November 5, 2025 • 21 mins
Just as self-help books provide advice to enhance your physical or mental wellness, attorney Danny Karon's new book does the same for "legal wellness." That's Karon's term for cultivating a healthy working knowledge of your legal rights when confronted with scams and cheaters both large and small.
Karon, a consumer law expert, provides readers with "an ounce of prevention" by teaching the problem-solving skills that will help anyone ably square off with everyday troubles like airlines that bump you, telemarketers that swindle you, or the fine print corporations assume you’ll never read. Also known as the "Lovable Lawyer" because he advocates for everyday people who might not have a personal attorney on retainer, Karon has invested more than 30 years into his calling: empowering everyone to access justice.
Covering everything from social media defamation to how to fight a traffic ticket, and peppered with plenty of anecdotes from his own life, Karon’s book simplifies legal issues with clear, straightforward explanations, and does it in a relatable, humorous way.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/arroe-collins-view-from-the-writing-instrument--1023245/support.
Karon, a consumer law expert, provides readers with "an ounce of prevention" by teaching the problem-solving skills that will help anyone ably square off with everyday troubles like airlines that bump you, telemarketers that swindle you, or the fine print corporations assume you’ll never read. Also known as the "Lovable Lawyer" because he advocates for everyday people who might not have a personal attorney on retainer, Karon has invested more than 30 years into his calling: empowering everyone to access justice.
Covering everything from social media defamation to how to fight a traffic ticket, and peppered with plenty of anecdotes from his own life, Karon’s book simplifies legal issues with clear, straightforward explanations, and does it in a relatable, humorous way.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/arroe-collins-view-from-the-writing-instrument--1023245/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, man, how are you doing today?
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I'm well, how are you?
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Absolutely fantastic? Hey, congratulations on this brand new book, A
Guide to Legal Wellness. Because until they saw this title,
I never even thought about how the average person does
not put themselves in a position of that wellness.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
It's no less essential than the other wellness buckets out there,
whether it be emotional or financial or physical. People neglected
people don't have the training to relate it to their
kids when they go to college, for instance, because you
got to be a lawyer to know from any of
the stuff I discussed, but you don't have to be
a lawyer to understand it. And that's kind of the
gap I'm trying to bridge, is to deliver legal awareness
(00:38):
and aptitude to people in an understandable, friendly way.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Yeah, because we live in this society where everybody thinks
they're going to go to chat GPT or they're going
to go to Google to find an answer. And I
know for a fact that what we've been through for
the past six months now that wasn't going to work.
We needed to have someone like you to give us
that guidance.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I hope more people agree than just you, because chatgy
can only take you so far. I mean, it's you know,
fraught with hallucinations. Lawyers are getting in trouble all over
the country for using chet ept in their legal filings
because it gets the law wrong a lot of the time,
and they're getting sanctioned by judges. So it's just not
a real worthwhile tool to employ in the lost space.
(01:21):
And that's what we're talking about. It's just that it's
a law spase that's accessible to people.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
So now, how did you know where? I mean, you
must have had an editor that kept you in line,
because I mean, you get into it. But then I
swear to God, this could be like a ten book series.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
I had an editor who was just helping with some
of the nits. I teach writing, I teach law school.
I also cheoch writing, So the writing wasn't a challenge
for me. The real challenge, they say in writing is
to know when to stop, and you stop when you're finished.
And I finally figured it about sixty seven thousand words.
Maybe she'd hold a little bit back for the next
next book, because you could go on and on with
(01:58):
these evergreen topics that people they need to know about.
But at some point it's got to be manageable, and
it can't be unwieldy and intimidating, because that is actually
the opposite of the brand and the purpose and the
goal I'm trying to promote, which is free, fun and
friendly legal guidance.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
And one of the things that you do is you
tap into everyday common thing such as a traffic ticket,
and you kind of suggest you do have the right
to fight that monkey?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Do you have the right to do a lot of things.
It's all about having the awareness to know what your
rights are. To avoid this victim mindset where you think, oh,
you know what, I got a ticket. I have to
pay it. There's a charge in myself and Bill, I
have to pay it. There's a charge in my visa, Bill,
I have to pay it. You can often dig deeper
and understand that there are rights that you have that
(02:43):
aren't only reserved for the privilege few who can afford
an expensive the lawyer, but instead everybody has them. Access
to the laws are right and not a privilege. We
just have to have the legal awareness to know what
our rights are, to know how to spot issues, and
to know how even just a little bit to address
the issues that we can get the other side attention
and they can back off.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
What about these people? And I don't want to say
these people as amil, you know, sectioning people off. But
there really is a big change in the way that
we do our work these days. It seems like that
everybody wants to hire us as you know, as Okay,
I'm going to get you in here for six months
and I'm not going to, you know, take take care
of your insurance for you. Basically you're a contract employee.
Well you know what that requires a lawyer and so
(03:24):
but most people go, well, I'm not taking this job then,
when they could have just called.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
You, Well, I don't do anything without talking to my lawyer, right,
And that's an anomaly. I happen to have a lawyer,
and I know that I need to at the level
I'm operating, have him look at things as he's going
to do tonight Frin for something. But most of our
everyday problems don't require a lawyer. They just require a
little bit of legal aptitude. So, for instance, if you're
(03:50):
in an auto accident, you don't need a lawyer off
the bat. You ought to get one ultimately, but there
are certain things that you should do at the scene
to preserve the scene, preserve your rights. Certain things you
should not do. So for instance, you might want to
secure your vehicles, take your pictures, exchange documents, get treated,
get a lawyer. Like I said, what might you not
want to do? Talk to the other side adjuster. They're
(04:11):
going to try to get in new admissions describing the
accident as your own fault. Don't talk to the other
side of the lawyer without your lawyer. Let them do
all the talking. These are just common sense things that
we lawyers know from but non lawyers don't. And this
is the information that the lawyers don't want people to
know that I'm trying to give away because people deserve
to know it without stepping into trouble. They deserve to
(04:32):
stay out of the trouble on account of having some
legal awareness or aptitude, or try to get out of
the trouble they're in because of the same legal awareness
and aptitude guidance that's rarely given out there.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
So now is basically when people tap into the book,
are they're going in there to just see that Okay,
here's my question. Oh my god, he's giving me the
guidance as to what my next steps should be.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
It's really a resource. It's something to keep on your shelf. So,
for instance, if you wind up in traffic corps, you
know what, I think a chapter and then how should
I manage that I was a nano accident. Let me
see how to manage that. I had a problem with
my landlord. Let me see how to manage that I
want to go to small claims card. Let me see
how to manage that. You know what mom and dad had,
are getting a little bit older, they don't have a
will and of trust. Let me see how to manage that.
(05:15):
And I talk about these evergreen topics. We call them
everyday topics in plan language, so that people can understand
them and appreciate what to do or maybe not to do,
if that's the course they want to take. But at
least they're doing what they're doing or not from a
place of information rather than cluelessness. And that's again what
legal wellness is all about.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Well, there was a few times during my days with
the big broadcast company where I felt like that when
I was going into that HR meeting, I should have
had a lawyer with me. Should we be doing something
like that, because it seems like HR is actually working
for the business and not the people.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
I would I have been in a big company in
a long time. I know that our understand I should
say that if you bring a lawyer into an HR meeting,
they might not go over so well, you've got to
feel it out. Maybe you want to consult with a
lawyer before and or afterward to ensure that things are
going to go right and went right. I wouldn't bring
a knife to a gun and fight like that. I
would always lawyer up. Hopefully there's somebody you can afford,
(06:07):
and there's somebody available to you, maybe a family friend.
But you know, for certain bigger ticket items like a
meeting with HR, you probably want to get a little
more intense counsel for something like a problem with the
airline because your flight was late and you want to
get back part of your purchase price because you didn't
get what you're bargained for. That's something you can manage
(06:27):
through this book.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
All right, let's talk reality here, because I know one
thing that's happening here in North Carolina when it comes
to selling alcohol to underage. You know, I realize that's
a bad thing, but here's what's happening. These people are
getting trapped because the people that are buying it have
better makeup on. They're looking older than what they really
should be, and that's how they're getting busted. I guess
it all goes down to you should have checked their license.
(06:49):
But the thing is, I mean, do they have the
right days? There's somebody that could back them up.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Listen, I still get carted and there's no reason we've parted.
We've all seen the signs and we cart up to
age thirty five. How the heck they know who the
heck knows? But it's a perception thing. They want to
let you know that. Hey listen, man, you're getting carted.
And I don't do this type of criminal law, but
I needn't to do this type of criminal law to
have a worthwhile opinion on it, which is this, if
you're working at a vendor or a merchant rather and
(07:15):
somebody comes in, I don't care how well they look cardom.
You can't go wrong have being carded them. If it's
a fake ID, that's not necessarily I you it's on them.
But if you don't cart them at all, you got
real problems if something were to happen, And I wouldn't
want to be in that position as a merchant or
as a cashier.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Don't you also see this book great for parents in
the way that as they send off their kids to
college and or even off to their first years of marriage,
that these parents step in and say, here's a book
for you, here's what you need to know and where
you need to lean on if you should get in
any type of trouble.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Funny, you should say that because I'm leaning heavily into
the book to do keynote speaking for college and university students,
because college and university kids are out of the house
for the first time. They're not free for the first
time to screw up things, to make their mistakes, to
sign bad leasas to get into car crashes away from
home and have to deal with them on their own.
All these sorts of things, and there are real problems
(08:07):
for people. And whereas parents might give their kids before
going to college a little bit of a guidance on hygiene,
maybe a little guidance on emotional wellness, maybe a little
guidance on financial wellness, they're rarely giving guidance on legal wellness.
Why because you need a specialty degree to do that.
You need to be a lawyer to have some real
(08:28):
aptitude for what it is kids out of know when
they head out into the real world. And I'm trying
to fill that gap, not just through the book, but
on the keynote circuit to go to colleges and not
only talk about the themes in the book, but real
college centric topics, such as, like you mentioned, what to
do when you get caught drinking underage. You're going to
do it anyway, but at least know the consequences. What
(08:49):
are the consequences of a fake ID? How about cheating?
How about hazing and a fraternity? How about sex offenses?
These are the things kids have no aptitude for. How
about getting in trouble online by popping off and having
a big mouth. What are the contras and limitations of
the First Amendment? And do they protect you not necessarily?
Ask gamber heard. There's a lot out there that kids
ought to be worried about.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Wow, And here's another one that comes up, and only
because I had to deal with it with my granddaughter.
She sees it as being a great idea to team
up with four other girls because they're in college. Okay,
we don't have to live on campus, and the three
girls left and left her with that bill to be paid.
It was all her because her name was on the contract.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Oh boy, you know what. I have experience with that too.
I mean my kid did a little bit of that.
You know, they always cram extra kids into the house.
But you got to be really careful because if you're
not in the lease, you're not obligated to pay the lease. Now,
am I cost you a friendship? Of things go south
and you bolt on the lease, but you know what
going with both eyes open, have a modest aptitude for
(09:47):
landlord tenelaw and I talk about that in the book too,
and then you'll know what the consequences of the least
are of that sort of arrangement. You might do it anyway,
but at least if you do then things go south,
you'll know what your remedies are. And more importantly, aren't.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
How much focus do you put on identity theft? Because
it seems like as we kind of change in this
nation right now, there's a lot of identity theft that's
going on, either that or just people just hacking into
your life period.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
I've got a chapter on that. There are a lot
of data breach cases out there in my practice. I'm
a plintif's class action attorney, and there are a ton
of data breach cases where folks identities are getting stolen.
And I talk about techniques to minimize that. You'll never
completely avoid it, unfortunately, because the hackers are so sophisticated.
I could speak from personal knowledge to that, despite my
(10:35):
best efforts. But you can do more than you're doing,
and you can only do more than you're doing if
that is somebody tells you what the steps and techniques
are that you ought to follow. And that's again keeping
with my books being kind of a resource, a living
document that you can look back to, refer to, keeping
the bookshelf and pull out when you have a problem
that it taps, such as like you said, identity theft.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
Please do not move. There's more with Daniel. I mean
up next the name of the book, A Guide to
Legal Wellness. Let's get back to that talk with Daniel.
What about AI technology. I talk with the rock stars
and even the movie stars who are going, man, they're
not copying my image, and I always say, so, what
are you doing to survive? Because you need some protection
and backup.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
I speak to that a bit. I've got a robust
chapter on online defamation, well, online indiscretions, defamation, dosing, and
invasion of privacy, And the law hasn't quite caught up
to the AI phenomenon yet. There's a lot of deep
fakes and the law is going to catch up, and
it's interesting to consider what the law is going to
do in that space. But it's absolutely something to be
(11:40):
mind to within the larger context of online indiscretions. So,
for instance, the angle I take in the chapter is,
and I mentioned this a second ago, people think they
can say anything they want because they have a First
Amendment right to say what they like. Well, wrong and wrong.
It's wrong once because the First Amendment only applies to
the government, state in federal not to private companies, which
(12:01):
is why employers can tell you what you can't say online,
which is why restaurants can say no shoes, no shirt,
no service. They're not bound by the strictures of the
First Amendment. Secondly, the First Amendment is limitations. It is
not ubiquitous. It doesn't cover everything. Some of the limitations
are defamation fighting words, boy, what are some other ones?
(12:28):
For profanity? And you're not protected from everything, even as
it concerns the government. So what ends up happening is kids,
you know, might be playing keyboard Warrior from the basement,
popping off firing off posts from the basement, and somebody
might get pissed off and sue a defamation case. And
if you're under age and you're in my basement, guess
who's getting sued me the parent. You're in my policy.
(12:50):
They're making a claim against me because I didn't have
this talk with my kid downstairs. And that's what I
meant a moment ago when I said Amber Heard should
have known what not to say. She should have known
what the elements of Virginia defamation law are, because her
case with Johnny Depp was not a special these case,
it was a defamation case. She didn't know what not
to say. She said it. She's out of packet millions
and millions of dollars for it.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
So now you being in that courtroom, how do you
handle these people when you have to bring in a
jury that they have figured out the idea on how
to get out of jury duty, because that can't be
fair to your playing field if you've got people in
there that just didn't figure it out.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
There are certain people that want to get out of
jury duty, and they'll say what's necessary to do it.
They'll say they're bias, they can't be fair and objective,
and that's fine, you know. But what I found in
the case is I've tried on balance, is that a
lot of people respect their constitutional duty yep, to sit
in a jury, which duty, by the way, is only
ranked by your right to vote and to be in
(13:48):
the military. It is really up there, and people take
it very seriously. I've never had a juror tell me
afterward I wish I hadn't sat.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
I know that, and if this is too political, please
please let me know. I just know that in many
of the major cities that their people are being arrested
and it's like, well, if you're going to jail, that
means you need a lawyer. I mean, they need legal rights,
they need this book. They need something that's going to
give them an answer because they're in a position that
they didn't think they were going to get in.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Well, if you're arrested, you absolutely need a lawyer, there's
no doubt about that. Now you're in the criminal space
more so than civil which is what my book focuses on.
But there's no denying that if you're arrested for whatever
in discretion, whether it's in you know, democratic city or
Republican city, doesn't matter. Being arrested. Is being arrested means
needing counsel to protect your rights?
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Yeah? Yeah, I just love where your heart is on
this because there's just something here for everybody. And that's
the thing about it is that you could put this
book up at Low's or home depot and I guarantee
you the thing would sell.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Well, that's what I tried to lean into. I didn't
want to get too specialized. I mentioned evergreen topics. Those
are topics that we deal with every day. We all
drive cars, we all rent property, we all have credit cards,
we are all online. I wanted to hit the big ones,
and I had to stop at a certain point because
I came into a three hundred and two pages. I figure,
you know what, that's probably enough. Got to leave a
(15:08):
little leftover for the the sequel.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
You could you could do an entire book on the
person that has made a decision to step into the
world of entrepreneurship in the way that they're going to
you know, either go and help people build their decks
or maybe they're going to cook food or it's going
to be some sort of care service. I mean, and
they're all doing it on their own without Big America.
But they're not protected, Daniel.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
That's why you need to pay mine to your legal wellness.
I mean, don't bring a knife to a gunfight, don't
go in out out ranked as it concerns your HR
meeting or your traffic stop or getting arrested or whatever.
So whereas I don't get into every topic out there
which is obvious, I can't, the first few chapters really
(15:52):
talk about the need to avoid that victim mentality, to
really stand on your own, stand up for yourself, pay
mind to your legal rights, your legal wife on the
spotting issues, getting help where you needed, and helping yourself
where you can by doing a little bit of research
and putting in a little bit of elbow grease and
not just rolling over and taking what big business and
the man give you because it's not okay. And if
(16:12):
you read my book, and when you're finished reading it,
I think you'll agree that you've got the tools in
the mindset to keep that from happening.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Well, it's more than reading I want them to do.
I want them to act debate the book. I want
them to know that this book is a tool, and
it's not just something that you just sit on the
toilet reading.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I think you're right. It is not a novel. It
is a living document. It is a resource. It's something
to keep handy. For the chapter on what to do
in an auto accident, I recommend taking a picture with
your phone of the top ten steps you ought to
enlist when in an auto accident, and just keep it
handy for when the inevitable car crash happens. You'll know
(16:49):
what to do and not have to worry. Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
So do you work on things such as wills.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Trust in the States? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (16:55):
Yeah? Are do you do you work on the trust estates?
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Yeah? Yeah. I've got a chat after on that on
the need for a will and a trust. I get
into living will, durable power, health care attorney, even talk
about pet trusts, because God forbid you both go down.
What do you do with the pet? Who's at home?
And I'll tell you every single I try to channel
every chapter through real situations, real problems that either I
(17:18):
had or my clients or friends had. I got a
bunch of letters in there that I wrote and every
single thing in there is real, and as it concerns
of wills and trust, I channel that chapter through. It
happened with my aunt in Minneapolis who died with a
simple will, not a trust. It was a nightmare. Don't
let what happened to me happened to you. I want
to bring this stuff to life, even if you don't
remember the particulars. You remember Danny Gott it shoved up
(17:38):
his backside because of this in chapter whatever, I don't
want it to happen to me. I'm going to get
a will and a trust.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
So are you hosting a podcast? Is it in your goals?
Because I mean you definitely have everything that a great
podcast that people can check in with. They'll they'll they'll
do it. They'll they'll get in there and listen to
it while driving to work or while being at work.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
I haven't done it yet. I've been encouraged to do it.
It's on my list. You know. My problem problem is,
you know, I'm still working, still got a law practice.
I've got a bunch of cases I'm working on. I'm
still teaching. I teach it on Michigan and Ohio State,
and I'm working on another book and Ultimately, if you're
asking about my goal, it's not so much to get
a podcast, although that would be fun, as it is
(18:19):
to get a TV show. I really want to become
the legal doctor Phil because the only legal content out
there that kind of goes towards this wellness space, arguably
are these ginned up courtroom shows that are more explicative
than they are helpful, in that they show up after
tragedy has befallen folks and they exploit it and they
just watch the misery ensue rather than moving the dial
(18:42):
back and kind of like if you go to the
doctor for physical to keep from getting sick. I want
to give people the tools to administer legal physical to
keep them getting legally sick. And that's what I want
my show to be about.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
I totally get that because the one thing I keep
hearing from my wife all the time, Doctor Judy, Doctor Judy,
Doctor Judy. I'm sure doctor Judy is beautiful, but to me,
that's like going to Google doctor.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
I think I can be a little more thoughtful than
some of the content that's on TV. What you know,
there are a lot of people, a lot of lawyers
who think they deserve the microphone, who just want to
be heard, think they deserve a stage in an audience.
And I did just show up doing this. I mean
I cultivated my experience three years of not just working cases,
(19:27):
but teaching. I mean I've got I've developed a voice
that allows me to, I think, relate to people and
lock in with people. I first started teaching in law
at Columbia, and when the community came in, he became
a bit much from Cleveland. I knew I needed somewhere closer,
which is why I wound up at Michigan and Ohio State.
And I'm teaching class all the time, which means I'm
(19:47):
teaching a real lesson to real kids who really need
to understand it in real understandable language. And that's what
I try to deliver, not only on the page, but
in person, as in our talk right now. So I'd
like to think that I I come at this process
from a more genuine angle than a lot of the
stuff we see in TV wow.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Where can people go to find out more about you
and everything that you're connected with, because you're you really
are about the community.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Oh thanks, In fact, now that you mention it, partial
proceeds for the book are going to the Cleveland Legal
Aid Society because it's such a great group and I'm
involved with them and it's just kind of in the
same space as I am. So I thought it would
be important to pay some of it forward to them
because they've helped me in terms of just kind of
(20:33):
you know, understanding in the way to help people, but
how to find me. My website Yourlovable Lawyer dot com.
I'm on Instagram, TikTok x, Facebook, YouTube, you know, across
all social and I'm always putting on content trying to
deliver accessible, digestible legal guidance to people in a way
(20:58):
that matters to them and that they can use a
daily basis.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Wow. Well, you've got to come back to this show
anytime in the future. The door is always going to
be open for you.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Oh that's so sweet. I would be happy to This
has been great, excellent.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
Will you be brilliant today?
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Okay, thank you, you too.
Hey, man, how are you doing today?
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I'm well, how are you?
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Absolutely fantastic? Hey, congratulations on this brand new book, A
Guide to Legal Wellness. Because until they saw this title,
I never even thought about how the average person does
not put themselves in a position of that wellness.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
It's no less essential than the other wellness buckets out there,
whether it be emotional or financial or physical. People neglected
people don't have the training to relate it to their
kids when they go to college, for instance, because you
got to be a lawyer to know from any of
the stuff I discussed, but you don't have to be
a lawyer to understand it. And that's kind of the
gap I'm trying to bridge, is to deliver legal awareness
(00:38):
and aptitude to people in an understandable, friendly way.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Yeah, because we live in this society where everybody thinks
they're going to go to chat GPT or they're going
to go to Google to find an answer. And I
know for a fact that what we've been through for
the past six months now that wasn't going to work.
We needed to have someone like you to give us
that guidance.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I hope more people agree than just you, because chatgy
can only take you so far. I mean, it's you know,
fraught with hallucinations. Lawyers are getting in trouble all over
the country for using chet ept in their legal filings
because it gets the law wrong a lot of the time,
and they're getting sanctioned by judges. So it's just not
a real worthwhile tool to employ in the lost space.
(01:21):
And that's what we're talking about. It's just that it's
a law spase that's accessible to people.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
So now, how did you know where? I mean, you
must have had an editor that kept you in line,
because I mean, you get into it. But then I
swear to God, this could be like a ten book series.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
I had an editor who was just helping with some
of the nits. I teach writing, I teach law school.
I also cheoch writing, So the writing wasn't a challenge
for me. The real challenge, they say in writing is
to know when to stop, and you stop when you're finished.
And I finally figured it about sixty seven thousand words.
Maybe she'd hold a little bit back for the next
next book, because you could go on and on with
(01:58):
these evergreen topics that people they need to know about.
But at some point it's got to be manageable, and
it can't be unwieldy and intimidating, because that is actually
the opposite of the brand and the purpose and the
goal I'm trying to promote, which is free, fun and
friendly legal guidance.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
And one of the things that you do is you
tap into everyday common thing such as a traffic ticket,
and you kind of suggest you do have the right
to fight that monkey?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Do you have the right to do a lot of things.
It's all about having the awareness to know what your
rights are. To avoid this victim mindset where you think, oh,
you know what, I got a ticket. I have to
pay it. There's a charge in myself and Bill, I
have to pay it. There's a charge in my visa, Bill,
I have to pay it. You can often dig deeper
and understand that there are rights that you have that
(02:43):
aren't only reserved for the privilege few who can afford
an expensive the lawyer, but instead everybody has them. Access
to the laws are right and not a privilege. We
just have to have the legal awareness to know what
our rights are, to know how to spot issues, and
to know how even just a little bit to address
the issues that we can get the other side attention
and they can back off.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
What about these people? And I don't want to say
these people as amil, you know, sectioning people off. But
there really is a big change in the way that
we do our work these days. It seems like that
everybody wants to hire us as you know, as Okay,
I'm going to get you in here for six months
and I'm not going to, you know, take take care
of your insurance for you. Basically you're a contract employee.
Well you know what that requires a lawyer and so
(03:24):
but most people go, well, I'm not taking this job then,
when they could have just called.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
You, Well, I don't do anything without talking to my lawyer, right,
And that's an anomaly. I happen to have a lawyer,
and I know that I need to at the level
I'm operating, have him look at things as he's going
to do tonight Frin for something. But most of our
everyday problems don't require a lawyer. They just require a
little bit of legal aptitude. So, for instance, if you're
(03:50):
in an auto accident, you don't need a lawyer off
the bat. You ought to get one ultimately, but there
are certain things that you should do at the scene
to preserve the scene, preserve your rights. Certain things you
should not do. So for instance, you might want to
secure your vehicles, take your pictures, exchange documents, get treated,
get a lawyer. Like I said, what might you not
want to do? Talk to the other side adjuster. They're
(04:11):
going to try to get in new admissions describing the
accident as your own fault. Don't talk to the other
side of the lawyer without your lawyer. Let them do
all the talking. These are just common sense things that
we lawyers know from but non lawyers don't. And this
is the information that the lawyers don't want people to
know that I'm trying to give away because people deserve
to know it without stepping into trouble. They deserve to
(04:32):
stay out of the trouble on account of having some
legal awareness or aptitude, or try to get out of
the trouble they're in because of the same legal awareness
and aptitude guidance that's rarely given out there.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
So now is basically when people tap into the book,
are they're going in there to just see that Okay,
here's my question. Oh my god, he's giving me the
guidance as to what my next steps should be.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
It's really a resource. It's something to keep on your shelf. So,
for instance, if you wind up in traffic corps, you
know what, I think a chapter and then how should
I manage that I was a nano accident. Let me
see how to manage that. I had a problem with
my landlord. Let me see how to manage that I
want to go to small claims card. Let me see
how to manage that. You know what mom and dad had,
are getting a little bit older, they don't have a
will and of trust. Let me see how to manage that.
(05:15):
And I talk about these evergreen topics. We call them
everyday topics in plan language, so that people can understand
them and appreciate what to do or maybe not to do,
if that's the course they want to take. But at
least they're doing what they're doing or not from a
place of information rather than cluelessness. And that's again what
legal wellness is all about.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Well, there was a few times during my days with
the big broadcast company where I felt like that when
I was going into that HR meeting, I should have
had a lawyer with me. Should we be doing something
like that, because it seems like HR is actually working
for the business and not the people.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
I would I have been in a big company in
a long time. I know that our understand I should
say that if you bring a lawyer into an HR meeting,
they might not go over so well, you've got to
feel it out. Maybe you want to consult with a
lawyer before and or afterward to ensure that things are
going to go right and went right. I wouldn't bring
a knife to a gun and fight like that. I
would always lawyer up. Hopefully there's somebody you can afford,
(06:07):
and there's somebody available to you, maybe a family friend.
But you know, for certain bigger ticket items like a
meeting with HR, you probably want to get a little
more intense counsel for something like a problem with the
airline because your flight was late and you want to
get back part of your purchase price because you didn't
get what you're bargained for. That's something you can manage
(06:27):
through this book.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
All right, let's talk reality here, because I know one
thing that's happening here in North Carolina when it comes
to selling alcohol to underage. You know, I realize that's
a bad thing, but here's what's happening. These people are
getting trapped because the people that are buying it have
better makeup on. They're looking older than what they really
should be, and that's how they're getting busted. I guess
it all goes down to you should have checked their license.
(06:49):
But the thing is, I mean, do they have the
right days? There's somebody that could back them up.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Listen, I still get carted and there's no reason we've parted.
We've all seen the signs and we cart up to
age thirty five. How the heck they know who the
heck knows? But it's a perception thing. They want to
let you know that. Hey listen, man, you're getting carted.
And I don't do this type of criminal law, but
I needn't to do this type of criminal law to
have a worthwhile opinion on it, which is this, if
you're working at a vendor or a merchant rather and
(07:15):
somebody comes in, I don't care how well they look cardom.
You can't go wrong have being carded them. If it's
a fake ID, that's not necessarily I you it's on them.
But if you don't cart them at all, you got
real problems if something were to happen, And I wouldn't
want to be in that position as a merchant or
as a cashier.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Don't you also see this book great for parents in
the way that as they send off their kids to
college and or even off to their first years of marriage,
that these parents step in and say, here's a book
for you, here's what you need to know and where
you need to lean on if you should get in
any type of trouble.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Funny, you should say that because I'm leaning heavily into
the book to do keynote speaking for college and university students,
because college and university kids are out of the house
for the first time. They're not free for the first
time to screw up things, to make their mistakes, to
sign bad leasas to get into car crashes away from
home and have to deal with them on their own.
All these sorts of things, and there are real problems
(08:07):
for people. And whereas parents might give their kids before
going to college a little bit of a guidance on hygiene,
maybe a little guidance on emotional wellness, maybe a little
guidance on financial wellness, they're rarely giving guidance on legal wellness.
Why because you need a specialty degree to do that.
You need to be a lawyer to have some real
(08:28):
aptitude for what it is kids out of know when
they head out into the real world. And I'm trying
to fill that gap, not just through the book, but
on the keynote circuit to go to colleges and not
only talk about the themes in the book, but real
college centric topics, such as, like you mentioned, what to
do when you get caught drinking underage. You're going to
do it anyway, but at least know the consequences. What
(08:49):
are the consequences of a fake ID? How about cheating?
How about hazing and a fraternity? How about sex offenses?
These are the things kids have no aptitude for. How
about getting in trouble online by popping off and having
a big mouth. What are the contras and limitations of
the First Amendment? And do they protect you not necessarily?
Ask gamber heard. There's a lot out there that kids
ought to be worried about.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Wow, And here's another one that comes up, and only
because I had to deal with it with my granddaughter.
She sees it as being a great idea to team
up with four other girls because they're in college. Okay,
we don't have to live on campus, and the three
girls left and left her with that bill to be paid.
It was all her because her name was on the contract.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Oh boy, you know what. I have experience with that too.
I mean my kid did a little bit of that.
You know, they always cram extra kids into the house.
But you got to be really careful because if you're
not in the lease, you're not obligated to pay the lease. Now,
am I cost you a friendship? Of things go south
and you bolt on the lease, but you know what
going with both eyes open, have a modest aptitude for
(09:47):
landlord tenelaw and I talk about that in the book too,
and then you'll know what the consequences of the least
are of that sort of arrangement. You might do it anyway,
but at least if you do then things go south,
you'll know what your remedies are. And more importantly, aren't.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
How much focus do you put on identity theft? Because
it seems like as we kind of change in this
nation right now, there's a lot of identity theft that's
going on, either that or just people just hacking into
your life period.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
I've got a chapter on that. There are a lot
of data breach cases out there in my practice. I'm
a plintif's class action attorney, and there are a ton
of data breach cases where folks identities are getting stolen.
And I talk about techniques to minimize that. You'll never
completely avoid it, unfortunately, because the hackers are so sophisticated.
I could speak from personal knowledge to that, despite my
(10:35):
best efforts. But you can do more than you're doing,
and you can only do more than you're doing if
that is somebody tells you what the steps and techniques
are that you ought to follow. And that's again keeping
with my books being kind of a resource, a living
document that you can look back to, refer to, keeping
the bookshelf and pull out when you have a problem
that it taps, such as like you said, identity theft.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
Please do not move. There's more with Daniel. I mean
up next the name of the book, A Guide to
Legal Wellness. Let's get back to that talk with Daniel.
What about AI technology. I talk with the rock stars
and even the movie stars who are going, man, they're
not copying my image, and I always say, so, what
are you doing to survive? Because you need some protection
and backup.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
I speak to that a bit. I've got a robust
chapter on online defamation, well, online indiscretions, defamation, dosing, and
invasion of privacy, And the law hasn't quite caught up
to the AI phenomenon yet. There's a lot of deep
fakes and the law is going to catch up, and
it's interesting to consider what the law is going to
do in that space. But it's absolutely something to be
(11:40):
mind to within the larger context of online indiscretions. So,
for instance, the angle I take in the chapter is,
and I mentioned this a second ago, people think they
can say anything they want because they have a First
Amendment right to say what they like. Well, wrong and wrong.
It's wrong once because the First Amendment only applies to
the government, state in federal not to private companies, which
(12:01):
is why employers can tell you what you can't say online,
which is why restaurants can say no shoes, no shirt,
no service. They're not bound by the strictures of the
First Amendment. Secondly, the First Amendment is limitations. It is
not ubiquitous. It doesn't cover everything. Some of the limitations
are defamation fighting words, boy, what are some other ones?
(12:28):
For profanity? And you're not protected from everything, even as
it concerns the government. So what ends up happening is kids,
you know, might be playing keyboard Warrior from the basement,
popping off firing off posts from the basement, and somebody
might get pissed off and sue a defamation case. And
if you're under age and you're in my basement, guess
who's getting sued me the parent. You're in my policy.
(12:50):
They're making a claim against me because I didn't have
this talk with my kid downstairs. And that's what I
meant a moment ago when I said Amber Heard should
have known what not to say. She should have known
what the elements of Virginia defamation law are, because her
case with Johnny Depp was not a special these case,
it was a defamation case. She didn't know what not
to say. She said it. She's out of packet millions
and millions of dollars for it.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
So now you being in that courtroom, how do you
handle these people when you have to bring in a
jury that they have figured out the idea on how
to get out of jury duty, because that can't be
fair to your playing field if you've got people in
there that just didn't figure it out.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
There are certain people that want to get out of
jury duty, and they'll say what's necessary to do it.
They'll say they're bias, they can't be fair and objective,
and that's fine, you know. But what I found in
the case is I've tried on balance, is that a
lot of people respect their constitutional duty yep, to sit
in a jury, which duty, by the way, is only
ranked by your right to vote and to be in
(13:48):
the military. It is really up there, and people take
it very seriously. I've never had a juror tell me
afterward I wish I hadn't sat.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
I know that, and if this is too political, please
please let me know. I just know that in many
of the major cities that their people are being arrested
and it's like, well, if you're going to jail, that
means you need a lawyer. I mean, they need legal rights,
they need this book. They need something that's going to
give them an answer because they're in a position that
they didn't think they were going to get in.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Well, if you're arrested, you absolutely need a lawyer, there's
no doubt about that. Now you're in the criminal space
more so than civil which is what my book focuses on.
But there's no denying that if you're arrested for whatever
in discretion, whether it's in you know, democratic city or
Republican city, doesn't matter. Being arrested. Is being arrested means
needing counsel to protect your rights?
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Yeah? Yeah, I just love where your heart is on
this because there's just something here for everybody. And that's
the thing about it is that you could put this
book up at Low's or home depot and I guarantee
you the thing would sell.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Well, that's what I tried to lean into. I didn't
want to get too specialized. I mentioned evergreen topics. Those
are topics that we deal with every day. We all
drive cars, we all rent property, we all have credit cards,
we are all online. I wanted to hit the big ones,
and I had to stop at a certain point because
I came into a three hundred and two pages. I figure,
you know what, that's probably enough. Got to leave a
(15:08):
little leftover for the the sequel.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
You could you could do an entire book on the
person that has made a decision to step into the
world of entrepreneurship in the way that they're going to
you know, either go and help people build their decks
or maybe they're going to cook food or it's going
to be some sort of care service. I mean, and
they're all doing it on their own without Big America.
But they're not protected, Daniel.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
That's why you need to pay mine to your legal wellness.
I mean, don't bring a knife to a gunfight, don't
go in out out ranked as it concerns your HR
meeting or your traffic stop or getting arrested or whatever.
So whereas I don't get into every topic out there
which is obvious, I can't, the first few chapters really
(15:52):
talk about the need to avoid that victim mentality, to
really stand on your own, stand up for yourself, pay
mind to your legal rights, your legal wife on the
spotting issues, getting help where you needed, and helping yourself
where you can by doing a little bit of research
and putting in a little bit of elbow grease and
not just rolling over and taking what big business and
the man give you because it's not okay. And if
(16:12):
you read my book, and when you're finished reading it,
I think you'll agree that you've got the tools in
the mindset to keep that from happening.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Well, it's more than reading I want them to do.
I want them to act debate the book. I want
them to know that this book is a tool, and
it's not just something that you just sit on the
toilet reading.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I think you're right. It is not a novel. It
is a living document. It is a resource. It's something
to keep handy. For the chapter on what to do
in an auto accident, I recommend taking a picture with
your phone of the top ten steps you ought to
enlist when in an auto accident, and just keep it
handy for when the inevitable car crash happens. You'll know
(16:49):
what to do and not have to worry. Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
So do you work on things such as wills.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Trust in the States? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (16:55):
Yeah? Are do you do you work on the trust estates?
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Yeah? Yeah. I've got a chat after on that on
the need for a will and a trust. I get
into living will, durable power, health care attorney, even talk
about pet trusts, because God forbid you both go down.
What do you do with the pet? Who's at home?
And I'll tell you every single I try to channel
every chapter through real situations, real problems that either I
(17:18):
had or my clients or friends had. I got a
bunch of letters in there that I wrote and every
single thing in there is real, and as it concerns
of wills and trust, I channel that chapter through. It
happened with my aunt in Minneapolis who died with a
simple will, not a trust. It was a nightmare. Don't
let what happened to me happened to you. I want
to bring this stuff to life, even if you don't
remember the particulars. You remember Danny Gott it shoved up
(17:38):
his backside because of this in chapter whatever, I don't
want it to happen to me. I'm going to get
a will and a trust.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
So are you hosting a podcast? Is it in your goals?
Because I mean you definitely have everything that a great
podcast that people can check in with. They'll they'll they'll
do it. They'll they'll get in there and listen to
it while driving to work or while being at work.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
I haven't done it yet. I've been encouraged to do it.
It's on my list. You know. My problem problem is,
you know, I'm still working, still got a law practice.
I've got a bunch of cases I'm working on. I'm
still teaching. I teach it on Michigan and Ohio State,
and I'm working on another book and Ultimately, if you're
asking about my goal, it's not so much to get
a podcast, although that would be fun, as it is
(18:19):
to get a TV show. I really want to become
the legal doctor Phil because the only legal content out
there that kind of goes towards this wellness space, arguably
are these ginned up courtroom shows that are more explicative
than they are helpful, in that they show up after
tragedy has befallen folks and they exploit it and they
just watch the misery ensue rather than moving the dial
(18:42):
back and kind of like if you go to the
doctor for physical to keep from getting sick. I want
to give people the tools to administer legal physical to
keep them getting legally sick. And that's what I want
my show to be about.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
I totally get that because the one thing I keep
hearing from my wife all the time, Doctor Judy, Doctor Judy,
Doctor Judy. I'm sure doctor Judy is beautiful, but to me,
that's like going to Google doctor.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
I think I can be a little more thoughtful than
some of the content that's on TV. What you know,
there are a lot of people, a lot of lawyers
who think they deserve the microphone, who just want to
be heard, think they deserve a stage in an audience.
And I did just show up doing this. I mean
I cultivated my experience three years of not just working cases,
(19:27):
but teaching. I mean I've got I've developed a voice
that allows me to, I think, relate to people and
lock in with people. I first started teaching in law
at Columbia, and when the community came in, he became
a bit much from Cleveland. I knew I needed somewhere closer,
which is why I wound up at Michigan and Ohio State.
And I'm teaching class all the time, which means I'm
(19:47):
teaching a real lesson to real kids who really need
to understand it in real understandable language. And that's what
I try to deliver, not only on the page, but
in person, as in our talk right now. So I'd
like to think that I I come at this process
from a more genuine angle than a lot of the
stuff we see in TV wow.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Where can people go to find out more about you
and everything that you're connected with, because you're you really
are about the community.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Oh thanks, In fact, now that you mention it, partial
proceeds for the book are going to the Cleveland Legal
Aid Society because it's such a great group and I'm
involved with them and it's just kind of in the
same space as I am. So I thought it would
be important to pay some of it forward to them
because they've helped me in terms of just kind of
(20:33):
you know, understanding in the way to help people, but
how to find me. My website Yourlovable Lawyer dot com.
I'm on Instagram, TikTok x, Facebook, YouTube, you know, across
all social and I'm always putting on content trying to
deliver accessible, digestible legal guidance to people in a way
(20:58):
that matters to them and that they can use a
daily basis.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Wow. Well, you've got to come back to this show
anytime in the future. The door is always going to
be open for you.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Oh that's so sweet. I would be happy to This
has been great, excellent.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
Will you be brilliant today?
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Okay, thank you, you too.
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