Episode 115: Overly Complicated Ransom Notes and Strict Speed Limits (Kidnapping of Barbara Jane Mackle, Part I)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
What was it? DP cooler d B. If I saw
the name, I could tell you which one was.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
You saw? What?

Speaker 1 (00:13):
If I saw the name, I would confidently identify it.
But I can't tell you the name well, because Google's
gonna tell me your name. Hell you, Hey, Gods, Welcome, Welcome.

Speaker 3 (00:39):
I'm Abby and I'm Shauna And this is Anxious and
Afraid the podcast. We're back, glorious return.

Speaker 1 (00:45):
Sorry for that pause of how long was that?

Speaker 3 (00:50):
We released our last episode in September.

Speaker 1 (00:52):
September, Yes, Merry Christmas, Every Christmas.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
Yeah, took a little breaky bring a lot of stuff
going on. Yeah, let's catch up on So if you
don't like the personal stuff, you're gonna just skip ahead
a little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:09):
Right to talk about Yeah, this will pretty much we'll
just do the ketchup as why we're all anxious and
afraid because life has just been lifing and these other reasons.
Why so, do you want to talk about what you did? Oh?

Speaker 3 (01:21):
Yeah, so Michael and I. This has been on the
to do list for a long time since.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
We moved into this house. But it's basically like.

Speaker 3 (01:29):
A time capsule from the nineties, like everything is very dated.
Golden oak Wood and like in the kitchen and the
floors were not cute anymore. So I took my little
DIY skills to task and.

Speaker 1 (01:49):
We redid our kitchen. You literally made a kitchen by yourself.
It was already a kitchen. We just made it look nicer.
But it's seriously so impressive because it doesn't look like
like a non professional did it. You know, thank you.

Speaker 3 (02:04):
It's such a compliment. It's the biggest DIY I've ever attempted.
And I kitchen is scary, like it's terrible.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
That's an everyday room.

Speaker 3 (02:14):
And doing that with a toddler, especially one like mine,
was quite the feat. Like, I mean, you use your
kitchen so much, and we were only able to work
on it when THEO was sleeping or if our amazing
in laws were able to watch him, and so like

(02:37):
we would have to work our.

Speaker 1 (02:39):
Little tails off.

Speaker 3 (02:40):
The kitchen would be in shambles, and then we would
have to clean up everything so that THEO wouldn't get
into anything. So then you're like constantly dissembling, reassembling, disassembling, reassembling.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
It's like a lot.

Speaker 3 (02:51):
It's a lot to disassemble and reasonable and I think,
how long did it take us a couple of weeks.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
Oh at least three or four, mostly weekends. But the
first chunk was like what four days.

Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yeah, we did take a few days off, and then
I realized I was like, oh, much more done. And
then I realized, like day three, I was like, oh no.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
I need so many more weekends.

Speaker 3 (03:13):
This is not getting done in the timeframe I had
hoped for.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, just quickly, we do my kitchen in one weekend.

Speaker 3 (03:20):
That's an abby thought for sure, for sure, so delusional
because like we had to. We didn't like replace the cabinets.
We completely like sanded them, primed them, sprayed them. We
it was my first time using like a handheld paint sprayer,
so that was a fun learning curve. But it really

(03:42):
does make them look so much more professional if you
spray it.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (03:47):
And then we did like we put a little gold hardware.
We did like a like a soft gray green color.
But it's pretty bright. It really brightened up the kitchen.

Speaker 1 (03:56):
Oh my gosh, it's so bright. It was so dark
before with all the the patterns and the wood.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
Yeah, because there was nineties wallpaper as well. Yeah, it
was it was nineties. It was very nineties.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
Maybe I'll just post I'll post photos for the I mean,
it's worth it. It's quite the change. Very and Abby
fucking did that, and Michael like, so wow, Michael really
stepped up. And you guys are still married after that.
I don't think you think we really fought. Did we fight?

Speaker 4 (04:22):
Wow?

Speaker 1 (04:23):
Impressive? We should get an award for fighting. Honestly, so
many gold stars, so many gold stars.

Speaker 3 (04:28):
It was a lot of work, but hey, it ended
up being worth it. I love our kitchen now. I
love being so beautiful, especially during the winter because it
just is so dark and rainy here all the time.

Speaker 1 (04:37):
Like having a nice brighten that you're like always in
it's nice to be a huge difference, Yeah, for sure.
So yeah we did that.

Speaker 3 (04:45):
It took quite a while and uh so that took
up a good chunk of time.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
What about you showing well once you were done with
the kitchen, then I decided to have like a teensy
weensy little like midlife crisis. And so I'm trying to
get a handle on that. That it's funny. It's not funny,
but just the way you said.

Speaker 3 (05:04):
It, it's always I feel like I'm always going through
something major and you're just.

Speaker 1 (05:08):
Like la la la, I'm gonna redo my kitchen. I'm
here for ride. Yeah, so I'm going to handle on that.
I am on new meds, so I will say that,
and I love it. So that's really helping me out.
I want to talk about your meds. Sure, positive meds talk.
I'm on prozac now, we just up the dosage to

(05:30):
forty milligrams. I'm still on also well beachin. But yeah,
those two combined have been really helpful these days. I
can feel a difference that, like my body has calm
the fuck down, and like me and like other people
notice too, like Sean, Yeah, which is like weird for
me to hear. Yeah, Like she's just really different now,
like I can like function as a human a little

(05:51):
bit better.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
Oh, it's crazy, like you just like not that you
were a mess before but more high strong.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
I guess before and now you're I was like, I truck,
so I struck. When I'm stressed, I'm fucking stra resd.
It's like I was over it. Yeah, I was like,
I need freaking help, my boy, I can't control my body.
So yeah, so I mean so I'm getting there. I'm
figuring it out. Yeah, and things are happening.

Speaker 3 (06:15):
I think that's just a testament to you know, being
mature enough to like take care of your mental health.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
Yes, yes, I definitely got to do that. Yeah, I'm
doing it.

Speaker 3 (06:23):
More people should do that. A lot of people should
do that, like everyone.

Speaker 1 (06:27):
Anyways, Okay, so we have like the craziest fun fact
of all time. Oh yes, yes, yes, okay, so we
forgot to talk about it too because we're idiots. Yeah, obviously,
because we found the found out about this like months
and months ago, months ago.

Speaker 3 (06:41):
So Shawna did the dB Cooper episode. Yes, and shortly
after that released, my mother texted and she was like,
oh and casually, by the way, she's just like like
no big deal, like whatever. She was like, Oh, yeah,
I used to work with that flight attendant that like
interacted with dB Cooper.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
Like the flight attendant that was on the actual flight
where he jumped, the flight attendant that spoke to d B.
Cooper himself. My mother with your mother who birthed you,
She did do that, and she also worked with uh,
what's her name, Tina Tina Muclough, Tina Muckle. Yeah, I

(07:20):
don't think I said her name in my episode, but yes,
that's the craziest thing ever I know.

Speaker 3 (07:26):
And she was like she's just a really nice lady,
like very unassuming.

Speaker 1 (07:29):
You would never know. She never talked about it. Yeah,
she didn't, and she didn't want to ask about it obviously,
like because probably that's happened forever. I can't remember.

Speaker 3 (07:37):
She said, like maybe she just confirmed it, but like
that's so crazy.

Speaker 1 (07:41):
Like she actually saw DBE Cooper's face, Like I can't
get over it.

Speaker 3 (07:46):
But she like, I just wonder how often she thinks
about it. I would think about it every frickin' day, well,
because like culture doesn't let you forget about it either, know,
and that I mean obviously a traumatic experience as well. Yeah,
but she just went into like I mean, my mom
worked in an elder health center, so she I think
she went into like caregiving, caregiving or something that's beautiful.

Speaker 1 (08:09):
Yeah, oh my god. And she's like just around like
maybe kind of still in the area ish, Yeah, like
what okay, like drop that news casually, so casual, Like mom,
that's the coolest thing ever. That's like what I'm two
people removed from DV Cooper. Yeah, that's insane. I got
the chills right now.

Speaker 3 (08:29):
Oh wow, Wow, wow, amazing. Yeah, so we just had
to like put that out there because I can't believe
you forgot to mention that.

Speaker 1 (08:37):
Yeah, your you and ized reactions were like over the top.
We're like, what, I'd losing it. We were losing it.
It's crazy.

Speaker 3 (08:44):
Oh and then also I just wanted to mention all
crazy freaking UFO drone activity.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
Okay, you guys is happening. It's happening as we speak,
as we live, as we breathe, and it's happening here.
It literally just happened around our home area. Yeah, like Eugene,
Oregon coasts. Ugh.

Speaker 3 (09:03):
And yeah, there's all this uh like audio from pilots
talking about.

Speaker 1 (09:09):
Multiple pilots, multiple commercial pilots witnessing weird shit in the
skuy Yeah, and the ocean right or they're in the
ocean too. I'm telling you, they're.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
So in the ocean.

Speaker 3 (09:20):
We've seen them literally come out of the ocean.

Speaker 1 (09:23):
In and out, in and out, in and out of
the ocean really fast. It's weird. It's so weird.

Speaker 3 (09:27):
And there's all these like New Jersey drones happening that
nobody understands.

Speaker 1 (09:32):
Yeah, you guys, what's happening. It's happening. We need to
talk about it, normalize it. I just want to know
what's going on.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
Honestly, the world kind of went insane on our break,
Like the wasn't just yeah, oh.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
My god, we didn't even we didn't we didn't even
bring up the Vegan election. I think it's talking about
fucking anxiety. I was just trying to like disassociate. But
I've been trying to forget so so hard, so hard
to do. So, yeah, we're in for another fun tree
of for the next four years. And so yeah, yes,

(10:09):
there's a lot of stuff. It's just like a CEO
assassinated and that whole thing seems to be something out
of like a Joker Riddler comic book storyline. Yeah, like
people are rooting for him and thinking he's hot, and
people are like morally can't figure it out, and everyone's
just freaking out, Like in every witch direction, we're all
morally confused, we're all upset, and we don't know who

(10:30):
to be upset with, you know.

Speaker 3 (10:33):
So the world it's been a really crazy place for
the last few months. So maybe we all needed a break.

Speaker 1 (10:37):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (10:38):
But here we're gonna have some continent for you.

Speaker 1 (10:41):
Abby's here to save my ass once again, because it's
it's her doing the work for me.

Speaker 3 (10:46):
Well, I do. I do love to tell a story.

Speaker 1 (10:49):
We all know we do, and I loved I love
your stories.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
And uh, I can't remember if this one was a
suggestion or not. I actually don't think this was a suggestion.

Speaker 1 (10:58):
I have zero idea what you're doing or where you're
even going.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
Okay, so I did kind of allude to this a
long time ago because it was the episode that I
had planned on doing.

Speaker 1 (11:09):
Oh and then you switched it. Yeah, and I switched
to when we like first started back again. No, it
was reap well recently as relative, But I did the
uh I remember.

Speaker 3 (11:20):
The Victorian urban legend spring Hill Jack. I did that
one instead, which was the recommendation because another huge podcast
had just end the story I'm.

Speaker 1 (11:32):
About to do. Oh that's right, you did say that. Yeah,
and I was like, oh, I don't want to release
like Red on Top the same time. Okay, that we are.

Speaker 3 (11:38):
Even in the same league, not at all at all,
but you know, just for the sake of.

Speaker 1 (11:45):
Being respectful, sure, so mature in kind, I guess.

Speaker 3 (11:50):
So anyway, here it is, We're gonna do it.

Speaker 1 (11:52):
Okay, love this.

Speaker 3 (11:53):
Okay, it's episode one fifteen. Wow, good to be back today.
I've brought you a tale of true crime.

Speaker 1 (12:01):
Okay, o gee.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
It is a story with all the trappings of a
cheesy eighties thriller, with elements of, and not limited to,
unlikely criminal pairings, kidnappings, overly complicated ransom notes, misogyny, and
one of my greatest fears, which is a surprise that
I'll say for later. Oh okay, fun, Yeah, Today, I'm
gonna be telling you the story of the kidnapping of

(12:26):
Barbara Jane Mackle.

Speaker 1 (12:28):
Okay, I don't recognize that name. Okay, I didn't think
that you would kidnapping. That's terrible. I know. I don't
think have we done a kidnapping?

Speaker 3 (12:34):
I don't really think so, not like just a kidnapping.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
Right, I don't think, oh, well we did okay the
baby one. We did Patty Hurst. Oh, yes, that's true.

Speaker 3 (12:44):
Honestly, this story is kind of it has some similarities.

Speaker 1 (12:49):
Okay, so we have we did Patty Hurst.

Speaker 3 (12:50):
Okay, So okay, this is another kidnapping case and it
was really big national news when it happened. So I
price I'd never heard of it. Because it was a
really big deal and this case is so beefy.

Speaker 1 (13:05):
It's a two parter. Stop. Okay, nice, of course you
are for I have a gale.

Speaker 3 (13:14):
I know I can't help myself, you really can't.

Speaker 1 (13:17):
So before you.

Speaker 3 (13:18):
Begin, I would like to recognize my primary source for
today's episode, which is a book I read called eighty
three Hours Till Dawn by Gene Miller, and he wrote
the book in collaboration with Barbara Mackle the Woman Herself.
The Woman Herself. It's also not in print anymore. Here
it is right here, you have it. I paid like

(13:39):
thirty five dollars for this piece of shit.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
It's like ripped. Yeah, it's an old book. Yeah, an
old It's.

Speaker 3 (13:46):
Thirty five dollars for a paperback is outrageous. Yeah, but
it's not in print anymore.

Speaker 1 (13:51):
And you needed to have it.

Speaker 3 (13:52):
There's very few copies, I guess, so I have it.
I have one.

Speaker 1 (13:56):
Wow. Yeah, I think that's the most I've ever paid
for a paperback.

Speaker 3 (14:00):
It's like, okay, here we go. It's the only way
you can read it, so you gotta do it. So
let's see here. It's a super detailed book, and like,
if you know I'm saying that it's like a little
dude detailed. But it was a good book. It's well written.
I would recommend it if you want to go out

(14:20):
there and hunt for a paperback, maybe spend more than
you want to. Okay, So without further ado, let's get
into it. The year is nineteen sixty eight, and the
hit song of that.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
Year was You're pointy at Me? What would your guests
be for nineteen sixty eight? God, who was around? I
don't know what's your guest, Michael. I wasn't finish the Beatles? Ooh,
you cheat, you cheat Beatles? Okay, yes, okay, obviously the Beatles. Okay,
so early Beatles nineteen sixty eight. That's not early early.

(14:55):
It's not early early. It's like mid Beatles. Yeah. There's
so many freakin songs. I know, I know, think of
like one of the biggest ones you can think of.

Speaker 3 (15:03):
Oh, it's like the one of the most popular ones ever.

Speaker 1 (15:08):
I can't stop thinking, Hey, Jude, yep, shut up so excited.
I can't confirm that's what Google says.

Speaker 3 (15:18):
Yes, I don't know the name, but if I saw it,
I love that song, I'd be able to confirm it.

Speaker 1 (15:24):
Wow, Oh my god. I know. I hated the way
I sounded an intro. I'm so stupid and confident so hard.
I was like, to my defense, there's two flight attendants,
so I'm going to put that in your face. There
was too.

Speaker 3 (15:37):
We were trying to google the flight attendant. Sean was like,
I don't know the name, but if I saw it,
I would know.

Speaker 1 (15:43):
I would confidently know. Yeah, Okay, okay, Wow, what a time. Okay, Hey, Jude,
you got it. I'm so impressed. I'm actually really impressed
that you got it. It's not that song. Oh my gosh,
me too, What a time? What do I win? Price
to be determined? The bragging right, braggy rights. It's not
good for today. I'm already overly competent. How about a

(16:04):
firm high five? A firm high five?

Speaker 3 (16:06):
Okay later, Yeah, it's not good for audio.

Speaker 1 (16:09):
My hands are two sweaty right now.

Speaker 3 (16:11):
It might be a wet high five cross all right.
So the main character of our story, Barbara Mackle, who
was twenty years old at the time, was a junior
at Emory University in Atlanta, Georgia, and she was majoring
in economics. And I honestly I don't think I can
think of a more boring major.

Speaker 1 (16:31):
I hated economics in school. I could not.

Speaker 3 (16:34):
Snore, snooze. But I wasn't born to Barbara, and even
if it was, it didn't stop her from getting good
grades in her college courses.

Speaker 1 (16:42):
Good for her. Yes, this wouldn't have.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
Surprised anyone who knew Barbara, as she had always been
an excellent student, winning many academic awards and becoming the
valedictorian of her high school class. Her parents had done
their best to set their daughter up for success. Robert
and Jane Mackall were said to be dough loving parents
who also had a son named Bob, four years older
than Barbara.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
Bob and Barbara. Of course, you just don't see a
little kids named Barbara anymore. Oh my gosh, No, imagine
that named Bob. So weird? Hi Bob, Hi, little Bob
seems weird. A doller name Bob, I was so good.
It would have to be Bobby, of course.

Speaker 3 (17:20):
Okay, yeah, so, h'll Bobby Hillo, Dear Hanko.

Speaker 1 (17:31):
That's not that's my purse. Okay, I love that show. Okay.

Speaker 3 (17:35):
So. Robert was a land developer and a co founder
of the Deltona Corporation, a major home building company based
in Florida. These business ventures turned into multimillion dollars success stories,
leaving the Macco family very well off. Even though Barbara
and her brother came from money, she would often say

(17:55):
she didn't know they were super rich.

Speaker 1 (17:57):
Growing up. She lived a charmed childhood, but like a
lavish childhood.

Speaker 3 (18:02):
So they weren't like spoiled. I guess Barbara kept a
level head on her shoulders. I mean, like, what else
would you expect from an economics major? Right. People would
often say how Barbara was really kind and she always
went the extra mile to make people feel valued and included. Basically,
her smile lit up a room and it didn't hurt
that she was a cutie petuity.

Speaker 1 (18:25):
Let's see here, I just lost my spot.

Speaker 3 (18:29):
As discussed earlier, Barbara took her studies very seriously, and
it was now time for the end of fall term exams,
which took place in December.

Speaker 1 (18:39):
So this story is also seasonally.

Speaker 3 (18:42):
Topical in December time. Yeah, so it's happened in December.
We're also in December.

Speaker 1 (18:47):
Isn't that fun? It's so fun.

Speaker 3 (18:49):
So let's see, Barbara had been studying hard for her
exams and felt confident about her chances until she contracted
the flu. And this wasn't just any flu. The CDC
described it as a Hong Kong variant of influenza and
it was taking people out all over the country. So
many people had fallen ill at Emory University that Barbara

(19:10):
couldn't even get into the infirmary because it was like,
oh my gosh, I'd be so weird, booked full, Like
I'm sorry, are you sick?

Speaker 1 (19:16):
Wow, everyone's sick.

Speaker 2 (19:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:18):
Even still, Barbara stubbornly attempted to get through her exams
just to get them over with so that she could
go home to Florida for Christmas.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
Yeah. She eventually ended up calling.

Speaker 3 (19:29):
Her mom, though, crying because she felt so ill, and
her mom, Jane, immediately booked a flight the next day
to go take care of Barbara that nice. When her
mom arrived, Barbara had one hundred and one degree fever
and was absolutely miserable. Jane checked them both into a
motel called the Roadside Inn since they couldn't fit into
Barbara's tiny dorm room, and she'd began to care for Barbara,

(19:51):
who was still stubbornly studying.

Speaker 1 (19:55):
Is she a Taurus?

Speaker 2 (19:56):
Is she like you?

Speaker 3 (19:57):
She's Oh, I should look up her birthday. Maybe she
is the taurus.

Speaker 1 (20:01):
She does sound like me, very stubborn, very must do
it independently.

Speaker 2 (20:06):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (20:07):
Barbara was pissed because she had lent her precious economics
notes to a classmate who never returned them.

Speaker 1 (20:15):
Rude.

Speaker 3 (20:15):
She just like a cardinal sin in school, Like how
how dare not okay? Especially back then when you had
her hand right, Probably all that would take. Even still,
she walked into her classroom that Friday, still incredibly sick,
and set on taking her three hour exam. Three hour exam,
that's no sick. However, her professor took one look at

(20:38):
her and told her she could make up the exam
later and sent her to the infirmary.

Speaker 1 (20:42):
She been so pale, I know. He was like, you
look like shit, poor girl. I know.

Speaker 3 (20:46):
She must have looked really bad. She tried so hard,
I know, poor girl. So she goes to the infirmary,
but once again she's turned away. It's too full and
she had to go back to the hotel. The next day,
Barbara felt a little better and took one of her exams,
but she couldn't help but feel like someone was watching
her as she walked across the dark parking lot to

(21:07):
her car. Ew Shaking the feeling, she returned to the
motel where her mom, who by now had also begun
to feel sick, was waiting hors Back at the motel,
Jane received a phone call from a man she didn't recognize.
The man stated that Barbara had been mailed a registered
letter and that it was waiting for her in her
dorm room. Barbara immediately assumed it was her economics notes

(21:31):
from the kid who had borrowed them, but she decided
that she would get them later since it was getting
late that evening. Barbara's friend, Stuart Woodward helped or stopped
by to help her study for her economics exam. He
was also a brilliant student majoring in economics. Barbara said
Stuart was her best friend, but they were very much

(21:53):
one of those best friend pairings where everyone else could
tell they're probably going to end up together, even though
they were both like, oh, we're just now. Stuart had
stopped by Barbara's dorm for her on the way over
and had seen Barbara's econ notes sitting there. Apparently returned
by the classmate. They all assumed that must have been

(22:13):
what the phone call was about, even though the notes
were not sent to the dorm by registered mail. Yeah,
so that's kind of weird. Either way, They brushed it
off and they didn't think about it anymore. Stuart came
back to the motel on Sunday to continue helping Barbara Steady.
He noticed a man in a blue Buick driving by

(22:34):
slowly in the parking lot, staring him down.

Speaker 1 (22:38):
But like the others, he just just like, Eh, it's fine,
it's not creepy. I'll just ignore. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (22:44):
The next day, Monday, Jane and Barbara returned to the
dorm room to pick up a change of clothes for Barbara,
and Jane noticed a man staring at her from a
blue station wagon in the parking lot. Again, she just
brushed it off and continued with the day. All three
were at the motel until about ten pm, when Stuart left.
As he walked out the door, he said, quote, well,

(23:05):
don't talk to any strange men. It was a joke
he often told. Everyone laughed, ouch, and then he was gone.

Speaker 1 (23:12):
Yikes.

Speaker 3 (23:14):
Barbara and Jane then got ready for bed. Barbara wore
a long sleeved red and white checkered nightgown and thick
knee high socks.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
Cute.

Speaker 3 (23:24):
It's giving little house on the prairie. And I just
want you to note, so I have the actual book here.
This is what they drew her wearing. Oh, she's in
like a silk white.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
Of course, I have to make it way more sexy.

Speaker 3 (23:39):
It's so sexy on the book cover. This book cover
honestly looks kind of inappropriate. And I was like kind
of scared to take it to work and I'm like,
it's not sexual. Oh no, they just drew it sexual.
So anyway, that made me laugh. Okay, So neither Jane
nor Barbara were sleeping. Well, Barbara was still super sick.
She couldn't breathe. I mean, we all know how it's like,

(24:01):
I mean, trying to sleep with your nose stuff. It's
the worst, absolute worst. And Jane was so worried about
how Barbara's breathing sounded that she couldn't sleep and was
up at three am just listening to the sounds of
Barbara's strained breathing, which tells me that we just never
get to relax about our children's breathing.

Speaker 1 (24:20):
Yeah, I guess that's true.

Speaker 3 (24:21):
We're going to be paranoid about our kids being alive
for the rest of our lives.

Speaker 1 (24:24):
Yep, that's what That's what people don't tell you. I know,
near stuck. I'm just kidding. Twenty year old daughter, Are
you alive? Okay? Okay?

Speaker 3 (24:34):
So she's up at three am and then suddenly there
was a loud knock at the door and the man
on the other side identified himself as police.

Speaker 1 (24:44):
Through the door.

Speaker 3 (24:44):
He said that a boy who drove a white Ford
had been in an accident and was in the hospital
asking for them. Jane immediately asked if the boy's name
was Stuart Woodward, which is her first mistake.

Speaker 1 (24:58):
Yeah, and the man replied that it, which is why
never give up information first. Never. Although she was sleepy,
we'll give her that sleepy sleepy. She doesn't know. This
is her mom.

Speaker 3 (25:10):
Her mom is the one that's addressing this person at
the door, wanting to make sure this wasn't just like
a random guy. Jane looked out the window and saw
a man standing there.

Speaker 1 (25:21):
With a police hat.

Speaker 3 (25:23):
Oh so he even had a cost Yes, he had
the hat. By now, Barbara had broken up and as
her mother went to.

Speaker 1 (25:29):
Open the door.

Speaker 3 (25:30):
She called out, mother, don't open the door, not really
knowing why.

Speaker 1 (25:34):
But it was too late. Oh mom's mom.

Speaker 3 (25:37):
Jane had already undone the latch, and the door was
suddenly pushed open, with the barrel of a rifle poking
through before the man violently pushed in, causing Jane to
be thrown against the wall and ripping the door chain off.
So scary as he rushed in, the woman could see
that he wasn't in a police form at all, but
a leather jacket, a yellow sweater and dark pants. He

(26:00):
was white, clean shaven, and very large, like tall and husky.
He held the door open and a small figure rushed
in behind him. The person was so small Barbara thought
it was a little boy dressed in all black with
a black ski mask on. The gun wielding man instructed
or the women to sit on the bed, facing away
from each other. The small figure wearing the ski mask

(26:24):
began to tie Jane's hands and feet with ropes. Jane
was convinced they were being robbed and kept shouting at
their captors to just take.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
The money and leave.

Speaker 3 (26:33):
The man had the barrel of his gun resting against
Barbara's head as she listened to her mother be tied up.
She put her hands behind her back in preparation to
also be tied up, but the man said, no, we
aren't tying you up.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
I hate it.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
I know.

Speaker 1 (26:49):
Barbara's heart immediately.

Speaker 3 (26:50):
Sank out what that could mean, but before she could
give it much thought, she heard her mother begin to
struggle as the small figure pressed a rag to her face.
Explained it was a harmless anesthetic, and Barbara begged her
mom to stop fighting it. Quickly, Jane fell silent, and
the man grabbed Barbara and forced her from the motel room,
the tiny, black clad figure in tow. They took her

(27:14):
to a blue station wagon with the engine still running,
and shoved her into the back seat. The small figure
jumped into the back with Barbara, and then the man
began to drive, and he ordered his accomplice to chloroform Barbara.
Barbara immediately said, please don't. I'll put my head down
and be quiet. I don't even want to know what
you guys look like. You can trust me to be good.

(27:35):
And surprisingly this works initially and they don't chloroform her.

Speaker 1 (27:39):
Oh nice, yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:40):
As they continued driving with Barbara's head resting on the
second person's lap. The figure reached down and put a
hand to Barbara's face and exclaimed, Oh, she's sick.

Speaker 1 (27:50):
She has a fever. Oh my gosh, I forgot. She
was freaking miserable this whole time. She's still very free,
but she's still so ill. No.

Speaker 3 (28:00):
Oh, and she's being dragged out in nothing but a
nightgown and socks.

Speaker 1 (28:06):
And so they left her mom unconscious in the hotel room.
Her mom. Yes, okay, heyie, so mom is still tied
up in the hotel room. They have kidnaped her. She's
in the car.

Speaker 3 (28:20):
So this person's like, oh, she's sick, she has a fever.
And it was a woman's voice with a Spanish accent. Barbara,
being from Florida, recognized her accent as Cuban, and the
Florida connection was almost a relief, because now Barbara assumed
that this had to do with her wealthy father and
his business dealings, and he would probably take care of
whatever this was.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
She was gonna be fine, you'd hope.

Speaker 3 (28:42):
So, right, the driving man said, in a smug voice,
this is going well, This is going extremely well.

Speaker 1 (28:50):
Oh. It was as if this was all a game.
He was winning.

Speaker 3 (28:53):
Uh uh, It was an extremely cold December night, and
Barbara began to shiver. The woman rubbed her arm and
tried to comfort her, telling Barbara they wouldn't hurt her as.

Speaker 1 (29:03):
Long as she was good.

Speaker 3 (29:05):
After about fifteen minutes, the car stopped and the man
got out. While he was gone, the girl began asking
Barbara about her classes and complimenting her on how nice
and well mannered she was.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
I would think I'm going crazy, Yes, that's what I said.
Next like the woman.

Speaker 3 (29:20):
So the woman even took her black sweater off and
gave it to the shivering Barbara, who by now was
just like so disoriented by her circumstances and how this
woman was treated carry. Yeah, like you're being so nice,
but why also just kid means and you might kill me?

Speaker 1 (29:34):
Still, I don't know, It's it's very confusing. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (29:38):
The man eventually came back and mentioned something about a house,
and then said, Jake and the boys dug the hole
too deep. No no holes, no no holes, No, don't
dig any holes too deep.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
Oh.

Speaker 3 (29:53):
Barbara began to panic, thinking they were about to kill
her and bury her in that hole, but her window
her escape had passed, and the man began to tie
her hands and feet. Once she was tied, the man said,
so you've probably figured out you're being kidnapped for ransom.
We're asking for quite a bit of money, but we're

(30:13):
sure your daddy will pay it.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
I hate this guy. He's such a dick. Yeah, sounds
like it.

Speaker 3 (30:20):
In the meantime, we're gonna put you in an underground room,
a room big enough to stand up in and walk around.
And then he starts to explain and confusing detail the
following She could only get air into this underground room
through a battery operated fan, which only had enough juice
to work for seven days. There was also a light

(30:42):
down there, but the light was connected to the same battery,
so if you use the light, the battery for the
fan would give her. Sorry, so if she uses the
light like there's the battery's gonna run out even faster for.

Speaker 1 (30:55):
The fan, who for the air that she needs to
carry it. Yes, this is like Saw manipulation. Shut up.

Speaker 3 (31:05):
There's literally a point in the script that I say
it sounds like bad instructions from a Saw movie.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
This is a song movie, for sure. I yes, it's okay.

Speaker 3 (31:17):
So if she uses both then the battery can run
out in as little as five days, not seven.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
I hate the specifics of this, like calculated. Okay.

Speaker 3 (31:28):
He then told her this room was also underwater, and
then the water would likely come in.

Speaker 1 (31:34):
Not to worry, though.

Speaker 3 (31:35):
When the water comes in, you just have to turn
on this pump to pump it out. However, this pump
is also connected to the matter.

Speaker 5 (31:44):
Is this because it's just so outrageous, outrageous, it's so outrageous,
Like why this is the most complicated this is what
really complicated stuff, Like.

Speaker 1 (31:56):
Probably just like not even taking a breath, just keep talking,
and she's just like having to consume all this. Yeah,
and she's so ill, and she's probably just like staring
at him, like what the fuck are you talking about.
It's like every scary scenario.

Speaker 3 (32:06):
They're like, Okay, here's a bunch of really complicated instructions
that your life depends on.

Speaker 1 (32:10):
Please absorbital. Okay.

Speaker 3 (32:13):
So yeah, you could turn on this pump, but again,
the battery will run out even faster.

Speaker 1 (32:20):
Okay, let's see.

Speaker 2 (32:23):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
Yeah, that's where I say it sounds like constructions out
of the movie song. Yeah. Okay, So the man reiterator
or yes, reiterated that the room was underwater, and as
she tried to escape, she would only succeed in drowning herself.
He also told her that there was a house nearby
and someone would check on her every two hours, implying
that several other people were involved. He continued describing in

(32:46):
great technical detail the live support systems inspecs of the
room she would be put in, but Barbara's head was
spinning with fever and panic. She told the man, you
don't know what it's like to be buried, and he
said he did because he had been to prison before.
Not shocking, but that was news to Barbara. She tried
to beg and reason with the man, but it was useless.

(33:08):
He asked her if she understood the instructions he had
given her, and she was like no, So he explained
them again, like, okay, explain them.

Speaker 1 (33:18):
A third time.

Speaker 3 (33:19):
I'm like, drag it out, yeah, right, this time telling
Barbara she would be eaten by ants if she tried
to escape.

Speaker 1 (33:26):
Oh it makes Is it water or is it ants?
Let's decide? Is it air? Is it darkness? Is it
a pump?

Speaker 3 (33:32):
Is it a fan? He then began stripping Barbara of
anything metal that she was wearing. He took the ring
she was wearing off her finger and said he would
use it to prove that they had the real Barbara
as she she lie in the back seat, still tied up.
Barbara was then injected with an unknown sedative and then chloroformed,

(33:54):
but then needle.

Speaker 1 (33:55):
Yes, that would terrify me.

Speaker 3 (33:57):
Yeah, I think in the book, he like lifts up
her nightgown like sticker in the leg and he's like,
is that all you're wearing? Like it's her fault you
weren't prepared to be killed at three in the morning, Yeah,
in bed wearing is a nightgown to bed?

Speaker 1 (34:10):
The fuck?

Speaker 3 (34:11):
This is such a dig Okay, So yes, he gets
her with a sedative, he chloroforms her, but even after
all this she still wasn't unconscious.

Speaker 1 (34:20):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (34:21):
Barbara felt herself being carried a short distance before being
set down in front of the car headlights. The man
handed her a cardboard sign telling her to smile for
the camera.

Speaker 1 (34:33):
He took a polaroid of a dazed and drugged Barbara,
half smiling. He told her to He's like, smile for
the photo, psycho.

Speaker 3 (34:41):
So there is I will post this photo because it exists. No,
it's just like you can tell she's completely out of
it like this, like drugged up smile.

Speaker 4 (34:50):
It's so so sad.

Speaker 3 (34:53):
He then wrapped her in a blanket and began carrying
her through a wooded area.

Speaker 1 (34:57):
Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (34:59):
When they stopped, the man placed Barbara on the ground,
and she felt her feet dangle into a hole. No,
the man pushed her in, but Barbara was confused. This
was once too small to be a room. It must
be a passageway leading to the room. But that wasn't
correct either. This wasn't a passage or a room. It

(35:19):
was a box, not much room, mirror than a coffin.

Speaker 1 (35:23):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (35:25):
It was then that the drugged Barbara began to truly panic,
screaming no, no, no, no, you can't do this. The
man stared down at her, calmly, saying, don't be such
a baby. Oh my gosh, don't be such a baby.

Speaker 1 (35:42):
I would be furious. This part makes my heart race, Like, okay,
so there's a box in the hole. It's not just
a buried a hole, it's a there's a box in it, yes,
like it's a coffin. Basically, this is every nightmare.

Speaker 3 (36:00):
It's like, yeah, this is like my worst night here
He then started yelling at his accomplice about a water tube.
The accomplish crawled into the box, literally on top of Barbara,
like crawling on her body, to pull up the tube
and give it to her before climbing out.

Speaker 1 (36:15):
She was already laying in the box. Yes, they pushed
her down in there, that's right. Ah okay.

Speaker 3 (36:21):
So then the you know, the two kidnappers, they started
to argue. And while they argue, they are stupid because
they let each.

Speaker 1 (36:29):
Other's name slip. He called her Ruthie and she called
him George.

Speaker 2 (36:33):
Wow. Okay.

Speaker 3 (36:34):
Still woozy from the drugs, Barbara attempted to climb out
of the box, but was shoved back down and the
top of the box dropped above her with a heavy thud,
enveloping her in complete darkness.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
No, and you're so weak and drugged and sick, sick, feverish.

Speaker 3 (36:50):
She pushed against it with all her might, but the
lid didn't budge.

Speaker 1 (36:54):
The man was standing on it.

Speaker 3 (36:56):
She began screaming and pleading, but her cries were only
met with silence and the sound of the lid being
screwed down.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
With like a drill, like a just a power tool.
Oh my, God, this is the worst. Like she's not
even out of it yet, she's hearing all of it.
Oh my gosh, I.

Speaker 3 (37:19):
Know I'd be like, can you please actually fully knock
me out? Because I would be I would be I
would beg to just leave my body, please, just I
just want to float away now by Oh okay, hives, yes, okay.
So she's listening to the box be or the lid
be screwed on, and her pleading was quickly interrupted by

(37:41):
the man who told her to be quiet and listen.
He told her she needed to reach behind her head
to turn on the fan switch to bring in the air.
Barbara found it and switched it on, but continued to
beg and plead to be let out of the box.
But her kidnappers had no plans to let her out
of that box, and as Barbara continued to she heard
the first shovelful of dirt o hit the top of

(38:03):
the box. In the book, she said there she just
had no words to describe what that felt like.

Speaker 1 (38:11):
Oh my god, no, I can't even imagine that.

Speaker 3 (38:14):
The horror of the box being screwed on, the lid
being screwed on, but then hearing.

Speaker 1 (38:18):
Dirt dirt, knowing you were over and over getting like
quieter and softer as it builds, just knowing.

Speaker 3 (38:25):
You're being literally buried alive in a small box. Not
even like it still a fan like it's psycho. We
don't have to figure out this fan.

Speaker 1 (38:35):
Wow. I hate all of this. I can't believe she
lived through this. It's this is the worst. It's how
do you go to you? Oh my god? Okay, so,
oh my gosh, oh my gosh. Okay, okay.

Speaker 3 (38:48):
So the sounds of dirt hitting the lid grew increasingly
muffled as the earth piled up on top of her.
After some time, Barbara heard the man ask if she
knew how to work the pump, and she was like no,
attempt to be let out so that he could explain
it again, but the man sarcastically replied, you know how
to work.

Speaker 1 (39:07):
It, you know you understand. Wow, this guy is like
just extra, such a dick.

Speaker 3 (39:13):
Then Ruthie the accomplice, told Barbara not to worry and
that she would return in two hours to check on her.
She's like, oh, thanks, I can stop worrying now.

Speaker 1 (39:22):
No, I don't want to be awake in two hours.
I don't want you to keep waking me up. Oh
my gosh.

Speaker 3 (39:27):
Barbara began to cry hysterically, pounding on the lid of
the box with her fists, but it was met with silence.
Her kidnappers had left her there.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
Oh, then it would get so hot.

Speaker 3 (39:38):
And no, it's December and you're in the ground. It's
very cold.

Speaker 1 (39:40):
It's cold, even if you're compacted under earth. Yeah, it's cold.
Oh shoot, okay, well I wasn't. Oh, I was thinking
like hot breath. If you're still alive. I'll talk about
that later. Oh okay, interesting, but it's mostly just cold. Okay,
So it's cold. Okay, I'm miserable. Mistake.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
Okay, let's just take a quick break right here. Okay,
welcome back, all right. Back at the roadway in Barbera's mother,
Jane was doing her best to call for help. After
the kidnappers tied her up. She pretended to pass out

(40:19):
from the core form that was pressed to her face
smart and as soon as the others had left the room,
she jumped up.

Speaker 1 (40:25):
Oh yes.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
Jane tried to get to the phone, but with her
hands tied behind her back, she only succeeded in knocking
it off.

Speaker 1 (40:31):
The receiver.

Speaker 3 (40:33):
Wearing only a nightgown and no shoes, Jane ran out
to the parking lot and began screaming frantically for help.
Even those seventy one rooms were occupied that night, not
a single person answered her cries for help.

Speaker 1 (40:46):
That's sad. I feel like that happened so often in stories,
like people just assume like she's gonna get help somewhere else,
or she's crazy and she just right, she's just like
screaming and doesn't really need all like the amount of jokes.

Speaker 3 (40:58):
Listen to that podcast I Survived. Uh yeah, I think, Yeah,
there's so many of those stories where they're like half dead,
like screaming for help out in the street and like cars.

Speaker 1 (41:07):
Just pass by like they see them and just like
don't stop. I don't get it.

Speaker 3 (41:12):
I can't even I don't know what I would do
in that situation. I think maybe I would at least
maybe all for help.

Speaker 1 (41:18):
Yeah, maybe people are scared, but yeah I would pull
over and at least call if I was scared. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
Yeah. I think people either don't want to get involved
in a messy situation or they're like thinking that person
is dangerous. But I'm just like, wow, how can you
do the worst thing in your whole life? People just
literally see you and are like, no, thanks, you know,
I would hate I hate humanity a lot of the time. Traumatizing.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
So this is happening to Jane. No one's wanting to
help her.

Speaker 3 (41:41):
She desperately ran to her car and then uh following
more than once in the process and injuring herself. She
managed to open her car doors like she had to,
like do it, you.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
Know, backwards? Backwards?

Speaker 3 (41:51):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (41:52):
Is anyone looking out their window and seeing that her
hands are freakin tied. Her hands are tied. There's literally
tape hanging off of her mouth mouth like that's no,
Oh my gosh, Okay, let's see.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
So she gets the car door open somehow and she
dives I guess this is before everyone locked their doors,
and she dove into the driver's seat. She then positioned
her chin on the steering wheel and pressed continually down
on the horn, determined to wake everyone in.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
The fuck ups. Oh my gosh, yeah, so smart.

Speaker 3 (42:24):
What she got instead was a very irritated middle aged
night desk clerk at the motel named Walter Perkins. And
just get ready to pull.

Speaker 1 (42:34):
Your hair out over this man. Stop okay.

Speaker 3 (42:37):
Walter scurries out and he's like, hey, lady, shut up,
you're gonna wake the guests. Jane was staring at him
with tape hanging off her mouth, thinking he can't be
fucking serious, and she yelled for Heaven's sake, help me,
and he walks over. He pulls the tape off her
face while Jane tells him she's been attacked and her
daughter was kidnapped. He was like, okay, calm down.

Speaker 1 (43:00):
No, you don't tell a woman to calm down. She's
like literally tied up.

Speaker 3 (43:05):
As he continued fussing about the commotion she was making.
He turned to leave and James like, can you like
at least untie my hands? He didn't even untie her hands,
He scolded her and then started to walk back to
his desk.

Speaker 1 (43:21):
Does he have eyeballs or a heart?

Speaker 3 (43:23):
Like, oh my gosh, I can't stop saying, oh my gosh,
I'm annoying myself. But yikes, throw in the trash. So
he cuts her hands free, not her feet, and her
feet are tired. Her feet are still tired, so he
takes the He takes the time to untie her hands
and then was like, not gonna do your feet though.

Speaker 1 (43:43):
You can do your own feet right because your hands
are free. Oh my, it's he's just wrong with men.

Speaker 3 (43:50):
Just imagine his like little pinched face with his little
glasses and a little smirky like I'm just irritated that
you cause him problem, make noise, scurries around and tells
people the rules. Uh okay, So he doesn't cut her
feet free. She has to hop back to her room
and had to call the police herself because he didn't
offer to do that either.

Speaker 1 (44:09):
He didn't even offer to do a call to police,
not even like Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (44:13):
And this is also I don't know if anyone remember,
well we don't remember obviously, but like this was a
time when nine to one one wasn't a thing, Like
there was.

Speaker 1 (44:20):
A number for every area that you were in for
the police. What year was this, sixty eight? There was
no nine one one in nineteen sixty eight.

Speaker 3 (44:27):
No, so people had to like figure out the number
for their own local police.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
Oh that's troubling.

Speaker 3 (44:33):
This was also during a time where there was a
switchboard operator, so you had to like go through a
switchboard operator.

Speaker 1 (44:38):
Why are they living in like the nineteen hundreds, like
early nineteen hundreds.

Speaker 3 (44:42):
It seems like there should be more modern things by then. Yeah,
I guess there wasn't, Like there was a switch that.

Speaker 1 (44:47):
It seems so odd to be weird.

Speaker 3 (44:48):
There's so many moments in this book where they're like, oh,
I had to talk to the switchboard operator, like, wow,
what a wild time to be alive. You couldn't make
a phone call with that nothing was easy to someone else.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
So weird.

Speaker 3 (45:02):
Okay, So she does manage to call the police, and
luckily they were more helpful than Walter, fucking Walter, fucking Walter,
and they arrive almost immediately.

Speaker 2 (45:14):
Good.

Speaker 3 (45:14):
When Jane saw that her purse and money were untouched
in the motel room, her heart sank.

Speaker 1 (45:18):
Yeah, that's scary.

Speaker 3 (45:19):
She knew that they had come after Barbara specifically, and
Jane gave so. Jane gave her account to the officers,
who assumed that it must have been a sexually motivated abduction.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
Okay, yeah, they like just instantly went to that.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
Sure. By now, Jane had also called Barbara's friend Steve
or not Steve Stuart. It's kind of funny because Patty
Hurst's significant other was named Stuart, oh Steve, and this
guy's name is Stuart, So sorry if I confused them. Okay,
So she calls Stuart to come back to the motel

(45:52):
and the police began questioning him too. They were initially
suspicious of Stuart, but once they realized he had nothing
to do with the abduction, the police allowed him to
comfort and assist Jane. I'm glad someone is right. He
started by trying to call Barbara's father and Coral Gables, Florida,
where they lived in a nice house right off of
the country club golf course, but he wasn't home. And

(46:14):
then Jane suddenly remembered that her husband didn't sleep well
when she was gone, and so he would check himself
into a hotel that he and his brother's company owned to.

Speaker 1 (46:24):
Just casual rich peoplesh rich people. He's like, can I
have the villa for tonight?

Speaker 3 (46:30):
So Stuart calls the villa around five am and finally
reaches Robert, who is stunned by the news. He immediately
immediately guessed that this was a ransom situation and told
Stuart to call the at the FBI immediately. Robert then
called a trusted employee, Billy Vessels, and his brothers to
meet him at his home, where they would begin figuring
out how they were going to handle this. He knew

(46:53):
they needed to keep the situation out of the media
as long as possible, and he was going to need
a lot of help from his closest people. This is
when like money really comes into players. Like no people
in such high up positions.

Speaker 1 (47:05):
It's so wild.

Speaker 3 (47:06):
Robert instructed the men to stay at the house in
case the kidnapper called, and then rushed to the airport
to catch a flight to Atlanta to be with his wife.
At nine ten am, the phone rang at the Mackle home.
One of the men answered, and the man on the
other end of the line asked for Robert. When he
was told Robert was gone, the man said, tell him

(47:27):
to look under a palm tree in the northeast corner
of the house for a rock about and dig about
six inches down. The men anxiously waited for the FBI
to arrive before they would check under that rock, because
they didn't want to, you know, ruin the crime scene.
When the agents arrived, they located the rock described by
the collar and carefully dug up the earth below it.

(47:50):
They quickly unearthed a clear glass bottle. It looked kind
of like a test tube from like a lab and
inside of the bottle were three cops. He said, the
same letter folded up inside, so elaborate.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
I know.

Speaker 3 (48:06):
I'm going to warn you that the letter, unsurprisingly, is
very long and overly detailed. Editing is not a skill
this kidnapper has, so.

Speaker 1 (48:15):
I'm going to read it to you. It's in the
book Eats Water. Okay, this letter is so long, but
there's a lot of information that's important, so I'm just
gonna read it. Okay, this is too Robert mackel and
this was the letter that was in the test tu
Test two buried, buried underground elaborate.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
Okay, Yes, sir, your daughter has been kidnapped by us,
and we now hold her for ransom. She is quite safe,
if somewhat uncomfortable. We offer no proof of our possession
of her at this time. It will arrive by mail
in a few days. Barbara is presently alive inside a
small capsule buried in a remote piece of soil. She

(48:55):
has enough food, of water, and air to last seven days.
At the end of the seven days, the life support
batteries will be discharged and her air supply will be
cut off. The box is waterproof and very strong fiber
glass reinforced plywood. She has the little chance of escaping.
The box is an unusual and.

Speaker 1 (49:14):
Lonely place, very important.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
She has no chance of being accidentally stumbled upon. Contemplate,
if you will, the position into which this puts you.

Speaker 5 (49:26):
If you.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
This guy is just like you can tell, thinks he's
so smart, he thinks, oh, he's the smartest.

Speaker 1 (49:33):
He's a brilliant genius, mastermind.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
Contemplate if you will, the position into which this puts you.
If you pay the ransom prior to the seven days,
we will tell you of her whereabouts. Should you catch
the sorry, should you catch the messenger, we start to
pick up the ransom, we will simply not say anything
to anyone. An airgo, he says, an ergo barber will
self the kate. A messenger knows only one of us,

(49:59):
and he will report to us via radio from the
pickup site. We will immediately know his feet. Should you
catch all of us, we will never admit anything, and
to do so would be suicide. And again she will die.
As you can see, you don't want to catch us,
for doing so would be condemning your lovely and intelligent

(50:19):
daughter To death. The police may allow you to have
a free hand prior to the return of your daughter,
should you be so callous as to contact them. If
you ask the police to advise you in this matter,
please be aware that their very presence will scare us off.
We can see no way for you to secure the
safe the safe return of your daughter other than to
obey our instructions.

Speaker 3 (50:40):
Explicitly, we haven't even gotten to the instructions yet.

Speaker 2 (50:45):
Although we will always anticipate the involvement of the police
in the situation, be assured that if your communication with
them or their actual presence is detected, we will break
off negotiations with you immediately. We have tied into seven
of the possible means of communications that you have with
the police, and we feel that you will be able
to contact them without our knowledge. The ransom will be

(51:09):
five hundred thousand dollars and recently issued twenty dollars bills.
Here are the requirements you must meet in this manner.
The notes must not be older than nineteen fifty issue
No more than ten notes may have consecutive serial numbers.
I even notes must have a great variety of serial
numbers and not be merely shuffled the notes.

Speaker 1 (51:32):
Who's going to verify this? By the way, Oh my gosh,
a sell a nitpicky.

Speaker 2 (51:38):
The notes must be Federal Reserve notes of standard configuration.

Speaker 1 (51:44):
These words, okay.

Speaker 2 (51:46):
No more than one.

Speaker 6 (51:47):
Half of the notes may be uncirculated. No form of
marking on the bills is acceptable. Please note that the
bills will undergo a minimum wait or a minimum eight
hours of intense examination before you will allow you to
have them. All of the subject subjects whereabouts. We have
planned a series of forty four tests on a large
rep a large sample of the bills. These tests include

(52:11):
every chemical and physical test of any remote applicability. No emission, shaping, spotting, cutting, counterfeiting,
irradiating ad nods will go undetected. These bills should occupy
no more than four thousand cubic inches, and thus they
fit into a standard large suitcase.

Speaker 3 (52:32):
Of He gives specific dimensions of the suitcase. It has
to be a very specific size.

Speaker 2 (52:37):
Wow, thirty one point five inches long by eighteen point
seven five inches high by six point two five inches deep.

Speaker 1 (52:45):
He even has points.

Speaker 2 (52:47):
Yes, purchase such a suitcase and lock the bills inside
when you have the money in readiness I'll call the
Miami area major newspapers and place the following ad in
the personal section of the classified advertisements. The ad reads
as follows, loved one, please come home. We will pay
all expenses and meet you anywhere at any time. Your family.

Speaker 3 (53:10):
So you're saying you need a place to add in
a newspaper well after you get the money, so that
the kidnappers will see it.

Speaker 2 (53:15):
Okay, prepare your car for a trip, and on the
night of the AD's first appearance, we will call you
at your home after midnight to advise you of where
you must go to deliver the money. You must be
the one to deliver the money, Robert. You will dress
yourself in an all light outfits.

Speaker 1 (53:34):
All right. First of all, no that after Labor.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
Day you must use the Lincoln to deliver the money.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
He even knows what Cari drives ew.

Speaker 2 (53:45):
In order to prevent the instructional call being traced, it
will be very brief and no portion of it will
be repeated. If the phone rings more than three times
or the connection takes longer than fifteen seconds, we will
not contact you. You will have a limited time time
to make the rendezvous, so you should be ready to
leave your house within one minute of receiving the phone call.

(54:06):
In order to be within the time limit, you will
proceed to the area of the meeting within the legal
speed limit.

Speaker 1 (54:16):
Within the legal speed limit as if you were in
no hurry.

Speaker 2 (54:21):
We will not meet you. If you fail to show
within the time limit, which is only a short time longer,
then you will be required to drive to the pickup site.
Any unusual police activity or other activity in the area
of the pickup will cancel the appointment. When you arrive
at the pickup site, you will know it by a
signal of three short flashes repeated continuously from a flashlight

(54:41):
directed at the windshield of your car. When you see
the signal, you will stop the car and immediately take
the suitcase towards the light. The light will be mounted
on top of a box. The suitcase should be placed
within the box. You will then return to your car
and proceed back up the street in the direct from
which you came and go home. Any deviation from this

(55:03):
outline will result in your death.

Speaker 3 (55:06):
Your death now any deviation from this sorry already said that.

Speaker 2 (55:11):
Our messenger will have you in sights from the time
you leave your car within twelve hours after you order
the money, you will receive another phone call advising you
of your daughter's whereabouts. It will also be sent to
ensure the fighting of your daughter.

Speaker 3 (55:27):
The end.

Speaker 1 (55:27):
I'm exhausted. I'm exhausted. That was the longest list of
the most specific things.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
Is like the biggest paid in the ass the amount
of the specific suitcase.

Speaker 1 (55:41):
Side the measurements. You have to drive within the legal
speed like the legal speed limit. As you make.

Speaker 3 (55:49):
Just just so over the top. Here go, heir go,
so sorry. The FBI collected the notes and began to
analyze them right away. Meanwhile, the treasurer of Robert Mackel's
company named he was named O'Dowd was already arguing with
the president of First National Bank in Florida. O dowd

(56:10):
explained the situation and demanded five hundred thousand dollars and
twenty dollar bills. Shockingly, the president was able to secure
a large sum of money in a very short amount
of time. What ended up being the hardest part was
finding a suitcase that fit the kidnappers requested dimensions, which
apparently were not standard. After plundering several department stores and

(56:31):
coming up empty, one of the agent's wives offered up
her suitcase, which thankfully was about the right size. As
for the money, the FBI needed to record every single
serial number of the twenty dollars bills for tracking purposes.
Of course, this was the sixties, so it all had
to be done by hand, thus messed up.

Speaker 1 (56:52):
It's all messed up.

Speaker 3 (56:54):
Eighty five clueless loan officers that First National Bank were
assigned to this task. They weren't, and this was after
work hours.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
I feel for them.

Speaker 3 (57:04):
They were all like, Hey, you're all gonna have to
stay late, so call your wives and tell them you're
not coming home, and then you're gonna do this like
super boring, tedious, my numbing thing task. So they're all
told they're gonna work late and record serial numbers. Meanwhile,
Robert made his way to the Roadway Inn, where his
wife Jane awaited him. He was shocked at her condition.

(57:27):
She was bruised, scraped up from falling so many times,
and she had chloroform burns on her face. I didn't
know chloroform burns you, but I guess I didn't know either.
She was nearly hysterical with worry and upset, repeatedly blaming
herself for the whole thing, since she had been the
one to open the door.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
That would feel so much Oh, yeah, the guilt.

Speaker 3 (57:47):
Robert did his best to comfort his wife and let
her know that it wasn't her fault and that they
would get Barbara back. By now, they had been notified
of the ransom note, but Robert kept the specifics of
Barbara's circumstances from Jane that the news of her daughter
being buried alive would push her over the edge. Yeah, Robert,
who was claustrophobic, was also horrified by the reality because

(58:08):
I guess he he had like really bad claustrophobia. So
just even the thought of being buried alive probably, yeah,
was upsetting.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
Yeah, well, I mean it is.

Speaker 3 (58:17):
It is also at this point, the media had caught
wind of the kidnapping of you know, a very rich
man's daughter, and reports reporters began to swarm the motel.
And this is also back when there was just like, no,
I don't know, regulations on dignity or like, reporters were
just so pushy and nosy, and I mean they still are.

Speaker 1 (58:37):
That's that's pop parzzi.

Speaker 3 (58:39):
Yeah, like pop Parazzi. But back then, like I don't
think they had a lot of regulations on.

Speaker 1 (58:43):
Rules and yeah stuff. Yeah, they just tried to really
get into it, very intrusive.

Speaker 3 (58:49):
Jane fought to stay at the motel, convinced that Barbara
might try to reach her, but Robert assured her that
the FBI had tapped you know, the phones at the
hotel and at the house, so like they could go
home to handle the situation, right, So the Macaeles flew
back to Florida and contact the newspaper to put in
the ad the kidnappers had requested.

Speaker 1 (59:12):
Wait, they had to drive or they had to fly
back to Florida. Yeah, while their daughter still buried in
the ground. Yes, probably in Georgia. But I mean as
a mom, having to get on a plane knowing you
leave your daughter.

Speaker 3 (59:28):
She doesn't know she's buried alive, I know, but leaving
her with a kidnapper, true, like having to leave the state. Ooh,
it's I can't even imagine the stress of what this
must have been like. Yeah, yeah, so they go back
to Florida. Also happening during this time was the very
late night verifying and recording of all the twenty dollars

(59:49):
bill serial numbers. When they finished the bank employees had
copied and verified over six million digits in less than
six hours. Six hours, and I really hope that they
got a pizza party for their efforts.

Speaker 1 (01:00:04):
At least the.

Speaker 3 (01:00:08):
FBI agents were surprised at just how perfectly the money
fit in the suitcase when it was all loaded up,
So apparently the guy.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
Had really planned it. I really knew that it was
going to fit, and it was like.

Speaker 3 (01:00:19):
Seventy five pounds in the suitcase. Wow, that's a lot heavy.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
Yeah, all twenties. That's a lot of bills, it really is.

Speaker 3 (01:00:27):
With the task completed, the money was taken to the
macle home in preparation for the drop off to the kidnappers.
In the meantime, FBI agents were canvassing the Emery College
campus attempting to track down any witnesses who may have
seen the kidnappers. They would have some luck when more
than one professor said that they had been approached by
an odd looking couple asking about Barbara. One was a

(01:00:50):
large man about six feet tall, weighing about two hundred
and forty pounds, with a full dark beard. He was
with a very petite woman with was like a whole
foot shorter than him. She had dark hair and it
was styled in a short pixie cut. The pair had
been trying to find out which classes Barber was in

(01:01:11):
and where she stayed, which, like, isn't that kind of suspicious?

Speaker 1 (01:01:15):
Like, yeah, but this random couple is just asking.

Speaker 3 (01:01:18):
It was concluded that the suspicious pair had likely gathered
barber schedule. So they ended up getting this information from
the school.

Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
That's not okay, oho, they just released it.

Speaker 3 (01:01:28):
What No, So they got her schedule and they even
figured out that she wasn't staying in her dorm room
anymore by the time that they left.

Speaker 1 (01:01:35):
That's too much information that they know.

Speaker 3 (01:01:39):
Yeah, so they found out that she was even staying
in the specific Roadway motel. Apparently this is a more
trusting time just let all that information out. When the
couple left the campus, one of the professors noted that
they left in a blue station wagon, just like the
one witnessed by Stuart sitting in the Roadway Motel parking
lot before the kidnapping. The FBI felt it had they

(01:02:02):
had the suspects of physical descriptions, but they had no
idea who they were, where they came from. So they're
kind of at square one. All right, it's been a
minute since we checked on Barbara, So let's just see
how she's doing in that box. But let's just take
a quick break first. Okay, let's go back to miss Barbara.

Speaker 1 (01:02:28):
Oh yeah, are checking up on her.

Speaker 2 (01:02:29):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:02:30):
Once Barbara felt she was well and truly alone, she
began to take in her surroundings, as limited as they were.
She flipped the fan and light switches on and off
to ensure that they were still working, and decided to
keep the light on. Although she knew this would deplete
the battery faster, Barbara was afraid of the dark and
decided to take the risk. After an awkward few minutes

(01:02:54):
of wrestling with the rope tight, she's still tied also,
so she's trying to get the rope off of her.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
She still has a fever.

Speaker 3 (01:03:01):
Yeah, but she couldn't like reach her feet because of
how narrow the boxes, Like, she can't bend in half,
and she also can't really sit up.

Speaker 1 (01:03:11):
And we're like, maybe bend her knees very well, no,
like it's so cramped.

Speaker 3 (01:03:15):
She actually talks about this moment where she absolutely panicked
because she got stuck like trying to get her feet untied.
She got stuck like in half, and then she eventually
like got it off, but complete panic, which, of course,
like if there's no one coming for you.

Speaker 1 (01:03:33):
I hate that she's so conscious throughout this whole thing.

Speaker 3 (01:03:37):
Okay, So she gets herself in tied and then she
looks around. She saw a box of Cotex like feminine
hygiene product products.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
That's which reminds me of like, still gotta take care
of that.

Speaker 3 (01:03:51):
I know they're like, just in case your feminine problems arise,
like they thought of that, but it's just so weird.

Speaker 1 (01:03:58):
That is very weird.

Speaker 3 (01:03:59):
But it reminds me of story of that the first
woman in space, how they gave her like a million tampons.

Speaker 1 (01:04:06):
Do you know how this works?

Speaker 4 (01:04:08):
For so many?

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
Oh men really needed me to know, like especially back then,
literally zero understanding of the females. I know there was
no education back there. So bad, you're like, or fifty
tampons enough for this week? Is that gonna work? I
don't know why it's so weird to learn how to
how humans operate, but that's just me, Okay, I'm sorry,

(01:04:34):
all right.

Speaker 3 (01:04:34):
So she sees this box of feminine hygiene products and
it's sitting on top of a xerox note. Are you
ready for us fucking notes? The note, much like the
ransom note, is ridiculously detailed and reads as follows.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
So she has to have the light on and read
this ridiculous note. Yeah, this like in a coffin. Okay, okay,
here's the note. Do not be alarmed. You are I
hate him.

Speaker 3 (01:05:02):
You are presently inside a fiberglass reinforced plywood capsule buried
beneath the ground near the house in which your kidnappers
are staying. Your status will be checked approximately every two hours.
The capsule is quite strong, you will not be able
to break it open. Be advised, however, that you are
beneath the water table. If you should break open a seam,

(01:05:25):
you would drown before we could dig you out. The
capsule in instrumentation. Sorry, The capsule instrumentation contains a water
sensitive switch which will warn us if the water enters
the capsule to a dangerous degree. Your life depends on
the air delivered to your chamber via the ventilation fan.

(01:05:47):
The fan is powered by a lead acid storage battery
capable of supplying the fan motor with power for two
hundred and seventy hours. However, the use of the light
and other systems for only a few hours. Coupled with
the higher amperage drain will reduce this figure.

Speaker 1 (01:06:06):
To only one week of safety. Like the del it's
like a word math problem, it really is.

Speaker 3 (01:06:11):
You're like, oh, what seventy ambridge with air bridge. Should
the air supply prove to be too much, you can
partially block the air outlet with a piece of paper.
A muffler has been placed in the passage to prevent
any noise you make from reaching the surface. If we
detect any commotion which we feel is dangerous, we will

(01:06:32):
introduce an ether to the air vents to put you
to sleep. The fan operates on six volts. It has
a switch with two positions to switch between two available
circuits should one circuit fail to the other. The box
has a pump which will evacuate any accidental leakage from
the box when you turn the pump to the on position.

(01:06:56):
This pump uses fifteen times as much power as your
ventilation fan fifteen times yeah, seven point five amps. Your
life support battery will not allow the use of the
pump except for emergency water evacuation. The light uses two
point five times the amperage of the circulation system. You

(01:07:17):
s that the light, when not necessary, will cut your
battery safety margins substantially. If you use the light continuously,
your life expectancy will be cut to one.

Speaker 1 (01:07:28):
Third of the week we have allotted you before you
are released. Also, but then he made this long ass
letter that she had to read to keep the light on. So,
my god, that's so true. Like as you read this letter,
half of your life support has drained. Let's see.

Speaker 3 (01:07:44):
Your capsule contains a water jug with three gallons of
water and a tube from which to drink. It be
careful to blow the water from the tube when you
are finished drinking to avoid siphoning the water onto the
floor when the tube and drops below the water level.
Your capsule contains a bucket for refutes as a pee
and poop and the products of your bowel movements. The

(01:08:07):
bucket has an antibacterial solution in it. Don't tip it over.
The lid seals tightly to prevent the escape of odors.
A roll of wax paper is provided. Wax paper that's
not comfortable to wipe with.

Speaker 1 (01:08:22):
Wax paper is like wax paper, It doesn't absorb. No,
it's very that. No, let's see.

Speaker 3 (01:08:30):
Wax paper is provided. Use it to prevent solid waste
from contaminating your bed. Cotex is provided should you need it.
Blankets and a mate are provided. Your warmth depends on
body heat, so regulate the air to prevent loss of
heat from the capsule.

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
Oh, it's cold, they keep forgetting it's cold.

Speaker 2 (01:08:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:08:50):
The case of candy is provided to furnish candy to
your body. Energy to your body. Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:08:56):
Tranquilizers are provided to aid you in sleeping the best
way you have to pass the time. The ventilation system
is doubly screened to prevent insects or animals from entering
the capsule area. Your risk being eaten by ants should
you break these protection screens. The electrical components behind these
screens are delicate and they support your life. Don't attempt

(01:09:17):
to touch these circuits. We're sure your father will pay
the ransom we have asked in less than one week.
When your father pays the ransom, we will tell him
where you are and he'll come for you. Should he fail,
should wait, should he fail to pay? Oh sorry, should
he fail to? Oh, my god, start that over. We're

(01:09:40):
sure your father will pay the ransom we have asked.
In less than one week.

Speaker 1 (01:09:44):
When your father pays the ransom, he will tell where
you are and will come for you. Should he fail
to pay, we will release you. So be calm and rest.
You'll be home for Christmas one way or the other.
Which is a lie because he told the dad if
they failed that she would di right, so he's just lying. Also, Also,

(01:10:04):
where's the room for all of this? Huh, she's in
a coffin. Where's the room for all of Oh? Right
to go to the bathroom. Where's bucket, where's the wax paper?
Where's the I think it's down by your feet?

Speaker 6 (01:10:14):
Hey?

Speaker 2 (01:10:14):
All of this?

Speaker 3 (01:10:14):
Yeah, it's like not if it makes any sense where
it's like and it's all true, Like it's.

Speaker 1 (01:10:19):
Like it's not like lies. Like she has a tube
that she drinks water from, Like this is crazy town.

Speaker 3 (01:10:25):
Yeah, I'll post the pictures of like the box, like
how big?

Speaker 1 (01:10:28):
Oh? Yeah, they dug it up. I mean it's we
have those are gonna be so eery to look at.

Speaker 3 (01:10:33):
It's literally when I saw the box, it made my
heart race because I was like, that's not a big box.

Speaker 1 (01:10:38):
Oh, I can't believe there's there's photos.

Speaker 3 (01:10:41):
Okay, Okay, so these instructions contain so many contradictions. It's
like a person who thinks they're super smart wrote them
and it's just super annoying.

Speaker 1 (01:10:50):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (01:10:52):
So it hadn't been two hours yet, but Barbara was
beginning to panic and decided to push the pump switch,
which would suppose suppose alert the kidnappers in the house
that something was wrong, which is what they said in
the letter. Right, she pushed it, nobody came. She waited
for two hours.

Speaker 1 (01:11:09):
Nobody came.

Speaker 3 (01:11:10):
Barbara then realized they had lied to her and she
was on her own. Nobody was coming to check on her.

Speaker 1 (01:11:15):
Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (01:11:16):
Of course, she attempted to pass the time and squash
her growing panic attacks by thinking about her life and
her family. She counted the seconds she mentally decorated her
Christmas tree in excruciating detail, over and over.

Speaker 1 (01:11:29):
That is so sad, I know.

Speaker 3 (01:11:31):
She even started seeing Christmas carols to make herself laugh
at how awful she sounded with.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
Her sick, craspy boys.

Speaker 3 (01:11:39):
She thought of all these things until something horrifying happened.
The light began to flicker. Her tiny little Christmas tree
bulb light and only source of comfort flickered briefly and
then burned out.

Speaker 1 (01:11:54):
The blow was what this blow was?

Speaker 3 (01:11:56):
Finally what like broke Barbara. She began to cry. I
don't think she'd really cry, like cried a whole lot
up to this point. Yeah, but she tried not to
because it made her congestion worse.

Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
I hate crying when I'm sick. I just I know
it makes everything worse, and it gives you a headache. Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:12:12):
She tried to distract herself by searching for the water
tube and tranquilizers the note spoke of. She realized, with
some disappointment, that there were no tranquilizing I was.

Speaker 1 (01:12:21):
Going to say, give me all the tranquilizers all at once.

Speaker 3 (01:12:23):
Oh no, at least none that she could find. There
was some candy, and she did find the water tube.

Speaker 1 (01:12:29):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:12:29):
But the water tasted disgusting, but it was all she had,
so she had to sip it sparingly. But Barbara soon
found that the kidnappers weren't lying about one thing.

Speaker 1 (01:12:40):
She was getting wet.

Speaker 3 (01:12:44):
The condensation from her hot breath was causing water to
drip from the top of the box onto her body.

Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
And let's just remember, and she's cold, she's sick.

Speaker 3 (01:12:54):
She has a nightgown and socks, and they wrapped her
in like a damp blanket. Everything's damp.

Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
Literally every detail is so excruciatingly like.

Speaker 3 (01:13:05):
You already feel so achy and miserable and like the chills,
the worst of the worst situation, and then just now
you're in the ground and you're wet and it's cold
and it's damp, and like your breath is.

Speaker 1 (01:13:18):
Making water drip on you and you're panicking and you're dark,
it's dark, crying and sick and just can't fall asleep.
There's no tranquilizers ugh, and she has like no watch,
there's no ability to know how much time has passed.
You totally start going like you don't know how much
times passed, like in a situation like that, Like imagine

(01:13:38):
sleeping and then waking up and being like, I don't
know how long I was asleep. It could have been
like literally fifteen minutes or twenty hours. Is it dark outside?
Is it light?

Speaker 3 (01:13:45):
I don't know what day is it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:47):
I don't know why am I still awake?

Speaker 3 (01:13:49):
So Okay, So she was also extremely uncomfortable because it's
on She's on like a hard surface. So just imagine
laying on a hard surface can time like, you would
get so stiff and sore. She can't fully stretch out
her legs either, which makes me freak out, not being
able to stretch out my legs, and she couldn't fully

(01:14:09):
sit up, so like there's just this painful Oh God,
just thinking about it. She's so uncomfortable. Thankfully, she never
needed to make a bowel movement, but she did have
to pee because of the cramped space. She ended up
peeing on herself while attempting to pee into the bucket they.

Speaker 1 (01:14:26):
Gave her, of course, like I mean, yeah, how do
you do that? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:14:28):
That She was like these idiots, like didn't even think
about how the hell am I supposed to pee it,
like in a box that I can't sit up in.

Speaker 1 (01:14:35):
God, Like, they didn't even give her a funnel. You
need a funnel. He's probably just thinking like, oh, I
peek with my penis and it's so easy. That's the problem.

Speaker 3 (01:14:46):
So she did all this in the dark, buried under
the ground, worried about the effect her kidnapping would have
on her family, but there was nothing left to do
but wait and hope for rescue. Okay, back to the parents,
Jane and Robert Mackell arrived back home to a house
full of FBI agents, the family, doctor, and Macael's closest
friends and employees. By now, the suitcase had been brought

(01:15:09):
to the house and the FBI had outfitted the Mackel's
car with a radio transmitting device and microphone installed in
the air vent. The conversation would be transmitted back to
the FBI if someone spoke inside the car. The FBI
agents then went to the back of the car and
opened the trunk, where a very large agent was crammed inside. Okay,
They explained that the agent would stay in the trunk

(01:15:31):
if Robert got into trouble with the kidnappers. Robert, unwilling
to disobey the kidnappers demands, though, told the agent to
get out of the trunk.

Speaker 1 (01:15:39):
He would be making the drop alone.

Speaker 2 (01:15:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:15:41):
I would be scared to because they're so specific and
they've been watching you, like they know all this stuff
about you. Yeah. I would be like, no, I have
to follow their directions. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:15:52):
And he's also like, what is this guy gonna do anyway?
He's in the trunk right, all right? So inside the home,
the family and agents milled about anxiously. It had now
been two days since Barbara was buried alive, Oh my god,
and the clock was ticking. Robert changed into an all
white outfit as requested, and paced the floor in front
of the phone. The FBI had instructed him to try

(01:16:14):
and keep the kidnappers on the phone as long as
he could so they could attempt to trace the call.
Jane had wandered into the room to check on her husband,
but was quickly ushered out of the room, given a
sedative and put to bed.

Speaker 1 (01:16:26):
We just can't handle the women around it.

Speaker 3 (01:16:29):
Literally, I it made me laugh, how like awful They like,
they just think she's so fragile. She they basically just
drug her for most of this and they're like, Okay, honey,
go to bed.

Speaker 1 (01:16:39):
I don't really want to deal with you either, So
just sleep. Yeah, They're like, your nerves are so delicate.
Just getting out of here.

Speaker 2 (01:16:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:16:47):
So she Jane, like pretty much the whole time, has
no idea what's going on. All she knows, she still
does know that she's buried, none of the details. All
she knows is that there's a five hundred thousand dollar
ransom and that her daughter is gone. Yeah, it's wild
to me.

Speaker 1 (01:16:59):
Uh, okay.

Speaker 3 (01:17:00):
So in the letter, the kidnappers said that they would
call after midnight with the instructions on where to take
the money. Midnight came and went, but there was no call.
It was agonizing. It also didn't help that there were
sick freaks trying to make a quick buck that called
the phone at home pretending to be the kidnappers. What
this happened three times after midnight, and every time Robert

(01:17:21):
had no choice but to take them seriously until he
began realizing they were lying, which is so excruciating, heartbreaking.
I can't even like, what kind of sick three times
in a row.

Speaker 1 (01:17:31):
Like different people. That's come on, that's so sick, get
a better life.

Speaker 3 (01:17:36):
Like torturing this poor dad about his daughter living kidnapping
It is funny about that. Well, they're just literally trying
to get the ransom money.

Speaker 1 (01:17:45):
Oh, that's still so sick. It's it is, It's so awful.

Speaker 3 (01:17:49):
So finally, at three forty seven am, which is quite
a bit after midnight, kidnappers, what are you waiting for?
The phone rang again, and Robert knew as soon as
he heard them on the other line that this was
the real deal. The man was cold and he cut
straight to the point. He began giving directions for where
Robert needed to drive, all roads that he was unfamiliar with.

(01:18:11):
In retrospect, he was unfamiliar because the kidnapper had given
him bad directions, not on purpose, he was just an idiot.
Robert was instructed to drive to the bay because they're
in Florida, so they're by the ocean, to a secluded
area where he would see a bridge. On the bridge
would be a box with a blinking light. Robert was

(01:18:32):
supposed to take the suitcase full of money, place it
in that box, and then leave. During the call, FBI
agents were frantically looking at paper maps, trying to make
the route like in pencil, because this is like before GPS,
literally just looking at paper maps and trying to figure
out where this is.

Speaker 1 (01:18:49):
I couldn't even imagine. I'm not jealous of that time,
Like I'm if.

Speaker 3 (01:18:54):
You gave me and told me to find where, I
would be so fussed. I would never get there. Uh yeah,
they gave me those directions. I'm sorry, Barb, but you
would be so well so. With his poor instructions in hand,
Robert and the suitcase or got the suitcase into the car,
and began his journey to the bay. As he drove,

(01:19:16):
Robert spoke every turn he took and what street he
was on out loud for the FBI agents listening in Mark. Yeah,
they had all been instructed not to intervene and not
to make any arrests. This was told to the police
as well, even if they saw the kidnappers.

Speaker 1 (01:19:33):
Like from him, he said that to the police and
the FBI.

Speaker 3 (01:19:36):
Yeah, well the FBI was also was the one instructing
the police.

Speaker 1 (01:19:39):
Oh, like they were agreeing to that.

Speaker 3 (01:19:41):
Yeah, because the note said if anyone intervenes, yeah, will
kill her.

Speaker 1 (01:19:45):
Or not tell you where she is. Right, So I'm
glad that they listened. Yeah, they did listen.

Speaker 3 (01:19:50):
I don't think that that's how they would go down today.

Speaker 1 (01:19:52):
No, they would still do whatever the fuck they want.

Speaker 3 (01:19:54):
Yeah, but back then they're like, okay, we'll take you seriously,
We're not going to intervene.

Speaker 1 (01:20:00):
Hmmm, uh okay.

Speaker 3 (01:20:02):
So unfortunately, it didn't take long for Robert to get
lost in the bungled directions. To make matters worse, he
stopped and asked some fishermen for directions, who confidently gave
him more bad directions, which maybe is why men don't
want to stop for directions.

Speaker 2 (01:20:15):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:20:16):
Maybe Robert was under severe pressure at this point and
felt like he was starting to crack apart. He yelled
into the microphone that he couldn't find the place, his
voice cracking with emotion.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28):
Oh that would be so frustrating. I know, I would
be so like just trying to do it. And there's
like a time frame. Yeah, there's a time there's a
time limit, and you have to go to the legal
speed limit. You have to call the legal speed limit.
You can't even go five above. Yeah, I would be
the panic.

Speaker 3 (01:20:44):
I would have it not because it's also dark, it's
at night. He's in a remote area, so there's probably
not street lamps. Cold and cold, so it's probably hard
to see. Well it's Florida, is it cold?

Speaker 2 (01:20:53):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:20:53):
No? Mmmm, that's right, different state, yeah hmmm. And like
also there's so many things to think about, like what
if you forget one or like what if you go
one mile above the speed of the mountain accent? Like
for a second.

Speaker 3 (01:21:05):
But who is like watching you? Like that's the other thing.
How are they monitoring this? But there's also no way
to know how many people are involved, so maybe they are.

Speaker 1 (01:21:15):
Back at the house.

Speaker 3 (01:21:15):
Robert's close friend and employee, Billy Vessels, who was listening
to the whole thing, said he couldn't take it anymore.
He and two agents piled into a car and raced
to find Robert before their time ran out. They intercepted Robert,
and Billy jumped into the passenger seat and sat on
the floor to avoid being seen. Robert said, Billy, I
can't find it. I've bungled it. Billy calmly began directing

(01:21:37):
Robert on where to go from the floor. When they
finally reached where they thought was the spot, Robert hurriedly
grabbed the case and ran to the bridge where he
was supposed to drop it, but there was no box
and there was no flashing light. Feeling sheer panic once again,
Robert put the case down and hoped the kidnappers wouldn't
punish him for not putting the suitcase in the box.

(01:22:00):
It was now four thirty am, which was like well
over the time.

Speaker 1 (01:22:03):
That they gave him. Really, yeah, okay with that, he
ran back.

Speaker 3 (01:22:08):
To the car, knowing it had been almost an hour
since the kidnapper had called, and hoped that he wasn't
too late, before Robert could even drive back home, though
the phone rang at the macl residence. Robert's brother, Frank,
picked up the call. It was the kidnapper asking about
where the hell the money was. Frank explained that Robert
was having trouble finding the spot, and the kidnapper proceeded

(01:22:28):
to talk to Frank very casually and calmly about the
whole thing. Frank said that perhaps Robert had made the
drop by now, and that he had better go check.
After Robert returned home, completely spent and exhausted, the FBI
reported that they had seen flashing lights in the drop
off location, so they think, like maybe flashlights, so they're

(01:22:49):
like and then they checked and the suitcase wasn't there,
so that's good, okay. The men all breathed a sigh
of relief. It had worked out even after all of that,
and the kidnappers had their money. Barbara was going to
be saved, but that all came crashing down, but an
agent walked into the room and said that there had
been a shootout with the local police. The money had

(01:23:11):
been recovered, but the suspects got away. Robert collapsed at
the news and began to sob shouting, my god, my god,
they're going to kill my daughter.

Speaker 1 (01:23:22):
M hmmm.

Speaker 3 (01:23:22):
And that's where we're going to stop from bart.

Speaker 1 (01:23:24):
One so sad.

Speaker 3 (01:23:26):
So basically, the local police did what they weren't supposed
to do, right, got involved, had a shoot out the kidnappers.

Speaker 1 (01:23:35):
They got away, but they didn't get their money. So
now so now so now, And I know I don't
like like the.

Speaker 3 (01:23:44):
Kidnappers identities or anything, but we will on the second half, okay,
because there's a lot of story.

Speaker 1 (01:23:49):
Wow, this is a juicy story. Like it's so juicy,
like the failed like money drop off like it that's
so scary. Yeah, so dramatic, all the worst things.

Speaker 3 (01:24:01):
The steaks, The steaks are so whidh kid is buried underground.

Speaker 1 (01:24:06):
That's terrible. Yeah. Wow, well, good job, thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:24:10):
We'll return soon for part two.

Speaker 1 (01:24:12):
We're excited. Yeah yeah cool, what's what now? So now
we have to do like our city of the Week thing.

Speaker 4 (01:24:20):
Yes, and that goes to Phoenix, Arizona. Hey Phoenix, Hello,
you're just talking about Phoenix Lights.

Speaker 1 (01:24:38):
How did that go? How do you think about that?
Tell us about that. It was a while ago.

Speaker 3 (01:24:43):
Did you see anything that was a big deal wasn't it.
That's the case we should probably cover at some point.

Speaker 1 (01:24:47):
Actually, yeah, that would be a great one. Yeah, ooh ideas.
It's a big one though, it is.

Speaker 3 (01:24:51):
That's why I'm way scared of it because it's so huge, intimidating.

Speaker 1 (01:24:55):
Oh well, thank you for listening, we see you. Thank
you so much. I don't think we've in Arizona before.
I'm not sure. Cool, cool, cool, So let me recommend
something for Christmas. If you haven't listened to it, I
really have been enjoying. This is gonna be kind of funny.

(01:25:15):
But it's it's Jimmy Fallon's really, it's Jimmy Fallon's Christmas album.
It's called Holiday Seasoning and it's so good. Really, it's
a bop. Like, there's so many great songs. I'm like,
Hella dancing in my card?

Speaker 2 (01:25:29):
Do it? Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:25:30):
So is it just to be fallen? Er? Is it? Like?
There's so many guests. There's there's the Jonas Brothers, there's JT.
Of course, there's Dolly Parton, there's uh, what's her name?
Arion Grande and Megan the Stallion. Wow. Yeah, a lot,
a lot, and they're so fun. They're just funny and

(01:25:52):
fun and it makes me laugh and I love it.

Speaker 3 (01:25:54):
Okay, well I haven't listened to a new Christmas album
this year, so I'll put it on the list.

Speaker 1 (01:25:59):
Yeah, yourself a favor and have some fun and listen
to that. Does Rylan like Christmas music? I'm not sure
we've played a whole lot. She loves Christmas tree and
the stockings and she goes ho ho ho oh.

Speaker 3 (01:26:13):
So cute the love Santa. He keeps pointing out the
picture we went to the mall Santa, so he has
a picture.

Speaker 1 (01:26:20):
It's so cute that they're like understanding Christmas.

Speaker 2 (01:26:22):
Now.

Speaker 1 (01:26:22):
I know they're like on Christmas tree and I'm like, yes,
it's curdy. Feel freaked out. When we put our tree up,
he was like, big tree. It was like, it is
a big tree.

Speaker 3 (01:26:32):
I think we really want to, like if it's not
cold and wet one night, well it's gonna be cold,
but not wet. I think we want to like try
and walk around the neighborhood so you can look at
all the Christmas lights.

Speaker 1 (01:26:40):
That's so fun. You get all bundled up, get some
hot cocoa. If you can exactly get all this like
scarves and hats and gloves on, and then it's like,
actually really nice to walk around in the cold and
like see all the fun lights.

Speaker 3 (01:26:51):
We actually have.

Speaker 1 (01:26:52):
There's I mean this people our neighborhood really do go
all out. So there's actually some good house I saw
some decked out houses.

Speaker 3 (01:26:58):
Yeah, it's fun, and I feel like I do kind
of want to drive around, but I don't know if
he can really see that well from the car seat,
you know, Yeah, so maybe just a walk around the neighborhood.

Speaker 1 (01:27:08):
But yeah, I would do a rock around the neighborhood
or drive to like one of those like fancy neighborhoods
with bottle lights. You get out and like yeah that
you can park and then you get out and walk.
Yeah it's cool.

Speaker 3 (01:27:19):
I actually like I didn't want to be the Grinch
this year, and I actually ordered Christmas lights and now
the order is not arriving. Oh non skin too late,
and now it's gonna be like Christmas in like a week,
and I'm just.

Speaker 1 (01:27:31):
Like for the Grinch, A can no, It's okay, just
do it next year. It'll come like so fast. I
really wanted to not be the grinch house this year.
Are you the only one without light? Pretty much everyone
hates you for like the black hole in the neighborhood's
so late. But I love Christmas. Our house is decorated
on the inside. I mean that's what matters. Yeah, don't

(01:27:53):
feel bad about it. Okay, Hey, is that?

Speaker 2 (01:27:56):
I mean?

Speaker 1 (01:27:56):
Is it? Do you have anything else? No?

Speaker 3 (01:27:58):
I assume we're not gonna probably record before Christmas holidays,
So Merry Christmas, Happy holidays, whatever you celebrate or don't.

Speaker 1 (01:28:06):
Happy New Year, Yeah, Happy New Year, and uh good up? Okay,
good night? All right.

Speaker 3 (01:28:20):
For my sources, I read a book called eighty three
Hours Till Dawn by Gene Miller in collaboration with back Barbaramacle.
Also looked at Time dot com, Wikipedia dot com. Our
music is by Broke for Free and Matt Eden, and
we are edited by Michael.

Speaker 1 (01:28:42):
All right, should I listart social media? Please? Do?

Speaker 3 (01:28:47):
We have a lot of our things that Anxious and
Afraid the Pod. So that's our handle for both of
our Facebook page and group, along with our Instagram and Gmail.

Speaker 1 (01:28:56):
We have a Twitter at AA Thepod. You can support
us on Patreon dot com forward slash Anxious and Afraid.

Speaker 3 (01:29:03):
If you do that you get some pretty nice perks.
You get ad free episodes that are released a whole
day early, and you get a free sticker.

Speaker 1 (01:29:12):
You can also support us for free. If you can't
do any of that by leaving a rate review, you
subscribe to the show. Tell your friends, yeah, we would
appreciate all of it.

Speaker 4 (01:29:22):
Do right now,

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce

Dateline NBC

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 115: Overly Complicated Ransom Notes and Strict Speed Limits (Kidnapping of Barbara Jane Mackle, Part I)

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}Stuff You Should Know

New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce

Dateline NBC

All Episodes

Episode 115: Overly Complicated Ransom Notes and Strict Speed Limits (Kidnapping of Barbara Jane Mackle, Part I)

Stuff You Should Know