September 24, 2025 • 42 mins
Welcome to Amelia Lester's original theory about your phone battery that makes PERFECT sense. It actually has nothing to do with your phone, and everything to do with naps.
Also, an announcement from US President Donald Trump this week about pregnancy, autism and paracetamol has upset a lot of people. We discuss the impact on women, how medical experts in Australia have rejected the claims and the dangers of medical misinformation.
Plus, Dressing for work is BACK BABY but is your office attire appropriate and is your shoe-to-foot ratio correct? We explain.
You can read the TGA's statement on pregnancy and paracetamol here.
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- Listen to Parenting Out Loud: Stealth Mums, The Roblox Controversy & A Tiny Internet Feud
- Listen to The Quicky: We Know You're Scared But Paracetamol Doesn't Cause Autism, Here's Why
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- An anti-vaxxer and a man who 'doesn't wash his hands.' Um... we need to talk about Trump's cabinet.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to
MoMA Mia out Loud. It's what women are actually talking
about on Wednesday, the twenty fourth of September. And my
name is Hollywayen.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Right, I'm Jesse Stevens, and my name is Amelia Lester,
and I have something to tease before we get into
today's show. Remember our Taro card reader friend Evelyn. She
said during the episode. I can't remember if it was
a subscriber, if it was on the main episode, but
she said there will be a big.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Announcement coming on out Loud.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
She did two weeks.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Yeah, she said this, and I was like, I'd shore,
I'm not. There is a big announcement coming on out
Loud on Friday. That is my teas. Be the first
to listen. It drops a bit earlier on a Friday, make.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Sure you're on that show, and make sure.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Because there's some exciting news. So there's my little teas
for Friday.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
That is as much as we're giving you, we are mean.
But on today's show, here is what made our agenda.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
An announcement from President Trump this week about pregnancy autism
and paracetamol upset me even more than I expected. We
discussed the new directive for pregnant women, which is to
tough it out.
Speaker 5 (01:25):
I've got a phone charging theory, which is not just
about phones.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
I'm going to tell you about it.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
And tremble in your soft pants. Friends. Your office attire
is not appropriate and you need to get ready to
be shamed about it because dressing for work is back.
But first, Amelia Lester.
Speaker 5 (01:42):
Yeah, in case you missed it, I got some good
news and some bad news. I guess I'll tell you
the good news first.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
The bears. The bears are getting fatter than ever. Do
you know what I'm talking about it?
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Are you talking about fat Bear Week?
Speaker 5 (01:53):
It is fat bear Week? Can we have a vovo
zailor sound just there? Is that?
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The word I don't know is that the.
Speaker 5 (02:00):
Word Voting has opened for the eleventh year of this
contest that's run by the Alaska National Park to German,
who the fattest bear is?
Speaker 2 (02:11):
Is that? Because it's so it's seasonal right, they're about
to go into hibernation and they've got to carblow it?
Is that great protein fish load.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
They're up your alley, Holly.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
They're all about the protein. They need nothing but salmon.
Think of their skin so radiant goodness. So you go
and watch a webcam of bears feeding at Brooks Falls,
which is a very beautiful looking place in Alaska, and
they're all eating their salmon, and then you vote on
which bear you think has fattened up the most over
the summer for the coming winter hibernation. And the voting
(02:41):
has just opened for this year. The contest is open
to all the bears in the park. There's about two
thy three hundred of them. As long as they are
sufficiently chunky.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
They must be trying the big bears, only to think
that they're stoked when they find that the camera's following them.
Speaker 5 (02:56):
Yes, there are some there definitely are more into it
than others. Bears double their weight over the summer in
preparation for hibernation, which I just love as.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
A fat fighting each other for the Yes.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
They're fighting each other.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
And I want to give a special shout out to
the adult females because I learned that basically they have
to get fat because they give birth to cubs midwinter
and then they're in the cave with them nursing them
until they come out in the spring.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
But they're not eating anything.
Speaker 5 (03:22):
For that whole time, so they give birth and nurse
and there's no food until they exit.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Apparently they've got particularly fat this season because there's been
a lot of food in the past, has been fighting
when it's been limited. But the ranger has said the
bears are extremely fat this year, and I'm looking forward
to seeing how people react to how fat they are.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Okay, how people react with shock and awe and a
tape measure in hand. I saw my bucket list to
go and see those beads. Me too, I would love too.
But maybe it's not as good as it sounds. Maybe
there's just like a horde of people.
Speaker 5 (03:55):
Look, there's a webcam. I would say, you don't need
to get on a plane. The webcam will give it
all to you. There's a guy named Mike Fitz who's
a ranger who won the first year of the contest,
and he said that the reason why people love this, Yes,
it's because the news is full of doom and gloom
and it's respite from that. But also, and I want
to get this quote right, because it's delightful. Beyond that,
people just like looking at photos of round animals.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Round animal that's why we like. Look.
Speaker 5 (04:23):
Okay, be thinking about the round animals. Because now I've
got the bad news. Okay, the bad news is the
rapture is coming today.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I've heard about their Somlia.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
Get your affairs in order.
Speaker 5 (04:33):
People are apparently selling their houses, which confuses me because
if the rapture's coming, why do you need to sell
your house. But anyway, that's what they're doing. They're quitting
their jobs, they're packing up their pets. And it all
started because a South African evangelical pastor whose name is
Joshua Malacala insisted that the world is going to be
(04:53):
ending on September twenty three, twenty four. We're not quite sure.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Which apparently with Australian time difference twenty four twenty fifth,
which is today or tomorrow. Yes, so, Ameilia, the rapture
is correct me if I'm wrong. The idea is that
what happens is holy, but it's like Jesus comes back
and takes all the good people. Is that the shortcut?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
It's not good for you and it's goods fine.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Imagine if we came into work tomorrow, and Jesse was
just gone, like her chair was empty, her cup was
undrunk from like, you know, her sandwich wrapper was just there.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
I'm gonna leave my clothes behind, so it looks like
I've just descended.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
And we were like, we were laughing about this. Imagine.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Yeah, I really liked the TikTok of the woman. There's
a lot of people explaining to people in their lives
how to survive without them after.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
The wrapper because they're going up.
Speaker 4 (05:41):
Yeah, a wife.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Being like, I know, I'm going like absolutely, I've lived
a moral, good life. But she's explaining to her husband
how to do things when she's off. You've got to
be outside, I think, to ascend. But her husband she's
going this.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
Are you sorry, You've got to be outside?
Speaker 1 (05:57):
Gonna hit the roof?
Speaker 5 (05:58):
Familiar?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
Oh my goodness, Jesus sorted that out.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
No, you have to wait outside on your doors.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
Really worried about all these people sitting outside waiting for
this to happen, and then if it doesn't happen, how
they're going to get on with their lives on Thursday's.
Speaker 4 (06:11):
An embarrassing next day.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
There are some TikTok trends where it's going like they
go through celebrities and who would ascend and who would not?
So I would obviously ascend the Irwins, they say absolutely,
But then the theory is Chris Hemsworth would ascend, but
Liam Hemsworth wouldn't, which feels mean that me.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
And what about all the celebrities named Chris, I wonder
which is.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
I know, I think it would be very very selective.
You couldn't have them.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
All Chris Pine for sure.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
And what they've done as well is that people are saying, yeah, look,
if you're going to ascend, just leave all your designer
items on your front port because they can be for
the scavengers who are left like you, Holly.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Ah. Is it too late for me to make it
onto the vulture escalator because I feel like things are
hard down here at the minute. I want to be
up there singing to me Pedro Pascale's whispering, scoreless gossip
in my ear.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
I'll give you my carcays, Holly, I'm not gonna need
my car anymore.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
That's true.
Speaker 5 (07:06):
You can jump onto hashtag rapture talk if you want
to learn more.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
I was shocked yesterday at how much an announcement from
the White House ruined my day because this actually isn't
a story about Trump or RFK Junior. It's a story
about women who have been, are currently or will one
day be pregnant. It's a story about people with an
autism diagnosis. It's a story about the blame that we
(07:32):
always apportioned to mothers. And it's also a story about misinformation,
scientific rigor, and expertise.
Speaker 4 (07:40):
Deep breath, you might remember that.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
My whole thing is like, I'm not going to be
troubled anymore by the craziness that's coming out of my
So I'm going to be ferries en by this. But
it's hard on this one. It's hard.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
You might remember President Donald Trump at Charlie Kirk's memorial
service took that opportunity to say, I think we found
an answer to autism.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
He teased us, just like.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
You did at the beginning of this leaf out of
Trump's book, and he ta used us, and he said,
I've got a big announcement coming well on Monday, US time,
Trump staged a press conference, and here's a little bit
of what he said.
Speaker 6 (08:17):
First, effective immediately, the FDA will be notifying physicians at
the use of I said, well, let's see how we
say that. A said menefin acetamnefin I said, okay, which
is basically commonly known as thailand all during pregnancy can
(08:41):
be associated with a very increased risk of autism. For
this reason, they are strongly recommending that women limit us
during pregnancy unless medically necessary. That's, for instance, in cases
of extremely high fever that you feel you can't tough
(09:03):
it out, you can't do it.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
I guess there's that.
Speaker 6 (09:06):
It's a small number of cases, I think, But if
you can't tough it out, if you can't do it.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
What a coherent and clear announcement about something so important.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
He sounds so well prepared now.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
I'm glad he was so well prepared.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
Now in Australia, the generic name for the medication he's
talking about is paracetamol. Right, and Trump's announcement prompted a
swift response from experts all over the world. In the
United States, it was the American Academy of Obstetricians and
Gynecologists who said, in more than two decades of research,
not a single reputable study has successfully concluded that the
(09:40):
use of this drug in any trimester of pregnancy causes
neurodevelopmental disorders in children in Australia, the Therapeutic Goods Administration,
the Royal Australian and New Zealand College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists,
including every other reputable source of medical information, release statements
assuring women that there is no link between paracetamol use
(10:01):
in pregnancy and autism or ADHD. I could go into
the studies, I'm not going to do that. We have
an incredibly comprehensive episode of The Quickie Drop this morning.
Highly recommend you listen to that. But Holly, what I
want to know is why this has struck such a
chord and why it feels particularly sinister, Like health misinformation
(10:22):
is not new, there's nothing new about this. There's nothing unprecedented.
There's not even anything particularly surprising, but it feels sinister.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Well, I think it partly feels sinister because of the
delivery mechanism. I mean, when we just played that clip,
you know, this is the President of the United States,
and whatever you think about him, that is a seat
of enormous power, getting the entire world's media pretty much
to turn their cameras on him for him to make
a confusing incoherent, fearmongering announcement that is then immediately refuted
(10:54):
by all these reputable organizations, as you've said, Jesse, but
the damage is done. That announcement just sets off an
explosion of shame and self loathing and panic and worry
lots of different groups of people, as you've already you said,
obviously women of childbearing age and pregnant women, but people
with autism, because what Trump was essentially saying was autism
(11:17):
is terrible and it should be eradicated. That's a whole
thing that upsets an enormous number of people to say
that women are somehow weak and selfish if they are
addressing pain, wanting even to address pain and pregnancy, not
toughing it out, and that whatever stage of all that
you're at, And obviously I have lived experience here. I
(11:38):
don't want to go into it in detail, but I've
sat in those rooms and heard those diagnoses that this
is your fault. Any difficult things that are coming your way,
for either yourself or your child, it's.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
Your fault and your own selfishness.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
It's your selfish. And so no one would suggest that
we should suppress any scientific evidence or findings to spare
people's feelings, So I don't mean to sit here and
go that makes me feel bad. So we shouldn't learn
about autism and the causes of autism. That is not
what I'm saying, or I think what anybody is saying.
But it's just so enormously irresponsible, Am I right, Amelia?
(12:16):
Is it enormously irresponsible? Yeah?
Speaker 5 (12:18):
Other presidents have dispensed health advice. So President Eisenhower recommended
the polio vaccine. Barack Obama suggested people should quit smoking.
But I think what's different about this is that he
has departed from the entire medical establishment. And the reason
that it catches on with people is because there's a
(12:39):
vacuum of information right now about a perception that autism
rates a rising in the population. And because there's that
perception and the medical establishment hasn't yet figured out the
no doubt complex causes for why this is or even
if this is the case, people seese on a definite
answer from someone, even if he doesn't know what he's
talking about.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
I mean, and you can fact check so much of
what he says.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
But I posted something on Instagram about it yesterday, and
the messages I got back from women who broke d
during pregnancy. That's what pregnancy did to them, the worst
migraines of your life. I got COVID and the flu
at like thirty five weeks pregnant, had a terrible fever.
And what I didn't know before that pregnancy was the
(13:24):
list of medicines I couldn't take, not just medicines, things
you can't do, things you can't eat. Like to suggest
that women are ever flippant about anything they put in
their bodies, on their bodies during pregnancy is so infuriating,
and that the experience of pregnancy in and of itself
is an exercise in toughing it out, Like you get
(13:46):
the flu, like there's virtually nothing you can take, and
all these experts have come out and said fever can
be dangerous for babies, and that's why we recommend getting
the fever down.
Speaker 4 (13:57):
I'm not a doctor.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Speak to your doctor if that's an experience you're having,
but that's putting a lot of pregnant women in danger
to basically say don't take this medicine when your doctor's,
your obstetricians, your midwives are saying the opposite.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
And the reason why people are going.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
To be really confused by this in particular is because
we don't know a lot about pregnancy, and one reason
for that is that you can't conduct to studies on
pregnant women for obvious reasons, and then you layer on
the misinformation and it starts to be a really dangerous stew.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
Yeah, because there are drugs, a doctor will often say
to you, we just don't know, so we're not going
to let you have that. To suggest that the medical
institution is an erring on the side of caution at
all times is just so irresponsible, And it's the endangering
I think that made me so angry, and also the
(14:55):
suggestion that there is this selfishness within pregnant women, or
this haphazard response to putting things in your body that
is causing long term damage, which is the wrong word anyway,
when we all know people who live with autism who
were incredible like as though it's some kind of disease
(15:16):
rather than a disorder that millions of people around the
world are diagnosed with and have always had as well.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
One of the things that's saddling my brain about this
is that I'm old enough to remember Jenny McCarthy going
on the Oprah Wimfrey show, yep, a couple of decades ago.
Now probably that interview. Really see it in my mind,
I must have watched it in real time where she
told a story about my child. At the time, she'd
been an actress and MTV presenter, like she was a
(15:44):
cool girl, and then she became like a real crunchymum
pin up for a while and she went on the
opera Woinfroy Show. And I see it in my memory,
this story I took my kid to get their vaccine
and then immediately, like the next day, that kid was
completely different and it changed everything. Now that was seen
as a moment of enormous irresponsibility on the side of
(16:05):
the media to be immediately bandying about all this misinformation.
But in the period of time since, we have learned
so much, and that message has been discredited so many times,
and we've seen this always this sort of underground hum
of skepticism around that, but every credible medical organization has
pushed back. And it feels like here we are a
(16:25):
couple of decades later and the President of the United
States standing up there and apart from his directive, he
spoke broadly and coherently about the kind of vaccines, babies
get how there's just too much liquid in those syringes
for them. He just went on and on about all
of these really dangerous, disproven things. You know, there are
(16:46):
people in my life who are very across this kind
of stuff, and I've already heard about these rumors and
already seen that it was disproven all these things. But
most of us are just busy and getting on with things.
And pregnancy is one of those moments in your life
where suddenly you have to learn about health and science
and if you're not a person who knows about that,
so we just have these little drops of buzzes and
information and oh, I remember hearing something on Oprah once
(17:07):
about vaccines. I remember hearing something about blah blah blah.
And if that's most of us, what's just happened with
this high profile misinformation dump is so many people will
just go, oh, well, that's true. There are a lot
of pregnant women or women who've been pregnant, and I'd
put myself in this bucket. Who are going, wait, did
(17:28):
I take paracenamol when I was pregnant or did I not?
Oh my god? And then thinking about whatever difficulties or
hurdles their kids might have and thinking it's all on me.
Speaker 4 (17:39):
You already think it's all on you regardless.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I just I find it befuddling, as you can probably
tell by my incoherent response. But I just want to
send love and solidarity, I really do, to autistic people
who are copying it over this, to the people who
support them, to the pregnant women who are wondering what
the hell they're supposed to do now. I just think
this is an incredibly difficult time, And of course, if
(18:03):
you are worried and confused, talk to an actual doctor.
As Jesse said, the health professionals know what they're talking about.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
In a moment, your phone, your life, and.
Speaker 5 (18:14):
A controversial theory about how they're connected. I saw a
headline this week which made me stop in my tracks.
Now that happens a lot these days, but this one
was about my phone. It was on the wire cutter
and it read stop charging your phone to one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
What fed especially when you first get it. I thought
that was the point. It was like you have to
have it to one hundred percent.
Speaker 5 (18:40):
I thought that was like phone hygiene, Yeah, like flossing,
Like you gotta charge your phone overnight to one hundred percent. No,
the wire cutter said that over time, charging your phone
all the way can weaken your battery and cause it
to lose its charge much faster. Instead, charge it somewhere
in the range of twenty to eighty percent.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Twenty percent, you'd be living on the edge. What kind
of risk taking adrenaline junkie is running around with their
phone only for charge to twenty.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
The kind who's also running around looking for a charger
at work.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
So apparently on your phone, if it's a your model,
you can just like make it do this automatically stop
at eighty percent. I haven't done this because it feels
wrong to me and I'm not ready to do it.
I'm just simply not ready to do it.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
You're not following the sciences points on other things important
medical information. Yes, the viber off on this anent.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
The vibe off it? Do you get me thinking?
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Though?
Speaker 5 (19:41):
Because there was something about that idea of don't charge
your phone to one hundred percent?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
I wondered whether we could apply it more broadly, like
not just to phones. Should we be avoiding one hundred
percent charge in life?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
I feel as though it's better if my body never
knows what one hundred percent feels like, so I try
and keep it in seventy to eighty.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
I've got some examples.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
Think about when you go to bed early and then
you wake up the next week kind of groggy because
you slept too much.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
Yeah, yep, yep.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
Or think about how a forty minute now you wake
up and you feel really discombobulated. A twenty minute nap,
you're ready to go.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Ten to fifteen is the sweet spot for a nap
in my experience.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
Oh no, micronapp, I have two hour naps.
Speaker 5 (20:19):
Really, yeah, that's charging your fine to one hundred, But.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
I don't feel good after. To be clear, I feel
this when I eat broccoli. I've been talking about how
I've been eating vegetables lately, and I think you don't
want to eat too healthy because you don't want your
body to expect it. You don't want your body to
grow accustomed to only eating vegetables. So then you get
some hot chips because you're like, this way, my body's
just ready for what's going to come, Like, I don't
(20:43):
want to give it a shock when my real life
starts up again.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
You know what I mean? Do you think it applies
to effort Amelia.
Speaker 5 (20:49):
Yeah, so I think that sometimes I go to work
and I've had too much coffee, and I give one
hundred percent and then people yourself, yeah, and they say
that I'm quote unquote overwhelming, and I try not to
do it anymore because people just start to back away.
So now at work, I aim for about seventy five.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
Yeah, And you also you don't want to raise people's
expectations firstly, and also you don't want to burn out,
no exactly, And if you're aiming for one hundred percent
all day, I feel as though what I have in
my life is one hundred percent moments where I can
give one hundred percent for forty five minutes, or like
if I go to the gym, I'll try and give
one hundred percent for literally one minute, and I'll just
(21:30):
like see that because I.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
Do a high intensity interval tree.
Speaker 3 (21:33):
Every now and then, I try to get my heart
right out really hard for a minute.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
I do.
Speaker 4 (21:38):
I'm going to give it a little bit.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
But the thing is, if you wanted to give one
hundred percent every time you went to the gym, you'd
never go to the gym because that's just daunting. So
you've got to understand that when you go, you only really.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
Need to be giving it seventy percent.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
I'd set on my exercise bike and I am giving
it thirty eight. And I'm saying to myself, well, at
least i'm here, it's better than not being here at all.
But someone on TikTok is nearly always telling me that's
not true. They are always telling me, if you're not
killing yourself and sweating your guts out, what are you
even do it here? And I'm like, no, no, no.
(22:11):
Now that Amelia has told me this, I'm going to.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
Say you.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
And I need to get into your settings and sort
you out. Pushing back down to a thirty eight.
Speaker 4 (22:20):
Can make out a battery at two pm.
Speaker 5 (22:22):
I'm going to take it to the next level this
theory about battery and say, Mia has this concept that
I think about a lot called intimacy leaking. Yes, yep,
this idea that if you're in a romantic relationship with
someone a monogamous from romantic relationship, I guess is the
way to describe it here. And then you start telling
people in your life who are not your partner sort
(22:42):
of details of how you're truly feeling or really difficult
things you're struggling with. You're leaking intimacy from your relationship.
And I'm thinking of this as kind of like a
battery leak. You can't be giving too much of your
battery to other people. That's my extension of the wire
cutter theory.
Speaker 1 (22:59):
Oh, like it's leaking out, it's leaking battery.
Speaker 5 (23:02):
So I think you just got to be mindful of
where your battery's going as well, in addition to being
mindful of what level the batteries are.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Is like, let's have another analogy. Remember how Taylor Swift,
the Overlord of the Women of the World, made that
statement about how treat your energy like it's expressive. This
is kind of like that. So if I'm cleaning my kitchen, look,
forty two is plenty, Like forty two percent is plenty
as long as someone's getting yes, But I have to
(23:31):
scrub every little gap.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
Child used all your battery on cleaning the kitchen, and
then your kids came home and you had nothing.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
To yes exactly, but my energy is expensive. So when
the kid walks in the door, this theory is at
least i'd be and I say, so happy to see you, darling.
Did you have a wonderful day. I'm going to put
one hundred percent. Make sure you feel.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Now I'm going to couch that because I don't think
we should ever be giving one hundred percent to parenting,
because again, it's about expectations. You can't have them expect
that you're going to be cooking and clin.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
No.
Speaker 5 (24:03):
But I've got a theory about children in general. This
is not about parents. Tony Morrison once told Michelle Obama,
you get that, So this is a third hand I
didn't hear it from Why Live in Directly. She said
that whenever a child walks in the room, you must
beam and act extremely excited because all children expect that
when they enter a room. Adults like act like they're
(24:25):
a joy in a miracle, which they are.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Yeah, I support that scene.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
And that's like at least five percent of your daily
battery on a child.
Speaker 5 (24:33):
So if you're a teacher, I'm sorry, I don't know
how you're handling it.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Also, it depends on what base you're coming from, Like
if you're hungover or sick or exhausted, or your bosses
and then the child, then you're coming from five percent
to one hundred and that takes a lot like that.
Speaker 4 (24:48):
Okay, I have another application, and it's to do with appearance.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Right.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
Do you ever like you doing your makeup?
Speaker 2 (24:55):
And you go, I.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Could, I could contour, I could give it one, but
my nose.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Is just going to be as wide as it actually.
Speaker 4 (25:02):
Is today exactly. And you go, you know what, I
want to be relatable. I want them to like it.
Speaker 3 (25:08):
If I look too good, then I'm going to walk
into work. I'm going to make everyone feel like she's Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
See, this is a problem that clearly you are.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
I have to live with it.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
I have a friend who's too attractive, right, And we
were saying recently she wasn't there. There were just men
flocking to her, which is interesting because they didn't see us,
but they flocked to her, and we all said it
would be hard being.
Speaker 4 (25:28):
That beautiful because it's distracting.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
When you speak to the men flocking, it sounds like seagulls.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Yeah, we go out to dinner, she gets harassed.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Can she turn it down from herd I don't know.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
And maybe she can turn it down to ninety, but
I can easily turn it to like an eighteen, and
I think that that is a superpower.
Speaker 5 (25:44):
Final question low battery mode. What is the human equivalent
of low battery mode, which, by the way, feels like magic.
Every time I put on low battery mode, I'm like,
I just conducted a magic trick.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
I know, closing all your tabs. It's closing all your tabs.
Low battery mode is what I've been operating in while
I've been poorly lately, and out Loud has been very
sick of I'm sure hearing about me being poorly. Actually,
this is true. People like to blame you for your illnesses,
don't they. So when I said to anyone lately, I've
had the flu, they've blamed it on one hundred percent theory.
(26:15):
They've said, no, I think about it. Oh, it's because
you worked too hard. I just caught the flu. Like,
I don't think it has anything to do with anything
other than that I caught a sickness.
Speaker 4 (26:28):
You went to low power mode.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
I went to low power mode for two weeks, very
little movement. Yes, if I was a fat bear, I
would have been eating a lot of salmon, but not
moving much, storing myself up, just barely raising the head
from the bed to smile winningly at the children when
they came royally. That was great. Low power mode was good.
Speaker 4 (26:51):
You're doing everything to not just die.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Literally, I think that low power mode can get the
job done if needed. Jesse, why didn't you tell me
that Luca was running in the Berlin Marathon last weekend?
I saw him in the office on Monday and I
was like, how you in Berlin? Like? The reason I
ask is that my boyfriend, Harry Stoyles's and don't worry
out loud, it would be very inappropriate. Harry Styles was
(27:16):
my boyfriend, very inappropriate. But we all know I love him.
He ran the bill in marathon on the weekend, in
Marathon full marin.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
It was a good time, right, six fifty.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Under three hours, which is a goal for many people.
This whole other thing about how much I love gap
here Harry Styles. But quite a lot of people when
Mom and Maya posted about this said they thought it
was Luca. That's the picture of Harry Styles is annoying.
The people generally thinking that Lucas.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Hast so annoying.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Look, someone said it before and then we've never brought
it up again. But it is so annoying to make
that comparison, like it gives someone such a big hit Jersey.
Speaker 5 (27:55):
Sorry, let's recap here. You've been told in recent weeks
you look like Sidney Sweeney. Luke has been Tory looks
like Harry Styles.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Look, did Luca love this Harry Styles thing?
Speaker 5 (28:07):
And is he kind of bringing it up at like
inappropriate at moments?
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (28:10):
And look I can kind of see it.
Speaker 3 (28:12):
He's got a headband and some sunglasses on in a
little bit of facial hair.
Speaker 4 (28:15):
But there's no way that Luke's running a marathon. It's
just not him.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
I just love that Harry Styles. And I've been on
this podcast winging about how much I want a new
Harry Styles album. Harry Styles is just like I am
living my life. I want to know what it's like
to run a marathon. I'm dating Zoe Kravitz. Were in
Rome or in New York. We're in London where wherever
he is spending his money, he is having a great time.
Here is my new role model.
Speaker 5 (28:38):
So with Zoe Kravitz, she is dating him, she is
dating him. There was some confusion that was.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
The bait and switched the Austin what's his name, hot man, very.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Hot Austin Butler Australian.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
No, he's not and he looks Australian, but he's not.
Everyone thought she was dating Austin Butler, but they were
just doing very good chemistry. For she is dating Harry Styles,
or at least she has been. And some people say
he had a fake name and everything in the marathon,
not that I've done a deep dive and she was
there and maybe also in cognito cheering him on. But
he is living his best life. And everyone's like, look
(29:10):
at Taylor Swift. She's released like twenty five albums since
you did Harry's House, Harry, get your shit together, And
I'm like, nah, I'm full respectful. I was going to
say them fat bear mode.
Speaker 3 (29:19):
Well, I was going to say, he's definitely not taking
it to one hundred percent, but then I realize he
just ran a marathon, so you might shit.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Can you run a marathon in low power? After the break,
soft Pants be damned? Dressing for Work is.
Speaker 4 (29:34):
Back one unlimited out loud access.
Speaker 3 (29:37):
We drop episodes every Tuesday and Thursday exclusively for Mum
and Me are subscribers. Follow the link in the show
notes to get us in your ears five days a week,
and a huge thank you to all our current subscribers, What.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Are you wearing right now? Out louders you want to
find out liking to imagine that. I don't think very
many of our louders are this, but you know how
there are all those bros who pretend they're working while
listening to their favorite podcasts. Yeah, or watching it on YouTube.
Maybe there are some outlouders doing that. If so, what
is your current worker tire? Because apparently the mass return
to office work in Australia we're judged to be at
(30:14):
about seventy seven percent from pre COVID levels.
Speaker 4 (30:18):
Of as in back to the office full time.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Yeah, and I know how much the back to the
office conversation anoys, teachers, nurses, doctors, you know, retail workers.
I know this not everybody, but this is about people
who pre COVID were in office were apparently about seventy
seven percent return, So lots of back to the office
and apparently what's come with this is a bit of
pearl clutching about the fact that a lot of people
(30:41):
don't know how to dress for the office anymore and
we are in a full return to corporate ware. Listen
to this. It's a collection of mostly female managers having
a winge about their mostly younger colleagues what they're wearing
to the office. They had an assistant show up tour
in joggers, no makeup.
Speaker 4 (30:59):
She sat down at the table to begin working.
Speaker 5 (31:01):
I instantly had this gut reaction of no, this doesn't represent.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
Our client who we are becoming.
Speaker 5 (31:07):
It didn't work for me, and from that day forward,
I have enforced this dress code, not only for my
team but for myself.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
When I get dressed for my top client every day,
even though I'm.
Speaker 5 (31:15):
Seeing no one potentially but my team, it improves productivity.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
There is it's neuroscience fact.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
You're going to have a more successful day. You're telling
your body in your mind you are here to work.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
It occurs to me that some of you have not
or do not have a grown up telling you how
to dress in the workplace.
Speaker 7 (31:36):
I just wanted to talk about your outfit today.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Okay, what about it.
Speaker 7 (31:41):
We have a huge client meeting today, a customer worth
a lot of money who's expecting like the utmost professionalism,
and some people on your team really not comfortable with
what you're wearing today.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
So that's a collection of tiktoks and reels from Australia
and America of basically bosses bitching about the fact that
nobody knows how to dress anymore. Now that's why you're seeing.
I'm certainly seeing on my social's lots of what I
watered the office reels right, lots of people putting together
their fashion and Vogue Australia declares that business casual is
(32:13):
dead and we're now into corporate core and there are
all these different trends with it that go office siren,
corp core, corporate fetish. Dressing for work is back. But
don't tell Emily Vernon because I checked in with her
today about this. I said, Duhl, did you dress for
work today? And you know what she said? She said,
I'm literally wearing see through linen pants that I may
(32:34):
or may not have slept it. I think that illustrates
the problem here, friends, are we dressing for work?
Speaker 3 (32:41):
It is so funny because you put this in yesterday
like a story about this, and at almost exactly the
same time, I got a message in one of my
biggest group chats from someone saying apparently I have to
dress corporate.
Speaker 4 (32:53):
Where is everyone shopping?
Speaker 3 (32:55):
And I was like, I have not seen that question
in such a long time, and it made me think
about a few things. The first is that if you've
been working a few days in the office, the difference
between two or three and five is an entire wardrobe
you need five, or you feel like you need five
different outfits or at least different things to put together.
The other is a change of season, is that it
might be the first warm season that you've looked around
(33:17):
and gone, how do you dress for warm?
Speaker 4 (33:20):
In the corporate vibe?
Speaker 3 (33:22):
But then I tried to find evidence of this, and
I was looking at data about the term relaxed dress,
and apparently in Australian job postings it's up. So a
lot of sectors are saying that they're encouraging relaxed dress,
especially in the Act and Queensland.
Speaker 4 (33:42):
The theory is that it's influenced from the tech sector.
Speaker 3 (33:45):
So because the tech sector has always been about pushing
against office norms. Think about your friends who work for
kind of really hip, techy places and they just wear
jeans and sneakers or whatever. Apparently that has leaked into accounting, legal,
banking and finance it and there's been an increasing casualization
of how people.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
But that's why there's a pushback on it now.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Right, well, I smell a rap.
Speaker 5 (34:11):
I think the reason why this discussion is kind of
seemingly surfacing organically on TikTok and elsewhere is because employers
are unhappy with hybrid work and they want to change
the game, and they think that if they get people
to buy enough.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Clothes, they'll become more happy about going into.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Lim somewhere to wear them to exactly.
Speaker 5 (34:32):
So I think it's also especially a story about the
corporate sector, because yeah, the point about tech is well taken.
They've always dressed a bit differently. But look at the
fact that the staff at the big four banks in
Australia have all been called back to work full time.
Also tab Corp and then Mineral Resources, that company in
Perth where the CEO said he wanted to hold the
(34:52):
staff captive. The staff are captive. They're back at work.
So I think smart casual that in the corporate sector
there's this real sense of we're paying you enough, why
aren't you here five days a week? And they think
that clothing is kind of the incentive to get people back.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Because as that piece in Vogue was saying that like
they're make trying to make corporate wear sexy. So it's
all about trying to appear like that. This is great.
This is a whole vibe to be coming out of
the office, getting dressed up, being sharp, and that what
I'm seeing. And you know, I don't speak fashion, I'm
not mere, but what I'm seeing in a lot of
these videos is lots of tailored pants, maybe a waistcoat
(35:29):
if you're like a hot thing who can have your arms.
Lots of draped blazer yet lots of blazers, heels seem
to be back, a bit of a pointed toe seems
to be.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Back officially pointed toes, back.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Slicked back hair. I think about and we've talked about
her on the show before, but you know, some of
the iconic girl bosses of the moment, like Emma Greed,
we've talked about her before. She's the woman behind skims
and all of those. She posts every week things I
want to the office every week, and it's her coming
out of the office lift in ever more elegant clothes.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Are they corporate or are they kind of more straddling like.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
What modern corporate means, because she's not in a suit,
but she's definitely I think the word we would be
looking for is polished.
Speaker 4 (36:11):
She and jeans.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
She lives in jeans on a non meeting day, but
they're very elegant jeens. What I was asking em when
I asked her about her in pas, I promise it
wasn't passac. It's basically I wonder if there's a generational
piece to this. But I definitely think that I have
work clothes and non work clothes. Even though I wear
jeans and things to work. I definitely dress differently on
a day when I'm coming into the office here at
(36:33):
Mamma Mia than I do when I'm at home in Hip.
But I don't know if that's true for a lot
of the younger people who came of work age during COVID.
I definitely have spoken to colleagues where I say, oh,
these are work clothes, and they look at me a
bit blankly, like what do you mean working? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:52):
So apparently self expression has become increasingly for GenZ and
millennial They've never really understood fashion without self expression, like
I'm going to show who I am, whether it's with
like a baseball hat or sneakers or something. They want
to look like themselves. Whereas when I first started in
the workplace. I worked in a school ADMINI thing like
(37:13):
I just copied exactly what everyone else was wearing, and
it was a pencil skirt, like that's the kind of
thing you did, which I felt incredibly uncomfortable in. But
I found this article in the Washington Post and it's
Lizzy Post, who works for the Emily Post Institute. Emily
Post was her great great grandmother, and she does all
the etiquette guides. Oh good, And she has business etiquette
(37:33):
and rules for what you have to wear to the office.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
Do you want to hear some of them this year
twenty twenty five?
Speaker 5 (37:38):
But I will say, if soft pants is on there,
I'm walking out. And there's been enough aggression towards soft
pants today.
Speaker 3 (37:45):
Well, she says, and this is important for summer. We're
going into a summer in Australia and there's a big
question regardings.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Assuming the rapture doesn't happen exactly true, that would be
one of the reliefs of the rapture. We don't have
to think about what to wear to the office tomorrow.
Speaker 3 (38:00):
The shoe to foot ratio, right, okay, shoes to foot ratio,
So we wear a sandal, how much sand or can
we get away with right?
Speaker 4 (38:08):
This is the big question.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
So she says that the shoe to foot visibility ratio
remains tipped in the balance of the shoe, so anything
that starts to have the majority of the foot exposed
starts to become questionable. So if I can say too
much foot, apparently that's a no no. Right, you've got
to have most of your foot covered. Rule iron your clothes, which,
by the way, did you really have to be told that,
(38:31):
jo I do iron my clothes, and every comment is.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
A shower and a coat hanger.
Speaker 4 (38:38):
I try, I try, but I actually iron them.
Speaker 3 (38:40):
And every time we post videos to the outloud as
they say, Jesse ironing, I do.
Speaker 2 (38:44):
But I'm the same as you. There are some people
who are really good at ironing, and I'm doing it right,
I'm terrible.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
I think iron your clothes.
Speaker 5 (38:50):
Probably if you gathered up all the comments on the
internet since it began when our Dore started at back
in two thousand, I think iron your clothes.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
And then mostly about me. Jeans are allowed.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
According to her, a particular type of gene loves a
straight leg, and she says the higher the waist, the better.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
The Princess Die the twee blazer exactly.
Speaker 4 (39:11):
You cannot wear the same socks you wear to the gym.
Speaker 1 (39:15):
No, but socks.
Speaker 5 (39:15):
I'm sorry with respect to the Post family, who I
know have been dispensing and I could advise for generations.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
Socks is a whole other thing right now.
Speaker 4 (39:24):
So you can have like a statement.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
So it's too many rules.
Speaker 5 (39:28):
I just I'm paralyzed by indecision on the sock front.
I don't understand what socks are appropriate anymore.
Speaker 2 (39:33):
You know, I found myself buying some statement socks on
the internet when I was statements, and then I thought,
this is yet another one of these examples in my
life where Mia was buying statements socks literally and we
were laughing at her one year ago. We were pointing
at her stupid socks and going ha ha ha. And
then I just bought some sparkly mesh mid cuff, strangely
(39:55):
bronze socks for too much money on the Internet, and
I'm like, OK, this is another example of how she's
always right ahead.
Speaker 4 (40:04):
Of the curt So backpacks are the new briefcase.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
You happy you always have. I mean, I have a
backpack too, but you've had piss taken out of you
about your Josh Live.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
And backpack for a while, for a very long time.
And this is the last one. T shirt rule, big
question about T shirts. All T shirts are not made equally.
You have to have a slightly thicker or softer fabric.
You need to tread carefully with logos, words and non
abstract images for example, a T shirt with them a
tease painting.
Speaker 4 (40:33):
Fine. A T shirt with a cartoon character. No, so
that's the rule. Would you wear a T shirt?
Speaker 3 (40:39):
I've never seen you wear a T shirt shirt. Yeah,
I don't mind. I make a T shirt look very cheap.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
My uniform is shirts. As you know, I've got a
lot of shirts, which means I do have to iron them,
which is annoying. I wear a lot of shirts. I
would not wear a T shirt with the cartoon encouragement.
But if we instilled that, if we instilled that rule
at MoMA Mere, there would be no one out there
and they're all wearing T shirts.
Speaker 3 (41:04):
Another fun one is that you can wear a hat,
but you must take it off for your meeting. Hat
then a fascinator like what from morning meeting?
Speaker 4 (41:17):
By sorry, guys, just take my hat off out loud as,
what are.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
You wearing to work? Like? Tell us and people started
talking to you about your clothes. Those tiktoks that we
played a bit of before, there's just these women walking
up to their coworkers and assistance and being like this.
Speaker 1 (41:31):
No, not working.
Speaker 4 (41:34):
Really, out Louders, tell.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Us how you're doing it?
Speaker 1 (41:37):
I think that's it.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
I think we've exhausted Wednesday.
Speaker 4 (41:40):
Yep, solved the problem in the world today.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
Massive thank you to all of you out louders for
being here with us. As always, we're going to be
back in your ears of course tomorrow, and don't forget
if you want to look at what we're wearing to
work today, at least the top half of it. Can't
check our socks. You'll find us on YouTube.
Speaker 3 (41:59):
And out Louders if you missed Monday's episode. We talked
about the latest development in what I am terming the
Internet's biggest cheating scandal. We also talk about what is
going on with Jimmy Kimmel and all the stuff you
might have missed, and why are you ugly cry on
your birthday every year?
Speaker 4 (42:16):
You're not alone?
Speaker 3 (42:17):
We unpack why it's a super common thing to do,
and my Mum got so offended by what I said,
she commented in the out.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
Special group, Anne Stevens continues to be dry Connie. She
was just like Jesse had a winge about her birthday.
You have to go listen, and Anne was just like
not having it.
Speaker 4 (42:35):
Not having any of it. We will pop a link
in the show notes. Bye bye.
Speaker 2 (42:40):
Shout out to any Mamma Mia subscribers listening. If you
love the show and you want to support us, subscribing
to Mamma Mia is the very best way to do it.
There's a link in the episode description.
You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to
MoMA Mia out Loud. It's what women are actually talking
about on Wednesday, the twenty fourth of September. And my
name is Hollywayen.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Right, I'm Jesse Stevens, and my name is Amelia Lester,
and I have something to tease before we get into
today's show. Remember our Taro card reader friend Evelyn. She
said during the episode. I can't remember if it was
a subscriber, if it was on the main episode, but
she said there will be a big.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Announcement coming on out Loud.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
She did two weeks.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Yeah, she said this, and I was like, I'd shore,
I'm not. There is a big announcement coming on out
Loud on Friday. That is my teas. Be the first
to listen. It drops a bit earlier on a Friday, make.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Sure you're on that show, and make sure.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Because there's some exciting news. So there's my little teas
for Friday.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
That is as much as we're giving you, we are mean.
But on today's show, here is what made our agenda.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
An announcement from President Trump this week about pregnancy autism
and paracetamol upset me even more than I expected. We
discussed the new directive for pregnant women, which is to
tough it out.
Speaker 5 (01:25):
I've got a phone charging theory, which is not just
about phones.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
I'm going to tell you about it.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
And tremble in your soft pants. Friends. Your office attire
is not appropriate and you need to get ready to
be shamed about it because dressing for work is back.
But first, Amelia Lester.
Speaker 5 (01:42):
Yeah, in case you missed it, I got some good
news and some bad news. I guess I'll tell you
the good news first.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
The bears. The bears are getting fatter than ever. Do
you know what I'm talking about it?
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Are you talking about fat Bear Week?
Speaker 5 (01:53):
It is fat bear Week? Can we have a vovo
zailor sound just there? Is that?
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The word I don't know is that the.
Speaker 5 (02:00):
Word Voting has opened for the eleventh year of this
contest that's run by the Alaska National Park to German,
who the fattest bear is?
Speaker 2 (02:11):
Is that? Because it's so it's seasonal right, they're about
to go into hibernation and they've got to carblow it?
Is that great protein fish load.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
They're up your alley, Holly.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
They're all about the protein. They need nothing but salmon.
Think of their skin so radiant goodness. So you go
and watch a webcam of bears feeding at Brooks Falls,
which is a very beautiful looking place in Alaska, and
they're all eating their salmon, and then you vote on
which bear you think has fattened up the most over
the summer for the coming winter hibernation. And the voting
(02:41):
has just opened for this year. The contest is open
to all the bears in the park. There's about two
thy three hundred of them. As long as they are
sufficiently chunky.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
They must be trying the big bears, only to think
that they're stoked when they find that the camera's following them.
Speaker 5 (02:56):
Yes, there are some there definitely are more into it
than others. Bears double their weight over the summer in
preparation for hibernation, which I just love as.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
A fat fighting each other for the Yes.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
They're fighting each other.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
And I want to give a special shout out to
the adult females because I learned that basically they have
to get fat because they give birth to cubs midwinter
and then they're in the cave with them nursing them
until they come out in the spring.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
But they're not eating anything.
Speaker 5 (03:22):
For that whole time, so they give birth and nurse
and there's no food until they exit.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Apparently they've got particularly fat this season because there's been
a lot of food in the past, has been fighting
when it's been limited. But the ranger has said the
bears are extremely fat this year, and I'm looking forward
to seeing how people react to how fat they are.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Okay, how people react with shock and awe and a
tape measure in hand. I saw my bucket list to
go and see those beads. Me too, I would love too.
But maybe it's not as good as it sounds. Maybe
there's just like a horde of people.
Speaker 5 (03:55):
Look, there's a webcam. I would say, you don't need
to get on a plane. The webcam will give it
all to you. There's a guy named Mike Fitz who's
a ranger who won the first year of the contest,
and he said that the reason why people love this, Yes,
it's because the news is full of doom and gloom
and it's respite from that. But also, and I want
to get this quote right, because it's delightful. Beyond that,
people just like looking at photos of round animals.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Round animal that's why we like. Look.
Speaker 5 (04:23):
Okay, be thinking about the round animals. Because now I've
got the bad news. Okay, the bad news is the
rapture is coming today.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I've heard about their Somlia.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
Get your affairs in order.
Speaker 5 (04:33):
People are apparently selling their houses, which confuses me because
if the rapture's coming, why do you need to sell
your house. But anyway, that's what they're doing. They're quitting
their jobs, they're packing up their pets. And it all
started because a South African evangelical pastor whose name is
Joshua Malacala insisted that the world is going to be
(04:53):
ending on September twenty three, twenty four. We're not quite sure.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Which apparently with Australian time difference twenty four twenty fifth,
which is today or tomorrow. Yes, so, Ameilia, the rapture
is correct me if I'm wrong. The idea is that
what happens is holy, but it's like Jesus comes back
and takes all the good people. Is that the shortcut?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
It's not good for you and it's goods fine.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Imagine if we came into work tomorrow, and Jesse was
just gone, like her chair was empty, her cup was
undrunk from like, you know, her sandwich wrapper was just there.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
I'm gonna leave my clothes behind, so it looks like
I've just descended.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
And we were like, we were laughing about this. Imagine.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Yeah, I really liked the TikTok of the woman. There's
a lot of people explaining to people in their lives
how to survive without them after.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
The wrapper because they're going up.
Speaker 4 (05:41):
Yeah, a wife.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Being like, I know, I'm going like absolutely, I've lived
a moral, good life. But she's explaining to her husband
how to do things when she's off. You've got to
be outside, I think, to ascend. But her husband she's
going this.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
Are you sorry, You've got to be outside?
Speaker 1 (05:57):
Gonna hit the roof?
Speaker 5 (05:58):
Familiar?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
Oh my goodness, Jesus sorted that out.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
No, you have to wait outside on your doors.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
Really worried about all these people sitting outside waiting for
this to happen, and then if it doesn't happen, how
they're going to get on with their lives on Thursday's.
Speaker 4 (06:11):
An embarrassing next day.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
There are some TikTok trends where it's going like they
go through celebrities and who would ascend and who would not?
So I would obviously ascend the Irwins, they say absolutely,
But then the theory is Chris Hemsworth would ascend, but
Liam Hemsworth wouldn't, which feels mean that me.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
And what about all the celebrities named Chris, I wonder
which is.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
I know, I think it would be very very selective.
You couldn't have them.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
All Chris Pine for sure.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
And what they've done as well is that people are saying, yeah, look,
if you're going to ascend, just leave all your designer
items on your front port because they can be for
the scavengers who are left like you, Holly.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Ah. Is it too late for me to make it
onto the vulture escalator because I feel like things are
hard down here at the minute. I want to be
up there singing to me Pedro Pascale's whispering, scoreless gossip
in my ear.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
I'll give you my carcays, Holly, I'm not gonna need
my car anymore.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
That's true.
Speaker 5 (07:06):
You can jump onto hashtag rapture talk if you want
to learn more.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
I was shocked yesterday at how much an announcement from
the White House ruined my day because this actually isn't
a story about Trump or RFK Junior. It's a story
about women who have been, are currently or will one
day be pregnant. It's a story about people with an
autism diagnosis. It's a story about the blame that we
(07:32):
always apportioned to mothers. And it's also a story about misinformation,
scientific rigor, and expertise.
Speaker 4 (07:40):
Deep breath, you might remember that.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
My whole thing is like, I'm not going to be
troubled anymore by the craziness that's coming out of my
So I'm going to be ferries en by this. But
it's hard on this one. It's hard.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
You might remember President Donald Trump at Charlie Kirk's memorial
service took that opportunity to say, I think we found
an answer to autism.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
He teased us, just like.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
You did at the beginning of this leaf out of
Trump's book, and he ta used us, and he said,
I've got a big announcement coming well on Monday, US time,
Trump staged a press conference, and here's a little bit
of what he said.
Speaker 6 (08:17):
First, effective immediately, the FDA will be notifying physicians at
the use of I said, well, let's see how we
say that. A said menefin acetamnefin I said, okay, which
is basically commonly known as thailand all during pregnancy can
(08:41):
be associated with a very increased risk of autism. For
this reason, they are strongly recommending that women limit us
during pregnancy unless medically necessary. That's, for instance, in cases
of extremely high fever that you feel you can't tough
(09:03):
it out, you can't do it.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
I guess there's that.
Speaker 6 (09:06):
It's a small number of cases, I think, But if
you can't tough it out, if you can't do it.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
What a coherent and clear announcement about something so important.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
He sounds so well prepared now.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
I'm glad he was so well prepared.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
Now in Australia, the generic name for the medication he's
talking about is paracetamol. Right, and Trump's announcement prompted a
swift response from experts all over the world. In the
United States, it was the American Academy of Obstetricians and
Gynecologists who said, in more than two decades of research,
not a single reputable study has successfully concluded that the
(09:40):
use of this drug in any trimester of pregnancy causes
neurodevelopmental disorders in children in Australia, the Therapeutic Goods Administration,
the Royal Australian and New Zealand College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists,
including every other reputable source of medical information, release statements
assuring women that there is no link between paracetamol use
(10:01):
in pregnancy and autism or ADHD. I could go into
the studies, I'm not going to do that. We have
an incredibly comprehensive episode of The Quickie Drop this morning.
Highly recommend you listen to that. But Holly, what I
want to know is why this has struck such a
chord and why it feels particularly sinister, Like health misinformation
(10:22):
is not new, there's nothing new about this. There's nothing unprecedented.
There's not even anything particularly surprising, but it feels sinister.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Well, I think it partly feels sinister because of the
delivery mechanism. I mean, when we just played that clip,
you know, this is the President of the United States,
and whatever you think about him, that is a seat
of enormous power, getting the entire world's media pretty much
to turn their cameras on him for him to make
a confusing incoherent, fearmongering announcement that is then immediately refuted
(10:54):
by all these reputable organizations, as you've said, Jesse, but
the damage is done. That announcement just sets off an
explosion of shame and self loathing and panic and worry
lots of different groups of people, as you've already you said,
obviously women of childbearing age and pregnant women, but people
with autism, because what Trump was essentially saying was autism
(11:17):
is terrible and it should be eradicated. That's a whole
thing that upsets an enormous number of people to say
that women are somehow weak and selfish if they are
addressing pain, wanting even to address pain and pregnancy, not
toughing it out, and that whatever stage of all that
you're at, And obviously I have lived experience here. I
(11:38):
don't want to go into it in detail, but I've
sat in those rooms and heard those diagnoses that this
is your fault. Any difficult things that are coming your way,
for either yourself or your child, it's.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
Your fault and your own selfishness.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
It's your selfish. And so no one would suggest that
we should suppress any scientific evidence or findings to spare
people's feelings, So I don't mean to sit here and
go that makes me feel bad. So we shouldn't learn
about autism and the causes of autism. That is not
what I'm saying, or I think what anybody is saying.
But it's just so enormously irresponsible, Am I right, Amelia?
(12:16):
Is it enormously irresponsible? Yeah?
Speaker 5 (12:18):
Other presidents have dispensed health advice. So President Eisenhower recommended
the polio vaccine. Barack Obama suggested people should quit smoking.
But I think what's different about this is that he
has departed from the entire medical establishment. And the reason
that it catches on with people is because there's a
(12:39):
vacuum of information right now about a perception that autism
rates a rising in the population. And because there's that
perception and the medical establishment hasn't yet figured out the
no doubt complex causes for why this is or even
if this is the case, people seese on a definite
answer from someone, even if he doesn't know what he's
talking about.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
I mean, and you can fact check so much of
what he says.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
But I posted something on Instagram about it yesterday, and
the messages I got back from women who broke d
during pregnancy. That's what pregnancy did to them, the worst
migraines of your life. I got COVID and the flu
at like thirty five weeks pregnant, had a terrible fever.
And what I didn't know before that pregnancy was the
(13:24):
list of medicines I couldn't take, not just medicines, things
you can't do, things you can't eat. Like to suggest
that women are ever flippant about anything they put in
their bodies, on their bodies during pregnancy is so infuriating,
and that the experience of pregnancy in and of itself
is an exercise in toughing it out, Like you get
(13:46):
the flu, like there's virtually nothing you can take, and
all these experts have come out and said fever can
be dangerous for babies, and that's why we recommend getting
the fever down.
Speaker 4 (13:57):
I'm not a doctor.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Speak to your doctor if that's an experience you're having,
but that's putting a lot of pregnant women in danger
to basically say don't take this medicine when your doctor's,
your obstetricians, your midwives are saying the opposite.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
And the reason why people are going.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
To be really confused by this in particular is because
we don't know a lot about pregnancy, and one reason
for that is that you can't conduct to studies on
pregnant women for obvious reasons, and then you layer on
the misinformation and it starts to be a really dangerous stew.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
Yeah, because there are drugs, a doctor will often say
to you, we just don't know, so we're not going
to let you have that. To suggest that the medical
institution is an erring on the side of caution at
all times is just so irresponsible, And it's the endangering
I think that made me so angry, and also the
(14:55):
suggestion that there is this selfishness within pregnant women, or
this haphazard response to putting things in your body that
is causing long term damage, which is the wrong word anyway,
when we all know people who live with autism who
were incredible like as though it's some kind of disease
(15:16):
rather than a disorder that millions of people around the
world are diagnosed with and have always had as well.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
One of the things that's saddling my brain about this
is that I'm old enough to remember Jenny McCarthy going
on the Oprah Wimfrey show, yep, a couple of decades ago.
Now probably that interview. Really see it in my mind,
I must have watched it in real time where she
told a story about my child. At the time, she'd
been an actress and MTV presenter, like she was a
(15:44):
cool girl, and then she became like a real crunchymum
pin up for a while and she went on the
opera Woinfroy Show. And I see it in my memory,
this story I took my kid to get their vaccine
and then immediately, like the next day, that kid was
completely different and it changed everything. Now that was seen
as a moment of enormous irresponsibility on the side of
(16:05):
the media to be immediately bandying about all this misinformation.
But in the period of time since, we have learned
so much, and that message has been discredited so many times,
and we've seen this always this sort of underground hum
of skepticism around that, but every credible medical organization has
pushed back. And it feels like here we are a
(16:25):
couple of decades later and the President of the United
States standing up there and apart from his directive, he
spoke broadly and coherently about the kind of vaccines, babies
get how there's just too much liquid in those syringes
for them. He just went on and on about all
of these really dangerous, disproven things. You know, there are
(16:46):
people in my life who are very across this kind
of stuff, and I've already heard about these rumors and
already seen that it was disproven all these things. But
most of us are just busy and getting on with things.
And pregnancy is one of those moments in your life
where suddenly you have to learn about health and science
and if you're not a person who knows about that,
so we just have these little drops of buzzes and
information and oh, I remember hearing something on Oprah once
(17:07):
about vaccines. I remember hearing something about blah blah blah.
And if that's most of us, what's just happened with
this high profile misinformation dump is so many people will
just go, oh, well, that's true. There are a lot
of pregnant women or women who've been pregnant, and I'd
put myself in this bucket. Who are going, wait, did
(17:28):
I take paracenamol when I was pregnant or did I not?
Oh my god? And then thinking about whatever difficulties or
hurdles their kids might have and thinking it's all on me.
Speaker 4 (17:39):
You already think it's all on you regardless.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I just I find it befuddling, as you can probably
tell by my incoherent response. But I just want to
send love and solidarity, I really do, to autistic people
who are copying it over this, to the people who
support them, to the pregnant women who are wondering what
the hell they're supposed to do now. I just think
this is an incredibly difficult time, And of course, if
(18:03):
you are worried and confused, talk to an actual doctor.
As Jesse said, the health professionals know what they're talking about.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
In a moment, your phone, your life, and.
Speaker 5 (18:14):
A controversial theory about how they're connected. I saw a
headline this week which made me stop in my tracks.
Now that happens a lot these days, but this one
was about my phone. It was on the wire cutter
and it read stop charging your phone to one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
What fed especially when you first get it. I thought
that was the point. It was like you have to
have it to one hundred percent.
Speaker 5 (18:40):
I thought that was like phone hygiene, Yeah, like flossing,
Like you gotta charge your phone overnight to one hundred percent. No,
the wire cutter said that over time, charging your phone
all the way can weaken your battery and cause it
to lose its charge much faster. Instead, charge it somewhere
in the range of twenty to eighty percent.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Twenty percent, you'd be living on the edge. What kind
of risk taking adrenaline junkie is running around with their
phone only for charge to twenty.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
The kind who's also running around looking for a charger
at work.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
So apparently on your phone, if it's a your model,
you can just like make it do this automatically stop
at eighty percent. I haven't done this because it feels
wrong to me and I'm not ready to do it.
I'm just simply not ready to do it.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
You're not following the sciences points on other things important
medical information. Yes, the viber off on this anent.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
The vibe off it? Do you get me thinking?
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Though?
Speaker 5 (19:41):
Because there was something about that idea of don't charge
your phone to one hundred percent?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
I wondered whether we could apply it more broadly, like
not just to phones. Should we be avoiding one hundred
percent charge in life?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
I feel as though it's better if my body never
knows what one hundred percent feels like, so I try
and keep it in seventy to eighty.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
I've got some examples.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
Think about when you go to bed early and then
you wake up the next week kind of groggy because
you slept too much.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
Yeah, yep, yep.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
Or think about how a forty minute now you wake
up and you feel really discombobulated. A twenty minute nap,
you're ready to go.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Ten to fifteen is the sweet spot for a nap
in my experience.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
Oh no, micronapp, I have two hour naps.
Speaker 5 (20:19):
Really, yeah, that's charging your fine to one hundred, But.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
I don't feel good after. To be clear, I feel
this when I eat broccoli. I've been talking about how
I've been eating vegetables lately, and I think you don't
want to eat too healthy because you don't want your
body to expect it. You don't want your body to
grow accustomed to only eating vegetables. So then you get
some hot chips because you're like, this way, my body's
just ready for what's going to come, Like, I don't
(20:43):
want to give it a shock when my real life
starts up again.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
You know what I mean? Do you think it applies
to effort Amelia.
Speaker 5 (20:49):
Yeah, so I think that sometimes I go to work
and I've had too much coffee, and I give one
hundred percent and then people yourself, yeah, and they say
that I'm quote unquote overwhelming, and I try not to
do it anymore because people just start to back away.
So now at work, I aim for about seventy five.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
Yeah, And you also you don't want to raise people's
expectations firstly, and also you don't want to burn out,
no exactly, And if you're aiming for one hundred percent
all day, I feel as though what I have in
my life is one hundred percent moments where I can
give one hundred percent for forty five minutes, or like
if I go to the gym, I'll try and give
one hundred percent for literally one minute, and I'll just
(21:30):
like see that because I.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
Do a high intensity interval tree.
Speaker 3 (21:33):
Every now and then, I try to get my heart
right out really hard for a minute.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
I do.
Speaker 4 (21:38):
I'm going to give it a little bit.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
But the thing is, if you wanted to give one
hundred percent every time you went to the gym, you'd
never go to the gym because that's just daunting. So
you've got to understand that when you go, you only really.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
Need to be giving it seventy percent.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
I'd set on my exercise bike and I am giving
it thirty eight. And I'm saying to myself, well, at
least i'm here, it's better than not being here at all.
But someone on TikTok is nearly always telling me that's
not true. They are always telling me, if you're not
killing yourself and sweating your guts out, what are you
even do it here? And I'm like, no, no, no.
(22:11):
Now that Amelia has told me this, I'm going to.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
Say you.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
And I need to get into your settings and sort
you out. Pushing back down to a thirty eight.
Speaker 4 (22:20):
Can make out a battery at two pm.
Speaker 5 (22:22):
I'm going to take it to the next level this
theory about battery and say, Mia has this concept that
I think about a lot called intimacy leaking. Yes, yep,
this idea that if you're in a romantic relationship with
someone a monogamous from romantic relationship, I guess is the
way to describe it here. And then you start telling
people in your life who are not your partner sort
(22:42):
of details of how you're truly feeling or really difficult
things you're struggling with. You're leaking intimacy from your relationship.
And I'm thinking of this as kind of like a
battery leak. You can't be giving too much of your
battery to other people. That's my extension of the wire
cutter theory.
Speaker 1 (22:59):
Oh, like it's leaking out, it's leaking battery.
Speaker 5 (23:02):
So I think you just got to be mindful of
where your battery's going as well, in addition to being
mindful of what level the batteries are.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Is like, let's have another analogy. Remember how Taylor Swift,
the Overlord of the Women of the World, made that
statement about how treat your energy like it's expressive. This
is kind of like that. So if I'm cleaning my kitchen, look,
forty two is plenty, Like forty two percent is plenty
as long as someone's getting yes, But I have to
(23:31):
scrub every little gap.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
Child used all your battery on cleaning the kitchen, and
then your kids came home and you had nothing.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
To yes exactly, but my energy is expensive. So when
the kid walks in the door, this theory is at
least i'd be and I say, so happy to see you, darling.
Did you have a wonderful day. I'm going to put
one hundred percent. Make sure you feel.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Now I'm going to couch that because I don't think
we should ever be giving one hundred percent to parenting,
because again, it's about expectations. You can't have them expect
that you're going to be cooking and clin.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
No.
Speaker 5 (24:03):
But I've got a theory about children in general. This
is not about parents. Tony Morrison once told Michelle Obama,
you get that, So this is a third hand I
didn't hear it from Why Live in Directly. She said
that whenever a child walks in the room, you must
beam and act extremely excited because all children expect that
when they enter a room. Adults like act like they're
(24:25):
a joy in a miracle, which they are.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Yeah, I support that scene.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
And that's like at least five percent of your daily
battery on a child.
Speaker 5 (24:33):
So if you're a teacher, I'm sorry, I don't know
how you're handling it.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Also, it depends on what base you're coming from, Like
if you're hungover or sick or exhausted, or your bosses
and then the child, then you're coming from five percent
to one hundred and that takes a lot like that.
Speaker 4 (24:48):
Okay, I have another application, and it's to do with appearance.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Right.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
Do you ever like you doing your makeup?
Speaker 2 (24:55):
And you go, I.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Could, I could contour, I could give it one, but
my nose.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Is just going to be as wide as it actually.
Speaker 4 (25:02):
Is today exactly. And you go, you know what, I
want to be relatable. I want them to like it.
Speaker 3 (25:08):
If I look too good, then I'm going to walk
into work. I'm going to make everyone feel like she's Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
See, this is a problem that clearly you are.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
I have to live with it.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
I have a friend who's too attractive, right, And we
were saying recently she wasn't there. There were just men
flocking to her, which is interesting because they didn't see us,
but they flocked to her, and we all said it
would be hard being.
Speaker 4 (25:28):
That beautiful because it's distracting.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
When you speak to the men flocking, it sounds like seagulls.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Yeah, we go out to dinner, she gets harassed.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Can she turn it down from herd I don't know.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
And maybe she can turn it down to ninety, but
I can easily turn it to like an eighteen, and
I think that that is a superpower.
Speaker 5 (25:44):
Final question low battery mode. What is the human equivalent
of low battery mode, which, by the way, feels like magic.
Every time I put on low battery mode, I'm like,
I just conducted a magic trick.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
I know, closing all your tabs. It's closing all your tabs.
Low battery mode is what I've been operating in while
I've been poorly lately, and out Loud has been very
sick of I'm sure hearing about me being poorly. Actually,
this is true. People like to blame you for your illnesses,
don't they. So when I said to anyone lately, I've
had the flu, they've blamed it on one hundred percent theory.
(26:15):
They've said, no, I think about it. Oh, it's because
you worked too hard. I just caught the flu. Like,
I don't think it has anything to do with anything
other than that I caught a sickness.
Speaker 4 (26:28):
You went to low power mode.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
I went to low power mode for two weeks, very
little movement. Yes, if I was a fat bear, I
would have been eating a lot of salmon, but not
moving much, storing myself up, just barely raising the head
from the bed to smile winningly at the children when
they came royally. That was great. Low power mode was good.
Speaker 4 (26:51):
You're doing everything to not just die.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Literally, I think that low power mode can get the
job done if needed. Jesse, why didn't you tell me
that Luca was running in the Berlin Marathon last weekend?
I saw him in the office on Monday and I
was like, how you in Berlin? Like? The reason I
ask is that my boyfriend, Harry Stoyles's and don't worry
out loud, it would be very inappropriate. Harry Styles was
(27:16):
my boyfriend, very inappropriate. But we all know I love him.
He ran the bill in marathon on the weekend, in
Marathon full marin.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
It was a good time, right, six fifty.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Under three hours, which is a goal for many people.
This whole other thing about how much I love gap
here Harry Styles. But quite a lot of people when
Mom and Maya posted about this said they thought it
was Luca. That's the picture of Harry Styles is annoying.
The people generally thinking that Lucas.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Hast so annoying.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Look, someone said it before and then we've never brought
it up again. But it is so annoying to make
that comparison, like it gives someone such a big hit Jersey.
Speaker 5 (27:55):
Sorry, let's recap here. You've been told in recent weeks
you look like Sidney Sweeney. Luke has been Tory looks
like Harry Styles.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Look, did Luca love this Harry Styles thing?
Speaker 5 (28:07):
And is he kind of bringing it up at like
inappropriate at moments?
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (28:10):
And look I can kind of see it.
Speaker 3 (28:12):
He's got a headband and some sunglasses on in a
little bit of facial hair.
Speaker 4 (28:15):
But there's no way that Luke's running a marathon. It's
just not him.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
I just love that Harry Styles. And I've been on
this podcast winging about how much I want a new
Harry Styles album. Harry Styles is just like I am
living my life. I want to know what it's like
to run a marathon. I'm dating Zoe Kravitz. Were in
Rome or in New York. We're in London where wherever
he is spending his money, he is having a great time.
Here is my new role model.
Speaker 5 (28:38):
So with Zoe Kravitz, she is dating him, she is
dating him. There was some confusion that was.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
The bait and switched the Austin what's his name, hot man, very.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Hot Austin Butler Australian.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
No, he's not and he looks Australian, but he's not.
Everyone thought she was dating Austin Butler, but they were
just doing very good chemistry. For she is dating Harry Styles,
or at least she has been. And some people say
he had a fake name and everything in the marathon,
not that I've done a deep dive and she was
there and maybe also in cognito cheering him on. But
he is living his best life. And everyone's like, look
(29:10):
at Taylor Swift. She's released like twenty five albums since
you did Harry's House, Harry, get your shit together, And
I'm like, nah, I'm full respectful. I was going to
say them fat bear mode.
Speaker 3 (29:19):
Well, I was going to say, he's definitely not taking
it to one hundred percent, but then I realize he
just ran a marathon, so you might shit.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Can you run a marathon in low power? After the break,
soft Pants be damned? Dressing for Work is.
Speaker 4 (29:34):
Back one unlimited out loud access.
Speaker 3 (29:37):
We drop episodes every Tuesday and Thursday exclusively for Mum
and Me are subscribers. Follow the link in the show
notes to get us in your ears five days a week,
and a huge thank you to all our current subscribers, What.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Are you wearing right now? Out louders you want to
find out liking to imagine that. I don't think very
many of our louders are this, but you know how
there are all those bros who pretend they're working while
listening to their favorite podcasts. Yeah, or watching it on YouTube.
Maybe there are some outlouders doing that. If so, what
is your current worker tire? Because apparently the mass return
to office work in Australia we're judged to be at
(30:14):
about seventy seven percent from pre COVID levels.
Speaker 4 (30:18):
Of as in back to the office full time.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Yeah, and I know how much the back to the
office conversation anoys, teachers, nurses, doctors, you know, retail workers.
I know this not everybody, but this is about people
who pre COVID were in office were apparently about seventy
seven percent return, So lots of back to the office
and apparently what's come with this is a bit of
pearl clutching about the fact that a lot of people
(30:41):
don't know how to dress for the office anymore and
we are in a full return to corporate ware. Listen
to this. It's a collection of mostly female managers having
a winge about their mostly younger colleagues what they're wearing
to the office. They had an assistant show up tour
in joggers, no makeup.
Speaker 4 (30:59):
She sat down at the table to begin working.
Speaker 5 (31:01):
I instantly had this gut reaction of no, this doesn't represent.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
Our client who we are becoming.
Speaker 5 (31:07):
It didn't work for me, and from that day forward,
I have enforced this dress code, not only for my
team but for myself.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
When I get dressed for my top client every day,
even though I'm.
Speaker 5 (31:15):
Seeing no one potentially but my team, it improves productivity.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
There is it's neuroscience fact.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
You're going to have a more successful day. You're telling
your body in your mind you are here to work.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
It occurs to me that some of you have not
or do not have a grown up telling you how
to dress in the workplace.
Speaker 7 (31:36):
I just wanted to talk about your outfit today.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Okay, what about it.
Speaker 7 (31:41):
We have a huge client meeting today, a customer worth
a lot of money who's expecting like the utmost professionalism,
and some people on your team really not comfortable with
what you're wearing today.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
So that's a collection of tiktoks and reels from Australia
and America of basically bosses bitching about the fact that
nobody knows how to dress anymore. Now that's why you're seeing.
I'm certainly seeing on my social's lots of what I
watered the office reels right, lots of people putting together
their fashion and Vogue Australia declares that business casual is
(32:13):
dead and we're now into corporate core and there are
all these different trends with it that go office siren,
corp core, corporate fetish. Dressing for work is back. But
don't tell Emily Vernon because I checked in with her
today about this. I said, Duhl, did you dress for
work today? And you know what she said? She said,
I'm literally wearing see through linen pants that I may
(32:34):
or may not have slept it. I think that illustrates
the problem here, friends, are we dressing for work?
Speaker 3 (32:41):
It is so funny because you put this in yesterday
like a story about this, and at almost exactly the
same time, I got a message in one of my
biggest group chats from someone saying apparently I have to
dress corporate.
Speaker 4 (32:53):
Where is everyone shopping?
Speaker 3 (32:55):
And I was like, I have not seen that question
in such a long time, and it made me think
about a few things. The first is that if you've
been working a few days in the office, the difference
between two or three and five is an entire wardrobe
you need five, or you feel like you need five
different outfits or at least different things to put together.
The other is a change of season, is that it
might be the first warm season that you've looked around
(33:17):
and gone, how do you dress for warm?
Speaker 4 (33:20):
In the corporate vibe?
Speaker 3 (33:22):
But then I tried to find evidence of this, and
I was looking at data about the term relaxed dress,
and apparently in Australian job postings it's up. So a
lot of sectors are saying that they're encouraging relaxed dress,
especially in the Act and Queensland.
Speaker 4 (33:42):
The theory is that it's influenced from the tech sector.
Speaker 3 (33:45):
So because the tech sector has always been about pushing
against office norms. Think about your friends who work for
kind of really hip, techy places and they just wear
jeans and sneakers or whatever. Apparently that has leaked into accounting, legal,
banking and finance it and there's been an increasing casualization
of how people.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
But that's why there's a pushback on it now.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Right, well, I smell a rap.
Speaker 5 (34:11):
I think the reason why this discussion is kind of
seemingly surfacing organically on TikTok and elsewhere is because employers
are unhappy with hybrid work and they want to change
the game, and they think that if they get people
to buy enough.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Clothes, they'll become more happy about going into.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Lim somewhere to wear them to exactly.
Speaker 5 (34:32):
So I think it's also especially a story about the
corporate sector, because yeah, the point about tech is well taken.
They've always dressed a bit differently. But look at the
fact that the staff at the big four banks in
Australia have all been called back to work full time.
Also tab Corp and then Mineral Resources, that company in
Perth where the CEO said he wanted to hold the
(34:52):
staff captive. The staff are captive. They're back at work.
So I think smart casual that in the corporate sector
there's this real sense of we're paying you enough, why
aren't you here five days a week? And they think
that clothing is kind of the incentive to get people back.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Because as that piece in Vogue was saying that like
they're make trying to make corporate wear sexy. So it's
all about trying to appear like that. This is great.
This is a whole vibe to be coming out of
the office, getting dressed up, being sharp, and that what
I'm seeing. And you know, I don't speak fashion, I'm
not mere, but what I'm seeing in a lot of
these videos is lots of tailored pants, maybe a waistcoat
(35:29):
if you're like a hot thing who can have your arms.
Lots of draped blazer yet lots of blazers, heels seem
to be back, a bit of a pointed toe seems
to be.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Back officially pointed toes, back.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Slicked back hair. I think about and we've talked about
her on the show before, but you know, some of
the iconic girl bosses of the moment, like Emma Greed,
we've talked about her before. She's the woman behind skims
and all of those. She posts every week things I
want to the office every week, and it's her coming
out of the office lift in ever more elegant clothes.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Are they corporate or are they kind of more straddling like.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
What modern corporate means, because she's not in a suit,
but she's definitely I think the word we would be
looking for is polished.
Speaker 4 (36:11):
She and jeans.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
She lives in jeans on a non meeting day, but
they're very elegant jeens. What I was asking em when
I asked her about her in pas, I promise it
wasn't passac. It's basically I wonder if there's a generational
piece to this. But I definitely think that I have
work clothes and non work clothes. Even though I wear
jeans and things to work. I definitely dress differently on
a day when I'm coming into the office here at
(36:33):
Mamma Mia than I do when I'm at home in Hip.
But I don't know if that's true for a lot
of the younger people who came of work age during COVID.
I definitely have spoken to colleagues where I say, oh,
these are work clothes, and they look at me a
bit blankly, like what do you mean working? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:52):
So apparently self expression has become increasingly for GenZ and
millennial They've never really understood fashion without self expression, like
I'm going to show who I am, whether it's with
like a baseball hat or sneakers or something. They want
to look like themselves. Whereas when I first started in
the workplace. I worked in a school ADMINI thing like
(37:13):
I just copied exactly what everyone else was wearing, and
it was a pencil skirt, like that's the kind of
thing you did, which I felt incredibly uncomfortable in. But
I found this article in the Washington Post and it's
Lizzy Post, who works for the Emily Post Institute. Emily
Post was her great great grandmother, and she does all
the etiquette guides. Oh good, And she has business etiquette
(37:33):
and rules for what you have to wear to the office.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
Do you want to hear some of them this year
twenty twenty five?
Speaker 5 (37:38):
But I will say, if soft pants is on there,
I'm walking out. And there's been enough aggression towards soft
pants today.
Speaker 3 (37:45):
Well, she says, and this is important for summer. We're
going into a summer in Australia and there's a big
question regardings.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Assuming the rapture doesn't happen exactly true, that would be
one of the reliefs of the rapture. We don't have
to think about what to wear to the office tomorrow.
Speaker 3 (38:00):
The shoe to foot ratio, right, okay, shoes to foot ratio,
So we wear a sandal, how much sand or can
we get away with right?
Speaker 4 (38:08):
This is the big question.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
So she says that the shoe to foot visibility ratio
remains tipped in the balance of the shoe, so anything
that starts to have the majority of the foot exposed
starts to become questionable. So if I can say too
much foot, apparently that's a no no. Right, you've got
to have most of your foot covered. Rule iron your clothes, which,
by the way, did you really have to be told that,
(38:31):
jo I do iron my clothes, and every comment is.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
A shower and a coat hanger.
Speaker 4 (38:38):
I try, I try, but I actually iron them.
Speaker 3 (38:40):
And every time we post videos to the outloud as
they say, Jesse ironing, I do.
Speaker 2 (38:44):
But I'm the same as you. There are some people
who are really good at ironing, and I'm doing it right,
I'm terrible.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
I think iron your clothes.
Speaker 5 (38:50):
Probably if you gathered up all the comments on the
internet since it began when our Dore started at back
in two thousand, I think iron your clothes.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
And then mostly about me. Jeans are allowed.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
According to her, a particular type of gene loves a
straight leg, and she says the higher the waist, the better.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
The Princess Die the twee blazer exactly.
Speaker 4 (39:11):
You cannot wear the same socks you wear to the gym.
Speaker 1 (39:15):
No, but socks.
Speaker 5 (39:15):
I'm sorry with respect to the Post family, who I
know have been dispensing and I could advise for generations.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
Socks is a whole other thing right now.
Speaker 4 (39:24):
So you can have like a statement.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
So it's too many rules.
Speaker 5 (39:28):
I just I'm paralyzed by indecision on the sock front.
I don't understand what socks are appropriate anymore.
Speaker 2 (39:33):
You know, I found myself buying some statement socks on
the internet when I was statements, and then I thought,
this is yet another one of these examples in my
life where Mia was buying statements socks literally and we
were laughing at her one year ago. We were pointing
at her stupid socks and going ha ha ha. And
then I just bought some sparkly mesh mid cuff, strangely
(39:55):
bronze socks for too much money on the Internet, and
I'm like, OK, this is another example of how she's
always right ahead.
Speaker 4 (40:04):
Of the curt So backpacks are the new briefcase.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
You happy you always have. I mean, I have a
backpack too, but you've had piss taken out of you
about your Josh Live.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
And backpack for a while, for a very long time.
And this is the last one. T shirt rule, big
question about T shirts. All T shirts are not made equally.
You have to have a slightly thicker or softer fabric.
You need to tread carefully with logos, words and non
abstract images for example, a T shirt with them a
tease painting.
Speaker 4 (40:33):
Fine. A T shirt with a cartoon character. No, so
that's the rule. Would you wear a T shirt?
Speaker 3 (40:39):
I've never seen you wear a T shirt shirt. Yeah,
I don't mind. I make a T shirt look very cheap.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
My uniform is shirts. As you know, I've got a
lot of shirts, which means I do have to iron them,
which is annoying. I wear a lot of shirts. I
would not wear a T shirt with the cartoon encouragement.
But if we instilled that, if we instilled that rule
at MoMA Mere, there would be no one out there
and they're all wearing T shirts.
Speaker 3 (41:04):
Another fun one is that you can wear a hat,
but you must take it off for your meeting. Hat
then a fascinator like what from morning meeting?
Speaker 4 (41:17):
By sorry, guys, just take my hat off out loud as,
what are.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
You wearing to work? Like? Tell us and people started
talking to you about your clothes. Those tiktoks that we
played a bit of before, there's just these women walking
up to their coworkers and assistance and being like this.
Speaker 1 (41:31):
No, not working.
Speaker 4 (41:34):
Really, out Louders, tell.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Us how you're doing it?
Speaker 1 (41:37):
I think that's it.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
I think we've exhausted Wednesday.
Speaker 4 (41:40):
Yep, solved the problem in the world today.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
Massive thank you to all of you out louders for
being here with us. As always, we're going to be
back in your ears of course tomorrow, and don't forget
if you want to look at what we're wearing to
work today, at least the top half of it. Can't
check our socks. You'll find us on YouTube.
Speaker 3 (41:59):
And out Louders if you missed Monday's episode. We talked
about the latest development in what I am terming the
Internet's biggest cheating scandal. We also talk about what is
going on with Jimmy Kimmel and all the stuff you
might have missed, and why are you ugly cry on
your birthday every year?
Speaker 4 (42:16):
You're not alone?
Speaker 3 (42:17):
We unpack why it's a super common thing to do,
and my Mum got so offended by what I said,
she commented in the out.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
Special group, Anne Stevens continues to be dry Connie. She
was just like Jesse had a winge about her birthday.
You have to go listen, and Anne was just like
not having it.
Speaker 4 (42:35):
Not having any of it. We will pop a link
in the show notes. Bye bye.
Speaker 2 (42:40):
Shout out to any Mamma Mia subscribers listening. If you
love the show and you want to support us, subscribing
to Mamma Mia is the very best way to do it.
There's a link in the episode description.
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