June 8, 2023 • 40 mins
The need for Mental Health services are on the rise after two years of COVID regulations, mandates, and isolation.As more employees are leaving their jobs in search of better opportunities, employers need to do all that they can to retain and attract new talent.On this month’s Benefits in Brief podcast, we have John Troutman from Mazzitti & Sullivan EAP (mseap) discussing with us why proving Mental Health services or Employee Assistance Programs is important, affordable, and essential to employee engagement and loyalty.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
So let's do this. I willintroduce mister John Trautman, which we're so
excited to have him on our monthlyBenefits and Brief podcast through the Sacramental Office
of the Allerric Group. I amJeff Turner, the managing partner or that
office. I've been in the healthinsurance industry. We're way longer than I
(00:20):
can count. I was at anetworking event last night and somebody asked me
how many years I've been in thebusiness. I said, you know what,
It's been a really long time.But I've seen it all. I
haven't done it all yet. Alot of great stuff that's happening on our
industry that is really changing the game, if you will, and we're super
excited about a lot of the highlevel strategies and like minded people quite frankly
(00:45):
that John and I rubbed shoulders withthat are really really honestly trying to make
a difference and impact healthcare as weknow it and what we've struggled with as
employers and employees. So we makehealthcare simple and more affordable is the best
way to put it. So withthat, I'm gonna go ahead and introduce
mister John Troutman and him and Imet each other about a year ago through
(01:07):
a mutual friend on LinkedIn. LinkedIn'sawesome connected with some really incredible people on
LinkedIn. It's been a great resourcefor me to be able to connect with
people like John. So, John, if you don't mind, I'm just
going to read your bio. Idon't have a memorized If you don't mind,
that's fine. So. John Troutmanis the national director of Marketing and
(01:30):
Business Development of Mazzetti and Sullivan EAPServices. For those of you who don't
know what EPAP staff boards Employee Assistanceprogram If I got that right, John,
Yes, sir, Yeah, we'regonna talk a little bit about that.
They are a subsidy of Pyramid Healthcare, the fourth largest behavioral health provider
in the United States. That's significant. In addition to business development, he's
(01:53):
a keynote speaker, a corporate consultant, a personal work life coach, the
benefit advisors like off across the country, and he has been with Mazzetti and
Sullivan EAP for over seven years,so that's pretty significant too. Prior to
joining the Massetti and Sullivan EAP team, John has over twenty years of experience
in public speaking and independently increasing brandawareness working with companies like on Fire Network,
(02:17):
Magic Marketing, Royal Buono coffee thatsounds fun, inspirational films, and
I didn't know that one John,we might have to talk about that South
Today's international realty. And he's spokento group's ranging from five to five thousand,
so he's comfortable in front of anaudience and has addressed leadership teams on
(02:37):
several continents, focusing on workplace strategiesthat reduce stress and increase employee engagement.
He's a survivor of burnout, whichwe're going to talk a little bit about
today, and brings the lessons learnto walk corporate leaders through strategies to address
employee needs while controlling the safety andfinancial impact of health issues. So that's
(02:58):
a great resume on to start with. Right out the gate. Um,
you're I think you've you've kind ofseen it all. Um, I'm still
yeah, thank you, I'm stillwaiting to meet that person in that bio.
So thank you for those kind ofwords. All right, well,
fair enough. I think it's agood representation of who you are and what
(03:21):
you're all about. And we're gonnawe're going to dive into kind of what
you're doing now and what you're seeingin the marketplace. UM. I'm super
excited to have you on today.UM. You know, you and I
connected last year, like I said, and on a business level, it
made sense for us to continue totalk, you know, what you guys
were doing and offering to employers andtheir employees. But on a personal level,
(03:42):
I really connected with you as well, and I've really wanted to,
you know, make sure that peopleget to hear you and your voice and
what you're doing and to make adifference in our world right now, which
you know, we need leaders andpeople that have the knowledge that you do
that you're bringing the table. Aswe know. You know the last two
years through the pandemic, mental healthis is I don't become I don't.
(04:05):
I'm not going to call it abuzzword, but it's it's it's relevant,
it's it's real. People are strugglingwith it. UM. I heard yesterday
a different terminology for it. Youknow, Rachel truck and Miller. I
was on one of her podcasts yesterday. She's really good, UM, and
they talked about burnout as being crispyused that terminology to crispy. Is it
(04:31):
crispy? And I thought, well, that's kind of interesting, that's a
good good way to describe it,but you know, not making lighted of
it. But I have never Ican't remember, um, in all the
years i've I've been on this earth, which is quite a few, I
think I can remember the word anxietybeing used so much, you know,
(04:57):
being described, being talked about,and you know, probably last five years
maybe then all the way my yearscombined. It's all of a sudden,
I hear that word a lot,anxiety in stress, and so I kind
of wanted to start with that,John and ask you kind of where that
is coming from. Is this somethingthat is new or is it just because
(05:20):
people are getting more comfortable talking aboutit now? Well, I would say
for a couple of reasons. Andbefore I really jump in here, Jeff,
thank you so much for having me. It's a great opportunity really appreciate
you as as a person but alsoprofessionally with what you've done over the year.
So it means a lot to haveyou include me and have me,
you know, participate with you heretoday. I equate the anxiety to really
(05:46):
where we are with communication right,So we didn't know because of the lack
of communication when a tornado was invarious parts of the country before, because
we didn't have cable television, right, it was radio, might been a
news feed, it might have beenwhatever back in the fifth nineteen fifties.
But here we are, you know, twenty two. Someone takes a video
(06:11):
and it's on LinkedIn. At leastthat's my feed. I've got connections in
Texas sending me minutes old video footageof a tornado that crosses the road and
a truck is on the edge ofthat vortex. So in today's world,
we are so in tune with currentevents globally that are going on. There's
isn't this pause or delay or orany of that. It's immediate and all
(06:34):
of those things I believe contribute tothat. And let's face it, this
planet, this planet was under theeffects and the impact of COVID and what
took place. I'm not going toget into any parts of the politics,
but let's let's be realistic. Thepolitics played a part of this. I'm
not going to get into either allthe sides of who the experts are.
(06:57):
They played a part of this.And when you don't know, And I'm
just going to say this, andI'm not intending to put on either side
of the aisle in any of thosecategories. When you start doubting truth and
you start wondering what is accurate,that that place is fear on the entire
population of the planet. So noone's exempted unless you're hiding an under a
(07:18):
rock or living in some cave.We're all in this same boat together,
and I am very concerned that we'vewe've climbed to a new plateau of a
normal stress level that's not healthy.That the vast majority of people on this
planet are operating living out their lives, going to work at a new normal
(07:42):
which is not healthy regarding stress.And they said it's okay to manage and
listen. I'm not saying that I'mexempt of this. I do presentations for
this around the country. I amcrispy right now. I am making myself
take days off next week because I'vebeen pursued in a major way because of
what's going on mental health. Wemay have put our masks aside in some
(08:05):
places, but the mental health pieceisn't going away, right. I can
feel kind of that responsibility that's onyour shoulders as you talk about this,
because you're in the trenches. You'redealing with this every day, right,
Yeah, and so I mean someof those side effects and if I may,
if I may give some of thoseside effects of those, you know,
those things that are going on withemployer groups around the country. We're
(08:28):
seeing increased number of employees taking theirlives at their place of employment. We're
seeing an increase of critical incident stressmanagement on site of having to send teams
on site to deal with these traumaticevents. We're seeing an increase in other
(08:48):
traumatics events on site as we haveto go there and physically send teams to
support them. And don't get mewrong, I'm grateful that we can provide
those solutions. But it's happening ata record pace. A lot, a
lot of a lot of decisions arebeing made at a heightened point of stress
by decision makers as well as employees, and that increases your risk of injury.
(09:13):
And the list goes on. Yeah, you know, as we're talking
about this, you you know,I mean, the pandemic was it's obvious,
right, you know, like yousaid, we all went through it
as a world community. If youwill you know, it's that information was
right there at our fingertips um,so I get you know, I felt
like this is still a relevant topic. You know, we're coming out coming
(09:35):
out of I feel the pandemic andthat anxiety around it and that uncertainty and
what's true what's not true? Butthis is still a relevant topic. Right.
It sounds like it's it's not goingyour way. It's not something that
just because the pandemic is supposedly over, if you will, um, this
is ongoing, and it sounds likeit's we have a big task ahead of
(10:00):
still well, And I would again, I would illustrate that by saying it
was the first domino that made anumber of other dominoes fall down in our
lives, right, whether that wasyou know, pick you pick your area,
because it affected all of our lives. The students last year who were
in school, who missed that yearin athletics perhaps or had to wear a
(10:20):
mask while they were playing, andmaybe they couldn't perform at the level they
could or couldn't study the regular levelthat they could. And that's just students.
I mean, there's a there's nota demographic that wasn't impacted. That
was a season of their life thatchanged their trajectory through the course of time.
That will that's that's a part ofthe stress factor. So relationships,
(10:41):
I mean, we heard of arecord number of divorce cases around the planet,
not just the United States, aroundthe planet, So relationships have been
strained. Yeah, we all dealwith stress, right, I mean,
that's just part of being human,the human condition and living right. But
I think you mentioned one, youknow, you mentioned at the top one
(11:05):
of the things that is creating morestress and anxiety is the ability to to
be connected communication, you know,social media, of the news, whatever
we can see at twenty four toseven if we if that's what we want
to do. So I'm thinking aboutmy grandchildren and some of them that are
(11:26):
pretty young, you know, betweenseventeen and twenty four, and they seem
to be the ones that are strugglingwith us the most. Maybe I'm wrong,
but that's my perception. I meanI had my own my own stress
and my own anxieties, and Imean I went through COVID last year,
(11:46):
as you know, John, Iwas in the hospital for ten days and
out of work for six weeks,and that created some anxiety for me.
Um not really knowing, you know, how healthy I was going to be
and if I'm going to be ableto be productive and get out there and
make a difference in my community andmy business and that. So I dealt
(12:07):
with that last year as well,but I felt like I had life experience
behind me that kind of gave mea little bit of strength knowing that,
hey, it's going to be okay, you know. So I guess that's
kind of where I wanted to gowith the next part was, well,
this you've made this kind of thisstatement that the new norm. Let's talk
(12:31):
about that a little bit. Howdo you see employers dealing with the new
norm with their employees good batter anddifferent And then we'll kind of get into
maybe some of the tools that areavailable. But as a whole, where
do you think we are hot?So again, I see a trend right
(12:54):
now that's happening that employers are lookingfor better quality care to looking for better
quality benefits. They're not looking certainly, they are not ignoring the bottom line,
but they are paying much more intentionto the quality of the benefits that
they're getting, including mental health,and that is much higher up on the
list than ever before. I'll beincredibly transparent. We started out when I
(13:20):
started three years ago, we werepredominantly a Northeast Middle Atlantic company. We're
now nationwide and forty seven of thefifty states, and I have groups of
very large sizes reaching out to me, where before I couldn't even get them
to even take a phone call oran email or anything. And then they're
lined up because there they don't wantthose services that are just a check box
(13:43):
when it comes to mental health.They want a robust mental health solution.
So that's a big trend that I'mseeing with the employer groups across the country,
is they're looking and revisiting their benefitsplan to get more robust services,
especially mental health. Do you believethat that is coming from the top,
(14:07):
you know the employers see that andthey really truly are benevolent or is that
you know the employees are the newemployees are demanding this or saying hey,
or maybe it's a combination of both. I don't know. Yeah, I
would say it's both because those thingsget manifested in the workplace. We see
them. We get those calls literallyevery day, Jeff of various so we
(14:28):
have a direct line for hr.They're contacting us literally daily about employee challenges
that are happening because of the heightenedstressed employees who are not acting like they
typically would say two years ago,and they're wanting us to work with them
to help them walk this out throughthe solution so that they can get the
(14:50):
help that they need. So Iwould say it's both cases. I think
the leadership is evolved, is awareof what's going on, but they're also
getting it from hr that they're tellingthem. It's a major challenge across the
nation. Where do you where ifyou were to put it on a scale
of one to ten, where doyou think we are in in terms of
addressing this and providing the tools youknow? You know, I mean,
(15:15):
do we have a lot of workahead of us still? I would say
we do because a lot of peopleare aware, you know. It's you
can be aware that there's something thatneeds to happen, but it takes the
action steps for that change to occur. And I think we're only at the
tip of the iceberg for people whoare going to go through burnout. I'm
very concerned people can just go throughtheir normal motions and your brain is not
(15:41):
like the rest of your body whereif you break your arm, you've got
that cast and everybody sees it andit's keenly aware, or you've got a
bone sticking out, so you knowyou've got to get that help. Right.
There are still a lot of stigmainvolved. There is still a lot
of other issues involved why people willnot get that mental help that they need
and uh and support that they shouldhave from other managers or leadership, whatever
(16:06):
that might be. So we arewe are not. We are not by
any means through this. I amconcerned that we're only at the tip of
the iceberg and the entire countries andlisten, the entire countries network is being
pressed to its limit. There isnot any ap out there. I'm not
going to give false hope here.We are being challenged in our network.
(16:27):
For the longest time we were ableto manage. But that you know,
we're being pressed in a lot ofparts of the country because of the demand
on the clinicians. So some partsof the country. I'm here in Boston,
New England area right now. They'retelling me New York City points northeast
they're looking at six months or latertill they can see somebody. Wow,
(16:49):
Yeah, that's not good. Yeah. Yeah, So let's let's talk about
an employee assistance program and what itis. And I'll kind of set the
stage this way, m being thatI understand that, you know, when
we provide a long term disability policygroup long term disaploy for an employer or
(17:11):
even a group life insurance that manyof those insurance carriers provide a kind of
an added value EAP program if youwill, They get you know, three
or four visits a year, youknow what a clinical clinician, an expert
um. So for those that mightbe saying, hey, well I've got
(17:32):
that, do they really have it, you know in those kind of scenarios
or is there something that they're missingthat they're not realizing And and maybe we
can that you can kind of diveinto what, you know, what you're
doing and what's different between those twoscenarios or offerings if you will. Yeah,
thank you. And to start off, let me just make this very
(17:52):
clear. I am not on thispodcast to belittle my competitors or to you
know, minimize any other mental healthsolution. A mental health solution is better
than no mental health solution, Sothere is a difference. However, when
you're talking about utilization, and thereis a difference when you're talking about results
(18:14):
across your employee group and the datais there, So I will speak to
the data that says those typical plansthat are included in a life insurance policy
or something like that, that wetypically refer to as embedded, those typical
utilization rates across the country are aroundone percent. Oh wow, so it
is very low when you went away. If you're wanting to make an impact
(18:37):
in your employee group, that isnot the best option for you when you're
talking a numbers game. So thatmay be what you're able to afford.
That's another topic, and I'm notgoing to say that's you know, that's
up to those decision makers to makethose calls. However, if you're looking
for impact, if you're looking forchange, and if you're looking for solutions
across the board, a stand toloan plan or something that's more robust than
(19:02):
those typical plans, it will makea greater difference. So we're only one
of many national providers that can offerstandalone plans. Our utilization rates we're seeing
right now with our standalons are aboutnineteen percent and with our embedded plans with
all of our different embedded plans,we're in the twenties. I would say
it's about twenty two percent. Sothe difference is we're engaging them on a
(19:26):
personal level. We're building a relationshipwith that HR team. We're trying to
stay top of mind on a monthlybasis with the employee population so that they're
regularly hearing about the service in differentways so that they feel more comfortable to
use it. It's not just somethingthat's tucked away in a plan that's not
(19:49):
being brought up or being explained ona regular basis. So would it be
fair to say that, you know, you say you're working with HR tools
that are proactive, if you will, rather than reactionary. We actually do
so it's preventative, right, Andso I like to get present the image
(20:14):
of you know, it isn't thecamel oftentimes that that lands on a person's
lap. It's the straws that thatbreaks the camel's back, right, And
it isn't always the house that's burneddown for someone. It's the conversation that
came up at work, that wasthe tenth thing that happened in the last
two weeks. So it's all thesethings that have compiled in a person's life
(20:34):
that maybe they haven't dealt with appropriately. So managing the load, all those
things are like rocks and a backpack, Jeff, So managing the load and
business and life on a regular basis. It's it's how you said, you
know, it's how we handle stress. You're exactly right. Learning to handle
that and manage the stress we haveis so critical in healthy mental health.
(20:56):
Yeah, he said, I hadto learn the hard way. I mean,
the COVID was one thing, butbefore that, Um, I had
a couple other situations that brought tothe forefront and made me realize that I'm
not immune to it. I alwaysfelt like, oh, that's not me,
you know, and you know,I'm not going to even talk about
it, like you said. Imean, it's you know, with that
(21:17):
stigma, if you will, right, um So I I you know,
I'm just being transparent, honest witheveryone. UM. A few years back,
I got a mental I call hima mental health coach, some coach.
We you know, we talk regularly. UM. So that's one thing
I've done for me. Um.You know, talking about being crispy,
(21:38):
you know, you you mentioned thatyou're going to take some time off,
so I did kind of want todive into that a little bit and maybe
we can give some takeaways that peoplecan use that can help them. Right
now, I've got a couple ofthoughts around that, but I want to
hear what you do for you forJohn, I mean, this is what
(21:59):
you do every day. Yeah,So it's it's a challenge. And if
I may just take a brief momentand explain my past, is that appropriate?
If I can? If I cando that, so hear your story.
So again, you can't see me, And I've been accused by my
good friends Lester Morales and others thatI'm a very tall person. You can't
always see that on a screen.So I'm six five, I'm about two
(22:22):
seventy five. I can work outwith the best of them in the gym,
perhaps, but mental health has alwaysbeen a challenge for me. I
genuinely care about my clients and mybusiness partners, strategic partners, and about
ten years ago I burned out severelyto the point where I was told by
a clinician I needed to take asix month sabbatical. And if anybody who
knows me, they know I tendto be a workaholic. I tend to
(22:45):
go all in and I tend todouble down on myself. So when I
was told to take a six monthsabbatical, I arrogantly laughed in the person's
face. So that cost me mycurrent my past career. That cost me
a lot of relations ships in thecommunity. It caused me reputation because when
you are burned out at that level, you're not making good decisions because you're
(23:07):
denying the help that's being offered,which is what I did. And then
those those spiraling effects continue on otherdecisions, which is what I did.
So I had to learn. Whenyou say about learning the hard way,
Jeff, believe me, I knowwhat it's like to learn the hard way.
I chose to reject the help thatwas there, and I paid dearly
for that. And to be fullytransparent, there's things I'll never get back.
(23:30):
There's health issues that I have becauseit damaged my body. I will
never be able to lift, youknow, the way I once could or
should and all that. And I'mnot going to go through the whole items
of lists there, but they're realand they're great reminders to me. So
what do I do now? Ihad to learn the hard way that self
care is not selfish, that Ineed to take care of myself first.
(23:52):
We are currently covering about a millionlives, and if I want to continue
that pace to get to three millionlives, which is what we're on pace
to doing in the next eighteen months, I need to make sure that I'm
taking care of myself first. There'sa reason why those oxygen masks come down
on the airplane and they say putit on first, right. Plus,
you cannot draw water from a shallowwell if you're going to help water people
(24:17):
around you, So make sure you'retaking care of you. That's not being
selfish. If you're not doing that, guess what that word is called neglect?
And I was a master of thatfor about forty some years. I
looked like I was in great shapephysically, but I was in a mental
health wreck. I never took timeto process the losses over fifty loved ones
(24:38):
and friends that have died, andthat took its toll. So take those
steps along the way. You takeyour car in to get the oil changed
every three thousand or five thousand orten thousand miles, do the same for
yourself. Get those regular checkups,check in on yourself and invest in yourself.
That can be a huge investment inthe best person, which is yourself.
(25:02):
Yeah, so do it before itbecomes running. And then the first
step is acknowledging that we all arehuman are subject to it. Nobody is
immune to it. Right we mightthink that we are, but we're not.
We're not. And taking time foryourself I really really like that.
(25:23):
And that's a hard thing to dowhen you're an AID type personality, right
to take care of yourself because you'retaking care of everybody else. But I
love that analogy of the oxygen mask, and that's that's that is point on
that makes so much sense to me. So what do you during the week
(25:47):
when you're starting you kind of feelingmaybe you're losing some of that rhythm,
if you will. I like tocall it rhythm rather than balance. There
are little things during the week thatyou do that kind of help you.
So there are a lot of littlethings that I do, and would I
would encourage anyone who's watching this orlistening to this to start off very small.
Many times people think, Okay,I need to do this for my
(26:11):
mental health, and they they createthis beautiful picture, this beautiful portrait,
and it's elaborate. I'm going togo to the gym, I'm gonna go
to yoga, I'm gonna go havethe practice mindfulness. But the reality is
those habits die fast because they're sovast. So start small and I mean
that. So I learned that fromagain from atomic habits. Two minutes go
(26:36):
for a two minute walk it.You're gonna think, well, that's a
waste of my time. No,it's not, because it's in the reps,
not in the time frame. Youcan trick your brain into being used
to that so that after a week, make it five minutes after that.
So I go for and I've donethose things to get started. But I
walk purposely, so I need tosay that so it's clearly understood. I'm
(26:56):
not just walking my Irish setter.I am purposely walking my Irish cetter.
My cell phone is not on,i am not getting notifications. I am
paying attention to the trees, tothe birds, to the sun, to
the clouds. I'm listening and tryingto identify those things to engage my brain
to turn it off. Because Iam an a type personality. I am
(27:18):
thinking about things NonStop, even inmy sleep when I wake up. So
it's a challenge. So we haveto train our minds to rest. Yeah,
I liked it. A Rachel talkedabout yesterday that very topic being called
it being present. That's what youjust described, getting out and not having
(27:42):
the technology on being in the moment, noticing the things around you, you
know, resetting that brain if youwill, so huge. I try.
I'm not good, always good atit. But I really like the council
you give about starting small, andit reminded me of a story um British
(28:02):
clecting team, and it's called theaggregation of marginal games the one percent.
Yes you heard of that, right, that is found soul. You're right.
I mean we start the year ornew year, Okay, I'm gonna
exercise and love fifty pounds whatever itis. That's not the way to do
it. He's got to start smalland and reach those small, little milestones
(28:27):
and then move from there. That'sthe key to improve one percent in the
area that you're focusing on. Soyou know what it like you're saying two
minutes, five minutes, whatever.I really like that. If anyone wants
to look that up, aggregation ofmarginal change. You've got to you've got
to read that story. It's it'sreally cool. Um, excuse me,
(28:51):
my throat that little allergy. California. The leaves are coming out and the
flowers are blooming here, so it'sin the air. I'm just looking at
my notes here and forgive me.One of the things that I'm talking more
about what you're doing, excuse me. One of the things that Rachel brought
(29:17):
up yesterday, and I felt thisreally resonated with me because it is something
that I have done for many,many years. She talked about journaling the
importance of journaling and writing your thoughtsdown, and she said a lot of
people think that, oh my gosh, I've got to write something down every
day. You know, it justseems like another task, if you will,
(29:37):
I feel stressed about it, shesays, No, I mean,
you don't have to write every day. But she says, it's it helps
us to reset our brain. Whenwe do that, we're able to articulate
and actually put down on paper whatwe're actually thinking, and then you go
back and read it and like,wow, that's actually pretty profound. A
day helps me to really kind toorganize my thoughts and make it concrete on
(30:03):
what it is I'm thinking about orstruggling with, and that for me,
it has been a great benefit overmy life is journaling. I love the
journal And she said, there's otherways to do it. She said,
you can there's apps, there's videoapps and um, different ways that you
can do that. You can geton the phone and and you know,
(30:23):
do it through their phone. Youdon't have to actually write it down.
She said that's really been helpful forher. And as we know, she
likes to sing. Michel sings alot, so she finds something that,
um that she's passionate about that hasnothing to do with or work necessarily,
although she's incorporated it. So nowshe talked about that how important it is
(30:44):
for us to find, you know, things that bring joy on a on
a regular basis that we enjoy andare passionate about. Like you know,
maybe working out in the jam itbrings brings you joy. I don't you
know. I know it. Ienjoy that too. But there's other things
that we all like to do.So what I mean, what other things
(31:04):
do you do? Well? I'msharing, but yeah, so let me
let me speak to that specifically.So there's a huge part when it comes
to behavioral health in processing our journeybecause I was a epic failure. That's
what led to my burnout. Inever took the time to stop and pause
and process what was going on.So there's a reason now again. And
(31:29):
I'll give a high five to everybodyout there who who can do journal and
who likes that. I would rathershovel a horsetable than journal. I just
absolutely It is not from my personalprofile. I can't do that. However,
However I do that in my mind. I do that every single at
the end of my business day,I take time to process that. There's
(31:51):
a reason why the kings of oldhad scribes write down every single thing of
their day and it was read backto them. And I believe the best
kings were the ones who had readback to them before they went to sleep
so they could process. Okay,maybe this needs to be followed up tomorrow.
Wow, we actually did have agreat day. I didn't perceive it
that way. Winding things down.It can be huge to take that time
(32:15):
every single day. I started offdoing it on a Saturday, and it
is my goal. I'm not goingto say that I'm currently succeeding on a
daily but it is my goal todo it every single day to process that
day, and I try to gothrough the events. I'll go through my
calendar, I'll go through how Ifelt about that day, what really took
place? Are there anything else thatI need to do? Well? Can
(32:36):
I learn from that? And emotionallynot just the data. Emotionally engaging those
things along the way helps our stressand helps us be able to manage that
load. And yes, if youbelieve me, I'm with you all the
way, Jeff. If you're ableto do journaling, I believe that is
the best way to do that.If you're like me and it's just a
(32:57):
it's that extra challenge, or youjust can't do that, at least take
that time to plot, to pause, and to process what's been going on.
And I don't do it every day, and there's times where I've gone
months without doing it. Um Andmost of the time when I have been
doing it every day, I'm goingthrough something very stressful. UM So,
yeah, no, I really appreciatethat. UM So, what you're kind
(33:22):
of talking about is kind of likeyou said, you're evaluating the day.
I really like that. Um.I thought about the scribes. I never
thought of that before you know,these kings had these scribes. I wouldn't
mind having a scribe mind sitting behindme. Yeah, there you goos.
Um. So in doing that,when you can reevaluate the day, you
(33:44):
can you can really um put someum some color to it, and you
can say, yeah, you knowthis, this went well, you know
it was a good day. Right, I did accomplish that, rather than
saying, oh my gosh, theworld's coming doing and I didn't get everything
done. I wanted to get done. And they're that kind of plays into
gratitude too, right, right,right, and perspective right. We often
(34:06):
get wrapped up into the It's verysimilar to meteorological events right here and here
in Pennsylvania where I live. Imean, people remember the big snowstorms and
they look back at that like itwas the norm and they were growing up.
No, it was just that onetime when you were twelve years old
that left its mark in your brain. You've actually got, you know,
an average that snowfall every year.So we only remember those extremes, the
(34:27):
highs and the lows, and itcan be huge for us to stay balanced,
to stay balanced by reviewing all theevents of the day and how we
felt about those things because things aretypically not as bad or as good sometimes
as we really perceive them to bein the moment and help us stay more
level managing that load. Yeah,you and I both know that that is
(34:52):
something that is amongst top elite athletesabout being level right, not getting too
high, not getting too low,so that you can be in the moment
and perform. Um. There's applicationhere um definitely in our own personal lives
for that as well. And Ifound that through my own life as well,
(35:13):
is that sometimes you know, somethingis presented to me or family members
going through something, my wife's ventingabout something, and I've got to kind
of take a step back and notget too emotionally attached to that and say,
Okay, it's probably not as badas we think it is. It's
usually not right right. Yeah.So, I mean, we have a
(35:37):
lot of girls in our family,so there's always something going on. I
think three fourths of our grand twentytwo grandkids or girls, there's always something
happening there with that. So,um, we could go on this,
John, I would love it ifwe could maybe circle back with you again
(35:58):
and talk about this again, becauseI just feel like this is something that
we need to continue to talk aboutUM and get out to you know,
the community, and they let peopleknow there's resources, there's you know,
there is there is people out therethat really can bring tools and knowledge and
(36:19):
help UM with whatever you're struggling withUM. So just before we sign off,
maybe just give us a little UMsummary on Mazzetti and Sullivan and kind
of you know, we've kind ofalluded to some of the stuff you're doing,
but what what are some of theother things that maybe we could you
know, take away from what youguys are doing for the business community and
(36:43):
their employees. Yeah, and youprobably understand when I talk we're refer to
having a more robust plan. There'sgoing to be personal engagement. You're going
to every group will get a dedicatedclient solution specialist. We do offer those
types of renewable sessions. You're alwaysgoing to get a live person that cares,
is qualified and certified. Those typesof things resonate with people. But
(37:06):
something else that employers need to beaware of is that we do a lot
of job benchmarking and we take thosesoft skills for the role. We work
with leadership teams. People are lookingfor things to attract and keep employees right
now and understanding who your ideal employeeshould be, what that should look like
in a soft skills the regular tradeskills can be learned, those things can
(37:30):
be taught. You're left with thepersonality if you don't get that right personality
person So being able to do thatin a job benchmark, we have seen
tremendous results over the years, andnow more than ever, we are doing
so many cases of that around thecountry to benchmark positions so they know who
(37:51):
they're really looking for. There canbe a demand and you just want to
fill the slot, so to speak, and that is not the best way
to hire the first time around.So looking for those right candidates and also
what happens is those employees stay engagedand they understand and they get a better
fitting employee and it makes them moreproductive as well. So it's really a
(38:12):
win win. It helps their mentalhealth, it's going to save you down
the road exponentially. So that's somethingthat I think is a differentiator for us
as we really try to be thatstrategic partner with our clients, not just
be a vendor. We want tounderstand the challenges that you're having in the
HR world. So that we canprovide those solutions with what you're already paying
(38:35):
for, not try to upsell something. So we're built to be the business
partner. And I believe that's whatseparates us many times from our competitors.
So that's great. I didn't knowthat about you guys, and talk about
a relevant topic right now. Andyou know the workforce and as we know,
you know there's more people out there. Well, there's a lot of
jobs. There's a lot of peoplethat are that are not. Our employers
(38:59):
are struggling with us or to findtalent right now right and hire people,
um, and they don't really understanda lot of time to why they're not
able to land those people that arelooking for jobs quite frankly, So that
that's a great Um cool you guyshave that I didn't realize you had available.
That's good to know going forward forus as well. Well, my
(39:20):
friend, I'm gonna let you getback to your your life, UM,
enjoy your rest of your day andhave a safe trip home to the family
and and your pets. I knowyou've got a dog or two, um
you need you want to get backto and I hope the weather is turning
around for you guys like it ishere for us. Well, we're getting
(39:40):
the much needed rain that we need. That's the positive angle. Oh okay,
sending some of that our way.We could use some of that too.
Oh, my brother, I appreciateyou. It's good talking with you,
um as usual. Always good tosee you and and you know,
converse. So you have a blessedday and you know, stay safe out
(40:02):
there. Thanks so much, Jeff, have a great day, all right.
Take care.
So let's do this. I willintroduce mister John Trautman, which we're so
excited to have him on our monthlyBenefits and Brief podcast through the Sacramental Office
of the Allerric Group. I amJeff Turner, the managing partner or that
office. I've been in the healthinsurance industry. We're way longer than I
(00:20):
can count. I was at anetworking event last night and somebody asked me
how many years I've been in thebusiness. I said, you know what,
It's been a really long time.But I've seen it all. I
haven't done it all yet. Alot of great stuff that's happening on our
industry that is really changing the game, if you will, and we're super
excited about a lot of the highlevel strategies and like minded people quite frankly
(00:45):
that John and I rubbed shoulders withthat are really really honestly trying to make
a difference and impact healthcare as weknow it and what we've struggled with as
employers and employees. So we makehealthcare simple and more affordable is the best
way to put it. So withthat, I'm gonna go ahead and introduce
mister John Troutman and him and Imet each other about a year ago through
(01:07):
a mutual friend on LinkedIn. LinkedIn'sawesome connected with some really incredible people on
LinkedIn. It's been a great resourcefor me to be able to connect with
people like John. So, John, if you don't mind, I'm just
going to read your bio. Idon't have a memorized If you don't mind,
that's fine. So. John Troutmanis the national director of Marketing and
(01:30):
Business Development of Mazzetti and Sullivan EAPServices. For those of you who don't
know what EPAP staff boards Employee Assistanceprogram If I got that right, John,
Yes, sir, Yeah, we'regonna talk a little bit about that.
They are a subsidy of Pyramid Healthcare, the fourth largest behavioral health provider
in the United States. That's significant. In addition to business development, he's
(01:53):
a keynote speaker, a corporate consultant, a personal work life coach, the
benefit advisors like off across the country, and he has been with Mazzetti and
Sullivan EAP for over seven years,so that's pretty significant too. Prior to
joining the Massetti and Sullivan EAP team, John has over twenty years of experience
in public speaking and independently increasing brandawareness working with companies like on Fire Network,
(02:17):
Magic Marketing, Royal Buono coffee thatsounds fun, inspirational films, and
I didn't know that one John,we might have to talk about that South
Today's international realty. And he's spokento group's ranging from five to five thousand,
so he's comfortable in front of anaudience and has addressed leadership teams on
(02:37):
several continents, focusing on workplace strategiesthat reduce stress and increase employee engagement.
He's a survivor of burnout, whichwe're going to talk a little bit about
today, and brings the lessons learnto walk corporate leaders through strategies to address
employee needs while controlling the safety andfinancial impact of health issues. So that's
(02:58):
a great resume on to start with. Right out the gate. Um,
you're I think you've you've kind ofseen it all. Um, I'm still
yeah, thank you, I'm stillwaiting to meet that person in that bio.
So thank you for those kind ofwords. All right, well,
fair enough. I think it's agood representation of who you are and what
(03:21):
you're all about. And we're gonnawe're going to dive into kind of what
you're doing now and what you're seeingin the marketplace. UM. I'm super
excited to have you on today.UM. You know, you and I
connected last year, like I said, and on a business level, it
made sense for us to continue totalk, you know, what you guys
were doing and offering to employers andtheir employees. But on a personal level,
(03:42):
I really connected with you as well, and I've really wanted to,
you know, make sure that peopleget to hear you and your voice and
what you're doing and to make adifference in our world right now, which
you know, we need leaders andpeople that have the knowledge that you do
that you're bringing the table. Aswe know. You know the last two
years through the pandemic, mental healthis is I don't become I don't.
(04:05):
I'm not going to call it abuzzword, but it's it's it's relevant,
it's it's real. People are strugglingwith it. UM. I heard yesterday
a different terminology for it. Youknow, Rachel truck and Miller. I
was on one of her podcasts yesterday. She's really good, UM, and
they talked about burnout as being crispyused that terminology to crispy. Is it
(04:31):
crispy? And I thought, well, that's kind of interesting, that's a
good good way to describe it,but you know, not making lighted of
it. But I have never Ican't remember, um, in all the
years i've I've been on this earth, which is quite a few, I
think I can remember the word anxietybeing used so much, you know,
(04:57):
being described, being talked about,and you know, probably last five years
maybe then all the way my yearscombined. It's all of a sudden,
I hear that word a lot,anxiety in stress, and so I kind
of wanted to start with that,John and ask you kind of where that
is coming from. Is this somethingthat is new or is it just because
(05:20):
people are getting more comfortable talking aboutit now? Well, I would say
for a couple of reasons. Andbefore I really jump in here, Jeff,
thank you so much for having me. It's a great opportunity really appreciate
you as as a person but alsoprofessionally with what you've done over the year.
So it means a lot to haveyou include me and have me,
you know, participate with you heretoday. I equate the anxiety to really
(05:46):
where we are with communication right,So we didn't know because of the lack
of communication when a tornado was invarious parts of the country before, because
we didn't have cable television, right, it was radio, might been a
news feed, it might have beenwhatever back in the fifth nineteen fifties.
But here we are, you know, twenty two. Someone takes a video
(06:11):
and it's on LinkedIn. At leastthat's my feed. I've got connections in
Texas sending me minutes old video footageof a tornado that crosses the road and
a truck is on the edge ofthat vortex. So in today's world,
we are so in tune with currentevents globally that are going on. There's
isn't this pause or delay or orany of that. It's immediate and all
(06:34):
of those things I believe contribute tothat. And let's face it, this
planet, this planet was under theeffects and the impact of COVID and what
took place. I'm not going toget into any parts of the politics,
but let's let's be realistic. Thepolitics played a part of this. I'm
not going to get into either allthe sides of who the experts are.
(06:57):
They played a part of this.And when you don't know, And I'm
just going to say this, andI'm not intending to put on either side
of the aisle in any of thosecategories. When you start doubting truth and
you start wondering what is accurate,that that place is fear on the entire
population of the planet. So noone's exempted unless you're hiding an under a
(07:18):
rock or living in some cave.We're all in this same boat together,
and I am very concerned that we'vewe've climbed to a new plateau of a
normal stress level that's not healthy.That the vast majority of people on this
planet are operating living out their lives, going to work at a new normal
(07:42):
which is not healthy regarding stress.And they said it's okay to manage and
listen. I'm not saying that I'mexempt of this. I do presentations for
this around the country. I amcrispy right now. I am making myself
take days off next week because I'vebeen pursued in a major way because of
what's going on mental health. Wemay have put our masks aside in some
(08:05):
places, but the mental health pieceisn't going away, right. I can
feel kind of that responsibility that's onyour shoulders as you talk about this,
because you're in the trenches. You'redealing with this every day, right,
Yeah, and so I mean someof those side effects and if I may,
if I may give some of thoseside effects of those, you know,
those things that are going on withemployer groups around the country. We're
(08:28):
seeing increased number of employees taking theirlives at their place of employment. We're
seeing an increase of critical incident stressmanagement on site of having to send teams
on site to deal with these traumaticevents. We're seeing an increase in other
(08:48):
traumatics events on site as we haveto go there and physically send teams to
support them. And don't get mewrong, I'm grateful that we can provide
those solutions. But it's happening ata record pace. A lot, a
lot of a lot of decisions arebeing made at a heightened point of stress
by decision makers as well as employees, and that increases your risk of injury.
(09:13):
And the list goes on. Yeah, you know, as we're talking
about this, you you know,I mean, the pandemic was it's obvious,
right, you know, like yousaid, we all went through it
as a world community. If youwill you know, it's that information was
right there at our fingertips um,so I get you know, I felt
like this is still a relevant topic. You know, we're coming out coming
(09:35):
out of I feel the pandemic andthat anxiety around it and that uncertainty and
what's true what's not true? Butthis is still a relevant topic. Right.
It sounds like it's it's not goingyour way. It's not something that
just because the pandemic is supposedly over, if you will, um, this
is ongoing, and it sounds likeit's we have a big task ahead of
(10:00):
still well, And I would again, I would illustrate that by saying it
was the first domino that made anumber of other dominoes fall down in our
lives, right, whether that wasyou know, pick you pick your area,
because it affected all of our lives. The students last year who were
in school, who missed that yearin athletics perhaps or had to wear a
(10:20):
mask while they were playing, andmaybe they couldn't perform at the level they
could or couldn't study the regular levelthat they could. And that's just students.
I mean, there's a there's nota demographic that wasn't impacted. That
was a season of their life thatchanged their trajectory through the course of time.
That will that's that's a part ofthe stress factor. So relationships,
(10:41):
I mean, we heard of arecord number of divorce cases around the planet,
not just the United States, aroundthe planet, So relationships have been
strained. Yeah, we all dealwith stress, right, I mean,
that's just part of being human,the human condition and living right. But
I think you mentioned one, youknow, you mentioned at the top one
(11:05):
of the things that is creating morestress and anxiety is the ability to to
be connected communication, you know,social media, of the news, whatever
we can see at twenty four toseven if we if that's what we want
to do. So I'm thinking aboutmy grandchildren and some of them that are
(11:26):
pretty young, you know, betweenseventeen and twenty four, and they seem
to be the ones that are strugglingwith us the most. Maybe I'm wrong,
but that's my perception. I meanI had my own my own stress
and my own anxieties, and Imean I went through COVID last year,
(11:46):
as you know, John, Iwas in the hospital for ten days and
out of work for six weeks,and that created some anxiety for me.
Um not really knowing, you know, how healthy I was going to be
and if I'm going to be ableto be productive and get out there and
make a difference in my community andmy business and that. So I dealt
(12:07):
with that last year as well,but I felt like I had life experience
behind me that kind of gave mea little bit of strength knowing that,
hey, it's going to be okay, you know. So I guess that's
kind of where I wanted to gowith the next part was, well,
this you've made this kind of thisstatement that the new norm. Let's talk
(12:31):
about that a little bit. Howdo you see employers dealing with the new
norm with their employees good batter anddifferent And then we'll kind of get into
maybe some of the tools that areavailable. But as a whole, where
do you think we are hot?So again, I see a trend right
(12:54):
now that's happening that employers are lookingfor better quality care to looking for better
quality benefits. They're not looking certainly, they are not ignoring the bottom line,
but they are paying much more intentionto the quality of the benefits that
they're getting, including mental health,and that is much higher up on the
list than ever before. I'll beincredibly transparent. We started out when I
(13:20):
started three years ago, we werepredominantly a Northeast Middle Atlantic company. We're
now nationwide and forty seven of thefifty states, and I have groups of
very large sizes reaching out to me, where before I couldn't even get them
to even take a phone call oran email or anything. And then they're
lined up because there they don't wantthose services that are just a check box
(13:43):
when it comes to mental health.They want a robust mental health solution.
So that's a big trend that I'mseeing with the employer groups across the country,
is they're looking and revisiting their benefitsplan to get more robust services,
especially mental health. Do you believethat that is coming from the top,
(14:07):
you know the employers see that andthey really truly are benevolent or is that
you know the employees are the newemployees are demanding this or saying hey,
or maybe it's a combination of both. I don't know. Yeah, I
would say it's both because those thingsget manifested in the workplace. We see
them. We get those calls literallyevery day, Jeff of various so we
(14:28):
have a direct line for hr.They're contacting us literally daily about employee challenges
that are happening because of the heightenedstressed employees who are not acting like they
typically would say two years ago,and they're wanting us to work with them
to help them walk this out throughthe solution so that they can get the
(14:50):
help that they need. So Iwould say it's both cases. I think
the leadership is evolved, is awareof what's going on, but they're also
getting it from hr that they're tellingthem. It's a major challenge across the
nation. Where do you where ifyou were to put it on a scale
of one to ten, where doyou think we are in in terms of
addressing this and providing the tools youknow? You know, I mean,
(15:15):
do we have a lot of workahead of us still? I would say
we do because a lot of peopleare aware, you know. It's you
can be aware that there's something thatneeds to happen, but it takes the
action steps for that change to occur. And I think we're only at the
tip of the iceberg for people whoare going to go through burnout. I'm
very concerned people can just go throughtheir normal motions and your brain is not
(15:41):
like the rest of your body whereif you break your arm, you've got
that cast and everybody sees it andit's keenly aware, or you've got a
bone sticking out, so you knowyou've got to get that help. Right.
There are still a lot of stigmainvolved. There is still a lot
of other issues involved why people willnot get that mental help that they need
and uh and support that they shouldhave from other managers or leadership, whatever
(16:06):
that might be. So we arewe are not. We are not by
any means through this. I amconcerned that we're only at the tip of
the iceberg and the entire countries andlisten, the entire countries network is being
pressed to its limit. There isnot any ap out there. I'm not
going to give false hope here.We are being challenged in our network.
(16:27):
For the longest time we were ableto manage. But that you know,
we're being pressed in a lot ofparts of the country because of the demand
on the clinicians. So some partsof the country. I'm here in Boston,
New England area right now. They'retelling me New York City points northeast
they're looking at six months or latertill they can see somebody. Wow,
(16:49):
Yeah, that's not good. Yeah. Yeah, So let's let's talk about
an employee assistance program and what itis. And I'll kind of set the
stage this way, m being thatI understand that, you know, when
we provide a long term disability policygroup long term disaploy for an employer or
(17:11):
even a group life insurance that manyof those insurance carriers provide a kind of
an added value EAP program if youwill, They get you know, three
or four visits a year, youknow what a clinical clinician, an expert
um. So for those that mightbe saying, hey, well I've got
(17:32):
that, do they really have it, you know in those kind of scenarios
or is there something that they're missingthat they're not realizing And and maybe we
can that you can kind of diveinto what, you know, what you're
doing and what's different between those twoscenarios or offerings if you will. Yeah,
thank you. And to start off, let me just make this very
(17:52):
clear. I am not on thispodcast to belittle my competitors or to you
know, minimize any other mental healthsolution. A mental health solution is better
than no mental health solution, Sothere is a difference. However, when
you're talking about utilization, and thereis a difference when you're talking about results
(18:14):
across your employee group and the datais there, So I will speak to
the data that says those typical plansthat are included in a life insurance policy
or something like that, that wetypically refer to as embedded, those typical
utilization rates across the country are aroundone percent. Oh wow, so it
is very low when you went away. If you're wanting to make an impact
(18:37):
in your employee group, that isnot the best option for you when you're
talking a numbers game. So thatmay be what you're able to afford.
That's another topic, and I'm notgoing to say that's you know, that's
up to those decision makers to makethose calls. However, if you're looking
for impact, if you're looking forchange, and if you're looking for solutions
across the board, a stand toloan plan or something that's more robust than
(19:02):
those typical plans, it will makea greater difference. So we're only one
of many national providers that can offerstandalone plans. Our utilization rates we're seeing
right now with our standalons are aboutnineteen percent and with our embedded plans with
all of our different embedded plans,we're in the twenties. I would say
it's about twenty two percent. Sothe difference is we're engaging them on a
(19:26):
personal level. We're building a relationshipwith that HR team. We're trying to
stay top of mind on a monthlybasis with the employee population so that they're
regularly hearing about the service in differentways so that they feel more comfortable to
use it. It's not just somethingthat's tucked away in a plan that's not
(19:49):
being brought up or being explained ona regular basis. So would it be
fair to say that, you know, you say you're working with HR tools
that are proactive, if you will, rather than reactionary. We actually do
so it's preventative, right, Andso I like to get present the image
(20:14):
of you know, it isn't thecamel oftentimes that that lands on a person's
lap. It's the straws that thatbreaks the camel's back, right, And
it isn't always the house that's burneddown for someone. It's the conversation that
came up at work, that wasthe tenth thing that happened in the last
two weeks. So it's all thesethings that have compiled in a person's life
(20:34):
that maybe they haven't dealt with appropriately. So managing the load, all those
things are like rocks and a backpack, Jeff, So managing the load and
business and life on a regular basis. It's it's how you said, you
know, it's how we handle stress. You're exactly right. Learning to handle
that and manage the stress we haveis so critical in healthy mental health.
(20:56):
Yeah, he said, I hadto learn the hard way. I mean,
the COVID was one thing, butbefore that, Um, I had
a couple other situations that brought tothe forefront and made me realize that I'm
not immune to it. I alwaysfelt like, oh, that's not me,
you know, and you know,I'm not going to even talk about
it, like you said. Imean, it's you know, with that
(21:17):
stigma, if you will, right, um So I I you know,
I'm just being transparent, honest witheveryone. UM. A few years back,
I got a mental I call hima mental health coach, some coach.
We you know, we talk regularly. UM. So that's one thing
I've done for me. Um.You know, talking about being crispy,
(21:38):
you know, you you mentioned thatyou're going to take some time off,
so I did kind of want todive into that a little bit and maybe
we can give some takeaways that peoplecan use that can help them. Right
now, I've got a couple ofthoughts around that, but I want to
hear what you do for you forJohn, I mean, this is what
(21:59):
you do every day. Yeah,So it's it's a challenge. And if
I may just take a brief momentand explain my past, is that appropriate?
If I can? If I cando that, so hear your story.
So again, you can't see me, And I've been accused by my
good friends Lester Morales and others thatI'm a very tall person. You can't
always see that on a screen.So I'm six five, I'm about two
(22:22):
seventy five. I can work outwith the best of them in the gym,
perhaps, but mental health has alwaysbeen a challenge for me. I
genuinely care about my clients and mybusiness partners, strategic partners, and about
ten years ago I burned out severelyto the point where I was told by
a clinician I needed to take asix month sabbatical. And if anybody who
knows me, they know I tendto be a workaholic. I tend to
(22:45):
go all in and I tend todouble down on myself. So when I
was told to take a six monthsabbatical, I arrogantly laughed in the person's
face. So that cost me mycurrent my past career. That cost me
a lot of relations ships in thecommunity. It caused me reputation because when
you are burned out at that level, you're not making good decisions because you're
(23:07):
denying the help that's being offered,which is what I did. And then
those those spiraling effects continue on otherdecisions, which is what I did.
So I had to learn. Whenyou say about learning the hard way,
Jeff, believe me, I knowwhat it's like to learn the hard way.
I chose to reject the help thatwas there, and I paid dearly
for that. And to be fullytransparent, there's things I'll never get back.
(23:30):
There's health issues that I have becauseit damaged my body. I will
never be able to lift, youknow, the way I once could or
should and all that. And I'mnot going to go through the whole items
of lists there, but they're realand they're great reminders to me. So
what do I do now? Ihad to learn the hard way that self
care is not selfish, that Ineed to take care of myself first.
(23:52):
We are currently covering about a millionlives, and if I want to continue
that pace to get to three millionlives, which is what we're on pace
to doing in the next eighteen months, I need to make sure that I'm
taking care of myself first. There'sa reason why those oxygen masks come down
on the airplane and they say putit on first, right. Plus,
you cannot draw water from a shallowwell if you're going to help water people
(24:17):
around you, So make sure you'retaking care of you. That's not being
selfish. If you're not doing that, guess what that word is called neglect?
And I was a master of thatfor about forty some years. I
looked like I was in great shapephysically, but I was in a mental
health wreck. I never took timeto process the losses over fifty loved ones
(24:38):
and friends that have died, andthat took its toll. So take those
steps along the way. You takeyour car in to get the oil changed
every three thousand or five thousand orten thousand miles, do the same for
yourself. Get those regular checkups,check in on yourself and invest in yourself.
That can be a huge investment inthe best person, which is yourself.
(25:02):
Yeah, so do it before itbecomes running. And then the first
step is acknowledging that we all arehuman are subject to it. Nobody is
immune to it. Right we mightthink that we are, but we're not.
We're not. And taking time foryourself I really really like that.
(25:23):
And that's a hard thing to dowhen you're an AID type personality, right
to take care of yourself because you'retaking care of everybody else. But I
love that analogy of the oxygen mask, and that's that's that is point on
that makes so much sense to me. So what do you during the week
(25:47):
when you're starting you kind of feelingmaybe you're losing some of that rhythm,
if you will. I like tocall it rhythm rather than balance. There
are little things during the week thatyou do that kind of help you.
So there are a lot of littlethings that I do, and would I
would encourage anyone who's watching this orlistening to this to start off very small.
Many times people think, Okay,I need to do this for my
(26:11):
mental health, and they they createthis beautiful picture, this beautiful portrait,
and it's elaborate. I'm going togo to the gym, I'm gonna go
to yoga, I'm gonna go havethe practice mindfulness. But the reality is
those habits die fast because they're sovast. So start small and I mean
that. So I learned that fromagain from atomic habits. Two minutes go
(26:36):
for a two minute walk it.You're gonna think, well, that's a
waste of my time. No,it's not, because it's in the reps,
not in the time frame. Youcan trick your brain into being used
to that so that after a week, make it five minutes after that.
So I go for and I've donethose things to get started. But I
walk purposely, so I need tosay that so it's clearly understood. I'm
(26:56):
not just walking my Irish setter.I am purposely walking my Irish cetter.
My cell phone is not on,i am not getting notifications. I am
paying attention to the trees, tothe birds, to the sun, to
the clouds. I'm listening and tryingto identify those things to engage my brain
to turn it off. Because Iam an a type personality. I am
(27:18):
thinking about things NonStop, even inmy sleep when I wake up. So
it's a challenge. So we haveto train our minds to rest. Yeah,
I liked it. A Rachel talkedabout yesterday that very topic being called
it being present. That's what youjust described, getting out and not having
(27:42):
the technology on being in the moment, noticing the things around you, you
know, resetting that brain if youwill, so huge. I try.
I'm not good, always good atit. But I really like the council
you give about starting small, andit reminded me of a story um British
(28:02):
clecting team, and it's called theaggregation of marginal games the one percent.
Yes you heard of that, right, that is found soul. You're right.
I mean we start the year ornew year, Okay, I'm gonna
exercise and love fifty pounds whatever itis. That's not the way to do
it. He's got to start smalland and reach those small, little milestones
(28:27):
and then move from there. That'sthe key to improve one percent in the
area that you're focusing on. Soyou know what it like you're saying two
minutes, five minutes, whatever.I really like that. If anyone wants
to look that up, aggregation ofmarginal change. You've got to you've got
to read that story. It's it'sreally cool. Um, excuse me,
(28:51):
my throat that little allergy. California. The leaves are coming out and the
flowers are blooming here, so it'sin the air. I'm just looking at
my notes here and forgive me.One of the things that I'm talking more
about what you're doing, excuse me. One of the things that Rachel brought
(29:17):
up yesterday, and I felt thisreally resonated with me because it is something
that I have done for many,many years. She talked about journaling the
importance of journaling and writing your thoughtsdown, and she said a lot of
people think that, oh my gosh, I've got to write something down every
day. You know, it justseems like another task, if you will,
(29:37):
I feel stressed about it, shesays, No, I mean,
you don't have to write every day. But she says, it's it helps
us to reset our brain. Whenwe do that, we're able to articulate
and actually put down on paper whatwe're actually thinking, and then you go
back and read it and like,wow, that's actually pretty profound. A
day helps me to really kind toorganize my thoughts and make it concrete on
(30:03):
what it is I'm thinking about orstruggling with, and that for me,
it has been a great benefit overmy life is journaling. I love the
journal And she said, there's otherways to do it. She said,
you can there's apps, there's videoapps and um, different ways that you
can do that. You can geton the phone and and you know,
(30:23):
do it through their phone. Youdon't have to actually write it down.
She said that's really been helpful forher. And as we know, she
likes to sing. Michel sings alot, so she finds something that,
um that she's passionate about that hasnothing to do with or work necessarily,
although she's incorporated it. So nowshe talked about that how important it is
(30:44):
for us to find, you know, things that bring joy on a on
a regular basis that we enjoy andare passionate about. Like you know,
maybe working out in the jam itbrings brings you joy. I don't you
know. I know it. Ienjoy that too. But there's other things
that we all like to do.So what I mean, what other things
(31:04):
do you do? Well? I'msharing, but yeah, so let me
let me speak to that specifically.So there's a huge part when it comes
to behavioral health in processing our journeybecause I was a epic failure. That's
what led to my burnout. Inever took the time to stop and pause
and process what was going on.So there's a reason now again. And
(31:29):
I'll give a high five to everybodyout there who who can do journal and
who likes that. I would rathershovel a horsetable than journal. I just
absolutely It is not from my personalprofile. I can't do that. However,
However I do that in my mind. I do that every single at
the end of my business day,I take time to process that. There's
(31:51):
a reason why the kings of oldhad scribes write down every single thing of
their day and it was read backto them. And I believe the best
kings were the ones who had readback to them before they went to sleep
so they could process. Okay,maybe this needs to be followed up tomorrow.
Wow, we actually did have agreat day. I didn't perceive it
that way. Winding things down.It can be huge to take that time
(32:15):
every single day. I started offdoing it on a Saturday, and it
is my goal. I'm not goingto say that I'm currently succeeding on a
daily but it is my goal todo it every single day to process that
day, and I try to gothrough the events. I'll go through my
calendar, I'll go through how Ifelt about that day, what really took
place? Are there anything else thatI need to do? Well? Can
(32:36):
I learn from that? And emotionallynot just the data. Emotionally engaging those
things along the way helps our stressand helps us be able to manage that
load. And yes, if youbelieve me, I'm with you all the
way, Jeff. If you're ableto do journaling, I believe that is
the best way to do that.If you're like me and it's just a
(32:57):
it's that extra challenge, or youjust can't do that, at least take
that time to plot, to pause, and to process what's been going on.
And I don't do it every day, and there's times where I've gone
months without doing it. Um Andmost of the time when I have been
doing it every day, I'm goingthrough something very stressful. UM So,
yeah, no, I really appreciatethat. UM So, what you're kind
(33:22):
of talking about is kind of likeyou said, you're evaluating the day.
I really like that. Um.I thought about the scribes. I never
thought of that before you know,these kings had these scribes. I wouldn't
mind having a scribe mind sitting behindme. Yeah, there you goos.
Um. So in doing that,when you can reevaluate the day, you
(33:44):
can you can really um put someum some color to it, and you
can say, yeah, you knowthis, this went well, you know
it was a good day. Right, I did accomplish that, rather than
saying, oh my gosh, theworld's coming doing and I didn't get everything
done. I wanted to get done. And they're that kind of plays into
gratitude too, right, right,right, and perspective right. We often
(34:06):
get wrapped up into the It's verysimilar to meteorological events right here and here
in Pennsylvania where I live. Imean, people remember the big snowstorms and
they look back at that like itwas the norm and they were growing up.
No, it was just that onetime when you were twelve years old
that left its mark in your brain. You've actually got, you know,
an average that snowfall every year.So we only remember those extremes, the
(34:27):
highs and the lows, and itcan be huge for us to stay balanced,
to stay balanced by reviewing all theevents of the day and how we
felt about those things because things aretypically not as bad or as good sometimes
as we really perceive them to bein the moment and help us stay more
level managing that load. Yeah,you and I both know that that is
(34:52):
something that is amongst top elite athletesabout being level right, not getting too
high, not getting too low,so that you can be in the moment
and perform. Um. There's applicationhere um definitely in our own personal lives
for that as well. And Ifound that through my own life as well,
(35:13):
is that sometimes you know, somethingis presented to me or family members
going through something, my wife's ventingabout something, and I've got to kind
of take a step back and notget too emotionally attached to that and say,
Okay, it's probably not as badas we think it is. It's
usually not right right. Yeah.So, I mean, we have a
(35:37):
lot of girls in our family,so there's always something going on. I
think three fourths of our grand twentytwo grandkids or girls, there's always something
happening there with that. So,um, we could go on this,
John, I would love it ifwe could maybe circle back with you again
(35:58):
and talk about this again, becauseI just feel like this is something that
we need to continue to talk aboutUM and get out to you know,
the community, and they let peopleknow there's resources, there's you know,
there is there is people out therethat really can bring tools and knowledge and
(36:19):
help UM with whatever you're struggling withUM. So just before we sign off,
maybe just give us a little UMsummary on Mazzetti and Sullivan and kind
of you know, we've kind ofalluded to some of the stuff you're doing,
but what what are some of theother things that maybe we could you
know, take away from what youguys are doing for the business community and
(36:43):
their employees. Yeah, and youprobably understand when I talk we're refer to
having a more robust plan. There'sgoing to be personal engagement. You're going
to every group will get a dedicatedclient solution specialist. We do offer those
types of renewable sessions. You're alwaysgoing to get a live person that cares,
is qualified and certified. Those typesof things resonate with people. But
(37:06):
something else that employers need to beaware of is that we do a lot
of job benchmarking and we take thosesoft skills for the role. We work
with leadership teams. People are lookingfor things to attract and keep employees right
now and understanding who your ideal employeeshould be, what that should look like
in a soft skills the regular tradeskills can be learned, those things can
(37:30):
be taught. You're left with thepersonality if you don't get that right personality
person So being able to do thatin a job benchmark, we have seen
tremendous results over the years, andnow more than ever, we are doing
so many cases of that around thecountry to benchmark positions so they know who
(37:51):
they're really looking for. There canbe a demand and you just want to
fill the slot, so to speak, and that is not the best way
to hire the first time around.So looking for those right candidates and also
what happens is those employees stay engagedand they understand and they get a better
fitting employee and it makes them moreproductive as well. So it's really a
(38:12):
win win. It helps their mentalhealth, it's going to save you down
the road exponentially. So that's somethingthat I think is a differentiator for us
as we really try to be thatstrategic partner with our clients, not just
be a vendor. We want tounderstand the challenges that you're having in the
HR world. So that we canprovide those solutions with what you're already paying
(38:35):
for, not try to upsell something. So we're built to be the business
partner. And I believe that's whatseparates us many times from our competitors.
So that's great. I didn't knowthat about you guys, and talk about
a relevant topic right now. Andyou know the workforce and as we know,
you know there's more people out there. Well, there's a lot of
jobs. There's a lot of peoplethat are that are not. Our employers
(38:59):
are struggling with us or to findtalent right now right and hire people,
um, and they don't really understanda lot of time to why they're not
able to land those people that arelooking for jobs quite frankly, So that
that's a great Um cool you guyshave that I didn't realize you had available.
That's good to know going forward forus as well. Well, my
(39:20):
friend, I'm gonna let you getback to your your life, UM,
enjoy your rest of your day andhave a safe trip home to the family
and and your pets. I knowyou've got a dog or two, um
you need you want to get backto and I hope the weather is turning
around for you guys like it ishere for us. Well, we're getting
(39:40):
the much needed rain that we need. That's the positive angle. Oh okay,
sending some of that our way.We could use some of that too.
Oh, my brother, I appreciateyou. It's good talking with you,
um as usual. Always good tosee you and and you know,
converse. So you have a blessedday and you know, stay safe out
(40:02):
there. Thanks so much, Jeff, have a great day, all right.
Take care.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!