September 12, 2025 • 34 mins
ICYMI: Hour Three of ‘Later, with Mo’Kelly’ Presents – “The Sex Doctor Is In” w/ Sam Zia, MA LMFT (#106352), PhD Candidate, Human Sexuality; asking the question - “Is Sex Addiction Real?” - on KFI AM 640…Live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app & YouTube @MrMoKelly
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're listening to Later with mo Kelly on demand from
kf I, A M six forty.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
SAMSI Sex Doc. He's a Sam Stop.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Stop Stop Sextett.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
The Sex Doc.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Kelly Later.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
Later with kf I, Later with mo Kelly Live Everywhere
on YouTube and the iHeartRadio app. Now the Sex Doctor
is in Samza and he will see us.
Speaker 5 (00:56):
Sam's good to see you this evening. What's going on, brother,
Good to see you. And I'd like to just reiterate
what Mark said in the newsroom. It's sixty nine everywhere,
so the weather is here for.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Me today too. Oh my gosh, we're off. Oh yeah
to the racist Oh yeah, Sam.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
Or earlier in the week, you and I had touched
upon the idea of sexual addiction.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
And I've had a friend I don't want to reveal
his name because he is somewhat famous, who was accused.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Of sexual addiction.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I've had and heard varying opinions about whether that's a thing.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
First, let me make it seem like it's a crime.
He's being accused of sex adiction. The way it was,
he was shamed for it. So let me put it
out there.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
Okay, addiction, Yes, is sex something that can be a
part of what is considered an impulsive addiction that someone
can't control.
Speaker 5 (01:52):
Because of the disease. That's the question. Is sex addiction
actually a real thing? And you know, you've been hearing
it with a lot of different celebrities, especially when they
have some kind of controversy come up where they get caught.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Tiger Woods is a great example of that back in.
Speaker 5 (02:10):
The day, where people are like, you know, they get
caught doing something sexual and they are regretful of it
and said they you know what, We're going to go
into a sex.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Addiction treatment facility and stuff like that.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
Well, they're celebrities and they do celebrity rehab stuff to
repair their image. But on a medical level, is there
any evidence to suggest that we know that addiction is
a thing? Yes, absolutely, we know that compulsive behavior is
a thing. We could talk about gambling, and I would
(02:43):
say that's the closest parallel. You have someone engaging in
possibly not dangerous behavior, but not necessarily sensible behavior at
their own detriment, you know, gambling way their rent or
their mortgage. Isn't there a parallel that could be drawn
between gam addiction and sexual addiction?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Now that's the thing.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
Yes, there is a very good parallel that can be
drawn between the two. I mean a lot of the
same high risk behavior, the idea of you know, risking
everything you have to either gamble again or to have
a sexual experience, especially for those who are in committed
relationships where the other person is not aware of the
(03:25):
of their partner engaging in sexual activity outside of the relationship.
That's where a lot of times people say, well, I'm
an addict, and it makes them feel very powerless to
what like, because usually whenever you look at addiction, we're
pointing at chemical substance addiction, and there's addiction there.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
You know, that doesn't mean that there's the that is.
Speaker 5 (03:43):
The only exclusive kind of addiction is chemical substance addiction.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Those are real, very real.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
Probably because that changes the brain chemistry or something else.
Speaker 5 (03:52):
It's something where you become addicted to the like to
whatever the substance is. It impacts your functioning as far
as day to day, you know, doing your day to
day responsibilities. It keep it makes it so that you
prioritize the substance over everything else.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
Oh, let me ask you that. But that's not on
a physiological level. That's just more like an emotional level,
and compulsive behavior sounds like.
Speaker 5 (04:14):
Compulsive behavior is part of what we call process addictions,
where it's we are addicted, quote unquote addicted to certain behaviors,
and that is something where you can we start to
get a little bit into the weeds with it, because
addiction is something that a lot of times people will
just classify something as addiction because it's what is easier
(04:35):
to like, it's just a way to make it a
lot easier to explain something that is something that's more
along the lines of impulse control. Okay, now that is
another diagnosis altogether. Now we got to get into the
two different schools of diagnosing. You have the ICD, which
is the International Classification of Disease.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
It's it's basically.
Speaker 5 (04:53):
The what the World Health Organization uses to classify disease
is medical conditions things like that. It also covers mental
health disorders and things like that. Now, on my side,
because I'm a mental health professional, what I do as
far as my diagnos, my diagnoses go go with the DSM,
(05:14):
the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual for Psychological Disorders.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
We are officially in the weeds now. Now this is
where now this is the thing.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
DSM is run by the APA, the American Psychiatric Association,
versus the WHO who recently in the last year or
so said, you know what, We're going to classify not
sex addiction, but compulsive sexual behavior disorder, and they treat
it at like it is treated as far as like
(05:42):
you know, actual medical treatment goes like an impulse control disorder.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Okay, if I understand you correctly, because I'm just a
lay person, A disorder would be more in the mind
and the processing of information, whereas is a disease is
physiological and has.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
To do with the body, yes, exactly, and it's not
a person disorder where it's something where this is you
know exactly who you are no matter what this is
like something that like people have anxiety disorders, people are
in their personality isn't based off of anxiety. They have anxiety,
you know, Whereas you have bipolar personality disorder, their personality
(06:17):
is fixed to the actual criteria of diagnosis for that
personality type. It's two different things altogether, but in this
you have two different diagnosing groups. Basically saying sex addiction
is not actually a real thing, but compulsive sexual behavior
as far as far as the ICD goes, is a
(06:38):
real thing as far as the international community goes.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
Now here's the thing.
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Is the whole purpose of both of those coding groups,
the ICD and the DSM, is so that insurance companies
and medical groups and psychiatrists and psychologists and all of
them can have a way to build for the treatment
of this stuff. And that's where I want to get into,
because the treatment of sex addiction is a huge business
(07:07):
that doesn't necessarily equate to anything more than the same
twelve step programs that you have for chemical addiction. But
it's not necessarily treating impulse control, and it doesn't necessarily
get to the root of what is actually causing problems
for them. It could be anxiety that's leading them to
those gates.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
It could be.
Speaker 5 (07:26):
Depression, it could be any number of things. So we're
treating it as if it's an addiction, either for you know,
for convenience sake, or for you know, just so that
people can just say, hey, you know, this is the
umbrella term that we can classify all of this under.
But it doesn't actually get to the root of what
is actually happening.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
If I understand you correctly and I may not, so
please correct me.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
It sounds like you're saying that sex may be the
end result of another disorder, and sex is just the
outward manifestation of some sort of anxiety or compulsive behavior.
Speaker 5 (08:01):
Yeah, a lot of compulsive behavior originates from, like, say,
for example, anxiety.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
If people have a.
Speaker 5 (08:07):
Serious problem with anxiety, you're now brushing that over because
you're treating an addiction. Where instead, if you treat the anxiety,
it's like tipping over the first domino, and you wait
for all of the dominoes to get to the sexual
compulsive behavior, and then all of those dominoes tip it
over because you're treating the first actual problem that's leading
(08:28):
to it. And a lot of these big businesses that
are trying to treat sex addiction are ones, especially like
the ones that cost a lot of money. You saw
a lot of celebrities going to places like I'm going
to this reserve in the middle of New Mexico or
Arizona where they pay tens of thousands of dollars to
basically get twelve step program treatment with a bunch of
(08:50):
extra bells and whistles like horse therapy and a bunch
of other things that people can do to almost make
it like it's almost a performative treatment of the second
ual compulsive behavior?
Speaker 4 (09:02):
Is it somewhat like AA where you have to do
this and do that and make amends?
Speaker 2 (09:07):
And absolutely it's the similar.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
It takes the similar same twelve step approach to something
that may be an impulse control to order and not
necessarily an addiction.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
And a lot of these.
Speaker 5 (09:17):
Groups make sure that they have professionals working with them
who totally buy into addressing it from an addiction model
instead of from an actual mental health like finding what
the first domino is model.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
We got to pause there, but when we come back,
I want to talk about the real world implications of
everything we talked about. We may not have a sex addiction,
but we may have a partner who may deal with that,
and what that means for a spouse, what that means
for maybe kids in the family, and how that plays out.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Can you do that for us? Absolutely?
Speaker 4 (09:49):
It's Late with mo Kelly, Sam the sex doctor is
in and he's making a house call. Ka if I
am six forty life everywhere on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI am six forty.
Speaker 4 (10:11):
KFI later with Moe Kelly. Sam the sex doctor joins me. Sam,
let's pick it back up where we left off. We
were talking about sexual addiction, and you were it was
it was complicated even for me as far as the
distinction between a disorder and a disease. But you said
there is money in treating it as a disease, if
(10:31):
I remember correctly.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
There's big money.
Speaker 5 (10:33):
Yeah, well, it's a big money in treating it as
an addiction because you can open up addiction facility facilities
like you have substance abuse facilities. You have a bunch
of different ways like and all of them, depending on
how much you pay, kind of boil down to twelve
step programs with a bunch of extra bells and whistles
to it. But for sex and compulsive sexual behavior, I
(10:54):
don't necessarily feel like an addictive addiction model of treatment
is one that's going to be helpful or most effective,
because if you look at it, it's an impulse controlled disorder,
and the way we treat impulse control disorders are way
different than how we treat addictions.
Speaker 4 (11:10):
Right right, Okay, And before the break, I said, Hey,
I wonder how this impacts a spouse, how this impacts
a child or family in the way that you may
have a family. And I'm not trying to be funny,
but they may sit down and say, you know, daddy's
dealing with gambling issues, or he's dealing with alcohol or
(11:32):
substance issues. You, as someone who is a mental health professional,
how do you think some of these conversations go if
they go at all? When you're dealing with some sort
of sexual addiction and its impacted the family.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Well, here's the thing.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
One of the big issues when you look at it
from also an addictive model, a lot of people are
going to say, well, how much is too much? And
it comes also that comes down to whether or not
what you're doing causes you a sense of distress.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
If it's bothering you.
Speaker 5 (12:04):
If it's causing that sense of distress in you, then
it's something that can be diagnosed. If it's not causing distress,
then it's not hurting or harming yourself or anyone else.
Whatever you're doing is consensual, nothing wrong with it, then
it's fine.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Say, if you're in a.
Speaker 5 (12:15):
Committed relationship and your partner is on the same wavelength
as you, you have a very similar sex drive with
each other, and you have open communication. You may have
an open relationship that allows for you to pursue sexual
encounters with people outside of the relationship. That very same
behavior may not actually be considered addictive because it's something
(12:37):
that's within their dynamic of a relationship.
Speaker 6 (12:39):
Right.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
But if you're in a committed relationship, take that same couple,
but you only have one person who has kind of
a stronger sex drive or more of the urge of
the compulsion to engage in sexual behavior with people outside
of the relationship, then they're going to be engaging in lying,
deceit and doing one thousand and one other things to
cover up what they're doing.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
And that's the problem. Okay, But let me play the
other side of the coin. Let's say you have the
unfaithful husband and the woman and the wife and the
relationship maybe not have the same sex strive, and the
husband decides to find sex outside the marriage. Is that
actual sex addiction or garden variety cheating and selfishness.
Speaker 5 (13:19):
It depends it. Really, you have to look at it individually.
It could be somebody with something where somebody has other
emotional needs that are not being fulfilled and they find
somebody who actually gives them that sense of being desired,
and so you know, there you can have someone who's
in a sexless relationship with someone and then they see
(13:41):
somebody outside the relationship who gives them that feeling of
being desired, and then they go and have sex with them.
That does not count as sex addiction.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
That's what I wanted to know.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
So it's a matter of, like, you have everything you
need sexually in your own relationship, but you gotta go
and do deceitful stuff outside of your relationship. And that's
the thing where it's similar to when you look at
gambling disorder, where it's a process addiction quote unquote addiction.
So it's compulsive behavior where you're continually engaging in high
(14:10):
risk behavior that threatens to destabilize everything of your life.
So if you're in a marriage, it will destabilize your
marriage if you get caught and cheating, just like if
you gamble away your life savings and you're in a
relationship with someone, it will destabilize that relationship. And a
lot of times they say the same thing with a
(14:31):
gambling addiction or a gambling disorder, it's not so much
that they are addicted to winning, they're waiting to lose.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
What's the difference there.
Speaker 5 (14:43):
If you're addicted to winning, then you're going to go
back and you want to win, and winning is going
to be give you that same great feeling. And every
time you lose, you're going to be upset, but you're
going to be like, well, I want to win, And
a lot of times that leads to doubling down.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
Got it.
Speaker 5 (14:56):
But when it's the waiting to get caught, you're not
getting any pleasure out of winning anymore.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
That is so weird.
Speaker 5 (15:04):
You're just doing it because you're like, yeah, it's me continuing, me,
just being me.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
I'm a gambler and I'm good at this.
Speaker 5 (15:09):
This is what I do, and I continually keep amping
it up and pushing more and more, and I'm not
getting any more pleasure out of this anymore. It's just
me compulsively engaging in that behavior, waiting to lose everything.
And once that happens, if you have a relationship with people,
that's where a lot of times these diagnoses come. These
diagnoses also come into play not just for the sake
(15:31):
of billing and insurance. It's also as a way a
lot of times to signal to the individual.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
This is a problem.
Speaker 5 (15:38):
If you diagnose someone with impulse control disorder, they're going
to be like, okay, well that's kind of a vague
general term. I have difficulty controlling my impulses. But if
you say you have gambling disorder, you're going to be
much more likely to say I have a specific problem
that I need to get specific treatment for.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
And people view that differently. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
You know, you can listen to a commercial and they'll
say problems with gambling one to eight hundred gambler and you.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
Know, dot com or whatever it was.
Speaker 4 (16:04):
But I'm saying, you know, we look upon gambling addiction
and alcohol addiction very differently.
Speaker 5 (16:13):
Yeah, can you agree absolutely both of them. We tend
to acknowledge the powerlessness that people have when they are
afflicted by these disorders. Whenever they have substance abuse issues
or gambling issues or set like we're talking sex and
sexual sexual or compulsive sexual behavior issues, it's similar along
(16:33):
those lines. But when you have a chemical dependency, it's
obviously different. Your body does not craves and desires the thing,
and you have withdrawal symptoms and things like that, where
the withdrawal of not gambling or not having sex usually
leads to more anxiety, tension, and wanting to do.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Whatever it takes.
Speaker 5 (16:51):
You will you will break whatever boundaries or rules it
takes in order to engage in that behavior and try
to keep it hidden from the people around you.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
If we were to look five years from now, do
you think that this will be a sexual addiction will
be viewed through a lens of greater respect and taken
more seriously than it is today.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Wherever that is, or will we might move in the
other direction. I think it will.
Speaker 5 (17:19):
Be ultimately classified as a diagnosis, But I mean, honestly,
I would much rather have it classified as impulse control
disorder with a subset of you know, compulsive sexual behavior,
because it's a matter of how it gets treated. I
don't want to see sexual addiction, or the idea of
sexual addiction, the treatment of it, of compulsive sexual behavior
(17:41):
being treated along the lines of an addiction model, versus
what we how we treat stuff for impulse control disorder
like pyromania is considered impulse control disorder, kleptomania impulse control disorder.
The way you treat those things are significantly different than
how you treat addiction. And using a twelve step model.
Speaker 4 (18:01):
So you're saying that sexual addiction, I'm just using a
phraseology is closer to pyromania and kleptomania.
Speaker 5 (18:08):
It's an impulse control issue, yes, but we just want
to call it something else. We call it an addiction
because it's way easier to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
You know.
Speaker 5 (18:17):
It's like, as far as celebrities go, it's a it's
basically an umbrella term that we can throw whatever compulsive
sexual behavior, compulsive masturbation, compulsive whatever sexual under that umbrella
and say that's an addiction.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
I think it for me, it gives it a different connotation.
If you say to me, there is impulse control, it's
something that I think is something wrong with the person
that they're choosing not to address. Yeah, where if you
say addiction is well, it's out of my control. It's
beyond my control.
Speaker 5 (18:49):
Exactly, And that changes how people individually look at how
they have those issues.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
I've talked to people about this before.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
A lot of times when people look at like, say
I have sex addiction, like they look at that in
the same lens that they look at substance.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Abuse and chemical addiction.
Speaker 5 (19:07):
Where I am powerless to this I am, I'm going
to relapse, I am, and they just allow themselves to
be powerless to it. Where if you call it impulse control,
that gives people more of a sense of maybe I
can control this impulse, this feeling that I have in
this moment, I have more power over this than it
has over me, where if you have to call it addiction,
(19:29):
you're basically saying, you know, I'm powerless to this, and
you have to go through the whole twelve step program,
say that you've you are powerless to this. You have
to accept a higher power into your life. And for
people who are atheists, that's a hard buy. There's a
lot like so for atheists you can't do twelve step.
There's an eleven step I guess program for them.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
But there's it.
Speaker 5 (19:49):
You treat these things differently than you would like. You
would treat impulsive behavior differently than you would can you
would treat addictive behavior.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
We could do this all night long, no pun intended.
Speaker 4 (20:03):
But it's fascinating how sophisticated just the concept of sexual
addiction has become.
Speaker 5 (20:09):
And it's going to be something where in order to
make it easier to get built, you know, process through
insurance so make sure people are covered for their treatment.
It may just become something where it becomes a diagnosis
just for sake of convenience.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
Sam the Sex Doctor. Always good to see you, Always
a pleasure. We'll talk again next week.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI AM six forty.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Mister Kelly Later with Kelly Live.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
Everyone in I Heartradio app And often times I'll tell
you about what I'm watching or what the crew, the
Later crew was watching. I just want to make a
couple of recommendations. I was watching this limited series on
Netflix called Hostage. It has to do with the British
Prime Minister. And this is not giveaway it's in the trailer.
(21:07):
Has to do with the British Prime Minister who's a
woman and her husband is kidnapped and held hostage, and
what she needs to do to navigate the moment and
dealing with world issues. It's only I think five or
six episodes, but it's really really good. You could probably
(21:29):
do it in a day or two. But highly recommend
Hostage on Netflix. In fact, I think Mark Ronald would
probably like it if he hasn't seen it.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
I have seen it.
Speaker 6 (21:38):
It's good and that same actress, Sarenne Jones. I think
Easy on the Eyes. She's in a couple other good things.
I think on Apple or a paramountflux called Vigil. It
starts off with a murder of mystery aboard a submarine,
and then there's a short second season that takes it
someplace else.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
She's good.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I like limited series because it's not like it's about
the length of one season, but it doesn't leave you hanging.
There's the beginning, there's a middle, there's an end. There's
one complete story which is being told, and you can
move on. It's almost like an elongated movie, you know.
It's it's a you can it's I think five or
six episodes.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
You can get through it pretty quick.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
Yeah, and you, as a married person, will understand the
importance of finding something that you and your wife can
watch together without arguing about it. It solves the what
do you want to watch?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Issue? It's uh, it's inoffensive. No, we have multiple TVs.
Speaker 4 (22:31):
So she goes to one side of the house and
watches what she wants to watch, which is usually reality tells.
Speaker 6 (22:36):
Okay, right, right, but ideally sometimes you want to watch
stuff together.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
No, no, no, we don't know.
Speaker 4 (22:41):
We don't know because she likes reality TV and I
don't like reality TV.
Speaker 6 (22:45):
Do we need to get Sam back in here for you? No,
it's not a he's not a marriage counselor Okay, we
can find one of those.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
No, it's just a no. She watches her stuff. I
watch my stuff.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
Now.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
There are rare occasions, or I'll come home and she's
watching something like some series on Netflix, and I'm maybe
in the kitchen getting some food, and there's enough to
keep my interest while I'll ask her, what is this?
Are you enjoying it? And then it may inspire me
to go back and later watch it. It's a rare occasion,
(23:19):
but you know there's a possibility that will.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
She likes her stuff. I like my.
Speaker 6 (23:24):
Stuff, all right, but don't pretend you don't know what
I'm talking about. It's been said by people with more
experience than us. Then a good chunk of marriage is
discussing what you want to eat and what you're gonna watch.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
We do a lot of food conversation, yeah, a lot
of food, but not but our schedules are so different. Like,
for example, she got up lomu hair got up today
at like four in the morning.
Speaker 6 (23:47):
What Yeah, she's one of those super morning people. Do
you guys own a cow that needs milking in the morning?
Speaker 2 (23:53):
Like it? Today?
Speaker 4 (23:54):
She got up and cleaned the backyard and picked up
the dog poo and hose down the backyard, went to
work out, walked the dogs all before six thirty am.
Speaker 6 (24:04):
Oh, I know you're Amish. We've never discussed this. She
might be you're an Amish family. She did all that
before seven am?
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Was there a barn raising? I'm still snoring at this point. Okay.
Speaker 4 (24:16):
Then she goes on to work. I get up, let's say,
in an eight nine o'clock hour. Today it was a
little bit different because I had to do some Charlie
Kirk interviews for different outlets, so I was up a
little bit earlier than usual.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
But then I'm going about my way. She's already at work.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
I leave my house at around two thirty three o'clock
on average. She'll get home at maybe six or seven o'clock.
I won't get home until closer to eleven. She's already asleep,
so there's not a lot of time for conversation about, Hey.
Speaker 6 (24:46):
What do you want to watch together? So you're just
roommates is what you're saying.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Well, sometimes and that's okay.
Speaker 4 (24:52):
Sometimes, you know, one day, when you grow up and
get married, you'll understand.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Okay, if it happens, you might find the right one.
Speaker 6 (25:00):
And it's really not looking terribly likely at this point
because nobody wants to marry my student loan.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Look, I will tell you this, and I mean this
sincerely as someone who got married later in life.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Marriage is not for everyone. This is what I gather.
Speaker 6 (25:16):
Hey, something that kind of threw me about that hostage
show is that the French female president is.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Who's who's she played by.
Speaker 6 (25:26):
She's played by Julie Delpy from those before movies, the
ones with I.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Didn't know that she was born in France.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
I had seen her in other stuff and so when
I saw her just ratally off the French was like wow,
I didn't know that she was bilingual. Then I did
the whole Wikipedia search. It's like, no, no, no, she's from
France and then came to the United States.
Speaker 6 (25:48):
It's strange to see somebody from approximately our age cohort
that age. Yeah, I know, it's like the you know,
the people from the Breakfast club are all like closing.
I know, I really don't feel great about this, not at.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
All, because the math is consistent, because you realize, well,
if Anthony Michael Hall is sixty years old, and that
means then.
Speaker 6 (26:12):
No point Like Charlie Sheen is doing a round of
interviews for his new memoir. Hey, I want to check
that out as well tonight. I'm not sure if I
do or not. It's just weird to see him also
like sixty ish sixty ish, yeah, and a lot of
life in between. You know, I'm surprised he's still alive.
Life is a very generous noun for you to use.
(26:34):
I would not trade my life with his ever.
Speaker 4 (26:37):
You know, he probably has had a wonderful life, big picture,
but I would not want any parts of it, any
parts of it.
Speaker 6 (26:46):
I'm I'm trying to think about the things that I
can say without either getting fired or having Tony hit
the dump button. I'm kind of curious about the salacious
details of his memoir, but I don't really want to
kill a whole lot of time on him.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Well.
Speaker 4 (26:59):
See, that's the thing. I am going to watch the documentary.
I'm not going to read the book in the memoir.
I'm just want to I want to hear his account
and other people's contemporaneous accounts like John Cryer, you know,
maybe Denise Richards and get a sense of what that
hell was like for them, or what he was like
at his worst.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
I don't want to read about it.
Speaker 6 (27:19):
Yeah, essentially, I wish there were a cliff Notes audio
book that I could play at double speed and be
done with it.
Speaker 4 (27:24):
Well, there probably is an audiobook for his memoir. Yeah,
but it boiled down, like whittled down. Oh yeah, you
don't want like the whole book. Reading is hard, you know,
And that's something I try to tell people because people say, like,
what was the last book you read?
Speaker 6 (27:38):
It's like, I don't have the time to read. Like
books fuel, you got to have it to exist. How
can you not read?
Speaker 4 (27:46):
I consume news and media and the whole idea of read.
Now I'll listen to an audiobook. That's the distinction I make.
That doesn't count.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 4 (27:55):
I know people say that, but it's the same words
going in the same brain. You know, it's not my voice,
but it's still okay. I mean, do what you can.
There's never a time I don't have at least two
or three books going at the same time. I don't
see how people can function without that. I just don't
see how you dedicate the time. I can't sit still
that long. Well, you sit still for a portion of
each day in that one little room.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I do. But I'm actually doing something.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
I'm not just quietly holding a book in front of
me and having my eyes scan from page to page.
Speaker 6 (28:25):
What else are you doing? You're isolated?
Speaker 4 (28:28):
No, I'm honestly working on something audio related, radio related
in yes, absolutely, okay, no, no, no. I could be
looking for stories. I could be trying to book guests
every second count. I do work on a twenty four
hour schedule. I really do, and you, of all people,
should understand it, because you'll stay up until six in
(28:50):
the morning writing.
Speaker 6 (28:51):
Well, yeah, I mean we all do other stuff outside
of the office, so of course, what mean enough? Of course, fact,
I just scored another gig. I'll tell you about it.
Oo's I'm doing a chapter in book on the sixtieth
anniversary of the Prisoner TV series. That's perfect for you, Mark,
I can't wait. I've already started. It's great. I'm happy
for you, but that means alive. It's a long suffering
(29:12):
one's book, so you'll never read it no, because it
won't be that many pages. Okay, what was it like
fifty pages? It's just a chapter on each episode. And
the series only ran seventeen episodes, so I'm doing one
on an episode that touches on AI for reasons you
can probably figure out.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
So spike maybe eight pages and we'll see.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI AM six Fortyfi.
Speaker 4 (29:40):
Mister mo Kelly, It's Later with mo Kelly. We're live
everywhere the iHeartRadio app. And now that I'm back from vacation,
now that we're back into the regular swing of things,
we can get back to name that movie cult classic
the way we always love to do it giveaway prizes
starting tomorrow. I don't think there's going to be any theme,
(30:00):
but we will be giving away passes to Footage Fest
twenty five. In fact, it's going to be for their
special event on September twenty fifth, the Napoleon Dynamite screening,
the twentieth anniversary of the movie. The Star John Heater
will be in the house. There'll be a special panel
(30:21):
discussion which I will lead later that night, and you'll
be able to participate in that. So we're going to
be giving away ten pairs of tickets to footage fests
tomorrow night as part of name that movie cult classic.
And that's all provided you get past Twalla Sharp because
Twala was in a real surly mood today. He didn't
(30:43):
feel like giving away the winning tickets to a have
a tribute group performance. He just doesn't like people, and
I think Mark said something to set them.
Speaker 6 (30:55):
Off, but I know it would never happen. I'm excited
about this Napoleon Dynamite thing. Are you going to get
in to repeat some quotes from the movie?
Speaker 5 (31:02):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (31:03):
I actually I want the chickens have large towns. I
don't know I plan to do all that. What's the
point of having the star of the movie and not
go there.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Here's the thing about the movie.
Speaker 6 (31:12):
It's super super funny, and I loved it the second
I saw when I came out, and you realize there's
not a swear word in the whole thing, which is weird.
Speaker 4 (31:19):
I didn't know that. But I do want to get
a vote for Pedro's shirt.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Okay.
Speaker 6 (31:25):
I just always wanted to have one and a tether
ball in your yard back at Chateau Lamo.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Yeah, I just want to go straight nineteen seventies. Yeah, yeah,
I think the haired looked good on you. Uh yeah,
I could grow it like that.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
It just would not be as you know, there.
Speaker 6 (31:43):
Might be Yeah, there might be slight differences given certain
factors that we don't need to go into.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But the glasses and everything,
that's yeah, that was definitely me. Yeah, it looked a
lot like me. But that's tomorrow, so be sure to
tune in for that. We're going to have nothing but fun,
do you know?
Speaker 2 (32:02):
Mark?
Speaker 4 (32:03):
What I actually been to ask you is what might
be coming up in a run a report tomorrow.
Speaker 6 (32:07):
Here, let's play a little game. There's a couple different
movies opening tomorrow. We've got Downton Abbey the Final Chapter
it doesn't sound like you.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
We've got.
Speaker 6 (32:18):
What's the one about the Rob Reiner the rock star
satire this final Tap, And we've got Stephen King's The
Long Walk of those three? Which do you think it's
going to be? Stephen King? Okay, that was kind of easy. Yeah,
(32:38):
I mean, what is there even to say about the others?
Speaker 2 (32:41):
Look, I don't know, you have a very eclectic movie taste.
Speaker 6 (32:44):
Well, here's what's interesting about the King one. This is
a story from that volume called the Bachmann Books that
was It became hard to find and expensive when you
do because it's got that rage story in it about
the I believe it's a school shooting. I've never read
it because you can't find it. Was that the the
mid eighties he did the Bachman Books. It's one of
the first things he wrote, and I think The Long
Walk may be the first book he did write before Carrie.
(33:08):
But the Bachman Books had four different shorter stories, shorter
novels in it, and this is one of those. So
I'm excited to see it. It's I don't think it's
going to be a real cheerful film. It's about people
who enter a contest to walk until they all drop
and are shot to death and the winner gets something.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
It's kind of a dystopian thing. Okay, I'd watch that.
But I love King. You know that.
Speaker 6 (33:30):
I think he can do almost no wrong. But the
people who make movies based on his stuff that's been
hit and miss over the decade.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
I got a question before we get out of here,
why do you think it seems? And correct me if
I'm wrong that Stephen King never was really or not
often was actively involved in the movie portion of his adaptations.
Speaker 6 (33:49):
Well, he's a novelist, he's a writer. That's just not
his Bailey Wick and when he did it, that Maximum
Overdrive movie, I think we all saw how that turned out.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
Unfortunately we all did.
Speaker 6 (33:59):
But I believe he even admits he was just like
waist deep in coke at the time too. I think
he's sticking to what he knows, and he does a
great job at it. I've read more than anybody I
know of his works, and I still haven't been able
to read everything. He almost writes faster than I can read. Well,
(34:19):
you're barely literate, so that's not saying Well, there's no
need to get mean about it.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
MO see you tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
Maybe we'll see It's Later with Mokelly k if I
AM six forty eleve everywhere I Heart Ready wap
Speaker 1 (34:30):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI AM six forty
You're listening to Later with mo Kelly on demand from
kf I, A M six forty.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
SAMSI Sex Doc. He's a Sam Stop.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Stop Stop Sextett.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
The Sex Doc.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Kelly Later.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
Later with kf I, Later with mo Kelly Live Everywhere
on YouTube and the iHeartRadio app. Now the Sex Doctor
is in Samza and he will see us.
Speaker 5 (00:56):
Sam's good to see you this evening. What's going on, brother,
Good to see you. And I'd like to just reiterate
what Mark said in the newsroom. It's sixty nine everywhere,
so the weather is here for.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Me today too. Oh my gosh, we're off. Oh yeah
to the racist Oh yeah, Sam.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
Or earlier in the week, you and I had touched
upon the idea of sexual addiction.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
And I've had a friend I don't want to reveal
his name because he is somewhat famous, who was accused.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Of sexual addiction.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I've had and heard varying opinions about whether that's a thing.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
First, let me make it seem like it's a crime.
He's being accused of sex adiction. The way it was,
he was shamed for it. So let me put it
out there.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
Okay, addiction, Yes, is sex something that can be a
part of what is considered an impulsive addiction that someone
can't control.
Speaker 5 (01:52):
Because of the disease. That's the question. Is sex addiction
actually a real thing? And you know, you've been hearing
it with a lot of different celebrities, especially when they
have some kind of controversy come up where they get caught.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Tiger Woods is a great example of that back in.
Speaker 5 (02:10):
The day, where people are like, you know, they get
caught doing something sexual and they are regretful of it
and said they you know what, We're going to go
into a sex.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Addiction treatment facility and stuff like that.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
Well, they're celebrities and they do celebrity rehab stuff to
repair their image. But on a medical level, is there
any evidence to suggest that we know that addiction is
a thing? Yes, absolutely, we know that compulsive behavior is
a thing. We could talk about gambling, and I would
(02:43):
say that's the closest parallel. You have someone engaging in
possibly not dangerous behavior, but not necessarily sensible behavior at
their own detriment, you know, gambling way their rent or
their mortgage. Isn't there a parallel that could be drawn
between gam addiction and sexual addiction?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Now that's the thing.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
Yes, there is a very good parallel that can be
drawn between the two. I mean a lot of the
same high risk behavior, the idea of you know, risking
everything you have to either gamble again or to have
a sexual experience, especially for those who are in committed
relationships where the other person is not aware of the
(03:25):
of their partner engaging in sexual activity outside of the relationship.
That's where a lot of times people say, well, I'm
an addict, and it makes them feel very powerless to
what like, because usually whenever you look at addiction, we're
pointing at chemical substance addiction, and there's addiction there.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
You know, that doesn't mean that there's the that is.
Speaker 5 (03:43):
The only exclusive kind of addiction is chemical substance addiction.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Those are real, very real.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
Probably because that changes the brain chemistry or something else.
Speaker 5 (03:52):
It's something where you become addicted to the like to
whatever the substance is. It impacts your functioning as far
as day to day, you know, doing your day to
day responsibilities. It keep it makes it so that you
prioritize the substance over everything else.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
Oh, let me ask you that. But that's not on
a physiological level. That's just more like an emotional level,
and compulsive behavior sounds like.
Speaker 5 (04:14):
Compulsive behavior is part of what we call process addictions,
where it's we are addicted, quote unquote addicted to certain behaviors,
and that is something where you can we start to
get a little bit into the weeds with it, because
addiction is something that a lot of times people will
just classify something as addiction because it's what is easier
(04:35):
to like, it's just a way to make it a
lot easier to explain something that is something that's more
along the lines of impulse control. Okay, now that is
another diagnosis altogether. Now we got to get into the
two different schools of diagnosing. You have the ICD, which
is the International Classification of Disease.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
It's it's basically.
Speaker 5 (04:53):
The what the World Health Organization uses to classify disease
is medical conditions things like that. It also covers mental
health disorders and things like that. Now, on my side,
because I'm a mental health professional, what I do as
far as my diagnos, my diagnoses go go with the DSM,
(05:14):
the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual for Psychological Disorders.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
We are officially in the weeds now. Now this is
where now this is the thing.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
DSM is run by the APA, the American Psychiatric Association,
versus the WHO who recently in the last year or
so said, you know what, We're going to classify not
sex addiction, but compulsive sexual behavior disorder, and they treat
it at like it is treated as far as like
(05:42):
you know, actual medical treatment goes like an impulse control disorder.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Okay, if I understand you correctly, because I'm just a
lay person, A disorder would be more in the mind
and the processing of information, whereas is a disease is
physiological and has.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
To do with the body, yes, exactly, and it's not
a person disorder where it's something where this is you
know exactly who you are no matter what this is
like something that like people have anxiety disorders, people are
in their personality isn't based off of anxiety. They have anxiety,
you know, Whereas you have bipolar personality disorder, their personality
(06:17):
is fixed to the actual criteria of diagnosis for that
personality type. It's two different things altogether, but in this
you have two different diagnosing groups. Basically saying sex addiction
is not actually a real thing, but compulsive sexual behavior
as far as far as the ICD goes, is a
(06:38):
real thing as far as the international community goes.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
Now here's the thing.
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Is the whole purpose of both of those coding groups,
the ICD and the DSM, is so that insurance companies
and medical groups and psychiatrists and psychologists and all of
them can have a way to build for the treatment
of this stuff. And that's where I want to get into,
because the treatment of sex addiction is a huge business
(07:07):
that doesn't necessarily equate to anything more than the same
twelve step programs that you have for chemical addiction. But
it's not necessarily treating impulse control, and it doesn't necessarily
get to the root of what is actually causing problems
for them. It could be anxiety that's leading them to
those gates.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
It could be.
Speaker 5 (07:26):
Depression, it could be any number of things. So we're
treating it as if it's an addiction, either for you know,
for convenience sake, or for you know, just so that
people can just say, hey, you know, this is the
umbrella term that we can classify all of this under.
But it doesn't actually get to the root of what
is actually happening.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
If I understand you correctly and I may not, so
please correct me.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
It sounds like you're saying that sex may be the
end result of another disorder, and sex is just the
outward manifestation of some sort of anxiety or compulsive behavior.
Speaker 5 (08:01):
Yeah, a lot of compulsive behavior originates from, like, say,
for example, anxiety.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
If people have a.
Speaker 5 (08:07):
Serious problem with anxiety, you're now brushing that over because
you're treating an addiction. Where instead, if you treat the anxiety,
it's like tipping over the first domino, and you wait
for all of the dominoes to get to the sexual
compulsive behavior, and then all of those dominoes tip it
over because you're treating the first actual problem that's leading
(08:28):
to it. And a lot of these big businesses that
are trying to treat sex addiction are ones, especially like
the ones that cost a lot of money. You saw
a lot of celebrities going to places like I'm going
to this reserve in the middle of New Mexico or
Arizona where they pay tens of thousands of dollars to
basically get twelve step program treatment with a bunch of
(08:50):
extra bells and whistles like horse therapy and a bunch
of other things that people can do to almost make
it like it's almost a performative treatment of the second
ual compulsive behavior?
Speaker 4 (09:02):
Is it somewhat like AA where you have to do
this and do that and make amends?
Speaker 2 (09:07):
And absolutely it's the similar.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
It takes the similar same twelve step approach to something
that may be an impulse control to order and not
necessarily an addiction.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
And a lot of these.
Speaker 5 (09:17):
Groups make sure that they have professionals working with them
who totally buy into addressing it from an addiction model
instead of from an actual mental health like finding what
the first domino is model.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
We got to pause there, but when we come back,
I want to talk about the real world implications of
everything we talked about. We may not have a sex addiction,
but we may have a partner who may deal with that,
and what that means for a spouse, what that means
for maybe kids in the family, and how that plays out.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Can you do that for us? Absolutely?
Speaker 4 (09:49):
It's Late with mo Kelly, Sam the sex doctor is
in and he's making a house call. Ka if I
am six forty life everywhere on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI am six forty.
Speaker 4 (10:11):
KFI later with Moe Kelly. Sam the sex doctor joins me. Sam,
let's pick it back up where we left off. We
were talking about sexual addiction, and you were it was
it was complicated even for me as far as the
distinction between a disorder and a disease. But you said
there is money in treating it as a disease, if
(10:31):
I remember correctly.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
There's big money.
Speaker 5 (10:33):
Yeah, well, it's a big money in treating it as
an addiction because you can open up addiction facility facilities
like you have substance abuse facilities. You have a bunch
of different ways like and all of them, depending on
how much you pay, kind of boil down to twelve
step programs with a bunch of extra bells and whistles
to it. But for sex and compulsive sexual behavior, I
(10:54):
don't necessarily feel like an addictive addiction model of treatment
is one that's going to be helpful or most effective,
because if you look at it, it's an impulse controlled disorder,
and the way we treat impulse control disorders are way
different than how we treat addictions.
Speaker 4 (11:10):
Right right, Okay, And before the break, I said, Hey,
I wonder how this impacts a spouse, how this impacts
a child or family in the way that you may
have a family. And I'm not trying to be funny,
but they may sit down and say, you know, daddy's
dealing with gambling issues, or he's dealing with alcohol or
(11:32):
substance issues. You, as someone who is a mental health professional,
how do you think some of these conversations go if
they go at all? When you're dealing with some sort
of sexual addiction and its impacted the family.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Well, here's the thing.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
One of the big issues when you look at it
from also an addictive model, a lot of people are
going to say, well, how much is too much? And
it comes also that comes down to whether or not
what you're doing causes you a sense of distress.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
If it's bothering you.
Speaker 5 (12:04):
If it's causing that sense of distress in you, then
it's something that can be diagnosed. If it's not causing distress,
then it's not hurting or harming yourself or anyone else.
Whatever you're doing is consensual, nothing wrong with it, then
it's fine.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Say, if you're in a.
Speaker 5 (12:15):
Committed relationship and your partner is on the same wavelength
as you, you have a very similar sex drive with
each other, and you have open communication. You may have
an open relationship that allows for you to pursue sexual
encounters with people outside of the relationship. That very same
behavior may not actually be considered addictive because it's something
(12:37):
that's within their dynamic of a relationship.
Speaker 6 (12:39):
Right.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
But if you're in a committed relationship, take that same couple,
but you only have one person who has kind of
a stronger sex drive or more of the urge of
the compulsion to engage in sexual behavior with people outside
of the relationship, then they're going to be engaging in lying,
deceit and doing one thousand and one other things to
cover up what they're doing.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
And that's the problem. Okay, But let me play the
other side of the coin. Let's say you have the
unfaithful husband and the woman and the wife and the
relationship maybe not have the same sex strive, and the
husband decides to find sex outside the marriage. Is that
actual sex addiction or garden variety cheating and selfishness.
Speaker 5 (13:19):
It depends it. Really, you have to look at it individually.
It could be somebody with something where somebody has other
emotional needs that are not being fulfilled and they find
somebody who actually gives them that sense of being desired,
and so you know, there you can have someone who's
in a sexless relationship with someone and then they see
(13:41):
somebody outside the relationship who gives them that feeling of
being desired, and then they go and have sex with them.
That does not count as sex addiction.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
That's what I wanted to know.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
So it's a matter of, like, you have everything you
need sexually in your own relationship, but you gotta go
and do deceitful stuff outside of your relationship. And that's
the thing where it's similar to when you look at
gambling disorder, where it's a process addiction quote unquote addiction.
So it's compulsive behavior where you're continually engaging in high
(14:10):
risk behavior that threatens to destabilize everything of your life.
So if you're in a marriage, it will destabilize your
marriage if you get caught and cheating, just like if
you gamble away your life savings and you're in a
relationship with someone, it will destabilize that relationship. And a
lot of times they say the same thing with a
(14:31):
gambling addiction or a gambling disorder, it's not so much
that they are addicted to winning, they're waiting to lose.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
What's the difference there.
Speaker 5 (14:43):
If you're addicted to winning, then you're going to go
back and you want to win, and winning is going
to be give you that same great feeling. And every
time you lose, you're going to be upset, but you're
going to be like, well, I want to win, And
a lot of times that leads to doubling down.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
Got it.
Speaker 5 (14:56):
But when it's the waiting to get caught, you're not
getting any pleasure out of winning anymore.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
That is so weird.
Speaker 5 (15:04):
You're just doing it because you're like, yeah, it's me continuing, me,
just being me.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
I'm a gambler and I'm good at this.
Speaker 5 (15:09):
This is what I do, and I continually keep amping
it up and pushing more and more, and I'm not
getting any more pleasure out of this anymore. It's just
me compulsively engaging in that behavior, waiting to lose everything.
And once that happens, if you have a relationship with people,
that's where a lot of times these diagnoses come. These
diagnoses also come into play not just for the sake
(15:31):
of billing and insurance. It's also as a way a
lot of times to signal to the individual.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
This is a problem.
Speaker 5 (15:38):
If you diagnose someone with impulse control disorder, they're going
to be like, okay, well that's kind of a vague
general term. I have difficulty controlling my impulses. But if
you say you have gambling disorder, you're going to be
much more likely to say I have a specific problem
that I need to get specific treatment for.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
And people view that differently. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
You know, you can listen to a commercial and they'll
say problems with gambling one to eight hundred gambler and you.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
Know, dot com or whatever it was.
Speaker 4 (16:04):
But I'm saying, you know, we look upon gambling addiction
and alcohol addiction very differently.
Speaker 5 (16:13):
Yeah, can you agree absolutely both of them. We tend
to acknowledge the powerlessness that people have when they are
afflicted by these disorders. Whenever they have substance abuse issues
or gambling issues or set like we're talking sex and
sexual sexual or compulsive sexual behavior issues, it's similar along
(16:33):
those lines. But when you have a chemical dependency, it's
obviously different. Your body does not craves and desires the thing,
and you have withdrawal symptoms and things like that, where
the withdrawal of not gambling or not having sex usually
leads to more anxiety, tension, and wanting to do.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Whatever it takes.
Speaker 5 (16:51):
You will you will break whatever boundaries or rules it
takes in order to engage in that behavior and try
to keep it hidden from the people around you.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
If we were to look five years from now, do
you think that this will be a sexual addiction will
be viewed through a lens of greater respect and taken
more seriously than it is today.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Wherever that is, or will we might move in the
other direction. I think it will.
Speaker 5 (17:19):
Be ultimately classified as a diagnosis, But I mean, honestly,
I would much rather have it classified as impulse control
disorder with a subset of you know, compulsive sexual behavior,
because it's a matter of how it gets treated. I
don't want to see sexual addiction, or the idea of
sexual addiction, the treatment of it, of compulsive sexual behavior
(17:41):
being treated along the lines of an addiction model, versus
what we how we treat stuff for impulse control disorder
like pyromania is considered impulse control disorder, kleptomania impulse control disorder.
The way you treat those things are significantly different than
how you treat addiction. And using a twelve step model.
Speaker 4 (18:01):
So you're saying that sexual addiction, I'm just using a
phraseology is closer to pyromania and kleptomania.
Speaker 5 (18:08):
It's an impulse control issue, yes, but we just want
to call it something else. We call it an addiction
because it's way easier to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
You know.
Speaker 5 (18:17):
It's like, as far as celebrities go, it's a it's
basically an umbrella term that we can throw whatever compulsive
sexual behavior, compulsive masturbation, compulsive whatever sexual under that umbrella
and say that's an addiction.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
I think it for me, it gives it a different connotation.
If you say to me, there is impulse control, it's
something that I think is something wrong with the person
that they're choosing not to address. Yeah, where if you
say addiction is well, it's out of my control. It's
beyond my control.
Speaker 5 (18:49):
Exactly, And that changes how people individually look at how
they have those issues.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
I've talked to people about this before.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
A lot of times when people look at like, say
I have sex addiction, like they look at that in
the same lens that they look at substance.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Abuse and chemical addiction.
Speaker 5 (19:07):
Where I am powerless to this I am, I'm going
to relapse, I am, and they just allow themselves to
be powerless to it. Where if you call it impulse control,
that gives people more of a sense of maybe I
can control this impulse, this feeling that I have in
this moment, I have more power over this than it
has over me, where if you have to call it addiction,
(19:29):
you're basically saying, you know, I'm powerless to this, and
you have to go through the whole twelve step program,
say that you've you are powerless to this. You have
to accept a higher power into your life. And for
people who are atheists, that's a hard buy. There's a
lot like so for atheists you can't do twelve step.
There's an eleven step I guess program for them.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
But there's it.
Speaker 5 (19:49):
You treat these things differently than you would like. You
would treat impulsive behavior differently than you would can you
would treat addictive behavior.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
We could do this all night long, no pun intended.
Speaker 4 (20:03):
But it's fascinating how sophisticated just the concept of sexual
addiction has become.
Speaker 5 (20:09):
And it's going to be something where in order to
make it easier to get built, you know, process through
insurance so make sure people are covered for their treatment.
It may just become something where it becomes a diagnosis
just for sake of convenience.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
Sam the Sex Doctor. Always good to see you, Always
a pleasure. We'll talk again next week.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI AM six forty.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Mister Kelly Later with Kelly Live.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
Everyone in I Heartradio app And often times I'll tell
you about what I'm watching or what the crew, the
Later crew was watching. I just want to make a
couple of recommendations. I was watching this limited series on
Netflix called Hostage. It has to do with the British
Prime Minister. And this is not giveaway it's in the trailer.
(21:07):
Has to do with the British Prime Minister who's a
woman and her husband is kidnapped and held hostage, and
what she needs to do to navigate the moment and
dealing with world issues. It's only I think five or
six episodes, but it's really really good. You could probably
(21:29):
do it in a day or two. But highly recommend
Hostage on Netflix. In fact, I think Mark Ronald would
probably like it if he hasn't seen it.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
I have seen it.
Speaker 6 (21:38):
It's good and that same actress, Sarenne Jones. I think
Easy on the Eyes. She's in a couple other good things.
I think on Apple or a paramountflux called Vigil. It
starts off with a murder of mystery aboard a submarine,
and then there's a short second season that takes it
someplace else.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
She's good.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I like limited series because it's not like it's about
the length of one season, but it doesn't leave you hanging.
There's the beginning, there's a middle, there's an end. There's
one complete story which is being told, and you can
move on. It's almost like an elongated movie, you know.
It's it's a you can it's I think five or
six episodes.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
You can get through it pretty quick.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
Yeah, and you, as a married person, will understand the
importance of finding something that you and your wife can
watch together without arguing about it. It solves the what
do you want to watch?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Issue? It's uh, it's inoffensive. No, we have multiple TVs.
Speaker 4 (22:31):
So she goes to one side of the house and
watches what she wants to watch, which is usually reality tells.
Speaker 6 (22:36):
Okay, right, right, but ideally sometimes you want to watch
stuff together.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
No, no, no, we don't know.
Speaker 4 (22:41):
We don't know because she likes reality TV and I
don't like reality TV.
Speaker 6 (22:45):
Do we need to get Sam back in here for you? No,
it's not a he's not a marriage counselor Okay, we
can find one of those.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
No, it's just a no. She watches her stuff. I
watch my stuff.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
Now.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
There are rare occasions, or I'll come home and she's
watching something like some series on Netflix, and I'm maybe
in the kitchen getting some food, and there's enough to
keep my interest while I'll ask her, what is this?
Are you enjoying it? And then it may inspire me
to go back and later watch it. It's a rare occasion,
(23:19):
but you know there's a possibility that will.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
She likes her stuff. I like my.
Speaker 6 (23:24):
Stuff, all right, but don't pretend you don't know what
I'm talking about. It's been said by people with more
experience than us. Then a good chunk of marriage is
discussing what you want to eat and what you're gonna watch.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
We do a lot of food conversation, yeah, a lot
of food, but not but our schedules are so different. Like,
for example, she got up lomu hair got up today
at like four in the morning.
Speaker 6 (23:47):
What Yeah, she's one of those super morning people. Do
you guys own a cow that needs milking in the morning?
Speaker 2 (23:53):
Like it? Today?
Speaker 4 (23:54):
She got up and cleaned the backyard and picked up
the dog poo and hose down the backyard, went to
work out, walked the dogs all before six thirty am.
Speaker 6 (24:04):
Oh, I know you're Amish. We've never discussed this. She
might be you're an Amish family. She did all that
before seven am?
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Was there a barn raising? I'm still snoring at this point. Okay.
Speaker 4 (24:16):
Then she goes on to work. I get up, let's say,
in an eight nine o'clock hour. Today it was a
little bit different because I had to do some Charlie
Kirk interviews for different outlets, so I was up a
little bit earlier than usual.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
But then I'm going about my way. She's already at work.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
I leave my house at around two thirty three o'clock
on average. She'll get home at maybe six or seven o'clock.
I won't get home until closer to eleven. She's already asleep,
so there's not a lot of time for conversation about, Hey.
Speaker 6 (24:46):
What do you want to watch together? So you're just
roommates is what you're saying.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Well, sometimes and that's okay.
Speaker 4 (24:52):
Sometimes, you know, one day, when you grow up and
get married, you'll understand.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Okay, if it happens, you might find the right one.
Speaker 6 (25:00):
And it's really not looking terribly likely at this point
because nobody wants to marry my student loan.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Look, I will tell you this, and I mean this
sincerely as someone who got married later in life.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Marriage is not for everyone. This is what I gather.
Speaker 6 (25:16):
Hey, something that kind of threw me about that hostage
show is that the French female president is.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Who's who's she played by.
Speaker 6 (25:26):
She's played by Julie Delpy from those before movies, the
ones with I.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Didn't know that she was born in France.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
I had seen her in other stuff and so when
I saw her just ratally off the French was like wow,
I didn't know that she was bilingual. Then I did
the whole Wikipedia search. It's like, no, no, no, she's from
France and then came to the United States.
Speaker 6 (25:48):
It's strange to see somebody from approximately our age cohort
that age. Yeah, I know, it's like the you know,
the people from the Breakfast club are all like closing.
I know, I really don't feel great about this, not at.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
All, because the math is consistent, because you realize, well,
if Anthony Michael Hall is sixty years old, and that
means then.
Speaker 6 (26:12):
No point Like Charlie Sheen is doing a round of
interviews for his new memoir. Hey, I want to check
that out as well tonight. I'm not sure if I
do or not. It's just weird to see him also
like sixty ish sixty ish, yeah, and a lot of
life in between. You know, I'm surprised he's still alive.
Life is a very generous noun for you to use.
(26:34):
I would not trade my life with his ever.
Speaker 4 (26:37):
You know, he probably has had a wonderful life, big picture,
but I would not want any parts of it, any
parts of it.
Speaker 6 (26:46):
I'm I'm trying to think about the things that I
can say without either getting fired or having Tony hit
the dump button. I'm kind of curious about the salacious
details of his memoir, but I don't really want to
kill a whole lot of time on him.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Well.
Speaker 4 (26:59):
See, that's the thing. I am going to watch the documentary.
I'm not going to read the book in the memoir.
I'm just want to I want to hear his account
and other people's contemporaneous accounts like John Cryer, you know,
maybe Denise Richards and get a sense of what that
hell was like for them, or what he was like
at his worst.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
I don't want to read about it.
Speaker 6 (27:19):
Yeah, essentially, I wish there were a cliff Notes audio
book that I could play at double speed and be
done with it.
Speaker 4 (27:24):
Well, there probably is an audiobook for his memoir. Yeah,
but it boiled down, like whittled down. Oh yeah, you
don't want like the whole book. Reading is hard, you know,
And that's something I try to tell people because people say, like,
what was the last book you read?
Speaker 6 (27:38):
It's like, I don't have the time to read. Like
books fuel, you got to have it to exist. How
can you not read?
Speaker 4 (27:46):
I consume news and media and the whole idea of read.
Now I'll listen to an audiobook. That's the distinction I make.
That doesn't count.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 4 (27:55):
I know people say that, but it's the same words
going in the same brain. You know, it's not my voice,
but it's still okay. I mean, do what you can.
There's never a time I don't have at least two
or three books going at the same time. I don't
see how people can function without that. I just don't
see how you dedicate the time. I can't sit still
that long. Well, you sit still for a portion of
each day in that one little room.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I do. But I'm actually doing something.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
I'm not just quietly holding a book in front of
me and having my eyes scan from page to page.
Speaker 6 (28:25):
What else are you doing? You're isolated?
Speaker 4 (28:28):
No, I'm honestly working on something audio related, radio related
in yes, absolutely, okay, no, no, no. I could be
looking for stories. I could be trying to book guests
every second count. I do work on a twenty four
hour schedule. I really do, and you, of all people,
should understand it, because you'll stay up until six in
(28:50):
the morning writing.
Speaker 6 (28:51):
Well, yeah, I mean we all do other stuff outside
of the office, so of course, what mean enough? Of course, fact,
I just scored another gig. I'll tell you about it.
Oo's I'm doing a chapter in book on the sixtieth
anniversary of the Prisoner TV series. That's perfect for you, Mark,
I can't wait. I've already started. It's great. I'm happy
for you, but that means alive. It's a long suffering
(29:12):
one's book, so you'll never read it no, because it
won't be that many pages. Okay, what was it like
fifty pages? It's just a chapter on each episode. And
the series only ran seventeen episodes, so I'm doing one
on an episode that touches on AI for reasons you
can probably figure out.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
So spike maybe eight pages and we'll see.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI AM six Fortyfi.
Speaker 4 (29:40):
Mister mo Kelly, It's Later with mo Kelly. We're live
everywhere the iHeartRadio app. And now that I'm back from vacation,
now that we're back into the regular swing of things,
we can get back to name that movie cult classic
the way we always love to do it giveaway prizes
starting tomorrow. I don't think there's going to be any theme,
(30:00):
but we will be giving away passes to Footage Fest
twenty five. In fact, it's going to be for their
special event on September twenty fifth, the Napoleon Dynamite screening,
the twentieth anniversary of the movie. The Star John Heater
will be in the house. There'll be a special panel
(30:21):
discussion which I will lead later that night, and you'll
be able to participate in that. So we're going to
be giving away ten pairs of tickets to footage fests
tomorrow night as part of name that movie cult classic.
And that's all provided you get past Twalla Sharp because
Twala was in a real surly mood today. He didn't
(30:43):
feel like giving away the winning tickets to a have
a tribute group performance. He just doesn't like people, and
I think Mark said something to set them.
Speaker 6 (30:55):
Off, but I know it would never happen. I'm excited
about this Napoleon Dynamite thing. Are you going to get
in to repeat some quotes from the movie?
Speaker 5 (31:02):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (31:03):
I actually I want the chickens have large towns. I
don't know I plan to do all that. What's the
point of having the star of the movie and not
go there.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Here's the thing about the movie.
Speaker 6 (31:12):
It's super super funny, and I loved it the second
I saw when I came out, and you realize there's
not a swear word in the whole thing, which is weird.
Speaker 4 (31:19):
I didn't know that. But I do want to get
a vote for Pedro's shirt.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Okay.
Speaker 6 (31:25):
I just always wanted to have one and a tether
ball in your yard back at Chateau Lamo.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Yeah, I just want to go straight nineteen seventies. Yeah, yeah,
I think the haired looked good on you. Uh yeah,
I could grow it like that.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
It just would not be as you know, there.
Speaker 6 (31:43):
Might be Yeah, there might be slight differences given certain
factors that we don't need to go into.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But the glasses and everything,
that's yeah, that was definitely me. Yeah, it looked a
lot like me. But that's tomorrow, so be sure to
tune in for that. We're going to have nothing but fun,
do you know?
Speaker 2 (32:02):
Mark?
Speaker 4 (32:03):
What I actually been to ask you is what might
be coming up in a run a report tomorrow.
Speaker 6 (32:07):
Here, let's play a little game. There's a couple different
movies opening tomorrow. We've got Downton Abbey the Final Chapter
it doesn't sound like you.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
We've got.
Speaker 6 (32:18):
What's the one about the Rob Reiner the rock star
satire this final Tap, And we've got Stephen King's The
Long Walk of those three? Which do you think it's
going to be? Stephen King? Okay, that was kind of easy. Yeah,
(32:38):
I mean, what is there even to say about the others?
Speaker 2 (32:41):
Look, I don't know, you have a very eclectic movie taste.
Speaker 6 (32:44):
Well, here's what's interesting about the King one. This is
a story from that volume called the Bachmann Books that
was It became hard to find and expensive when you
do because it's got that rage story in it about
the I believe it's a school shooting. I've never read
it because you can't find it. Was that the the
mid eighties he did the Bachman Books. It's one of
the first things he wrote, and I think The Long
Walk may be the first book he did write before Carrie.
(33:08):
But the Bachman Books had four different shorter stories, shorter
novels in it, and this is one of those. So
I'm excited to see it. It's I don't think it's
going to be a real cheerful film. It's about people
who enter a contest to walk until they all drop
and are shot to death and the winner gets something.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
It's kind of a dystopian thing. Okay, I'd watch that.
But I love King. You know that.
Speaker 6 (33:30):
I think he can do almost no wrong. But the
people who make movies based on his stuff that's been
hit and miss over the decade.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
I got a question before we get out of here,
why do you think it seems? And correct me if
I'm wrong that Stephen King never was really or not
often was actively involved in the movie portion of his adaptations.
Speaker 6 (33:49):
Well, he's a novelist, he's a writer. That's just not
his Bailey Wick and when he did it, that Maximum
Overdrive movie, I think we all saw how that turned out.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
Unfortunately we all did.
Speaker 6 (33:59):
But I believe he even admits he was just like
waist deep in coke at the time too. I think
he's sticking to what he knows, and he does a
great job at it. I've read more than anybody I
know of his works, and I still haven't been able
to read everything. He almost writes faster than I can read. Well,
(34:19):
you're barely literate, so that's not saying Well, there's no
need to get mean about it.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
MO see you tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
Maybe we'll see It's Later with Mokelly k if I
AM six forty eleve everywhere I Heart Ready wap
Speaker 1 (34:30):
You're listening to Later with Moe Kelly on demand from
KFI AM six forty
Later, with Mo'Kelly News
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