November 9, 2025 • 8 mins
Newstalk ZB political reporter Ethan Griffiths joins Nick Mills for Beehive Buzz this week discussing the annoucement from Te Pati Maori that two MPs - Mariameno Kapa-Kingi and Tākuta Ferris have been expelled from the party.
They talk what's next for these MPs and Te Pati Maori, possibilities of exercising the waka jumping legislation and reactions around parliament.
For the latest insight into parliament, it's Beehive Buzz with Ethan Griffiths.
LISTEN ABOVE
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk said B direct from News Talks edb's
team at Parliament's the bee Hive buzz Y Bo.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Let's head to the Beehive with News talksb's political reporter
Ethan Griffith. Ethan, good morning, Good morning neck, Well, big
morning for you. Madamino Kappa Kini gone, Takua Fairnis gone
both by lunchtime.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Yeah, it's a pretty big morning here at Parliament. As
you say, to Party Marty expelled Turbot's MPs. That's the
MP for the northern Marty Seed of Te Tay Tokoto
who is Mariimino Kappakingi, and the Marti Seed covering the
South island Tako to Ferris as well. What does it mean,
Well that gone from the party, they will no longer
sit with TA Party Marti in the House. They'll essentially
(00:58):
become independent MPs. They sort of sit up the very
far back corner of the House that is known here
at Parliament as Siberia, so they'll be sitting up there now. Interestingly,
the co leaders haven't explicitly said this morning what the
peer are being expelled for only that they've been expelled
for a breach of the party's constitution. So you can
(01:20):
have a fair idea what's happened here from where all
of this begun and what we've heard over the last
six weeks, but in terms of an exact reason, we
don't really have one.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Is this a win for Tomaherry as well?
Speaker 3 (01:32):
You'd have to think so. I mean tacker to Ferris
especially has come out in recent weeks and said, look,
the leadership style of John Tamerhetty is not what we
want in the party. Maria and Meno Kapakingi, whose son
Edu Kapakini had called the leadership style of the party dictatorial,
and both of them were sort of working to try
and I guess roll John Tomahetty as party president. There'd
(01:56):
been a petition that had been launched to get him
to resign from the role. So there are some concerns there,
but the fact that these tw MP's are gone would
suggest it's probably a win for him.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
How do you think that the other men members are feeling,
because I think they're a pretty tight group. Would there
be some disharmony now and the ones that are still there?
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Yeah, Look, you'd have to think. So the interesting example
there is already Kaipito, who's the new to party malimp
for Tommackimikoto, who was only elected what two months two
three months ago? Now, she'd only posted on social media
last week a photo of her and Maudi and Mino
together sitting in the house, so clearly she's quite friendly
with Mudiam Mino, who's now essentially been sacked from the party.
(02:39):
So you have to wonder one hundred half at he
might be. Clark, the youngest MP, who is only twenty
three years old. We haven't heard anything from her about
where she stands on this, so it's really hard to
say what the thoughts of these other MPs are. That
was actually asked of the coles Co leaders today. Have
you spoken to your other MPs and they said that
(03:01):
they weren't going to comment on it, and that's their
MPs to talk to.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
So where does this leave them? I mean, now I
listen to people in the street. They all tell me,
they all moan about the same thing to Parthy Mauri
don't turn up to behive, They're never there. You know.
Now you're going to have a couple of X members
sort of sitting up in the back corner. They won't
turn up. It's just it's just going to go from
I don't know. It's a strange one, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
It is a very strange one. I mean, the key
thing to remember with taparty Maori, they're not going for mainstream,
broad appeal right. They don't want to be a major party.
They're trying to attract maybe ten percent of the vote
at max. They've only really ever been successful at attracting
maybe four percent if you look at recent polls. The
problem is with such a small small voter base and
a small pool of voters, they're clearly going to alienate
(03:49):
many of them by this move right. They have essentially
sacked two MP's. And these aren't list MPs, you know,
these aren't These aren't Darlene Tanner's or anything like that.
These are electorate MPs that have been elected in their
Marti seats by significantly you know, sizeable Mardi communities and
the party said no, we don't want them anymore. So,
(04:09):
I mean, the real question here is is how those
elect electorates are going to respond. Does tuckt to Ferris
and Mariameno Kapakni do they want to run a next
year's election, will they run as independents? And how's that
going to affect the Marti Party. I mean, there are
so many questions here that really are an answered at
the moment.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Do you think, and this is hypothetical that to party
Mari will try and use the Woker jumping law? I mean,
is there any difference using the Woker jumping law too?
I mean, this is a lot of our listeners would
not like to know this between being an elected and
a list MP.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
So there's not not really anyway. So under the Walker
jumping legislation, if you're an MP who is booted from
your party in parliament, the party leader can then write
to the Speaker and say this person has been booted
from our parliamentary party. We don't want them in parliament anymore.
In that case, that MP essentially gets removed from parliament
(05:04):
and a by election is called in the E. And
that's the big question for the party. Marti co leaders
this morning Debinado, Huapaka and Naradi. Why to Tea are
they going to invoke that Waker jumping legislation because they're
clearly annoyed enough to expel them, but do they want
them gone from Parliament entirely at the moment. They've said
they're not doing that, but they have also said there's
(05:24):
been no consideration on whether they're going to do that.
They say that's a decision for their National Council, which
essentially is their governing board of the party, and it
hasn't been discussed yet.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
But can I just jump in and ask you, Ethan,
do you know whether they are supportive of the Walker
jumping because I know that the left the Greens definitely aren't.
I mean, are they are they supportive of the idea?
Speaker 3 (05:46):
I don't think their position's ever really been made clear
on it. It sort of came to Parliament before they
were in or it was in that intervening period when
they were out of Parliament, so they haven't actually voted
on it. I'm not sure what their position is. But
if you think about it, it would cause two two
by elections. It's a lot of money for the party
if they want to stand candidates in both of those buyos.
They might be sitting there thinking twelve months to go
(06:09):
to an election, is it really worth kicking these guys
out and having to fight too by elections after we've just.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
And how bad would it be of the people actually
are supportive of them and they get voted back in,
which could also be just as problematic for them. I
want to get onto what it means for Labor.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
Yeah, and this is the interesting thing. Chris Hipkins in
the last few weeks has essentially said Locke, I think
to party Marty have got a lot of work to
do if they want to form a government with the
Labor Party. Very interesting today Debbie Nardo were Packer and
it Alwiti whit did he stood up and said Locke.
In the last few weeks we've been having very constructive
conversations with the Labor Party about, you know, potentially forming
(06:48):
a government. Last week Chris Hipkins said that he even
bumped into John Tammaheady in the hallways and had a
chat with him here at Parliament. So it's a huge
question for Labor. I mean, over the last few weeks
there's been a lot of commentary suggesting, actually, you know,
cut them off, guys. I think you'd be in a
better position to rule them out. Whether Chris Hipkins would
do that, I'm not sure, especially now after this decision
(07:09):
has been made. But from the rhetoric that's come from
Debbie and Ardi today. They really really want to try
and get Labor on side, and they can see that
the issues over the last six weeks have really affected
that relationship.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
Do you think it could be as simple? I've got
to go in a couple of minutes, But do you
do you think it could be as simple as them
they've got rid of some of the problems and it's
cleaned them up and they'll be a lot better now.
Or is that simplifying it too much?
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Well, I think that really really depends on where things
go in the next few weeks, right, I mean, there's
questions over whether the suspension is legal's I mean that's
Kappa Kingy's suggestion, suggestion. Her son has said, Look, we're
considering legal actions. So there's a lot of things going
on here and this may not be the end of it. Right,
They've still got two other MPs, the Ordiny Kipeter and
(07:52):
Huna Uffady might be Clark who actually may have some
issues themselves with this. We don't know. I'm not suggesting
they do, but you know, there's a lot of water
to go under the bridge yet, and I think a
lot of it will depend on what they do with
these two MP's and if they choose to invoke walker
jumping legislation, you.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Might see them attending parliament bit more.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Too well, I must say, in Mariamino Cupakini's credit, she's
probably got the best attendance rate of them all. So
now she'll be an expelled MP sitting up in Siberia Independent,
but she'll probably still show up. She's got quite a
good attendance rate to her credit.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
She might get the goal. Watch it. It is for
the UC. Always great to talk to you, Thank you
appreciate it. That's News Talks eb's political reporter Ethan Griffith.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills. Listen live
to News Talks There'd Be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk said B direct from News Talks edb's
team at Parliament's the bee Hive buzz Y Bo.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Let's head to the Beehive with News talksb's political reporter
Ethan Griffith. Ethan, good morning, Good morning neck, Well, big
morning for you. Madamino Kappa Kini gone, Takua Fairnis gone
both by lunchtime.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Yeah, it's a pretty big morning here at Parliament. As
you say, to Party Marty expelled Turbot's MPs. That's the
MP for the northern Marty Seed of Te Tay Tokoto
who is Mariimino Kappakingi, and the Marti Seed covering the
South island Tako to Ferris as well. What does it mean,
Well that gone from the party, they will no longer
sit with TA Party Marti in the House. They'll essentially
(00:58):
become independent MPs. They sort of sit up the very
far back corner of the House that is known here
at Parliament as Siberia, so they'll be sitting up there now. Interestingly,
the co leaders haven't explicitly said this morning what the
peer are being expelled for only that they've been expelled
for a breach of the party's constitution. So you can
(01:20):
have a fair idea what's happened here from where all
of this begun and what we've heard over the last
six weeks, but in terms of an exact reason, we
don't really have one.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Is this a win for Tomaherry as well?
Speaker 3 (01:32):
You'd have to think so. I mean tacker to Ferris
especially has come out in recent weeks and said, look,
the leadership style of John Tamerhetty is not what we
want in the party. Maria and Meno Kapakingi, whose son
Edu Kapakini had called the leadership style of the party dictatorial,
and both of them were sort of working to try
and I guess roll John Tomahetty as party president. There'd
(01:56):
been a petition that had been launched to get him
to resign from the role. So there are some concerns there,
but the fact that these tw MP's are gone would
suggest it's probably a win for him.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
How do you think that the other men members are feeling,
because I think they're a pretty tight group. Would there
be some disharmony now and the ones that are still there?
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Yeah, Look, you'd have to think. So the interesting example
there is already Kaipito, who's the new to party malimp
for Tommackimikoto, who was only elected what two months two
three months ago? Now, she'd only posted on social media
last week a photo of her and Maudi and Mino
together sitting in the house, so clearly she's quite friendly
with Mudiam Mino, who's now essentially been sacked from the party.
(02:39):
So you have to wonder one hundred half at he
might be. Clark, the youngest MP, who is only twenty
three years old. We haven't heard anything from her about
where she stands on this, so it's really hard to
say what the thoughts of these other MPs are. That
was actually asked of the coles Co leaders today. Have
you spoken to your other MPs and they said that
(03:01):
they weren't going to comment on it, and that's their
MPs to talk to.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
So where does this leave them? I mean, now I
listen to people in the street. They all tell me,
they all moan about the same thing to Parthy Mauri
don't turn up to behive, They're never there. You know.
Now you're going to have a couple of X members
sort of sitting up in the back corner. They won't
turn up. It's just it's just going to go from
I don't know. It's a strange one, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
It is a very strange one. I mean, the key
thing to remember with taparty Maori, they're not going for mainstream,
broad appeal right. They don't want to be a major party.
They're trying to attract maybe ten percent of the vote
at max. They've only really ever been successful at attracting
maybe four percent if you look at recent polls. The
problem is with such a small small voter base and
a small pool of voters, they're clearly going to alienate
(03:49):
many of them by this move right. They have essentially
sacked two MP's. And these aren't list MPs, you know,
these aren't These aren't Darlene Tanner's or anything like that.
These are electorate MPs that have been elected in their
Marti seats by significantly you know, sizeable Mardi communities and
the party said no, we don't want them anymore. So,
(04:09):
I mean, the real question here is is how those
elect electorates are going to respond. Does tuckt to Ferris
and Mariameno Kapakni do they want to run a next
year's election, will they run as independents? And how's that
going to affect the Marti Party. I mean, there are
so many questions here that really are an answered at
the moment.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Do you think, and this is hypothetical that to party
Mari will try and use the Woker jumping law? I mean,
is there any difference using the Woker jumping law too?
I mean, this is a lot of our listeners would
not like to know this between being an elected and
a list MP.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
So there's not not really anyway. So under the Walker
jumping legislation, if you're an MP who is booted from
your party in parliament, the party leader can then write
to the Speaker and say this person has been booted
from our parliamentary party. We don't want them in parliament anymore.
In that case, that MP essentially gets removed from parliament
(05:04):
and a by election is called in the E. And
that's the big question for the party. Marti co leaders
this morning Debinado, Huapaka and Naradi. Why to Tea are
they going to invoke that Waker jumping legislation because they're
clearly annoyed enough to expel them, but do they want
them gone from Parliament entirely at the moment. They've said
they're not doing that, but they have also said there's
(05:24):
been no consideration on whether they're going to do that.
They say that's a decision for their National Council, which
essentially is their governing board of the party, and it
hasn't been discussed yet.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
But can I just jump in and ask you, Ethan,
do you know whether they are supportive of the Walker
jumping because I know that the left the Greens definitely aren't.
I mean, are they are they supportive of the idea?
Speaker 3 (05:46):
I don't think their position's ever really been made clear
on it. It sort of came to Parliament before they
were in or it was in that intervening period when
they were out of Parliament, so they haven't actually voted
on it. I'm not sure what their position is. But
if you think about it, it would cause two two
by elections. It's a lot of money for the party
if they want to stand candidates in both of those buyos.
They might be sitting there thinking twelve months to go
(06:09):
to an election, is it really worth kicking these guys
out and having to fight too by elections after we've just.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
And how bad would it be of the people actually
are supportive of them and they get voted back in,
which could also be just as problematic for them. I
want to get onto what it means for Labor.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
Yeah, and this is the interesting thing. Chris Hipkins in
the last few weeks has essentially said Locke, I think
to party Marty have got a lot of work to
do if they want to form a government with the
Labor Party. Very interesting today Debbie Nardo were Packer and
it Alwiti whit did he stood up and said Locke.
In the last few weeks we've been having very constructive
conversations with the Labor Party about, you know, potentially forming
(06:48):
a government. Last week Chris Hipkins said that he even
bumped into John Tammaheady in the hallways and had a
chat with him here at Parliament. So it's a huge
question for Labor. I mean, over the last few weeks
there's been a lot of commentary suggesting, actually, you know,
cut them off, guys. I think you'd be in a
better position to rule them out. Whether Chris Hipkins would
do that, I'm not sure, especially now after this decision
(07:09):
has been made. But from the rhetoric that's come from
Debbie and Ardi today. They really really want to try
and get Labor on side, and they can see that
the issues over the last six weeks have really affected
that relationship.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
Do you think it could be as simple? I've got
to go in a couple of minutes, But do you
do you think it could be as simple as them
they've got rid of some of the problems and it's
cleaned them up and they'll be a lot better now.
Or is that simplifying it too much?
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Well, I think that really really depends on where things
go in the next few weeks, right, I mean, there's
questions over whether the suspension is legal's I mean that's
Kappa Kingy's suggestion, suggestion. Her son has said, Look, we're
considering legal actions. So there's a lot of things going
on here and this may not be the end of it. Right,
They've still got two other MPs, the Ordiny Kipeter and
(07:52):
Huna Uffady might be Clark who actually may have some
issues themselves with this. We don't know. I'm not suggesting
they do, but you know, there's a lot of water
to go under the bridge yet, and I think a
lot of it will depend on what they do with
these two MP's and if they choose to invoke walker
jumping legislation, you.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Might see them attending parliament bit more.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Too well, I must say, in Mariamino Cupakini's credit, she's
probably got the best attendance rate of them all. So
now she'll be an expelled MP sitting up in Siberia Independent,
but she'll probably still show up. She's got quite a
good attendance rate to her credit.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
She might get the goal. Watch it. It is for
the UC. Always great to talk to you, Thank you
appreciate it. That's News Talks eb's political reporter Ethan Griffith.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills. Listen live
to News Talks There'd Be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com