):
All of these things need to be taken into consideration.
It's not as simple as they made it out to
be that we're just going to simply reverse it, because
they've found actually in some communities that just by announcing
that they're going to reverse it up to one hundred,
some communities have gone, well, actually, hold on, we don't
want it to one hundred. So they should take their
time and make sure they get it right because what
we don't want actually is things like road safety to
(09:00):
become a political issue like at has.
Speaker 5 (09:01):
Over the last couple of years.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
There's been a lot of talk about privatization and asset sales.
This week Chris Prime Minister Chris Luxe and said National
may run on a platform of assets sales next election,
while David Seymour has suggested we privatize the entire health system.
Karen Labor has come out swinging on this. Why is
the idea of asset sales bad?
Speaker 3 (09:24):
Well, we've got numerous examples as to why it hasn't
worked in this country. You look at the Railways that's
been sold and bought back a couple of times now,
and it's been stripped of its assets and the taxpayers
have had to bail it out. Exactly the same for
in New Zealand. The partial privatization of the power companies
have led to a significant increase in prices and a
(09:47):
reduction of investment in renewable energy. When you're driven by
a return to your shareholders as opposed to providing a
common and public good in this country, you're going to
get different outcomes. So we are fundamentally opposed to privatization.
And look, let's be honest, let's front up. The Labor
Party did this in the eighties and we've learned the lesson.
(10:10):
It's a shame that Act and potentially National haven't learned
that lesson. I frankly shocked that the Prime Minister has
indicated that they may campaign on this. We saw the
public opinion when there was a referendum, a citizen's initiated
referendum on asset sales, which John Key ignored. New Zealanders
don't want this.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
And the issue that I have is what have you
got to sell? That's the thing. What is there really
to sell?
Speaker 4 (10:36):
Oh, I've got some great news for you. Then we're
not selling anything. So this is people talking about what
they may or may not want to run on in
future campaigns, but we are not selling anything. Is there
a time coming in the future when kew we are
going to want to talk about well, if we've got
limited right, we want to grow economy. If we've got
limited munds, funds, limited capital that we can invest, do
(10:57):
we want to invest that in a partially privatized electricity
sector or do we want to invest that in new
roads or schools or hospitals. Right, So we've got to
make some decisions about how we spend money in the future.
So I think the Prime Minister said, look, we're open
to having that discussion, but for right now, we're not.
We're not doing it.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
He's the Prime minister, he's your boss, and he's saying
that he's when it gets time for the next election,
and he's definitely going to run on it. So he's
saying it's coming, it's just not right now.
Speaker 4 (11:24):
I don't think he said he's definitely going to run
on it. I think he said we're open to a conversation.
I'm happy to be corrected on that, but that's for
future elections. What are we doing now as a government.
We're not selling anything. We're focused on growing the economy
and delivering the kind of quality of public services that
I think every care we want.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
If you spoiled down what just said. We're not selling anything,
but here's the reasons why we should consider selling something.
And we're not selling anything. But they can't guarantee that
that will always be the position. We can.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
They can't. We're not selling anything yet.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Is there anything to sell?
Speaker 5 (11:56):
Well, absolutely there is.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
There are a number of state owned things that deliver
either a public good or a core service in this country.
Now we still have fifty one percent in many of
the energy companies. It's our firm view that we should
never have reduced our share down to that. We've still
got a significant share in in New Zealand. Now if
we relinquish those we will get an injection of revenue
(12:19):
into the government coffers, but we will relinquish all the
dividends that come back to the government, and we will
the security that comes with knowing that a New Zealand
will always operate as long as the government is a
majority shareholder. Now that's a pretty important service for this country.
If that gets run down by the private sector and
hopped off, we don't.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
Have that security. So everybody that lives outside.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Are the main centers your team it Oo's or your
Hamilton's or whatever. The smaller centers Parmersan North, you can
expect your regular services to reduce significantly because they have
a different framework.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
I don't think they can reduce. I mean, we had Max,
our news boss, and here saying that he's tried to
get to Timuru three times, and all three times it's
been a complete screw up and he hasn't got there
on the day that he was supposed to get there.
I don't think the services for me and zeal And
can get any worse if private enterprise owned them.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
Do you to well, I certainly I know that the
locally imp down there, James Meaga would love to see
the service to Timuru improve, not like I mean, I
think this is sort of broadline skier hungering. Right, let's
focus well, no.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
No, no, no, no, hold hold off so that when
you've got the Prime Minister that's come out to set it.
I mean, come on, but you guard you we're ski buggery.
When you got your boss, the Prime Minister of New
Zealand actually standing up and saying we're going to talk
about it, just before the next election and if we
one will have the mandate to sell and you're telling me, now,
oh no, this is ska mungry.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
So what we're hearing as a prime minister saying we'll
campaign on some stuff at the next election and that
and if we won't, we'll have a man.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
How we skim it, how we ski bungering.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
By asking questions that are going to decrease because the
whole bunch of stuff is happening right now. What we're
focused on is growing the economy. You're seeing and you
plan for drinking investment into New Zealand, you're seeing reforms
of that science technology innovation sector. You're seeing the digital
no mad Visa come out as all the ways that
we're focused on. What we're focused on as a government
is looking for ways to grow the economy, to increase
opportunities for key we still have a better quality of
(14:13):
life and in the future, is there going to be
a discussion about what we campaign on. Sure, But I
don't think that's something we need to be scared of
right now.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
I mean, that's frankly a pathetic response. It's a response
for someone who doesn't want to front up to something
that the Prime Minister has said. It's like they're saying, oh, well,
the Prime Minister said that we're going to campaign on this,
but we don't want you to talk about it until then,
So please don't open your mouth get stuffed this that
we're talking about privatization. This is a serious issue that
(14:42):
New Zealanders care about. And let's be frank the only
reason they're talking about it is because they've buggered the
books leading into the last election. The National Party, we're
the only ones that said their.
Speaker 5 (14:51):
Tax plan headed up.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
Everyone including economists, said it didn't add up, and love
and behold, here we are in a situation where it
doesn't add up. They're borrowing more than the previous government
except for that one COVID year when we spent money
to save businesses. Their approach to the economy is got
holes all through it. They need revenue, so they're looking
and lining up. You can look at the work that
(15:15):
Nichola Willis is doing with Treasury at the moment they
are assessing what the government owns. They are going to
campaign on this, and to say it's skimong Greek, I
think is frankly ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
I'm a little bit taken back by it too, because
it's his own Prime minister telling us that, not me
and you making up Karen?
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Is it?
Speaker 3 (15:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (15:32):
But we're responding to what the PM said, and so
am I and I think that's absolutely fine that in
future elections will campaign on what we campaign on. But
right now that's not our focus. It's not something we do,
and we're focused on growing the economy. It's like, I mean,
five minutes ago, Karen sat here and said, well, he
asked to change the speed limit and they said no,
and that's it. I mean, how is that an acceptable answer?
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Right? Let's move on. Government has announced the new visa
for digital nomads, allowing them to stay in New Zealand
and work remotely from their computers up for up to
nine months. Tim, is this really the answer to the
economic growth? Surely these digital nomad's already in New Zealand
and I know that they are because you know, I've
seen them in cafes working away and online. How does
Immigration even know if they're working or sending emails to families?
(16:15):
I mean, how do we actually know all this stuff?
Speaker 4 (16:18):
I think this is a great thing, right. What we're
saying is the doors open, come on and we need
to revitalize our sort of tourism sect do we need
to get more people into the country. What we're saying
is where there was a barrier before, we're moving it.
It's something that other parties, including Labor, have spoken about
previously and supported. Let's open the door to them. Let's
encourage people to come in here and they can spend
(16:38):
some money while they're here, they're having a holiday, they
can keep their business back home, tickn over or do
what they do. I think this is a great thing,
and we've seen reaction overseas that shows that it's pretty popular.
Every bit counts right now, right we landed in the
worst recession in thirty years. Every bit counts. This is
a great thing.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Yeah, surprising me that you want to wind part companies up,
But that's another story, Karen. Do you actually think that
label would support this or not.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
We do support it. It's a logical thing that would
have happened anyway. But we've got to look at this
in the broader picture.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Here.
Speaker 3 (17:11):
The government says that they are all about growth and
have been since day one. They've done a reshuffle, they've
announced the Minister for Economic Growth, and this is their
big thing. So it's a good thing, but it's not
the silver bullet, and it certainly shouldn't have been the
first idea off the plankt If this was a government
that really was focused on economic growth, wouldn't you expect
(17:32):
their first announcement to be something significant and substantial, not
extending a three month visitor visited nine months for those
who want to work, because let's be honest, they've been
doing it anyway. There's been nothing to stop them doing
Anybody that's visited here for three months and has the
capacity to work remotely has been doing it, and we
should encourage it absolutely. But let's actually look at things
(17:55):
in the broader context. These guys have not got a
big idea.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Right, well, let's hope they have got some big ideas.
Let's talk about banking. You see on first Shane Jones,
and really quickly because I know you guys have got
to go talking on what he calls woke banks who
are debanking some mineral companies, farm as an independent petrol
station owners because of their climate change commitments. He's talking
about bringing in a member's bill to prevent banks from
making these decisions. Karen, is it okay? In your eyes,
(18:21):
for these banks to be making these decisions based on.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
That, it's totally appropriate for banks to make commercial decisions.
No one's forcing them to do this. This is the
decision that they have made. They've made the choice that
they want to be associated with business practices that are
taking the climate crisis that we are facing very seriously.
And if banks are choosing this, given the size of them,
(18:45):
and given them amount of money that they deal with,
and the importance of banks in our economy or frankly
the reliance of banks for our economy, this is a
decision that they have made. It's a decision that is
inconvenient to the platform of New Zealand first, who incidentally
seem to have decided that they are just going to
try and make as many headlines as they can by
saying the most outrageous what.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Do you think of out the poor guy that's bought
the independent petrol station though that can't get refinanced. Don't
you care about him?
Speaker 5 (19:11):
Of course I do, But that wasn't the question.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Well, it is because the bank. The banks are actually
making that moral high ground stand on it. They're not
going to refinance them or her.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Precisely, but This is a decision that the banks have made.
It's not for the government to come in and force
the banks to make commercial decisions that they wouldn't and
their shareholders and their board want to do. Let's also
think about this. The government promised that they would reduce regulation.
(19:41):
Now the government is threatening to impose regulation. They are
completely all over the shop.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Tim, what are your thoughts on it? I mean, should
banks really be the more moral arbiter of what's right
and wrong in business? I mean that we heard about
a sex shop not being able to open a bank
account because they didn't want brothels fully legal can't open
bank account you know, farmers, you know that's your people.
Speaker 4 (20:07):
Well every key with our people. But this is why
we've got a Select committee looking at banking right, the
lack of competition, support for as you mentioned, rural areas,
rural banking giving kiwis a fore you go. I think
there are absolutely some issues that we want to have
a look at, and we want to make sure that
petrol shop owner has the ability to run. We still need,
you know, cars in this country that run on petrol.
(20:28):
Where we're a long way away from being able to
get rid of that completely, so we have to be
giving Kiwi's if you go with banking. I am concerned
about the lack of competition. I'm concerned about Australian banks
coming in and dictating to Kiwis. And I think it's
entirely appropriate that that Select Committee in quiry is doing
what it's doing. Have a look at this making sure
Keiwis get a fair shop.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
It was it interesting for you when you're talking about
that select committee that TSB said that refinancing or giving
Kiwi Bank a whole lot of money would make no
difference at all? Did that concern either of you? I
mean not.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Just well you know this is we take a different view.
The advice is certainly very different to that other banks
saying I don't give Kiwibank a bunch of money. We
don't want more competition maybe wouldn't be a surprise, but
actually I think competition in the market for Kiwis is
what we need and we don't want to see you know,
Kiwi's getting rates height and money going offshore. We want
(21:21):
to see it back here in New Zealand giving Kiyis
a shot.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Karen, did you get a frightmen? Did you see that
article where the TSB said, financing a Kiwi bank, give government,
give them a whole lot of money, won't make any
difference at all.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
I mean, what do we expect them to say? They
don't want that to happen. They don't want another large
competitor in the market. But the country does, the consumers do,
and the more competitive the more options business people like
the ones you mentioned will have. And that's exactly the
scenario that we need. The solution to these challenges is
(21:53):
not to impose more rules on the big banks. It's
to impose more competition. And in this instance, why should
someone who operates a sex shop be judged morally by
a bank? That which was not posted to me in
the question that one is totally inappropriate.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Mean, but that you basically said to be fair, you
said that the banks could make their own decisions.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
They can make their own business decisions looking at the market.
So actually what the banks are doing here is no
different to what Fonterra are doing with their farmers. Now
they've identified that Nesle, that Tesco and other major buyers
of Fonterra's products have signaled that unless they make changes
in their production so that they are meeting climate objectives,
(22:37):
they won't buy them. That is a business decision looking
at the markets and that's all that the banks are
doing in terms of the climate stuff. But placing moral
judgments on people that's out for something that's legal. I
don't support that.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
Supporting Carey Bank.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
Supporting supporting Kiwi Bank to be competitive by giving it
the capital that it requires to do so will be
a massive injection into the competition of the banks. Selling
Kiwi Bank in order to be able to do there
is not something we would support.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Okay, thank you both very much. I know you've got
to run off and go to select committees and go
to stuff, so I appreciate around if you want to
assure you, I appreciate both of you coming in. It's amazing.
Have a great new year. I mean it's a start
of it. How's it feeling. What's Parliament feeling? One quick word,
give me one quick word, e to how it's feeling
to be parliament.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
How it's exciting, it's great, focus on growth, It's going
to be a great year.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
We're enjoying watching the government argue makes themselves so we're
we're happy.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Thank you both for coming in.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills. Listen live
to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
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