May 30, 2025 • 51 mins
Michelle finds herself in a world where she is connected to the energy of our world and can help so many on their journeys to discover the power within themselves. As an empath she connects deeply to the core issues and supports people in their personal growth. A conversation that opens us up to possibility.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hello, good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Wherever you are
in the world, My name is your Tiny and welcome
to the Being Human Hidden Depths podcast by Collaboration Global.
It's been a bit chilly here in the good old UK,
but I'm really excited to talk to somebody over the
other side of the pond who's probably used to much
(00:25):
worse weather than we are here here in England, and
one of our latest members at Collaboration Global. And I'm
excited for this podcast because I don't know a huge
amount about her and I want to find out more
about this amazing human being that has just entered our
lovely community. So welcome, Michelle. How lovely to have you
with us.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Thank you, Jill, It's great to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
Lovely now on your zoom picture and on your LinkedIn
and anywhere else we can find you your Michelle Jay Howe.
One thing I've never actually said is what's the JAY
stand for?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
You know, I've questioned why do I keep my J?
Why do I keep my J? I'm like, it's just
because people are like, if you're going to get introduced
or if you're speaking Michelle, how like, why are you
putting the J in there Michelle, who's going to stop
and say Michelle J. But I'm like, Josephine is my
middle name, and Josephine was came from my mother's side
(01:23):
of the family. It's on my father's side of the family.
I'm like, I am not getting rid of even when
I got married, I'm like, I am not getting rid
of my middle name because I love I love It's
just when I think of the world, it's an old name.
But when I think of it, I'm like, oh no, no,
it's me Michelle J. How And then I called my kids.
(01:45):
All my kids have Jay's for first name. I didn't
plan that, but they are. So I'm like, I must
have an affinity to J. There's something about the J
that is And I do numerology and I know it.
I know a lot about a lot of different topics,
and I know that your name there's a certain numerology
that goes with it. And when I you know what
(02:09):
you were born with, what you became, I'm like, nope,
I need my J in there. It's just me.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Yeah, no, I love it. And you know what, when
you go searching for you, you put the J in,
then you know you've got the right person. There's a
lot of Michelle Howe's out there.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
There is Michelle Howe.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Sounds like a beginning of a question.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Yeah, j how It's like, that's it.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
That's who she's now in a Josephine. What a lovely name.
Thank you, that's gorgeous, okay, Michel j. How You are
known for being the founder and creator of the EmPATH
evolution or evolution as we might say here in the UK.
Empathy is a big deal in my book. People go
(02:55):
around call themselves an EmPATH and I didn't know what
that meant. But I have lived my life feeling other
people's pain. However it manifests, and for me that means
if I see somebody in pain, it makes my knees
go funny. I really just oh, it's just I feel
that I can't watch any movies or anything when people
(03:16):
are in pain because I know it's pretend, but it
still gets me. So I just I don't watch it.
I don't want that angst and that upset inside. Where
did your journey of being an EmPATH or being empathetic
or understanding the power then? Where did that come from?
Speaker 2 (03:36):
That's a great question, My god, that's a really good question.
I ask you this little question, where did it begin? Well, okay,
EmPATH being empathic? I you know, people get bogged down
with both of them. There is a difference between those
two concepts and ideas. But for the most part, I
(04:00):
don't like to divide up, spit out these concepts. You
belong in the club, you don't belong in the club.
But so you know, being I've so to me, being
empathic is about sensing and feeling and looking at people,
(04:21):
not so much surface level, but really noticing things that
are more that are there. And although everybody can sense
and feel, we all sense and feel a bit differently
than we all see things a little bit differently, which
(04:42):
isn't necessarily about being an EmPATH or not, but it's
how do I manage through life? How do I relate
to life? And there's so many different like tools out
there at Myers Briggs, you know the this system that
it tells you about your personality, how you function, right,
and empathy is one of the characteristics character traits empathy, right,
(05:05):
is it a leadership skill? Is it not a leadership skill? Well,
to me, being an umpath as a way of being
in the world, it's really when I discovered I was
an umpath, which did not happen till age forty.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
A couple of years ago.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I didn't know there was a word. I've always functioned
as an unpath, but I didn't know that was a thing.
I didn't know that it was different. I didn't know.
I didn't know until I really was struggling, and I
really went looking for some answer to something. Why am
(05:41):
I struggling so much? Why did I feel so much?
Why am I going through this massive I went through
like a dark knight of the soul, massive spiritual awakening.
And I didn't I hadn't recognized it. I didn't know
such a thing existed. But when I found thirty traits
(06:01):
of an EmPATH, I'm like, oh shit, I'm like, I
have I have most of these traits, or I've had them,
or I relate with them and my knowing. Because an
person who is an EmPATH, or because they have a
strong intuitive hit, they know things that others do not
(06:23):
read or notice or appreciate. You know, the energy goes
up in the room, the energy goes down in a room.
Someone's upset like I would. I was involved in different
women's organizations and once I'd go to these meetings immediately beehive.
This person needs me. Yeah, I don't know why they
(06:46):
need me, but my attention goes to her immediately. My
husband would say to me before we knew any of this,
there is something absolutely wrong with you, Michelle. I know
to all these events. Why do you go to events
and strangers people you don't even know? They tell you
their stories. They don't tell you a little story. They
(07:06):
tell you the deepest, darkest story of their life.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Nice. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
And he would look at me and I'd be like, well,
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
I'm like, doesn't that happen to you, darling?
Speaker 2 (07:19):
And he's like, no, no, my husband and bind you.
I think my husband's quite sensitive and respectful of people
and leans in, but he has such a logical side
to him. People don't. He doesn't want to hear what
their stories are. He doesn't ask them what they are Like.
(07:39):
I have a very open stance. So if you ask
me who an mpath is, and that path is a
person that has the capacity to feel and sense. They're
very open people. They can uplift, they can transmute negativity.
They're the person you call on the phone when you
don't feel good and they helped lift you up.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, and we all need one of those, don't we.
Even an impath needs somebody they can go to that's
like that.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Oh absolutely, And I can tell you. I mean I
didn't know the word mpath, but I you know, when
I ran into different challenges in my life, I would
get on the phone, you know, only once. Yeah, oh
my god, I'm never calling her again because she did
(08:30):
not uplift. She didn't have the capacity helped me, hold
me shift transmute. She didn't have it. Some people have
it in spades, some people. I felt worse when I
got off the phone, right, So everybody needs a friend
who is an EmPATH. Yeah, there are a lot of
(08:52):
empaths in the world that do not realize they're empathic.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
I didn't know for forty years. I just knew things.
And I was like in high school, I'd come home
and eat. I had to eat to feel better. I
didn't know why I had to eat. Oh, but I'm like,
I just do not feel good. I'm like, something is wrong.
So I'm eating, and Okay, I feel better now.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I didn't want to go certain places. I didn't know
why I didn't want to go certain places. Nope. I
might have had plans, but nope, that's not happening. I
don't feel it. It's not happening. I'm stubborn enough that
I actually listen. Some people don't listen to their intuition
and override it, right, But I listened. And then again,
(09:43):
all my friends would I would be friends with the
people who needed help, and I didn't mind it. But
you know, at the end of the day, like my
brother's like, what's going on with all your friends, Michelle,
Like they are the people that needed me and I'm
their friend. So a lot of mpaths do struggle.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
You know.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
I would have to write at night. I figured out
that journaling and writing helped me feel better. Yeah, just
to kind of clear myself. I after the fact, I'm like,
oh my god. When I was young, every New Year's Eve,
I was a basket case of wow. And I'm like, why, Like, oh,
(10:29):
the emotional energies on the planet are really high. Yeah
that night, right, And I'm open enough or fluid enough
that I'm tapping into what's going on around me and
it's not necessarily my pain or my feelings. But these
are some of the skills that when you really are
(10:51):
an mpath you need to learn some of there are a
lot of them are energetic. They're just teaching you how
to use your senses news information in ways that are
more positive to you because you really do function differently
than other people.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
It's interesting. It's interesting, isn't it, because you can look
at the world that we're in now is much more
open about how our brains work and how our mental
health is, and the universe and the energy that's out
into the world and the fact that we are all
energy energetic beings. And of course there are people that
(11:32):
there's these labels that we would love to give people
don't really all these little labels. And on the autistic spectrum,
you can see how, and having been a teacher many
years ago and worked with young children, mostly the boys,
is that when a child is on that autistic spectrum,
it's very hard for them to connect with you because
they don't like the eye contact, they don't like any
(11:53):
touch of any sort, and there's no kind of empathy
from them. It's like that it doesn't exist. They can
lash out at another child and have no recourse. Is
that if they've hurt another child or there's no remorse
shown because they just can't see it. And if you imagine,
as I believe, that we're all kind of on a
(12:14):
level of a spectrum. EmPATH is kind of at one end,
and maybe autism is at the other end. I don't know.
This is not scientific, folks, This is just me thinking
out loud. And it's interesting how the people at one
end can actually connect up and help the people at
the other end, and obviously all those in the middle
as well. And it's not aren't they lovely, aren't they clever?
(12:39):
They're an EmPATH. It's just that's the way the gift
that you've been given. And we've all got different gifts,
and sometimes an autistic person has got amazing gifts and
they call it their superpower because of how they see
the world and how they operate and how they can
look at you know, technology or other things in a
way that an EmPATH would be like totally lost. It's
(13:00):
the gift that we're given throughout the world. So if
you waited until your fault is until you kind of
suss worked out, did the research and found out that
you were an impact, did that have an impact on
your life or did you just go okay, That's that's
why I cry on music. Was it kind of like
a revolutionary you know, now I get who I am?
(13:23):
Or was it something that like, oh, now what am
I going to do with this?
Speaker 2 (13:28):
It lit me up. It lit me up because I
am a curious person to begin with. Yeah, and I'm like, oh,
my dear lord, what does this mean for me? What
does this mean for my you know? What is this about?
I mean I had one woman say you have so
much healing potential, so much light. Stop hiding your light
(13:49):
behind the bushop? And I'm like, what are you talking about?
Like are you talking about? But it lit me up,
and it threw me into this stage of my development
where a lot of things became about spiritual knowledge, A
lot of things became about energy and healing and depth
and who am I? Like, I really went and I
(14:13):
kind of secluded or separated or stepped back from. I
was very much about family and my kids and this
game and that game and work. All of a sudden,
my interests kind of shifted. I shifted, and my husband's like,
what's going on with you? I'm like, I'm sorry, you
(14:33):
married a CPA accountant, But guess what I care more about?
Who people are than their businesses, who they are, where
they're going, what they're becoming, and that's my role in
the world, and that's what I'm here to do. So
deal with it.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
So you saw it was like fates complays like now
I know this, then I have to go down that road.
It wasn't like I'll hold this to myself and keep
it to myself and not well, there anybody with it.
It was like it's going to come out.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Well. I felt I'm passed through this. The responsibility and
the obligation and the passion behind what it was that
I went through, and how I see a lot of
people struggling in the world and a lot of people
unbeknownst to them what the struggle is about. Truly, I
(15:29):
felt like I could be a huge asset and helping
them uncover beneath. You know, there's a lot of theories
and personality assessments and blah blah blah. People are teaching
and telling me how to behave, But innately, there's a
huge knowing and a huge feeling component to life that
can guide you in the direction that you need to
(15:53):
go to to be more in line with your spiritual purpose,
your actual authentic self, not because you're trying to fit
into some box, because you're not in the box. You're
outside the box. It's my books, there is no So
that was like the passion behind Path Evolution. It's just
(16:16):
you know, seeing it and then creating it. Creating is
a lot harder than seeing it. Creating it is a
little bit more methodical because you there's all these things
progress very slow when you're trying to really try to
dot your eyes, cross your t's and do this and
do that. But on a spiritual level, the things I know,
(16:39):
spiritually energetically we are so powerful and there's so much
that happens when we come together. And I'm like, you know,
the brand of EmPATH Evolution, the brand of Michelle, Like,
I want to help at the higher level bring the
people who are ready to hear this message forward.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
More so, you've obviously got a message to share when
you first started out and you're sort of sitting on
your own going I think, I'm going to start a business,
and I think it's going to be about this, and
I think, and I'm going to get my brand and
this is going to and this is how it's going
to work. Were you in a community relationships with people
(17:23):
whereby you could announce this and they go whoo. Or
were you in a space where people go, Okay, that
sounds a bit woo woo. Were they kind of were
they in that place or did you feel nervous coming
out with this idea that you know in the business world,
some people might go okay, bit of a crack part. Maybe,
(17:44):
I don't know. I mean, in my world we'd be
all like, whoa brilliant rock on. But there are some
places where you go like, Okay, can you go and
talk to those people over there, because this is the
business lot over here. And I've been in those rooms
as well when I've been looked at as a crackpot
too when you first came out, as it were.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
So when I first started. So I'm a little bit
of a shape shifter, like I change how I present
things depending on who I'm in front of, right, so
in order for them to get the message of what
I'm saying, I changed. And sometimes this hasn't really always
felt like this is not such a great quality, But
(18:25):
then other times I'm like, oh, it needed that in
order for it to land where it needed to land.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
How can I hear it if they're not here, if
it's not being delivered in the language to understand.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
When I when I first started an unpath evolution, I
can remember being very open and frank with some of
the women that I thought could hear it, and even
they could not hear it. Wow, they could not appreciate it.
So it didn't land. It didn't have anything to until
somebody goes through an awakening experience, until they decide that
(18:57):
there's something that they're missing. They don't. Yeah, that's kind
of cute, that's kind of interesting, that's yeah, that's yeah,
But it doesn't stick to anything. It doesn't have any
relevance to them until they are ready to really hear more. So,
I would say in the very beginning, it's not that
(19:20):
I was shy about saying it. I just was looking
for the way that they could hear me, and for
the most part, they really couldn't. So I kept a
lot of things to myself and even my husband he
could not wrap his head around what I was doing. Wow,
(19:44):
And he was I want to say almost I don't
want to say embarrassed, but he couldn't put words to it.
And it didn't really become more acceptable until the last
maybe five years. Like I've had to like coax him
and give him, you know, talk on his terms. He
(20:06):
could hear me yet, because I really would like you
to stop using the word energy. It's just so weird, Michelle.
It's just like, oh my god. Because you cannot bring
that word into the corporate they will listen to you.
And I'm like, things have really turned around a lot,
(20:26):
and you know, it's taken those individual people at those levels.
You know, yes, you're not going to be appreciated, you
can't really talk your language. But what I found is
you don't have to talk your language. You just have
to be what that is and you do what you do.
You don't have to They don't have to accept you.
(20:47):
They don't have to understand. You have to understand yourself.
Of course, it's nice to be around people that you
can talk frankly with and they can you can relate with,
and you're there to support one another relating well. But
in most environments people understand or can like you meet
(21:07):
them where they are, yeah, and you can help them,
but they can't. You can't help them if your language,
if they can't relate to you, you cannot. They can't
absorb it unless they can. So you just be so
being an up, you be all of who you are,
and that in a sense does ninety percent of the work. Yeah,
(21:31):
which is sub level to their consciousness. They're being shifted there.
You're you're doing your work just by being who you are.
And then if they want to know more, if you
can add a phraser two or some advice more, that's,
you know, the cherry on the top.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
It's a bit like when people go through, as an example,
a grief. If you've going through a bereavement, somebody can
tell you what it's going to be like, but you
won't understand it until you've gone through it for yourself.
And then you can, having gone through that experience, you
can you know the highs and the lows and everything
(22:13):
in between, but you still can't explain it effectively to
somebody else because they have to go through it. And
I think that's what you're saying, is when somebody is
there holding your hand through the understanding and the learning
of getting your head around how being an EmPATH is
a powerful thing. It's a bit like Brene Brown with
her shame and guilt and all the things that she
(22:39):
talks about and vulnerability and the courage to be vulnerable
until somebody kind of guide you in that way that
you think you block it off and you or you
don't know about it so you don't explore it. You
just go, oh, no, I'm not an EmPATH, or oh
it's not for me. Oh it's that energy talk I'm not. Yeah, yeah,
I get it. I get it. So when you're kind
(23:01):
of pushing it away, you're not allowing yourself to get it.
And until someone can sit by your side and be
with you, as I say, through a bereavement, then you
get what it feels like and it's okay, and it's
okay to feel those fields, and then you move through
into another space. It's the same as personal development. You
can read all the books in the world to say,
(23:22):
you know, when you understand your limiting beliefs and when
you understand the mindset of this A, B or c.
And you don't, you can go not and intellectually you
get it. But emotionally, spiritually, energetically, yeah, not at all
until you've walked into that space and explored with another
(23:43):
human being that can take you by the hand, not
literally necessarily, but sometimes and walk you through it. I
went through a learning space around a relationship I had
when I was a child. I was bullied as a child,
And it wasn't until I went through a physicality process
(24:05):
or forgiving myself and forgiving this other person, that I
was able to let it go, let it go. But
I knew logically about it, and I'm like, yeah, yeah,
I'm done. It's good, it's fine, it's over. But it
wasn't till I went through the physical process that took
about a two hour process, which actually then happened again
six months later, and it happened again six months later
(24:25):
for it to kind of the layers of an onion
to be peeled away, so you can go, I haven't
it ago I have.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
It's very very it's very humbling to be in the
zone and aware that there is some spiritual emotional healing
underway and that you are You're just you're growing, you're shifting,
you're changing. You've accepted it. But it's not like, oh, yeah,
(24:55):
check done, you know, but you know on some level,
we're you're ready. You were ready to look at it.
Like Some people do not care to self reflect, do
not care to forgive. They like holding on to a
certain ident it's not their time, yes, yeah, not for them.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
So yeah, it's hard, isn't it. So Obviously you've had
various clients and you've helped them through various elements of
their life with no names now pactrial. Have you got
any stories of anything beautiful that you.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Have some beautiful stories? Yeah, well, I would we remiss
if I didn't talk about George. George is a huge
client of mine. He's still we're still connected, very connected.
George had gone through horror, horrible, well, challenging, let's put
(25:55):
challenging traumatic childhood, and he had survived lots of things,
and he had become always very empathic, always very sensitive.
But people feared to George because if you got in
the way of his family, George had no fear other
than his own father. I have no fear George's. The
(26:18):
emotions that George experience were pretty intense when he experienced them,
and he, you know, he had to like build certain
walls to survive certain things that happen to him. And
the good news is he got through cancer when he
was twenty five, he got through divorce, he got through
(26:40):
his grandmother dying really in a poor in a really
bad way. And then his wife, the love of his life.
He loved, he loved, he loved, and thankfully he found
his soulmate. He married her and she died in the
middle of the nights.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
So you wake up to that. He was fifty seven
years old. Make it up to that one morning and
it's completely you know, what do you do when the
love of your life dies? You? You know, you cry?
You are you cry? He was a puddle of tears
and whatnot. Now he was on my list as a
(27:22):
subscriber and he was getting information, but at one point
I'm like, I need to know from all you people
where you're from, you know, and you know, if you
ever want to talk to me, here's my link. And
this was probably three or four months after his wife
had passed away. Reached out to me and we got
on the phone and immediately he's not a guy that
(27:45):
would he can spop bullshit a mile away like he
just he's the kind of guy nobody would ever say
was sensitive because he was a man's man, let's put
it that way. Yeah, Michelle, I'm very lucky and I
am not in jail because with the things that where
I was around and the intensity of emotions around some
(28:07):
of these things. I'm lucky that it didn't go that far.
I had someone watching my back. So we started working together,
and at one point I said to him, I think
he goes, I think you're kind of nuts. He goes,
I go, you are a heat like his hands were
heating up. He just I was working on him energetically,
(28:30):
and then there's some teachings. I like to bring people
through storylines and shifting things. It's all energy work. I'm
working behind the scenes, dissipating the charges, clearing the storylines,
just helping you come back together. And he goes, I
don't know what's happening, but I'm starting to believe you.
(28:56):
He goes, and he goes, and I don't believe most people,
but he knew immediately. It's almost like I was giving
him oxygen to breathe. He was finally making sense of
who he was, and he could connect with spirit, connect
with his wife, he could connect with his ancestors. His
hands are active and moving. He's like, I'm like, while
(29:19):
George like, George's like completely shifted and found a new
purpose in his life. Yes, I mean the answer for
I mean his is probably the highest version of a
role probably that I've had to date is to be
there and beside him and watch this unfold for him.
(29:43):
So that's George. Some other people again, I think natural empaths.
But you know, your childhood has so much to do,
and you can hold on to some things and their
fears that hold you back as an adult. Ali really
(30:09):
didn't know about being married, getting married, Like, she had
so much hesitations about this topic, and she had so
much residue, like toxic grief and shame and like just
things from her family carried forward that. I did some
work on her energetically. Before you know it, she's lost
(30:32):
a ton of weight, she's getting engaged, she's married, she's
doing plays like the things that were holding her back,
and she's learned how to manage her mind, her beliefs,
her fears in a way that support her making like
(30:52):
and she was ready and pathic, she was already feeling
and sensing. But it was putting that in perspective with
living in or light. Yeah right, you don't. So it's
all energetic. I guess that's my biggest thing.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Yea, which is I mean, whether you believe it or not,
it's a bit I've used this example a lot. You know,
when you plug in the plug to light your lamp
and you flick the switch, you expect the electricity to
come on, because that's what happens. But in our world,
we don't think about the energy that we're emanating or receiving.
And people go, oh, I don't really understand how it
(31:31):
all works. Well, I don't understand really. I mean, I
know the basics of electricity getting from me to be,
but it's still quite a miracle when that light goes on.
But we just take it for granted. It's the dune thing.
If we were brought up with this understanding of empathy
and understanding of the energy that flows, where you can
walk in the room and you can just feel it.
You can you can taste it, you can touch it
(31:52):
when it's you know, a serious energy or a joyful energy.
When somebody's just sitting there but they're just so happy inside,
you can just off of them. It's this literally, you
can feel the buzz. If we were all taught about
that and it was as natural as turning on a
light bulb, and the world, you can imagine, would be
(32:12):
a different place because people wouldn't be quite so quick.
I don't think to criticize because they would understand the
impact they have from a look, from a glance, or
a word that they said that actually hit the wrong nerve.
And then when we understand ourselves better, we understand how
to unpack the stuff that's happened to us in our past,
(32:32):
but also historically generationally, the impacts from our parents' lives
and our grandparents' lives and our ancestors lives. It depends
how far you want to go back. I've only recently
discovered that my grandmother had a huge impact in how
I behaved as a child and as an adult, because
that was the history, the family story that we've been
(32:58):
brought through the ages. Because what she'd lived through, the trauma,
the massive trauma that she had lived through, we were
still i wan't say suffering from because it stood me
in good stage to be honest with you, it got me.
There was resilience. I was resilient because she had been
resilient going through her trauma. But at the same time,
all the other stuff stopped me from being who I
(33:20):
was and finding out who I was. So what you're
doing what I absolutely love about this, Michelle, is that
you are normalizing what is a normal thing for most people,
where most people want to just use logic and stick
to this one road that they know. And it's A
plus B equal C two plus two equals four. And
you're going, well, maybe it doesn't because if we open
(33:44):
this door and there's all this other stuff going on,
it's a whole new world that most people don't even
dare to take a step into that room to see
what's going on there. And actually, and again, I use
this example lot. When you buy a washing machine, bear
with all right, there's a message. When you buy a
washing machine, generally you want to get the fancy one
(34:06):
that does all singing, all dancing, makes you a cup
of tea, and does everything else. But in reality, you
use that program, and you use that program one for
you white.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
It's a one for your colors, but.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
It does so much more. You can have it. You
can set it for this, and you can schedule it
for that, and it can do these colors, and it
can do woolens and it can do everything else. But no,
it's all right, I'll use that one, and I'll use
that one. That's what we're like in our bodies. We're
only using like twenty percent of what's possible, and you
are opening that door to the eighty percent that we
don't ever ever utilize and consider. So I think what
(34:40):
you're doing is a powerful thing. And having these stories
of how these strong men have kind of come into realization.
Ah huh because of you, I'm now a different person,
and it can be a good different person. You're not
going to be going backwards. It can only be moving
you forwards.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
He's mooing. No, he's absolutely, he said, we we just
met the other day. We're talking about he was born
with a lot of rage in him. His father had
the rage, his grandfather had the rage. Interesting, and what
do you do when you don't even know where it's
coming from. It's just there, So you're you know, someone
just flicked the light on and it's there again. Like
(35:20):
so we had to work with that anger rage quite
a bit, and it's it's morphed throughout the time. But
it could do it could burn things down really along
the way. It did burn things down. It's just a
matter of just thinking a little bit bigger than just
(35:40):
this present moment and being real with yourself. I mean,
one guy I talked to last week he's old. He's old.
He's not old, he's probably in his early sixties. But
he's a former. That warrior calls himself very spiritual now
eighty eight, Like he's educated himself about so many things,
(36:02):
but he always had the empathy there. He just didn't know.
And here are these he goes, Wow, he goes, So,
you know, someone going from going from surviving When you're
just surviving, you're just basically doing what you need to
do to get by, to all of a sudden you
(36:22):
have the bandwidth to really take a closer look and
focus and thrive and enjoy instead of you know, push push, push,
push push, like because that's you know, nonsensical in a
sense that you're just going about your life and before
you know it, it's done. Like you're empty, there's nothing there,
(36:46):
there's nothing revitalizing you. And like George had walls built
all around him to protect him, but those walls, as
much as they're protection, they can also keep away. Well
it's feeding you or good feed you. So it's him
finding a safe enough space where he allowed that to happen.
(37:08):
And like what I have seen too is and George
has worked with this, which is so cool it's so
cool when you hear about where he's able to connect
and what he's able to do spiritually, which helps people
on a very concrete level live their lives. Because when
you feel like there's missing parts of you, they are
(37:30):
shut off. Is they're missing, they're not there, there's empty
spots in you because along the way, you've had trauma
that's been left to just sit there or left alone.
The emotions weren't processed, the scenario wasn't validated. There's shame
around it. It's like, and you know, people become suicidal,
(37:54):
people become depressed, Like you've allowed your light, You've allowed
the outside to suppress so much of who you are
that you don't even recognize who you are anymore. Life
is not really an enjoyable scene unless you're feeling those
endorphins that make you happy about yourself, your life, your light,
(38:18):
like you need the light on, yeah off work for
very long or very well for you. So like we're helping,
we're helping one person that we know, he's a young kid.
He's going through really tough time, but it's from trauma
(38:38):
from when he was young and those hidden small parts
of him, that young six year old child needs a
little help. So spiritually speaking, you're working on that to
help integrate it back in to who he is. Like,
it takes a lot of courage to go back and
(38:59):
to look hm to be with that.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
So and the thing is if if you don't go
back and look, and you leave it there and you
lock it in the box and go that's fine. I
can ignore it. That's okay. It's still there and it's
still kind of festering away. And that festering not only
does it block away because you're making these decisions, this
cutting off decision, you're also cutting off other emotions in
(39:24):
your body because you're not dealing with the emotions because
they're too scary. And I get that is really scary, right,
You're cutting off joy.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
It's it's.
Speaker 1 (39:34):
Out. And then what happens to that festering It turns
in on you and then before you know it, you're ill.
You've got this disease. You've got that disease. And I'm
saying going on and it just perpetuates.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
The snowball effect, the snowball effact. We actually had a
scenario in our house. It's forced me out of my
office and into our bedroom here. So I've got that
the digital background going. But you know, it doesn't take
much when you look at like dreams and symbolism houses,
(40:09):
first floor, second floor, basement, subconsciousness, the basement with the
first floor. Your higher self is the second floor of
the attic. Right, So you're we found water damage, water,
some mold going on in our basement. I'm like looking,
I'm like, my office is in the basement. I'm like, hm,
(40:36):
you leave it, y'all it takes is a little damage.
You don't fix it up. Next thing, you know, you've
got a bigger problem. And you don't even notice the
problem there until it shows itself. Forget me, you didn't
remember five years ago you didn't leave the humidifier on
for four months, and the humidifier and this is what happens.
And I'm like, and it grows. It almost like it
(40:58):
that that top it It can grow to infect other
things because there's no air circulation. Like this is all
symbolism for me. I was like. My husband looked at me,
he goes, okay, you've got me, Michelle. We're getting rid
of things in the baby Lord like, let's just ship
(41:19):
this stuff out, things up as much as possible, so
that and you keep your eye on it. Like I
called around my friend who's a realtor. I'm like, what
to write? She goes, it's the basement. There is things
that can accumulate there, like there is water that can
come in. You have to keep your eye on it,
(41:41):
like you just have to do your due diligence. And
it's like your vessel, your your your body, like it's
serving you physically, right, but there's a whole mental, emotional,
spiritual like how are you feeling like and trying to
balance out the you know, the anxiety either turmoil, distress,
(42:02):
all these other things we're expecting or thinking that our
bodies are capable of handling. Well, maybe you are, but
what's happening ten years from now that you didn't, Like,
how do you make sure this vessel is running like habnatch,
it's running?
Speaker 1 (42:19):
Yeah? And also if the vessel is running a high capacity,
you've got space for other people to support them, haven't you. Yes,
when you've looked after yourself and it's your turn to
look after somebody else and take it on from there.
Michell talking about people having traumas from their childhood. One
(42:41):
of the questions I love asking people is when you
were young. Do you have a happy memory that you
can recall for us when you were like seven or eight.
Was that a happy moment in your life, just a
one off memory that you might go, oh, yeah, I
remember that. It's a really good day.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
Always lots of happy memories. At one point, when I
was going through my awakening, I used to write about
my childhood. I think I was asked to write about
my childhood and I only outlined all the happy moments
and I shared it with someone and he said, to me,
(43:22):
this doesn't quite seem right, Michelle, because I'm only really
remembering the happy things. I'm like, oh, that's really interesting.
I'm like, there had to be some things that weren't,
and I'm sure I tried to not remember them if
they were. Yeah, but seven or eight, gosh, at seven
(43:44):
or eight, I was in Italy. I lived in Italy
for five years, in Sicily. My parents, both my parents
are from there. They were both born there, but my
father's family was there and one had died, and so
my grandfather was there. So we went out there to
straighten out things, and turned out from a year I
(44:06):
was there for five years, so I became very Italian
at age five, and I think a happy fun moment
is it's a really fun moment. So we used to
walk to school every day, me and my brothers two
years younger than me, and I was a little bit.
I like to tease people, especially my brother. I was
(44:28):
like incessantly like he was always like what would I say?
My brother could do nothing wrong. He was always very
loved and he got attention for no reason. I was
always like the oldest and the smartest, and the this
and the that. So here we got walking to get home,
(44:51):
and we would go around the corner and I would
yell for my mother to open the door, and she
would like hit the bell and the door would open
been for us to go home. And I still it
was so rotten at me. So I would say, mom
up on the border like and she would open the door,
(45:12):
click the door open, and I would run to the
door and I would shut the door on my Oh
but he loved you, Oh my gosh. I mean, I
think of it now and it makes me laugh. And
back then, my mother's like, why do you do that
to your brother. I'm like, I don't know. It's kind
of funny, man. So that's one of the things.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Yeah, oh cool, that's funny. I wonder what he would
make of that. Now, does he still remember it or
if you know I had that conversation.
Speaker 2 (45:41):
I'm sure he would say, well, mind you, he's a
laid back kind of guy. You would just say you
were just not very nice, just have like this humor,
like I would just laugh the funniest thing. But anyway,
that that is, he does hold it against me, glad.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Not that you know. If he does, you might secretly
you don't know. I suggest next time you talk to
him and just say, Jill told me. I need to
say sorry for that, apologize from your heart. You mean,
little girl.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
Well it's funny because you know, as a I really
this is going to sound kind of bad, but I
really think girls their brains. I think we could be
much more malicious boys. It's just like just this nice
little boy.
Speaker 1 (46:34):
Bless bless it attention all the time. Yeah, he was
a gold boy, and you were jealous.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I was, I was at that moment, right, But it's
it's just a it's a kid thing. It's a sibling thing.
It's a I don't know any siblings who didn't you know?
Let that I have three kids, and they all had
their own thing that did and I'm like, interesting.
Speaker 1 (47:03):
It is, isn't it how people operate at that time?
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (47:06):
And what people remember in the future. Yeah, that's for sure.
Speaker 2 (47:09):
How Yes, absolutely, three kids I came from we had,
we're three. Each of us remembers things completely our own way.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
Yes, yes, it's like the other people weren't even there
at the time, and it's like, don't you remember that? No,
it's not what I remember. And they've got a different
story of the same thing. Yeah, for sure. Interesting before
you go, I'm just looking at the time. Now you've
come into Collaboration Global. I can't even remember how we met.
But you know, God bless LinkedIn. It's done its job
(47:40):
and you're in the right community and we're having a
fabulous time with what you're teaching us.
Speaker 2 (47:45):
What was it about the.
Speaker 1 (47:46):
Idea of Collaboration Global that sparked your interests and what
made you joy?
Speaker 2 (47:52):
I believe Oh gosh, what was his name? There was
a man that I was networking with and he sent
over a bunch of different networks that he participates in,
and Grand Connection was one of them. And when I
went in, I always follow my feeling. I trust my feeling,
(48:14):
my feeling, and it was I actually came in late
because I had a client session before the meeting, and
that was a guest meeting that you were having, and
You're like, Michelle, they're all in their small circles, and
I'm like, all right, now I've had a big deal.
So I went to that, and then I went to
another one and I noticed you were doing the mental
(48:35):
health summit, and I'm like, they're not decisions. When I
need to do something, if I have to think about it,
it's actually a no. It's just an actual nope. We're
doing this, this and this, Like okay, I'm right there.
(48:55):
So it wasn't. I felt like the people in it,
we're thinking bigger and that's who I am for our
intents and purposes, and I minded to be affiliated with
that and support that mission.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
Yeah, thank you. That's really interesting that you're right. They
are up to something good and they are thinking in
a bigger way, and you've just given me a top
tip there is if you want to do it, it's
the feeling that makes the decision for you, so you
don't even have to choose. If it feels right, then
it's the thing to do. So we're so happy that
you're in the community. There are so many people that
(49:33):
you have yet to connect with that are going to
be loved you, enamored with what you're doing, and it's
going to support and help so many people, not only
in the community, but it's our job to make sure
more and more people know about you so that you
can help more and more people as time goes on.
So thank you so much for your time and your
insight and the way you look at the world and
(49:54):
the way empathy that's been part of you forever is
only now become part of your purpose in your mission,
and I can see it going in a great direction.
So Michelle, thank you so much. If somebody wanted to
contact you, what's the best way for them to get
hold of you?
Speaker 2 (50:09):
I would say email me Michelle at mpathevolution dot com.
You could also check out my website mpathevolution dot com
and you know, there's a quiz on there, there's a
subscriber button down there. There's all kinds of nice things
you can get involved with. I share a lot of
contact with my community, so they grow from that. But
(50:30):
I'm also looking to grow the message and to speak
different places and be interviewed.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
Yes, indeed, And obviously if you want to meet Michelle online,
she comes along to our Collaboration Global sessions as well.
So if you come along to a guest session and
you can find that at collaboration Global dot org, we'll
go to event write and search for Collaboration Global and
you can grab yourself the seat there and meet her there.
So it just leaves me to say, thank you so much, Job,
(50:55):
I had a thoroughly nice conversation. Cannot wait to do
it again very soon.
Speaker 2 (51:00):
Thank you, Michelle, You're welcome. Have a nice day, said
Hello, good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Wherever you are
in the world, My name is your Tiny and welcome
to the Being Human Hidden Depths podcast by Collaboration Global.
It's been a bit chilly here in the good old UK,
but I'm really excited to talk to somebody over the
other side of the pond who's probably used to much
(00:25):
worse weather than we are here here in England, and
one of our latest members at Collaboration Global. And I'm
excited for this podcast because I don't know a huge
amount about her and I want to find out more
about this amazing human being that has just entered our
lovely community. So welcome, Michelle. How lovely to have you
with us.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Thank you, Jill, It's great to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
Lovely now on your zoom picture and on your LinkedIn
and anywhere else we can find you your Michelle Jay Howe.
One thing I've never actually said is what's the JAY
stand for?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
You know, I've questioned why do I keep my J?
Why do I keep my J? I'm like, it's just
because people are like, if you're going to get introduced
or if you're speaking Michelle, how like, why are you
putting the J in there Michelle, who's going to stop
and say Michelle J. But I'm like, Josephine is my
middle name, and Josephine was came from my mother's side
(01:23):
of the family. It's on my father's side of the family.
I'm like, I am not getting rid of even when
I got married, I'm like, I am not getting rid
of my middle name because I love I love It's
just when I think of the world, it's an old name.
But when I think of it, I'm like, oh no, no,
it's me Michelle J. How And then I called my kids.
(01:45):
All my kids have Jay's for first name. I didn't
plan that, but they are. So I'm like, I must
have an affinity to J. There's something about the J
that is And I do numerology and I know it.
I know a lot about a lot of different topics,
and I know that your name there's a certain numerology
that goes with it. And when I you know what
(02:09):
you were born with, what you became, I'm like, nope,
I need my J in there. It's just me.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Yeah, no, I love it. And you know what, when
you go searching for you, you put the J in,
then you know you've got the right person. There's a
lot of Michelle Howe's out there.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
There is Michelle Howe.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Sounds like a beginning of a question.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Yeah, j how It's like, that's it.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
That's who she's now in a Josephine. What a lovely name.
Thank you, that's gorgeous, okay, Michel j. How You are
known for being the founder and creator of the EmPATH
evolution or evolution as we might say here in the UK.
Empathy is a big deal in my book. People go
(02:55):
around call themselves an EmPATH and I didn't know what
that meant. But I have lived my life feeling other
people's pain. However it manifests, and for me that means
if I see somebody in pain, it makes my knees
go funny. I really just oh, it's just I feel
that I can't watch any movies or anything when people
(03:16):
are in pain because I know it's pretend, but it
still gets me. So I just I don't watch it.
I don't want that angst and that upset inside. Where
did your journey of being an EmPATH or being empathetic
or understanding the power then? Where did that come from?
Speaker 2 (03:36):
That's a great question, My god, that's a really good question.
I ask you this little question, where did it begin? Well, okay,
EmPATH being empathic? I you know, people get bogged down
with both of them. There is a difference between those
two concepts and ideas. But for the most part, I
(04:00):
don't like to divide up, spit out these concepts. You
belong in the club, you don't belong in the club.
But so you know, being I've so to me, being
empathic is about sensing and feeling and looking at people,
(04:21):
not so much surface level, but really noticing things that
are more that are there. And although everybody can sense
and feel, we all sense and feel a bit differently
than we all see things a little bit differently, which
(04:42):
isn't necessarily about being an EmPATH or not, but it's
how do I manage through life? How do I relate
to life? And there's so many different like tools out
there at Myers Briggs, you know the this system that
it tells you about your personality, how you function, right,
and empathy is one of the characteristics character traits empathy, right,
(05:05):
is it a leadership skill? Is it not a leadership skill? Well,
to me, being an umpath as a way of being
in the world, it's really when I discovered I was
an umpath, which did not happen till age forty.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
A couple of years ago.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I didn't know there was a word. I've always functioned
as an unpath, but I didn't know that was a thing.
I didn't know that it was different. I didn't know.
I didn't know until I really was struggling, and I
really went looking for some answer to something. Why am
(05:41):
I struggling so much? Why did I feel so much?
Why am I going through this massive I went through
like a dark knight of the soul, massive spiritual awakening.
And I didn't I hadn't recognized it. I didn't know
such a thing existed. But when I found thirty traits
(06:01):
of an EmPATH, I'm like, oh shit, I'm like, I
have I have most of these traits, or I've had them,
or I relate with them and my knowing. Because an
person who is an EmPATH, or because they have a
strong intuitive hit, they know things that others do not
(06:23):
read or notice or appreciate. You know, the energy goes
up in the room, the energy goes down in a room.
Someone's upset like I would. I was involved in different
women's organizations and once I'd go to these meetings immediately beehive.
This person needs me. Yeah, I don't know why they
(06:46):
need me, but my attention goes to her immediately. My
husband would say to me before we knew any of this,
there is something absolutely wrong with you, Michelle. I know
to all these events. Why do you go to events
and strangers people you don't even know? They tell you
their stories. They don't tell you a little story. They
(07:06):
tell you the deepest, darkest story of their life.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Nice. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
And he would look at me and I'd be like, well,
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
I'm like, doesn't that happen to you, darling?
Speaker 2 (07:19):
And he's like, no, no, my husband and bind you.
I think my husband's quite sensitive and respectful of people
and leans in, but he has such a logical side
to him. People don't. He doesn't want to hear what
their stories are. He doesn't ask them what they are Like.
(07:39):
I have a very open stance. So if you ask
me who an mpath is, and that path is a
person that has the capacity to feel and sense. They're
very open people. They can uplift, they can transmute negativity.
They're the person you call on the phone when you
don't feel good and they helped lift you up.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, and we all need one of those, don't we.
Even an impath needs somebody they can go to that's
like that.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Oh absolutely, And I can tell you. I mean I
didn't know the word mpath, but I you know, when
I ran into different challenges in my life, I would
get on the phone, you know, only once. Yeah, oh
my god, I'm never calling her again because she did
(08:30):
not uplift. She didn't have the capacity helped me, hold
me shift transmute. She didn't have it. Some people have
it in spades, some people. I felt worse when I
got off the phone, right, So everybody needs a friend
who is an EmPATH. Yeah, there are a lot of
(08:52):
empaths in the world that do not realize they're empathic.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
I didn't know for forty years. I just knew things.
And I was like in high school, I'd come home
and eat. I had to eat to feel better. I
didn't know why I had to eat. Oh, but I'm like,
I just do not feel good. I'm like, something is wrong.
So I'm eating, and Okay, I feel better now.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I didn't want to go certain places. I didn't know
why I didn't want to go certain places. Nope. I
might have had plans, but nope, that's not happening. I
don't feel it. It's not happening. I'm stubborn enough that
I actually listen. Some people don't listen to their intuition
and override it, right, But I listened. And then again,
(09:43):
all my friends would I would be friends with the
people who needed help, and I didn't mind it. But
you know, at the end of the day, like my
brother's like, what's going on with all your friends, Michelle,
Like they are the people that needed me and I'm
their friend. So a lot of mpaths do struggle.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
You know.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
I would have to write at night. I figured out
that journaling and writing helped me feel better. Yeah, just
to kind of clear myself. I after the fact, I'm like,
oh my god. When I was young, every New Year's Eve,
I was a basket case of wow. And I'm like, why, Like, oh,
(10:29):
the emotional energies on the planet are really high. Yeah
that night, right, And I'm open enough or fluid enough
that I'm tapping into what's going on around me and
it's not necessarily my pain or my feelings. But these
are some of the skills that when you really are
(10:51):
an mpath you need to learn some of there are a
lot of them are energetic. They're just teaching you how
to use your senses news information in ways that are
more positive to you because you really do function differently
than other people.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
It's interesting. It's interesting, isn't it, because you can look
at the world that we're in now is much more
open about how our brains work and how our mental
health is, and the universe and the energy that's out
into the world and the fact that we are all
energy energetic beings. And of course there are people that
(11:32):
there's these labels that we would love to give people
don't really all these little labels. And on the autistic spectrum,
you can see how, and having been a teacher many
years ago and worked with young children, mostly the boys,
is that when a child is on that autistic spectrum,
it's very hard for them to connect with you because
they don't like the eye contact, they don't like any
(11:53):
touch of any sort, and there's no kind of empathy
from them. It's like that it doesn't exist. They can
lash out at another child and have no recourse. Is
that if they've hurt another child or there's no remorse
shown because they just can't see it. And if you imagine,
as I believe, that we're all kind of on a
(12:14):
level of a spectrum. EmPATH is kind of at one end,
and maybe autism is at the other end. I don't know.
This is not scientific, folks, This is just me thinking
out loud. And it's interesting how the people at one
end can actually connect up and help the people at
the other end, and obviously all those in the middle
as well. And it's not aren't they lovely, aren't they clever?
(12:39):
They're an EmPATH. It's just that's the way the gift
that you've been given. And we've all got different gifts,
and sometimes an autistic person has got amazing gifts and
they call it their superpower because of how they see
the world and how they operate and how they can
look at you know, technology or other things in a
way that an EmPATH would be like totally lost. It's
(13:00):
the gift that we're given throughout the world. So if
you waited until your fault is until you kind of
suss worked out, did the research and found out that
you were an impact, did that have an impact on
your life or did you just go okay, That's that's
why I cry on music. Was it kind of like
a revolutionary you know, now I get who I am?
(13:23):
Or was it something that like, oh, now what am
I going to do with this?
Speaker 2 (13:28):
It lit me up. It lit me up because I
am a curious person to begin with. Yeah, and I'm like, oh,
my dear lord, what does this mean for me? What
does this mean for my you know? What is this about?
I mean I had one woman say you have so
much healing potential, so much light. Stop hiding your light
(13:49):
behind the bushop? And I'm like, what are you talking about?
Like are you talking about? But it lit me up,
and it threw me into this stage of my development
where a lot of things became about spiritual knowledge, A
lot of things became about energy and healing and depth
and who am I? Like, I really went and I
(14:13):
kind of secluded or separated or stepped back from. I
was very much about family and my kids and this
game and that game and work. All of a sudden,
my interests kind of shifted. I shifted, and my husband's like,
what's going on with you? I'm like, I'm sorry, you
(14:33):
married a CPA accountant, But guess what I care more about?
Who people are than their businesses, who they are, where
they're going, what they're becoming, and that's my role in
the world, and that's what I'm here to do. So
deal with it.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
So you saw it was like fates complays like now
I know this, then I have to go down that road.
It wasn't like I'll hold this to myself and keep
it to myself and not well, there anybody with it.
It was like it's going to come out.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Well. I felt I'm passed through this. The responsibility and
the obligation and the passion behind what it was that
I went through, and how I see a lot of
people struggling in the world and a lot of people
unbeknownst to them what the struggle is about. Truly, I
(15:29):
felt like I could be a huge asset and helping
them uncover beneath. You know, there's a lot of theories
and personality assessments and blah blah blah. People are teaching
and telling me how to behave, But innately, there's a
huge knowing and a huge feeling component to life that
can guide you in the direction that you need to
(15:53):
go to to be more in line with your spiritual purpose,
your actual authentic self, not because you're trying to fit
into some box, because you're not in the box. You're
outside the box. It's my books, there is no So
that was like the passion behind Path Evolution. It's just
(16:16):
you know, seeing it and then creating it. Creating is
a lot harder than seeing it. Creating it is a
little bit more methodical because you there's all these things
progress very slow when you're trying to really try to
dot your eyes, cross your t's and do this and
do that. But on a spiritual level, the things I know,
(16:39):
spiritually energetically we are so powerful and there's so much
that happens when we come together. And I'm like, you know,
the brand of EmPATH Evolution, the brand of Michelle, Like,
I want to help at the higher level bring the
people who are ready to hear this message forward.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
More so, you've obviously got a message to share when
you first started out and you're sort of sitting on
your own going I think, I'm going to start a business,
and I think it's going to be about this, and
I think, and I'm going to get my brand and
this is going to and this is how it's going
to work. Were you in a community relationships with people
(17:23):
whereby you could announce this and they go whoo. Or
were you in a space where people go, Okay, that
sounds a bit woo woo. Were they kind of were
they in that place or did you feel nervous coming
out with this idea that you know in the business world,
some people might go okay, bit of a crack part. Maybe,
(17:44):
I don't know. I mean, in my world we'd be
all like, whoa brilliant rock on. But there are some
places where you go like, Okay, can you go and
talk to those people over there, because this is the
business lot over here. And I've been in those rooms
as well when I've been looked at as a crackpot
too when you first came out, as it were.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
So when I first started. So I'm a little bit
of a shape shifter, like I change how I present
things depending on who I'm in front of, right, so
in order for them to get the message of what
I'm saying, I changed. And sometimes this hasn't really always
felt like this is not such a great quality, But
(18:25):
then other times I'm like, oh, it needed that in
order for it to land where it needed to land.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
How can I hear it if they're not here, if
it's not being delivered in the language to understand.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
When I when I first started an unpath evolution, I
can remember being very open and frank with some of
the women that I thought could hear it, and even
they could not hear it. Wow, they could not appreciate it.
So it didn't land. It didn't have anything to until
somebody goes through an awakening experience, until they decide that
(18:57):
there's something that they're missing. They don't. Yeah, that's kind
of cute, that's kind of interesting, that's yeah, that's yeah,
But it doesn't stick to anything. It doesn't have any
relevance to them until they are ready to really hear more. So,
I would say in the very beginning, it's not that
(19:20):
I was shy about saying it. I just was looking
for the way that they could hear me, and for
the most part, they really couldn't. So I kept a
lot of things to myself and even my husband he
could not wrap his head around what I was doing. Wow,
(19:44):
And he was I want to say almost I don't
want to say embarrassed, but he couldn't put words to it.
And it didn't really become more acceptable until the last
maybe five years. Like I've had to like coax him
and give him, you know, talk on his terms. He
(20:06):
could hear me yet, because I really would like you
to stop using the word energy. It's just so weird, Michelle.
It's just like, oh my god. Because you cannot bring
that word into the corporate they will listen to you.
And I'm like, things have really turned around a lot,
(20:26):
and you know, it's taken those individual people at those levels.
You know, yes, you're not going to be appreciated, you
can't really talk your language. But what I found is
you don't have to talk your language. You just have
to be what that is and you do what you do.
You don't have to They don't have to accept you.
(20:47):
They don't have to understand. You have to understand yourself.
Of course, it's nice to be around people that you
can talk frankly with and they can you can relate with,
and you're there to support one another relating well. But
in most environments people understand or can like you meet
(21:07):
them where they are, yeah, and you can help them,
but they can't. You can't help them if your language,
if they can't relate to you, you cannot. They can't
absorb it unless they can. So you just be so
being an up, you be all of who you are,
and that in a sense does ninety percent of the work. Yeah,
(21:31):
which is sub level to their consciousness. They're being shifted there.
You're you're doing your work just by being who you are.
And then if they want to know more, if you
can add a phraser two or some advice more, that's,
you know, the cherry on the top.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
It's a bit like when people go through, as an example,
a grief. If you've going through a bereavement, somebody can
tell you what it's going to be like, but you
won't understand it until you've gone through it for yourself.
And then you can, having gone through that experience, you
can you know the highs and the lows and everything
(22:13):
in between, but you still can't explain it effectively to
somebody else because they have to go through it. And
I think that's what you're saying, is when somebody is
there holding your hand through the understanding and the learning
of getting your head around how being an EmPATH is
a powerful thing. It's a bit like Brene Brown with
her shame and guilt and all the things that she
(22:39):
talks about and vulnerability and the courage to be vulnerable
until somebody kind of guide you in that way that
you think you block it off and you or you
don't know about it so you don't explore it. You
just go, oh, no, I'm not an EmPATH, or oh
it's not for me. Oh it's that energy talk I'm not. Yeah, yeah,
I get it. I get it. So when you're kind
(23:01):
of pushing it away, you're not allowing yourself to get it.
And until someone can sit by your side and be
with you, as I say, through a bereavement, then you
get what it feels like and it's okay, and it's
okay to feel those fields, and then you move through
into another space. It's the same as personal development. You
can read all the books in the world to say,
(23:22):
you know, when you understand your limiting beliefs and when
you understand the mindset of this A, B or c.
And you don't, you can go not and intellectually you
get it. But emotionally, spiritually, energetically, yeah, not at all
until you've walked into that space and explored with another
(23:43):
human being that can take you by the hand, not
literally necessarily, but sometimes and walk you through it. I
went through a learning space around a relationship I had
when I was a child. I was bullied as a child,
And it wasn't until I went through a physicality process
(24:05):
or forgiving myself and forgiving this other person, that I
was able to let it go, let it go. But
I knew logically about it, and I'm like, yeah, yeah,
I'm done. It's good, it's fine, it's over. But it
wasn't till I went through the physical process that took
about a two hour process, which actually then happened again
six months later, and it happened again six months later
(24:25):
for it to kind of the layers of an onion
to be peeled away, so you can go, I haven't
it ago I have.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
It's very very it's very humbling to be in the
zone and aware that there is some spiritual emotional healing
underway and that you are You're just you're growing, you're shifting,
you're changing. You've accepted it. But it's not like, oh, yeah,
(24:55):
check done, you know, but you know on some level,
we're you're ready. You were ready to look at it.
Like Some people do not care to self reflect, do
not care to forgive. They like holding on to a
certain ident it's not their time, yes, yeah, not for them.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
So yeah, it's hard, isn't it. So Obviously you've had
various clients and you've helped them through various elements of
their life with no names now pactrial. Have you got
any stories of anything beautiful that you.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Have some beautiful stories? Yeah, well, I would we remiss
if I didn't talk about George. George is a huge
client of mine. He's still we're still connected, very connected.
George had gone through horror, horrible, well, challenging, let's put
(25:55):
challenging traumatic childhood, and he had survived lots of things,
and he had become always very empathic, always very sensitive.
But people feared to George because if you got in
the way of his family, George had no fear other
than his own father. I have no fear George's. The
(26:18):
emotions that George experience were pretty intense when he experienced them,
and he, you know, he had to like build certain
walls to survive certain things that happen to him. And
the good news is he got through cancer when he
was twenty five, he got through divorce, he got through
(26:40):
his grandmother dying really in a poor in a really
bad way. And then his wife, the love of his life.
He loved, he loved, he loved, and thankfully he found
his soulmate. He married her and she died in the
middle of the nights.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
So you wake up to that. He was fifty seven
years old. Make it up to that one morning and
it's completely you know, what do you do when the
love of your life dies? You? You know, you cry?
You are you cry? He was a puddle of tears
and whatnot. Now he was on my list as a
(27:22):
subscriber and he was getting information, but at one point
I'm like, I need to know from all you people
where you're from, you know, and you know, if you
ever want to talk to me, here's my link. And
this was probably three or four months after his wife
had passed away. Reached out to me and we got
on the phone and immediately he's not a guy that
(27:45):
would he can spop bullshit a mile away like he
just he's the kind of guy nobody would ever say
was sensitive because he was a man's man, let's put
it that way. Yeah, Michelle, I'm very lucky and I
am not in jail because with the things that where
I was around and the intensity of emotions around some
(28:07):
of these things. I'm lucky that it didn't go that far.
I had someone watching my back. So we started working together,
and at one point I said to him, I think
he goes, I think you're kind of nuts. He goes,
I go, you are a heat like his hands were
heating up. He just I was working on him energetically,
(28:30):
and then there's some teachings. I like to bring people
through storylines and shifting things. It's all energy work. I'm
working behind the scenes, dissipating the charges, clearing the storylines,
just helping you come back together. And he goes, I
don't know what's happening, but I'm starting to believe you.
(28:56):
He goes, and he goes, and I don't believe most people,
but he knew immediately. It's almost like I was giving
him oxygen to breathe. He was finally making sense of
who he was, and he could connect with spirit, connect
with his wife, he could connect with his ancestors. His
hands are active and moving. He's like, I'm like, while
(29:19):
George like, George's like completely shifted and found a new
purpose in his life. Yes, I mean the answer for
I mean his is probably the highest version of a
role probably that I've had to date is to be
there and beside him and watch this unfold for him.
(29:43):
So that's George. Some other people again, I think natural empaths.
But you know, your childhood has so much to do,
and you can hold on to some things and their
fears that hold you back as an adult. Ali really
(30:09):
didn't know about being married, getting married, Like, she had
so much hesitations about this topic, and she had so
much residue, like toxic grief and shame and like just
things from her family carried forward that. I did some
work on her energetically. Before you know it, she's lost
(30:32):
a ton of weight, she's getting engaged, she's married, she's
doing plays like the things that were holding her back,
and she's learned how to manage her mind, her beliefs,
her fears in a way that support her making like
(30:52):
and she was ready and pathic, she was already feeling
and sensing. But it was putting that in perspective with
living in or light. Yeah right, you don't. So it's
all energetic. I guess that's my biggest thing.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Yea, which is I mean, whether you believe it or not,
it's a bit I've used this example a lot. You know,
when you plug in the plug to light your lamp
and you flick the switch, you expect the electricity to
come on, because that's what happens. But in our world,
we don't think about the energy that we're emanating or receiving.
And people go, oh, I don't really understand how it
(31:31):
all works. Well, I don't understand really. I mean, I
know the basics of electricity getting from me to be,
but it's still quite a miracle when that light goes on.
But we just take it for granted. It's the dune thing.
If we were brought up with this understanding of empathy
and understanding of the energy that flows, where you can
walk in the room and you can just feel it.
You can you can taste it, you can touch it
(31:52):
when it's you know, a serious energy or a joyful energy.
When somebody's just sitting there but they're just so happy inside,
you can just off of them. It's this literally, you
can feel the buzz. If we were all taught about
that and it was as natural as turning on a
light bulb, and the world, you can imagine, would be
(32:12):
a different place because people wouldn't be quite so quick.
I don't think to criticize because they would understand the
impact they have from a look, from a glance, or
a word that they said that actually hit the wrong nerve.
And then when we understand ourselves better, we understand how
to unpack the stuff that's happened to us in our past,
(32:32):
but also historically generationally, the impacts from our parents' lives
and our grandparents' lives and our ancestors lives. It depends
how far you want to go back. I've only recently
discovered that my grandmother had a huge impact in how
I behaved as a child and as an adult, because
that was the history, the family story that we've been
(32:58):
brought through the ages. Because what she'd lived through, the trauma,
the massive trauma that she had lived through, we were
still i wan't say suffering from because it stood me
in good stage to be honest with you, it got me.
There was resilience. I was resilient because she had been
resilient going through her trauma. But at the same time,
all the other stuff stopped me from being who I
(33:20):
was and finding out who I was. So what you're
doing what I absolutely love about this, Michelle, is that
you are normalizing what is a normal thing for most people,
where most people want to just use logic and stick
to this one road that they know. And it's A
plus B equal C two plus two equals four. And
you're going, well, maybe it doesn't because if we open
(33:44):
this door and there's all this other stuff going on,
it's a whole new world that most people don't even
dare to take a step into that room to see
what's going on there. And actually, and again, I use
this example lot. When you buy a washing machine, bear
with all right, there's a message. When you buy a
washing machine, generally you want to get the fancy one
(34:06):
that does all singing, all dancing, makes you a cup
of tea, and does everything else. But in reality, you
use that program, and you use that program one for
you white.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
It's a one for your colors, but.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
It does so much more. You can have it. You
can set it for this, and you can schedule it
for that, and it can do these colors, and it
can do woolens and it can do everything else. But no,
it's all right, I'll use that one, and I'll use
that one. That's what we're like in our bodies. We're
only using like twenty percent of what's possible, and you
are opening that door to the eighty percent that we
don't ever ever utilize and consider. So I think what
(34:40):
you're doing is a powerful thing. And having these stories
of how these strong men have kind of come into realization.
Ah huh because of you, I'm now a different person,
and it can be a good different person. You're not
going to be going backwards. It can only be moving
you forwards.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
He's mooing. No, he's absolutely, he said, we we just
met the other day. We're talking about he was born
with a lot of rage in him. His father had
the rage, his grandfather had the rage. Interesting, and what
do you do when you don't even know where it's
coming from. It's just there, So you're you know, someone
just flicked the light on and it's there again. Like
(35:20):
so we had to work with that anger rage quite
a bit, and it's it's morphed throughout the time. But
it could do it could burn things down really along
the way. It did burn things down. It's just a
matter of just thinking a little bit bigger than just
(35:40):
this present moment and being real with yourself. I mean,
one guy I talked to last week he's old. He's old.
He's not old, he's probably in his early sixties. But
he's a former. That warrior calls himself very spiritual now
eighty eight, Like he's educated himself about so many things,
(36:02):
but he always had the empathy there. He just didn't know.
And here are these he goes, Wow, he goes, So,
you know, someone going from going from surviving When you're
just surviving, you're just basically doing what you need to
do to get by, to all of a sudden you
(36:22):
have the bandwidth to really take a closer look and
focus and thrive and enjoy instead of you know, push push, push,
push push, like because that's you know, nonsensical in a
sense that you're just going about your life and before
you know it, it's done. Like you're empty, there's nothing there,
(36:46):
there's nothing revitalizing you. And like George had walls built
all around him to protect him, but those walls, as
much as they're protection, they can also keep away. Well
it's feeding you or good feed you. So it's him
finding a safe enough space where he allowed that to happen.
(37:08):
And like what I have seen too is and George
has worked with this, which is so cool it's so
cool when you hear about where he's able to connect
and what he's able to do spiritually, which helps people
on a very concrete level live their lives. Because when
you feel like there's missing parts of you, they are
(37:30):
shut off. Is they're missing, they're not there, there's empty
spots in you because along the way, you've had trauma
that's been left to just sit there or left alone.
The emotions weren't processed, the scenario wasn't validated. There's shame
around it. It's like, and you know, people become suicidal,
(37:54):
people become depressed, Like you've allowed your light, You've allowed
the outside to suppress so much of who you are
that you don't even recognize who you are anymore. Life
is not really an enjoyable scene unless you're feeling those
endorphins that make you happy about yourself, your life, your light,
(38:18):
like you need the light on, yeah off work for
very long or very well for you. So like we're helping,
we're helping one person that we know, he's a young kid.
He's going through really tough time, but it's from trauma
(38:38):
from when he was young and those hidden small parts
of him, that young six year old child needs a
little help. So spiritually speaking, you're working on that to
help integrate it back in to who he is. Like,
it takes a lot of courage to go back and
(38:59):
to look hm to be with that.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
So and the thing is if if you don't go
back and look, and you leave it there and you
lock it in the box and go that's fine. I
can ignore it. That's okay. It's still there and it's
still kind of festering away. And that festering not only
does it block away because you're making these decisions, this
cutting off decision, you're also cutting off other emotions in
(39:24):
your body because you're not dealing with the emotions because
they're too scary. And I get that is really scary, right,
You're cutting off joy.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
It's it's.
Speaker 1 (39:34):
Out. And then what happens to that festering It turns
in on you and then before you know it, you're ill.
You've got this disease. You've got that disease. And I'm
saying going on and it just perpetuates.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
The snowball effect, the snowball effact. We actually had a
scenario in our house. It's forced me out of my
office and into our bedroom here. So I've got that
the digital background going. But you know, it doesn't take
much when you look at like dreams and symbolism houses,
(40:09):
first floor, second floor, basement, subconsciousness, the basement with the
first floor. Your higher self is the second floor of
the attic. Right, So you're we found water damage, water,
some mold going on in our basement. I'm like looking,
I'm like, my office is in the basement. I'm like, hm,
(40:36):
you leave it, y'all it takes is a little damage.
You don't fix it up. Next thing, you know, you've
got a bigger problem. And you don't even notice the
problem there until it shows itself. Forget me, you didn't
remember five years ago you didn't leave the humidifier on
for four months, and the humidifier and this is what happens.
And I'm like, and it grows. It almost like it
(40:58):
that that top it It can grow to infect other
things because there's no air circulation. Like this is all
symbolism for me. I was like. My husband looked at me,
he goes, okay, you've got me, Michelle. We're getting rid
of things in the baby Lord like, let's just ship
(41:19):
this stuff out, things up as much as possible, so
that and you keep your eye on it. Like I
called around my friend who's a realtor. I'm like, what
to write? She goes, it's the basement. There is things
that can accumulate there, like there is water that can
come in. You have to keep your eye on it,
(41:41):
like you just have to do your due diligence. And
it's like your vessel, your your your body, like it's
serving you physically, right, but there's a whole mental, emotional,
spiritual like how are you feeling like and trying to
balance out the you know, the anxiety either turmoil, distress,
(42:02):
all these other things we're expecting or thinking that our
bodies are capable of handling. Well, maybe you are, but
what's happening ten years from now that you didn't, Like,
how do you make sure this vessel is running like habnatch,
it's running?
Speaker 1 (42:19):
Yeah? And also if the vessel is running a high capacity,
you've got space for other people to support them, haven't you. Yes,
when you've looked after yourself and it's your turn to
look after somebody else and take it on from there.
Michell talking about people having traumas from their childhood. One
(42:41):
of the questions I love asking people is when you
were young. Do you have a happy memory that you
can recall for us when you were like seven or eight.
Was that a happy moment in your life, just a
one off memory that you might go, oh, yeah, I
remember that. It's a really good day.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
Always lots of happy memories. At one point, when I
was going through my awakening, I used to write about
my childhood. I think I was asked to write about
my childhood and I only outlined all the happy moments
and I shared it with someone and he said, to me,
(43:22):
this doesn't quite seem right, Michelle, because I'm only really
remembering the happy things. I'm like, oh, that's really interesting.
I'm like, there had to be some things that weren't,
and I'm sure I tried to not remember them if
they were. Yeah, but seven or eight, gosh, at seven
(43:44):
or eight, I was in Italy. I lived in Italy
for five years, in Sicily. My parents, both my parents
are from there. They were both born there, but my
father's family was there and one had died, and so
my grandfather was there. So we went out there to
straighten out things, and turned out from a year I
(44:06):
was there for five years, so I became very Italian
at age five, and I think a happy fun moment
is it's a really fun moment. So we used to
walk to school every day, me and my brothers two
years younger than me, and I was a little bit.
I like to tease people, especially my brother. I was
(44:28):
like incessantly like he was always like what would I say?
My brother could do nothing wrong. He was always very
loved and he got attention for no reason. I was
always like the oldest and the smartest, and the this
and the that. So here we got walking to get home,
(44:51):
and we would go around the corner and I would
yell for my mother to open the door, and she
would like hit the bell and the door would open
been for us to go home. And I still it
was so rotten at me. So I would say, mom
up on the border like and she would open the door,
(45:12):
click the door open, and I would run to the
door and I would shut the door on my Oh
but he loved you, Oh my gosh. I mean, I
think of it now and it makes me laugh. And
back then, my mother's like, why do you do that
to your brother. I'm like, I don't know. It's kind
of funny, man. So that's one of the things.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Yeah, oh cool, that's funny. I wonder what he would
make of that. Now, does he still remember it or
if you know I had that conversation.
Speaker 2 (45:41):
I'm sure he would say, well, mind you, he's a
laid back kind of guy. You would just say you
were just not very nice, just have like this humor,
like I would just laugh the funniest thing. But anyway,
that that is, he does hold it against me, glad.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Not that you know. If he does, you might secretly
you don't know. I suggest next time you talk to
him and just say, Jill told me. I need to
say sorry for that, apologize from your heart. You mean,
little girl.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
Well it's funny because you know, as a I really
this is going to sound kind of bad, but I
really think girls their brains. I think we could be
much more malicious boys. It's just like just this nice
little boy.
Speaker 1 (46:34):
Bless bless it attention all the time. Yeah, he was
a gold boy, and you were jealous.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I was, I was at that moment, right, But it's
it's just a it's a kid thing. It's a sibling thing.
It's a I don't know any siblings who didn't you know?
Let that I have three kids, and they all had
their own thing that did and I'm like, interesting.
Speaker 1 (47:03):
It is, isn't it how people operate at that time?
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (47:06):
And what people remember in the future. Yeah, that's for sure.
Speaker 2 (47:09):
How Yes, absolutely, three kids I came from we had,
we're three. Each of us remembers things completely our own way.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
Yes, yes, it's like the other people weren't even there
at the time, and it's like, don't you remember that? No,
it's not what I remember. And they've got a different
story of the same thing. Yeah, for sure. Interesting before
you go, I'm just looking at the time. Now you've
come into Collaboration Global. I can't even remember how we met.
But you know, God bless LinkedIn. It's done its job
(47:40):
and you're in the right community and we're having a
fabulous time with what you're teaching us.
Speaker 2 (47:45):
What was it about the.
Speaker 1 (47:46):
Idea of Collaboration Global that sparked your interests and what
made you joy?
Speaker 2 (47:52):
I believe Oh gosh, what was his name? There was
a man that I was networking with and he sent
over a bunch of different networks that he participates in,
and Grand Connection was one of them. And when I
went in, I always follow my feeling. I trust my feeling,
(48:14):
my feeling, and it was I actually came in late
because I had a client session before the meeting, and
that was a guest meeting that you were having, and
You're like, Michelle, they're all in their small circles, and
I'm like, all right, now I've had a big deal.
So I went to that, and then I went to
another one and I noticed you were doing the mental
(48:35):
health summit, and I'm like, they're not decisions. When I
need to do something, if I have to think about it,
it's actually a no. It's just an actual nope. We're
doing this, this and this, Like okay, I'm right there.
(48:55):
So it wasn't. I felt like the people in it,
we're thinking bigger and that's who I am for our
intents and purposes, and I minded to be affiliated with
that and support that mission.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
Yeah, thank you. That's really interesting that you're right. They
are up to something good and they are thinking in
a bigger way, and you've just given me a top
tip there is if you want to do it, it's
the feeling that makes the decision for you, so you
don't even have to choose. If it feels right, then
it's the thing to do. So we're so happy that
you're in the community. There are so many people that
(49:33):
you have yet to connect with that are going to
be loved you, enamored with what you're doing, and it's
going to support and help so many people, not only
in the community, but it's our job to make sure
more and more people know about you so that you
can help more and more people as time goes on.
So thank you so much for your time and your
insight and the way you look at the world and
(49:54):
the way empathy that's been part of you forever is
only now become part of your purpose in your mission,
and I can see it going in a great direction.
So Michelle, thank you so much. If somebody wanted to
contact you, what's the best way for them to get
hold of you?
Speaker 2 (50:09):
I would say email me Michelle at mpathevolution dot com.
You could also check out my website mpathevolution dot com
and you know, there's a quiz on there, there's a
subscriber button down there. There's all kinds of nice things
you can get involved with. I share a lot of
contact with my community, so they grow from that. But
(50:30):
I'm also looking to grow the message and to speak
different places and be interviewed.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
Yes, indeed, And obviously if you want to meet Michelle online,
she comes along to our Collaboration Global sessions as well.
So if you come along to a guest session and
you can find that at collaboration Global dot org, we'll
go to event write and search for Collaboration Global and
you can grab yourself the seat there and meet her there.
So it just leaves me to say, thank you so much, Job,
(50:55):
I had a thoroughly nice conversation. Cannot wait to do
it again very soon.
Speaker 2 (51:00):
Thank you, Michelle, You're welcome. Have a nice day, said
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