August 20, 2025 • 18 mins
Feeling like the office weakest link in your new role? Your partner's "work wife / husband" making you seriously uncomfortable? Or maybe you're just trying to master the art of looking busy on those "done by lunch" WFH Fridays?
This week, we're serving up the exact strategies and scripts you need to handle these sticky situations - from reframing new role anxiety to having that awkward work wife conversation, plus tactical Friday WFH hacks.
What you'll learn:
• New Role Confidence Toolkit: Why the "drowning" feeling means you're doing it right, plus how to reframe imposter syndrome using the HP study that shows men apply at 60% qualified
• Friday WFH Survival Tactics: Specific strategies for spreading workload, scheduling emails, and staying available without being glued to your desk
• The Work Wife Conversation Script: Exact approaches for discussing boundaries with your partner and red flags to watch for when workplace friendships cross the line
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Got office politics nightmares or boss-from-hell situations? Send us a voice note or email us at podcast@mamamia.com.au. You can remain completely anonymous!
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HOSTS: Sarah Davidson and Em Vernem
SENIOR PRODUCER: Sophie Campbell
AUDIO PRODUCER: Leah Porges
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to Amma mea Podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Hello, and welcome back to Biz in Box. I'm Mmmrnham
and I'm Sarah Davidson. And the way these episodes work
is that you submit a workplace or career dilemma to
us via the link in our show notes, or you
can DM us on our Instagram biz by Mom and Mia,
and then we answer them here on our podcast. You
can put your name on your dilemma if you want to,
(00:36):
or you can remain completely anonymous. It is so up
to you.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Today we are unpacking some seriously relatable workplace drama that's
going to hit close to home. We're talking sneaky work
from home haacks that are going to make you rethink
your Friday afternoons. And we're diving deep into the murky waders.
Oh my god, of work wives.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Are they just.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Harmless workplace friendships or do they cross a line that
makes partners uncomfortable? This one's definitely going to divide the room.
I alread feeling a bit divided in my brain. But first,
m we've got someone who's gone from office hero to
feeling like they can barely keep up.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
We do? We have this DM sent in by Ellie.
She got in touch with us, and she said, I'm
in a new role and everyone seems to be flying
while I'm crawling. I used to be the one that
others could ask for help. Now I'm googling basic stuff
and afraid to speak up. How do you survive the
phase where you feel like the weakest link and not
lose yourself in the process. This is really sad. I'm
(01:38):
with you, Ellie. I feel this. I feel this so deeply.
I think to play Devil's Advocate, I genuinely don't think
you're meant to enter any new role and feel like
you're immediately soaring and doing so so well. And if
you do feel like that, you are immediately sowing in
your new role, I think you're going to get super bored,
(01:58):
super quickly, because the whole point of being in a
new role is that you're learning new skills, you're finding
your play, so you're learning how to develop yourself in
the new role, and you're meant to grow with that role.
It shouldn't be already established in a way where you
feel like you're just nailing it straight up. So I
think you give yourself some grace.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Sally one hundred percent. I don't know if I've mentioned
this one before. I probably have, because I force it
down everyone's throats because I think it's such a valuable
thing to remember. But there was a study done by
Hewlett Packard. But the crux of it was basically about
when people do apply for promotions or new roles. And
it's a mass generalization, so there are obviously exceptions to
(02:40):
this rule. But basically, men would apply for a promotion
when they had about sixty percent of the criteria, knowing
very logically that once you get to a new role,
as you said, m, you're meant to be a little
bit out of your depths, because otherwise you'd just stain
the one that you had on the go, you learn
the remaining forty percent, So they apply at sixty percent.
Women will wait not till they had one hundred percent
of the criteria. They wait until they have one hundred
(03:02):
and ten plus. So not only are they qualified for
the new role, overqualified because they are worried that they're
not good enough or that when they do get to
the role, there'll be that discomfort of not meeting all
the criteria and more. And because of that, women will
miss out. Even if there was no other institutional inequalities.
They will miss out on the promotion because men have
(03:22):
already applied, like purely based on time, men will think
they're ready a little bit earlier. And I think there's
something to be taken from that that the whole point
of stepping into something new is that you're meant to
be uncomfortable. You're not meant to already have all the
criteria when you get there. Otherwise it wouldn't there'd be
no point in taking the new position. You would have
already mastered that level. The whole idea is that you
(03:45):
do throw yourself into new levels of discomfort, and then obviously,
as you learn, that position becomes more comfortable. But the
whole crux of learning is discomfort. It is feeling a
little bit out of your depths. It is googling everything,
and that's a sign that you've taken an amazing step.
Like I kind of think that that uncomfortable feeling you're
experiencing early is a good thing. You should kind of.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Embrace that you're just doing what every man already does.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
Yeah, and that helps him get ahead. I think we've
got such a fear of feeling uncomfortable or ill equipped
or not ready, Like when you look at people's trajectories,
I think that people who really get ahead of the
ones who don't wait until they feel one hundred percent ready,
they're willing to go through that yucky phase where they
feel completely you know, scrambling, and they do feel like
(04:31):
the weakest link. And part of it, I think is
just pretending that you're more confident than you are and like.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Fake it till you make one hundred.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
It's a cliche for a reason. Or if you do
really need help, people know you're new, ask for help.
That's also not the sign of weakness that we sometimes
think it is.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Yeah, especially if it's a new role that has completely
new processes and stuff like there are certain things that
you have to learn on the go, Like you're not
just going to come in and know exactly how everything operates.
Give yourself some grace, Like I think this is such
a great opportunity. Also, there's a reason you're in this role,
Like people don't just hand out roles. So the leaders
in your team picked you out out of like so
(05:13):
many other people. I'm sure because I thought you were
perfect for this role. And just don't be scared of
that because I think you're gonna end up soaring and
end up loving it, and it will just take time.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
One hundred percent. Remember that question we had a couple
of weeks ago about how do you know if you
get into a new role and it's only been three
weeks and you already hate it. Similarly, I think if
you get into a new role and you are only
three weeks in and you already know everything and you've
already nailed everything and you're not feeling a little bit uncomfortable,
like there's novelty, then maybe it's not a big enough challenge.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
That's so true. Okay, our next question. We got this
via email from Kate and she said, I need some
sneaky work from home hacks. I work from home Fridays.
And now this is really interesting because here i'mmer Me,
and we work from home on Fridays as well, So
I wonder if Kate is within this company. Now, I'm
(06:05):
sure I work from home on Fridays and I'm usually
done by lunchtime, but my boss expects me to be
available until five pm, even when there's nothing left to do.
What are your best tricks for looking busy when you're
not scheduling emails to send later, keeping teams active, whatever
you figured out, I'll get all my work done. I
just want to enjoy my Friday RVO without getting in trouble. Now, Kate,
(06:29):
this is probably the lowest end of dilemmas we've ever received. Like,
this is like one of the best dilemmas I've ever
come across, because it feels like it's firstly not a
dilemma at all. The one thing I will say is
that do not tell your boss that you finished all
your work by lunchtime. That is not what a boss
(06:51):
wants to hear.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Or that you just want to enjoy your Friday afternoon.
We're getting in trouble. I feel like you can't vocalize
that that is your aim of the game.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
My boss expects me to be available until the five pm. Yeah,
that makes sense to me.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
It's a week day.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Are you probably available?
Speaker 1 (07:07):
But do you know what it does bring up a
very interesting point that I'm actually really glad Katie raised it,
because as much as it's not the biggest dilemma we've heard,
it is sort of an example of the way that
sometimes you are penalized for being efficient if you're faster,
you actually just end up doing you know, double trip
(07:29):
or the workload of your colleague, even though you're getting
paid the same. And I found that when I was
a lawyer, our whole time structure not so much now
and not in every law firm, but traditionally lawyers have
always builled for every six minute unit of their time
all day, every day. You have to build a client
for every six minutes, so you can't be a six
(07:51):
minute unit in your day that you don't know what
you are working on. So to meet your budget, it
was like how many units did you have to meet,
which actually meant that if you were slower, you met
your budget faster, and if you were it's slower, you
sort of made more bonuses. And if you were faster,
exactly like Katie, you would disadvantage because if you finish
(08:13):
your work really quickly, then you'd be under your targets
for billable hours. It'd look like you were not doing
as much work when you were actually just doing it faster,
so there was no incentive to go quicker. So I
understand what she's saying, even though I wouldn't necessarily phrase
it as I just want to finish my work quickly,
so I can have Friday afternoon drinks earlier. I do
think that if you are extremely fast, part of the
(08:34):
whole working from home ERA has been accepting that people
don't have to necessarily be doing FaceTime sitting at a
desk from nine to five in order to get all
their work done. So maybe you can schedule emails. If
you really do finish everything early in the morning in
front load the day, maybe you can kind of schedule
the submission of that work a little bit more efficiently.
(08:57):
I don't mean like work nine or twelve and then
just finish the day. Maybe you do have to be
available if that's what you're getting paid for, but I
think you can be a little bit strategic about not
disadvantaging yourself just because you're fast.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yes, spread it out, spread out the workload. I would
say though, like if you're scheduling in emails to send
at four thirty pm from nine am and around four
thirty pm, you're also like at the bar with the girls,
and then you get a reply at four thirty two
or something, you have to action. You have to go
back and action. Yes, you have to say just be aware,
(09:31):
like you can. I guess work from home. If you
finish all your work, like, great for you, but maybe
just do like at home tasks like you're washing cleaning
up your house, like doing your dishes. I would be
wary of actually going out, like be wary of how
far you're pushing that on, Like how much you're actually
doing on a workday.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Yeah, if the expectation is that you will be available
to action something, if it did come in at four thirty,
you probably need to be around. Like it's a hard one.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
You don't answer the phone and there's like screaming and
like like rave music in the background.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
It's my neighbor. What they're really last?
Speaker 2 (10:10):
I live?
Speaker 1 (10:10):
I live that apartment building.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yeah, sorry, watching TV, it's a race. I love watching
ray TV. Okay, our next one is an anonymous It
is anonymous DM. We got this on our Instagram and
it reads my husband has a work wife and I'm
starting to feel uncomfortable about it. They chat constantly, grab
(10:35):
coffee together and have all these inside jokes I'm not
part of. He talks about her all the time and
says it's a normal work friendship, but it feels more
than that to me. What even our work wife's supposed
to be Is this just a trendy term for close
work friendships or doesn't normalize relationships like cross boundaries. What
do you guys think about work wives? Am I being
(10:56):
paranoid or is my gut telling me something's off here?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Oh? Oh, this is so hard because I do think
that there's something that's really familiar about calling someone your
work wife or work husband, and on the one hand,
that kind of makes me feel extremely uncomfortable. On the
other hand, I've also worked in environments where you're pulling
(11:21):
really long hours and you're together all the time, going
absolutely de lulu with this one other person you know,
you know their partner, you know their kids, Like it
is extremely platonic, but you're just spending so much time
together that you naturally have all these in jokes and
personal jokes and it doesn't mean anything. So it's a
(11:42):
really difficult one because I see how these really close
platonic relationships do come about. But I think if your
partner is uncomfortable about it, perhaps I wouldn't put a
label on it. Like I think there's a way that
you can navigate your partner's security or feeling of security
around it that isn't just like deal with it. Then
my work wife, just deal with it. I think if
(12:02):
there may be being defensive, then that's probably where your guts, like,
why are you being so defensive about that?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
That's the thing I want to know with this anonymous
person is how their husband reacts when they kind of
put their concerns forward. Because I don't think it has
anything to do with his work wife. I think it
has to do with their relationship. And obviously she has
a gut instinct that she doesn't feel comfortable with this
(12:29):
work relationship between her husband and his friend at work,
and I think that's something that you need to sort
out with him, and don't actually bring that other person
in it, because they are just a colleague. Like they're
literally just a colleague with that label on it, and
that colleague might not even know the intricacies of your
relationship or might not even know what you perceive as
(12:49):
something that's unprofessional. They might be thinking, oh, this is
not how we act. Actually, like it's been blown out
of proportion. So I think just tread lightly. But I
do think handle it with your husband first before you
bring it as like a work issue, because I don't
think it is a work issue as yet totally.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
And I also think the way that he deals with
it before you sort of confronted him and explained how
you feel versus after, that's where your gut will kind
of guide you. If there's like a really compassionate, understanding
response like I'm so sorry, I didn't realize you felt
that way. I just talk about them because I'm with
them all the time. Yeah, then you would obviously feel
(13:27):
a lot less threatened. But if it was sort of
like extreme defensiveness, that's where I think you'd listen to
your gut a bit more.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Yeah, There's been like times in the past where I've
gotten really close with some of my male colleagues. And
there was one where I went to a birthday party
in one of my male colleagues and I met his
wife who he was engaged to at the time, and
it was so interesting because she just knew so much
about me, like everything, like I would tell him, and
(13:54):
it just made me feel really good, Like it made
me feel like, oh my god, he now like there's
ce mens the fact that we are actually friends, that
he actually talks about me to like his partner, like
the best person in the world, And I'm like hoping
that this is the situation where it's more like, oh
my god, I actually have a really great close friend
at work, and now we're outside friends, and now like
they really like talking about me and wanting me to
(14:17):
meet like the people in their life. Like, I hope
it's not that. If it's more of a situation where
he has his work wife that you've heard of and
they're constantly messaging each other, but like you're never meeting
her or something, I feel like that's a bit weird,
But yeah, good luck. I hope that conversation goes well.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
And I also hope if anyone listening has any sort
of insider tips on how they've managed a work wife
or work husband situation effectively, please dm us. I have
had many, and I think it comes from having works,
like I mentioned, in an environment where you're pulling really
long hours together, so you're like eating dinner together for
(14:53):
weeks at a time. Just your mass exposure to that
one person. When you're on a deal, like when I
was working in the law firm, it was mergers and acquisition,
so you'd work on a deal in really concentrated periods
with just one or two other people, and so you
would get so familiar with them, you'd get familiar with
how they order their food and what their toilet habits are, Like,
you just know them as well as you would know
(15:13):
your partner, and at the same time, you're not seeing
your partner a lot. So I think for me, I
did feel like I needed to make my husband feelally
comfortable about being at the office at nine pm or
ten pm with this one other guy.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
When you say that, it does sound quite weird, doesn't
they Why I'm staying back? Who are you staying with?
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Just just one other guy at work? How long you're staying
till ten? People?
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, and we're eating and there's no one else in
the office, And it actually sounds really weird. But because
knowing how platonic those situations were, I'm like, it's not
always a red flag, because some work situations do require that.
It's just how you approach it with your partner to
make sure that they don't feel like especially because my
husband has never worked in a corporate office. He was like,
I don't understand what you mean. That's not normal to me.
(15:56):
I'm like, because you haven't seen this, but I promise
you I would come home if I was allowed but
I have to stay here, so let me make you
feel comfortable with it.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
And I think it's all about like building that trust.
I think what you did with your partners exactly what
this anonymous person's husband should have done with her, like
give her a full down low and debrief of their
work structure and like the expectations of the industry that
he works in and stuff like that, because it does
all just come down to trust. And then if that
sounds reasonable to you, then that's probably will make you
(16:27):
feel so much better about the situation. But if they're
still red flags and things that aren't adding up, then
I think that's when you need to have a conversation.
Oh my god, and that was it. Oh my god.
I kind of want to get like a follow up
from that last dilemma for our next episode.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
But I want to hear more people submit their stories,
Like I want to hear if they did discover that
across the line and what did they do about it
or how did they know?
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Oh my god, let us know. There'll be a link
in our show notes to submit your dilemmas, or you
can always dm us at Instagram at biz buy Mama Mia.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Yeah, and guys, make sure the juicy has because you
can remain anonymous, so of course you can tell us
anything if it's particularly spicy or like your own chaos,
if you're feeling brave. We'll be back next week to
solve more of your work life mysteries and maybe continue
this work life work husband and drummer.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Oh my god, please please please. Also don't forget we
have a very free newsletter Biz. We'll put a link
in our show notes for how you can sign up
to that because it's such good content. It's written by
Katie Powers, who works on the biz team here at
Mma Mia. She's absolutely brilliant. Quick psay for the biz fam.
Want to get a deal and make a difference, say less.
Sign up to Mama Mia this week using our link,
(17:36):
and you'll get twenty percent off. The best part, we're
matching that twenty percent with a donation to Rise Up,
supporting women impacted by domestic violence. The code is give
Back BIZ. That's give Back bi Z and it's valid
until August twenty fourth. All of our details will be
in the show notes.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
And all our past episodes are ready and waiting in
your feed if you need to catch up on workplace wisdom.
We've covered some really good topics at this point, so
do go back into the archive if you haven't. Bye,
and we'll be back next week with fresh Courier Chaos
two Untangled See y
Speaker 2 (18:27):
M Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and
waters that this podcast is recorded on
You're listening to Amma mea Podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Hello, and welcome back to Biz in Box. I'm Mmmrnham
and I'm Sarah Davidson. And the way these episodes work
is that you submit a workplace or career dilemma to
us via the link in our show notes, or you
can DM us on our Instagram biz by Mom and Mia,
and then we answer them here on our podcast. You
can put your name on your dilemma if you want to,
(00:36):
or you can remain completely anonymous. It is so up
to you.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Today we are unpacking some seriously relatable workplace drama that's
going to hit close to home. We're talking sneaky work
from home haacks that are going to make you rethink
your Friday afternoons. And we're diving deep into the murky waders.
Oh my god, of work wives.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Are they just.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Harmless workplace friendships or do they cross a line that
makes partners uncomfortable? This one's definitely going to divide the room.
I alread feeling a bit divided in my brain. But first,
m we've got someone who's gone from office hero to
feeling like they can barely keep up.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
We do? We have this DM sent in by Ellie.
She got in touch with us, and she said, I'm
in a new role and everyone seems to be flying
while I'm crawling. I used to be the one that
others could ask for help. Now I'm googling basic stuff
and afraid to speak up. How do you survive the
phase where you feel like the weakest link and not
lose yourself in the process. This is really sad. I'm
(01:38):
with you, Ellie. I feel this. I feel this so deeply.
I think to play Devil's Advocate, I genuinely don't think
you're meant to enter any new role and feel like
you're immediately soaring and doing so so well. And if
you do feel like that, you are immediately sowing in
your new role, I think you're going to get super bored,
(01:58):
super quickly, because the whole point of being in a
new role is that you're learning new skills, you're finding
your play, so you're learning how to develop yourself in
the new role, and you're meant to grow with that role.
It shouldn't be already established in a way where you
feel like you're just nailing it straight up. So I
think you give yourself some grace.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Sally one hundred percent. I don't know if I've mentioned
this one before. I probably have, because I force it
down everyone's throats because I think it's such a valuable
thing to remember. But there was a study done by
Hewlett Packard. But the crux of it was basically about
when people do apply for promotions or new roles. And
it's a mass generalization, so there are obviously exceptions to
(02:40):
this rule. But basically, men would apply for a promotion
when they had about sixty percent of the criteria, knowing
very logically that once you get to a new role,
as you said, m, you're meant to be a little
bit out of your depths, because otherwise you'd just stain
the one that you had on the go, you learn
the remaining forty percent, So they apply at sixty percent.
Women will wait not till they had one hundred percent
of the criteria. They wait until they have one hundred
(03:02):
and ten plus. So not only are they qualified for
the new role, overqualified because they are worried that they're
not good enough or that when they do get to
the role, there'll be that discomfort of not meeting all
the criteria and more. And because of that, women will
miss out. Even if there was no other institutional inequalities.
They will miss out on the promotion because men have
(03:22):
already applied, like purely based on time, men will think
they're ready a little bit earlier. And I think there's
something to be taken from that that the whole point
of stepping into something new is that you're meant to
be uncomfortable. You're not meant to already have all the
criteria when you get there. Otherwise it wouldn't there'd be
no point in taking the new position. You would have
already mastered that level. The whole idea is that you
(03:45):
do throw yourself into new levels of discomfort, and then obviously,
as you learn, that position becomes more comfortable. But the
whole crux of learning is discomfort. It is feeling a
little bit out of your depths. It is googling everything,
and that's a sign that you've taken an amazing step.
Like I kind of think that that uncomfortable feeling you're
experiencing early is a good thing. You should kind of.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Embrace that you're just doing what every man already does.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
Yeah, and that helps him get ahead. I think we've
got such a fear of feeling uncomfortable or ill equipped
or not ready, Like when you look at people's trajectories,
I think that people who really get ahead of the
ones who don't wait until they feel one hundred percent ready,
they're willing to go through that yucky phase where they
feel completely you know, scrambling, and they do feel like
(04:31):
the weakest link. And part of it, I think is
just pretending that you're more confident than you are and like.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Fake it till you make one hundred.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
It's a cliche for a reason. Or if you do
really need help, people know you're new, ask for help.
That's also not the sign of weakness that we sometimes
think it is.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Yeah, especially if it's a new role that has completely
new processes and stuff like there are certain things that
you have to learn on the go, Like you're not
just going to come in and know exactly how everything operates.
Give yourself some grace, Like I think this is such
a great opportunity. Also, there's a reason you're in this role,
Like people don't just hand out roles. So the leaders
in your team picked you out out of like so
(05:13):
many other people. I'm sure because I thought you were
perfect for this role. And just don't be scared of
that because I think you're gonna end up soaring and
end up loving it, and it will just take time.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
One hundred percent. Remember that question we had a couple
of weeks ago about how do you know if you
get into a new role and it's only been three
weeks and you already hate it. Similarly, I think if
you get into a new role and you are only
three weeks in and you already know everything and you've
already nailed everything and you're not feeling a little bit uncomfortable,
like there's novelty, then maybe it's not a big enough challenge.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
That's so true. Okay, our next question. We got this
via email from Kate and she said, I need some
sneaky work from home hacks. I work from home Fridays.
And now this is really interesting because here i'mmer Me,
and we work from home on Fridays as well, So
I wonder if Kate is within this company. Now, I'm
(06:05):
sure I work from home on Fridays and I'm usually
done by lunchtime, but my boss expects me to be
available until five pm, even when there's nothing left to do.
What are your best tricks for looking busy when you're
not scheduling emails to send later, keeping teams active, whatever
you figured out, I'll get all my work done. I
just want to enjoy my Friday RVO without getting in trouble. Now, Kate,
(06:29):
this is probably the lowest end of dilemmas we've ever received. Like,
this is like one of the best dilemmas I've ever
come across, because it feels like it's firstly not a
dilemma at all. The one thing I will say is
that do not tell your boss that you finished all
your work by lunchtime. That is not what a boss
(06:51):
wants to hear.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Or that you just want to enjoy your Friday afternoon.
We're getting in trouble. I feel like you can't vocalize
that that is your aim of the game.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
My boss expects me to be available until the five pm. Yeah,
that makes sense to me.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
It's a week day.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Are you probably available?
Speaker 1 (07:07):
But do you know what it does bring up a
very interesting point that I'm actually really glad Katie raised it,
because as much as it's not the biggest dilemma we've heard,
it is sort of an example of the way that
sometimes you are penalized for being efficient if you're faster,
you actually just end up doing you know, double trip
(07:29):
or the workload of your colleague, even though you're getting
paid the same. And I found that when I was
a lawyer, our whole time structure not so much now
and not in every law firm, but traditionally lawyers have
always builled for every six minute unit of their time
all day, every day. You have to build a client
for every six minutes, so you can't be a six
(07:51):
minute unit in your day that you don't know what
you are working on. So to meet your budget, it
was like how many units did you have to meet,
which actually meant that if you were slower, you met
your budget faster, and if you were it's slower, you
sort of made more bonuses. And if you were faster,
exactly like Katie, you would disadvantage because if you finish
(08:13):
your work really quickly, then you'd be under your targets
for billable hours. It'd look like you were not doing
as much work when you were actually just doing it faster,
so there was no incentive to go quicker. So I
understand what she's saying, even though I wouldn't necessarily phrase
it as I just want to finish my work quickly,
so I can have Friday afternoon drinks earlier. I do
think that if you are extremely fast, part of the
(08:34):
whole working from home ERA has been accepting that people
don't have to necessarily be doing FaceTime sitting at a
desk from nine to five in order to get all
their work done. So maybe you can schedule emails. If
you really do finish everything early in the morning in
front load the day, maybe you can kind of schedule
the submission of that work a little bit more efficiently.
(08:57):
I don't mean like work nine or twelve and then
just finish the day. Maybe you do have to be
available if that's what you're getting paid for, but I
think you can be a little bit strategic about not
disadvantaging yourself just because you're fast.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yes, spread it out, spread out the workload. I would
say though, like if you're scheduling in emails to send
at four thirty pm from nine am and around four
thirty pm, you're also like at the bar with the girls,
and then you get a reply at four thirty two
or something, you have to action. You have to go
back and action. Yes, you have to say just be aware,
(09:31):
like you can. I guess work from home. If you
finish all your work, like, great for you, but maybe
just do like at home tasks like you're washing cleaning
up your house, like doing your dishes. I would be
wary of actually going out, like be wary of how
far you're pushing that on, Like how much you're actually
doing on a workday.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Yeah, if the expectation is that you will be available
to action something, if it did come in at four thirty,
you probably need to be around. Like it's a hard one.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
You don't answer the phone and there's like screaming and
like like rave music in the background.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
It's my neighbor. What they're really last?
Speaker 2 (10:10):
I live?
Speaker 1 (10:10):
I live that apartment building.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yeah, sorry, watching TV, it's a race. I love watching
ray TV. Okay, our next one is an anonymous It
is anonymous DM. We got this on our Instagram and
it reads my husband has a work wife and I'm
starting to feel uncomfortable about it. They chat constantly, grab
(10:35):
coffee together and have all these inside jokes I'm not
part of. He talks about her all the time and
says it's a normal work friendship, but it feels more
than that to me. What even our work wife's supposed
to be Is this just a trendy term for close
work friendships or doesn't normalize relationships like cross boundaries. What
do you guys think about work wives? Am I being
(10:56):
paranoid or is my gut telling me something's off here?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Oh? Oh, this is so hard because I do think
that there's something that's really familiar about calling someone your
work wife or work husband, and on the one hand,
that kind of makes me feel extremely uncomfortable. On the
other hand, I've also worked in environments where you're pulling
(11:21):
really long hours and you're together all the time, going
absolutely de lulu with this one other person you know,
you know their partner, you know their kids, Like it
is extremely platonic, but you're just spending so much time
together that you naturally have all these in jokes and
personal jokes and it doesn't mean anything. So it's a
(11:42):
really difficult one because I see how these really close
platonic relationships do come about. But I think if your
partner is uncomfortable about it, perhaps I wouldn't put a
label on it. Like I think there's a way that
you can navigate your partner's security or feeling of security
around it that isn't just like deal with it. Then
my work wife, just deal with it. I think if
(12:02):
there may be being defensive, then that's probably where your guts, like,
why are you being so defensive about that?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
That's the thing I want to know with this anonymous
person is how their husband reacts when they kind of
put their concerns forward. Because I don't think it has
anything to do with his work wife. I think it
has to do with their relationship. And obviously she has
a gut instinct that she doesn't feel comfortable with this
(12:29):
work relationship between her husband and his friend at work,
and I think that's something that you need to sort
out with him, and don't actually bring that other person
in it, because they are just a colleague. Like they're
literally just a colleague with that label on it, and
that colleague might not even know the intricacies of your
relationship or might not even know what you perceive as
(12:49):
something that's unprofessional. They might be thinking, oh, this is
not how we act. Actually, like it's been blown out
of proportion. So I think just tread lightly. But I
do think handle it with your husband first before you
bring it as like a work issue, because I don't
think it is a work issue as yet totally.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
And I also think the way that he deals with
it before you sort of confronted him and explained how
you feel versus after, that's where your gut will kind
of guide you. If there's like a really compassionate, understanding
response like I'm so sorry, I didn't realize you felt
that way. I just talk about them because I'm with
them all the time. Yeah, then you would obviously feel
(13:27):
a lot less threatened. But if it was sort of
like extreme defensiveness, that's where I think you'd listen to
your gut a bit more.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Yeah, There's been like times in the past where I've
gotten really close with some of my male colleagues. And
there was one where I went to a birthday party
in one of my male colleagues and I met his
wife who he was engaged to at the time, and
it was so interesting because she just knew so much
about me, like everything, like I would tell him, and
(13:54):
it just made me feel really good, Like it made
me feel like, oh my god, he now like there's
ce mens the fact that we are actually friends, that
he actually talks about me to like his partner, like
the best person in the world, And I'm like hoping
that this is the situation where it's more like, oh
my god, I actually have a really great close friend
at work, and now we're outside friends, and now like
they really like talking about me and wanting me to
(14:17):
meet like the people in their life. Like, I hope
it's not that. If it's more of a situation where
he has his work wife that you've heard of and
they're constantly messaging each other, but like you're never meeting
her or something, I feel like that's a bit weird,
But yeah, good luck. I hope that conversation goes well.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
And I also hope if anyone listening has any sort
of insider tips on how they've managed a work wife
or work husband situation effectively, please dm us. I have
had many, and I think it comes from having works,
like I mentioned, in an environment where you're pulling really
long hours together, so you're like eating dinner together for
(14:53):
weeks at a time. Just your mass exposure to that
one person. When you're on a deal, like when I
was working in the law firm, it was mergers and acquisition,
so you'd work on a deal in really concentrated periods
with just one or two other people, and so you
would get so familiar with them, you'd get familiar with
how they order their food and what their toilet habits are, Like,
you just know them as well as you would know
(15:13):
your partner, and at the same time, you're not seeing
your partner a lot. So I think for me, I
did feel like I needed to make my husband feelally
comfortable about being at the office at nine pm or
ten pm with this one other guy.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
When you say that, it does sound quite weird, doesn't
they Why I'm staying back? Who are you staying with?
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Just just one other guy at work? How long you're staying
till ten? People?
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, and we're eating and there's no one else in
the office, And it actually sounds really weird. But because
knowing how platonic those situations were, I'm like, it's not
always a red flag, because some work situations do require that.
It's just how you approach it with your partner to
make sure that they don't feel like especially because my
husband has never worked in a corporate office. He was like,
I don't understand what you mean. That's not normal to me.
(15:56):
I'm like, because you haven't seen this, but I promise
you I would come home if I was allowed but
I have to stay here, so let me make you
feel comfortable with it.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
And I think it's all about like building that trust.
I think what you did with your partners exactly what
this anonymous person's husband should have done with her, like
give her a full down low and debrief of their
work structure and like the expectations of the industry that
he works in and stuff like that, because it does
all just come down to trust. And then if that
sounds reasonable to you, then that's probably will make you
(16:27):
feel so much better about the situation. But if they're
still red flags and things that aren't adding up, then
I think that's when you need to have a conversation.
Oh my god, and that was it. Oh my god.
I kind of want to get like a follow up
from that last dilemma for our next episode.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
But I want to hear more people submit their stories,
Like I want to hear if they did discover that
across the line and what did they do about it
or how did they know?
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Oh my god, let us know. There'll be a link
in our show notes to submit your dilemmas, or you
can always dm us at Instagram at biz buy Mama Mia.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Yeah, and guys, make sure the juicy has because you
can remain anonymous, so of course you can tell us
anything if it's particularly spicy or like your own chaos,
if you're feeling brave. We'll be back next week to
solve more of your work life mysteries and maybe continue
this work life work husband and drummer.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Oh my god, please please please. Also don't forget we
have a very free newsletter Biz. We'll put a link
in our show notes for how you can sign up
to that because it's such good content. It's written by
Katie Powers, who works on the biz team here at
Mma Mia. She's absolutely brilliant. Quick psay for the biz fam.
Want to get a deal and make a difference, say less.
Sign up to Mama Mia this week using our link,
(17:36):
and you'll get twenty percent off. The best part, we're
matching that twenty percent with a donation to Rise Up,
supporting women impacted by domestic violence. The code is give
Back BIZ. That's give Back bi Z and it's valid
until August twenty fourth. All of our details will be
in the show notes.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
And all our past episodes are ready and waiting in
your feed if you need to catch up on workplace wisdom.
We've covered some really good topics at this point, so
do go back into the archive if you haven't. Bye,
and we'll be back next week with fresh Courier Chaos
two Untangled See y
Speaker 2 (18:27):
M Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and
waters that this podcast is recorded on
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