October 11, 2025 • 9 mins
The last seven days has been quite incredible in asset markets. We have Wall Street and the ASX200 trading near a record level, gold and Bitcoin and even Pokemon cards hitting an all-time high.
But is it a bubble or not? Sean Aylmer and Adam Lang talk through the consequences of what's going on in the world of assets at the moment.
The information in this episode is general in nature, and doesn’t take into account your own circumstances. You should do your own research and seek professional advice before making investment decisions.
Find out more: https://fearandgreed.com.au/
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Welcome to Fear and Greed, a Q and A where
we ask and answer questions about business, investing, economics, politics,
and more. I'm Suan Alma. The last seven days has
been quite incredible in asset markets. We have Wall Street
trading near a record level. The ASEX two hundreds also
newer record level, not doing quite as well as Wall Street, admittedly,
(00:28):
but still has only seventy or eighty points behind its
all time high. Golden in all time high. Bitcoin it
an all time high. In fact, Pokemon cards hit an
all time high. All sorts of assets classes doing very well.
But is it a bubble or not?
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Now?
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Remember, anytime you are thinking about investing, you should always
get financial device. This is not an investment podcast. To
help me think through the consequences of what's going on
in the world of assets at the moment. A welcome,
Adam Lang Adam, Welcome to Sunday.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Q and a Hello Sean.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
So off the top, what do you eving about these
asset prices with equities and gold and bitcoin and other
cryptocurrencies at record levels and Pokemon cards but maybe we'll
just sleeve them aside for the moment.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Well, can I confess something very personal here, Sean. Yes,
I'm you know, I have a pretty cautious outlook in
terms certainly in terms of my investor appetite, but I'm
feeling like it's very highly valued and so I'm normally
a nervous investor, but at the moment I think that
(01:40):
anxiety is a little higher than it has been through
my life. And I'm just looking at so many things
and not a relentless crawl upwards, but seemingly continual increases
in valuations. And so we've got global geopolitical issues, We've
got probably a cautious approach on inflation. Have we really
(02:03):
got it under control around the world and including in Australia.
And then you've got given asset classes and this growing
pot of superannuation money in our country. What are we
the fourth biggest fund in the world now? And so
we've just got so many I guess variables that are
supporting high valuations and that makes me a little bit nervous.
(02:23):
So how are you seeing it?
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Look, I think it's a well, let's talk equities first,
right and to help and I have nots as Lachland
Halloway from morning Star faked Us during the week is
talking about the fact that if you take the big
four banks and We's Farmers out of the market, our
market isn't that hot. It's just that Commonwealth Bank, Westpac, National,
Australia Bank and A and Z have done so well,
(02:46):
as has We's Farmers. There are a bunch of other stocks,
the HP Rio, Tinto, Forteskew Metals Group, Woolworths is another
big one, CSL throw them in that just even the
energy companies that just haven't done so well. So in
a sense, it's a very I was going to do.
What's that word, bifurcated. I never had to use that. Yeah,
(03:08):
bifurcated market where you have the haves and have nots.
And I think that explains equities away. I agree. I mean,
I think it's overpriced to the moment equities. But what
you will find is that some stocks, and you're already
seeing it a little bit with the banks, they will
come back to the pack and other stocks will do well.
(03:28):
So when what Lachlan said the three stocks and he
nominated that he thought he was interested in Woolworth's, CSL
and Santos, Now that's contra and investing almost because there
are plenty of people who say, I mean all those
three stocks are down Trodam. The other interesting thing I
think inequities is the comeback of the small cap market.
(03:48):
And for years we expected them to outperform the large caps,
didn't do it. This year they are, so I think
that's where that is in inequities. Let's turn to bitcoin.
Can you believe at it that bitcoin in some ways
is considered a safe haven asset.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
I know you talked about this, I know I've talked
about it. I'm still in disbelief, you know. In essence,
bitcoin is one of those things that's just worth what
people think it's worth. It doesn't give you a return
on your investment, it doesn't pay dividend. It's just what
a reflection of demand for what is obviously in fixed
supply or relatively tight supply. And short answer Sean, No,
(04:29):
I can't. I can't. Yes, US one hundred and twenty
five thousand dollars. I mean this is an extraordinary large
amount of money.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Yeah. I mean what I find interesting is that its
credibility is such, thanks in part to the US and
slash the Trump White House, that people are replacing holding
the currencies holding the US dollar, the Japanese yen the
euro with holding crypto and particularly bitcoin. Now the bunch
(04:58):
of reasons why you don't like the US dollar at
the MA I mean people still it's devalued thirty percent
against the against bitcoin this year alone. That's very much
on the back of fears of what's going on there.
Japan's got a new prime minister that'sen its currency lower.
The Euro. Well, the French had a new prime minister
and now needs another one. I think he lasted twenty
(05:18):
four hours or they're about to announce a new cabinet.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
But yeah, Theresa May her record's.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
He's just fleaten the trees and may record. The euro
is definitely on well on the nose this week, and
so you know where you're going to put your money,
I mean the Aussie dollar for let's face it, it's
not a major currency. So suddenly you're getting bitcoin as
a place to park funds, which truly extraordinary, I mean
truly extraordinary.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Yeah. Can I ask a question on bitcoin though, because
amongst the cryptocurrencies, it's almost feeling like a cryptocurrency and
bitcoin are synonymous, meaning that we cryptocurrencies is obviously the category,
right and then but we talk about Bitcoin, almost as
if they're one and the same thing, because Bitcoin is
so dominant in cryptocurrency, but there are so many others.
(06:11):
There's like hundreds of them.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
In fact, that's another market, which is what's the word
I was using, bifurcated. There are certain ether solano some
of those currencies are actually tradingly at higher levels. Some
of them may record levels well, well, maybe not what
I think you're finding in the cryptocurrency market, though it
is being found out a bit. So there are hundreds
(06:35):
of mean coins might have zero value nowadays, and cryptos
sometimes those with good technology behind them. There's kind of
a handful of top ones and I'm talking four or
five they seem to be doing very well, whereas the
rest of the market less. So, so I think there
is a little bit more rationality coming into that market,
which is good.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yeah, what about do you think the longer this goes on? Right,
in a way, if the world's banks got together and
said we're going to create an international digital currency, that
it could disrupt this market entirely. But the longer this
market goes on, it feels like the less likely that
threat is real.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Yes, I don't know the answer to that, Adam, because
I mean central b If you get a central bank
digital currency, how does that play out? Because the banks
are working on that. I'm still not a huge fan
of bitcoin. I get that we now have you know,
ETF funds, exchange traded funds for bitcoin. We have a
(07:41):
US government which is pro bitcoin, so you're probably right,
You're probably right. I still just it doesn't have anything
backing it. It still worries me. Look, we're running out
of time, so we've got to quickly talk about gold,
and I think gold, You mind if I go first
on this one. I think you know, gold that OVERFO
thousand and US dollars and hours as it hit this week,
(08:02):
I think that demonstrates just how fearful markets are, and
that's why you should worry about equities. That's why you
should worry about bitcoin, because gold safe haven status been
around ever since Bretton Woods in the forties. Well probably
well before that in fact, but given the price of
it at the moment, it just shows how really sensible investors,
(08:24):
and I suppose mostly I'm talking about central banks here,
but also institutional investors are rushing to gold, and I
think that in itself tells the story about other asset
prices like equities and bitcoin potentially being overvalued. I don't know.
I noticed something was gold and Sacks during the week
(08:45):
came out and said gold will go to forty nine
hundred US dollars and ounce crazy prices for that asset.
Crazy prices. But when people are talking like that, it just.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Suggests, yeah, another twenty percent.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Is a little bit crazy. Maybe at the moment.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Oh, I think it's a great point.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Well, mate, what a good place to leave it, Adam,
thank you very much for having a chat this morning.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Thank you to being my pleasure.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
That was a weekend edition of Fear and Greed Q
and A. Remember this is general information only and you
should always see professional advice before making investment decisions. I'm
Sean Aelma Enjoy your day.
Welcome to Fear and Greed, a Q and A where
we ask and answer questions about business, investing, economics, politics,
and more. I'm Suan Alma. The last seven days has
been quite incredible in asset markets. We have Wall Street
trading near a record level. The ASEX two hundreds also
newer record level, not doing quite as well as Wall Street, admittedly,
(00:28):
but still has only seventy or eighty points behind its
all time high. Golden in all time high. Bitcoin it
an all time high. In fact, Pokemon cards hit an
all time high. All sorts of assets classes doing very well.
But is it a bubble or not?
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Now?
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Remember, anytime you are thinking about investing, you should always
get financial device. This is not an investment podcast. To
help me think through the consequences of what's going on
in the world of assets at the moment. A welcome,
Adam Lang Adam, Welcome to Sunday.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Q and a Hello Sean.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
So off the top, what do you eving about these
asset prices with equities and gold and bitcoin and other
cryptocurrencies at record levels and Pokemon cards but maybe we'll
just sleeve them aside for the moment.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Well, can I confess something very personal here, Sean. Yes,
I'm you know, I have a pretty cautious outlook in
terms certainly in terms of my investor appetite, but I'm
feeling like it's very highly valued and so I'm normally
a nervous investor, but at the moment I think that
(01:40):
anxiety is a little higher than it has been through
my life. And I'm just looking at so many things
and not a relentless crawl upwards, but seemingly continual increases
in valuations. And so we've got global geopolitical issues, We've
got probably a cautious approach on inflation. Have we really
(02:03):
got it under control around the world and including in Australia.
And then you've got given asset classes and this growing
pot of superannuation money in our country. What are we
the fourth biggest fund in the world now? And so
we've just got so many I guess variables that are
supporting high valuations and that makes me a little bit nervous.
(02:23):
So how are you seeing it?
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Look, I think it's a well, let's talk equities first,
right and to help and I have nots as Lachland
Halloway from morning Star faked Us during the week is
talking about the fact that if you take the big
four banks and We's Farmers out of the market, our
market isn't that hot. It's just that Commonwealth Bank, Westpac, National,
Australia Bank and A and Z have done so well,
(02:46):
as has We's Farmers. There are a bunch of other stocks,
the HP Rio, Tinto, Forteskew Metals Group, Woolworths is another
big one, CSL throw them in that just even the
energy companies that just haven't done so well. So in
a sense, it's a very I was going to do.
What's that word, bifurcated. I never had to use that. Yeah,
(03:08):
bifurcated market where you have the haves and have nots.
And I think that explains equities away. I agree. I mean,
I think it's overpriced to the moment equities. But what
you will find is that some stocks, and you're already
seeing it a little bit with the banks, they will
come back to the pack and other stocks will do well.
(03:28):
So when what Lachlan said the three stocks and he
nominated that he thought he was interested in Woolworth's, CSL
and Santos, Now that's contra and investing almost because there
are plenty of people who say, I mean all those
three stocks are down Trodam. The other interesting thing I
think inequities is the comeback of the small cap market.
(03:48):
And for years we expected them to outperform the large caps,
didn't do it. This year they are, so I think
that's where that is in inequities. Let's turn to bitcoin.
Can you believe at it that bitcoin in some ways
is considered a safe haven asset.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
I know you talked about this, I know I've talked
about it. I'm still in disbelief, you know. In essence,
bitcoin is one of those things that's just worth what
people think it's worth. It doesn't give you a return
on your investment, it doesn't pay dividend. It's just what
a reflection of demand for what is obviously in fixed
supply or relatively tight supply. And short answer Sean, No,
(04:29):
I can't. I can't. Yes, US one hundred and twenty
five thousand dollars. I mean this is an extraordinary large
amount of money.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Yeah. I mean what I find interesting is that its
credibility is such, thanks in part to the US and
slash the Trump White House, that people are replacing holding
the currencies holding the US dollar, the Japanese yen the
euro with holding crypto and particularly bitcoin. Now the bunch
(04:58):
of reasons why you don't like the US dollar at
the MA I mean people still it's devalued thirty percent
against the against bitcoin this year alone. That's very much
on the back of fears of what's going on there.
Japan's got a new prime minister that'sen its currency lower.
The Euro. Well, the French had a new prime minister
and now needs another one. I think he lasted twenty
(05:18):
four hours or they're about to announce a new cabinet.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
But yeah, Theresa May her record's.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
He's just fleaten the trees and may record. The euro
is definitely on well on the nose this week, and
so you know where you're going to put your money,
I mean the Aussie dollar for let's face it, it's
not a major currency. So suddenly you're getting bitcoin as
a place to park funds, which truly extraordinary, I mean
truly extraordinary.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Yeah. Can I ask a question on bitcoin though, because
amongst the cryptocurrencies, it's almost feeling like a cryptocurrency and
bitcoin are synonymous, meaning that we cryptocurrencies is obviously the category,
right and then but we talk about Bitcoin, almost as
if they're one and the same thing, because Bitcoin is
so dominant in cryptocurrency, but there are so many others.
(06:11):
There's like hundreds of them.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
In fact, that's another market, which is what's the word
I was using, bifurcated. There are certain ether solano some
of those currencies are actually tradingly at higher levels. Some
of them may record levels well, well, maybe not what
I think you're finding in the cryptocurrency market, though it
is being found out a bit. So there are hundreds
(06:35):
of mean coins might have zero value nowadays, and cryptos
sometimes those with good technology behind them. There's kind of
a handful of top ones and I'm talking four or
five they seem to be doing very well, whereas the
rest of the market less. So, so I think there
is a little bit more rationality coming into that market,
which is good.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yeah, what about do you think the longer this goes on? Right,
in a way, if the world's banks got together and
said we're going to create an international digital currency, that
it could disrupt this market entirely. But the longer this
market goes on, it feels like the less likely that
threat is real.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Yes, I don't know the answer to that, Adam, because
I mean central b If you get a central bank
digital currency, how does that play out? Because the banks
are working on that. I'm still not a huge fan
of bitcoin. I get that we now have you know,
ETF funds, exchange traded funds for bitcoin. We have a
(07:41):
US government which is pro bitcoin, so you're probably right,
You're probably right. I still just it doesn't have anything
backing it. It still worries me. Look, we're running out
of time, so we've got to quickly talk about gold,
and I think gold, You mind if I go first
on this one. I think you know, gold that OVERFO
thousand and US dollars and hours as it hit this week,
(08:02):
I think that demonstrates just how fearful markets are, and
that's why you should worry about equities. That's why you
should worry about bitcoin, because gold safe haven status been
around ever since Bretton Woods in the forties. Well probably
well before that in fact, but given the price of
it at the moment, it just shows how really sensible investors,
(08:24):
and I suppose mostly I'm talking about central banks here,
but also institutional investors are rushing to gold, and I
think that in itself tells the story about other asset
prices like equities and bitcoin potentially being overvalued. I don't know.
I noticed something was gold and Sacks during the week
(08:45):
came out and said gold will go to forty nine
hundred US dollars and ounce crazy prices for that asset.
Crazy prices. But when people are talking like that, it just.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Suggests, yeah, another twenty percent.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Is a little bit crazy. Maybe at the moment.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Oh, I think it's a great point.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Well, mate, what a good place to leave it, Adam,
thank you very much for having a chat this morning.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Thank you to being my pleasure.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
That was a weekend edition of Fear and Greed Q
and A. Remember this is general information only and you
should always see professional advice before making investment decisions. I'm
Sean Aelma Enjoy your day.
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