April 30, 2025 • 10 mins
News that Kiwirail is retiring the Aratere this year has sparked questions about just how soon we will have contracts for the new Interisland ferries.
To answer those questions, the man in charge of negotiating the new contracts, Ferry Holdings Ltd chair Chris Mackenzie, joined Nick Mills to discuss the progress.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks d be.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Joining us now is Chris McKenzie. He's the chair of
Faery Holdings Limited, the government appointed company responsible for the
negotiations for the new inter Island fairies.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Good morning, Chris, nexod morning.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Thank you for joining us and having a chat to us,
because we've been speaking for the last two hours about
the threat to Wellington or Pickton or the South Island
North Island with only having two fairies not three. How
close most of it? Okay?
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Driving down yep okay?
Speaker 2 (00:41):
So was it your the new organization? Will you actually
tell us about your organization so our listeners know exactly
what you were there to do and what you're doing.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
All right, Look at the history. We had i REX
which was under the was with the previous organization which
was going to bring in two fairies and rebuild the
infrastructure in Auckland and Impact and then Wellington. The Minister
of Finance put an end to that one and then
(01:14):
over the last twelve months there has been discussions which
ended up with the Minister of Rail Winston Peters, and
we were set up to take over the ferries from
one April. Our role is we're a very small fight group.
(01:36):
Our role is to design contract, sign a new contract
with a shipyard and then to with the Port of
Marlborough and Center Port put the infrastructure in place. So
we are at the point where we are near to
(01:58):
talking to shipyards with the design that we have made,
and we say to the ports, there's a ship two
hundred meters twenty eight meters wide, speed twenty knots now.
We need a box at your port so we can
come in and tie up.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Okay, So have you, Chris, have you been given a budget?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
We have been given a budget, which will be announced
by ministers further down the track. We don't at this
point in time have anything specifically allocated to any particular activity.
There has been a ballpark number that ministers themselves have determined,
(02:45):
but that's for ministers to disclose.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Is that a nice way of telling me, You're not
going to tell me how much your budget or your
ballpark figure is.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
No, I'm not going to tell you. So you're right.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Yeah, Oh gosh, I thought you were. I thought you're
going to give us some news how the negotiations go.
How close are you to say the ship's going to
look like this company's going to build it, and this
is what when we're going to get it? How close?
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Very close?
Speaker 2 (03:15):
How close is very close? Are we talking a month,
a year, a week, a day or an hour?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
All right? I'll go back to the Minister of Rail's
release on the thirty first of March. He indicated that
we needed to have signed contract with a shipyard that
can deliver two fairies, one early twenty twenty nine and
the second one in about the third quarter of twenty
(03:40):
twenty nine, and we are well on the way to
do that. We anticipate at the moment signing a contract
sometime between November and December with a shipyard. The shipyards
that we are working with, and there's a large number
of them, have all indicated that they will be able
(04:02):
to deliver those two ships on that time and deliver
the type of ship that has been designed.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Are you negotiating, Chris with the company that had the
existing contract and we don't have to pay out the
three hundred million. Is that in the discussion or no?
Speaker 3 (04:19):
That that is as the Minister Rail said, They are
interested in being involved, but Irex project is solely the
responsibility of qu Rail and qu Rail are negotiating. The
(04:39):
shipyard becomes involved, it will be on a clean sheet
from us, so that there will be no hint or
conspiracy theory that we've done a deal with them because
we had to deal with them in the past. That
can be a clean sheet along with all of the
other shipyards.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
Okay, So whose decision was it not to spend the
one hundred and twenty million dollars and keep the arditary
and use until twenty twenty nine.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
All right, I'll just give you. We wrote to q
Rail and indicated to qu Rail that in the discussions
with the ports they would like to have access, particularly Pickton,
they would like to have access to the wall post
October this year, but no later than the beginning of
(05:35):
twenty twenty six qu Rail. And there's all sorts of
guests on your program that have different views and so forth.
The fact is the arratary and it's nothing to do
with the grounding. The ratary is due for its dry
(05:57):
docking this year, and so even if it hadn't run aground,
the ratary was still going to go off to Singapore
for its two yearly dry dock. So it's not related
to running ashore just out of Picton. The Kiwi Rail
(06:18):
Board is responsible for the arratary and the decision that
they will make from what we have seen from Kivu Rail,
they are considering the ritary in the context of a
commercial decision, and that commercial decision will be based on
the fact that if the ratary goes off in June,
(06:42):
it's a way for nearly three months. It comes back
and then it can only work for two or three
months before we actually start putting piles in the ground
in the birth that it uses in Pickton. Now, the
arratary decision is driven largely by the Picton end of
(07:03):
the fairy route because and pick them. The infrastructure that's
there is the infrastructure that was put in them. What
nineteen ninety nineteen eighteen? Is it sixty one? You know
for the Ara Muana?
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Well, can you just quit me? I know you're a
very busy man, and we really appreciate you coming on
the show and clarifying a whole lot of things. How confident,
Chris are you that the new fairies that haven't even
had a contract done for, haven't had a design apart
from the basics. You know, you've said how long it's
going to be, how wide it's been, how fast it
can go. You've got no drawings, no plans. How confident
(07:44):
are you? And remember that I'll have this recording in
twenty twenty nine, that the first fairy will arrive in
twenty twenty nine.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
All right, I just want to correct you a bit.
I have seen the detailed drawings of the new fairies.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Okay, Why have we not been.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
Go off to neighbor architects and so forth, who will
then finalize the drawings to the design that we are
putting to the shipyards, so that we are more advanced
than just having a vessel that's two hundred by twenty
eight and nothing inside it?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Chris, why have we not seen that? Why have the
New Zealand not seen that?
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Because this will be a contractoral arrangement between the shipyards
and ferry holdings, and for the people who are hindering
for the ship construction do not have or will not
be able to give us a price based on a
(08:54):
drawing that they have not had the opportunity to actually analyze.
As I said, it has to go through a naval
architect and others. So that's it's all to do with
the contractor arrangements with whichever shipyard ends up constructing the ship.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Chris, really appreciate you taking time to talk to us,
and good luck, I mean Wellingtonyan's New Zealanders. We need
the sort of do we need it sorted as quickly
as we possibly can if we're ever going to get
our tourism back. It's a very important part of that
as well. So I wish you all the very best,
and I do appreciate you coming on and we will
bring you again because having.
Speaker 3 (09:33):
It I just make it. Can I make just another point?
Two points. The first is we're having very good cooperation
with q Rail and the two ports. The second is
the decision that was made to have a rail capable
fury is actually more flexible than having a road only ferry.
A rail fery can carry just as many trucks as
(09:57):
a road ferry can, so that in fact, having a
rail fury gives us more flexibility.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Well, and I think, well, I certainly do. I think
most of New Zealand agree that that's the right way
to go. Appreciate you coming on and thank you, and
we'll keep in touch and we'll hopefully twenty twenty nine
we'll see all these fantastic these two fantastic new fairies.
Chris Mackenzie, who's the chair of Faery Holdings Limited. This
is the government appointed company responsible for the negotiations for
(10:24):
the new inter arum firies.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks d be.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Joining us now is Chris McKenzie. He's the chair of
Faery Holdings Limited, the government appointed company responsible for the
negotiations for the new inter Island fairies.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Good morning, Chris, nexod morning.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Thank you for joining us and having a chat to us,
because we've been speaking for the last two hours about
the threat to Wellington or Pickton or the South Island
North Island with only having two fairies not three. How
close most of it? Okay?
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Driving down yep okay?
Speaker 2 (00:41):
So was it your the new organization? Will you actually
tell us about your organization so our listeners know exactly
what you were there to do and what you're doing.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
All right, Look at the history. We had i REX
which was under the was with the previous organization which
was going to bring in two fairies and rebuild the
infrastructure in Auckland and Impact and then Wellington. The Minister
of Finance put an end to that one and then
(01:14):
over the last twelve months there has been discussions which
ended up with the Minister of Rail Winston Peters, and
we were set up to take over the ferries from
one April. Our role is we're a very small fight group.
(01:36):
Our role is to design contract, sign a new contract
with a shipyard and then to with the Port of
Marlborough and Center Port put the infrastructure in place. So
we are at the point where we are near to
(01:58):
talking to shipyards with the design that we have made,
and we say to the ports, there's a ship two
hundred meters twenty eight meters wide, speed twenty knots now.
We need a box at your port so we can
come in and tie up.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Okay, So have you, Chris, have you been given a budget?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
We have been given a budget, which will be announced
by ministers further down the track. We don't at this
point in time have anything specifically allocated to any particular activity.
There has been a ballpark number that ministers themselves have determined,
(02:45):
but that's for ministers to disclose.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Is that a nice way of telling me, You're not
going to tell me how much your budget or your
ballpark figure is.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
No, I'm not going to tell you. So you're right.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Yeah, Oh gosh, I thought you were. I thought you're
going to give us some news how the negotiations go.
How close are you to say the ship's going to
look like this company's going to build it, and this
is what when we're going to get it? How close?
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Very close?
Speaker 2 (03:15):
How close is very close? Are we talking a month,
a year, a week, a day or an hour?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
All right? I'll go back to the Minister of Rail's
release on the thirty first of March. He indicated that
we needed to have signed contract with a shipyard that
can deliver two fairies, one early twenty twenty nine and
the second one in about the third quarter of twenty
(03:40):
twenty nine, and we are well on the way to
do that. We anticipate at the moment signing a contract
sometime between November and December with a shipyard. The shipyards
that we are working with, and there's a large number
of them, have all indicated that they will be able
(04:02):
to deliver those two ships on that time and deliver
the type of ship that has been designed.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Are you negotiating, Chris with the company that had the
existing contract and we don't have to pay out the
three hundred million. Is that in the discussion or no?
Speaker 3 (04:19):
That that is as the Minister Rail said, They are
interested in being involved, but Irex project is solely the
responsibility of qu Rail and qu Rail are negotiating. The
(04:39):
shipyard becomes involved, it will be on a clean sheet
from us, so that there will be no hint or
conspiracy theory that we've done a deal with them because
we had to deal with them in the past. That
can be a clean sheet along with all of the
other shipyards.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
Okay, So whose decision was it not to spend the
one hundred and twenty million dollars and keep the arditary
and use until twenty twenty nine.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
All right, I'll just give you. We wrote to q
Rail and indicated to qu Rail that in the discussions
with the ports they would like to have access, particularly Pickton,
they would like to have access to the wall post
October this year, but no later than the beginning of
(05:35):
twenty twenty six qu Rail. And there's all sorts of
guests on your program that have different views and so forth.
The fact is the arratary and it's nothing to do
with the grounding. The ratary is due for its dry
(05:57):
docking this year, and so even if it hadn't run aground,
the ratary was still going to go off to Singapore
for its two yearly dry dock. So it's not related
to running ashore just out of Picton. The Kiwi Rail
(06:18):
Board is responsible for the arratary and the decision that
they will make from what we have seen from Kivu Rail,
they are considering the ritary in the context of a
commercial decision, and that commercial decision will be based on
the fact that if the ratary goes off in June,
(06:42):
it's a way for nearly three months. It comes back
and then it can only work for two or three
months before we actually start putting piles in the ground
in the birth that it uses in Pickton. Now, the
arratary decision is driven largely by the Picton end of
(07:03):
the fairy route because and pick them. The infrastructure that's
there is the infrastructure that was put in them. What
nineteen ninety nineteen eighteen? Is it sixty one? You know
for the Ara Muana?
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Well, can you just quit me? I know you're a
very busy man, and we really appreciate you coming on
the show and clarifying a whole lot of things. How confident,
Chris are you that the new fairies that haven't even
had a contract done for, haven't had a design apart
from the basics. You know, you've said how long it's
going to be, how wide it's been, how fast it
can go. You've got no drawings, no plans. How confident
(07:44):
are you? And remember that I'll have this recording in
twenty twenty nine, that the first fairy will arrive in
twenty twenty nine.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
All right, I just want to correct you a bit.
I have seen the detailed drawings of the new fairies.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Okay, Why have we not been.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
Go off to neighbor architects and so forth, who will
then finalize the drawings to the design that we are
putting to the shipyards, so that we are more advanced
than just having a vessel that's two hundred by twenty
eight and nothing inside it?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Chris, why have we not seen that? Why have the
New Zealand not seen that?
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Because this will be a contractoral arrangement between the shipyards
and ferry holdings, and for the people who are hindering
for the ship construction do not have or will not
be able to give us a price based on a
(08:54):
drawing that they have not had the opportunity to actually analyze.
As I said, it has to go through a naval
architect and others. So that's it's all to do with
the contractor arrangements with whichever shipyard ends up constructing the ship.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Chris, really appreciate you taking time to talk to us,
and good luck, I mean Wellingtonyan's New Zealanders. We need
the sort of do we need it sorted as quickly
as we possibly can if we're ever going to get
our tourism back. It's a very important part of that
as well. So I wish you all the very best,
and I do appreciate you coming on and we will
bring you again because having.
Speaker 3 (09:33):
It I just make it. Can I make just another point?
Two points. The first is we're having very good cooperation
with q Rail and the two ports. The second is
the decision that was made to have a rail capable
fury is actually more flexible than having a road only ferry.
A rail fery can carry just as many trucks as
(09:57):
a road ferry can, so that in fact, having a
rail fury gives us more flexibility.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Well, and I think, well, I certainly do. I think
most of New Zealand agree that that's the right way
to go. Appreciate you coming on and thank you, and
we'll keep in touch and we'll hopefully twenty twenty nine
we'll see all these fantastic these two fantastic new fairies.
Chris Mackenzie, who's the chair of Faery Holdings Limited. This
is the government appointed company responsible for the negotiations for
(10:24):
the new inter arum firies.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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