June 18, 2025 • 30 mins
Think end-of-life planning is only for the wealthy? Here’s what every woman 50+ needs to know.
End-of-life planninng for women over 50 isn't about wealth —it’s about clarity, care, and protecting what matters most.
In this powerful episode, I’m joined by Sara Ecklein, a Licensed Professional Fiduciary and founder of Trust & Honor, to break down how estate planning without millions is not only possible—it’s essential.
We explore:
- What a fiduciary actually does and how to protect your loved ones without without a will
- The critical difference between power of attorney vs. healthcare proxy
- Real-life stories, including a 70-year-old woman whose lack of planning led to financial and healthcare crises
- The hidden risks of solo aging—and how to stay in control of your future
- Why so many families fall apart over end-of-life care and how to avoid family conflict over inheritance.
Whether you’re planning your own legacy, caring for aging parents, or just starting to think about the future, this episode gives you the tools—and the mindset shift—to act with clarity and heart.
🎁 Ready to shift from stuck to unstoppable?
Download my free guide to empower your thinking and start your second act with bold, focused energy.
Because legacy isn’t about what you leave behind—it’s how you live forward.
Resources:
For similar episodes on empowering yourself in later years, check out episodes 96 and 125 of Aging with Purpose and Passion and, if you love podcasts for older women, the Late Bloomer Living podcast will give you a fresh perspective on midlife and aging.
Sara Ecklein:
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100067625615341
https://www.instagram.com/themindfulfiduciary/
http://www.linkedin.com/in/sara-ecklein
Beverley Glazer:
https://reinventimpossible.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/beverleyglazer/
https://www.facebook.com/beverley.glazer
https://www.facebook.com/groups/womenover50rock
https://www.instagram.com/beverleyglazer_reinvention/
🎁 BONUS: Take your first step to clarity, courage and momentum. Your free checklist: → From Stuck to Unstoppable – is here.
https://reinvent-impossible.aweb.page/from-stuck-to-unstoppable
Have feedback or a powerful story that's worth telling? Contact us at info@Reinventimpossible.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Welcome to Aging with Purpose and Passion, the
podcast designed to inspire yourgreatness and thrive through
life.
Get ready to conquer your fears.
Here's your hostpsychotherapist, coach and
empowerment expert, BeverlyGlazer.
Beverley Glazer (00:30):
How do you protect your loved ones when you
don't have millions of dollarsin a trust?
Well, welcome to Aging withPurpose and Passion, the podcast
for women over 50 who are readyto stop settling and live life
on their own terms.
Each week, you will hear rawconversations, inspiring stories
(00:51):
and get practical tools to helpyou reignite your fire.
I'm Beverley Glazer and I'm atransformational coach and
therapist for women ready toreclaim their voice and break
free from what's holding themback, and you can find me on
reinventimpossiblecom.
Sara Ecklein is the founder ofTrust and Honor and host of the
(01:17):
Legacy of Love, a podcast toredefine what it means to leave
a legacy.
She's a licensed professionalfiduciary and she helps ordinary
families, not just the rich andfamous, to protect their loved
ones with intention, clarity andheart.
Do you think that a legacy isjust about money and wills?
(01:39):
In this episode, we areflipping the script and we'll be
showing you how to protect yourfamily, your wishes and your
peace of mind, even if you don'thave a huge estate.
So keep listening and welcomeSarah.
Sara Ecklein (01:59):
Oh, Bev, thank you for that warm welcome.
I'm so happy to be here.
Beverley Glazer (02:05):
Thank you for that warm welcome.
I'm so happy to be here, Sara,you're younger than 50.
And that's what I thought wouldbe most interesting, and that's
why you're here as a guest,because our audience is over 50.
And so, simply because of that,that makes you very special, I
have to say, because at 24, youhad a wake-up call.
(02:28):
What was that wake-up call?
Sara Ecklein (02:33):
Yeah well, it was really being witnessed to a
final like kind of the finalthree days of a loved one's life
.
My partner at the time's auntgot referred to hospice.
She was dying of brain cancer.
She was actually in her fifties.
She had two children, both inhigh school, and when we got the
(02:59):
call I put everything down.
I was working left and we droveup and it just had this profound
impact on my life.
Of course I didn't know it atthe time and I do describe it as
it was like a mysticalspiritual experience for me,
where all the noise and thechatter and busyness of life
(03:22):
just goes away with death.
I say death is kind of theultimate truth serum and it can
bring into full focus, like ourown, like life and life force.
Whether you believe in God,whatever your spiritual beliefs
and religious beliefs are, Ithink we're all connected to
(03:43):
that life force.
So for me, being witness to herdeath just was being so present
to this unconditional lovingpresence and I noticed in myself
this wanting to lean in andbeing present to her dying.
And most people they don't havethat inclination I find most
(04:06):
people are running away fromdeath.
So it was so obvious for methat this was a calling, of a
place, of where I needed toserve.
I originally thought that Iwould be working as a hospice
nurse and started going back toschool, and then some things
weren't quite aligned andeventually my path led me to
(04:29):
working for a professionalfiduciary, and really the rest
is history.
Beverley Glazer (04:35):
It sure is.
But for those who do not knowwhat is a professional fiduciary
, Explain what that is.
Sara Ecklein (04:45):
Yeah.
So I think, first off, it'simportant to just point out that
I'm based in California.
I'm in the San Francisco BayArea.
California does things a littledifferently than most states
and we're one of two states thatactually has licensing for this
profession.
(05:05):
So that's where, with the workthat I do, it really does become
state specific.
Or I know that you're outsideof the US, you're in Canada, and
so working with an attorney inyour local area is very
important.
But, that being said, the workthat I do, I describe it as an
(05:27):
umbrella term of different hatsthat I can wear.
So I can act as someone'sguardian we use the word
conservator to distinguishbetween a minor and an adult,
but in essence it's the samerole, it's just conservators or
for someone over the age of 18.
(05:48):
I can act as a trustee, as anexecutor, and I think also one
of the wonderful things that Ican do is act as someone's agent
for both finance and healthcare.
So with whatever hat I'mwearing for my clients,
typically I'm wearing multiple,but not always.
(06:09):
Sometimes I'm only wearing,like the trustee hat, for
example, but a lot of times I'mkind of supporting both the
financial aspects of people lifeand also that really
person-centered focus of makinghealthcare decisions and it's
really just I can't say where Idescribe the work that I do as
(06:31):
like this head and heartalignment where I'm absolutely
of service to my clients everyday.
There's not a day that goes bythat I don't question the impact
that I have.
But then, of course, there'sjust always this interest and
engaging because people haveunique lives and own different
assets and have different familydynamics.
(06:51):
So when I come into the familyand and supporting and whatever
hat that I'm wearing, I'm alwayslearning and always growing.
Beverley Glazer (07:01):
So it's deeper than just being a financial
advisor.
That's what I'm hearing.
Sara Ecklein (07:06):
Yeah, yeah, and I, I, you know, I actually a lot
of times when people hear theword fiduciary, they confuse me
and think that I'm a financialadvisor, because financial
advisors can also be held tothat same fiduciary standard
that I'm held to, which reallyfiduciary means you're putting
your client's interest beforeyour own, which unfortunately is
(07:30):
not the standard in allprofessions.
You think it would, but that'snot always the case.
But yeah, I don't manage money.
I would partner with afinancial advisor for clients
that have enough assets forthose services.
But yeah, no, I know my clientsvery intimately, very closely.
(07:53):
I know all of my clients and,depending on what role I'm at,
sometimes it can be asfrequently as meeting twice a
week like in-person meetings.
Of course, that's when I'mtypically wearing the hat of a
healthcare decision maker andsupporting someone kind of
during their kind of final youknow, their final season in life
(08:15):
.
Beverley Glazer (08:17):
But there can be all kinds of different family
units.
What happens if there'scomplication between the
children or they say what, youdon't trust me, you don't trust
us.
What happens there when there'sconflict?
Sara Ecklein (08:33):
Yeah, I mean, that's not an easy answer.
My initial thoughts are a lotof times why a professional is
needed is because there isconflict.
So I think you know we can allagree that families are changing
right.
People are living longer,people are choosing to either
(08:54):
have fewer children or nochildren at all.
You know, divorce rates are,you know, I think, 51% at least
in the United States, and thenalso remarriage.
This all adds complexity.
So let's just talk about myactive cases.
(09:16):
A lot of times I am coming inmaybe needing to be a neutral
party and really look at what isin the client's best interest,
and there can be those dynamicswhere, you know, siblings are
fighting of what's really bestto do and I have to be that
neutral party.
I also work with clients in theplanning phase and this is a
(09:40):
lot of what I love to speak on.
I think that there's so muchthat we can do proactively, not
only for our own selves but alsoour loved ones and that future
generation.
When things go well, I findit's not by chance Things go
(10:02):
well for families that arereally leaning in to the hard
conversations.
We're willing to look and faceour own mortality and death and
I would say that we're really adeath denying culture.
So death is a big taboo,money's a big taboo, money's a
(10:24):
big taboo.
And then with also familydynamics and stuff, there can
just be a lot of shame andwanting to avoid the difficult,
hard conversations.
And so I think it makes senseof why I don't know the
statistics in Canada, but Iwould guess that it's not far
off from the U?
S but the United States onlyone in three people actually
(10:47):
have an estate plan, um, and somost people aren't planning, and
so of course it would makesense that you know I think most
of us know the examples offamilies being torn apart, um,
you know, after the matriarchand patriarchs of the family
pass away, and fighting overthings.
And that's so much of whatinspired me to launch my podcast
(11:11):
called the Legacy of Love,because I think that if we're
really cultivating not only justthese difficult conversations
but cultivating these qualitieswithin ourselves, I think at the
end of the day, this reallydoes come down to identity and
who we're choosing to be and thelegacy, not that only that we
(11:32):
will leave, but the legacy thatwe're living.
Beverley Glazer (11:36):
Beautifully said.
Let me ask you, what ifsomebody says well, I don't have
very much money, I don't havemillions of dollars for a trust
and now I'm going to be hiringsomeone else, which will be even
more money.
But what to speak to that?
Do you really need a hugeamount of money?
(11:56):
Who comes to you?
Sara Ecklein (11:59):
Yeah, yeah.
So I would say, for the mostpart, for clients that choose to
work with a professional, andalso let me, I think it's
important to say I think mostfamilies aren't going to work
with a professional.
So, people that you're choosingto either be your executor,
(12:21):
your trustee, your agent, makinghealthcare decision makers for
you, I think for most peopleit's going to be someone in your
life, whether it's your adultchildren, extended family, an
entrusted friend.
So it's not that everyone needsto work with a professional,
it's more of that.
(12:41):
We really need to be thinkingthis through and planning and
hopefully, you know, I feel likeI find that maybe then less
people might even needprofessionals, but anyways,
we're we're far off from thatday.
Beverley Glazer (12:56):
For sure, for sure.
But what if somebody says well,I have a, I don't have much
money, I really have a smallestate.
Sara Ecklein (13:03):
Yeah, and you know , bev, that's where I get really
kind of fired up.
I think it's so much of youknow kind of misinformation
within you know, betweenHollywood and movies and you
know what is the story that'sbeing shown to us, right, we can
(13:23):
think of shows like Succession,right, where it's like this
billion dollar family, butthere's just so many movies
where, yeah, it's only kind ofseen for the wealthy.
Or if you hear the word trustfund, you assume that that
person has a lot of money.
Again, I can really speakmostly to California.
(13:44):
Has a lot of money.
Again, I can really speakmostly to California.
We just had a recent changethis year of bumping up that
threshold, whether or not youneed to go to probate court or
not.
Before it was about $180,000.
So if your estate was more thanthat it really made sense to
set up a trust.
(14:05):
It's just bumped up to likearound 750,000.
I'm not an attorney so I don'tknow the specifics, but still,
like you know, especially youknow, in the cities right, I'm
in the Bay Area and LA I meanmost homes are over a million
dollars where in California.
(14:25):
So that's where, more timesthan not, it still makes sense
to set up a trust.
But the other piece, I think, isthat our estate plan isn't only
about our assets.
It's also directing of who'sgoing to be making decisions for
you in the event of yourincapacity.
(14:46):
So that's what your power ofattorney document is for, that's
what your advanced health caredirective is for.
Everyone needs those documents.
These are crucial because Ithink that's where you know,
going back to kind of one of mypoints of we're a death denying
culture and why, the more that Ikind of peel the onion of why
(15:09):
do people not plan, I think Ireally come to that our brain
tricks us and the denial ofdeath is kind of part of kind of
our biology we're going tothink that there's always a
tomorrow, kind of our biology.
We're going to think thatthere's always a tomorrow.
So, yeah, I think that that'swhere it is a bit of like this
(15:36):
perfect storm between kind ofwhat we're fed from media, of
misinformation, and how weshould think about estate
planning.
But really, at the end of theday, once you're turn 18, there
are certain documents that wecan really all have.
I'm finding more attorneysactually are beginning to kind
of broadcast that like if yourchild's going off to college.
These are some of the keypieces that you could do,
(15:57):
because if something happens tothem, even though you're a
parent, you might not bereceiving any information on
them, especially with thathealthcare piece Right, so
crucial.
Beverley Glazer (16:09):
What challenges do you see older women face?
Sara Ecklein (16:13):
Oh well, um, we live longer, right, we live
longer.
So, um, yeah, I have a lot, alot of my clients are the single
ladies, um, whether or not theywere married and they're just
the surviving spouse or theywere never married and didn't
have children.
(16:34):
Um, those are some of my, myfavorite clients, cause I
support them in a lot of rolesand we build really close
relationships.
But, yeah, the, I think it'sjust that right, we're living
longer and, you know, also, forthe single ladies, they might
not have as many assets, as youknow, as as people that are, you
(16:58):
know, married and you know,partnered with a man and you
know partnered with a man, sothere might not be as many
resources.
So that actually is like one ofmy you know, my, I would say,
more recent clients that havepassed.
She passed a couple of yearsago and we had a really close
(17:23):
relationship.
I got involved in her life whenshe was having a full-on medical
crisis in her seventies, sostill fairly young.
She was working basically upuntil that as an accountant and
she basically didn't really havea well-thought-out plan,
(17:49):
thought out plan.
She was single, never married,no children, and where she lived
she was on the top floor, thethird floor of her condo, no
elevators, so three flights ofstairs to get there and she kept
falling, getting hospitalized,transferred to a rehab facility
to heal, then going back homeand the whole cycle would happen
again.
That happened four times beforeI started working with her.
(18:12):
So there was a huge kind ofmess with her financial life
because basically bills weren'tpaid, some like around six
months.
So bringing her kind of up todate on paying all the bills.
And then there was also thislike needing to assess what's
(18:37):
really going on medically andthat took a lot of time because
what was happening was shedidn't have that person
alongside her and her cognitivedecline was also part and tied
into her physical decline.
It was all kind of going handin hand.
And so she's getting thesedischarge paperwork and the
(18:59):
doctor is talking to her.
She wasn't really able toretain what was going on, so
needing to go back over the lastsix months figure out what was
going on and she was a bit of amystery.
So even there there wasn't liketotal clarity.
It was also advocating andneeding to push for more exams,
(19:20):
but also building therelationships with her medical
team.
And then I would say the lastpiece that was really important
was she finally, before Istarted working with her, was
placed at an assisted livingfacility but it really wasn't
sustainable for her budget.
She was, like I said, in her70sies and while she had a lot
(19:45):
going on medically, I was stillplanning for longevity and she
also.
Not only was it not sustainablefinancially, but I don't think
it was the best place for her.
This woman was super private,liked her space, and with larger
facilities there's more staffand there's a lot of different
(20:07):
people going in and out, so kindof the other piece that I
worked with her over the monthsfirst working together was
finding a better place for herand I moved her to.
We have what's called a boardand care but there's licensing,
but it is it's a home.
It's in residential Um, butnurses live in house and she
(20:28):
lived with four other women.
She had this beautiful um kindof master bedroom that opened
out to the garden and she hadthe care and the support, plus
it was less expensive.
So it really ended up beingkind of a good fit for her and
she lived there her final yearsand it was just.
It was better.
She was having issues of justfeeling like agitated and
(20:54):
aggravated of all these peoplecoming in and out of her room
before to then just having twopeople that were supporting her
and really kind of building thatsense of support and community
and really kind of building thatsense of support and community.
Beverley Glazer (21:05):
When I'm listening, I'm thinking Sarah,
you are like a professionalfriend and daughter.
Oh, that's so sweet.
That's how I'm sure yourclients look at you, Because
it's a matter of trust.
And what can you tell someonewho is just like that, that
(21:36):
client that you have thatdoesn't not want to start the
conversation, that even haschildren or people that they can
rely on, but they're justafraid of opening up that
difficult conversation?
Sara Ecklein (21:42):
afraid of opening up that difficult conversation.
I know it's hard to go thereright, especially when we're not
willing or resistant to it.
I can't I mean I can paintpictures of kind of like the
horror stories of when we don't,when we don't plan, you know,
if we're not willing to do that.
So that's where I really liketo speak to is who are we going
(22:04):
to choose to be, you know, forourselves, for our family?
There's times in our lives andI definitely see this kind of
with the there's kind of like aparting of two camps.
You know our senior years camps, you know our senior years.
(22:27):
There's the people that reallyembrace it, that are willing to
pivot, that are resilient, thatare flexible, and then there's
the people that are kind ofholding on to the past and who
they once were and not willingto change, and I can kind of
anticipate that over the years,as they're declining, it's going
to be a real fighting battle.
(22:49):
We can frame this season aswhat are we moving towards?
What is our vision?
What do we want to leave for?
You know our legacy, whether ornot you have children or not,
(23:09):
just also for the world and thenext generation.
And I think that the more thatwe're willing to have the
difficult conversations, even ifit's, you know, I think, most
importantly for ourselves toreally acknowledge that you know
we're not able to do what weonce were, and how can we plan
around that things are going togo so much better in this season
(23:33):
of life?
I had a client pass a couple ofyears ago who was 110 years so,
and she's always my model clientwhen I work with clients in the
planning phase.
So you know our longevity yes,it can be so long, but we also
want these years to be qualityyears, right, we don't only want
(23:55):
to just be fighting the processand also resistant to building
in the support and the communitythat we need during our you
know, our aging years.
So you know, whether or notyou're working with a
professional, whether you'rejust building that support with
your family, it's again just, Ithink, reminding us, like we
(24:17):
know that right, the truth thatyou know things are going to, of
course, change and evolve.
You know, and you can also seethat, like with, things are
going to, of course, change andevolve.
You know, and you can also seethat, like with people's homes
and people's belongings,especially like that next
generation Most people you knowdon't appreciate, like the
antiques and the and the China.
So that's where also beingproactive and, and you know,
(24:41):
downsizing now, not requiring acrisis.
It really is a night and daydifference.
Beverley Glazer (24:49):
So plan for yourself, don't fear, it is what
I'm hearing.
Sara Ecklein (24:54):
Yeah.
Beverley Glazer (24:55):
We all know the end result.
Don't deny it.
Do it with power.
Sara Ecklein (25:01):
Yeah, it's definitely stepping into that.
I mean, when we're in controlof our own change, like that
feels right, like we're allhuman, that feels way better to
let go of those things that youno longer need.
Then, oh my gosh, I'm goingthrough a medical crisis, I'm
forced to kind of downsize, Ican no longer live at home
(25:25):
because my care needs are toohigh, and now you're just going
through like kind of thesemultiple losses, like a whole
shock to the system.
So I think the more that we'rekind of cultivating this like
ongoing in our relationship, itreally can give us the
opportunity to evolve and growinto those like wise women.
Beverley Glazer (25:48):
Right, that's what I try to embody, even in my
30s I think you're doing a very, very good job and you left
some wonderful information.
We have to open up to it.
Get out of the denial.
I want to thank you, sarah.
Sarah Ecklein is a Californialicensed professional fiduciary
(26:09):
and founder of Trust and Honor,a mindful fiduciary agency
serving families in the SanFrancisco Bay Area and beyond.
She is the host of the Legacyof Love podcast that redefines
what is the meaning of leaving alegacy.
Here are a few takeaways fromthis episode.
(26:30):
Legacy is not only about wealth.
You don't need to have billionsto leave something meaningful
behind.
Avoiding the conversation causesmore pain than having it in the
first place and whether you'resolo, aging in a blended family
or caring for aging parents, afiduciary can bring you peace of
(26:54):
mind.
If you've been avoiding thisend-of-life conversation, here
are some easy things to empoweryou to move forward.
Ask yourself what stories andmemories you want to leave
behind.
Locate your legal documents and, if you don't have them, start
working on them and pick onesafe person to talk to and start
(27:17):
the conversation.
For similar episodes onempowering yourself in later
years, check out episodes 96 and125 of Aging with Purpose and
Passion and, if you lovepodcasts for older women, the
Late Bloomer Living podcast willgive you a fresh perspective on
(27:38):
midlife and aging.
On Wednesdays, Yvonne Marchesinterviews inspiring guests and
experts who provide valuableguidance on navigating the
unique challenges in midlife andbeyond, and this podcast is all
about celebrating the courageto grow, change and find joy at
(27:59):
any age.
The link is going to be in theshow notes below.
And where can people learn moreabout you, Sara?
Where can they find yourservices?
Where can they listen to yourpodcast?
What are your links?
Sara Ecklein (28:13):
Yeah, so for social media, I'm most active on
LinkedIn so you can search myname.
I know I'll be linked in theshow notes.
Trustandhonorco is my website.
You can find my podcast there.
We're on kind of all the majorplatforms.
You know Apple, spotify, soonenough, I'll be on YouTube as
(28:36):
well and I also have a freeresource for listeners.
If this conversation resonated.
It's a legacy of love workbookand really it's an exercise for
wherever you're at in yourplanning journey, whether you've
spent zero time on it or maybeyou already have an estate plan.
This is a like we talked about.
(28:58):
This is an ongoing kind ofcultivation and conversation
with ourself and loved ones, sogetting clear on your values, on
your wishes, the legacy thatyou want to both live and leave
behind.
So you can also get that in thelink in the show notes.
Beverley Glazer (29:16):
Excellent.
All Sara's services are on mysite too.
That's re-inventimpossiblecom.
And, of course, they're in theshow notes below.
And so, my friends, what's nextfor you?
Are you just going through themotions or are you living a life
that you truly love?
Get my free guide to go fromstuck to unstoppable, and that's
(29:40):
also in the show notes below.
You can connect with me,beverly Glazer, on all social
media platforms and in mypositive group on Facebook.
That's Women Over 50 Rock, andthank you for listening.
Have you enjoyed thisconversation?
Please subscribe.
Help us spread the word bydropping a review and sending it
(30:01):
to a friend, and remember youonly have one life, so live it
with purpose and passion.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
Thank you for joining us.
You can connect with Bev on herwebsite, reinventimpossiblecom
and, while you're there, joinour newsletter Subscribe so you
don't miss an episode.
Until next time, keep agingwith purpose and passion and
celebrate life.
Welcome to Aging with Purpose and Passion, the
podcast designed to inspire yourgreatness and thrive through
life.
Get ready to conquer your fears.
Here's your hostpsychotherapist, coach and
empowerment expert, BeverlyGlazer.
Beverley Glazer (00:30):
How do you protect your loved ones when you
don't have millions of dollarsin a trust?
Well, welcome to Aging withPurpose and Passion, the podcast
for women over 50 who are readyto stop settling and live life
on their own terms.
Each week, you will hear rawconversations, inspiring stories
(00:51):
and get practical tools to helpyou reignite your fire.
I'm Beverley Glazer and I'm atransformational coach and
therapist for women ready toreclaim their voice and break
free from what's holding themback, and you can find me on
reinventimpossiblecom.
Sara Ecklein is the founder ofTrust and Honor and host of the
(01:17):
Legacy of Love, a podcast toredefine what it means to leave
a legacy.
She's a licensed professionalfiduciary and she helps ordinary
families, not just the rich andfamous, to protect their loved
ones with intention, clarity andheart.
Do you think that a legacy isjust about money and wills?
(01:39):
In this episode, we areflipping the script and we'll be
showing you how to protect yourfamily, your wishes and your
peace of mind, even if you don'thave a huge estate.
So keep listening and welcomeSarah.
Sara Ecklein (01:59):
Oh, Bev, thank you for that warm welcome.
I'm so happy to be here.
Beverley Glazer (02:05):
Thank you for that warm welcome.
I'm so happy to be here, Sara,you're younger than 50.
And that's what I thought wouldbe most interesting, and that's
why you're here as a guest,because our audience is over 50.
And so, simply because of that,that makes you very special, I
have to say, because at 24, youhad a wake-up call.
(02:28):
What was that wake-up call?
Sara Ecklein (02:33):
Yeah well, it was really being witnessed to a
final like kind of the finalthree days of a loved one's life
.
My partner at the time's auntgot referred to hospice.
She was dying of brain cancer.
She was actually in her fifties.
She had two children, both inhigh school, and when we got the
(02:59):
call I put everything down.
I was working left and we droveup and it just had this profound
impact on my life.
Of course I didn't know it atthe time and I do describe it as
it was like a mysticalspiritual experience for me,
where all the noise and thechatter and busyness of life
(03:22):
just goes away with death.
I say death is kind of theultimate truth serum and it can
bring into full focus, like ourown, like life and life force.
Whether you believe in God,whatever your spiritual beliefs
and religious beliefs are, Ithink we're all connected to
(03:43):
that life force.
So for me, being witness to herdeath just was being so present
to this unconditional lovingpresence and I noticed in myself
this wanting to lean in andbeing present to her dying.
And most people they don't havethat inclination I find most
(04:06):
people are running away fromdeath.
So it was so obvious for methat this was a calling, of a
place, of where I needed toserve.
I originally thought that Iwould be working as a hospice
nurse and started going back toschool, and then some things
weren't quite aligned andeventually my path led me to
(04:29):
working for a professionalfiduciary, and really the rest
is history.
Beverley Glazer (04:35):
It sure is.
But for those who do not knowwhat is a professional fiduciary
, Explain what that is.
Sara Ecklein (04:45):
Yeah.
So I think, first off, it'simportant to just point out that
I'm based in California.
I'm in the San Francisco BayArea.
California does things a littledifferently than most states
and we're one of two states thatactually has licensing for this
profession.
(05:05):
So that's where, with the workthat I do, it really does become
state specific.
Or I know that you're outsideof the US, you're in Canada, and
so working with an attorney inyour local area is very
important.
But, that being said, the workthat I do, I describe it as an
(05:27):
umbrella term of different hatsthat I can wear.
So I can act as someone'sguardian we use the word
conservator to distinguishbetween a minor and an adult,
but in essence it's the samerole, it's just conservators or
for someone over the age of 18.
(05:48):
I can act as a trustee, as anexecutor, and I think also one
of the wonderful things that Ican do is act as someone's agent
for both finance and healthcare.
So with whatever hat I'mwearing for my clients,
typically I'm wearing multiple,but not always.
(06:09):
Sometimes I'm only wearing,like the trustee hat, for
example, but a lot of times I'mkind of supporting both the
financial aspects of people lifeand also that really
person-centered focus of makinghealthcare decisions and it's
really just I can't say where Idescribe the work that I do as
(06:31):
like this head and heartalignment where I'm absolutely
of service to my clients everyday.
There's not a day that goes bythat I don't question the impact
that I have.
But then, of course, there'sjust always this interest and
engaging because people haveunique lives and own different
assets and have different familydynamics.
(06:51):
So when I come into the familyand and supporting and whatever
hat that I'm wearing, I'm alwayslearning and always growing.
Beverley Glazer (07:01):
So it's deeper than just being a financial
advisor.
That's what I'm hearing.
Sara Ecklein (07:06):
Yeah, yeah, and I, I, you know, I actually a lot
of times when people hear theword fiduciary, they confuse me
and think that I'm a financialadvisor, because financial
advisors can also be held tothat same fiduciary standard
that I'm held to, which reallyfiduciary means you're putting
your client's interest beforeyour own, which unfortunately is
(07:30):
not the standard in allprofessions.
You think it would, but that'snot always the case.
But yeah, I don't manage money.
I would partner with afinancial advisor for clients
that have enough assets forthose services.
But yeah, no, I know my clientsvery intimately, very closely.
(07:53):
I know all of my clients and,depending on what role I'm at,
sometimes it can be asfrequently as meeting twice a
week like in-person meetings.
Of course, that's when I'mtypically wearing the hat of a
healthcare decision maker andsupporting someone kind of
during their kind of final youknow, their final season in life
(08:15):
.
Beverley Glazer (08:17):
But there can be all kinds of different family
units.
What happens if there'scomplication between the
children or they say what, youdon't trust me, you don't trust
us.
What happens there when there'sconflict?
Sara Ecklein (08:33):
Yeah, I mean, that's not an easy answer.
My initial thoughts are a lotof times why a professional is
needed is because there isconflict.
So I think you know we can allagree that families are changing
right.
People are living longer,people are choosing to either
(08:54):
have fewer children or nochildren at all.
You know, divorce rates are,you know, I think, 51% at least
in the United States, and thenalso remarriage.
This all adds complexity.
So let's just talk about myactive cases.
(09:16):
A lot of times I am coming inmaybe needing to be a neutral
party and really look at what isin the client's best interest,
and there can be those dynamicswhere, you know, siblings are
fighting of what's really bestto do and I have to be that
neutral party.
I also work with clients in theplanning phase and this is a
(09:40):
lot of what I love to speak on.
I think that there's so muchthat we can do proactively, not
only for our own selves but alsoour loved ones and that future
generation.
When things go well, I findit's not by chance Things go
(10:02):
well for families that arereally leaning in to the hard
conversations.
We're willing to look and faceour own mortality and death and
I would say that we're really adeath denying culture.
So death is a big taboo,money's a big taboo, money's a
(10:24):
big taboo.
And then with also familydynamics and stuff, there can
just be a lot of shame andwanting to avoid the difficult,
hard conversations.
And so I think it makes senseof why I don't know the
statistics in Canada, but Iwould guess that it's not far
off from the U?
S but the United States onlyone in three people actually
(10:47):
have an estate plan, um, and somost people aren't planning, and
so of course it would makesense that you know I think most
of us know the examples offamilies being torn apart, um,
you know, after the matriarchand patriarchs of the family
pass away, and fighting overthings.
And that's so much of whatinspired me to launch my podcast
(11:11):
called the Legacy of Love,because I think that if we're
really cultivating not only justthese difficult conversations
but cultivating these qualitieswithin ourselves, I think at the
end of the day, this reallydoes come down to identity and
who we're choosing to be and thelegacy, not that only that we
(11:32):
will leave, but the legacy thatwe're living.
Beverley Glazer (11:36):
Beautifully said.
Let me ask you, what ifsomebody says well, I don't have
very much money, I don't havemillions of dollars for a trust
and now I'm going to be hiringsomeone else, which will be even
more money.
But what to speak to that?
Do you really need a hugeamount of money?
(11:56):
Who comes to you?
Sara Ecklein (11:59):
Yeah, yeah.
So I would say, for the mostpart, for clients that choose to
work with a professional, andalso let me, I think it's
important to say I think mostfamilies aren't going to work
with a professional.
So, people that you're choosingto either be your executor,
(12:21):
your trustee, your agent, makinghealthcare decision makers for
you, I think for most peopleit's going to be someone in your
life, whether it's your adultchildren, extended family, an
entrusted friend.
So it's not that everyone needsto work with a professional,
it's more of that.
(12:41):
We really need to be thinkingthis through and planning and
hopefully, you know, I feel likeI find that maybe then less
people might even needprofessionals, but anyways,
we're we're far off from thatday.
Beverley Glazer (12:56):
For sure, for sure.
But what if somebody says well,I have a, I don't have much
money, I really have a smallestate.
Sara Ecklein (13:03):
Yeah, and you know , bev, that's where I get really
kind of fired up.
I think it's so much of youknow kind of misinformation
within you know, betweenHollywood and movies and you
know what is the story that'sbeing shown to us, right, we can
(13:23):
think of shows like Succession,right, where it's like this
billion dollar family, butthere's just so many movies
where, yeah, it's only kind ofseen for the wealthy.
Or if you hear the word trustfund, you assume that that
person has a lot of money.
Again, I can really speakmostly to California.
(13:44):
Has a lot of money.
Again, I can really speakmostly to California.
We just had a recent changethis year of bumping up that
threshold, whether or not youneed to go to probate court or
not.
Before it was about $180,000.
So if your estate was more thanthat it really made sense to
set up a trust.
(14:05):
It's just bumped up to likearound 750,000.
I'm not an attorney so I don'tknow the specifics, but still,
like you know, especially youknow, in the cities right, I'm
in the Bay Area and LA I meanmost homes are over a million
dollars where in California.
(14:25):
So that's where, more timesthan not, it still makes sense
to set up a trust.
But the other piece, I think, isthat our estate plan isn't only
about our assets.
It's also directing of who'sgoing to be making decisions for
you in the event of yourincapacity.
(14:46):
So that's what your power ofattorney document is for, that's
what your advanced health caredirective is for.
Everyone needs those documents.
These are crucial because Ithink that's where you know,
going back to kind of one of mypoints of we're a death denying
culture and why, the more that Ikind of peel the onion of why
(15:09):
do people not plan, I think Ireally come to that our brain
tricks us and the denial ofdeath is kind of part of kind of
our biology we're going tothink that there's always a
tomorrow, kind of our biology.
We're going to think thatthere's always a tomorrow.
So, yeah, I think that that'swhere it is a bit of like this
(15:36):
perfect storm between kind ofwhat we're fed from media, of
misinformation, and how weshould think about estate
planning.
But really, at the end of theday, once you're turn 18, there
are certain documents that wecan really all have.
I'm finding more attorneysactually are beginning to kind
of broadcast that like if yourchild's going off to college.
These are some of the keypieces that you could do,
(15:57):
because if something happens tothem, even though you're a
parent, you might not bereceiving any information on
them, especially with thathealthcare piece Right, so
crucial.
Beverley Glazer (16:09):
What challenges do you see older women face?
Sara Ecklein (16:13):
Oh well, um, we live longer, right, we live
longer.
So, um, yeah, I have a lot, alot of my clients are the single
ladies, um, whether or not theywere married and they're just
the surviving spouse or theywere never married and didn't
have children.
(16:34):
Um, those are some of my, myfavorite clients, cause I
support them in a lot of rolesand we build really close
relationships.
But, yeah, the, I think it'sjust that right, we're living
longer and, you know, also, forthe single ladies, they might
not have as many assets, as youknow, as as people that are, you
(16:58):
know, married and you know,partnered with a man and you
know partnered with a man, sothere might not be as many
resources.
So that actually is like one ofmy you know, my, I would say,
more recent clients that havepassed.
She passed a couple of yearsago and we had a really close
(17:23):
relationship.
I got involved in her life whenshe was having a full-on medical
crisis in her seventies, sostill fairly young.
She was working basically upuntil that as an accountant and
she basically didn't really havea well-thought-out plan,
(17:49):
thought out plan.
She was single, never married,no children, and where she lived
she was on the top floor, thethird floor of her condo, no
elevators, so three flights ofstairs to get there and she kept
falling, getting hospitalized,transferred to a rehab facility
to heal, then going back homeand the whole cycle would happen
again.
That happened four times beforeI started working with her.
(18:12):
So there was a huge kind ofmess with her financial life
because basically bills weren'tpaid, some like around six
months.
So bringing her kind of up todate on paying all the bills.
And then there was also thislike needing to assess what's
(18:37):
really going on medically andthat took a lot of time because
what was happening was shedidn't have that person
alongside her and her cognitivedecline was also part and tied
into her physical decline.
It was all kind of going handin hand.
And so she's getting thesedischarge paperwork and the
(18:59):
doctor is talking to her.
She wasn't really able toretain what was going on, so
needing to go back over the lastsix months figure out what was
going on and she was a bit of amystery.
So even there there wasn't liketotal clarity.
It was also advocating andneeding to push for more exams,
(19:20):
but also building therelationships with her medical
team.
And then I would say the lastpiece that was really important
was she finally, before Istarted working with her, was
placed at an assisted livingfacility but it really wasn't
sustainable for her budget.
She was, like I said, in her70sies and while she had a lot
(19:45):
going on medically, I was stillplanning for longevity and she
also.
Not only was it not sustainablefinancially, but I don't think
it was the best place for her.
This woman was super private,liked her space, and with larger
facilities there's more staffand there's a lot of different
(20:07):
people going in and out, so kindof the other piece that I
worked with her over the monthsfirst working together was
finding a better place for herand I moved her to.
We have what's called a boardand care but there's licensing,
but it is it's a home.
It's in residential Um, butnurses live in house and she
(20:28):
lived with four other women.
She had this beautiful um kindof master bedroom that opened
out to the garden and she hadthe care and the support, plus
it was less expensive.
So it really ended up beingkind of a good fit for her and
she lived there her final yearsand it was just.
It was better.
She was having issues of justfeeling like agitated and
(20:54):
aggravated of all these peoplecoming in and out of her room
before to then just having twopeople that were supporting her
and really kind of building thatsense of support and community
and really kind of building thatsense of support and community.
Beverley Glazer (21:05):
When I'm listening, I'm thinking Sarah,
you are like a professionalfriend and daughter.
Oh, that's so sweet.
That's how I'm sure yourclients look at you, Because
it's a matter of trust.
And what can you tell someonewho is just like that, that
(21:36):
client that you have thatdoesn't not want to start the
conversation, that even haschildren or people that they can
rely on, but they're justafraid of opening up that
difficult conversation?
Sara Ecklein (21:42):
afraid of opening up that difficult conversation.
I know it's hard to go thereright, especially when we're not
willing or resistant to it.
I can't I mean I can paintpictures of kind of like the
horror stories of when we don't,when we don't plan, you know,
if we're not willing to do that.
So that's where I really liketo speak to is who are we going
(22:04):
to choose to be, you know, forourselves, for our family?
There's times in our lives andI definitely see this kind of
with the there's kind of like aparting of two camps.
You know our senior years camps, you know our senior years.
(22:27):
There's the people that reallyembrace it, that are willing to
pivot, that are resilient, thatare flexible, and then there's
the people that are kind ofholding on to the past and who
they once were and not willingto change, and I can kind of
anticipate that over the years,as they're declining, it's going
to be a real fighting battle.
(22:49):
We can frame this season aswhat are we moving towards?
What is our vision?
What do we want to leave for?
You know our legacy, whether ornot you have children or not,
(23:09):
just also for the world and thenext generation.
And I think that the more thatwe're willing to have the
difficult conversations, even ifit's, you know, I think, most
importantly for ourselves toreally acknowledge that you know
we're not able to do what weonce were, and how can we plan
around that things are going togo so much better in this season
(23:33):
of life?
I had a client pass a couple ofyears ago who was 110 years so,
and she's always my model clientwhen I work with clients in the
planning phase.
So you know our longevity yes,it can be so long, but we also
want these years to be qualityyears, right, we don't only want
(23:55):
to just be fighting the processand also resistant to building
in the support and the communitythat we need during our you
know, our aging years.
So you know, whether or notyou're working with a
professional, whether you'rejust building that support with
your family, it's again just, Ithink, reminding us, like we
(24:17):
know that right, the truth thatyou know things are going to, of
course, change and evolve.
You know, and you can also seethat, like with, things are
going to, of course, change andevolve.
You know, and you can also seethat, like with people's homes
and people's belongings,especially like that next
generation Most people you knowdon't appreciate, like the
antiques and the and the China.
So that's where also beingproactive and, and you know,
(24:41):
downsizing now, not requiring acrisis.
It really is a night and daydifference.
Beverley Glazer (24:49):
So plan for yourself, don't fear, it is what
I'm hearing.
Sara Ecklein (24:54):
Yeah.
Beverley Glazer (24:55):
We all know the end result.
Don't deny it.
Do it with power.
Sara Ecklein (25:01):
Yeah, it's definitely stepping into that.
I mean, when we're in controlof our own change, like that
feels right, like we're allhuman, that feels way better to
let go of those things that youno longer need.
Then, oh my gosh, I'm goingthrough a medical crisis, I'm
forced to kind of downsize, Ican no longer live at home
(25:25):
because my care needs are toohigh, and now you're just going
through like kind of thesemultiple losses, like a whole
shock to the system.
So I think the more that we'rekind of cultivating this like
ongoing in our relationship, itreally can give us the
opportunity to evolve and growinto those like wise women.
Beverley Glazer (25:48):
Right, that's what I try to embody, even in my
30s I think you're doing a very, very good job and you left
some wonderful information.
We have to open up to it.
Get out of the denial.
I want to thank you, sarah.
Sarah Ecklein is a Californialicensed professional fiduciary
(26:09):
and founder of Trust and Honor,a mindful fiduciary agency
serving families in the SanFrancisco Bay Area and beyond.
She is the host of the Legacyof Love podcast that redefines
what is the meaning of leaving alegacy.
Here are a few takeaways fromthis episode.
(26:30):
Legacy is not only about wealth.
You don't need to have billionsto leave something meaningful
behind.
Avoiding the conversation causesmore pain than having it in the
first place and whether you'resolo, aging in a blended family
or caring for aging parents, afiduciary can bring you peace of
(26:54):
mind.
If you've been avoiding thisend-of-life conversation, here
are some easy things to empoweryou to move forward.
Ask yourself what stories andmemories you want to leave
behind.
Locate your legal documents and, if you don't have them, start
working on them and pick onesafe person to talk to and start
(27:17):
the conversation.
For similar episodes onempowering yourself in later
years, check out episodes 96 and125 of Aging with Purpose and
Passion and, if you lovepodcasts for older women, the
Late Bloomer Living podcast willgive you a fresh perspective on
(27:38):
midlife and aging.
On Wednesdays, Yvonne Marchesinterviews inspiring guests and
experts who provide valuableguidance on navigating the
unique challenges in midlife andbeyond, and this podcast is all
about celebrating the courageto grow, change and find joy at
(27:59):
any age.
The link is going to be in theshow notes below.
And where can people learn moreabout you, Sara?
Where can they find yourservices?
Where can they listen to yourpodcast?
What are your links?
Sara Ecklein (28:13):
Yeah, so for social media, I'm most active on
LinkedIn so you can search myname.
I know I'll be linked in theshow notes.
Trustandhonorco is my website.
You can find my podcast there.
We're on kind of all the majorplatforms.
You know Apple, spotify, soonenough, I'll be on YouTube as
(28:36):
well and I also have a freeresource for listeners.
If this conversation resonated.
It's a legacy of love workbookand really it's an exercise for
wherever you're at in yourplanning journey, whether you've
spent zero time on it or maybeyou already have an estate plan.
This is a like we talked about.
(28:58):
This is an ongoing kind ofcultivation and conversation
with ourself and loved ones, sogetting clear on your values, on
your wishes, the legacy thatyou want to both live and leave
behind.
So you can also get that in thelink in the show notes.
Beverley Glazer (29:16):
Excellent.
All Sara's services are on mysite too.
That's re-inventimpossiblecom.
And, of course, they're in theshow notes below.
And so, my friends, what's nextfor you?
Are you just going through themotions or are you living a life
that you truly love?
Get my free guide to go fromstuck to unstoppable, and that's
(29:40):
also in the show notes below.
You can connect with me,beverly Glazer, on all social
media platforms and in mypositive group on Facebook.
That's Women Over 50 Rock, andthank you for listening.
Have you enjoyed thisconversation?
Please subscribe.
Help us spread the word bydropping a review and sending it
(30:01):
to a friend, and remember youonly have one life, so live it
with purpose and passion.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
Thank you for joining us.
You can connect with Bev on herwebsite, reinventimpossiblecom
and, while you're there, joinour newsletter Subscribe so you
don't miss an episode.
Until next time, keep agingwith purpose and passion and
celebrate life.
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