July 1, 2025 • 25 mins
George sits down with actor Darryl Stephens and writer/director Patrik-Ian Polk of Noah’s Arc, the groundbreaking TV show that came out 20 years ago, centering Black Queer characters on screen. Now, they're back with a brand-new Noah’s Arc movie on Paramount+. Darryl and Patrik-Ian talk to George about the original show, and what it felt like returning to that world in the current political climate.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
He was creating a utopia, a very colorful and richly
textured world with these characters. There's such a specific vision
to Noah's Ark. I don't feel like anything else has
really come close to it.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
That's Darryl Stevens, who plays the title character of Noah
in the iconic TV series Noah's Ark. He's talking about
the groundbreaking world that the show's writer Patrick A.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Poe created.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
If you haven't heard, Noah and the crew are back
in an all new movies streaming now on Paramount Plus.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
And don't worry, it is still trendset.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
We had a lot of things in the film that
were I think that are now in vogue.
Speaker 5 (00:41):
This monologue in the beginning.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Is, yes, the world is ending, but we are resilient
and we will figure this out.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
We will endure the times.
Speaker 5 (00:52):
We're in now.
Speaker 6 (00:52):
Who knew.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
I had the opportunity to sit down with both of them,
actor and writer, to not own, to discuss what it
was like to return to Noah after twenty years, but
also how art moves society forward, what stayed the same,
what has changed, and what the future holds for all
of us.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Singing in them heavy handed with the world take a.
Speaker 5 (01:20):
Super branded he spoke a guy you know what the plan.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Is, or became a Latin you know when to understand me.
My name is George M.
Speaker 5 (01:28):
Johnson.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I am the New York Times bestselling author of the
book All Boys Aren't Blue, which is the number one
most challenged.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
Book in the United States. This is Fighting Words, a.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Show where we take you to the front lines of
the culture wars with the people who are using their
words to make change and who refuse to be silenced.
Today's guests are darl Stevens and Patrick ian Polk. Daryl
and Patrick, I want to welcome you to my podcast,
(02:00):
Fighting Words. I'd like to think that this podcast isn't
possible without the work that you two have done in communities.
Dah Honestly, I am big on giving flowers. As the
author of a book All Boys Aren't Blue. That doesn't
happen unless we have someone breaking barriers for us. Like
show Not was ARCTD for me. I was in college
when it came out. I wouldn't say I was closetive
(02:22):
because you can't closet this. I think everybody else knew
it about me watching that show. I was struggling. Everybody
knew I was like, I was always a little sassy thing,
even when I joined a fraternity. But having a show
like that, you know, twenty years ago, it really meant
the world to some of us. So sneaking to watch
the show just to give like a little bit of
peace or a little bit of feeling of like, oh,
(02:44):
that's a community that's out there for me one day.
So I just want to start off by saying, thank you.
What does it feel like twenty years later, the nostalgia
for people like me, but also now introducing Noah to
a brand new audience of I would say, young queer
people who are just out at a time when we're
trying to be silenced.
Speaker 4 (03:03):
When I envisioned the show was creating this sort of
gay black utopia that these characters lived in, existed.
Speaker 6 (03:13):
In a black gay bubble kind of right, yeah.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
You know, so it wasn't really.
Speaker 4 (03:19):
Reflective of like the sort of overall mainstream of gay
culture at the time.
Speaker 5 (03:23):
Right. So I feel like these young.
Speaker 4 (03:28):
Kids can relate to it because even though it was
done twenty years ago, the characters were all living out
loud and proud, and they weren't giving a fuck. It's
not like dealing with a lot of oppression and all
of that, you know what I mean, these characters like
we're just out doing it.
Speaker 6 (03:42):
That's a really good point.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I hadn't really thought about the fact that we were
living as the young people are now.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Yes, twenty years ago.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
We were acting as if we didn't have, you know,
a Bush administration and breathing down on next Yeah and yeah,
it was a completely different world.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
When we thought Bush was the worst thing that could
We thought Wish was the worst thing that ever happen.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
And who we are now we know.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
So you play the character of Noah, iconic character in
queer community. But I think it's always important that, like
with the work that we do, especially as like public figures,
that people get to know who we are.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Right So, who is Darryl Stevens?
Speaker 2 (04:20):
You know?
Speaker 6 (04:20):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
I'm a dad, That's that's kind of my primary focus
in life right now. I'm also a son. My mother's
house burned down in Altadena. She's living in my house
right now, so that's very much part of my life.
Speaker 6 (04:36):
I like music.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
I'm sitting under headphones whenever i can. I'm listening to
books online. I'm fairly chilling and for the most part.
Darryl doesn't dress as fabulously as Noah, and I feel
like that's the thing that shocks people the most. I'm
know in many ways, but in many other ways, completely
the opposite of that.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
Man, Yes, who's Petrik? And Pope Noah? I start that
Who am I? We don't get asked this question a lot.
People just don't who am I? I am an artist?
Speaker 4 (05:07):
I guess pretty much just a fil filmmaker really sort
of at heart.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
You're always thinking about movies and like what the pitch
and what's the next story you want to tell? Right?
Speaker 6 (05:17):
That's that's kind of your life pretty much.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Yeah, if I don't have traditional hobbies, because when you're creative,
at least the kind of creative I am, then you're
just kind of always moving on to the next thing
and you're always creating, so work doesn't feel like work.
Speaker 6 (05:37):
I'm trying to be like Patrick.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
I'm trying to be more of a storyteller these days,
sharing stories reflect the communities that I want to see represented.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
And yeah, the visibility and representation of it all. Twenty
years ago, it wasn't much. There wasn't much. There was this, Yeah,
and I would say we also had SpongeBob because very
close SpongeBob and we watch SpongeBob in college. Everybody was like, yeah,
a little funny, like so we had Nozart and we
had fun vib But what do you feel about like
(06:05):
the current state of visibility and representation and like that
you've been able to make this a franchise.
Speaker 4 (06:11):
We've had a lot of great programming. There's still a
lot of great programming coming right now. There's Overcompensating and
English Teacher and adults adult all. It's great, but there
still has kind of been nothing like Noah's Ark, nothing
that's really centering black queer characters. Right, So you have
these sort of isolated black queer characters that pop up
(06:32):
on something like in the Adults or post. We had
a great but most of the time it's one of
the group or on the fringe, and never partner with.
Speaker 5 (06:44):
A black person.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
Ye never see a black gay person with a black
gay partner in that way. Like the representation of a
Noazark still really matters.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
There's such a specific vision to Noah's Arc. I don't
feel like anything else has really come.
Speaker 6 (07:00):
Close to it.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
He created a very specific and richly textured world with
these characters. And I think this movie, particularly Alexander our cinematographer.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Alexandersonson that but he's brilliant.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
And you see in this movie it's got all this
rich color and it's just beautiful, right, And I feel
like something about that really sort of helps tell our story.
We are these vibrant, beautiful colors, and look at how
richly and deeply and the makeup artists on this film, please,
they were painting us down. There are shots where I'm like,
(07:38):
I cannot believe that's my face at that age, that
is my face. So I think we were very lucky
to have this production.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
How long was this in the works?
Speaker 5 (07:47):
Not long?
Speaker 4 (07:48):
I mean I think I got the call about the
wanting to do a movie in the spring of twenty two.
Initially they wanted a movie to release that year. It
was like Holy Cow, and we were gonna tell a story.
Speaker 6 (08:03):
What what were you supposed to be? This is fun?
Speaker 4 (08:07):
So they said we want to do a Christmas movie. Okay,
but we wanted for this Christmas and this is like
March leading into April.
Speaker 5 (08:16):
I just wasn't going to say no.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
It was like we've been waiting for this, so whatever
it was as hard as it was going to be.
I was like, Okay, what is it, we can do it.
I turned the script in maybe a month later. It
was May. The day I turned the script in, I
got an email from one of the top execs saying
that now they didn't want a Christmas movie, they just
(08:38):
wanted to be a regular movie.
Speaker 5 (08:40):
So I redid.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
The script, take the Christmas out, and we shot the
movie October of twenty twenty two. Finished post production summer
of twenty three. We went on to strike.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Everything.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
When we were just kind of waiting, don't make sense
now for last year, I realized it would have been
nineteen years.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
But I will say we're very much ahead of the curve.
We shot this movie pre Cowboy Carter. We had a
lot of things in the film that were I think
that are now in vogue.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
Even I realized the.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
Opening scene, which features Eva Marcel playing the star of
Noah's Zombie Apocalypse series. This monologue that she gives in
the beginning is, yes, the world is ending, but we
are resilient and we will figure this out.
Speaker 5 (09:36):
We will endure for the times we're in now.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
So yeah, and now back to my conversation with Darryl
(10:11):
Stevens and Patrick ian Polk. They were like, how is
it for you to jump back into that character after
some time? You're also having to portray the evolution of
the character after all this time.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
When we shot The Rona Chronicles in twenty twenty, Jensen.
Speaker 6 (10:34):
And Rodney and I were in a house.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
Did he rented to shoot that, but everybody else was remote.
Everything was like a solo one person on camera. He
was like, that's not no, you gotta try it again.
Speaker 6 (10:46):
That's not it. And it took me a minute to
find him.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
I just there was a very specific energy that that
guy requires. I was just kind of like, oh, you'll
come back to me, and I was did not come back,
So he had, you know. He pulled me aside and
gave me some notes and was like it took a
minute time when we shot the movie. Uh. Two years later,
I did watch the first movie some of the episodes
of the first two seasons, and I felt like I
(11:10):
was remembering who he was, but also wanted to bring
some maturity to him, right, give him some subtlety and
some nuance that the young Noah didn't have.
Speaker 6 (11:17):
He was a little bit more. I wanted to give him,
you know, give him some groundedness and.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Some some original notes.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
This was an opportunity to give him the weight of
an adult. But I wanted him to feel like he
had been married for a long time, and I've been
in a relationship for a long time, so I kind
of understood the ins and outs of what that feels like.
I recently watched the movie with my brother and that
scene where Noah and Waye go out to the porch
after he brings home two tone Noah just reading him
(11:49):
for filth.
Speaker 6 (11:49):
I was like, that is so mean. She was like, yeah,
that's your that's not no that's your favor. There was
definitely some preparation.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
In terms of just remembering who no it is, but
there was also some intentionality behind grounding him in a
new sort of maturity.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Yeah, it felt like, yeah, this is what Noah would
be like.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
I think we all as we all were watching it
like smiling the whole time because we just were so
excited to just see it on, just to finally have something.
But I think what was even more fascinating for us
for the arcs of everyone's stories, We're is so good
the adopting of the kids. Jasmine guy, she was a kid,
(12:28):
but then you know, you took on grief and death.
It just was way more than I was even thinking
was going to be addressed in the movie. But it
was like addressing trans issues, like it was touching on
so many of like those little things. But even if
it was bringing us to points of trauma, it was
also healing us. It was also giving us the medicine
to be okay at the end of it. What went
into that.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
Just the natural progression of life as you kind of
veer into these next seasons, and the reality of what
a lot of my peers and friends are dealing with loss, divorces,
having kids, losing loved ones.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
It just felt like the right choice.
Speaker 4 (13:07):
I knew we wanted Jonathan Julian, the actor who plays Eddie.
Speaker 5 (13:11):
I didn't want him to not be around.
Speaker 4 (13:13):
So that was the conundrum, sort of how do we
do this, And so then I came up with this
idea that you know, he's around, but it's really sort
of chances, imagination, his memory, his you know, the way
he's kind of coping with this.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
It was such a great twist and we're all caught
off guard and love that we didn't have.
Speaker 6 (13:32):
To see Eddie died.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
I felt like that would have been too much for
this movie, right, Like the fact that he had died
a year ago, technically three years ago, sort of let
us off the hook to be like, oh, okay, so
we're in the grievings stages still.
Speaker 5 (13:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
I thought it was great. I mean like we gassed,
like we audibly.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Gassed, because it took us a second to connect the
dots and we were like, wait, oh my god, he's
been seeing him his whole time. It took us to
the place, but we didn't have to see the death,
but we could still.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Feel weight of it and like what it was like
to be grieving.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
And I think it was important, especially because I think
we've just all been collectively grieving, Like as a community, we.
Speaker 6 (14:09):
Have been traumatized.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
There has to be some sort of collective some study
about the collective trauma we've all experienced with the first administration, COVID,
this administration, we are being tried right now.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
How do you think art helps that?
Speaker 6 (14:25):
You know, I'm not.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Thinking about that when we're making it. For me, it's
like what are these characters going through? And what is
how are we going to tell the story? In the
most effective way. How can we be as true to
the script, you know, as possible? And remember three years ago,
we weren't in the midst of what we're in the
midst of. Now this feels like it's right on time
because it took paramount a minute to put it out,
(14:47):
or they were very deliberate, maybe they.
Speaker 6 (14:49):
Knew what was coming.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
We have had six almost seven months of hell, and
now we get to sort of breathe and laugh with
each other in a way that we've not done in
you know.
Speaker 6 (14:59):
Fifteen year Wow.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
I really felt it. It was necessary.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Also shout out to putting my book in the movie,
because I was getting all these messages. I was like,
there's all these dms coming from and then everybody kept
sending like, your books in the movie, Your books in
the movie. How full circle is that that the show
that I watched when I was figuring myself out continues
to give us space to be in spaces that we
(15:24):
most oftentimes can't get in right, putting us in spaces
where our work can be celebrated. So again, another big
thank you to you and the work that you're doing.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
Welcome.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
So what's next for you? Dah.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
I've co written and produced a pilot called One for
the Team, which is about a trans teenager who was
switched high schools to get us a scholarship to play
on the boys team at that school. We had our
world premiere last weekend at a film festival called Dances
with Films. We're working on the pitch for that and
I'm kind of excited to sort of start telling stories.
Speaker 6 (16:11):
That I want to see.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
There was a that moment after Pose ended, we were like, Okay,
now where did okay?
Speaker 3 (16:18):
So what's next?
Speaker 6 (16:22):
There was that was so important.
Speaker 5 (16:23):
At that time.
Speaker 6 (16:24):
I feel like that's why I know it's our cast
to come back.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
We need we need that weekly Like Pose was so
important to me, and I felt like, what's the version
of this. That's the complete opposite of Pose. It's an
l a story about a boy, it's playing sports, a
completely different story. But but I felt like we felt
like that was the next version of the story. And
of course now we're dealing with this administration attacking trans
(16:49):
kids who are trying to play sports. It's just like, wow, Wow,
so that's the next that's my next step?
Speaker 3 (16:56):
Yeah, Patrick, what you got going on?
Speaker 4 (17:00):
Uh?
Speaker 5 (17:01):
I forgot much? Really?
Speaker 2 (17:03):
He always says that he always say, wait a minute.
Speaker 4 (17:09):
That listen. I subscribed. I keep saying this to people.
I call it Beyonce doctrine of you moving stealth. Next
up for Me is a film adaptation of Elin Harris's
groundbreaking novel Invisible Life. I've written the script now we're
just getting it all together. The Nose are the movie soundtrack.
(17:31):
I guess it's technically a soundtrack playlist, but it's all
the songs that are in the film. So there's an
Apple Music version, there's a Spotify version that has all
the songs that are in the movie, which includes a
long list of carefully curated black queer musical artists.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
So we've got people that we know.
Speaker 4 (17:49):
Like the Mike, Michael Kilgore and Duran Bernard, and some
new faces like Chris Collins, and some really exciting.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
I wanted to shout out the two women who wrote
and produced the the opening song.
Speaker 6 (18:01):
Oh yeah, one of them have arrived, Miss Vain.
Speaker 4 (18:03):
But like all of these music artists have been reaching
out with these kind of profound thank you messages, saying like,
oh my god, because the show was so important to
me to have my work in the show.
Speaker 5 (18:13):
It's such a moment.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
The starry to interrupt you on the beaut Awards the
Red carpet, and she was thanking him for putting her
on because she was in the first season, and I
guess that was.
Speaker 6 (18:25):
A big deal for her.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
It was because a lot of us went and bought
Complex Simplicity because we heard the songs.
Speaker 6 (18:30):
And I loved that.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
I didn't realize that.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
It's just super important the work that you're doing, highlighting
so many people. Just see all of the love and
the fanfare that was like, this is dope, this is
our community supports community and how we continue to build together.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
It's been cool, and I would say, well, the other
thing to having this movie come out now in this
kind of new age that we live in where we
didn't have social media and all of that twenty years ago,
and so it's cool to see the reach it can
have a lot faster and easier than the way we
used to have to promote. And so the hope really is, yes,
we want to reboot. Absolutely, it be great to bring
(19:06):
the show back, And specifically I just want opportunity and financing.
So it's literally like wherever it comes from, whether it's
wherever the money and the support comes from. Because that's
all I need. I have plenty of stories ready to go.
I could be shooting something next week because we need
to tell these stories. There's still an appetite, and there's
still a void that needs to be filled.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
And there's still people who don't understand who we are,
which is the shocking part. I feel like you've had
all this time to figure out. We just live in
our lives, trying to go to the store, the grocery store,
and raise our kids.
Speaker 6 (19:39):
Just like you, Calm the fuck down. Nothing is wrong
with us.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
It's a beautiful thing to see all these years later.
The queer art is still just as beautiful as it was.
To watch it today is just like amazing and you
both look amazing and okay, so you know it's not agent.
I think that's what everybody was saying.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
As we were watching. It's like, damn, do we aid?
Speaker 5 (20:05):
I don't know.
Speaker 6 (20:06):
The makeup artist.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Makeup artists.
Speaker 6 (20:11):
Kept us together. Yes, they were very, very generous.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
If you could play anybody in a biotic who would
you play.
Speaker 6 (20:19):
Oh, that's a good question. Billy d Williams.
Speaker 5 (20:26):
Story, he's that about yeah, something.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
As a young you know, Star Wars geek I was
always fascinated by the one black guy in the show,
and I.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
See that and where what what is the Billy Williams story?
Speaker 6 (20:46):
I have no idea, but that just pops into my head.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Someone like James Baldwin is fascinating, but it takes some
work to pull that off.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
What would be like your dream like biopics to create.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
One day, I'm planning on doing a Luther Vandros movie.
Speaker 5 (21:02):
That is the dream.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
It'll be my take on a very specific moment or
time or thing. It's not going to be like the
whole story with an interesting piece.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Is going to actually Luthor or like a black R
and B singer who's got the voice of gold to
everyone loves and has a secret life.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
That's what someone was telling me that you should do this. No,
it's going to be Luthor. I mean, listen, he's a
public figure. There's books about him, there's stories. I know
tons of people that worked with him, So you know,
I'm going to tell a real Luther story. It'll be
my interpretation of it, whatever it is. I don't need
permission from anyone to do it, but I'm planning to
(21:41):
do so, all right, It'll just be.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Why we've seen Lifetime get around the rule exactly.
Speaker 5 (21:46):
There's ways to do it.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
Because he's a global superstar. He deserves more than one
film treatment. So we can have a traditional biopic like
we've had. How many Maryland and Roe movies and stories
have been told, Like, there's plenty of stories to be
told about. Did you see that doc documentary? I mean,
come on, you could take any you could take any
five minutes of that documentary and make a movie about
any of that stuff that he created and worked on.
(22:08):
And the David Bowie Sessions alone could be a movie.
Speaker 6 (22:12):
Young Americans is like the baddest David Bowie album.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
And then when you hear the stories and the thing
about how some of the best pieces of it, it's
like it's all sitting on the couch just vibing to
the other girl and then David going, wait, what are
you doing?
Speaker 5 (22:25):
Let's get that put.
Speaker 4 (22:26):
That on thing, and then that becomes the main part
of the fucking record.
Speaker 5 (22:28):
So that's what it is.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
And now back to my conversation with Daryl Stevens and
Patrick ian Polk.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Any words that you're living by in twenty twenty five, at.
Speaker 6 (23:12):
This point, it's just keep hope alive. Basically, you know
this is going to pass. How many of.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Us he takes out with him is still in question,
but this is not going to last.
Speaker 6 (23:26):
They're always shut down.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Yeah, they don't always see justice, but they end. And
so for me, it's really about just getting through it,
you know, with art and hopefully telling stories that give
people hope.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
Kamala Harris told y'all if you elect Donald Trump, we
will be at war within six months.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
That it was direct quote. Yeah, and here we are.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Here we are, but art like yours gives us joy
and needs trying to.
Speaker 6 (23:58):
Back around.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
We are grateful though that you all continue to create art,
and I'm grateful to be in community with both of you.
Speaker 5 (24:05):
Thank you, thank you, Yes, thank you.
Speaker 2 (24:21):
Art must discover and reveal the beauty which prejudice and
caricature have overlaid. That quote is from the philosopher Elaine
Leroy Locke. Elaying Locke was known as the architect of
the Harlem Renaissance, bringing together every artist he could find
to create a book in nineteen twenty five called The
New Negro. The New Negro would eventually be considered the
(24:44):
African American Bible because it brought together art poetry, literature,
and culture in a way that we had never seen before.
Elaine will forever be remembered as one of our greatest philosophers.
(25:08):
Fighting Words is a production of iHeart Podcasts in partnership
with Best's Case Studios. I'm Georgia and Johnson. This episode
was produced by Charlotte Morley. A section producers are myself
and Twiggy Puchi guar Song with Adam Pinks and Brick
Cats for Best Case Studios. The theme song was written
and composed by Coole Vas Bambianna and myself.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
Original music by Klevas.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
This episode was edited and scored by Max Michael Miller.
Our iHeart team is Ali Perry and Carl Ketel. Following Rape,
Fighting Words Wherever you get your podcast
He was creating a utopia, a very colorful and richly
textured world with these characters. There's such a specific vision
to Noah's Ark. I don't feel like anything else has
really come close to it.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
That's Darryl Stevens, who plays the title character of Noah
in the iconic TV series Noah's Ark. He's talking about
the groundbreaking world that the show's writer Patrick A.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Poe created.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
If you haven't heard, Noah and the crew are back
in an all new movies streaming now on Paramount Plus.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
And don't worry, it is still trendset.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
We had a lot of things in the film that
were I think that are now in vogue.
Speaker 5 (00:41):
This monologue in the beginning.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Is, yes, the world is ending, but we are resilient
and we will figure this out.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
We will endure the times.
Speaker 5 (00:52):
We're in now.
Speaker 6 (00:52):
Who knew.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
I had the opportunity to sit down with both of them,
actor and writer, to not own, to discuss what it
was like to return to Noah after twenty years, but
also how art moves society forward, what stayed the same,
what has changed, and what the future holds for all
of us.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Singing in them heavy handed with the world take a.
Speaker 5 (01:20):
Super branded he spoke a guy you know what the plan.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Is, or became a Latin you know when to understand me.
My name is George M.
Speaker 5 (01:28):
Johnson.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I am the New York Times bestselling author of the
book All Boys Aren't Blue, which is the number one
most challenged.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
Book in the United States. This is Fighting Words, a.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Show where we take you to the front lines of
the culture wars with the people who are using their
words to make change and who refuse to be silenced.
Today's guests are darl Stevens and Patrick ian Polk. Daryl
and Patrick, I want to welcome you to my podcast,
(02:00):
Fighting Words. I'd like to think that this podcast isn't
possible without the work that you two have done in communities.
Dah Honestly, I am big on giving flowers. As the
author of a book All Boys Aren't Blue. That doesn't
happen unless we have someone breaking barriers for us. Like
show Not was ARCTD for me. I was in college
when it came out. I wouldn't say I was closetive
(02:22):
because you can't closet this. I think everybody else knew
it about me watching that show. I was struggling. Everybody
knew I was like, I was always a little sassy thing,
even when I joined a fraternity. But having a show
like that, you know, twenty years ago, it really meant
the world to some of us. So sneaking to watch
the show just to give like a little bit of
peace or a little bit of feeling of like, oh,
(02:44):
that's a community that's out there for me one day.
So I just want to start off by saying, thank you.
What does it feel like twenty years later, the nostalgia
for people like me, but also now introducing Noah to
a brand new audience of I would say, young queer
people who are just out at a time when we're
trying to be silenced.
Speaker 4 (03:03):
When I envisioned the show was creating this sort of
gay black utopia that these characters lived in, existed.
Speaker 6 (03:13):
In a black gay bubble kind of right, yeah.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
You know, so it wasn't really.
Speaker 4 (03:19):
Reflective of like the sort of overall mainstream of gay
culture at the time.
Speaker 5 (03:23):
Right. So I feel like these young.
Speaker 4 (03:28):
Kids can relate to it because even though it was
done twenty years ago, the characters were all living out
loud and proud, and they weren't giving a fuck. It's
not like dealing with a lot of oppression and all
of that, you know what I mean, these characters like
we're just out doing it.
Speaker 6 (03:42):
That's a really good point.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I hadn't really thought about the fact that we were
living as the young people are now.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Yes, twenty years ago.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
We were acting as if we didn't have, you know,
a Bush administration and breathing down on next Yeah and yeah,
it was a completely different world.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
When we thought Bush was the worst thing that could
We thought Wish was the worst thing that ever happen.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
And who we are now we know.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
So you play the character of Noah, iconic character in
queer community. But I think it's always important that, like
with the work that we do, especially as like public figures,
that people get to know who we are.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Right So, who is Darryl Stevens?
Speaker 2 (04:20):
You know?
Speaker 6 (04:20):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
I'm a dad, That's that's kind of my primary focus
in life right now. I'm also a son. My mother's
house burned down in Altadena. She's living in my house
right now, so that's very much part of my life.
Speaker 6 (04:36):
I like music.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
I'm sitting under headphones whenever i can. I'm listening to
books online. I'm fairly chilling and for the most part.
Darryl doesn't dress as fabulously as Noah, and I feel
like that's the thing that shocks people the most. I'm
know in many ways, but in many other ways, completely
the opposite of that.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
Man, Yes, who's Petrik? And Pope Noah? I start that
Who am I? We don't get asked this question a lot.
People just don't who am I? I am an artist?
Speaker 4 (05:07):
I guess pretty much just a fil filmmaker really sort
of at heart.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
You're always thinking about movies and like what the pitch
and what's the next story you want to tell? Right?
Speaker 6 (05:17):
That's that's kind of your life pretty much.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Yeah, if I don't have traditional hobbies, because when you're creative,
at least the kind of creative I am, then you're
just kind of always moving on to the next thing
and you're always creating, so work doesn't feel like work.
Speaker 6 (05:37):
I'm trying to be like Patrick.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
I'm trying to be more of a storyteller these days,
sharing stories reflect the communities that I want to see represented.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
And yeah, the visibility and representation of it all. Twenty
years ago, it wasn't much. There wasn't much. There was this, Yeah,
and I would say we also had SpongeBob because very
close SpongeBob and we watch SpongeBob in college. Everybody was like, yeah,
a little funny, like so we had Nozart and we
had fun vib But what do you feel about like
(06:05):
the current state of visibility and representation and like that
you've been able to make this a franchise.
Speaker 4 (06:11):
We've had a lot of great programming. There's still a
lot of great programming coming right now. There's Overcompensating and
English Teacher and adults adult all. It's great, but there
still has kind of been nothing like Noah's Ark, nothing
that's really centering black queer characters. Right, So you have
these sort of isolated black queer characters that pop up
(06:32):
on something like in the Adults or post. We had
a great but most of the time it's one of
the group or on the fringe, and never partner with.
Speaker 5 (06:44):
A black person.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
Ye never see a black gay person with a black
gay partner in that way. Like the representation of a
Noazark still really matters.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
There's such a specific vision to Noah's Arc. I don't
feel like anything else has really come.
Speaker 6 (07:00):
Close to it.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
He created a very specific and richly textured world with
these characters. And I think this movie, particularly Alexander our cinematographer.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Alexandersonson that but he's brilliant.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
And you see in this movie it's got all this
rich color and it's just beautiful, right, And I feel
like something about that really sort of helps tell our story.
We are these vibrant, beautiful colors, and look at how
richly and deeply and the makeup artists on this film, please,
they were painting us down. There are shots where I'm like,
(07:38):
I cannot believe that's my face at that age, that
is my face. So I think we were very lucky
to have this production.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
How long was this in the works?
Speaker 5 (07:47):
Not long?
Speaker 4 (07:48):
I mean I think I got the call about the
wanting to do a movie in the spring of twenty two.
Initially they wanted a movie to release that year. It
was like Holy Cow, and we were gonna tell a story.
Speaker 6 (08:03):
What what were you supposed to be? This is fun?
Speaker 4 (08:07):
So they said we want to do a Christmas movie. Okay,
but we wanted for this Christmas and this is like
March leading into April.
Speaker 5 (08:16):
I just wasn't going to say no.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
It was like we've been waiting for this, so whatever
it was as hard as it was going to be.
I was like, Okay, what is it, we can do it.
I turned the script in maybe a month later. It
was May. The day I turned the script in, I
got an email from one of the top execs saying
that now they didn't want a Christmas movie, they just
(08:38):
wanted to be a regular movie.
Speaker 5 (08:40):
So I redid.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
The script, take the Christmas out, and we shot the
movie October of twenty twenty two. Finished post production summer
of twenty three. We went on to strike.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Everything.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
When we were just kind of waiting, don't make sense
now for last year, I realized it would have been
nineteen years.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
But I will say we're very much ahead of the curve.
We shot this movie pre Cowboy Carter. We had a
lot of things in the film that were I think
that are now in vogue.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
Even I realized the.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
Opening scene, which features Eva Marcel playing the star of
Noah's Zombie Apocalypse series. This monologue that she gives in
the beginning is, yes, the world is ending, but we
are resilient and we will figure this out.
Speaker 5 (09:36):
We will endure for the times we're in now.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
So yeah, and now back to my conversation with Darryl
(10:11):
Stevens and Patrick ian Polk. They were like, how is
it for you to jump back into that character after
some time? You're also having to portray the evolution of
the character after all this time.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
When we shot The Rona Chronicles in twenty twenty, Jensen.
Speaker 6 (10:34):
And Rodney and I were in a house.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
Did he rented to shoot that, but everybody else was remote.
Everything was like a solo one person on camera. He
was like, that's not no, you gotta try it again.
Speaker 6 (10:46):
That's not it. And it took me a minute to
find him.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
I just there was a very specific energy that that
guy requires. I was just kind of like, oh, you'll
come back to me, and I was did not come back,
So he had, you know. He pulled me aside and
gave me some notes and was like it took a
minute time when we shot the movie. Uh. Two years later,
I did watch the first movie some of the episodes
of the first two seasons, and I felt like I
(11:10):
was remembering who he was, but also wanted to bring
some maturity to him, right, give him some subtlety and
some nuance that the young Noah didn't have.
Speaker 6 (11:17):
He was a little bit more. I wanted to give him,
you know, give him some groundedness and.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Some some original notes.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
This was an opportunity to give him the weight of
an adult. But I wanted him to feel like he
had been married for a long time, and I've been
in a relationship for a long time, so I kind
of understood the ins and outs of what that feels like.
I recently watched the movie with my brother and that
scene where Noah and Waye go out to the porch
after he brings home two tone Noah just reading him
(11:49):
for filth.
Speaker 6 (11:49):
I was like, that is so mean. She was like, yeah,
that's your that's not no that's your favor. There was
definitely some preparation.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
In terms of just remembering who no it is, but
there was also some intentionality behind grounding him in a
new sort of maturity.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Yeah, it felt like, yeah, this is what Noah would
be like.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
I think we all as we all were watching it
like smiling the whole time because we just were so
excited to just see it on, just to finally have something.
But I think what was even more fascinating for us
for the arcs of everyone's stories, We're is so good
the adopting of the kids. Jasmine guy, she was a kid,
(12:28):
but then you know, you took on grief and death.
It just was way more than I was even thinking
was going to be addressed in the movie. But it
was like addressing trans issues, like it was touching on
so many of like those little things. But even if
it was bringing us to points of trauma, it was
also healing us. It was also giving us the medicine
to be okay at the end of it. What went
into that.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
Just the natural progression of life as you kind of
veer into these next seasons, and the reality of what
a lot of my peers and friends are dealing with loss, divorces,
having kids, losing loved ones.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
It just felt like the right choice.
Speaker 4 (13:07):
I knew we wanted Jonathan Julian, the actor who plays Eddie.
Speaker 5 (13:11):
I didn't want him to not be around.
Speaker 4 (13:13):
So that was the conundrum, sort of how do we
do this, And so then I came up with this
idea that you know, he's around, but it's really sort
of chances, imagination, his memory, his you know, the way
he's kind of coping with this.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
It was such a great twist and we're all caught
off guard and love that we didn't have.
Speaker 6 (13:32):
To see Eddie died.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
I felt like that would have been too much for
this movie, right, Like the fact that he had died
a year ago, technically three years ago, sort of let
us off the hook to be like, oh, okay, so
we're in the grievings stages still.
Speaker 5 (13:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
I thought it was great. I mean like we gassed,
like we audibly.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Gassed, because it took us a second to connect the
dots and we were like, wait, oh my god, he's
been seeing him his whole time. It took us to
the place, but we didn't have to see the death,
but we could still.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Feel weight of it and like what it was like
to be grieving.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
And I think it was important, especially because I think
we've just all been collectively grieving, Like as a community, we.
Speaker 6 (14:09):
Have been traumatized.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
There has to be some sort of collective some study
about the collective trauma we've all experienced with the first administration, COVID,
this administration, we are being tried right now.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
How do you think art helps that?
Speaker 6 (14:25):
You know, I'm not.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Thinking about that when we're making it. For me, it's
like what are these characters going through? And what is
how are we going to tell the story? In the
most effective way. How can we be as true to
the script, you know, as possible? And remember three years ago,
we weren't in the midst of what we're in the
midst of. Now this feels like it's right on time
because it took paramount a minute to put it out,
(14:47):
or they were very deliberate, maybe they.
Speaker 6 (14:49):
Knew what was coming.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
We have had six almost seven months of hell, and
now we get to sort of breathe and laugh with
each other in a way that we've not done in
you know.
Speaker 6 (14:59):
Fifteen year Wow.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
I really felt it. It was necessary.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Also shout out to putting my book in the movie,
because I was getting all these messages. I was like,
there's all these dms coming from and then everybody kept
sending like, your books in the movie, Your books in
the movie. How full circle is that that the show
that I watched when I was figuring myself out continues
to give us space to be in spaces that we
(15:24):
most oftentimes can't get in right, putting us in spaces
where our work can be celebrated. So again, another big
thank you to you and the work that you're doing.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
Welcome.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
So what's next for you? Dah.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
I've co written and produced a pilot called One for
the Team, which is about a trans teenager who was
switched high schools to get us a scholarship to play
on the boys team at that school. We had our
world premiere last weekend at a film festival called Dances
with Films. We're working on the pitch for that and
I'm kind of excited to sort of start telling stories.
Speaker 6 (16:11):
That I want to see.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
There was a that moment after Pose ended, we were like, Okay,
now where did okay?
Speaker 3 (16:18):
So what's next?
Speaker 6 (16:22):
There was that was so important.
Speaker 5 (16:23):
At that time.
Speaker 6 (16:24):
I feel like that's why I know it's our cast
to come back.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
We need we need that weekly Like Pose was so
important to me, and I felt like, what's the version
of this. That's the complete opposite of Pose. It's an
l a story about a boy, it's playing sports, a
completely different story. But but I felt like we felt
like that was the next version of the story. And
of course now we're dealing with this administration attacking trans
(16:49):
kids who are trying to play sports. It's just like, wow, Wow,
so that's the next that's my next step?
Speaker 3 (16:56):
Yeah, Patrick, what you got going on?
Speaker 4 (17:00):
Uh?
Speaker 5 (17:01):
I forgot much? Really?
Speaker 2 (17:03):
He always says that he always say, wait a minute.
Speaker 4 (17:09):
That listen. I subscribed. I keep saying this to people.
I call it Beyonce doctrine of you moving stealth. Next
up for Me is a film adaptation of Elin Harris's
groundbreaking novel Invisible Life. I've written the script now we're
just getting it all together. The Nose are the movie soundtrack.
(17:31):
I guess it's technically a soundtrack playlist, but it's all
the songs that are in the film. So there's an
Apple Music version, there's a Spotify version that has all
the songs that are in the movie, which includes a
long list of carefully curated black queer musical artists.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
So we've got people that we know.
Speaker 4 (17:49):
Like the Mike, Michael Kilgore and Duran Bernard, and some
new faces like Chris Collins, and some really exciting.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
I wanted to shout out the two women who wrote
and produced the the opening song.
Speaker 6 (18:01):
Oh yeah, one of them have arrived, Miss Vain.
Speaker 4 (18:03):
But like all of these music artists have been reaching
out with these kind of profound thank you messages, saying like,
oh my god, because the show was so important to
me to have my work in the show.
Speaker 5 (18:13):
It's such a moment.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
The starry to interrupt you on the beaut Awards the
Red carpet, and she was thanking him for putting her
on because she was in the first season, and I
guess that was.
Speaker 6 (18:25):
A big deal for her.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
It was because a lot of us went and bought
Complex Simplicity because we heard the songs.
Speaker 6 (18:30):
And I loved that.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
I didn't realize that.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
It's just super important the work that you're doing, highlighting
so many people. Just see all of the love and
the fanfare that was like, this is dope, this is
our community supports community and how we continue to build together.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
It's been cool, and I would say, well, the other
thing to having this movie come out now in this
kind of new age that we live in where we
didn't have social media and all of that twenty years ago,
and so it's cool to see the reach it can
have a lot faster and easier than the way we
used to have to promote. And so the hope really is, yes,
we want to reboot. Absolutely, it be great to bring
(19:06):
the show back, And specifically I just want opportunity and financing.
So it's literally like wherever it comes from, whether it's
wherever the money and the support comes from. Because that's
all I need. I have plenty of stories ready to go.
I could be shooting something next week because we need
to tell these stories. There's still an appetite, and there's
still a void that needs to be filled.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
And there's still people who don't understand who we are,
which is the shocking part. I feel like you've had
all this time to figure out. We just live in
our lives, trying to go to the store, the grocery store,
and raise our kids.
Speaker 6 (19:39):
Just like you, Calm the fuck down. Nothing is wrong
with us.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
It's a beautiful thing to see all these years later.
The queer art is still just as beautiful as it was.
To watch it today is just like amazing and you
both look amazing and okay, so you know it's not agent.
I think that's what everybody was saying.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
As we were watching. It's like, damn, do we aid?
Speaker 5 (20:05):
I don't know.
Speaker 6 (20:06):
The makeup artist.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Makeup artists.
Speaker 6 (20:11):
Kept us together. Yes, they were very, very generous.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
If you could play anybody in a biotic who would
you play.
Speaker 6 (20:19):
Oh, that's a good question. Billy d Williams.
Speaker 5 (20:26):
Story, he's that about yeah, something.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
As a young you know, Star Wars geek I was
always fascinated by the one black guy in the show,
and I.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
See that and where what what is the Billy Williams story?
Speaker 6 (20:46):
I have no idea, but that just pops into my head.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Someone like James Baldwin is fascinating, but it takes some
work to pull that off.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
What would be like your dream like biopics to create.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
One day, I'm planning on doing a Luther Vandros movie.
Speaker 5 (21:02):
That is the dream.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
It'll be my take on a very specific moment or
time or thing. It's not going to be like the
whole story with an interesting piece.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Is going to actually Luthor or like a black R
and B singer who's got the voice of gold to
everyone loves and has a secret life.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
That's what someone was telling me that you should do this. No,
it's going to be Luthor. I mean, listen, he's a
public figure. There's books about him, there's stories. I know
tons of people that worked with him, So you know,
I'm going to tell a real Luther story. It'll be
my interpretation of it, whatever it is. I don't need
permission from anyone to do it, but I'm planning to
(21:41):
do so, all right, It'll just be.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Why we've seen Lifetime get around the rule exactly.
Speaker 5 (21:46):
There's ways to do it.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
Because he's a global superstar. He deserves more than one
film treatment. So we can have a traditional biopic like
we've had. How many Maryland and Roe movies and stories
have been told, Like, there's plenty of stories to be
told about. Did you see that doc documentary? I mean,
come on, you could take any you could take any
five minutes of that documentary and make a movie about
any of that stuff that he created and worked on.
(22:08):
And the David Bowie Sessions alone could be a movie.
Speaker 6 (22:12):
Young Americans is like the baddest David Bowie album.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
And then when you hear the stories and the thing
about how some of the best pieces of it, it's
like it's all sitting on the couch just vibing to
the other girl and then David going, wait, what are
you doing?
Speaker 5 (22:25):
Let's get that put.
Speaker 4 (22:26):
That on thing, and then that becomes the main part
of the fucking record.
Speaker 5 (22:28):
So that's what it is.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
And now back to my conversation with Daryl Stevens and
Patrick ian Polk.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Any words that you're living by in twenty twenty five, at.
Speaker 6 (23:12):
This point, it's just keep hope alive. Basically, you know
this is going to pass. How many of.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Us he takes out with him is still in question,
but this is not going to last.
Speaker 6 (23:26):
They're always shut down.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Yeah, they don't always see justice, but they end. And
so for me, it's really about just getting through it,
you know, with art and hopefully telling stories that give
people hope.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
Kamala Harris told y'all if you elect Donald Trump, we
will be at war within six months.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
That it was direct quote. Yeah, and here we are.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Here we are, but art like yours gives us joy
and needs trying to.
Speaker 6 (23:58):
Back around.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
We are grateful though that you all continue to create art,
and I'm grateful to be in community with both of you.
Speaker 5 (24:05):
Thank you, thank you, Yes, thank you.
Speaker 2 (24:21):
Art must discover and reveal the beauty which prejudice and
caricature have overlaid. That quote is from the philosopher Elaine
Leroy Locke. Elaying Locke was known as the architect of
the Harlem Renaissance, bringing together every artist he could find
to create a book in nineteen twenty five called The
New Negro. The New Negro would eventually be considered the
(24:44):
African American Bible because it brought together art poetry, literature,
and culture in a way that we had never seen before.
Elaine will forever be remembered as one of our greatest philosophers.
(25:08):
Fighting Words is a production of iHeart Podcasts in partnership
with Best's Case Studios. I'm Georgia and Johnson. This episode
was produced by Charlotte Morley. A section producers are myself
and Twiggy Puchi guar Song with Adam Pinks and Brick
Cats for Best Case Studios. The theme song was written
and composed by Coole Vas Bambianna and myself.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
Original music by Klevas.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
This episode was edited and scored by Max Michael Miller.
Our iHeart team is Ali Perry and Carl Ketel. Following Rape,
Fighting Words Wherever you get your podcast
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