Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Trying to do things like protect girls' sports and other
things with my friend Rich Gugenheim. Well, he's got an
update because he went to the Capitol to testify about
a bill, and Willie left a little dissatisfied with the
actions of some lawmakers. But it's not do you think
good afternoon, Rich Guggenheim.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Hey, Mandy, how are you so?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'm doing great? I want to talk first of all,
what you were testifying about, because actually, let me back
that up to the station for just one second. Yesterday
at the White House, the President signed an executive order
protecting girls sports. This is huge, I mean it's really huge.
Now it is an executive order, so if another president
(00:40):
gets into office, then that will go away if they're
from a different party. That being said, that issue for
right now, for this moment, seems to be somewhat settled
for like five minutes. So what were you ish? We'll
say ish, We'll put that to the side, just for
right now.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I'll tell you this, Yeah, I actually am going to
run the girls Sports ballot initiative in Colorado again because
ultimately this could get challenged by courts, yep, and it
is a states rights issue, and we know Colorado's legislature
cannot be counted on to protect women.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Correct Watch, that's not what you were testifying about, piastre Right.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
I was there to testify on a bill that would
have made it so that any person who was harmed
by gender affirming care could then file acclaim against their
medical practitioner. And medical practitioners carry insurance that protect them
in the event that they are sued for malpractice, and
(01:39):
in the state of Colorado, those insurers are not allowed
to take any kind of action against a doctor who
causes harm related to gender affirming care. All other kinds
of medical interventions are covered, but not gender affirming care.
So this bill would have made it so that being
insurance that covers a doctor could say, you know what,
You've been sued times because of problems that you've done
(02:02):
to your patients under the guys that have doneer firming care,
and now we're going to raise your rates or we're
going to cancel your policy. So that's that's all this
bill would do.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
So it is designed essentially to give people who maybe
were convinced by the medical establishment that they were in
the wrong body and then took or accepted permanent medical
changes to their bodies. So it would allow it would
allow them. I'm confused, Rich, it would allow them they
(02:32):
can already sue or they can't sue.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Well, that's there's two different issues tied up in that
they can not in Colorado. But the problem isn't necessarily
this wasn't about the patients that are harmed. This is
about the insurers that are covering the doctors. And so
this just allows those insurance companies to say, Okay, you've
been sued. We've paid out hundreds of thousands of dollars,
(02:57):
millions of dollars. So in the case of like Chloe
call suing Kaiser Permanente, this would allow the insurance company
that protects Kaiser Permanente and pay them out, so that
insurance company could take higher You've got sued for millions
of dollars, and now is the result, We're going to
raise your rates or now we're going to at you.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
You know what's interesting this really is about. This is
about deregulation essentially and saying to the insurance companies, yeah,
you can do what you want to do. That's in
the best interest of your industry and your business.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
It's interesting because most situations that doctors or hospitals are
sued over are about negligence or malpractice, right, I mean,
they're about a hospital mistake or a doctor's mistake that
leads to death or injury. That's what a vast majority
of these suits are about. This sort of gender affirming
care for some people is from the outset damaging. I mean,
(03:50):
is this an attempt to hold doctors accountable for these
choices or is it an attempt to encourage insurance company
is to just not cover this sort of lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
I think it's both. My personal opinion as someone who
will help bring this bill to life, it's both. But
you know, the thing is from the very onset. Let's
be honest, A skin grass could fail, vaginal plast these
my factomies. Those things all come with risk, septic infection,
(04:24):
stuff like that. And so this just makes sure that
in my testimony I said this I'm sure is that
transgender people are receiving the highest quality of care and
that there are repercussions for doctors who don't provide that.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
I will say I read a stat not that long
ago that said thirty percent of people who undergo significant
and we're talking about we'll call it botom surgery for
lack of a better way to make it easy to understand,
thirty percent of them live in constant pain from the surgery.
That is insane to me. What other surgery would we
(05:01):
allow to continue? We're a third of the people who
received the surgery live in constant pain because of the surgery.
I found that appalling and shocking.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
It is well and you know, even w Pass, one
of the top medical practitioners on w Path, came out
this last week and said that the number of d
transitioners are roughly thirty percent and they deserve the same
kind of compassion and care that we provide to our
people who are transitioning. And this person, I will say,
(05:33):
I absolutely agree with that. But they've been lying and
telling us it's less than one percent, and now they're
finally coming clean and saying it's as high as thirty percent.
What and this is what? Yeah, this is the w
Path people finally coming clean and things as high as
thirty percent. So why aren't we protecting those people?
Speaker 1 (05:53):
Golly, that is a staggeringly high number. I mean exactly, yeah,
Holy mac oh it to protect them? See and Rich
we've talked about this before, and we both feel the
exact same way. If I'm wrong, you can correct me.
But if you're an adult, you can do whatever you want.
You can as long as you make informed decisions right
like you should be informed of all the negative downsides
(06:15):
and that thirty percent of people regret this or whatever
it is. But it's for children that is where it
feels especially egregious, especially knowing what you just said. I'm
guessing that the you know, children making these decisions, they're
the ones I just I don't know. It's all this is.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
This is terrible, rich it is And I'll tell you
what the biggest complaint that I had, We had panels
of experts and Mandy yesterday was a monumental change in
what has been going on in the country. Yesterday on
the testimony on this bill was the first time that
a lot of us who have been in this fight
(06:54):
all across the country can actually say we ever remember
seeing more people on our side who opposed under ideology
testifying on a bill then trans rights activists. We outnumbered
the trans rights activists yesterday.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
So what happened? Because I know that you expected the
Democrats to not be particularly engaged or responsive but what
happened with the Republicans on the committee, Well, let me let.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
Me address the Democrats first. They did. They went in
and they said you were respect pronouns. So right out
of the gate, they were compelling our speech again like
they did last time. But we expected that type of homophobia,
we expected that anti constitutional First Amendment stuff from the Democrats.
But the Republicans I wrote fact sheets on this. I
(07:44):
gave them a whole packet of questions to ask people
that we're going to be testifying, both pro trans rights,
a transitioner, a youth transitioner, an LGB person, an attorney,
a lawyer, and so they had a whole bunch of
questions that they could ask. And the four Republicans that
were sitting on that committee literally had Aaron Lee, Jamie Reid,
(08:06):
the whistleblower from George Washington University, myself, Travis Morrell, a
doctor with dunal harm medicine, and a whole bunch of
other d transitioners and LGB people, and they didn't bother
to ask us a single question.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
I think, and I don't know what Republicans were on
this committee, but I think that there would be a
lot of Republicans who would be happy to not have
to deal with this subject anymore. And yesterday when Donald
Trump had that executive order signing at the White House,
I think they thought, Okay, I don't have to deal
with this. I really believe that that was the attitude
that is happening. But to your point that you made earlier,
(08:45):
if we don't quantify this stuff into Colorado law, it
could change on a heartbeat because of an executive order.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Right. And at the end of the day, I said,
I just have to ask, you know, if these are
the Republicans and they aren't going to step up to
fight to protect children, then why are we wasting our
time in Colorado?
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Yep?
Speaker 2 (09:04):
These people were elected to represent us and they aren't
even doing that. They're putting in the bare minimum. And
these are the Republicans in solid safe red districts doing
the bare minimum in these committee hearings. And it's embarrassing
and it's offensive.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
What happened with the bill in the committee it.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Right along party lines.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, honestly, Rich maybe that's why they
were disengaged, because they knew that it was going to
die on party lines and they didn't want to put
their necks out when they feel like Donald Trump has
done something, you know, and I'm.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
Not going to think excuse Yeah, Well Donald Trump has
opened the door. He's holding it open for us to
walk through. And it's up to the States to walk
through the door that he's holding open. And Colorado is
falling flat on a face right now. Well, you're asking Republicans,
you're doing it.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
You were asking for courage from a group of people
that are not particularly known for showing courage in these situations.
So what's next, rich You're going to start? When are
we launching the You Save Women's Sports Initiative here in Colorado?
Speaker 2 (10:03):
That starts on February nineteenth, here in Terry Creek. We'll
be putting it on I'm on the Protect Kids Colorado website.
You can sign up and come. We're going to have
the funder either. That's going to be a lot of fun.
We're going to have some fun people there. Don't want
to give any means away, but show up and support it.
You know. I'll tell you it costs a lot of
(10:24):
money to do this. Just printing costs alone after the
petitions is going to run right around ten thousand dollars
so hotly mad questions. Yeah, so it's expensive. So and
I actually people to show up.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Yeah, I actually think that Trump signing that executive order
is going to make it tougher for you guys because
people are going to be like, oh, that box has
been checked. So we got to make sure the messaging
gets out that that is an executive order and it's
our responsibility to protect girls in our state. Correct.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
And I think that's going to be important. But people
that can show up, sign up, protect kids Colorado. We're
on all the social teams. They'll follow us against groomers
or myself fifty two eighty based homo. We're going to
be blessed. I love I know.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Every time I see your handle on Twitter, I laugh.
I'm not gonna lie. I think it's hilarious.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
But we're going to be working hard on this. And
if you're able to come to our fundraisers, or if
you're able to support us as a volunteer, or if
you're looking for people to you can host an event
your community and have us come speak, please let us know.
We are going to need all hands even for this,
because I can tell you last year, this last time
(11:33):
we did it. Organizations like one. Colorado raised quarter million
dollars to defeat it.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
Wow. Wow, all right, Rach. We'll get you on right
before that so we can remind people and they can
come out and support it.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
All right, Thank you, Mandy, No problem.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
That's Rich Gugenheim, gaze against groomers, protect kids, Colorado, all
kinds of good stuff. He is looking out for your
kids even if other people are not. All right, Rach,
I'll talk to you se my friend.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
Thanks, Mamie.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
All right, you know that is I think it is
going to make it harder because of Trump's executive order.
But that executive order is it's only good for four years.
I do think that the tide is shifting when it
comes to people feeling comfortable saying you know what. I
(12:18):
support the right of people to do what they want,
but I don't support the right of boys to compete
in girl sports. I think that you can hold those two.
Even if you believe that children should be able to transition,
which I think is horribly wrong. You can still believe
that children should be able to transition while also believing
that boys who went through male puberty should not be
(12:40):
allowed to compete in girls sports. I mean, it's just
a fundamental issue of fairness right and I don't know,
we got a lot of stuff going on. It's just
crazy right now. It's absolutely crazy.
Trying to do things like protect girls' sports and other
things with my friend Rich Gugenheim. Well, he's got an
update because he went to the Capitol to testify about
a bill, and Willie left a little dissatisfied with the
actions of some lawmakers. But it's not do you think
good afternoon, Rich Guggenheim.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Hey, Mandy, how are you so?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'm doing great? I want to talk first of all,
what you were testifying about, because actually, let me back
that up to the station for just one second. Yesterday
at the White House, the President signed an executive order
protecting girls sports. This is huge, I mean it's really huge.
Now it is an executive order, so if another president
(00:40):
gets into office, then that will go away if they're
from a different party. That being said, that issue for
right now, for this moment, seems to be somewhat settled
for like five minutes. So what were you ish? We'll
say ish, We'll put that to the side, just for
right now.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I'll tell you this, Yeah, I actually am going to
run the girls Sports ballot initiative in Colorado again because
ultimately this could get challenged by courts, yep, and it
is a states rights issue, and we know Colorado's legislature
cannot be counted on to protect women.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Correct Watch, that's not what you were testifying about, piastre Right.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
I was there to testify on a bill that would
have made it so that any person who was harmed
by gender affirming care could then file acclaim against their
medical practitioner. And medical practitioners carry insurance that protect them
in the event that they are sued for malpractice, and
(01:39):
in the state of Colorado, those insurers are not allowed
to take any kind of action against a doctor who
causes harm related to gender affirming care. All other kinds
of medical interventions are covered, but not gender affirming care.
So this bill would have made it so that being
insurance that covers a doctor could say, you know what,
You've been sued times because of problems that you've done
(02:02):
to your patients under the guys that have doneer firming care,
and now we're going to raise your rates or we're
going to cancel your policy. So that's that's all this
bill would do.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
So it is designed essentially to give people who maybe
were convinced by the medical establishment that they were in
the wrong body and then took or accepted permanent medical
changes to their bodies. So it would allow it would
allow them. I'm confused, Rich, it would allow them they
(02:32):
can already sue or they can't sue.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Well, that's there's two different issues tied up in that
they can not in Colorado. But the problem isn't necessarily
this wasn't about the patients that are harmed. This is
about the insurers that are covering the doctors. And so
this just allows those insurance companies to say, Okay, you've
been sued. We've paid out hundreds of thousands of dollars,
(02:57):
millions of dollars. So in the case of like Chloe
call suing Kaiser Permanente, this would allow the insurance company
that protects Kaiser Permanente and pay them out, so that
insurance company could take higher You've got sued for millions
of dollars, and now is the result, We're going to
raise your rates or now we're going to at you.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
You know what's interesting this really is about. This is
about deregulation essentially and saying to the insurance companies, yeah,
you can do what you want to do. That's in
the best interest of your industry and your business.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
It's interesting because most situations that doctors or hospitals are
sued over are about negligence or malpractice, right, I mean,
they're about a hospital mistake or a doctor's mistake that
leads to death or injury. That's what a vast majority
of these suits are about. This sort of gender affirming
care for some people is from the outset damaging. I mean,
(03:50):
is this an attempt to hold doctors accountable for these
choices or is it an attempt to encourage insurance company
is to just not cover this sort of lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
I think it's both. My personal opinion as someone who
will help bring this bill to life, it's both. But
you know, the thing is from the very onset. Let's
be honest, A skin grass could fail, vaginal plast these
my factomies. Those things all come with risk, septic infection,
(04:24):
stuff like that. And so this just makes sure that
in my testimony I said this I'm sure is that
transgender people are receiving the highest quality of care and
that there are repercussions for doctors who don't provide that.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
I will say I read a stat not that long
ago that said thirty percent of people who undergo significant
and we're talking about we'll call it botom surgery for
lack of a better way to make it easy to understand,
thirty percent of them live in constant pain from the surgery.
That is insane to me. What other surgery would we
(05:01):
allow to continue? We're a third of the people who
received the surgery live in constant pain because of the surgery.
I found that appalling and shocking.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
It is well and you know, even w Pass, one
of the top medical practitioners on w Path, came out
this last week and said that the number of d
transitioners are roughly thirty percent and they deserve the same
kind of compassion and care that we provide to our
people who are transitioning. And this person, I will say,
(05:33):
I absolutely agree with that. But they've been lying and
telling us it's less than one percent, and now they're
finally coming clean and saying it's as high as thirty percent.
What and this is what? Yeah, this is the w
Path people finally coming clean and things as high as
thirty percent. So why aren't we protecting those people?
Speaker 1 (05:53):
Golly, that is a staggeringly high number. I mean exactly, yeah,
Holy mac oh it to protect them? See and Rich
we've talked about this before, and we both feel the
exact same way. If I'm wrong, you can correct me.
But if you're an adult, you can do whatever you want.
You can as long as you make informed decisions right
like you should be informed of all the negative downsides
(06:15):
and that thirty percent of people regret this or whatever
it is. But it's for children that is where it
feels especially egregious, especially knowing what you just said. I'm
guessing that the you know, children making these decisions, they're
the ones I just I don't know. It's all this is.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
This is terrible, rich it is And I'll tell you
what the biggest complaint that I had, We had panels
of experts and Mandy yesterday was a monumental change in
what has been going on in the country. Yesterday on
the testimony on this bill was the first time that
a lot of us who have been in this fight
(06:54):
all across the country can actually say we ever remember
seeing more people on our side who opposed under ideology
testifying on a bill then trans rights activists. We outnumbered
the trans rights activists yesterday.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
So what happened? Because I know that you expected the
Democrats to not be particularly engaged or responsive but what
happened with the Republicans on the committee, Well, let me let.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
Me address the Democrats first. They did. They went in
and they said you were respect pronouns. So right out
of the gate, they were compelling our speech again like
they did last time. But we expected that type of homophobia,
we expected that anti constitutional First Amendment stuff from the Democrats.
But the Republicans I wrote fact sheets on this. I
(07:44):
gave them a whole packet of questions to ask people
that we're going to be testifying, both pro trans rights,
a transitioner, a youth transitioner, an LGB person, an attorney,
a lawyer, and so they had a whole bunch of
questions that they could ask. And the four Republicans that
were sitting on that committee literally had Aaron Lee, Jamie Reid,
(08:06):
the whistleblower from George Washington University, myself, Travis Morrell, a
doctor with dunal harm medicine, and a whole bunch of
other d transitioners and LGB people, and they didn't bother
to ask us a single question.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
I think, and I don't know what Republicans were on
this committee, but I think that there would be a
lot of Republicans who would be happy to not have
to deal with this subject anymore. And yesterday when Donald
Trump had that executive order signing at the White House,
I think they thought, Okay, I don't have to deal
with this. I really believe that that was the attitude
that is happening. But to your point that you made earlier,
(08:45):
if we don't quantify this stuff into Colorado law, it
could change on a heartbeat because of an executive order.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Right. And at the end of the day, I said,
I just have to ask, you know, if these are
the Republicans and they aren't going to step up to
fight to protect children, then why are we wasting our
time in Colorado?
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Yep?
Speaker 2 (09:04):
These people were elected to represent us and they aren't
even doing that. They're putting in the bare minimum. And
these are the Republicans in solid safe red districts doing
the bare minimum in these committee hearings. And it's embarrassing
and it's offensive.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
What happened with the bill in the committee it.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Right along party lines.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, honestly, Rich maybe that's why they
were disengaged, because they knew that it was going to
die on party lines and they didn't want to put
their necks out when they feel like Donald Trump has
done something, you know, and I'm.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
Not going to think excuse Yeah, Well Donald Trump has
opened the door. He's holding it open for us to
walk through. And it's up to the States to walk
through the door that he's holding open. And Colorado is
falling flat on a face right now. Well, you're asking Republicans,
you're doing it.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
You were asking for courage from a group of people
that are not particularly known for showing courage in these situations.
So what's next, rich You're going to start? When are
we launching the You Save Women's Sports Initiative here in Colorado?
Speaker 2 (10:03):
That starts on February nineteenth, here in Terry Creek. We'll
be putting it on I'm on the Protect Kids Colorado website.
You can sign up and come. We're going to have
the funder either. That's going to be a lot of fun.
We're going to have some fun people there. Don't want
to give any means away, but show up and support it.
You know. I'll tell you it costs a lot of
(10:24):
money to do this. Just printing costs alone after the
petitions is going to run right around ten thousand dollars
so hotly mad questions. Yeah, so it's expensive. So and
I actually people to show up.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Yeah, I actually think that Trump signing that executive order
is going to make it tougher for you guys because
people are going to be like, oh, that box has
been checked. So we got to make sure the messaging
gets out that that is an executive order and it's
our responsibility to protect girls in our state. Correct.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
And I think that's going to be important. But people
that can show up, sign up, protect kids Colorado. We're
on all the social teams. They'll follow us against groomers
or myself fifty two eighty based homo. We're going to
be blessed. I love I know.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Every time I see your handle on Twitter, I laugh.
I'm not gonna lie. I think it's hilarious.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
But we're going to be working hard on this. And
if you're able to come to our fundraisers, or if
you're able to support us as a volunteer, or if
you're looking for people to you can host an event
your community and have us come speak, please let us know.
We are going to need all hands even for this,
because I can tell you last year, this last time
(11:33):
we did it. Organizations like one. Colorado raised quarter million
dollars to defeat it.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
Wow. Wow, all right, Rach. We'll get you on right
before that so we can remind people and they can
come out and support it.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
All right, Thank you, Mandy, No problem.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
That's Rich Gugenheim, gaze against groomers, protect kids, Colorado, all
kinds of good stuff. He is looking out for your
kids even if other people are not. All right, Rach,
I'll talk to you se my friend.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
Thanks, Mamie.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
All right, you know that is I think it is
going to make it harder because of Trump's executive order.
But that executive order is it's only good for four years.
I do think that the tide is shifting when it
comes to people feeling comfortable saying you know what. I
(12:18):
support the right of people to do what they want,
but I don't support the right of boys to compete
in girl sports. I think that you can hold those two.
Even if you believe that children should be able to transition,
which I think is horribly wrong. You can still believe
that children should be able to transition while also believing
that boys who went through male puberty should not be
(12:40):
allowed to compete in girls sports. I mean, it's just
a fundamental issue of fairness right and I don't know,
we got a lot of stuff going on. It's just
crazy right now. It's absolutely crazy.
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