June 2, 2025 • 25 mins
Celebrities are masters at keeping us guessing – private chefs, secret trainers, and now the latest beauty investment they're tight-lipped about? Those suspiciously "natural" facelifts sporting many A-list faces! Kelly chats with plastic surgeon Dr. Catherine Boorer about these $45K + procedures, including the shocking truth about recovery time (hint: it's not the weekend getaway celebrities make it seem!).
Plus, Dr Boorer shares her science-backed skincare routine that doesn't require a Hollywood budget, and which trendy products are actually worth investing in versus what's just expensive moisturiser.
Whether you're just nosy about what the rich and famous are doing to their faces or considering options for yourself, this episode cuts through the Hollywood smoke and mirrors with some seriously refreshing honesty.
LINKS TO EVERYTHING MENTIONED:
SkinCeuticals Vitamin C Serum $242
The Ordinary Affordable Skincare Range
Ultra Violette Supreme Screen Hydrating Facial $52
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CREDITS:
Hosts: Kelly McCarren
Guest: Dr Catherine Boorer
Producer: Mollie Harwood & Sophie Campbell
Audio Producer: Tegan Sadler
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
You're listening to Amma Mia podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
that this podcast is recorded.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
On Makeup is My Therapy. I'm in love, I'm obsessed,
and I don't even feel guilty a body.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hello, and welcome to you Beauty, the daily podcast for
Your Face. I'm Kelly McCarran, and this is the formula,
the show where we get up close and personal with
the biggest names in skincare and beauty, and I get
to be ridiculously nosy about everyone's secrets.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Today we're diving into something.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
The Internet is obsessed with Chris Jenner's new face, and
before you shouted.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Us, don't talk about women's faces.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
This is the podcast for your Face, so shush. It's
not just Chris, Demi Moore, Christina Aguilera and Hathaway and
Lindsay Lohan have all suddenly turned up looking drastically different.
And it's not just whatever skincare trying to currently flog.
It's next level sorcery that everyone is wondering what on
earth is happening, But it's behind closed doors. To decode
(01:18):
this cosmetic wizardry. I've brought in doctor Catherine Bora, one
of Sydney's few female plastic surgeons working out of Macquarie Street,
and as creepy as it sounds, I'm very excited to
chat with her about Chris's new face. Welcome, Dr Bora.
I hope you're ready to answer everything I've been dying
to know. You are such beautiful, skilled How before we
(01:43):
get into the juicy stuff, I'm curious, are there any
total myths or misconceptions about facelifts that make you want
to scream when you hear them. What's the one thing
that you want our ubi is to take away from
this chat today.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
I want them to realize that a facelift is a
very invasive medical procedure, and so I think sometimes people
see it as an extension of a beauty treatment like
a facial and you know, I just have a quick facelift,
and I think social media tends to play into that
a little bit. But it is a serious medical procedure
(02:17):
which is quite invasive and does carry risks. So it's
important to take that on board.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
And I also think social media makes it hard because
a lot of it is so shrouded in secrecy, we
don't see how hard the recovery is for these people.
So it's almost like, oh, they just like went away
for the weekend and then they came out with a
whole new face. But that's actually not how it works
at all.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Oh absolutely, I think you really hit it on the
nail on the head there. I think what we don't
see is what they have access to. So when we
see a celebrity looking amazing after a transformation, and then
they have celebrity hair and makeup people following them around.
I saw that recently with one of the celebrities who
recently had a face, if she had her hair person
(03:01):
was there running around behind her fixing her hair up,
so she looked perfect, And we don't see the hard yards.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
We don't see the.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Six weeks or more of recovery process and what they
look like in the first few hours after surgery or.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Weeks exactly exactly.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
And as someone that's had rhinoplasty and did document it,
it is intense.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
I think rhinoplastis is one of the more intense procedure.
I think any facial procedure is difficult because the recovery
period you can't hide it. It's not like a breast
or a body procedure where it's sort of under your
clothes and you can go about your job and every
time you see your face like it's there, and the
pain is different when it's in your face compared to
different parts of the body.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I think I completely agree.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
I've also had my boobs done in my face was
just on a whole other level. But we're not talking
about my nose job today. We're talking about Well, the
thing that kicked off this conversation was Chris Jenner's new face.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
But it's not just Chris Jenner.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
It's Brad Pitt, Demi Moore, Lindsay Lohan, they've all been transformed,
well allegedly by doctor Stephen Levine, who's apparently the go
to for a natural in But what does a natural
looking face lift actually mean?
Speaker 3 (04:14):
I think what people are talking about with natural is
going away from the image of we all had a
facelifts back in the maybe the seventies and eighties, where
people would look overstretched, overtight, you know, their mouse pulled
in a very unnatural often I would say bizarre fashion,
where you would instantly be recognized as having had a procedure,
(04:36):
whereas these days, most people, including celebrities, I imagine are just
looking to look like a good version of themselves, like
minus some of the aging.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Fresher, younger, healthier.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Perfect, Yes, so not transforming their face into something that's different, bizarre, unnatural.
So I think that's what we're talking about. We're just
looking for a better version of ourselves, not a different person,
because I think sometimes the older faces can make people
look a bit alien.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
I was just thinking that, like the way that their
face is then shaped, pulled, very alien like.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
So with these new natural facelifts and different natural sort
of tweakments or enhancements that people are getting done. The
thing is is that Chris Jenner, Demimore, Brad Pitt, they're
all in their sixties. So that's sort of the age
bracket that you'd expect for a potential facelift customer. Kristin,
Aguilera and Hathaway are only in their forties, and Lindsay's
(05:34):
in her thirties. She's only a few years older than me.
So why is it getting younger and younger? And do
you think that this is putting pressure on us regular folk?
Like have you seen an increase in younger people wanting
this sort of work?
Speaker 3 (05:48):
There is definitely an increase in younger people. They're interested
in all levels of rejuvenation, whether it's let you see
lots of young women at Sephora and Mecca, for example,
buying really complicated, expensive beauty routines retinol, yeah, exactly. And
then there's you know, everyone into this preventive botox and
(06:10):
in their twenties, which there's no evidence that getting ahead
of aging is actually worthwhile. And I think social media
fuels like we're bombarded with images of ourselves through platforms
like this, through Zoom for example, We're looking at ourselves
constantly and we notice these changes, and then when you
compare that to a celebrity in your age group, you think, well,
(06:32):
why can't I look that good? Or there's something wrong
with me if I don't look that good. So I
think there is the tendency, particularly as a woman, to
feel inadequate, and to want to hold onto your looks
or what you perceive is the right look for longer
and longer. And I think younger people are more vulnerable
to that. And I know personally I didn't sort of
get really comfortable in my own skin until my forties,
(06:53):
late forties, really after I had my kids and I
sort of, Yeah, I feel comfortable, and I think you
don't get that in your twenties and thirties, and so
you're vulnerable to doing these superficial things to try and
make yourself feel better from the outside rather than from within.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Yeah, that's so true.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
And people are coming to you with this sort of thing,
like how do you navigate that If someone's you know, say,
thirty five and wanting a facelift.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
I'm just really honest with them, like, I'll do it.
You don't need it, I will, you.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Know, give certainly, give them the time, like I'll do
an assessment. I'll talk to them about the things that
are concerning them, and I'll try to put it into
context with where I think they are, you know, in
terms of the general population for their age, and most
of them are gorgeous. And what I say to them is, look,
you're going to keep aging. Aging is not a disease,
but you are going to continue to age, and you've
(07:44):
got to come to terms without it at some stage,
because I can guarantee you, when you're forty five, you
wish that you look like you did now when you're
thirty five.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
That's so true.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
But I also think sometimes it's not always the case.
Because if you told me that I could look the
way that I did at twenty five instead at thirty five,
I'd be like, yikes, no way, I think I'm way
hotter now. Yeah, And I think that's age and confidence
though as well.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
It's in a confidence, but aging adds character and that's
agree And I think especially in the age of AI,
where if you look online at AI models and images
of beauty, they're all morphine into something that is unattainable and.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Essentially the same thing.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
It's all just like a weird AI version of each
other exactly.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
And what makes us unique is the different way we age.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I agree.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
So doctor Levine's facelist started around forty five thousand USD,
so if you're in Australia, that's like close to one
hundred thousand dollars. What in the world makes these procedures
so expensive?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Okay, So in cosmetic surgery there's no set fee, so
there's no regulation about fees. So as a baseline, people
charge what they need to charge to cover costs of
running a business and then make a profit just like
any other business. And the more specialized and renowned you
get for a particular procedure, the market.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
Allows you to charge more and more and more. So
it's a bit like wine.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
You know, if you have a twenty thousand dollars bottle
of red wine, is it going to be so much
better than a five hundred dollars bottle of red wine.
Speaker 4 (09:18):
No, it comes down to.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
Scarcity of that resource. So if you're a top plastic
surgeon and you want to do two or three faceifs
a week, there's a limit to how many you can
do in a year, So that makes your services scarce,
so you can charge more.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
I also think it comes down to, like I personally
wouldn't want someone that hasn't done that many or doesn't
have that sort of background, Like a lot of it
comes from his expertise, I'd say as well, right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
When it comes to facial cosmetic procedures, patients are looking
for somebody who's not right at the beginning of their career,
someone who's had experience. And what experience does is it
helps you in your assessment of what can be done.
It helps you understand what can be achieved and if
that aligns with what the patient wants, and it means
that you've actually had enough complications and bad outcomes to
(10:08):
understand how to avoid those things down the track.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yes, you never want to be someone's first bad outcome.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
No, but we all have our first yes yet and
even the star plastic surgeons in New York still get complications.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
In Australia, what would we expect to fork out for
something like that if we were facelift curious.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
In terms of costs in Australia, So when we talk
about it, a cost for surgery, patients should be given
that upfront and that should include surgeon fee, anesetus fee,
hospital fees and then follow up so it needs to
be all inclusive. So you'd be looking at a starting
fee of around thirty thousand dollars up to you know,
one hundred thousand dollars. But it also depends on the
(10:49):
type of face lift in any ancillary procedures you may
be having, like for example, fat grafting and eyelid procedures.
So that's a very broad range, but it is mandatory
in Australia with OPRO guidelines to be very upfront with
your fees and look, fees are a very important part
of the conversation. That amount of money is a huge
amount of money. You know, for most people, and when
(11:10):
it comes to choosing a surgeon, I think in Australia
it has been murky because there has previously not been
regulations as to who can perform cosmetic surgery. Who can
call themselves a surgeon. Now the title of surgeon now
is protected, so if you're, for example, a GP, there's
nothing stopping you performing a facelift.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
That is terrifying.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Yep, but that's the rules. But they can no longer
call themselves a cosmetic surgeon. They can call themselves a
cosmetic doctor or a cosmetic physician. So what potential patients
need to understand is what the actual qualifications behind a
doctor's names mean. A safe start is to make sure
the doctor is medically registered as a specialist surgeon. For example,
(11:51):
you can go to the Austrange Society of Plastic Surgeons
website or ASPS for sure, and that has listed all
the fully qualified plastic surgeons who perform cosmetic surgery.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Okay, that's such a good tip for people.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Let's talk recovery, because no one ever admits to getting
these things done, as we sort of said at the top,
so let alone. They're not going to share what the
recovery is like Chris Jenna, let's use her as the example.
What is that downtime looking like?
Speaker 3 (12:21):
I think you would need a minimum of at least
six to eight weeks to be able to walk out
with cameras on.
Speaker 4 (12:28):
You because you're so puffy.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
And I mean, the thing is is that she has
access to you know, she's probably got an omnilux or
light therapy thing at home that is good for recovers
if she could just stick her head onto.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
That all the time.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
But she would have access to so many things to
help speed up recovery, there.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
Is only so much that those things can exactly.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
For example, you know, laser treatments to scars, that sort
of thing.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
The biggest factor.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
In recovery is time, and that's not something you can
fast forward. So it takes a minimum of three to
four weeks before you have a reasonable amount of puffiness
that you could appear in public. Most of my patients
say it's four months before they start to feel a
bit sort of human or like they're usual selves, because
the skin can feel numb for a very long time.
(13:12):
So even though someone might look presentable with a full
face of makeup, good lighting, good hair, at six weeks,
and it may look like it was of a very
quick transformation. If you were able to see them before
they got dressed, made up, hair done, I think the
real picture would be quite different.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
There'd be a lot of bruising still potentially.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
Potentially, and everybody bruises differently.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Okay, So on an aesthetic level, because obviously some really
dark things could obviously happen with any sort of medical procedure,
but what can go wrong with this sort of work?
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Okay, So with any surgery, there's an anesthetic, and the
anesthetic for facelifting procedures could be from four to six hours.
So need to be fit enough from a general medical
perspective to undergo that sort of length anesthetic for a start,
it's a very tedious operation in terms of we as
a surgeon have to go very slowly because especially in
a deep plane. Left just under that deep plane and
(14:06):
all the nerves called the facial nerve that work the
muscles of facial expression. So every time you smile, crinkle
your eyes, wriggle your nose, those are called the muscles
of facial expression, and the nerves that motor those muscles
are directly underneath the layer we are lifting, so you
have to go very slow and carefully when you're doing
(14:26):
a face ift. That's why it takes so long. And
there's a lot of stitching and that has to be
immaculate in order to get good scars. So that's why
it's a long procedure. It's not like having brain surgery.
It's very deep inside a body cavity. It's very superficial
in terms of the body location. But it has to
be very careful surgery.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, and this is such a gory question, but like,
is the whole face peeled off?
Speaker 3 (14:49):
No, So in a lower face and necklift or a
deep plane left say the middle third of the face,
the skin in that section is left intact, but the
next skin is lifted off and the cheek skin from
the sides towards that middle third is lifted off. So
it's not like peeling down the skin from the top,
for example, because the skin still needs a blood supply,
(15:10):
and we have these facial archy, which is a big
archery that comes in here and supplies the skin and
that's what keeps the skin alive during the process.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
Okay, oh gosh.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
When it comes to things that are botched with something
like a face lift.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
What can go wrong?
Speaker 3 (15:26):
So there can be true complications, So damage to that
facial nerve can leave to temporary or permanent problems with
facial expression. There can be damage to the skin or
even death of the skin because of poor blood supply.
There can be asymmetries in terms of the way one
side is slightly tighter than the other. But often there
are some underlying asymmetries we have naturally.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Most people do, don't they.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
It's something that really can be very frustrating as a surgeon,
and you have to come to terms with it that
people will never scrutinize their faces as closely as they
do after surgery.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
Yeah, So how different is so say someone comes to
you and says that I want to facelift. How different
is the approach whether you are doing someone in their
sixth dase versus someone in their forties or fifties or
is that then sort of just dependent on how they
have aged naturally?
Speaker 1 (16:17):
And also I guess genetics.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Yes, I mean every patient has their own individual circumstances
in terms of how they look their aging and what
they want to achieve. There can be vast differences in
for example, someone who spent a lot of time in
the sun, who has a lot of photo aging at
sixty is going to look very different to someone who
grew up in a country with very little sun exposure,
or someone who's looked after their skin in terms of
(16:40):
sun protection. But if they were the same person, both
looked after their skin, both had the same amount of
sun protection, good genetics, then yes, there are still differences
in how I would approach that their patterns of aging
are going to be different just because of the length
of time and in the person who's looked after themselves.
The main problem is going to be just a gravitational
effects which you can't escape. There's no way to escape gravity.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
No, exactly as we get old or we get saggia.
And how much does genetics though influence the aging process,
Oh a huge amount. Say two people both never have
touched the sign, but one of them could still look
vastly different.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Yeah, absolutely, because genetics is from the inside out, so
it's your bone structure.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
So the way you.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
Age is dependent upon things as simple as your bone structure.
So having a prominent cheek, or we call it the
mailer area or the jawline area, so having a strong
bony structure to your face mean that you will age
differently to someone who has less support for their skin.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
I've got a very bony face. Does that mean I'm
going to age?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
But it also depends on what your skin genetically, what
your skin is.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Are there any other options, because, like you know, as
we were talking about earlier, it's quite expensive. What are
options that could work, if any?
Speaker 3 (17:53):
So some patients will come in with a very set
idea of I want a facelift, I want this, I
want that, And some people will come in I don't
know what I want, but can you tell me what
my options are from nonsurgical through to surgical, And that's
how I would start. I say, well, a facelift is
great for gravitational effects with jarling deep with Naser laby
of folds. Now, depending on the depths and the degree
(18:15):
of aging, sometimes filler can, for example, camouflage that to
a certain point, because it's very easy to go overboard
and you see people who have gone way too far
down that pathway and then they start looking weird. You
may be a candidate for a lesser procedure. For example,
if someone said, look, what would be the one thing
(18:36):
you would do for my face, and a lot of
times that could be just doing an upper left throplasty,
which might which is less than ten thousand dollars all up,
and taking the heaviness out of someone's eyes making them
look more awake and fresh. Is I think one of
the best sort of if to use a crew term
bang for buck procedures there is.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
I also think the results are just outstanding. I agree,
because you don't even realize sometimes that someone has their
upper eyelids just starting to get a little bit saggyer
and you don't realize how much opening that whole area
up can the difference that it can make.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
That's one of my favorite procedures for someone who's not
ready to go into a full face rejuvenation, and that
may be all somebody needs.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
I mean, what is your self carety?
Speaker 4 (19:25):
Give us the dirty detail.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Can we talk about your skin care routine?
Speaker 1 (19:32):
Because you've got such good skin.
Speaker 3 (19:35):
This comes back to the days when I was at
medical school and like a young resident and interested in
plastic surgery and skin and I didn't have much money,
so I was really into the science of what actually works,
what doesn't work, and what are the really good affordable
options out there because I couldn't afford, you know, lamaire
face creams. And the truth is, like there are some
really excellent products that don't.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Cost a lot of money.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
So I start in the morning with cleansing, like usually
a mix of Aha Bhapha type cleanser in the morning,
just to freshen up the skin the glycolic or the acids.
And then I will use serum, so I always use
a vitamin C serum in the morning, and I use
niacinamide and basically because I'm targeting pigment in my skin,
but they also have effects on improving collagen production and
(20:20):
brightening the skin. And then I will follow up with
sunscreen and some of those actually have a bit of
a tint in it, which means that then I don't
actually use even foundation. And in the evening once again
I will use a little wipes that have some hydroxy
acids in them. And then at nighttime I tend to
focus on retinols. And I've got really sensitive skin, so
I can't take a prescription strength rentinol more than once
(20:42):
a week, so I'll use a prescription strengths like a
retrieve cream once a week, but otherwise I'm using a
retinol product or a retinol product, and then I'm using
a moisturizer after that.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Well, ones are your favorites, I'm so intrigued.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
So I do use skin cuticals at the moment. I
do like to chop and change because I just like variety,
so I use that. It is very expensive. So for example,
if I was giving advice to someone in their twenties,
I would be using products from something like an Australian
company like the Ordinary, which is a great company with
really affordable products, or even serav and all of those
have now have vitamin C niceinamid type products.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
But personally, at.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
The moment, I'm using skin cuticles for my nicinamide and
vitamin C for my over the counter retinol or retinaur products.
I like a company called Medicate.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Oh yes.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
So the reason I like their products, the retinal products
in particular, is they have a step wise progression, so
you start with the one, and then there's a three,
and then there's a six, so you can gradually get
your skin tolerant of the higher percentage. And then when
it comes to sunscreen, I really like the Australian brand Ultraviolet.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
It gives a nice glass, give a.
Speaker 4 (21:49):
Glow, and it's a really comfortable product to wear.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
We always finish our episodes with the one skincare technique
or ingredient that you absolutely love and recommend to everyone.
And then on the opposite, what is something that you
just think is so not worth it?
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I think the retinal products, because retinol or rtinoric acid,
which is the active ingredient, is the only gold standard
proven ingredient with before and after biopsies of people who
are aging to actually show an absolute difference when it
comes to hype. Things that don't live up like whe
would just be moisturizers, like thick moisturizers without particularly any
(22:30):
active ingredients are never going to change anything in the
long term in terms of aging. They feel great when
they're on, they feel like they're plump and you're smooth
and hydrated, but they only last as long as they're
on your face. And the other thing I really don't
like is ingestible products for beauty like collagen tablets, and
the idea that you can swallow something and it's going
(22:50):
to improve your skin is I think a bit crazy.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Oh, make your hair grow heat if you have.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
A deficiency in a protein or a vitamin C or
a zinc, which are all important for the skin. Yes,
ingestible products are important, but most of us don't have
a deficiency living in the country where we are.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
So you just think big waste of money.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Well, we appreciate you coming on and talking all things
facelift and everything.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
This has been so interesting.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
We're going to pop links to go find you and
your TikTok. Can you explain actually if someone hasn't seen
your TikTok's what you do.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Yeah. So most people are visual learners, and I think
it's important to understand an operation before you have the operation.
You need to know what you're getting yourself into. But
most people can't look at an actual operation understandably. So
I try to recreate steps of procedures using Plato and
it takes a long time, and it's been a long
(23:46):
learning curve of how to actually operate on Plato and
make it look realistic.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
I try to just recreate.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Various operations, all the operations I'm planning to cover. For example,
I've just done a deep plane facelift with Plato that's
on my TikTok to show you the layers of the
face to show you how we elevate the skin and
how we elevate the deep plane and how we secure that,
just to give you an idea of what you're actually
getting yourself into.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
That's so good, though fun Thank you for the on
behalf of all of us, because I think that's just
so helpful to know you're so right and doing it
in an easier to digest manner is just genius.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
It's so much more approachable, and I can show people
and my consultations actually real life photos of surgery, and
I think as a starting point to educate people, it's
more accessible than the actual operations.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Oh well, we'll pop a link to your TikTok in
our show notes. Doctor Catherine Bora, thank you so much
for joining us today and giving us a real no
BS look at facelifts and modern cosmetic surgery.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
I've learned so much, and I'm sure the ubis have too.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Whether you're a Chris Joanna Stan facelift curious or just
love geeking out over beauty tech like I do, I
hope this episode has given you a better understanding of
what's really possible and what's actually realistic. If You're interested
in learning more about doctor Borrow's work, will pop all
of her details in the show notes for you. And
as always, if you have enjoyed this episode, polease check
(25:09):
out it in Instagram at you Beauty podcast and have
a look at our YouTube channel. All of the links
are in the show notes, and don't forget to subscribe
to our beauty newsletter.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
This episode of You Beauty was.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Produced by Molly Harwood and Sophie Campbell, with audio production
by Lou Hill. Thanks for listening and we'll be back
in your ears tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
Bye.
You're listening to Amma Mia podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
that this podcast is recorded.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
On Makeup is My Therapy. I'm in love, I'm obsessed,
and I don't even feel guilty a body.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hello, and welcome to you Beauty, the daily podcast for
Your Face. I'm Kelly McCarran, and this is the formula,
the show where we get up close and personal with
the biggest names in skincare and beauty, and I get
to be ridiculously nosy about everyone's secrets.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Today we're diving into something.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
The Internet is obsessed with Chris Jenner's new face, and
before you shouted.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Us, don't talk about women's faces.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
This is the podcast for your Face, so shush. It's
not just Chris, Demi Moore, Christina Aguilera and Hathaway and
Lindsay Lohan have all suddenly turned up looking drastically different.
And it's not just whatever skincare trying to currently flog.
It's next level sorcery that everyone is wondering what on
earth is happening, But it's behind closed doors. To decode
(01:18):
this cosmetic wizardry. I've brought in doctor Catherine Bora, one
of Sydney's few female plastic surgeons working out of Macquarie Street,
and as creepy as it sounds, I'm very excited to
chat with her about Chris's new face. Welcome, Dr Bora.
I hope you're ready to answer everything I've been dying
to know. You are such beautiful, skilled How before we
(01:43):
get into the juicy stuff, I'm curious, are there any
total myths or misconceptions about facelifts that make you want
to scream when you hear them. What's the one thing
that you want our ubi is to take away from
this chat today.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
I want them to realize that a facelift is a
very invasive medical procedure, and so I think sometimes people
see it as an extension of a beauty treatment like
a facial and you know, I just have a quick facelift,
and I think social media tends to play into that
a little bit. But it is a serious medical procedure
(02:17):
which is quite invasive and does carry risks. So it's
important to take that on board.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
And I also think social media makes it hard because
a lot of it is so shrouded in secrecy, we
don't see how hard the recovery is for these people.
So it's almost like, oh, they just like went away
for the weekend and then they came out with a
whole new face. But that's actually not how it works
at all.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Oh absolutely, I think you really hit it on the
nail on the head there. I think what we don't
see is what they have access to. So when we
see a celebrity looking amazing after a transformation, and then
they have celebrity hair and makeup people following them around.
I saw that recently with one of the celebrities who
recently had a face, if she had her hair person
(03:01):
was there running around behind her fixing her hair up,
so she looked perfect, And we don't see the hard yards.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
We don't see the.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Six weeks or more of recovery process and what they
look like in the first few hours after surgery or.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Weeks exactly exactly.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
And as someone that's had rhinoplasty and did document it,
it is intense.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
I think rhinoplastis is one of the more intense procedure.
I think any facial procedure is difficult because the recovery
period you can't hide it. It's not like a breast
or a body procedure where it's sort of under your
clothes and you can go about your job and every
time you see your face like it's there, and the
pain is different when it's in your face compared to
different parts of the body.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I think I completely agree.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
I've also had my boobs done in my face was
just on a whole other level. But we're not talking
about my nose job today. We're talking about Well, the
thing that kicked off this conversation was Chris Jenner's new face.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
But it's not just Chris Jenner.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
It's Brad Pitt, Demi Moore, Lindsay Lohan, they've all been transformed,
well allegedly by doctor Stephen Levine, who's apparently the go
to for a natural in But what does a natural
looking face lift actually mean?
Speaker 3 (04:14):
I think what people are talking about with natural is
going away from the image of we all had a
facelifts back in the maybe the seventies and eighties, where
people would look overstretched, overtight, you know, their mouse pulled
in a very unnatural often I would say bizarre fashion,
where you would instantly be recognized as having had a procedure,
(04:36):
whereas these days, most people, including celebrities, I imagine are just
looking to look like a good version of themselves, like
minus some of the aging.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Fresher, younger, healthier.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Perfect, Yes, so not transforming their face into something that's different, bizarre, unnatural.
So I think that's what we're talking about. We're just
looking for a better version of ourselves, not a different person,
because I think sometimes the older faces can make people
look a bit alien.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
I was just thinking that, like the way that their
face is then shaped, pulled, very alien like.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
So with these new natural facelifts and different natural sort
of tweakments or enhancements that people are getting done. The
thing is is that Chris Jenner, Demimore, Brad Pitt, they're
all in their sixties. So that's sort of the age
bracket that you'd expect for a potential facelift customer. Kristin,
Aguilera and Hathaway are only in their forties, and Lindsay's
(05:34):
in her thirties. She's only a few years older than me.
So why is it getting younger and younger? And do
you think that this is putting pressure on us regular folk?
Like have you seen an increase in younger people wanting
this sort of work?
Speaker 3 (05:48):
There is definitely an increase in younger people. They're interested
in all levels of rejuvenation, whether it's let you see
lots of young women at Sephora and Mecca, for example,
buying really complicated, expensive beauty routines retinol, yeah, exactly. And
then there's you know, everyone into this preventive botox and
(06:10):
in their twenties, which there's no evidence that getting ahead
of aging is actually worthwhile. And I think social media
fuels like we're bombarded with images of ourselves through platforms
like this, through Zoom for example, We're looking at ourselves
constantly and we notice these changes, and then when you
compare that to a celebrity in your age group, you think, well,
(06:32):
why can't I look that good? Or there's something wrong
with me if I don't look that good. So I
think there is the tendency, particularly as a woman, to
feel inadequate, and to want to hold onto your looks
or what you perceive is the right look for longer
and longer. And I think younger people are more vulnerable
to that. And I know personally I didn't sort of
get really comfortable in my own skin until my forties,
(06:53):
late forties, really after I had my kids and I
sort of, Yeah, I feel comfortable, and I think you
don't get that in your twenties and thirties, and so
you're vulnerable to doing these superficial things to try and
make yourself feel better from the outside rather than from within.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Yeah, that's so true.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
And people are coming to you with this sort of thing,
like how do you navigate that If someone's you know, say,
thirty five and wanting a facelift.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
I'm just really honest with them, like, I'll do it.
You don't need it, I will, you.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Know, give certainly, give them the time, like I'll do
an assessment. I'll talk to them about the things that
are concerning them, and I'll try to put it into
context with where I think they are, you know, in
terms of the general population for their age, and most
of them are gorgeous. And what I say to them is, look,
you're going to keep aging. Aging is not a disease,
but you are going to continue to age, and you've
(07:44):
got to come to terms without it at some stage,
because I can guarantee you, when you're forty five, you
wish that you look like you did now when you're
thirty five.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
That's so true.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
But I also think sometimes it's not always the case.
Because if you told me that I could look the
way that I did at twenty five instead at thirty five,
I'd be like, yikes, no way, I think I'm way
hotter now. Yeah, And I think that's age and confidence
though as well.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
It's in a confidence, but aging adds character and that's
agree And I think especially in the age of AI,
where if you look online at AI models and images
of beauty, they're all morphine into something that is unattainable and.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Essentially the same thing.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
It's all just like a weird AI version of each
other exactly.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
And what makes us unique is the different way we age.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I agree.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
So doctor Levine's facelist started around forty five thousand USD,
so if you're in Australia, that's like close to one
hundred thousand dollars. What in the world makes these procedures
so expensive?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Okay, So in cosmetic surgery there's no set fee, so
there's no regulation about fees. So as a baseline, people
charge what they need to charge to cover costs of
running a business and then make a profit just like
any other business. And the more specialized and renowned you
get for a particular procedure, the market.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
Allows you to charge more and more and more. So
it's a bit like wine.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
You know, if you have a twenty thousand dollars bottle
of red wine, is it going to be so much
better than a five hundred dollars bottle of red wine.
Speaker 4 (09:18):
No, it comes down to.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
Scarcity of that resource. So if you're a top plastic
surgeon and you want to do two or three faceifs
a week, there's a limit to how many you can
do in a year, So that makes your services scarce,
so you can charge more.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
I also think it comes down to, like I personally
wouldn't want someone that hasn't done that many or doesn't
have that sort of background, Like a lot of it
comes from his expertise, I'd say as well, right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
When it comes to facial cosmetic procedures, patients are looking
for somebody who's not right at the beginning of their career,
someone who's had experience. And what experience does is it
helps you in your assessment of what can be done.
It helps you understand what can be achieved and if
that aligns with what the patient wants, and it means
that you've actually had enough complications and bad outcomes to
(10:08):
understand how to avoid those things down the track.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yes, you never want to be someone's first bad outcome.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
No, but we all have our first yes yet and
even the star plastic surgeons in New York still get complications.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
In Australia, what would we expect to fork out for
something like that if we were facelift curious.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
In terms of costs in Australia, So when we talk
about it, a cost for surgery, patients should be given
that upfront and that should include surgeon fee, anesetus fee,
hospital fees and then follow up so it needs to
be all inclusive. So you'd be looking at a starting
fee of around thirty thousand dollars up to you know,
one hundred thousand dollars. But it also depends on the
(10:49):
type of face lift in any ancillary procedures you may
be having, like for example, fat grafting and eyelid procedures.
So that's a very broad range, but it is mandatory
in Australia with OPRO guidelines to be very upfront with
your fees and look, fees are a very important part
of the conversation. That amount of money is a huge
amount of money. You know, for most people, and when
(11:10):
it comes to choosing a surgeon, I think in Australia
it has been murky because there has previously not been
regulations as to who can perform cosmetic surgery. Who can
call themselves a surgeon. Now the title of surgeon now
is protected, so if you're, for example, a GP, there's
nothing stopping you performing a facelift.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
That is terrifying.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Yep, but that's the rules. But they can no longer
call themselves a cosmetic surgeon. They can call themselves a
cosmetic doctor or a cosmetic physician. So what potential patients
need to understand is what the actual qualifications behind a
doctor's names mean. A safe start is to make sure
the doctor is medically registered as a specialist surgeon. For example,
(11:51):
you can go to the Austrange Society of Plastic Surgeons
website or ASPS for sure, and that has listed all
the fully qualified plastic surgeons who perform cosmetic surgery.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Okay, that's such a good tip for people.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Let's talk recovery, because no one ever admits to getting
these things done, as we sort of said at the top,
so let alone. They're not going to share what the
recovery is like Chris Jenna, let's use her as the example.
What is that downtime looking like?
Speaker 3 (12:21):
I think you would need a minimum of at least
six to eight weeks to be able to walk out
with cameras on.
Speaker 4 (12:28):
You because you're so puffy.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
And I mean, the thing is is that she has
access to you know, she's probably got an omnilux or
light therapy thing at home that is good for recovers
if she could just stick her head onto.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
That all the time.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
But she would have access to so many things to
help speed up recovery, there.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
Is only so much that those things can exactly.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
For example, you know, laser treatments to scars, that sort
of thing.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
The biggest factor.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
In recovery is time, and that's not something you can
fast forward. So it takes a minimum of three to
four weeks before you have a reasonable amount of puffiness
that you could appear in public. Most of my patients
say it's four months before they start to feel a
bit sort of human or like they're usual selves, because
the skin can feel numb for a very long time.
(13:12):
So even though someone might look presentable with a full
face of makeup, good lighting, good hair, at six weeks,
and it may look like it was of a very
quick transformation. If you were able to see them before
they got dressed, made up, hair done, I think the
real picture would be quite different.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
There'd be a lot of bruising still potentially.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
Potentially, and everybody bruises differently.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Okay, So on an aesthetic level, because obviously some really
dark things could obviously happen with any sort of medical procedure,
but what can go wrong with this sort of work?
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Okay, So with any surgery, there's an anesthetic, and the
anesthetic for facelifting procedures could be from four to six hours.
So need to be fit enough from a general medical
perspective to undergo that sort of length anesthetic for a start,
it's a very tedious operation in terms of we as
a surgeon have to go very slowly because especially in
a deep plane. Left just under that deep plane and
(14:06):
all the nerves called the facial nerve that work the
muscles of facial expression. So every time you smile, crinkle
your eyes, wriggle your nose, those are called the muscles
of facial expression, and the nerves that motor those muscles
are directly underneath the layer we are lifting, so you
have to go very slow and carefully when you're doing
(14:26):
a face ift. That's why it takes so long. And
there's a lot of stitching and that has to be
immaculate in order to get good scars. So that's why
it's a long procedure. It's not like having brain surgery.
It's very deep inside a body cavity. It's very superficial
in terms of the body location. But it has to
be very careful surgery.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, and this is such a gory question, but like,
is the whole face peeled off?
Speaker 3 (14:49):
No, So in a lower face and necklift or a
deep plane left say the middle third of the face,
the skin in that section is left intact, but the
next skin is lifted off and the cheek skin from
the sides towards that middle third is lifted off. So
it's not like peeling down the skin from the top,
for example, because the skin still needs a blood supply,
(15:10):
and we have these facial archy, which is a big
archery that comes in here and supplies the skin and
that's what keeps the skin alive during the process.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
Okay, oh gosh.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
When it comes to things that are botched with something
like a face lift.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
What can go wrong?
Speaker 3 (15:26):
So there can be true complications, So damage to that
facial nerve can leave to temporary or permanent problems with
facial expression. There can be damage to the skin or
even death of the skin because of poor blood supply.
There can be asymmetries in terms of the way one
side is slightly tighter than the other. But often there
are some underlying asymmetries we have naturally.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Most people do, don't they.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
It's something that really can be very frustrating as a surgeon,
and you have to come to terms with it that
people will never scrutinize their faces as closely as they
do after surgery.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
Yeah, So how different is so say someone comes to
you and says that I want to facelift. How different
is the approach whether you are doing someone in their
sixth dase versus someone in their forties or fifties or
is that then sort of just dependent on how they
have aged naturally?
Speaker 1 (16:17):
And also I guess genetics.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Yes, I mean every patient has their own individual circumstances
in terms of how they look their aging and what
they want to achieve. There can be vast differences in
for example, someone who spent a lot of time in
the sun, who has a lot of photo aging at
sixty is going to look very different to someone who
grew up in a country with very little sun exposure,
or someone who's looked after their skin in terms of
(16:40):
sun protection. But if they were the same person, both
looked after their skin, both had the same amount of
sun protection, good genetics, then yes, there are still differences
in how I would approach that their patterns of aging
are going to be different just because of the length
of time and in the person who's looked after themselves.
The main problem is going to be just a gravitational
effects which you can't escape. There's no way to escape gravity.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
No, exactly as we get old or we get saggia.
And how much does genetics though influence the aging process,
Oh a huge amount. Say two people both never have
touched the sign, but one of them could still look
vastly different.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Yeah, absolutely, because genetics is from the inside out, so
it's your bone structure.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
So the way you.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
Age is dependent upon things as simple as your bone structure.
So having a prominent cheek, or we call it the
mailer area or the jawline area, so having a strong
bony structure to your face mean that you will age
differently to someone who has less support for their skin.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
I've got a very bony face. Does that mean I'm
going to age?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
But it also depends on what your skin genetically, what
your skin is.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Are there any other options, because, like you know, as
we were talking about earlier, it's quite expensive. What are
options that could work, if any?
Speaker 3 (17:53):
So some patients will come in with a very set
idea of I want a facelift, I want this, I
want that, And some people will come in I don't
know what I want, but can you tell me what
my options are from nonsurgical through to surgical, And that's
how I would start. I say, well, a facelift is
great for gravitational effects with jarling deep with Naser laby
of folds. Now, depending on the depths and the degree
(18:15):
of aging, sometimes filler can, for example, camouflage that to
a certain point, because it's very easy to go overboard
and you see people who have gone way too far
down that pathway and then they start looking weird. You
may be a candidate for a lesser procedure. For example,
if someone said, look, what would be the one thing
(18:36):
you would do for my face, and a lot of
times that could be just doing an upper left throplasty,
which might which is less than ten thousand dollars all up,
and taking the heaviness out of someone's eyes making them
look more awake and fresh. Is I think one of
the best sort of if to use a crew term
bang for buck procedures there is.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
I also think the results are just outstanding. I agree,
because you don't even realize sometimes that someone has their
upper eyelids just starting to get a little bit saggyer
and you don't realize how much opening that whole area
up can the difference that it can make.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
That's one of my favorite procedures for someone who's not
ready to go into a full face rejuvenation, and that
may be all somebody needs.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
I mean, what is your self carety?
Speaker 4 (19:25):
Give us the dirty detail.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Can we talk about your skin care routine?
Speaker 1 (19:32):
Because you've got such good skin.
Speaker 3 (19:35):
This comes back to the days when I was at
medical school and like a young resident and interested in
plastic surgery and skin and I didn't have much money,
so I was really into the science of what actually works,
what doesn't work, and what are the really good affordable
options out there because I couldn't afford, you know, lamaire
face creams. And the truth is, like there are some
really excellent products that don't.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Cost a lot of money.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
So I start in the morning with cleansing, like usually
a mix of Aha Bhapha type cleanser in the morning,
just to freshen up the skin the glycolic or the acids.
And then I will use serum, so I always use
a vitamin C serum in the morning, and I use
niacinamide and basically because I'm targeting pigment in my skin,
but they also have effects on improving collagen production and
(20:20):
brightening the skin. And then I will follow up with
sunscreen and some of those actually have a bit of
a tint in it, which means that then I don't
actually use even foundation. And in the evening once again
I will use a little wipes that have some hydroxy
acids in them. And then at nighttime I tend to
focus on retinols. And I've got really sensitive skin, so
I can't take a prescription strength rentinol more than once
(20:42):
a week, so I'll use a prescription strengths like a
retrieve cream once a week, but otherwise I'm using a
retinol product or a retinol product, and then I'm using
a moisturizer after that.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Well, ones are your favorites, I'm so intrigued.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
So I do use skin cuticals at the moment. I
do like to chop and change because I just like variety,
so I use that. It is very expensive. So for example,
if I was giving advice to someone in their twenties,
I would be using products from something like an Australian
company like the Ordinary, which is a great company with
really affordable products, or even serav and all of those
have now have vitamin C niceinamid type products.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
But personally, at.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
The moment, I'm using skin cuticles for my nicinamide and
vitamin C for my over the counter retinol or retinaur products.
I like a company called Medicate.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Oh yes.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
So the reason I like their products, the retinal products
in particular, is they have a step wise progression, so
you start with the one, and then there's a three,
and then there's a six, so you can gradually get
your skin tolerant of the higher percentage. And then when
it comes to sunscreen, I really like the Australian brand Ultraviolet.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
It gives a nice glass, give a.
Speaker 4 (21:49):
Glow, and it's a really comfortable product to wear.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
We always finish our episodes with the one skincare technique
or ingredient that you absolutely love and recommend to everyone.
And then on the opposite, what is something that you
just think is so not worth it?
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I think the retinal products, because retinol or rtinoric acid,
which is the active ingredient, is the only gold standard
proven ingredient with before and after biopsies of people who
are aging to actually show an absolute difference when it
comes to hype. Things that don't live up like whe
would just be moisturizers, like thick moisturizers without particularly any
(22:30):
active ingredients are never going to change anything in the
long term in terms of aging. They feel great when
they're on, they feel like they're plump and you're smooth
and hydrated, but they only last as long as they're
on your face. And the other thing I really don't
like is ingestible products for beauty like collagen tablets, and
the idea that you can swallow something and it's going
(22:50):
to improve your skin is I think a bit crazy.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Oh, make your hair grow heat if you have.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
A deficiency in a protein or a vitamin C or
a zinc, which are all important for the skin. Yes,
ingestible products are important, but most of us don't have
a deficiency living in the country where we are.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
So you just think big waste of money.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Well, we appreciate you coming on and talking all things
facelift and everything.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
This has been so interesting.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
We're going to pop links to go find you and
your TikTok. Can you explain actually if someone hasn't seen
your TikTok's what you do.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Yeah. So most people are visual learners, and I think
it's important to understand an operation before you have the operation.
You need to know what you're getting yourself into. But
most people can't look at an actual operation understandably. So
I try to recreate steps of procedures using Plato and
it takes a long time, and it's been a long
(23:46):
learning curve of how to actually operate on Plato and
make it look realistic.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
I try to just recreate.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Various operations, all the operations I'm planning to cover. For example,
I've just done a deep plane facelift with Plato that's
on my TikTok to show you the layers of the
face to show you how we elevate the skin and
how we elevate the deep plane and how we secure that,
just to give you an idea of what you're actually
getting yourself into.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
That's so good, though fun Thank you for the on
behalf of all of us, because I think that's just
so helpful to know you're so right and doing it
in an easier to digest manner is just genius.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
It's so much more approachable, and I can show people
and my consultations actually real life photos of surgery, and
I think as a starting point to educate people, it's
more accessible than the actual operations.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Oh well, we'll pop a link to your TikTok in
our show notes. Doctor Catherine Bora, thank you so much
for joining us today and giving us a real no
BS look at facelifts and modern cosmetic surgery.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
I've learned so much, and I'm sure the ubis have too.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Whether you're a Chris Joanna Stan facelift curious or just
love geeking out over beauty tech like I do, I
hope this episode has given you a better understanding of
what's really possible and what's actually realistic. If You're interested
in learning more about doctor Borrow's work, will pop all
of her details in the show notes for you. And
as always, if you have enjoyed this episode, polease check
(25:09):
out it in Instagram at you Beauty podcast and have
a look at our YouTube channel. All of the links
are in the show notes, and don't forget to subscribe
to our beauty newsletter.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
This episode of You Beauty was.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Produced by Molly Harwood and Sophie Campbell, with audio production
by Lou Hill. Thanks for listening and we'll be back
in your ears tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
Bye.
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