Debate Your Illusion: with Ace Von Johnson of L.A. Guns | Ep. 494

Let's finally end the debate. Ace Von Johnson, guitarist for L.A. Guns, joins to chat the seemingly endless conversation of whether Guns N' Roses' Use Your Illusion 1 & 2 should have only been one album. Ace says yes, I say no. What say you?

More info:
https://www.acevonjohnson.com/site/
http://www.lagunsmusic.com/

Our Website: www.afdpod.com

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
You know.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
This is Appetite for Distortion. Welcome to the podcast Appetite

(00:33):
four Distortion, episode number four hundred and ninety four. My
name is Brando. Welcome to the podcast as Vaughn Johnson.
How are you, sir?

Speaker 1 (00:43):
I'm very well. How are you.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
I'm doing well. You know, it's interesting that you were
on my short lived well it's on Hiatus horror podcast
because I had I had a kid. I can't really
watch horror stuff with him, so I had to put
it on pause. Talk about G and R though. Yeah,
but so it's just fun to get the you know,

(01:06):
guitars from La Guns to talk about something else, and
then here we're going to talk about the User Illusion Records,
which if you're watching on Zoom on my new webcam,
I say it like it's fancy, but it was like
fifty bucks. I figured, like that's that's something of an
upgrade than just what comes with the laptop. I should

(01:27):
I'm close to five hundred episodes and half of those
have been Zoom. I should spend a little money, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
It's worth upgrading at that point.

Speaker 2 (01:35):
Yeah, I thank you. I appreciate it. I wanted to
sow even though you're your bugs. You have a nice
camera you have. Are you used to do a podcast
as well? Didn't you? Or you you you've done plenty
of video of content for your stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:50):
Yeah, I'm all have a Patreon that I spend a
lot of time. Funny, I'm getting an email right right
now about it. I spend a lot of time and
energy on But uh, yeah, I don't really have any
sort of creator tools or I don't have those little
cameras that everybody has that mount to everything. Okay, nothing

(02:11):
like that. I'm pretty you know, use my phone, use
my computer, use my hands, some rocks and sticks.

Speaker 2 (02:18):
That's that was me. So I'm so behind. I may
seem like I'm on it. I'm cool, but I'm like
I got to upgrade this because I want to keep
doing it because there's so many things to talk about.
Because with you, before we get to losing this thing,
because it's like, okay, we've done nearly five hundred episodes,

(02:38):
we haven't talked about we haven't spoken about what everyone
talks about every year when they should be one record,
two records. We're going to get to that, but before
we get into the nitty gritty, and I have a
difference of opinion about things you speak about Patreon. What
else can you talk about that you have going on
right now? Any updates with Like Guns or any already works.

(03:00):
I know you're always working with dogs and you're voting dogs,
So before it gets lost in the weeds, if you
wouldn't mind just share.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, new La Guns record comes out in
about a month and some change the beginning of April,
and I'm about to leave in forty eight hours to
do the Eighties Cruise with Faster Pussycat. I'll be sort
of moonlighting with them, I say, next month, but you
know what I mean, in a couple of days in March,

(03:28):
doing the Eighties Cruise with them and as well as
the Monsters of Rock Crews with both Faster Pussycat and
La Guns. And La Guns has a headline tour starting
sort of the tail end of April going into mid
to late May, and some other things I'm doing over

(03:52):
the summer. A bunch of guest albums I'm played on
I think come out in the next let's say three
to six months, like or four different records that aren't
either La Guns or something sort of on the nose
like that played on there's an old punk band from
New York City called The Undead that features Bobby Steele,

(04:14):
who was originally in the Misfits in the late seventies.
I'm sure everybody watching or listening knows who the Misfits
our Bobby was in the Misfits. So I played on
his new record. And there's a band from San Diego
called Agent fifty one that's been around for forever, another
kind of punk rock band, sort of Green Day type
meets Rancid band. I was there roady when I was

(04:35):
like fourteen, like I was like a kid. I got
all my early music knowledge from working for them. I
played on their new record a couple songs and a
couple other things.

Speaker 2 (04:45):
So yeah, and then other things on top of all that, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, and all that. But yeah, just you know, some
musical cameos. I do really enjoy when somebody goes, hey,
there's some other stuff that hasn't happened yet, but you know,
bands will hit me up and say, you know, hey,
you know, like, uh, would you write a song with us,
or play on a record, or maybe do a guest solo.
I love that stuff. Even I'm wearing I'm wearing an

(05:11):
electric Frankenstein shirt right now, and even those guys and
I've been talking for years. At one point I think
I played on some stuff that ended up getting shit canned,
just in general, but just I love I love the
little music, musical cameo stuff because when I was a kid,
I really enjoyed reading liner notes and being like, oh
my like speaking of these records, being like, oh my god,

(05:32):
the guy from Hanoway Rocks is on that song or
whatever it was. So I enjoy sort of spreading my
little musical uh you know, feed dirty cooties into other
people's uh, you know, whatever you want to call it.
But and then as far as Patreon and charity and
stuff like that, I love my Patreon. I have a
really great support system there, you know, ranging from five

(05:55):
dollars to all the way up. And I have a
podcast I do there that's pretty much not even a podcast,
but it's just Ricky Rackman and I just shooting the
shit every week. So I'm assuming everybody here knows who
Ricky Rackman is. And the short end is that he's
arguably my closest friend on earth, Like, you know, play
guitar and his wedding like a La slash in a

(06:16):
Guns N' Roses video and all this stuff. We're really
close and so it have been for about ten years.
But we will just shoot the shit. And so that's
one of the things that you get access to if
you join my Patreon and just my you know, the
travel and tribulations and whatnot of being a touring rock
musician and somebody who does voiceover work and somebody who

(06:37):
does animal rescue work and advocacy and whatever the you know,
composing stuff for horror movie related stuff, whatever the fuck
I'm doing that today, whatever hat I'm wearing, that's all
what ties into the Patreon. And then I've spent most
of my free time now I have for the last
four months I'm here in Nashville, Tennessee, I've spent a

(06:57):
lot of time at the animal shelter. I'm a sort
of upper middle management volunteer guy because it's all color
coded and like I'm now, I'm training volunteers, so you know,
and so I go, I'll be there tomorrow morning at
like ten in the morning and just hanging out with

(07:17):
dogs and trying to network and get dogs out of
the shelter and adopted and talking to some people. I
don't want to say too much, but some events going
on over the summer, we're all a peer as sort
of a talking head or whatever, like an f level
of music celebrity or whatever you want to call it.
Like this is we've got Hayes, Van Johnson, Formelli, other veastetables,

(07:38):
a get and I'll be there waving like with a poodle,
and you know, like these adoption fair adoption events. So
a lot of stuff like that, just as much as
I can. I'm sure there's twenty other things I'm forgetting,
but that's everything in a nutshell.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
That's a large nutshell, and I mean, wow, that's that's
a lot to the process, just as listening to and
let alone you doing it. You don't have an assistant.
You probably just have all this down in your.

Speaker 1 (08:04):
System is more legged and downstairs right on the door.

Speaker 2 (08:08):
That's cool. Well, I appreciate you you're taking the time
from those twenty odd things, uh to talk with me
about use your illusion one and two. You spent your
time much better way. So just just thanks man. You
know I've I've we followed each other on social media.
I enjoy following you for those every reason you just

(08:29):
announced between horror and the animals and everything in between
rock and roll. Uh, but just being a fan of music,
and I kind of just threw this out at you.
I was wasn't like a plan. I'm like, hey, you
want to come on my podcast, Sure, and we could
talk if it comes up organically and more about Elie
guns and everything, but like you know, let let's let's

(08:50):
do something a little bit different, which is I do
here and you talk about the many hands I want that. Yeah,
thank you, trust me.

Speaker 1 (08:55):
Everybody everybody wants to talk about guns, we can talk
about anything anything. On top of that as well.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Well, you're talking about the many hats you wear. What
about this really fugly user illusion one hat that I
bought off Amazon that I'm wearing.

Speaker 1 (09:10):
It's like so when I first saw it, I didn't
realize what I was looking at, and I was like,
maybe it's like fire. I thought it was fire, and
then you're like, oh, check it out, And then I
was like, Okay, that's cool, Like if you're a diehard fan,
that's cool.

Speaker 2 (09:22):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
I cannot sport anything that's not a neutral way. So
I commend you for rocking the like day glo orange
and yellow and I forgot what that painting is called,
with the sort of like Theologian on the cover there
School of Athens describe what is it?

Speaker 2 (09:43):
The School of Athens by Raphael If you look at it,
it's all the philosophers. It's such a part of a
larger painting, and it's just the what I believe is
actually it was my first tattoo, is the little boy
writing in the in a book. Why I always look
at it as like a philosophy student. It's on my left
shoulder blade. I don't want to take off my shirt

(10:05):
and I'm not as ripped as you, you know, so
it's it's not gonna I got a clear webcam. I'm
not gonna start taking off my clothes now.

Speaker 1 (10:12):
I only to myself.

Speaker 2 (10:15):
You only have one tattoo, because they're all connected.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
It's the whole body. It's just one.

Speaker 2 (10:21):
Gotcha, So you have for you someone like you all
just say because you showed a little bit of your chest.
I just have a sketch out line of a dinosaur
that I got from Harrison's Onesie. You know who may
join us. He's currently taking a bath. See just a
little dinosaur and it's all covered in my Jewish chest hair,

(10:42):
so it's like he's in the jungle. Yeah, that's what
I tell myself.

Speaker 1 (10:48):
Nothing wrong with chest hair. I I I am not
one of them. I'm not very naturally hairy. So even
even my chest hair doesn't really show. But uh yeah,
my tattoo scheme does encompass other than sort of like
my abdominal area other than like my stomach. Okay, and

(11:12):
the front not the back, but the front portion of
like your underwear. Other than that, my entire body is
covered other than my hands. So I like that I
can put a shirt on, like a like a collared shirt,
and I haven't somewhere in some neck tattoos, but like,
you know, I could, I could show up at a wedding,
you know for Slash and sure Axle or what Ricky Rackman,

(11:35):
and uh you know, fit in and not look like
a ruffian.

Speaker 2 (11:40):
So well, I got the Usier illusion one on my
left shoulder blade and to hide it from my mom
at the time, you know, and I was twenty.

Speaker 1 (11:47):
I went through that.

Speaker 2 (11:48):
I mean I was even like I was just so
not a wrap. My rebellion stage came so much later.
I mean, now to I have this is we're getting
off way, off subject or whatever. That's what is. I
have the robot I'm showing up side.

Speaker 1 (12:03):
Oh that's awesome on my left.

Speaker 2 (12:06):
Inside of my real left arm. But I want to
get more now. Maybe not as much as you, but
I do want to get more. I got to save
it for baby Brownstone. I guess he needs to go
to school at some point. But the reason, yeah, I guess.
But the reason, oh and by the way, because I
guess it's I want to be a good parent. I'm
very tempted one day when he's eating spaghetti just to

(12:27):
dump it on him so I can just say I
had a spaghetti incident and take pictures. Yeah, but that
would be beat social services. I don't know if I
want to deal with that.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
I mean, you got to do it tastefully, where you
like just put a couple on the face and like
may spill it a little bit, and then you make
it like we're having fun.

Speaker 2 (12:42):
And then it's art. Yes, then it's art. So yeah,
to go back. So speaking of art, yes, School of
Athens talking about the beautiful artwork. I've usual Illusion one
and two and we're here to today and what made
it perfect? Before we really got into it Ace and

(13:03):
I and just diam and giving them the idea. I'm like, hey,
just throwing this past you. You know, every year we
talk about it, you know, whenever it's brought up. It
should have been one album to a lot of fans
say others like, oh no, it needs to be double album.
It's something that news magazines. It's a topic of conversation
every anniversary. What was it like, September seventeenth oror something.

(13:26):
I feel like it came out in nineteen ninety one,
and I used to be of the thought of like, Okay,
I can make some cuts. Now I'm not they all
need to be there. However, when I was like, as
soon as I just gave you that premise to you,
You're like, oh, yeah, that totally needs to be one album.
Like all right, Ace is the perfect guy to talk
about this with. So you're a little older than me.

(13:50):
I was not old enough when they came out. I
was into Nature, Turtles and Ghostbusters. I still am.

Speaker 1 (13:57):
So I don't know what that says. How old are you?

Speaker 2 (14:00):
I'm forty one, so I would have been I mean
a year I.

Speaker 1 (14:04):
Just turned forty two, like a month.

Speaker 2 (14:05):
Oh really, I don't know. I thought I was thinking
you were forty three or forty four. Forgive me, I
didn't think you were that much.

Speaker 1 (14:10):
Were like the same age, all right.

Speaker 2 (14:11):
So you didn't experience at it either, Okay.

Speaker 1 (14:14):
No, I faintly remember seeing the artwork, you know, like
in them. So what was I like eight or nine
or ten or something like that in the mall and
just all the hype around it and everything. And I
was probably two years short of actually participating, because you

(14:39):
said ninety one, So I think the first records I
bought were like ninety three and ninety four. Sure, yeah, so,
but but I remember it, and I remember getting clawbered
over the head with it on MTV and then via
friends with older siblings where they were like you got
to you know, like it's out, you know, and the

(15:00):
whole hype around it. So I vaguely remember obviously anything
prior to that, like appetite that's way before my time.

Speaker 2 (15:08):
But yeah, no, right, not, because it's all about perspective,
because I always want to set that because there are
certain fans that come up with appetite, you know, you
and I you know, I'm four, I'm listening to Muppet
babies and it's not Yeah, I had to wait a
few years, so my perspective when I became a fan,
they were already broken up, really and use your Illusion

(15:30):
was already out. I didn't know them from a five
piece that expanded. They were already expanded, So you know,
just want to get that out there before we kind
of give our opinions because some people just think of
what's usually said. This is a word that's usually used
when they talk about The Illusions, especially some of those videos,
is bloated. So I see that that term, So I

(15:51):
guess what's your when you listen to it. I mean,
when you were introduced to GNR, where did you go first?
And you go to Apple, you go to the Illusions
because I told my story of asking a friend, okay,
the list of songs you like? Most of them were
off appetite, of course, and I bought usually Illusion one

(16:13):
first time with my own money because they had no
member rain on it, and that's what maybe a fan.
And since then it's been a it's been a monstrosity
of a fan boy ship that I've had with this
band that's been going on. So I'm just curious of
like when you discovered you immediately think of like Okay,
this is a lot of music. Is it something you
think about now and you're like, okay, let's go back,

(16:35):
and we'll go back. Well, we will do track by track,
but we're not going to be here. We're not going
to make this a double episode. Don't worry. I know.

Speaker 1 (16:42):
I'm kind of like so, I mean, my first introduction
to Guns Roses was Far and Away was definitely Appetite
for Destruction. I had a friend in middle school whose
mom was like the cool rocker mom, you know, and
was always like, you know, trying to you know, fit

(17:03):
in and all this stuff, and so I probably got
Appetite when I was like twelve, and it was probably
a couple of years before I got another G and
R record. I think the second album I got was
probably User Illusion To and I was probably a freshman

(17:25):
or something like that, just trying to sort of round
out my musical palette because I loved Appetite, but the
musical landscape in nineteen ninety six was not lending itself
to let's just say the eighties hard rock genre as

(17:48):
a whole. So a lot of the stuff that I
was listening to was either metal or punk or something
completely off the reservation, like you know, NWA or Beach
Boys or Chubby Checker, just the opposite ends of the spectrum.
So I think of the ILK that we're discussing and

(18:10):
the genre of music that I'm sort of known for
being in now. I really didn't deep dive until much later.
But the next the record I got next was used
Dellusion two and probably was the only thing I had
for a very long time. And I keep looking over
here because I have both of them on vinyl, and
like looking at the I keep looking at what's.

Speaker 2 (18:30):
On what trying to thank you for I appreciate that.

Speaker 1 (18:34):
Yeah, well I the CDs somewhere.

Speaker 2 (18:36):
I never got the vinyl.

Speaker 1 (18:39):
Yeah, I think I had two for I've had two
for a long time, and I think I only just
recently got one. But uh, I think some of the
stuff like Civil War you could be Mine and Estrange
and Yesterday's was enough for me to go that's the
one of the two if I had to, like, you know,
divvy up my allowance and by just one, okay. And

(19:02):
there was some point, maybe twenty years ago, where they
issued this double kind of like the albums is Double
Guns and Roses Live DVDs of the tour, Yeah, and
it was kind of like Volume one and Volume two
if you will. Yeah, And I actually spent more time
with those DVDs than I ever did with the albums,

(19:24):
And if you want to go into that, I will.
But ultimately, when I think of Guns and Roses records
that I have owned and knew intimately, intimately, it's the
debut record and use your illusion too, and then everything
else was almost an afterthought because I just never had
it for very long or didn't listen to it very much.

(19:47):
And then as the years have gone by, when Chinese
Democracy came out, I almost that's probably my third favorite
Guns and Guns N' Roses air quotes, whatever you want
to call it album, because I genuinely enjoy the production
value of it. It's not it's it's fresh. And just

(20:10):
the fact that it was like my only new Guns
and Roses record, you know, it was like I bought
it when it came out.

Speaker 2 (20:16):
Right, Yeah, same experience exactly. It was the first time
the Yeah, so we were ten when the Incident came out,
or I was ten, so you're not, yeah, very cool.

Speaker 1 (20:27):
And see I think I got Spaghetti Incident as like
a gimmick gift from a friend in high school because
it was some of my friends were like, you know,
it was clickie as it was pre Internet, and you know,
the I was lobbying between the Hessians and the punks
and the goths and the raver kids, and I was

(20:49):
like Switzerland where I would bounce between all of them.
And I had a metal friend that was like, you know,
Guns and Roses did a punk covers album and I
was like, huh, this was before Wikipedia and everything, and
so I think I was given a cassette of Spaghetti
Incident and I was like, wow, Fear the Misfits, New
York Dolls is sex Pistols, UK subs. That's my bread

(21:10):
and butter. So I was like, wow, okay, cool. And
then obviously Metallica did sort of similar same thing with
the Garage Days albums and Garage ink et, cetera. And
I just would use those as you know topic, you know,
bullet points in conversations with people like well, you can't
listen to heavy metal and then be a punk rocker.

(21:31):
And I was like, then, why is the guy in
Cannibal Corpse guitar covered in punkstickers? And why is Dave
Mustain covering sex, pistols, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera,
et cetera, And so I appreciated that element of guns
n' Roses and that stuff. And also of course it
ties in with with La Guns and Faster too, having
a sort of punk rock pedigree background. Like the debut

(21:57):
La Guns record is Nikki Beat on drums except for
one track, and Nikki Beat is like he was in
the Cramps. There's a Cramps poster there. He was in
the Germs and the Weirdos and all these pump bands
from LA that I love, and I just appreciate that
stuff in the same sense that like Duff was in
the Farts, Yeah yeah, and like whatever other punk band
from the PNW and and stuff like that. So I

(22:19):
was like, okay, cool, But going back to use your allusions,
if I had to pick one, it's definitely the second record.
And there's no bad songs. There's probably like two or
three filler type songs on each album in my opinion,
but every album since The dawna Time has it as
some filler I don't think, I you know, it's like
always one song where you're like.

Speaker 2 (22:41):
Eh, sure, but and that's the thing. And that's sort
of the conversation begins where Okay, we are picking, you're
picking one or the other, and here it's like, okay, Harrison,
my son, I'm glad he's one. I don't have to
make a choice between two children or anything. But it's
like almost like two children here, and they happen to

(23:02):
be They weren't put out as a double album in
the sense that you had to buy it together, and
that was a strategic thing by Axel Rose. So it
gave kids the option to buy one or the other.
And he did not care about burning cassettes or CDs.
It's maybe different in the leak days, you know, the
digital days, but he did not know. And that's on record.

(23:25):
I guess pun tended record, so that in there. So
you said you choose usualr illusion too because of the
songs you named. I happened to buy that one first,
and why I have that tattooed on me because of
November rain? Does that mean I'm picking one over two
if you want to hold the gun to my head
shore But that's life or death if we're talking. We're

(23:45):
not in that situation here, So I never like picking.
I guess it's kind of like that that gif you
see why not both both? Yeah, That's how I feel.
So we're gonna kind of okay, go ahead, please, are
you gonna say something?

Speaker 1 (23:58):
Yeah, I was gonna say. I mean like, it's it's
also like any other band where to me where I'm like, oh,
my favorite record is this record today and in a
month from now might beat the completely opposite, right. I
think it's just sort of nostalgia for me was that
was the record that I had the mote the longest,
and if I had to pick one child or the other,
I suppose it would be two. And I think it's great.

(24:19):
I think it's really cool as an artist that he
was like, no, let's do two records and if they
can only afford one, they can get one, versus making
it a full on double album together, like say the
Clash is Sandinista or whatever, and then it's you have
to pay the double fee or double whatever the overhead is.

(24:39):
I don't know, I mean. And then I also was
prepping for this conversation thinking like, well, what if they
were just called two different records? What if it was
usually Illusion and you know, Guns and Roses Goes to
the City LP three or some shit like that where
it's like whenever you know, like then would my opinion
change and I would say, you know, I'm still the
same thing. Where I would go, there's probably two or

(25:00):
three songs on each record that I skip, you know,
if I was on a digitally.

Speaker 2 (25:05):
So let's let's let's go there. And again, we're not
gonna we're not gonna spend a ton of time here
in every single song again because we'd be making it
a double episode. And although that would prove my points,
I don't have the time. Uh maybe Brownstone doesn't have
the time for that. So right, just kicking off, I'll
use your illusion one. I don't know if you hear

(25:25):
him playing with his rubber ducks, his rubber animals. He
just got finished with the bath and now he took
them out of the bath. He's got a pig, a frog,
a horse. He's lining them up all in a row.
This is this is great rat. Yet one day he's
gonna be my my co host. It's gonna be even better. Uh,
you're kicking off, use your illusion one. And this is

(25:47):
a big height because this is like there first, like
you know, it's past and if you want to count
lives fine, but this is really like all new material
electric since appetite right next to Hell? Is that a
failer to you?

Speaker 1 (26:02):
Or? Now?

Speaker 2 (26:03):
Ten out of ten?

Speaker 1 (26:03):
You got it?

Speaker 2 (26:06):
I should preface this with something big too, By the way,
because this isn't just I will. While I am biased
with certain things, I need to give the fan opinion,
not just me, the consensus of what I see of
running a G and R Themes podcast. So I put
up what is the most underrated song on Use Your
Illusion one and Use Your Illusion two? And I made

(26:28):
these two posts to respect the two albums. Both posts
got over a thousand likes and over a thousand comments.
That is not typical for what in my posts. If
it was, I'd be making a lot more money off Zuckerberg.
But it's I guess. So just to keep that in
mind as I go down this list, and I'll be
honest with you, Ace when you say filler. If I

(26:49):
got what I got from this, I will so right
next to right next door to Hell? Ten out of
ten dustin Bones? The izzy song? Is that stay or
a go Oh?

Speaker 1 (27:01):
I love that song? I think is these compositions? What
is it like? Dust and Bones? And then what's on
the other one fourteen years or something like that. Those
are like, I'm a huge Izzy fan, so he can
do no wrong. Those are ten talk to your GENR.

Speaker 2 (27:17):
Song figured as much. So here's an interesting one, Live
and Let Die the cover of course of Paul McCartney.
Is that what you consider a filler or I mean
it's a radio hit. It's something they still play.

Speaker 1 (27:29):
It was a big hit. I enjoy it, but I
suppose overall, you know, it's to cover, so I would
always lean towards new original material versus a cover track.
But I mean, when I think of like hyped up

(27:49):
guns Rose Selms, hyped up Gen R songs, it's definitely
a great track. You can't deny that, right.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
Isn't that what you're gonna sing? Arson? You know he
just gave me. Look at all these puzzle pieces. No,
you're gonna swallow these. You're gonna swallow all these puzzle pieces,
and that's not gonna be good radio. When I have
to give you, do we have an appropriate shaped puzzle
for our son here that I don't know? Oh man,

(28:23):
I'm telling you, one day, I'm gonna he's I'm gonna
have him sit down and go through just like with
the puzzle pieces, now use your illusion one and two.
This is prep for him. This is like, this is
what he's gonna study these episodes when he gets older.
But live and let die. I do revisionist history. Yeah,
I don't think they were expecting putting out the Spaghetti Incident,

(28:45):
which we're all covers. Obviously not a punk cover there,
but a cover. So fine, if you want to go
and say you don't prefer that on there, I'm not
gonna you know, it's your opinion. I'm not gonna tell
you or you're right or wrong, Ace or anybody else.
Don't Cry the original lyrics.

Speaker 1 (29:03):
I think the version of don't Cry that I enjoy
is the one that's on two. But now, I honestly
I cannot recall which ones what and what the fucking
difference really is than some lyrical lines, right, I think
happening in on both of them is a little redundant,
So I would say it should just be on one album.

(29:24):
I will say this version I can't answer right now.

Speaker 2 (29:26):
I don't know, And that's all I really knew with
the lyrics, And we'll get to it and we get
to the usual illusion to But that is one of
the songs I initially thought I would cut in my
initial like listening to these albums, am I CD what
I would skip? That would be one of the two.
And I'm sure you can guess the other one. We'll
get that, we'll get there. So I mean Perfect Crime.

(29:51):
I mean, if anybody wants to cut that, they don't need.
They shouldn't be a Guns to Roses fan. Is that fair?

Speaker 1 (29:56):
Can't I can't recall how the song.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
Goes in my to be on very Fast, and Todd
Curnes just brought it back live with uh really okay, smile,
I'm not gonna sing it. I'm telling you that everyone's
gonna says.

Speaker 1 (30:10):
All right, I I I have to bow out. I
don't recall how it goes.

Speaker 2 (30:15):
Okay, Well, then do you remember how you ain't the
first goes? Because that's more of a slow kind.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
Of you ain't the first isn't really a favorite of mine?
Which which one's got the video with the balancing ball,
with the lyrics.

Speaker 2 (30:30):
That is we're getting to it, Garden of Eden, thank you? Yeah,
so you ain't the first?

Speaker 1 (30:38):
I mean, if I was choosing between the two, I
guess I'd keep Perfect Crime because now I'm remembering it
how it goes. But uh, you would the first. Uh
what's next bad Obsession?

Speaker 2 (30:48):
Well we could say about you ain't the first, and
you're right, bad obsession is next. I was like that
when I was younger, but now having because Guns and
Roses released finally, it's a high depth. I forget what
show it is, but Shannon Hoone's there and he does
a great version with them live. And I believe it
was in Matt's book that he kind of called it

(31:10):
their pirate song, you know, kind of just you know,
you know, what's it called swashbuckling, Like it's kind of
like that, And that kind of made me always look
at the song differently because that's how they felt, just
going from city in the city and getting with their
women and making money and all that. So I look
at that song differently now. But yeah, so bad Obsession Harmonica,

(31:32):
I mean it. And those are those Tokyo?

Speaker 1 (31:35):
Is that Ted?

Speaker 2 (31:36):
That That is Teddy zig Zag who I finally got
to see live. I love Teddy zig Zag. I mean
Teddy Zigzag andre Atis who was also little known fact
in the band with Jesse and the Rippers. If you
know who remember who that is John Staymouse for Old Yeah,

(31:56):
yeah he did. He was one of his background bands
for Jesse and the Rivers.

Speaker 1 (32:02):
Okay, so how.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
About this back off Bitch? How do you? How do
you feel about that?

Speaker 1 (32:07):
Backcraft Bitch is not the greatest GENR song? However, I
do love it because when I was in middle school,
I had a good friend and he was obsessed with
that song, probably because it had a swear word in it,
so we would always be like, bitchy, Yeah, it's a
good song. I don't know. I mean, I'm not cutting it,

(32:31):
but I mean, do I have to cut anything? Like
I said, I think there's probably like two or three
from both that I could probably do without. So what
am I? Maybe you ain't first?

Speaker 2 (32:40):
Okay, so you said you went the first so far
that you and you were kind of lukewarm on Live
and Let Die. Yeah, double talking jive. I mean that's
to me, that's one of my.

Speaker 1 (32:51):
That's a great song. That's a great song. I just
like the mood he sets where he's just you know,
he's just talking ship. You know, it's it's it's definitely
like I like that Axles sort of like you know,
almost threatening somebody in the song.

Speaker 2 (33:14):
Oh, you're you thinking of getting the ring or are
you thinking of.

Speaker 1 (33:17):
No, I'm not thinking getting in the ring double.

Speaker 2 (33:19):
Talking drive because that's based on the I.

Speaker 1 (33:21):
Know what I'm talking about. But I'm just saying, like
I'm not thinking of getting the ring, I'm thinking of
double talking. But I just like his his cadence in
it is.

Speaker 2 (33:28):
Very like that's my misunderstanding, okay, Like like I feel
like he's he's delivering it like you know you he
says something, of course I can't remember.

Speaker 1 (33:38):
He says something in it.

Speaker 2 (33:39):
He goes like in the live video home.

Speaker 1 (33:42):
Is that what it is? Yeah? And and I just
I just can sense the seething in that, and I
appreciate his his candor there in in Double Talking John,
that's out that I'd keep that one for sure.

Speaker 2 (33:57):
And forgive me for cutting you off because you're absolutely
right and that because that describes it well, especially when
those Tokyo tapes when he's like home fuck oh and
you can you get angry with him? I feel that absolutely.
I mean the next one November Rain.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
Cut you off. He says, you dig what I'm saying that,
That's what I'm talking about, Like I can hear him
being like, fuck you.

Speaker 2 (34:21):
Yeah, I appreciate that you get what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay,
now I totally got you right on great points there.
November Rain, my personal favorite GNR song, changed kind of
my whole view on what rock and roll could be
when I first saw that on an MTV and still
feel that way.

Speaker 1 (34:37):
It's quite the what is it like, opus magness, Yeah,
Maggie that it just it.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
Definitely, I think the influence of a band, say like
Queen or.

Speaker 1 (34:59):
I Can't just this grandiose piece of music comes to mind.
Obviously with a Strange as well, but November Rain just
really being this really epic, you know, kind of taking
you on a journey, versus just like, oh, here's a
three and a half minute rock song. So yeah, definitely

(35:20):
top tier material on the Rain for sure.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
And I always just love how it starts out a
certain way and then just the way you know, Slash
and his solo take it and make it, you know,
a hard rock song towards the end. And yeah, I
mean we can we have you know, done episodes on it,
and like I said, we could spend enough time on
each song, but we're not going to do that because
sure we don't have the time. The Garden of Course

(35:46):
with Alice Cooper.

Speaker 1 (35:48):
Yeah, I love it mostly because Coop's in it, and
I'm a huge Coop fan. It's not really a standout
track to meet other than his sort of cameo. And
I do frequently wonder why they put the Garden next
to a song called Garden of Eden, because it's almost.

Speaker 2 (36:12):
Redundant.

Speaker 1 (36:13):
Redundant, thank you, Yeah, at least looking at it on paper.
But uh, I like it. I wouldn't get rid of it.

Speaker 2 (36:22):
I get is it as bad as like Black Sabbath,
Black Sabbath on Black Sabbath? No, yeah, uh no, I
hear what you say. And then then we get to
the Garden of Eden when you were talking about with
the bouncing ball and the words you follow along that.

Speaker 1 (36:40):
I fucking love that song, right, I love that song.
It's just it's and it's punky, you know, so it's
just like fucking.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
You know.

Speaker 1 (36:47):
I like that.

Speaker 2 (36:48):
And if the fish Eye lends video, which is such
a contrast, and I love it. It's the same director
Andy Morahan, who did it estranged in November Rain and
like his favorite when I interviewed him, is is uh
Guard of Eden? Because of a simplicity and it just
happened right then and there, and it's uh yeah, no,
I love it. And if you get a chance, given

(37:09):
your age, you may have seen it when when Beavers
and Butthead watched that video and they're trying to sing
along to it. It's classic TV. I remember that, Harrison.
That's okay, we'll watch Beavis and Butthead later. This one
when I put out the most underrated I told you
put out those posts that had over a thousand likes

(37:29):
and a thousand views by far and away, this was
voted the most underrated song on November on a usual
illusion one don't Damn Me?

Speaker 1 (37:39):
I am frawing a blank on how don't damn Me goes?

Speaker 2 (37:45):
Well, you have to learn, I mean, that's another one
that that Todd Kurns brought back too.

Speaker 1 (37:50):
Really yeah, I don't. I'm I Unfortunately, I am limited by
how many hours are in my day at this point.
But I did do frantic skip through a lot of these,
and I still can't jot my memory on how don't
damn Me go? So I'm gonna I'm gonna have to

(38:11):
take a take a fifth plead the.

Speaker 2 (38:13):
Fifth Well, as we said, that.

Speaker 1 (38:15):
Todd damn it Kerns chose don't damn me right, tongue
in cheek with his stage moniker.

Speaker 2 (38:22):
I know it does, and he said what a hard
song it is, especially while playing bass to play and
it's okay, we we'll have some homework for you. We
already discussed the amount of things that you're doing and
the fact that you're taking time out of your day
to talk about this with me. I know I won't
penalize you any points with that. So just so you know,

(38:43):
the guns and Roses fans that have spoken, and that's
the one that's the most underrated, unusual lousion one will.

Speaker 1 (38:49):
As soon as this is over, I will revisit that
because now I want to know what I'm missing out
on honestly, right on, So.

Speaker 2 (38:54):
How about do you remember Bad Apples?

Speaker 1 (38:58):
I feel like Bad Apples is a song that I regularly,
regular literally skip mostly trying to get to the last two.

Speaker 2 (39:06):
Okay, okay, well thoughts, give Bad Apples another chance? I understand,
Uh now I like it. The lyrics are fun. I mean,
it's just a fun phrase too, with calling somebody a
bad apple. I don't know, it's like a nice little
setup to what you call you know, those last two
those like two heavy haters at the end, which are

(39:27):
dead Horse and Coma and dead Horse acts al on
guitar for a little bit of it doesn't usually play that.

Speaker 1 (39:33):
I love dead Horse. I love that song.

Speaker 2 (39:36):
Guns and Roses brought that back, and I do want
to say that bad Apples Todd Curn's brought back. So
it's Oh, I didn't say this. I didn't want to
say this to him when I interviewed him because I
didn't want it to be taken out of like contacts
and made into clickbait, even though I would be the
one saying it. Yeah, hot take he should join Guns
and Roses as the third guitarist. They've had three guitars before,

(39:58):
and he should help back Axel out with the vocals
on some of these notes that Axel is you know,
allowed to each out of.

Speaker 1 (40:07):
So yeah, I almost just asked the question I did
know the answer to. I would totally support that. I
think that would be amazing. I would love to see
that putting it out there. Totally agree, I would be
I would I would be supportive of that, whether Axel
would be up for it. Other conversation that is but
I think that would be cool. I mean, honestly, in

(40:29):
my book, Todd Currents can do no wrong. He's super
underrated as a musician and a player and just a
really wonderful human being and uh and great great pipes,
great writer, great great person. And he's tall.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
So it's so it's good. I've never interviewed a different person.
I just be like, I feel like one of those
uh you like during like NBA halftyke of basketball halftime,
you have like this really short reporter interviewing. So yeah, yeah,
that's what I feel like.

Speaker 1 (41:03):
He's got to be. I'm not short by any means.
I'm just shy of six feet if I stand up straight,
which I seldom do. But he's got to be six
three four sure that he's tall.

Speaker 2 (41:14):
Sure, well, well I will get him on the Canadian
basketball team next time around. So dead Horse, yes, And
and Coma. I mean, if there was one coming in
second for most Underrated, it's Coma. I mean that that's
that's a magn of opus and I think that's U
Slash's favorite solo.

Speaker 1 (41:32):
Then yeah, that's a great track. It it production wise
could have been maybe a minute shorter in my in
my opinion. It's definitely a lengthy ass fucking song it is,
but it's great. It's it's a great track. I always
at this. I don't know what. Maybe it's just my
you know, the fabric that i'm the cloth I'm cut from.

(41:54):
But like I'm like, three to five minutes in a song,
I'm like, okay, great, if you have me, you have me.
But when it starts getting into five, six, seven minutes,
I'm like, I gotta do stuff, man. I'm like, get
to the solo, you know, as a guitar player, like,
get to the solo, and then let's get double chorus
this shit at the end and wrap it up. You know.
I think that's my only qualm is that it's it's lengthy,

(42:15):
whereas something like uh Estranged and November Rain, for me,
those are those songs where they have me and it
really I'm never going this is too long. So but
I do think if you're gonna have a song that's
over seven minutes or six minutes, don't over stay. You're welcome,
like have two of them, but don't have like you know,

(42:38):
one on every side of the LP.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
I always think you speak of LP. I always I
got to take the time when this happened. You know,
when this happened, there wasn't really the internet. People are
sitting down and listening to a whole record. They weren't,
you know, juggling multiple things. I mean, not the way
that they do today.

Speaker 1 (42:58):
Right, And and that's true. And people weren't scrolling through
Spotify playlists every forty five seconds either.

Speaker 2 (43:06):
Right, right, And that's the as we make the transition
to Usual Illusion too. That's the another important thing to
realize is that you can make a dumb album. Now,
what does that even mean? It just means you're streaming longer,
Like that doesn't mean anything. Back then, right, there was
only a certain amount of time that you could put
on a CD. And that's what they did in minutes.

(43:29):
And it's so funny. I'd have to Wikipedia this, but
I think basically Usual Illusion one and two or within
fourteen seconds of each other, like the same amount almost
the same amount of length. It's something like that.

Speaker 1 (43:40):
So it's like, I guess that's the kind of that's
my guess is that's the kind of thing that I go,
this is how much time we have so that they're like, Okay,
this song will have some feedback or this song will
be like some ambient thing and you're just maximizing the
space there. And I'm sure the play the sequencing played
into a factor, but all ultimately I doubt it was

(44:01):
like a fluke that they both ended up being, you know,
like a full sep.

Speaker 2 (44:05):
I know, too much of a coincidence. I mean, within
fourteen seconds you could have made like the last III
have Don't Cry another fourteen seconds to and they would.
But so what you would have just to recap usual
illusion one if you live and let die? I think
that's a lot some revisionist history, because we know about
the covers record and you want more original material we

(44:27):
had know how little we would get since then.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
But yeah, I mean I guess I would have put
it on the spaghetti incident.

Speaker 2 (44:35):
Then some people say that, yeah, you ain't the first
and you had bad apples and you like the back
off bitch only because they reminded you of her friend
and saying that word.

Speaker 1 (44:49):
Yeah, I would keep I would keep back off.

Speaker 2 (44:51):
Okay, all right, well still you can't wait.

Speaker 1 (44:55):
Now I'm getting my assignments confused. Here? Am I just
eliminating two or three songs? Am I trying to whittle
them down.

Speaker 2 (45:02):
You know what, I'm just recapping.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
You're not.

Speaker 2 (45:04):
You don't have to do anything. I'm just because I.

Speaker 1 (45:06):
Could whittle I could whittle them down to one LP,
a one seventy eight minute double LP album.

Speaker 2 (45:13):
Well that's not that's the exercise here is that we
that's been done. We can do that. I'm here to
tell you when you will give your reasons to say
here at the at the end, here's why I'm keeping
them all and we're not doing any of that.

Speaker 1 (45:27):
Yeah, well, ultimately they exist as they exist, but.

Speaker 2 (45:30):
Exactly going exactly that's part of the reason, just because
of you know, facts, things happen so usual. Your allusion
to civil War. I mean, nobody's cutting that. I mean,
how profound is that? Still?

Speaker 1 (45:44):
Today's probably my top three Gen R songs from these
two records.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
Sure, I mean it's uh still played on the radio,
just a massive just one of those songs that could
not have existed on Appetite for Destruction but exists unusual illusion. Uh.
You mentioned earlier the other isy song fourteen years, so
I don't I don't think you're cutting that one.

Speaker 1 (46:11):
Right, No, I love that song.

Speaker 2 (46:13):
And you also mentioned Yesterday's as one of the reasons.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
Yeah, I mean I love that song. I love the video,
I love the song. I like the you know, the
vibe it paints because it's kind of a ballad, but
it's almost it's it's in I think it's in a
major key, so it's not like a sad ballad. It's
like an like a it's almost optimistic. Yeah, you know

(46:37):
for a band that's so nihilistic. Uh it's a nice
turn of you know, change of pace there. But yeah, no,
I loved it. Yesterday's for sure.

Speaker 2 (46:46):
And I don't know if you had, because again we're
around the same age. I had an online live journal.
Uh you know, I remember remember live journal because I
was I was like Guns of Roses, an emo, you know,
I was that it was all the emo kids had
to live journals complained about your feelings. So I had
Yesterday is all quoted like time just phades the pages
of my book of memories. Oh what a loser.

Speaker 1 (47:08):
It's a great line.

Speaker 2 (47:10):
Not it's a great line, but for me to use
it for my complaining about girls, I.

Speaker 1 (47:13):
Don't know very very Uh MySpace live.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
Journally right, right, that's what happened.

Speaker 1 (47:20):
I mean, you can't deny Axel Rose is really a
you know, a lyricist of his time. I mean, some
of the stuff he's written is obviously transcends the genre
and era. I mean, you can't go to a sporting
event without hearing you know whatever, fucking Welcome to the
Jungle or whatever. Yeah, but I mean again, like that

(47:41):
what you just read from quoted from yesterday's I mean
it's you know, it's like really great poetry.

Speaker 2 (47:46):
Really to me, I know, that's one of the reasons why,
you know, before this podcast, he just happened to be
my favorite band. So this is maybe the same conversation
we had with the last album with the covers Knocking
on Han's Door.

Speaker 1 (48:01):
I'm tired of the song it can go. It's a
brilliant cover. They do a great job with it. I
think they play it at every show for forever. But
I never need to hear it again.

Speaker 2 (48:11):
That's how I feel now, and it is I agree
with you. It's just when it came out, massive hit
fun the single live, you know, with Tracy and Roberta
here to help you, you know at the time, you
gotta have it. Now, Yeah, I can never hear again
and be in that miss it. I understand.

Speaker 1 (48:31):
And it's also I don't know if the album version
is this long, but I feel like live it goes
on for like seven to ten minutes, and I just
get and they're like, you some reggae, and I'm like, no,
let's not give us some reggae. Let's get this song
over and get onto something that you wrote.

Speaker 2 (48:50):
Well speak good of which this is. It depends on
who you ask. I'm a fan of Getting the Ring.
How about you?

Speaker 1 (48:57):
Oh, getting the Ring? Yeah? Yeah, I love getting.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
There are fans that that just like, oh, it's a
distasteful and they stin't. I see that a lot brought
up as far as like I can do without it,
And to me, wow, what a time capsule of Axel
Rose and guns and Roses. At that time, everyone's talking
about the whole Kendrick and Drake dissing, no, no, get

(49:22):
in the Ring. All of that pales in comparison to
get in the Ring. You know, I just think to
do that at that time, I just think is as special.
Everybody now has diss tracks, but to do it at
that time, I think it's pretty special. Never played live,
even though the chance of gttings, yeah, the chance oft Yeah,

(49:44):
never played live. Don't Damn Me was never played live
until if you ask you count Todd currents. Uh, we're
gonna get Todd. Yeah, Todd, uh so getting the ring.
We both keep it. This is another one that a
lot I like it, but a lot of people will
put that on their fellow list. Shotgun Blues.

Speaker 1 (50:04):
I like it, it's filler. I really like the song,
but it's not to me. It's a solid song, but
it's definitely if I had to put one on the
chopping block, I could live without it. Okay, And I
say that, and I like the song. I mean, you know,
it's bouncy and it's very gn R, you know, in

(50:27):
the traditional sense, like I could hear that almost being
on appetite. But yeah, I don't know, it's not my favorite.

Speaker 2 (50:36):
I can see the argument where, Okay, you obviously have
the two albums. That's part of it. Yeah, and that's
not something I would ever skip. But if we were
going to do the exercise where you have to cut
this down to fifteen songs, I could see that not
making the cut. So I think that's part of the
conversation where it doesn't have to be your favorite, but
does it not deserve to be on these double albums.

(50:58):
So that's something to consider.

Speaker 1 (51:00):
Uh yeah, I think got his place. But again, if
we were whittling it down, I would to one LP.
I would probably take.

Speaker 2 (51:07):
It out fair. That's fair. Now, what about Locomotive Complicity Locomotives?
That was one of the ones that was actually I
I skipped forgive me. Shotgun Blues goes into breakdown breakdowns first.

Speaker 1 (51:26):
I have no idea how breakdown goes. I don't even
know what the fuck that is.

Speaker 2 (51:29):
That's that's probably a probably most I think it was
the most underrated. That ends real what's that scene? Oh
my god, I'm forgetting the famous actor's name? When he
gonna He did first he was in Oh my god everything,
I'm already getting daddy brain. Uh, very famous. They took

(51:52):
a movie clip and they put it at the end.
It was the guy that was also in Blazing Saddles
and he did like the end of the movie. I
should bring this up. I need to train my son
to be a producer and just call things up in
another computer.

Speaker 1 (52:06):
Yeah, can you google that?

Speaker 2 (52:07):
Those is ABC's.

Speaker 1 (52:10):
I don't. I'm reading lyrics and I can't even hear
the melody.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
And I don't want to. I don't even want to
sing it because or bring it up because they'll hit
with an FCC thing.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
But yeah, so I'm going to go with I'm gonna
go with skip it, cut it, or whatever, because I
honestly and this is the record I know best of
all of the two.

Speaker 2 (52:32):
Yelled at by some some fans, I think this is
going to be your.

Speaker 1 (52:35):
Oh yeah, I'm sure you're hot. Take just yelled at.

Speaker 2 (52:40):
Well, this is a Listen to it and especially the
end where they I will say this I have there.

Speaker 1 (52:49):
You can see probably half of my record collection behind me, right, yeah,
I have something like seventeen hundred LPs and hundreds of singles,
et cetera. And digitally, you know, obviously Spotify, Apple Music
goes into infinity. I cannot sing or be expected to
recall every song from every record.

Speaker 2 (53:12):
What how dare you?

Speaker 1 (53:13):
What? I know? So apologies, I can't remember how breakdown goes?

Speaker 2 (53:18):
Well, well, it's it's it's okay. I mean, you came
with Show and Tell and you have the albums, but
just when you again a little more homework, when you
get a chance listen to the ending of you know,
a breakdown, that's definitely one of the ones that people
would like to keep. And why I think it's hard
to make this one record because it's a longer song too,

(53:40):
So just.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
Do it instinctively.

Speaker 2 (53:44):
Have the conversation. That's what it's all about. It's okay, Yeah,
absolutely pretty tied up.

Speaker 1 (53:51):
I fucking love that's kind of squear. I love that song.

Speaker 2 (53:55):
Yeah, I love that song as you should.

Speaker 1 (54:00):
That might be one of my first, uh standout moments
besides maybe a strange and November rain that I remember
hearing from this record combo. So yeah, definitely a favorite
of mine.

Speaker 2 (54:18):
And that's a fun one to watch on those those
Tokyo VIDs too when he plays that. And I don't
know if I've seen that live yet, which bothers me
because that's one of my favorites to bring back. Oh
I got it now. Vanishing Points. I don't know if
you've ever seen the movie Vanishing Points.

Speaker 1 (54:38):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:41):
So Clevelan little rest in peace, Sorry Cleveland forgive me.
So there's a where he plays the radio DJ and
that's used at the end of Breakdown and it just
fits beautifully, So just keep that in mind, all right.
So now we got Locomotive Complicity the head before. So
what about Locomotive? Do you remember that one?

Speaker 1 (55:03):
I do.

Speaker 2 (55:05):
Might breakdown. That's it's a little like breakdown as far
as like it's just a long song.

Speaker 1 (55:11):
Yeah, I would probably cut Locomotive.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Okay, all right, all hate mail to a spawn Johnson.

Speaker 1 (55:18):
That's fine. I don't. I don't dislike the song, but
I mean, you know, if I'm going you know, yeay
or nay, I think and I will say this, I
think anybody and I get it, like if it's your
favorite band, your favorite record, whatever, but like you know,
artists subjective, so like my favorite song is not going
to be your favorite song or listener excess famite. So
I and I also there's probably like seven albums on

(55:41):
the earth where I go. Every song is a keeper,
even my favorite records. I'm like, yeah, that second song
on side too. So you know that's just my take.
Locomotive is a great song, but it's not I would
I Like, if I was listening to this on on
vinyl right now, I probably wouldn't get up to move
the needle. But if we were in my car listening

(56:01):
to it digitally, I'd probably say okay.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
And that's another point I don't want to be lost.
All of this is objective. There's there is no.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
Right or rock art is subjective. People need to remember that.

Speaker 2 (56:13):
Very true. Yeah, how about this with the with the
duff on vocals, So Fine?

Speaker 1 (56:20):
I'm out of ten. I fucking love it. See I'm
coming back from my uh trending downwards here. Yeah, I
love so fau. That's didn't he dedicate that to Johnny Thunders? Uh?

Speaker 2 (56:33):
Was that to Johnny Thunders? Or is that the one
that was on the spaghetti incident that covered that he made?

Speaker 1 (56:38):
Maybe you're right, I can't remember, but either way, I
felt like so Fine was his attempt at writing a
cell alone or you know case rosserrah Era. I met
Case rossra Era Johnny Thunders type track like punky. It's
not punky, but like you know, like a like a

(57:01):
you know, some junkies version of a ballad if you will,
you know, all on Johnny Thunders. So that's I like,
that's what I took from that, and I do love
so Fine. I think it's a great song, and I'm
a huge stuff fan.

Speaker 2 (57:13):
So I hope they bring that back live. I think
that would they would nail it. Twenty twenty five gn
R would nail so fine. I mean this one. I mean,
it's it's one of the probably gonna put on Mount Rushmore, right, Estranged.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
You, Oh yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (57:29):
I mean it's a it's it's it's crazy. They actually
I will put when I put out the word underrated,
and that's also where people can read into however deeply
they want that Estranged wasn't really a radio hit. Of course,
it had was played on the radio a little bit.
It was played on you know of course the video,
but there are those who feel it should have been
bigger than November Rain. So maybe that's the way it's underrated.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
I again talking about like O today, this album tomorrow,
a different record, I don't. I always sort of in
my mind put Estranged with like on par next to
November Rain, and they're very similar arrangement wise, and their ballads,
and they're long, and their epic and the videos are epic.

(58:13):
I think if I had to pick one, I think
I think I would pick Estranged, other than I prefer
the November Rain guitar solo better.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
Okay, I like it.

Speaker 1 (58:23):
So, but I wouldn't. I would never cut a strange.
That's insanity. It's such a great song, and.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
If you cut this, this would be insanity as well.
You could be mine.

Speaker 1 (58:32):
You could be mine. Oh yeah, that's probably if if
you said, name your favorite song on this record, I
would say it's either Civil War or you could be mine.

Speaker 2 (58:46):
I mean, you're book ending it with like the best,
Well I shouldn't say book ending it, so I guess
I'm alluding to how I used to approach this, the
user illusion to record for me growing up ended, and
you could be mine, I would skip that. Don't cry
alternate lyrics in my world, like for years and years
and years now doing this podcast. And you said it

(59:07):
earlier that you found yourself gravitating towards the alternate lyrics.
I really am shocked every time or whenever.

Speaker 1 (59:16):
I'm not sure which one's which. I'm not sure which
version is is?

Speaker 2 (59:21):
Which two is the alternate lyrics? One is the original
that had that.

Speaker 1 (59:26):
Was the video If you didn't preface which one, if
you played them side by side, I could tell you which.
That's what I'm saying, So I guess i'd keep it
on use your illusion one and get rid of it
off of user.

Speaker 2 (59:39):
Illusion to Okay. See, I'm not like you, know I
don't have a musician brain where I can really remember things.
I'm kind of like that. If you remember this scene
from in Wayne's World where Garth's kind of singing quote
unquote air quote singing along to Bohemia Rahap City, but
it's like his mouth is moving, but it's not in
sync to what's being said. That's me. So I got

(01:00:02):
the words to Don't Cry. I don't want to learn
more lyrics. Why do I have to learn the song again?
So I just didn't want the second song. But I've
grown just from having the listeners that I'm telling you,
it's like eighty twenty whenever I've posted this over the years,
that people who prefer the alternate lyrics, whether they're burned
out from the original. Maybe that's the reason. I don't know,

(01:00:23):
So that's I'm doing it for you. I'm doing it
for the listeners of why I won't cut that song.

Speaker 1 (01:00:29):
It should have just been on one album. I don't
care which version or which album, but it didn't need
to be represented twice in my opinion.

Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
Okay, and then we get to the one where it's
a is it a joke or have we learned to
appreciate it? Over the years my world. Is it an
easter egg to what Chinese democracy would be? Is it
an easter egg to where guns and roses would be?
In the more industrial sounding I.

Speaker 1 (01:00:55):
Think I think you did definitely nail it there. I
think it's a little bit of like a a early
representation of what Axel wanted to do moving forward, especially
considering a lot of that type of genre with not
you know, nine inch nails blowing up and such. I
think people were looking to expand I mean, Tamey did it.

(01:01:17):
You know a bunch of other people I know at
least dabbled or were interested or we're listening to that
genre of music or whether it was you know, an
offshoot of hip hop or industrial or whatever you want
to call it. I definitely think it was him alluding
to I mean, even Glenn Danzig, I think, you know,

(01:01:41):
clearly something he was interested in that he was like, oh,
we're going to do this for this one song and
see what happens. But I don't really know the story
behind it other than I think it's interesting to listen to,
but like, would I put it on and be like fuck, yeah,
not at all? And I did appreciate that he incorporated

(01:02:02):
some of those elements into Chinese democracy. Like there's a
little bit, there's some textural stuff, and I apologize I
can't remember the woman's name that's the sort of secondary
keyboard player.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
Of Melissa resee thank You.

Speaker 1 (01:02:16):
And she I imagined caters to all of those sonic elements,
not for my world, but for the stuff from Chinese democracy,
et cetera. I think it's cool, you know, especially when
you hear stuff from Chinese democracies as an album, but
stuck tagged on the end of this record, it's very

(01:02:37):
it's like almost like off putting.

Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
It is very strange. The band did not know what
it would happen. I mean, yeah, it's it's certainly not
something I would ever put on be like yeah my world,
Well yeah, Eric, No, it's I think what's it's become.
It's just like this easter egg, this fun thing that
talk about every time we talk about guns, the usual

(01:03:04):
Illusion records. I mean, I think the lyrics are fun.
You know, it's a socius psychotic state of bliss. I mean,
there are elements to appreciate, I think, but I mean
so that alone, I think is the reason and my
final reason why we got to keep, you know, song wise,
everything because it gives us something to talk about every year.

(01:03:25):
I mean, we could talk about these double records and
all these great songs who are were blue in the face.
Then we get to that my World and it's that
little twist that it's I think it's just a fun
thing at the end, and I don't know, maybe act
will go more into it one day of why he
did it? Not surprising? Another No, probably not surprisingly another

(01:03:47):
guns of Rosa song that has never been played live
My World. Well, Ace, I really appreciate you taking time
to kind of dissect the user illusion No. One and
two with me. I mean there we discussed.

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
There's no hope. I didn't upset too Manyny diehards.

Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
There's no right or wrong or just enjoying the music.
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
I'm a fan.

Speaker 2 (01:04:11):
Yeah, I just think it's it's great, you know, being
in twenty twenty five. It's funny having this conversation now
knowing how little Guns A Roses music has come out
since these records. I don't want to cut anything, even
My World. I want to keep everything because it's just
we don't have a lot as as G and R fans,
but that's not the case with La Guns fans, So

(01:04:32):
I thank you. I thank you for that, for always
putting out new music.

Speaker 1 (01:04:36):
Oh shortage of La Guns music, that's for sure. There's
record there's multiple records from La Guns I've never even heard.

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
So what is the best way to keep in touch
with you? I know, Instagram? What's like, You're not on
Twitter as much?

Speaker 1 (01:04:51):
For no, I haven't opened eye. You know anybody that
can guess why I'm not on Twitter.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
It's become a healthscape. I only do it just because
I need every fan I can get, but it's become
a healthcare It's.

Speaker 1 (01:05:07):
Yeah, I am only active on social media on Instagram,
and even there I don't really post. I've pretty much
tried to wash my hands of social media as much
as I can, with the exception of being in a
rock band for a living, so obviously I have to
share tour dates and whatever obligatory elements, like hey on

(01:05:30):
new but Instagram's your best bet at as von Johnson
circling back to the Patreon, I really try to just
hyper focus on that because again, it's people that want
to be there. It's not riddled with trolls or people
whose opinions that I'm you know, I'm not interested in,
which is the internet is rife with and that's really it.

(01:05:55):
If you're trying to reach me, I have a website
as von Johnson dot com with whatever information you need,
you know, a bio. I don't know who needs to
reach me. You don't. I don't need to be reached.
I don't want to be reached.

Speaker 2 (01:06:10):
I'll just say I saw you at the LA Gun Show.
I just want to say how handsome you look, so
thank you for for the good time. What's the nice comments? Uh?

Speaker 1 (01:06:20):
Yeah, you know you can either contact page on my
dot com or or Instagram. I suppose you could send
me a d M or again. I was just tell
people just join joined the Patreon check that out, or
send me an email, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:06:33):
Right, Well, unless if you're not doing that, maybe we
can just speak again, uh in the future on the
podcast after you've done some research more on user illusion.
I'm just kidding. You knew a lot. You knew a lot.
I want you just to hear a breakdown. Break down
caught me off?

Speaker 1 (01:06:49):
What song? Wait? What song? Is Michael Monroe on? Two songs?

Speaker 2 (01:06:53):
Right? He's on Aiden, He's on Sorry, I keep grabbing
my mouth, and that's disconnected because I'm an idiot.

Speaker 1 (01:06:59):
Because I I was waiting for that to come up
and it didn't, and then now I'm going now, I
don't even know.

Speaker 2 (01:07:04):
He's on Ain't in Fun, which was on the spaghetti incident,
And yeah, he's.

Speaker 1 (01:07:10):
Also doesn't he sing backups?

Speaker 2 (01:07:12):
Get some bad? I think it's bad obsession. I think
it's Mike. I should again, these are things I knew
at one point, but I sleep privately.

Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
Keep there's a couple of musical cameos in these records.

Speaker 2 (01:07:26):
Yeah, baession, Yeah, bad obsession? And then Ain't in Fun? Yep, Okay,
I didn't. I had him on the podcast a few
years ago.

Speaker 1 (01:07:35):
But Michael, what did I say?

Speaker 2 (01:07:38):
Michael? Yeah, Michael Monroe.

Speaker 1 (01:07:40):
And that's awesome. I'm a big fan.

Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
And it's crazy. We talked about Todd Kurns. Todd Curns
is temporarily in his band now, so you and Todd
are just like always filling these spots. It's I love it.
You're You're always in demands a little.

Speaker 1 (01:07:54):
Todd's a little higher on the food chain than I am,
but you know, I'm happy to fill in any voice
that he can't get to himself.

Speaker 2 (01:08:01):
Well, he's taller, he can reach those.

Speaker 1 (01:08:03):
Because he's taller, he's got long flowing hair, and he's Canadian,
so he just definitely leaps in the bounds ahead of me.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
Well, you're both very nice people, and I appreciate your
time today. Ace. Try to take an try to take
a nap, take some time to yourself in between everything.

Speaker 1 (01:08:22):
There's no what is Henry Rollins quote that I always
say that I'm forgetting now, there's no downtime something something
now I don't know, I'm fucking it up.

Speaker 2 (01:08:32):
That sounds like whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:08:33):
The last song on Rollins Band's Weight album, Henry Rawlins,
who I'm a massive fan of, who also lives in Nashville,
now goes off on this whole thing where he's like,
there's no downtime, all you have is lifetime blah blah blah.
I'm angry, go and I just and of course I
can't remember the quote, so I'm fucking myself.

Speaker 2 (01:08:54):
But I I had him on the podcast once for
ten minutes. I try to get him on again and
he declined. I got him on once. Yeah, Henry Rowlins,
what's just one of those lucky things of just being
able to you know, somebody is promoting the right thing
at the right time, and I'm you know, my my
association working in radio sometimes helped me get certain interviews.

(01:09:16):
So lucky, just lucky. But he didn't. I spent an
hour with him talking about use your illusion. We can't
do that. Only ten minutes about punk rock. Yeah, all right,
now we're just going off the tangents here, so only
just quote Axel Rose here. This is how I end
the episodes. So that does it for this episode of

(01:09:37):
Appetite for Distortion. When will you see the next one?
In the words of Axel Rose concerning Chinese democracy, I
don't know as soon as the word, but you'll see
it thanks to the lame ass security.

Speaker 1 (01:09:54):
I'm going home.