Episode 108: Ketchup Or Blood? Better Grab A French Fry (Daniel LaPlante-Murderer)

In this week's episode, Abby brings us back to the true crime of it all with the horrible story of Daniel LaPlante. Although this story is chock-full of disclaimers and content warnings, the gang forges ahead with the story about a disturbed teenager who would go on to commit heinous crimes against the Bowen family and the Gustafson family during the 1980s in Massachusetts, culminating in the murder of three innocent lives.

Credits:
The Boston Globe
Allthatsinteresting.com
celticssentenial.com
wikipedia.com
newspaperarchive.com
cbsnews.com
talkmurderwithme.com
Redhanded podcast episode 103

Music By:
Brokeforfree.com
Matt Edwards

Edited By:
Michael

Website:
https://anxiousandafraidthepod.com/

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
I mean, if you don't havetime, you could just leave it with
me to go there anyway. Imight, But then I also have your
guys, this Mexico present that Ikeep forgetting to give you. Oh yeah,
that's right. I could have broughtit for you, but I did,
right, So I'll just keep itfrom myself. After I slaved morning

(00:27):
after morning for your cats. I'msure I thought they were my cats.
If you were like, okay,well we have to just get these cats.
Great, Hello, I'm going inhot dramatic. I know. I

(00:58):
was like, do I have togasp a Well, hey, guys,
welcome, Welcome. Yeah, I'mhappy and I'm Shana and this is anxious
and afraid the gasping episode. Indeed, there probably will be gaps. I'm
really good at a good gasp.Honestly, you're a classic gasper. Sometimes
I guessed too much. Sometime Isay I wouldn't say that, but everyone's

(01:21):
got their opinions. Welcome, Welcometo this where we talk about terrible things
and we're here for it. SoI'm going to be really proactive. You're
going to be really proud of meright now? What made you anxious and

(01:42):
afraid the proudness I have for youfor asking first. It should be at
least a good handful. It's throughthe roof. It's through the roof.
She's also proud of me because Ihad to deal with a spider before we
started. Yes, thank you somuch for being the brave soul you guys.
I'm growing because I didn't kill it. I got it in a cup,

(02:05):
honestly, and I'm I'm not onefor that. I'm sorry. I'm
sorry, but I kill spider.It's going to depend on the spider.
Some of them also true that one. You know. It's like, some
people really don't like the furry jumpingspiders, but I think they're kind of
cute as far as spiders go.So anyway, I got it. It's
outside. It's fine. I getwhy they're cute, but I also do
not like them, so it's fair. They move, it did move too

(02:29):
quickly. Do not like the waythey move. They jump, it's terrifying.
They're little, but they're thick.They're thick. I think that's why
I'm okay with them, because Ithink the Spindley spiders are way worse to
me. Interesting, I mean,because they're kind of like still spider,
thick in furry, kind of likea little critter. You know, sure,
sure, I get it, Iget it. However, for me,

(02:51):
they're still a spider, still aspider. That's fair. Okay,
Well, anyway I could be agood What what made me anxious? I
was gonna get We started anxious,We did we it was on brand.
I was going to say the dentist, because I had to go to the
dentist, and it's never good foryou. It's literally, I don't think
I've ever had a good experience.You literally always have problems, and I'm
so sorry. I go multiple timesa year because I have to because my

(03:15):
teeth are just made of chalk,I guess. And you have supersonic saliva.
Supersonic I haven't told. My salivais on the acidic side. The
good news is I never have plaque. The bad news is I also have
no enamel, so the so cavitiesare ever present. I like almost always

(03:38):
have one, even though I brushand floss, and you're so good with
your teeth. I try, Ido try. I guess. If I
didn't try, I wouldn't have anyleft. But I've spent a small fortune
all my mouth just trying to keepmy teeth in my face right. So
anyway, I had to get workdone the other week because I had two

(03:59):
tin cavities, and when I wasat the dentist for cleaning a few weeks
later, one of the spots theyworked on which I wasn't really aware of,
but they touched that with a firstit was like the water pick,
and then it was oh yeah no. Then it was like a buffer,
and then it was one of thosemetal picks. And each time I about

(04:19):
jumped off that table, I likejerked super hard. The girl kept apologizing.
Eventually she was just like I'm noteven going to touch it. I'm
like, thank you because it feelslike white hot nerve pain. So anyway,
I'm gonna have to get more workdone done. I'm so sorry.
The story some of the worst painever. Yeah, they had to do
full X rays while I was therebecause I hadn't had that done a long

(04:40):
time. They're like, hey,we found something else, like awesome,
awesome, please keep it coming's next. I'm so excited for my journey.
Yeah, They're like, you knowthat root canal you had done? I
was like, literally, which oneit's been? I've had multiple and they're
like, well, we found ashadow, and that might be an absence.
I'm not supposed to have a shadows. Awesome for me. So anyway,

(05:01):
that was what made me anxious.What made you anxious? Living?
Yeah, I mean baseline living living? I mean, can I just milk
the moving for a while. Youcan milk that for weeks? Okay,
So this is the stage I'm at. It is legally ours. We did
the signing for it. Random applause. Shanna is a homeowner, you disgusting

(05:27):
owner over here. You just gonnahave to pay house property taxes. We're
so happy it's included in the loone. Yeah, so that happened. That
was really crazy. So yeah,we're gonna get keys like next week,
and we're packing up. I mean, the kitchen's getting started, like things
are scattered everywhere. Moving is soit's kind of exciting because you get to

(05:53):
like pick a new home for everything. Sure, but it's also I don't
know, we're still got the badpart of it. Yeah, packing is
the worst. Un Packing is kindof fun. Unpacking is fun. Finally
being at the new house, eventhough everything is in boxes, is still
kind of fun. Yeah, Imean, especially when you first get there
and nothing's unpacked. It's kind oflike camping. Yeah, and you kind
of like, oh, what where, where's their place? Like where are

(06:15):
we gonna put things sleep in onthe floor on a mattress and have pizza?
I don't know. It's kind offun, that's kind of funny,
but it is a lot of work. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so
excited for you guys. I'm soexcited to see this house. I have
not seen it yet. You thinkyou thank you. I am so excited.
I definitely want like you guys needto come over like all the time.
I need to tell if you don'tcheck out my bedroom. Hello exactly,

(06:39):
Sorry, Ryland, this is actuallymy bedroom right right exactly part time.
Yeah, we can share a bed, but yeah we need to have
barbecues, we need to have sleepovers, we need to have all of the
parties. Yep, we're gonna doit barbecue. I already said that.
But yeah, oh housewarming party onits way. It's gonna be so fun.
Yep. But I'm at very fairto be anxious about it because it

(07:02):
is a lot. Yeah, justhaving like everything like scattered and not like
where it should be, and everything'slike staying a mess like gets to me
after a while as a virgo,that's just not okay. It's just like
there's nowhere to really have like apiece of mind because everything is everywhere.
Yes, so that's kind of whereI'm at. Okay, well that's fair.

(07:27):
Sorry. Jesse just texted me.She's like, when are you coming
over? And I'm like, uh, I have things to give her.
She's about to have a baby.Yeah, we talk about that. She's
getting ready for her girl maybe numbertwo maybe number two probably next week is
going to be here. I can'teven believe it. I mean I can,
but like, whoa all over again, It's like so weird. So
much is happening right now? Isit's happening all at once? That's always

(07:48):
how it goes, it really is. Yeah, man, So everyone send
your good positive vibes our good friendJesse. Yep, she's got push A
baby needs it for sure. Yeah. But yeah, yeah, yay,
life good things are still happening allover. Yeah. So for your teeth,
sorry, well yeah, I don'thave anything good to say about my

(08:11):
teeth. They're beautiful. Thank you. I love your smile. Don't quit
smiling. I won't even when Ihad half a tooth missing in the front,
that's right. I don't know ifI've ever told that story when I
was a kid. I've never trulyseen it. Oh well, well,
it's like glued. It's in thereunless it falls out. But I don't

(08:33):
think I saw it when it cameout that one time I fell on my
face pretty hard when I was akid and broke my front tooth. Poor
thing. So there's only half ofit there, but you can't tell due
to modern dentistry. Collaps to moderndentistry, claps, claps, claps.
Honestly, if we weren't now,like in this time period, I would
if we were like two hundred yearsago, I would probably have no teeth

(08:56):
left, no teeth, wooden dentures. Ugh, fuck, I would be
a cute Look, do we haveanything else in the front to talk about?
In the front? No, Ithink we're good. Honestly, I'm
ready for a story. Are youokay? This one's going to be a
doozy It's yeah, Oh I knowyou. You're changing the vibe immediately,

(09:20):
Okay, just got sad. Okay, we're getting serious for today's episode,
which is one hundred and eight.Oh yes, one hundred and eight episodes.
Wow, I thought it was timeto bring us back to the true
crime side of things. Yes,here we are doing it. Yes,

(09:43):
specifically, I want to tell astory that involves something I'm personally terrified of,
which is a phenomenon called frogging.Have you heard of it? No?
So with a pH frogging? Okay, what the hell is that?
I'm not going to tell you.Oh, forget it. So, yeah,
I was thinking you probably didn't knowwhat it was because I didn't know

(10:07):
what it was called. Like,I knew it was a thing, but
I didn't know how to name.Oh, okay, so maybe I know
it, but I don't know thatit's called froggy. Yes, okay,
interesting, I mean you do knowit, you just know it. But
yeah, it's got a name nobodyreally probably knows very well. Okay,
Okay, I am going to givea content warning up top because there's going
to be murders. I'll give youa warning with more specifics before they happen.

(10:31):
But if true crime isn't what youlisten to the show for, you
might not enjoy this episode. Andone more disclaimer. The story I'm about
to tell has been covered on alot of shows. And websites. It's
one of those stories where there havebeen so many versions, like and embellishments
over the years that's pretty hard tofind the legit story. Yeah, to

(10:56):
the point where it's almost lower atthis point. Oh really Yeah, So
this story, I guess you couldsay it's kind of like in two acts.
Like the first act is uh moremurky, that's more the lore side
of it. Okay, the secondact is definitely more concrete. Okay,
so take the first part with agrain of salt. That's what I'm saying.

(11:16):
Okay. And normally I don't liketo do, you know, stories
that aren't like verified, but itis just like such a crazy story.
I feel like I had to doit, Okay, all right, very
intrigued. Yes, and there arekids in the story, so I'm already
breaking my own rules on not doingany kids stories. But we said that

(11:37):
like like two episodes ago. SoI was like, I will never do
a story teach oldren here I am. Unfortunately it happens, Okay, all
right, we're ready for that mentally, Okay, Yeah, I did pick
the story before I knew about thesecond half that involved children. But anyway,
and because there's kids, I thinkthat's another reason why it's kind of
murky in parts, because maybe thingsweren't disclosed to the public. Sure,

(12:00):
yeah, okay, so I'm goingto start telling you the story before backstory
for a dramatic effect. That's whatI say. Sometimes that's funny to build
suspense. All right. So theyear is nineteen eighty six. We are
in Pepperell, Massachusetts, a smalltown about thirty minutes outside of Boston.

(12:20):
Okay. Residing in that town wasa small family called the Bowens. There
was also a source naming them asthe Andrews family, but most sources named
them the Bowens. Okay. TheBowens family consisted of Frank Bowen, who
was the father of Tina and KarenBowen, who were both teenage girls.
The family had just tragically lost theirmother to cancer, and we're all doing

(12:43):
their best to continue with work inschool, although I'm sure it was really
tough with losing your mom at thatage. Oh yeah. Frank was now
a single dad, working constantly tomeet ends as a bus driver. Because
of this, the girls were largelyleft at home alone to take care of
themselves while their dad worked. Oneday, while at home, Tina gets

(13:05):
a phone call from a boy,and it's a boy she doesn't know.
He introduces himself as Daniel or DannyLaplant and tells her he got a number
or her number through a mutual friend. Some sources say that they went to
the same school. Others say thatthey went to different schools. It probably
makes more sense that they had goneto different schools since she didn't know who
he was. I guess Daniel hadseen Tina out and about and thought she

(13:31):
was cute. And because this wasthe eighties, I guess it just wasn't
that weird to track down a Randa'sphone number and then just call them.
Sure. Yeah, at different time, technology wasn't there yet. Do you
remember looking through phone books for phonenumbers? Oh? My god, that's
how we ordered pizza, my codWe're old. We're so old. I
actually remember using phone books. Yeah, as a kid, we legit used

(13:52):
phone books. We kind of gotexcited when you got the new phone book
every year. That's sad, okayanyway, aging, So the pairs start
talking regularly on the phone, andthey seem to have a like a genuine
connection. Daniel allegedly describes himself aslike tall and athletic looking sports, Tina's

(14:13):
like cute into it. Eventually,Daniel gets up the courage to ask Tina
out on a date and she acceptsthe day. The day comes and Tina
is excited to finally meet this cuteguy she's been talking to on the phone,
but when he shows up at herhouse, she finds he isn't anything

(14:33):
like he described himself to be.He was described as being on the shorter
side, with dark hair, poorhygiene, bedskin, like he just really
kind of sold himself so completely different. So Tina doesn't really know what to
do, and it's like awkward.Yeah, on one hand, she liked
talking to him on the phone,but he had described himself so differently,

(14:54):
which is kind of like a redflag. Sure, and I feel for
her because he don't want to beseen a shallow you know, and base
everything off of looks. But likethe shock is seeing someone so different from
what you had imagined would be jarring. Yeah, And it's like, we
don't have pictures, we don't haveFaceTime, we don't have social media,
so there is no way to knowwhat that person is like except for how

(15:16):
they describe themselves. And clearly thatwas a lie, So how do you
feel about that? That's odd?Why would you lie so hard? Because
if you're lying right from the start, like, that's not a great way
to start a relationship. And ofcourse, you know, being a girl,
you don't want to be rude,you want to be polite. Yeah,
he And it's also like he didn'thave to describe himself as good looking.
Sure he didn't have to do thatfor sure, Like yeah, yeah,

(15:37):
so here we are. Yeah it'sokay. He kind of just already
put them in an awkward spot.Hate it, okay, but you know,
Tina does what I probably would havedone as a people pleaser. She
gives them a shot. Anyway Iwould too, to be honest, I
would too. Yeah. The Paarago out for ice cream, but the
date doesn't exactly go well. Tinaopens up about the death of her mom,

(15:58):
and Daniel starts asking like really weirdand inappropriate questions about her death,
just asking weird specifics of like howshe died. She looked like, you
know, like just it made herreally uncomfortable and she ended up ending the
date early and she went home.Don't blame her, Okay, Yeah,
that's a that's a line that youright through. You're like strike one,

(16:18):
strike two. This guy is notfor me. Uh so let's see here.
Oh, there was another source thatsaid that they they did go on
the date, but when Tina gotback to school, her friends told her
to stay away from Daniel because hewas facing rape allegations. I couldn't really
find anything concrete on that, soI'm not really sure about that one.
But okay, I'm gonna guess thatthey probably just had an awkward date and

(16:40):
it ended okay either way, shedecides not to see him again. So
this next bit it's also feels likean embellishment. But here we go.
I'm just gonna tell you. Soonafter the date, while her dad was
at work, the sisters decided toeither There was different sources on this either
play was a wig aboard or holda seance to try and contact their late

(17:03):
mother. Oh that makes me sad. It is murky on whether they had
any success in speaking to her.Some sources say that the dad came home
and interrupted their Wigia board session beforethey could close it out, which we
can't see them. It's a bigno no. And the Wisia board were
okay, yep, yep, yep, Shortly after that happened, strange things

(17:23):
started happening around the house. Itemsstarted showing up in different places. The
girls heard knocking on the walls.They would get home from school to find
the TV on super loud, orthe channel would mysteriously change when they weren't
in the room. Weird they beganto notice food items being left out or
half empty beverages left on the table. At first, the girls believed their

(17:48):
late mother was trying to contact them. They heard the knocks, and they
seemed to be intelligent, as ifresponsive to things that they were saying or
doing. They tried to tell theirdad about it, but he didn't believe
them, of course, assuming theywere either messing with each other or doing
this for attention. The sisters werefrustrated that their dad didn't believe them.

(18:08):
They were often home alone and thespooky activity in the house was only escalating.
Once Or stated that Tina even founda family photo pinned to the wall
with a knife through it, andif the sources can be believed, it
would only get worse from there.That's not just a ghost Like ghosts don't

(18:30):
do that. I mean, Imean like nice ghosts, Like sure,
nice ghosts wouldn't do that. It'sjust feel like you've heard stories of like
Poultergeist, Like that kind of soundskind of poultergeisty. It definitely sounds poltergeisty.
And I feel like, yeah,you can hear of like knives like
flying in the air, I guess, but like a photo specifically through a

(18:52):
photo on a wall feels too much. Yeah, I'm with you. I'm
with you. Okay, Okay,So I know I sounded like a broken
record. But this next bit alsohas a few different versions of how it
went down. So one night,the sisters are home alone as usual when
they start hearing the tapping noises again, only now it seems to be coming
from the basement. Against the adviceof nearly every horror movie ever made,

(19:18):
the sisters decide to investigate and creepdown the stairs to the basement. Well,
honestly, who else is gonna doit? These bad ass cossoits we're
helone. I guess we're the onlyone's believing in it. So we're gonna
check it out. We're gonna handleit. Mom, scary, okay there,
uh okay. So when they arriveddownstairs, the girls look on in
horror at the message they find writtenon the wall, seemingly in blood.

(19:44):
The message read I'm in your room, Come find me. I hate it.
That's disgusting, it's so awful.Okay, yeah, I already feel
like I know where this is going. Okay, continue, Okay. Scared
out of their minds, the girlsrun to a neighbor's house and call their
dad, asking him to come homeimmediately. Abso frickingly, that's what you

(20:07):
should have done. That's the move. He rushes home and investigates the basement,
realizing that the message was written inKetchup, not Block Classic. That's,
of course the first choice. Fortunatelyfor the girls, their dad assumes
that they're either messing with him oreach other, and doesn't believe the message
was written by anyone other than themselves. Okay, so I get I guess

(20:30):
for the time, I can understandit. I can understand wanting to brush
it off. Maybe it's grief.Maybe they're acting out because of the grief.
Exactly, I get the reasoning.How however, now we know better,
Well, yeah, I mean itcould they could, I mean even
now, could be just messing withthem. But because they're like dealing with

(20:52):
their grief in just like a messyway, but sure absolutely could totally be
the case. Yeah, but likeI feel like these days, maybe there's
just better resources, yeah, orlike maybe better conversations to have or be
like, like I don't know,maybe address it in a more educated way.
Yeah, definitely, definitely, Andlike from the girls side of things,

(21:12):
like I can't even imagine how sofrustrating, scary, scary, but
you don't have like your one personthat you have to help you, like
creepy, weird things are happening andthat is not you, and they don't
believe you. Yeah, and ifit's truly either case scenario is terrifying to

(21:33):
think about. It's terrifying. Yes, sorry, continue correct, all right,
it's scary. So a couple moreweeks pass and things had quieted down
a bit until the evening of Decembereighth, nineteen eighty six. The sisters
are once again at home watching amovie together when they start to hear noises
again, but this time it's comingfrom upstairs. They creep up the stairs

(21:55):
to investigate, and Tina comes intoher bedroom to find another message in red
letters, I'm back, come findme. I hate it again. The
terrified girls ran to the neighbor's houseand called their dad, who's beyond annoyed,
but came home. Anyway, Imight have licked the message first.
It might have been like, wait, is this ketchup? You grab a

(22:18):
French fry. Let's test it.Don't waste it, grab some French French
fries. Okay, So he getshome. The dad gets home. He
enters the house to investigate. Henotices that the TV is on way louder
than it should be and continues tothe stairs. He climbs the stairs to

(22:41):
Tina's bedroom and sees the message I'mback, come find me. He also
sees another message written in read thatsays marry me. No, that's not
how you do it. Oh no, oh it's still in ketchup. Yeah,
that's not how you do it.Okay. Horrified. The girls didn't

(23:03):
see that at first. No,I don't think they saw that. They
just saw the first message and werelike, see you. Oh my god.
Okay. Horrified. Frank Bowen turnsaway from the message, only to
find a figure standing in the bedroomwearing a white dress what his dead wife's
wedding dress? Wait, okay,I got chills. I feel like I

(23:29):
have barely glimpsed maybe hearing this storybefore. It's like an urban legend,
so I'm sure you have. Okay, there's so many versions of it,
though, this is so screwed up. It's fucked dude, youw Okay,
So who's wearing it? So?Okay, so he did. So this
person's wearing the wedding dress, andhe barely had any time to process that
hideous fact before noticing, right,the figure was also wearing a quote Native

(23:55):
American face paint and wielding a hatchet. This is not anywhere where I was
thinking. Okay, I mean itwas, but also this is very shocking,
sill. Okay, the details areweird, and don't worry. I'll
tell you fifty other details that couldor could not have happened. Okay,
that's true. I guess this couldbe like the upsail right story, like

(24:15):
the most embellished like it. Probablymaybe he didn't have the face paint,
but adding that makes it extra cutey. Yeah, I get it, Okay,
for dramatic effect, I see whythey embellished it this way, but
I really don't think it. Okay, you got me there for a second,
but I'm going to reel it inand I'm back. Okay, welcome.
Frank fled the home and called thepolice before he could find out what

(24:36):
the man wearing his dead wife's weddingdress intended to do with the hatchet.
Hatchet. Okay, that's pretty wild, right, like, maybe even a
little far fetched. So keep thatand hold on to it because there's more.
Okay, I'm pinning it and pinningit to the side. Okay.
There's also a version of the storywhere the intruder is not wearing a wedding
dress, but he does take thewhole family hostage, but Tina is able

(25:00):
to escape and call the police.Another version has the father wrestling the intruder
and getting the hatchet, but theintruder mysteriously disappears in the struggle. Okay,
so literally every scenario possible, We'restill going okay. There is also
a version where the intruder was wearinga Native American style jacket and ninja mask.
Another version says he had the weddingdress on with makeup, red lipstick

(25:22):
and a blonde wig. Oh like, okay, wow, full get up.
A final version I discovered, aftersome really deep digging, might be
the closest to the truth. Okay. There was an article in the Boston
Globe where the Pepperell Police Chief DavidYoung, who worked the case, was
interviewed. He said that the girlshad a friend over one night, and
on this particular night, Frank Bowenwas home not at work. Daniel Plant,

(25:48):
our friend from earlier, yes,allegedly, I'm sure you've guessed,
allegedly, had broken into the housedressed as a Native American wielding a hatchet
and calmly took everyone hostage by forcingthem into a bedroom. He then stole
money and jewelry while the family wassequestered. Uh huh okay. The whole

(26:10):
family and the friend were able toescape out the window during the ordeal and
called the police. The responding officersfound no trace of the intruder, which
led the Bowen family to stay ina nearby hotel for fear of returning to
their home with a maniac on theloose. Two days later, Frank Bowen
decided to return to the home toretrieve some belongings and saw a man standing

(26:30):
in front of a window watching him. Frank again called the police, who
responded to the scene. One ofthe offers officers was named Stephen bees basins
and Stephen by Wait, Stephen B. How you bet. He was interviewed

(26:51):
in the Celtics Centennial saying, quote, when I opened the door on the
right hand wall, I saw aknife sticking out of the wall, and
I see it through family picture,which is probably where that family picture part
comes from. Okay. Written onit in magic marker is quote, I'm
still here, Come find me.And now the hair goes up on the

(27:11):
back of my head. This isthe officer still talking. On the other
wall, I saw another picture sayingI'm gonna kill you all with a knife
through it. The officers continued theirsearch with the home and eventually found the
plant hiding behind a wall in thebathroom. There's like a drawing of it.
I still don't really understand how itworks, but somehow he's behind the

(27:32):
wall in the bathroom. Yes,okay. Upon discovering him, Officer B
recalled, I put my pistol.Sorry, I pulled my pistol and said,
I got the son of a bitchright here, but he didn't move.
I told him, let me seeyour hands, or I will splatter
your brains all over that wall.And I guess that did the trick because
they arrested the Plant without further incident. Okay, uh okay, So just

(28:00):
for shits and giggles, if youwant to go with the first version of
the story where Frank Boone is confrontedby a hatchet wielding little Plant and then
flees the home and calls the police, this is how that version ends.
Okay. When the police arrived,they begin to search the house. Nobody
had seen the intruder escape, sothey assumed he must still be hiding in
the home. Eventually, the policediscovered a cupboard door. Some sources say
it was a cupboard below the stairs, other say it was in Tina's bedroom.

(28:22):
Either way, the police opened thedoor and discovered the intruder hiding in
the small space. They brought theman, or rather boy, out,
and even though Tina didn't initially recognizehim, she would soon find out that
it was none other than gasp DanielLaplant, who had been terrorizing her and
her family for the past several weeks. Something about like somebody sneaking into your

(28:45):
house and like staying there or likedoing creepy things while you're in there.
I hate it so much, LikeI just hate those stories that's frogging.
Ah, when this circle is complete? How is it called froggy? I
don't know. They don't explain why. Maybe someone does, but I just

(29:06):
remember I had to like google,Like, what is it called when you
like secretly live in someone's house.Yeah, like in their atticts or in
their walls. I hate it.I hateah, frogging. I don't.
Yeah, I don't. I don'treally know why they call it that.
But it's too cute of a name, really really like, it's too fun,
it's too playful. I don't it'stoo positive. It needs to be

(29:27):
I needs to have more of acreep factory, because it's like one of
the creepiest things I've ever heard of. No, it needs to be a
little bit more insidious. It's likemore than stocking. It's you're it's in
your house, and it's not squatting, because squatting is when the person doesn't
live there. I see, right, I think, or I think I
don't like the homeowners don't live thereor the person. Yeah, when like

(29:48):
they like people squat and empty houses? Right, yeah, okay, interesting?
All right, So yeah, that'sfrogging for you. This is where
we're at. Yeah, that's why. So I looked up frogging and then
I looked up Frogging store because like, this thing has always freaked me out.
I feel like people have stories.Are you looking at me, Michael?
Okay? I thought maybe he foundsomething. Okay, he was just

(30:10):
admiring my face. It is fora moment. It's fine. He was
like, I wasn't even looking atyou. Okay, all right, so
let's see. Some sources say thatas he was brought out out of the
house, Daniel showed little to noemotion. Others say that he was laughing.
Hate both. I don't like it. Yeah. After further investigation,

(30:30):
it was believed that Laplant had beenliving in the walls, coming out to
eat and drink the family's food,and moving items around when they weren't there.
Yeah, it makes complete sense.The half beverages. Yep, yeah,
I hate it. And then likea gross of course, like you
rather think of a ghost, likeI would rather think of a gast.
Yeah, honestly, like somebody inmy walls, let's make it a ghost.

(30:52):
I don't want to think that there'sa teenager looking at me at all
times when I'm not still a teenat this point, he's doing it as
a teen he's a teenager. Wowyeah, not good. Okay, so
thank you for bearing with me.I promise that the rest of the story
doesn't have twelve versions, but thefirst part of it does. And I
think it's just because everyone's a teenager, so maybe they just didn't release a

(31:14):
lot of details about it. Well, and it's just like such a bizarre
story, and like just adding themore bizarre details just makes it more of
a story. But like you'll asI will continue the story, like there
is crimes that lead to a trial, but even in the trial documents,
I couldn't find anything about this firstbit. Really, they just didn't really

(31:36):
mention it. They or if therewas news articles, it'd be like,
yeah, he was also guilty ofterrorizing a family, but there was ever
not a lot of details. Isit kind of like you know how there's
like not rules for stalking, likeyou can't get in trouble. There's like
no evidence they're technically not like quoteunquote committing a crime. So maybe back
in that day too, like youcan't really prove they were living there.

(31:57):
I guess like what the crime.I guess how I would get in trouble
for it. He does get introuble, he gets arrested, and it's
probably breaking an entering menacing least becausehe does attack the family at one point,
if the okay versus can be believed, Yeah, yeah, he does
get in trouble. But yeah,it's just very vague. And that's why
there's a million different versions out therebecause people just have ran with it.

(32:20):
For sure. It's easy to dothat with this kind of case. I
guess, Yeah, I forgot towrite and breaks. So we're just going
to go fast and loose with itand say, let's take a break.
Okay, Hi, welcome back.Okay, shall we continue? Yes?

(32:42):
Please? Oh okay, Now,because Daniel was only sixteen years old,
he's still a minor sixteen okay.Yeah, he was not taken to jail.
He was instead booked into a juveniledetention facility. Makes sense. Not
much else is known about the Bowenfamily as far as they could find,
but as far as I know,they did their best to recover from the

(33:02):
trauma they had just lived through,and they ended up moving to a different
house. I would Yeah, youcan't really blame him for that, okay,
So I think it's about time wehave some backstory on Daniel Plant,
because like, how do you getto the point where you're living in the
walls of an unsuspecting family? Yeah, especially as a teen. That's a

(33:24):
teen, Like what are your aren'tyour parents wondering where you are? Yeah?
What's your story, little dude.So it may come as no surprise
that Daniel did not have an easychildhood. Right. He was born on
May fifteenth in nineteen seventy. Hegrew up in Townsend, Massachusetts, with
his mother and stepfather, along withhis many siblings. So this is another

(33:45):
kind of horror movie element of thestory. But can you guess what street
name they lived on? Sleepy Hollow? Now close, you're in the right
neighborhood, easy, I did there. The street is Elm Street. Oh
okay, yeah, duh Yeah,so he lives on Elm Street, which
I wonder if Finny, maybe there'sa connection. Yeah, I wonder what

(34:06):
came first? So Daniel's home lifewas not a happy one. He was
allegedly physically and sexually abused by hisbiological father and possibly other adults in his
life. Sucks. It would alsolater come out in court that Daniel had
suffered head injuries in his youth,which we all know can spell out trouble
in some cases. The home helived in was reportedly not great and always

(34:30):
had garbage and junkie old cars inthe yard. Neighbors said that they would
often see Daniel wandering off by himselfto spend time alone in the woods by
his house. Town locals described Laplantas a loaner from a very early age
who showed signs of troubling behavior.Daniel struggled with his hygiene and social awkwardness.

(34:51):
In school. He struggled to makeany friends, and his classmates described
him as creepy and weird. Sosad, yikes, kids are hard Vidal.
He was also diagnosed with dyslexia andhyperactive disorder, which only led to
more struggles in school. In hispersonal life, Daniel was eventually sent to

(35:13):
a psychologist to help him with thetrauma he had experienced from the abuse in
his struggle in high school or sorryin school. Sadly, though, it
was alleged that his psychiatrists also beganto sexually abuse Daniel. Stop. That's
so upsetting. It's like the mostfucked up. I hate this world so
bad. People are bad this worldis bad and people are bad. It's

(35:35):
like, what he just had nochance he had a good Yeah, I
mean, I know this is terriblethat he does terrible things, but like
that's sad. It is it issad. It can be both. He
can be terrible and also have hadreally sad terrible things happened to him a
psychiatrist. That's so infuriating. Yeah, it makes me, Man, it's
sick. If that's true. Ithink that came out in court. So

(35:55):
it's always kind of hard to saybecause they're just a that happened. I'm
not sure if there was any likehard proof, but that factoid wasn't many
sources, so I'm gonna say it'sprobably accurate, Okay. In his early
teens, Daniel began breaking into homesand stealing items. This was the eighties,

(36:16):
after all, and people just didn'tlock their doors, yeah, especially
in a small town, and thismade it relatively easy for the plant to
break in while the homeowner was awayand take their items. Soon though,
Daniel began to escalate in his breakingand entering with psychological tactics. He would
drink and eat people's food, leavinga half empty glass out on the counter,

(36:37):
he'd move items around, you know, small things that would leave the
homeowner just feeling really you know violated. Yeah, definitely the beginnings of a
power trip. It's just like itwould just be so much more violating if
you get robbed and then you seethat they fucking helped themselves to a sandwich
or something while they were Yeah,it's it's definitely like twisting the knife in

(36:58):
that like you you like ate myfood. It just like made yourself a
home growth. It is thought thatLaplant may have broken into the Bowen family
home and seen a picture of Tina, kicking off his obsession with her.
He may have obtained her phone numberby finding it in the home and then
called to ask her out on thatdate. You know, So that could

(37:19):
happen to other sources to say thathe just found out about her through a
mutual friend. It's hard to say. Again, it's all speculation, but
it wouldn't be shocking if that's howthat all started. It's all plausible for
sure. Yeah, all right,So that is Daniel Plant's really sad backstory
in a nutshell. He certainly hada very rough start to his life,
but that doesn't excuse what happens inthe second half of this story. So,

(37:44):
as I said before, Daniel wasonly sixteen when he decided to terrorize
the Bowen family and was taken toa juvenile detention center to await his court
hearing. Laplant stayed in the StateDepartment of Youth Services secured detention facility from
January to the following October. Hiscase was then transferred to the Low Superior
Court and Laplant's bail was set atten thousand dollars. Surprisingly, Daniel's mother,

(38:09):
Elaine Moore, re mortgaged their hometo post the bond money and get
Daniel out of state custody while hewaited for his trial. And I found
that pretty surprising because it doesn't seemlike he like they had a great relationship.
You know, hey neglected. Butthat's I guess that's what happened.
So he gets released and sent backto his home on Elm Street, much

(38:32):
to the dismay of the neighborhood andthe Bowen family. Many people disagreed with
his release, believing he was adangerous individual who showed no remorse for his
crimes. Neighbors witnessed Daniel disappearing intothe woods near his house and they couldn't
help but feel like he was upto no good, and unfortunately they weren't
wrong. Soon after his release,Daniel was back back up to like breaking

(38:55):
into houses, stealing things, justgenerally being a creep. In one of
his break ins to a neighbor's house, the plant managed to steal a twenty
two caliber revolver and later would purchasebullets for it from his brother's friend.
As you can probably guess, nothinggood is going to come of the gun

(39:16):
theft. No, I feel likethe rest of the story isn't going to
be good. It's downhill from here, folks. On November sixteenth, nineteen
eighty seven, after careful consideration,Daniel decided to break into a nearby home
owned by the Gustafson family. Thehome, located less than a mile from
Daniel's house, separated by the woodedarea Daniel like to wander into, was

(39:39):
occupied by a young family. Thefamily consisted of Andrew and Priscilla and their
two kids, Abigail, who wasseven and William, who was five.
Priscilla was also pregnant with their thirdchild. Everyone in the community loved the
Gustoffsons. Andrew was a successful lawyer. Priscilla was a nursery school teacher at

(39:59):
the Townsend Cooperative Play School. They'rejust like you know, classic Americ,
super classic. All the names areclassic. They just sound like such a
sweet family. Yeah, and theyhad they'd moved to Townsend like five years
prior. They were described as America'sperfect family. So, as he said
before, less than a month afterbeing released on bail, Daniel is already

(40:21):
back to breaking into houses. Hebroke into the Gustavson's home on November sixteenth
and stole several items. In thefollowing weeks, he would break into other
homes in the area and steal itemsfrom them as well. He also spent
time with his newly acquired revolver practicingloading and unloading the bullets. On December
one, nineteen eighty seven, LaPlantedecided to return to the Gustavson home to

(40:45):
once again steal more items, butthis time he decided to take his stolen
gun with him. And it's righthere that I'm going to give a content
warning. We are going to bediscussing violent crimes against women and children,
something I don't take lightly, andI want to give a fair warning of
I'm not going to go into,like, you know, the gory details,

(41:06):
but I'm just I'm just gonna saywhat happened. So if you don't
want to listen, you should probablyskip ahead. Okay. So Daniel is
rummaging through the Gustavson's home in themiddle of the day when no one's home
Andrew's at work, and at onepm, Priscilla picks up her son William
from the babysitter and heads home.Upon arriving home, Priscilla and William are
confronted by a gun wielding Daniel laPlant, who would normally flee the scene

(41:30):
when the homeowners appeared, but onthis day decided to stay and commit atrocities.
Laplant ordered Priscilla into her bedroom andtied her to the bed. He
locked young William in a closet,and then proceeded to rape Priscilla. When
he was finished, he placed pillowsagainst her head and he shot her twice

(41:50):
through the pillows to muffle the sound, killing her. And he's seventeen.
Yeah, what the fuck? Okay, all right, that's so oh drastic,
Okay, little Plant, it justdoesn't stop. Then took William into
the bathroom and drowned him. Inthe bathtub. Oh my gosh, he's
not picking like, Oh no,okay. On his way out of the

(42:14):
home, La Plant ran into sevenyear old Abigail, who had just returned
home from school. She like walkedby herself home to school, okay.
Instead of just leaving, he tookher into a different bathroom and drowned her
as well. She also suffered bluntforce trauma, indicating that she had fought
him, which fu, Oh mygod, it's just it's so fucking sad.

(42:37):
Little Plant then left the house andcontinued with his day as if nothing
had happened. He returned home,ate a meal, and then attended the
birthday party of his six year oldniece, where he ate cake and acted
as normal. Oh I wasn't normalas Daniel Plant could act. Why is
that? It's just so extra disturbing. Yeah, he goes and hangs out

(42:58):
with a six year old after killinga seven seven year old girl, Yeah,
and her brother and a pregnant woman, and he kills them all separately.
It's not like there was like thisone after the other. It's not
like he shot them all like togetherat one time. He like methodically no,
And then he decides to drown them, which is like violent. Oh

(43:19):
fuck. And then he goes toa kid's birthday party and eats the cake.
I'm like, I red, likeI feel like I'm fuming. The
light bold's purple in here. It'shard to tell, but I can't bring
me out or all. Just likedisgusted. And this story is over only
seventeen. He's only seventeen. Wow, that escalated really quickly. Yeah.

(43:42):
So at five point thirty that evening, Andrew Kustofson returned home to find the
remains of his WIFEH my god,the dad. Yeah he had to find
it, literally, his entire family. Yeah, oh okay, we got
you. We gotta move on quickly. Completely horrified and devastated, Andrew called

(44:07):
the police and fled the home.In an interview with the La Times,
he said, quote, I wastoo afraid of going to look for my
children because I was afraid i'd findthem dead. I would. I mean,
yes, do yourself a favor andnot look at that. Yeah,
he said, it was so shockingand unbelievable. I screamed, I wailed.
Oh seeah, he found his wifeand then just left. He's like,

(44:28):
I I mean, if the wife'sgone, like yeah, kind of.
He got home and the lights wereall off, so he was like,
something is really wrong. Yeah,oh that poor man. Okay.
No. After detectives responded to thescene, it didn't take long for them
to start looking at Laplant for themurders. The attacker had left an almost
full glass of beer obtained from theGustavsin's fridge in the primary bedroom where Priscilla

(44:53):
was murdered. So he takes abeer out of their fridge and swigs it
and then leaves. Yeah, whichis so stupid. Well, I guess
DNA is not a thing, andhe's a child and he's stupid. Yeah,
so he but that's like his callingcard almost at this point, is
just to like leave something in thekitchen or yeah, like you have consumed
beverage. So yeah, that eerieclue was very similar to the things Daniel

(45:16):
Plant did with food and beverages andhis other crime scenes. So the police
are like, mmm, it's socrazy that that was his first murders,
right, it doesn't seem like sodrastic and brutal. Mm hmm. It's
not like he killed he killed threepeople and she's two children pregnant. It's
not even like an Yeah, Ican't, I can't speak. Yeah,

(45:37):
it's it's awful. I feel sobad for a just okay, like how
the mindset? Like how do youget there? How where is the logic
that that's the answer, or likewhat is motivating you? And it's like
I don't know even like, okay, he kills her. He didn't have
to kill the kid. He reallyhonestly, what are they going to do?

(46:00):
Right? They're so small? Yeah, it's just fucked up. It's
so bad. Okay. So thevery next day, the police find the
plant at the town library and questionhim about his whereabouts on the previous day.
He's like, well, I'm justinstantly library studying in the library,
where I often spend my days.So they questioned him. He did have

(46:23):
an alibi for the evening obviously hewas at his niece's birthday party, but
he didn't have an alibi for earlierin the day when the murder occurred.
They didn't have enough to arrest himat that point, but they're like,
mmmm, this guy. So thenext day the police decided they needed to
question Daniel further, and they arriveat his house. Daniel's mother answers the

(46:43):
door, assuming the police are therebecause you know, he missed a hearing
or something for his other crimes.But when Daniel saw the police arrive at
his home, he ran and hemade it out of his house and into
the nearby woods before the police couldcatch him. Now, this maniac is
on the run. On December third, a warrant is issued for Laplant's arrest,

(47:06):
and a man hunt ensues on apretty large scale, as Daniel was
considered armed and very dangerous. Yeah. So they had like fifty officers,
dogs, helicopters, like they weregoing after him, going for it.
I would be so scared if Ilived there. Yeah. Imagine like wild
tea killing teen on the loose.Yeah, and it's a small town.

(47:28):
Oh okay. So I also heardthat the Bowen family learned that Laplant was
on the run and they like wentinto hiding. I think they went and
stayed in a hotel because they wereso scared that he was. This was
after their attack. Yeah, Ohmy gosh, I lived, they'd be
like, he's after us now,right, That's what I would immediately assume.
Terrifying because they well, they mighthave known about the murders. I

(47:51):
don't know what was reported when Butlike God, that'd be so scary.
So they were right to be terrified, because Daniel reportedly broke into a woman's
home named Lynn McGovern and hid outin her upstairs bedroom while the police searched
the wooded area near his home.Lynn reportedly was not home at the time,
but arrived in her neighborhood to findthe area flooded with police. After

(48:15):
pulling up to her home, Lynnflagged down an officer and requested that he
go inside with her first. Absolutely, Yeah, it was a good instinct
because once they answered her home,the armed daniela plant decided to flee instead
of fight, which might not havebeen the case if Lynn had gone in
alone. So he escapes out theupstairs window onto the roof, and once

(48:35):
again gets away. Wow, buthe's not done terrorizing the area yet.
He also broke into a woman's homenamed Pam mckela and threatened her, ordering
her to drive him out of townin her bright orange van just like very
inconspicuous. Oh wow, I'm yeah. I mean, I guess it was

(48:57):
the eighties, but was everything elserange? I mean no, I mean
that's assisting. It's still a wildcolor for a van like you're gonna be
it for sure, I mean conveniencefor our part to hopefully catch him.
Right, there's probably not very manyin the area. But like I also
heard that it like he demanded shedrive because he only had its learners permit

(49:20):
because he's a freaking kid, right. Wow. So yeah, so he
is now also kidnapping. Yeah,yep. So she's driving him near town
Hall when Pam decided to make abreak for it, and she was able
to flee from the van. Idon't understand the logistics of how she did
that, but it's amazing. I'mglad she survived. Yes, absolutely,

(49:43):
he gets away again. He's stilldriving. He's now driving the bride orange
van, the bright orange van.And we're not talking Scooby Doo. I
mean, I know it's not orange, but okay, I mean you might
as well be sure. It's thatrecognizable. So I think I also had
like big for sale signs in thewindows. It was just like it would
be very hard to miss, likethe one van you probably shouldn't be getting

(50:04):
if this is your plan. Iwonder if you like knew that that's what
she had in the garage, orif she like was like fuck, like
this was not the right house.He's probably not that smart to think no,
no, he's probably just going notthinking ahead for sure. Okay,
So she gets away, but youknow, immediately tells the police what he's
driving. And now the search ison and you know, considerably narrowed down

(50:29):
because of a bright orange van.The stolen man was soon spotted in the
nearby town of ay R by Ayrit's a a y E R a r
Air by officer Charles Nelson, whopulled the vehicle over. Daniel then fled
on foot down an alleyway and intoa nearby lumberyard, where he threatened the

(50:49):
owner with a gun and jumped intoa dumpster to hide. Okay. The
police quickly surrounded the area and theyfinally arrested Daniel Little Plant. He was
taken into custody and charged with threecounts of first degree murder for Priscilla Abigail
and William Gustafson, along with aslew of other charges for the several crimes
he had committed over the last fewdays, breaking an entering, kidnapping,

(51:13):
etc. Et cetera. La Plantwas sent to Bridgewater State Hospital for psychiatric
evaluation after he pled not guilty tothe murders and was found mentally fit to
stand trial. Although Laplant's attorney statedthat all the evidence against Daniel was circumstantial,
it was pretty damning circumstantial evidence becauseyeah, there's not an eyewitness,

(51:36):
but like the evidence it's just prettyastounding. So yeah, when the police
searched the Gustafson home, they founda pillow case containing shell casings that matched
the bullets found in La Plant's homeand also matched the gun that he had
previously stolen from a neighbor. Theyrecorded sneaker prints outside the Gustafson's home that

(51:57):
matched the shoes Daniel was wearing whenhe was apprehended, and they found a
glove at the Gustafson's home, which, in its match, was located at
La Plant's home. I mean,okay, yeah, there you go.
Yeah. The police also found asock in the plants room with a hair
on it, belonging to Abigail Gustavson, and they also found the stolen items
from the Gustasan's home in Daniel's room. I mean, okay, so like

(52:20):
it's you, dude, I mean, how do you even argue it.
DNA evidence was not widely used,you know, at the time of the
murders, so early. Yeah,but police were able to collect a semen
sample from the crime scene and asample of Daniel's blood. Yeah, and
they he was like a type Asecret which matched the semen sample. So

(52:42):
yeah, I mean pretty solid.The trial began in October of nineteen eighty
eight, and at that point,Daniel was now eighteen years old, and
the judge determined he would be triedas an adult, even though he was
only seventeen during the time the murderswere committed. Sure, sure, that's
what happens. Yeah. His defenseattorney brought up Daniel's rough childhood and the
abuse he suffered as a child.He also tried to point the finger at

(53:06):
Daniel's stepfather and brother for the murders, but they both had solid alibis.
La Plant's demeanor during the trial alsodidn't help his case. He seemed to
show no remorse for his actions andreportedly smirked his way through the proceedings Yee.
In the end, Daniel Plant wassentenced to three consecutive life sentences without
the chance of parole. He hassince been incarcerated in the Massachusetts Correctional Institution.

(53:31):
And although he's applied for appeals andhas generally been a pain in the
ass in prison, he has beenunsuccessful in his appeals and will remain good,
hopefully in prison for the rest ofhis life. Yeah. I don't
think. I don't think you're gonnachange. No, And even like it
sucks though, just because they dothe appeal, it's all brought back up
again. The family has to livethrough it again. Yeah, even if

(53:53):
he gets denied, like, theystill have to relive it. You know,
that's true. So I mean,and I guess that's his way to
still cause her mess. He's like, you know, he did a whole
like apology, like, oh,I'm so sorry I did all this,
but like then psychiatrists evaluated him andthey're like, he still doesn't really show
remorse and he's minimizing what he did, so they don't. Yeah, I

(54:15):
mean, I probably like it's Iit's like, yeah, isn't I know
you did like, uh was ita mini episode about the difference between psychopaths
and oh sociopaths. Sociopath But yeah, he's definitely one of those because it
doesn't seem like he has like anyfeeling. No, Yeah, it's and
who knows, maybe like the headinjuries damaged his brain or his like ability

(54:40):
to feel empathy, but like heyeah, he doesn't seem to be that
sorry for what he did and whichis terrific. Don't feel bad at all
that he'll be in prison. No. I almost thought you were gonna say
three years when I was gonna beso much, Oh my god, but
it was three he's out right now. I was gonna be so mad.
No, he's in jail. Iguess he's a pain in the ass.
In jail would be complains a lot. He's always filing like I'm being treated

(55:06):
poorly and that for all kinds ofdifferent reasons. Sure, but yeah,
he's in there. He's staying inthere. O. Good, So sorry
about that sad story. And that'sthe case staying Oh and it's over,
okay. I don't have anything elsefor you, So a short one for
me today it is. But it'sgood. Thank you still told it.
Well, still a good story.It's a wild story. That is wild,

(55:28):
and now we know what frogging is. Yeah, yeah, hopefully you
never have to experience it, right, there's a lot of crazy frogging stories
like it's just probably happens a lotmore than we realize or Noah, he's
like, I'm not going up there. Well, let's do SIY of the

(55:51):
week, okay, And that goesto Brooklyn, New York. Hello,
Brooklyn, we see you, Wesee you over there, Brooklyn being all
cool, being all cool, beingall cool in Brooklyny, Brooklynny. Yes,

(56:14):
thank you for listening. We appreciateyou. Shout outs to you,
Brooklyn. Not that you need it, No, you're doing just fine.
They don't need us, but theyappreciator than all of us. Yeah,
it's fine. Okays. What areyou, Seana? What are you watching?
What are you listening to? Youtalk for a second, I'll talk
for a second. Okay. SoI am still being messed with and toyed

(56:37):
with my feelings because in Sync islike back together but not back together,
and I'm dying for them to justannounce their world tour. So justin Timberlake's
new album as actually pretty good,and I don't like his past, like
his last album he put out,so it's kind of like he's kind of

(56:58):
like, I don't know, notdoing it for me these but it's really
good. It's a good dancy one. And then there is a new song
with him and in sync and it'sso good. I'm just living my best
life listening to it on blast inthe car. So that's what I'm doing
and listening to is that, overand over and over, and I'm not
sorry for it. I don't be. I'm proud of it, and no

(57:19):
one can make me feel shame.I would never and I still tell Chad
that when they announced the World comingBack, I will be spending a pretty
penny on a ticket. Oh you'reliving your best like like early two thousands
dreams. You're gonna go see Blinkytoo. I am there back together for
real, zies and I did spenda pretty penny on it, the tickets
to see them that I'm gonna dolater this year. So yay my teenage

(57:43):
self and then yay my little kid'sself within sync. It's happening. And
I got her a band T shirtto wear to the concert. It is
so cute. You gonna look flylook fly. Oh no, now we're
turning extra criage. Uh okay,but that's I guess the list the music
I'm listening to while I'm packing.What about you? What are you watching,

(58:05):
listening to? Doing? Thinking?I mean nothing exciting. Michael and
I have been watching Abbott Elementary,which is funny. And what's that on
Hulu or yeah, it's I don'tremember a cable network it's on, but
it's on Hulu. Sure, it'sfunny. It's probably gonna be triggering if
you are a teacher, because it'sjust makes sense all the terrible funding and

(58:29):
everything that you deal with. Butit's funny. It's kind of done like
an office style. Oh nice,you know. Cool. So there's that,
and then we're obviously there's a newseason of Somebody Feed Phill. We
love that show. You've mentioned thatshow before. It's on Netflix. It's
just so pure and heartwarming and willmake you want to eat all the food
and travel and eat all the food. Yeah. So it good if you

(58:52):
wanted just a nice feel good thingto put on in the background, those
are a nice feel good yeahoundations.Yeah, that's what I got. That's
what we're watching. All right,All right, Well I gotta go because
guess what I gotta do some pockgo pack. Oh I gotta do some
okay, stretch lift with your buttor whatever. Oh okay, not your
back, you're right, your legslet's see how injured all get yeah,

(59:16):
with your butt, your butt?Alright, alright, good app good night,
all right. My sources are theBoston Globe, All That's interesting dot

(59:37):
com, Celtic Centennial dot com,Wikipedia dot com, Newspaper Archives dot com,
CBS News dot com, Talk Murderwith Me dot com, and an
episode of Red Handed Podcast episode oneo three. Our music is by Broke
for Free and Matt Edwards, andwe are edited by Michael. All right,
should I lest our social media?Please do? We have a lot

(01:00:00):
of our things that Anxious and Afraidthe Pod, So that's our handle for
both of our Facebook page and group, along with our Instagram and Gmail.
We have a Twitter at aa Thepod. You can support us on Patreon dot
com, forward slash Anxious and Afraid. If you do that, you get
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(01:00:22):
day early, and you get afree sticker. You can also support us
for free if you can't do anyof that by leaving a rate review,
subscribe to the show. Tell yourfriends, yeah, we would appreciate all
of it. Do right now?Do you have to