05-02-24 FULL SHOW - The Show Starts Right After Baseball

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Abbreviated edition of the show. Butnonetheless I am your host for the next
one and a half hours Mandy Connell, joined of course by my right hand
man, Anthony Rodriguez. We callhim a Rod, and we will get
you through the next hour and ahalf and you won't even know about our
technical difficulties that a Rod is championingthrough right now. He's actually right now

(00:21):
on a treadmill keeping the entire stationon the air. I cry, I
try, it's a lot. Okay, we're good. I'll take you going.
Okay, we're good. Let's talkabout the blog, because even though
we had a short show and Ihave a great guest coming up in an
hour that I'm super excited about,I of course prepared a blog for you.
But he did try to back offa little bit on the relentless coverage

(00:44):
of these protests because I realized yesterdayit was kind of like all in.
Although if you checked the blog earliertoday, there was a late audition and
what I believe to be my favoritevideo of twenty twenty four as of May
twenty twenty four, is on today'sblog. Let me tell you what else

(01:04):
is on today's blog, and thenyou too. Can go to mandy'sblog dot
com. Look for the headline thatsays five to twenty four blog the show
starts right after baseball. Click onthat, and here are the headlines you
will find within. I think you'remuch in office? Half of American allerships
and clipmas a that's ConA press plant? Did I on the blog? Doris

(01:26):
Kerns Goodwin is making history? Democratsstealing tax refunds again? Thank goodness,
we have clearer demands from idiot protesters. How bad are the Rockies? This
Aurora dentist murder story just got evenstupider. Aaron offering scholarships to students kicked
out for protesting. Congress has hadenough of MGT? Did we pass peak?

(01:49):
Dementia? Cardio fitness? Dave's offdeath, where's our Invisible President?
Watch out for pickpockets? And theseEuropean destinations? Want to be a super
human athlete? And that pimple couldbe cancer? And now fart talk?
Scrolling, how couple photos work?Scrolling late edition and you're welcome. Those

(02:10):
are the headlines on the abbreviated blogat mandy'sblog dot com. And I am
going to direct your attention directly downto the video at the very bottom of
the blog. I don't know wherethis was taken. I don't know who
these people are. But yesterday Iburst out laughing when I saw the list
of food demands from those at UCLAthat included, in giant letters, no

(02:36):
bagels and no bananas and no peanutsbecause apparently they forgot their EpiPens and their
inhalers. That made me laugh yesterday, and I've decided I'm gonna start calling
bagels Satan's donuts. Yeah, Satan'sdonuts are really overrated. Oh see,
here's the thing, useless carbs.No offense to any bagel you're in the

(03:00):
Denver metro area. Oh come on, all the wait no, no offense
meant, but none of them remotelycome close to the bagels you get in
New York City that are perfectly crispyon the outside chewy on the inside.
I love Bagel Deli and that's whereI go to get my bagels because their
bagels are delicious. But a rodis right eating a bagels like the equivalent
of eating six slices of bread.And you're almost right. All bagels are

(03:22):
terrible. Not just no, no, no, no, there are delicious
bagels. No especially get a goodshmer on there. No, oh,
it's delicious, all terrible useless carbsdelicious. Anyway, So in this video
that I want to direct your attentionto at the bottom of the blog,
and you have to go watch it, let me just narrate what's happening,
as I don't need my computer audio. I just just let me see,

(03:42):
Okay, right now, at thevery beginning, you see a bunch of
people. They're all wearing like bicyclehelmets and skater helmets, and they all,
upon first blush, appear to becarrying some kind of shields, large
rectangular shields with a slight curve tothem. But then you realize as they're
running towards you, and it's obviousthey don't run much, this group,

(04:03):
but they're running towards you, gallopinglike a deer on ice. I mean
really all knees and elbows, alot of inefficient activity going on, and
they've got their shields and they're runningup. And then you realize that they
have cut gray garbage cans into piecesto craft makeshift or a shields out of

(04:24):
said garbage cans. And then yousee them as they continue to run,
and you can tell that half ofthem are already winded and out of breath
and want to just stop running becauseit's making them so tired. And then
they come in direct contact with apolice officer who merely puts his hands up,
and when the protester runs into thecop, it's like the cop is

(04:44):
the immovable force and the protester justgoes dink and bounces off of him.
And I I am some days whenI'm sad, when I'm feeling blue,
I'm just gonna find this video andI'm going to watch it. This is
what and my tweet about it waswhen LARPing meets real life. And if

(05:05):
you don't know what LARPing is,LARPing is live action role playing. And
if you've ever been in a parkand you see a bunch of mostly dudes.
There are some women who larp,but mostly dudes sword fighting and whatnot,
that's LARPing. A lot of thetime. They may have costumes on,
they may just be practicing. Andas someone who enjoys good fake sword

(05:25):
play, and that's not some inyou, I know I'm talking about.
I actually enjoy fighting with swords becausewe did that a lot as at theater
school. So I love that kindof stuff, But I'm not dumb enough
to believe that I can take onthe cops with my wooden sword and accomplish
anything, like I'm the King Arthurof the protest movement. But yet these

(05:49):
young skulls full of mush really thoughtthis was gonna be a good idea,
And it begs the question what werethey going to do next? And this
is one of the questions I haveabout the January sixth protesters, like what
was the original endgame plan that obviouslydidn't come to fruition? Like what were
you going to do other than snapyour photo with your feet up on Nancy

(06:11):
Pelosi's desk, you know? Waswhat did you really think was going to
happen? And yet same thing here, what did you think when you ran
towards the cops with your garbage canshield? What did you think was going to
happen? I mean, I'd loveto know you guys, if you're having
a bad day, if you're sad, like maybe you got bad news,

(06:32):
maybe you got a mole that's concerningyou that you need to have checked out.
Whatever your situation is, all youhave to do to make yourself feel
better is just go to my blogand watch this video because it is truly
a thing of beauty, just anabsolute thing of beauty. Now coming up
in about fifty minutes from now,we're going to talk to Doris Kerns Goodwin.

(06:57):
And if you don't know who DorisKerns Goodwin is, she has written
some of the most outstanding biographies offamous Americans. She's written one about Abraham
Lincoln. She's written about Teddy Roosevelt, Lyndon Johnson, William Taft. She's
written really good and more important,readable histories that if you want just even
you know, a really well roundedviewpoint of these people. Her books are

(07:20):
really really great because not only arethey informative, but they're also, as
I said, very readable. Shehas a new book out and this one's
a little bit different, and I'minterested to talk to her about this because
her late husband was also a Washingtonpolitico and sort of a self appointed historian
as well, and at the endof his life they started going through three

(07:44):
hundred boxes of notes from the sixties. When they met, she was working
for the Lyndon Baines Johnson administration.He was working for someone else, or
maybe he was working for the Johnsonadministration too. I don't know exactly,
but this particular book is as mucha biography of her as it is the
timeframe that she and her husband wereintimately connected in DC in the White House.

(08:07):
So we're going to talk to herat two thirty. She has a
book signing tonight at Tattered Cover,but it is sold out, so that
is disappointing. But I'm excited totalk to her about this as well.
But in the meantime, we havelots and lots of stuff to talk about.
Thank goodness, I'm going to getthe protester stuff out of the way
in the next segment, and thenin the next hour we're going to talk
about a whole bunch of stuff.But thank thankfully, thankfully, the geniuses

(08:31):
at the Araria campus have clarified theirdemands. So now we have clear demands,
and I'm going to tell the administrationand leadership what they need to do
in response, knowing they won't doit because they have no backbone. I'll
do that right after this talking aboutthe protesters, but it is honestly the

(08:52):
biggest story in the country right now. And again, if you're just joining
me. You've got to see thevideo at the bottom of today's blog.
Need you guys go watch it andthen text me your reaction because this has
given me such joy, such andI shouldn't be It's almost like laughing at
your little brother's best friend. Youknow what I'm saying, Like just feels
mean a little bit. But Idon't care. If you're gonna put yourself

(09:13):
out here like a dumbass, expectto be mocked like a dumb ass.
So five six six nine oer isthe CooA Common Spirit health text line.
You can text us your reactions there. And in the meantime, Thankfully,
the emboldened idiots I mean students orpeople camped out on the Tripoli Quad at
the Araria campus have issued their newdemands to the University of Colorado. Do

(09:39):
you want to hear them? Doyou want to hear them? Suyld,
I'll bite. Number one, publisha statement condemning the genocidal actions of Israel
again like Israel gives a rat's ass. That's thing number one. Thing number
two. Fully divest from any corporationsoperating in Israel. Number three, Fully

(10:01):
disclose financial investments. Number four terminatestudy of broad programs to Israel, because
God forbid any of these people actuallygo to Israel and actually see for themselves
what they're protesting against, right,God forbid anyway. Refuse to accept grants
or funding from corporations that contract withthe US Armed Forces, and terminate any

(10:22):
relationships with said corporations. Release allarrested on our April twenty sixth at the
Oraria campus and drop the charges.And have Chancellor Michelle Marks of CU Denver
meet with student organizers to discuss andplan implementation of the above demands. So

(10:43):
here's what I would do if Iwas the leadership, I would send back
my counter list of demands, andit would read like this, Okay,
tell us every company that is inevery single fund that we are invested in,
and then tell us each of thoseanyone that works with Israel. We're
going to need you to provide alist, and then we're going to need
you to also find other funds thatdon't have any companies that have any business

(11:05):
with Israel, that have the samereturn on investment and the same fee structure
as the funds that we are alreadyinvested in, because we cannot lose money
because of your feelings, and thenwe're going to continue sending people to Israel
because it's obvious to us that youguys are idiots and maybe a trip to
Israel would give you some perspective thatyou're sorely lacking now and a release all

(11:26):
arrested. Nope, we're going tothrow them out of school instead, the
ones that are actually students, Andif they're not students, we don't care
what happens to them anyway, andwe're absolutely filing and pressing charges. But
they won't do that because we've alreadyseen the weakness. The students have already
seen the weakness. The students areemboldened. It's now probably a bunch of
professional protesters. I mean, youknow, students do have finals coming up.

(11:52):
A Rod made a great point tome earlier. We're now at the
point now where these protesters are gettinggraduation commenceds canceled. And these are the
same kids who had their high schoolgraduation canceled. That is so unfair because
this is a tiny fraction of thestudent body. I think if you are

(12:13):
a part of these protests, ifthey allow you to stay in school,
which I don't think they should,then you should have to forfeit your right
to have a graduation ceremony. Youshould not be allowed to walk at graduation,
regardless of when you graduate or not. You should just not be your
ban from walking. When you ruina graduation ceremony for everybody else, then
yours too should be ruined. Theprice of the revolution, my friend.

(12:41):
Of course, none of this willhappen. By the way, I have
a companion story to this on theblog today. Listen to this, you
guys. The head of Shiraz Universityhas made an offer to students demonstrating against
Israel's actions in its war against Tamasand Gaza uh and Shiraz University would like

(13:01):
to offer scholarships to any student oryou know what, a job to any
faculty who either got kicked out ofschool or lost their job for protesting against
Israel's actions. It's going to beslightly longer of a commute for a lot
of students because Shiraz University is inIran. That is challenging. But if

(13:24):
that does not clearly clearly show youthat these students who are protesting on behalf
of Hamas are also protesting on behalfof Iran, and if that's who you
want to be associated with? Mygoodness, are you stupid? Truly truly

(13:45):
stupid. We'll be right back,joined of course by Anthony Rodriguez. We're
not doing the two minute drill todaybecause the show has been so short that
really kind of like the whole showis the two minute drill. So there
you go. But we're moving onbecause I do have some interesting stuff that
I want to get to you.And again, if you're just joining us,
there's a video at the bottom oftoday's blog that I'm now just watching

(14:07):
on repeat because it makes me laughso hard. And it is a bunch
of protesters who made shields out ofgray garbage cans and then decided to bum
rush the cops. And it iseverything you think it would be, everything
magic. I found out it's fromPortland State University Portland State in Oregon,

(14:30):
so I'm sure that was you know, went well. Anyway, I've got
an interesting column today. I thinkit's I call it a column. Seems
like a column to me, butI sometimes at the Hill dot Com,
the writing that is supposed to bereporting often comes off like a column.
That being said, there's an interestingcolumn and it kind of dovetails with something

(14:50):
I thought the other day when Iheard that there was a formal movement in
the House of Representatives by a groupof Democrats and a group of Republicans to
protect Speaker Mike Johnson, and theywere protecting Speaker Mike Johnson from a move
by Marjorie Taylor Green, representative fromGeorgia. She was going to call a

(15:20):
she was calling to boot Speaker MikeJohnson because she doesn't like the way his
job is going, because he compromisedon the security bill for Israel, Ukraine
and everyone else. I am alsounhappy with that, but I'm not willing
to kind of continue the shenanigans thatRepublicans have seen on their watch right,

(15:43):
and we saw it with Kevin McCarthy. That was a debacle and a disaster,
And I feel like that whole thingwas really pushed forward by Matt Gates,
who had a long standing beef withKevin McCarthy. But Mike Johnson is
in the role of trying to getstuff done, and he made compromises that
he thought were in the best interestof the country, even if I disagree
with him. That being said,we can't keep bouncing speakers every time they

(16:07):
do something that upsets the fringe ofthe Republican Party. So this is a
pretty significant crackback. The overwhelming votein the House. This is from the
Hill dot Com for a foreign packageincluding funding for Ukraine was a rebuke to
Representative Marjorie Taylor Green, who isnow running into bipartisan opposition as she threatens

(16:29):
to force a snap leadership election inthe House. Johnson says he's done.
Essentially, he's done with hardline conservativecritics, and House Republicans said Tuesday that
Green's efforts to pressure Johnson are fallingflat with their constituents back home, because
I think most people are tired ofthe petty politics and they just want things

(16:53):
to work. Now. I thinka lot most and I'm going to say
most Republicans would have preferred some kindof United States border security as part of
this bill. It was the bestbit of leverage they had, and they
wouldn't even put it in it,just saying it's dead in Chuck Schumer Senate.
I say, let him kill it. Let Chuck Schumer kill it hanging
around his neck. The problem isthat even if that happened, the media

(17:18):
would run with the story that Republicanskilled the aid package by putting in a
poison pill, that would be theheadline poison pill kills Aid Package. It
wouldn't be that Chuck Schumer refused toeven take it up. They would have
never even asked Chuck Schumer why hedoesn't want to secure our southern border,
which would be the logical question inthat situation. But I'm tired of the

(17:44):
fringes of the party having an outsizedrole in determining the direction of the party.
I don't care if it's AOC,I don't care if it's MTG.
I just don't care. And Ithink the vast majority of Americans are sick
of it. We know that youcan't go through life behaving the way that
they're behaving and get anything done.John Cornyn, a member of the Senate

(18:10):
Leadership team, agreed and said,I think people are sick and tired of
chaos and dysfunction. And they are. Well, I take that back,
not every Republican is. There arethe people on the fringe, you right,
who would love to just burn itall down. They don't care about
winning, They just care about poningthe lives, you know. And I'm
sick of those people. I'm sickof the people on the left that have

(18:34):
lurched the Democratic Party so hard tothe left that it's unrecognizable even to longtime
Democrats who are truly liberals instead ofhardcore leftists. There's a big difference there.
So that's on the blog today.But I, for one am happy.
I just every time I see MarjorieTaylor Green, I just I have

(18:55):
this urge to just look at herand say, sit down and shut up,
But of course that would be rude, and I don't have access to
her. So there you go.Totally unrelated story, but kind of cool,
is you know. I talk alot about diseases of dementia, Alzheimer's
and dementia. This is probably oneof my greatest fears about getting older,

(19:19):
is that I suffer from some kindof dementia and then my children are tasked
with taking care of me at theend of my life when I may not
even recognize them. I think thatdementia Alzheimer's are the cruelest afflictions that we
deal with in terms of how theyreally disrupt familial relationships. And you can't

(19:41):
blame the person who has the diseasebecause they're not doing it on purpose.
But I've just known so many caregiverswho have just continually gotten their heartbroken over
and over and over again. Allof that being said, prior research has
said that by twenty fifty, thenumber of people with dementia would triple.
Right, So that's a pretty scarystatistic. So a new study developed or

(20:08):
published in a journal called Developmental Reviewtook a really deep dive into different trends
in cognitive aging through three different lenses. So they looked at existing research,
historical data, and the results ofnew experiments. And this researcher says,
hey, it's not so bad.Across the board. They found that those

(20:33):
born later tended to outperform those bornearlier on cognitive tests. Well, younger
people are going to do better ona cognitive test. What's more, the
gap in performance grew larger as thebirth years of the groups being com prepared
grew further apart. This suggests asteady continuous improvement in cognitive function among older

(20:55):
adults over time. So older adultsnow are doing better than previous generations.
So older folks now are aging bettermentally cognitively than previous generations. And you
know what, I was reading thisthis morning, I was thinking to myself,

(21:15):
I wonder how much of and pleasedon't take what I'm about to say
as I think that leaded gasoline causeddementia. But we have leaded gasoline for
a very long time, and aswe phased it out, it would stand
a reason that we are able tolive healthier lifestyles because we're not sucking in

(21:37):
the exhaust of leaded gasoline. Andlead can have a terrible impact on mental
health, It can have a terribleimpact on aggressiveness, It can have a
terrible impact on a lot of ourpersonalities. And so I read this and
it's just one of those things whereI think, I wonder if there is
any connection. You know, again, I'm not saying there is by any
stretch of the imagination, But lookingback, why would people who were younger

(22:02):
earlier. What were we doing thenthat we are not doing now, Or
what are we doing now that wedidn't do then. It's just it's kind
of an interesting thought experiment. Butif you're worried like I am about getting
dementia, this may be good newsfor all of us. Or maybe the
answer is just young people are gettingdumber. I don't know, could be

(22:22):
any of these things, any ofthem. When we get back, we
are going to talk about how tobe a superhuman athlete. We are going
to without actually being a superhuman athlete. I got a cheat for you,
I got a hack for that.And I also want to talk about this,

(22:44):
and we haven't talked about this ina long time. This dentist who
allegedly murdered his wife, This guyactually gets dumber and dumber. It's amazing.
Worst criminal ever will dip our toesinto that when we get back.
I don't cover a lot of crimestories. It's just not my bag,

(23:07):
right, Like, what are wegoing to talk about? Oh, that
person shouldn't have committed a crime.But this Aurora dentist accused of killing his
wife, this guy is the worstcriminal in the history of criminals. First
of all, if you know thedetails of the case, he left a
trail of breadcrumbs that mister Magoo wouldbe able to see that led directly from

(23:33):
his dead wife to him. Heordered cyanide that he used to poison his
wife allegedly and had it delivered tohis office. But now he's proven he's
even dumber. I didn't think itwas possible, but yet he's even dumber.
He's in jail awaiting trial, andall of a sudden, the Aurora

(23:56):
police had a guy who happened tobe inmate with him give him a call,
and, according to an Aurora detective, this idiot doctor told another inmate
about the charges he faced. Thenhe asked the inmate to place letters in
his garage and truck at his home. The letters were written from inside the

(24:18):
jail and were meant to appear asif his dead wife, Angela, had
written them before she died. Thedentist was going to try and sell the
narrative that his wife was not happywith life and suicidal, and obviously she
had ordered cyanide, had it sentto her husband's office, and then took

(24:38):
it in an effort to frame him. I mean, I'm guessing about the
last part. The inmate said,dude wrote the letters and in exchange for
placing the letters, this is guys, this is where it gets. This
is where it gets truly into comical. Like if you saw this in a

(24:59):
movie, you would be like,come on. In exchange for placing the
fake letters in his house, doctorCraig offered the inmate free dental work or
money for bond. The inmate didnot take the doctor up on his offer.
Instead, he goes law enforcement,and now the idiot doctor is facing

(25:25):
yet one more charge in addition tothe charges the bases for allegedly murdered his
wife. I mean, you knowwhat, I just want to say this
if I ever do decide to gointo a life of crime, and there's
a very small chance that will everhappen, because in my soul I'm a
rule follower and I just don't feellike I would feel good about myself if
I entered into a life of crime. But hey, I'm not ruling anything

(25:47):
out. You never know, right, I leave every door open just in
case. That being said, Ipromise you, dear listeners, that I
will be a much better criminal thanthis guy. A five year old would
be a better criminal than this guy. You let him watch a couple episodes
of Law and Order. They couldcreate a much better crime than this idiot.

(26:10):
I mean, I'm not making lightof the fact that he killed the
mother of his children and his longtimewife so he could be with his orthodontist
girlfriend from Texas, But good gravy. I mean, don't you think about
things? Don't you think about howthings might go, how to cover your
tracks. Ugh, just absolutely terrible, absolutely terrible. When we get back,

(26:33):
I'm super excited because Doris Kerns Goodwinhas written some of the best modern
histories of various great Americans, andshe has written a new book that is
a little bit of a departure,though not at all a departure. She's
writing about the sixties, but whatmakes it different is she's writing about her
late husband's role and her role inthat time period as it unfolded. And

(27:00):
I, for one, am excitedabout this book, and I'm more excited
to talk to her after we getback from this break. I am very,
very excited about my next guest.She has been intertwined with history since
the nineteen sixties, has written someof the best biographies and historical nonfiction that
I've read, because not only asit informative, it is interesting and well

(27:22):
written, which is a nice change. And now she's got a new book
out with a slightly different approach becauseshe is part of the story. Doris
Kerns Goodwin, thank you so muchfor making time for me and coming on
the show today. Oh I'm soglad to be with you. Mandy thank
you very much. Well, firstof all, I meant what I said
when your books are extremely accessible.Whereas some books written about historical figures can

(27:45):
be a wee bit dense, yourbooks make it easy to learn about some
of the greatest Americans in our history. And I wanted to ask you this,
how aside from the fact that youstarted your career in Lyndon Maine Johnson's
office, right, it seems likea great place to start, how do
you choose what you write about afterthat? Well, the main thing,

(28:06):
because I know it's going to takeme so long to write these books,
I have to find somebody that Iwant to wake up with in the morning
and think about when I go tobed at night. I really want to
like the person. Of course,they'll have their flaws and strengths like anybody
else does. But I chose AbrahamLincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, Franklin Roosevelt after
Lyndon Johnson, and each one tookyou eight ten years, so I had

(28:27):
to want to wake up with them. And then you want to tell a
story, and you hope that you'vegot an era that people are going to
care about and characters that they canrelate to. That era through and there
were a bunch of great characters aroundeach one of the people that I wrote
about. Well, and I'm wantingto get to the book that you have
out now, and it is calledAn Unfinished Love Story, a personal history

(28:47):
of the nineteen sixties. This isslightly different in that you and your late
husband are a big part of this. How was that a different experience for
you writing where you are part ofthe story. Well, especially in the
early years of working on it wasso different because what happened is my husband
came down the steps one day afterhis eightieth birthday and he decided he was

(29:10):
singing that he was going to openthe boxes. And I knew exactly what
that meant. Through our entire marriedlife of over forty years, he had
carted around three hundred boxes that werereally a time capital of the sixties.
He was like Zellig. He waseverywhere he wanted to be in the sixties.
He worked for JFK in the campaign. He was in the JFK White
House, He was there when thebody was brought back. He then worked

(29:30):
for Lynnon Johnson at the heyday ofthe Great Society. He then went to
work for Eugene McCarthy in New Hampshirewhen he turned against the war in Vietnam,
and then when Bobby entered the race. Bobby was his closest friend.
He went with Bobby and was withhim when he died. All those years
he didn't want to look at theboxes because it had all ended so sadly
with Bobby's death and Martin Luther King'sand the riots and the campus violence.

(29:52):
But finally turning eighty, he saidtypically him, if I have any wisdom
to dispense, I better start now. It's now or never. So we
had this great adventure of real lifeliving the sixties together. He was twelve
years older than I, but itwas my decade too, And during that
period of time it was so differentbecause I'm used to my guys. I
used to call them that I nevercould get an answer to a question I
might to ask. Of course,I'd talk to them, but they wouldn't

(30:14):
come back to me. But therewas Dick sitting right there in the room
with me, talking and you couldcorrect me and argue with me. It
was the last great adventure of ourlife. I'm definitely going to read this
book, I absolutely because I thinkit's such an interesting time, and we're
now seeing not to get into awhole other political conversation, but we're seeing
echoes of that on college campuses now. And I wanted to just ask you,

(30:37):
what are the differences in your mind, since you just came out of
writing this book about an era whichwas both camelot and also incredibly turbulent,
how do you see or if thereare any parallels between then and now.
Well, I do think one ofthe parallels that I thought before the campus
outbreaks occurred was that the decade ofthe sixties not last in terms of that

(31:02):
sadness. Most of it was firedby conspiring the conscience of the American people
through the civil rights movement. Imean, all those people who marched for
arguing against segregation, who marched againstthe denial of the vote. They sacrificed
themselves and they were successful. Acivil rights back passed, a voting my
backpass. So there was a greatfeeling in the early part of the decade

(31:23):
that if you could be powered bythe conviction that individuals can make a difference,
things will happen. Government will respond. It was a very heady,
wonderful time. And then when thewar in Vietnam came and the anti war
violence occurred late in the decade.In the early part of the decade,
when the young people crisscrossed the countryto go vote for McCarthy in New Hampshire
and join the New Hampshire Primary,thousands of kids came. They cut their

(31:47):
beards, they cut their long hair, the girls wore long skirts instead of
short skirts, and McCarthy did incrediblywell in New Hampshire because of them.
They hugged one another, they feltthey had made a difference, and then
Lyndon Johnson actually started to go siationswith North Vietnam, pulled out of the
race, and was beginning to talkabout, you know, stopping the bombing.
Then fate intervened and Bobby's killed,and Martin Luther King has killed.

(32:10):
The peace courts breakdown, and thenat the end of the summer, the
Democratic Convention becomes chaotic, and thenlaw and order becomes the theme, and
Richard Nixon wins the election. Sothere's lots of pieces to the sixties that
have to be unpacked. But itwas a great decade to be alive.
You felt fired by the feeling thatyou might be able to do something to
make life better. I was inthat march on Washington in nineteen sixty three,

(32:31):
and actually Dick was there too,though we didn't meet because there were
two hundred and fifty thousand other people. Payer he always claimed he was looking
for me the whole time. Andthere was that feeling when people sung way
shell Overcome, and I carried asign Catholics and Jews and Protestants united for
civil rights, and I really feltlike I was helping to make the country
a better place. So that feelinghas to be remembered. We can learn

(32:52):
from that feeling. Is What wasit like when that all came to an
end? Was it a curse?Disappointment? Was it exasperation? What was
the emotional toll of living through whatyou just described as a very heady time
with such a tragic ending, somany tragedies, not just one. Well,
you know, the interesting thing happenedin my personal life was that Dick

(33:15):
and I had gotten through the boxesof the sixties before he died from the
cancer that finally took his life,And before he died, he had come
to the realization he had been soangry with Lyndon Johnson, who he had
loved, because he had been hismain speechwriter in the nineteen sixty four or
five period. He was so angryabout the war that he carried that resentment
most of his life. But aswe relived those moments, those moments stood

(33:37):
out and he began to soften inhis feelings. I remember one night we
went to bed and he said,oh my god, I'm beginning to feel
affection for the old guy again.And because he felt that, it really
made him feel that he had madea difference to and that the great society
had not been destroyed by the warin Vietnam, that still so much of
it remained medicare, medicaid, aidto education, voting rights, civil rights

(33:59):
in reform, NPR, PBS.It was extraordinary, and that softened his
feelings, and it made him,as he faced his death, feel better.
I think everybody wants, when whenyou're facing death, possibly to think
that maybe you've done something that youmight be remembered by. So even though
there was that sadness at the end, by remembering the part in the middle,
it made those last months of hislife. He gave him joy and

(34:20):
a sense of purpose to be workingon this book before he died. See.
I think when I hear you talkabout that, Doris. I think
that that's probably what these young peopleare trying to tap into. It is
that wanting to believe they're going tomake a difference. I think that's absolutely
right. I mean, all ofus want to do that in our own
lives, whether it's on a smallerscale or a larger scale. And I
think it's there's a there's a hopefulnessin the fact that they've come together to

(34:45):
be arguing for something. There's somuch to be thought through in this decade.
There's so many things that really needto be fixed. We've gone backward
in lots of ways, and Ijust hope that that activism keeps going and
works itself in a disciplined way.I mean, that's one of the things
you can learn from the sixth seesthat once violence comes into the play,
then people's fired consciences turned the oppositeway, and you lose that message as

(35:07):
you're trying to deliver. That's anexcellent point. So when you began when
you set out to write your firstbook about Lyndon Johnson because you worked in
his administration. Even though I findit interesting that you had written anti Johnson
articles, before you were invited tocome work at the White House. You
must be quite charming in person topull that one off. But when you

(35:29):
started writing that book, did youforesee in any way, shape or form
that this would become your legacy,that you would be the woman who writes
these incredibly interesting and well researched historicalbooks that you know people would look to
for as reference books. Oh thankyou for saying that. No, of

(35:51):
course not. You know what youwould do is I wrote that book because
I had had these long conversations withLyndon Johnson. And you're right. I've
been involved in the anti Vietnam Warmovement myself and had written an article against
him before I became a White Housefellow and was chosen to work with him,
And I thought he would kick meout of the program when he found
out, especially because the title ofthe article, not put on by me
by the New Republic, was howto remove Lyndon Johnson in nineteen sixty eight,

(36:15):
And anyways, he said, bringher down here for a year.
And if I can't win or overno one can. I think I would
have become an historian if I hadn'thad that experience with Lyndon Johnson, because
I'd loved history all my life,from the time my father taught me how
to keep score at baseball game soI could record for the history of him,
the history of that afternoon's Brooklyn Dodgergame. But it might have been
some other kind of history where itnot for Lyndon Johnson. And then somehow,

(36:37):
once I wrote that book, Istarted to write books about other presidents,
Franklin Roosevelt and Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt, And before you know it,
I had become a presidential historian.It just happens, you know. And
people will tease me, how couldyou live with dead presidents all your life?
But I wouldn't change it. Myonly fear is that in the afterlife,
There'll be a panel of all thesepower characters that I've studied, and
each one will tell me everything Imissed about them, and the first person

(37:00):
which came out will be Lyndon Johnson. How from that damn book on the
Kennedy where the FitzGeralds was to order, whether Lincoln's was twice as long as
the book you wrote about me.I was going to ask you if your
feelings were reflections on Johnson had shiftedor changed over the years from the first
book that you wrote about him tonow when you're writing this retrospective about his

(37:21):
era the sixties, has that changedat all or do you still have the
same opinions of him. Well,I felt I always felt empathy for him,
even though I had disagreed with himabout the war, just by the
experience of being down there with LyndonJohnson and with Lady Bird. But I
think what we've seen in the lastyear is not just on my feelings,
but the country's feeling, is thatas the war recedes in time, people

(37:44):
are beginning to realize what an extraordinarymaster of the bipartisanship of the Congress he
was. And since we've had noone since it's been able to do that,
we look back I think with morepride. He's rising in historians polls.
I think one of the last pollsi I saw, he was number
eight in the top presidents and Kennedywas number nine. How he would have

(38:05):
loved to see that. Actually,what he yells at you in the pearly
gates, you can just say,wait, did you see that you're number
eight over Kennedy? Exactly? Yedistracting you. Good news. I have
a message for you, a messagefor you. But I think really he's
one of the great figures in Americanhistory, a tragic figure in some ways,
but a formidable figure in others.And I think more people have realized

(38:27):
that, and I'm so glad tosee that happen. You know, I
found the title of the book,an unfinished love Story, to be interesting.
What is the unfinished love story fromthe nineteen sixties for you? Well,
it really meant two things for me. One was unfinished love story for
my husband, because I had promisedhim before he died that I'd tried to
finish the book that I was goingto help him write, and then it
became something different because I became anhistorian writing it. But it was also

(38:51):
an unfinished love story for America,that the promises not only of the sixties
that weren't fulfilled, but the promisesare never fulfilled from our country. We
always have an idea and we tryto move closer and closer to that ideal,
and so it was really a lovestory to America as well as to
my husband. Well, people canbuy the book. I put a link
to the tattered covers website because they'rea local bookstore and Doris Karn's Goodwin is

(39:13):
going to be there tonight, butit is sold out. I hate to
talk people with that, but goodfor you and thank you. But I
will be signing extra copies for people. I want to go in early so
that I can sign their stock copies, so if people can come tonight,
they can come and get it.I'd love to do that. It's a
wonderful bookstore. I just got aquestion. We have a text line,
and I just got this question.I think it's kind of interesting because you

(39:36):
mentioned NPR and PBS. What doyou think about the recent controversy with for
now former employees saying, you knowthat they've lost their way in terms of
middle of the road journalism. Yeah. No, I think one of the
complications of our road that we're livingon today is this question of split cable,
split radio. And I think somany people in the country are looking

(40:00):
for where is there a place thatI can just trust the facts and I
don't have to have opinions into thosefacts. And I don't think it's just
there. I think it's something we'reall looking for all over the country right
now, and it will emerge again. I think it does emerge in places.
I think in local news it's morelikely to be there than sometimes on
the national level. I agree withthat wholeheartedly. We actually have some very

(40:20):
good networks here in Denver that doa really good job covering our area and
do so in a very straightforward manner. Doris Kerns Goodwin, I so appreciate
your time today, and I hopeyou have a wonderful event tonight and have
great success with this book. DareI ask what dead president you'll be waking
up with for the next eight years. Is there a third other plan for

(40:42):
another book? Now? The onlything that's in the works right now is
the last book I wrote was calledLeadership in Turbulent Time, and it was
about my four guys, and it'sgoing to be adapted into a young adult
book will be coming out in thefall. I just would love to have
young people understand what it means tobe a leader, and what of those
qualities of humility and empathy and resilienceand accountability and acknowledging errors, all the

(41:05):
qualities that made these leaders great.You have to start developing them when you're
young. So I'm hoping that thatthat's going to come out. I can't
believe it. In the fall.Somehow I've managed to do these two things
at once. At my age,it seems to be crazy. Oh you
know, you've got plenty more inyou, Doris, you got plenty more
in you. You know my friend, my friend Larry Reid, who's an
economic history and he calls what youjust described all those characteristics character and like

(41:29):
it's exactly right. Yeah, Andit sounds like what we need in this
country exactly right now is character onehundred percent. Thank you so much for
making time with us, and Ihope you enjoy your time here in Denver.
Thank you so much. I'm soglad we could talk together. All
right, have a great day.That is Doris Kerns Goodwin. Her book
An Unfinished Love Story, a PersonalHistory of the nineteen sixties is available and

(41:50):
I linked to the chattered cover,but it's available everywhere. And if you've
never read one of her books andyou want to be a lot smarter about
Abraham Lincoln, about Teddy Roosevelt,about William Taft, about the Kennedy's and
the Fitzgerald go read her books becausethey read like a novel. But They
are so well researched and so goodand just a really great way to dip

(42:13):
your toe into history without you know, having to weigh your way through a
book that's, you know, athousand pages long. Some of those history
books can be so boring and drytoo, which is what probably makes her
so much better. She is sobeloved and awarded and acclaimed because she makes
it accessible. She makes it soyou don't fall asleep trying to get through
two pages. That's Grant everybody.Hi, he's come in. What's here

(42:35):
for Grant of the day. Ohyou know what, I'm sorry. I've
only been here for like, youknow, an hour and a half,
so I'm you know. I canalso promote my podcast too, Taking It
for Granted podcast you can find onthe tree and totally awesome my Heart Radio
app. I thoroughly enjoyed the interviewwith Dave Logan to you, I want
stuff I did not know about DaveLogan in that interview. I know.
And that's the best part about doinga deep dive with someone that's like,

(42:58):
even though you get to hear someonelike Dave every day, yeah you do,
you get to hear some stories thatyeah you don't hear anywhere else,
and you did a great job.Who's on this week? Scott de Huff?
Who is Scott Dehuff. He isa former radio guy like me from
behind the Glass. He was atour competitor, The Fan for a long
time. But he has started apodcast called d Huff Uncensored. Oh and

(43:19):
it is hilarious. His demand heis so funny. Well, there you
go. You can tune into theTaking It for Granted podcast on the iHeartRadio
completely free app. We'll be backtomorrow. It's a full show, looking
forward to it and we've got somegreat, great guests, including Jamie Lissau,
who, if you may know,from Gutfeld, which is honestly the
funniest show on television a vast majorityof the time. We will be back

(43:44):
then, but we're going to turnit over to KOA Sports right now.
Keep it right here on KOA