Episode 242: Poddy Pop Up

Podcasting 2.0 November 21st 2025 Episode 242: "Poddy Pop Up"

Adam & Dave Discuss how the Cloudflare outage affected podcasting and have solutions to the index synch problem

ShowNotes

We are LIT

Alby-Hub spam issue

Cloudflare Outage

Decentralization

RSS.com goes Hyper-Local!

Feed re-directs

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ast Modified 11/21/2025 14:30:08 by Freedom Controller  

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Podcasting 2.0 for November 21st, 2025, episode
242, Potty Pop-Up.
Hey now, hello everybody.
Welcome to Podcasting 2.0. It is time
to talk podcasting.
That's right.
Everything going on with podcasting, everything that went
on throughout the last 20 years, everything that's

(00:22):
still to come is all here.
We are the board meeting.
You should be in the boardroom.
In fact, we are the only boardroom that
is never seditious.
I'm Adam Curry here in the heart of
the Texas Hill Country and in Alabama, the
man who spent hours unclogging party time just
for you.
Say hello to my friend on the other
end, the one, the only pod sage, I'm

(00:43):
talking about Mr. Dave Jones.
It's not only the aggregators that are clogged
up.
It's the, it's the drains, the sewer drain
in my house is now clogged, which is
- We reverted to the outhouse.

(01:04):
I might have to drop trowel in the
backyard behind the shed if it's not-
I woke up this morning and Melissa is
like, there's some goo coming out of the
sink.
I was like,

(01:30):
man, there's no way I can get a
sewer guy out here today.
So you actually have goo coming out?
Oh yeah.
No, it's for real.
I'm not kidding.
The sewer is backing up and I'm like,
okay, can we take like 30 second showers
for however long it takes and just limp

(01:51):
along until we leave and then I'll call
the sewer guy when we get back.
I'm worried, brother, because you can come back
and then something could have happened where your
entire house is filled with slop.
It's the drain line.
It's like, it's not the sewer system.
It's like the drain line.
So it's one of those things where it's
like a slow leak down.
It's happened before we got old pipes and

(02:14):
stuff.
It's manageable.
Come on, everybody.
Help get Dave new pipes.
He needs to lay new pipes.
Help Dave.
Help Dave.
Man, this cloud flare outage, it just reminds
you how centralized we've become and how decentralized
we need to be.

(02:34):
I mean, holy crap.
So much broke.
I mean, it was just everywhere.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, it was, it was bad.
I mean, it's, and it's becoming more frequent
because I mean, we have like AWS, then
Azure, then cloud flare.
Like these are all within what, six weeks
of each other.
And think about the government who rely on

(02:58):
these things heavily, particularly as your AWS, I
don't know how much cloud flare they're doing.
Um, man, it was, it was just bad.
I mean, okay.
So, oh, I can't access my ex account.
Uh, all right, fine.
But then people go, oh, I can't get
to my chat GPT bot.
I don't know what to do.
I don't know what to have for dinner.

(03:19):
I don't know how to feel.
Yeah.
I mean, I had no idea what was
happening at first.
I mean, I was, it's, it's weird.
Cause I was, um, excuse me.
Um, I, I never look at the, the
index really.

(03:40):
Um, why would you, why would you, that
was, that was, that sounded very definitive.
No, I never really look at the index,
uh, like in the, in the morning I'll
do stuff later in the day, but, um,
like for some weird reason and I can't
even remember what, I actually think it had

(04:01):
something to do with a dream.
I woke up and like immediately grabbed my
phone, which I don't do either, but I
immediately grabbed my phone off the nightstand and
pulled up podcast index.org.
I still can't even remember why I did
it.
I was looking for something and, and I
pulled it up and everything on it was
blank.
Oh, you didn't even get the little cloud

(04:23):
flare where you got you, your server and
the black part in the middle.
No, no.
I got, I got, I got a, I
got the template of what the podcast index
website should look like.
And then no, no carousel.
And then all the stats were blank.
And I'm like, okay, wait, is the API
down?

(04:43):
And then I got in and out and
I was like, no, I'm able to make
it.
API calls are working and I start pulling
up servers and stuff and everything looked fine.
And I'm like, man, is this, is this
weird?
Every time I blame cloud flare, it's never
a cloud flare.
And this time it was cloud flare.
And then I started, then I started seeing
on online that everybody was broken.

(05:04):
Right.
But yeah, it was weird.
Yeah.
I mean, in my world, uh, a lot
of stuff went down cause I could not
get to the API for whatever reason.
Yeah.
It was edge.
Like it was location specific.
Oh, okay.
So of course Dallas.
Um, so I couldn't get to the API.
So that meant all of my channel streams

(05:24):
were breaking.
We had stuff that wasn't updating.
Of course.
Uh, it got pretty busy in the podcast,
uh, customer success, uh, the pod podcast index
customer success desk.
Yeah.
My show's not updated.
Look, it looks good on pod bean.

(05:45):
We, we need an AI customer success manager
is what we need.
Oh, vibe coding.
Okay.
All right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I got, I can build that.
I got this idea from, uh, from Jason
Hudgens.
I had a, which I want to talk
about, uh, his, I want to talk about
the call we had.
We had a zoom call where he, uh,

(06:07):
graciously gave me probably two hours of his
time.
Now, who is this?
Jason Hudgens from podcast guru.
Oh, I just know him as Jason from
podcast guru.
I'm like Jason Hudgens.
Who's this guy?
Yeah.
I don't know him.
Nobody has last names.
No, we don't need last names here.
Not in the boardroom.
The, so he gave me, he's, he just,

(06:30):
he reached out after our conversation two weeks
ago and he was like, um, he's like,
Hey, I, you know, I was hearing about
y'all, you know, talking about vibe coding
and AI and all this kind of stuff.
He's like, let me show you my praise.
Like, give me a, give me a little
bit of time.
Let me show you my process.
And he's like, I think I can turn
you into a super coder.
Me or you?
Me.

(06:50):
Oh, specific.
He said your whole, he said that you're
hopeless.
He said this specifically.
Adam's beyond, beyond repair.
He's hopeless.
We can't, hold on.
Let me get my Turkey out here.
Hold on.
Okay.
But he says specifically, he's like, Dave, you
can be a super coder.

(07:11):
And, um, so anyway, he said, he spent
a couple of hours with me showing me
like his whole way that he does, you
know, the way he uses AI in his
process.
And I will say that it was, it
was very enlightening.
First of all, it was very helpful.
Yeah.
And then very enlightening, but then as part,

(07:32):
and I want to talk about later, but
then part of his, uh, you know, part
of what he mentioned was he's like, uh,
you know, he was talking about like bots
to help people and that kind of thing.
Like, and I was thinking, you know, what,
that would be great.
Like we could get an email and says
my, my RSS feed is not my podcast,
not updating it, extract the feed or the
ID or something out of it.

(07:54):
No, not an email.
No, we'll have a little chat bot on
the website.
Hi, I'm Clippy.
I'm Clippy.
We're going to, we're going to, we're going
to resurrect Clippy.
In fact, yes, Indy.
I'm Indy.
This is a great idea.
I love it.
We'll, uh, we'll get, we'll bring Clippy back.
Indy.
I like Indy.

(08:15):
I am Indy, your podcast index, uh, Indy.
Yes.
Okay.
Indy bot.
I like it.
Hold on a second.
Is that with an IE?
I guess Indy like Indiana, like Indiana Jones,
you know, as short as like a nickname.
Indy bot.
Okay.
Yeah, that should be, you know, it should
be, Indy should be able to, uh, perform
a scan, uh, perform a reset.

(08:39):
Potty.
Potty.
Potty's pretty good.
Potty.
Potty's even better.
Potty.
I'm writing this down.
I can build this.
No doubt.
I can run it on the Linode five
bucks a month and, uh, and, and it'll
check, it can check stuff.
Of course.
And it'll talk back to you.
Absolutely.
Well, I, I'm, this is not my job.

(09:01):
I'm going to give it IMAP access to
your, to your, um, to email, to email,
to your guide, I mean, to your podcast
index email so that you can, you can
just monitor for, for, for stuff.
Yeah.
For emails coming in and then automatically send
an API request to reset the feed.
Yeah, absolutely.
And then, and then reply and with a

(09:23):
bunch of unhelpful, like three paragraphs of text.
Tons of unhelpful stuff.
We're going to do lots of unhelpful stuff.
Uh, and, and it's going to say, have
you tried turning it off and back on
again?
That's where that's how that's the, that there'll
be the stock reply to everything.
It should be a minimum conversation of at
least seven emails with the, with the person

(09:44):
sending the email.
Start starting with, have you uploaded it to
Apple?
Like have you uploaded, uploaded it to Apple?
Okay.
Absolutely.
I'm excited already to make this.
This is, this, this will be a breeze,
man.
I already have it mapped out in my
head.
I just, the toughest part will be making

(10:04):
potty appear on the page.
Potty.
Potty pop-up.
You put your problems in the potty and
let us fix them for you.
And then when you hit send, you hear,
you hear a toilet flush.
Yeah.
That's actually a quite as, as, as you

(10:25):
know, how much humor we're getting out of
it.
That could solve 90% of all success
desk issues.
Success desk.
I love the success desk.
Of course.
I pay attention.
Support request and it has a form.
You must put in your RS, your, your
podcast, like reference, like a, an RSS feed

(10:49):
or an ID or something.
I mean, you know, you're, I mean, not
a form.
No, it's not a form day.
Literally potty, potty pops up right in the
lower right-hand corner.
Hi, I'm potty.
How can I help you today?
And then you type in, and then if
you put in a podcast index URL or
an ID, we can parse all that.

(11:10):
That's easy.
Yeah.
Or your, uh, your RSS feed.
And I mean, I, I know the 10
answers to everything.
So yeah.
The 10 answers to everything.
Yeah.
There's, there's 10 questions that people ask.
My favorite is always, I don't want to

(11:30):
be on your platform.
And so we get a steady stream of
that.
Yeah.
And so the response is sure.
Happy to remove it.
If you want to be gone from the
70 plus apps and services that use the
podcast index.
Are you sure?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I will go.
And then you go sign up for, I

(11:51):
want my, I don't want my podcast on
your system, but then I'm going to go
sign up for something that uses podcast index
and then complain to them, to their support.
Exactly.
Your stuff doesn't work.
I love your, you're scraping my feed, bro.
Yeah.
Yes.
Yes.
That's the point.
That's the point.

(12:12):
Oh man.
And then I'll have potty just, uh, send
off reams of stuff about how podcasting works.
That's a good idea.
That's it could even, it could even respond
to the stupid lawyer stuff.
Absolutely.
Hi, stupid lawyer.
I'm potty.
How can I help you?
Yeah.
This where you need to pay us because

(12:34):
you're using our RSS feed.
Okay.
Let pot, sit down and let potty explained
to you how RSS feeds work.
I'm going to build this.
I am motivated, excited.
I'm hydromated.
I'm ready to go.
I'm ready to go.
Yeah.
Uh, but all things aside, thank you so
much because I know that you spent hours,

(12:55):
hours on clogging stuff.
Well, you know, this is a long, this
is a story.
Oh good.
Let me just grab, I got my, my
gigawatt cold brew.
I'm ready to go.
Oh, you drink cold.
Do you drink cold brew from gigawatt?
Yeah.
Cause they, it's, it has nitro.

(13:17):
Uh, and you have to shake the can
vigorously.
And then when you open it, it does
wash.
Now you hit because it releases the nitro.
It's got a little bubble of nitro in
there.
Nitro.
Nitro.
Yeah.
And it's a no agenda producer.
Um, uh, Eli, the coffee guy, he roasts
coffee.

(13:38):
Stacey.
Wait, hold on a second.
What is it?
That's a good point.
Um, let me see.
Oh, I don't, I thought I, I thought
I had the music.
Well, it's pod Sage story time.
Do you know?
So, Oh, do you have a story time?
I don't know.
Let's see.
Let's see what this is.

(13:59):
Ladies and gentlemen, it is now time for
pod Sage story time in the boardroom podcasting
2.0. Oh, go ahead.
Dave.
Um, that's called me off guard there.
It's yeah, it's a story.
I mean, now this is the podcast podcasting

(14:24):
2.0 podcast version of the sad puppy
boost the sad puppy email.
You guys got to support us.
Cause I feel somehow, whatever Dave is going
to tell us, bigger machines or more machines
would be the answer.
So yeah, it, it sort of comes down.

(14:44):
I'll give you the bottom line first is
it, it, part of this really comes down
to trying to be too, um, too sexy
with the purse.
It's not, it's impossible for me to be
too sexy.
Uh, exactly.
But, um, it's, it comes down to, you

(15:05):
know, the trying to be too tight with
the purse and really what has, what's been
biting me in the rear for a while
now is I keep running up against just
memory constraints.
Cause I've been trying the aggregators.
I'm trying to use a bunch of, um,
a bunch of, uh, a bunch of $5

(15:30):
nanodes, you know, and they only have, they
have a gig of Ram, but by the,
by the time you finish, um, you know,
the system's going to take some and you,
by the, by the time you get every
system loaded, I mean, you got maybe half
that left.
It takes a, it takes a good bit
just to keep, just, just to keep it

(15:51):
in a running state.
So you're talking about probably 400 Megs of
Ram.
That's just being used just to keep the
system going.
So, you know, it's run into this a
bunch where it just boils down the problems
we, I keep running into just boil, boil

(16:11):
down to just simply not enough memory.
And I've been resistant to upgrade to bigger
VMs because I'm like, well, these are a
five, a one gig VM.
It's five bucks.
Right.
Yeah.
It's five bucks.
A two gig VM is $12.

(16:32):
So I'm like the difference between five and
seven, you know, that's seven bucks.
By the way, that's excluding backups.
Yes.
Backups.
Backups.
Another two bucks a month, another two and
a half bucks a month.
That's for the five, you know, for the
12 it's more.
And so I'm like, well, this multiplies and
all this kind of stuff.
So I've, I keep everything to the bone

(16:53):
as expense wise.
And, um, C-Loss, uh, rerun, uh, running
it as a, as a Lambda like event
driven function would not help because these run
24 seven.
They never stop running.
Thanks for your input C-Loss.
Thanks.

(17:13):
But you can put your hand down.
There you go.
Dreb Scott, one, two, three, four, five, six.
Oh, that's to the index.
Yes.
Yes.
Dave and big in the VMs, he says.
The, um, yeah, so the, so what's this,

(17:40):
this, this is a part, the party time,
which is the, the parser on the aggregators
is written in JavaScript.
It's a node, um, no JS, no JS
thing.
Yes.
And so it, it, it is not light
on memory to begin with.
Um, so it, I've got all these ways

(18:03):
in which it tries to detect memory problems
and sort of rescue itself if it gets
caught in a loop.
So, you know, I mean, it doesn't know
ahead of time, what, how big these files
are going to be.
And so you can have, um, you, when

(18:24):
you, when you download a bunch of files,
you try to parse them.
And if you hit one that's enormous, well,
then it depends on what all you else
you had.
So like, this is kind of hard to
explain.
So the way it works is there's two
parts to our aggregators.

(18:45):
There's aggravator, which is a debt, which is
the polling agent, which downloads the files and
it saves all the files into a folder
with metadata within the file.
So the first line is the last modified
date, HTTP header.
The second line is the E tag header.
The third line is the feed URL.

(19:06):
And the fourth line is the, uh, is
the current Unix timestamp stamp of when it
wrote the file, excuse me, of when it
polled.
So, and then the rest, starting with line
five and the rest of it, that is
your XML content.
So you have, once that, you know, aggravator
pulls a couple of hundred files at a

(19:28):
couple of hundred feed URLs at a time,
downloads them all into these component files into
in a folder.
Then it hands it off to party time,
which picks up all these files and runs
through them and parses them into and processes
SQL transactions for these, for the, the, the
episodes and on all the different parts of
the XML that this, so when party time

(19:52):
picks up these files, it tries, you know,
it grabs them all.
And what it does is it tries to
process them all.
If, if it hits a certain memory limit,
it will just stop processing and just go
with what it has already.

(20:13):
And when you say file, that's an RSS
feed.
That's, that's what a file is.
Yeah.
It's the RSS feed with some of that
metadata attached at the top.
And so it, it run it, it tries
to process.
And so the memory limit may be, you
know, 400 megabytes.
And once it hits 400 megabytes, it stops

(20:34):
and bails out.
Hold on.
Are we actually running a machine with 400
megabytes?
No, that's what's left.
That's usable after in a one.
Oh, okay.
Okay.
I got you.
Yes.
Okay.
Got it.
Got it.
And so the, it, it, it runs up
to its supposed limit, processes what it has,

(20:55):
what it was able to capture, and then,
you know, removes those files out of the
directories and then grabs another batch.
So this, the pro, so here's where the
problems come in.
You imagine if you have three, you know,

(21:20):
imagine you have 10 files, one of the
RSS feeds is 75 megabytes.
Yeah, that's mine.
So, and you've got, let's say a 300
megabyte limit.
Well, it's, if that, if that 75er processes
at the end, then it may, it may

(21:44):
just crash the whole process because it never
had a chance to sort of anticipate.
And you don't, you can't tell from just
the file size, because remember you're keeping the
file in memory and the parsed out objects,
JavaScript objects in memory.
It's, it's, it's inflating the size much bigger

(22:07):
than, than just the file size.
And you can't know in advance what it's
going to be.
So the, because you don't, you can't look
at the memory management that's happening in, in
node.
So you just have to run it in
real time and calculate it as you go.
And unless you hit a scenario where it,

(22:28):
where it just jumps way up suddenly, then
the whole thing, then the process crashes out.
Well, once the process, so there's a backup
for that.
If the process crashes out, it detects that
because it drops a stub file before it
even starts processing and says, you know, it
drops a stub, then runs through the whole

(22:51):
thing.
And the last thing it does before the
process exits is delete the stub.
Well, if it, if it, it'll check for
the presence of the stub when it starts
on the next run.
And if that thing is still there, it
knows that it crashed.
So if it crashed, what it will do
is it will reduce the number of feeds
it tries to capture the next time by

(23:13):
half.
Oh, that's just a guess.
It's a guess.
Yeah.
And then it'll, if it crashes again, it'll
reduce it again by half.
And it, it sort of fall, it keeps
falling back over and over and over until
it can get through the bot, the bottleneck
and then go back up and start over.

(23:35):
And this is a, I hate the way
this works.
I mean, it, it works, but it's very,
I don't even have a word for it.
Lame.
It feels inel, lame.
It feels inelegant.
Um, and I mean, this is a known
computer science like methodology, uh, you know, circuit

(23:57):
breaker or, um, back off, you know, progressive
back off, whatever you want to call it.
I mean, this, this is the way you
have to do some things, but it, it's
just, it's, this is all just to make
up because this pro this thing I'm describing
at these low memory levels, it happens all
the time.
It, I mean, it's constantly happening like this,

(24:21):
but it's the trade-off you have to
make to not spend, you know, 1500 to
$2,000 a month on, on, on hosting
fees.
Right.
So we, so that's the way that we
do it.
So I was finally, it, it got, it
got itself into a funk where it had

(24:45):
like a couple of really large feeds and
it could not push through.
And it was just crashing.
Oh, there's two aggregators that were crashing over
and over and over again.
And they just would not go through and
find.
And so I had to just get in
there and re and just like recode some
stuff.
And I was trying to get this and

(25:09):
trying to find a route around this code
wise.
And eventually I was just like, you know
what?
I just got to throw more memory, more
memory at this thing.
So I just upgraded both of those VMs
from $5 to $12.
And so it's, it, it sounds silly.
This sounds silly to people to hear.
Why are you, why, why is this four,

(25:30):
why is $14 a month?
So it's such a big deal.
It's a big deal because we're paying $800
a month right now for our Lendo bill
and another 90 for CloudFlare.
Yeah.
So, I mean, we're, we're pushing a thousand
bucks.
Every dollar counts.
And if you get, if you get in
the mindset, this is, this is what I've,

(25:50):
this is how I talk to myself about
these kinds of things.
Wait, wait, wait.
Dave?
Yes, Dave.
I need to talk to you.
What do you say?
Self?
You're capable, you're lovable and you're worth it.
Do not become comfortable with solving problems with

(26:14):
money.
Do not let that become a thing that
you get used to.
Yeah.
Because if you get used to it, you
will overspend money when it's not necessary.
And before you know it, you will find
just like spending money on a credit card,

(26:34):
when you're, you know, when you're undisciplined financially,
you will find that you have spent way
more money than you should have and you
will regret it.
Yeah.
And so this is the mindset I bring
to the table everywhere.
My day job, podcast index, God cast, everything
that we deal with, that we work with

(26:55):
your stuff, everything that I deal with, I
have to keep this financial discipline in mind.
And it may seem silly to argue over
such a tiny amount, but that's the way
you have to do it.
Because cloud hosting providers, they want all of
your money.
Yeah.

(27:16):
Yes, they do.
And they will, and they will lull you
into getting it and giving it to them.
So I've, I've solved it that way for
now, but this gave me a good reason
to go back and we're caught up now
if everything's parsing fine.
But this gave me a good reason to

(27:39):
put into practice all the stuff that me
and Jason talked about and try to go,
try to move forward with the next generation
of aggregators.
And I'm going to, it's a tedious process
to build a podcast aggregator.

(28:03):
And so I've decided that I'm going to
try to build it with coding agents, LLMs.
And so that's my project.
All right.
There is one other thing we need to
take care of, which is a problem.
What's that?
Uh, so we switched to LN address and

(28:27):
using podcast index at getalby.com.
Yeah, that's not going to work.
Uh, we got blocked evidently.
Well, no, no, no, no.
Here's what's happening.
Um, I, I got the note from Moritz.
Payments to lightning addresses create an increased load
on our server infrastructure because of the high

(28:48):
payment frequency in podcasting that makes it difficult
for us to reliably distinguish between spam and
legitimate traffic.
So some requests may get blocked accidentally.
It's happening right now.
In fact, um, he says you can log
into your Albie account on getalby.com, follow
the steps to reactivate your lightning address.

(29:09):
For now we've manually fixed it for the
listed accounts.
Well, so we got, uh, we got relisted
or unlisted or whatever because people can't, uh,
boost us right now.
Um, and so I said, you know, uh,
is this, uh, how do you determine if
something's spam?
Is it, you know, for each, you know,
is one sat spam?

(29:30):
And he correctly replies by saying one sat
payments are not spam.
A lightning address resolves to a URL that
gives you a bolt 11 invoice.
This invoice will be paid in the ideal
case or it won't be paid for different
reasons.
So we cannot know if there's a real
payment intent behind an invoice request.
And then he finally says, uh, he says,

(29:51):
uh, what'd he say here?
You had solid reasons for choosing keys in
the first place.
Okay.
Thanks.
Very helpful.
The customer is always wrong.
So we need to just change that.
We just need to put a well-known,
uh, somewhere else.
We, we can't rely on Albi hub because

(30:11):
we got a lot of, uh, payments and
we're going to keep getting blocked.
This is, this is an interesting thing that
he said.
He's right.
He's, he's right when he says, and this
is really, it's funny that I never saw
this before as a fatal flaw in LNURLP.

(30:33):
No, me neither.
We cannot know if there's a real payment
intent behind an invoice request.
So you could request 7 billion invoice payments
through LNURLP and never pay any of them.
And essentially that would crash LND.
Hmm.

(30:54):
Am I wrong?
That's a DDoS against LND, isn't it?
Oh, that's a, that's an interesting question.
If you created, if you created a, a
script that requested, uh, 50 invoices a second,
um, through, uh, get well known, you know,

(31:15):
as an LN address for the, for an
LNURLP payment and never paid any of them.
I mean, you, you'd, you would eventually just
exhaust LND, I think.
Hmm.
With zero payments being made.
Yeah.
Cause it has to track that.
Yeah.

(31:35):
That's a good question.
I'm asking Grok right now.
Yeah.
I mean, it has to keep track of
the invoice so it knows when the invoice
got paid.
Yeah.
And I'm sure this come up before, but
I've just never thought about it.
And, you know, I don't, I mean, you

(31:58):
can, I can, we can all imagine ways
to sort of defend against it where you're
trying, you know, rate limiting and things like
that.
But I mean, that's not, that doesn't actually
solve the problem.
Well, I can understand if they're, if they're
operating as a hub for everybody, we've basically
created the biggest vulnerability ever.
Uh, yes, it is possible to attempt to

(32:20):
DDoS attacks on LND based Lightning node as
these nodes exposed network interfaces that could be
targeted.
No features like onion routing for privacy.
Okay.
Blah, blah, blah.
No, you could in fact, uh, easily do
that.
Yeah.
Keeping LND updated is crucial.
Okay.

(32:41):
Hmm.
Well, I think we should consider taking the
load off of them.
Yeah, for sure.
Uh, the, the thing I don't, the, I,
I, I did not intend to use Albie
to begin with to get our LN address,
but it was, you needed to do it
at that time.
Yeah.

(33:02):
I wanted to get something up and running
quickly and also didn't want to, um, expose
our node directly to the internet.
Yeah.
Uh, cause I don't, you, there's, if you
go look, this all is just kind of,
it's all kind of frustrating, honestly.

(33:27):
If you go, if you say, okay, I
want an LN address, I want a Lightning
address.
If you say, and you have your own,
if you run your own node, hold on,
hold on.
Aren't we creating the, the Bolt 11 invoice?
Shouldn't we be, aren't we just using RSS
or, um, uh, get albie.com as the,

(33:48):
for the well-known address part?
Aren't, aren't we creating the Bolt 11?
Why are they creating it?
No, we're running there.
The Albie hub is a node.
Oh, oh, I see.
And we're using Albie hub.
I see.
It, you can, you can set Albie hub
to talk to a, to talk to an
LND node, an external LND node.

(34:09):
Yeah.
That's how I do it.
But again, I don't, I don't, I don't
know.
I'm just uncomfortable with that.
If you go, if you go to try,
if you go and look for, if you,
if you run your own node and you
go and try to find a way to
put LN URL on top of that, you're
going to end up with something like LN
bits or whatever.

(34:29):
Right.
Otherwise you're on some get hub project that
has, you know, three stars.
Reviews are bullcrap, man.
I don't trust reviews.
Well, you don't know what the quality of
that thing.
I mean, like, what even is it?
And, but LN bits won't, won't even function
on our node because it's so gargantuan.

(34:51):
Right.
Yeah.
I see.
Well, I mean, so I'm running an Albi
hub at home and obviously that, that works.
So we might have to, I mean, we
can, we can run LN bits on a,
although I have to talk to Graham about
it because every single time I try to
set it up, it freaks out.

(35:13):
Yeah.
Cause we get, cause our database is so
big.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It just crashes.
I don't, I don't know what the answer
to this is.
I guess, you know, one, one answer would
be cause we have a bunch of own
chain Bitcoin and we have a bunch of
lightning channels.

(35:34):
We could just move a lot of that
own chain off of the node just to
say, you know, to safeguard it.
Well, how about this?
Why don't we just set up a separate
node just for receiving?
And cause I, I like how we provide
liquidity for a lot.
I mean, we are a massive liquidity provider.

(35:55):
I don't know how many channels we have.
I can look at it.
Oh, it's like 125 or something.
Maybe even more than that.
So we could just set up a separate
node just for receiving and just have it
have that be it.
I didn't think about that.
That's a good idea.
I'm full of good ideas, Dave.
You've always been full of good ideas.

(36:17):
And then, and yeah, that's, yeah, that's a
really good idea.
Why don't we do that?
I'll, I'll set up another node.
How much is it going to cost though?
No, it doesn't cost much.
They have small nodes.
I'll set it up.
Who's they?
Voltage.
Voltage.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'll, I'll set up a small node, smaller
node.
And we can stick in bits on top

(36:38):
of that.
And then I'm going to try that.
Yeah.
Okay.
The last time I, yeah, the last, the
last time I tried that though, there was,
it was like, you have to be an
admin to create and have wallet, huh?
I'll have to dive into it.
Another thing I got to do, when am
I going to build my potty bot?
Get potty bot, build potty bot first, then

(36:59):
get potty bot to build a node.
Potty bot will do it.
Sure.
Let me see.
Let me check here.
Let me see.
Can I, should be able to, I want
to check, I want to check our nodes,

(37:19):
see how many, see how many channels we
have.
I should be able to do that some
other way than the way I'm doing it.
But, but anyway, yeah.
Okay.
We'll, we'll do that.
Which uh, that means another change of course,
in all fees.

(37:39):
That's okay though.
Yeah.
That's okay.
Because we, we, we did use podcast index
at podcastindex.org.
Yeah.
That's the lightning address.
So right, right, right.
I mean, right now it redirects through podcastindex
at getalpy.com, but we, but, but it's
bouncing, it's bouncing like it's a redirect.

(38:00):
So it should be fine if we just
shoot it somewhere else.
Okay.
Well, I'm almost here.
Let me check our node.
Okay.
I have a separate device for that.
This is very, uh, I'm very, uh, security
minded.
Yeah.
That's what happens after you get a Bitcoin

(38:21):
miner on your VM.
It changes, it changes, it changes your whole,
your whole attitude, man.
Okay.
Here we go.
Podcast index.
All right.
Channels.
Let me check the channels.
How many channels do we have?
Well, we have a lot of capacity, baby.

(38:44):
We had 116.
You're right.
I thought it was more than that.
116 channels.
It used to be like 120 plus, I
think.
Yeah.
Sending capacity, 22 million.
Receiving capacity, 225 million.
Offline, 43 million.
Gosh, that's pretty bad.

(39:05):
Why?
Well, it's just, just dead channels.
Oh, oh yeah, that is bad.
Yeah.
Well, they eventually close.
Well, I mean, our, our global rank for
channel capacity is 118.
Really?
Our global rank?
We're 118 in the entire lightning infrastructure?

(39:28):
Yes.
Wow.
Yes.
Wow.
Our capacity rank is like 368, but right.
But our channel, our channel rank is 118.
That's not bad.
A fan.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's cool.
We have so much.
So, I mean, but the balance of these
nodes is beautiful, man.
We're, we're well balanced.
We're very balanced.
We don't need any meds.

(39:51):
We're well balanced.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
Cool.
All right.
Well, I feel happier about that.
Yeah.
I'll set up a node.
We'll get that rocking.
That's, that's probably the best way to do
it.
And we don't want, because we're basically, we
are basically creating a DDoS for Albi Hub.
For get Albi.
Yeah.
And I, and I, I mean, I don't

(40:11):
want to do that to them.
No, no.
Um, let's see.
Nice to see RSS.com going hyperlocal.
Oh yeah.
That, and, and yeah, pushing the location tag.
That's great.
Yeah.
I like that a lot.
That's very cool.
So now do you have to be hyperlocal

(40:33):
to do that?
I don't think so.
Here.
I think you have, you have to include
a location.
Location tag.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Let me see.
That's rad, man.
I think it is too.
I like it a lot.
Let me see.
That's rad, man.
Yeah, man.
That's super rad.
Let me see.
Start your podcast free.
Let me see.

(40:55):
Free podcast hosting made simple.
Doesn't care how simple it is.
As long as it's free, man, everybody's bolting
on hosting now.
Isn't that interesting?
And they have, I think many don't really
know what they're getting into.
I think I agree with you because hosting
you're basically your number besides getting the files

(41:16):
out right after that comes stats.
And if you don't have pretty charts and
graphs and pie charts and, uh, and maps
and, uh, every single detail you're dead.
This, this is what people think is important.

(41:38):
Bandwidth, then stats, then support.
Bandwidth seems to be less of an issue
somehow.
Hmm.
Yeah.
I'm not sure why, but that just seems
to be less, less and less of an
issue.
I think a lot of people are, a
lot of people who are hosting small amounts

(41:59):
of podcasts are in the, what would you
call that?
Like the, they're in the fog of these
CDNs where they, where they're just sort of
like hiding in the shadows of these CDNs.
But as soon as, if they break out
over a certain threshold and the CDN sees

(42:20):
what they're doing, you get a phone call
and it's not a fun phone call because
you get a phone call from Cloudflare that
says, Hey, yeah, we've noticed, uh, your, your
traffic.
You've got a lot of egress.
Yeah.
Your egress traffic is, uh, has spiked unless
you, and it looks like it's sustained now
at, uh, at around this number of terabytes
per month.

(42:40):
Yeah.
We're going to need you to upgrade to
our enterprise plan.
Yeah.
Um, our first, uh, our first estimate is
probably going to be about, um, $5,000.
Yeah.
About 20 grand a month.
Does that, does that work for you?
Yeah.
Does that work for you?
Yeah.
Not a fun phone call.
No.
And it goes from like $20 a month
to like thousands.

(43:02):
Yeah, exactly.
There's not an in-between.
Yeah.
And the second, you know, the next thing
is customer support and people, because you're just
going to get people saying, you know, my
podcast didn't upload to Apple.
I mean, yes, R2 has, uh, Cloudflare R2
has free bandwidth, but still there, every provider

(43:24):
that says they give you free egress, there
is a clause in their terms that allow
them to give you that phone call.
It, I promise you is not free infinitely.
If you hit a certain threshold, you do,
they are not going to, you're going to
have to pay.
And I, I still, you know, someone else
asked me about this the other day, IPFS

(43:46):
podcasting.com or.net.
I think it is.
Is it.net?
Let me see.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That works.
I mean, it's still just works beautifully.
And if you look at the map on
IPFS podcasting.net, man, there's coverage and this
are y'all still running a node?

(44:07):
I am an exit now.
Yeah.
Didn't a void zero build one?
I think he still is.
Um, let me see.
Yeah, I think so.
I'm just looking at the map and it
looks like, yeah, yeah, that's him.
That's him.
That loser.
He's sitting there on the map.
I think he is running one.

(44:28):
Now, of course there's, you know, there are
issues, uh, but not that much.
I mean, it's a pretty stable network and
I'm still running a node.
Let me see.
Manage.
Okay.
This feels good.
I haven't looked at this in months.
Uh, yeah.
Yes.
All my feeds are still up, uh, and

(44:51):
they're current and they're active and they're pinned
by tons of servers.
I mean, it's, it's really, it's, let me
see node.
Let me see what node tells me.
I was running two, but my, uh, one
was it, uh, what's that, uh, that home
bake stuff.
Not the start nine, but the, uh, the

(45:12):
other one.
Yeah.
That died.
Yeah.
It's funny you say that.
Cause my umbrella died today.
Yeah.
It just dies.
I don't know what happened.
I didn't do anything here.
My, my, uh, let's see.
Goodness gracious.
This is amazing.
I mean, I'm look, I'm hosting smashing security,

(45:35):
all twit TV shows, the Ezra Klein show.
Hey, get him off.
V for Valentine pivot, pivot, pivot.
I'm hosting pivot.
Are you hosting pivot?
Yeah.
Apparently that's in the limited 48 hour episodes,
uh, bin.
How are you hosting pivot?
They don't include IPFS in their RSS.
Someone's doing it.

(45:56):
Let's take a look.
Um, let me see.
Let me click on that.
Let me see what information I get.
Yeah.
New York mag doc.
I mean, I don't need their permission.
Someone can just add it.
You don't need permission to host somebody's feed
on IPFS.

(46:16):
Doesn't have to be out.
Doesn't have to go out through, don't you
have to reference it in the enclosure?
Well, that's a good, uh, that's a good,
uh, good question.
I don't re I mean, someone's doing it.
So they're losing click somewhere.

(46:37):
Yeah.
But I'm just saying it, it works.
I mean, it's a, it's an amazing system
and I'm seeing so many node connections, thousands,
thousands of nodes can node connections.
I should say I have 23 peers.
That's not bad.

(46:58):
That's, that's right.
I forgot Eric, Eric Pippy's right.
It gives you a different feed.
It like proxies the feed.
Yeah, that's it.
Yeah, that's right.
So, you know, I mean, that still works.
It's still a thing for, you know, for,
for, you know, I mean you can build
a hosting company on that.

(47:21):
RSS.com still runs an exit node.
Oh, they're one of the biggest.
Yeah.
Cause those guys care about the community.
I care about speaking of caring about the
community.
Here we go.
Can we talk about apple apple's directory in
relationship to our directory?
Yes.
Good idea.
I've seen the posts pod stage go click.

(47:47):
Um, I mean, I'm gonna, so the way
that the way this came up is, is
James posts in and James, not the first
person to post this.
I mean, this, this is just a known
issue with, with the index, but, uh, he's
the most recent person to post about that.
Some of the, some of the, um, feed

(48:09):
URLs don't jive, man.
Yeah.
Some of the feed URLs in the index
do not match what apple podcast shows as
the feed index as the feed URL.
So given a show, uh, like what, you
know, whatever, focus on the family, uh, Joe
Rogan, anything you take a show and that
feed URL, we show something different than when

(48:32):
apple podcasts shows.
Yeah.
So, um, you could call this a problem
with keeping, keeping the podcast directories in sync.
Um, which is what Marco used to do
for us.
True.
And still does.
Oh, he still does.

(48:52):
Okay.
Yes.
He's still running his sync agent.
And when he has, but there's reasons that,
um, yes, we do, Daniel, we do update
by the way, feed redirects void zero just
said running IPFS on all servers.
We HTTP 302 forward everything that is not

(49:13):
audio file to IPFS.io. Okay.
Okay.
There you go.
Okay.
Uh, so I'm going to be in to
Daniel's question.
He said his podcast index updating feed redirects.
Yes, we do.
We've always done that, but this is part

(49:37):
of the problem.
People don't know about this.
Uh, some of the biggest organizations in the
world don't know about this.
We've seen it.
Correct.
And they just go, I'm just moving to
host.
I'll just change it in apple podcast.
Connect.
Good to go.
And so I'm going to be, I'm going
to be very, I'm going to be upfront

(49:58):
and honest about this whole conversation is I
don't know.
I've got an idea, but I don't know
how, but, but in general, I don't know
how to solve this because I think part
of, I think it's partly not solvable.
Um, but I think this needs, I would

(50:18):
like to see a community based effort around
getting, getting something better going here.
So, so realizing that like to realize the
true complexity of, of keeping these things in

(50:39):
sync, um, you, you have to start with
mentally decoupling yourself from this idea that Apple's
directory is authoritative.
Yes.
This is the, this is the issue that
comes universally sync, the meaning multiple computers or

(51:06):
pieces of software that have to stay in
quote unquote, sync with one another is one
of the hardest, hardest problems in the universe.
It is very difficult.
Always has.
That's why, that's one of the reasons why
Dropbox was such a power in the beginning
is because they did this very well.
It seemed when you, this is just like

(51:26):
RSS feed parsing.
When you first go into this, you think
it's easy.
And then you hit all the problems and
you know, three months into a project, you're
tearing your hair out.
And so, um, but you can have to
decouple from this, from this feeling, this, this

(51:50):
sort of emotional attachment to Apple's directory being
the authority.
And I'm saying this up front, but then
I'm going to contradict myself.
Okay.
I'm, I'm, I'm just telling you, this is
going to be messy.
I realized that arguments can be made that
Apple's directory is authoritative and I'm not really

(52:14):
even going to like, uh, you know, I'm,
I'm not going to even go against that.
But I'm saying that it, what I'm saying
is it should not be right.
If our, if, if, if RSS, RSS is
open source, podcasting is built on open source

(52:37):
foundations.
It is a open protocol.
And the whole reason that the podcast index
exists is to try to make it so
that podcasting is not controlled by one single
closed corporation.
And like it or not, whoever controls the
directory controls podcasting to a certain degree.

(53:02):
Because if you can't, people do not search
for RSS feed URLs.
They search for names.
They search for titles.
They search for shows in a way that
is disconnected from the URL of the podcast
feed.
And while it's true that the podcast feed

(53:23):
will always work and is not dependent, that's
not dependent on Apple.
The finding the podcast requires a directory, at
least at this stage of the game.
This is already sounding like it's going to
end up in a SETI at home situation.

(53:44):
Yeah, yeah, Eric, exactly.
We, this, this project started because, you know,
we wanted to decouple podcasting from Apple's control.
But again, I don't think you can be
an idealist or some sort of utopian, you

(54:06):
know, dreamer here.
I think you have to be realistic.
And one of the reasons that, so maybe
this is a good way to say it.
While I have convictions that Apple's directory should

(54:30):
not be authoritative.
And I also have good reasons to show
that it also has problems.
Just because they show that something has a
certain feed URL, that doesn't mean it's true.
They have bad data just like we do.
I know because I send them emails sometimes

(54:52):
to let them know that, you know, that
they have spam in there or they have,
you know, problems.
The, so the one advantage that they have
is, and this is again, sort of theoretical,

(55:14):
but the one advantage they have is that
podcasters go and change their feed URL in
their directory.
Yeah.
That is a real advantage.
It's a signal from the owner of the,
of the show that says, I own this
show and I'm telling you, Apple, here's what

(55:34):
my podcast feed URL is.
Right.
Now that is authoritative.
Something, something, something we can't even do for
this very show.
We cannot.
Because we've been put in there by someone
we don't know who.
Right.
Yep.
Yep.
And that's, and so their authority doesn't come

(55:56):
from their largesse or anything like that.
It comes mostly from the fact that they
get firsthand attribution in many cases that what
their day, that the data they have is
correct from the podcast owner.

(56:16):
And that's something we don't have.
We search around in the dark.
We see through a glass dimly.
Ah, there it is.
We've got scripture in the podcast.
Good work.
So, but, but we have advantages.
We get, we get podcasts much faster than
Apple does.
Yeah.

(56:36):
You know, things go into the index through
pod.
I mean, so fast.
Yeah.
It's crazy how fast we get stuff.
Uh, but you know, so then you have
this bottom line, neither Apple podcast, nor us
is right.
100% of the time.
Correct.
Sometimes they're wrong.
Sometimes we're wrong.

(56:57):
And I've seen plenty of instances where we,
this is a con let me, let me,
this is a common thing that happens.
Let me describe this.
We get a support email that says, Hey,
my show is, um, my feed URL changed.
I moved from captivate to bus route.

(57:17):
And, uh, here's my feed on the index.
And can you please up here's my show
on the index.
Can you please upgrade, update my feed URL
to be, uh, this new hosting, which, uh,
by the way, uh, coming to you from
the success desk is not possible.
If you potty, if you have submitted your
new feed to the index, this becomes impossible.

(57:39):
Yeah.
Uh, so we get that email and it
says, Hey, my feed's wrong.
So what I do is I go and
I do, I look it up and I
see that they have an iTunes ID that's
connected to this show.
You click on the iTunes ID and the

(58:00):
iTunes ID still shows the old incorrect URL.
And so that's the one we have because
we stay, we try to stay in sync.
And I say try because it's not successful
all the time, but we try to stay
in sync.
And that means not changing a URL.
If Apple still shows that they have a

(58:22):
URL.
Wow.
So that leads to a problem that leads
to this secondary problem.
Secondary problem is here's the way that happens.
Somebody moves to a different hosting company, that
hosting company posts, it publishes that feed.
Ah, pod ping.
Hello.

(58:42):
New, new entry on the index.
Got it.
Yep.
Now they get two shows.
Yeah.
They, even with a redirect, we will not
update that show if it's not been updated
in Apple podcasts.
Right.
But now there's two shows.
Then later they go back and change their
URL in Apple podcasts.

(59:03):
Now we have to do this heuristic dance
where we try to figure out is the
podcast in, okay, somebody has, uh, there's now
a redirect from this URL to this other
URL and Apple podcast concurs with that.
But we also have a, we can now
have a secondary show with a conflict that
also says they have that URL.

(59:23):
Is that in podcast index ID higher?
Hmm.
If it is okay, make the assume, assume,
yeah.
Delete and make the change.
If it's not, don't make the change.
But it can also be a, here's a
third problem can also be a hijacked feed.
True.
Yes.
I see a lot of those people, not

(59:45):
even malice intended, you know, we, we actually
know we had a customer who was like,
oh, I, uh, I don't like the artwork
on that feed.
So I just created a new feed and
it syncs up with the old feed with
a new artwork.
Well, you've just created a double entry.
Yeah.

(01:00:06):
Yep.
Bad.
It's a bad, bad, bad customer.
But, okay.
So I think you could say it this
way in the, in the absence of a
clear intent from the podcast owner themselves, it

(01:00:30):
is, it truly is impossible to determine which
feed URL is correct.
I think that's the statement of fact that
we, that we sort of like go to
step two with.
If you don't have a clear intent from
the podcast creator, you will not know ever
whether the feed URL you have is the

(01:00:52):
right one.
And Apple has more contact with the podcast
creator than we do.
Those are two statements that I feel are
factual.
Now comes, what do we do about that?
If I just scrape Apple podcast directory all

(01:01:13):
the time, which we could do, uh, then
why do we exist?
Yep.
So that's, that's again, and we know why
we exist.
We exist to return podcasting to ownership by
a community of creators and hosts and hosters.

(01:01:37):
We, we don't want it to be owned
by a corporation.
So my, the idea that I have is,
is, is sort of vague and loose.
Oh, we love that.
Vague and loose.
Vague and loose.
That's how I like my women.

(01:01:59):
Vague and loose.
The loose part I get, the vague part
is confusing.
Baby, just be vague with me.
I don't need to know exactly what you're
thinking.
Look, just, just don't get specific.
That's all I ask.
Okay.
Yeah.
Pour me another drink.
So here's, here's sort of like a rough

(01:02:22):
sketch of this idea.
I, for years ago, I bought this podcast.
I bought this domain called move your podcast
.com.
Ooh.
Uh-huh.
It's good.
And I didn't know really why I grabbed
it.
I just grabbed it and I was like,
Hey, this sounds kind of interesting.
We could do something with this later.

(01:02:44):
Ooh.
I feel where you're going.
I'm liking it already.
Okay.
So the, I, my idea is why don't
we as a community, meaning the PSP podcasting
2.0 people, um, you know, uh, James,

(01:03:04):
everybody, why don't we all come together and
we, and this has happened.
We've done things like this before.
Why don't we come together and create a
website at move your podcast.com?
I will don't, I will just give that
domain to whoever, you know, uh, wants to
control it.
I'll give it to the PSP or whatever.

(01:03:25):
Why don't we create a website that will
interface directly with creators where they can, uh,
verify their ownership in the new fancy ways
that we do that, you know, not just
email, but also, you know, the TXT record

(01:03:46):
and the tokens and all this kind of
stuff.
Uh, we throw a website together and then
we verify ownership and then we ask, and
then that web, they can tell us where
their podcast is and it will be an
open source community owned resource for getting this

(01:04:14):
information directly from the podcast owner.
And then we will take that information and
distribute it to everyone.
It'll go that whatever gets put in, whatever
the owner says that their feed URL is
on that side, we will, we will treat

(01:04:34):
that as absolutely authoritative.
And we will, we will put that in
their feed as in their podcast, as their
feed URL immediately with no ifs, ands, or
buts.
Then we will push something out through pod
ping, maybe a new act, a new, uh,

(01:04:55):
verb or action type through pod ping saying,
uh, state as, as, and this would be
sort of like a, simply a statement of
fact instead of, you know, like the update
action in pod ping, we could see, we
could do something and I'll run this by
Alex and see what his thoughts are on
it.
We could do something like, um, uh, a

(01:05:18):
test.
So this is an attestation from a verified
podcast creator that this show is the author,
is the true URL for their podcast.
And that gets distributed out through pod ping.
Then all the directories that are monitoring pod
ping can say, Oh, there we go.

(01:05:38):
We have a, we've just got an authoritative
voice saying I am the owner of podcast
XYZ and my feed is fill in the
blank.
I think that's a very good idea.
Um, the, the biggest problem we have is

(01:06:01):
education.
And I have two examples.
Uh, this came up just the other day
from Bill Simmons.
Uh, the, was it the ringer podcast network,
Spotify and listen.
And the question was about what do we
still call these things podcasts, but listen to

(01:06:21):
the definition he looked up of the term
podcast and what a podcast is.
Brian asks, at what point do we retire
the term podcast?
Nobody uses an iPad.
And with the pivot to video and streaming,
these are very clearly talk shows, by the
way, he says iPad, which is just funny,
which called the pad cast, but okay, there

(01:06:42):
we go.
Not necessarily.
Um, I think we're stuck with the term.
I just think we're going to morph into
saying video podcasts or podcasts, depending on if
it's a video show or not.
But if you look at the definition of
podcast, which I looked up, a podcast is
a program made available in digital format for
download over the internet.

(01:07:03):
So why would we change that?
Um, okay.
So when I hear that my skin crawls.
Yeah, me too.
And October, 2023, I did a keynote, the
spark media conference.
This was all, uh, Christian faith based podcasters.
And I talked about how important their RSS

(01:07:25):
feed was.
And I did a cute little thing.
I said, you know, some people call it
really simple syndication, but I think, I think
of it as rock solid syndication, build your
house on the rock.
Come on.
I mean, give me some props for that.
And, and I could see people's eyes light
up like, Oh, Oh, wow.
Oh, because they, they really, and this is

(01:07:47):
almost three years ago or two years ago,
they really had never understood how it all
worked.
And quite honestly, I think hosting companies could
do a better job, um, because they make
it look like you're uploading to Apple.
You're uploading to Spotify in some cases with

(01:08:07):
video.
They actually are.
Um, but that education piece I think should
be more prevalent in the workflow.
So you actually educate people.
It's not that hard.
I don't think, but educate people as to
how this is really, what's really taking place

(01:08:28):
and how magical it is and how important
it is that we have this decentralized open
system because the workflow, it literally looks like,
let me see what rss.com does.
Uh, cause I kind of noticed it there.
Um, cause you, let me see.
Cause they have, yeah, they have a tab

(01:08:51):
called, let me see.
Hmm.
Distribution major directories, automatic submission, Apple podcasts, Spotify,
Amazon music, podcast index, listen notes, rss.com
community, and then additional apps, automatic listing.

(01:09:14):
I mean, it just, the automatic submission makes
it feel like you are uploading your file
to those apps, to those platforms.
So while we're talking about creating move my
podcast, move my podcast, feed.com, what was

(01:09:35):
it?
Move my podcast.com.
Yeah.
Move your podcast, move your podcast.com.
We need to, and we owe it to
ourselves to continuously educate how podcasting really works
because we're losing that battle every single day.
And eventually why need, why would you need

(01:09:56):
it?
And it's host important for the hosting companies
to eventually be like, well, I just auto
submit to me, which is already happening with
Spotify with video and YouTube.
Yeah.
Um, that's probably the best thing we can
do is continue to educate.

(01:10:18):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, I, yeah, no, I agree.
I agree.
That's yeah.
I wonder where he got that definition from.
I'm sure it's from some chat bot.
Let's take a look.
I mean, that sounds like it sounds is

(01:10:39):
the definition of a podcast.
I'm asking Chad GPT.
It's thinking I have it in expert mode,
a series.
Oh, here it is.
A series of spoken word, audio, or video
episodes that you can listen to or watch
over the internet, usually on demand, often by
subscribing through an app.

(01:11:00):
Very poor.
No mention of RSS at all.
Let's look at grok because that's the only
two ones I have an account with grok.
Let's see what grok says.
This is grok 4.1. So I expect
it to be spot on the money.
Boy, to ensure accuracy, let's search for a

(01:11:21):
reliable definition of a podcast.
Well, it's really going through man.
A podcast is a digital program, typically consisting
of episodic audio and sometimes video content that
is distributed over the internet for on demand
streaming or downloading often through subscription via RSS
feeds.
At least it has RSS.

(01:11:41):
But often, it should be always.
Always.
Not often.
So, you know, I don't want to get
off into the definitions of things, but I
mean, it's, it's important.
It is.
Yeah.
No, it's important for the, it's important because
if the, if there's no understanding that there
is an RSS feed behind this thing, then

(01:12:02):
people don't understand what, we'll never understand what
the problem is, go, why things get out
of sync.
Somebody needs to write me a script.
Short script.
Daniel J.
Write me a script.
I'll do a video.
Hi, I'm Adam Curry.
You probably think of me as an over

(01:12:24):
the hill, out of work VJ.
However, however, I'm not out of work.
Well, I'm out of, I don't have a
job that I do have a podcast.
No, I mean, it's, it's all just education.
I think we, you know, if we want
to keep it alive, then we need to

(01:12:46):
continue to educate.
That's for sure.
Yeah.
Ask potty.com.
That's good.
Yeah.
Potty will pop up.
Hi, do you even know how that works?
You idiot.
Do you even know what a podcast is?
Do you even know what a pod, answer
the, answer me.
What is, if you can't answer, that's it.
I'm happy to help you with our customer

(01:13:07):
success desk, but first you have to tell
me what a podcast is.
If you can't answer that question, we're not
going to help you.
And it's not even AI.
It's not the analysis.
It's not even AI.
It just looks, if you, if you didn't
put the word RSS in there, it just
rejected.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Go away.
Oh man.
Well, I mean, that's, that's the only way
I can think of to, to get a

(01:13:29):
handle on this problem is, is, is taking,
taking the voice of the owner, the attestation
of the podcast owner and put, putting it
into a place that is community managed where
we can all hook in to that authoritative

(01:13:51):
source.
I totally agree.
And get, get proper, uh, attribution.
And, um, because you can't just trust the
podcast hosting company.
It's not that I'm not saying that they're
nefarious.
What I'm saying is they don't know what's

(01:14:12):
going on.
Like you, this happens multi, this is how
this happens all the time.
I can tell you this, uh, scenario.
I've seen podcasts that are literally on, they
have identical shows on like seven different podcast
hosts.
I know I've seen it too.
They'll start over on bus sprout.
Then they'll go to rss.com.

(01:14:33):
Then they'll make one on Spreaker.
Then they'll make one on, uh, you know,
on red circle.
Then they'll make one on captivate.
Then they'll make one on Lipson.
They will literally have seven accounts with the
same show on it because they're like shopping
or something.
They're trying to figure out what they'll, and
they'll go, they'll go from rss.com over

(01:14:54):
to bus sprout and then to Lipson and
then back to rss.com and then they'll
go from rss.com to blueberry.
And then they'll go back to rss.com.
It's like, what are you doing?
And, and none of those hosting companies, they,
none of them know what, what to, to
attest to as the authoritative URL, right?

(01:15:14):
They're just a cog in the wheel of
the machine at that point.
Like they can't claim ownership because they don't
know it's the, it's the podcaster that has
to tell us where their show lives.
Yes.
So whatever the solution to this is, it's,
I feel like it's got to be that.
And you know, move your podcast.com.

(01:15:36):
We can use that.
We can use some other thing, but it
doesn't matter.
I don't care, but I feel like that
has to happen.
Yes.
Yeah.
I think that's, that's a very good idea.
And, uh, we'll never get the deserve peace
prize award for this work that we're doing.
We'll never give up on it.
We're solving global strife.

(01:15:57):
Yes.
Give up on, uh, on the prize.
Adam Carolla will get that.
Don't worry.
Um, but I used to have this, um,
this, uh, silver coin that's, uh, it had
a picture of, uh, Dick Cheney on the
back of it.
And it said, uh, God, I'm trying to

(01:16:19):
remember the quote on it.
It said something like, uh, uh, battling global
terrorism by creating it or something like that.
And it's like, that's what we're, we're battling
global strife by creating strife by creating more
strife.
Yes.
Well, education and that hub is a great
idea.

(01:16:40):
Let's see if, if that can get picked
up.
I will, I will gladly participate in it.
You send me a script, I'll do it.
Whatever, whatever you are.
I mean, you're going to create potty and
potty is going to be what powers.
Yes.
Potty will potty potty power, potty power, potty
is your backend.

(01:17:03):
Wow.
That's deep.
That's very deep.
I like that a lot.
Potty is your backend.
Oh, thanks.
And people, Dave, get you out on time.
We got to that time already.
Yeah, it is thousand sats from Dred Scott
here.
He comes in from cast thematic sage advice
from the pod sage.
Three 33 from salty crayon, all in the
potty helper potty.

(01:17:25):
Where's my transcript?
We got that baller boost from Dred Scott.
One, two, three, four, five, six from a
pod verse.
He was slinging some sassy index for doing
big in the VM.
That's right.
Uh, triple five from salty crayon.
How did Dave and Adam glad that all
it took to shut up the Nostra bros
and zaps was cloud flare and rust chalk

(01:17:47):
up another win for nodes and key sent
in Trump voice.
Are you tired of winning yet?
What happened with Nostra?
Did it, when did cloud flare go down
and Nostra went down?
Oh, is that, did that happen for real?
I don't know.
Um, I guess I'm curious about that.
I wonder.
Interesting.
Cause I, you know, cause it's decentralized and

(01:18:09):
censorship resistant.
Yes.
Does, uh, does anyone in the board, the
boardroom?
No.
Salty crayon.
Anybody?
Hello.
Is this thing on?
It's decentralized and censorship resistant.
Unless cloud flare goes down, chat F is
typing.
So chat and chat F is the one
who would know.
I guess the C Brooklyn one, one, two

(01:18:29):
says Nostra worked.
Oh, salty crayon says the zaps.
Didn't.
That's interesting.
One of the clients was down.
Yeah.
Well just, you only need one.
You'll need a big one that everybody uses.
That's how it goes.
And then your blue and then your blue
sky and strike.
Yep.
Strike went down.
Yeah.
I saw that too.
Strike one.

(01:18:49):
I was, I did.
I'm glad strike went down so I didn't
have to look at the Bitcoin price.
I don't want to see that thing at
all.
Uh, this is funny.
I love all the memes about the Bitcoin
and all the hot, hot takes, hot takes.
Bitcoin has a math problem.
Okay.
Yeah.
My favorite is, Oh yeah.

(01:19:11):
All kinds of nonsense.
I, another one is, you know, um, AI
and quantum will be able to decrypt a
Bitcoin bro.
Like Bitcoin's not encrypted and you know, it's
like, okay, fine.
Whatever.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
All right.
What you got on the list?
Uh, let's see.

(01:19:32):
Oh, these are all these PayPal's are going
to be mixed in.
So you got, you mean monthlies and one
-offs mix?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Good job.
Well, actually, you know what?
I can, I can not, I can do
it.
I can, I can separate them in real
time because I'm that good.
Yo, uh, Edgar Rios, $10.

(01:19:53):
No note.
That's a one-time.
Thank you, Edgar.
Do you see how I just extracted that
out of the list?
Yeah.
You're phenomenal pod sage for the wind.
Yes.
Lauren ball.
These are monthly Lauren ball, $24.20. Thank
you, Lauren.
I appreciate that pod verse.
That's Mitch and Creon over there.
Still waiting for podcast, pod verse next gen,

(01:20:14):
by the way.
Um, uh, $50.
Thank you guys.
Uh, Mitch Downey coming in.
Always.
He's always right behind pod verse.
Funny how that works.
$10.
I haven't even talked to Mitch in like
four months.
I saw him post the other day.
He did.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He posted about, uh, uh, pod verse next

(01:20:35):
gen.
Oh, I must've missed it on the index.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, he's social.
Uh, he said, what did he say?
He said it was going to be focused
on something specific, which I kind of liked.
Uh, and I can't remember what it was
going off to look it up.
I'll look up what he said because I
was like, Oh, that's cool.
That sounds like he's doing something different again.

(01:20:56):
Cause you remember pod verse started as, um,
specifically for clips.
Yeah.
For sharing clips.
Hold on a second.
Let me see if I can find it.
Um, Mitch, Mitch, Mitch, Mitch.
Let me see what Mitch said.
He said quick V oh, quick demo of

(01:21:18):
the video feature.
Oh, video.
Oh yeah.
It's long overdue, but I think the pod
verse 2.0 website will finally be available
in beta before the end of the month,
which is a precursor to the, to the
app.
The goal of pod verse 2.0 is
to support as many podcasting 2.0 features
as possible from the ground up emphasis is
placed on multiple medium experiences.

(01:21:40):
That's 3m podcast video and music.
Other goals include a focus on up to
optimizing app performances, simplifying code.
Okay.
So it's the multi it's the, and I
think he's going to do a lot of
music highlighting.
So not just as an afterthought, but as
a specific music section or whatever.

(01:22:00):
That's cool.
Yeah.
He's been posting a lot actually.
So cool, Mitch.
We're excited, excited to see what you come
up with brother and Jason from podcast guru
at the, you know, long talk with him
the other day.
And he's, he's got some pretty good stuff
cooking too.
So we're going to, as soon as he,
he's got some stuff he's cooking up right
now.
And as soon as he releases that, we're
going to have him on the show.
Nice.
Nice.
Uh, Christopher Harabaric $10.
Thank you very much.

(01:22:21):
Thank you.
Uh, Terry Keller $5.
Thank you, Terry.
Uh, Chris Cowan, $5 silicone florist, $10.
Damon Cassajack $15.
These are all great.
Thank you so much.
These are fantastic.
Yeah.
Two weeks of, uh, of, of, uh, donations
here to Derek J.
Viscar.
That's the best name in podcast.
It's $21.

(01:22:42):
Nice.
Uh, Paul Saltzman $22.
Yes.
Paul's always the same and always there.
Thank you, Paul.
Jeremy Gertz, $5.
Thank you, Jeremy.
Uh, Gene Liverman.
Hey, Gene and jeans, uh, Gene and Archie
both run a podcast index monitoring.

(01:23:03):
So whenever podcast index goes down, I get
pinged in the emails and it was blowing
up on cloudflare day.
Let me tell you that I'll bet.
Let me see.
They have a website.
He sent me an email and was like,
uh, Hey, do you want me to turn
off the emails?
Cause they're blowing up.
Yeah.
Cool.
I was like, no man, let them run.
Let them roll.
Yeah.

(01:23:23):
Um, Michael Hall, $5 and 50 cents.
Thank you, Michael.
Uh, new media productions.
That's, uh, that's Todd and Rob.
And I guess Todd from heaven, I guess.
So $30 from, you know, from the film.
Oh my God.
He's, he put us on an automatic pay.
That's what I'm saying.
It's still running.

(01:23:44):
I just, that's Todd from heaven, brother.
Yeah.
I'll take it.
Thank you, Todd.
Think of you a lot, man.
If, um, you know, Rob, if, if you
need $30 a month, tell us.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I guess it'll just run until it runs
out until we join Todd.
Um, Timothy voice $10.

(01:24:06):
Thank you, Timothy.
Uh, Basil Phillip, $25.
Thank you, Basil.
Uh, Oh, look at this.
It's bus sprouts.
A thousand dollars.
Thank you.
Boys and girls from buzz sprouts.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Keeping it rolling for us.

(01:24:28):
Thank you guys.
Appreciate that.
Uh, Oystein Berha $5, uh, $5 from Michael
Goggin, Jorge Hernandez, $5.
And that's our group.
Let's see.
We've got some boosts.
Not many, not many, but I, you know,
I always somehow managed to read the same
boost that you just read two seconds ago.

(01:24:49):
Yeah.
I appreciate that.
It makes me feel important.
It's cause I have to, by the time
I finished running through the PayPal's, I forgotten
what the boosts were.
I'll call it out.
Um, let's see.
Gene Everett, Satchel Richards, 1, 1, 1, 1.
Hey guys, I was just curious if you
could mention on show on the show current

(01:25:11):
status of what status that sounds Canadian status
of what depends on hive blockchain for pod
2.0 hive is not in a good
place right now.
And I noticed a few people asking, is
it, is it not in a good place?
Oh goodness, please.
No.
Oh, now, now you know that Brian of
London is going to blow up the signal
chat.

(01:25:32):
This is false.
Yeah.
Uh, they had a hard fork and I
think everything went smoothly.
Not a pod ping was missed the way
I understood it.
I think there will be disruptions coming years
on hive chain personally and was curious how
easy to not depend on this step might
be years out.
Cheers.

(01:25:52):
I'm not aware of any issue, but I'm
going to pass this boost straight through to
Brian of London so he can tell us
the truth.
And, uh, yeah, I mean, we have alternatives.
Yeah, we can switch pod ping to use
something else.
I'm not too worried about that.
Um, let's see.

(01:26:13):
Oh, uh, the ugly cracking Doug, that's Bruce
22, 22 through podcast guru.
Speak of the devil.
He says, build it big, make it for
gaming.
It should be able to handle anything.
I'm not sure what he's talking about.
We'll do it.
We'll do that tomorrow.
Over the weekend.
Yeah.
Done.
Consider it done.
Jake, Jake Lester, Jack Lester, Jake L S

(01:26:33):
T R L S T R.
That sounds like a C programming language function.
A big satchel of Richards one, one, one,
one, one.
Whoa.
Thank you.
Through fountain.
He says on the last show, Dave used
the term horny gay guy.
Oh no.
I'm sure you are aware is my phrase
that pays.

(01:26:56):
Hey, what's the phrase that pays horny gay
guy.
I don't, I don't remember using the term
horny gay guy, but we've got 11,000
sets out of it.
So good job.
Good job.
Dave mere mortals podcast.
That's Kyra and the satchel of Richards.
Hey, Karen, thanks for that.

(01:27:16):
Through fountain.
He says, Hey Dave, the creator of social
to Toshi's dot stream was looking for a
way to read up on the latest developments
of what he might need to do with
the move away from key send.
Well, number one, don't go through Albie's hub.
Yeah.
Close up shop is the answer.
Yeah.
Any particular resource or blog or summary I
could send him to catch up with on
all the discussion here.

(01:27:37):
Well, that's a good question.
I don't think we have one particular resource.
I mean, he's on, isn't he?
I believe he's on podcast index dot dot
social.
If not hit me up and I'll let
you know.
Yeah.
Telegram guy, right?
Oh yeah.
Telegram.
Yeah.
I forget.
Telegram exists.
No, I, I know it exists because I
have to keep deleting spammers from the podcast

(01:27:59):
index group.
Hi, it's Elsie.
Gross.
Yeah.
Uh, I don't know, man.
I mean like it's basically just a lightning
address instead of, instead of keys and it's
Ellen URL instead of keys.
Yeah.
And so you just, it, and it's, uh,

(01:28:21):
the, the, the method is, um, well, the
problem is he's going to have to create
Ellen addresses for all of his recipients.
He has to create a well-known for
everybody.
That's the problem.
Maybe you can do that with, uh, what's
the thing called a bitly and bit, bit
bits, Ellen bits.

(01:28:41):
Yeah.
And put that on top maybe.
Cause you can create a lot of addresses
with that.
Just stick it on top.
Just like, yeah, just stick it on top.
Just rub it right on the top.
Back to your horny gay guy.
Well, I mean, to quote Morris from Albie,
there were solid reasons for choosing keys.
And well, yes, there were solid reasons.

(01:29:03):
We, we agree.
Yeah.
Um, okay.
It's well, that's victim shaming is what that
is, but okay.
That is true.
Me too.
Yeah.
So I would say that satoshi's dot stream
would be good to get on the index.
Yeah.
If you're not, send me an email, Adam

(01:29:23):
mccurry.com and I'll get you on.
Okay.
Uh, Oh, wait, wait.
Is this, I think you already read this
one.
No, we got two from comic strip blogger.
Oh, well, yeah.
One for each show.
Yeah.
We missed one show.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Uh, comes to your blogger.
That's a double delimiter, which is valid.

(01:29:45):
16,015 through fountain.
Nice.
This is last week.
He said, how do you Dave and Adam
today?
I'd like to recommend a podcast called podcast
for 11.
That's the word podcast and the numbers four,
one, one written together.
It features insider interviews with podcast legends, like
Todd Cochran and Aaron monkey, along with pro

(01:30:09):
tips from editors, real talk for podcasters.
You can find it by visiting podcast for
11.libson.com or by searching for podcast
for 11 in your favorite podcast app.
Yo CSB, the AI arch wizard.
Hmm.
That's a, that's the limiter.
Number one delimiter.
Number two is 18,015 sass through fountain.

(01:30:32):
And he says, how do you Dave and
Adam today?
I'd like to recommend a podcast called podcast
for 11.
It's the same podcast.
Sorry.
He's just double promoing.
Just doubling.
Yes.
Uh, you can find it by searching by
visiting podcast for 11.libson.com or by
searching for podcast for 11 in your favorite
podcast app.

(01:30:52):
Yo CSB, the AI arch wizard.
He is the one and only AI arch
wizard.
Thank you for doubling up on a CSB.
Appreciate that.
All right.
Rob Walters podcast.
That's his thing.
Yes.
Thank you all very much for supporting the
podcast index project.
If you want to support us, you can
boost us.
Uh, I think we, you can also send

(01:31:13):
this on chain Bitcoin will accept.
And, uh, if not, uh, you can always
go to podcast index.org, scroll down to
the bottom, big red donate button, send us
your fiat fund coupons, uh, through PayPal.
And thank you all so much for supporting
the project for keeping it going.
Uh, I think last count more than 70
apps and services use the podcast index has

(01:31:34):
become quite a, an important resource and it's
a funded by you.
And, uh, and we love that.
And, uh, we don't accept a peace prize.
We, in fact, if they offered it to
us, we'd, uh, we'd decline it.
I would turn it down.
Yeah.
So I don't need your stinking peace prize
with respect.
All right, everybody.
Perfect timing.
Two minutes over Dave.

(01:31:55):
Uh, you going rock climbing again this weekend?
No, we are.
Uh, we have a school function tonight.
We have a wedding tomorrow morning and then
we had, and then we're leaving to go
to Atlanta tomorrow night and then flying out
to New York on Sunday.
Okay.
How long are you going to be in
the big apple?
Uh, for a week.

(01:32:16):
So I will miss next week's show.
Okay.
When you're there, I need to report from
you.
How much weed you smell while walking on
the streets?
If it's as much as I smell here,
it'll be a lot.
That'll do it.
Everybody for podcasting 2.0, the board meeting
will take off next week.
We'll be back the week after that.
Have a good one, everybody.
Adios.

(01:32:52):
You have been listening to podcasting 2.0
visit podcastindex.org for more information.
When am I going to build my potty
bot?