July 28, 2025 • 21 mins
In the last 72 hours, devastating images from Gaza have moved the world - babies with swollen bellies lacking vital nutrition and children reduced to skin and bone as Palestinians face starvation amid ongoing conflict.
Israel has announced "tactical pauses" to allow small windows for aid, but experts say it's nowhere near enough, while political pressure builds in Australia to take stronger action on what we're witnessing.
And in headlines today US President Donald Trump says he is setting a new 10 or 12-day deadline for Russia over its war in Ukraine. Parents are being urged to vaccinate their children against this season’s flu outbreak after a 2 year old girl died in WA, US President Donald Trump has asked a judge to order a fast deposition for billionaire Rupert Murdoch in the president's defamation lawsuit against the Wall Street Journal; US comedian Marc Maron has paid $US50,000 to use just one minute of a Taylor Swift song in his stand-up special
Email your MP for action on Gaza
Donate to Doctors Without Borders
THE END BITS
Support independent women's media
Check out The Quicky Instagram here
Listen to Morning Tea celebrity headlines here
GET IN TOUCH
Share your story, feedback, or dilemma! Send us a voice note or email us at thequicky@mamamia.com.au
CREDITS
Hosts: Taylah Strano & Claire Murphy
Guest: Dr Jessica Genauer, Senior Lecturer in International Relations at Flinders University
Audio Producer: Lu Hill
Become a Mamamia subscriber: https://www.mamamia.com.au/subscribe
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
You're listening Tea a Muma Mea podcast. Mumma Mea acknowledges
the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast
is recorded on.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Hey, I'm Taylorstrano. This is Mumma Mer's twice daily news podcast,
The Quickie. In the last seventy two hours, the world
has been moved by images coming out of Gaza. Babies
with swollen bellies, lacking vital nutrition, mothers too weak to
feed them. Children literally reduce to skin and bone. As
(00:42):
Palestinians hunger for food and justice, The situation has reached
another deadly turning point, the death told due to starvation
rising as Israel announces tactical pauses to allow small windows
for aid to reach those in need. Meanwhile, inside Australia,
political pressure builds to act on what we're seeing out
of Gaza. So where to from here and what can
(01:06):
you do at home before we get there. Here's Murphy
with the latest from The Quickie newsroom for Tuesday, July
twenty nine.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Thanks Taylor. US President Donald Trump says he's setting a
new ten or twelve day deadline for Russia over its
war in Ukraine. His frustration with Russian president Vladimir Putin
for prolonging fighting between the two sides becoming more evident.
Speaking in Scotland, where he's holding meetings with European leaders
and playing golf, Trump said he was disappointed in Putin
(01:34):
and shortening a fifty day deadline he'd said on the
issue earlier this month, saying there's no reason in waiting.
We just don't see any progress being made. He went
on to say he thinks he already knows the answer
to the shortened deadline and what's going to happen. There
was no immediate comment from the Kremlin. Before returning to
the White House in January, Trump, who views himself as
a peacemaker, had promised to end the three and a
(01:56):
half year old conflict within twenty four hours. He's now
threatened both sanctions on Russia and buyers of its exports
unless progress is made. Parents are being urged to vaccinate
their children against this season's flew out break. After a
time two year old girl died in wa the Toddlers
family wrote an open letter via the Immunization Foundation of
Australia describing how, after returning from an overseas holiday, their
(02:20):
little RB, who they called the heart of their home
deteriorated quickly from having a slight fever to being unresponsive
in just two days. They rushed her to hospital after
her fever spiked to over forty degrees and she began vomiting.
Before she could even receive any medication, she suffered a seizure.
She was transferred to the ICU, but her family says
they believe she was already lost at this point. Medical
(02:42):
experts are urging everyone to get a flu vaccination. Data
from the Australian Respiratory Surveillance Report shows one hundred and
eighty Ozsies have died from the flu between January and
April this year, a seventy three percent increase compared to
the same time last year. Two of those with children
under the age of sixteen. The flu vaccine is free
for children aged six months to five years, for adults
(03:04):
over sixty five, pregnant women, and Aboriginal and Torres Strait
Islander people. US President Donald Trump has asked a judge
to order a fast deposition for billionaire Rupert Murdock in
the president's defamation lawsuit against The Wall Street Journal over
its July seventeen article about Trump's relationship with the late
financier and sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. On July eighteen, Trump
(03:26):
sued the news outlet, its owners, including Murdoch, and the
reporters who wrote the story, which claimed Trump's name was
signed on a two thousand and three birthday greeting for
Epstein that included a sexually suggestive drawing and a reference
to secrets they shared. In a court filing on Monday,
lawyers for Trump asked the federal court in Miami, Florida,
to compel ninety four year old Rupert Murdock to testify
(03:48):
within fifteen days, in part due to his advanced age.
Dal Jones, the Wall Street Journal's publisher, has said they
stand by its reporting and would vigorously defend itself against
the lawsuit. US comedian Mark Maron has paid fifty thousand
dollars US to use just one minute of a Taylor
Swift song in his stand up special. The comic felt
he needed bigger than the whole, a bonus track on
(04:11):
the three AM edition of Taylor's twenty twenty two album Midnights.
For a pivotal moment in his HBO show, Mark Maron
panicked he got in touch with mutual friend Jack Antonov
for help in licensing the track, and while his power
was able to offer advice on going through the official channels,
he couldn't get him a discount on the fee. Maren
didn't know if Swift had heard the specific joke that
(04:31):
her team signed off on letting him use the track for,
but he was manifesting that she would like it if
she did.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Thanks Claire. Next the latest out of Gaza. You might
have seen the headlines tactical pause, humanitarian corridor ate.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Allowed in, but what does that really.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Look like on the ground in Gaza? The Israeli military
this week announced tactical pauses in fighting aka ten hour
breaks in three of the enclaves most populated areas, Gaza City, Dia,
Albala and Mamasi. Israel says the daily windows from ten
am to eight pm are to increase the scale of
humanitarian aid getting in, but for many Palestinians that promise
(05:18):
comes with deep weariness. Soon after the first pause began,
Israel carried out an airstrike in Gaza City, with reports
from Al Alda Hospital confirming a mother and her four
children were killed. Elsewhere, even as trucks lined up to
bring in supplies. Crowds weighted nervously, reporting that anyone coming
close to the aid drop points risked being shot. Even
(05:40):
during the pause, fighting continues outside of the designated zones.
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netna, who has described the pauses
as allowing only a minimal amount of aid, downplaying any
suggestion that the blockade is really being lifted. Humanitarian experts
and aid groups say this is nowhere near enough. About
(06:00):
seventy trucks of food and supplies are now getting in
a day when Garza realistically needs five hundred just to
halt the deepening famine crisis inside Gaza. Doctors and aid
agencies paint a devastating picture. Images are circulating globally, small
children whose arms and legs are stick thin, bellies swollen
(06:21):
from hunger, mothers too weak to stand. The situation is
so grave some healthcare workers have turned to TikTok and
social media to explain step by step what starvation does
to the body.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
In the first six to twenty four hours, lo sugar drops,
the body burns stored lackergy to stay alive one to
three days no more. Lacogene fat is stemmed into ketones
to fuel your brain. The body is now in a
survival mood, we call it. From three to five days,
the muscles start breaking down. The body sacrifice its own tissue,
(06:58):
even the hard, just to survive. This is when children
stop crying.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Meanwhile, back home, Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanezi has ramped
out criticism of Israel's blow bode, calling it a clear
breach of international law, warning that stopping food and medical
supplies is costing Israel vital support. Worldwide, more than one
hundred humanitarian organizations are calling for the immediate opening of
all Gaza crossings, reminding leaders that the only thing that
(07:26):
will save lives is a true flood of humanitarian relief,
not minimal supplies. All of this happens as the political
spotlight turns to whether Australia will join France in recognizing
a Palestinian state. France's President Emmanuel Macron has made the move,
but pressure inside Labour is mixed. Foreign Minister Penny Wong
(07:48):
has reaffirmed the government stance, telling the ABC there are
challenges ahead before recognizing Palestinian statehood.
Speaker 4 (07:56):
We have to see Amas demilitarized, we have to see
the hostages released. We need to see progress in terms
of the Palestinian authority and its moves to more democratic
and accountable governance, and it's easy to see some of
that happening.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Political debates aside, the crisis on the ground remains urgent,
a situation, in the words of humanitarian groups, entirely preventable
if only enough aid and action are allowed. In for
more on what these developments mean and what you can
do at home, we're joined by international relations expert doctor
Jessica Ganaua. Let's start with these military pauses. What's actually
(08:33):
going on there is it's going to be effective in
delivering the right amount of aid needed.
Speaker 5 (08:38):
So we're seeing a ramping up of pressure on Israel
to address the ongoing humanitarian crisis in Gaza, and this
is particularly around aid not getting through. So we're talking
about food, we're also talking about fresh water and medicines,
and where it is getting through not necessarily getting to
all of the civilian population that is requiring those basic
(09:01):
daily requirements. So at the moment, we are starting to
see some responsiveness from Israel in terms of trying to
ensure that aid will start to get through. It's still
small scale and its early days. According to estimates, the
civilian population there would need about five hundred or six
(09:24):
hundred AID trucks per day, and we just haven't seen
anything of that volume actually getting through. And because there's
still the military operation ongoing in the Gaza Strip, that
would require a pause in fighting and humanitarian corridors to
be enabled in order to make sure the aid can
actually get through without aid workers or people coming to
(09:45):
get that aid being physically threatened themselves while they're essentially
in a war zone. So that's what we're also starting
to see and move towards having some military pauses for
aid to get through, but we still don't know if
that will be sufficient for what's required to address the
humanitarian crisis.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Can we take a step back? People and even the
UN have been very critical of the Gaza Humanitarian Founder
that US and Israelly backed private organization who've been delivering
aid in Gaza. Why is there so much criticism around
that particular outlet.
Speaker 5 (10:18):
First of all, the whole concept of having a private organization,
which it seems may even be a for profit organization
delivering aid is a very tricky area because when it
comes to aid, when it's trying to supply civilian populations
with necessary food stuff. You really want that to be overseen,
(10:42):
particularly a very tricky political, high intensity military environment. You
want that to be overseen by neutral actors who are
part of some kind of international organization and whose only
imperative is going to be a humanitarian one to get
food to people who need it, to get water to
people who need it, et cetera. So, yes, there's been
(11:02):
a lot of controversy around this particular organization, saying that
they're using on the ground private security contractors who maybe
are not in their first objective humanitarian actors. So essentially
they're there to provide security for other actors who are
then delivering the aid, but they might view there to
(11:25):
be a security threat, where a humanitarian actor might say, no,
you know, this crowd of people coming in and wanting
to get food for their families, we're not going to
view them as a security threat. So there's been I
think a lot of gray area there around the way
that those private security actors have been operating on the ground.
So I think this really comes down to the complexity
(11:46):
of having a private organization trying to deliver up what
should be a public good that should be overseen by
an international organization.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Recently we've seen France move to recognize the state of Palestine.
Australia is yet to do so. The Foreign Minister, Penny
Wong says that Hamas needs to be demilitarized before any
kind of recognition of statehood can occur. Beyond not releasing
the remaining Israeli hostages, what else is Hamas actually doing
right now? When she says they need to be demilitarized,
(12:16):
there's imagery that they're actively in a war zone and
engaging in conflict. Is that correct?
Speaker 5 (12:22):
This is again a tricky area, like the extent to
which Israel could prove that they have achieved or not
achieved their stated military objective of ensuring that Hamas can
no longer operate as a military fighting force. I've no
doubt there are still some elements of armed ha mass
(12:42):
fighters who still exist within the Gaza strip and are
trying to operate. However they're best able. Ha Maas has
been severely degraded since Israel's response to those October seven attacks.
Most of the Hamas leadership have been assassinated and they've
been replaced by others who in turn have often been assassinated,
so the entire group has been severely degraded. But an
(13:06):
element of complexity here again is that we're talking about
non state actor essentially, so HAMAS fighters aren't always going
to be in military fatigues as we would think of
state military fighting force. It can be hard to pinpoint
and identify exactly has every single fighter who identifies as
(13:26):
part of the Hamas fighting force? Have they all laid
down their arms or have they not laid down their arms?
How many are exactly left? Nobody could give an exact count,
But I think that what is clear is that it
is going to be very tricky to say definitively every
single person who's ever identified with Hamas has now been
(13:49):
disarmed in terms of their ability to engage in operations
against Israel. I almost think trying to get to that
point is something that is almost impossible when you're looking
at a force who are essentially a non state actor,
so they sort of can blend in and out of populations.
So I'm not sure that that actually gives us any
kind of clear timeline on what point in time would
(14:13):
a stance change and would countries say, well, yes, okay,
that objective has now been clearly achieved.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
When we say recognition of statehood, jess, what does that
actually mean? Do we not already recognize that Palestine is
a country.
Speaker 5 (14:28):
This is an interesting area because there are a few
different factors that state entities need to have if they
want to claim statehood internationally. One of those is a
clear territory, clear territorial boundaries, clear governance over the territory.
But an interesting aspect is what's called international legitimacy and recognition,
(14:50):
and that typically takes place through as a sort of
a proxy measure, through states being recognized and having full
membership of the United Nations, and Palestine at the moment
has a non member observer status at the United Nations.
So a key aspect individual states want to go out
(15:11):
and say we now recognize Palestine as a state. That
does matter symbolically because if ultimately all the states in
the world were to say that, it would almost create
a situation where Palestine becomes a state. But at the
same time, if Palestine does not become a full member
of the United Nations, they won't really be viewed within
the international system as a full state. And in order
(15:34):
to get that full membership that needs to go through
the United Nations Security Council. And a complicating aspect is
that in the United Nations Security Council there are five
major countries who have veto power, so the United States, China,
the UK, France and Russia. And as you can imagine,
on this issue, there has been a proposal put the
(15:56):
United Nations Security Council that Palestine should be put forward
for full statehood, but in the most recent case, the
United States vetoed that. But any one of those five
countries could potentially veto. So the fact that France is
decided to recognize Palestinian statehood and they are on the
United Nations Security Council is important and is significant, but
it's not going to be enough just bringing.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
It back home. We've seen reporting that within labor there's
pressure mounting to do more. We saw former Foreign Minister
Bob Carr said that we shouldn't be waiting for other
countries to make a move, so why are we. We've
seen last week that the Australian government was a signatory
to that declaration asking for a ceasefire. We've seen alban
easy tough in his stance in the last few weeks.
(16:40):
Why are we hesitant to maybe make a move like
France and recognize statehood.
Speaker 5 (16:45):
I think there are probably a couple of reasons, but
I think that Australia we've seen generally, is tending to
follow European countries' partners rather than wanting to go out
and actually lead on taking new steps when it comes
to statements or even recognition of a Palestinian state or
(17:08):
other types of things that might be seen as steps
towards trying to pressure Israel to more seriously address the
humanitarian crisis in Gaza. So it's not that the Australian
government is not concerned, but I don't think that Australia
wants to kind of go out ahead of our European partners.
So I could imagine if a lot more countries across
Europe decide to recognize a Palestinian state, Australia might do so.
(17:29):
But I think that we are cautious around upsetting our
key US partner as well. So I think on this issue,
the current Labor government is actually trying to remain quite centrist,
and I think they've been sticking to that in quite
a persistent way, even when there are voices within the
Australian domestic context that are calling for more action from
(17:53):
the Labor government. I think they're still remaining very centrist
in their stance, and I don't think that's likely to
change in the near future. Jess.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
This weekend was really a turning point for a lot
of people. Seeing those images of Style children left people
with a feeling of despair and helplessness. What is the
most useful, practical, helpful thing that we can do for
people who are sitting at home and wanting to contribute
to ending this starvation. Is it more effective to donate
(18:22):
to aid and relief? Will it even get through We
don't necessarily know with these tactical pauses, Or would we
be better place to focus our attention and energy at home,
like writing to our members of parliament or showing up
to a protest. What would you suggest people do?
Speaker 5 (18:37):
Ultimately, domestic pressure does matter, like I think that in
a democratic society, our political actors are concerned first and
foremost with their domestic constituency. So whether it's members of
Parliament thinking about their own electorate or whether it's members
(18:57):
of the current government thinking about more generally opinion across
of Australia. The thing that tends to actually bring pressure
to bear on politicians is concern about domestic sentiment, and
they do care, they do want to know. It could
be that if on a particular issue area there's a
sort of a fifty to fifty split across the Australian population,
(19:19):
that will be one thing. If it becomes clear that
actually the split is more eighty percent one way twenty
percent the other way, that will concern politicians, That will
concern political actors, and then they will also bring internal
pressure to bear for something to be done about that.
I think that internationally it does matter countries like France
that do have a fair amount of leverage and quite
(19:41):
powerful in the international system, so what they do is
going to matter. I mean, importantly, those sort of five
countries on the UN Security Council have relatively more ability
for leverage. But I think that for a country like Israel,
the thing that would probably matter the most besides general
(20:01):
international opinion, the thing that probably matters the most is
sanctions and economic pressure. We haven't really seen that so
far in any sort of serious way from countries around
the world, but that's probably the thing when we look
at the history of international affairs. That's probably the mechanism
that ends up having impact, not in all cases, but
(20:23):
where it is effective, that does have impact on states policy.
For politicians back at home in Australia, it is definitely
always top of mind for political actors. What do their
own constituencies think, What is the vibe check of the population,
where are people sitting on different issues? And they definitely
do care if they start to see a swing on
(20:45):
a particular issue one way or another.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Thanks for taking some time to feed your mind with
us today, hey, Linked in the show notes will be
further reading on the situation in Gaza, as well as
links to contribute to aid relief and other helpful resources too.
The quickie is produced by me Taylor Strano and Clare Murphy,
with audio production by Lou Hill.
You're listening Tea a Muma Mea podcast. Mumma Mea acknowledges
the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast
is recorded on.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Hey, I'm Taylorstrano. This is Mumma Mer's twice daily news podcast,
The Quickie. In the last seventy two hours, the world
has been moved by images coming out of Gaza. Babies
with swollen bellies, lacking vital nutrition, mothers too weak to
feed them. Children literally reduce to skin and bone. As
(00:42):
Palestinians hunger for food and justice, The situation has reached
another deadly turning point, the death told due to starvation
rising as Israel announces tactical pauses to allow small windows
for aid to reach those in need. Meanwhile, inside Australia,
political pressure builds to act on what we're seeing out
of Gaza. So where to from here and what can
(01:06):
you do at home before we get there. Here's Murphy
with the latest from The Quickie newsroom for Tuesday, July
twenty nine.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Thanks Taylor. US President Donald Trump says he's setting a
new ten or twelve day deadline for Russia over its
war in Ukraine. His frustration with Russian president Vladimir Putin
for prolonging fighting between the two sides becoming more evident.
Speaking in Scotland, where he's holding meetings with European leaders
and playing golf, Trump said he was disappointed in Putin
(01:34):
and shortening a fifty day deadline he'd said on the
issue earlier this month, saying there's no reason in waiting.
We just don't see any progress being made. He went
on to say he thinks he already knows the answer
to the shortened deadline and what's going to happen. There
was no immediate comment from the Kremlin. Before returning to
the White House in January, Trump, who views himself as
a peacemaker, had promised to end the three and a
(01:56):
half year old conflict within twenty four hours. He's now
threatened both sanctions on Russia and buyers of its exports
unless progress is made. Parents are being urged to vaccinate
their children against this season's flew out break. After a
time two year old girl died in wa the Toddlers
family wrote an open letter via the Immunization Foundation of
Australia describing how, after returning from an overseas holiday, their
(02:20):
little RB, who they called the heart of their home
deteriorated quickly from having a slight fever to being unresponsive
in just two days. They rushed her to hospital after
her fever spiked to over forty degrees and she began vomiting.
Before she could even receive any medication, she suffered a seizure.
She was transferred to the ICU, but her family says
they believe she was already lost at this point. Medical
(02:42):
experts are urging everyone to get a flu vaccination. Data
from the Australian Respiratory Surveillance Report shows one hundred and
eighty Ozsies have died from the flu between January and
April this year, a seventy three percent increase compared to
the same time last year. Two of those with children
under the age of sixteen. The flu vaccine is free
for children aged six months to five years, for adults
(03:04):
over sixty five, pregnant women, and Aboriginal and Torres Strait
Islander people. US President Donald Trump has asked a judge
to order a fast deposition for billionaire Rupert Murdock in
the president's defamation lawsuit against The Wall Street Journal over
its July seventeen article about Trump's relationship with the late
financier and sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. On July eighteen, Trump
(03:26):
sued the news outlet, its owners, including Murdoch, and the
reporters who wrote the story, which claimed Trump's name was
signed on a two thousand and three birthday greeting for
Epstein that included a sexually suggestive drawing and a reference
to secrets they shared. In a court filing on Monday,
lawyers for Trump asked the federal court in Miami, Florida,
to compel ninety four year old Rupert Murdock to testify
(03:48):
within fifteen days, in part due to his advanced age.
Dal Jones, the Wall Street Journal's publisher, has said they
stand by its reporting and would vigorously defend itself against
the lawsuit. US comedian Mark Maron has paid fifty thousand
dollars US to use just one minute of a Taylor
Swift song in his stand up special. The comic felt
he needed bigger than the whole, a bonus track on
(04:11):
the three AM edition of Taylor's twenty twenty two album Midnights.
For a pivotal moment in his HBO show, Mark Maron
panicked he got in touch with mutual friend Jack Antonov
for help in licensing the track, and while his power
was able to offer advice on going through the official channels,
he couldn't get him a discount on the fee. Maren
didn't know if Swift had heard the specific joke that
(04:31):
her team signed off on letting him use the track for,
but he was manifesting that she would like it if
she did.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Thanks Claire. Next the latest out of Gaza. You might
have seen the headlines tactical pause, humanitarian corridor ate.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Allowed in, but what does that really.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Look like on the ground in Gaza? The Israeli military
this week announced tactical pauses in fighting aka ten hour
breaks in three of the enclaves most populated areas, Gaza City, Dia,
Albala and Mamasi. Israel says the daily windows from ten
am to eight pm are to increase the scale of
humanitarian aid getting in, but for many Palestinians that promise
(05:18):
comes with deep weariness. Soon after the first pause began,
Israel carried out an airstrike in Gaza City, with reports
from Al Alda Hospital confirming a mother and her four
children were killed. Elsewhere, even as trucks lined up to
bring in supplies. Crowds weighted nervously, reporting that anyone coming
close to the aid drop points risked being shot. Even
(05:40):
during the pause, fighting continues outside of the designated zones.
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netna, who has described the pauses
as allowing only a minimal amount of aid, downplaying any
suggestion that the blockade is really being lifted. Humanitarian experts
and aid groups say this is nowhere near enough. About
(06:00):
seventy trucks of food and supplies are now getting in
a day when Garza realistically needs five hundred just to
halt the deepening famine crisis inside Gaza. Doctors and aid
agencies paint a devastating picture. Images are circulating globally, small
children whose arms and legs are stick thin, bellies swollen
(06:21):
from hunger, mothers too weak to stand. The situation is
so grave some healthcare workers have turned to TikTok and
social media to explain step by step what starvation does
to the body.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
In the first six to twenty four hours, lo sugar drops,
the body burns stored lackergy to stay alive one to
three days no more. Lacogene fat is stemmed into ketones
to fuel your brain. The body is now in a
survival mood, we call it. From three to five days,
the muscles start breaking down. The body sacrifice its own tissue,
(06:58):
even the hard, just to survive. This is when children
stop crying.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Meanwhile, back home, Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanezi has ramped
out criticism of Israel's blow bode, calling it a clear
breach of international law, warning that stopping food and medical
supplies is costing Israel vital support. Worldwide, more than one
hundred humanitarian organizations are calling for the immediate opening of
all Gaza crossings, reminding leaders that the only thing that
(07:26):
will save lives is a true flood of humanitarian relief,
not minimal supplies. All of this happens as the political
spotlight turns to whether Australia will join France in recognizing
a Palestinian state. France's President Emmanuel Macron has made the move,
but pressure inside Labour is mixed. Foreign Minister Penny Wong
(07:48):
has reaffirmed the government stance, telling the ABC there are
challenges ahead before recognizing Palestinian statehood.
Speaker 4 (07:56):
We have to see Amas demilitarized, we have to see
the hostages released. We need to see progress in terms
of the Palestinian authority and its moves to more democratic
and accountable governance, and it's easy to see some of
that happening.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Political debates aside, the crisis on the ground remains urgent,
a situation, in the words of humanitarian groups, entirely preventable
if only enough aid and action are allowed. In for
more on what these developments mean and what you can
do at home, we're joined by international relations expert doctor
Jessica Ganaua. Let's start with these military pauses. What's actually
(08:33):
going on there is it's going to be effective in
delivering the right amount of aid needed.
Speaker 5 (08:38):
So we're seeing a ramping up of pressure on Israel
to address the ongoing humanitarian crisis in Gaza, and this
is particularly around aid not getting through. So we're talking
about food, we're also talking about fresh water and medicines,
and where it is getting through not necessarily getting to
all of the civilian population that is requiring those basic
(09:01):
daily requirements. So at the moment, we are starting to
see some responsiveness from Israel in terms of trying to
ensure that aid will start to get through. It's still
small scale and its early days. According to estimates, the
civilian population there would need about five hundred or six
(09:24):
hundred AID trucks per day, and we just haven't seen
anything of that volume actually getting through. And because there's
still the military operation ongoing in the Gaza Strip, that
would require a pause in fighting and humanitarian corridors to
be enabled in order to make sure the aid can
actually get through without aid workers or people coming to
(09:45):
get that aid being physically threatened themselves while they're essentially
in a war zone. So that's what we're also starting
to see and move towards having some military pauses for
aid to get through, but we still don't know if
that will be sufficient for what's required to address the
humanitarian crisis.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Can we take a step back? People and even the
UN have been very critical of the Gaza Humanitarian Founder
that US and Israelly backed private organization who've been delivering
aid in Gaza. Why is there so much criticism around
that particular outlet.
Speaker 5 (10:18):
First of all, the whole concept of having a private organization,
which it seems may even be a for profit organization
delivering aid is a very tricky area because when it
comes to aid, when it's trying to supply civilian populations
with necessary food stuff. You really want that to be overseen,
(10:42):
particularly a very tricky political, high intensity military environment. You
want that to be overseen by neutral actors who are
part of some kind of international organization and whose only
imperative is going to be a humanitarian one to get
food to people who need it, to get water to
people who need it, et cetera. So, yes, there's been
(11:02):
a lot of controversy around this particular organization, saying that
they're using on the ground private security contractors who maybe
are not in their first objective humanitarian actors. So essentially
they're there to provide security for other actors who are
then delivering the aid, but they might view there to
(11:25):
be a security threat, where a humanitarian actor might say, no,
you know, this crowd of people coming in and wanting
to get food for their families, we're not going to
view them as a security threat. So there's been I
think a lot of gray area there around the way
that those private security actors have been operating on the ground.
So I think this really comes down to the complexity
(11:46):
of having a private organization trying to deliver up what
should be a public good that should be overseen by
an international organization.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Recently we've seen France move to recognize the state of Palestine.
Australia is yet to do so. The Foreign Minister, Penny
Wong says that Hamas needs to be demilitarized before any
kind of recognition of statehood can occur. Beyond not releasing
the remaining Israeli hostages, what else is Hamas actually doing
right now? When she says they need to be demilitarized,
(12:16):
there's imagery that they're actively in a war zone and
engaging in conflict. Is that correct?
Speaker 5 (12:22):
This is again a tricky area, like the extent to
which Israel could prove that they have achieved or not
achieved their stated military objective of ensuring that Hamas can
no longer operate as a military fighting force. I've no
doubt there are still some elements of armed ha mass
(12:42):
fighters who still exist within the Gaza strip and are
trying to operate. However they're best able. Ha Maas has
been severely degraded since Israel's response to those October seven attacks.
Most of the Hamas leadership have been assassinated and they've
been replaced by others who in turn have often been assassinated,
so the entire group has been severely degraded. But an
(13:06):
element of complexity here again is that we're talking about
non state actor essentially, so HAMAS fighters aren't always going
to be in military fatigues as we would think of
state military fighting force. It can be hard to pinpoint
and identify exactly has every single fighter who identifies as
(13:26):
part of the Hamas fighting force? Have they all laid
down their arms or have they not laid down their arms?
How many are exactly left? Nobody could give an exact count,
But I think that what is clear is that it
is going to be very tricky to say definitively every
single person who's ever identified with Hamas has now been
(13:49):
disarmed in terms of their ability to engage in operations
against Israel. I almost think trying to get to that
point is something that is almost impossible when you're looking
at a force who are essentially a non state actor,
so they sort of can blend in and out of populations.
So I'm not sure that that actually gives us any
kind of clear timeline on what point in time would
(14:13):
a stance change and would countries say, well, yes, okay,
that objective has now been clearly achieved.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
When we say recognition of statehood, jess, what does that
actually mean? Do we not already recognize that Palestine is
a country.
Speaker 5 (14:28):
This is an interesting area because there are a few
different factors that state entities need to have if they
want to claim statehood internationally. One of those is a
clear territory, clear territorial boundaries, clear governance over the territory.
But an interesting aspect is what's called international legitimacy and recognition,
(14:50):
and that typically takes place through as a sort of
a proxy measure, through states being recognized and having full
membership of the United Nations, and Palestine at the moment
has a non member observer status at the United Nations.
So a key aspect individual states want to go out
(15:11):
and say we now recognize Palestine as a state. That
does matter symbolically because if ultimately all the states in
the world were to say that, it would almost create
a situation where Palestine becomes a state. But at the
same time, if Palestine does not become a full member
of the United Nations, they won't really be viewed within
the international system as a full state. And in order
(15:34):
to get that full membership that needs to go through
the United Nations Security Council. And a complicating aspect is
that in the United Nations Security Council there are five
major countries who have veto power, so the United States, China,
the UK, France and Russia. And as you can imagine,
on this issue, there has been a proposal put the
(15:56):
United Nations Security Council that Palestine should be put forward
for full statehood, but in the most recent case, the
United States vetoed that. But any one of those five
countries could potentially veto. So the fact that France is
decided to recognize Palestinian statehood and they are on the
United Nations Security Council is important and is significant, but
it's not going to be enough just bringing.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
It back home. We've seen reporting that within labor there's
pressure mounting to do more. We saw former Foreign Minister
Bob Carr said that we shouldn't be waiting for other
countries to make a move, so why are we. We've
seen last week that the Australian government was a signatory
to that declaration asking for a ceasefire. We've seen alban
easy tough in his stance in the last few weeks.
(16:40):
Why are we hesitant to maybe make a move like
France and recognize statehood.
Speaker 5 (16:45):
I think there are probably a couple of reasons, but
I think that Australia we've seen generally, is tending to
follow European countries' partners rather than wanting to go out
and actually lead on taking new steps when it comes
to statements or even recognition of a Palestinian state or
(17:08):
other types of things that might be seen as steps
towards trying to pressure Israel to more seriously address the
humanitarian crisis in Gaza. So it's not that the Australian
government is not concerned, but I don't think that Australia
wants to kind of go out ahead of our European partners.
So I could imagine if a lot more countries across
Europe decide to recognize a Palestinian state, Australia might do so.
(17:29):
But I think that we are cautious around upsetting our
key US partner as well. So I think on this issue,
the current Labor government is actually trying to remain quite centrist,
and I think they've been sticking to that in quite
a persistent way, even when there are voices within the
Australian domestic context that are calling for more action from
(17:53):
the Labor government. I think they're still remaining very centrist
in their stance, and I don't think that's likely to
change in the near future. Jess.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
This weekend was really a turning point for a lot
of people. Seeing those images of Style children left people
with a feeling of despair and helplessness. What is the
most useful, practical, helpful thing that we can do for
people who are sitting at home and wanting to contribute
to ending this starvation. Is it more effective to donate
(18:22):
to aid and relief? Will it even get through We
don't necessarily know with these tactical pauses, Or would we
be better place to focus our attention and energy at home,
like writing to our members of parliament or showing up
to a protest. What would you suggest people do?
Speaker 5 (18:37):
Ultimately, domestic pressure does matter, like I think that in
a democratic society, our political actors are concerned first and
foremost with their domestic constituency. So whether it's members of
Parliament thinking about their own electorate or whether it's members
(18:57):
of the current government thinking about more generally opinion across
of Australia. The thing that tends to actually bring pressure
to bear on politicians is concern about domestic sentiment, and
they do care, they do want to know. It could
be that if on a particular issue area there's a
sort of a fifty to fifty split across the Australian population,
(19:19):
that will be one thing. If it becomes clear that
actually the split is more eighty percent one way twenty
percent the other way, that will concern politicians, That will
concern political actors, and then they will also bring internal
pressure to bear for something to be done about that.
I think that internationally it does matter countries like France
that do have a fair amount of leverage and quite
(19:41):
powerful in the international system, so what they do is
going to matter. I mean, importantly, those sort of five
countries on the UN Security Council have relatively more ability
for leverage. But I think that for a country like Israel,
the thing that would probably matter the most besides general
(20:01):
international opinion, the thing that probably matters the most is
sanctions and economic pressure. We haven't really seen that so
far in any sort of serious way from countries around
the world, but that's probably the thing when we look
at the history of international affairs. That's probably the mechanism
that ends up having impact, not in all cases, but
(20:23):
where it is effective, that does have impact on states policy.
For politicians back at home in Australia, it is definitely
always top of mind for political actors. What do their
own constituencies think, What is the vibe check of the population,
where are people sitting on different issues? And they definitely
do care if they start to see a swing on
(20:45):
a particular issue one way or another.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Thanks for taking some time to feed your mind with
us today, hey, Linked in the show notes will be
further reading on the situation in Gaza, as well as
links to contribute to aid relief and other helpful resources too.
The quickie is produced by me Taylor Strano and Clare Murphy,
with audio production by Lou Hill.
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show. Clay Travis and Buck Sexton tackle the biggest stories in news, politics and current events with intelligence and humor. From the border crisis, to the madness of cancel culture and far-left missteps, Clay and Buck guide listeners through the latest headlines and hot topics with fun and entertaining conversations and opinions.