Lindsay McKenzie: Wellington City Council's Crown Observer on the council's improvement

Wellington City Council’s Crown Observer believes Tory Whanau made the right move in deciding not to run for Mayor again. 

Lindsay McKenzie has ended his six month stint after being brought in by the Government last year to be its eyes and ears as the council failed to deliver a long-term plan.  

His final report suggests the capital is facing the same problems as the rest of the country but is steadily progressing. 

McKenzie says the council has effectively solved the problems that were the catalyst for the Ministerial intervention, and the level of cooperation and consideration for each other's views and preferences has increased. 

When it comes to Whanau’s leadership, he told Nick Mills that it’s a tough ask for somebody to come into a mayoral role with no local government experience, especially in the capital city, and it showed. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
Said b Joining us now is Lindsay Mackenzie, who has
just finished up as the government appointed Crown Observer to
Wellington's City Council.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
Good morning, Lindsay, Good morning, carry this morning.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
I'm great, thank you, Nice to meet you. Finally, thank you.
Nobody comes to Wellington for that long period of time
without meeting me. How did you get away with it?

Speaker 3 (00:31):
Ah? I think I was ke busy on the terrorists.
To be honest, mack.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
I would have walked up to terraces to meet you.

Speaker 3 (00:39):
Sorry you didn't.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
Well, I'm sorry that you wouldn't meet me.

Speaker 3 (00:43):
No the problem. We're talking now, let's.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
Do okay, all right? How has the Wellington City Council
improved since you started in November?

Speaker 3 (00:53):
Significantly? I think they are point that I need to
emphasize at the outsetters that they have effectively solved the
problems that were the capitalist for the ministerial intervention. So
that's the key, and I've noted that in my final report.
The other thing that's happened at least than the council
chamber the level of cooperation and consideration for each other's

(01:18):
views and preferences as stepped up, So on those two
counts significant change.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
Why were you not more transparent when you were in
the role so us the people of Wellington knew what
was going on.

Speaker 3 (01:30):
I was as transparent as it possibly could without being
completely see through Nick. My reports to the Minister were
all made public quite soon after they were submitted. There
were seven of those, including the final report which has
been on the DIA's website for a few days now,
and the reports that I provided to Wellington City were

(01:53):
also proactively released on their website. So I don't know
that there's much more that I could do. My accountability
was to the minister, not to the minister, not to
the Wellington The rate pader directly were paying you.

Speaker 2 (02:07):
We we me and my fellow rate payers were paying
you to do a job. Surely, if we were paying
we should have known what was going on.

Speaker 3 (02:16):
You did know? Did you not read?

Speaker 2 (02:18):
I definitely read them, but there was nothing there that
actually told me that how you were improving anything.

Speaker 3 (02:24):
I think the evidence for that was manifest both in
the reports and in the way that the conduct of
the council was reported in the wider media. I think
the evidence was there to see and certainly the evidence
is there to see in terms of the decisions that
were taken at the end of journey.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
Can I just ask you, Lindsey, Can I just ask you?
I just want to go back to when you first
were given the job? What was what were your major concerns?
I mean, I mean it was you, you can you
would have known exactly what was happening even though you
lived in Nelson, I mean the whole in New Zealand.
We're understanding what was going on with the Wellington City Council.
What was your major concern when you took the job.

Speaker 3 (03:07):
I think the major concern was understanding the dynamic, and
that dynamic had three dimensions, not really there was a
people dynamic. There's the politics, which is you know, a
feature I guess of Warrington City Council life and it
has been for many years. And then there were the

(03:28):
processes that they use. So once they kind of got
my head around those, I could work out how I
get add a bit a value. That's probably a few weeks,
four to six tweets. And subsequent to Christmas, I think
we started to move the dial a but and some
advice that I offered was accepted, and ultimately the council
was able to move through some really challenging decisions and

(03:51):
processes to get their rates struck, their Amendo LTP adopted
and their annual plan over line.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
Lindsey, can I ask you if those dynamics were unusual
in that council.

Speaker 3 (04:03):
I think they're more evident in Willington and in other places.
It's not uniquely a Wearrington thing, although the history shows
that parliamentary party politics have played a role in a
capital city, not unsurprisingly to a greater extent than another place.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
Lindsey, I mean, as an observer, do you think there
is a role and I'm really interested in yourself, your
own interest on this one for party politics around a
council table anywhere.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:40):
I did a piece on that, Nick, and I was
kind of ambivalent on it. I can see pluses and minuses.
The plus is that if a person stands on a
parliamentary party endorsed tack out, there's a good probability that
they will follow the values and the principles and ideologies

(05:03):
of that political party. So you've got to degree your
st is that the position they're going to take where
it can come on stuck is if the influence of
that party is so strong that the elected members' ability
to function independently as an elected member and a local
authority has compromised. So that's that's where the adverse effects

(05:26):
of kind of whipping can come into play. So there
is pluster minus.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
How strongly did you feel that the minister who whether
it was Simmey and Brown or Simon wats because you
dealt with them both, How seriously do you feel that
they thought the issue was with Wellington? Did they think
it was just a little tweak and you'd come in
there and calm things down, exactly what actually happened? Or

(05:52):
did they want more?

Speaker 3 (05:54):
Now? I think they got what they asked for. I
certainly hope from my perspectives that they did. And if
the endgame was to ensure that Wellington solved the problems
that with a catalyst for the intervention, they've got that. Also.
I think one of the things that people forget is
that the minister's powers are actually to assist in intervening. Right,

(06:17):
there's a lot of emphasis on the intervention, but as
a risk mitigation strategy, I think it was timely and
it paid off.

Speaker 2 (06:28):
I would love your opinion on this. I probably aren't
going to get the answer that that that I want,
but I'm going to ask it. Tory Farno became mayor
on campaigning that she was going to be an effective
and communal leader, but a very good leader. Do you
think she is.

Speaker 3 (06:48):
I'm not going to comment on Mayor Faro's personal leadership attributes.
I think what happened it well at Wellington City Council
is attributable to multiple factors. I think, yeah, absolutely honest.

(07:09):
It's a tough ask for somebody to come into a
mirror role, especially in the capital city with no local
company experience, and I think that showed she had probably
ad butt that, but that's not the only factor that
was in play in Wellington.

Speaker 2 (07:24):
Do you think she's made the right move by stepping
down for her Yes, fabulous, Thank you, Thank you for
taking your time and talking to us personally. I think
that it would have been easier for people to understand
what was going on if there had been more communication

(07:46):
from the start, but that's just my personal thought. Do
you think when leaving now you know you've left already,
do you think that Wannington City Council is better for
having you there.

Speaker 3 (07:59):
I certainly hope. So I certainly committed the best part
of eight months of my life to trying to produce
that sort of outcome. So I certainly hope the investment
that they've made in me plays out in the medium too. Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (08:15):
Do you know what it costs? What the total bill was?

Speaker 3 (08:18):
It's been oi aid or lagoymad, depending on who you're asking,
and I think it's some seventy k okay, including travel.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
Okay, Now grade yourself, give yourself an A to F.
Where do you think you did? How do you think
you did yourself?

Speaker 3 (08:39):
There's an old primary, doesn't it that says not up
to a kuma to say how sweet it is? But
I'd say I'll give me. I'll give me an eight
point five? How about that?

Speaker 2 (08:49):
Are you going out of ten? You see I've changed,
I've gone gone to Erica Stanford's new rules eight eight
to f. So what do you say? Do you say
you're a beat?

Speaker 3 (08:59):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (08:59):
Okay, thank you for chatting to us, thank you for
coming to Wellington, and thank you for doing what you.

Speaker 3 (09:06):
Did, not a problem.

Speaker 2 (09:07):
Appreciate you, appreciate I appreciate your time.

Speaker 1 (09:11):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills. Listen live
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