June 29, 2025 • 33 mins
It's exactly halfway through 2025 - six months ago the catch phrase of the Wellington business community was 'survive til 25'. Are our businesses still struggling halfway through the year?
Also, have tourism numbers in Wellington bounced back to pre-Covid levels, and can Kiwi consumers and businesses cope with the increasing costs of flights?
To answer those questions, Business Central/Wellington Chamber of Commerce CEO Simon Arcus and Travel Agents Association CEO Julie White joined Nick Mills for the Business Panel.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk said by Mondays Mean Business. It's the
business panel on Wellington Mornings with Quinovic Property Management, a
better rental experience for all. Visit Quinovic dot co dot inshead.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Joining us for the business panel this week is a
Central Wellington Chamber of Commerce CEO Simon Arcis, Good morning, Simon,
good to be back here. Gosh, it feels great to
be back. And Travel Agents Association CEO Julie White Morning.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Julie, Good morning, Nick. Nice to see you.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
We've changed from hospital to travel. Don't want to get
him in the bar, want to get about and travel
and get him somewhere.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Else traveling to the bars.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
So what made you? What? What was the change? Why
is the change?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Oh? Look, I took some time out and my mum
was a little bit sick and she's based in Australia,
so I spent some time with mum and I feel
really lucky on that she had Alzheimer's and I was
able to be there for a passing. So then it
was time to jump back in and this opportunity came
(01:26):
up and it's still in my wheelhouse and it's really
great to be part of the Travel Agent's Association. And
you know, I'm sure over the discussions this morning, what's
really exciting to share is that our industry, like you know,
don't want to show off or anything, but we're up
you know last year year on year, we're up thirty
two percent. And yeah, so there's actually some positivity out there.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
I do want to bring that up because I know
that the government's I mean, in my sec time, I've
been reading a lot and the government wants there to
be more international tourism. They're still the saying that we're
short and they wanted to be bigger, but therese issues
with that there.
Speaker 4 (02:07):
Well, look, I need to do a shout out to
the Minister for Tourism Hospitality because she is certainly prioritizing
the tourism and you know, we really all need to
lean in because it's a shared problem, so we need
a shared solution. So the Tourism Growth Roadmap, which she
recently released, twenty million dollars of that is to be
(02:28):
spent in the short term on growing demand. Nick. Now,
it's been really specific, it's been really specific on that.
So it's twofold where I see Valentonians are going to
benefit from that. It's business events. We've got this amazing
facility down the road here Taquina, So business events is
right down our wheelhouse. And so when we actually have
business events in town, you know, hospo guys actually benefit
(02:52):
from it, so do the retailer. So everyone wins when
there's events. She's also going to dedicate I think it's
three million dollars to rto funding to attract especially the Aussies.
And look, I went to the Pulse game last night.
Cut us to the Pulse for taking out the win.
How good is this place with events? So absolutely the
(03:14):
Aussie should come over. It's a really great city. And
I'm feeling really positive that the time, the tide is changing.
So you know, I'm all for the tourism roadmap. I'm
feeling quietly optimistic. But there's a gap to gold and
we've got a lot to do.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Simon, what are your people telling you give us? Give
us a little bit of a state of Wellington. I mean,
I love doing this with you because you're dealing with
all the business people all over Wellington, which is our soul.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
You're right now. Look, it's the themes that you pull
out from those discussions and the themes that come out
from business is what a lot of people relate to,
that idea of bumping along the bottom, like it feels
like there's no further down to go, and it feels
like there's sort of two steps forward one step back
in terms of there can see a trajectory improvement in
the economy.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
See the light at the end of the tunnel.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
They're beginning to they're beginning to. But I'll give you
a really good example of two steps forward, one step back.
You've had business confidences lifted generally, and there's and there's
good feelings a hit about you know, changes at the council,
but equally our our services and our manufacturing measurements for
the country went backwards in June and so and so.
Then you apply that to one can you say, you know,
we've we've been through some tough times. And what I'd
(04:22):
say is you've got some really resilient businesses here because
they've made it through. You know, if you haven't. If
you've made it through by now, you've been tested in
just about every way. And look, I think Wellington business
is at a point that it's saying we have to
get behind change and exciting new change because dwelling on
the past, not putting a line under the under the past,
is going to be a problem.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
If you were me sitting here and tomorrow you I
was looking at the Finance Minister Nichola Willis, which I am.
She's coming into the studio. What's the one question that
you had put to her that you think has not
been fulfilled for your clients.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Well, a really good example that we had the Canberra
Chamber over here visiting the other day. They brought about
eight tech people in about twelve other business people and
they asked me a question, but what are the incentives
for us to joint venture with businesses here in Wellington
or in New Zealand And the answer was not, there
aren't really any, you know, and there are other countries
do these things. So in the pullback on spending, you know,
(05:21):
my question would be, have do you think that you
may have neglected this issue of incentives for business because
just helps to build that foundation to get a business going,
to boost it and then then business will look after itself.
And that's where I think we've got to gap.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
What would your question be to the to the Minister
of Finance. Finance Minister you, My.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Question would be very similar to Simon. So if we
have a look at one of the biggest issues in
our industry, that's the travel agent's sector, and we earlier
spoke about attracting more inbound visitors here, we have flight
capacity issues. So the Aussies are doing a really good
(06:03):
job and they've got incentive money to a train airlines
and that's the key. If we want to grow visitor numbers,
we need more seats available on airlines. The only way
we're going to do that is if we have more
airlines coming to New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
What about them investing more money into their New Zealand
the major shareholder of the in New Zealand. You're right,
capacity as everyone sees the same thing we're not getting.
I mean, you know, we are a small nation at
the bottom of the world, so surely having our own
airline with more capacity would be appealing.
Speaker 4 (06:38):
I think it's just not as simple as that. The
fact look, Air New Zealand's not alone, but it is
our national carrier and they've got quite a substantial number
of their fleet in the garage. It's they're basically offline
and no matter how much money the government puts towards that.
It won't help that. You know, it's a Rolls Royce
issue and we've got a we've got a ticket and
(07:01):
we're waiting our turn until that's turned around. But I
think that's really a question for air New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
So you think it's as simple as getting more airlines
coming into New Zealand.
Speaker 4 (07:11):
Yeah, we need to be attractive. And again this is
for others to answer, like good people from Barnes and
New Zealand airports is around. What will that take? There is,
as I said, incentive money. Like the Queenslanders have a
really good model. They have a co fund approach, so
(07:31):
government and industry will co fund the incentive to attract
new airlines coming here. That's exactly what we need. So
you know, I believe it's a shared problem, a shared
solution approach, and it's really hard to compete against when
you've actually got that incentive money.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
When we're talking about the state of Wellington, which we're
starting to do it, you know, how we're starting the show.
Is there Simon, I'll come to you on this and
is there stories that make you excited? Is the stories
out there? You say yourself. You know, this is the
start of it. I kind of get that feeling that
we're almost about to go again.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
I think there are some great stories from change in
city leadership. You've got a change of mayor this year,
you've got a change of the head of the City Council,
and you've also got a change of the head of
the Economic Development Agency. So you've got three fresh faces
looking at the city differently, and that's a huge opportunity
after a number of years.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Have you met the new CEO of I.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Have yes, several times, yes, And I think he's You're
lucky as of me he has been Yeah, No, he
doesn't want to talk to me. He's a very good operator,
and I think I have confidence in him as far
as I've known him. And look, we got to get
behind him and try and be supportive and make change.
But another thing, Nick, I was thinking about Civic Square recently.
(08:52):
That's going to have a couple of things next year
it opens and also in the town hall opens after
a long period, but also the city Council moves and
right next door to it, you've got another thirteen or
fourteen hundred people in that area in the city, which
has been so neglected and so sort of downtrodden, and
that's going to liven up. So if we think about
what the future looks like in just a matter of months,
(09:13):
there are some great stories for the city to come.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Okay, do you believe that we will be in a
position to actually, I don't know, get something out of it.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
I do, I do, and I think we need. I
think that's all about the fresh eyes on the city
and what we're planning to do. What we have is
a problem of profligate spending for years, so that's made
the budget pretty tight. But that is just then about
making some smart and rational decisions and doing it on
a shoestring. We to it. We're used to it in
busib we used to it in Wellington from time to time.
And I think we're creative and we've we've got really
(09:45):
talented people and we'll be able to knock it out
of the ballpark.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Julie, what do you see? What do you see when
you put your visionary glasses on and look to the future,
What do you see? I mean, we were told hang
on to twenty five or whatever it was was the slogan,
we're halfway through. What do you see at the end
of the year.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
Look, I'm with Simon. I am quietly optimistic. I think
we've a couple of speed bumps, namely Trump in the
road of the recovery.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
To you think that's made a difference. I will talk
about that. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (10:16):
But look, if I from my lens, from the travel
agents sector point of view, this is a great confidence leader. Petra.
Got to give Petra a shout out. So House of Travel,
Wellington City has reopened up bricks and mortar outlet in
Old Bank Arcade. Now that's a great sign of confidence.
(10:37):
You we're really optimistic. We're actually and I'm hearing more
of the travel agents are going to come back to
bricks and mortar. So that's a great sign. Nick I
mentioned it beforehand. I think you. I think events is
going to be one of our solutions. Recently I had
a look at global average hotel rates around the world
(11:00):
and look sadly Wellington was just sitting above Wuhant. However,
the solution is really simple. And what I'm really.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Excited about the event cheaple deer.
Speaker 4 (11:11):
Just slightly deer of the muha, But what's really positive
And again a shout out to Warwick dent from sky Stadium,
he secured Wrexham, he secured two rugby games there. Then
we're leading into wow now having events over weekends. This
is game changing. This actually turns the dial in getting
(11:31):
our Wellington economics going.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
So this is where I.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
And I firmly believe we are the leading city in
New Zealand as the best to deliver events. It's easy,
it's walkable, we've got great infrastructure.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
We just don't get enough of them. Wellington Morning's Business
Panel with Simon Argus and Julie White, Wellington City Council
has just agreed to a twelve percent rates rise from September. Meanwhile,
we also know that Wellington has some of the highest
commercial rates in the country. Simon, I want to start
with you on this because I think that people underestimate
(12:07):
the impact on the scale of what business rates are
in the city compared to anywhere else in the country.
How important a fact is it that our commercial rates,
you know, they're really hurting business.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
It's really important, Nick, and now business has gone from
paying forty four percent of the whole rates FELD to
forty eight percent of the whole rates FELD. So that's
waiting down on businesses, Plus we pay another seventeen million
dollars into a targeted rate fund called the Downtown Levy
that is used to prop up tourism. Look, the thing
about the rates is, first of all, twelve seems very
(12:44):
suspicious to me, to be perfectly honest, when you think
about that. We come down from eeteen nineteen and suddenly
got it reduced. And I think we're going to have
information pretty soon about the council that the finances aren't
as good as they've presented them to be. That's what
I would suspect will happen.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
So you think that this is like a bit of
a cover up.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
It's an election year. I just wonder if it's a
little low for what the reality of what we'll be
paying will be. But the main point about the rates
for businesses, and you're questioned quite right, it puts people
off because they say it's very expensive to try and
set up and do business here, and the costs get
pushed on to you. And remember also we have insurance,
and insurance is another thing that's heavy on business because
(13:23):
if you're own a building or anything like that, there's
a lot of uncertainty. So it's about the choice you're
making around the country for where do I set up?
And we are unattractive in both rates and insurance and
seismic risks. So that is a real challenge for business.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
Julie, You'll be getting your rate bills at home and
you'll know how tough they are. You know, put that
to commercial and times it by.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Forty if for every dollar three points seven times.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Yeah, I mean it's you know, you're just talking about
your bricks and water shops opening. Surely that would be
putting them off.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
Look, I concur with Simon. It's a real concern, especially
around the compounding costs. Look if I reflect and I
reflect on the hospitality sector. Look, the fact is they
can't always keep pushing these costs onto their consumers.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
It's fact.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
No one will pay ten dollars for a cup of coffee, right,
That's fact. So they're going to have to look at
other leavers. And the other leavers are literally reduction in workforce,
reduction in operating hours. Simonari mentioned, We've got some pretty
steep increases in fixed costs like insurance, so you know,
(14:38):
it again becomes an all of our issue. It's a
community issue, I think, and I think the council is
really short sighted in continually looking at the rate payers
of propping the council up.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Answer me this question, Julie, and this is a real fact.
Yesterday afternoon I got an email from a disgruntled customer
saying that they go to one of our family places,
have done for once a month for many years. Suddenly
the musli is not on the menu anymore. The fresh
(15:12):
fruit and eatable floured musli is no longer on the
menu because it would have cost thirty dollars to produce that.
They wanted to know why it was not I.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
Think they should just be completely transparent and actually ask them,
at what point in time would you stop buying it?
Would you buy a bowl of musley for thirty dollars?
Because you've got to have labor costs, you've got insurance costs,
you've got the rate costs. You know, it's not just
even about the musli.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
No, but I'm still saying, but that's reality of the
world that we live in. We're peeing annoying customers because
we can't give them what they want for their value anymore.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
So that's why businesses have to pivot and they either
pull menu items or they cut back on their service options. Yeah,
they have to pivot to survive, right, it's a margin squeeze.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Why our council not sitting back and looking at this
thinking how can we actually help them? Is there something
that the council can do in commercial rates or rates
and help us? I mean it was interesting and I
can't remember the lady's name, and Ethan will get it
for me. The mayor of Masterton, a woman was on
(16:26):
Q and A yesterday. She was magnificent, by the way,
and she said, anybody that's standing for city council and
says they're going to drop the rates or they're going
to keep the rates as what they are is an
absolute liar, don't trust them and don't vote for them.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
Well, I think that. I mean, this is the thing
when you're looking at at what can they do. We've
had years of a council where the majority hasn't been interested,
been indifferent to business. Now that's been a real problem.
You can see that it reflected in the way the
city has evolved under them. That we've got opportunity to
change that. And that's the burg shout out is get
out there and vote, you know, in this election that's
(17:04):
coming out because we can make change, can have a
very different makeup of counselors that support business better. You know,
we've the grand experiments over with all the big spending
and actually when you look at it, the council that
was most spending probably about three times what this current
council was, was the one before it twenty nineteen twenty one.
They piled a whole lot of projects on when the
(17:26):
cash rate was one percent and are now paying the
price for it.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
What do we do though, when we need the council
to spend that money to bring the events like Julie's
just telling us because that's our answer, but they don't
have the money.
Speaker 4 (17:40):
Well, this is why the Minister of Tourism has really
stepped in and put in the business events fun, the
tourism boost. You're right, so attracting business events and the
international visitors. So we need to hustle. We as in
Valentoni and Wellington and z Tourism team you know, and
(18:00):
I know they are out there. What we need to
hustle harder, hustle longer and really make sure that Wellington
is chosen as the preferred venue of preferred location outside
the other cities as simple as that tough.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
That's very I need to go to a break, but
that's a very tough ask knowing that Auckland's really on fire,
really got the population that is on fire, and christ
Church is just suddenly I mean, you know it used
to be Auckland and Wellington would fight it out. Now
we've suddenly got this red and black stripe down down
the road in Canterbury that really are coming at us
(18:37):
as well, Simon.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Absolutely. Look, one of the big things that cities around
the world have found it starts with local pride as well,
and we have to start focusing a little bit on
local pride. First. You're not going to bring people into
the city if everyone's down in the mouth about it.
And cities like Amsterdam, Tokyo and christ Church actually had
a local pride campaign first fostered and then they went
to the world. I think that's really interesting.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Yeah, we have to be We used to be so
proud of our city, didn't we. I Mean we used
to think where the movie can with the coffee capital,
where the beer capital. We're the political capital. We were
everything yet and we love we love being that, you know,
I still.
Speaker 4 (19:18):
Think we're the best city to be able to host events.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
Yep, oh we are, because Julie White and Simon Archis
joined me for the business panel. Let's talk about the world.
Let's go big, Let's go to the world. We've got
a bit positive near the end of that little big
but there it kind of had a bit of a
ceasefire at the moment. I've been following world the world
(19:41):
situation from from my bed. You know, we've seen a
bit of a ceasefire after the US drops and missiles.
I want to know, Judy, what impact is this actually
having on New Zealand. I mean this world. I mean,
I don't think I'm a lot older than you guys,
but I don't think that in my time I've ever
felt more insecure with world peace than I do right now.
(20:06):
How how does that effeit? I mean, you're deal dealing
with travel. Are people traveling?
Speaker 4 (20:11):
Yeah, Look, it's a it's a good question, Nick. Uncertainty
always makes travelers pause. What we have noticed? You know,
there's there's game of two halves here, there's inbound. So
I'll just reflect on the inbound side. So when I
talk about inbound, I'm talking about those international visitors arriving
into New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
So let's say the US.
Speaker 4 (20:32):
There has been definitely some softening from the US. So
that's actually a red flag and it just goes into
that nervousness around travelers. However, they're still coming, but there's
quite a significant softening in the US.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
The outcome of my time, I'm going to say, I mean,
would you go to would you tomorrow go to America?
Speaker 4 (20:56):
Well, we've got people traveling to America. You know, there's
there's no need not to travel, So we don't have
em fat saying otherwise or safe traveler. No one's saying
that it's unsafe to go there.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
It's just but you and I both know that it's
about your gap feeling, you know what I mean. And
if you want to take your kids to Disneyland, would
you go to Disneyland in LA right now? Would you
go to the one in Japan? You know, Simon's laughing
because he knows I'm right.
Speaker 4 (21:26):
Yeah, Well, people will want to go where they want
to go. What we're what we're seeing is that there's
there's still demand there, and.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
There is still demand to travel in holiday in America,
yes there.
Speaker 4 (21:39):
Is and Jap. But you bring up a really salient point.
Japan is hot. It is probably up there with number
one destination out of New Zealand at the moment. You know,
Bali was hot, now Japan is hot.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
When Vietnam Vietnam was this time last year.
Speaker 4 (21:57):
Yeah, that's right. Well, obviously it's winter and people want
to go to a warma, warmer place. But yeah, have.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
You ever heard someone, I mean, this is a really
interesting thing because I've got personal experience on it right now.
Have you ever heard anyone say a bad thing about
a trip to Japan.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
No, They've made a huge effort with tourism and also
of course Julian as you know, part of the attractions
for the first time in a long time. The yen
is actually you know, you're able to spend on the
currency there because the one thing it used to be
is hugely expensive. But it's actually it's good really for
money for New Zealands at the moment. But i'd just
pick up on that briefly from my point of view,
very differently from tariff's. I mean, if you look at tariffs,
(22:35):
it's not in the business world, it's not like a
blanket thing that the book. The tariffs themselves are blanket
numbers like thirty or ten percent or whatever. But if
you talk to some businesses. I know one business was saying,
we're importing very expensive spray paints, prayers that have two
pieces of Chinese sort of things in their makeup, components
(22:57):
in their makeup. And suddenly they're talking to a guy
in Denmark who's the second best in the world to
go and he's saying, well, guess what I can get
view it for thirty percent less than you can get
it in the States these days, you know.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
So what you're trying to say, is this opportunity.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
Out of this opportunity and tell what give you an
example with whittakers, the estates grows no cocoa at all,
so all of a sudden they've got to bring in
chocolate from somewhere, and and Americans love chocolate. And again,
you know, the countries that might have supplied in the
past may have higher tariffs than we have, and all
of a sudden, an opening it occurs. I'm not saying
tariffs are a great thing, but I am saying opportunities.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
What are you hearing from your business people? Are they
nervous about the tariffs?
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Well, I think it's the fact that everybody's experiencing it,
that there's a sort of an acceptance you can't do
much about it. And also that these prices will go up.
And as long as the Americans say that's all we're doing,
that's fine. If it continues on or it's uncertain. As
you say, uncertainty is the worst thing out and I
think that's the thing. The other thing is the price
aren't going to come back once the tariff's come off,
and that's the law of economics.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
You know, it is not ridiculous. You think, oh, well
they dropped the tariffs and the prices come down, but
the price has never come down. I mean, you're going
to be paying the same amount for a coffee now
for the rest of your life. Unfortunately, off not more gosh.
I love this time because we chat with a couple
of movers and shakers from Wellington today. We have Simon
Arcus and Julie White, and Julie's involved and travel now
has had an extensive background hospitality, and obviously Simon Argus,
(24:21):
well he deals with every tiny, little, large small business
in the Wellington region, so he knows exactly what's going on.
Let's talk about retail crime. Do you know about retail crime, Simon,
I mean, we're expecting government and announced this week on
a retail a new plan on retail crime and shoplifting.
What impact does crime have on retail businesses in Wellington,
(24:46):
New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
Well, it's huge. And when I got back here from
Melbourne next five years ago, they were talking about they
come to the point of talking about these smoke cannons
and things which I've never heard of. They're going to
fund people to have them in there in their own shops,
and that wasn't the answer. And I think the thing
with retail is one hundred is about one hundred and
forty thousand crimes New Zealand last year. It if it's unaddressed,
(25:10):
it impacts the whole a whole area in which the
business is operating. The retailers become frightened.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Are they still talk to you about it?
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Definitely? Are? They definitely are. And the one thing I
will say is a beat I think the beat cops
on the street have been a fantastic innovation because and
this is the thing that having those beat cops around,
they know who's good news bad. They know the local
scene much better than anyone else. They get to know
who's causing trouble, and that's a big thing. So retail
I think we'll see this week probably in that source
from the government, they said they're very warm on facial
(25:39):
recognition technology. That's one thing they've talked about. Very hard
to know what's going going to come out exactly, but
let's hope it's supporting those retailers.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Right, Julie, I want to attack you on this one.
We're into the winter school holidays. They started today, first
day of the of the winter holidays, and we're now
our flights and our airports are busiest that they have
been outside Christmas week, So we know that there's a
lot going on. Do you think that Kiwis are getting
a fair price when it comes to travel? Do you
reckon we get looked after?
Speaker 4 (26:07):
Well, we touched on this earlier. It comes down to
capacity issue, Nick, you know the fundamentally that's actually what's
hamstringing us in particular domestic airline connectivity. Right, it is problematic.
Although I'll do a shout out to New Zellan and
I see that they just released some you know, sharp
domestic fares, But that's down the track right here. We are.
(26:29):
You're right, this is a busy period, and we were
talking off air around a bit of a change that
I've noticed. I've noticed the behavior of Kiwi's more and
more actually booking through travel agents. And there's a reason
for that because of you know, we had these unexpected
weather events, but actually they're becoming more than norm so
(26:49):
in peak periods, like we're going to come up with,
you know, for those people who haven't booked through a
travel agent, what's your game plan if there is a
weather disruptor and you have an onward connection or other
hotel bookings and so forth. So why I did have
a look at the IATA before coming on the show,
and IATA is the association that represents all the international airlines,
(27:13):
and there's actually a change. There's a new change that's
come through that I've just noticed is that the value
of the tickets is now coming down. Previously it was
the value of the tickets was really high, you know,
less less volume, but higher tickets. I've now seen a
step change and the value of the tickets is starting
(27:36):
to come down and the volume is going up. So
I think, yes, we have had high prices, but I
can see that that's changing. Those prices are now starting
to come down. But again it comes down to airline
capacity and connectivity.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Can I throw a curveball at both of you and
get your answered?
Speaker 1 (27:53):
It?
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Is it time maybe that the government looked at selling
down near New Zealand. Are they the right owners for
a New Zealand if we are really worried about you know,
domestic travel and you know are we is it? I
mean that we could look at perhaps and get a
better value from a big multinational like a Virgin or
someone buying a New Zealand simon.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
I think you can look at a couple of things.
First of all, selling down the interest is one thing,
and the second is in getting the settings right for
increasing competition. That's how prices change in the airlines, along
with obviously the cost of oil. But the reality is
that there's not a lot of competition and we know
that when competition comes into the country that the price
is dropped. I think the thing about selling down the
(28:37):
in New Zealand is airlines are big boys toys so
to speak, and what happens is that when they fall
over the government is often involved in bailing them out.
So in a funny sort of way. The government's always
on the hook for you in New Zealand, whether they
sail down or not, in my view, because if the
national carrier falls over, there's only one place you go
to to prop it up.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
I think this is an all of our answer. However,
I will say, be careful what you wish for. When
we came out or through COVID, we had freight issues,
so people forget about airlines and the importance of bringing
in cargo goot, and you know it was really tough
(29:18):
to get products here if you remember, we're shipping issues
and so what we were left with were freighting. And
so I do do applaud the government for stepping in
because where would we have been left without the airline
bringing in that cargo.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
It was last resort, right.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
I've got really want to quickly ask you this question
because of running out of time, and I want to
find out where you're going to take your special guests.
But local body elections are only four months away, right
either of you really excited and think, gosh, this is
going to be good. I know who I want, I
know who I'm going to vote for. Judy.
Speaker 4 (29:55):
Look, I think what's positive is that we've got a number.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
A number of people have put in the datas.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
Yeah, we know who the date is. But I love
the fact it's going to be contested. You know, we've
got Ray who's not aligned to a political party so
doesn't have the toe the political line. You've got Andrew
Little who is really seasoned politicians so he knows the mechanics.
Then you've got business leaders, et cetera, et cetera. But
(30:21):
my shout out is, we can't go backwards. You can't
look back. We can't keep doing the same old, same
old timon mentioned. We've got some new leadership coming in.
I think the future is bright, but the mayor's need.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
To go very quickly because I need to go to
a break when you're thinking.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
Look, it's a contest of ideas. We've got people are
passionately stepping up for the city again, and that's great
to see. I think. I think that we've got the
debating big things and they're coming out in the media
and that's the stuff we need to do. And quite frankly,
whoever in that group takes over, we've got grown up
back in the room. Who's for mayre?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Okay, here we go right, Oh, Okay, This is the
part of the show that I really enjoy the most
when I have my guests and because I want to
know what they're going to do. Simon, you're going to
go first because you've done this before. You're going to
pick up someone extremely special, someone that you know. The
hair on the back of your neck is raising when
you're driving to the airport because you so want to
see them. What are you going to do with them
when you pick them up?
Speaker 3 (31:14):
Well, it's a two part answer, and the first thing
I'd say to them, And this is something for people
who are wanting to feel a bit positive about the city,
because that's been the theme today kind of is have
a look at the Reddit. And I feel very trendy
saying Reddit that I know what it is. Have a
look at the Wellington read it. It is such a
positive thing about the city of people who are saying
I'm miss living there. I want to come back. People say,
what a wonderful place to take photos in the morning.
(31:36):
So I'd say, have a look at that, because this
is the kind of city you're coming to. Then we
drive from the airport straight up to Mount vickv a
good look and dip down into that wonderful little section
because we've got these little sections of the city at
the moment, at the bottom of Marshbanks Street, where you've
got places like or t Yeah, you've got Capital, You've
got tom Boy Tom I mean, how cool is that
little body? And that's that's where I'd probably just cruise
(31:57):
around with him.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
That's a very very good idea, Julia, come on, hit
us with something innovative.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
Oh no, well, look, Wellington know this best.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
You know you can't.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
I picked them up. You're picking up in Australian that's
never been here before, that's really close to you, and
you're going to say, now you know why I want
to live here.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
Well, look, I've got to do a couple of parts
as well. So I'd hook around to Lyle Bay because
there's nothing better than watching planes come in and the
sea roaring in. It's a really good There's a couple
of nice places. If you haven't heard Spruce Bruce the
Surf Club, you know, we'd start there and then definitely
got to take them to Papa because it is awesome.
(32:33):
I think we forget about how.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
Good we forget we do we do forget about it.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
And then of course they'd be here for a while,
because that is amazing. You know, we should be so
proud of that, the fact that you know, we've been
able to retain it. It is internationally recognized. That's that's
what I would be doing.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
Julie White, Simon Argus, thank you for taking your time off.
Loved having you in the studio. It's very good to
have some positive welling Tinis and the show.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on radio.
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk said by Mondays Mean Business. It's the
business panel on Wellington Mornings with Quinovic Property Management, a
better rental experience for all. Visit Quinovic dot co dot inshead.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Joining us for the business panel this week is a
Central Wellington Chamber of Commerce CEO Simon Arcis, Good morning, Simon,
good to be back here. Gosh, it feels great to
be back. And Travel Agents Association CEO Julie White Morning.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Julie, Good morning, Nick. Nice to see you.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
We've changed from hospital to travel. Don't want to get
him in the bar, want to get about and travel
and get him somewhere.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Else traveling to the bars.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
So what made you? What? What was the change? Why
is the change?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Oh? Look, I took some time out and my mum
was a little bit sick and she's based in Australia,
so I spent some time with mum and I feel
really lucky on that she had Alzheimer's and I was
able to be there for a passing. So then it
was time to jump back in and this opportunity came
(01:26):
up and it's still in my wheelhouse and it's really
great to be part of the Travel Agent's Association. And
you know, I'm sure over the discussions this morning, what's
really exciting to share is that our industry, like you know,
don't want to show off or anything, but we're up
you know last year year on year, we're up thirty
two percent. And yeah, so there's actually some positivity out there.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
I do want to bring that up because I know
that the government's I mean, in my sec time, I've
been reading a lot and the government wants there to
be more international tourism. They're still the saying that we're
short and they wanted to be bigger, but therese issues
with that there.
Speaker 4 (02:07):
Well, look, I need to do a shout out to
the Minister for Tourism Hospitality because she is certainly prioritizing
the tourism and you know, we really all need to
lean in because it's a shared problem, so we need
a shared solution. So the Tourism Growth Roadmap, which she
recently released, twenty million dollars of that is to be
(02:28):
spent in the short term on growing demand. Nick. Now,
it's been really specific, it's been really specific on that.
So it's twofold where I see Valentonians are going to
benefit from that. It's business events. We've got this amazing
facility down the road here Taquina, So business events is
right down our wheelhouse. And so when we actually have
business events in town, you know, hospo guys actually benefit
(02:52):
from it, so do the retailer. So everyone wins when
there's events. She's also going to dedicate I think it's
three million dollars to rto funding to attract especially the Aussies.
And look, I went to the Pulse game last night.
Cut us to the Pulse for taking out the win.
How good is this place with events? So absolutely the
(03:14):
Aussie should come over. It's a really great city. And
I'm feeling really positive that the time, the tide is changing.
So you know, I'm all for the tourism roadmap. I'm
feeling quietly optimistic. But there's a gap to gold and
we've got a lot to do.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Simon, what are your people telling you give us? Give
us a little bit of a state of Wellington. I mean,
I love doing this with you because you're dealing with
all the business people all over Wellington, which is our soul.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
You're right now. Look, it's the themes that you pull
out from those discussions and the themes that come out
from business is what a lot of people relate to,
that idea of bumping along the bottom, like it feels
like there's no further down to go, and it feels
like there's sort of two steps forward one step back
in terms of there can see a trajectory improvement in
the economy.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
See the light at the end of the tunnel.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
They're beginning to they're beginning to. But I'll give you
a really good example of two steps forward, one step back.
You've had business confidences lifted generally, and there's and there's
good feelings a hit about you know, changes at the council,
but equally our our services and our manufacturing measurements for
the country went backwards in June and so and so.
Then you apply that to one can you say, you know,
we've we've been through some tough times. And what I'd
(04:22):
say is you've got some really resilient businesses here because
they've made it through. You know, if you haven't. If
you've made it through by now, you've been tested in
just about every way. And look, I think Wellington business
is at a point that it's saying we have to
get behind change and exciting new change because dwelling on
the past, not putting a line under the under the past,
is going to be a problem.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
If you were me sitting here and tomorrow you I
was looking at the Finance Minister Nichola Willis, which I am.
She's coming into the studio. What's the one question that
you had put to her that you think has not
been fulfilled for your clients.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Well, a really good example that we had the Canberra
Chamber over here visiting the other day. They brought about
eight tech people in about twelve other business people and
they asked me a question, but what are the incentives
for us to joint venture with businesses here in Wellington
or in New Zealand And the answer was not, there
aren't really any, you know, and there are other countries
do these things. So in the pullback on spending, you know,
(05:21):
my question would be, have do you think that you
may have neglected this issue of incentives for business because
just helps to build that foundation to get a business going,
to boost it and then then business will look after itself.
And that's where I think we've got to gap.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
What would your question be to the to the Minister
of Finance. Finance Minister you, My.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Question would be very similar to Simon. So if we
have a look at one of the biggest issues in
our industry, that's the travel agent's sector, and we earlier
spoke about attracting more inbound visitors here, we have flight
capacity issues. So the Aussies are doing a really good
(06:03):
job and they've got incentive money to a train airlines
and that's the key. If we want to grow visitor numbers,
we need more seats available on airlines. The only way
we're going to do that is if we have more
airlines coming to New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
What about them investing more money into their New Zealand
the major shareholder of the in New Zealand. You're right,
capacity as everyone sees the same thing we're not getting.
I mean, you know, we are a small nation at
the bottom of the world, so surely having our own
airline with more capacity would be appealing.
Speaker 4 (06:38):
I think it's just not as simple as that. The
fact look, Air New Zealand's not alone, but it is
our national carrier and they've got quite a substantial number
of their fleet in the garage. It's they're basically offline
and no matter how much money the government puts towards that.
It won't help that. You know, it's a Rolls Royce
issue and we've got a we've got a ticket and
(07:01):
we're waiting our turn until that's turned around. But I
think that's really a question for air New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
So you think it's as simple as getting more airlines
coming into New Zealand.
Speaker 4 (07:11):
Yeah, we need to be attractive. And again this is
for others to answer, like good people from Barnes and
New Zealand airports is around. What will that take? There is,
as I said, incentive money. Like the Queenslanders have a
really good model. They have a co fund approach, so
(07:31):
government and industry will co fund the incentive to attract
new airlines coming here. That's exactly what we need. So
you know, I believe it's a shared problem, a shared
solution approach, and it's really hard to compete against when
you've actually got that incentive money.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
When we're talking about the state of Wellington, which we're
starting to do it, you know, how we're starting the show.
Is there Simon, I'll come to you on this and
is there stories that make you excited? Is the stories
out there? You say yourself. You know, this is the
start of it. I kind of get that feeling that
we're almost about to go again.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
I think there are some great stories from change in
city leadership. You've got a change of mayor this year,
you've got a change of the head of the City Council,
and you've also got a change of the head of
the Economic Development Agency. So you've got three fresh faces
looking at the city differently, and that's a huge opportunity
after a number of years.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Have you met the new CEO of I.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Have yes, several times, yes, And I think he's You're
lucky as of me he has been Yeah, No, he
doesn't want to talk to me. He's a very good operator,
and I think I have confidence in him as far
as I've known him. And look, we got to get
behind him and try and be supportive and make change.
But another thing, Nick, I was thinking about Civic Square recently.
(08:52):
That's going to have a couple of things next year
it opens and also in the town hall opens after
a long period, but also the city Council moves and
right next door to it, you've got another thirteen or
fourteen hundred people in that area in the city, which
has been so neglected and so sort of downtrodden, and
that's going to liven up. So if we think about
what the future looks like in just a matter of months,
(09:13):
there are some great stories for the city to come.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Okay, do you believe that we will be in a
position to actually, I don't know, get something out of it.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
I do, I do, and I think we need. I
think that's all about the fresh eyes on the city
and what we're planning to do. What we have is
a problem of profligate spending for years, so that's made
the budget pretty tight. But that is just then about
making some smart and rational decisions and doing it on
a shoestring. We to it. We're used to it in
busib we used to it in Wellington from time to time.
And I think we're creative and we've we've got really
(09:45):
talented people and we'll be able to knock it out
of the ballpark.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Julie, what do you see? What do you see when
you put your visionary glasses on and look to the future,
What do you see? I mean, we were told hang
on to twenty five or whatever it was was the slogan,
we're halfway through. What do you see at the end
of the year.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
Look, I'm with Simon. I am quietly optimistic. I think
we've a couple of speed bumps, namely Trump in the
road of the recovery.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
To you think that's made a difference. I will talk
about that. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (10:16):
But look, if I from my lens, from the travel
agents sector point of view, this is a great confidence leader. Petra.
Got to give Petra a shout out. So House of Travel,
Wellington City has reopened up bricks and mortar outlet in
Old Bank Arcade. Now that's a great sign of confidence.
(10:37):
You we're really optimistic. We're actually and I'm hearing more
of the travel agents are going to come back to
bricks and mortar. So that's a great sign. Nick I
mentioned it beforehand. I think you. I think events is
going to be one of our solutions. Recently I had
a look at global average hotel rates around the world
(11:00):
and look sadly Wellington was just sitting above Wuhant. However,
the solution is really simple. And what I'm really.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Excited about the event cheaple deer.
Speaker 4 (11:11):
Just slightly deer of the muha, But what's really positive
And again a shout out to Warwick dent from sky Stadium,
he secured Wrexham, he secured two rugby games there. Then
we're leading into wow now having events over weekends. This
is game changing. This actually turns the dial in getting
(11:31):
our Wellington economics going.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
So this is where I.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
And I firmly believe we are the leading city in
New Zealand as the best to deliver events. It's easy,
it's walkable, we've got great infrastructure.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
We just don't get enough of them. Wellington Morning's Business
Panel with Simon Argus and Julie White, Wellington City Council
has just agreed to a twelve percent rates rise from September. Meanwhile,
we also know that Wellington has some of the highest
commercial rates in the country. Simon, I want to start
with you on this because I think that people underestimate
(12:07):
the impact on the scale of what business rates are
in the city compared to anywhere else in the country.
How important a fact is it that our commercial rates,
you know, they're really hurting business.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
It's really important, Nick, and now business has gone from
paying forty four percent of the whole rates FELD to
forty eight percent of the whole rates FELD. So that's
waiting down on businesses, Plus we pay another seventeen million
dollars into a targeted rate fund called the Downtown Levy
that is used to prop up tourism. Look, the thing
about the rates is, first of all, twelve seems very
(12:44):
suspicious to me, to be perfectly honest, when you think
about that. We come down from eeteen nineteen and suddenly
got it reduced. And I think we're going to have
information pretty soon about the council that the finances aren't
as good as they've presented them to be. That's what
I would suspect will happen.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
So you think that this is like a bit of
a cover up.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
It's an election year. I just wonder if it's a
little low for what the reality of what we'll be
paying will be. But the main point about the rates
for businesses, and you're questioned quite right, it puts people
off because they say it's very expensive to try and
set up and do business here, and the costs get
pushed on to you. And remember also we have insurance,
and insurance is another thing that's heavy on business because
(13:23):
if you're own a building or anything like that, there's
a lot of uncertainty. So it's about the choice you're
making around the country for where do I set up?
And we are unattractive in both rates and insurance and
seismic risks. So that is a real challenge for business.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
Julie, You'll be getting your rate bills at home and
you'll know how tough they are. You know, put that
to commercial and times it by.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Forty if for every dollar three points seven times.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Yeah, I mean it's you know, you're just talking about
your bricks and water shops opening. Surely that would be
putting them off.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
Look, I concur with Simon. It's a real concern, especially
around the compounding costs. Look if I reflect and I
reflect on the hospitality sector. Look, the fact is they
can't always keep pushing these costs onto their consumers.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
It's fact.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
No one will pay ten dollars for a cup of coffee, right,
That's fact. So they're going to have to look at
other leavers. And the other leavers are literally reduction in workforce,
reduction in operating hours. Simonari mentioned, We've got some pretty
steep increases in fixed costs like insurance, so you know,
(14:38):
it again becomes an all of our issue. It's a
community issue, I think, and I think the council is
really short sighted in continually looking at the rate payers
of propping the council up.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Answer me this question, Julie, and this is a real fact.
Yesterday afternoon I got an email from a disgruntled customer
saying that they go to one of our family places,
have done for once a month for many years. Suddenly
the musli is not on the menu anymore. The fresh
(15:12):
fruit and eatable floured musli is no longer on the
menu because it would have cost thirty dollars to produce that.
They wanted to know why it was not I.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
Think they should just be completely transparent and actually ask them,
at what point in time would you stop buying it?
Would you buy a bowl of musley for thirty dollars?
Because you've got to have labor costs, you've got insurance costs,
you've got the rate costs. You know, it's not just
even about the musli.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
No, but I'm still saying, but that's reality of the
world that we live in. We're peeing annoying customers because
we can't give them what they want for their value anymore.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
So that's why businesses have to pivot and they either
pull menu items or they cut back on their service options. Yeah,
they have to pivot to survive, right, it's a margin squeeze.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Why our council not sitting back and looking at this
thinking how can we actually help them? Is there something
that the council can do in commercial rates or rates
and help us? I mean it was interesting and I
can't remember the lady's name, and Ethan will get it
for me. The mayor of Masterton, a woman was on
(16:26):
Q and A yesterday. She was magnificent, by the way,
and she said, anybody that's standing for city council and
says they're going to drop the rates or they're going
to keep the rates as what they are is an
absolute liar, don't trust them and don't vote for them.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
Well, I think that. I mean, this is the thing
when you're looking at at what can they do. We've
had years of a council where the majority hasn't been interested,
been indifferent to business. Now that's been a real problem.
You can see that it reflected in the way the
city has evolved under them. That we've got opportunity to
change that. And that's the burg shout out is get
out there and vote, you know, in this election that's
(17:04):
coming out because we can make change, can have a
very different makeup of counselors that support business better. You know,
we've the grand experiments over with all the big spending
and actually when you look at it, the council that
was most spending probably about three times what this current
council was, was the one before it twenty nineteen twenty one.
They piled a whole lot of projects on when the
(17:26):
cash rate was one percent and are now paying the
price for it.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
What do we do though, when we need the council
to spend that money to bring the events like Julie's
just telling us because that's our answer, but they don't
have the money.
Speaker 4 (17:40):
Well, this is why the Minister of Tourism has really
stepped in and put in the business events fun, the
tourism boost. You're right, so attracting business events and the
international visitors. So we need to hustle. We as in
Valentoni and Wellington and z Tourism team you know, and
(18:00):
I know they are out there. What we need to
hustle harder, hustle longer and really make sure that Wellington
is chosen as the preferred venue of preferred location outside
the other cities as simple as that tough.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
That's very I need to go to a break, but
that's a very tough ask knowing that Auckland's really on fire,
really got the population that is on fire, and christ
Church is just suddenly I mean, you know it used
to be Auckland and Wellington would fight it out. Now
we've suddenly got this red and black stripe down down
the road in Canterbury that really are coming at us
(18:37):
as well, Simon.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Absolutely. Look, one of the big things that cities around
the world have found it starts with local pride as well,
and we have to start focusing a little bit on
local pride. First. You're not going to bring people into
the city if everyone's down in the mouth about it.
And cities like Amsterdam, Tokyo and christ Church actually had
a local pride campaign first fostered and then they went
to the world. I think that's really interesting.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Yeah, we have to be We used to be so
proud of our city, didn't we. I Mean we used
to think where the movie can with the coffee capital,
where the beer capital. We're the political capital. We were
everything yet and we love we love being that, you know,
I still.
Speaker 4 (19:18):
Think we're the best city to be able to host events.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
Yep, oh we are, because Julie White and Simon Archis
joined me for the business panel. Let's talk about the world.
Let's go big, Let's go to the world. We've got
a bit positive near the end of that little big
but there it kind of had a bit of a
ceasefire at the moment. I've been following world the world
(19:41):
situation from from my bed. You know, we've seen a
bit of a ceasefire after the US drops and missiles.
I want to know, Judy, what impact is this actually
having on New Zealand. I mean this world. I mean,
I don't think I'm a lot older than you guys,
but I don't think that in my time I've ever
felt more insecure with world peace than I do right now.
(20:06):
How how does that effeit? I mean, you're deal dealing
with travel. Are people traveling?
Speaker 4 (20:11):
Yeah, Look, it's a it's a good question, Nick. Uncertainty
always makes travelers pause. What we have noticed? You know,
there's there's game of two halves here, there's inbound. So
I'll just reflect on the inbound side. So when I
talk about inbound, I'm talking about those international visitors arriving
into New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
So let's say the US.
Speaker 4 (20:32):
There has been definitely some softening from the US. So
that's actually a red flag and it just goes into
that nervousness around travelers. However, they're still coming, but there's
quite a significant softening in the US.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
The outcome of my time, I'm going to say, I mean,
would you go to would you tomorrow go to America?
Speaker 4 (20:56):
Well, we've got people traveling to America. You know, there's
there's no need not to travel, So we don't have
em fat saying otherwise or safe traveler. No one's saying
that it's unsafe to go there.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
It's just but you and I both know that it's
about your gap feeling, you know what I mean. And
if you want to take your kids to Disneyland, would
you go to Disneyland in LA right now? Would you
go to the one in Japan? You know, Simon's laughing
because he knows I'm right.
Speaker 4 (21:26):
Yeah, Well, people will want to go where they want
to go. What we're what we're seeing is that there's
there's still demand there, and.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
There is still demand to travel in holiday in America,
yes there.
Speaker 4 (21:39):
Is and Jap. But you bring up a really salient point.
Japan is hot. It is probably up there with number
one destination out of New Zealand at the moment. You know,
Bali was hot, now Japan is hot.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
When Vietnam Vietnam was this time last year.
Speaker 4 (21:57):
Yeah, that's right. Well, obviously it's winter and people want
to go to a warma, warmer place. But yeah, have.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
You ever heard someone, I mean, this is a really
interesting thing because I've got personal experience on it right now.
Have you ever heard anyone say a bad thing about
a trip to Japan.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
No, They've made a huge effort with tourism and also
of course Julian as you know, part of the attractions
for the first time in a long time. The yen
is actually you know, you're able to spend on the
currency there because the one thing it used to be
is hugely expensive. But it's actually it's good really for
money for New Zealands at the moment. But i'd just
pick up on that briefly from my point of view,
very differently from tariff's. I mean, if you look at tariffs,
(22:35):
it's not in the business world, it's not like a
blanket thing that the book. The tariffs themselves are blanket
numbers like thirty or ten percent or whatever. But if
you talk to some businesses. I know one business was saying,
we're importing very expensive spray paints, prayers that have two
pieces of Chinese sort of things in their makeup, components
(22:57):
in their makeup. And suddenly they're talking to a guy
in Denmark who's the second best in the world to
go and he's saying, well, guess what I can get
view it for thirty percent less than you can get
it in the States these days, you know.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
So what you're trying to say, is this opportunity.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
Out of this opportunity and tell what give you an
example with whittakers, the estates grows no cocoa at all,
so all of a sudden they've got to bring in
chocolate from somewhere, and and Americans love chocolate. And again,
you know, the countries that might have supplied in the
past may have higher tariffs than we have, and all
of a sudden, an opening it occurs. I'm not saying
tariffs are a great thing, but I am saying opportunities.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
What are you hearing from your business people? Are they
nervous about the tariffs?
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Well, I think it's the fact that everybody's experiencing it,
that there's a sort of an acceptance you can't do
much about it. And also that these prices will go up.
And as long as the Americans say that's all we're doing,
that's fine. If it continues on or it's uncertain. As
you say, uncertainty is the worst thing out and I
think that's the thing. The other thing is the price
aren't going to come back once the tariff's come off,
and that's the law of economics.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
You know, it is not ridiculous. You think, oh, well
they dropped the tariffs and the prices come down, but
the price has never come down. I mean, you're going
to be paying the same amount for a coffee now
for the rest of your life. Unfortunately, off not more gosh.
I love this time because we chat with a couple
of movers and shakers from Wellington today. We have Simon
Arcus and Julie White, and Julie's involved and travel now
has had an extensive background hospitality, and obviously Simon Argus,
(24:21):
well he deals with every tiny, little, large small business
in the Wellington region, so he knows exactly what's going on.
Let's talk about retail crime. Do you know about retail crime, Simon,
I mean, we're expecting government and announced this week on
a retail a new plan on retail crime and shoplifting.
What impact does crime have on retail businesses in Wellington,
(24:46):
New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
Well, it's huge. And when I got back here from
Melbourne next five years ago, they were talking about they
come to the point of talking about these smoke cannons
and things which I've never heard of. They're going to
fund people to have them in there in their own shops,
and that wasn't the answer. And I think the thing
with retail is one hundred is about one hundred and
forty thousand crimes New Zealand last year. It if it's unaddressed,
(25:10):
it impacts the whole a whole area in which the
business is operating. The retailers become frightened.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Are they still talk to you about it?
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Definitely? Are? They definitely are. And the one thing I
will say is a beat I think the beat cops
on the street have been a fantastic innovation because and
this is the thing that having those beat cops around,
they know who's good news bad. They know the local
scene much better than anyone else. They get to know
who's causing trouble, and that's a big thing. So retail
I think we'll see this week probably in that source
from the government, they said they're very warm on facial
(25:39):
recognition technology. That's one thing they've talked about. Very hard
to know what's going going to come out exactly, but
let's hope it's supporting those retailers.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Right, Julie, I want to attack you on this one.
We're into the winter school holidays. They started today, first
day of the of the winter holidays, and we're now
our flights and our airports are busiest that they have
been outside Christmas week, So we know that there's a
lot going on. Do you think that Kiwis are getting
a fair price when it comes to travel? Do you
reckon we get looked after?
Speaker 4 (26:07):
Well, we touched on this earlier. It comes down to
capacity issue, Nick, you know the fundamentally that's actually what's
hamstringing us in particular domestic airline connectivity. Right, it is problematic.
Although I'll do a shout out to New Zellan and
I see that they just released some you know, sharp
domestic fares, But that's down the track right here. We are.
(26:29):
You're right, this is a busy period, and we were
talking off air around a bit of a change that
I've noticed. I've noticed the behavior of Kiwi's more and
more actually booking through travel agents. And there's a reason
for that because of you know, we had these unexpected
weather events, but actually they're becoming more than norm so
(26:49):
in peak periods, like we're going to come up with,
you know, for those people who haven't booked through a
travel agent, what's your game plan if there is a
weather disruptor and you have an onward connection or other
hotel bookings and so forth. So why I did have
a look at the IATA before coming on the show,
and IATA is the association that represents all the international airlines,
(27:13):
and there's actually a change. There's a new change that's
come through that I've just noticed is that the value
of the tickets is now coming down. Previously it was
the value of the tickets was really high, you know,
less less volume, but higher tickets. I've now seen a
step change and the value of the tickets is starting
(27:36):
to come down and the volume is going up. So
I think, yes, we have had high prices, but I
can see that that's changing. Those prices are now starting
to come down. But again it comes down to airline
capacity and connectivity.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Can I throw a curveball at both of you and
get your answered?
Speaker 1 (27:53):
It?
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Is it time maybe that the government looked at selling
down near New Zealand. Are they the right owners for
a New Zealand if we are really worried about you know,
domestic travel and you know are we is it? I
mean that we could look at perhaps and get a
better value from a big multinational like a Virgin or
someone buying a New Zealand simon.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
I think you can look at a couple of things.
First of all, selling down the interest is one thing,
and the second is in getting the settings right for
increasing competition. That's how prices change in the airlines, along
with obviously the cost of oil. But the reality is
that there's not a lot of competition and we know
that when competition comes into the country that the price
is dropped. I think the thing about selling down the
(28:37):
in New Zealand is airlines are big boys toys so
to speak, and what happens is that when they fall
over the government is often involved in bailing them out.
So in a funny sort of way. The government's always
on the hook for you in New Zealand, whether they
sail down or not, in my view, because if the
national carrier falls over, there's only one place you go
to to prop it up.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
I think this is an all of our answer. However,
I will say, be careful what you wish for. When
we came out or through COVID, we had freight issues,
so people forget about airlines and the importance of bringing
in cargo goot, and you know it was really tough
(29:18):
to get products here if you remember, we're shipping issues
and so what we were left with were freighting. And
so I do do applaud the government for stepping in
because where would we have been left without the airline
bringing in that cargo.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
It was last resort, right.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
I've got really want to quickly ask you this question
because of running out of time, and I want to
find out where you're going to take your special guests.
But local body elections are only four months away, right
either of you really excited and think, gosh, this is
going to be good. I know who I want, I
know who I'm going to vote for. Judy.
Speaker 4 (29:55):
Look, I think what's positive is that we've got a number.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
A number of people have put in the datas.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
Yeah, we know who the date is. But I love
the fact it's going to be contested. You know, we've
got Ray who's not aligned to a political party so
doesn't have the toe the political line. You've got Andrew
Little who is really seasoned politicians so he knows the mechanics.
Then you've got business leaders, et cetera, et cetera. But
(30:21):
my shout out is, we can't go backwards. You can't
look back. We can't keep doing the same old, same
old timon mentioned. We've got some new leadership coming in.
I think the future is bright, but the mayor's need.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
To go very quickly because I need to go to
a break when you're thinking.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
Look, it's a contest of ideas. We've got people are
passionately stepping up for the city again, and that's great
to see. I think. I think that we've got the
debating big things and they're coming out in the media
and that's the stuff we need to do. And quite frankly,
whoever in that group takes over, we've got grown up
back in the room. Who's for mayre?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Okay, here we go right, Oh, Okay, This is the
part of the show that I really enjoy the most
when I have my guests and because I want to
know what they're going to do. Simon, you're going to
go first because you've done this before. You're going to
pick up someone extremely special, someone that you know. The
hair on the back of your neck is raising when
you're driving to the airport because you so want to
see them. What are you going to do with them
when you pick them up?
Speaker 3 (31:14):
Well, it's a two part answer, and the first thing
I'd say to them, And this is something for people
who are wanting to feel a bit positive about the city,
because that's been the theme today kind of is have
a look at the Reddit. And I feel very trendy
saying Reddit that I know what it is. Have a
look at the Wellington read it. It is such a
positive thing about the city of people who are saying
I'm miss living there. I want to come back. People say,
what a wonderful place to take photos in the morning.
(31:36):
So I'd say, have a look at that, because this
is the kind of city you're coming to. Then we
drive from the airport straight up to Mount vickv a
good look and dip down into that wonderful little section
because we've got these little sections of the city at
the moment, at the bottom of Marshbanks Street, where you've
got places like or t Yeah, you've got Capital, You've
got tom Boy Tom I mean, how cool is that
little body? And that's that's where I'd probably just cruise
(31:57):
around with him.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
That's a very very good idea, Julia, come on, hit
us with something innovative.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
Oh no, well, look, Wellington know this best.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
You know you can't.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
I picked them up. You're picking up in Australian that's
never been here before, that's really close to you, and
you're going to say, now you know why I want
to live here.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
Well, look, I've got to do a couple of parts
as well. So I'd hook around to Lyle Bay because
there's nothing better than watching planes come in and the
sea roaring in. It's a really good There's a couple
of nice places. If you haven't heard Spruce Bruce the
Surf Club, you know, we'd start there and then definitely
got to take them to Papa because it is awesome.
(32:33):
I think we forget about how.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
Good we forget we do we do forget about it.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
And then of course they'd be here for a while,
because that is amazing. You know, we should be so
proud of that, the fact that you know, we've been
able to retain it. It is internationally recognized. That's that's
what I would be doing.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
Julie White, Simon Argus, thank you for taking your time off.
Loved having you in the studio. It's very good to
have some positive welling Tinis and the show.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on radio.
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