June 3, 2025 • 41 mins
George kicks off Pride Month with fitness influencer Kevin Carnell to talk about putting in the work, maintaining your mental health while using social media, growing up playing sports to mask his queerness, and coming out to his family at an Outback Steakhouse.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Whenever people compare themselves to me or idolize my body.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Of course it's flattering. However, it was a lot of.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Trial and error, and I think when people see the
photos they don't know the trial and error that led
to it.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Today, we've got something a little different. That's my friend
Kevin Carnell. He's a bodybuilder and an online fitness coach
with over three hundred thousand followers on Instagram.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
People probably don't even hear you talk often, you.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Know, they don't. They don't.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Yeah, but there's much more to Kevin than what meets
the eye. And I thought as we kick off frid
that we could talk to Kevin about how gig we're
men represent themselves online, about the benefits and harms of
social media, how to maintain your mental health, and much more.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
And also, don't search my name on Twitter. I do
not search my name anymore. If someone has an opinion
about me, that is their opinion. Right. I am going
to sleep just fine at night, regardless.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Singing in I'm heavy handy with the world. Take a
sup of brandy and you spoke, you guy.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
You know what the plan is?
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Overcame a Latin you.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
No one does understand me. My name is George M. Johnson.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
I am the New York Times bestselling author of the
book All Boys Aren't Blue, which is the number one
most challenged book in the United States. This is Fighting Words,
a show where we take you to the front lines
of the culture wars with the people who are using
their words to make change and who refuse to be silenced.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
Today's guest Kevin Carnell.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I'm ready, I'm ready. Let's go.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Hello everyone, I want to welcome to another episode of
Fighting Words. I am here today with one of my
dearest best friends, mister Kevin Carnell.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
How are you doing today?
Speaker 2 (01:57):
I'm great. I'm thankful and honored to be here.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
How are you, I'm good, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
For those who don't know, we are recording on a
Monday after partying weekend, Kevin has been to multiple Beyonce concerts.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
So two in the last four days, but.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Exactly so yeah, sorry about our voices. We always like
to start to episode the same way. I feel like
because many of us have like these online personas, people
don't really know who we are, and sometimes we don't
get the opportunity to say who we are. So for
everyone who is listening, Could you please let everyone to
know who is Kevin Carnell.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
Oh, I love this, So Kevin Carnell. I was originally
born in Florida, Miami, Florida. To be exact who am I? So,
I think outside of the Internet and what people know
of me, I would identify as a great uncle, a
great friend, a great brother, great son. Very passionate about Beyonce.
(03:00):
I love Anime, I love Pokemon, and I love self expression.
And I think that's something that in the years that
I've been active on social media, it's been very apparent
because I have utilized my platform to express myself and
my sexuality.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
I do not lead with that.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
I think it's it's very important that I specify that
it is a part of me, but not all of me.
So I do love that you have given me the
space to identify who I am before other people do,
because it feels like sometimes I'm working or fighting an
uphill battle where people may perceive who I am just
based off of photos and very limited interaction with dms
(03:45):
because I don't respond to all of them. But yeah, absolutely, absolutely, yeah.
I mean I signed an NDA so I'll never disclose
what we talk about but.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
I'm just kidding. We didn't sign an NDA.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
But yes, I think being able to speak and get
ahead of who someone else thinks I am is.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Very powerful and very important to me.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So all of those things I mentioned, I'm sure I
might have forgotten some things. It's been a minute since
I've brushed up on my elevator pitch.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
But yeah, no, thank you.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
You know, someone being your friend, it's I know how
hard it must be.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
At times.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
We joke because if I'm on Twitter, I'm going to
see someone post Kevin and make a comment. Sometimes they're
funny comments, sometimes they're really flattering comments and complimenting, but
sometimes they're pretty harsh, right, And sometimes we have to
get on and we drag people who make those harsh comments.
I feel like someone like you, it was like everyone
(04:48):
loved you until and then we never know what the
until is though, and then it just kind of starts
to dog file. How have you especially like being so
viral often? How does that take a toll on your
mental health? And what are some practices that you do
to be able to continue to remain calm and stay yourself?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Well, I would be lying if I ever said that
it didn't bother me. It has impacted my mental health
and the way that I will present online because there's
that gratification that you see all of the likes coming in,
you see the comments. And when I first started and
(05:30):
I was utilizing my body as a way of getting
that gratification, it was like fuel and it would fuel
me until it was time to post another swimsuit photo
or it was time to update and do something else.
And I have since gone back and archived a lot
of old posts just because of the frame of mind
(05:51):
that I was in when I posted them. I was
trying to get someone's attention, or I was doing it
because I needed that boost of validation. And so I
don't know if there was ever a pivotal moment that
kind of made me have that shift and turn that
behavior off, but I will say it fueled me less
(06:13):
and less when I would post something trying to get
a reaction or response from anyone, whether it be someone
I was interested in or the people who follow me.
It just became something where I knew that I was
growing as a person, where I would be able to
post something and put my phone down and continue working
because I do have a job outside of social media,
(06:35):
So to be able to put the phone down and
be like, Okay, well that was that, instead of sitting
there holding the phone trying to read comments and see
what else is going to pop up or who's going
to DM me based off of what they saw. So
my practice is now that I've gotten to a place
(06:55):
where I don't need the external validation. I know how
I looked, and I know how I felt when I
snapped the photo, took the video.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
What have you? That to me is enough.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
Early on, when I would post my travel photos, people
don't know that I, like was living in Florida, living
with my parents, saving up before I moved to LA
So people didn't know I wasn't paying rent, I was
able to travel, I was able to do all these things,
and they would just assume, Oh, you must be like
a sex worker, you must be in that score blah
(07:39):
blah blah. So it's like people don't know my life. Yeah,
and those are the people that I cannot give them
any value or stock in their opinion because they don't
know me.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
This is extremely important because you can't get lost in
the comments. I sometimes am like, oh, I want to
say something back. I want to say something back, so
you have to kind of remember, like, sometimes these are
people who you'll never meet, we never.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Know, and when you're within five feet of them, they
won't say anything. And you look around everybody on mute,
like now all of a sudden, you can't speak, You
got twitter fingers, you have all this stuff to say,
but they'll be within five feet of you and say nothing.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
You are very close to your family.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
What is that like for you, especially being such a
public figure, because you are a public figure.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, so my family and I we are close. I
like to talk to my parents every single day. And
I think that growing up they were very strict. They
provided structure, but they were just doing what their parents
did for them. And I mean, we can look back
and we can kind of pinpoint what might have worked,
(08:53):
what might not have worked. But without their parenting I
would not be as strong or as disciplined as I
am today. So I have learned to give them that grace,
even as I am an adult. They are imperfect. We're
all imperfect. I'm not expecting them to understand everything about
(09:15):
the Kevin that they have today.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
They know segmented parts of me. Yes, I don't share
or confide every single detail with my family.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
My family, they know that I have a following on
social media, but I'm not like running my bikini photos
by my parents to be like, hey, can I close
this one? Do you think I need to post a
little bit more ass on this one? Like, we're not
running that by my parents. They didn't sign up for this.
I like to be very selective with what I share.
Speaker 5 (09:50):
Yeah, you play sports.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
You were very into sports Viking. I believe you were
on a kickball I was. But you said that you
used to use sports as a way to like disguise
your sexual identity.
Speaker 4 (10:15):
What was that like? Feeling like you.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Couldn't fully be yourself but using sports as like kind
of like a I don't know, I guess, like a
cover of masculinity at some point. So how has that
like relationship changed. It started as this thing as a
cloak almost, but now it's like something that you really enjoy.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
The short answer to that, it's kind of like a
spectrum for survival, if we had to go maybe left
to right. Growing up, my dad loved football. We were
conditioned from a young age. You're going to learn how
to play, You're going to learn how to catch, You're
going to learn how to do all of these things,
and I'd know and I was gay since I was
(10:52):
nine years old. I remember when Survivor came out and
I was thinking I was Michelle Williams and the Raft
and I was like, oh, like I knew. I knew
I was gay, but I also knew my family around
that time would be expecting me to start playing football
because the school I went to at the time was
(11:12):
a private school and you could start as of sixth grade,
so sixth grade and then there was like junior varsity and.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Then varsity, and I was.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Like, okay, well, I just have to like hide it
or disguise it because I knew being gay in my
household at that time was not going to work. So
sports were survival. If it was a mask, that is
a great I guess symbolism for the helmet that I
had to wear, like that was my mask. So football season,
(11:46):
I toughed it out. I did what I had to
do just so people would stop asking questions. And people
ask questions regardless. I remember my sixth or seventh grade
football coach, one of them called me skittles, and I
didn't know what that meant at the time, but of course,
as you grow up, you're like, why would he call
me skittles?
Speaker 5 (12:06):
Right?
Speaker 1 (12:07):
I like, I don't. I don't get it it. It
wasn't clicking for me at that moment. But because my
older brother was a star athlete at the school, if
there were any like hints or rumors about my sexuality,
they didn't say anything. So I just had to kind
of keep my head down, wear that mask, and continue
(12:27):
to place where I hated it. I didn't like football.
I didn't like playing it. I didn't want to get injured.
So I looked like the michelin man going to practice.
I had my shoulder pads, I had pads underneath the pads.
I had pads on my legs like all of this.
I had the ankle wraps like. I was just so
fixated on one not getting injured, but two I still
(12:52):
wanted to blend in but me being gay, of course,
I still.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Wanted to be good. I want to be dainty.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
So like there was this like a core patting that
went around, but it would kind of like give me
a little shape. So I I was so excited for
football practice because I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna act, but
but let me put.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
This one, let me put it on, let me squeeze.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
And it's just such a mess. But I did what
I could to get through that moment. So my parents
were like, we will pay for your dorm and all
of that your first year, but you need a football
scholarship because we're not paying for anything else. So we
had an understanding when I went off to college that
I was going to play football. I got to college,
(13:37):
I wasn't doing anything sports related that summer. I was
enjoying college. I was having fun. I'd never been able
to sleep over at someone's house before, and I slept
over at friends' places before they were girls, so like
nothing was gonna happen, but like I slept over in
their dorms, and I was like, oh my god, this
is what it's like to have friends and not be
(13:58):
so strict. Yeah, and so when it was time for
me to try out for the football team, I was like, oh, fuck,
I have to wear this mask again, Like I have
to go right back into this mindset. So I had
two months of freedom and then August comes around. August
of two thousand and nine comes around, and I have
to try out for the football team. I mean, I
(14:19):
made it like made it. But after two weeks I quit,
and I remember calling my parents and being like, hey,
I quit the team. That was probably the toughest, probably
the second toughest conversation I had with them besides me
coming out, and I remember they were really quiet and
they were like, well, you need to figure out how
(14:39):
you're going to pay for college. And then that was
it and we didn't talk for about two three weeks.
And in those two and three weeks, I was trying
to figure out how I was going to pay for college,
so I became a tour guide. At that point, it
was I have to figure out survival. So sports were
survival in high school, so people in me names anything
(15:01):
in front of my brothers that would bring up speculation.
Then there was the survival of my freshman year. It's like,
how am I going to be able to pay for school?
I obviously need to go to college. I need a degree.
So I then had to rediscover who Kevin was. Kevin's outgoing,
he's bubbly, he's fun. My adolescence was definitely pushed back
(15:22):
because I waited so.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Long to reveal who I actually was.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Yeah, so that first summer in college was a taste
of being authentic, and I mean I still hadn't come
out yet, but it just felt good to say, you
know what, I let the mask off. What else is
out there? What else is there for me to explore?
So I got really active on campus. I was able
(15:47):
to get scholarships from being active on campus. I joined
different clubs. I competed in a pageant my sophomore year,
which is so embarrassing whenever I if I come across
anything of it, like cut the cameras like that wasn't me.
And then I came out to my best friend Lindsay.
I came out to her after a day of Magic Kingdom,
(16:09):
like we were at Magic Kingdom, and then we went
to this place across the street. It was called Chevy's
and it just like kind of like word vomit. I
was like, Lindsay, can I tell you something? And she
was like what And I was like, I'm gay, and
then she was like really like mid bite, like mid show.
She couldn't even swallow it, but she gave me the
biggest hug and then we like talked about it, and
(16:32):
then she drove me back to campus and Firework by
Katy Perry was on this was so this was twenty
ten and this was like teenage dream era, and she
was like, you know what, whenever I hear this song,
I'm going to think of you.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
So literally to this day.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
When Biden got elected, I believe Katy Perry performed at
the inauguration that did firework. Any fourth of July, I
expect a text from Lindsay because I know she's gonna
hear that song and she's gonna be like, I'm I
thought of you.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
And was this like public or privately coming out or
like were you so or.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Just Lindsey No knew when I came out in twenty ten.
In twenty eleven, I joined my school's orientation team and
then I slowly told members of the team, but I
still wasn't out to my family. Okay, I didn't come
out to my family until I think it was Thanksgiving
of twenty twelve.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
We were at outback.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Sure was Wait, was the joke gays I think gays
come out at Thanksgiving?
Speaker 4 (17:30):
Leslie's come out of Christmas?
Speaker 3 (17:33):
I think I think it's gays come out in Thanksgiving
and lesbian's come out of Christmas.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
We absolutely did. Whoever made that joke, you were correct.
I waited until Thanksgiving, and I remember sitting across the
table from my parents. They probably hate this story, but
I'll keep it brief. I had dinner with them. It
was just me, my mom, and my dad, and I
was like, is there anything that you've ever wanted to
ask me? Like anything you've ever been curious of? And
(18:00):
my dad was like, you mean about like you being eccentric?
And I was like, well, there's another word for it.
And then he was like, you gay and I was like, yeah, yeah,
I am. And so my dad he loves a baseball cap,
and I think I get that trade from him. He
starts like fidgeting with his baseball cap and my mom
(18:23):
like completely lost her appetite, didn't want to eat the
rest of dinner. Meanwhile, I'm free. I kept that a
secret the last two years. So I'm looking at their
food like you gonna eat the rest of that? I'm
gonna take that home again, still a college student, right,
Like you lost your appetite? I got a bag. I
can take that to go. And so when I came
out to my family, that was more so okay. So
(18:46):
I'm still rediscovering myself. How do I change the things
that I've been using for survival, and now I flip
it so I am healthy and I work out for
my mental health. I work out obviously just to be
healthy and to maintain some semblance of don't ask me
(19:10):
how long it takes me to run a mile, but
I will get on the track. Like I like being
healthy and I like being able to go on hikes
whenever I visit LA and be able to walk and
do all of these things without being out of breath.
And so fitness has gone from or sports, I should say,
have gone from this method of survival to something that
(19:35):
it's part of my lifestyle and I can't live without
every single day.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
And now back to my conversation with Kevin Carr. Now
you started talking just a little bit about fitness. For
those listening who don't know, Kevin is like the prototype.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
It's not community like.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
If you see posts online, people are gonna be like goals,
like this is our goal.
Speaker 4 (20:40):
He's the goal, like this is the body.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
What inspired you to like because it's like fitness, Like
you said, it was survival that it became your safe
space and now it's a business. What made you want
to go in that direction? And how has that been
working out for you, work out.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Work, see what you're doing there.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
When it comes to fitness. I remember coming out, and
when I came out, obviously, the first thing you want
to do is immerse yourself and everything gay, and what
is everything gay? You see the ripped bodies, you see
all of the parties, you see everything that is kind
of thrown at you. But I didn't see many black
(21:27):
males doing that. It was predominantly white, masculine presenting men
who were being pushed to the forefront. And of course
there's queer media, like I remember that show obviously, Noah's Ark,
Thank you, I remember Noah's Ark. I remember Queer as Folk.
We didn't have drag Race back then, so like I know,
(21:49):
so I was yeah, and I was definitely familiar with RuPaul.
Like none of my no members of my family were gay.
I had to kind of figure everything out, and a
lot of being gay seemed to revolve around our appearance,
and it was a lot of desirability politics. If you
have muscles, you were bound to have the invite or
(22:12):
the end to do all of these things as So,
to be honest, when I first came out, I was like, well,
I mean I guess I have to start working out
and like being more serious about it. So I got
a membership at the YMCA near the Rosen Campus because
I ended up being an RA again. My parents said,
you got to figure out how to pay for school.
So I came out, listen, check the LinkedIn. So I
(22:38):
was an RA at the Rosen Campus in Orlando, which
was near all the theme parks. When I came out,
there was a YMCA on I want to say it
was Orlando Drive, and I would go there and start
working out. Didn't know what the hell I was doing,
and you know, I got a little bit of muscle.
Little body body was tea. I just did not have
(22:59):
the best habit. It was when it came to social media.
It was updating everyone on my progress and how my
body was transforming because I was going to the gym.
But I also wasn't eating properly. I had disordered eating habits.
It was a lot of trial and error, and I
think when people see the photos, they don't know the
(23:19):
trial and error that led to it. They don't know
what might have led in my earlier days to being
able to go to the beach and feel confident in
that swimsuit, but then once the photos are taken, oh,
now I think that I can eat everything in sight.
So like, I don't think many people I have talked
about this, but I don't think people read when I
(23:40):
post sometimes, so I will say something about me having
issues with binge eating, yeah, and they'll be like, no,
you didn't.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
When did you have that?
Speaker 1 (23:48):
And it's like, no, I definitely talked about this, yeah,
because I would want to be super cut and super
chiseled for a photo shoot or a day at the beach,
just to wear my swimsuits and look good in the photos.
But then I would eat an entire box of cereal
and think that, oh, I need to do an hour
on the StairMaster. So it was this like there was
like take the photo, then you have the engorging of
(24:12):
all the food. Then you have the shame. So it's
like a shame cycle of like rinse and repeat, rinse
and repeat, and so whenever people compare themselves to me
or idolize my body, of course it's flattering. However, I
want people to know all of the details that have
gone into it. Now I don't I'm lucky to say
(24:33):
that I don't have those same issues or disorders with eating,
body image issues like this is all for me. I
don't do this to try and get anyone's attention affection.
This is part of my life. I feel my most
confident and sexiest when I have a routine and my
(24:54):
lifestyle is very regiment and not regimented to the point
where I can't have some else partake in this life
with me, but regimented to where I am so disciplined
in what I eat, how I structure my day, being
able to find the time to cook, clean, do laundry,
(25:15):
but still go to the gym, still make time for friends,
Like I'm able to maintain this body but still have
all of those different things that people don't see online.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
I always want to say there is more than what
meets the eye when it comes to having a chiseled
body or ripped body. And when I launched my fitness
app last summer, a lot of the promotion that my
business coach and I work together on was just being
honest and authentic with what it takes to not only
(25:48):
have a body that I do, but maintain it so
being able to say I have to drink maybe a
gallon of water a day, I have to get enough sleep,
I have to limit my olco a whole intake, or
just not drink alcohol at all. When you say things
like that, people are like, I'm not doing that.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
I don't need to.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I don't need to do it until they see that
there is an event or there's a pool party, and
then you have someone like, oh, can you help me
get ripped in two weeks? Like, no, I can't, actually
I can't. So thankfully with the app, the rollout was
successful in my eyes, which is what matters the most.
After investing in a business coach, you wanted to be successful, right,
(26:29):
So it was successful in my eyes, and I was
very happy with how it was received. How many people
purchase training programs, how many people still use those programs
and still comment to this day. I want people to
understand there's a lot of hard work that goes into this,
and you have had a transformation as well with your body,
and you have found what works for you what doesn't
(26:52):
work for you. You are very confident and sexy, and
you present this aura of like I earn this, I've
worked so damn hard, and even your birthday photos whenever
you go on the trip. Yeah, and I'll see you.
I'll see you in a little keV kini. It's not
a bikini. It's a keV kni when it's thin enough,
when it's standing up and it shows that shape. Yeah,
(27:13):
so you'd know firsthand, and especially like being a close
friend of mine, you know firsthand how hard I work,
how hard you've had to work to achieve your body
but also maintain it. Yeah, and so that is that's
my biggest thing is I want people to learn my method,
know my method, and know that I didn't cheat to
(27:33):
look like this.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
They ain't no no better harp on me.
Speaker 4 (27:37):
You can call me for his web brand with the
brand new place.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
They are jealous. You are very, like I said, regimented,
but like very scheduled, which is something I'm finding more
important the older I get. Like I'll be forty in
a couple of months. I'm excited for it. Yeah, yeah,
(28:05):
I'm really excited for it. I'll be forty in a
few months, and so routine, having a bedtime, drinking a
gallon of water a day, because I'm now up to
a gallon of water a day. But there was a
post you made maybe about two months ago that really
really pushed me because The post was so universal, and
it was essentially people were asking you, like, how do
(28:25):
you get up so early in the morning to go
to the gym? Like it's like four point thirty in
the morning, it was like freezing outside because you see
your breath in the video. But you essentially were just
like you, like what's stopping you?
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Right?
Speaker 3 (28:37):
Like you just have to do it, Like you have
to have this mentality like if this is what I want,
I can't stop myself. And it was essentially something I
needed to see and hear, and I texted you, like
you sure did because I was like I was struggling
with working on a script for a movie and I
was also struggling with writing this next book, and I
(28:58):
was like the anxiety of it, like just thinking about
writing it was stopping me from writing.
Speaker 4 (29:02):
It and thinking about it.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
And I saw that post and literally just text you
and then I opened up my laptop and was like,
what is stopping me? Like it's me, Like I'm stopping
me for no reason. How have you, I guess like
found that space to be so confident in even that
like in the motivation for other people when you really
don't have to be right And I say that as
(29:25):
a person, because like my dad, sometimes it's like, why
do you do what you do when you know it
could put you in danger?
Speaker 4 (29:31):
And I'm like, because it's my purpose.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
How have you found this as like your purpose of
like living a purpose driven life.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
I think back to old Kevin, the Kevin that came
out and didn't have anyone to look at, and I
remember modeling my behavior based off of other people instead
of being myself and being authentic to who I was.
And so when I drop like nuggets of information whenever
(30:02):
I occasionally will speak online and let people hear my voice,
I want to provide value. I don't do it with
the intention of being this motivational speaker. I know my
strengths as a speaker, and I don't think that I
can command. You can command a room. You can absolutely
(30:22):
command a room. And I have seen you on your
book tour, like the way that you're able to eloquently
state your inspirations, your thought process behind crafting the narratives
and bringing stories from your own personal experiences and making
it something universal that other people can relate to, like
(30:42):
that is powerful and it's the reason why you're unfortunately
experiencing all of these things because you have too much power,
Like your pin is powerful. Yeah, and so for me
when it comes to fitness and being someone who wants
people to be healthier and wants them to live a
life that isn't dictated by an appearance for somebody else,
(31:07):
Like I want people to feel confident and sexy, and
here's how I do it. This is what I have
done to feel confident and sexy in my body. I
also have the people who inspire me. You inspire me.
Beyonce obviously is my biggest inspiration. Like this is a
woman who has had three children but continues to perfect
her craft. She's obviously like going to be beautiful regardless
(31:30):
of what she does. But the way in which she's
able to display sex and be tasteful instead of vulgar
and vulgar is something that I mean, everyone has a
different interpretation of that, Like some people might consider what
I do to be vulgar, but everyone has a different
level for that. So it's important to have inspiration and
(31:52):
be able to make it my own. And so these
are habits that I feel could be beneficial, but people
can also make it their own. I don't think everyone
is meant to wake up at three forty five four o'clock.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
In the morning.
Speaker 1 (32:06):
I don't think everyone should wake up at that time
because then my gym will be crowded. So no, if
you want to go to the gym later on in
the day, if you want to go to the gym
in the middle of the day, if you want to
skip the gym for the day, you do what is
best for you. Comparing yourself to me, comparing yourself to
someone else that you might have come across on social media,
(32:28):
it's not beneficial. It helps no one when everyone is
the same like it.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
It just doesn't.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
Parithon is the theft of joy.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
If I hit a milestone at the gym, or if
I hit a pr at the gym, I'm going to
post about it because that made me feel good. It's
not in any way, shape or form to tell people
you need to be squatting this much or you need
to be benching this much. If you're in the gym,
that's great. I'm not going to poke fun. I'm not
gonna make fun like I'm in there doing my thing.
(32:59):
I really don't care. You could be in there with
a thong on great cool. If the front desk allows
you to do that by all means. But as much
as my gym membership is, I do not pay to
worry about what someone else is doing when I go
to the gym.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
That is my motivation.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
You pay this much money and the hundreds of dollars
for your gym membership, you were going to the gym,
and so I know, as hard as I work for
my money, if I'm committing it to that gym membership,
I need to go. Yeah, if someone is paying for
my training programs, you should be using that. Yes, Like
it's cheaper than a trainer and you get all the
(33:36):
benefits and.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
You get all the benefits and we get to look
at you. Yeah, exactly living.
Speaker 1 (33:41):
You see me in short shorts, like I have instructional
videos for a lot of the moves. I like looking
at the videos because it's like, oh, I was in
the short short era, or I have now gone to
like a six or seven inch gym short. Yeah, before
it was given Kuci cutter, it was like was you
could see what my religion was, what panties I had on.
(34:04):
But now I'm demure, We're demure, we're mindful, we embrace
every version.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
No right, and now back to my conversation with Kevin Carr.
(34:35):
Now getting to the close out of the show, this
was again, this was a I love when anybody gets
to come on here because it's always going to be
a good conversation.
Speaker 4 (34:44):
I feel like.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
People could just leave with these gems and you have
dropped a lot today. We always close out with two segments.
I used to have a column it was called George
is Tired, where I would write once a week about
what I was tired of. So we always like to ask,
(35:05):
so what is Kevin tired of for the week?
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Oh my goodness, what am I tired of?
Speaker 3 (35:14):
You know, it could be it could be serious, like
I've been tired of shrimp tails impasta like on a
shrimp and apastas like take the tails off.
Speaker 4 (35:23):
I've been tired of kitten heels. But then I had
a friend.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
I had a friend d I mean it was like,
I have bad knees and I was like, okay, well
wedge or flat, but like we'll discuss this later. Sorry
with the kitten heels, but I still have a beef
with kitten heels.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
Listen, if you are one inch off the ground, just
take it, take it back, put a flat on.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
What am I tired of, you know what.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Leaving the stadium yesterday, I realized how many people walk
slow with no sense of urgency. That's what I'm tired of.
I'm tired of people who walk with no sense of
urge and see. I'm not saying you need to be
walking like you got a pair of shape ups on.
I'm saying you need to be conscious that there are
other people around you who may need to go or
(36:12):
pass you. I'm tired of slow walkers. I'm tired of
people who walk to a breast on a sidewalk because
who's gonna move. It's not gonna be me. It's not
gonna be me. Somebody need to figure it out. You
need to walk one behind the other. When I was
training for Ages life Cycle, they told us we could
not ride with our bike side by side. Same thing
(36:34):
for walking. I would say, that's what I'm tired of.
I love it among other things.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
And the final thing we always like to ask is
do you have a mantra or any words that you
live by. I live by the Tony Morrison quote. There's
a book you want to read and it hasn't been
written yet, then you must write it. My mantra for
twenty twenty five is scorched the Earth And yes, as
of this recording, not a way plantation was burned down.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Did you shout out to who you it? We did
hear sirens looking for they look at.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
But a plantation was reasentally burned down that it was
a venue for weddings and things, and so shout out
to whoever did that, because plantation should be burned down.
But yes, scor is my mantra twenty five. Are there
any words, quotes, or anything that you live by that
keeps you going in like a time and need you know?
Speaker 1 (37:26):
My mantra changes depending on what era I'm in, And
so I'm currently in a don't hurt yourself era and
I do mine based on marriag blog album. Ye see,
I'm so you get that you get to share my world. Yeah,
you understand. I would say not so much lemonade because
(37:51):
I've not experienced a heartbreak or anything like that. But
I have experienced betrayal when it comes to friendships and
people not either living up to your expectations of them
or just not being great friends. Yea, And so for me,
as structured as I am, if I'm carving out time
to build these relationships, to maintain these relationships, and I'm
(38:15):
not getting anything in return. Like it's it's night and
day for me. If you've ever watched the Powerpuff Girls,
I feel like I'm bubbles, Like I'm very sweet, I'm
very fun until you cross me. So I think my
mantra now is yeah, it's it's definitely don't hurt yourself
because it's like I know my worth, I know what
(38:36):
I have to offer body tea, I can crack a joke,
I can keep a conversation going, I can dance, which
I feel like people they see the little like videos
or clips of me and they're like, oh, he probably
can't t work.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
You won't say to my face, you won't do it.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
It's like I know that I have so much more
to offer than a one by one photo on Instagram
or a four by five portrait.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
And so people just have to learn that the hard way.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
And so I am in this era where I am
enjoying myself and I'm enjoying the people that pour into
me and those who don't and want to come back around.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
Don't hurt yourself.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Beautiful way to close out the shells. Everybody, remember, don't
hurt yourself. Don't Kevin here today on fighting words. I
love you so much. Yeah, and I see some We
(39:43):
delight in the beauty of the butterfly, but rarely admit
the changes that has gone through to achieve that beauty.
This is a quote from the multi talented Maya Angelou.
Angelou was a poet, a writer, an activist, and the
first black woman to answer Hollywood's directors. Get Angelou was
born in Saint Louis, Missouri, in nineteen twenty eight.
Speaker 4 (40:04):
A victim of sexual abuse at.
Speaker 3 (40:06):
A very young age, she spent five years completely mute
before she was able to speak again, thanks to an
African American woman called Miss Flowers, who made her fall
in love with poetry.
Speaker 4 (40:18):
In the nineteen fifties.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
Maya Angelou was active in the civil rights movement, working
with Martin Luther King and Malcolm X, living in Cairo
and Ghana during the early days of the Pan African
Revolutionary movement. Her acclaimed autobiography, I Know Why the Cage
Bird Sings was published in nineteen sixty nine and was
an instant bestseller. She wrote and recited the poem on
(40:42):
the posts of the morning for President Clinton's inauguration in
nineteen ninety three. Maya Angelou passed away in twenty fourteen
at the age of eighty six years old.
Speaker 4 (41:03):
Fighting Words is a production of iHeart.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Podcast in partnership with Bett's Case Studios. I'm Georgia Johnson.
This episode was produced by Charlotte Morley. Execution producers are
myself and Twiggy Puchi guar song with Adam Pinks and
brig Cats for Best Case Studios. The theme song was
written and composed by kole Vas Banbianna and Myself. Original
(41:25):
music by Kolevas. This episode was edited and scored.
Speaker 4 (41:30):
By Max Michael Miller. Our iHeart team is Ali Perry
and Carl Ketel.
Speaker 3 (41:36):
Following rape, Fighting Words, wherever you get your podcast
Whenever people compare themselves to me or idolize my body.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Of course it's flattering. However, it was a lot of.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Trial and error, and I think when people see the
photos they don't know the trial and error that led
to it.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Today, we've got something a little different. That's my friend
Kevin Carnell. He's a bodybuilder and an online fitness coach
with over three hundred thousand followers on Instagram.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
People probably don't even hear you talk often, you.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Know, they don't. They don't.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Yeah, but there's much more to Kevin than what meets
the eye. And I thought as we kick off frid
that we could talk to Kevin about how gig we're
men represent themselves online, about the benefits and harms of
social media, how to maintain your mental health, and much more.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
And also, don't search my name on Twitter. I do
not search my name anymore. If someone has an opinion
about me, that is their opinion. Right. I am going
to sleep just fine at night, regardless.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Singing in I'm heavy handy with the world. Take a
sup of brandy and you spoke, you guy.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
You know what the plan is?
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Overcame a Latin you.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
No one does understand me. My name is George M. Johnson.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
I am the New York Times bestselling author of the
book All Boys Aren't Blue, which is the number one
most challenged book in the United States. This is Fighting Words,
a show where we take you to the front lines
of the culture wars with the people who are using
their words to make change and who refuse to be silenced.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
Today's guest Kevin Carnell.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I'm ready, I'm ready. Let's go.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Hello everyone, I want to welcome to another episode of
Fighting Words. I am here today with one of my
dearest best friends, mister Kevin Carnell.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
How are you doing today?
Speaker 2 (01:57):
I'm great. I'm thankful and honored to be here.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
How are you, I'm good, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
For those who don't know, we are recording on a
Monday after partying weekend, Kevin has been to multiple Beyonce concerts.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
So two in the last four days, but.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Exactly so yeah, sorry about our voices. We always like
to start to episode the same way. I feel like
because many of us have like these online personas, people
don't really know who we are, and sometimes we don't
get the opportunity to say who we are. So for
everyone who is listening, Could you please let everyone to
know who is Kevin Carnell.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
Oh, I love this, So Kevin Carnell. I was originally
born in Florida, Miami, Florida. To be exact who am I? So,
I think outside of the Internet and what people know
of me, I would identify as a great uncle, a
great friend, a great brother, great son. Very passionate about Beyonce.
(03:00):
I love Anime, I love Pokemon, and I love self expression.
And I think that's something that in the years that
I've been active on social media, it's been very apparent
because I have utilized my platform to express myself and
my sexuality.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
I do not lead with that.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
I think it's it's very important that I specify that
it is a part of me, but not all of me.
So I do love that you have given me the
space to identify who I am before other people do,
because it feels like sometimes I'm working or fighting an
uphill battle where people may perceive who I am just
based off of photos and very limited interaction with dms
(03:45):
because I don't respond to all of them. But yeah, absolutely, absolutely, yeah.
I mean I signed an NDA so I'll never disclose
what we talk about but.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
I'm just kidding. We didn't sign an NDA.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
But yes, I think being able to speak and get
ahead of who someone else thinks I am is.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Very powerful and very important to me.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So all of those things I mentioned, I'm sure I
might have forgotten some things. It's been a minute since
I've brushed up on my elevator pitch.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
But yeah, no, thank you.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
You know, someone being your friend, it's I know how
hard it must be.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
At times.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
We joke because if I'm on Twitter, I'm going to
see someone post Kevin and make a comment. Sometimes they're
funny comments, sometimes they're really flattering comments and complimenting, but
sometimes they're pretty harsh, right, And sometimes we have to
get on and we drag people who make those harsh comments.
I feel like someone like you, it was like everyone
(04:48):
loved you until and then we never know what the
until is though, and then it just kind of starts
to dog file. How have you especially like being so
viral often? How does that take a toll on your
mental health? And what are some practices that you do
to be able to continue to remain calm and stay yourself?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Well, I would be lying if I ever said that
it didn't bother me. It has impacted my mental health
and the way that I will present online because there's
that gratification that you see all of the likes coming in,
you see the comments. And when I first started and
(05:30):
I was utilizing my body as a way of getting
that gratification, it was like fuel and it would fuel
me until it was time to post another swimsuit photo
or it was time to update and do something else.
And I have since gone back and archived a lot
of old posts just because of the frame of mind
(05:51):
that I was in when I posted them. I was
trying to get someone's attention, or I was doing it
because I needed that boost of validation. And so I
don't know if there was ever a pivotal moment that
kind of made me have that shift and turn that
behavior off, but I will say it fueled me less
(06:13):
and less when I would post something trying to get
a reaction or response from anyone, whether it be someone
I was interested in or the people who follow me.
It just became something where I knew that I was
growing as a person, where I would be able to
post something and put my phone down and continue working
because I do have a job outside of social media,
(06:35):
So to be able to put the phone down and
be like, Okay, well that was that, instead of sitting
there holding the phone trying to read comments and see
what else is going to pop up or who's going
to DM me based off of what they saw. So
my practice is now that I've gotten to a place
(06:55):
where I don't need the external validation. I know how
I looked, and I know how I felt when I
snapped the photo, took the video.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
What have you? That to me is enough.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
Early on, when I would post my travel photos, people
don't know that I, like was living in Florida, living
with my parents, saving up before I moved to LA
So people didn't know I wasn't paying rent, I was
able to travel, I was able to do all these things,
and they would just assume, Oh, you must be like
a sex worker, you must be in that score blah
(07:39):
blah blah. So it's like people don't know my life. Yeah,
and those are the people that I cannot give them
any value or stock in their opinion because they don't
know me.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
This is extremely important because you can't get lost in
the comments. I sometimes am like, oh, I want to
say something back. I want to say something back, so
you have to kind of remember, like, sometimes these are
people who you'll never meet, we never.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Know, and when you're within five feet of them, they
won't say anything. And you look around everybody on mute,
like now all of a sudden, you can't speak, You
got twitter fingers, you have all this stuff to say,
but they'll be within five feet of you and say nothing.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
You are very close to your family.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
What is that like for you, especially being such a
public figure, because you are a public figure.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, so my family and I we are close. I
like to talk to my parents every single day. And
I think that growing up they were very strict. They
provided structure, but they were just doing what their parents
did for them. And I mean, we can look back
and we can kind of pinpoint what might have worked,
(08:53):
what might not have worked. But without their parenting I
would not be as strong or as disciplined as I
am today. So I have learned to give them that grace,
even as I am an adult. They are imperfect. We're
all imperfect. I'm not expecting them to understand everything about
(09:15):
the Kevin that they have today.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
They know segmented parts of me. Yes, I don't share
or confide every single detail with my family.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
My family, they know that I have a following on
social media, but I'm not like running my bikini photos
by my parents to be like, hey, can I close
this one? Do you think I need to post a
little bit more ass on this one? Like, we're not
running that by my parents. They didn't sign up for this.
I like to be very selective with what I share.
Speaker 5 (09:50):
Yeah, you play sports.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
You were very into sports Viking. I believe you were
on a kickball I was. But you said that you
used to use sports as a way to like disguise
your sexual identity.
Speaker 4 (10:15):
What was that like? Feeling like you.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Couldn't fully be yourself but using sports as like kind
of like a I don't know, I guess, like a
cover of masculinity at some point. So how has that
like relationship changed. It started as this thing as a
cloak almost, but now it's like something that you really enjoy.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
The short answer to that, it's kind of like a
spectrum for survival, if we had to go maybe left
to right. Growing up, my dad loved football. We were
conditioned from a young age. You're going to learn how
to play, You're going to learn how to catch, You're
going to learn how to do all of these things,
and I'd know and I was gay since I was
(10:52):
nine years old. I remember when Survivor came out and
I was thinking I was Michelle Williams and the Raft
and I was like, oh, like I knew. I knew
I was gay, but I also knew my family around
that time would be expecting me to start playing football
because the school I went to at the time was
(11:12):
a private school and you could start as of sixth grade,
so sixth grade and then there was like junior varsity and.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Then varsity, and I was.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Like, okay, well, I just have to like hide it
or disguise it because I knew being gay in my
household at that time was not going to work. So
sports were survival. If it was a mask, that is
a great I guess symbolism for the helmet that I
had to wear, like that was my mask. So football season,
(11:46):
I toughed it out. I did what I had to
do just so people would stop asking questions. And people
ask questions regardless. I remember my sixth or seventh grade
football coach, one of them called me skittles, and I
didn't know what that meant at the time, but of course,
as you grow up, you're like, why would he call
me skittles?
Speaker 5 (12:06):
Right?
Speaker 1 (12:07):
I like, I don't. I don't get it it. It
wasn't clicking for me at that moment. But because my
older brother was a star athlete at the school, if
there were any like hints or rumors about my sexuality,
they didn't say anything. So I just had to kind
of keep my head down, wear that mask, and continue
(12:27):
to place where I hated it. I didn't like football.
I didn't like playing it. I didn't want to get injured.
So I looked like the michelin man going to practice.
I had my shoulder pads, I had pads underneath the pads.
I had pads on my legs like all of this.
I had the ankle wraps like. I was just so
fixated on one not getting injured, but two I still
(12:52):
wanted to blend in but me being gay, of course,
I still.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Wanted to be good. I want to be dainty.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
So like there was this like a core patting that
went around, but it would kind of like give me
a little shape. So I I was so excited for
football practice because I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna act, but
but let me put.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
This one, let me put it on, let me squeeze.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
And it's just such a mess. But I did what
I could to get through that moment. So my parents
were like, we will pay for your dorm and all
of that your first year, but you need a football
scholarship because we're not paying for anything else. So we
had an understanding when I went off to college that
I was going to play football. I got to college,
(13:37):
I wasn't doing anything sports related that summer. I was
enjoying college. I was having fun. I'd never been able
to sleep over at someone's house before, and I slept
over at friends' places before they were girls, so like
nothing was gonna happen, but like I slept over in
their dorms, and I was like, oh my god, this
is what it's like to have friends and not be
(13:58):
so strict. Yeah, and so when it was time for
me to try out for the football team, I was like, oh, fuck,
I have to wear this mask again, Like I have
to go right back into this mindset. So I had
two months of freedom and then August comes around. August
of two thousand and nine comes around, and I have
to try out for the football team. I mean, I
(14:19):
made it like made it. But after two weeks I quit,
and I remember calling my parents and being like, hey,
I quit the team. That was probably the toughest, probably
the second toughest conversation I had with them besides me
coming out, and I remember they were really quiet and
they were like, well, you need to figure out how
(14:39):
you're going to pay for college. And then that was
it and we didn't talk for about two three weeks.
And in those two and three weeks, I was trying
to figure out how I was going to pay for college,
so I became a tour guide. At that point, it
was I have to figure out survival. So sports were
survival in high school, so people in me names anything
(15:01):
in front of my brothers that would bring up speculation.
Then there was the survival of my freshman year. It's like,
how am I going to be able to pay for school?
I obviously need to go to college. I need a degree.
So I then had to rediscover who Kevin was. Kevin's outgoing,
he's bubbly, he's fun. My adolescence was definitely pushed back
(15:22):
because I waited so.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Long to reveal who I actually was.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Yeah, so that first summer in college was a taste
of being authentic, and I mean I still hadn't come
out yet, but it just felt good to say, you
know what, I let the mask off. What else is
out there? What else is there for me to explore?
So I got really active on campus. I was able
(15:47):
to get scholarships from being active on campus. I joined
different clubs. I competed in a pageant my sophomore year,
which is so embarrassing whenever I if I come across
anything of it, like cut the cameras like that wasn't me.
And then I came out to my best friend Lindsay.
I came out to her after a day of Magic Kingdom,
(16:09):
like we were at Magic Kingdom, and then we went
to this place across the street. It was called Chevy's
and it just like kind of like word vomit. I
was like, Lindsay, can I tell you something? And she
was like what And I was like, I'm gay, and
then she was like really like mid bite, like mid show.
She couldn't even swallow it, but she gave me the
biggest hug and then we like talked about it, and
(16:32):
then she drove me back to campus and Firework by
Katy Perry was on this was so this was twenty
ten and this was like teenage dream era, and she
was like, you know what, whenever I hear this song,
I'm going to think of you.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
So literally to this day.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
When Biden got elected, I believe Katy Perry performed at
the inauguration that did firework. Any fourth of July, I
expect a text from Lindsay because I know she's gonna
hear that song and she's gonna be like, I'm I
thought of you.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
And was this like public or privately coming out or
like were you so or.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Just Lindsey No knew when I came out in twenty ten.
In twenty eleven, I joined my school's orientation team and
then I slowly told members of the team, but I
still wasn't out to my family. Okay, I didn't come
out to my family until I think it was Thanksgiving
of twenty twelve.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
We were at outback.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Sure was Wait, was the joke gays I think gays
come out at Thanksgiving?
Speaker 4 (17:30):
Leslie's come out of Christmas?
Speaker 3 (17:33):
I think I think it's gays come out in Thanksgiving
and lesbian's come out of Christmas.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
We absolutely did. Whoever made that joke, you were correct.
I waited until Thanksgiving, and I remember sitting across the
table from my parents. They probably hate this story, but
I'll keep it brief. I had dinner with them. It
was just me, my mom, and my dad, and I
was like, is there anything that you've ever wanted to
ask me? Like anything you've ever been curious of? And
(18:00):
my dad was like, you mean about like you being eccentric?
And I was like, well, there's another word for it.
And then he was like, you gay and I was like, yeah, yeah,
I am. And so my dad he loves a baseball cap,
and I think I get that trade from him. He
starts like fidgeting with his baseball cap and my mom
(18:23):
like completely lost her appetite, didn't want to eat the
rest of dinner. Meanwhile, I'm free. I kept that a
secret the last two years. So I'm looking at their
food like you gonna eat the rest of that? I'm
gonna take that home again, still a college student, right,
Like you lost your appetite? I got a bag. I
can take that to go. And so when I came
out to my family, that was more so okay. So
(18:46):
I'm still rediscovering myself. How do I change the things
that I've been using for survival, and now I flip
it so I am healthy and I work out for
my mental health. I work out obviously just to be
healthy and to maintain some semblance of don't ask me
(19:10):
how long it takes me to run a mile, but
I will get on the track. Like I like being
healthy and I like being able to go on hikes
whenever I visit LA and be able to walk and
do all of these things without being out of breath.
And so fitness has gone from or sports, I should say,
have gone from this method of survival to something that
(19:35):
it's part of my lifestyle and I can't live without
every single day.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
And now back to my conversation with Kevin Carr. Now
you started talking just a little bit about fitness. For
those listening who don't know, Kevin is like the prototype.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
It's not community like.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
If you see posts online, people are gonna be like goals,
like this is our goal.
Speaker 4 (20:40):
He's the goal, like this is the body.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
What inspired you to like because it's like fitness, Like
you said, it was survival that it became your safe
space and now it's a business. What made you want
to go in that direction? And how has that been
working out for you, work out.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Work, see what you're doing there.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
When it comes to fitness. I remember coming out, and
when I came out, obviously, the first thing you want
to do is immerse yourself and everything gay, and what
is everything gay? You see the ripped bodies, you see
all of the parties, you see everything that is kind
of thrown at you. But I didn't see many black
(21:27):
males doing that. It was predominantly white, masculine presenting men
who were being pushed to the forefront. And of course
there's queer media, like I remember that show obviously, Noah's Ark,
Thank you, I remember Noah's Ark. I remember Queer as Folk.
We didn't have drag Race back then, so like I know,
(21:49):
so I was yeah, and I was definitely familiar with RuPaul.
Like none of my no members of my family were gay.
I had to kind of figure everything out, and a
lot of being gay seemed to revolve around our appearance,
and it was a lot of desirability politics. If you
have muscles, you were bound to have the invite or
(22:12):
the end to do all of these things as So,
to be honest, when I first came out, I was like, well,
I mean I guess I have to start working out
and like being more serious about it. So I got
a membership at the YMCA near the Rosen Campus because
I ended up being an RA again. My parents said,
you got to figure out how to pay for school.
So I came out, listen, check the LinkedIn. So I
(22:38):
was an RA at the Rosen Campus in Orlando, which
was near all the theme parks. When I came out,
there was a YMCA on I want to say it
was Orlando Drive, and I would go there and start
working out. Didn't know what the hell I was doing,
and you know, I got a little bit of muscle.
Little body body was tea. I just did not have
(22:59):
the best habit. It was when it came to social media.
It was updating everyone on my progress and how my
body was transforming because I was going to the gym.
But I also wasn't eating properly. I had disordered eating habits.
It was a lot of trial and error, and I
think when people see the photos, they don't know the
(23:19):
trial and error that led to it. They don't know
what might have led in my earlier days to being
able to go to the beach and feel confident in
that swimsuit, but then once the photos are taken, oh,
now I think that I can eat everything in sight.
So like, I don't think many people I have talked
about this, but I don't think people read when I
(23:40):
post sometimes, so I will say something about me having
issues with binge eating, yeah, and they'll be like, no,
you didn't.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
When did you have that?
Speaker 1 (23:48):
And it's like, no, I definitely talked about this, yeah,
because I would want to be super cut and super
chiseled for a photo shoot or a day at the beach,
just to wear my swimsuits and look good in the photos.
But then I would eat an entire box of cereal
and think that, oh, I need to do an hour
on the StairMaster. So it was this like there was
like take the photo, then you have the engorging of
(24:12):
all the food. Then you have the shame. So it's
like a shame cycle of like rinse and repeat, rinse
and repeat, and so whenever people compare themselves to me
or idolize my body, of course it's flattering. However, I
want people to know all of the details that have
gone into it. Now I don't I'm lucky to say
(24:33):
that I don't have those same issues or disorders with eating,
body image issues like this is all for me. I
don't do this to try and get anyone's attention affection.
This is part of my life. I feel my most
confident and sexiest when I have a routine and my
(24:54):
lifestyle is very regiment and not regimented to the point
where I can't have some else partake in this life
with me, but regimented to where I am so disciplined
in what I eat, how I structure my day, being
able to find the time to cook, clean, do laundry,
(25:15):
but still go to the gym, still make time for friends,
Like I'm able to maintain this body but still have
all of those different things that people don't see online.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
I always want to say there is more than what
meets the eye when it comes to having a chiseled
body or ripped body. And when I launched my fitness
app last summer, a lot of the promotion that my
business coach and I work together on was just being
honest and authentic with what it takes to not only
(25:48):
have a body that I do, but maintain it so
being able to say I have to drink maybe a
gallon of water a day, I have to get enough sleep,
I have to limit my olco a whole intake, or
just not drink alcohol at all. When you say things
like that, people are like, I'm not doing that.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
I don't need to.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I don't need to do it until they see that
there is an event or there's a pool party, and
then you have someone like, oh, can you help me
get ripped in two weeks? Like, no, I can't, actually
I can't. So thankfully with the app, the rollout was
successful in my eyes, which is what matters the most.
After investing in a business coach, you wanted to be successful, right,
(26:29):
So it was successful in my eyes, and I was
very happy with how it was received. How many people
purchase training programs, how many people still use those programs
and still comment to this day. I want people to
understand there's a lot of hard work that goes into this,
and you have had a transformation as well with your body,
and you have found what works for you what doesn't
(26:52):
work for you. You are very confident and sexy, and
you present this aura of like I earn this, I've
worked so damn hard, and even your birthday photos whenever
you go on the trip. Yeah, and I'll see you.
I'll see you in a little keV kini. It's not
a bikini. It's a keV kni when it's thin enough,
when it's standing up and it shows that shape. Yeah,
(27:13):
so you'd know firsthand, and especially like being a close
friend of mine, you know firsthand how hard I work,
how hard you've had to work to achieve your body
but also maintain it. Yeah, and so that is that's
my biggest thing is I want people to learn my method,
know my method, and know that I didn't cheat to
(27:33):
look like this.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
They ain't no no better harp on me.
Speaker 4 (27:37):
You can call me for his web brand with the
brand new place.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
They are jealous. You are very, like I said, regimented,
but like very scheduled, which is something I'm finding more
important the older I get. Like I'll be forty in
a couple of months. I'm excited for it. Yeah, yeah,
(28:05):
I'm really excited for it. I'll be forty in a
few months, and so routine, having a bedtime, drinking a
gallon of water a day, because I'm now up to
a gallon of water a day. But there was a
post you made maybe about two months ago that really
really pushed me because The post was so universal, and
it was essentially people were asking you, like, how do
(28:25):
you get up so early in the morning to go
to the gym? Like it's like four point thirty in
the morning, it was like freezing outside because you see
your breath in the video. But you essentially were just
like you, like what's stopping you?
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Right?
Speaker 3 (28:37):
Like you just have to do it, Like you have
to have this mentality like if this is what I want,
I can't stop myself. And it was essentially something I
needed to see and hear, and I texted you, like
you sure did because I was like I was struggling
with working on a script for a movie and I
was also struggling with writing this next book, and I
(28:58):
was like the anxiety of it, like just thinking about
writing it was stopping me from writing.
Speaker 4 (29:02):
It and thinking about it.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
And I saw that post and literally just text you
and then I opened up my laptop and was like,
what is stopping me? Like it's me, Like I'm stopping
me for no reason. How have you, I guess like
found that space to be so confident in even that
like in the motivation for other people when you really
don't have to be right And I say that as
(29:25):
a person, because like my dad, sometimes it's like, why
do you do what you do when you know it
could put you in danger?
Speaker 4 (29:31):
And I'm like, because it's my purpose.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
How have you found this as like your purpose of
like living a purpose driven life.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
I think back to old Kevin, the Kevin that came
out and didn't have anyone to look at, and I
remember modeling my behavior based off of other people instead
of being myself and being authentic to who I was.
And so when I drop like nuggets of information whenever
(30:02):
I occasionally will speak online and let people hear my voice,
I want to provide value. I don't do it with
the intention of being this motivational speaker. I know my
strengths as a speaker, and I don't think that I
can command. You can command a room. You can absolutely
(30:22):
command a room. And I have seen you on your
book tour, like the way that you're able to eloquently
state your inspirations, your thought process behind crafting the narratives
and bringing stories from your own personal experiences and making
it something universal that other people can relate to, like
(30:42):
that is powerful and it's the reason why you're unfortunately
experiencing all of these things because you have too much power,
Like your pin is powerful. Yeah, and so for me
when it comes to fitness and being someone who wants
people to be healthier and wants them to live a
life that isn't dictated by an appearance for somebody else,
(31:07):
Like I want people to feel confident and sexy, and
here's how I do it. This is what I have
done to feel confident and sexy in my body. I
also have the people who inspire me. You inspire me.
Beyonce obviously is my biggest inspiration. Like this is a
woman who has had three children but continues to perfect
her craft. She's obviously like going to be beautiful regardless
(31:30):
of what she does. But the way in which she's
able to display sex and be tasteful instead of vulgar
and vulgar is something that I mean, everyone has a
different interpretation of that, Like some people might consider what
I do to be vulgar, but everyone has a different
level for that. So it's important to have inspiration and
(31:52):
be able to make it my own. And so these
are habits that I feel could be beneficial, but people
can also make it their own. I don't think everyone
is meant to wake up at three forty five four o'clock.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
In the morning.
Speaker 1 (32:06):
I don't think everyone should wake up at that time
because then my gym will be crowded. So no, if
you want to go to the gym later on in
the day, if you want to go to the gym
in the middle of the day, if you want to
skip the gym for the day, you do what is
best for you. Comparing yourself to me, comparing yourself to
someone else that you might have come across on social media,
(32:28):
it's not beneficial. It helps no one when everyone is
the same like it.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
It just doesn't.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
Parithon is the theft of joy.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
If I hit a milestone at the gym, or if
I hit a pr at the gym, I'm going to
post about it because that made me feel good. It's
not in any way, shape or form to tell people
you need to be squatting this much or you need
to be benching this much. If you're in the gym,
that's great. I'm not going to poke fun. I'm not
gonna make fun like I'm in there doing my thing.
(32:59):
I really don't care. You could be in there with
a thong on great cool. If the front desk allows
you to do that by all means. But as much
as my gym membership is, I do not pay to
worry about what someone else is doing when I go
to the gym.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
That is my motivation.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
You pay this much money and the hundreds of dollars
for your gym membership, you were going to the gym,
and so I know, as hard as I work for
my money, if I'm committing it to that gym membership,
I need to go. Yeah, if someone is paying for
my training programs, you should be using that. Yes, Like
it's cheaper than a trainer and you get all the
(33:36):
benefits and.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
You get all the benefits and we get to look
at you. Yeah, exactly living.
Speaker 1 (33:41):
You see me in short shorts, like I have instructional
videos for a lot of the moves. I like looking
at the videos because it's like, oh, I was in
the short short era, or I have now gone to
like a six or seven inch gym short. Yeah, before
it was given Kuci cutter, it was like was you
could see what my religion was, what panties I had on.
(34:04):
But now I'm demure, We're demure, we're mindful, we embrace
every version.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
No right, and now back to my conversation with Kevin Carr.
(34:35):
Now getting to the close out of the show, this
was again, this was a I love when anybody gets
to come on here because it's always going to be
a good conversation.
Speaker 4 (34:44):
I feel like.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
People could just leave with these gems and you have
dropped a lot today. We always close out with two segments.
I used to have a column it was called George
is Tired, where I would write once a week about
what I was tired of. So we always like to ask,
(35:05):
so what is Kevin tired of for the week?
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Oh my goodness, what am I tired of?
Speaker 3 (35:14):
You know, it could be it could be serious, like
I've been tired of shrimp tails impasta like on a
shrimp and apastas like take the tails off.
Speaker 4 (35:23):
I've been tired of kitten heels. But then I had
a friend.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
I had a friend d I mean it was like,
I have bad knees and I was like, okay, well
wedge or flat, but like we'll discuss this later. Sorry
with the kitten heels, but I still have a beef
with kitten heels.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
Listen, if you are one inch off the ground, just
take it, take it back, put a flat on.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
What am I tired of, you know what.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Leaving the stadium yesterday, I realized how many people walk
slow with no sense of urgency. That's what I'm tired of.
I'm tired of people who walk with no sense of
urge and see. I'm not saying you need to be
walking like you got a pair of shape ups on.
I'm saying you need to be conscious that there are
other people around you who may need to go or
(36:12):
pass you. I'm tired of slow walkers. I'm tired of
people who walk to a breast on a sidewalk because
who's gonna move. It's not gonna be me. It's not
gonna be me. Somebody need to figure it out. You
need to walk one behind the other. When I was
training for Ages life Cycle, they told us we could
not ride with our bike side by side. Same thing
(36:34):
for walking. I would say, that's what I'm tired of.
I love it among other things.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
And the final thing we always like to ask is
do you have a mantra or any words that you
live by. I live by the Tony Morrison quote. There's
a book you want to read and it hasn't been
written yet, then you must write it. My mantra for
twenty twenty five is scorched the Earth And yes, as
of this recording, not a way plantation was burned down.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Did you shout out to who you it? We did
hear sirens looking for they look at.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
But a plantation was reasentally burned down that it was
a venue for weddings and things, and so shout out
to whoever did that, because plantation should be burned down.
But yes, scor is my mantra twenty five. Are there
any words, quotes, or anything that you live by that
keeps you going in like a time and need you know?
Speaker 1 (37:26):
My mantra changes depending on what era I'm in, And
so I'm currently in a don't hurt yourself era and
I do mine based on marriag blog album. Ye see,
I'm so you get that you get to share my world. Yeah,
you understand. I would say not so much lemonade because
(37:51):
I've not experienced a heartbreak or anything like that. But
I have experienced betrayal when it comes to friendships and
people not either living up to your expectations of them
or just not being great friends. Yea, And so for me,
as structured as I am, if I'm carving out time
to build these relationships, to maintain these relationships, and I'm
(38:15):
not getting anything in return. Like it's it's night and
day for me. If you've ever watched the Powerpuff Girls,
I feel like I'm bubbles, Like I'm very sweet, I'm
very fun until you cross me. So I think my
mantra now is yeah, it's it's definitely don't hurt yourself
because it's like I know my worth, I know what
(38:36):
I have to offer body tea, I can crack a joke,
I can keep a conversation going, I can dance, which
I feel like people they see the little like videos
or clips of me and they're like, oh, he probably
can't t work.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
You won't say to my face, you won't do it.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
It's like I know that I have so much more
to offer than a one by one photo on Instagram
or a four by five portrait.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
And so people just have to learn that the hard way.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
And so I am in this era where I am
enjoying myself and I'm enjoying the people that pour into
me and those who don't and want to come back around.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
Don't hurt yourself.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Beautiful way to close out the shells. Everybody, remember, don't
hurt yourself. Don't Kevin here today on fighting words. I
love you so much. Yeah, and I see some We
(39:43):
delight in the beauty of the butterfly, but rarely admit
the changes that has gone through to achieve that beauty.
This is a quote from the multi talented Maya Angelou.
Angelou was a poet, a writer, an activist, and the
first black woman to answer Hollywood's directors. Get Angelou was
born in Saint Louis, Missouri, in nineteen twenty eight.
Speaker 4 (40:04):
A victim of sexual abuse at.
Speaker 3 (40:06):
A very young age, she spent five years completely mute
before she was able to speak again, thanks to an
African American woman called Miss Flowers, who made her fall
in love with poetry.
Speaker 4 (40:18):
In the nineteen fifties.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
Maya Angelou was active in the civil rights movement, working
with Martin Luther King and Malcolm X, living in Cairo
and Ghana during the early days of the Pan African
Revolutionary movement. Her acclaimed autobiography, I Know Why the Cage
Bird Sings was published in nineteen sixty nine and was
an instant bestseller. She wrote and recited the poem on
(40:42):
the posts of the morning for President Clinton's inauguration in
nineteen ninety three. Maya Angelou passed away in twenty fourteen
at the age of eighty six years old.
Speaker 4 (41:03):
Fighting Words is a production of iHeart.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Podcast in partnership with Bett's Case Studios. I'm Georgia Johnson.
This episode was produced by Charlotte Morley. Execution producers are
myself and Twiggy Puchi guar song with Adam Pinks and
brig Cats for Best Case Studios. The theme song was
written and composed by kole Vas Banbianna and Myself. Original
(41:25):
music by Kolevas. This episode was edited and scored.
Speaker 4 (41:30):
By Max Michael Miller. Our iHeart team is Ali Perry
and Carl Ketel.
Speaker 3 (41:36):
Following rape, Fighting Words, wherever you get your podcast
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