June 17, 2023 • 29 mins
Ryan Gorman hosts an iHeartRadio nationwide special featuring Cole Lyle, USMC Veteran & Executive Director of Mission Roll Call. Cole Lyle joins the show for PTSD Awareness Month to discuss the issue of PTSD and mental health among veterans, including the overall scope of the problem and different strategies that have effectively addressed the challenges some veterans face. Kelly Navies, Museum Specialist of Oral History at the Smithsonian National Museum of African American History and Culture, also joins the show. Kelly Navies discusses the history of the Juneteenth holiday, from the period between the conclusion of the Civil War and the freeing of enslaved people in Texas to the events following that moment in history that led to the recent push for Juneteenth to become a federal holiday.
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(00:00):
Welcome to iHeartRadio Communities, a publicaffairs special focusing on the biggest issues impacting
you. This week, here's RyanGorman. Thanks so much for joining us
here on iHeartRadio Communities. I'm RyanGorman, and we have some important conversations
lined up for you. In justa bit, we'll run through the history
behind the upcoming June teenth Holiday witha special guest from the Smithsonian National Museum
(00:24):
of African American History and Culture.But right now, to get things started,
I'm joined by US Marine Corps veteranand executive director of Mission roll Call,
Cole Lyle. You can find outmore about this organization at Mission Rollcall
dot org. Cole really appreciate takinga few minutes to come on the show
as this month, June is PTSDAwareness Month and a lot to talk about
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on this topic. But let mestart if you don't mind, with your
personal story of dealing with PTSD.Yeah, Ryan, Well, thank you
for having me on first and foremost. When I got to the Marine Corps
in twenty fourteen, I had alreadybeen experiencing issues with post traumatic stress when
I got back from Afghanistan. Theymake people take what's called a post deployment
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Health assessment, which ranges from tryingto identify physical injuries or issues to mental
health issues like postraumatic stress. Itwas indicated that I needed to see treatment,
so I started doing that and Iused traditional kind of evidence based therapies
that the VA provides and went tosome counseling at what is called a BET
(01:29):
center. I was prescribed sleep aidsand antidepressants for my symptoms of postraumatic stress
because there's actually no medication that's adaproof for postraumatic stress. All of that
didn't really work that well for me. Ultimately, I went through a pretty
rough period and one night in twentyfourteen almost became a veteran suicide physic.
I kind of crawled out of thathole with help from other Marines and peers
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of mine mentors, ended up gettinga service. ARBIT worked tremendous well for
me, and that's kind of howI got into betteran advocacy because I wanted
to help others get through the samethings that I went through. And this
is an issue that is not uncommonamong veterans. Correct, Yeah, I
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mean it's it's hard to say exactlyhow common it is because there are statistics
that suggest like from the VA,for example, that less than thirty percent
of veterans with some symptoms of postraumaticstress on a regular basis, and obviously
from service eras it can differ widely, viet non veterans tend to have a
(02:38):
higher rate of postraumatic stress symptoms thanglobal warm terior veterans. But there's some
non VA studies, like when theWarrior Project came out with a study last
year a pole of veterans that theydid it was nationwide that said that I'm
going to get the statistic wrong,but it was some overwhelming number of veterans
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like seventy five at eighty percent todeal with symptoms of post traumatic stress.
So it's hard to know exactly howcommon it is, but certainly if you
talk to veterans in the community,either they or somebody they know has dealt
with this at some point. Let'sget to the issue of veteran suicide now,
because the number of veterans who taketheir own lives on a daily basis
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is just astonishing. The figure saidit most frequently is about twenty two per
day. But even if it's alittle lower, which I've heard, or
a little higher, which I've alsoheard we're still talking about a tragic situation
in this country. Yeah, sothe twenty two number was an official statistic
from VA. That number, accordingto BA, has now decreased to a
little less than seventeen a day.There are a couple of different reasons for
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this, because year over years theVA's numbers. They get their data from
the CDC, who in turn getsit from individual states, and unfortunately,
all states are not equal when itcomes to counting suicides or verifying a veteran's
status as a veteran. There's nouniform tool to do that, so the
data is frankly pretty sketchy, andthere are outside studies groups like America's Warrior
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Partnerships did Operation Deep Dive, andthe Inner Runs study that is being done
by Duke University in conjunction with severalstates, including Florida, suggests that the
actual suicide rate is when you accountfor accidental overdose with opioids and things that
aren't as obvious as gunshot wounds,that the actual numbers is closer to probably
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about forty four a day. Sowe don't know exactly because the data is
so bad, and that's why groupslike America's Warrior Partnership are doing operations deep
dive to try to get an accurateassessment of the problem, because until we
do that we have an idea ofscope and scale, we're kind of just,
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you know, throwing spaghetti at arefrigerator, trying to figure out what
works and what doesn't. I'm RyanGorman, joined by s Marine Corps veteran
and Executive director of Mission Role callcoal Lyle the issue of mental health within
the veteran community. Are we talkingabout a growing issue or is it more
that veterans are more comfortable now comingforward and seeking out that mental health treatment.
(05:21):
Yeah, you know, I don'tknow that I would say that it
is becoming a growing concern overall.I think that we are becoming it probably
is a combination of Yes, itmay be getting a little worse, but
I think it also has to dowith the fact that we're getting a lot
more comfortable talking about it at thispoint. So it may just seem like
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it's getting worse because people that we'redealing with it before in silence are now
openly talking about it, which isa good thing. They should be able
to talk about it and work throughthese issues. Would I would also note
though that you know, suicide isnot all is necessarily a mental health problem.
Certainly a mental health issue can exacerbatethose symptoms. But you know,
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when somebody commits suicide, it couldbe a conglomeration and usually is a conglomeration
of things like financial stress, acutefinancial stress, relationship problems, divorces or
breakups, things like that, youknow, and and also mental health issues.
But we too often, and especiallyat BEA, they look at suicide
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prevention through the lens of mental health, and I think that structurally is not
a good way to look at itbecause first of all, the BEA only
actually touches less than fifty percent ofveterans in the United States, you know,
so they're not reaching the entire population. And number two, the success
rates of therapy and medication cover ataround fifty three perspectively, so their own
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data suggests that it only works halfthe time. We need a different approach
and their organizations out there in thelocal communities that Mission Roll Call went and
visited last year that are doing theLord's work on the ground and will continue
to advocate for those community organizations.Can you tell us about some of the
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different strategies that are being used tohelp deal with this. Yeah, so
again, when you look at this, it could be an issue of a
veteran kind of losing purpose. Youknow, their identity was wrapped up in
the military service. They were fightingfor a cause greater than themselves. They
had a very tight knit community,a chain of command that they could take
their their issues too and hopefully,you know, solve whatever personal problems they
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were having, you know, outsideof military service, things like that.
So a lot of the organizations thatare seeing success are organizations like Boldercrest Foundation
has two locations in northern Virginia andthen out in Arizona that bring veterans in
for what is called a Warrior Pathprogram that brings veterans into a group together
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and kind of reprograms them, soto speak. We do a really good
job of programming civilians to become servicemembers, but then we're not doing a
great job of teaching them how toreintegrate when their services done. So bouldercrests
other organizations, they bring them togetherand they kind of help them reprogram their
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sense of purpose and their identity dealingwith specific issues. But it's not always
trauma based, right, it's notalways post traumatic stress symptoms. Sometimes it's
it really is just conditions of thehuman condition that they're struggling with. So
that's why Congress actually recognize June thirteenthas Post Traumatic Growth Day, because,
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yes, traumas can affect the wayyou live your life and how you respond
to things, but it can alsomake you stronger in the long run if
you actively learn how to mitigate itand help other people go through them.
So you mentioned vetter in service dogsand how that helped you. Is that
becoming a more popular approach to dealingwith mental health issues including PTSD and tell
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us more about how that worked foryou. Certainly it's becoming more prevalent.
I think, as I mentioned,the VA's approach is very evident spased talk,
therapy, and medication, and they'vebeen reticent historically to embrace more holistic
approaches to mental health. You know, they say they have the veteran Whole
Health Initiative, but you know,when you look at the funding that they
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give to certain programs versus traditional it'sclear where the priorities are. But yes,
service dogs are becoming more prevalent.HI work tremendously well for me.
She was trying to wake me upfrom nightmares and stop anxiety attacks. And
but more than that, she gaveme a sense of purpose that pills just
wouldn't ever. Do you know,a dog needs to be walked, needs
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to be taken care of. Um, So it gave me a kind of
a partner on kind of my pathin recovery. And I trusted that you
would be there. So it wastremendously helpful, which is why you know,
I ultimately lobbied for the Pause Act, which was passed in twenty twenty
one, expanding service dog access toveterans with postraatic stress. And I think
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other than service dogs, veterans arejust screaming for different approaches to try to
mitigate not only symptoms of mental healthissues, but kind of, like I
said, the loss of identity,which is why you're seeing organizations that are
less you know, traditional better inservice organizations. We visited in Montana,
great example last year a nonprofit calledHeroes and Horses that is effectively a dude
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ranch that brings veterans out for fortyone days and teaches them how to be
a cowboy if they if they wantto start a new life and a new
identity. Veterans are screaming for theseoptions. So I think, along with
service dogs, other approaches to thisare just going to continue to grow and
expand. And finally, for thosewho want to support the work that you're
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doing at Mission Role Call, whatare the different ways they can help?
Yeah, I think first and foremost, if you go to Mission roll Calls
dot org, you can sign upfor texting email polls. You don't have
to be a veteran, but youknow we can pull veterans and veteran supporters
about issues that Congress is considering thatwould affect the veteran community. We're actually
(11:31):
testifying for the House that are FairSubcommittee on Help next week about community care.
Sign up for those text and emailpolls. But also, you know,
donate um if you can an recurringdonor. But I would say just
we put out newsletters. Just keepyourself in the note and do your best
to help veterans in your local community. US Marine Corps veteran and executive director
(11:54):
of Mission Role Call Cole Lyle.Again, you can learn more about the
work this great organization does at MissionRollcall dot org. Cole want to thank
you so much, obviously, foryour service to this country and for taking
a few minutes to come on theshow. We appreciate it. Yeah,
absolutely, thank you. Right,all right, I'm Ryan Gorman here on
iHeartRadio Communities. A new Gallup pollfound about six and ten Americans say they
(12:16):
know a lot or some about Juneteenth. That means many of us are still
learning about the history and importance ofJuneteenth. And to offer a comprehensive overview
of the holiday, I'm joined nowby Kelly Navies, Museum Specialist of Oral
History at the Smithsonian National Museum ofAfrican American History and Culture. Kelly,
(12:39):
thanks so much for coming on theshow. Now, before we get to
the events of June nineteenth that ledto this holiday, can you set the
stage for us and run through someof what happened leading up to that date.
So you're talking about the end ofthe Civil War. The Civil War
had officially ended it April of eighteensixty five. The Amancipation Proclamation was signed
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in the middle of the Civil War, and it was really a wartime strategy,
and that was in January first,eighteen sixty three, and that only
had an impact on states in theConfederacy, so did not impacts you.
If you were in a state suchas Texas that had very little Union presence,
your life did not change if youwere an enslaved individual. And so
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you're talking about the aftermath of theCivil War. The country and somewhat still
in the state of disarray. TheConfederacy has not fully accepted the authority of
the United States of America. Sothe Union troops are needed to enforce the
Emancipation Proclamation. And that is exactlythe setting for G ANDT. You know,
it can be kind of hard tocomprehend what it must have been like
(13:46):
to live in that time period.So connected these days we get so much
information in an instant but back then, obviously that wasn't the case. How
was worth spreading about what was happeningacross the country. Well, yeah,
so people think that they didn't knowabout it at all, and that's not
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exactly true. There were networks amongstthe enslaved. When some people were some
of the enslaved had jobs, forexample, that took them on the road,
and whenever they did that, theywould pass messages. So it isn't
that they didn't necessarily know. Andas well as the slave owners, of
course, you had horses and trainsand such carrying information. Of course,
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we didn't have the Internet, butthey were aware of what had happened with
the Emancipation Proclamation. It was justthat they had no intention of enforcing it.
And those African Americans who were stillthere and under those conditions, there
was something that they could do becausetheir lives would be threatened if they attempted
to assert their freedom. There weremany who ran away, of course,
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but those were African Americans that werecloser to Union line and this specific day
tunes. How did this become thedate that now we celebrate as federal holiday.
So on June nineteenth, eighteen sixtyfive, General Gordon Granger arrives in
Galveston, Texas, was about twothousand Union troops and some of those troops
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towards United States Colored troops, andthe troops were necessary to enforce the order
Orders number three, which basically confirmedthe Emancipation Proclamation and let them know that
they were no longer legally enslaved.And this he was enforced again by the
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presence of these troops. Without thepresence of these troops, it would be
meaningless of General Gordon Granger had shownup by himself. They would have said
get out of here with that news, right, Bud. He had the
troops. And this actually went onin different cities throughout Texas as well.
The African Americans who were freed asa result of that announcement and the enforcement
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of the Union in truth, theybegan to celebrate juenteenth the following year in
Houston in eighteen sixty six, andit's spread from there, and it's been
celebrated in Texas non stop since thatday. Senna State Holiday in Texas since
nineteen seventy nine, and some otherplaces as well, and with the Great
Migration, it started to spread.I grew up in California. We were
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celebrating it there. The city ofBerkeley has been celebrating June tenth since thineteen
eighty six. So things were buildingto the point where now, of course,
we have this federal holiday and peoplearound the entire country are finally getting
to know what June tenth is andwhat it's about and why it's important to
celebrate. You kind of alluded tothis earlier, but I want to follow
up on this point in particular,and again I'm Ryan Gorman, joined by
(16:45):
Kelly Navies. Museum specialist of OralHistory at the Smithsonian National Museum of African
American History and Culture. So Juneteenthis directly linked to Texas, and I
want to go back to that timeperiod because there was so much happening following
the conclusion of the Civil War inso many different parts of the country.
Can you dive a little bit deeperinto why Texas is the focal point?
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Yeah, Well, Texas was thefurthest west slaveholting state, and throughout the
Civil War had very little Union presence, and so in fact, slave owners
from other states such as Alabama,Mississippi, Georgia actually moved to Texas,
some slave owners so that they continuedto hold their enslaved people. It was
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like a renegade state in some waysit still is, right, So you
really required the presence of these Uniontruths to enforce the Emancipation Proclamation. Now,
let's remind people that's the Emancipation Proclamation. Still wasn't the final document that
the end of slavery. That wasthe Thirteenth Amendment that was ratified later that
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year December eighteen sixty five. Takinga look at that year, follow the
wing the arrival of General Granger andhis troops to Texas to announce that they
were going to enforce the Emancipation Proclamation. From that period of time to the
first anniversary of Juneteenth, the firstcommemoration of that day tell us about some
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of the events that transpired in Texasand across the country. Well, of
course, they were supposed to theclause in the states that they have to
maintain our relationship as employer and higherlabor with their former slave owners. That
was an interesting clause. So theyhad to either stay in the area and
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become officially employed or try to leavethe area. This is what we're talking
This is an air of reconstruction.It is a very very chaotic period in
American history. And of course therewere troops throughout the state, but Texas
being a very large state, itwas still quite dangerous if you were trying
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to leave. And a lot ofAfrican Americans to day title leanings in that
period because many of them have beensold away as a domestic slave trade.
In the previous years leading up tothe Civil War, there was a huge
domestic slave trade that continued in Overa million African Americans were displaced from places
like Maryland and sent for deeper Southso people wanted to return to their families.
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They wanted to bring their families together. So many people tried to leave,
a lot of people stayed. Thatthose that stayed banded together in communities
and raised money to buy land.And Houston, Reverend Jackie led his community
and they raised money and they boughtproperty in Houston and started a part Emancipation
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Parts available to African Americans in Houston, and a similar developments throughout the nation
where people formed bought land. AfricanAmericans bought land and formed Emancipation Park so
that they could have spaces to sell. Great Team. I'm Ryan Gorman,
joined by Kelly Navy's Museum Specialist ofOral History at the Smithsonian National Museum of
African American History and Culture. Youcan find out more about all of their
(20:11):
work on Juneteenth at NMAAHC dot SIdot edu. That's NMAAHC dot SI dot
edu. So, as we getfurther and further removed from the original commemoration
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of June Team, what were someof the other events that have taken place
some of the notable moments that ledup to more recently June Team eventually becoming
a federally recognized holiday. That's acomplicated question, but I can list some
of the milestones. I mean,a lot of things have happened. For
example, just with the celebration itselfevolved the first Juneteenth, you had actual
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people still living who would prove recalledslavery, and those people would share and
give testimony to their experience. Theysang spirituals. Then the Black National Anthem,
which is now a feature of allGantee, that wasn't written until nineteen
hundred, right, so it wasn'tuntil after nineteen hundreds that becomes a part
of the holiday. And what yousee is as a culture evolved, as
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African American culture evolved, the celebrationof Gantee's changes, and then of course
their different developments taking place to WorldWar two, the Great Migration, when
the African Americans have left the Souththousands by the thousands and took their celebrations
with them, not just any teams, but other aspects of the culture as
well. But Gerantins was one ofthe things that traveled. Particularly you see
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a lot of Texans moving out westto California. Of course it's celebrated in
Oklahoma as well. Then the celebrationkind of wanes a little bit and becomes
up again during the Civil Rights movementin the nineteen sixty eight you have the
Poor People's Campaign where you have acted. This is all races coming to Washington,
DC to advocate for the rights ofthe poor. This is a campaign
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started by doctor Martin US King inthe SCLC, but it involved many different
activists wore around the country and atthe end of that campaign they had a
Solidarity Day and it was on Junenineteenth, nineteen sixty eight, June tenth.
So many of these activists learned aboutgun tines for the first time.
And this is around the time,for example, that my father learned this
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holiday and we started celebrating it inour family. They took it back to
their towns where they lived throughout thecountry and you see it research until Genny
tents at that time, and thenit settled down and again it was mainly
celebrated in Texas, around Oklahoma,parts of California where those people moved in.
There were pockets, but it wasn'tuntil the last few years when there
were many, many, many incidentsthat occurred that kind of made people realize
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we need to look at our history, like why are we having these problems.
George Floyd, what's going on withthat? Uh? People started to
learn about the Tulsa massacre. Um, why why why are we having these
problems with race in this country?What brought us to this moment? So
people are looking back to Guneteenth andthe history of slavery because clearly we haven't
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resolved a lot of the issues ofthat time period. Issues of citizenship and
democracy, for example, UM thatpeople were fighting for in reconstruction are still
big issues today. So Guneteenth placesum a light on those issues and gives
us an opportunity to meditate on howfar we've come, What does freedom mean,
what does it mean to be anAmerican? How do we all and
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utilize the citizenship that we have asAmericans? So this is a time that
of Guneteenth gives us a space anda place to reflect on those things and
to celebrate how far we've actually come. And I think adisinally Americans are looking
for a way to come together likethis. This holiday started by African Americans.
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But it's American history, right.The Civil War is American history.
The Amanciation proclamations the American history.General Gordon Granger was a white man Union
troops were both races, were allraces were all Americans are different races,
right, So this is something thatreflects all of our history and the continuing
struggle for freedom and the demand forcitizenship. As new people move into our
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country, they can look back tojun teenth as a way to to see
where this journey began in the UnitedStates of America. I'm Ryan Gorman,
joined by Kelly Navies, Museum Specialistof Oral History at the Smithsonian National Museum
of African American History and Culture.We're talking about the history of Juneteenth within
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African American communities across the country.How much has the importance of this Juneteenth
date, what took place so manyyears ago on June nineteenth, How much
has that grown, especially as Juneteam has become the focal point of this
push to make it a federally recognizeholiday. Well, it's grown tremendously,
(25:11):
not just for African Americans, butfor all Americans in the past few years.
I mean that's someone who has beencelebrating it in my family. Each
year, new people come, sowe saw it grow with each year.
Each year we would invite any andeverybody around and people would show up and
whenever they would come to our gentteems. They would always come to next
year. They would like, thisis fantastic. They loved the presentation,
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the cultural presentation with children would perform, and the poetry and the music,
and of course the delicious foods,and people would say, I love this.
I mean, this is like sucha good mix of the generations and
learning about history and celebrating our eldersbut also looking towards the future and nurturing
the children. And it would justgrow with each year. But now,
(25:55):
of course, as it became afederal holiday, one of the best pieces
of news that we've had in ita difficult last two to three years,
more and more people are learning aboutit, and I believe that it will
continue to grow. You mentioned acouple of things that many in this country
are still learning more and more about, Juneteenth being one of them. Also,
the Tulsa Race massacre was something youmentioned. Was there anything else looking
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back at that time period from theend of the Civil War Juneteenth, that
June nineteenth date through you the nextcouple of decades that really stands out to
you that you think is notable andis worth discussing further. Like we have
begun to do with Juneteenth, theend of slavery, with things like the
(26:44):
Tulsa Race massacre. Well, itwas reconstruction is a rich, rich,
rich period. I mean, thisis when you see through the roots of
public education in the United States ofAmerica. People don't understand it. There's
a newly freed to African Americans orsome of the first to push for the
education for public education because of coursethat was one of the on the top
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things in their list, and theyhad been unable to go to school while
they were enslaved, and one ofthe first things that they were able to
do is to get out and learnhow to read and write and to have
their children have access to in education. So that's a huge issue and we
see that right now. Education isstill a huge issue, the state of
public education and what is taught rightin the schools. Voting rights, that
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was another big issue. Black menearned the right to vote with the fourteenth
Amendment and the fifteenth Amendment rather thanthose thirteen fourteen to fifteen Amendment. For
those reconstruction amendments. Women of coursedid not have the vote as any race
at that time, but black menstarted to exercise the right to vote.
But even as they were exercising theright to vote, they did that there's
(27:51):
a set of violence. Many werekilled trying to exercise the right to vote
then, and of course linconstruction,there was a back class to Reconstruction,
starting in eighteen seventy seven when theUnion troops were removed from the South and
continuing up to the passes of Plusyversus Ferguson in eighteen ninety six for Separate
(28:12):
but Equal Law, and then yousee voting rights almost completely taken away from
African Americans throughout the South until whatwe know of as a modern civil rights
list right sixty years later. Soall of this is going on in the
Reconstruction era. Education, the earlybusiness, voting rights, even the beginnings
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of women's rights movements of course whitewomen, but Black women as well were
starting the beginnings become of their ownconventions and struggle for civil rights as well.
You see the roots of that duringthe era of Reconstruction. So it's
a it's a very rich period andit wasn't a spirity period as well,
I mean violent. You know,people African Americans who were once chattel right,
(28:56):
they had values. At the endof the Civil war, they no
longer had value, so their livesweren't worth much, and many of them
were kill trying to assertas their rightsand two basic things like own property,
learn how to reason right. KellyNavies Museum Specialist of Oral History at the
(29:18):
Smithsonian National Museum of African American Historyand Culture. You can learn more at
NMAAHC dot SI dot edu. Kelly, we really appreciate the time. Thank
you so much for coming on andtalking to us about the history of this
juneteent holiday. Oh it's been mypleasure and I'm actually just getting started,
but thank you, all right,and that's going to do it for this
(29:40):
edition of Ihear Radio Communities. I'myour host, Ryan Gorman. We'll talk
to you again real soon.
Welcome to iHeartRadio Communities, a publicaffairs special focusing on the biggest issues impacting
you. This week, here's RyanGorman. Thanks so much for joining us
here on iHeartRadio Communities. I'm RyanGorman, and we have some important conversations
lined up for you. In justa bit, we'll run through the history
behind the upcoming June teenth Holiday witha special guest from the Smithsonian National Museum
(00:24):
of African American History and Culture.But right now, to get things started,
I'm joined by US Marine Corps veteranand executive director of Mission roll Call,
Cole Lyle. You can find outmore about this organization at Mission Rollcall
dot org. Cole really appreciate takinga few minutes to come on the show
as this month, June is PTSDAwareness Month and a lot to talk about
(00:48):
on this topic. But let mestart if you don't mind, with your
personal story of dealing with PTSD.Yeah, Ryan, Well, thank you
for having me on first and foremost. When I got to the Marine Corps
in twenty fourteen, I had alreadybeen experiencing issues with post traumatic stress when
I got back from Afghanistan. Theymake people take what's called a post deployment
(01:08):
Health assessment, which ranges from tryingto identify physical injuries or issues to mental
health issues like postraumatic stress. Itwas indicated that I needed to see treatment,
so I started doing that and Iused traditional kind of evidence based therapies
that the VA provides and went tosome counseling at what is called a BET
(01:29):
center. I was prescribed sleep aidsand antidepressants for my symptoms of postraumatic stress
because there's actually no medication that's adaproof for postraumatic stress. All of that
didn't really work that well for me. Ultimately, I went through a pretty
rough period and one night in twentyfourteen almost became a veteran suicide physic.
I kind of crawled out of thathole with help from other Marines and peers
(01:55):
of mine mentors, ended up gettinga service. ARBIT worked tremendous well for
me, and that's kind of howI got into betteran advocacy because I wanted
to help others get through the samethings that I went through. And this
is an issue that is not uncommonamong veterans. Correct, Yeah, I
(02:16):
mean it's it's hard to say exactlyhow common it is because there are statistics
that suggest like from the VA,for example, that less than thirty percent
of veterans with some symptoms of postraumaticstress on a regular basis, and obviously
from service eras it can differ widely, viet non veterans tend to have a
(02:38):
higher rate of postraumatic stress symptoms thanglobal warm terior veterans. But there's some
non VA studies, like when theWarrior Project came out with a study last
year a pole of veterans that theydid it was nationwide that said that I'm
going to get the statistic wrong,but it was some overwhelming number of veterans
(02:59):
like seventy five at eighty percent todeal with symptoms of post traumatic stress.
So it's hard to know exactly howcommon it is, but certainly if you
talk to veterans in the community,either they or somebody they know has dealt
with this at some point. Let'sget to the issue of veteran suicide now,
because the number of veterans who taketheir own lives on a daily basis
(03:19):
is just astonishing. The figure saidit most frequently is about twenty two per
day. But even if it's alittle lower, which I've heard, or
a little higher, which I've alsoheard we're still talking about a tragic situation
in this country. Yeah, sothe twenty two number was an official statistic
from VA. That number, accordingto BA, has now decreased to a
little less than seventeen a day.There are a couple of different reasons for
(03:44):
this, because year over years theVA's numbers. They get their data from
the CDC, who in turn getsit from individual states, and unfortunately,
all states are not equal when itcomes to counting suicides or verifying a veteran's
status as a veteran. There's nouniform tool to do that, so the
data is frankly pretty sketchy, andthere are outside studies groups like America's Warrior
(04:12):
Partnerships did Operation Deep Dive, andthe Inner Runs study that is being done
by Duke University in conjunction with severalstates, including Florida, suggests that the
actual suicide rate is when you accountfor accidental overdose with opioids and things that
aren't as obvious as gunshot wounds,that the actual numbers is closer to probably
(04:33):
about forty four a day. Sowe don't know exactly because the data is
so bad, and that's why groupslike America's Warrior Partnership are doing operations deep
dive to try to get an accurateassessment of the problem, because until we
do that we have an idea ofscope and scale, we're kind of just,
(04:54):
you know, throwing spaghetti at arefrigerator, trying to figure out what
works and what doesn't. I'm RyanGorman, joined by s Marine Corps veteran
and Executive director of Mission Role callcoal Lyle the issue of mental health within
the veteran community. Are we talkingabout a growing issue or is it more
that veterans are more comfortable now comingforward and seeking out that mental health treatment.
(05:21):
Yeah, you know, I don'tknow that I would say that it
is becoming a growing concern overall.I think that we are becoming it probably
is a combination of Yes, itmay be getting a little worse, but
I think it also has to dowith the fact that we're getting a lot
more comfortable talking about it at thispoint. So it may just seem like
(05:44):
it's getting worse because people that we'redealing with it before in silence are now
openly talking about it, which isa good thing. They should be able
to talk about it and work throughthese issues. Would I would also note
though that you know, suicide isnot all is necessarily a mental health problem.
Certainly a mental health issue can exacerbatethose symptoms. But you know,
(06:06):
when somebody commits suicide, it couldbe a conglomeration and usually is a conglomeration
of things like financial stress, acutefinancial stress, relationship problems, divorces or
breakups, things like that, youknow, and and also mental health issues.
But we too often, and especiallyat BEA, they look at suicide
(06:27):
prevention through the lens of mental health, and I think that structurally is not
a good way to look at itbecause first of all, the BEA only
actually touches less than fifty percent ofveterans in the United States, you know,
so they're not reaching the entire population. And number two, the success
rates of therapy and medication cover ataround fifty three perspectively, so their own
(06:54):
data suggests that it only works halfthe time. We need a different approach
and their organizations out there in thelocal communities that Mission Roll Call went and
visited last year that are doing theLord's work on the ground and will continue
to advocate for those community organizations.Can you tell us about some of the
(07:15):
different strategies that are being used tohelp deal with this. Yeah, so
again, when you look at this, it could be an issue of a
veteran kind of losing purpose. Youknow, their identity was wrapped up in
the military service. They were fightingfor a cause greater than themselves. They
had a very tight knit community,a chain of command that they could take
their their issues too and hopefully,you know, solve whatever personal problems they
(07:40):
were having, you know, outsideof military service, things like that.
So a lot of the organizations thatare seeing success are organizations like Boldercrest Foundation
has two locations in northern Virginia andthen out in Arizona that bring veterans in
for what is called a Warrior Pathprogram that brings veterans into a group together
(08:03):
and kind of reprograms them, soto speak. We do a really good
job of programming civilians to become servicemembers, but then we're not doing a
great job of teaching them how toreintegrate when their services done. So bouldercrests
other organizations, they bring them togetherand they kind of help them reprogram their
(08:26):
sense of purpose and their identity dealingwith specific issues. But it's not always
trauma based, right, it's notalways post traumatic stress symptoms. Sometimes it's
it really is just conditions of thehuman condition that they're struggling with. So
that's why Congress actually recognize June thirteenthas Post Traumatic Growth Day, because,
(08:50):
yes, traumas can affect the wayyou live your life and how you respond
to things, but it can alsomake you stronger in the long run if
you actively learn how to mitigate itand help other people go through them.
So you mentioned vetter in service dogsand how that helped you. Is that
becoming a more popular approach to dealingwith mental health issues including PTSD and tell
(09:16):
us more about how that worked foryou. Certainly it's becoming more prevalent.
I think, as I mentioned,the VA's approach is very evident spased talk,
therapy, and medication, and they'vebeen reticent historically to embrace more holistic
approaches to mental health. You know, they say they have the veteran Whole
Health Initiative, but you know,when you look at the funding that they
(09:37):
give to certain programs versus traditional it'sclear where the priorities are. But yes,
service dogs are becoming more prevalent.HI work tremendously well for me.
She was trying to wake me upfrom nightmares and stop anxiety attacks. And
but more than that, she gaveme a sense of purpose that pills just
wouldn't ever. Do you know,a dog needs to be walked, needs
(09:58):
to be taken care of. Um, So it gave me a kind of
a partner on kind of my pathin recovery. And I trusted that you
would be there. So it wastremendously helpful, which is why you know,
I ultimately lobbied for the Pause Act, which was passed in twenty twenty
one, expanding service dog access toveterans with postraatic stress. And I think
(10:22):
other than service dogs, veterans arejust screaming for different approaches to try to
mitigate not only symptoms of mental healthissues, but kind of, like I
said, the loss of identity,which is why you're seeing organizations that are
less you know, traditional better inservice organizations. We visited in Montana,
great example last year a nonprofit calledHeroes and Horses that is effectively a dude
(10:48):
ranch that brings veterans out for fortyone days and teaches them how to be
a cowboy if they if they wantto start a new life and a new
identity. Veterans are screaming for theseoptions. So I think, along with
service dogs, other approaches to thisare just going to continue to grow and
expand. And finally, for thosewho want to support the work that you're
(11:11):
doing at Mission Role Call, whatare the different ways they can help?
Yeah, I think first and foremost, if you go to Mission roll Calls
dot org, you can sign upfor texting email polls. You don't have
to be a veteran, but youknow we can pull veterans and veteran supporters
about issues that Congress is considering thatwould affect the veteran community. We're actually
(11:31):
testifying for the House that are FairSubcommittee on Help next week about community care.
Sign up for those text and emailpolls. But also, you know,
donate um if you can an recurringdonor. But I would say just
we put out newsletters. Just keepyourself in the note and do your best
to help veterans in your local community. US Marine Corps veteran and executive director
(11:54):
of Mission Role Call Cole Lyle.Again, you can learn more about the
work this great organization does at MissionRollcall dot org. Cole want to thank
you so much, obviously, foryour service to this country and for taking
a few minutes to come on theshow. We appreciate it. Yeah,
absolutely, thank you. Right,all right, I'm Ryan Gorman here on
iHeartRadio Communities. A new Gallup pollfound about six and ten Americans say they
(12:16):
know a lot or some about Juneteenth. That means many of us are still
learning about the history and importance ofJuneteenth. And to offer a comprehensive overview
of the holiday, I'm joined nowby Kelly Navies, Museum Specialist of Oral
History at the Smithsonian National Museum ofAfrican American History and Culture. Kelly,
(12:39):
thanks so much for coming on theshow. Now, before we get to
the events of June nineteenth that ledto this holiday, can you set the
stage for us and run through someof what happened leading up to that date.
So you're talking about the end ofthe Civil War. The Civil War
had officially ended it April of eighteensixty five. The Amancipation Proclamation was signed
(13:01):
in the middle of the Civil War, and it was really a wartime strategy,
and that was in January first,eighteen sixty three, and that only
had an impact on states in theConfederacy, so did not impacts you.
If you were in a state suchas Texas that had very little Union presence,
your life did not change if youwere an enslaved individual. And so
(13:22):
you're talking about the aftermath of theCivil War. The country and somewhat still
in the state of disarray. TheConfederacy has not fully accepted the authority of
the United States of America. Sothe Union troops are needed to enforce the
Emancipation Proclamation. And that is exactlythe setting for G ANDT. You know,
it can be kind of hard tocomprehend what it must have been like
(13:46):
to live in that time period.So connected these days we get so much
information in an instant but back then, obviously that wasn't the case. How
was worth spreading about what was happeningacross the country. Well, yeah,
so people think that they didn't knowabout it at all, and that's not
(14:09):
exactly true. There were networks amongstthe enslaved. When some people were some
of the enslaved had jobs, forexample, that took them on the road,
and whenever they did that, theywould pass messages. So it isn't
that they didn't necessarily know. Andas well as the slave owners, of
course, you had horses and trainsand such carrying information. Of course,
(14:33):
we didn't have the Internet, butthey were aware of what had happened with
the Emancipation Proclamation. It was justthat they had no intention of enforcing it.
And those African Americans who were stillthere and under those conditions, there
was something that they could do becausetheir lives would be threatened if they attempted
to assert their freedom. There weremany who ran away, of course,
(14:54):
but those were African Americans that werecloser to Union line and this specific day
tunes. How did this become thedate that now we celebrate as federal holiday.
So on June nineteenth, eighteen sixtyfive, General Gordon Granger arrives in
Galveston, Texas, was about twothousand Union troops and some of those troops
(15:16):
towards United States Colored troops, andthe troops were necessary to enforce the order
Orders number three, which basically confirmedthe Emancipation Proclamation and let them know that
they were no longer legally enslaved.And this he was enforced again by the
(15:37):
presence of these troops. Without thepresence of these troops, it would be
meaningless of General Gordon Granger had shownup by himself. They would have said
get out of here with that news, right, Bud. He had the
troops. And this actually went onin different cities throughout Texas as well.
The African Americans who were freed asa result of that announcement and the enforcement
(15:58):
of the Union in truth, theybegan to celebrate juenteenth the following year in
Houston in eighteen sixty six, andit's spread from there, and it's been
celebrated in Texas non stop since thatday. Senna State Holiday in Texas since
nineteen seventy nine, and some otherplaces as well, and with the Great
Migration, it started to spread.I grew up in California. We were
(16:21):
celebrating it there. The city ofBerkeley has been celebrating June tenth since thineteen
eighty six. So things were buildingto the point where now, of course,
we have this federal holiday and peoplearound the entire country are finally getting
to know what June tenth is andwhat it's about and why it's important to
celebrate. You kind of alluded tothis earlier, but I want to follow
up on this point in particular,and again I'm Ryan Gorman, joined by
(16:45):
Kelly Navies. Museum specialist of OralHistory at the Smithsonian National Museum of African
American History and Culture. So Juneteenthis directly linked to Texas, and I
want to go back to that timeperiod because there was so much happening following
the conclusion of the Civil War inso many different parts of the country.
Can you dive a little bit deeperinto why Texas is the focal point?
(17:10):
Yeah, Well, Texas was thefurthest west slaveholting state, and throughout the
Civil War had very little Union presence, and so in fact, slave owners
from other states such as Alabama,Mississippi, Georgia actually moved to Texas,
some slave owners so that they continuedto hold their enslaved people. It was
(17:33):
like a renegade state in some waysit still is, right, So you
really required the presence of these Uniontruths to enforce the Emancipation Proclamation. Now,
let's remind people that's the Emancipation Proclamation. Still wasn't the final document that
the end of slavery. That wasthe Thirteenth Amendment that was ratified later that
(17:56):
year December eighteen sixty five. Takinga look at that year, follow the
wing the arrival of General Granger andhis troops to Texas to announce that they
were going to enforce the Emancipation Proclamation. From that period of time to the
first anniversary of Juneteenth, the firstcommemoration of that day tell us about some
(18:19):
of the events that transpired in Texasand across the country. Well, of
course, they were supposed to theclause in the states that they have to
maintain our relationship as employer and higherlabor with their former slave owners. That
was an interesting clause. So theyhad to either stay in the area and
(18:41):
become officially employed or try to leavethe area. This is what we're talking
This is an air of reconstruction.It is a very very chaotic period in
American history. And of course therewere troops throughout the state, but Texas
being a very large state, itwas still quite dangerous if you were trying
(19:03):
to leave. And a lot ofAfrican Americans to day title leanings in that
period because many of them have beensold away as a domestic slave trade.
In the previous years leading up tothe Civil War, there was a huge
domestic slave trade that continued in Overa million African Americans were displaced from places
like Maryland and sent for deeper Southso people wanted to return to their families.
(19:26):
They wanted to bring their families together. So many people tried to leave,
a lot of people stayed. Thatthose that stayed banded together in communities
and raised money to buy land.And Houston, Reverend Jackie led his community
and they raised money and they boughtproperty in Houston and started a part Emancipation
(19:47):
Parts available to African Americans in Houston, and a similar developments throughout the nation
where people formed bought land. AfricanAmericans bought land and formed Emancipation Park so
that they could have spaces to sell. Great Team. I'm Ryan Gorman,
joined by Kelly Navy's Museum Specialist ofOral History at the Smithsonian National Museum of
African American History and Culture. Youcan find out more about all of their
(20:11):
work on Juneteenth at NMAAHC dot SIdot edu. That's NMAAHC dot SI dot
edu. So, as we getfurther and further removed from the original commemoration
(20:32):
of June Team, what were someof the other events that have taken place
some of the notable moments that ledup to more recently June Team eventually becoming
a federally recognized holiday. That's acomplicated question, but I can list some
of the milestones. I mean,a lot of things have happened. For
example, just with the celebration itselfevolved the first Juneteenth, you had actual
(21:00):
people still living who would prove recalledslavery, and those people would share and
give testimony to their experience. Theysang spirituals. Then the Black National Anthem,
which is now a feature of allGantee, that wasn't written until nineteen
hundred, right, so it wasn'tuntil after nineteen hundreds that becomes a part
of the holiday. And what yousee is as a culture evolved, as
(21:21):
African American culture evolved, the celebrationof Gantee's changes, and then of course
their different developments taking place to WorldWar two, the Great Migration, when
the African Americans have left the Souththousands by the thousands and took their celebrations
with them, not just any teams, but other aspects of the culture as
well. But Gerantins was one ofthe things that traveled. Particularly you see
(21:42):
a lot of Texans moving out westto California. Of course it's celebrated in
Oklahoma as well. Then the celebrationkind of wanes a little bit and becomes
up again during the Civil Rights movementin the nineteen sixty eight you have the
Poor People's Campaign where you have acted. This is all races coming to Washington,
DC to advocate for the rights ofthe poor. This is a campaign
(22:07):
started by doctor Martin US King inthe SCLC, but it involved many different
activists wore around the country and atthe end of that campaign they had a
Solidarity Day and it was on Junenineteenth, nineteen sixty eight, June tenth.
So many of these activists learned aboutgun tines for the first time.
And this is around the time,for example, that my father learned this
(22:29):
holiday and we started celebrating it inour family. They took it back to
their towns where they lived throughout thecountry and you see it research until Genny
tents at that time, and thenit settled down and again it was mainly
celebrated in Texas, around Oklahoma,parts of California where those people moved in.
There were pockets, but it wasn'tuntil the last few years when there
were many, many, many incidentsthat occurred that kind of made people realize
(22:53):
we need to look at our history, like why are we having these problems.
George Floyd, what's going on withthat? Uh? People started to
learn about the Tulsa massacre. Um, why why why are we having these
problems with race in this country?What brought us to this moment? So
people are looking back to Guneteenth andthe history of slavery because clearly we haven't
(23:15):
resolved a lot of the issues ofthat time period. Issues of citizenship and
democracy, for example, UM thatpeople were fighting for in reconstruction are still
big issues today. So Guneteenth placesum a light on those issues and gives
us an opportunity to meditate on howfar we've come, What does freedom mean,
what does it mean to be anAmerican? How do we all and
(23:41):
utilize the citizenship that we have asAmericans? So this is a time that
of Guneteenth gives us a space anda place to reflect on those things and
to celebrate how far we've actually come. And I think adisinally Americans are looking
for a way to come together likethis. This holiday started by African Americans.
(24:02):
But it's American history, right.The Civil War is American history.
The Amanciation proclamations the American history.General Gordon Granger was a white man Union
troops were both races, were allraces were all Americans are different races,
right, So this is something thatreflects all of our history and the continuing
struggle for freedom and the demand forcitizenship. As new people move into our
(24:26):
country, they can look back tojun teenth as a way to to see
where this journey began in the UnitedStates of America. I'm Ryan Gorman,
joined by Kelly Navies, Museum Specialistof Oral History at the Smithsonian National Museum
of African American History and Culture.We're talking about the history of Juneteenth within
(24:48):
African American communities across the country.How much has the importance of this Juneteenth
date, what took place so manyyears ago on June nineteenth, How much
has that grown, especially as Juneteam has become the focal point of this
push to make it a federally recognizeholiday. Well, it's grown tremendously,
(25:11):
not just for African Americans, butfor all Americans in the past few years.
I mean that's someone who has beencelebrating it in my family. Each
year, new people come, sowe saw it grow with each year.
Each year we would invite any andeverybody around and people would show up and
whenever they would come to our gentteems. They would always come to next
year. They would like, thisis fantastic. They loved the presentation,
(25:34):
the cultural presentation with children would perform, and the poetry and the music,
and of course the delicious foods,and people would say, I love this.
I mean, this is like sucha good mix of the generations and
learning about history and celebrating our eldersbut also looking towards the future and nurturing
the children. And it would justgrow with each year. But now,
(25:55):
of course, as it became afederal holiday, one of the best pieces
of news that we've had in ita difficult last two to three years,
more and more people are learning aboutit, and I believe that it will
continue to grow. You mentioned acouple of things that many in this country
are still learning more and more about, Juneteenth being one of them. Also,
the Tulsa Race massacre was something youmentioned. Was there anything else looking
(26:18):
back at that time period from theend of the Civil War Juneteenth, that
June nineteenth date through you the nextcouple of decades that really stands out to
you that you think is notable andis worth discussing further. Like we have
begun to do with Juneteenth, theend of slavery, with things like the
(26:44):
Tulsa Race massacre. Well, itwas reconstruction is a rich, rich,
rich period. I mean, thisis when you see through the roots of
public education in the United States ofAmerica. People don't understand it. There's
a newly freed to African Americans orsome of the first to push for the
education for public education because of coursethat was one of the on the top
(27:04):
things in their list, and theyhad been unable to go to school while
they were enslaved, and one ofthe first things that they were able to
do is to get out and learnhow to read and write and to have
their children have access to in education. So that's a huge issue and we
see that right now. Education isstill a huge issue, the state of
public education and what is taught rightin the schools. Voting rights, that
(27:27):
was another big issue. Black menearned the right to vote with the fourteenth
Amendment and the fifteenth Amendment rather thanthose thirteen fourteen to fifteen Amendment. For
those reconstruction amendments. Women of coursedid not have the vote as any race
at that time, but black menstarted to exercise the right to vote.
But even as they were exercising theright to vote, they did that there's
(27:51):
a set of violence. Many werekilled trying to exercise the right to vote
then, and of course linconstruction,there was a back class to Reconstruction,
starting in eighteen seventy seven when theUnion troops were removed from the South and
continuing up to the passes of Plusyversus Ferguson in eighteen ninety six for Separate
(28:12):
but Equal Law, and then yousee voting rights almost completely taken away from
African Americans throughout the South until whatwe know of as a modern civil rights
list right sixty years later. Soall of this is going on in the
Reconstruction era. Education, the earlybusiness, voting rights, even the beginnings
(28:33):
of women's rights movements of course whitewomen, but Black women as well were
starting the beginnings become of their ownconventions and struggle for civil rights as well.
You see the roots of that duringthe era of Reconstruction. So it's
a it's a very rich period andit wasn't a spirity period as well,
I mean violent. You know,people African Americans who were once chattel right,
(28:56):
they had values. At the endof the Civil war, they no
longer had value, so their livesweren't worth much, and many of them
were kill trying to assertas their rightsand two basic things like own property,
learn how to reason right. KellyNavies Museum Specialist of Oral History at the
(29:18):
Smithsonian National Museum of African American Historyand Culture. You can learn more at
NMAAHC dot SI dot edu. Kelly, we really appreciate the time. Thank
you so much for coming on andtalking to us about the history of this
juneteent holiday. Oh it's been mypleasure and I'm actually just getting started,
but thank you, all right,and that's going to do it for this
(29:40):
edition of Ihear Radio Communities. I'myour host, Ryan Gorman. We'll talk
to you again real soon.
Host
Manny Munoz
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