Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Natalie Fulton. She works with Pro Animal Future and they
have two ballad initiatives on the ballot in Denver. One
is Initiative THREEHO eight, and that would ban the use
of fur from animals that are solely grown for the
purpose of fur. Is that correct, Natalie, Well, dang, let
grant turn your microphone. I'll go ahead. That's correct.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
There's some other exemptions as well. Okay, that's the gist
of it.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
And then three oh nine would close a slaughterhouse that
has been operating in Denver for a very long time,
also correct.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Also correct, for about seventy years. They have been polluting
the city.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
So let me ask you to tell us a little
bit about Pro Animal Future to start, so we know
where you're coming from totally.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
So I want to start by explaining the concept of
agricultural exceptionalism, which is the romanticized idea of animal farming
that many people share.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
When we're kids, we're.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Taught Old mc donald had a farm that farmed animals
have happy lives and nice deaths.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
This could not be further from the truth.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Over ninety nine percent of animals products come from factory farms,
where animals are confined on deplorable. In deplorable conditions, they're
denied their natural behaviors, and they're slaughtered at a small
fraction of their natural lifespan. The presidential debate revealed massive
inconsistencies in the way society views animals. We were horrified
(01:18):
by the idea of eating dogs and eating cats, but
scientific evidence has confirmed that the animals we eat are
just as emotionally complex.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
As the animals we love at home.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
We think it's time to update our morality along with
that knowledge and evolve away from treating animals as objects.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
So ultimately, the goal of pro animal future is to
have no one eat meat. That is not the goal.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Our nearby goal for the next few decades is to
ban factory farming in the United States. As far as
eating meat, I would love to see a world where
no animals are harmed for meat. The first time I
went to a slaughterhouse was a pig facility in Michigan,
and I watched as workers beat the pigs off the
trucks they forced them inside, and then I heard the
screams of as they were killed in gas chambers. And
(02:02):
I think some people could hear that story and think,
you know, maybe there's just a better way to do it,
and some people would think we should stop.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Doing this completely.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
But the cool thing about our measures is that it's
a step in the right direction for both groups, for
anyone who thinks that industrialized slaughter is bad, or for
anyone who thinks that we should completely move away from it.
We're tackling at the factory farming level right now.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
So philosophically, I am on the other side of this issue.
I am a carnivore. I think that our teeth structure
and our eyeplacement shows that we are predators, and therefore
we are sort of biologically programmed to eat meat. And
I too, have also been to a slaughterhouse when I
was ten. My dad wanted us to understand what the
cycle of life was for our food. I lived in
a rural area. He never wanted me to think my
meat came from the grocery store, right. He always wanted
(02:45):
us to have that connection. That's great. I also knew
a lot of farmers and ranchers growing up, So I
knew these people and I knew the kind of people
that they were, and I was on their farms and
I saw how they treated their cows and it was
a much different experience than the one you describe. I'm
not saying that you're what you're saying is wrong, because
I am aware that there are bad actors in every industry,
including farming, absolutely, and kind of to speak to that.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Over the last couple decades, animal farming has really consolidated.
The average slaughterhouse is double the size that it was.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
In nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
These big, massive corporations have put a lot of the
small farmers out of business.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
But even if.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
An animal has a great life on a small farm,
they're still going to be slaughtered at a small fraction
of their natural lifespan. What if I had a dog
and I said I'm going to give them a great
life for six months and then send him to a slaughterhouse.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Would you support that? No, that's a ridiculous assertion, because
the only reason that those cows exist is for food.
We would not have the numbers of herds, we would
not have the heads of cattle if we did not
use them for food or get milk from them to
use for food. So to say I'm going to have
a pet that its purpose is much different than that
of an animal. To make that comparison to me, is
(03:56):
in our culture a little bit ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I want to push back because there are many cultures
where they do breed dogs just to eat that sure
in agriculture, Sure, do you think culture is a good
barometer for morality or should we.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Look at scientific evidence?
Speaker 2 (04:10):
You know, there was a time in our culture where
men had complete dominance over women. You and me wouldn't
be allowed to be working the jobs that we have
now if we just looked at culture to determine our morality.
I'm saying that culture should change based on a new
understanding of the world. The agriculture revolution was ten thousand
years ago. Our ancestors didn't know what we know about
animal sentience and behavior. They also didn't know that we
(04:34):
can be healthy without doing this, And now that we
do know that stuff, do you think it's time to
evolve with the times?
Speaker 1 (04:41):
I think it should be a matter of personal choice,
and I think the agenda behind this, quite frankly, is
to make meat so expensive by shutting down the available
slaughterhouses in our area that it becomes out of reach
by design for a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Animal agriculture receives billions of dollars in government subsidies every
single year. Without this government support, animal products would cost
two to four times more than they currently do.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
A big mac would be thirteen dollars.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
This industry is already supported by the government. The average
dairy farm hasn't been profitable. It's only been profitable for
two years in the last twenty years because of all
the government support that they get.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
And the only reason so many.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
People eat meat is because it's artificially lowered. And our
measures would only affect right now the cost of lamb,
which is already a premium meat that low income people
cannot afford. So stee.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
But that's that's that's a very that's a very nanny
state answer, because ultimately you're saying we've already priced it
out of the market. The nanny state is telling other
people the choices they should make. Ye. Yeah, that's what
you're trying to set up, though, That's the endgame is
to make it impossible for more people to be able
to afford a premium meat. That's the endgame here.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
The endgame is to eliminate the factory farming system.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
But let me ask you this.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
We agree that humans should have a choice, should animals
not have a choice and whether.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
They learn most is on the same level, on the
same level.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
I don't have to because it's not the choice between
humans and animals. I put pigs, chickens, and cows at
the same level as dogs and cats because that's what
the scientific evidence shows. Do you think that we should
take what they want into account?
Speaker 1 (06:15):
You know, here's the thing about that specifically, I have
a dog. I love my dog. I absolutely love my dog.
But if I were starving, I would eat my dog.
I think the same it is. I mean, it's like
but I understand, but none of us is starving right now.
We have options farms.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
We are trying to ban factory farms, but superior farms.
The industrial slaughterhouse, the largest industrial lampslaughterhouse in the US,
is the face of factory farming here in Denver. Industrial
slaughterhouses and factory farms are part of the same supply chain.
There are no factory farms in Denver. Since we're from here,
we have a lot of local activists here. We wanted
to run a campaign in Denver, so we're tackling the
(06:52):
industrial slaughterhouse here because it's part of that same system.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
And what about the people that get tossed out of
work who have already come out and said, look, they
take really good care of us. We've been here for
over a decade, and our jobs are going to go
the jobs that we like.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
We included a provision in the legislation for the City
of Denver to prioritize affected workers in their employment assistance program.
But I do not think that we should trust the
people who currently work there because they're mostly management. We
should be asking the people who work on the kill floor.
And we've interviewed former workers, and one former worker told
us that the number one thing he wants people in
Denver to know about is the animal cruelty. There was
(07:26):
also a lawsuit in twenty twenty one where Muslim employees
suited Superior Farms for racial and religious discrimination. They were
called racial slurs over the intercom and that is unacceptable behavior.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
We should have heat from that lawsuit. What happened. It
was settled. It was settled. So but do you think
perhaps if that was settled, that situation has been fixed
because the same slaughterhouse was just cited by the EPA
for potential potential releases of ammonium gas, and in response,
they're paying a fine, and they're going above and beyond
what the EPA is doing and adding two hundred and
(07:57):
fifty thousand dollars worth of redundancies to ensure that what
didn't happen but the EPA said could would not happen.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
The EPA investigation actually showed that they were mishandling anhydrous ammonia,
which is a very dangerous chemical. Superior Farms has claimed
for the last year that they were doing everything correctly.
This new report shows that they were lying about that.
They're lying about that, why should we trust them about
the other things They said.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Well, everybody who's being fined by the EPA is going
to say they didn't do it. I mean, that's a
pretty standard response. Nobody immediately capitulates.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
They said that they were mishandling the ammonia and now
they're fixing it. So why were they claiming that they
were doing everything correctly for the last year.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
When this shows that's not the case.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
We also have the Clean Water Act violations which have
been going on for over four years. But I want
to go back to the jobs question. I think that
we all have a line with animal cruelty.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
Let's say it were.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Nineteen seventy four, and dog fighting was talking about being banned.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
Would you say keeping a dog fighting? You keep throwing
up the comparisons designed to evoke emotional response instead of
talking about the reality, which is this is a legal
product which people want to consume. Your organization is trying
to make it prohibitively expensive and then shut down the
farming that makes meat affordable in the first place. So
your theater trying.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
You a way comfortable with the way animals are treated
on factory farms and the waterhouses. They feel like it's
a really hard choice to not eat meat because of
the way our society is structured. That's why we're tackling
this at a systemic issue. Forty nine percent of Americans
want to ban factory farms.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Follow up question to those people and if your meat
costs double, would you still be in favor of banning it?
I guarantee you that number would drop considerably.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Do you think that it's acceptable for animals to be
confined by the hundreds of thousands in sheds where twenty
five percent of them die before they even reach the slaughterhouse.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
I buy my meat from a rancher that is doing
things cows grazing things of that nature. I try to
be a responsible consumer, but ultimately I have to trust
other consumers to those choices. I think that if you
want to be a vegan and make animal rights at
the center of your life, I think that's fantastic, absolutely fantastic.
But when you start to try to put people out
(10:09):
of work, you try to use violations from other different
slaughterhouses in California, not then not you specifically in the
news media, there's things going around that you're trying to lose.
Use things in California. There's no evidence of us doing that.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
The one in California is the same company, and an
investigation revealed lamps being kicked front around, suffering well before
they died.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
But that hasn't happened here.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
We have evidence based on testimonials that there are many
animal welfare violations at the plant in Denver. We don't
have video evidence, but I don't see why it would
be different if it's the same company and there's so
much worker testimonial corroborating that investigation.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Well, perhaps go at it from that point of view,
but I'm a firm no on both of these media.
And to get to three oh eight I'm not a
person notoriously cruel.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
They all so confine wild animals for their entire lives,
and every fall their bludgeon to death or gas to
preserve the product. Over ninety percent of fur comes from
fur factory farms. It's unnecessary animal cruelty. We have alternative materials,
just like dogfighting is unnecessary entertainment. This is unnecessary animal cruelty,
and we should evolve beyond it. Because you're right that
(11:21):
humans are different from other animals.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
We have moral agency.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
We can make choices based on right and wrong, and
based on our understanding of the world. Now that we
know that these animals are suffering massively in these places,
it's time for us to evolve away from treating them
like objects.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
Natalie Fault, and you are a fine advocate for your position.
Thank you, you really are. You are fine advocate. I still
think you're wrong, but I think you are a fine
advocate for your position, and I very much appreciate you
coming in today to make your case. You might have
changed someone's mind hotly. You never know. Well, just see
what happened on the vote. Sing a little song for
you before we're We're very late. So yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
That song eight six seven five three No nine. I'm
vote yes. I'm three O eight, I'm three oh nah
yea on just so everyone can remember, vote yes for
animals this November if you want to see a better
future for everyone.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That is Natalie Fulton with pro I'm sorry, Pro Animal Future. Natalie,
thank you. We'll be right Batch
Natalie Fulton. She works with Pro Animal Future and they
have two ballad initiatives on the ballot in Denver. One
is Initiative THREEHO eight, and that would ban the use
of fur from animals that are solely grown for the
purpose of fur. Is that correct, Natalie, Well, dang, let
grant turn your microphone. I'll go ahead. That's correct.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
There's some other exemptions as well. Okay, that's the gist
of it.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
And then three oh nine would close a slaughterhouse that
has been operating in Denver for a very long time,
also correct.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Also correct, for about seventy years. They have been polluting
the city.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
So let me ask you to tell us a little
bit about Pro Animal Future to start, so we know
where you're coming from totally.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
So I want to start by explaining the concept of
agricultural exceptionalism, which is the romanticized idea of animal farming
that many people share.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
When we're kids, we're.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Taught Old mc donald had a farm that farmed animals
have happy lives and nice deaths.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
This could not be further from the truth.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Over ninety nine percent of animals products come from factory farms,
where animals are confined on deplorable. In deplorable conditions, they're
denied their natural behaviors, and they're slaughtered at a small
fraction of their natural lifespan. The presidential debate revealed massive
inconsistencies in the way society views animals. We were horrified
(01:18):
by the idea of eating dogs and eating cats, but
scientific evidence has confirmed that the animals we eat are
just as emotionally complex.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
As the animals we love at home.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
We think it's time to update our morality along with
that knowledge and evolve away from treating animals as objects.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
So ultimately, the goal of pro animal future is to
have no one eat meat. That is not the goal.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Our nearby goal for the next few decades is to
ban factory farming in the United States. As far as
eating meat, I would love to see a world where
no animals are harmed for meat. The first time I
went to a slaughterhouse was a pig facility in Michigan,
and I watched as workers beat the pigs off the
trucks they forced them inside, and then I heard the
screams of as they were killed in gas chambers. And
(02:02):
I think some people could hear that story and think,
you know, maybe there's just a better way to do it,
and some people would think we should stop.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Doing this completely.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
But the cool thing about our measures is that it's
a step in the right direction for both groups, for
anyone who thinks that industrialized slaughter is bad, or for
anyone who thinks that we should completely move away from it.
We're tackling at the factory farming level right now.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
So philosophically, I am on the other side of this issue.
I am a carnivore. I think that our teeth structure
and our eyeplacement shows that we are predators, and therefore
we are sort of biologically programmed to eat meat. And
I too, have also been to a slaughterhouse when I
was ten. My dad wanted us to understand what the
cycle of life was for our food. I lived in
a rural area. He never wanted me to think my
meat came from the grocery store, right. He always wanted
(02:45):
us to have that connection. That's great. I also knew
a lot of farmers and ranchers growing up, So I
knew these people and I knew the kind of people
that they were, and I was on their farms and
I saw how they treated their cows and it was
a much different experience than the one you describe. I'm
not saying that you're what you're saying is wrong, because
I am aware that there are bad actors in every industry,
including farming, absolutely, and kind of to speak to that.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Over the last couple decades, animal farming has really consolidated.
The average slaughterhouse is double the size that it was.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
In nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
These big, massive corporations have put a lot of the
small farmers out of business.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
But even if.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
An animal has a great life on a small farm,
they're still going to be slaughtered at a small fraction
of their natural lifespan. What if I had a dog
and I said I'm going to give them a great
life for six months and then send him to a slaughterhouse.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Would you support that? No, that's a ridiculous assertion, because
the only reason that those cows exist is for food.
We would not have the numbers of herds, we would
not have the heads of cattle if we did not
use them for food or get milk from them to
use for food. So to say I'm going to have
a pet that its purpose is much different than that
of an animal. To make that comparison to me, is
(03:56):
in our culture a little bit ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I want to push back because there are many cultures
where they do breed dogs just to eat that sure
in agriculture, Sure, do you think culture is a good
barometer for morality or should we.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Look at scientific evidence?
Speaker 2 (04:10):
You know, there was a time in our culture where
men had complete dominance over women. You and me wouldn't
be allowed to be working the jobs that we have
now if we just looked at culture to determine our morality.
I'm saying that culture should change based on a new
understanding of the world. The agriculture revolution was ten thousand
years ago. Our ancestors didn't know what we know about
animal sentience and behavior. They also didn't know that we
(04:34):
can be healthy without doing this, And now that we
do know that stuff, do you think it's time to
evolve with the times?
Speaker 1 (04:41):
I think it should be a matter of personal choice,
and I think the agenda behind this, quite frankly, is
to make meat so expensive by shutting down the available
slaughterhouses in our area that it becomes out of reach
by design for a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Animal agriculture receives billions of dollars in government subsidies every
single year. Without this government support, animal products would cost
two to four times more than they currently do.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
A big mac would be thirteen dollars.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
This industry is already supported by the government. The average
dairy farm hasn't been profitable. It's only been profitable for
two years in the last twenty years because of all
the government support that they get.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
And the only reason so many.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
People eat meat is because it's artificially lowered. And our
measures would only affect right now the cost of lamb,
which is already a premium meat that low income people
cannot afford. So stee.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
But that's that's that's a very that's a very nanny
state answer, because ultimately you're saying we've already priced it
out of the market. The nanny state is telling other
people the choices they should make. Ye. Yeah, that's what
you're trying to set up, though, That's the endgame is
to make it impossible for more people to be able
to afford a premium meat. That's the endgame here.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
The endgame is to eliminate the factory farming system.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
But let me ask you this.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
We agree that humans should have a choice, should animals
not have a choice and whether.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
They learn most is on the same level, on the
same level.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
I don't have to because it's not the choice between
humans and animals. I put pigs, chickens, and cows at
the same level as dogs and cats because that's what
the scientific evidence shows. Do you think that we should
take what they want into account?
Speaker 1 (06:15):
You know, here's the thing about that specifically, I have
a dog. I love my dog. I absolutely love my dog.
But if I were starving, I would eat my dog.
I think the same it is. I mean, it's like
but I understand, but none of us is starving right now.
We have options farms.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
We are trying to ban factory farms, but superior farms.
The industrial slaughterhouse, the largest industrial lampslaughterhouse in the US,
is the face of factory farming here in Denver. Industrial
slaughterhouses and factory farms are part of the same supply chain.
There are no factory farms in Denver. Since we're from here,
we have a lot of local activists here. We wanted
to run a campaign in Denver, so we're tackling the
(06:52):
industrial slaughterhouse here because it's part of that same system.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
And what about the people that get tossed out of
work who have already come out and said, look, they
take really good care of us. We've been here for
over a decade, and our jobs are going to go
the jobs that we like.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
We included a provision in the legislation for the City
of Denver to prioritize affected workers in their employment assistance program.
But I do not think that we should trust the
people who currently work there because they're mostly management. We
should be asking the people who work on the kill floor.
And we've interviewed former workers, and one former worker told
us that the number one thing he wants people in
Denver to know about is the animal cruelty. There was
(07:26):
also a lawsuit in twenty twenty one where Muslim employees
suited Superior Farms for racial and religious discrimination. They were
called racial slurs over the intercom and that is unacceptable behavior.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
We should have heat from that lawsuit. What happened. It
was settled. It was settled. So but do you think
perhaps if that was settled, that situation has been fixed
because the same slaughterhouse was just cited by the EPA
for potential potential releases of ammonium gas, and in response,
they're paying a fine, and they're going above and beyond
what the EPA is doing and adding two hundred and
(07:57):
fifty thousand dollars worth of redundancies to ensure that what
didn't happen but the EPA said could would not happen.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
The EPA investigation actually showed that they were mishandling anhydrous ammonia,
which is a very dangerous chemical. Superior Farms has claimed
for the last year that they were doing everything correctly.
This new report shows that they were lying about that.
They're lying about that, why should we trust them about
the other things They said.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Well, everybody who's being fined by the EPA is going
to say they didn't do it. I mean, that's a
pretty standard response. Nobody immediately capitulates.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
They said that they were mishandling the ammonia and now
they're fixing it. So why were they claiming that they
were doing everything correctly for the last year.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
When this shows that's not the case.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
We also have the Clean Water Act violations which have
been going on for over four years. But I want
to go back to the jobs question. I think that
we all have a line with animal cruelty.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
Let's say it were.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Nineteen seventy four, and dog fighting was talking about being banned.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
Would you say keeping a dog fighting? You keep throwing
up the comparisons designed to evoke emotional response instead of
talking about the reality, which is this is a legal
product which people want to consume. Your organization is trying
to make it prohibitively expensive and then shut down the
farming that makes meat affordable in the first place. So
your theater trying.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
You a way comfortable with the way animals are treated
on factory farms and the waterhouses. They feel like it's
a really hard choice to not eat meat because of
the way our society is structured. That's why we're tackling
this at a systemic issue. Forty nine percent of Americans
want to ban factory farms.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Follow up question to those people and if your meat
costs double, would you still be in favor of banning it?
I guarantee you that number would drop considerably.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Do you think that it's acceptable for animals to be
confined by the hundreds of thousands in sheds where twenty
five percent of them die before they even reach the slaughterhouse.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
I buy my meat from a rancher that is doing
things cows grazing things of that nature. I try to
be a responsible consumer, but ultimately I have to trust
other consumers to those choices. I think that if you
want to be a vegan and make animal rights at
the center of your life, I think that's fantastic, absolutely fantastic.
But when you start to try to put people out
(10:09):
of work, you try to use violations from other different
slaughterhouses in California, not then not you specifically in the
news media, there's things going around that you're trying to lose.
Use things in California. There's no evidence of us doing that.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
The one in California is the same company, and an
investigation revealed lamps being kicked front around, suffering well before
they died.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
But that hasn't happened here.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
We have evidence based on testimonials that there are many
animal welfare violations at the plant in Denver. We don't
have video evidence, but I don't see why it would
be different if it's the same company and there's so
much worker testimonial corroborating that investigation.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Well, perhaps go at it from that point of view,
but I'm a firm no on both of these media.
And to get to three oh eight I'm not a
person notoriously cruel.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
They all so confine wild animals for their entire lives,
and every fall their bludgeon to death or gas to
preserve the product. Over ninety percent of fur comes from
fur factory farms. It's unnecessary animal cruelty. We have alternative materials,
just like dogfighting is unnecessary entertainment. This is unnecessary animal cruelty,
and we should evolve beyond it. Because you're right that
(11:21):
humans are different from other animals.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
We have moral agency.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
We can make choices based on right and wrong, and
based on our understanding of the world. Now that we
know that these animals are suffering massively in these places,
it's time for us to evolve away from treating them
like objects.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
Natalie Fault, and you are a fine advocate for your position.
Thank you, you really are. You are fine advocate. I still
think you're wrong, but I think you are a fine
advocate for your position, and I very much appreciate you
coming in today to make your case. You might have
changed someone's mind hotly. You never know. Well, just see
what happened on the vote. Sing a little song for
you before we're We're very late. So yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
That song eight six seven five three No nine. I'm
vote yes. I'm three O eight, I'm three oh nah
yea on just so everyone can remember, vote yes for
animals this November if you want to see a better
future for everyone.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That is Natalie Fulton with pro I'm sorry, Pro Animal Future. Natalie,
thank you. We'll be right Batch
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