Lazy Booking Powered by A2DRadio EP:17 WWE WRESTLEPALOOZA REVIEW

Brock Lesnar squashing John Cena at Wrestlepalooza was the wrong booking decision by WWE: #AGREE or DISAGREE?
WWE Wrestlepalooza Review
Styles/Cena & Rhodes/Rollins at Crown Jewel
PWI 500 Released

The ESPN Era of WWE kicked off this past weekend with Wrestlepalooza, and the show has been met with mixed reviews. WWE’s decision for Brock Lesnar to squash John Cena has been very controversial. We debate if this was a bad booking decision by WWE, as well as AJ Lee’s in-ring return, Stephanie McMahon’s 2026 HOF announcement, Stephanie Vaquer’s world title win, and more.
We also discuss the 2 featured matchups at the upcoming WWE Crown Jewel, where we will see AJ Styles challenge John Cena and Seth Rollins take on Cody Rhodes.
Also, PWI released its Top 500 list for 2026. Who cracked the Top 10 and who was snubbed?

S/P: Specialized Physical Therapy | specializedphysicaltherapy.com
 

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Everybody's got a price for the million dollar man. Oh
who's that kid?

Speaker 2 (00:09):
Nick uh? He looks like Beaker from Muppets The One
on one Nick Right.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Yeah, Yeah, I got something I.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Did not even I love I love that.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
If I get five limit and they're all in the
same room with me, we're going at it at one
hundred and tenth.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
Per what's going on? Everybody? Lazy Booking Podcast back on
its regularly schedule night in Time, coming at you for
a niche Night. We're here first Flyers Talk A two

(00:51):
D comes at you later tonight. We're here to kick
off Niche Night as usual. I'm your host Chrome, joined
by my co host Archer. What's up, brother?

Speaker 1 (01:02):
What's happening?

Speaker 2 (01:03):
Chrome?

Speaker 1 (01:03):
Ready to talk some paloza?

Speaker 2 (01:07):
Oh yeah, I mean a lot to talk about. We're
coming off of I would say very eventful wrestler Palooza
to say the least. We're going to crack into that momentarily,
the first and foremost pasting bills and show some love
to our doctor. Doctor Paul Idell Specialized physical Therapy Physical
locations in Burlington and Cherryo on New Jersey. You can
find him on the web. It's specialized physical Therapy dot

(01:29):
com and he aches pains. Brand new or any long
standing physical ailments that you have, please contact his award
winning team will set you up, take a look at
you and get you on a program to get your
back film better than ever. Hey, brother, lots to talk about.
We have been debating this, so we were going to

(01:50):
do one opening topic and we decided to change it.
And uh, before we dive into I want to welcome
in our viewers. Anybody out or Facebook, YouTube, Twitter x,
whatever you call it, please come in, Come on in,
drop in, like our buddy Rob Povey here, Hey Rob,
say hello, drop your comments in, and uh, while you're

(02:12):
at it, give us a share, give us a like,
give us a follow. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:15):
This should be this should be fun. This should be
a good show. I think it's gonna be very collaborative
as well. I think the viewers, you know, hopefully we
see uh see some new faces and get some uh,
get some feedback because I think there's a lot of
a lot of different opinions about what we saw over
the weekend.

Speaker 2 (02:33):
Yeah. Yeah, well let's let's just let's dive in. Man,
let's get head first into it. Our opening topic brought
to you by Specialized Physicotherapy dot Com comes to us
uh and listen, we've been debating we were gonna do
uh did the show fall short? Was it a success?
But ultimately, I think from us debriefing and getting together

(02:54):
to try and come up with a show criteria, this
question seemed to be a very We're on two opposite
ends of this, so I'd say when we're agree to
disagree radio A two D, it's best to lean into it.
So let's have this conversation. Rock Lesner squashing John Cena

(03:15):
was the wrong booking decision by wwee agree or disagree
again wherever you're at, Facebook, YouTube, x comment and we
want to know your opinion on this topic. We're also
going to talk about the two primary matches already announced
for Crown Jewel, as well as another kind of I
would say controversial list is the PWI five hundred of

(03:38):
twenty twenty six release today, and I do not agree
with the top ten. There's there's a number of things
on there I don't agree with, So we'll dive into
that towards the end of the show. But let's get
into their app sorry, Crown Jewel, Let's get into wrestle
Palooza and Eric, I'm gonna let you take this one off. Buddy,
agreed to disagree that this was the wrong book decision

(04:00):
by w W.

Speaker 1 (04:01):
As of today, September twenty third, twenty twenty five. This
is a very mind boggling booking decision on my in
my view.

Speaker 2 (04:13):
Now, as of today, I stand on business. If you're in,
you're in.

Speaker 1 (04:20):
I'm gonna go all in. I'm gonna put the cards,
I'm want to put the chips out there, and I'm
going to agree that this was this booking decision is wrong.
And it goes back to this whole John Cena run. Right.
He announced he was done as of December this year,

(04:41):
and we got some really interesting moments throughout this run
where you know he he was the runner up in
the Royal Rumble. He goes and says, I'm gonna I'm
gonna go ahead and announce it. I'm gonna be in
the elimination chamber because I feel like I just there
to be in the elimination chamber. And he wins the

(05:03):
elimination chamber for Cody Rhodes, his opponent at WrestleMania, to
come out, and we're thinking that Cody Rhoads is possibly
going to sell his soul to the Rock and we
find out that he told him to go somewhere, and
John Cena goes in, kicks him in the uh in

(05:24):
the Mommy Daddy button, and there goes uh there, here
goes the John Cena heel run that everybody's been waiting
for for for about ten years. I would say, let
me tell you, from that point on, it's been very,
very convoluted and very confusing, and I wouldn't say that

(05:48):
that's John Cena's fault. I don't think we're ever gonna
know what happened as far as the Rocks involvement at
WrestleMania is concerned. Bottom line was it. It fell flat.
The the heel turn fell flat, very below expectations, and
I think WWEE as a whole missed missed out on

(06:10):
the opportunity to really dig into that heel run. And
Sena didn't really change a whole lot in his in
his persona, he kind of backed down on the fans
and did all that, but at the end of the day,
he was kind of the same guy. He didn't change.
The only thing he changed was his entrance, really and
the fans decided to decided to cling on to him.

(06:33):
We got him turning face right before SummerSlam, and we
got the best match of this run at SummerSlam. I
think we can both agree with that. Now, the following
months we got Logan Paul, which was also as we discussed,
thought it was a it was a good match. Thought
Logan was the right guy. It was a new up

(06:53):
and coming star that he sprinkled a little scene of
dust on. He didn't. Sena won the match, but Logan
looked really strong. Now back backwards the SummerSlam, we see
the return of Brock Lesner and we're thinking, all right,
you know we're gonna have this Brock Lesnar John Cena
match during this run, which you know, we kind of debated,

(07:14):
you know, it's it's a it's gonna be a We
both agreed that it was going to be a marquee match.
It was going to be a match that people are
going to see whether you like Brock personally, you agree
with him, you know, gree or disagree with you know,
how he lives his life and the decisions that he's made.
That that's besides that, you kind of that match was

(07:37):
going to be something that people wanted to see. They
put that as part of this Russell Palooza, the first
event on ESPN, and what do they do now? Sina
got a couple of licks in, but I would say
this wasn't a complete squash, but it was a I
would say a domination of brock Lesnar on John Cena.

(08:01):
We talked about this a few months ago when they
were fiddling with you know, this whole face Heel run
and how how good it was, and we said that
we didn't want to see him losing all these matches.
And he goes out and loses this match to brock
Lesner unless there's something future plans that we don't know about,

(08:21):
is there gonna be a return match? I feel like
this booking decision right now is just has just got
a lot of questions that haven't been answered yet, and
right now I don't feel like it was the right
decision to be made, especially now you come out of
this no mention of the match at all, and now

(08:41):
he's out challenging aj styles on X So to me,
it's like, what are we doing here? What are we doing?
Is there gonna be a return match? Is he gonna
just don't know? What's going on, and I and I
wouldn't say this is John Cena's fault at all because
clear I think it's clear as they he's not making

(09:03):
it making the choices here. I think this is all
Hunter and making these booking decisions, and I think they
have bigger plans for brock Lesner, but unfortunately it comes
at the it comes at the behest of this John
Cena run, and I think this makes this run even
more convoluted and confusing than what it was before.

Speaker 2 (09:24):
Yeah, I couldn't disagree with you more. Okay, first and foremost,
I'm gonna go I'm gonna I guess I'm gonna start
backwards because the last couple of comments you made there
we watched ww unreal. We hear them talk about John Cena. Okay,
John may not be the creative drive behind anything, but

(09:45):
nothing goes by without John Cena clearing it. He's got
that kind of swagger and pull with his company. He's
like a quarterback when they're going out and making an acquisition.
When you're a franchise quarterback like Aaron Rodgers and his
prime Tom Brady, the organization goes to them to make sure, Hey,
before we pull the trigger on this. Are you good

(10:05):
with this? They have say in the room, they have
a seat at the table. So there's no way, shape
or form that John Cena is not at the least
on board with everything. Okay, that's first and foremost. Secondly,
I think we're overthinking him a little bit. I agree.
We did have a conversation. But here's the thing. It's

(10:29):
not that John Cena can't lose. We said we don't
want to see him lose, and part of the reason
is because of previous booking. To be fair, because we
watched him lose to Theory one hundred times. We watched
them lose to get squashed by basically by Solo Socoa.
I mean, we watched him do the job and do

(10:50):
the honors and do the duties for a couple of years.
So it did make this final run feel like an estaticic.
It wasn't nostalgia where we wanted to see him come
out and do the Jimmy Dugan that we talked about
and tip his little cap and you know, scratches nuts
to get his paycheck. We wanted to see him. We

(11:10):
wanted if we're gonna do this run, we want a
John Cena run. So I'm not debating you on the
success or not of of the heel turn. Something something
was weird about that. There's wires crossed that. As you said,

(11:33):
there may be a time or a place or a
day where somebody sits down and gives an interview, where
somebody writes a book on what actually went down behind
the scenes. I don't think we're gonna learn it anytime soon.
I don't think we're going to get a a makeup
out of this. It is what it is. And they
pulled the trigger, they busted the glass in case of emergency,

(11:56):
and they went back. So honestly the john Cena that
we hoped we would get at the end and in
fairness to them, whether the Heel Run went as long
as we thought it would or it went the way
that we thought it would, And we talked about this
from jump Eric, I felt that the heel Run was
going to be done right after Summer SNT. So you

(12:19):
know that's essentially what happened. So I got the timeframe.
I thought, I'm getting the timeframe of the John Sena
that I want to see a so loyalty and respect
them and everything else that comes with it. Now you
know we had we I mean, we we went up
and down all kinds of things here, right, we felt
them undertaker streak and did Rock need to be the

(12:39):
guy who broke that streak? To me, John Cena doesn't
get hurt by this, Okay, I don't think this is
the end of it now, whether he's the final opponent
at Saturday Night's main event, you know, we've heard him,
we've heard Gunther, we've heard a couple of different names.
Turn out, maybe that's the ultimate destination, which I think
if that ends up being in the case, you'll be

(13:01):
satisfied with that. And I and I know you we
discussed that.

Speaker 1 (13:06):
Yeah, it's it's just kind of I think, and we
said last week we kind of thought that Lesner was
going to dominate this match. It was clear that was
kind of the the makeup of this match, where Brock
was just was getting his licks in and and Seena
hadn't got any offense on him and clear you out

(13:29):
during this uh during this few since uh after SummerSlam
or right after that SummerSlam match, So it was kind
of clear that that was probably going to be the
kind of the the makeup of the match was going
to be that Lesner would dominate. And I think if
seen a point out a win and then Lesner getting

(13:51):
his licks in after would have probably done the same
thing if as far as continuing whatever that whatever they
play on doing, keeping Lesner, you know, uh strong and
getting seen it at win. Now if the payoff is
indeed going to be you know, I know, you think

(14:11):
maybe maybe war Games and that could be it. Absolutely,
I can absolutely see that. You see that with you know,
Lesner now aligning himself back with Paul Hayman, so that
kind of you know, painting that you know, put it
connecting the dots where that could be one team at
war Games and on the other side could be seen
with a with a group of baby faces. So that

(14:32):
could be it. That could There are a couple more
appearances left, but I I just feel like for this
run and and I think it points to the fact
that Brock Lesner is probably going to be in the conversation,
if not in the main event at WrestleMania, because if

(14:53):
they're having him dominate Seena like this, it kind of
points out kind of what they did at wrestle A
thirty where he ended the Undertaker streak and he went
on to Summer Slam and he became the world champion.
So that kind of picture, I can see that happening again,
where Brock is this almighty nobody's touching him, nobody's beating him,

(15:17):
and he's going straight in you know, to the road,
you know, down down the road into uh, you know,
the road to WrestleMania.

Speaker 2 (15:24):
Right. But that gets that gets to where I was
going with this, right, So then we continue to move
on with this here, right, So Brock hasn't been seen
for a while, and this is something else that we
I don't think we were on the same page with
maybe we just so my point I'm making with this right,
I made this statement to you all fair that it

(15:46):
is very clear that WWE utilized Russell Pouluza as a
show to showcase the characters and the town. Right. So
you saw what they did with thes and the opening
and the presentation, right and getting the crowd involved and
showing their personalities. So Rock Lesner is a guy who's

(16:11):
an ass kicker, and he's a dominant force. He's a
legitimate fighter, a legitimate badass. He's a probably mostly world champion.
And it was clear when you look at the beginning
of that show, and Hunter gives us opening statement as
almost his mission statement. It's very clear that this whole

(16:32):
thing was a way they were looking at it to
present their talent and the characters that they have to
try to bring in others. Now, whether or not it
worked was I think where we were kind of maybe
just crossing wires on what the conversation was about, because

(16:56):
I was saying to you, I'm not saying that that worked,
but to say that that wasn't the idea. So which
is why I understand why the match win is it did.
I am one hundred percent certain that John Cena is
not just going to go out in his back and
we're not going to hear anything about CNN unless again, now,
whether it's war Games or whether it's Saturday Night's main event,
I don't know. Find being one hundred percent honest with you,

(17:17):
the way it's looking to me, and you mentioned aj
styles and the randomness, and we're gonna get down to
that in a minute a few minutes. But the way
this is looking to me is this was booked out
John CNN as a heel, right, and but we got
his greatest hits, but we got him in a way

(17:37):
that was different because John Cena worked with other than
a j everybody else is a heel. I'm seeing this
now as we've gotten that. Now they're utilizing this to
set up war Games where you're gonna get Brock with
the vision and then I think somebody else could be

(17:58):
added to the team to where you end up seeing
something along the lines up. If Cody is not in
this match, then it stays at four. Otherwise I think
you get sena Orton, Cody AJ Punk Punk certainly to

(18:19):
where they're going to give you almost a John sena
All Star tribute match without calling it that through War Games,
as well as featuring two of their hottest young talents
in Bron and Bronson with I mean a Schmorgesborg of talent, right.

(18:40):
So I know we say, oh, we hate when they
do things to advance, but by the end of the
at the end of the day, their advancements when hindsight
end up being like, Okay, that did work because of this.
So I'm not going to react to wrestll Palooza and
that result. I think like SCENEA can take a squash

(19:03):
from Rock the reality is it is because then there
is a real realistic aspect of John Cena is forty
something years old and rock Lesnar is still a badass.
So the reality is a big man like that probably
could kick his ass pretty hard like that. He's a legitimate,
trained fighter, right, so we talk about legitimacy and everything
and this and that. I thought it came off very real,

(19:25):
and you have to represent your guy even if it
is the same presentation, like over two years. There are
casual fans and people who haven't watched rock Lesnar. They
might be young kids, so you build them up as
a monster heel to be like the big scary heel

(19:45):
kind of like we had Earthquake when we were a kid,
you know what I mean. Or with Andre, you know,
I'm not saying he's Andre obviously, but just saying he's
a big, physically imposing human being. He's the villain for
the hero to overcome. So yeah, the endgame might be
Saturday Nights made event like for the one on one aspect,

(20:07):
but this is the story advancement to get us to
get to where we're going. And if it's Wargames, depending
on how that goes, and then if it is Saturday's
main event, we're gonna look back at this, and it's
gonna be a completely different conversation on how this was
booked to what the result is. But I'm okay with it.
It doesn't hurt, it doesn't bother me, it doesn't bug me.

(20:28):
I mean, you're probably right, and I think the original
plan probably was gone there. But it does seem like
they're leaning towards brock because they are really leaning in
even on raw about how Sena has only defeated Rock,
I think what once or twice twice? Even so they're
leaning in on how many Rock has beaten him compared

(20:49):
to how many times he's beaten Rock, to where I
think he becomes almost Hogan's Andre of the unbeatable force,
this guy who has been a physical menace to John
Cena's whole career, He's been his kryptonite, and he goes
out it. And and if you want to put Sena over,
because we always talk about most guys go out on

(21:11):
their back. If you want Seena to go over, who
can take a loss to John Cena, it's brock Lesnon
And it doesn't hurt them going forward because brock lesnar
got the monster win beforehand to go into it. So
I think it benefits both characters. So I'm looking at
this in a totally different perspective when I say I

(21:33):
think this was the right decision. We didn't think it
was going that we thought seen it. I thought this
match was going to go as it did, but I
thought Sena would somehow find a way to overcome and
he did it. But with what I believe in the
seeds that are dropped, Rek, I believe this is where
we're headed.

Speaker 1 (21:53):
If those seeds are planted correctly and you're watering those
plants every day, then I can see that happening, and
I can, I can, I can buy into that. I
just don't know if they're thinking the same thing, and
I hope they. I hope they are. I just that match,

(22:14):
and it's like, I totally get where you're you're coming
from as far as what the why. I just think
that it's just kind of one of those things where
his dates are very limited, right, so you want to
capitalize on every single opportunity you have with him, and

(22:37):
and it kind of goes back to that AJ styles
thing that we're going to get to in a minute,
where there's really no build there really doesn't need the Yeah,
thank you're really there. Doesn't need to be a build
for aj styles. All people have been asking for it
for a while. So so I like the strategy of
utilizing social media. Hey, I don't have any between now

(23:00):
and Crown Jewel, So what am I gonna do? I'm
gonna post it on social media and get viral and
get two million people to look at it. That was great.
I just don't want that to be the end for
brack Lesler and John Cena. I think that's where if
if the plan is war Games or Saturday's Made Event,

(23:23):
it makes sense.

Speaker 2 (23:24):
I just went back and I rewatched WrestleMania forty Behind
the Curtain, WrestleMania XL Behind the Curtain, and just rewatching
how that whole thing went down with you know, going
out there and let's test the waters with Rock going
out and making that statement, you know, should I sit

(23:44):
at the head of the table and whatnot. And it
feels like Lesson learned this Cenus seed that was dropped
on his Twitter X was let's put it out there.
I mentioned it in the promo and it got a
little bit of juice. Now let's put it out there,

(24:06):
and I think it caught such a wildfire that immediately
they were like, there it.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
Is, Yeah, and it worked. You press though, you've got
your matchup Crown Jewel.

Speaker 2 (24:18):
With John and John doesn't need to be present for
AJ because they can. Their video packages, by the way,
are so unbelievable, right, They could make, you know, Maxine
versus Piper Niven look like a WrestleMania main event with
the way they run a package, right.

Speaker 1 (24:37):
Yeah, So.

Speaker 2 (24:40):
They could literally do almost similar to what they did
with Brockensina and go through the history of these guys
and week by week show a little bit like you know,
one last time however they were I would promote it
that way. Two of the greatest wrestlers of all time
of their generations, one last time, rivals, rivalry renewed, however

(25:03):
you want to do.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:06):
And the fact that this was John Cena's last great
feud because he's shortly after this kind of scaled back
and started going part time, that he would be away
for a year, it just gives a lot. There's a
lot of juice to squeeze out of this to where
they really don't need And that's the other point, right Eric,

(25:29):
At this point, I know, we want like things to
be booked a certain way, but because John Cena has
four or five dates left, whatever it is, you have
to be creative with the end of this. You have
to be able to promote this without him being there.
And AJ styles versus John Cena does not need John
Cena to be there. It doesn't even need a reason

(25:51):
to happen. It's the nick loves AWR Buddy Neck. This
is literally the We're giving you this because this is
a great wrestling match between two guys that are two
of the biggest names in the world. That's it. That's
all we need.

Speaker 1 (26:09):
Yep. And I think a lot of the audience to
WWE probably may not have even seen this feud and
hopefully and I would think ww vault has done such
an amazing job. I wouldn't be surprised if their matches
on there now, if not during this during this next

(26:30):
few weeks. But like you said, those video packages with
Brock and Sena were really well done, and I would
expect them to do the same thing. And I'm sure
AJ is gonna come out and cut a promo gonna
beat him John Cena. I can't wait. That's gonna be
It's gonna be great. And the Australian crowd is gonna

(26:51):
be jacked and they're gonna do that a J. J.
Styles and then the scene, like the crowd itself is
gonna be It's gonna be electric for that match, and
I can't wait to see it. It's gonna be great.

Speaker 2 (27:04):
And listen early early prediction, I guess, but I don't.
I think Brock shows up. I don't know that he
necessarily interferes, but I think this becomes a clean match
because I think that's what people want and I think
they know that, and then it becomes one of those
like handshake hugs at the end, feel good moment broken

(27:28):
up by Brock, and that can set up the AJA,
the justification of AJ being on John Cena's War Games.

Speaker 1 (27:36):
That's a possibility. Another another thing, and I don't know
if you saw it in our chat earlier where I
had a kind of that same where Brock would show up,
you give him some extra money to make that flight
out to out the Perth, and you cost AJ Styles
that win and you get John Seen and JOHNSENA wins

(27:56):
that match only because Brock didn't get the job on
retiring him. I think that was kind of the message
that Brock put out there for for Russell Palooza. I'm
here to put a dent in this retirement to if
anybody's gonna do it, it's gonna be Brock Lesner. And
the fact that Aj Styles is now going to be
a threat to it. It's a possibility maybe that Brock

(28:19):
sees at and gives them an F five, and that's
another way to get Aj Styles on that on that
War Games team. Do I think that happens. Probably not.
I think I think your your theory probably makes a
little more sense. But there's definitely options there, and I
think it's gonna be intriguing as far as and I

(28:40):
hope we get a clean match like that. That's that's
one thing that I really hope happens. I don't want
to see no interference or anything like that. I'd I'd
like to see a clear winner, but Sena's got to
win the match. Come on, man, Aj loses to everybody anymore. Unfortunately,
it's it's one of those things where it's like you're

(29:01):
so good at your craft that you get to a
point where a lot of these guys are are there
unfortunately to put younger guys over, and you know, he's
kind of been put in that position more times than
he should have over the last i'd say several years.
But he's still a guy that's super popular. Crowd loves him.

(29:23):
Every time he comes out, they're chanting his name. He's
still a draw and he's going to put out a performance.
And if this is his contract's coming up, so he
what better way to go out if this run? Is
it for AJ as well? For him to have this
match and then possibly war games? I mean, what better

(29:45):
way would you want to go out? Then ye do
it with the greatest of all time?

Speaker 2 (29:49):
Yeah? Absolutely, And yeah I agree we need a clean
match out of this. It would be unfortunate if if
they were to do some sort of I really don't
believe that's what we're going to get here. But in fairness,
you bring up a great point because AJ does lose
a lot. We had this whole conversation last week about
Drew and does that hurt him. I think the AJ's

(30:10):
in a different point in his career as you mentioned,
and Aj it is a wind out, whether that means
wind down of career. Maybe he leaves and goes to
AW for a year or two to get a couple
of those dream matches under his belt. He says, I
could just go there and just wrestle some guys, get
you know, knock a few guys off the bucket list
or the wish list, and then call it a day.

(30:32):
But it is this is again one of Johnsena's greatest rivalries.
This is aj Styles, who in and of his own right,
had an amazing story to get to this point in
his career. How hard he had to work as a
very underestimated undervalue for many years people said the greatest
wrestler in the world, and nobody talks about it because
he's in CNA.

Speaker 1 (30:49):
WW didn't want him because he was too small.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
Right, So what like, what a what A? What a
real full circle opportunity for both guys. And again, you know,
I think that that this will get us to war game.
So speaking of Crown Jewel, you know you wanted to
talk about Cody and Seth Rollins. This is another feud.
So it seems like, you know, we have conversations and

(31:15):
again we have other people who were in these conversations
when we talk about well, it's it's always the same people.
I think the biggest culprit of that is it's Seth.
Every feud he has goes years. It's Roman, it's punk,

(31:38):
you know. I know they had that little break in
between where he went face and helped Cody last year
for the better part of you know, two years before then,
you know those two were feuding. So anyway, I know
you wanted to get to go through this match. So
what are your thoughts on? Obviously, we're getting Crown Jewel back,

(32:00):
we are having the ring back where there is a favorite,
there's going to be two champions. Uh, you know, the
two champions face each other. But I believe these are
the only two matches announced for Crown Jewel at this point. Obviously,
Stephanie Vackera is waiting for her challenger, although she's also
got to face either Naya or Jay Cargill after they

(32:22):
have their Number one Contenders match. But what are your
thoughts on a rivalry renewed? I did like the promo
on Wrong by the.

Speaker 1 (32:31):
Man, Yes, very very very good, excellent.

Speaker 2 (32:35):
So what are your thoughts on, uh, you know, yet
another chapter in the Cody set story.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
Yeah, I'm I'm really excited for this match. Now, to
your point, we've seen this match a few I think
they said three times I thought it was two. I guess, yeah,
it's it's been three matches, and I know Cody is
has one. All three. We had Mania, had Mania, you
had Helena South and apparently there was one more somewhere

(33:03):
that they they're putting that in their promo, but we
might have to look that up. But either way, Cody's
got the edge on Seth right now. And I love
how they brought that up. And I love that they
didn't They didn't make what happened at WrestleMania forty like

(33:23):
they brought it up, which was nice. They didn't insult
anybody's intelligence, which wrestling can get away with insulting intelligence.
Insulting people's intelligence from time to time. You know who's
helped who and who betrayed who, and things like that.
So I liked that they brought that up. That Seth
was a big part of why Cody finished his story

(33:44):
at WrestleMania forty. The one thing that you and I
always have a discussion about and a slight disagreement is
the value of the World Heavyweight Championship.

Speaker 2 (34:00):
Real Quick Backlash twenty twenty two, they had a trilogy
of match.

Speaker 1 (34:04):
Ah, there you go, There you Go, and all three
were good. I specifically held in a cell with with
the torn peck and that's wild still I still like
every time I see it. But anyway, so yeah, seriously, now,
the World Heavyweight Championship, we know, it's not the it's

(34:26):
not as big as the WWE title. It's never going
to be. I think you go back twenty some years,
they've tried to have secondary you know, or equal titles.
They've had, you know, the big Gold comeback they had,
they brought in the Universal title to try to you know,
have something on the other brand. And now you know,

(34:49):
over the last few years they've had they've brought the
World Heavyweight title over, which has only been held by
a handful of people. But I think the people that
have held it, you know, Seth has had it twice,
Gunther has has done a nice job with it, Jay Us,
They've done a nice job with it. But at the
end of the day, the WWE undisputed Championship, to tell

(35:13):
by Cody Rhodes is the flagship championship, right, So I
think this is a great opportunity and it looks like,
you know, they're leaning into it as far as you know,
Cody's got three wins over Seth. Seth gets a win here,
it not only gets him a win over Cody, but also,

(35:33):
even though the title's not on the line, the World
Heavyweight Champion gets a victory over the WWA champion, which
can only help that title. And I'm hoping that that's
the direction they're going in because I think it The
championships get criticism a lot of times with you know,
how long these reigns have been in recent memory, and

(35:57):
I think for good reason that they do that is
because they want these titles to really mean something and
they and they're one there needs to be there just
needs to be more lineage to them. So I think
these longer ragns are good in the in the long term.
Sometimes in the short term it's a little tough because

(36:18):
you know, it's kind of predictable that people aren't winning
the title, and I think, you know, that kind of
goes to Drew and uh Drew and Cody at Russell Palooza,
but you know, kind of the predictability of like, I
don't think this guy's losing the title anytime soon. But
I think this is a golden opportunity for them to
put some good quality, you know, establishment on this on

(36:43):
the world heavyweight title with it, with this match, and
doesn't have to win clean, but a win's a win,
and he can go out and brag, hey, the world
heavyweight champion. Yeah, this is the mean, and then he
can he can sell it because he's he's Seth fricking
for a reason. He's he he knows how to do
it and knows how to get under people's skin. And

(37:06):
he'll he'll make it. He'll he'll be talking about that
for months that he beat the world. I'm the real champion.
I mean, it's it's it's right there for them for
the taking. So hopefully you take advantage of it.

Speaker 2 (37:17):
Oh yeah. I mean you know when you when you
bought this topic up, you thought we were gonna have
varying or differing opinions. I couldn't agree with you more.
I think you have to have Seth Rollins win this
match for every reason that you gave. Because Cody has
had his day in this feud. And that's not to
say that he won't going forward, but the opportunity to

(37:43):
get continue sets moment. Like I do think Cody's Cody's
the number one guy. Yeah, he is what he is
and and we'll get into p w I five hundred.
The spoiler alert, Coty's number one, right. The opportunity to
advance this title and its meaning and its stature within

(38:09):
professional wrestling is massive. And I said it from day
one and I'll say it again. I said this to
everybody that we know. I said it on other AH
West shows. Death Rollins was the perfect guy to start
with this title, and every time he has held the

(38:31):
World Heavyweight Title, it has felt important. And I think
that that's important. It's a key factor to point out
here that Seth, there are other people that held this
title where you felt like it was modest. It was
a true secondary title along the lines of a US
title or an intercontinental title. And Seth Rollins holds this

(38:52):
title and it's happened every time he has it feels
on the same level as the WWE Championship. So for
him to go and get a win over Cody Rhodes,
and similar to what MJF does, walk around with that ring,
wear it to the ring, flawn it to the camera,
bring it up in every promo. It's priceless. It just

(39:16):
opens up a whole bunch of possibilities. So I'm with
you on this, brother, you get no pushback For me.

Speaker 1 (39:24):
I think that. I think the difference was kind of
the secondary, you know, feeling like the world title secondary,
like it should throw a light on for myself. God,
it shouldn't feel secondary. And I think you're right. The guy,
the guy for that title, the person holding it makes

(39:45):
that title versus sometimes you know, the title makes the person.
I think in this instance, the person is making the title,
and he makes it more valuable the longer he has it,
and whoever winds up taking it from him, the title
will mean will mean as much as it does because

(40:08):
of Seth.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
Rollins got our boy ruin here. I think it's pretty
clear they're going to milk Seth Punk title until WrestleMania.
Like one, I was hoping Punk would get the big
WrestleMania match with Cody for the restuming or for w
shrapp by kids. That happening now, No, I think again.

(40:30):
Maybe I'm in the minority of this. We know others
that disagree, but I have felt you know that that
circumstances changed last year and they weren't able to go
to here. I just feel that this is something that
they can they can push it out. To Mania, and
I don't think it hurts it at all. Certain people

(40:52):
are tired of it, so be it. Those same people
tell us that they want to see other people wrestle
a million times, so you know, it's it's uh, it's
it's a matter of convenience, for.

Speaker 1 (41:09):
Better or for worse. Right now, there's really nobody else
that's really set up to take that spot, to be
that number one contender. And except for Punk. I mean,
if you look at if you look at Raw right now,
Jay Uso, l A. Knight, you got Jimmy involved, and
you got the vision. They're kind of doing their thing

(41:32):
while Seth is doing now he's doing his thing with Cody,
and then after that it's probably gonna go to War Games.
So you've already you're already in November there, and then
you've got December, January, you got Royal Rumble. So you're
either doing that at Royal Rumble or you're or you're
pushing it to WrestleMania. So I mean, chances are you're

(41:52):
probably I mean, and that's a that's a that's a
bona fide WrestleMania main event. I don't see anything else
right now on the horizon that would top that, So
chances are that's probably what we're getting. And to your point,
it's like, yeah, right, Like there is some impatience with

(42:13):
you know, the internet wrestling community. I get impatience sometimes too.
It's it's kind of one of those things like you
look back twenty thirty years ago, this thing would have
milked out for two three years and maybe you got
a payoff at the end. Like it's I think things
have kind of changed, but they stayed the same. Where

(42:35):
if you build something and you continue to put layers
in it, you're going to see it come to a
bigger payout and a bigger payoff at the at the end.
And I think that's what you're going to see here.
Like Punk got robbed, he got cashed in on, so
now this is his redemption story where now he's brought
his wife involved and now they're going to go into

(42:58):
war games. So I think it's going slow, but it's methodical,
it's strategic. It's kind of like the opposite of what
I was just saying with Sin where it feels like
I don't know what's going on, but I feel like
you can see what's going on with with Punk and
Seth so we shall see sir.

Speaker 2 (43:18):
Yeah, no, I agree. Yeah, it's gonna be interesting to
see how it goes. I do want to We're just
real quick. There's two couple two points I think, or
maybe three points. Just quick thoughts from Russell Palooza before
we jump to the pwry real quick first and foremost,
Stephanie McMahon surprise announcement. She goes into the ww Hall

(43:40):
of Fame undertaker surprises her. Your thoughts on this, because
this seems to be a thing now, right, Uh, it's
we've seen it for years where not necessarily it's like
a surprise like this, but like when people are candidates
of a Hall of Fame, say the nf FELL or

(44:01):
NBA or Major League Baseball, they'll get a phone call
or someone will knock on their door and surprise them.
And I like the WWE is now capitalizing on the
social media and the streaming platform and giving us those
those actual interactions of showing us, you know, Hunter got

(44:24):
surprised last year, Michelle McCool surprised on I remember it
was Get Up or if it was.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
Yeah, Luger got surprised at his house with DDP and Cody.

Speaker 2 (44:35):
And they had right, So, like, what are your thoughts
a on Stephanie going in, because I think we're probably
along the same lines here. And the other part is
how do you like this new? And I don't imagine
they're going to do it for everybody, but maybe for
the headliners at least. Yeah, this new Like, let's find

(44:57):
a creative way to let them know and let's share
with the fans and let them experience that moment with them.

Speaker 1 (45:04):
Oh yeah, I think it's like you said, it's a
page right out of Hall of Fame, like the NFL,
Like they go to the house, they knock on the door.
Here here a guy with the jacket on, like, Hey,
I'm in the Hall of Fame. I'm gonna bring you in.
I'm gonna I want to I want to welcome you
to the class. You welcome you to the to the group,
which is which is? Which is really cool? And I

(45:26):
think this was a it and of course it's it
goes without saying, you know, she deserves to go in.
Are there other people that may you know, there's probably
other people out there, you know, but I think she's
one that everybody can relate and knows kind of her
story and kind of some of the things that have

(45:46):
that have gone on with you know, her father, you know,
and kind of you know, she kind of stepped away
for a bit and came back and and she's you know,
and even and of course before that, as a as
an on screen character, is is a GM A SmackDown.
She's she's done. She's done a lot for the business,
and I'm glad that she's back involved, and I'm glad

(46:06):
that she's going to get a rightful place. I would say,
you know, that being said, and I know we're going
to talk about Russell Palooza a little bit, and I
know you and I have had differing thoughts about, you know,
what the goal was and what the expectations were for

(46:28):
this show. And I want to be the first to
say that I thought the show was good. I thought
overall the show was good, had some really good matches.
Stephanie and EO tore the house down. I think that
should have been the opening match, by the way, but
I think you know, you've got what you were you
were thinking you were going to get with uh with
the mixed tag match. We kind of said it, you know,

(46:50):
and was kind of spot on, and Cody and and
Drew was. You know, it was good. It wasn't It
wasn't great, but it wasn't it wasn't bad. You know
Usso's and the vision. It was what it was. And
like I said last week, I really thought that there

(47:12):
was going to be more to the surprise element. Yeah
we got that. We got Stephanie and take a cool
great like that's all well and good. We got Pat McAfee,
which everybody in their mom knew. If you're watching the
Pat McAfee show, you saw him on social media and
you knew where the venue.

Speaker 2 (47:30):
Was gonna before gone.

Speaker 1 (47:35):
Conclusion, let's go but any but I just expected and
maybe my expectations were so high because of ESPN. I
just think that they missed an opportunity to just have
I don't even know what they would have, like have
some legends, have some you know. I love the video

(47:58):
package at the beginning that was that was really good,
but I just it was just missing something to me
and for somebody like myself and like like U Chrome,
we're gonna watch it and if we had to pay
twenty nine to ninety nine, we were gonna pull out
our credit cards and pay for the show, because we
do this one, we do the podcast too because we're

(48:19):
big wrestling fans. We're gonna watch it either way. But
if the goal was to get a new audience, if
the goal is to get new viewers to sign up
for this platform, and I and I'm sure ESPN has
been building this on their bottom screen saying hey, download
the app. We got unlimited, And I'm sure people signed
up to watch watch college football. I'm sure that I

(48:42):
know there's some like camera views and things like that,
different interactive things that uh that I'm you know if
I I haven't signed up for it yet, but I
you know, I'm hearing these things. So I used a
VPN to watch Wrestle Palosa and it worked out pretty well.
But if if Hunter, if WWETKO was expecting to get

(49:06):
a different audience for this show, I think they are
sadly mistaken. I just don't see people that aren't in
the bubble of watching wrestling paying twenty nine ninety nine
to just watch wrestling. Now, if they're watching football, if
they got the platform to watch football, they're watching football.
They're not watching wrestling. So I don't I just have

(49:30):
a hard time trying to decipher where they're where WWE
thinks that they're getting this extra audience from. If anything,
you might be losing audience because people may be paying
twenty nine ninety nine and may not be able to
do it. So I just have a hard time trying
to figure out what they're why they think that there

(49:51):
was going to be a new viewers to this to
the show. The casual fan or the fan that's watching
every Monday and Friday and watching the shows and watching
all the pls. They're probably tuning in most of them.
But I just don't see where they're getting this other
audience from. It's it's kind of hard for me to

(50:11):
figure it out. But the show was good. I just
think ww somewhere along somewhere, I don't think that one.
And another thing too, I don't think the platform was
promoted as well as it could have. Yeah, they did
a little less ditch effort with our truth and you know,
and they definitely tried on SmackDown. But I think it's

(50:34):
still it's still confusing to people. I mean, I don't know,
what are your thoughts? Man, you're muted?

Speaker 2 (50:48):
I got it, ucky, Yeah, listen, I enjoyed the show. Okay,
I did enjoy the show. I thought match wise, it
was about what I expected for me to go in
and for you know, obviously what we talked about last week,
for them to hit the expectations of essentially almost every

(51:08):
match that I had in mind, tells me to me,
that was what would make it a successful story or
a successful show. So I did enjoy the show. I
felt that. I think I think the criticism is the
wrestling fan mindset of we expected a bigger show because

(51:31):
of this new platform, and we've seen what they've done
on Netflix. When they made it premiere on the Netflix.

Speaker 1 (51:40):
And all you heard all week was Triple A saying
we're gonna have all these surprises, and ALL was like, so,
I don't REMI.

Speaker 2 (51:47):
All these surprises. I remember him saying you're gonna see
great matches and surprises. I don't. I don't remember him
saying like like, I didn't go in thinking we're gonna
get like two returns and and no, but he's gonna
drop the title, although did report that Cody and and
Orton presented to drop the title.

Speaker 1 (52:07):
So I saw that quick note.

Speaker 2 (52:10):
For everybody here, which is a pretty good wrestling media
outlet had two reports that Sina as of the morning
of Russell Paloza Sena was originally booked to defeat rock
Lester and then it got changed last minute, just a
little crumb, little food for thought. And then obviously the

(52:33):
other which was more surprising was Cody and Randy Orton
themselves went to creative with the They pushed for it.
And it's so funny because it comes off of the
heels of what we talked about last week, Eric, where
we talked about Drew and and the losses in big matches.

(52:58):
But Cody the champion himself, pushed for Drew to who
was it to cost him? It was Orton was going
to accidentally got him and then back in tire was
going to win the title.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (53:16):
Interesting point. Yes, I think in terms of the shock
factor that would have been a game changer. However we
didn't get that obviously, and I do believe overall show
was good. I think for new eyes to see something
at the level of what you got from an EO
Sky and a Stephanie Vacker.

Speaker 4 (53:43):
I just stephan were good now.

Speaker 2 (53:47):
Yeah, OK, and then I think you got a bit
of everything. So again it depends on how you look
at it.

Speaker 4 (53:54):
Now.

Speaker 2 (53:55):
ESPN themselves were a little critical in the Show's the
thing their person who does he grades their shows all
the time. He's a little bit of a mark. So
it's not like, you know, and that's and you know what,
that's fair. Actually it makes.

Speaker 1 (54:09):
Me appreciate honesty. Yeah, we're not like, oh a plus.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
Baby, correct, you're getting an honest opinion on right now.
That being said, I think it depends on what do
you look at as a success. I started the show
talking about how WWE, I think, wanted to present all
aspects of their business to try to just to try
to display and showcase what WWA is. And part of

(54:36):
that is we have the monsters like a brock Lesner,
we have the legends like a John Cena. We have
Jump too young, incredibly athletic up in the conversation of
men or women, best wrestlers in the world, world class

(54:56):
female wrestlers, to promote women, and I think Stephanie Tai
into that because Stephanie was such a big important piece
two the women's revolution, evolution whatever you call it. Yeah,
and that too is one of you know. The thing
with Stephanie is there's more the in ring alone. Maybe

(55:17):
could be borderline, but I think she was important, such
an important part of so many major storylines with every
top name, and of course he's a McMahon. But it's
not just that it's she. She like did well in
her presentation and acting. Yeah, I think that that's deserving enough.
But then when you look at the behind the scenes,

(55:39):
the charity work, how hard she pushed for women to
advance in this business. I think it's a very well deserved.
But they're able to showcase that they get the legend
the Undertaker on there just because you get that right,
because you get to showcase one.

Speaker 4 (55:56):
Of your legends.

Speaker 2 (55:57):
Then you get the big return, which is something that
happens in wrestling, So now you get the returning star
first time after ten years. There were just so many
storylines and things going on. Then you get you show
them that there can be a violent, hardcore aspect to things.
They really put out a buffet of what everything is,

(56:20):
and that to me is why I didn't have an
issue with how the show was.

Speaker 4 (56:25):
Well.

Speaker 2 (56:26):
Listen, I think this show and Hunter admitted it that
basically ESPN had them under the gun to put something
out there because they wanted to speed this up. We
talked about it, you brought it up last week. I mean,
how even with the name they did it as an
homage to ECW, but they also didn't have much time
to think of a different name, right, So I think

(56:50):
all of this was put together in a short period
of time, and how can we present our product and
show as many aspects of it as we can on
a grand scale because listen, the rest of the shows
they're getting are all top not shows. They're getting every
major pay per view they have. So if we're expecting

(57:11):
that Mania and SummerSlam and Royal Rumble are going to
be this quality, then we have a problem. But for
a pl and I think two, you don't want your
first show on ESPN being Survivor Series or WrestleMania or
Royal Rumble because if there's an issue, whether it's with
the streaming, I mean we saw on Netflix when they

(57:33):
put out Jake Paul and Mike Tyson, absolute catastrophe of
trying to get through the first five rounds of that.
It kicked you out every through seconds. Yeah, for the
whole time. There's an opportunity too for them to not
give away the shop, put out a good show, a
really good show, display all the aspects of their business

(57:56):
and come out. So again, maybe I'm overthinking it. I
really don't think that I am. I think it's common sense.
That's what the mission was. When you heard on her
tall and understanding they were on. They were in a
very short leash timeframe to get this out.

Speaker 1 (58:11):
I yeah, like I said, was not it was a
good show. Like I am not arguing that fact that
better than a C show. I would have gave it.
Oh yeah, maybe I say, yeah, yeah, we're we're right,
we're right on right on part there. But real quick,
like I would just say. The last thing I want

(58:32):
to say is you said new audience, and that's the key.
Did they get any new audience? And I and I
don't know if we're ever gonna know. I mean, I'm
sure ESPN will come out with, you know, hopefully come
out with some like hey we've got X amount of
view like of subscribers. I don't I don't know how
much we're gonna find out. We don't get a lot
from Netflix either, so it's kind of hard to hard

(58:54):
to gauge. But I think the key is did you
get the audience that you were expecting? And if you did,
grade it's a success. But I just find it very
tough to believe that they got anybody new as far
as viewers are concerned with this, especially how some cable

(59:19):
providers had it, some didn't. You had to some people
had it on Netflix and overseas you had to some
people getting VPN. Some people then had to pay twenty
nine ninety nine because they thought they had it in
a bundle with with Hulu and Disney Plus and no,
it's it was just very very tough for the consumer

(59:40):
to try to find it. And we said that last week.
Where are people going to be able to locate it
and are they going to be able to tune in?
And hopefully hopefully that's the case, but it's find it
hard to believe like anybody like just because of that,
did they get anybody new? And that's that's a hard

(01:00:01):
thing to to.

Speaker 2 (01:00:03):
Know listen for. It wasn't money in the bank, it
wasn't Royal Rumble, but it was a step. But it
was above Saturday Night's main event, which is one of
their bigger presented shows. And again first time out the gate,
you're not going to put one of your big time

(01:00:24):
shows on there. I didn't have an issue with it.
You're right, We're not going to really know if they
got new people or not potato, because a lot of
people at this point are going to be upgrading. You
don't know if it's because of wrestling or not. They're
going to release streaming numbers at some point, So I honestly,
I'm not overly concerned because people thought, you know, when

(01:00:45):
WW went to Peacock, you know, people thought, oh, you know,
are people going to follow them to Peacock And guess
what they did.

Speaker 1 (01:00:55):
Was a lot cheaper.

Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
But but regards like I don't know a lot of
people like commercial free on things, and I can tell you,
like you're talking twenty nine ninety nine, but you're getting Hulu,
Disney Plus and like you're getting three things.

Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
You're such a getting You're only getting it for a
year and then it goes to forty and then it
goes in another ten dollars.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
Right regardless, Eric, can you I pay so much for
streaming services right now? We're looking at we're looking at
if I am just a WW fan, and like I
don't care about Disney Plus, I don't care about Hulu.
You're one hundred percent right, But there's there is good
programming on all of that stuff. Sure it is a
value package regardless, because it's essentially nine ninety nine.

Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
I don't know if if a consumer doesn't have that
already and they have everything else now they fork out
another thirty dollars if they don't have if they don't
have those items.

Speaker 2 (01:01:50):
Well then they have to maybe they have to make
a decision and say, you know, I've watched everything they
have on Peacock. They put most of it now on
the vault on you Tube. Anyway, I don't need Peacock.
That'll save me the difference of the money to go
and get you know what I'm saying. It's just I
just I don't think that I get the price point.

(01:02:11):
I don't like it either. I don't like that I
have to go to multiple My thing is even the
price point, it's that I have to go to multiple
platforms for multiple Yeah, that's what's annoying to me. I
get Peacock for free. I think I upgraded for like
four extra bucks a month that I so I pay
like four dollars a month for the unlimited like for
the commercial I need commercials. So I was paid for

(01:02:34):
a top package. Yeah, I'll pay around that way too. Yeah,
I can't sit there and watch one hundred commercials. Yeah,
and at some point I will do the upgrade with
so I have. I have this same bundle, just not
the unlimited through Verizon. I will cancel it through Verizon
and I will do the upgrade on my own in

(01:02:56):
due time. Promab the Royal Rumble. I don't feel the
necessity to do it right this.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
Moment, right, I mean, I was impressed with the VPN myself.
The only thing with the VPN is you can't watch
it on TV. You gotta watch it on a tablet
or a phone and stuff like that. And who wants
to do who wants to do that? So, I mean,
I'm hoping that I have YouTube, So hopefully eventually they
will get a deal and that'll be the end. But

(01:03:24):
until then, it's like, I know, wait, and you've got
a couple couple of months. Hopefully they'll figure it all out.

Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
Right, Yeah, I think it'll be fine. Yeah, there's Joey,
my buddy, Joey ESPN fighter gave me. Yeah, yeah, we know, Joey, Joey.

Speaker 1 (01:03:43):
Yeah, we we don't agree, I think, you know, and
if and if he thinks it's a scene, you know,
that's that's his opinion and and we'll see what happens.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
Yeah, and what else are you gonna say? Good on him? Yeah?
So obviously big news today. I didn't I can't believe it.
It's already out. I feel like last year's was just released.
I actually subscribed. I subscribed to PROG Wrestling Illustrated. I

(01:04:18):
still get the physical copies of the magazine.

Speaker 1 (01:04:20):
That's awesome. I didn't even know they still made the
physical copies.

Speaker 2 (01:04:23):
It's all color now, like back in the day when
we were kids. Oh yeah, there's typically had some color
and then some black and white. There's it's all color now.
So I've subscribed for like three years, all four. I
like the idea of having the physical magazine. I miss
I miss WWF magazine. I have a number of WWF magazines.

Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
Yeah, I've got some somewhere too.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
I miss it. Yeah. So true story, real quick. I
went to uh the Berlin Farmers Market back when our
old buddy on here, Matt Tremont, at a wrestling store there,
and he would sell old a lot of wrestlings. They
get a wrestling story. He doesn't have any more ups
and he had like a bind with ald WWF magazines.

(01:05:09):
So I went out, there were like five bucks whatever.
So I went in and I bought a couple of them.
Go home. I start flipping through one and remember they
had like the perforated edges from trading cards and stuff
in there.

Speaker 1 (01:05:23):
Ye.

Speaker 2 (01:05:25):
Well it had one where it was like a bigger
thing signed by sid Way Autographs sit inside there.

Speaker 1 (01:05:33):
It was awes awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:05:34):
It was our first like big a two D Lazy
Booking wrestling interview, you know, a resting piece to our
our old buddies. Sick. Actually watched a little bit of
that episode the other day. Go on, tell some great stories.

Speaker 1 (01:05:48):
Awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:05:49):
I've been researching some of the old interviews in our archives,
which by the way, you guys can check out on
A two d's YouTube or Lazy Booking podcast has its
own YouTube as well, you can go in. I don't
have all of the interviews. I have five of the
past interviews posted out there. It is one of them.
But I'm going to eventually archive some of the old interviews,

(01:06:10):
round tables and classic shows on there along with our
new shows, and just to have a quicker place to
grab them if you don't have time to go and
search for them. But too DS YouTube you can find
a whole bunch of stuff anyway. So but yeah, so
I do get the physical magazine.

Speaker 1 (01:06:28):
That's so cool.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
It feels like it just so I'll probably I think
i'll probably get that one in the next week or so.

Speaker 1 (01:06:34):
So that so from what I from what I read,
this is the desce. It'll be in the December.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
Issue, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
So yeah, so yeah, so a little bit about p
WI those of you not familiar Pro Wrestling Illustrated. They've
been doing the Top five hundred wrestlers since nineteen ninety one.
So Chrome and I did some research looking at nineteen
ninety one and without without uh without looking so number

(01:07:04):
one was Haaul Cogan of course, but.

Speaker 2 (01:07:07):
Top five, so who is so Cee?

Speaker 1 (01:07:10):
If I may guess who number two was, and I'll
give you a hint. He was not a w w
F superstar at the time. See if anybody can guess.
But and don't cheat, don't be one of those cheating
cheats out there. But yeah, so they released the Top
five hundred Wrestlers and it goes you know, w w

(01:07:32):
E A w New Japan basically everywhere in Mexico, all
the all the promotions and independence. So we'll go through
the top ten, and how do you want do you
want to do this?

Speaker 2 (01:07:47):
I don't think anybody's gonna go through it. I want
you to read the old top ten just because it's
it would be like thirty five years later at this point.
All right, Well, this is the top ten of nineteen
ninety one, all right, and then I'm going to read
the top ten of twenty twenty five.

Speaker 1 (01:08:07):
Cool, all right, cool. So so we'll go from ten
to one. So number ten was Rick Steiner of the
Steiner Brothers. Number nine was arn Anderson. And you'll see
a trend here, a lot of NWAWCW guys. So number

(01:08:28):
eight was doctor Death Steve Williams, God rest his soul.
Doctor Death's my boy? Who would know about that? Ricky
Steamboat number seven, so I believe Ricky Steamboat went to
W was in WWF in nineteen ninety one. He came
back in ninety one for a little bit. Number six

(01:08:50):
was Scott Steiner, So you had both Steiner Brothers tag
team in the top ten of the PWI five hundred.
Number five was the Stinger. Number four was the macho
man Randy Savage. Number three was Rick Flair, and number

(01:09:11):
ninety one, Rick Flair left w CW to go to
WWF in the summer. Number two was Lex Luger. So
Lex Luger was in WCW.

Speaker 2 (01:09:26):
That's the one I guessed, but was shocked at how
high on them.

Speaker 1 (01:09:33):
Yeah, so Luger was basically the heir apparent. He was
supposed to fight Flair I think at the Great American Bash,
and then that's when Rick Flair said he wasn't showing
up and they had the with Jim Hurd I think
was the guy that was running WCW, called him the
Pizza Hut guy, and he took the belt with him

(01:09:54):
and took it to took it to Bobby Heenan and
the rest is history. And then of course number one
world Yeah, yeah, I'm Rick Fair, I'm the rail World Champion.
And then number one was the other champion, hul Cogan.
So that was thirty four years ago. That that list,

(01:10:17):
and that's the first one, and then now.

Speaker 2 (01:10:20):
Thirty four years ago, but thirty five lists ago. So yeah,
think about the names, the wrestling styles, the gimmicks of
that list, and then you look at what it is
now thirty five thirty four years later. So going down
ten to one this year's top top ten of the

(01:10:45):
PWI topic. By the way, quick note, number forty on
that list also was a guest hero on Lazy Booking
three years ago. Now a WWID prospect. Marcus Mathers go
back and I got that interview, so congratulations to him.
Year over year. He actually made a social media post

(01:11:08):
before I read this real quick, I want to read,
so Marcus made a post about it and he said,
so he's been in the last four years now, my
nu He's only twenty two. Started at four sixty one,
jumped to three sixty, last year was one forty, and
this year's number forty. So congratulations to Marcus. Congratsman was great,

(01:11:28):
always was a great kid, big wrestling fan, living his dream,
the potential future ww superstar here and he's made it
to number forty on the PWI Top five hundred. Number
ten is will osbry Aw. Number nine is missedic Go
from CMLL number eight, Seth Rollins from WWE number seven,

(01:11:50):
Swerve Strickland from AW number six, j USO WWE number five,
the Rookie Gatto from MJPW number four, Hanging in Adham
page of ae W number three, Gum thro WW, number two,
John Moxley ae W, and number one the American Nightmare

(01:12:12):
Cody rows your thoughts.

Speaker 1 (01:12:17):
So, yeah, I don't know a lot about HIERARCHI go
to go to you know, I have to have to
take a look at him. I'm not sure about him,
but I think Cody's deserving. So just a little bit
of insight. This goes from an evaluation from August twenty

(01:12:41):
twenty four to July thirty first to twenty five, so
it's kind of midyear to mid year, and it goes
off of different criteria like win loss record, championships that
are one, major feuds, quality of competition, and overall wrestling ability.
So there's you know, different factors that play into this.

(01:13:03):
And the first person that really like number ten should
probably be in the top three and number two. I
just I'm I'm not surprised, but I like, I'm you know,
I don't think John Moxley had a great year. I don't.

(01:13:26):
There's there's not a match that I really remember. And
the death and we all know the Death Riders, you
know story. You know, it's been the top a W story,
but it's it's really fell flat and I think, you know,
the audiences has and social media has been very vocal
as far as that goes. So, you know, Hangman probably

(01:13:52):
is right there. I mean, you can make an argument
for him to be be the top guy jay Us so,
I mean he who had a bigger year than him,
Like he's just been super over like I think that's part,
like most of the reason why he's in the top ten.
One guy that is way down the list that I

(01:14:13):
was really surprised that was Dominic Mysterio number forty eight,
not that he I mean maybe not top ten, but
like top fifteen, you know, I think, you know, for
the rest of the list, I think it's I'd put

(01:14:36):
Seth maybe a little higher. Okada's probably right. I mean
except for the only guy i'd probably take out, and
not knowing much about Rookie Godo, you know, I'd probably
take Moxley out of the top ten. He's a top fifteen,
but not not number two. But uh yeah, that's that's

(01:14:57):
my thoughts.

Speaker 2 (01:15:01):
Yeah, I am not I think a lot of the
names are good. I agree with you. I don't I
don't know much about Gotto. I don't watch a lot
of n J p W anymore. I feel like everybody
defects now there and goes to a w So I'm
just it's just not I can watch great wrestling in

(01:15:23):
a W. I I only have so much time in
my day, yeah season now, so I can't really comment
too much on that, but I think is good. Little
surprised that mist to Go is up in that list
as well, for fans who don't know, I'm correct. I

(01:15:43):
believe Mistago is the old Sinkar, the original Sinkhar of
w W A yeah, which is insane to me because
what a botch fest he was all those years, and
he actually is tremendous to watch now. But the growing,
the growth for that man is wild. But anyway, you know,

(01:16:04):
I think Hangman's too low Moxy. I don't think should
even be on the list. I said this to you
guys before in our private chat. I believe I don't
believe that you should be in a top ten of
a top five hundred wrestling list because of booking decisions,
because it's the only explanation that puts John Moxley. Because

(01:16:28):
this run was terrible. I think the first three months
started good when you thought that there was maybe like
a past WWE faction type of deal similar to nWo
with the reveal of like a Shane McMahon or somebody
being behind this right, never got there, never happened. We
put the title belt for in a briefcase for almost

(01:16:50):
a year and you didn't say it, and that was
just an awful storyline. I didn't. I think every John
Moxy match was a rinse and repeat. And when you
constantly do the death match shocking stuff, particularly on the
WWE scouts different if you're like an indie death match

(01:17:11):
wrestler and that's what you want to do. But in
his case too much hold on one secon. But in
his case, when you're on it, when you're one of
the faces of a major syndicated program such as they are,

(01:17:35):
it is hard for me to get behind the same
thing over and over. The shock factor becomes gone. Like
at least with Mick, he did different things and he
picked and Jose moments. He didn't do all that same
shit on Raw as you know, like Moxley bleeds every
freaking matches in on Dynamite like it's yeah for Collision,

(01:17:56):
it's the same shit every day. I don't think the
cow is that great now. I think it. I think
it started hot, but got really really bad, So I
don't understand his inclusion on there. I gave it earlier.
I'm gonna give you mine. I will take John Cena
off of my list. I originally had John Cena on
there for a couple of reasons that were already presented.

(01:18:17):
Maybe not the greatest thing in the world in terms
of how this is going if you're going by the
dates that they set up to the thirty first of July.
I still think. I still think he's a guy that
I look at when I look at status biggest moment
of the year. I don't care what anybody says, regardless

(01:18:38):
regardless of how the follow through ended up. John cenas
he'll turn, is the biggest moment of the year. Yeah,
and he has had unbelievable match quality overall minus the
Brock match, so and obviously the rest of me. I
didn't mind the WrestleMania match. I get it was a

(01:18:58):
slower style, but it was intense. Did for the storytelling,
but obviously the ending was what it was. But giving
you my top ten, I'm gonna remove John Cena at ten.
I'm gonna put Kyle Fletcher because I think Kyle Fletcher
unbelievable year. You could argue maybe even in Okada, even

(01:19:21):
though I think the Ocada Okada is a little bit
of rinse and repeat as well. Match quality is through
the roof and you can't take it away from him.
So but I'm gonna go Kyle Fletcher because I think
Kyle Fletcher from where this year started to where he
ended up at the end of the year is astronomical.

(01:19:43):
You can make an argument that he should be the
world champion for this company. I'm not even joking. I
think or at least in the in the contendership for that.
And then let me see here, so everybody's flight's taken off.
Now I had to do it outside that Will Ospright

(01:20:04):
is my number nine. I think that Will has had
a good year in terms of his matches. Great. I
have not been a fan of the story. I know
me and Nick beg to differ on this. I don't
believe that he's been a heater for anything. I think
he's played a supporting character. At the end of the day,

(01:20:25):
all of that was about Swerve, Strickland and Hangman Page
and getting them to where they were having one great
eight man tag or ten man tag or whatever they
call it, stadium stampede match, whatever they call it, That
to me is not enough. So and then going through

(01:20:47):
the rest of my list here, I have CM Punk,
who I thinks had a really good year. I have
Gunther who I can maybe argue could go a little
bit higher. I have Dom, who I think by the
end of this year could be a top five. It's
hard to argue against Jay usso with where he's Yeah,

(01:21:08):
he's got to be a top five. Number four. I
have Swerved three, I have Seth Rowins, I have Cody
it two and to me, Hangman Page, I think it's
had an unbelievable year. Character development has been great, all
of his in ring matches have been tremendous. I think
he's been so much of a better champion, even just
in talking already I am and I think he's gonna

(01:21:30):
have a monster year coming up. So that is my
top ten. Fletcher Spray, Punk, Gunther, Dom, Jay Swerve, Seth Rowins, Cody,
and Hangman.

Speaker 1 (01:21:43):
No, it's you know, the guy I don't see on
this list at all. Roman.

Speaker 2 (01:21:51):
He may not have qualified because he'd probably you know,
you haven't.

Speaker 1 (01:21:55):
Ye, I mean they have Tommy Dreamer on the list
at for eighty seven.

Speaker 2 (01:21:58):
Yeah, they haven't. They have a that's crazy, but they
have a there's a qualification for it, so gotcha. Uh,
he may not have qualified for it otherwise he I
don't care if he hits the minimum, Roman is going
to be a top five or top ten.

Speaker 1 (01:22:15):
So yeah, yeah, I don't see him on the list.

Speaker 2 (01:22:20):
I think I think we saw him a little bit
less this year.

Speaker 1 (01:22:23):
Oh so yeah, and folks, he should I mean, he
shouldn't be in a top ten this year just because
he hasn't He hasn't done He hasn't done much of
anything of note. He had the triple Threat match at Mania.

Speaker 2 (01:22:37):
Yeah, keep in mind, focus this is a top ten
list as well, I mean on all men's lists rather.

Speaker 1 (01:22:41):
Yeah there's yeah the women's list that's.

Speaker 2 (01:22:44):
Not out yet, right, I can inter change quite a
few women in there. But yeah, interesting list. I'm sure
it'll be debated. Uh again. I I just I know
why Cody's won. I would personally put hanging in there.
I don't know why John Moxleys too. Maybe.

Speaker 1 (01:23:03):
Like I said, I think you can interchange a couple
of guys, like I get why you know Cody's and
I agree hang man. You know, despite some questionable booking
from a w has you know has come, Cream has
risen to the top. You know, he's uh he delivers,

(01:23:24):
So I think, uh, he's he should be one or
two and Gunther you can't, I mean, you can't argue
his his his matches are usually you know, strong. He's
gotten better on the mic as well. I think you know,
his run with the world title is pretty under under
uh underrated. Jericho is down the lid. I just saw

(01:23:50):
his name. He's number fifty four, right above Adam colebaby shocking.

Speaker 2 (01:23:58):
Actually, yeah, anyway, anything else for the clause Eric before
we sign off here, buddy.

Speaker 1 (01:24:07):
No, this is a good show, and you know, we
went a little more than we than we planned, but
I think it was we had a lot of topics
and I think we hit them all really well and
hopefully everybody enjoyed. And uh, you know we will, uh
we'll have stuff. I'm sure we'll have more to talk about,
you know, next time. But yeah, let's that's it. Man,

(01:24:28):
It's a good show and we shall see what happens,
uh coming up in the coming weeks leading up the
Crown Jewel.

Speaker 2 (01:24:38):
Yeah, it's gonna be interesting and stay tuned. Next week
I believe actually I have to talk to him, might
be our mini show because it's so I'll talk to him.
It'll be either next week or the following week, so
stay tuned for that. Make sure you guys follow A
two D social media pages, follow Lazy Booking as well,
because we will post when that is going to be.

(01:25:01):
I have to confirm with him, so make sure you
guys are joining them and checking out with them, and
make sure that you guys check us all out on
Instagram as well, at A two D Radio and at
Lazy Booking Podcast. Obviously you can find myself too and Eric,
we have our handles up there at heal Prome and
at Eric the Archer. A great show today. Thank you

(01:25:24):
to everybody who commented and here. Every want to throw
a like on there if you have it yet on
your way out the door, please do so. It's an
exciting time we're having up. We're going to be coming
up to the SummerSlam pretty quick, I'm sorry, Survivor series
pretty quick. So yeah, it's exciting. Thank you to our sponsor,
Specialized Physical Therapy, appreciate them, and for all of you

(01:25:45):
out there, For all of us here at at D Radio,
myself Eric Archer. We wish you guys a wonderful week.
Hope you guys are blessed and love, Tell someone you
love them, and hey go birds.

Speaker 1 (01:25:57):
See you

Speaker 2 (01:26:01):
Burial, then flyin Burial and the limited