October 22, 2025 • 19 mins
This Politics Thursday Nick Mills was joined by Labour MP Ayesha Verrall and National's MP Tama Potaka.
They discussed the issues in the beehive this week, starting with the mega strike of 100,000 including teachers, nurses and senior doctors. They also chatted with Nick about Labours health policy mix-up, whether politicians should get involved in the Dame Noeline Taurua coaching debacle, the new transport announcements from National and working towards more bipartisan agreements.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks ed B, focusing in on the issues
that matter Politics Thursday on Wellington Mornings News Talks ed B.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Joining us for our politics Thursday is Labour's Ei Chaveril.
She's the list MP spokesperson for Health and Wellington's Issues.
Good morning, I Sha, Good morning Mack.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
How you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
I'm doing well. How are you doing? How's the weather?
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Where are you? I'm in Parliament House and up on
the third well. I'm in the gallery now, but I
was up on the third floor. We can hear the
roof rattling away.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
How did you get there? Was it all right getting there?
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Yeah? I drove it into the basement. It was all
right on the way in Okay.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
National's Tama Pocata, Minister for Mary Crown Relations Married Developments.
Good morning, minister chond mate.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
How are you.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I'm very well. Where are you?
Speaker 4 (01:03):
I'm in Wellington at the Parliamentary Precinct and the b mate.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
So you both tucked away in probably the safest building
in the town.
Speaker 4 (01:13):
It's busy and it's busy out there, the weather too.
But you know, like Uguay on kuntry panda make good weather,
bad weather, It's just weather.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
It's just whether tell that to the people who wanting
to You know, there's not a single person in our
office apart from the reporters and me.
Speaker 4 (01:29):
Mate, you're a hard working Kiwi. Thanks have been at work.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Well, you know nothing about that. It's about picking up
the pay in it right. Let's talk about the strike today,
talking about hard working Kiwis. An estimated one hundred thousand
workers are striking and what's being called the mega strike.
Tamma is the omen? The weather a bit of an
omen for them. Has this stopped the whole momentum of
(01:52):
the strike?
Speaker 4 (01:53):
Look, I'll leave the weather to their gods, but there
are a lot of hard work and Kiwis out there,
people in all sorts of jobs, farmers, business people, teachers,
nurses all over the country. People are trying to work
hard and people are really focus on their kids, calling,
getting food on the table and seeing the doctor when
they have some issues. And we really want to see
(02:14):
the current issues around teachers and nurses come back to
the table and resolve themselves.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
I shall. I think a lot of people have got
the feeling that this is a political strike rather than
an employment strike.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Well, that would be disappointing because the fact is those
workers voted to go out on strike because of the negotiations.
That's over pay, and that's simple. That is always what
strikes are about under New Zealand law. And I think
(02:50):
you can see that in the polls out this week.
Sixty five percent of New Zealand is supporting the strike,
including forty nine percent of people who are voters for
government parties. Most of us know either one of the
workers impacted. You know, many of us would know teachers
or nurses or doctors and know what their experience of
their worker's life or or think, you know, they're not
(03:12):
so different from me. And I think that's why the
workers on strike today have public sympathy.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
I shir, what did you make of Sir Brian Roach
saying that they didn't even want to come around the table.
There were some unions that didn't even want to come
around the table. They wanted to strike to go ahead
no matter what.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
I find that very hard to believe. And I do
think that the government really needs to consider its tactics
with respect to this. And I've said this before on
this show. I think by being deliberately provocative, whether that's
Sir Brian Roche or whether it's what Simeon Brown says,
and racking things up is not going to achieve what
we all want, which is a settlement. We all want
(03:51):
everyone to be back at their jobs, but in taking
potshots at them just makes it harder to get people
around the table.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Talma, did you see Sir Brian Roach on TV last night?
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Ago? I was working away, beating away in miles. I
didn't have the time to watch TV. But what I
did see this morning a couple of kids in Parliament
that really want to be at school with their mates
and learning. That's what I saw. And I think there
are some teachers that are at school throughout the country today.
They are working hard and supporting students. And I know
a lot of people are missing out on their specialist
(04:24):
assessments and the procedures today, and that's really really sad.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Do you feel that there was any politicalness in this strike?
I just can't help but think that it was.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
I do think there are a lot of motivations and
some of them are political. But what I do want
to acknowledge is that the government, many many New Zealanders
actually regret the disruption there strikes course, but also value
people working across these sectors and across these industries. We've
got some real challenges in our economy and our communities,
and we really want to support people to get back
(04:56):
to the table, to get to a resolution, and let's
get on with the money that we need to do
to support news lenders.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Surely, though, Tama that the government must be slightly concerned
that this was supposedly to be the biggest labor strike
in forty or fifty years in New Zealand. That's an
anti government strike, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (05:15):
I think if you're saying it's an anti government strike,
then it's clearly is political. What we want to see
as people come to the CHA table and not all
the unions and not all workers are in the same
position as one another. Actually people in very diverse and
variable positions. But we just really want to see people
come back to the Cardinal, come back to the table,
make progress, and don't leave it up to one use
(05:38):
and a variety of other media stations to sort of
play it out. We want that discussion to take place
and move on.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
What do you see the outcome being aisher.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
The government has choices, doesn't it, And it made a
choice to prioritize tax cuts for landlords and tobacco companies
over investment in public services. So to fix this, the
government needs to be able to put credible offers to
those workers and our essential services and how if you
education and firefighters, to be able to get a settlement.
(06:11):
All those workers workers are looking for is something that
keeps their pay up with That's what I understand, is
keeps their pay up with inflation. If the government has
done something that means they don't have the ability to
pay for that because they prioritize landlords and tax cuts.
And that's the bad that's these governments bad choices. And
I think that is the sense in which this is
(06:32):
about political decisions. It's in that sense, and the government's
made the wrong priorities.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
I think some of that is an accurate and comes
from a very difficult place. You know, we've brought down inflation.
If own inflation was rampant under the previous government. We
all know that we actually made sure that health received
the biggest funding boost in decades, and that's all the wall.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Well, hang on a minute. If that's the case, why
can't why can't you pay a pay increase that keeps
up with inflation if the funding is so so big,
Well I can't pay keep up with inflation.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
Yeah, well we've got to be that's.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
Because you didn't fund.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Didn't you didn't fund one of the time, please one
at a time.
Speaker 3 (07:17):
Time.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
We're really focused on Nick and it's my team is
to get people back to the table to ensure that
actually families, kids, patients are looked after. And the strikes
today are by you know, Asia's fair weather friends. I'm
not going to enable that to happen. We're really concerned
(07:39):
about families and communities and at the heart of this
is getting to a negotiation and getting to closure on
this matter.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
I so you can have your say.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
Yeah, I worked for twenty years in the health system,
so of course I've got a lot of friends there.
But I think the implication that this is about anything
than the worker's wages is incorrect. You know, the fact.
The fact is the health. The money the government put
into health didn't keep up with inflation. So when wages
are seventy percent of what we spend health funding on,
it's not a surprise if you didn't put enough money
(08:10):
in you haven't got enough money to wait raise wages
to keep up with inflation. So government decisions have led
to this have led to this situation. The funding for
health wasn't enough and therefore you don't have enough to
pay the bills, and that is playing out now. So well,
you know, if this has got to change, the government
has to reflect that it's got the wrong priorities.
Speaker 4 (08:31):
But Nick, if that is the case, when the educationals
turn up to see the minister and the ministri's, Palestine
should not be at the top of the list.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Yeah, that's a fact, Aisha. He's got a point there
that when a lot of people saw that, they thought,
holy holl this is not about putting some mints on
my table.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Well, a lot of people weren't in the room. It
does sound like what came out of that room was
a whole lot of spin. Because I also heard that
the that the workers were told they weren't allowed to
raise issues around bargaining. So I find I'm not paying
too much attention to what people say about that.
Speaker 4 (09:06):
Talking about Palestine, Nick, is not going to improve sheen.
It's attendance at school and achievement at school.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Fact, in fact, it's not going to put mints on
your table.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
In fact, I shall.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
I mean it was clearly it was.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
You go to a meeting. If you go to a
meeting with a senior official minister during a strike, and
you walk in you're told you're not allowed to talk
about the issues related to bargaining, you know, How's what
even is the point of that?
Speaker 4 (09:35):
I was clear related to bargaining, Well, the.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Strike at this time, You seek a meeting with the
minister when you've got these major issues about how about
pay bargaining underway, and then told you're not allowed to
speak about it. That seems pretty weird, doesn't it. Can
I just show the minister isn't even interested in dealing
with the issue.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Can I just get a clear answer from you on
this one? Iha according to facts that Erica Stanford was
in a meeting and they presented their list of requirements
or some the list of requirements, and on the top
of the list was Palestine.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Well, I don't. I don't rely on Eric Stanford's facts.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
Okay, Politics Thursday with Tama Powtucka and Aisha verl Aisher
II Sha I shay. You're making announcements without telling your leader.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Haha, No, that's not true. I had an off ed
in New Zealand, doctor, and it did catch Chross off guard.
He thought it would be later in the week. The
policy we had both discussed extensively and his Labor Party's
Labor Party policy. So yeah, we and sadly I was
sick on the day, so I wasn't there to be
(10:55):
able to answer answer questions about that. But it's a
great little idea or mean that general practices don't get
underfunded in the in the future, and that'll make it easier.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
You're not going to get away with it that easily
with me, and you know you're not going to get
away with that easy. Chris Hipkins didn't have a clue
what anyone was talking about. So if you had explained
to him you'd had discussions with him with him earlier,
he must have been glazed off looking at someone else
or talking to someone else because he did not have
our clue.
Speaker 3 (11:25):
No, that's not that's not correct. We had discussed it extensively.
He was just surprised about when it was and that's
all that happened.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
But the reporters asked him about and he knew nothing
about it. I watched it. I saw it with my
own eyes.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
No, he definitely did know about it, and you know,
and there's plenty of plenty of discussions that we had
about it, Slabor Party policy. It was just the timing
that caught him off guard and that happens.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Did you have to take the day off in case
he was so angry with you?
Speaker 3 (11:56):
No? I was sack, mate, I was really sick and
I was lucky to be helped helped by Actually has
it happened one of my classmates at Wellington Hospital?
Speaker 2 (12:05):
I was, I was only I don't want to make
fun of you being ill, but just too strained. Talma.
What were your thoughts when you saw this all unfold
in front of your eyes?
Speaker 4 (12:15):
Well, it's about as chaotic as the Wellington weather, mate,
But I just want to mention along this program just
to acknowledge the recent passing of Jim Bold or the
great helmsman. It never make a mistake like this led
the country over many many years and his tongue he's
on today out at Carverty's just acknowledge him in passing.
But look at Shambollock. Labor's big on announcement and we
(12:37):
are massive on delivery that's what we believe in. We
get on and do the mohey and make sure that
we support New Zealanders to get to school, to get
to hospital, to get to work. And that's why we've
got these transport announcements and other matters going on. Absolutely
focused on staying positive, staying focused and staying relevant.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Right, let's stay focused, TAMA. I want to know your
thoughts are you know at the moment, because we're now
you spent a bit of time in Wellington. You know
how important the Mount Victoria Tunnel is to us, Chris
as an announce the start of it. Why can't we, TAMA,
do our pathsiders that deal with labor so that we
don't have issues going forward? Why are we sitting there
(13:17):
waiting to see whether who's going to get and whether
we get our tunnel.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
People want to spend less time stuck in traffic and
more time with their farm own instead of worrying about
getting to pick up their kids on time or their
nannies on time, or get into the airport safely and
on time. And we had a roads of national significance
under the previous national lead government, absolutely fantastic, especially in
places like the White the White Contalk Expressway and our
current Roads of National Significance program. It's moving at place
(13:43):
like the Meling Link. Labor pushed it back to twenty
twenty nine, but the hard work in Hut South MP
Chris Bishop got it started in twenty twenty five. We've
got a whole range of additional projects here in Willington,
whether or not it's Mount Tunnel, Patoni to Grenada or
Pittorni as I describe it. But the last Roads of
National Significance program transformed how people travel. We're building on
(14:05):
that success and get moving.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
I so you work together with Transmission Gully, different governments
started at different government finished that you work well together.
Why can't we see more of it, especially with in physciality.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
Yeah. The reality of these big projects as they're always
going to take longer than any particular government has in power.
So you're right there. It is important that we create
the situation where there can be bipartisan agreement. And I
guess two points about that. One is having actual details
helps us to be able to reach those sorts of agreements.
So there's a lot of questions we have about the
(14:42):
funding and plan for that Mount vic Tunnel. A second tunnel.
That makes it really hard for us to be able
to reach an agreement. You know, is it responsible for
us to say we support something when we haven't seen
any numbers connected with it at or whatever. That's what
the challenge is. So yeah, bi partisan agreement is possible,
but you do actually have to share the information so
that that can happen. And if there's an approach from
(15:04):
national about that, you know, I'm sure it'll be taken
wh seriously, that's what Chris hippens.
Speaker 4 (15:08):
Then we've announced the roads, Nick and I'd love Asha
to come up and wave the fleet for the sudden
links in Hamilton to be wonderful.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Thank you that that's not how it works if you
if you want bipartisan, you actually have to discuss things,
not issure press release and say why aren't you clapping?
Speaker 4 (15:25):
Well, we're not going to spend hundreds of millions of
dollars into cycle wys to nowhere. We've got a pretty
clear plan, get roads moving, to build the roads, to
help New Zealanders to get to Whoop, to get to
their pharma, to get to the community events.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
And little that little politic, that little political.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
That little dick, great ideas.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
So the question was why can't you be bipartisan and
you just decided to have a crack, So that that
is precisely why it's hard to reach agreements on things Tama,
because yeah, we do have different views. I do want
to see balanced transport. I want to see to make
sure there's options for active transport and public transport. You
have a different perspective, that's fine, but we have to
(16:07):
find common ground and that means sharing information, not just
writing a press release and saying why won't you get
on board? That's not by partisanship.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
Well, I appreciate your support for the medical school and
why Kusile, thank you.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
I just want to ask because the last time we
talked about this on the show was when the Education
Minister wanted to sit down with your Education Minister Aisher
and talked about some of the plans, and they didn't
even They got snobbed, they got frozen out. So that's
not you know, it's.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Really it's really hard to build trust around bipartisanship, you know,
because these sorts of things keep happening and so all
you know, you do have to make an effort, you
do have to engage. Sometimes you have to do it
behind the scenes and not make it that the first
thing you do is put it in the media when
you think you've caught someone out. That is a way
(16:58):
of operating that's not conducive to bipartisanship.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
I want to think, though, Nick, that mister Stanford and
here engagement with the Labor Education spokesperson has reached out.
She's gone from the famous text sense around various initiatives
and what did she hear? Crickets? So I do think
there are some efforts to get bipartisan called it all
happening and sometimes and all the time it needs to
(17:21):
be bad waste.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Yeah, one hundred percent. Let's talk about the Nolling Taruma saga.
Let's call it a saga, right. Willie Jackson has called
for funding for Netball New Zealand to be pulled. Mark
Mitchell said he's talking to them about fixing it. Nothing
seems to be getting done. I shall We've talked about
(17:43):
it with you on the show before. Are you starting
to get a bit annoyed by it all?
Speaker 3 (17:48):
Well, I'm a big fan of New Zealand netball, the
Silver Ferns, but particularly the Pulse, and this is reaching
out to too long. I do want it sorted out
for the god of Knowles, the girls, and the and
the game. I think Mark Mitchell's done the right thing
in terms of setting the expectation that it needs to
(18:10):
be needs to be resolved.
Speaker 4 (18:13):
Tom, are your thoughts well, Look, I remember the days
in the nineties when I live down here, going out
and supporting pic Knowles and Gale Parts and others, all
living out there, working out playing neple out there out
of the courts at halt ti time. The situation at
the moment's not good. Mister Mitchell's are Sport in z
for advice on the matter, but ultimately the government doesn't
(18:34):
have an official role in the dispute. But we really
want to see it resolved, and all of us want
to see the silver ferns and actually community and it
will go really really well.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
It is just straight like an employment issue, though, Tom,
I shouldn't everyone to stay out and let them sort
their own problem. I know it's taken too long and
it's been disastrous for the sport, but it's a basic
employment problem.
Speaker 4 (18:56):
Absolutely, it is an employment problem, and obviously one around
mana Tata is the way I describe it. But importantly
I think there's multi parts in support for the matter
to be resolved, and the government's not going to jump
in and try and be the arbiter or a fix
it man or woman. And I think a share myself
are both big fans of the Silver fans getting on
(19:20):
and playing the game that they love.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Thank you both very much for joining us this morning
on the show. Appreciate it. Have a safe trip home, Tama.
Hopefully it's Thursday. You go home tonight. Oh. I wouldn't
want to be on the flight with you there, buddy.
You wouldn't want to be.
Speaker 4 (19:35):
Holding your hands there, full place mate, City of the Future.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Yeah, but it's the flight that scares me right now. Tama,
Po Tucker and Aischeverel joining us for Politics Thursday.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks There'd be Wellington from nine to am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks ed B, focusing in on the issues
that matter Politics Thursday on Wellington Mornings News Talks ed B.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Joining us for our politics Thursday is Labour's Ei Chaveril.
She's the list MP spokesperson for Health and Wellington's Issues.
Good morning, I Sha, Good morning Mack.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
How you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
I'm doing well. How are you doing? How's the weather?
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Where are you? I'm in Parliament House and up on
the third well. I'm in the gallery now, but I
was up on the third floor. We can hear the
roof rattling away.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
How did you get there? Was it all right getting there?
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Yeah? I drove it into the basement. It was all
right on the way in Okay.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
National's Tama Pocata, Minister for Mary Crown Relations Married Developments.
Good morning, minister chond mate.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
How are you.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I'm very well. Where are you?
Speaker 4 (01:03):
I'm in Wellington at the Parliamentary Precinct and the b mate.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
So you both tucked away in probably the safest building
in the town.
Speaker 4 (01:13):
It's busy and it's busy out there, the weather too.
But you know, like Uguay on kuntry panda make good weather,
bad weather, It's just weather.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
It's just whether tell that to the people who wanting
to You know, there's not a single person in our
office apart from the reporters and me.
Speaker 4 (01:29):
Mate, you're a hard working Kiwi. Thanks have been at work.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Well, you know nothing about that. It's about picking up
the pay in it right. Let's talk about the strike today,
talking about hard working Kiwis. An estimated one hundred thousand
workers are striking and what's being called the mega strike.
Tamma is the omen? The weather a bit of an
omen for them. Has this stopped the whole momentum of
(01:52):
the strike?
Speaker 4 (01:53):
Look, I'll leave the weather to their gods, but there
are a lot of hard work and Kiwis out there,
people in all sorts of jobs, farmers, business people, teachers,
nurses all over the country. People are trying to work
hard and people are really focus on their kids, calling,
getting food on the table and seeing the doctor when
they have some issues. And we really want to see
(02:14):
the current issues around teachers and nurses come back to
the table and resolve themselves.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
I shall. I think a lot of people have got
the feeling that this is a political strike rather than
an employment strike.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Well, that would be disappointing because the fact is those
workers voted to go out on strike because of the negotiations.
That's over pay, and that's simple. That is always what
strikes are about under New Zealand law. And I think
(02:50):
you can see that in the polls out this week.
Sixty five percent of New Zealand is supporting the strike,
including forty nine percent of people who are voters for
government parties. Most of us know either one of the
workers impacted. You know, many of us would know teachers
or nurses or doctors and know what their experience of
their worker's life or or think, you know, they're not
(03:12):
so different from me. And I think that's why the
workers on strike today have public sympathy.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
I shir, what did you make of Sir Brian Roach
saying that they didn't even want to come around the table.
There were some unions that didn't even want to come
around the table. They wanted to strike to go ahead
no matter what.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
I find that very hard to believe. And I do
think that the government really needs to consider its tactics
with respect to this. And I've said this before on
this show. I think by being deliberately provocative, whether that's
Sir Brian Roche or whether it's what Simeon Brown says,
and racking things up is not going to achieve what
we all want, which is a settlement. We all want
(03:51):
everyone to be back at their jobs, but in taking
potshots at them just makes it harder to get people
around the table.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Talma, did you see Sir Brian Roach on TV last night?
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Ago? I was working away, beating away in miles. I
didn't have the time to watch TV. But what I
did see this morning a couple of kids in Parliament
that really want to be at school with their mates
and learning. That's what I saw. And I think there
are some teachers that are at school throughout the country today.
They are working hard and supporting students. And I know
a lot of people are missing out on their specialist
(04:24):
assessments and the procedures today, and that's really really sad.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Do you feel that there was any politicalness in this strike?
I just can't help but think that it was.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
I do think there are a lot of motivations and
some of them are political. But what I do want
to acknowledge is that the government, many many New Zealanders
actually regret the disruption there strikes course, but also value
people working across these sectors and across these industries. We've
got some real challenges in our economy and our communities,
and we really want to support people to get back
(04:56):
to the table, to get to a resolution, and let's
get on with the money that we need to do
to support news lenders.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Surely, though, Tama that the government must be slightly concerned
that this was supposedly to be the biggest labor strike
in forty or fifty years in New Zealand. That's an
anti government strike, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (05:15):
I think if you're saying it's an anti government strike,
then it's clearly is political. What we want to see
as people come to the CHA table and not all
the unions and not all workers are in the same
position as one another. Actually people in very diverse and
variable positions. But we just really want to see people
come back to the Cardinal, come back to the table,
make progress, and don't leave it up to one use
(05:38):
and a variety of other media stations to sort of
play it out. We want that discussion to take place
and move on.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
What do you see the outcome being aisher.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
The government has choices, doesn't it, And it made a
choice to prioritize tax cuts for landlords and tobacco companies
over investment in public services. So to fix this, the
government needs to be able to put credible offers to
those workers and our essential services and how if you
education and firefighters, to be able to get a settlement.
(06:11):
All those workers workers are looking for is something that
keeps their pay up with That's what I understand, is
keeps their pay up with inflation. If the government has
done something that means they don't have the ability to
pay for that because they prioritize landlords and tax cuts.
And that's the bad that's these governments bad choices. And
I think that is the sense in which this is
(06:32):
about political decisions. It's in that sense, and the government's
made the wrong priorities.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
I think some of that is an accurate and comes
from a very difficult place. You know, we've brought down inflation.
If own inflation was rampant under the previous government. We
all know that we actually made sure that health received
the biggest funding boost in decades, and that's all the wall.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Well, hang on a minute. If that's the case, why
can't why can't you pay a pay increase that keeps
up with inflation if the funding is so so big,
Well I can't pay keep up with inflation.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
Yeah, well we've got to be that's.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
Because you didn't fund.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Didn't you didn't fund one of the time, please one
at a time.
Speaker 3 (07:17):
Time.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
We're really focused on Nick and it's my team is
to get people back to the table to ensure that
actually families, kids, patients are looked after. And the strikes
today are by you know, Asia's fair weather friends. I'm
not going to enable that to happen. We're really concerned
(07:39):
about families and communities and at the heart of this
is getting to a negotiation and getting to closure on
this matter.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
I so you can have your say.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
Yeah, I worked for twenty years in the health system,
so of course I've got a lot of friends there.
But I think the implication that this is about anything
than the worker's wages is incorrect. You know, the fact.
The fact is the health. The money the government put
into health didn't keep up with inflation. So when wages
are seventy percent of what we spend health funding on,
it's not a surprise if you didn't put enough money
(08:10):
in you haven't got enough money to wait raise wages
to keep up with inflation. So government decisions have led
to this have led to this situation. The funding for
health wasn't enough and therefore you don't have enough to
pay the bills, and that is playing out now. So well,
you know, if this has got to change, the government
has to reflect that it's got the wrong priorities.
Speaker 4 (08:31):
But Nick, if that is the case, when the educationals
turn up to see the minister and the ministri's, Palestine
should not be at the top of the list.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Yeah, that's a fact, Aisha. He's got a point there
that when a lot of people saw that, they thought,
holy holl this is not about putting some mints on
my table.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Well, a lot of people weren't in the room. It
does sound like what came out of that room was
a whole lot of spin. Because I also heard that
the that the workers were told they weren't allowed to
raise issues around bargaining. So I find I'm not paying
too much attention to what people say about that.
Speaker 4 (09:06):
Talking about Palestine, Nick, is not going to improve sheen.
It's attendance at school and achievement at school.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Fact, in fact, it's not going to put mints on
your table.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
In fact, I shall.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
I mean it was clearly it was.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
You go to a meeting. If you go to a
meeting with a senior official minister during a strike, and
you walk in you're told you're not allowed to talk
about the issues related to bargaining, you know, How's what
even is the point of that?
Speaker 4 (09:35):
I was clear related to bargaining, Well, the.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Strike at this time, You seek a meeting with the
minister when you've got these major issues about how about
pay bargaining underway, and then told you're not allowed to
speak about it. That seems pretty weird, doesn't it. Can
I just show the minister isn't even interested in dealing
with the issue.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Can I just get a clear answer from you on
this one? Iha according to facts that Erica Stanford was
in a meeting and they presented their list of requirements
or some the list of requirements, and on the top
of the list was Palestine.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Well, I don't. I don't rely on Eric Stanford's facts.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
Okay, Politics Thursday with Tama Powtucka and Aisha verl Aisher
II Sha I shay. You're making announcements without telling your leader.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Haha, No, that's not true. I had an off ed
in New Zealand, doctor, and it did catch Chross off guard.
He thought it would be later in the week. The
policy we had both discussed extensively and his Labor Party's
Labor Party policy. So yeah, we and sadly I was
sick on the day, so I wasn't there to be
(10:55):
able to answer answer questions about that. But it's a
great little idea or mean that general practices don't get
underfunded in the in the future, and that'll make it easier.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
You're not going to get away with it that easily
with me, and you know you're not going to get
away with that easy. Chris Hipkins didn't have a clue
what anyone was talking about. So if you had explained
to him you'd had discussions with him with him earlier,
he must have been glazed off looking at someone else
or talking to someone else because he did not have
our clue.
Speaker 3 (11:25):
No, that's not that's not correct. We had discussed it extensively.
He was just surprised about when it was and that's
all that happened.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
But the reporters asked him about and he knew nothing
about it. I watched it. I saw it with my
own eyes.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
No, he definitely did know about it, and you know,
and there's plenty of plenty of discussions that we had
about it, Slabor Party policy. It was just the timing
that caught him off guard and that happens.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Did you have to take the day off in case
he was so angry with you?
Speaker 3 (11:56):
No? I was sack, mate, I was really sick and
I was lucky to be helped helped by Actually has
it happened one of my classmates at Wellington Hospital?
Speaker 2 (12:05):
I was, I was only I don't want to make
fun of you being ill, but just too strained. Talma.
What were your thoughts when you saw this all unfold
in front of your eyes?
Speaker 4 (12:15):
Well, it's about as chaotic as the Wellington weather, mate,
But I just want to mention along this program just
to acknowledge the recent passing of Jim Bold or the
great helmsman. It never make a mistake like this led
the country over many many years and his tongue he's
on today out at Carverty's just acknowledge him in passing.
But look at Shambollock. Labor's big on announcement and we
(12:37):
are massive on delivery that's what we believe in. We
get on and do the mohey and make sure that
we support New Zealanders to get to school, to get
to hospital, to get to work. And that's why we've
got these transport announcements and other matters going on. Absolutely
focused on staying positive, staying focused and staying relevant.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Right, let's stay focused, TAMA. I want to know your
thoughts are you know at the moment, because we're now
you spent a bit of time in Wellington. You know
how important the Mount Victoria Tunnel is to us, Chris
as an announce the start of it. Why can't we, TAMA,
do our pathsiders that deal with labor so that we
don't have issues going forward? Why are we sitting there
(13:17):
waiting to see whether who's going to get and whether
we get our tunnel.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
People want to spend less time stuck in traffic and
more time with their farm own instead of worrying about
getting to pick up their kids on time or their
nannies on time, or get into the airport safely and
on time. And we had a roads of national significance
under the previous national lead government, absolutely fantastic, especially in
places like the White the White Contalk Expressway and our
current Roads of National Significance program. It's moving at place
(13:43):
like the Meling Link. Labor pushed it back to twenty
twenty nine, but the hard work in Hut South MP
Chris Bishop got it started in twenty twenty five. We've
got a whole range of additional projects here in Willington,
whether or not it's Mount Tunnel, Patoni to Grenada or
Pittorni as I describe it. But the last Roads of
National Significance program transformed how people travel. We're building on
(14:05):
that success and get moving.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
I so you work together with Transmission Gully, different governments
started at different government finished that you work well together.
Why can't we see more of it, especially with in physciality.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
Yeah. The reality of these big projects as they're always
going to take longer than any particular government has in power.
So you're right there. It is important that we create
the situation where there can be bipartisan agreement. And I
guess two points about that. One is having actual details
helps us to be able to reach those sorts of agreements.
So there's a lot of questions we have about the
(14:42):
funding and plan for that Mount vic Tunnel. A second tunnel.
That makes it really hard for us to be able
to reach an agreement. You know, is it responsible for
us to say we support something when we haven't seen
any numbers connected with it at or whatever. That's what
the challenge is. So yeah, bi partisan agreement is possible,
but you do actually have to share the information so
that that can happen. And if there's an approach from
(15:04):
national about that, you know, I'm sure it'll be taken
wh seriously, that's what Chris hippens.
Speaker 4 (15:08):
Then we've announced the roads, Nick and I'd love Asha
to come up and wave the fleet for the sudden
links in Hamilton to be wonderful.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Thank you that that's not how it works if you
if you want bipartisan, you actually have to discuss things,
not issure press release and say why aren't you clapping?
Speaker 4 (15:25):
Well, we're not going to spend hundreds of millions of
dollars into cycle wys to nowhere. We've got a pretty
clear plan, get roads moving, to build the roads, to
help New Zealanders to get to Whoop, to get to
their pharma, to get to the community events.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
And little that little politic, that little political.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
That little dick, great ideas.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
So the question was why can't you be bipartisan and
you just decided to have a crack, So that that
is precisely why it's hard to reach agreements on things Tama,
because yeah, we do have different views. I do want
to see balanced transport. I want to see to make
sure there's options for active transport and public transport. You
have a different perspective, that's fine, but we have to
(16:07):
find common ground and that means sharing information, not just
writing a press release and saying why won't you get
on board? That's not by partisanship.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
Well, I appreciate your support for the medical school and
why Kusile, thank you.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
I just want to ask because the last time we
talked about this on the show was when the Education
Minister wanted to sit down with your Education Minister Aisher
and talked about some of the plans, and they didn't
even They got snobbed, they got frozen out. So that's
not you know, it's.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Really it's really hard to build trust around bipartisanship, you know,
because these sorts of things keep happening and so all
you know, you do have to make an effort, you
do have to engage. Sometimes you have to do it
behind the scenes and not make it that the first
thing you do is put it in the media when
you think you've caught someone out. That is a way
(16:58):
of operating that's not conducive to bipartisanship.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
I want to think, though, Nick, that mister Stanford and
here engagement with the Labor Education spokesperson has reached out.
She's gone from the famous text sense around various initiatives
and what did she hear? Crickets? So I do think
there are some efforts to get bipartisan called it all
happening and sometimes and all the time it needs to
(17:21):
be bad waste.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Yeah, one hundred percent. Let's talk about the Nolling Taruma saga.
Let's call it a saga, right. Willie Jackson has called
for funding for Netball New Zealand to be pulled. Mark
Mitchell said he's talking to them about fixing it. Nothing
seems to be getting done. I shall We've talked about
(17:43):
it with you on the show before. Are you starting
to get a bit annoyed by it all?
Speaker 3 (17:48):
Well, I'm a big fan of New Zealand netball, the
Silver Ferns, but particularly the Pulse, and this is reaching
out to too long. I do want it sorted out
for the god of Knowles, the girls, and the and
the game. I think Mark Mitchell's done the right thing
in terms of setting the expectation that it needs to
(18:10):
be needs to be resolved.
Speaker 4 (18:13):
Tom, are your thoughts well, Look, I remember the days
in the nineties when I live down here, going out
and supporting pic Knowles and Gale Parts and others, all
living out there, working out playing neple out there out
of the courts at halt ti time. The situation at
the moment's not good. Mister Mitchell's are Sport in z
for advice on the matter, but ultimately the government doesn't
(18:34):
have an official role in the dispute. But we really
want to see it resolved, and all of us want
to see the silver ferns and actually community and it
will go really really well.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
It is just straight like an employment issue, though, Tom,
I shouldn't everyone to stay out and let them sort
their own problem. I know it's taken too long and
it's been disastrous for the sport, but it's a basic
employment problem.
Speaker 4 (18:56):
Absolutely, it is an employment problem, and obviously one around
mana Tata is the way I describe it. But importantly
I think there's multi parts in support for the matter
to be resolved, and the government's not going to jump
in and try and be the arbiter or a fix
it man or woman. And I think a share myself
are both big fans of the Silver fans getting on
(19:20):
and playing the game that they love.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Thank you both very much for joining us this morning
on the show. Appreciate it. Have a safe trip home, Tama.
Hopefully it's Thursday. You go home tonight. Oh. I wouldn't
want to be on the flight with you there, buddy.
You wouldn't want to be.
Speaker 4 (19:35):
Holding your hands there, full place mate, City of the Future.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Yeah, but it's the flight that scares me right now. Tama,
Po Tucker and Aischeverel joining us for Politics Thursday.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks There'd be Wellington from nine to am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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