June 5, 2025 • 32 mins
Morgan begins Week Eight, Day Four, with a foremother meditation honoring Susie King Taylor, a trailblazer in education and activism. Vanessa then teaches two life-saving skills—how to engage in restorative justice and how to take personal accountability—offering listeners actionable steps toward healing and justice. Finally, Sandria returns with an insightful interview featuring Dr. Jay, the founder of Purple Path and a leading expert in restorative justice.
Dedicated to repair and community care, this episode is a must-listen for anyone seeking meaningful ways to build stronger, more compassionate communities.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:07):
We are. Sick and tired of.
Being sick and tired the. Disrespected person in America.
Is the black woman? But still like dust.
All right. Pretty girls in the VIP they
(00:29):
came with drain. They'll need ideas.
The revolution will not be televised, brother.
You are like. A new Joe John.
Even if. You are not ready for the day.
It cannot. Always be night freedom.
(00:51):
Freedom. Freedom.
Welcome to self-care school everybody.
My name is Morgan. I'm joined on the line with my
friend Vanessa. I want to start with an Audrey
Lorde quote. She taught us that self-care is
(01:14):
an act of political warfare. Y'all.
This is our daily SOS to save ourselves, to save our sisters.
This is self-care school. You are welcome here.
You belong here. We've been waiting for you.
We are 1,000,000 black women whoare walking by your side every
day in the direction of your healthiest, most fulfilled life.
(01:37):
We start as we always do. V Are you there?
I am here. Hey everyone.
AV We start as we always do, on our porches.
Open your front door, let the sunshine in, let it touch your
face and step out onto your porch.
(01:58):
Hopefully you hear some soothingsounds out there.
We are the daughters of Susan King Taylor and before we begin,
let's honour her. She is a guardian who kept the
brave men who fought for us safe.
She was the first black army nurse in the Civil War.
(02:20):
And if you saw the movie Glory, she took care of those men.
And they just named a square after her in Savannah.
So shout out to the city of Savannah, Susan King Taylor.
But we're also opening this up to all of the black nurses who
carried that sacred legacy forward, tending to our bodies,
easing our pain and restoring our spirits.
(02:43):
Y'all, safety is what we're talking about this week.
And so I want you to stand comfortably on your porch.
I want you to feel the solid ground beneath your feet.
I want you to take a slow breathin and a longer breath out.
(03:11):
Let your shoulders soften. Let your hands rest gently by
your side. Open your senses to the world
around you. The rustle of the leaves, the
breeze. Maybe there is a distant song of
birds welcoming you to this day,the warmth of sunlight or the
(03:36):
coolness of clouds. It is all touching your skin
softly. You are here, you are present,
you are safe. This is a quiet place.
You were watched over by the earth and the sky.
(03:58):
All around you are the invisiblehands of those who came before,
the mothers who sang to childrenunder open skies, the aunties
who shared stories that built courage, sisters who stood
strong, protecting one another. Breathe deeply.
(04:20):
Breathe in the strength and carewoven through your lineage.
The nurturing spirit passed downlike a gentle river flowing
through time. Feel the rhythm of the world,
the sway of the trees, the hum of the insects, the breath of
nature itself, cradling you likea sacred shawl.
(04:44):
You are held, my sisters. You are rooted.
You are enough. You are safe.
Let that truth settle into your body, into your heart, and to
your soul. Welcome again.
We are here, Vanessa. What are we?
What are we going to talk about today?
Thank you for that meditation, Morgan.
(05:05):
Today we're going to talk about repair, and we're going to talk
about the radical possibility ofwhat community care could look
like. And we're going to talk about
what it means to truly heal, notjust as individuals, but as a
collective. And the two skills we are going
to learn today are how to participate in restorative
(05:26):
justice and how to take personalaccountability without losing
ourselves. I hope it's an episode that
really gives some people some practical information.
Morgan around not just restorative justice and repair
at large, but personally in our own personal walk, in our own
(05:47):
personal lives. I really hope that this episode
is helpful for people. And before we even get into any
of that, I just have 4 audit questions for you today so you
can step out onto your porch if you're there, if you're in a
park, on the treadmill, whereveryou are.
These questions are just meant to help you reflect before we
get into today's topic. The first question is if you
believe in second chances, I want you to step forward.
(06:12):
The second question is if you have stayed silent about harm
out of fear or shame, I want youto step back.
The third question is if you have ever donated to a bail fund
mutually or court support effort, step forward.
And then my last question is, ifyou are unsure of how to define
(06:34):
justice outside of the legal system, meaning police or the
courts, I want you to take a step back.
I want to tell a quick story. And then I want to bring in so
dope Sandria and her interview and just us getting a little bit
more context and definition before we even jump into the two
skills. So let's bring in Sandra as you.
She's usually on Tuesdays, but Iheld her this interview for
(06:55):
today so that we can talk, have a really rich conversation.
Hey y'all, it's your home girl host.
So dope. Sandria Chicago's very own and
today I'm joined by Doctor Shaniqua Jones, affectionately
known as Doctor J. She is a global leader,
restorative justice expert, scholar, and the founder of
(07:16):
Purple Path. Welcome to self-care school.
Doctor J. Thank you for having me.
I am so excited to have you. This is truly a treat.
We hear the phrase criminal justice reform often, but what
does that actually mean and how is restorative justice a part of
(07:37):
that? I'll start off with saying that
when we think about restorative justice is restoring humanity,
we live in a day and time where we see so many instances of
dehumanization taking place thathumanity has to be at the
forefront. And we have to stop using
buzzwords, you know, because they have become buzzwords, but
they're more than just buzzwords.
Reentry, restorative justice andreform.
And so we have to get to the healing so people can live and
(08:00):
thrive. So when we talk about this
healing, how does restorative justice help bring healing?
Because in a traditional sense, when we talk about criminal
justice, it's really focusing onthe punishment.
When we talk about restorative justice, it's talking about the
healing, the need to take place and seeing the person, the
humanity and the person, regardless of what the harm may
have been, and then how to repair that harm.
(08:21):
And I know this is an area that you are very well studied in.
You are a thought leader in the area of restorative justice is
how can the everyday citizen be a part of restorative justice?
What does that look like for theeveryday person?
To make it as plain and simple as you know, humanity starts
with hello. And I'm not saying you have to
(08:41):
stop and speak to every person that you come in connection to
or in close proximity to. But how many times have you
walked past someone and they mayhave spoken to you and by the
time you realize they spoke, that moment of humanity has
passed by because we have to do this in our head.
So one is hello. That's the most simplest Form 2,
making space for accountability as well as three truth for
(09:03):
healing and transformation. And so doing the internal work
that you need to do to make surethat you're whole again or as
whole as possible so that you could begin to heal others as
well as humanize them. And that's how the healing takes
place. And I think there's a balance.
I feel like in Western culture, we're very much taught to be
individualized or individual healing.
(09:24):
But then there's also something to be said, especially as Black
people, just around collective healing and being communal.
So from that restorative justicelens, what does collective
healing look like? What, what could be the impact
of that? Oh my gosh.
So just give you a quick glimpse.
I started doing Hillary treats that are open to the public
(09:46):
April of 2023 because most timesI'm brought on through
organizational leadership and things of that nature.
And so when I started doing these retreats, it was for the
community and we went to, we started with 15 people and now
we're well over 200 plus people.And it's not just women because
healing is, you know, it's not linear, it's not gender
specific, it's for everyone. If you have a heartbeat, healing
(10:06):
is for you, right? And so it's about being able to
have a safe and brave space thatyou could call your own and then
not just trauma dump or have a trauma bond, but let's get to
the solution that's conducive tomeet your needs.
It's about making sure that you know how to advocate for
yourself in order to advocate for others.
It's about knowing your rights as a citizen.
It's about knowing that voting is very intentional.
(10:28):
It's about understanding refusing to dehumanize people.
It's about being willing to holdspace for hard conversations and
shift from a scarcity to a wealth mindset.
It's all of these things that wehave the capacity and bandwidth
to do when we start doing the internal work that's needed.
It sounds like with this particular practice, we're
really calling people in rather than calling them out and and
(10:50):
shaming them. So thank you for for bringing
this to the forefront for us. Thank you for being a guest
today. And I will turn it back over to
you, Morgan and Vanessa. Thank.
You, Sandria, and thank you, Doctor J.
Her organization is called Purple Path Morgan.
I loved when Sandria said we arecalling people in and not
calling them out. So just as a recap of what she
(11:12):
said in my own words. Restorative justice is a healing
centered response to harm that focuses on accountability,
repair, and transformation, not punishment.
It asked what happened, who was harmed, and what will it take to
make things right. Instead of removing people from
their communities, restorative justice brings them together to
(11:35):
tell the truth, feel the impact,and do the actual work.
There's three Rs of healing justice.
You recognize the harm. You request permission to make
amends. You repair with actions, not
just words. And the repair part is so
essential. Morgan It's actually now that
(11:57):
we're in this conversation, that's what I think about
justice. There's something about repair.
There's something about figuringout how do you repair with your
actions and not just your words,the harm that was done.
And oftentimes it might be, I'm imagining, especially in the
cases of say like murder or something like that, that the
repair is not going to be bringing a person back.
But there might be something that you can do, some sort of
(12:19):
service, some sort of offering, sort of some sort of something
that would bring that kind of reconciliation into into a
person's heart. I want to tell a story for
people and just give some examples of a restorative
justice work that is working really well.
So in the morning Morgan of November of 1979 in Greensboro,
NC, a group of activists were organized and they gathered in
(12:43):
the Morningside Homes neighborhood for a death to the
Klan rally. And by the way, this is 1979
that they were having to have this rally in Greensboro, NC
They, unbeknownst to them, they didn't know that there was a
caravan of nine vehicles carrying 37 members of the KKK
and the American Nazi Party thatwere in route and they were
(13:04):
armed and they intended to have a confrontation.
At approximately 11:00 AM, the caravan arrived.
A confrontation ensued. It escalated rapidly.
Gunfire erupted. 5 protesters were killed, the incident cat
was captured on camera and it became known as the Greensboro
(13:27):
Massacre. In the aftermath, 2 criminal
trials resulted in acquittals for the accused Klansmen and the
Nazis. Despite the video evidence, a
subsequent civil trial in 1985 found members of the KKK and the
Nazi Party and the Greensboro Police Department were all
(13:47):
liable for the wrongful death ofone of those men who were
killed, Doctor Nathan, and they awarded them damages to his
widow. But that wasn't Justice Morgan
for those folks. So in 1999, on the 20th
anniversary of the massacre, some folks who we know and got a
chance to meet Morgan, Reverend Nelson and Mrs. Joyce Johnson,
(14:08):
initiated the Greensboro Truth and Reconciliation Commission.
It was the first of its kind in the United States.
The Commission eventually was established fully in 2004, and
it seeks to uncover the truth, promote healing and foster
reconciliation. And Doctor Nelson and Misses
Johnson started something calledthe Beloved Community Center,
(14:31):
which is very active today, and it embodies their vision and
their principles of justice and equality and love.
And they have been bringing members together, Morgan, in
that community where the KKK andthe Nazis pressed down on them
as early as 1979. And they have been bringing
together people from across the community and pioneering really
(14:54):
powerful truth and reconciliation in this country
around racial reckoning, racial reconciliation.
And it's been a really powerful example of, for me, around
what's possible. So I just wanted to uplift their
work and uplift as a solidarity spotlight, the Beloved Community
Center in Greensboro and the work that they are doing.
(15:14):
You had a chance to meet them, right?
Yeah, a lot. And I, and I was supposed to go
to their house in Greensboro andI sat with Pastor Johnson on a
panel and they're all of what you just said is so beautiful.
And I was just thinking to myself and Essa.
And it also resulted in the mostbeautiful love affair between
the two of them, where when you can find forgiveness in your own
(15:36):
heart, you have a different energy and you have a different
posture. And love requires the absence of
rage. And there's something so
beautiful about the two of them,this couple, this pastor and his
wife and how they love each other.
It's so pure and so light filledand so beautiful.
And they love other people that way.
Yeah, their love story is reallybeautiful.
(15:58):
And they're pulling their I, their concepts of restorative
justice, y'all. They're pulling from very
ancient traditions, indigenous communities, African
communities, Maori communities. They've long practiced circle
justice, truth telling and collective repair.
And I feel like in today's world, we've been so
indoctrinated by this idea that only the police, only the
(16:21):
courts, only the legal system can solve our challenges for us.
And this for me, is an opportunity, especially in this
skill, one around just understanding restorative
justice, to open up our own minds to what's possible.
There's two other really great examples besides the beloved
Community Center of where this is happening excellently.
First of all, shout out to the Oakland Public School District.
(16:44):
I was on their site doing research for this episode and
they are so explicit and they speak such truths of power about
the need to not criminalize our students.
And we all know the hopefully know the the statistics, the
startling statistics around black boys and girls.
I think they're like 4 times more likely to get like
suspended, 4 times more likely to get like to face consequences
(17:08):
at school around their behaviors.
And the Oakland Public School District, Morgan, they're
pushing back on this in a reallybeautiful way.
And they've instituted A restorative justice practice
throughout their school system so that when a student causes
harm, they're invited into a circle alongside those they
hurt. And they're asked to first, all
of them are asked to name their emotions.
(17:28):
And they're given this really beautiful fillings chart that
actually goes deeper than I'm angry or I'm hurt.
And it asks them to name their emotions.
And then it asks the person who does the harm to actually own
their actions. And then they agree as a
collective on how they are goingto make things right.
And these practices have reducedsuspensions by almost 45% in the
(17:49):
schools that are practicing it. And it's strengthened the
community around the school, as you can imagine.
So the Oakland Public School District is one really beautiful
example of how it's working. And then in Brooklyn, there's an
organization called Common Justice.
I don't know if you've heard of them before, but I think the
founder of the Common Justice was at Ted with us a couple of
times. But they offer survivors of
(18:11):
serious violence and alternativeto prison.
So when survivors choose this path, people who caused the harm
sit in the circle. So if a survivor of a serious
crime Morgan, they can choose towork with common justice instead
of the legal system, which is all already in and of itself
powerfully freeing you from the need for punishment of this
(18:32):
person in this way, where punishment is equal to
inflicting harm on the person who inflicted harm on you.
So common justice allows the survivors to choose a path and
then they bring the person who'scaused them harm into the circle
to admit what they've done and to complete a healing plan that
centers the survivors needs. And they've had a dramatic
(18:52):
amount of success with their program common justice.
So those are three really good examples.
The beloved community in North Carolina, the Oakland Public
School District and in Brooklyn common justice where people are
finding alternatives to involving the court systems and
the legal systems and the ways that they're doing.
And then one common thread around all three of these
examples is they really do believe, Morgan, that we cannot
(19:16):
just remove the people who've done the harm from our community
and then expect that they're just going to come back into the
community and things are going to be OK.
And that the removing them from the community causes such harm
that there never is really a chance for a repair.
So those are three examples and I hope people feel really
inspired by those examples. Yeah, I think it's fantastic.
(19:37):
I also want to lift up the work that's happening in Rwanda
because what you just said reminds me of that, You know,
after South Africa and apartheidand all of the violence that was
done there. You know, Bishop Tutu did the
truth and Reconciliation trials.And then after the war in
Rwanda, where half of the population was warring against
(19:58):
the other half, and there was somuch egregious, like violent,
violent, violent murder, you wonder how a society can come
back from that, where neighbors are still living next to the
people who may have killed theirloved ones.
And that country has done such an excellent job in restorative
(20:21):
justice. And so I have a friend who's a
leader there in Rwanda. And on her first day on her job,
when she went, she sent me this long text.
And she was like, yo, I was like, what?
She was like, yeah. So it's, it's it every single
year they, they, they have memorialized the massacre.
(20:41):
And so, you know, the businessesgo quiet.
They take moments to like, reflect.
People write poetry. I was there one year for the
memorial. They write poetry.
People sing in the streets, theylight candles.
They don't forget. And, and she was like, yeah, I'm
here. And she goes.
So my first duty kind of as, youknow, as a diplomat here is to
(21:01):
sit and, and listen to the trials.
And she was like, it's just people begging for forgiveness
from their community. And she was like, and then
there's like mothers who are just like lying prone on the
ground crying. And she was just like, but this
is what healing looks like. And so, you know, you take it at
a country level, then you take it at like, you know, a city
(21:25):
like Greensboro that needs to heal.
You take it like at a school level or a system of schools
level. And then you take it to a family
level or a friendship level and it just is hard because we keep
doing violence instead of even doing any restoration or any
curiosity or any kindness. And that's and it.
(21:45):
And it feels easier to understand at this kind of
extracted level of like a city or like a whatever.
But when it's like your family it it's harder.
Exactly, Morgan. It's very hard.
And actually that's a beautiful segue into our second skill,
which is actually how to take upaccountability for our own
(22:08):
actions personally. So we've talked about
restorative justice and what it looks like in the world.
We've talked about what it lookslike in the schools and how it
cannot be in the courtrooms. And we've talked about it from a
community level. But I wanted to provide space on
this episode for us to turn inward and to walk towards our
own personal truths and to ask ourselves, where is it that
(22:28):
maybe we have caused harm to somebody?
And where is it and how is it that we can personally seek to
have a reconciliation? And so I want to lead everybody
through. First of all, I want to talk
about the 4A's of personal repair.
And this is for us personally, the first thing that we have to
(22:50):
do when we're talking about personal repair is to
acknowledge. And so right now actually, I
want everybody to think about one person in their life who
comes up when you think about the word regret, or maybe it's
not regret, but maybe it's sorrow and you think about
somebody or maybe it's harm. Think about somebody, but have
(23:13):
somebody in your mind. You have to acknowledge that
there was harm done. That's the first thing.
And you have to say the truth isI hurt.
And you can insert their name and you can say it without an
excuse. So just for yourself, the truth
is I hurt this person and this is just an exercise for us.
(23:33):
And the second a of the 4A's is apologize.
You have to take full responsibility without excuses
or making excuses for why you did it.
Just full responsibility. I was wrong.
I'm not here to explain it away,I'm here to own it.
So first you acknowledge, then you apologize.
(23:55):
The third of the 4A's of personal affair is then you ask
what would healing look like foryou.
You have to ask it to the other person.
This is not about you. This is now about the other
person. What would healing look like for
you? And you may not know or they may
not know, but to ask the question is powerful.
(24:15):
So we're going to acknowledge that there was harm done.
We're going to apologize and take responsibility.
We're going to ask what would healing look like?
And then we are going to act. We are going to commit to acting
differently, commit to showing up better.
(24:35):
Even if they never forgive you, which is the powerful part of
this accountability is that you commit to act differently and to
show up better and other circumstances and situations in
your life. Every single person who's
walking with us, who's listeningto my voice right now, this is a
part of the accountability without shame.
(24:57):
We all have hurt somebody. It's easier for us to talk about
reconciliation and to talk aboutrestorative justice when we're
talking about the outside peopleoutside of us or especially when
we're talking about harm that isdone to us.
But the most powerful practice is to actually put your own self
in the situation and ask where is it in your life where you can
(25:18):
experience repair. And I have two affirmations for
us, Morgan. And maybe you can just repeat
them and everybody else can repeat them out there.
I am not my mistakes. I am the change I choose today.
And then the second one is I walk in truth, I walk in love.
(25:39):
I walk towards repair. And just like that, y'all, we
have walked through two powerfulskills, how to participate in
restorative justice and how to take personal accountability
without losing yourself. And it's talk back Thursday now.
And so I actually want to bring in my home girl, our home girl
Naira. We call her next Gen.
(25:59):
Naira now. Naira, are you on the line with
us? Yes.
I am hello. Naira, what do you have for us
today? So I have some women just
sharing their experiences about reflecting on power plays and
really just reflecting on all the ways that they connect, if
it's life experiences, if it's the women or the foremothers
(26:21):
that you have all kind of mentioned in last weeks or the
previous weeks episodes. But one thing that I really want
to hear, and I actually want to challenge the women I love
hearing the experiences. But I would love to know what
young women that you're impacting and sharing this
information with in your life. And are they walking with you on
(26:42):
this journey? And so as we're building a
coalition of young women, of getting more young women into
the movement, I would love to hear women sharing about their
experience with sharing their experience with self-care school
with younger women in their lives.
So yeah. And Morgan, y'all just gotta
stop playing. Stop playing.
(27:04):
Like, I don't know. I was getting so excited today.
Oh my goodness. You started hauling out the
names of their four mothers about Phyllis Wheatley and
Quinn, not Singer and Ella Baker.
And then you got this team o'clock.
(27:24):
And I'm like, wait a minute, they are the names of the back
of the T-shirt that we had when we went to Selma for the Bloody
Sunday 50th anniversary. I made my granddaughter, who was
able to go long, 14 years old atthe time, know every one of them
names and tell it to her cousinsin them.
(27:44):
So yes, I'm walking in this power.
I'm getting ready, going to thislittle sister circle now.
But a diverse intergenerational group of women and the first
thing I'm gonna make have them do is pull out their self up and
do the good thing myself Care school.
Hi girl Trek, I'm just finishingup my Walk for Thursdays power
(28:10):
plays episode on public assistance.
And I'm an educator. And like so many other
educators, our salaries, our income, it's so low that we
qualify for public assistance. And I just want to encourage the
teachers, the staff, the supportstaff in education to not be
(28:36):
shamed, to seek that public assistance and support your
family. Girl trek just finished week 7.
I'm standing taller with my shoulders back.
This class remind me not to shrivel.
When I was in high school in Charleston, SC, I had the
opportunity of a brief conversation with Miss Septima
(28:59):
Clark. Back then I did not know her
legacy, but I did know she was aperson that I should get to
know. Now I have and hold dearly a
picture of my mother-in-law, Ernestine Felder, with Miss
Septima Clark and Rosa Parks. They work tirelessly together
(29:20):
for the civil rights. First of all, that's a master
class on how to say Septima Clark.
It is Septima Septima, not Septima Septima.
This is from the words of somebody who knew her, Septima
Clark. Septima.
Oh, I love that. First of all, that we have
people who knew Septima Clark and we honor you.
We honor you, sister, and we honor her legacy too, by saying
(29:43):
her name correctly. Oh, this is so beautiful.
Those are beautiful choices. Naira y'all.
Keep going to myself. careschool.com.
Keep leaving your testimonials. All right, Morgan.
All right, Naira, we have come to the end of this talk back
Thursday, the end of today's walk.
Thank you all. We will be back here tomorrow
for for Mother Friday. We're going to close out with a
(30:06):
reading of a poem by Mrs. Asada Shakur.
This poem is called Affirmationsand it's read by a troupe of
actors. So I hope you all enjoyed this
poem as you close out your walksand finish up to go wherever you
need to go today. See y'all tomorrow.
I believe in living. I believe in the spectrum of
(30:27):
beta days and gamma people. I believe in sunshine.
And windmills, Waterfalls. Tricycles.
Rocking chairs. And I believe that seeds grow
into sprouts. And sprouts grow into trees.
I believe in the magic of the hands.
(30:48):
And in the wisdom. Of the eyes.
I. Believe in rain and tears and in
the blood of Infinity. I believe in life.
And I have seen the Death paradeMarch through the torso of the
earth. Sculpting mud bodies in its
path. I have seen the destruction of
(31:10):
the daylight and seen bloodthirsty maggots.
Prayed to and some loot. I've seen the kind.
Become the blind and the. Blind become the bind.
In one. Easy lesson I've walked on Cut.
Grass. I've eaten crow and blunder
bread. I have been locked.
By the lawless. Handcuffed.
(31:30):
By the haters, gagged by the greedy, and if I know anything
at all instead of Wall. Is just.
A wall and nothing more at all. It can be broken.
Down I believe in living. I believe in birth.
I believe in the sweat of love. And in the fire.
(31:51):
Of truth. And I believe.
That a lost ship. Steered by.
Tired sea. 6 sailors can still. Be tied at home to.
Port.
We are. Sick and tired of.
Being sick and tired the. Disrespected person in America.
Is the black woman? But still like dust.
All right. Pretty girls in the VIP they
(00:29):
came with drain. They'll need ideas.
The revolution will not be televised, brother.
You are like. A new Joe John.
Even if. You are not ready for the day.
It cannot. Always be night freedom.
(00:51):
Freedom. Freedom.
Welcome to self-care school everybody.
My name is Morgan. I'm joined on the line with my
friend Vanessa. I want to start with an Audrey
Lorde quote. She taught us that self-care is
(01:14):
an act of political warfare. Y'all.
This is our daily SOS to save ourselves, to save our sisters.
This is self-care school. You are welcome here.
You belong here. We've been waiting for you.
We are 1,000,000 black women whoare walking by your side every
day in the direction of your healthiest, most fulfilled life.
(01:37):
We start as we always do. V Are you there?
I am here. Hey everyone.
AV We start as we always do, on our porches.
Open your front door, let the sunshine in, let it touch your
face and step out onto your porch.
(01:58):
Hopefully you hear some soothingsounds out there.
We are the daughters of Susan King Taylor and before we begin,
let's honour her. She is a guardian who kept the
brave men who fought for us safe.
She was the first black army nurse in the Civil War.
(02:20):
And if you saw the movie Glory, she took care of those men.
And they just named a square after her in Savannah.
So shout out to the city of Savannah, Susan King Taylor.
But we're also opening this up to all of the black nurses who
carried that sacred legacy forward, tending to our bodies,
easing our pain and restoring our spirits.
(02:43):
Y'all, safety is what we're talking about this week.
And so I want you to stand comfortably on your porch.
I want you to feel the solid ground beneath your feet.
I want you to take a slow breathin and a longer breath out.
(03:11):
Let your shoulders soften. Let your hands rest gently by
your side. Open your senses to the world
around you. The rustle of the leaves, the
breeze. Maybe there is a distant song of
birds welcoming you to this day,the warmth of sunlight or the
(03:36):
coolness of clouds. It is all touching your skin
softly. You are here, you are present,
you are safe. This is a quiet place.
You were watched over by the earth and the sky.
(03:58):
All around you are the invisiblehands of those who came before,
the mothers who sang to childrenunder open skies, the aunties
who shared stories that built courage, sisters who stood
strong, protecting one another. Breathe deeply.
(04:20):
Breathe in the strength and carewoven through your lineage.
The nurturing spirit passed downlike a gentle river flowing
through time. Feel the rhythm of the world,
the sway of the trees, the hum of the insects, the breath of
nature itself, cradling you likea sacred shawl.
(04:44):
You are held, my sisters. You are rooted.
You are enough. You are safe.
Let that truth settle into your body, into your heart, and to
your soul. Welcome again.
We are here, Vanessa. What are we?
What are we going to talk about today?
Thank you for that meditation, Morgan.
(05:05):
Today we're going to talk about repair, and we're going to talk
about the radical possibility ofwhat community care could look
like. And we're going to talk about
what it means to truly heal, notjust as individuals, but as a
collective. And the two skills we are going
to learn today are how to participate in restorative
(05:26):
justice and how to take personalaccountability without losing
ourselves. I hope it's an episode that
really gives some people some practical information.
Morgan around not just restorative justice and repair
at large, but personally in our own personal walk, in our own
(05:47):
personal lives. I really hope that this episode
is helpful for people. And before we even get into any
of that, I just have 4 audit questions for you today so you
can step out onto your porch if you're there, if you're in a
park, on the treadmill, whereveryou are.
These questions are just meant to help you reflect before we
get into today's topic. The first question is if you
believe in second chances, I want you to step forward.
(06:12):
The second question is if you have stayed silent about harm
out of fear or shame, I want youto step back.
The third question is if you have ever donated to a bail fund
mutually or court support effort, step forward.
And then my last question is, ifyou are unsure of how to define
(06:34):
justice outside of the legal system, meaning police or the
courts, I want you to take a step back.
I want to tell a quick story. And then I want to bring in so
dope Sandria and her interview and just us getting a little bit
more context and definition before we even jump into the two
skills. So let's bring in Sandra as you.
She's usually on Tuesdays, but Iheld her this interview for
(06:55):
today so that we can talk, have a really rich conversation.
Hey y'all, it's your home girl host.
So dope. Sandria Chicago's very own and
today I'm joined by Doctor Shaniqua Jones, affectionately
known as Doctor J. She is a global leader,
restorative justice expert, scholar, and the founder of
(07:16):
Purple Path. Welcome to self-care school.
Doctor J. Thank you for having me.
I am so excited to have you. This is truly a treat.
We hear the phrase criminal justice reform often, but what
does that actually mean and how is restorative justice a part of
(07:37):
that? I'll start off with saying that
when we think about restorative justice is restoring humanity,
we live in a day and time where we see so many instances of
dehumanization taking place thathumanity has to be at the
forefront. And we have to stop using
buzzwords, you know, because they have become buzzwords, but
they're more than just buzzwords.
Reentry, restorative justice andreform.
And so we have to get to the healing so people can live and
(08:00):
thrive. So when we talk about this
healing, how does restorative justice help bring healing?
Because in a traditional sense, when we talk about criminal
justice, it's really focusing onthe punishment.
When we talk about restorative justice, it's talking about the
healing, the need to take place and seeing the person, the
humanity and the person, regardless of what the harm may
have been, and then how to repair that harm.
(08:21):
And I know this is an area that you are very well studied in.
You are a thought leader in the area of restorative justice is
how can the everyday citizen be a part of restorative justice?
What does that look like for theeveryday person?
To make it as plain and simple as you know, humanity starts
with hello. And I'm not saying you have to
(08:41):
stop and speak to every person that you come in connection to
or in close proximity to. But how many times have you
walked past someone and they mayhave spoken to you and by the
time you realize they spoke, that moment of humanity has
passed by because we have to do this in our head.
So one is hello. That's the most simplest Form 2,
making space for accountability as well as three truth for
(09:03):
healing and transformation. And so doing the internal work
that you need to do to make surethat you're whole again or as
whole as possible so that you could begin to heal others as
well as humanize them. And that's how the healing takes
place. And I think there's a balance.
I feel like in Western culture, we're very much taught to be
individualized or individual healing.
(09:24):
But then there's also something to be said, especially as Black
people, just around collective healing and being communal.
So from that restorative justicelens, what does collective
healing look like? What, what could be the impact
of that? Oh my gosh.
So just give you a quick glimpse.
I started doing Hillary treats that are open to the public
(09:46):
April of 2023 because most timesI'm brought on through
organizational leadership and things of that nature.
And so when I started doing these retreats, it was for the
community and we went to, we started with 15 people and now
we're well over 200 plus people.And it's not just women because
healing is, you know, it's not linear, it's not gender
specific, it's for everyone. If you have a heartbeat, healing
(10:06):
is for you, right? And so it's about being able to
have a safe and brave space thatyou could call your own and then
not just trauma dump or have a trauma bond, but let's get to
the solution that's conducive tomeet your needs.
It's about making sure that you know how to advocate for
yourself in order to advocate for others.
It's about knowing your rights as a citizen.
It's about knowing that voting is very intentional.
(10:28):
It's about understanding refusing to dehumanize people.
It's about being willing to holdspace for hard conversations and
shift from a scarcity to a wealth mindset.
It's all of these things that wehave the capacity and bandwidth
to do when we start doing the internal work that's needed.
It sounds like with this particular practice, we're
really calling people in rather than calling them out and and
(10:50):
shaming them. So thank you for for bringing
this to the forefront for us. Thank you for being a guest
today. And I will turn it back over to
you, Morgan and Vanessa. Thank.
You, Sandria, and thank you, Doctor J.
Her organization is called Purple Path Morgan.
I loved when Sandria said we arecalling people in and not
calling them out. So just as a recap of what she
(11:12):
said in my own words. Restorative justice is a healing
centered response to harm that focuses on accountability,
repair, and transformation, not punishment.
It asked what happened, who was harmed, and what will it take to
make things right. Instead of removing people from
their communities, restorative justice brings them together to
(11:35):
tell the truth, feel the impact,and do the actual work.
There's three Rs of healing justice.
You recognize the harm. You request permission to make
amends. You repair with actions, not
just words. And the repair part is so
essential. Morgan It's actually now that
(11:57):
we're in this conversation, that's what I think about
justice. There's something about repair.
There's something about figuringout how do you repair with your
actions and not just your words,the harm that was done.
And oftentimes it might be, I'm imagining, especially in the
cases of say like murder or something like that, that the
repair is not going to be bringing a person back.
But there might be something that you can do, some sort of
(12:19):
service, some sort of offering, sort of some sort of something
that would bring that kind of reconciliation into into a
person's heart. I want to tell a story for
people and just give some examples of a restorative
justice work that is working really well.
So in the morning Morgan of November of 1979 in Greensboro,
NC, a group of activists were organized and they gathered in
(12:43):
the Morningside Homes neighborhood for a death to the
Klan rally. And by the way, this is 1979
that they were having to have this rally in Greensboro, NC
They, unbeknownst to them, they didn't know that there was a
caravan of nine vehicles carrying 37 members of the KKK
and the American Nazi Party thatwere in route and they were
(13:04):
armed and they intended to have a confrontation.
At approximately 11:00 AM, the caravan arrived.
A confrontation ensued. It escalated rapidly.
Gunfire erupted. 5 protesters were killed, the incident cat
was captured on camera and it became known as the Greensboro
(13:27):
Massacre. In the aftermath, 2 criminal
trials resulted in acquittals for the accused Klansmen and the
Nazis. Despite the video evidence, a
subsequent civil trial in 1985 found members of the KKK and the
Nazi Party and the Greensboro Police Department were all
(13:47):
liable for the wrongful death ofone of those men who were
killed, Doctor Nathan, and they awarded them damages to his
widow. But that wasn't Justice Morgan
for those folks. So in 1999, on the 20th
anniversary of the massacre, some folks who we know and got a
chance to meet Morgan, Reverend Nelson and Mrs. Joyce Johnson,
(14:08):
initiated the Greensboro Truth and Reconciliation Commission.
It was the first of its kind in the United States.
The Commission eventually was established fully in 2004, and
it seeks to uncover the truth, promote healing and foster
reconciliation. And Doctor Nelson and Misses
Johnson started something calledthe Beloved Community Center,
(14:31):
which is very active today, and it embodies their vision and
their principles of justice and equality and love.
And they have been bringing members together, Morgan, in
that community where the KKK andthe Nazis pressed down on them
as early as 1979. And they have been bringing
together people from across the community and pioneering really
(14:54):
powerful truth and reconciliation in this country
around racial reckoning, racial reconciliation.
And it's been a really powerful example of, for me, around
what's possible. So I just wanted to uplift their
work and uplift as a solidarity spotlight, the Beloved Community
Center in Greensboro and the work that they are doing.
(15:14):
You had a chance to meet them, right?
Yeah, a lot. And I, and I was supposed to go
to their house in Greensboro andI sat with Pastor Johnson on a
panel and they're all of what you just said is so beautiful.
And I was just thinking to myself and Essa.
And it also resulted in the mostbeautiful love affair between
the two of them, where when you can find forgiveness in your own
(15:36):
heart, you have a different energy and you have a different
posture. And love requires the absence of
rage. And there's something so
beautiful about the two of them,this couple, this pastor and his
wife and how they love each other.
It's so pure and so light filledand so beautiful.
And they love other people that way.
Yeah, their love story is reallybeautiful.
(15:58):
And they're pulling their I, their concepts of restorative
justice, y'all. They're pulling from very
ancient traditions, indigenous communities, African
communities, Maori communities. They've long practiced circle
justice, truth telling and collective repair.
And I feel like in today's world, we've been so
indoctrinated by this idea that only the police, only the
(16:21):
courts, only the legal system can solve our challenges for us.
And this for me, is an opportunity, especially in this
skill, one around just understanding restorative
justice, to open up our own minds to what's possible.
There's two other really great examples besides the beloved
Community Center of where this is happening excellently.
First of all, shout out to the Oakland Public School District.
(16:44):
I was on their site doing research for this episode and
they are so explicit and they speak such truths of power about
the need to not criminalize our students.
And we all know the hopefully know the the statistics, the
startling statistics around black boys and girls.
I think they're like 4 times more likely to get like
suspended, 4 times more likely to get like to face consequences
(17:08):
at school around their behaviors.
And the Oakland Public School District, Morgan, they're
pushing back on this in a reallybeautiful way.
And they've instituted A restorative justice practice
throughout their school system so that when a student causes
harm, they're invited into a circle alongside those they
hurt. And they're asked to first, all
of them are asked to name their emotions.
(17:28):
And they're given this really beautiful fillings chart that
actually goes deeper than I'm angry or I'm hurt.
And it asks them to name their emotions.
And then it asks the person who does the harm to actually own
their actions. And then they agree as a
collective on how they are goingto make things right.
And these practices have reducedsuspensions by almost 45% in the
(17:49):
schools that are practicing it. And it's strengthened the
community around the school, as you can imagine.
So the Oakland Public School District is one really beautiful
example of how it's working. And then in Brooklyn, there's an
organization called Common Justice.
I don't know if you've heard of them before, but I think the
founder of the Common Justice was at Ted with us a couple of
times. But they offer survivors of
(18:11):
serious violence and alternativeto prison.
So when survivors choose this path, people who caused the harm
sit in the circle. So if a survivor of a serious
crime Morgan, they can choose towork with common justice instead
of the legal system, which is all already in and of itself
powerfully freeing you from the need for punishment of this
(18:32):
person in this way, where punishment is equal to
inflicting harm on the person who inflicted harm on you.
So common justice allows the survivors to choose a path and
then they bring the person who'scaused them harm into the circle
to admit what they've done and to complete a healing plan that
centers the survivors needs. And they've had a dramatic
(18:52):
amount of success with their program common justice.
So those are three really good examples.
The beloved community in North Carolina, the Oakland Public
School District and in Brooklyn common justice where people are
finding alternatives to involving the court systems and
the legal systems and the ways that they're doing.
And then one common thread around all three of these
examples is they really do believe, Morgan, that we cannot
(19:16):
just remove the people who've done the harm from our community
and then expect that they're just going to come back into the
community and things are going to be OK.
And that the removing them from the community causes such harm
that there never is really a chance for a repair.
So those are three examples and I hope people feel really
inspired by those examples. Yeah, I think it's fantastic.
(19:37):
I also want to lift up the work that's happening in Rwanda
because what you just said reminds me of that, You know,
after South Africa and apartheidand all of the violence that was
done there. You know, Bishop Tutu did the
truth and Reconciliation trials.And then after the war in
Rwanda, where half of the population was warring against
(19:58):
the other half, and there was somuch egregious, like violent,
violent, violent murder, you wonder how a society can come
back from that, where neighbors are still living next to the
people who may have killed theirloved ones.
And that country has done such an excellent job in restorative
(20:21):
justice. And so I have a friend who's a
leader there in Rwanda. And on her first day on her job,
when she went, she sent me this long text.
And she was like, yo, I was like, what?
She was like, yeah. So it's, it's it every single
year they, they, they have memorialized the massacre.
(20:41):
And so, you know, the businessesgo quiet.
They take moments to like, reflect.
People write poetry. I was there one year for the
memorial. They write poetry.
People sing in the streets, theylight candles.
They don't forget. And, and she was like, yeah, I'm
here. And she goes.
So my first duty kind of as, youknow, as a diplomat here is to
(21:01):
sit and, and listen to the trials.
And she was like, it's just people begging for forgiveness
from their community. And she was like, and then
there's like mothers who are just like lying prone on the
ground crying. And she was just like, but this
is what healing looks like. And so, you know, you take it at
a country level, then you take it at like, you know, a city
(21:25):
like Greensboro that needs to heal.
You take it like at a school level or a system of schools
level. And then you take it to a family
level or a friendship level and it just is hard because we keep
doing violence instead of even doing any restoration or any
curiosity or any kindness. And that's and it.
(21:45):
And it feels easier to understand at this kind of
extracted level of like a city or like a whatever.
But when it's like your family it it's harder.
Exactly, Morgan. It's very hard.
And actually that's a beautiful segue into our second skill,
which is actually how to take upaccountability for our own
(22:08):
actions personally. So we've talked about
restorative justice and what it looks like in the world.
We've talked about what it lookslike in the schools and how it
cannot be in the courtrooms. And we've talked about it from a
community level. But I wanted to provide space on
this episode for us to turn inward and to walk towards our
own personal truths and to ask ourselves, where is it that
(22:28):
maybe we have caused harm to somebody?
And where is it and how is it that we can personally seek to
have a reconciliation? And so I want to lead everybody
through. First of all, I want to talk
about the 4A's of personal repair.
And this is for us personally, the first thing that we have to
(22:50):
do when we're talking about personal repair is to
acknowledge. And so right now actually, I
want everybody to think about one person in their life who
comes up when you think about the word regret, or maybe it's
not regret, but maybe it's sorrow and you think about
somebody or maybe it's harm. Think about somebody, but have
(23:13):
somebody in your mind. You have to acknowledge that
there was harm done. That's the first thing.
And you have to say the truth isI hurt.
And you can insert their name and you can say it without an
excuse. So just for yourself, the truth
is I hurt this person and this is just an exercise for us.
(23:33):
And the second a of the 4A's is apologize.
You have to take full responsibility without excuses
or making excuses for why you did it.
Just full responsibility. I was wrong.
I'm not here to explain it away,I'm here to own it.
So first you acknowledge, then you apologize.
(23:55):
The third of the 4A's of personal affair is then you ask
what would healing look like foryou.
You have to ask it to the other person.
This is not about you. This is now about the other
person. What would healing look like for
you? And you may not know or they may
not know, but to ask the question is powerful.
(24:15):
So we're going to acknowledge that there was harm done.
We're going to apologize and take responsibility.
We're going to ask what would healing look like?
And then we are going to act. We are going to commit to acting
differently, commit to showing up better.
(24:35):
Even if they never forgive you, which is the powerful part of
this accountability is that you commit to act differently and to
show up better and other circumstances and situations in
your life. Every single person who's
walking with us, who's listeningto my voice right now, this is a
part of the accountability without shame.
(24:57):
We all have hurt somebody. It's easier for us to talk about
reconciliation and to talk aboutrestorative justice when we're
talking about the outside peopleoutside of us or especially when
we're talking about harm that isdone to us.
But the most powerful practice is to actually put your own self
in the situation and ask where is it in your life where you can
(25:18):
experience repair. And I have two affirmations for
us, Morgan. And maybe you can just repeat
them and everybody else can repeat them out there.
I am not my mistakes. I am the change I choose today.
And then the second one is I walk in truth, I walk in love.
(25:39):
I walk towards repair. And just like that, y'all, we
have walked through two powerfulskills, how to participate in
restorative justice and how to take personal accountability
without losing yourself. And it's talk back Thursday now.
And so I actually want to bring in my home girl, our home girl
Naira. We call her next Gen.
(25:59):
Naira now. Naira, are you on the line with
us? Yes.
I am hello. Naira, what do you have for us
today? So I have some women just
sharing their experiences about reflecting on power plays and
really just reflecting on all the ways that they connect, if
it's life experiences, if it's the women or the foremothers
(26:21):
that you have all kind of mentioned in last weeks or the
previous weeks episodes. But one thing that I really want
to hear, and I actually want to challenge the women I love
hearing the experiences. But I would love to know what
young women that you're impacting and sharing this
information with in your life. And are they walking with you on
(26:42):
this journey? And so as we're building a
coalition of young women, of getting more young women into
the movement, I would love to hear women sharing about their
experience with sharing their experience with self-care school
with younger women in their lives.
So yeah. And Morgan, y'all just gotta
stop playing. Stop playing.
(27:04):
Like, I don't know. I was getting so excited today.
Oh my goodness. You started hauling out the
names of their four mothers about Phyllis Wheatley and
Quinn, not Singer and Ella Baker.
And then you got this team o'clock.
(27:24):
And I'm like, wait a minute, they are the names of the back
of the T-shirt that we had when we went to Selma for the Bloody
Sunday 50th anniversary. I made my granddaughter, who was
able to go long, 14 years old atthe time, know every one of them
names and tell it to her cousinsin them.
(27:44):
So yes, I'm walking in this power.
I'm getting ready, going to thislittle sister circle now.
But a diverse intergenerational group of women and the first
thing I'm gonna make have them do is pull out their self up and
do the good thing myself Care school.
Hi girl Trek, I'm just finishingup my Walk for Thursdays power
(28:10):
plays episode on public assistance.
And I'm an educator. And like so many other
educators, our salaries, our income, it's so low that we
qualify for public assistance. And I just want to encourage the
teachers, the staff, the supportstaff in education to not be
(28:36):
shamed, to seek that public assistance and support your
family. Girl trek just finished week 7.
I'm standing taller with my shoulders back.
This class remind me not to shrivel.
When I was in high school in Charleston, SC, I had the
opportunity of a brief conversation with Miss Septima
(28:59):
Clark. Back then I did not know her
legacy, but I did know she was aperson that I should get to
know. Now I have and hold dearly a
picture of my mother-in-law, Ernestine Felder, with Miss
Septima Clark and Rosa Parks. They work tirelessly together
(29:20):
for the civil rights. First of all, that's a master
class on how to say Septima Clark.
It is Septima Septima, not Septima Septima.
This is from the words of somebody who knew her, Septima
Clark. Septima.
Oh, I love that. First of all, that we have
people who knew Septima Clark and we honor you.
We honor you, sister, and we honor her legacy too, by saying
(29:43):
her name correctly. Oh, this is so beautiful.
Those are beautiful choices. Naira y'all.
Keep going to myself. careschool.com.
Keep leaving your testimonials. All right, Morgan.
All right, Naira, we have come to the end of this talk back
Thursday, the end of today's walk.
Thank you all. We will be back here tomorrow
for for Mother Friday. We're going to close out with a
(30:06):
reading of a poem by Mrs. Asada Shakur.
This poem is called Affirmationsand it's read by a troupe of
actors. So I hope you all enjoyed this
poem as you close out your walksand finish up to go wherever you
need to go today. See y'all tomorrow.
I believe in living. I believe in the spectrum of
(30:27):
beta days and gamma people. I believe in sunshine.
And windmills, Waterfalls. Tricycles.
Rocking chairs. And I believe that seeds grow
into sprouts. And sprouts grow into trees.
I believe in the magic of the hands.
(30:48):
And in the wisdom. Of the eyes.
I. Believe in rain and tears and in
the blood of Infinity. I believe in life.
And I have seen the Death paradeMarch through the torso of the
earth. Sculpting mud bodies in its
path. I have seen the destruction of
(31:10):
the daylight and seen bloodthirsty maggots.
Prayed to and some loot. I've seen the kind.
Become the blind and the. Blind become the bind.
In one. Easy lesson I've walked on Cut.
Grass. I've eaten crow and blunder
bread. I have been locked.
By the lawless. Handcuffed.
(31:30):
By the haters, gagged by the greedy, and if I know anything
at all instead of Wall. Is just.
A wall and nothing more at all. It can be broken.
Down I believe in living. I believe in birth.
I believe in the sweat of love. And in the fire.
(31:51):
Of truth. And I believe.
That a lost ship. Steered by.
Tired sea. 6 sailors can still. Be tied at home to.
Port.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.