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September 3, 2025 41 mins

In a special Book Club episode, Julia Gillard sits down with Global Institute for Women’s Leadership Chair Professor Michelle Ryan to discuss The Book of Guilt by New Zealand author Catherine Chidgey.


The Book of Guilt is a deeply unsettling exploration of autonomy, identity, and morality.


It’s set in an alternate England in 1979 – where Hitler’s assassination in 1943 led to a negotiated peace and a chillingly different trajectory for post-war Britain.


The story follows three identical boys: Vincent, William, and Lawrence, who are the last remaining residents of a bleak, run-down state children’s institution. 


The boys are part of a mysterious government project, called The Sycamore Scheme, subjected to meticulous routines, daily medication, and round-the-clock surveillance.


In a conversation recorded at GIWL at ANU in Canberra, Julia and Michelle discuss the book’s twists and turns, and how it explores humankind’s treatment of those deemed “the other’.


Show notes:


The Book of Guilt by Catherine Chidgey is published by Penguin Books and is available at all good bookstores.




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