April 25, 2024 • 15 mins
Time for a little "Moore History" with Dr. Ed Moore. Our topic this year is "explorers and pioneers." To appease Ed's penchant for chasing rabbits down holes we decided to "explore" the history of Florida's cabinet. The people and the structure. Good stuff.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:13):
Just in case Steve Stewart's still listening. The reason you didn't have sound on
your headphones is you had it unplugged. We just blew up doctor Ed Moore's
e or canals by plugging it backin. Welcome friends to the third hour
of the Morning Show with Brustin Scottlaughing. Over there at Studio one A
is Grant Allen. I'm here inStudio one B, and I am joined
(00:34):
by doctor Ed Moore. Time fora little more history. Hello, my
friend, are you I've already explainedto everybody that the we're going to go
back to explorers and pioneers next month, that I can see how this happened
for you after last month you juststarted, you know, you know,
we really ought to. So herewe are. We're going to talk about
Flora's cabinet. Well, yeah,what prompted actually was there a little change
(00:57):
is that two people that I knewthat served Florida both passed away within the
last month, and I started thinkingabout them, and I actually worked in
the cabinet process back when they served, and I thought it'd be worth all
because so many people are here thatweren't here, And that's what you realize
Florida's changed, and we'll talk aboutnumbers later, but it's changed so radically
(01:22):
since that time. You mentioned BillGunner to people, and they just go
Bill Gunner, Who who is that? The insurance office on Thomas Vill Road.
I mean, they don't have thatsense. You mentioned Bob Graham.
Even you think we wasn't that longago, But to a lot of people,
it was that long ago because theyweren't here, They lived somewhere else.
And these guys served in a veryinteresting time. And I was fortunate
(01:48):
to first work for the legislature whenBob Graham was a US I'm in a
state senator from Miami Dade. Andwhat an interesting group of characters served during
that era. There are people thathave written books Golden Age and like to
call that time framed Golden Age.You could also write a book called the
(02:08):
Age of Corruption because of what wasgoing on in Florida during that time frame.
Just within the cabinet itself. Whattimeframe would that be, I've said
nineteen seventies. If you just clockedacross the seventies, Ruben ask you got
elected governor in seventies, and ofcourse he never had one scandal involved him,
but in his administration, there werequite a few members of the cabinet.
(02:32):
In those days, the cabinet wasa seven member cabinet, all independently
elected. Florida is the only statethat's had that form of government where most
states have a very very strong governor, and we've moved towards that since that
time, really actually since the nineteenninety eight constitutional revision took place in two
(02:54):
thousand and three with term limits foreverybody. It changed the nature of government
in Florida. But in those dayswe always had term Actually in the sixties
and prior to the governor served onlyone term in Florida, and the cabinet
members could serve for life. Sowe had a lot of people that were
there for a very very long time. So does your look at Florida's cabinet
(03:16):
for today, are you focusing onthose roaring seventies or are you going back
to the very beginning. Well,we could go back to the beginning.
Eighteen forty five. They created agovernment in Florida when Florida became a state,
and you had cabinet positions then,but in those days, largely they
(03:37):
served at the will of the governor. Or served the governor. Even in
the constitution that took place after theCivil War when a new government was put
in place, basically inserted. Wasit friends of the governor at the time
or was it people that the governorsaid they were capable for this task.
(03:59):
May not be friends, they mightbe friends both. It wasn't largely a
meritocracy, you know it. Youknow, it was more like you knew,
yeah, any Preston, will youcome help me out? And you
people that you met, and that'show you formed the cabinet in those days.
The public got tired of that.From eighteen sixty five to the eighteen
eighty five we had a constitutional revisionoccurred in eighteen eighty five, and that's
(04:26):
when you have the independent cabinet membersseven from that time forward, and they
all were all independently elected and couldserve lifetime. You had to run for
reelection, but it was tough todefeat them because they were the incumbents.
They incumbencies very strong. This isthe Morning Show with Preston Scott eleven minutes
(04:49):
past the hour of the Morning Showand Doctor Ed Moore picking up with the
change where we started. What werethe seven cabinet positions. What were they?
What were they? Well, youhad the governor obviously as the chairman
of the cabinet, and you hadan attorney general. You had a state
comptroller, you had a Commissioner ofAgriculture, you had the insurance commissioner,
(05:14):
state treasurer and insurance commissioner, anda Secretary of State. Wide range of
people. One would have thought thatgenerally, if you think about politics,
people would run, say I'll runfor Secretary of State and then serve awhile
and then I'm going to be theUS Senator or the governor or whatever.
But that really isn't the case.Charlie christ and since the sixty eight nineteen
(05:38):
sixty eight Constitution revision to now,Charlie Chris, I'm pretty sure, is
the only one that was a servingcabinet member that became governor. No way
Charlie seeking another office. Well,and that's what he did. He did
what most people thinks happened happens withall of them, as Commissioner of Education,
(05:58):
attorney General, than governor. It'slike kind of like the children's pastor,
the youth pastor, the associate pastorbecomes the pastor. You work your
way up you would think that wouldhappen. There's been three US Senators Graham,
Bob Graham, and then Dick Stoneand Bill Nelson that were served in
(06:19):
a role on the cabinet and thenbecame US senators from Florida. That's it.
Out of all of those people overall that long period of time.
So it's not necessarily that proving ground, training ground, let the people evaluate
what kind of job you do,kind of thing doesn't happen that often.
We're more and largely it's because ofthe population shifts in Florida. In my
(06:41):
view, Florida has changed so radicallysince the nineteen seventy election, and now
that people that live here don't knowwho these people are. I mean they
well, you dropped some names I'dnever heard of. Yeah, well dick
Stone was Secretary. Bill Nelson,I mean, next thing you're gonn tell
me he was an astronaut. Hewas an astronaut, and now he's the
head of the Space program. Youknow, So the kind of lateral arabesque
(07:06):
I was, Yeah, but gotlike dick Stone Secretary of State and then
ran for the US Senate, ranactually against Bill Gunner back then, and
dick Stone ended up eking that out. I worked in that campaign. I
knew dick Stone and a good manand did a good job, and Paula
Hawkins beat him. I mean paulHawkins came off of the old statewide elected
(07:30):
Public Service Commission that had three publicservice commissioners. Paula was able to always
be the no vote. She wasa Republican and two old time Democrats.
So when he came for rating increasesand all those things that everybody hates,
Paula would vote no. Everybody lovedher. She went to the US Senate
back in the day, and youdefine that however you want. Did the
(07:50):
cabinet matter, Yes, it mattereda lot. It's what governed the state.
A lot of agencies. Back inthe those days, a lot of
the state agencies were under the purviewof the cabinet, Natural Resources, Environmental
Protection, Department of Revenue. Theywere all cabinet agencies. There were thirteen
(08:11):
fourteen agencies that function under. Nowwe're down to four and there's four members
and it takes only how do youget a majority on a four person board?
Well, you say, well,the governor has the weighted vote.
So if the governor's on the affirmativeside. He just needs one vote to
get his way, and so that'swhat occurs frequently. Now. They still
(08:39):
sit over a number of agencies andof State Board of Administration, by example,
it's the board responsible for managing theinvestments of all the state money.
Pretty big. I mean you're talkingbillions and billions of dollars. Three of
the four cabinet members sit on that. One Commissioner of Agriculture, No,
(09:00):
they're not part of that. Soit's an awkward structure. I'm an old
cabinet guy. I like having thoseseven people there. I think that gives
public a lot more access places theycan go, they can I was going
to say as large as government,I mean, granted, Florida as lean
as any state government is, butthat's in kind of per capita staffing.
(09:24):
I would think you'd want more cabinetmembers. Over the last thirty years or
so, Florida has drifted towards thenational norm of having a very strong governor
and holding the governor accountable. Ikind of like the diffusion and having more
people engaged, but we're not there. Final segment, Doctor had more more
(09:46):
history and the Florida cabinet no good. You had asked before about consolidation when
we went from seven to four.Yeah, I always found the precipitated that
goo goose, they call them goodgovernment type people. It's too much.
We don't like the cabinet, let'sshrink it down. Can't get rid of
it at all. I find itinteresting. One of the ones that survived
(10:09):
out of all that was Commissioner ofAgriculture stayed as a cabinet with four votes.
They consolidated the Treasurer and the comptrollerCFO, put them together as a
CFO. Secretary of State got removed. If I were in a track or
a mindset of running for office,probably one of the ones I would be
(10:31):
best suited for them, or oflike being Secretary of State of Florida.
The stuff that's within that agency,stuff that is a tremendous interest to me.
But it's gone. It's an appointedposition now. So you're down to
four. We'll see. There's noreal push anywhere to do any changes or
consolidation on anything that's there now.Is that because the perception is that Florida
(10:54):
is well run and it's working.Yeah, and we have. We've gravitated
towards a much stronger governor that workswhen the governor's doing things that you like
and you want to have happened.And if you get a governor that we
almost got two elections ago, thatpeople would have scratched their husband. Go
where's Florida going now? But rightnow, you know, if you're a
(11:16):
conservative, you like what's happening here. If you're not, it's bothering you.
But there's still no real change.But it's proven magnetic. They want
to take the office back, butI'm not hearing anywhere. Hey, you
know, we ought to get someother positions here. We can put our
people in. You've had some diversity. Alex Sink is a Democrat. I
(11:37):
mean there's been Would she be aDemocrat today, by definitely, you know
what I mean, conservative business personand that's what I'm saying. I mean,
she wouldn't fit inside that mold anymore, you know, I don't know.
I mean it was an opportunity forher. She ran one nice lady,
did a good job, and it'sgone. Nikki Freed was a Democrat
on the as the Commissioner of Agricultureand not a traditional person that you would
(12:01):
think, but it was available andshe took that position. Will there be
a Democrat after the next election inFlorida. On that probably not And a
lot of those people that are sittingthere, people are speculating they want to
run for governor, so what's goingto happen? And they're term limited,
largely termal limited, so we'll havea pretty fresh slate. When DeSantis leaves
(12:24):
office, you're going to see alot of new cabinet members and so that
changed the nature. But first Iwant to talk about the numbers. I
went back, he asked earlier eighteenforty five, when Florida became a state,
we A Mosely defeated Richard Kall ina governor's race three two hundred and
ninety five to two thousand, sixhundred and seventy nine. Statewide, that
(12:48):
was it Miami Dade. Then itwas just Dade counties at sothwher Mosely won
sixty to five. I think Floridahas changed a little bit since eighteen forty
five. Yeah, yeah, andthen you go when you go more recently,
eighteen forty five forty five, Floridahad approximately sixty six thousand people,
(13:13):
mostly across the top of the statein the panandle So you know, we've
changed When Aski was elected in nineteenseventy, one million, seven hundred and
thirty thousand plus votes were casts.One million, seven hundred and thirty Okay.
We had a total population of sixmillion, seven hundred and eighty nine
thousand people in nineteen seventy six pointseven million people. The Desanus election in
(13:37):
twenty two, Florida had twenty twomillion people. Seven million, seven hundred
and twenty thousand people voted. Okay, seven million, seven hundred thousand voted.
When ASCU won, the state populationwas less than seven million. I
mean, when you see numbers likethat, it's crazy aftermation that Florida is
(14:01):
growing. We're probably netting people movingand coming, probably netting two hundred two
hundred and fifty thousand people a yearstill, and we've been doing that for
a long time. Where it endsnobody knows, But all I see is
development occurring. So I think thatthose the Santus numbers of people seven million
(14:22):
voting is going to be ten millionvoting soon. And I mean we're big
players on a national stage. Westill have yet to have anybody make that
national stage, but I pray thatit's coming. We need to be represented
in DC by a president from ourstate. Love to see it happen.
In my lifetime. We've had peopletry not so good so far. You're
(14:48):
smiling at me, but you know, twenty three million people in this state.
We're growing, California shrinking even thoughthey're so still so big, they're
still shrinking. You know, we'replayers. We should be players and continue
to be players. The cabinet helpedto build this state and created the environment.
(15:09):
I think as a group, thosestrong people out of the seventies,
not the ones that went to jail, and a number of men ended up
going to jail. Commissioner of Education, the state treasurer went to jail.
I mean, it wasn't all pureright, but there were good people involved.
In to their credit, guys likeBob Graham and Bill Gunner served did
(15:31):
well and stepped aside and stayed availableand engaged. I've served on boards with
Bill Gunner, a nice, wonderfulman, and I'm sorry to see them
go. Thanks for the time.Doctor edmore with us this morning twenty seven
minutes after the hour of the MorningShaw with President Scott
Just in case Steve Stewart's still listening. The reason you didn't have sound on
your headphones is you had it unplugged. We just blew up doctor Ed Moore's
e or canals by plugging it backin. Welcome friends to the third hour
of the Morning Show with Brustin Scottlaughing. Over there at Studio one A
is Grant Allen. I'm here inStudio one B, and I am joined
(00:34):
by doctor Ed Moore. Time fora little more history. Hello, my
friend, are you I've already explainedto everybody that the we're going to go
back to explorers and pioneers next month, that I can see how this happened
for you after last month you juststarted, you know, you know,
we really ought to. So herewe are. We're going to talk about
Flora's cabinet. Well, yeah,what prompted actually was there a little change
(00:57):
is that two people that I knewthat served Florida both passed away within the
last month, and I started thinkingabout them, and I actually worked in
the cabinet process back when they served, and I thought it'd be worth all
because so many people are here thatweren't here, And that's what you realize
Florida's changed, and we'll talk aboutnumbers later, but it's changed so radically
(01:22):
since that time. You mentioned BillGunner to people, and they just go
Bill Gunner, Who who is that? The insurance office on Thomas Vill Road.
I mean, they don't have thatsense. You mentioned Bob Graham.
Even you think we wasn't that longago, But to a lot of people,
it was that long ago because theyweren't here, They lived somewhere else.
And these guys served in a veryinteresting time. And I was fortunate
(01:48):
to first work for the legislature whenBob Graham was a US I'm in a
state senator from Miami Dade. Andwhat an interesting group of characters served during
that era. There are people thathave written books Golden Age and like to
call that time framed Golden Age.You could also write a book called the
(02:08):
Age of Corruption because of what wasgoing on in Florida during that time frame.
Just within the cabinet itself. Whattimeframe would that be, I've said
nineteen seventies. If you just clockedacross the seventies, Ruben ask you got
elected governor in seventies, and ofcourse he never had one scandal involved him,
but in his administration, there werequite a few members of the cabinet.
(02:32):
In those days, the cabinet wasa seven member cabinet, all independently
elected. Florida is the only statethat's had that form of government where most
states have a very very strong governor, and we've moved towards that since that
time, really actually since the nineteenninety eight constitutional revision took place in two
(02:54):
thousand and three with term limits foreverybody. It changed the nature of government
in Florida. But in those dayswe always had term Actually in the sixties
and prior to the governor served onlyone term in Florida, and the cabinet
members could serve for life. Sowe had a lot of people that were
there for a very very long time. So does your look at Florida's cabinet
(03:16):
for today, are you focusing onthose roaring seventies or are you going back
to the very beginning. Well,we could go back to the beginning.
Eighteen forty five. They created agovernment in Florida when Florida became a state,
and you had cabinet positions then,but in those days, largely they
(03:37):
served at the will of the governor. Or served the governor. Even in
the constitution that took place after theCivil War when a new government was put
in place, basically inserted. Wasit friends of the governor at the time
or was it people that the governorsaid they were capable for this task.
(03:59):
May not be friends, they mightbe friends both. It wasn't largely a
meritocracy, you know it. Youknow, it was more like you knew,
yeah, any Preston, will youcome help me out? And you
people that you met, and that'show you formed the cabinet in those days.
The public got tired of that.From eighteen sixty five to the eighteen
eighty five we had a constitutional revisionoccurred in eighteen eighty five, and that's
(04:26):
when you have the independent cabinet membersseven from that time forward, and they
all were all independently elected and couldserve lifetime. You had to run for
reelection, but it was tough todefeat them because they were the incumbents.
They incumbencies very strong. This isthe Morning Show with Preston Scott eleven minutes
(04:49):
past the hour of the Morning Showand Doctor Ed Moore picking up with the
change where we started. What werethe seven cabinet positions. What were they?
What were they? Well, youhad the governor obviously as the chairman
of the cabinet, and you hadan attorney general. You had a state
comptroller, you had a Commissioner ofAgriculture, you had the insurance commissioner,
(05:14):
state treasurer and insurance commissioner, anda Secretary of State. Wide range of
people. One would have thought thatgenerally, if you think about politics,
people would run, say I'll runfor Secretary of State and then serve awhile
and then I'm going to be theUS Senator or the governor or whatever.
But that really isn't the case.Charlie christ and since the sixty eight nineteen
(05:38):
sixty eight Constitution revision to now,Charlie Chris, I'm pretty sure, is
the only one that was a servingcabinet member that became governor. No way
Charlie seeking another office. Well,and that's what he did. He did
what most people thinks happened happens withall of them, as Commissioner of Education,
(05:58):
attorney General, than governor. It'slike kind of like the children's pastor,
the youth pastor, the associate pastorbecomes the pastor. You work your
way up you would think that wouldhappen. There's been three US Senators Graham,
Bob Graham, and then Dick Stoneand Bill Nelson that were served in
(06:19):
a role on the cabinet and thenbecame US senators from Florida. That's it.
Out of all of those people overall that long period of time.
So it's not necessarily that proving ground, training ground, let the people evaluate
what kind of job you do,kind of thing doesn't happen that often.
We're more and largely it's because ofthe population shifts in Florida. In my
(06:41):
view, Florida has changed so radicallysince the nineteen seventy election, and now
that people that live here don't knowwho these people are. I mean they
well, you dropped some names I'dnever heard of. Yeah, well dick
Stone was Secretary. Bill Nelson,I mean, next thing you're gonn tell
me he was an astronaut. Hewas an astronaut, and now he's the
head of the Space program. Youknow, So the kind of lateral arabesque
(07:06):
I was, Yeah, but gotlike dick Stone Secretary of State and then
ran for the US Senate, ranactually against Bill Gunner back then, and
dick Stone ended up eking that out. I worked in that campaign. I
knew dick Stone and a good manand did a good job, and Paula
Hawkins beat him. I mean paulHawkins came off of the old statewide elected
(07:30):
Public Service Commission that had three publicservice commissioners. Paula was able to always
be the no vote. She wasa Republican and two old time Democrats.
So when he came for rating increasesand all those things that everybody hates,
Paula would vote no. Everybody lovedher. She went to the US Senate
back in the day, and youdefine that however you want. Did the
(07:50):
cabinet matter, Yes, it mattereda lot. It's what governed the state.
A lot of agencies. Back inthe those days, a lot of
the state agencies were under the purviewof the cabinet, Natural Resources, Environmental
Protection, Department of Revenue. Theywere all cabinet agencies. There were thirteen
(08:11):
fourteen agencies that function under. Nowwe're down to four and there's four members
and it takes only how do youget a majority on a four person board?
Well, you say, well,the governor has the weighted vote.
So if the governor's on the affirmativeside. He just needs one vote to
get his way, and so that'swhat occurs frequently. Now. They still
(08:39):
sit over a number of agencies andof State Board of Administration, by example,
it's the board responsible for managing theinvestments of all the state money.
Pretty big. I mean you're talkingbillions and billions of dollars. Three of
the four cabinet members sit on that. One Commissioner of Agriculture, No,
(09:00):
they're not part of that. Soit's an awkward structure. I'm an old
cabinet guy. I like having thoseseven people there. I think that gives
public a lot more access places theycan go, they can I was going
to say as large as government,I mean, granted, Florida as lean
as any state government is, butthat's in kind of per capita staffing.
(09:24):
I would think you'd want more cabinetmembers. Over the last thirty years or
so, Florida has drifted towards thenational norm of having a very strong governor
and holding the governor accountable. Ikind of like the diffusion and having more
people engaged, but we're not there. Final segment, Doctor had more more
(09:46):
history and the Florida cabinet no good. You had asked before about consolidation when
we went from seven to four.Yeah, I always found the precipitated that
goo goose, they call them goodgovernment type people. It's too much.
We don't like the cabinet, let'sshrink it down. Can't get rid of
it at all. I find itinteresting. One of the ones that survived
(10:09):
out of all that was Commissioner ofAgriculture stayed as a cabinet with four votes.
They consolidated the Treasurer and the comptrollerCFO, put them together as a
CFO. Secretary of State got removed. If I were in a track or
a mindset of running for office,probably one of the ones I would be
(10:31):
best suited for them, or oflike being Secretary of State of Florida.
The stuff that's within that agency,stuff that is a tremendous interest to me.
But it's gone. It's an appointedposition now. So you're down to
four. We'll see. There's noreal push anywhere to do any changes or
consolidation on anything that's there now.Is that because the perception is that Florida
(10:54):
is well run and it's working.Yeah, and we have. We've gravitated
towards a much stronger governor that workswhen the governor's doing things that you like
and you want to have happened.And if you get a governor that we
almost got two elections ago, thatpeople would have scratched their husband. Go
where's Florida going now? But rightnow, you know, if you're a
(11:16):
conservative, you like what's happening here. If you're not, it's bothering you.
But there's still no real change.But it's proven magnetic. They want
to take the office back, butI'm not hearing anywhere. Hey, you
know, we ought to get someother positions here. We can put our
people in. You've had some diversity. Alex Sink is a Democrat. I
(11:37):
mean there's been Would she be aDemocrat today, by definitely, you know
what I mean, conservative business personand that's what I'm saying. I mean,
she wouldn't fit inside that mold anymore, you know, I don't know.
I mean it was an opportunity forher. She ran one nice lady,
did a good job, and it'sgone. Nikki Freed was a Democrat
on the as the Commissioner of Agricultureand not a traditional person that you would
(12:01):
think, but it was available andshe took that position. Will there be
a Democrat after the next election inFlorida. On that probably not And a
lot of those people that are sittingthere, people are speculating they want to
run for governor, so what's goingto happen? And they're term limited,
largely termal limited, so we'll havea pretty fresh slate. When DeSantis leaves
(12:24):
office, you're going to see alot of new cabinet members and so that
changed the nature. But first Iwant to talk about the numbers. I
went back, he asked earlier eighteenforty five, when Florida became a state,
we A Mosely defeated Richard Kall ina governor's race three two hundred and
ninety five to two thousand, sixhundred and seventy nine. Statewide, that
(12:48):
was it Miami Dade. Then itwas just Dade counties at sothwher Mosely won
sixty to five. I think Floridahas changed a little bit since eighteen forty
five. Yeah, yeah, andthen you go when you go more recently,
eighteen forty five forty five, Floridahad approximately sixty six thousand people,
(13:13):
mostly across the top of the statein the panandle So you know, we've
changed When Aski was elected in nineteenseventy, one million, seven hundred and
thirty thousand plus votes were casts.One million, seven hundred and thirty Okay.
We had a total population of sixmillion, seven hundred and eighty nine
thousand people in nineteen seventy six pointseven million people. The Desanus election in
(13:37):
twenty two, Florida had twenty twomillion people. Seven million, seven hundred
and twenty thousand people voted. Okay, seven million, seven hundred thousand voted.
When ASCU won, the state populationwas less than seven million. I
mean, when you see numbers likethat, it's crazy aftermation that Florida is
(14:01):
growing. We're probably netting people movingand coming, probably netting two hundred two
hundred and fifty thousand people a yearstill, and we've been doing that for
a long time. Where it endsnobody knows, But all I see is
development occurring. So I think thatthose the Santus numbers of people seven million
(14:22):
voting is going to be ten millionvoting soon. And I mean we're big
players on a national stage. Westill have yet to have anybody make that
national stage, but I pray thatit's coming. We need to be represented
in DC by a president from ourstate. Love to see it happen.
In my lifetime. We've had peopletry not so good so far. You're
(14:48):
smiling at me, but you know, twenty three million people in this state.
We're growing, California shrinking even thoughthey're so still so big, they're
still shrinking. You know, we'replayers. We should be players and continue
to be players. The cabinet helpedto build this state and created the environment.
(15:09):
I think as a group, thosestrong people out of the seventies,
not the ones that went to jail, and a number of men ended up
going to jail. Commissioner of Education, the state treasurer went to jail.
I mean, it wasn't all pureright, but there were good people involved.
In to their credit, guys likeBob Graham and Bill Gunner served did
(15:31):
well and stepped aside and stayed availableand engaged. I've served on boards with
Bill Gunner, a nice, wonderfulman, and I'm sorry to see them
go. Thanks for the time.Doctor edmore with us this morning twenty seven
minutes after the hour of the MorningShaw with President Scott
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