Rapture

folks, we had a whole different episode planned for today but due to a series of extremely annoying technological problems and frustrating audio issues, we decided to switch topics and do a little catharsis. we talk about the new rapture predictions, which are supposed to happen on either September 23 or 24, why it's silly to predict the Second Coming, and why most people who have ever been involved in organized religion understand that while a few decide to try it out anyway. so we get some good laughs in at their expense and talk about how Medieval folk would've thought about this. enjoy!

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:31):
And I mean, of course, we have to talk about
the most pressing issue of the day, which is that
they released a trailer for a new Star Wars movie
and it looks like shit, fucking shit like No, I
don't mean the content of it, like Star Wars, like
sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad. We all know this,
but it looks like a TV show. And you know,

(00:53):
I may be a boomer about this, and that's fine,
but movies are supposed to look better than TV shows,
God damn it, and they're supposed to be look I
mean like, it doesn't matter how good the show is,
but they're supposed to look better. And this is just like, this.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
Is just.

Speaker 3 (01:12):
I gotta go look hold on.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
It just doesn't look good very like.

Speaker 3 (01:19):
But no, you're right, because if what you're saying is
that I need to go out of my house and
into a theater, which I'm not against, then you need
to make it look good.

Speaker 1 (01:31):
H exactly, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:34):
So okay, So the Mandalorian and Grogu that says what
I'm looking at. That's what I'm looking for.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
The worst named movie of all time.

Speaker 3 (01:42):
Yeah it is a really bad name.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:46):
Oh wow, that does look like shit like that looks
like the opening title to a video game sequence.

Speaker 1 (01:53):
It does. Oh no, we used to leads to be
a proper country.

Speaker 3 (02:01):
Oh my god. Oh you know, I'm sorry to your culture.
Let me just start out, this is a great insult
to your religion. Wow, don't just throw a baby Yoda
at me and go there you go red meat like
that doesn't count. I mean, no, thank you.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
Yeah, I don't. I don't understand. I don't understand.

Speaker 3 (02:31):
This is why we can't have nice things. You know,
Like what can I say?

Speaker 1 (02:35):
I just don't. I just don't. Man, don't you.

Speaker 3 (02:39):
Know it's disrespect it's disrespectful to you because basically what
they're saying is here, piggy, piggy, picky piggy, here's your slop,
and like they're not even bothering with anything else. And
I just don't think that's very right. You know, youre
a large corporation. You've got the cash. Let's let's see it,
spend it, you know, Yeah, build a set. I just

(03:02):
want to set my kingdom for a set.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah, it's yeah, it's uh, it's rather annoying. I just
don't think, uh, I don't think you're you know, Flagship
movie franchise should look like shit, like these these are
supposed to be movies. They are. Like I love all

(03:24):
the extra stuff I do, but like their movies first
and foremost. That's why we That's what we all talk about,
Like that's what they are. And when you do this,
it's just like what what are Like, what are we
doing here? I don't like but like the whole thing
with Bob Eiger, Like his whole thing was that like
he like he wanted this stuff to have like a

(03:45):
certain quality and everything. And I understand that this was
originally like supposed to have been like season four of
the show or whatever, but like they've decided that it
was a movie long enough ago that they could have
like spruced it up to the point. And I mean
like and they just put this stuff out and like,
I don't know how it's gonna be, how this thing
might make. This thing might make untold millions because people

(04:05):
do love Baby Yoda and that's fine, but like we
used to be a proper country, yeah or whatever. We're failing.
We're failing our artist. We're failing George Lucas, and you
know that makes me sad. I just yeah, anyway, No,

(04:28):
that's definitely not anywhere close to the most important thing
going on these days. These days we are you know,
everything's everything's going fun, everybody miserable, everybody pissed off. It is.

(04:48):
It is a day, you know, everybody. Everybody's mad. Trump
is like his brain's looking out of his head on
the unit on the u N days day is man.
I said that, I said that is days until I.

Speaker 3 (05:07):
Was l like I was, no, I was gonna do it.
I was gonna do it.

Speaker 1 (05:11):
That's the way, like I still do it, and every
and like everybod it's like days and I'm like, I guess,
I guess. Fucking English, French, Spanish, all of it just
mixed together with Germanic and here we are.

Speaker 3 (05:26):
It's a beautiful medieval culture that we're doing.

Speaker 1 (05:29):
It is it is we are. We're living the medieval dream.
Yeah that's right. Oh god yeah. Anyway, Uh, what's going
on with you? I mean, I nothing, nothing could possibly
compare to the horrors I've seen by watching this trailer.

Speaker 3 (05:45):
But you know, well, okay, so the big thing that's
happened over here in the past couple of days is that,
like the BBC has decided that they're just gonna pivot
to totally cheerleading, uh the Reform Party now. So yesterday
I'm trying to get like a cute late breakfast and

(06:09):
the pub is like playing BBC News and it's just
this press conference for Reform where Nigel Farage and what's
this phasey use if? Like, are like announcing their flagship plan,
which is that they are going to kick everyone who
has a visa that gives them indefinitely to remain out

(06:29):
of the country, which is cool.

Speaker 1 (06:33):
So for example, my I'm sorry, I'm sorry, can'd you
say that again? I really, I'm not making a joke.
I really, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (06:41):
So they're like, we're going to take everyone who has
indefinitely leave to remain, and we're not going to let
them have indefinitely to remain, and we're going to make
them leave and they can either then go back onto
a series of five year visas or leave the country. So,
for example, my husband is here with indefinite leave to

(07:04):
remain and like, I guess that we're going to have
to get him citizenship now, and they're like, and we're
also going to be making it harder to get citizenship, bitch.
It's so hard to get citizenship. It like takes years
and years and thousands and thousands of pounds. They make
you take this exam called the Life in Britain Exam
that like no English people can answer the questions too,

(07:26):
but like you have to go and take it. It's
like really not an easy thing. And they're just like,
it's also this bizarre situation because here they are at
this press conference and they were just saying shit that
was totally unhinged, where they were like half of everybody
on indefinite leave to remain are don't work and it's

(07:46):
like according to who, like no, they don't. And they're like, oh,
and then you have indefinitely leave to remain and it's
so easy to bring family members over, bitch, it's not
like you have to prove that you make a certain
amount of money in order for that to happen, and
blah blah blah blah blah, and it's really really difficult
to get people in. And then they kept referring to
something over and over again where they were like I

(08:08):
think they're trying to make fetch happen, and it's something
like the Boris eight hundred thousand or something, because like
while Boris Johnson was Prime Minister. We took in a
bunch of people from Ukraine and also Hong Kong. Yeah yeah,

(08:28):
and apparently that's bad question mark. And then also, you know,
one of the other things that's happened here is that
you know, Brexit happened, and we still don't want to
pick our own apples, you know, and so you have
to go find someone who will do it for a
fairly low rate rage from somewhere, and they're not coming

(08:49):
from Eastern Europe anymore. So they come from other places
in order to do these jobs that we don't want
to do. And like your dad down in Rochester is
every time he sees a brown person essentially, and the
BBC has just been like, yeah, we're just gonna like
this is fine, We're just gonna like roll this through
and like, yeah, how do we get more people who

(09:11):
want to vote reform to watch us? And it's like
it's crazy being somewhere that is so closely tied to America,
who is completely able to see everything that's going on
and watch them be like hell, yeah, we should do that,

(09:31):
because it's like it's just exactly the same like Star
Wars acting like the Democrats did, being like, well, what
if I just get really racist with it, will you
like me? Then the newspapers are like you got to
get more racist. It's like, why don't you just do
like anything to make stuff better for people? And they're like, no, sorry,
or do you say racism? You know, it's like the

(09:52):
drill tweet. It's like, you know, they're just turning the
big dial says racism and anyway, it's kind of terrifying
when you're just trying to have breakfast and they're like,
we're gonna try to deport your husband. You're like, cool, cool, cool, cool, cool, cool,
cool cool cool, you know, like.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
Hmm, sounds good, thanks.

Speaker 3 (10:09):
Great, and it's like it's and no one even really
came out like, uh, Zach Plansky, the new leader of
the Greens, I joined the Greens. We talked about this.
I did my little I did my little entry ism
and he's solid and he was like this is racist
and fucking stupid and like we and immigrants are chill. Actually,
Sadik Khan, the mayor of London, was like, what the
fuck are you talking about, because like everyone in London

(10:30):
is from everywhere and like what kier Starbar said about
it was it was too expensive and unworkable.

Speaker 1 (10:39):
So not like having a country.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
Well, like he was saying, it's too expensive to take
away the visus from everyone, and that's why we're not
gonna do it, not like yeah, yeah, yeah, not like
this is morally repugnant. He's like, yeah, too expensive.

Speaker 1 (10:52):
Well, my first thought was that even if they wanted
to do this, they would stop like immediately, because it
called a lot of money.

Speaker 3 (11:02):
Oh and like you know, just things like okay, well,
everyone will just have to be on a series of
like rotating five year visas. Well, you have you have
to hire so many people, you have so many bureaucrats
for that, like, and you don't want to pay for that.
So explained that the NHS will just collapse entirely because
we're pretty dependent on like nurses coming from overseas, because

(11:25):
you know, we don't pay them enough, you know. And
like obviously they answered all this, like, if you truly
truly wanted to have fewer people immigrate here, you should
pay better wages and then like people would do the
jobs that they don't want to do now, like you know,
teaching and nursing and elderly care. That's a really big
one that we're facing a crisis of. But no, you

(11:47):
can't do that. You can't ever make anything better. You
can only only only do racism. So pretty comfortable here,
and I'm feeling great. It's a great time to be
an immigrant. Don't feel threatened even slightly. It's really good. Yeah,

(12:09):
a lot of common sense happening, you know, it seems
like it m mm hmm. So yeah, but it's just weird,
like watching everything kind of happened in this way, and
the watching, like the complete and other utter refusal to

(12:30):
do anything about it, and like just the way threats
are increasing all the time is not brill I would.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
Say, Yeah, it seems uh suboptimal. Oh yeah, not not great.
I just like, yeah, I don't know, We're all just
we're all just hurtling toward gridlock.

Speaker 3 (12:56):
Years of let, years of let.

Speaker 1 (12:59):
I don't like we I don't know America, America is
not too stupid to do years of lead, because I
don't think you's are particularly smart for we might be
too lazy to sufficiently do it. Yeah, uh, it's just.

Speaker 3 (13:21):
Yeah, you know, maybe maybe the revolution will happen, you
know what.

Speaker 1 (13:29):
Yeah, I just I don't even know. I don't like. Yeah,
it's just it's such a weird it's such a weird time,
all of us just waiting for something and God only
knows what it is.

Speaker 3 (13:48):
Yeah, I don't know some you know acknowledgment of the
present situation. I guess, like the acknowledgment that like Tony
Blair isn't coming to save you. Uh you know, oh
that we did have more Nanserie afoot though, because you
know how last week I was talking to you about
how like, uh, the ambassador was all over the Epstein files. Ye,

(14:10):
Fergie's in trouble now too, because she was all like
email and Jeffrey Epstein, which is not a surprise because
like her husband was such good friends with him or whatever.
But I'm like, oh, not Fergie, who's very funny, very funny.
So yeah, it just uh it's it goes all the

(14:33):
way to the bloody top, doesn't it. And uh it's
funny because you know, all those cute people and everyone
are like blah blah blah International Nansen Organization and I'm
always like, yeah, that exists, but like it's just rich people.
It's not like anyone underground at a pizza place. Yeah,
I don't know man hm hmm, great times.

Speaker 1 (14:57):
Yeah, yeah, who who knows? Really, who's to say? I
what a's time to be alive? That's all I know.
I have to say. Yeah, Well, let's uh, let's just
get into it. Yes, folks, welcome back to We're Not

(15:24):
So Different podcasts about how we've always been idiots. We
are here today. Uh and we were going to talk
about something else, but I've had copious technological problems and
so yeah, we are actually just going to talk about

(15:45):
a big, a recent news subject in the news that
that that has come up. And uh, so we're going
to talk about We're going to talk about the rapture.

Speaker 3 (15:58):
If you're listening to this, you haven't been raptured, I've bet.

Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yeah, if you are listening to this, you are still
in Hell with the rest of us, or you know.

Speaker 3 (16:08):
Oh, actually maybe they listen to us exclusively in heaven.
That could be.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
Well, that would like imagine if this was heaven, be
like God, damn damn. Oh no, this ship sucks dog.

Speaker 3 (16:24):
Truly, it is worse.

Speaker 1 (16:26):
Truly, it is worse. Oh yeah, we uh fuck yeah, folks,
we were gonna have some questions. We're gonna do a
different topic. But instead, we're going to talk about the
rapture that was supposed to happen today or tomorrow, depending, you.

Speaker 3 (16:51):
Know, it always depends.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
And if you if you aren't familiar, in the last
I guess week or so, there's been a picktok trend
I guess among some versions of Christianity, where it was
a South African pastor of some variety predicted that the

(17:19):
rapture was going to take place. He said he saw
God in a vision and the vision said that the
rapture was going to take place on either September twenty
third or twenty fourth. So and I guess in fits
of you know, just grasping it something to find meaningness,

(17:44):
to find you know, meaning in, people really took to
that and it started a trend. I don't know how
many of these people were serious, but yeah, the I mean,
if you're hearing this, as Eleanor said, the rapture did
not happen to you. You were not taken away with

(18:06):
your clothes left in a neat pile wherever you were standing,
your your you know, your car didn't veer off the
road because the driver was raptured or the pilot you know,
or whatever it was just uh, we're all still here,
so yeah, and I don't. It's a very medieval thing,

(18:30):
uh in some ways, and a very not medieval thing
in some ways. And Eleanor is uh uh speaks a
lot on apocalypse apocalyptics. Uh, you know, the the end times,
all that sort of stuff. So Eleanor before we get

(18:51):
into that, uh yeah, growing up, what was your growing
up in Seattle or the Seattle area to come, I'm sorry,
what was your exposure to the concept of the rapture?

Speaker 3 (19:06):
It was something that the kind of like Megachurch people
believed in, right, So like I was existing in this
very weird miliu right where partially I was in Buddhist culture,
and I was going to Catholic school, right, And Catholics
don't believe in this shit, right, Like it's not like

(19:28):
this is not a part of Catholic dogma and it
does not have a scriptural basis. Really, you know, medieval
people would be like what. But so my high school,
which was like the big Catholic high school, was also
a place where a lot of the kids who went

(19:49):
to the Christian schools went to high school. So like,
if you were at one of the kind of more megachurchy,
like we're doing a live Nativity with camels kind of place.
Those kids would come in and it was real like
they you know, they walk amongst us shit, because like
you'd think you would like know a normal person and
they'd just like say something and you'd be like what, Like,

(20:13):
you know, there would be the occasional kid who thought
that dinosaur bones were like a test from the devil,
you know, and things of that, and they would sort
of mention the rapture, and I think that I can
kind of remember billboards that like alluded to the rapture
and things. But for me, it was always this thing
that kind of was happening within evangelical communities. But I

(20:38):
didn't really have access to evangelical communities, so I kind
of understood it to be like, oh, it's a thing
that they kind of believe, but they believe all sorts
of crazy shit, if that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (20:52):
Yeah it uh, I yeah, it is evangelical, but it's
not universally evangelical because when I was a kid. When
I was a kid, the rapture was like a thing
that like we laughed at Baptists and like I guess

(21:16):
certain Conservative Methodists for believing because it's just like even
if you even for groups that do like biblical literalism,
Like one of the most obvious rate ways to read

(21:37):
Revelation if you're reading it literally, is that he meant
it all allegory as an allegory, yeah, and you know
you weren't actually going to see the seven headed Beast
and everything. That was just you know, a reference to
like a big kingdom or what you know, whatever it
happens to be. And so like is one of those
things like that you you would kind of hear like

(21:58):
people talk about you be like all right, and then
like when the Kirk Cameron left behind stuff, when that
became big, like you heard more about it and there
was like a movie and everything.

Speaker 2 (22:11):
But like.

Speaker 1 (22:14):
It's I mean, it's always been a joke even among
even even even among some evangelicals. Like it's just like
it wasn't like a thing that like is universally believed in,
not even all Baptists believe in. And it's just like
to find out that people are still getting taken in

(22:35):
by this, which I mean, like you know that what
is this the thousandth incorrect, the ten thousandth incorrect prediction
for the return of the Messiah, like, yeah, what are
we when are we gonna start like just being like yeah, man,
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (22:54):
Yeah, I think I learned more about the rapture like
during the Bush years, if that makes sense, because I
think that that was coming word at the front. And
I learned about the concept of those left behind books
which I never read because I've never read that. I

(23:15):
have stuff to do, like drink and have sex. You know,
here we go, all right, it's a real tech day.
It's a real tech day, hear Okay, So basically I'm
aware of these books and like kind of the premises
everyone gets raptured and isn't it terrible being on earth
and blah blah blah. But I think it's really funny
how they're going all in on this rapture thing, because

(23:37):
you know, I'm always talking about this in terms of
a medieval standpoint, you never predict shit like this because
when it doesn't come true, you look stupid and it
puts people off believing. And it's like, this is just
like such a basic fucking thing that medieval people have
down in terms of pr that in the year of

(24:01):
Our Lord twenty twenty five, we are incapable of And
I find that really funny.

Speaker 1 (24:07):
Yeah, it's you look bad doing it, Like every everybody
laughs about it, like there's there's nothing like, there's no
redeeming quality in it. There's no point in doing it

(24:28):
except to like try and uh like to to try
and like generate like some publicity or something like that,
because like the downsides are that you look like an idiot,
You discredit like your religious movement broadly, and you know
you have these you you make it look even worse

(24:54):
than it does, and you look personally stupid. And it's
just like once you do all of these things, what
like what do we what do we? What do we do?
Like you, it discredits everything you have to say because
like if you if you make a big deal about

(25:15):
how like this is like this is going to be
the end. This is when it's gonna happen. This is
going to be when it happens. And people hear that,
they just they're like okay, and then when it doesn't happen,
they're like, all right, cool, Well I can I can
ignore what you have to say? I can? I can

(25:36):
I can minimize that in my mind, And it's just.

Speaker 3 (25:43):
This is kind of why it's good sometimes I think
to have leaders of a religion, right, well, yeah, I
mean we do not under any circumstances have to happen
like hand it to the papacy. That's not what I'm saying,
but like the papacy would be like shut up, shut up,
shut up, shut up, shut up. Nope, uh uh, Like
you know, the big guy wouldn't go around saying this,
and like you would get in trouble for saying it

(26:04):
from the pope. And that's a real that's a real thing,
you know.

Speaker 1 (26:10):
Yeah, it's and it's if it fundamentally marks you out
as unseerious, like because like the whole the whole thing
here is supposed to be that you know, we don't
know when Jesus is coming back, no one, you know,

(26:33):
no no one, No one knows the hour or anything
like that. And throughout history, most people have understood understood
the apocalypse of John, the Book of Revelation, whatever you
want to call it to be, like like it's it's
an allegorical biblical end times thing. It is, you know,

(26:58):
you see all this stuff in your head. It's you know,
there's fighting, there's there's fighting. The Devil's who's a dragon
and there's you know, the horror Babylon is there writing
a many headed beast and the seven trumpets are gonna
sound and seven scrolls will be unfurled and all this stuff,
and you're just like okay, yeah, like I mean you

(27:19):
you can do numerology to yea like to do this stuff.
And they certainly did numerology, like they were not immune
to that. But like when you start applying like you
like the you know, the Time before the Time and
the Halftime and the blah blah, and you combine like

(27:41):
the Book of Revelation stuff from like the prophetic books
of the Old Testament like Daniel and you know, all
the books at the end of the Old Testament basically
that aren't like Songs and Song of Solomon, like all
those they like, when you combine those things and you

(28:01):
do this, and you're like, okay, like this is the
end times. But it's like, no, John is writing in
the end times of the first century CE when he
is facing complete and total repression from from the Roman
Empire and the Roman state has killed his Lord and Savior. Meanwhile,

(28:24):
you know, your biblical prophetic writers, most of whom are
believed to have been writing during or after the Babylonian
captivity and that was their in times. It's like you
these things can mean stuff, but they don't. They just
mean like vague signifiers in the world. Like instead of writing,

(28:49):
you know, Rome is going to oppress us, and then
the successor of Rome will oppress us, and then et cetera,
et cetera, you write you know you're right that you
know the the feet will be made of clay and
the shins will be made of brass, and you know,
and it's just like, uh, it's it's meant to stand

(29:12):
for something to these people, but it's not meant to
say this is exactly when it's going to happen. The
least of which reason that most people who lived around
the time of John and and during the first century
uh Ce thought that Jesus was coming back like tomorrow,
like yeah, he died, he's coming back next week. Like

(29:33):
he said we weren't going to suffer. That means we're
not going to suffer, and like and another thing like
you would think that it would like you can see
why they why Christians have to invent like narratives of
oppression to talk about like how they are uniquely oppressed

(29:56):
despite like you know, ruling the world for the past
few hundred years. And it's because they have to be
like we, you know, because the Book of Revelation is
about how Christians are being oppressed and like the end times,
you know, and everything like that. And I'm sorry, but

(30:16):
for the most part, Christians have not been oppressed in
the quote unquote Western world since no, since Christianity became
the since Christianity became the religion of the Roman Empire
and the three hundreds, except when after the Reformation happened,

(30:40):
when it was visited, you know, first by the Catholics
onto the Protestants and then vice versa, and so on
and so on. But like now you're like you're all
the big dog of this weird melded pluralist thing and
you're still predicting this stuff, like you're like fucking John

(31:02):
licking toads and living in a cave on patents, Like
what the fuck are we doing here? And I mean,
like whether he was high or not, like he should
have been, but he should have been, but regardless, like
this is I mean, like this is not he when Paul,
when John wrote this, he was not saying all right,
so it's the year. I don't know, like I think

(31:23):
people say it's written in like sixty seven or something
sixty six, something like that. He was not saying okay
in one thy two hundred and seventy six years, like
in eight you know, and you know, or in two
thousand years on September twenty third, twenty twenty five, that's
when the Lord was coming back. He's like, the Lord's

(31:43):
coming back soon. And even if he's not, you need
to live like he's coming back soon. Like that's the thing.
You have to live like you're supposed to live like
he's coming back soon. That whole thieven the Night thing
is meant to be. Like you like, so get yourself right,
get yourself right, and you and you ignore that, and
I'm not and I mean, I'm not pointing out religious

(32:06):
hypocrisy is never convinced anyone of anything, but like it
does make people view you as less serious. Christians have
to understand that. Like you could be mad about it,
you could be like, oh, we have to be a
people apart or something like that, but like the way
that people view you is very very important. So when
you act like this, when.

Speaker 3 (32:30):
You reacting a lot of a pocket, Like how is
this going to bring people in? I guess? And so
I find it interesting, right because if I'm comparing and
contrasting this with my good friend young Milich Chromo, you
know who I wrote my PhD about, right, and my
man indulges in what we call antichrist prediction. So he

(32:51):
tries to do the thing of like getting a date
when Antichrist is going to come back. He very much
like spends a bunch of time looking at numbers in
the Danielne prophecies and like subtracting that from like, you know,
the day that he says the temple was destroyed in
Jerusalem and all kinds of weird shit.

Speaker 1 (33:12):
You know.

Speaker 3 (33:14):
But what he's attempted to do with this is not
anything that is perfectly like legible in the same way
that like the Book of Revelation is like he likes
to identify things with things. You know. He's like, oh,
the terrors and the harvest are Franciscans who have too
much money, and you know, here's this, here's that, Like

(33:36):
you can identify this with that.

Speaker 1 (33:39):
You know.

Speaker 3 (33:39):
The the loosening of the hordes of Gog and Magog
is because the emperor isn't in Rome, or it's the
Pope isn't in Rome. Sorry, you know, things like that.
And but one of the things that I find really
interesting that's quite different between him as like a really
avowed thinker about the apocalypse and someone who spends all

(34:02):
his time preaching about it and trying to identify certain
symbols with eschatological ideas, is he's trying to stop it.
So like he doesn't think, oh, it'll be awesome when
the world ends, even though he's this super holy person
who you know in theory, would I mean, he wouldn't

(34:24):
be raptured because they don't believe in that, but would
you know, come through the persecutions or you know, be
killed in the persecutions. That's also acceptable. You'll go to
have it any way, Like who care really? But he's like,
there are ways of stopping this, and we need to
we need to keep it from happening. We need to
somehow stop Antichrist from taking control. And I find it

(34:49):
so fucking interesting that these people who you know, like
I cannot stress enough, Like if you're in America, you've
got everything you want.

Speaker 1 (34:57):
If you're in a like, what what do you what
is oppressing you? What is it? Is it the culture
is that gay people exist? Like because that's I mean,
like that's the basic thing, Like what you're what you're yeah, yeah,
What is oppressing you is the fact that people are
just like, yeah, we were not going to live by

(35:17):
the exact strictures of like the exact words of what
people wrote two thousand or more years ago, Like we're
just not going to do that. And so you're like, like.

Speaker 3 (35:29):
That's It's like, basically you're oppressed because like your nephew
who went to college and like moved to a big
city thinks your politics are bad at Thanksgiving, that's your oppression.

Speaker 1 (35:41):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (35:42):
I calm down, and so you you want to be
raptured so that like you're above criticism. It just strikes
me so strange because you know, I don't even necessarily
have a problem with people being avowed Christians. I spend
all of my time thinking about people who are avowed Christians,
and I think they're neat. What I about a problem
with is when you're using that as an excuse to

(36:03):
destroy the world and make things worse. And it's interesting
as well, because like you know, when you see people
talk about the medieval period, which you do daily, right,
Like I was posting about other things on police sky
dot com today, like there's some fucking idiots had like
something where they're like, well, to understand why we should
be able to press trans people, what if women were

(36:26):
gold and it's the medieval period and you only use gold.
And then someone says, oh, they can make gold out
of iron pyrite because there and it's just like everybody
needs to shut the fuck up immediately, and so I
was like talking about I'm sorry, what like it's it's
long and drawn out philo.

Speaker 1 (36:43):
Was that the philosopher stuff?

Speaker 3 (36:46):
Yeah? Yeah, and they're so basically they're like oh yeah,
and then they try to pass off iron pyrate as
gold but it isn't gold. And it's like did you
just call women a like means of currency and trans
people worthless? Like interesting? But uh I was posting about
this and then someone was like and I was like, hey,
trans people existed in the medieval period, be no one,
like people didn't use gold, Like there's not enough gold

(37:09):
real shop, Like if you if you insisted on payments
in gold, which is basically what they're saying, then you
would simply starve because there's no fucking gold in Europe, right, like, so.

Speaker 1 (37:20):
Good luck with that.

Speaker 3 (37:21):
Gee, like you're not man, samusa.

Speaker 1 (37:23):
I don't know. I don't know what to tell you
ho me.

Speaker 3 (37:26):
But then like also someone in the comments was like, well,
not to mention that, since when did we look to
the medieval period for you know, cogent ideas? And I
was like, okay, yeah, But the point is medieval people
didn't think any of this. It's modern people putting it
into the words of medieval people. And then you go,
these medieval people are stupid. It's like, that's not how

(37:47):
we're Like, medieval people were chiller or about trans people
than you. They don't think about gold this way, Like
what like why are you mad at medieval people right now?
And I feel the same way when you see stuff
like this with the rapture, because people say, oh, look
at these Christians. Christians are fucking stupid because they do
stuff like say, oh, the rapture is coming and then

(38:07):
it doesn't happen. So therefore Christians in the past were
as stupid. It's always been the same, but worse. So
medieval people must be really really really really really stupid
and it's like, that's not how any of this shit works.
And then my boys end up catching strays right like yeah,
like no, leave them alone. They don't think this, Like

(38:29):
Jon Milich never thought he was going to send Bodily
into heaven. That's for Jesus and the Virgin Mary.

Speaker 1 (38:35):
Only and Elias and ch oh. Yeah, and then they
had to come back and die, that's it. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (38:42):
Yeah, like then their bodies go up after they die,
so they got to die first. Calm down, you know, damn, damn.
And I guess it's weird for me because it's like
I'm really interested in apocalyptic stuff, like you know, that's
my my number one stuff that I'm interested in it,
I guess. And we did the when Derek and I

(39:04):
did the majority of report the other week. You know,
they like clipped a video of me like talking about
apocalyptics beliefs, and some angry Christians were in the mentions
being like, she's stupid. She thinks that we all think
this is literally going to happen, but we don't think that.
I'm like, I never said that.

Speaker 1 (39:20):
Also, some of you clearly do think it's literally.

Speaker 3 (39:22):
And also a bunch of you do literally because.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
Because here's the thing, like they they these people do
try to do this, and I remember them doing this
like when I was in like middle school in high school.
Like it's like, oh, we don't believe all this stuff
and this stuff is going to happen. It's like, man,
if you are working out the numbers for this stuff
and you are like puzzling all of this out as
a as an exercise, you are If you're puzzling it

(39:54):
all out as an exercise, you cannot then turn around
and go oh, it's oh, like oh, but we believe
the seven trumpets thing means this, but we don't believe
the actual Horror Babylon is gonna be there. Well, then
why is the Horror Babylon there? If if the seven
trumpets mean something, then the Horror Babylon and uh A

(40:19):
Zazel and beels above and the Bridle Beast, the Bridle
Beast of beth cherizeb all have to mean something and
they don't. And you're saying they don't, but you are
saying that you divined that. It's like they you want
to walk a type rope that is impossible to walk,

(40:44):
and you want to be congratulated for that. You want
all of us to immediately agree with you, and it's
just like, what the fuck are we doing? Like that
that doesn't pass like a big problem that Christianity, but

(41:05):
like all organized religions have now is that all of
this stuff has been so denuded and it's been sapped of,
like all of all of its vigor as like a
living faith and something where that like people take solace
in like these are in a lot of ways, like
very large political apparatuses and and and and money making

(41:28):
ventures and cultural institutions and like that nothing is necessarily
wrong except for the money making part. That's definitely not
okay per the Bible. Yeah, but you know, but like
there's nothing in I guess totally and inherently wrong with it.
But at the same time, like you, you have to

(41:52):
find a lane, and you can't just be like, well,
some of it's real and some of it's fake, and uh,
the stuff I say that I use to like divine
this out as real. And so if you make fun
of us about X, then you know that's not true
because we didn't say that. But also if the Lord

(42:12):
doesn't come back, you can't make fun of me about
that either, because uh, you know, oopsie you know. That's
why pencils have erasers, and that's the that's the thing here.
And it's like, if you want to be taken, you
clearly believe this to some degree, or someone does, or
even if you just started it as a gimmick. People

(42:35):
who are down the line believe this, and so if
you seriously believe this, like you, you think it is
a serious thing worthy of like understanding. But then when
you want when people talk about it, you're like, uh,
this isn't a like no, you're you're applying logic to it.

Speaker 3 (42:53):
Well, like a yeah, yeah, that's a normal thing to do.

Speaker 1 (42:58):
What else? What else does anyone's supposed to do? Like
I just in my like I grew up in the
Church of Christ, which is a small like non denominational,
not like the megachurch. Like these are like small like
one hundred to two hundred people churches at most a
few like a few bigger ones, but like for the
most part, pretty damn small, and like we made fun

(43:21):
of people who believed in this shit, and we believed
in biblical literalism except for the Book of Revelation, because
the Book of Revelation is clearly like BATCHA it's the
it's it's clearly just symbols.

Speaker 2 (43:35):
Like it's clearly like like like a like.

Speaker 1 (43:39):
A puppet show, a symbol's puppet show. And it's cool
the imagery, and it's fucking amazing. And like if John
did that without like you know, without drink or you know,
without getting high or whatever, that's a I mean, that's
amazing and that speaks to an incredible like imagination and
and I idea of that. But like even we didn't

(44:02):
think that was real, and like we would make fun
of people who believe that, like, oh, yeah, Jesus is
gonna come back, and then there's gonna be some Romanian
guy because for some reason, it was always like a
Romanian or like a Serbian, it's going to be the Antichrist,
and it's like cool, why yeah. But then but then
one of I think one of the things that really

(44:22):
like started turning, like all this stuff in my head
was like as we got older and the enemy of
America changed from like nebulous Eastern European group because that
was the only people we had to fight in the
end of history of the nineties, and then all of
a sudden, the Antichrist became a Muslim because we decided

(44:46):
we had to go to war with Iraq and Afghanistan.
And it's like, oh, oh I see, like, oh I
get it now, Like you like this is like you
guys are just contouring this to the politics the country
that you live in, to the status quo.

Speaker 3 (45:02):
Yeah, exactly, And you know that's fine. It's a that
is a proud tradition. It's certainly something that we see
medieval people do all the time, you know, when they
want to call someone out, if they want to say
that a king has overstepped their bounds, if they want
to say that the clergy are not living up to
what they ought to be doing, the thing that they're
going to do is say, ah, see you are this guy.

Speaker 1 (45:27):
You know you are.

Speaker 3 (45:29):
This is the beast of the horror of Babylon, you know,
like the Holy Roman Empire is, you know, or the
you know, things of this nature, and you see it
happen all the time. But that's the thing and why
it is kind of clever to specifically say, okay, yeah,
well you can take the Bible literally, except the Book
of Revelation, because the Book of Revelation is so incredibly

(45:53):
clearly meant to be symbolic and we're too far away
to understand what the fuck it means.

Speaker 1 (45:59):
Right, Yeah, I understand that, but I am now imagining
a version of that written about the Holy Roman Empire.
And he's like, the beasts will have like two hundred
ish heads. Yeah, yeah, they have three hundred, and then
it'll be six, and then it'll be one, and it'll
be called Prussian. You're like, what the fuck is this
guy taught people in like the two hundreds are like,

(46:20):
the fuck is Prussia? What is going on? Like anyway?

Speaker 3 (46:23):
Yeah, exactly, yeah, And I mean even to the point where,
you know, one of the big baddies really in a
big way to interpret all of this is just like
the Romans. The Romans are bad. It's the Romans, Romans
and more. And then you know, we stop interpreting it
that way because everyone decides they like the Romans, right
you know, So yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:44):
Like, okay, I mean we've kind of talked about it,
but like the fact that like, like at least in
the Middle Ages, like they had to come to terms
with the fact that like the Roman, like you know,
Jesus was killed by the stated even if they thought,
even if they anti semitically thought the Jews did it.

(47:05):
He was still killed by the Roman state. They gave
the glad hand the thumbs up to it happening. But
they want to be Rome so bad. They think Rome
is great, like they yay Julius Caesar, yay Augustus, et cetera,
et cetera. And at least they had to reason with

(47:26):
that rationally. They had to figure out, like how how
that could work, and they came up with reasons for it,
some of them good, some of them stupid, but whatever,
And you don't have to do that now, like you
are the successor to the successor to the successor to
the spiritual successor of Rome, like you know, denuded ten

(47:47):
million times over first his tragedy, second as far as
third time. As like, I don't know whatever the fuck
this surreal healthscape we have now is, but like like
you don't, you don't uh reason with that at all anymore.
And I mean, I do think there is something to that,

(48:08):
Like you like, if you have to reason with this
and you take it very literally and you smell like
the hell of fire and brimstone, it's much easier to
be like, I'm not predicting the end of the world.
Are you fucking crazy? Why would I do that? Like
why that's God? That is God's domain, Like if anything
is God's domain, that is like that that humans have

(48:31):
no like you know, function in. And it's just like, yeah,
I don't know. I guess before we close out, I did.
I kind of wanted to contrast this now. I mean
you you you've you've taught on medieval apocalypticism and like
all that sort of stuff. So let's say that we

(48:52):
are to the extent that we can know this. Of course,
let's say we are everyday Christians in the Middle Ages
where you know, merchants, we have a little bit of money,
worried that we're going to go to hell, but you know,
try to be good people. What does the and but
we also are very scared that like Jesus is coming back,

(49:13):
you know soon, because we still feel that like what
are they thinking about like the Book of Revelation in
the end times? And is the church specifically talking about
like the end times like how that will occur? Are
they more like, yeah, Jesus is going to come back
and then we're all going to heaven, Like you know,

(49:34):
how were they perceiving and taking this stuff in I guess.

Speaker 3 (49:38):
So I guess that their thing is that, you know,
the church itself as an organization really was stressing the
you know, not the day or hour right right, right right,
and so that for them that was really really important. Now,
they weren't above saying that God was punishing the world
when bad things were happening, but like even when you know,
the Black Death is occurring, they are not saying this

(49:59):
is the end times, like the jig is up.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
Yeah, individually true that, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (50:05):
Individuals within the church might say that, you know, like
a priest here or there might intimate that, but the
papacy is not saying, yeah, this is it, guys. You know,
here's the here's the the you know, pestilence, horsemen. That's
not that's not what's happening. And usually what the church

(50:26):
as a body will attempt to do is say, yeah,
there's all this stuff like these are these are symbolic.
And you know, medieval people have a better idea about
symbolism than we do now because since they aren't literate
by and large, they spend a lot of time looking
at art. And because they spend a lot of time
looking at art, they can kind of understand a symbol

(50:47):
when they see it. So even when you see things like,
for example, the Apocalypse tapestry, like the fourteenth century Apocalypse Tapestry,
that like is just pretty literal, like here's all the
things you know, you're supposed to be reading that as
like HM, So for example, we tend to do just
some light interpretation of it in general, where you know,
there's two seven headed beasts, there's the dragon, and then

(51:11):
there's the Beast of the Abyss. And the dragon we
generally identify as Satan, and the Beast of the Abyss
we generally identify as Antichrist, and the dragon that is
Satan we tend to also then further identify with spiritual corruption,
and the Beast of the Abyss or Antichrist we tend

(51:32):
to identify with political corruption. And there's like a whole
thing where like Satan gets his ass beat Satan, the
dragon gets his ass beat by the archangel Michael, and
then he's like, all right, you're gonna have to take
it from here, chief and gets like the Beast of
the Abyss to do it, and then the Beast of
the Abyss like gets everyone to worship him and blah
blah blah, blah blah, here comes the horror of Babylon.

(51:54):
So there is all of an understanding even at that
point that you got to go, oh, okay, well this
means this. That means that. So even when you're seeing
a literal interpretation of it, you're supposed to understand that
you're what we're talking about here is spiritual corruption versus
political corruption. Now, in theory, the apocalypse does kind of

(52:16):
have a happy ending, which is one of the big
things that they're kind of like trying to get at.
It's like, you can't necessarily really do anything about the
apocalypse happening. Millage thinks maybe you can, but like, you
know whatever, But what you just need to be able
to do is like keep your powder dry, essentially, like
don't go around worshiping the seven headed Beast when it

(52:38):
shows up. Well whoever that might be right, And we
see a lot of identification with the seven headed beasts,
like usually varying kings who get too big for their
breeches and Peror Frederick the second you know, people like that,
that's who will get identified as the beast. And so
it's like, well, don't don't fall into the trap of
being swayed in the and keep trying to do charitable works,

(53:04):
and you know, understand that sometimes bad things happen to
good people, but in the end you'll get the reward
of you know, first the ten thousand year reign of
peace if you believe in that interpretation, or second, you know,
heaven after the Last Judgment, And so that is just
kind of an extended way of thinking about, for example,

(53:25):
the idea that you're going to go to heaven after
you die in the first place, Like, you know, they
don't think that they're going directly to heaven. They usually
think there's like a stop off. Yeah, maybe it's hell
for a while. Maybe you do go straight to heaven
if you're like really good, but you know, most people
are going to go to purgatory for a bit, things
of this nature. So you know, they they are looking
forward to the time after the apocalypse because what happens

(53:47):
after the last judgment is that everyone is sorted into
their final place. Yeah, you know, you're like either in
heaven or you're in Hell and then that's it forever. Yeah,
And I mean even you know, at the time, a
lot of people did interpret hell not necessarily as a
physical place. You know, you see all sorts of people
identify Hell as an absence of the presence of God. Yeah,

(54:11):
and the suffering that comes from that. So there you
have these incredibly nuanced views of things, and it's just
that they're like, yeah, this is an allegory, get it right,
and the video people are like, yeah, I do. And
it's cool because people in twenty twenty five are like, no, yeah,
actually for real, for real, just by the bye.

Speaker 1 (54:33):
I find I find it very funny that these people
were biblical literalists in the sense that they believe that
the Bible was literally true. Is the literal word of God,
you know, it presents an accurate and historical view of
things that took place in the past, you know, et cetera,

(54:55):
et cetera. Some of it, a lot of it's filled
with symbols, but like, these things did happen, and so
these people were a Biblical letterrialists. But they understood that
this book is just symbols. It is just symbols and
and and words on a page and you know, the

(55:18):
shadows on the cave wall or whatever you want to say.
Like they they understand that these things are symbols. But
they're like, are these groups of people who just they have.
And there there are some older ones that I looked
up while like kind of like doing a little researching
into this, and like, you know, some of them, like

(55:40):
they I mean, they used to believe the world was
not very old, basically that the world began like shortly
before the time of writing or something like that. A
lot of them did. But like they even they understood
that this is just like John's just tripping out or
he's just like, whoa, the was gonna come back? And

(56:01):
he's and instead of being like it's gonna be really scary,
he's like he's got this many heads and he's got
six swords and everything. He's like, whoa, John, that's cool
as ship. Where'd you come up with it? Hell? Yeah, bro,
all in my nogging, brother, all in my nog and yeah,
it's just you know again, it's it's it's so yeah,
go ahead.

Speaker 3 (56:19):
Yeah we said this on the Patreon the other week.
People long to make a little guy. Ye, people want
to make a little monster.

Speaker 1 (56:27):
And they long They long to see the end of
the world. People long to see the end of this planet.
Not that they necessarily want it to happen, but like,
don't you kind of want to see what happens at
the end, Like don't you just a little like even

(56:48):
even if it's the heat death of the universe and
you just time travel like you know, five billion years
in the future and the Sun eats the Earth as
it expands out because it's it's a die. It's like,
don't you kind of want to see that? So, like
I do think there is something to like keep all
of these things predicting the end of the world, like

(57:11):
you know, Ragnarok and and the Biblical years of Tribulation
or whatever, and like all of these other things that predict,
you know, like how eventually we're going to overcome the
suffering of the world or how we're going to overcome
Samsara or whatever, and you just keep making these predictions

(57:31):
and you keep looking stupid. Like you can forgive the
early people who like did this, especially like after like
the Reformation. Yeah, I'd be like, the world's fucking ending tomorrow, dude,
Like I don't know what to tell you, but like yeah,
but like now, like I mean, like you can you
can go and just pull up lists of famous incidents

(57:52):
of people saying the world is going to end, and
then of course we're all still here, and it's like,
how do you not that this makes your faith? How
do you not see that this makes your face look

(58:14):
so much worse and so much more embarrassing, to the
point that like why would you ever say it? Because
because people who hear this are going to laugh and
take anything Christians say less seriously because of stuff like this.
Now there are a million other things, but like this
shit ain't helping, Like I don't know, I don't know

(58:36):
what the hell they're doing, Like, yeah, I don't know.
It's don't predict the Oh my god, I don't think
I sent it to you. But like somebody posted this
TikTok of this woman being like what are y'all going
to do when your baby? What are all these parents
going to do when they have to leave their babies?

(58:57):
And I'm like, under what religious doctrine of Protestantism do
you get that babies aren't going to heaven? Because one
of the big things in Protestantism is that original sin
is dumb bullshit, which it is, but that's beside the point.

(59:20):
But like it's dumb bullshit, So like why would those
babies not go to have been with you? What kind
of what is it?

Speaker 2 (59:29):
Like?

Speaker 1 (59:30):
What mishmash of shit? Is this? You are? Is this
the Reformation with original sin? Is that what we're doing?
I mean, is this the end Times of Revelation plus
Catholic original Sin? Like? What are you Baptist? Catholic? What
are we doing? Yes?

Speaker 3 (59:48):
Are they the kind where it's like I'm adult Baptism
only I guess.

Speaker 1 (59:53):
I mean like they, well we were too in the
Church of Christ. But the thing was if you died
before you were mentally ready to go to be bad,
like before you were mentally if I'm able to understand it,
then you you go to heaven anyway? Like you it
was like a you know, it was like a get
out of jail free card, like until you're like, you know,

(01:00:14):
twelve or thirteen or how you know, however old you
you might be. And it's like even we didn't believe
that shit, Like and I'm just like, how can you
be weirder than the stupid ass Church of Christ? Like
what do you people fucking doing?

Speaker 3 (01:00:29):
I mean gotta say, absolutely a hilarious thing to like
And also why would you want to be a part
of a real like I mean, to me, I'm always
shocked when I see the people like that, because I'm like,
you would want to believe in a god that would
send your baby to hell? Like it's just strange.

Speaker 1 (01:00:46):
How would you ever believe in that?

Speaker 2 (01:00:48):
Like I if you, yeah, Like how could you believe
in a god like that would allow something like that
to happen.

Speaker 1 (01:01:00):
To like a little baby? Just because they didn't like
they weren't raised in like a Baptist church, Like what
the fuck is happening? What is going on? Like, and
I mean this is just more of the like, you know,
we're melding into the dune like orange Catholic Bible type

(01:01:20):
thing where it's all just kind of like Christian Catholicism
and Protestantism seem to be meeting back on the other end,
and they're just kind of like, well, I don't know,
might as well hug it out and lord it over
the rest of these people, Like I don't what are

(01:01:43):
what are you doing? I mean, I don't know why
I care? Like why that, Like I said it the
other day on Twitter, but like it was one of
those Ai Charlie Kirk things and it was like why
do I, as an atheist care more about like the

(01:02:04):
basic strictures of your religion than I do. Why is
it more offensive to me, a person who does not
believe in God that you would invite something this unholy
into your sanctum?

Speaker 2 (01:02:14):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:02:14):
Why does that bother me more than it should not
bother me more than it does you? You you worship
in a a in a strip mall. I don't even
think it's sanctified to begin with, but it's still offensive?
Like what ah?

Speaker 3 (01:02:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
Is this why everybody goes? I mean, like, you know,
people have always gone insane about the end times, that's
definitely nothing new, but uh, you know, like, uh, I
mean I guess that's why. Because people are just like, well,
what if I do this? What if I do this?
I wonder is this gonna happen? Oh no, I'm scared.
I'm scared. U God's gonna come back? Uh? And you

(01:02:49):
just keep reaching back and back for more stuff. I
guess I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
Yeah, I don't really know. Uh. Like my thing with
these people is that it almost doesn't matter. Like I
always kind of take them seriously, try to think about
what it is they're talking about, because I'm interested in
apocalyptic thought. And then I realized that none of it
fucking matters, and that they're just going to be like, oh,
well do doo doo after Yeah, they don't get raptured

(01:03:16):
and they'll be like, never mind, try again next Tuesday.
And it's just kind of like hmm, interesting, Like I'm
constantly putting more thought into this than they are. Yeah,
And I mean that's the thing is, like it must
be so fucking cool being stupid, dude.

Speaker 1 (01:03:34):
This must hit, This must hit so hard if you're
dumb as fuck, Like, yeah, I mean the most famous,
I think the most famous of these, at least in America,
is William Miller and the Millerites in UH. In the
years leading up to it, William Miller, who's a preacher,
predicted that Christ would return between March twenty first, eighteen

(01:03:57):
forty three and March twenty first, eighteen forty four, and
then revised it to October twenty second, eighteen forty four.
It didn't happen. This was became known as like the
Great Disappointment because people had like sold their goods, they'd
sold their lives in some cases their livelihoods, and yeah,

(01:04:19):
they they referred to it as the Great Disappointment. And
that's what Birth the Seventh Day after Adventist Church here
in America, and I mean the Jehovah's Witness were also
birthed out of a failure to predict the end of
the world by Charles tays Russell In he predicted nineteen fourteen,

(01:04:43):
nineteen eighteen, and then nineteen twenty five. And it's like,
I mean, at least with nineteen fourteen and nineteen eighteen,
there was like, you know, some some real big stuff
there that you could kind of point to, you know,
nineteen twenty five, little ify on that prediction. If you
back it up to like nineteen thirty nine, you'd be like,
well you yeah, yeah, oh oh, did you predict that

(01:05:04):
bad things were going to happen in nineteen thirty nine?
I don't think so. So oh the seven the seven
headed beast isn't a beast. Isn't a seven headed beast.
It's an Austrian painter. Oh, Like, where's your prediction? Huh yeah? Anyway, No,
I just.

Speaker 3 (01:05:22):
Yeah, you know, we're just gonna have to chalk it
up to the big old bulk of several failed you know, apocalypses. Well,
we'll add it to the timeline and someday it would
be cute to make a television show where you show
what happens if every one of them had been correcked.

Speaker 1 (01:05:42):
That would been funny. How how like the population of
the world progressively gets knocked down by like ten people
or something like that, because the only people who are
getting into heaven. Yeah, it's I mean realistically, like you know,
we are just bitching for Catharsis here and to laugh

(01:06:06):
at these people because they were wrong and it is
silly and you know are we had a bunch of
technology problems and it was easier to talk about this
than trying to record the whole episode we had planned.
But like, you know, in your day to day life,
please do not like worry that much about this stuff.
These people like are so quickxotic. They just you have

(01:06:29):
no like there's no predicting what they're going to say
or do or what they think or anything like that.
Like if you can like go all in on the
on the rapture happening today or tomorrow, and and then
like it doesn't happen, and you're like, oh, well, I
still believe in all this stuff? Like how how do

(01:06:51):
you still believe in all that stuff? After that prediction
didn't come true, like either you don't take it that
seriously or like, I don't know. Just see, it seems
to me that the edges of cognitive dissonance will be
strained by such a ridiculous thing. But what do I know?
I guess mm hmm. In the end, uh, you know,

(01:07:18):
human understanding is a vast and complex thing, and there's
no logical predicting, logically predicting anything that come when it
comes to religion. But I don't know. Most Christians throughout
history have understood that it's stupid to try and predict
when Jesus is coming back, because there are numerous Bible

(01:07:40):
verses that say not to and the concept of the thing.
But you know what you do, You keep on doing it,
and we will keep having stuff to laugh about and
wig out about on here, and then you know, go
back to thinking your Yeah, I guess anyway, I don't, uh.

(01:08:04):
Eleanor thoughts on thoughts and apocalypticism and the Middle Ages,
they they.

Speaker 3 (01:08:15):
Were concerned, they were concerned. And I guess that it
just goes to show you how much sorry about that.
Looking my mind, my mic just keeps cutting in it out.
I don't know what is happening today.

Speaker 1 (01:08:33):
I don't. Folks, if you get through all this, please
know that we have had numerous technical difficulties. If the
microphones sound weird or anything like that, do not.

Speaker 3 (01:08:42):
Because they keep turning off again.

Speaker 1 (01:08:45):
It's not happening.

Speaker 3 (01:08:46):
I'm sorry, I don't know what's happening.

Speaker 1 (01:08:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:08:49):
Like, basically, one of the major difference between medieval people
and modern people with this is that medieval people will
leave in this but proceed with an abundance of caution,
and they are doing the thing that medieval Christians do,
which is they are saying all of this stuff needs

(01:09:10):
to be interpreted. And that's one of the reasons why
you used to have to just like not everyone could
read the Bible, right because if some brain dead shithead
gets hold of the Bible and starts thinking that literally
a seven headed beast is going to crawl out of
the Abyss, that could cause problems. Right. So, instead, you're
supposed to have people who are trained and know how

(01:09:32):
to interpret the Bible helping you out and mediating with
that and helping you understand that the Bible isn't exactly
just like a book that you can read and one
hundred percent understand word for word. And this is the
great sin that Martin Luther has on his head is
because he didn't really think anyone other than rich guys

(01:09:53):
were people. So he didn't consider that eventually someday everybody
would be reading, right, and that you know, everyday ordinary
people might have something to say about religion, and it
wouldn't accord with what he thought. He's like, surely everyone
who can read will still go to university.

Speaker 1 (01:10:16):
Yeah, it happened in his lifetime before, before before the
movement had even coalesced around a single individual or anything.
It happened in his lifetime because the German peasants were like, Haha, finally, fuckers,
all that stuff about how we're gonna be freed from
slavery's coming true. And he's like, wait, what no.

Speaker 3 (01:10:36):
I mean you get back to fucking work, Thank you
very much.

Speaker 1 (01:10:41):
Right, And so we've got that. We've got two We've
got two inescapable truths. One is that uh, people can't
be trusted with religion on their own, and two is
that the modern world would abhor ah a religious vacuum

(01:11:05):
like the one created where you only have priests as
the intercessors to reality. So I'm sorry to to to
Godliness and to the spiritual world. So yeah, I guess
we've just got to figure out how to make those
two completely implacable and uh uh incompatible processes work.

Speaker 3 (01:11:31):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:11:31):
It's not like that's been the that's not it's not
like that's what we've been doing for the past two
thousand years. It's just trying to trying to brute force this,
like we're gonna make it work. It's gonna happen in
reality is like no, I don't know what to tell you,
but it ain't happening today. Dog. It's like, no, no,
it's going to like, look, we're gonna have this church

(01:11:52):
and everybody's going to adhere to it, and then some
guys like, but I don't think that's what the Bible says.
I'm going to live on the forest stage and like
the fuck you are, and then you back. You gotta heresy. Oh,
and then we gotta fight the other religions. But then
we gotta come home. We gotta fighter on It's it's

(01:12:13):
you can't. They cannot exist. So we have to figure
out how to square the numerous feelings that humans have
with the fact that heavy even even having a hierarchy
back in the ancient period in the Middle Ages didn't
stop people from doing this. Are we going to do

(01:12:34):
it now? How? How? How could it ever happened? Folks?
I don't know, but uh, at least we get to
talk about it. It's fun. Yeah, I think that is
about going to do it for us today is a
little bit disjoining, it, a little bit off the cuff,
but sometimes that's what's going to happen. Just think about
it as a Catharsis too to laugh at these people

(01:12:56):
for being wrong and if they are right. Uh. And
you listen to this on September twenty fourth when it
comes out and people were raptured, Well, then I guess
we're all still in hell together. Oh well, epsey, folks, folks,
thank you very much for listening. We will be back
later this week with our eighth episode in our book

(01:13:19):
club series on Giovanni Biccaccio's The de Cameron For patrons,
check that out. It'll be out on Friday. If you
want to listen to that and hear us talk about
it five bucks a month. Patreon dot com, slash w nstpod.
We just released an episode on Dragons Why we like
them and why we think they're cool. And yeah, you

(01:13:40):
can check that out on the Patreon as well. And yeah, Eleanor,
what's going on with you?

Speaker 3 (01:13:47):
Once again, I am in the situation of doing a
bunch of things that aren't quite out yet. I mean,
I suppose if you want to spend some money about
it and hear more about me talking about apocalypticism, can
check out the show The Medieval Apocalypse I did for
History hit. It's pretty cool I saw on art Uh,
so you can go back and check that out. Otherwise,

(01:14:08):
I'm on the socials at Going Medieval or on Instagram
at doctor Eleanor Yataga. Got a bunch of guests on
other podcasts coming up. I'll let you know closer to
the time. But yeah, otherwise, I've just been having migraines
and vibin.

Speaker 1 (01:14:26):
I'm sorry to hear that. Uh, Folks, you can find me,
luc is amazing. I haven't been having migraines trying to
vibe though. You can find me, you know, on the
various social media websites that exist, and you can find
my old showy sister of the Old Republic. If you
can hear me yam Or on about Star Wars. But anyway,

(01:14:49):
thank you very much for listening and we will see
you next time.

Speaker 3 (01:14:53):
Bye, a fucking night.