Guilt

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Of the law and order franchises. SVU is considered especially watchable.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
vicious felonies. These episodes are based on.

Speaker 3 (00:09):
These are our stories.

Speaker 4 (00:11):
Done done, Yay, that's messed up.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
At SVU podcast, my name is Lisa and my name
is Kara, and every week we take you into the
depths of an SVU episode as well as the true
crime it was based on.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
And we talk to a guest.

Speaker 1 (00:42):
Not today, but you know a lot of times we do,
and we've got great guests coming up, so don't worry
about that. But today it's just us and we're going
to chat and listen. This is our first time talking
intro wise on the pod since the election, and we
don't have to dwell on it. But we're not happy.

(01:03):
I don't think I need to tell you guys that.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
No, there's fear, there's dread, and then there's moments of
joy on the micro level because people around me are good,
you know, and yeah, there's community and art and like things,
and then but also grateful that I'm not the most
vulnerable right now. We have to like hold I don't know,
be there for people it's a nightmare the dread hits.

(01:28):
But oh my god, yesterday. Okay, so I'm under the weather.
You might hear this me my voice, but I did
go out last night and I had spots, but I
wasn't touching people right like if you wanted a hug.

Speaker 3 (01:38):
I was like, listen, I'm feeling under the weather, like elbows, elbows.

Speaker 2 (01:42):
And then a comic, who I fucking hate, part of
the little Nazi free speech brigade. He came to say hi,
and I gave him two high fives with my germy
jermy hand.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
You're like, actually, I've always wanted to kiss you. Get
in here, buddy. Yeah, but then.

Speaker 2 (01:57):
He heard he actually saw me to someone else be
like I'm under the weather elbow and then he took
hands sanitates er out and put it on his hands.
But yeah, I did it on purpose, bitch, I am
a terrorist. No, And and this leads to this next thing.
If you voted for our new president, we would prefer

(02:18):
I don't know, this isn't for you.

Speaker 1 (02:19):
This show's up for you.

Speaker 2 (02:20):
You don't get to enjoy our our our work, our
labor in then vote against everything we believe in with
our show and the subject matter, but with the other
people that listen to us. So if you want to
vote for scum, go listen to kid rock Like there
you know Tim Allen I think has a few movies out.

Speaker 1 (02:37):
You can go watch that.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
Like, you don't get to fucking vote against us, our
rights and the people.

Speaker 3 (02:43):
I enjoy our ship.

Speaker 1 (02:45):
I know our people are feeling stressed. And if you
think that this is the guy that's gonna fucking fix it,
I don't know what to tell you. I don't think
we're the place. I don't think we're the place for
this isn't for you. Don't write a thing of Oh
but you're not being tolerant.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, well I'm not tolerant of your dumba fucking ass
if you're if you're voting for policy that's gonna endanger
human lives here, Like, go fuck yourself. You don't get
to listen to our podcast. Get gone. You are not welcome.
I mean you need you, Like.

Speaker 3 (03:14):
If he gets rid of the ACA, I lose my insurance.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
That's my health insurance for my family that I already
say a lot for Like what am I gonna do?
I'm gonna have? Like you know, it's like these are
real like stresses people have and people are like, oh,
but eggs. It's like, I know, there's he's he literally
is hiring Elon Musk. He's hiring all these people to
do jobs they don't know how to. Like that are insane.
It's just so crazy.

Speaker 2 (03:38):
The Department of Education, Environment, FDA, health, everything is gonna
be run by Bozo Claris.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
Kay An anti vaxer is gonna be leading like the
Department of Health. Whatever.

Speaker 2 (03:50):
I just I'm sorry to you. Yeah, as listeners, you know,
we're pissed. We want to make sure that if you
voted for him, you are not wealthy come to listen
to us. We do not want you here and the
rest of us, you know, we're enraged. We're gonna have
constant thoughts and feelings about it. But I also want
to do the show that we love to do. Yeah,
you know, Yeah, I don't want to ignore the dread

(04:14):
and you know, horrors, and I hope I'm wrong about everything,
you know.

Speaker 1 (04:17):
Yeah, And we obviously we're obviously going to use our
platform to like, you know, resist as much as we can.
We'll be sharing information over the next like however many
years into we last or this pot or this presidency last,
like we'll be sharing information on how to and resources
and stuff. But and I hope everybody is doing okay

(04:37):
out there, especially people that, yeah, this is going to
affect the most directly. But unfortunately, I think people that
voted for him, this is gonna affect very directly.

Speaker 3 (04:45):
Well that's the batligning for me.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
At least the people that voted for him, their lives
will get worse too. And that's all I really have
to cling on too, because I can't wait till your
kids don't have schools to go to and there's no
food on the show. At least you're you're suffering, and
that's all that these people that are like, don't worry
if he comes for you, I'll still fight for your rights,
not me. I'll step on your fucking throat as I

(05:10):
step over your body, Like that's.

Speaker 1 (05:11):
How I feel.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Yeah, I can't wait for your life to get worse.
I hope your farm goes under your crops fucking dust up.
I hope your car breaking. I hope you Yeah, I
hope you can never go to the doctor again. I
hope the worst, and I hope the worst for all
the fifteen million that decided not to vote to yeah,
not only vote for him. The people that were like,
I'm gonna I'm gonna make a stand, well cool, cool, Yeah,

(05:35):
Well the.

Speaker 3 (05:36):
Soviet Union States of America.

Speaker 1 (05:38):
Here we are. RFK is gonna take the fluoride out
of the water. Okay, but and we're not gonna be
Andy Cohen. We're not gonna be Andy Cohen.

Speaker 2 (05:47):
And watch what happens live going it's a great country
and it's the country I love, and half.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
The population's happy. I'm not doing that.

Speaker 1 (05:54):
Alwa is that what he said?

Speaker 4 (05:55):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (05:55):
Everyone is.

Speaker 2 (05:56):
I got messages from clothing browns already like cool red,
Like people want, people want their jobs, people want their listeners.
Because there was like a caller and watch what happens
that was like, ugh, this gross country and he goes, No.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
America is amazing and we love it here.

Speaker 2 (06:10):
And like the day after the election, I mean, they're
all gonna do it.

Speaker 1 (06:14):
I didn't know that.

Speaker 4 (06:15):
No, Andy, they all are gonna do it.

Speaker 2 (06:18):
And I saw a thing online about like all this
all these white women, they're all don't don't let the
turfs get you, don't. Yeah, it's all it happens fast.

Speaker 1 (06:31):
And you know, my friend I mean, my friend who
lives in La He's he's like, he's like he says
he's going to Canada because he's like the training wheels
are off. He's like, this is like he's gonna go
around things. Because I was texting him because he's he
knows like a lot. I was like, is he really
gonna get rid of the ACA? Like that's my insurance?
Like I'm really nervous, and she was like, I don't
think he'll do He'll probably not do anything legally, like

(06:53):
it would go around, it would circumvent legal channels. So
who fucking knows. I'm just gonna like hold my nose
and try to get through the next four years. I
don't know how we're gonna fucking do it. And if
you're one of these people that's like I come to
this podcast to escape and not hear about politics, it's like,
I'm sorry, this is a podcast about crimes against women
and children and the justice system, and that's just intrinsically

(07:14):
linked to politics. And you know how we fit. Our
president's a rapists. Yeah, that's another thing. Our president's a
rapist who almost played a part on an SVU. If
you can believe that he was almost in the episode design.
According to SVU inside Information, apparently, anyway, how have you

(07:35):
been other than that, I haven't seen you in a
long time? Has uh what's been going on? I mean
a hard time living with these radiators. It's going to
be a lot winter. It's going to be a winter.
I am struggling, I am sick. I could barely breathe.
I'm not sleeping through the night.

Speaker 3 (07:53):
Are the radiators just like trying you out? Is that
the deal?

Speaker 1 (07:56):
Like? Because that's what I remember.

Speaker 2 (07:57):
Well, they're also clinging and clanging, and it's also just hot.
I have the full but I can't fully open the
window because it's the city streets of New York in
the morning.

Speaker 3 (08:08):
But my air conditioners on, all the fans are on.

Speaker 2 (08:10):
My window is fully open at all times, and it
is just blasting heat. I am sick, I'm coughing, and
I if you've never lived in New York City, this
is just a thing we have to deal with. Is
that a lot of the buildings there is no little
thermostat on your wall that tells you what can like,
what temperature you want to make it. It's literally just
heat when it wants to be heat and then it's not.

Speaker 1 (08:32):
So that was how my apartment was too, and it
was and there's not very many like tips. There's just
like put a towel and are a blanket on it.
And I'm like, okay, that literally sounds like a fire
hazard of some kind too. I don't want you to
do that.

Speaker 2 (08:48):
I know they're like, just put a wet towel on.
I'm like, won't. It's sizzle. I mean, I'm lucky to
have a way.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
I'm worried about you in a boiling hot apartment with
bracelet glue, just like working on your racelesson getting poisoned.

Speaker 4 (09:02):
I know.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Casey Muskraves is this week, Taylor Swift's next week. I
wish I got to enjoy the Swift concert with like
a different type of prevent presidency.

Speaker 1 (09:10):
Well.

Speaker 2 (09:10):
So funny that it's already November because we were someone
was talking about the you know, the Paul Tyson fight
and I was like, wait, what, No, that's in November
and they're like it's no Vember?

Speaker 1 (09:19):
No, what what? I can't believe it. I was like, oh,
Lisa's not going at Taylor for like a month, Like
I completely what's the date again?

Speaker 2 (09:27):
The twenty first, and then my show's the twenty second,
So if you guys can come November twenty second, Yes,
you can see me do comedy.

Speaker 3 (09:35):
You see Lisa at the Royal.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
If you go to That's Messed Up Live, or you
go to Lisa's Instagram, you can see, like on Lat's
Mess Up Live, it says Lisa's website and it's or
Lisa's Instagram and that has like the link tree to
all the tickets. But that's where you guys saw us.
That's a great venue. Go check it out and it'll
be the day after, so you'll have all your stories
from the concert, right, yeah, and hopefully my voice, but

(09:58):
I all, yeah, I'm it's really excited. It's nearing and
nearing and you have the outfit. I placed my vote.
I did vote in the poll. Yeah, I won't go
the floral one. People like the floral Yeah, that's what
I voted for me. Yeah, people like it.

Speaker 2 (10:15):
It's the most like in theme and I could wear
my glitter one the next day.

Speaker 1 (10:18):
And I just think it's gonna pop in pictures. It's
gonna be like those are your pictures from it? Like,
you know, I think it's gonna be.

Speaker 2 (10:24):
And Julia is wearing like a black sea through reputation
style things, so we could both be in black.

Speaker 1 (10:30):
And be a little bit well.

Speaker 2 (10:34):
It's like the flowers from her piano from her surprise song.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
It's like, oh, okay, sick.

Speaker 2 (10:41):
And then it's also a nod like copy dupe of
her Grammy dress in the folklore era. Got it okay,
So that's what that is. But she dropped her holiday
collection today. I will not be buying it, do not worry.

Speaker 1 (10:58):
Wait, but speaking of a holiday collection, we don't have
a collection, but we have one item in our shop.
We have that's messed Up holiday ornament. It's very cute.
It's like our little logo and it says, hope your
holidays are messed up you guys. You should get it
for your tree, for your hanka bush, for your office.
And it's available at our store, which you can you know,

(11:18):
click on through our Instagram or shop our merch at
that's messed Up live dot com. And yeah, just wanted
to shout out the shout out the ornament, but also, yeah,
the holidays are coming up, guys. Shop all of our stuff.
We got a lot of do have children detective stuff.
We've still got a few purple sweatshirts available. The fanny
packs are on sale.

Speaker 3 (11:37):
We got stuff. Get on there. Get shopping.

Speaker 1 (11:43):
Also a big life milestone for me as I did
go to Medieval Times for the first time.

Speaker 2 (11:48):
What did you get? Because you can't eat a turkey leg?
What do they give you meal?

Speaker 1 (11:53):
No? They So I took Rosie I was. I was
a chaperone on a rosy field trip to medieval Times,
which some of the parents in the group. In our
group chat were like why and I was like, I
don't know, It's just fun, like just let it go.
So we took them to medieval Times on a bus
and I got my meal was like fruit and apasta
salad with veggies that that I thought was, I mean,

(12:14):
pretty good for medieval Times. A lot of the kids
did not want the food. They just like, I think,
eating with their hands and like just ripping apart at chicken.
They're only five, you know, they were kind of like what.
But some were really going to town on it and
having a blast. But they were mesmerized by the performance.
I mean like they loved it. They were loving it,

(12:35):
and I was only vaguely tuning into like the story
of like oh, the night has to fight for me
because of blah blah blah, because I was helping so
many kids like open packages and open water bottles and stuff.
But they did like a whole thing about social media
where they were like, I don't have a device that
sends magic communications and pretending like they didn't know what

(12:58):
it was. But then the whole lesson was like, if
you use social media, don't spread rumors, like make sure
that you're not like spreading misinformation. Like if you get
if you see something, just make sure you fact check it.
Like that seemed to be the message at medieval times,
and that was really making me laugh, especially because five
year olds they had no fucking idea. But there were
all aged kids there. It's a real shit show there

(13:19):
in the middle of the day. It's just a billion
children and screaming, and they're like, if you've got a
yellow car, to go over there, if your card is green,
go over there.

Speaker 3 (13:28):
Like it's crazy, but you know, we had a good time.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (13:32):
I only went once.

Speaker 3 (13:33):
Yeah, I went once, and I remember I loved it.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
Yeah. Yeah. Oh and some of those nights could get it.
There were some hot nights. I mean, like we're in
La so I'm sure some of them are like trying
to be actors and aren't hot. It was it was cute.
I caught a carnation from one of them. Rosie and
I were like holding our hands up when he was
throwing carnations and he threw one right at us. We
caught it, gave it to Rosie. Wow, I unlike, unlike,

(13:57):
what was that? Did you see some fuck? Uh? I
know we're a little bit past, like the big baseball
season and all, like the World Series stuff, but like
those fans that just ripped a baseball out of the
player's mitt, Yeah, of course I saw that. Like just
people are it's psychotic. It's psychotic.

Speaker 2 (14:13):
And what's crazy is the guy that did that with
the Cubs like twenty years ago truly had to go
into witness protection, like if they were got him apart.

Speaker 1 (14:21):
Yeah Bart something.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
I was like, is it Bart may On or something?

Speaker 1 (14:25):
But I mean enemy number one And now.

Speaker 2 (14:28):
People are like yeah, so it's kind of but it's
disgusting and I'm glad that they lost, like because there
was two like the beginning of the series. Someone just
caught it and it was kind of like an axe
maybe not like it was a little rough and tumble,
but not And then the second time it was like
they were one of them was opening this man like.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
This guy's glove. It was abuse, Like they should be
banned for life. It was.

Speaker 2 (14:52):
It was really insane. Honestly, Yeah, it's it's well level
at all. Well, also, I caught that on the internet. Also,
I'm in the middle of a bit of a situation
myself on the Internet where I'm waking up every single
morning to fifty comments from people telling me that I
look like Gail from Bob's Burgers, because well, no, first

(15:16):
of all, like so just for contact everybody, I went
on my friend Steph Tolev's podcast called Steph Infection, and
she's like, does anyone ever tell you look like someone
from Bob's Burgers? And I go, yeah, I get Linda
a lot because people say I have like Linda energy
or whatever, and I kind of style my hair where
it flips on the bottom or whatever, and so I've
gotten Linda f YOUTI have.

Speaker 3 (15:35):
She goes, are you kidding? You look like Gail?

Speaker 1 (15:37):
And then I know the show vaguely, so I knew
who Gail was, but like she whips out a picture
and it's just like a woman with a chin that
goes right into a neck, which is so insulting, and
so I like fake, I'm fake yelling at my friend.
I'm like, oh my god, this is what you fucking
think of me, like I'm yelling at her. And then
obviously the clip is funny. I look like I'm getting
really reled up. I'm not.

Speaker 3 (15:58):
I'm not upset. Do I think I look like Gail?
Not really? I asked my children. They said no.

Speaker 1 (16:04):
But like I'm yelling at Steph to just be funny
on the podcast, and everyone's like, she's so pressed, she's
so mad.

Speaker 3 (16:11):
Oh my god, this is so Gail.

Speaker 1 (16:13):
And I'm like, you know what, I'm fine with the comments,
except the ones that are going it's the fact that
she has no jawline.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
I'm like, stop, it's so mean.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
Don't say I have no jaw line. I think I
actually have a pretty big chit.

Speaker 3 (16:25):
I've been really sensitivebout my chin my whole life.

Speaker 1 (16:27):
It's very big. But they think it just blends right
into my neck and that I have bangs and that
I talk like I'm from the Midwest, because Gail talks like,
you know, right, isn't she like Linda bab like she
talks like a Midwest person and how does Linda. But
Linda's more New Yorky. I think Linda's more well, she's
a little bit bob but like she's like, oh, what

(16:48):
do you guys do in where we go? When I
don't know, maybe I'm just making these sound exactly the
same Casey's nodding.

Speaker 3 (16:54):
I'm like, you know, I love.

Speaker 1 (16:55):
John Roberts, I love the guy who voices Linda, and
I love Megan Malally Like it's not, uh, I'm not.
It's just to wake up every morning and have everybody
telling you that you look like this fucking dorky looking character.
But I think she's a beloved character. So I'm trying
not to take it too personally. But it has like.

Speaker 3 (17:12):
It's like it's like creeping up on a million views,
like what the fuck?

Speaker 1 (17:16):
Like people just love seeing people get mad on the internet,
and I think everybody thinks I'm super pissed in the video,
so they're all just like, wait.

Speaker 3 (17:23):
Are you paying attention to the chicken fry?

Speaker 1 (17:26):
Okay, so I heard about this on who Weekly, you know,
my my source for all like C lists celebrity and
I just don't know who these people are. He's a
country singer. She's Ariana chicken Fry. What I just read that? Yeah,
saw that they are Brianna. Sorry, sorry I read You know,
chicken Fry is not her name. Someone just her legs
look like chicken fries and then chicken fries. Yes, and

(17:50):
and she's like a beautiful girl. I'm like, wow, if
I can, if she can just be called chicken Fry, now,
I guess I can be Gail, you know whatever. We
all just have to we have to be what the
internet calls us. But but like what happened, like because
when I had listened to the episode on Weekly, it
was so new in the breakup that they had just
sort of both posted it and you couldn't tell who
was at fault or whatever.

Speaker 3 (18:10):
Is there more gossip to it or what?

Speaker 2 (18:13):
I don't know if it's goss Okay, Like, if she
was my friend, I'd probably go to her house, take
her phone and say why don't we why don't we.

Speaker 3 (18:22):
Go up stake for a couple of days?

Speaker 2 (18:23):
Yeah, I think I would.

Speaker 1 (18:25):
If I was a good friend of hers, I'd be like, honey,
let's not let's stop going on live. You know, I
think I'd be there for her. Oh, I believe her.
I think he was probably abusive.

Speaker 2 (18:35):
He emotionally control it like it was, you know, ruined everything.
So basically, she has a podcast with one of the
scum of the earth, Dave Portnoy. Even though I love Peaches,
he did vote for Trump and go for herself, so
and he's barstool. I don't know why I thought I was,
but I was mesmerized by Peaches. I do love this dog,
and so miss Peaches my bad. So Brianna, this other

(18:56):
young guy and Dave Portnoy have like a bff's podcast,
and so she did an episode of this podcast kind
of talking about the breakoup because they broke up and
then he posted about it right away online and without
any warning to her, right, and so she just kind
of opened up and was like, yeah, the night of
the Grammy or the Golden Globes, he's texting me you
look like shit, You're like a slut. I can't believe

(19:17):
I'm dating someone that looks like you, like all this
mean stuff, but then posting gorgeous photos of her, going wow,
look at my beautiful girlfriend.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
And so there's just a.

Speaker 2 (19:25):
Lot of like and people that listen all the time,
are like, yeah, she has lost a lot of weight
and looked more stressed than on edge, and I was
emotionally abused. I know what this is like, someone controlling
and ruining your life and wanting to change you.

Speaker 3 (19:38):
And so I think he probably cheated on her.

Speaker 2 (19:41):
She gave him everything she had and he kind of
treated her like shit, and she's a shame that she
stayed with someone like that. But because of her erratic
online behavior and talking so much about it, and because
she's a woman, there's obviously tons of people that are like,
you're the crazy one now, bitch, don't you know?

Speaker 1 (19:57):
We don't care.

Speaker 2 (19:58):
And so but Zack Bryan's getting roasted, like people are
speaking out against him and they hate him, and.

Speaker 3 (20:03):
So like, I'm not So that's all I know.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
But now the other layer is that Zach Bryan offered
her twelve million dollars to sign an NDA and two properties,
and she turned it down because other of his exes
have done it.

Speaker 3 (20:20):
And she goes, I can make my own money.

Speaker 2 (20:22):
I don't want to have control over me, and like
forever he would have this over me and I can't
speak and it's like my voice. Yeah, but her best friend,
this girl Grace. They have a podcast together. I don't
know if it's still going on or if there was
a rift or what, but like they're these best friends,
and people are saying, since she's not speaking, maybe she
took the money and signed an NDA, like the best friend.

Speaker 1 (20:44):
Oh shit.

Speaker 2 (20:46):
So that's kind of a rumor too. But yeah, so
that's why because it was like twelve million dollars. So
people are like, oh my god, she didn't sign the NDA.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
Damn. I'm just looking at him. I don't like the
look of this guy. I don't like the life. He
looks like a purp on SVU or something. Yeah, like
no East gross. Yeah. Yeah, And I'm sure.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
She was excited to date him and they had something
and you know, patterns and shit like I don't really know,
but I would be like, let's let's take a trip
if she was my friend. But I don't know if
Grace signed a thing.

Speaker 1 (21:20):
Or what, like I take the focus off, let's stop
focusing on this and maybe go to OHI or something. Yeah,
I hear you, damn.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
But you're allowed to fucking get dumped and go crazy online,
like allowed to process, okay, process things.

Speaker 1 (21:38):
Yeah, but I hope she has a good friend right
now it feels like maybe not.

Speaker 2 (21:44):
Well, yeah, so I don't know what's going on with
this friendship because they've started touring kind of separate and
doing separate things, and like I don't I don't really know.
But I saw them together at the Tom Brady Roast
whenever that was in May. Oh yeah, yeah, so I
don't know, kind of like I I just uh, that's all.

Speaker 1 (22:03):
That's all.

Speaker 2 (22:03):
Like, I'm still I'm still about all about Moodang, you
know what I mean, Like I still am looking at
like twenty to forty photos of Moodang a day.

Speaker 1 (22:14):
Amazing.

Speaker 3 (22:15):
That's that's what's keeping me going.

Speaker 1 (22:18):
I was gonna say, though, this is circling back. I'm glad.
I'm not glad that you're not feeling good and have
a cold, but I'm sort of glad that it's happening
now so you'll be totally healthy by next week for
the big knock yeah yeah, knock on wood.

Speaker 3 (22:34):
You know it's like you just have to sleep. It's annoying.

Speaker 1 (22:37):
Yeah yeah, And I know you're and I guess I'm
the go Yeah, let's sorright, we gotta see. Yeah, let's
start that one of my favorites, one of my favorites. Yeah,
this is this is going back into the vault or
the early season. So let's go, okay, we are doing

(22:59):
the episode guilt.

Speaker 3 (23:01):
It is season three, episode eighteen, and.

Speaker 1 (23:04):
I like, I confuse it with yeah, but I forgot
which one this was until the minute it started. I go, okay,
this one, but it was like it gave me kind
of the feeling of watching it anew, even though I
have seen it like ten times. So it opens the
cold open opens with a man walking into a train
station and he greets a teen boy with a hug.

(23:25):
Oh Sammy, good to see you. Glad you called. The
teen looks like upset. He's like, something happened my mom.
I think she knows, and like the minute you hear that,
you're like, oh, I thought this was like an uncle
or something, or an old teacher. This is not good.
The grown man looks very mind open. I know I knew,
we knew they were a MELA station, but the way

(23:45):
they played at the beginning, he is like, hey, what's up.
They're happy to see each other, and you're like, oh,
an old coach, Like I don't know, and then grown
man looks very concerned and he's like, did you say anything?
And then we see Finn kind of skulking around in
the background, so we know the is a bust. And
then the team Clockspin, who was wearing the most obvious
earpiece of all time, like, I mean Finn's earpiece, like

(24:06):
he's got his slick back ponytail.

Speaker 3 (24:08):
And the earpieces like hello, it's me.

Speaker 1 (24:10):
And then Maloney is there ear pieces also popping, and
then we cut to the oldest looking tape recorder of
all time, like it looks like from the eighties when
there's like a ransom like message sent and it's Alex
Cabot is in another room listening to the whole conversation
between the kid and the guy go down. So this
kid's wearing a wire. This is a full bust. The

(24:32):
kid's mom is also in the room with Cabbage. She
looks very stressed. The adult man keeps saying, don't worry,
nothing illegal happened. We're just good friends. I mean yuck,
And then back to the station live in montre there
as well, watching from afar. This kid is getting more pressure.
Is he's seasoned? He's seasoned, Yes, he knows Durindez. Say it, well,

(24:54):
say it and write it. Regret it?

Speaker 3 (24:56):
Yes, yes, say it, forget it, write it, regret it.

Speaker 1 (25:00):
So this guy is like, you know, just like we're
good baby, no worries, and then the teen is just
getting more and more stressed, and finally he tells the
guy run and he's like huh and he's like they're listening. Run.

Speaker 3 (25:13):
So then there's a chase in the train station.

Speaker 1 (25:15):
This guy avoids all the cops like somehow, he's like
random people are getting taken down, and then Finn cuts
him off and totally grabs him, which is very fun
and exciting little chase, and then they haul this guy
off lives like what the fuck just happened? And Craigan,
Cabot and the mom they must have been literally in
a room right off of the train station because now
they're there and they're like the kid warned him, and

(25:37):
the mom is like, you did good, and it's like, no,
you told a pedophile to run, So I mean, it's like,
I don't want a victim blame, but you did not
do amazing, sweetie. And then Cabot's like, you guys, it
wasn't enough. And that's the credits, So already, what's happening
where I'm intrigued.

Speaker 3 (25:54):
In cement room bars now with this man.

Speaker 1 (25:57):
His name is Roy Barnett and his lawyer is Roger
crest Or, a shark played by the late great net Eisenberg.
Bent's and his table are trying to get him to
talk and trying to bluff that everything he said on
the tape is incriminating, but like this guy kind of
knows what's up, and he's We find out that this
guy's been bringing Sam kavanaughf this team to his apartment

(26:17):
for four years. I'm molesting him and the guy's like no, no, no, no,
He's a troubled teen. He makes stuff up to see
what will happen. And they're like how howe yes, yeah,
you said the exact same thing about another boy in
nineteen eighty five and then another boy in nineteen ninety
and it's like you always know those are just the
ones that he's getting caught for, you know. And he
says he spends time with Sam because he feels bad
for him. He needs a father figure, boys need to

(26:39):
talk to a man, et cetera, et cetera. He's just
like I just feel so responsible and like, I have
to help teens.

Speaker 3 (26:45):
I don't know what it is about me. I'm just
such a good guy.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
And he claims that these incidents in nineteen eighty five
and nineteen ninety were like misunderstanding whatever, but he did
serve time for them and had like a parole officer
and everything. So on the other side of the glass
watching this interrogation is Cabot, Daddy, Craigan, and Huang. They
all know this guy is putting on an act. They're
like the Oscar goes to this fucking perve. Cabot and
Craigan don't understand why the boy has been working with

(27:11):
them for a month and then still chose to sabotage
the whole operation. And Wong says, because part of Sam
cares for this guy. I mean he's been four years.
Sam told his mom about the abuse, but the mom
is the one who called the cops. Like Sam is
kind of protecting this guy because it is a man
in his mind who he loves and who loves him.
And Cabot's like, whatever, we don't have a case. Craigan's like,

(27:34):
we got to get the kid to testify. And he's like, Huong,
you talk to him find out where his head is.
And Huong's like, ah, victims this kid's age think because
their assailant is male, they're worried that they might be gay,
and my present might be presents might be seen as
an accusation.

Speaker 3 (27:49):
And I always wonder if he's saying that.

Speaker 1 (27:51):
Because he's gay or just because he's a man and
they think a woman should talk to him.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
I think because I don't think he's come out at
this point.

Speaker 2 (28:01):
No, they didn't even think. They didn't even think about that,
you know, because yeah, when B. D. Wong was on,
he said it, it was kind of annoying. He felt
like they shoehorned it in, right, right, I don't. Yeah,
but it is Neil Bear so.

Speaker 1 (28:14):
Right exactly, Okay, so it could be a subtle hint, Yeah,
who knows. But Huang goes, listen, remember that this kid
thinks this whole thing is his fault, and the hardest
part is going to be convincing him that he's wrong.
So now Cabot goes to talk to Sam and she's like,
you know, love Cabot, gorgeous, very competent, not the warmest
woman in the world to like really go heart to

(28:36):
heart with a teen, you know, like, and she's like no,
you're like sorry, the law's the lot and the child
is going to prison. Yeah yeah, and she's like I'm
sorry you had to go through this. Like she's just
very like you know, dead pan, and she's like and
no one is mad at you for telling him what happened.
And he's like, yeah, right, you guys are pissed. I
blew it like I know you're mad. And Cabot's like, no, no,

(28:58):
it's okay to care about what happens to him. None
of this is your fault. And his immediate reaction is
to clarify I'm not gay, I have a girlfriend, and
Cabot's like okay, and then he starts screaming like I'm
not a slur. I want to go home, Like he's
said a slur a couple times, like he's very concerned
that that's what she thinks. And then he runs out
and his mom is there with the entire squad and

(29:20):
he wants to leave, and the mom's like, okay, we're
done here. We tried to help you guys out, We're done,
Like this is over. She's like I cannot put him
through this whole thing again. It's just not going to happen.
And they're like, Okay, well, Barnett's gonna get out and
of jail tomorrow. We don't have much time. Kragan's like
track down Barnett's court mandated therapist from his earlier charges,

(29:41):
which I don't know why the guy's allowed to talk
to them, but I'll get into that. Stable's like, we
got to get into his apartment. Guys like this collect
mementos and you know, keepsakes from their crimes.

Speaker 3 (29:50):
Do we have cause for a warrant?

Speaker 1 (29:52):
And Cabot goes plenty and I'm like, why wasn't this
done immediately after the accusation was filed, Like why, Like
they've been serving this guy for a month, but he
was accused. Why wouldn't that be enough for a warrant?
I guess maybe because it's like he said, he said,
he said. I don't know. But at Barnett's apartment, it
turns out Stabler was wrong. They cannot find any stuff
from this guy's victims. Just a ton of hetero adult porn.

(30:15):
It's like, as they say in the episode, it's a
teen boy paradise, but nothing is illegal. So now we're
at teru and friend of the pod at Ruben Morales
is Joel de la Fuente is there and he's like, uh,
this computer is like two hundred gigs and it's like
one hundred and ninety nine gigs are porn, but nothing
with kids, he says. He's like, it also looks like
this guy clears out his hard drive daily and uses

(30:38):
a scrubbing software shifts at all. No normal normal you
need to get the old porn out and get the
new porn in. You know, you got to clear every day.
So this guy's using like a pretty high tech scrubbing software,
so they can't even find the deleted images. You know.
It's like always like, oh no, it's in there somewhere.
You just got to find a nerd to find it
for you. No, this guy uses the software, so it's gone.

(30:59):
He said, if you gave me six months and fifty
K and an electron microscope, I might be able to
find something. But there's also no guarantees, so we're not
giving you all that stuff. Sorry about that, Morales. So
Finn and Munch are now talking to this therapist who
I don't know, I guess is just allowed to say
whatever because the guy is a criminal. He's just like
kind of telling them. It seems like it'll be privileged,
but he's just like, Okay, I'm an open book. And

(31:22):
he's like Barnett was one of the most gifted liars
I've ever met, Like he fooled everyone into thinking he
was cured, but I could tell it was an act.
And the therapist is like, oh, he just loved listening
to the other sex offenders disclose their crimes like this guy.
Oh maybe because it's parole group, it's not the same
as a therapist. Oh okay, Okay, that's just a guess.

Speaker 3 (31:42):
That's just a guess.

Speaker 2 (31:43):
Yeah, could be to other episodes, because I feel like
those guys always talk.

Speaker 1 (31:47):
I remember them they were looking for Yeah, but then
there's like women that are like that run victim groups
that are like I can't say anything or no one
will come to our victim groups. But I guess this
is different because they're assailants. So yeah, like that was
just that's just some ethics and not like ethical, right right, Yeah,
that's probably it. So he goes guys like this, The

(32:09):
shrink goes guys like this are why I left this
prison system and started teaching. At one point, he says,
Barnett admitted to molesting over one hundred boys. But like,
I don't get why you didn't have to disclose that,
Like that's a crime. You would have had to say.
But I guess again, he's like a prison therapist. Probably
hears about crimes all the time. They're like, oh, any names,

(32:30):
dates or places, and they're like, no, he's smart, Like
he's too smart for that. He's more calculating than your
average pedophile. He's a true predator, unrepentant and unstoppable, and
no amount of therapy will change him. Yikes.

Speaker 3 (32:41):
Scary.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
So next that's I think they lay that out for
you so that it kind of excuses why Cabot is
like going to the ends of the earth in this episode.
So next scene, we've got Bureau chief Elizabeth Donnelly in
her first ever appearance on SVU. This is her first moment,
her first episode episode, the episode Guilt is first. She's
a bitch from moment one. I mean they hit the

(33:04):
ground running, sure, like, yeah, they never liked each other,
but I guess there's respect, but like, no nonsense from
the get go. Have you heard all this stuff that
Judith Light, Like, I know we've I've read the thing
about how she told Stephanie Marsh like, you don't need
to have kids, like you can have a perfectly great
life without kids. But she also lives I think, on

(33:24):
an opposite coast from her husband, like her and her
husband lived in live ins suppert homes, and she's like,
that's how marriage works for me, babies, and that's how
I do it. We've been happily married for decades, and
I just think Judith Light is the shit and if
anyone knows her, we need her, we want her. She's
laying into Cabot, like you guys don't have shit. How
much more time and how many more resources are you

(33:45):
gonna waste on this? And Cabot's like, this guy's smart,
but I know we can get him. And Donaldy's like,
I had your job for ten years. None of these
guys are Rhodes scholars. And then Cabot's like, well, you
pled this guy down when you had my job, and
Donaldy's like, how dare you? Like her face is like
it was a first offense and there was no evidence,
but let's compare records. Sure, and then she's like shitting

(34:07):
on Cabot for this being a slam dunk and how
Cabot totally blew it. I don't get how Cabot gets
a lot, a lot of shit in this episode. Wait,
how did cabt blow it? I know you're projecting you
blew it. Yeah, we set this guy up for a
meet at a busy train station. We did a lot.
But Cabot is now at the Kavanaugh apartment, Sam's apartment,
trying to convince his mom to get back on board.

(34:29):
She She's like, I want to make Barnett paid for
what he did. He's going to keep doing this if
we don't get him, and the mom tries to argue,
but Cabot eventually like brings her around, and she walks
over to Sam, who's been within ear shot of the
entire conversation. I mean, he knows what she's about to
ask him. And she's like, I know this is so hard.
It's my fault. I'll never forgive myself for letting that
man get near you. You tell me what you want

(34:50):
to do, and I'll let this lady go. I'll tell
her to get out of here. You just tell me,
and whatever you want to do, we'll do it. Like
the mom, this is actually like such a lovely scene
between the mom and the sun. It always this is
like very touching to me. And then Sam goes, I'll
do it. I'll do the trial. So he wants to,
you know, I hopefully he wants to make this guy.
Put this guy away so we can't do each other kids.

(35:11):
Sam is now outside the courtroom with Stabler. Stable's trying
to like relax his nerves, like tell him about how,
oh I've my first time testifying. I fucked up before testifying,
blah blah blah. And he's like, is Roy going to
be in there? And Maloney says, no, not while you're testifying.
You never have to see him, and he goes, I
don't care. But it's like I think you probably do care.
But it's because this is a grand jury, he doesn't

(35:33):
actually have to face him. And Stabler's like, no one
thinks this is easy for you. This takes guts and
courage and when you're a man, you got to do
hard stuff and that's what you're doing. So he's Stable's
really trying to play into this guy's like you know,
father figure issues his you know his you're straight, you're
a man, we get it. You're good and so now
it's time for grand jury. Sam says, the first time

(35:54):
Barnett made him feel uncomfortable, he was twelve years old. Ugh.
He was at Barnett's home. They were hanging out. He
gave him a beer. He started showing me stuff, magazines,
pictures of girls. He talked about how guys like to
look at this stuff because it feels good and it's
not bad to do it. And the kid's getting very
choked up describing it. He's like, he says. Barnett says,

(36:15):
I can show you how to do it because I'm
older and all guys do this and you could be
a man just like me. And you know, it's like
it's what we've seen like time and time again on
this show. It's like hang out buddies, father Figure, give
him a little bit of booze, show him some porn,
and then you know, go into the illegal activities. Afterward,
Cabot is walking with Sam and his mom and she's

(36:37):
like villaandite quickly like don't worry, and then Stabler goes, Sam,
you did great. They're about to leave, when, of course,
good old SVU Logistics Barnett shows up in the hallway,
makes prolonged eye contact with Sam. Stablers like keep walking
dirt bag. This guy smirks, we hate him. Then suddenly
I actually had to rewatch it twice because I couldn't
tell if it was Sam doing it. But it's another

(37:00):
dude out of nowhere who just lunges at Barnett knocks
Cabot to the ground, and he goes, burn in hell,
you six son of a bitch. You ruined my life.

Speaker 3 (37:08):
So who's this?

Speaker 1 (37:10):
So now we're talking to this dude in the woodblind's
room with Benson and Stabler, and he's saying, I thought
I was over it, but then I saw Barnett on
the news. It all came flooding back to me. It
started when I was eleven. He coached my baseball team
and he picked out, you know, special kids for extra practice,
and he goes, there were a few kids who just

(37:30):
stopped going or moved, but I kept going back for
five years. Eventually, you have to admit that you keep
going back by choice, like I could have stopped. And
Stabler's like, I don't care if he was ten years
he took away your choice, like the minute he touched you,
and he goes, I got older and he told me
to stop coming around, told me to bring my friends,
my younger friends, whose fault is that? And they're like,

(37:52):
still Barnett's fault, like not yours, and they're like, we
want names of other victims. But he's like it was
a long time ago. He wants to press charges now,
but sadly, he's twenty seven and the statute of limitations
has expired. He has to have reported the abuse within
five years of his eighteenth birthday, which I think we've covered.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
This has changed, but so that's it.

Speaker 1 (38:12):
The guy says, he's like I waited too long and
he gets away with it. Ugh, really heartbreaking because it's
like you had to do it by twenty three. He
is twenty seven, like he's only four years past it,
and it's just like how arbitrary is it? Like just
that amount of time.

Speaker 3 (38:27):
So now Kresler is.

Speaker 1 (38:28):
Telling Cabot that don't worry, my client wont press charges
about the assaults of this guy like lunging at him,
and Cabot's like, how generous, considering he doesn't have a
scratch on him, And Kresler's like, let's discuss a deal,
and he goes, we'll do custodial interference too. I don't
even know what that means, but that means like you
try to get involved with try to parent somebody without
being asked.

Speaker 3 (38:48):
I've never heard that charge, I don't think.

Speaker 1 (38:51):
And then she's like, lol, a misdemeanor instead of three
felony indictments. Get out of here. She basically tells him
to fuck write off. And she's like, why don't you
tell your guy to plead guilty and save us all
a lot of time? And she hates Kressler. She's like,
he's worse than the pedophile. He's hoping the victim is
too traumatized to testify, and she's lucky she didn't. He's
lucky she didn't kick his teeth down his throat. Creigan

(39:11):
was like, sign me up to see more of that, please,
And then back at the squad room, Benson has a
list of names that this twenty seven year old guy
whose name is Tommy priorre another fucking Tommy. Oh oh
my god, Like, I know there's a listener that's keeping
a list, and I hope you have this one on
the list. It's so nots how many Tommies there are.
It really is now that it's been pointed out, I

(39:32):
can never unsee it. Cabot goes, well, that could help
us establish a pattern of behavior, but the statute of
limitations has probably expired on all of these. Did Sam
maybe ever refer any friends to Barnett? Like, cause Sam
was getting up on sixteen years old, and so you
know it's possible Barnett wanted him to bring younger friends around,
So let's go check with him. Cabot's now at Sam's place,

(39:53):
like working on a trial prep with him over some takeout,
and she goes, you got I answered directly short answers.
Barnett will be there but he can't talk to you,
and he's like how long is it going to take?
And she's like, I'll try to make it as quick
as possible, but we don't really know. And Cabot then
starts to gently try to like fish for other names,
and Sam's like, yeah, I think there were other boys.

(40:15):
Roy kept telling him that he was getting older soon
and he wouldn't want to quote unquote be his friend anymore.
And so Sam's like telling this story to Cabot. He goes,
one time he picked me up early from school. We
went to the piers we took one of those tour
boats that goes all around the city. It was freezing
and I didn't have a jacket. He gave me his coat.
I'd never seen the city all lit up at night

(40:36):
like that before. Then he just bought me a burger
and took me home. He didn't even try anything, and
he goes, that was one of the best times I
ever had. How sick is that? And It's like, no,
it's like textbook. He's like giving you a perfect afternoon
with dad so that the next time he can do
whatever he wants, you know. And Cabbot goes, that's what
he wanted to make you like him because he knew
what he was doing was wrong. And Sam's like, so

(40:58):
he didn't really like me. You can tell that. That's
kind of like sad for him. And Cabbot just kind
of looks at him and he's like, yeah, no, that's
what I thought. And I'm just like noticing now that
Cabot has like a little band aid on the side
of her head from the scuffle at the courthouse, and
it is oh wow, and yeah, it's like she hit
the floor and it's like this little beet poop. And
then Sam leaves and he's like, I'll get a cab home,

(41:20):
and then cut.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
To a landline ringing in the middle of the night.

Speaker 1 (41:24):
It's a rare glimpse of Alex's Cabot at home, in
her natural habitat She's just in bed in the middle
of the night. She answers the phone and goes, oh
my God. Cuts to her at the hospital, Benson and
Stabler fill her in. Sam sadly tried to take his
own life. He asphyxiated by combining his anti depresence and aspirin.
Not sure how long he had stopped breathing, but he

(41:45):
is still alive. Sam's mom shows up glaring at Cabot,
telling her to get out.

Speaker 3 (41:51):
She lunges at her. Are you happy now?

Speaker 1 (41:53):
Stabler's like holding the mom back, and Benson kind of
shuffles Cabot out of their Cabot looks very shook and
the mom is like, all right, get off of me,
like makes Stabler leckover. But it is just kind of
wild that Cabot's getting all the shit when it's like, lady,
you went to your son and you said, what do
you want to do? We'll do whatever you want to do.
When he chose to do it, and Cabot's just been
trying to coach him, to help it, make it easy.

Speaker 3 (42:15):
But she's the scapegoat. She's the one everybody's mad at.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
So at the squadroom, everyone's still in their outfits from
the hospital. Craigan has the like the report that he
suffered from hypoxia which led to cardiac arrest. He's on
a respirator, there is brain activity. He could wake up,
but no one knows how much brain damage was done.
It's one of those things where they just have no
idea how much how bad it is. There was no note.

(42:39):
Cabot looks despondent, and Craigan is like, this kid had
problems way before you, and then she interrupts. She's like,
dump the phones. I want to know if Barnett made contact.
And Munch is like, already did it, babe. And it
turns out Sam made a fifteen second call to Barnett's
house around midnight. Fifteen seconds, and they're like, are you
going for coercion? It's going to be kind of tough
to prove that fifteen second call that the victim initiated,

(43:03):
but he could have given Sam the idea to take
his own life, and Kraigan's like, I want to crucify
this guy. Sabler goes, we got one hit off of
Tommy Priori's list. The guy's name is Benjamin Tucker, but
bad news. He's in Sing Sing convicted of molesting eight
year old girls. So not a perfect victim another or
not that there is, but you know the cop see

(43:24):
it that way. Cabots like set up the meeting. I
got to save this case. Kresler filed a motion to dismiss,
so fuck now. She's in chambers with Petrovski and the
late Great Joanna Merlin, and Kresler is arguing that the
completing witnesses incapacitated prosecution cannot meet its burden of proof,
and Cabot's like, it's been twelve hours, he's not dead.

(43:45):
This is premature, and Kresler's being Kressler, and Petrovski's like, dude,
it's really not cute how gleeful you are about this tragedy, Like, let's.

Speaker 3 (43:52):
Kill the enthusiasm.

Speaker 1 (43:53):
I loved that line. Yeah, what a dick. This was
an episode that we tried to get her full We
tried to get Joanna Merlin for this episode, and she
wrote us back and said, this sounds like a real like,
this sounds like a lot of fun. But she passed
like she liked the idea of the podcast, and then
she passed on doing the podcast, and then she did
pass away like months later or so I can understand why.

(44:15):
Maybe she didn't want to spend her the last months
of her life doing a podcast. But we love her
so much. But Petrowski says, this guy does have a
right to a speedy trial. Cabot like, I'll give you
three days. And Cabot's like, well, what about the grand
jury testimony? Can't that be readitt trial? And Kressler's like, well,
he wasn't cross examined. My client has a right to
confront his accuser. Cabot ret references people versus Garassi. When

(44:37):
a witness has been intimidated by a defendant, you can
use grand jury testimony, which we've seen before. We've seen
grand jury testimony when people have been like murdered or like,
you know.

Speaker 2 (44:47):
She argues and it's not the testimony. But I always
think of the Narda Leia episode where the girls like
her dying declaration and the oh yes exactly.

Speaker 1 (44:57):
When she has like sepsis so habit's arguing it. But
Petrov so many good episodes of the show.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
It's crazy, I know so many we haven't even touched yet.

Speaker 1 (45:07):
Cabbot tries to argue, but Petrovsky's like, bitch your bootstrapping.
The grand jury testimony is out. Cabot begs, but Petrovsky
is like, three days, babe, or I throw it out.
And then now we're at Sing Sing talking to Benjamin Tucker,
and this is Lee Pace, who is the actor from
Body's Body's Bodies. I only started to know about him
because Evan ross Katz is obsessed and posts him all

(45:28):
the time. Is like, because he's like six foot four,
he's very like hot and tall, gay actor, and he's
been in Twilight, Hobbit, like Marvel stuff. I just don't
know him from much, and I only know him from
Evan ross Katz's Instagram. And this is him in a
young role. And he tells Cabot, Benson, and Stabler, who
are all there at Sing Sing talking to him, He's like, yeah,

(45:50):
I started offending when I was eighteen. I had a
lot of anger and self hatred because of what Roy
Barnett did to me, and my parents were you know, distant,
and he's like, about that kid who odeed, I could testify,
and they're like, unfortunately, you have a history of lying
and trying to get your sentences reduced, so it's probably
not gonna happen. And they're like, well, did Roy keep

(46:11):
any mementos?

Speaker 3 (46:12):
W wait, did you say this? It's Lee Pace's first credit.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
Oh this is oh I didn't even know that, and beize, yeah,
it's his first credit, first credit. So they're like, did
he keep any mementos? And he goes, I don't remember,
and you know, they can kind of tell he's bullshitting,
and Cabot's like, what do you want? And he's like,
I want to transfer to a psych facility for sex offenders.
I don't belong in prison, and he admits. He's like,
I did terrible things, but now I know they were wrong,

(46:37):
and I'm going to stay away from temptation, no schools
or malls. It's like, I don't believe this guy. I
don't think anybody else does either, And Cabot's like, I'll
consider some like some kind of deal with you if
it leads to Burnett's conviction, and that's it, Like no
other deals take it or leave it right now, or
I'm out of here. So he agrees. He's like, Roy
is smart. He knew to never keep records. Videotapes were

(46:58):
his weakness. He would send them to us, And I'm
that seems like a big record. This is the smartest
pedophile in the world. You're just sending video evidence to
your victims. Like, what the fuck are we talking about here.
This is a guy who's gotten away with this for
years and years, Like, no mom has ever found a tape,
No one's ever gone to the police with a tape.
That's crazy to mail them to your victims. But I

(47:19):
guess that's how cocky he was and how confident he
was that he had these kids in like a choke
hold emotionally. So Tucker's like, he definitely would have sent
videos to that guy Sam, that kid like he couldn't
help himself. So they go to the hospital to talk
to Sam's mom. They're like, you gotta let us search
your house. She's like, no, leave, Like she's literally sitting

(47:40):
next to her comatose son, like cleaning his respirator tubes,
like she's not in the mood. And she's like, you
guys could have just shot him it maybe would have
been better. I don't ever want to see you people
ever again. So at the precinct, Cabot is pissed that
they didn't get through to the mom. But it's like, girl,
she hates you guys. What about Tucker. Cabot's like, fuck no,
he's the worst witness ever. Stabler is needling her like, well,

(48:01):
why don't you make him a good witness? And she
gets pissy with Stabler and she's like, I try the
cases that you guys give me. You don't like the evidence,
go find some more. I can't do your job too.
Craigan goes, you're not alone mad in this Like I
have never seen her this mad. She's so mad and
it's really good. Like Craigan goes, you're out of line,
and she goes, I'm not out of line. And I
don't work for you. You work for me, and your

(48:23):
sole purpose is to give me a case I can proxecute, prosecute,
not one I have to fix. So then Cragan does
gentle parenting here, This is what I would call gentle parenting.
Craigan goes, so tell us, how can we help you?
What can we do to help you win this case,
and Cabot like calms down, she regulates, she goes, nothing,
You've done all you can, and then she just walks out.

(48:45):
Now at trial, Cabot is requesting a continuance to gather
additional evidence, and Petrovski's like, girl, like I told you
three days. She dismisses the case and Cabot looks like
she just got punched in the fucking gut. Now, Cabot's
walking and talking with Petrowski like, I gotta get a
warrant to search the Kavanaugh house and like Petrovski's like,
oh cool, where are the tapes? She's like at the

(49:07):
Kavitol House And she's like, and you've got a reliable
source and she's like, well, it's a guy who's in
sing sing for a sex offense. Petrovsky's like, I cannot
believe you even came to me with this, Like this
is wild. She's like, I can't order a search based
on the dubious word of a convicted pedophile.

Speaker 3 (49:22):
I know, but he was also molested.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
Yes, because this is season three, I do think a judge,
like in more current seasons, would be like Jess, because
someone's incarcerated, It doesn't negate their victim status or like
any information they could help with the case. You know,
in fact, it's a huge part of the prison industrial
complex that people reap people that are victims, offend and reoffend,
and you know, it's like that's part of it. So

(49:49):
she goes, you look like hell, Alexandra gets some sleep,
So now Sailor's getting to work, and Benson's like, we
got a head to the Cavanaughs. Alex must have called
in a big favor to get a warrant. So now
they're there at the Cavanaughs, and cab it is like
telling missus Kavanaugh, your house is a crime scene. Your
son's suicide attempt is being treated as an attempted homicide
because it was never investigated. So it's like she's loopholing

(50:11):
some shit. Here. The mom tries to shut the door
in Cabot's face, but she stops her, and she's like,
I'll take the blame for what happened to Sam, but
don't let Roy Barnett get away with this, and then
she the woman. The mom glares at Cabot but does
let her in, and Benson asks Cabot, are there restrictions
on the warrant the search warrant and Cabbot just goes, Nope,
whatever you can bind. So Stabler finds a cubby hole

(50:32):
in the back of like a shelf of Sam's closet
that has a package in it with a return address
that is Barnett's, and I'm like, in my mind, I'm like, this.

Speaker 3 (50:42):
Kid worked with the cops for a month and didn't
turn this in.

Speaker 1 (50:44):
But then they go it's unopened, and I'm like, okay,
so the guy got this package from this guy and
just too traumatized, didn't open it, just hit it. But okay,
they open it up, spill it out four VHS tapes,
and you know it's not It's not just like some
fun dizzy movies. So they show up to Barnett's home.
He's mid move. Look at that someone's leaving town, and

(51:05):
they arrest his ass. Benson and Stables show up at
the squad. They're like, Barnett's in processing, let's all go
do shots at Mulligans and let's celebrate, and Finn's like,
not a good idea. And then this is where Finn
goes Dad's mad, which I think is like a line
that we love and I can't remember.

Speaker 3 (51:20):
I could remember it was from this episode. He goes,
Dad's mad and it's really good.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
Craigan goes, get your asses into my office, So yeah,
Dad is pissed. Craigan accuses them of searching the Kavanaugh
place without consent, and they're like, we had a search warrant,
and Craigan goes try again. They look stunned. Craigan's piecing
it together. They're like, are you saying Cabot told you
she had a warrant? Stabler goes, I don't remember, and
she's like she didn't, and then Benson goes, she didn't

(51:47):
actually say, but like she told us to meet her there,
and basically the search implied she had a warrant. And
Benson says Cabot was trying to protect us. The taped
show Barnett with half a dozen boys. We would have
never known about these boys, and k Kraigan's like, yeah,
but if the judge throws them out, it's like we
never did, so that's fucked. It's like, you do have
to find everything the right way. In court. Kressler is

(52:11):
now screaming to the rooftops that Cabot lied her way
into the Kavanaugh's home with an illegal search, and Cabot tries,
we were investigating the suicide attempt, and Petrovski is not
buying it. Krestler's like, this is a Fourth Amendment violation,
and Cabot argues Barnett's rights were not violated. Only Linda
Kavanaugh's rights were violated. But she is not the defendant.
He has no standing to contest a search of someone

(52:33):
else's home. And Krestler's like, so what, You're like the Gestapo.
You could just march into anybody's house at any time.
And Petrovsky says, while I deplore the ada Cabot's actions,
I have to agree with her. The illegal search of
Linda Kavanaugh's home is a civil tourt. The defendant's privacy
was not violated. But then Petrovski lays into Cabot, the

(52:55):
liberties you've taken, the disdain toward the law. It's unethical
and it's a just grace to your position. I will
recommend your office look into your actions. And you've done
yourself a disservice in my courtroom. I won't forget it.
And Cabbot looks like not that bothered. She's kind of like,
h okay, I'll send you a nice bottle of Scotch
or something like that. Like she doesn't look that.

Speaker 3 (53:17):
Upset well because she got away with it.

Speaker 1 (53:19):
Yeah, yeah, Cabot tells goes out and tells Benson and
Stabler the tapes are in, and she goes, well, Petrofsky
acted like I killed her dog and another she goes,
just add another enemy to the list. It's like, yeah,
but most of your enemies are like drug dealers, not
like judges that you need for Warrens. And they do
go on to have a very sweet relationship, like I
do think they have. Like when Cabbot comes back from

(53:40):
witness protection, Petrofski like hates the man that like did
the fake killing, right, Like she's like, that was my friend,
Alex Cabot, And she tells Benson and Stabler or Cabot
does She's like, you guys were never in jeopardy. I
made sure it was all gonna fall on me. And
they're like, you still should have told us, and Alex like,
I'm sorry you were in the middle of this, but
I'm not sorry about the rest of it. So cut
to the arrange where they're just announcing a never ending

(54:02):
list of charges against this scumbag Roy Burnett about all
the stuff they found on the tape. It's like sodomy, coercion,
it's like everything. He glares at Alex and she looks
so smug and satisfied as she should. And this guy
knows he's fucked, like he's probably never getting out of jail.
And Sam's mom is in the gallery and so at
least she got to see this guy fucking get you know,

(54:23):
legally put away. Cut to Donnelly giving Cabot a one
month suspension without pay, and she's like, that's a gift,
so don't argue.

Speaker 3 (54:31):
Donnelly goes, Luckily, LANDA.

Speaker 1 (54:33):
Kavanaugh decided not to file a civil suit against you, me,
the NYPD, or the city for your illegal search. Congrats
on setting back civil liberties about two hundred years. She goes, well,
it was her choice to let me in, like cause
Cabot did stop the door. But then the woman did
like just turn around and say yeah, come on in,
so or like not yeah, come on in, but she
didn't stop them anymore.

Speaker 3 (54:53):
So I don't know. It's just kind of a sneaky move.

Speaker 1 (54:57):
I like it. And Donnelly goes, no, you decided that
for her you think that makes you passionate and righteous,
and Cabot goes, I take full responsibility. She goes, of
course you took it for the greater good, the safety
of society. But that's bullshit. You did this for you,
And Cabot's like, I did this for hundreds of Barnet's
future victims, and she goes, no, you did it for one,
for Sam Kavanaugh. Did it work? Did it assuade your guilt?

(55:20):
And Alex says no, I don't think that's gonna happen
anytime soon, and Donnallee goes, I got news for you.
It won't happen ever, and Alex looks stunned. And then
that is Dick Wolf baby.

Speaker 4 (55:33):
Bam.

Speaker 2 (55:33):
All right, sad and yeah, more sadness. Oh wait, yeah,
so I.

Speaker 1 (55:40):
Can't wait to hear the real life story. So there's
two cases.

Speaker 4 (55:51):
Here, and there's a lot.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
Of overlap with the episode and all of it and
both of them. So, okay, this is the Peter Dudley
Albertson case. Peter met a set of brothers in nineteen
eighty five while working as a counselor slash lifeguard at
Monkton Summer Camp.

Speaker 1 (56:11):
So uh oh, camp.

Speaker 2 (56:13):
Oh, I don't like a camp thing now, but I
guess that's There's like a girl on TikTok. Her dad's
an SVU detective and she has a viral TikTok where
she's like things my dad did as an SVU detective
and dad that you might be mad about. And one
was he would never send the kids. It's like no sleepovers,
no summer camp, and no going to the bathroom by

(56:33):
herself was a kid.

Speaker 1 (56:35):
Okay, I guess that's this dad SVU. Guys, I'm letting
my kids do all three of those already. So u oh.

Speaker 2 (56:42):
So it's matt and Justin Wilkie and like this dude
befriended them and their parents before starting to molest the
boys at his Hampton row house. The boys were eleven
and nine when they met, and then the abuse began
was when Justin was eleven and Matthew was thirteen, and
he molested the boys for nearly two years, and he

(57:04):
befriended the parents in such a way that they allowed
the brothers to spend.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
Weekends with this dude. Oh ye ye.

Speaker 2 (57:10):
And then Matthew kept its secret for the whole two
years and then finally told his mother and she reported it.
And this dude was arrested in nineteen ninety on a
series of crimes, and the prosecutors to make a deal
dropped the charges involving Matt and most of those involving Justin,
and in return, Albertson pled guilty to one count of

(57:31):
child abuse from molesting Justin. What that's not enough? Two
years of abuse? One count?

Speaker 1 (57:36):
Like that so fucked up?

Speaker 2 (57:37):
What was the deal? Why was it a deal? Oh,
it gets even worse, it gets even worse. Well, they
didn't they didn't want the boys to testify, so they
didn't want to traumatize them more So, if this guy's,
you know, pled guilty, it would be easier. But he
only got three years and then five years probation. But

(57:58):
then there were recommendations for psychologists and prosecutors in nineteen
ninety and the judge suspended his three year prison term
and just gave him probation and with a condition, and
only one condition, stay away from Justin.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
And he didn't. That's so fucked Oh my god. Uh
like it's like what also, I don't get why, Like,
if it's kids involved in cases, why can't we just
like videotape them in a room with like someone asking
them a list of questions, and both sides get to
write down the list of questions and that's it. And
you don't have to be there in the same room
with the person that did this to you, and you

(58:36):
don't have to be like there's no reporters like for kids, Like,
why can't we like do that? It seems so crazy.
You can be able to confront your accuser. But the
reason people choose people this young is because they know
they'll be too scared.

Speaker 2 (58:48):
Oh yeah, and it's like kids don't have adult rights,
so if you do that, that means you don't get
the right to like see your accuser.

Speaker 3 (58:56):
And corps like fuck off.

Speaker 1 (58:58):
Ugh.

Speaker 2 (58:58):
So yeah, the motherfucker just got probation and some psychological
help and they're like, please stay away from the kids.
He violated his probation and stock Justin sent love letters.
He showed up to Justin's nineteen ninety four graduation from
Layola High School.

Speaker 3 (59:16):
He showed up in the driveway of his home his
favorite hangouts.

Speaker 2 (59:19):
Justin was so scared that eventually Albertson would kill him
for not being able to have him, So Justin was
sent two videos of child abuse videos.

Speaker 1 (59:29):
But because this.

Speaker 2 (59:31):
Guy was in Germany, it counted as like a federal offense.
So the Albertson was in Germany, and in May nineteen
ninety five, right before the probation was going to expire,
Albertson mailed a package for Justin's nineteenth birthday, and the
video was so explicit, and by mailing it to the US,

(59:53):
and it was it was a tape and a card
and two letters that totaled twenty five pages. This kind
of just destroyed the whole family. So within fifteen months
of mailing the tape in nineteen ninety five, Justin, Matt,
and their father all took their own lives and God
and all in the same way, all with like cars

(01:00:15):
and carbon monoxide.

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
Yeah, the tape, I read like represented the family's inability
to keep this motherfucker away. And so the father, Dawn,
was fifty six. He was devastated by what happened to
his son. His marriage fell apart, his ex wife moved
to Florida, and then two days after Thanksgiving in nineteen
ninety five, he exfixiated himself in his car and then
three months later, Justin ended his life in the same way,

(01:00:41):
and there was a note in the car that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:43):
Said, I hate you Pete.

Speaker 2 (01:00:46):
And that's by the Tampa Bay Times, that is who
reported that quote. And August nineteen ninety six, Matt, who
believed he should have done more to protect his brother,
funneled carbon monoxide into his car after diving deep into
a Baltimore County cornfields. The boys are I know, I know,

(01:01:06):
it's not a good one. And the boy's aunt said
to the Baltimore son that if this was done right
to begin with, we wouldn't be here today.

Speaker 3 (01:01:15):
It's terrible.

Speaker 2 (01:01:16):
And the assistant state's Attorney, Jan m Alexander, a man.
I know Jan could go the other way, but I
want it to be clear. It's a man said that
this has haunted him and been such a hard thing.
This is to the Baltimore son, he said, I did
sex crimes for six years, and you always want to
try to protect the kids.

Speaker 3 (01:01:34):
This is a prosecutor's nightmare.

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
But this is the.

Speaker 2 (01:01:38):
Same guy who thought a three year prison term in
five year probation was reasonable since Albertson had no criminal
pass and that the Wilke's mother didn't want her sons
to testify an open court.

Speaker 1 (01:01:49):
I just don't get why the cops why he was
not arrested for violating this stay away from Justin rule
when he showed up at the high school graduation and
he did all this shit, Like why, I don't get it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:02):
And so at this time, he then pleads guilty to
violating the probation, and the Baltimore Circuit Court judge is
Edward J. Angaletti, and he accepted the guilty plea, and
then Albertson was sentenced to a ten year federal prison
term for sending Justin the tape of child abuse videos
without the possibility of parole. And that was the max

(01:02:24):
was the ten years. But he's just so sick. In
an open court, he told spectators in a stunned court
in quotes, I loved Justin. According to the Baltimore Paper,
he continued, I loved him very much. And when they
told me he wasn't old enough at fourteen, I said, okay,
I'll wait for him. He was like a sick He

(01:02:45):
was like, he's like, no one misses him more than me,
like in front of his fucking family. And then he continued,
he was my family, he was my friend, he was
my brother and my lover, and he made a fifteen
minute statement and the judge gave the max. But then
US District Judge William Nickerson called this sentence unfortunately inadequate.

(01:03:06):
I agree, especially with the facts of the case. And
that's to the Tampa Bay Times, And so then the
judge added an extra three years to his sentence for
violating the probation like a long time ago. Okay, I'm
still a little too late, like fuck you and Angeletti,
you should not be sitting on the bench.

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
So and I.

Speaker 2 (01:03:25):
Feel if they're saying Judith Leif's character did something like
this and the show, she shouldn't be on the fucking bench.

Speaker 1 (01:03:31):
Yeah, it's like disgusting. I can't.

Speaker 2 (01:03:35):
I don't know how someone molests kids for years and
gets probation, Like it's so fucked up. And yeah, so
you were reinstated the jail time he should have had
to begin with. And then again at the Baltimore Sun,
it seemed no amount of jail time would keep Albertson
from abusing children. And that's a quote from the judge,
And I'm like, yeah, so why would you let him go? Yeah,

(01:03:57):
I couldn't find him in the sexual registry, which it
seems fucked up. I should be able to see where
he lives. But I did find him in the federal
inmate lock look up so but he hasn't been in
custody since January seventeenth, two thousand and eight, and I
couldn't find an obituary either.

Speaker 1 (01:04:14):
I wonder if he changed his name.

Speaker 2 (01:04:16):
Should I tell them? World should be telling? Should I
tell the FBI that he like, why isn't he on
the list?

Speaker 1 (01:04:21):
Like? Where is this guy? Or maybe he has like
maybe he's one of these guys, Like did you try?
I mean, yeah, because if you looked up Peter Dudley Albertson,
it would have given you Dudley Peter too, like in
case he was like a kind of guy that went
by his middle name or something like that.

Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
I did a lot of options, yeah, a lot of
different options of all the names.

Speaker 1 (01:04:39):
Weird, sir, that's weird. He should be on a registry.
Is a federal registry. It's not by state.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
They have state ones and they have federal This was
a federal crime.

Speaker 1 (01:04:50):
Interesting. I don't know. That's crazy. I think you should
give a little tip tip to the FBI. No, where's
the sky. I really want to.

Speaker 2 (01:04:56):
Know, so and then the next case even worse if that,
if you can even imagine, well, I don't know. It
all seems really bad. So the will we don't have
to compare tragedies. So it's the William Gode case. And
this guy is believed to have abused up to three
five hundred boys. And one of his quotes is like

(01:05:17):
direct from the episode, like he was bragging one year,
but he denies it. He is quoted saying, oh, I
beat my record this year and it was like one
hundred and forty five boys for the year.

Speaker 3 (01:05:27):
So and he was doing this for decades. It's fucked up.

Speaker 2 (01:05:30):
But even like I'm reading the news about the you know,
thirty five hundred boys and it's on the BBC where
Jimmy several works, and they allowed him, you know, to
they knew that he was abusing kids, So it's all
just so kind of twisted. The Plymouth Herald in the
UK called him a sex beast, and he was a
millionaire businessman. He owned discount shops and market stalls, and

(01:05:52):
he groomed his victims by offering them jobs and then
slowly inviting them into his home and then not only
did the abuse happen in his home, but at the
warehouses in his van camping trips, and he had a
cottage in Darmoor. The abuse is believed to have gone
back as far as nineteen sixty five. That's why the
numbers are like in the thousands. Yeah, but the abuse,

(01:06:17):
like they don't have to believe it.

Speaker 3 (01:06:19):
There's a trail.

Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
And this is one of those things that make us
so mad on this podcast because there's a fucking history.
So in October of nineteen seventy two he had a
conviction and indecency with a child and in decent assault
on a male. He got probation for three years. I
don't know what this is about molesters only getting probation. Yeah,

(01:06:42):
like a pedophile probation program is confusing to me. And
then in nineteen eighty he was convicted of two counts
of indecent assault, two counts of procuring an act of
gross indecency, and one count of indecency with children. And
finally in April nineteen eighty seven, he was convicted of
three indecent assault and sentenced to six months imprisonment and

(01:07:04):
suspended for two years, which I guess is probably like
probation in England.

Speaker 1 (01:07:08):
In nineteen ninety one, he opens.

Speaker 2 (01:07:10):
This market, so he's like so he like serves time
and then is able to just like party on and
make this cool market that kids get to go to.
And nineteen ninety four finally a boy comes forward about
the abuse, and in nineteen ninety five he's arrested, but
then the court said that further charges would be an

(01:07:30):
abusive process and the case was dropped. What yeah, And
then in nineteen ninety six and nineteen ninety seven further
allegations against God are formally made to police and then
to go backwards, like he owned two houses that overlooked
school playgrounds, so he was still after all of these
able to like live next to schools. He also set

(01:07:53):
up play areas in his Cornish market world. There was
a Kid's World with a z kids World's Adventure Play,
one of the largest indoor children's playparks, and the staff,
in quotes to the Plymouth Herald, said he would happily
sit and watch the children play for hours at a time.
He ran a camping club and then he started like

(01:08:15):
paying kids off to introduce him to their friends for
fifty pounds and he would silence children with drugs, money, sweets, toys,
and the classic of threatening violence to them and their
families if they told anybody. One boy was supposed to
kidnap someone for him but couldn't do it, and then
he was like raped and beaten worse than normal because

(01:08:37):
of it. And so there was just like good punishment.
And for decades people didn't believe these boys or care.
And it was found out that some of these kids
went to the police and the cops called them lying
little queers, and so that's cool, and of course I can't.
We both said, cool, okay, And of course he knew

(01:08:59):
how to pick his victims. He targeted boys whose parents
were on the breadline. That's not my word desperate. I
don't know England had breadlines, but maybe it's just a
saying desperate for any kind of maybe yeah, desperate for
any kind of financial support or aid. And then you know,
there'd be poor ass kids and he'd be like, well,
I have a job or a task and I can
give your family money. So he really appeared like a

(01:09:22):
saving grace to people. And then some boys lived in
children's homes and he had access to these homes as
a quote uncle, like he was just this like market
wizard of the community. And for some of the abuse
at home, Like for some of these kids, the abuse
was so bad at home that like his abuse was

(01:09:42):
chiller than the abuse they had at home, Oh so hard.
And like there's like one victim who lived in such
poverty that he said that he cried the first time
God hugged him because he had never been shown such
kindness before. So once these like inquiries started to bubble up,
in nineteen ninety eight, he fled to Thailand. He had

(01:10:04):
a false pass poor and he knew the police were
on his tail. And I wonder how, I wonder how
the cops knew all about this. There's more. So he
was arrested finally in two thousand and three. He pled
guilty to fourteen counts of serious sexual assault and two
counts of indecent assault. He was jailed in two thousand

(01:10:24):
and four at Plymouth Crown Court and he was sentenced
to life. He was jailed at age sixty, and a
lot of his victims were there and they cheered and
really had a joyous moment in that second I mean
probably complicated feelings. And then before this court case started,
though two of his victims did take their own life.

(01:10:45):
But after two thousand and eight, when all of us
like was legit and they could see that court was happening,
a lot more victims started coming forward, at a rate
of one a week. He tried to get parole in
twenty ten, but also not lol with what we've seen.
He died in prison though of natural causes, in twenty twelve,

(01:11:06):
at the age of sixty eight. So, Tom there's an
ex detective Shirley Thompson, and she said that many victims
spoke to her an inquiry in two thousand and three
that identified several other abusers, but senior officers wanted to
restrict the inquiry and focus just on God. Oh and

(01:11:28):
in twenty thirteen, she said this ring could still be
active today. So I think this was like a powerful
sex string of fucking freaks, and that's why the cops
didn't really do much. Yeah, And I think it's very Epstein. Yeah,
and I think it's like really powerful people. I couldn't
find more evidence, but I believe Thompson. But also this

(01:11:48):
case shows the depths of trauma from abuse for generations
of victims, you know, many you know hit the bottle,
the alcohol, drugs, you know, violence towards themselves and and
it also turned a lot of young boys into problematic criminals.
And a lot of these things eventually lead to death.
And no matter how many victims came forward about other

(01:12:10):
men in the ring and abusers, no no arrests were
ever made or like, no prosecution of any other suspected offenders.
And the only reason they investigated this at all is
because a report showed how they failed to do enough
for decades. They were forced to do all this and
then nothing really came of it. Detective Inspector Mike Cooper

(01:12:32):
to the Plymouth Herald only said, the reasons why we
did not formally proceed against any suspected offenders has been
fully explained to the.

Speaker 1 (01:12:40):
Victims, and that's it. Yeah, if you're like a millionaire,
I just kind of never believe you're working alone or
like heaven, you know, you don't have other names of people.
I just I'm not buying. Oh that's awful. Yeah, at least, yeah,
I mean, at least in this case. This guy fucking

(01:13:01):
died in jail.

Speaker 2 (01:13:03):
But now gas so well, so talking about their palette,
we'll just roll right into our post mortem.

Speaker 1 (01:13:16):
This episode, it's a nightmare, is a nightmare. It is
truly a nightmare. Family, a whole family. These fucking molesters, man,
I know, and Lilfish. Yeah, and just like these guys
that just do they I don't know. It's like this,
the main character in the episode, just so brazen and

(01:13:38):
like you think you're never gonna get caught, like you
just I guess you just do it for so long
that you don't get caught. And you're like, I'm the
best pedophile there is and no one's gonna catch me.
So I'm just gonna male videotapes of my crimes around,
Like yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:13:51):
The one thing is like listen, you don't even have
to go to jail, just leave this family alone. And
it's like, yeah, he can't do it, but fuck the
justice system. Why so much, Leewaye.

Speaker 1 (01:14:01):
So these fucking molesters, I know, lock them up, like what,
walk them up? Especially this guy in the episode. I
know he's not real, but like he had prior crimes
and they were It's like I think when there's repeat
crimes happening, it's like this is a person that cannot
be in society without hurting children.

Speaker 2 (01:14:20):
You know, it's just but it's one of my favorite
episodes in terms of, you know, the lawyer's breaking the
rules and like, yeah, kind of an exciting showdown.

Speaker 1 (01:14:33):
I just feel bad that everybody shits on Cowbot the
whole time when she's truly just trying to put away
a very very bad pedophile and everyone's like happy now,
like like, well, I'm really just trying to get justice
for your kid, but oh.

Speaker 2 (01:14:49):
Yeah, it shouldn't be so much on victim's statements, Like
we have to make it like we're so concerned with
rapists and criminals and murder, but also, you know, there's
so much injustice that way, but like we're so concerned
with them getting fair legal trial. We're not concerned with
rape victims having to testify and be confronted by their
people and like all of that stuff, Like why is

(01:15:11):
the priority not protecting victims but like making sure these
rapists no one says anything disparaging mistrial, Like yeah, yeah,
you know, yeah, well I get it, but it's just
it's frustrating.

Speaker 3 (01:15:26):
Yeah, well it's.

Speaker 1 (01:15:27):
Like what I said. I think when we were recording
the episode, I was like I get the the it's
constitutional and you have like the right to confront your
accuser or whatever, like that's in the law. But I
think with like, if you're under eighteen, like you're a
child that's going to cause you massive trauma, then why
can't it just be like videotaped in advance, like just
the lawyer and the child, and then the other person's

(01:15:47):
lawyer can go in there and there's a guardian, like
you can get crossings, you can cross examine the child.
I'm not saying the child just gets to tell the
story with no cross examination, but that they don't have
to sit in the room with their abuser. Like that
feels like a weird that feels like that's something we
should be able to loophole around, is all I'm saying,
Like we should be able to get around that.

Speaker 2 (01:16:05):
No, I mean forever, we would have to beg to
be like, hey, can we still prosecute these rapists? The
kids were scared, and it's like, yeah, it's a day
too late.

Speaker 1 (01:16:13):
Yeah they should have come to the cops earlier. Oh
they couldn't talk yet, fuck them, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:16:17):
Like it's so wild what we expect if people who
have just gone through like the worst thing ever. It's
so fucking weird. I don't know, not things even bring
me joy anymore. I mean, this fucking election. I mean,
I don't even play I'm not even playing Wordle every
day anymore. I'm not playing the games if I miss it, Like,

(01:16:38):
I don't even give a shit anymore.

Speaker 3 (01:16:40):
Cinematrix, are you okay, Lisa?

Speaker 1 (01:16:42):
What's I have?

Speaker 2 (01:16:43):
Every time I see Rosamond Pike, I'm like, oh my god,
get her out of this game. No, I don't know,
it's I just the zest is just I just want
to watch. Yeah, I'm still in my horror movie.

Speaker 1 (01:16:57):
Kick. Oh.

Speaker 3 (01:16:57):
I ran into someone who watched Barbarian because.

Speaker 2 (01:16:59):
They heard me talk about on the pot and then
oh yeah, yeah it felt thrilling.

Speaker 3 (01:17:03):
I like this influence I have over others.

Speaker 2 (01:17:06):
Maybe I should become a fascist dictator, kick people out
of their homes. I mean, it's crazy what people voted for.
Oh my god, I know.

Speaker 1 (01:17:17):
It's like speaking of people getting justice, Like, it's just
crazy that a couple of short months ago, we were
all watching Donald Trump fall asleep in a fucking courtroom
while he was getting you know, his convicted of thirty
six felony counts or whatever it is, and I was
so excited to see what was going to happen after
he lost, Like what justice he was going to see
And we'll never see it, you know. So that's just

(01:17:40):
another extra thing that I'm pissed about. We will never
uh will never, Oh my god, because people just like him.
They just think he's funny and cool. And I guess
he has a gold toilet, so they love that. But anyway,
let's let's move on to what would Sister Peg do
a little bit of good in this People are still

(01:18:00):
trying to do good in this world. And you know
what would sister Peg do is when we point you
guys to a resource that gives you more info about
today's episode, and today we wanted that resource to be
the National Sexual Violence Resource Center. We have recommended this
organization before, but it was years ago, and I just
thought I would give them another shout out. They are

(01:18:21):
the leading nonprofit and providing information and tools to prevent
and respond to sexual violence. Every April, nsvr C lead
Sexual Assault Awareness Month, which is SAAM abbreviated, and that's
a campaign to educate and engage the public in addressing
this widespread issue. So for more info, go to NSVRC

(01:18:41):
dot org. We will link to that in a story
the day the episode comes out, and that will be
saved forever in our WWSPD highlights where all of our
what would sister peg dos are saved. If you ever
want to, you know, giving season is upon us. If
you ever want to go back and give to any organizations,
you can always scroll through and see if any other
organizations we've recommended, you know, resonate with you.

Speaker 3 (01:19:03):
Oh my god, wait, hold on, care you're gonna like this.

Speaker 2 (01:19:06):
So, you know, I usually look crazy on flights, like sweatshirt, sweatpants,
I see, like, you know, do I already tell you this?

Speaker 1 (01:19:12):
No? So yeah, I'm usually messy bun. And I was.

Speaker 2 (01:19:16):
Shopping online and I saw kind of like a more
classy looking sweatsuit where it's like a little high neck
tank with like you know, those expensive pants our friend wears,
but it's like on a doupe of those like wrinkles
silky kind of pants. And I was like, oh, oh,
we're my new Jenny Kine sweater. You know, I'll kind
of spruce it up.

Speaker 1 (01:19:33):
I'll wear a boot.

Speaker 2 (01:19:34):
I mean, my family roast me from the moment I
got off the flight like it was like, are you
going to a meeting? They're like, what is this business casual?
Like no one let me even breathe an inch. And
then my mom used to work at a company and
Elan was like, wow, are you on lunch break from
new care services?

Speaker 3 (01:19:52):
Like they're like are you doing payroll today?

Speaker 2 (01:19:55):
Like no one understood why I was dressed in like
this business out.

Speaker 1 (01:19:59):
He quarterly review, like yeah, that is so funny.

Speaker 3 (01:20:04):
I was like, I'm going back to sweatshirts.

Speaker 1 (01:20:06):
I'm I don't need this messy comfort see through sweatpants.
Let's do it.

Speaker 3 (01:20:11):
Or maybe those were my sweatpants that are see through.

Speaker 1 (01:20:13):
I need to get new ones now.

Speaker 2 (01:20:15):
My favorite sweatpants the cratch rapped. I mean, it's so
hard to dress in these months for me. It's just
like I'm not good at winter where I am struggling.
I'm struggling on all accounts.

Speaker 1 (01:20:24):
I know.

Speaker 2 (01:20:25):
Also, no, I will not come at violence. I'm not
you know, I don't know, but I'm pissed. Yeah, but
I'll tell you what we're doing next week and the
beat goes on next week. I mean, it is crazy,
It's it's just crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:20:41):
It's like Joe Mandy always posts we live in hell,
and that's just like I think of that all. I'm
like always like, oh yeah, we live in hell, like
we live in hell.

Speaker 3 (01:20:48):
I have enough good memories that'll keep me warm, I guess. Yeah, Yeah,
I have my health for now.

Speaker 1 (01:20:55):
For now.

Speaker 2 (01:20:56):
Yeah, that's very Homer Simpson. It's the worst thing of
your life so far. The Ballad of Dwight and Irena.
That's what we're doing next week. Please join us, Season
twenty two, episode two. Yeah, if you want to get
your head out of the clouds of our democracy crumbling,

(01:21:19):
there's always a show about domestic violence you can really sink.

Speaker 1 (01:21:22):
Your teeth into, Yes, to really escape black. Yeah, we're
here to shepherd you through just a family get sex
crime show. All Right, we love you guys, hang in
there and we'll see you next week.

Speaker 2 (01:21:45):
That's Messed Up as an exactly right production.

Speaker 1 (01:21:48):
If you have compliments you'd like to give us, or
episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email
it That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:21:55):
Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod
and on Twitter at messed Up Pod, and follow us
personally at Kara Klank and.

Speaker 3 (01:22:04):
At glitter cheese.

Speaker 1 (01:22:05):
As always, please see our show notes for sources and
more information.

Speaker 2 (01:22:09):
Thank you so much to our senior producer Casey O'Brien
and our associate producer Christina Chamberlain.

Speaker 1 (01:22:15):
And to our mixer John Bradley and our guest booker
Patrick Cottner, and to Henry Kaperski for our theme song,
and Carly Geen Andrews for our artwork. Thank you to
our executive producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgareff, Daniel Kramer,
and everybody at Exactly Right Media. Dud dun

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Kara Klenk

Liza Treyger

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