Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Big B Show rolls on live the Lot one hundred studio.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Of course, that's the day Trader Trio live and in
person right there here at the bar. It's cost the Marry, Regodwin, Breag,
Carob and of course Sully.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
All right.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
We met a really great guy named Jeffrey Mechler a
couple of weeks ago in studio and with Adaptis Therapeutics.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
They are Public Trader Unstoctable I n DP And it
was really this interesting conversation not just about bio Parma.
What are you laughing at?
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Because we spent as much time talking about Ohio State football.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yes we as.
Speaker 5 (01:06):
We was just going to say, well.
Speaker 6 (01:07):
Twenty minute one on one interview we had that we
had a business focus.
Speaker 5 (01:12):
It was so and what did you learn there that
you didn't It was it.
Speaker 6 (01:15):
Was from New York and you told me about a
lot of good places I need to go.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Jeffrey Mechler, I bring you the CEO friend of the
program already.
Speaker 5 (01:23):
I don't think that's what the interview is. It wasn't
a food show. We didn't come back because we had
a cooking show interview in aroundity or something something on
your company. Sorry, Okay, there.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
Listen, man, great to see you. Glad that we're recovering
you on a regular basis here. Uh, going forward, let's
review and talk about, uh, you know, what does it
mean to be a clinical stage asset company that's building
uh on the hopes of tumor regression. I think is
what you said when you were in studio last time
talking about it.
Speaker 7 (01:59):
So, first of all, I think I failed the first
test here because everyone remembers I high of state football
and restaurants in New York. Then I'm gonna try again
to tell you about tumor regressions.
Speaker 4 (02:13):
Thank you talk about so talk about that because because
you guys have this proprietary platform, and I'm saying this right,
you're exploiting you said, an exploiting bacteria, uh, the ability
to activate our own cells or something to that too.
And I was listening, I was thinking about the restaurant.
Speaker 8 (02:31):
So the whole premise of our company is this observation
that when people have bacteria infections, sometimes the cancers regress.
And this goes back literally centuries. So what we're doing
is utilizing that historic observation with and pairing with today's
(02:53):
knowledge of immunotherapy. Particularly we know what toll like receptors
and not in sting, And they're basically names for all
these different kind of agonists that exists that activate our
immune system, and many of them are on gram negative bacteria.
So we essentially took the gram negative bacteria, we engineer
(03:16):
it in a way that we can safely give it
to humans, but still use all of those immune agonists
that are on the bacteria. I love that video or
I love that visional there that sly because it shows
how we engage both different parts of the innate and
the adaptive immune system. So most modern therapies, whether they're
(03:37):
checkpoint inhibitors, are car t they're really attacking or activating
one part of the immune system. Where we're doing it
in this broad general sense.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
Jeff Beckler, CEO of Adaptos Therapeutics. Their ticker symbol is IDP.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
Jeff. As you peel back the layers of.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
This, as you continue to go on, you find out
is our body set up?
Speaker 5 (04:01):
Has our bodies have our bodies always been set up
for this type of immunotherapy.
Speaker 8 (04:08):
Well, look, what cancer is is just your cell programming
gone awry. And this happens all the time and in
most courses, your immune cells pick up on it. This
cell didn't divide, right, this is not foreign right. And
the B cells, the T cells, dendritic macrofact they all
kind of in coordination go after these things. Cancer occurs
(04:32):
when for whatever reason, that doesn't happen, and then the
cancer really kind of resets your immune system. It systemically
reprograms it to do the Jedi mind game, saying these
are not the cells you're looking for, and then the
immune cells go and bypass it. And what we've learned
(04:52):
over the last couple decades are there are certain ways
we can trick the immune cells to get back to
doing what their designed to do. So the short answer
your question is, we've always had this ability, but what
happens in cancer is, for whatever reason, our body seems
to miss that particular cell type, and all we're trying
(05:13):
to do is reset it so the body can do
what it's designed to do.
Speaker 5 (05:17):
Jeff.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
Since you were here at our studio, you folks released
your fourth quarter you're in twenty twenty four financial results
and gave us an update, which was pretty interesting stuff
because some of the milestones you hit that we sort
of glossed over in studio because we don't have enough
time are pretty significant here, and if you go back
and kind of look at how you were communicating with
(05:41):
shareholders last year, you kind of told everybody all of
this was going to happen, and then you delivered on it.
Talk about some of these highlights.
Speaker 8 (05:47):
Well, what we're really proud about in the fourth quarter
release is announcing that we passed this threshold of twenty
patients that had been being dosed weekly, and a few
of them have what's considered stable disease, which means they
their diseases. We scan the cancer, we pick lesions, they
(06:09):
scan them again in eight weeks, and they see if
they've grown, and if they haven't grown meaningfully, we call
that stable disease. So what we're seeing is two things. One,
most importantly, we've been able to dose more than twenty
patients weekly and we're seeing some safety out of that.
But we're also seeing a glimpse of some immune activity.
(06:33):
Now we also know that from our immune profiling, we
are kicking up the immune system. So this is kind
of a crescendo, and it's building for when we later
in the first half of this year announce and start
dosing in the combination therapy, and when we do that,
that's when we're hoping to see real signals of efficacy.
(06:54):
And again this is something we expect this year to
really dig into. How many patients we get all of
that will determine when we dose our first patient. We
have a very stage safety oriented approach and so the
first few patients will be slow, but once in the
second half we get going, we hope to see the results.
(07:15):
And the one thing I can promise your viewers is
we'll give you the results. I can't promise it all
work or it won't, you know, if I could do.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
That, there are a lot of other things.
Speaker 8 (07:27):
You know, We've been very proud over the three and
a half years, which is a really short time in biopharma,
to go from creating the company to getting a clinical
trial started, to getting a proof of concept studies started.
And this has always been for us. We thought we would,
you know, four ish years, we'd be able to get
(07:50):
an answer. Does this stuff work the way we think
it does?
Speaker 6 (07:53):
Jeffrey, remind me, is there a specific cancer type that
you're going after or is this just generalid cancer tumors?
Speaker 8 (08:02):
So what we're starting with our solid tumors, we have
a subset of solid tumors we're going after, and essentially
it's a patcellular, liver, pancreatic, head and neck, breast, cold erectal.
These are cancers that and their advanced stage patients of
(08:22):
these cancers, but they're solid tumors that we feel from
our preclinical have the best chance for us to see
a signal.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Hey, Jeff, So part of this, part of the milestones
obviously were the new patents in China, Japan, Israel and such,
but but uh one was one of the highlights was
in respect to getting clinical trial authorization from Health Canada.
That's a big one. Talk about that's pretty significant stuff.
Talk about that and what that?
Speaker 5 (08:49):
What that opens the door for well Canada?
Speaker 8 (08:55):
How do I say Canada is a great place to
do clinical trials. We have always wanted to open some
sites up in Canada from the fact that there are
Canadian researchers there, investigators who share our passion and also
have patients that we really want to access, particularly like
(09:15):
a patacellular carcinoma. We haven't done a great job recruiting
HCC patients so far, and part of it is is
the sites we currently have are not big HCC sites.
Where in Canada. There are a couple that we plan
to join, but just getting Health Canada on board, there's
lots of questions. We're still having conversations with them, but
(09:36):
they gave us the green light a few weeks ago,
and what we hope to do is start when we
start enrolling here in the combination study later this year,
that we'll be able to access these Canadian sites and
get that patacellular carsonoma patients quickly.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Has become one of our favorite guests, of course. Oh
he's the favorite. He's the favorite, and you'll see him again.
Speaker 4 (09:58):
I'm making him come on there every week with us
so we can have the least you're gonna come back
in San Diego.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
He is Jeff Meckler, CEO in Depthess Therapeutics. They're techt
symbol and I am excuse me.
Speaker 9 (10:07):
D I want to come show show dot Com.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
De Big B Show rolls on in over one hundred
(11:14):
and seventy five countries, all.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
The ships at sea.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
As always we say a special thank you to the
right men and women of the United States Armed Forces.
We always thank the DTT as well. Day Trader Trio.
Back here at the bar, Mike Haryburg Godwin, Greg Tadarov
our executive producer, of course, Sully And we.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Have a special guest right here in the biotech biopharma
center of the universe.
Speaker 7 (11:35):
We do.
Speaker 5 (11:36):
He might be watching us in New York City, may
be listening to us in Texas.
Speaker 4 (11:39):
You might be watching us in Dubai because of American
forces networking one hundred and seventy five countries and.
Speaker 5 (11:44):
All the ships at sea.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
But you're probably watching us on biz TV one hundred
and twenty five million TV holls every night.
Speaker 5 (11:49):
And Mike, what do you got here?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Mister Jim Joyce who has been a friend, a former neighbor.
That's how much of a friend he has been to
before you were evicted or the fun he.
Speaker 5 (12:00):
Had Kicknai was the one that called the cop.
Speaker 4 (12:05):
Uh ceo, Hey, you gotta talk you about your partner
on the air.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
CEO of Seaking Therapeutics Incorporated their ticker symbol of course
s I G Y. He is also an inventor man
a former Denver Bronco. Are you really sure did one
of the best ever come out of the University of Maryland?
I'm done blowing Sunshine.
Speaker 5 (12:26):
Was a Raider fan. I can't believe you even mentioned
it well.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Once once he found out I was a Raider fan
when you moved up, yeah, a little bit so so.
Speaker 10 (12:34):
Mike lived across the street from us, and uh during
during the pandemic, I welcomed him to the world headquarters
of Seagin Therapeutics.
Speaker 5 (12:44):
We started.
Speaker 10 (12:45):
It was and it was it was a plastic costco
table and people walk by, Welcome, Welcome to the world
headquarters of Seagan Therapy.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
It is. I would go down.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
I would go down our street with our leaf blower,
and they look in there. Jim was seeking deal when
you're out there in a perfect time now looking at
now in the Big BIS show.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
Bio Farmas has taken quite a journey in the last
few year twenty twenty three twenty three really hard for
biopharma companies. JP Morgan comes back last year being your
twenty twenty.
Speaker 5 (13:17):
Four and says, this is the year, but you're not
gonna raise money the first quarter.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
Sure enough, you could raise money to the second quarter
last year, and then the whole thing once again started
waning again and had a really tough twenty twenty four.
It seems as though capital markets are open for biotech.
Biopharma seems like things are looking good now.
Speaker 10 (13:33):
It seems through the worst of it starting to open up.
But you know, if you're an investor in small cap
or microcap, you better know your CEO.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
Well yeah, well, well listen. But I'm talking about as
a group. I think you're in the right place at
the right time.
Speaker 4 (13:45):
Now you come to be twenty middle of twenty twenty three,
I'm thinking, man, you had to we were swimming through cement.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
Everyone was in your don't you.
Speaker 10 (13:52):
Think, No, I that's very much the case. But I
think there's a transition in our industry as it relates
to therapeutics, you know, against the merger, infectious disease disorders
or sepsis or things of that nature, where there's a
trend that you know, trend towards medical technologies, blood purification technology.
Speaker 5 (14:11):
Well, and I think that's and you're in the new
frontier here.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Hence hence the word sepsis heard about. And I have
an antheesy that is going through that right like as
we speak, as we're interviewing here here, talk about the problem,
talk about the solution, talk about this new industry that's
emerging that you guys even announced in the press.
Speaker 10 (14:29):
Really if you do. Yeah, it's an emerging new industry,
like twenty years into making.
Speaker 5 (14:33):
Yeah, that's how it always works.
Speaker 10 (14:34):
So right, that is that's how it works.
Speaker 5 (14:35):
We just thought out about Today's what it started today.
Speaker 10 (14:38):
So sepsis, this is a disregulated immune response to infection.
So it's the transition if somebody is suffering from a
life threatening viral infection like COVID nineteen. You know, when
it becomes a serious severe infection, it transitions into sepsis.
Sepsist in general number one killer in US hospitals, one
in three.
Speaker 5 (14:58):
Deaths because because it's an't about a resistant is it.
Speaker 10 (15:00):
Not in many cases? Yes, But something that's fascinating about
sepsis in general, and this was learned, you know, as
devastating as COVID was, sometimes we learned things that really
weren't known before. But there was a study of individuals
that was severe COVID infection at George Washington University Hospital
(15:22):
and they enrolled ninety six individuals in this study and
they quantified that these individuals, ninety five of ninety six
had circulating bacterial toxin called endotoxin.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
And in this circulating back that means it's circulating it's
I mean, it's not here anymore over here now.
Speaker 5 (15:39):
It's in the bloodstream, man.
Speaker 10 (15:41):
But it's one of those riddled me this moment because
only three of the ninety five people diagnosed to have
circulating bacterial toxins actually had a bacterial infection. So one
of the things we learned with COVID is that when
you have an infectious response, the immune system response, it
produces pro and flatlammatory cytokines. The overproduction of pro inflammatory
(16:03):
side of kinds called the cytokine storm, and a lot
of people heard about that phenomenon with COVID, but what
they didn't recognize is that inflammatory process creates permeability in
the intestinal wall and it leaks out. You're leaking bacterial
yep and and this is the potent activator of sepsis.
(16:23):
And we didn't know this. We were I was involved
in a Darper program for five years to develop devices
to treat sepsis for wounded warfighters. We didn't have any
idea that this was an important component of sepsis.
Speaker 5 (16:37):
So now we know.
Speaker 10 (16:40):
Damp and down pro inflammatory side of kines addressed the
pathogen source of inflammation, but also address these bacterial toxic.
Speaker 4 (16:47):
So what is Sigin doing is segan have a do
we have the do we have a pathway here for
a treatment, do we have a candidate?
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Are we on the way there?
Speaker 10 (16:55):
Or yeah, we're getting ready to head into human studies.
We've done that's yeah, since since Mike I waved to
him in the morning.
Speaker 5 (17:04):
How was the catalyst?
Speaker 10 (17:05):
By the way, we conducted a whole series of studies
at the University of Michigan to demonstrate the ability to
address these bacterial toxins broad spectrum viral clearance as well
as being able to dampen down excessive you know, inflammatory
cytokine production. Then we moved into animal studies and now
we're getting ready to submit what's called an Investigational Device
(17:26):
Exemption UH to FDA to initiate studies to address this endotoxemia.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
And can I make the assumption that since as you
mentioned in the beginning, that it's the leading cause of
hospital mortality a scepsis that your addressable market is endless for.
Speaker 5 (17:42):
Something like this.
Speaker 10 (17:43):
It's large, but we also have a strategy from a
clinical standpoint. We have an early clinical and commercialization strategy
to start off in dialysis patients. These are end stage
renal disease patients who are being treated three times a
week four hours of treatment. These individuals suffer from endotoxemia
(18:07):
that's created created by the inflammatory response to the regular
dialysis and it shortens their life. Average lifespan once it
on dialysis is five years. It's the same, it's the
same markers we're looking at in STEPSIS, but in this indication,
we don't have to wait for anybody to come into
the ICU.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
They're already.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
This is good news. You said we're going to be scared.
I think this is good. Good about what I'm hearing.
There's part completely different book.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Joyce is the CEO of Seeking Therapeutics. Their ticker symbol
is s I G Y JIM. To the point that
Greg talked about the next big pandemic or what's going
on over in.
Speaker 5 (18:46):
The what's the next coutie going to be?
Speaker 10 (18:49):
I don't know. There's all kinds of stuff floating.
Speaker 5 (18:50):
Over I'm going to get my mask. I'll be right there.
Speaker 10 (18:57):
It used to be like, okay, you know bird Lieu
of two thousand and nine, and that'd be a concern
for a few years, and then there'd be the next
thing ze could pop up or whatever it might be.
But now everything's just like looming at the same time,
and the ability to monitor these diseases is getting.
Speaker 5 (19:14):
More and more. You're not going anywhere. This is like
the mop. We're keeping your hair. We want to make
Greg cry.
Speaker 4 (19:20):
So Chapter two is here. Greg's I could be part
of the show until next week. Marry's out there buying
maps because this me Mike.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Jim all right, Jim joy CEO of Seeking Therapeutics. Much
more to come. We hope the news is better as
a big V show rolls on.
Speaker 5 (19:33):
Keep it here.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
We continue, put the loft one hundred studios, wherever you're watching,
wherever you're listening, Appreciate the riot. That's the day Trader
Trio here at the bar Costa Maryburg Godwin.
Speaker 5 (20:14):
Our executive producer is Grig Totterov.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
Sully's here and Jim Joyce CEO inventor CEO of Seeking Therapeutics.
Speaker 5 (20:22):
Their ticker symbol is s I g Y. You go
to Seeking Therapeutics dot com.
Speaker 4 (20:27):
You see there on the screen here for a radio
audience is go to our website a Big Biz show
dot Com. You've wanted to find out you want to
find out how to get a hold of these guys
and take a look at the eleven most remarkable advances
in healthcare, which is what you invented here?
Speaker 5 (20:41):
Is that the same thing as user that's something different.
Speaker 10 (20:43):
It was previously we started off in previously, I founded
a company here in San Diego, took it from single
shareholders start up to over ten thousand shareholders on nas
deck and we developed the first in industry blood purification device.
That was the first therapy of its approved to treat
a pandemic virus by FDA. And that was a bowl
(21:03):
of virus and that was, you know, awarded with a
multitude of awards, drop invention at BI magazine, Top eleven
Medical Breakthrough. But that was the first generation product that
was limited to broad spectrum clearance of viral pathogens. What
we're developing now with Seagan Therapy is a device that
(21:24):
can have broad spectrum clearance of viral pathogens, address these
translocated bacterial toxins and dampen down the excessive inflammatory response.
Speaker 4 (21:35):
The inflammatory sides seems to be a buzzwords like sepsis
is these days. Not to minimize what you guys are treating,
but you know when it gets to the radar population.
Now it's a buzzword some of you been working on
for fifteen years talk about. With respect to the sepsis
response and the next pandemic that we talk about, it
all sort of falls into one thing because you've got sepsis,
you've got pandemic. We got information, we got cancer, we
(21:56):
got so I mean it's kind of one long tree
and this is the bad news.
Speaker 10 (22:00):
They're all connected. Yeah, they're all connected. And something that
was remarkable with COVID nineteen was the ability to have
vaccines developed within a year prevented it.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
Let's stop down in for a second, because what I
think many people don't know is that vaccines are a
recipe where you plug in the coudie.
Speaker 5 (22:20):
So it's not you're not redoing the wheel every time. Correct?
Speaker 4 (22:22):
Is am I excer in saying when vaccines come out,
we don't have to reinvent from the start, because I
think I think one of the big mis numbers during
COVID was that the we rushed to a vaccine when
in reality, you might correct me if I'm wrong, didn't
those vaccine companies just get to skip the line and
get That's how it was done so quickly or was
it rushed?
Speaker 5 (22:41):
Because I think the FDA, what.
Speaker 4 (22:42):
FDA is a long, arduous process just because of the
amount of NDA sill was out there.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
So what really happened?
Speaker 10 (22:48):
So I was in a program I mentioned earlier, this
darker program to advance Blood purification Therapies Parallel. DARPO was
a program to accelerate vaccine production vaccine development production based
on mRNA vaccines.
Speaker 5 (23:03):
And acceleration does that mean rushed or does that just mean.
Speaker 10 (23:06):
Accelerat It means accelerated development.
Speaker 5 (23:07):
Okay, is that a bad thing potentially?
Speaker 10 (23:10):
Well, if you look at the journal Lancet, they had
a publication on the advancement of the MODERNA vaccine and
then the other vaccine and they projected that in the
first year of the availability of that vaccine worldwide, it's
saved between fourteen to eighteen million lives.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
Good.
Speaker 10 (23:26):
Thanks, so very powerful. But what it changed was the
environment vaccines preventative what are post exposure therapies. So historically
the fastest vaccine development history prior to this was four years,
and so you would never know if a vaccine would
be developed or not. So they were always competitive with
(23:47):
antiviral drugs.
Speaker 5 (23:48):
So there's the question.
Speaker 4 (23:49):
Four years for vaccine development versus eight months is what
we've witness and.
Speaker 10 (23:55):
Coach putting the vaccine in people's arms within the year.
Speaker 4 (23:58):
Was that because the FDA was able to assess this,
or was that because the science was solid, or we
just don't know yet.
Speaker 10 (24:06):
I don't think you can say definitively the problem you
have when you have a new outbreak. You use the
perfect word assess, So how do you treat it? If
you have a post exposure therapy? How do you like
we're developing? How do you run a controlled study? You
can't uh and and the government legislation says there's a
reliance on animal models, but for most of these emerging
(24:29):
pandemic threats there is no animal model s s so
well challenge.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
So it's on that subject we don't know, You don't
know during that problem, that's correct. Now you're the guy
to ask this question to Okay, five years post COVID,
five years post the beginning of COVID, Okay, what would
you do differently now, knowing what you know now in
your own business, knowing what you know, what we've all
experienced and you seeing and you have you have a
you have a unique seat in the stadium on this one.
(24:55):
What would you do different? What do you think we
should have done this? What would we do different next time?
To make this more I can't say the word paleatee well,
but make.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
It so well.
Speaker 10 (25:02):
I think there's some basic things like have mask available.
That's probably a good start right the But you know,
as it relates to responding, you know, vaccine development I
think is critical. But with the ability to develop vaccines
at a rapid pace, you know, the whole concept historically
(25:25):
of trying to also develop an anti viral drug which
starts when a new virus emerges, and that can take
five or more years, you know, that's no longer an
appropriate exposure strategy right now. Post exposures are predicated on
what we're doing with blood purification technologies, and they're also
(25:46):
important because they can not only be first line countermeasures
and be available right at the outset of an outbreak,
but they also have commercialized, commercial applications in mainstream medicine.
So it's not a countermeasure that you worry about being
put in the stockpile and then expiring and have to
be repurchased every three years. This is something that is
(26:07):
there's an inventory. It can be used for mainstream so
medical indications.
Speaker 4 (26:11):
So what's gonna be so is that therevens what's the
treatment strategy going to be in your in your opinion?
And the next is it you're just talked about having
a stockpile, but then maybe not knowing that we can
depend on that stockpile.
Speaker 5 (26:22):
What's the treatment strategy?
Speaker 10 (26:23):
Well, I'll replay what happened with COVID nineteen. First four
therapies approved to treat COVID nineteen. They were not a vaccine,
not an anti viral drug. They were all four blood
purification technologies. One was for pathogen cont.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
I forget the name of that beause I remember that
it was called Do you recall the name of the of.
Speaker 10 (26:42):
The path The pathway was called Emergency Use Authorization Pathway
UH And the first four therapies under this pathway were
blood purification technologies, one to control infection that addressed the
pathogen itself. The other three were designed to dampen down
excessive pro inflammatory cytokine production. Our device performs all of
(27:05):
those functions, plus it addresses the bacterial toxins that locate
from the gut leak into the bloodstream and cause a
very disregulated immune response to infection. So and that was
not known as being a primary target at that says
that would be.
Speaker 5 (27:20):
We're a better spot now we are where we were.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
I'd like to think, So, okay, what about the back
to chapter one?
Speaker 2 (27:25):
What about the plexiglass shields and restaurants? Do we go
back to those two for the next well, because you know,
the bacteria would stop at the past, would never go
higher than the plexiglass either.
Speaker 4 (27:37):
Joy Well, seeking therapeutics, I've been a question for you
because I did some research and this also goes into
chemo chemotherapy. What you guys were talking about with with
your with the therapy in terms of delivery method.
Speaker 10 (27:52):
Correct, yeah, this is this is a pipeline product. But
we were dismayed, you know, we had we initiate a
relationship with some researchers who were trying to improve the
delivery of chemotherapy as well as immunotherapeutic antibodies, and we
were dismayed at how poorly these compounds are delivered. In
both cases chemotherapy, you know, typically less than three percent
(28:17):
of the drug is actually delivered to tumor cell targets.
The rest is also with all.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
This targeted tumor therapy all hear about and you know
the well on the TV, commercials, in the radio and
so on and so forth.
Speaker 10 (28:28):
Well, the targeted therapy. You know, then all of a
sudden you have an antibody component that can selectively target
where it's going to get to. But antibodies bind exquisitely
to receptor targets that are on the cancer target. But
these receptor targets are oftentimes in a lot of other
places that aren't the targets, and those those act as
decoys that intercept.
Speaker 5 (28:48):
You're putting in the drug advilace that doesn't belong.
Speaker 10 (28:50):
Yeah, so so yeah, so we we've we've developed intellectual
property to take immunotherapeutic antibodies, attach them to a bead,
put them in a blood purification device, and sweep out
these decoys prior to the delivery of the drug itself.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
What are you most excited about for the rest of
this year, as much as you can share with us
as a SECO of a public company in the next
five years, What are you most topping up and down
about right now?
Speaker 10 (29:13):
Well, I think what we're doing in cancer is very executable.
But the clinical study we're getting ready to kick off
with our lead products seegan therapy.
Speaker 5 (29:22):
That's a.
Speaker 10 (29:24):
That's a real value driver for us because this is
a small feasibility study twelve to fifteen subjects, and we
successfully navigate through this, then we can bridge into multiple
pivotal studies as a device for approval in the indications
such as the SRD indication I mentioned earlier, emerging infectious
disease and sepsis.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
So in the capital information problem that we saw in
biofarmer the last couple of years.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
You guys have a runway for your studies and stuff.
You feel pretty good about.
Speaker 10 (29:53):
Your Yeah, our cost of running the study is pretty minimal,
and we have a good collaborator from the Diete also
this industry, one of the leaders in the industry there,
and uh, you know, we've always been very cognizant of
being uh you know, keeping our burn rates so we
can have flexibility to do things.
Speaker 5 (30:12):
Well, it's kids, I'm feeling better and better, but I
still feel better. Greg, you feel okay, Well, I'm all.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Right, Jim joy CEO Seeking Therapeutics. Of course, their ticker
symbol s I G Y. I was there on day
one in his garage for all.
Speaker 5 (30:32):
Right, keep it here. A lots more to come with
the big biz.
Speaker 10 (30:42):
H m m.
Speaker 2 (31:09):
Hmm.
Speaker 4 (31:13):
You have potato skins, we have treatments.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Is the big miss show.
Speaker 5 (31:23):
Potato skins and six Jared's Apple Beans.
Speaker 4 (31:28):
Applebee's is the Little elson Or of TJ Fridays, just
like Tinder is the Lake Elsner Bumble okay of online dating.
Speaker 5 (31:35):
Remember that I agree. He wrote the book Future Business
and the Naked Entrepreneurs. You're listen, you're marketing genius. Mister. Listen.
Speaker 4 (31:45):
We we are brought to you by outback Seakhouse with
the authentic Australian food.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
They've got blue and onions growing down the sides of
the roads.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
And and he is the son of a son of
a son of a son of a son of some
from Pearth.
Speaker 5 (31:57):
Have you ever seen a blue on onion down there
in Australia? You know?
Speaker 4 (32:04):
Have you ever said do not say shrimp Barbie or
good day? I will all right, Hey, I want to
talk to you mister. You are an expert in goal setting,
an expert in avoiding disasters in business and personal life
from unplanning, and one way you do it you and
I've talked about this off the heere is you do
(32:25):
bottom up goals versus top down goals?
Speaker 5 (32:27):
Talk about that?
Speaker 11 (32:28):
Yeah, yeah, So for about thirty years I've been coaching, mentoring,
working with entrepreneurs, sitting on their boards of directors and
helping them navigate what's next. And the typical psyche of
an entrepreneur is that they have these rainbows that they
have in their head, and I'm going to try and
match that with some sort of reality. Here's what you
think you can do, here's what we're likely to be
able to do, and somewhere in the middle will meet.
(32:50):
And then the second big thing I'm going to deal
with is that most of them are squirrels. They're running
off to different things at different times. Not that you
know about that, Sally.
Speaker 3 (32:58):
Fish.
Speaker 5 (33:00):
We are. This is the reason why we're fish. We
are we are fish in a barrel. We are squirrel.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
It's so so continued. So how does the bottom up
thing work? Because I think that's interesting.
Speaker 11 (33:09):
So we start by creating three separate strategies with three
separate sets of financial so it's a good better best format.
Good is budget for the year, which is typically a
little bit more than last year, and then we've got better,
which is a stretch target, so we get on the
line that they could actually achieve that if everything worked
out for us as.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
It should do for the year. And then best is
the rainbows.
Speaker 11 (33:30):
Now, rainbows only happen if it snows in Florida, dogs
and cats start playing together, and men start understanding women.
Speaker 3 (33:37):
And if these think the line, then.
Speaker 11 (33:40):
We can hit that that best budget, that best strategy.
But aligne the rainbows top down doesn't always work. We've
got to set our goals bottom up so they match
somewhere in the middle.
Speaker 5 (33:52):
All of this, all of.
Speaker 4 (33:53):
This comes down to just finding another way to plan ahead, correct, Yeah,
a little bit.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Yeah, So you can trage like the three of them.
Speaker 11 (34:00):
When things go sideways as they will when the world
changes as it does as the year goes on, then
you can easily pick a different lane and go all right,
that's not working for us, but this might. Let's adjust
it up and down so we don't surprise ourselves or
to support ourselves in the process, because if we've got
to catch that halfway through the year, you're never going
to pick it up because the rest of the year
you're always behind the eight ball, and it just never
(34:23):
quite aligns for you at all, leads to is disappointment.
Speaker 5 (34:26):
Okay tooy.
Speaker 6 (34:27):
That actually brings up a good point because I know
I fall into the trap of I might do some strategizing.
I think we talked about this last time you sat
for Google docking ball. There is absolutely Google docs and sheets.
Speaker 5 (34:37):
I love them both.
Speaker 6 (34:38):
I'll set them all up, it's all pretty, I'll send
them out to the people that need to know, and
then maybe I file it away and I completely forget
to come back to it. So you look the part
I love the strategy and is this a problem and
how can you help people like me?
Speaker 3 (34:53):
So there's two parts to that.
Speaker 11 (34:54):
Once you've got the plan in places, it's kind of crazy,
but we all do it. We put it in draw
and don't refer to it, just like you to explaining.
So the second thing we're going to do is just
go back and keep checking it. And for us, that
means we're going to look at the bottom up goals
and the unit economics of the business. So dissect a transaction,
a sale, a department, a region you work in, a
(35:15):
product that you're trying to launch, and understand that the
micro economics of the business will match the macro strategy
you put in place. The only way to do that
is to keep coming back and referring to it on
a regular basis.
Speaker 5 (35:26):
So I was thinking.
Speaker 4 (35:27):
The other thing, too, is couldn't you attach it to
Because they're always spinning multiple plates, it seems like couldn't
you attach it like the last thing on your list
there as you plan to another thing that you're actively
working on, which kind of forces you.
Speaker 5 (35:39):
To do that.
Speaker 4 (35:39):
I'll tell you what I've been doing with regards to
making plans to do something is I email it to
myself and I use my email as my to do list.
Speaker 5 (35:48):
I want to get down to like six or ten emails.
Speaker 4 (35:50):
A night, and there's and and there is that sort
of time where I've had that same damn email and
then you start adopting that feared thing first process.
Speaker 5 (35:57):
I'm not doing that.
Speaker 4 (35:58):
I'm doing that thing first because once you get into it,
it's much like anything else, working out or doing chores
or planning. It's not as bad as you think it's
going to be when you're avoiding.
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Right, No, it's not.
Speaker 11 (36:08):
And I do exactly the same thing. So I send
myself email so it comes back to top of my box.
But it really means you've got to create a habit
and a rhythm and a routine that has you check
it every day, every week, every month, every quarter, as
I do every Monday. Every Monday, I sit down and
go through the same routine and make sure that the
economics bottom up goals, I'm matching the top down strategy
(36:29):
and the rainbows that I've gone to my head that
I think I can create for the Okay, so I want.
Speaker 5 (36:33):
To ask you guy, you guess your cephones list this? Listen?
Speaker 4 (36:35):
Yeah, okay, front page of the cell phone. I tell
you that I told my mom to hit the message goes.
I don't have that like the message, but like every house,
I don't.
Speaker 5 (36:42):
If you want to Apple, start to get it. So
if you'll notice, let me see you se your face is?
I have go to your email section because this is
you don't want to see my don't I want to
see it? This is twenty seventy eighty nine on there.
It has no I want to know. I want to see, like,
what's the number? Oh, it's a lot? What is let's
see mine's twelve? What's yours? What am I looking for?
The number?
Speaker 6 (37:02):
My kids, set up something fancy so you can't see.
Speaker 4 (37:05):
Okay, So what I'm saying is if I see a
person that has three thousand emails on their phone and oh,
oh geez, that strategy doesn't work because they're getting nothing done,
and listen, I know that it's it's I know I'm
wasting my time because I unsubscribe to to crap that
I get all the time jest or whatever.
Speaker 5 (37:23):
But and then you can get.
Speaker 4 (37:24):
It to her for a day or so, oh you
got six new messages. When I wake up, I get
one hundred messages. Is most of it's crap. But if
you're disciplined about it, honestly, it works for me because
when I tell you or you or you email it
to me, because I know that i'll because I've got
I'm so o c d about getting that number down.
I don't want to see those little red dots. I
think that's part of it.
Speaker 6 (37:41):
About this news feature on your you don't have to
email yourself. You can snooze an email.
Speaker 5 (37:46):
What is this?
Speaker 6 (37:47):
This is amazing?
Speaker 5 (37:48):
Do you utilize this? Try you snooze an email?
Speaker 3 (37:50):
I've a bit of a disconnect on this one.
Speaker 11 (37:53):
Is there a reason you don't respond to my emails.
Speaker 5 (38:03):
It's too much reading. So tell me what this snooze
you can.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
Let's say I send something to you and I know
you're not going to give back to me. I'm going
to snooze it until maybe four days from now and
hits you again.
Speaker 2 (38:16):
Yeah, it's called an embargoes when you were gone for
six weeks, that's true.
Speaker 5 (38:23):
Tight, Troy.
Speaker 4 (38:25):
I want to take next week, on Tuesday or Thursday,
whenever you can come back and talk about the reality.
When you do your reality checks on your forecast, something
we haven't really talked about. Because it's easy to make goals,
like's like nine pounds today, learning to surf tomorrow.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
I mean when you're making.
Speaker 4 (38:44):
Yeah, I will be CEO of the company by Thursday,
when you don't check the reality of your goals, because
oftentimes is when you're doing those things.
Speaker 5 (38:52):
I know when I need.
Speaker 4 (38:53):
Spreadsheets, were to be rich by thursday, But you're just planning.
They're just thoughts at this point, and at some point
you got to give some spacer and check the reality, right.
I want to spend some time with that. His name
is Troy Hazard.
Speaker 5 (39:04):
Of course, there's two books, Future trooping 'priduous to day
and after Troy Haaser dot com.
Speaker 4 (39:08):
All this talk of rainbows in bottom makes me hungry
for potato, potatoes.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
Peata can.
Speaker 8 (39:15):
I'm gonna starting now.
Speaker 5 (39:20):
Remember the time when I landed the Texans to record
that album, and I said
Big B Show rolls on live the Lot one hundred studio.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Of course, that's the day Trader Trio live and in
person right there here at the bar. It's cost the Marry, Regodwin, Breag,
Carob and of course Sully.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
All right.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
We met a really great guy named Jeffrey Mechler a
couple of weeks ago in studio and with Adaptis Therapeutics.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
They are Public Trader Unstoctable I n DP And it
was really this interesting conversation not just about bio Parma.
What are you laughing at?
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Because we spent as much time talking about Ohio State football.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yes we as.
Speaker 5 (01:06):
We was just going to say, well.
Speaker 6 (01:07):
Twenty minute one on one interview we had that we
had a business focus.
Speaker 5 (01:12):
It was so and what did you learn there that
you didn't It was it.
Speaker 6 (01:15):
Was from New York and you told me about a
lot of good places I need to go.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Jeffrey Mechler, I bring you the CEO friend of the
program already.
Speaker 5 (01:23):
I don't think that's what the interview is. It wasn't
a food show. We didn't come back because we had
a cooking show interview in aroundity or something something on
your company. Sorry, Okay, there.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
Listen, man, great to see you. Glad that we're recovering
you on a regular basis here. Uh, going forward, let's
review and talk about, uh, you know, what does it
mean to be a clinical stage asset company that's building
uh on the hopes of tumor regression. I think is
what you said when you were in studio last time
talking about it.
Speaker 7 (01:59):
So, first of all, I think I failed the first
test here because everyone remembers I high of state football
and restaurants in New York. Then I'm gonna try again
to tell you about tumor regressions.
Speaker 4 (02:13):
Thank you talk about so talk about that because because
you guys have this proprietary platform, and I'm saying this right,
you're exploiting you said, an exploiting bacteria, uh, the ability
to activate our own cells or something to that too.
And I was listening, I was thinking about the restaurant.
Speaker 8 (02:31):
So the whole premise of our company is this observation
that when people have bacteria infections, sometimes the cancers regress.
And this goes back literally centuries. So what we're doing
is utilizing that historic observation with and pairing with today's
(02:53):
knowledge of immunotherapy. Particularly we know what toll like receptors
and not in sting, And they're basically names for all
these different kind of agonists that exists that activate our
immune system, and many of them are on gram negative bacteria.
So we essentially took the gram negative bacteria, we engineer
(03:16):
it in a way that we can safely give it
to humans, but still use all of those immune agonists
that are on the bacteria. I love that video or
I love that visional there that sly because it shows
how we engage both different parts of the innate and
the adaptive immune system. So most modern therapies, whether they're
(03:37):
checkpoint inhibitors, are car t they're really attacking or activating
one part of the immune system. Where we're doing it
in this broad general sense.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
Jeff Beckler, CEO of Adaptos Therapeutics. Their ticker symbol is IDP.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
Jeff. As you peel back the layers of.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
This, as you continue to go on, you find out
is our body set up?
Speaker 5 (04:01):
Has our bodies have our bodies always been set up
for this type of immunotherapy.
Speaker 8 (04:08):
Well, look, what cancer is is just your cell programming
gone awry. And this happens all the time and in
most courses, your immune cells pick up on it. This
cell didn't divide, right, this is not foreign right. And
the B cells, the T cells, dendritic macrofact they all
kind of in coordination go after these things. Cancer occurs
(04:32):
when for whatever reason, that doesn't happen, and then the
cancer really kind of resets your immune system. It systemically
reprograms it to do the Jedi mind game, saying these
are not the cells you're looking for, and then the
immune cells go and bypass it. And what we've learned
(04:52):
over the last couple decades are there are certain ways
we can trick the immune cells to get back to
doing what their designed to do. So the short answer
your question is, we've always had this ability, but what
happens in cancer is, for whatever reason, our body seems
to miss that particular cell type, and all we're trying
(05:13):
to do is reset it so the body can do
what it's designed to do.
Speaker 5 (05:17):
Jeff.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
Since you were here at our studio, you folks released
your fourth quarter you're in twenty twenty four financial results
and gave us an update, which was pretty interesting stuff
because some of the milestones you hit that we sort
of glossed over in studio because we don't have enough
time are pretty significant here, and if you go back
and kind of look at how you were communicating with
(05:41):
shareholders last year, you kind of told everybody all of
this was going to happen, and then you delivered on it.
Talk about some of these highlights.
Speaker 8 (05:47):
Well, what we're really proud about in the fourth quarter
release is announcing that we passed this threshold of twenty
patients that had been being dosed weekly, and a few
of them have what's considered stable disease, which means they
their diseases. We scan the cancer, we pick lesions, they
(06:09):
scan them again in eight weeks, and they see if
they've grown, and if they haven't grown meaningfully, we call
that stable disease. So what we're seeing is two things. One,
most importantly, we've been able to dose more than twenty
patients weekly and we're seeing some safety out of that.
But we're also seeing a glimpse of some immune activity.
(06:33):
Now we also know that from our immune profiling, we
are kicking up the immune system. So this is kind
of a crescendo, and it's building for when we later
in the first half of this year announce and start
dosing in the combination therapy, and when we do that,
that's when we're hoping to see real signals of efficacy.
(06:54):
And again this is something we expect this year to
really dig into. How many patients we get all of
that will determine when we dose our first patient. We
have a very stage safety oriented approach and so the
first few patients will be slow, but once in the
second half we get going, we hope to see the results.
(07:15):
And the one thing I can promise your viewers is
we'll give you the results. I can't promise it all
work or it won't, you know, if I could do.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
That, there are a lot of other things.
Speaker 8 (07:27):
You know, We've been very proud over the three and
a half years, which is a really short time in biopharma,
to go from creating the company to getting a clinical
trial started, to getting a proof of concept studies started.
And this has always been for us. We thought we would,
you know, four ish years, we'd be able to get
(07:50):
an answer. Does this stuff work the way we think
it does?
Speaker 6 (07:53):
Jeffrey, remind me, is there a specific cancer type that
you're going after or is this just generalid cancer tumors?
Speaker 8 (08:02):
So what we're starting with our solid tumors, we have
a subset of solid tumors we're going after, and essentially
it's a patcellular, liver, pancreatic, head and neck, breast, cold erectal.
These are cancers that and their advanced stage patients of
(08:22):
these cancers, but they're solid tumors that we feel from
our preclinical have the best chance for us to see
a signal.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Hey, Jeff, So part of this, part of the milestones
obviously were the new patents in China, Japan, Israel and such,
but but uh one was one of the highlights was
in respect to getting clinical trial authorization from Health Canada.
That's a big one. Talk about that's pretty significant stuff.
Talk about that and what that?
Speaker 5 (08:49):
What that opens the door for well Canada?
Speaker 8 (08:55):
How do I say Canada is a great place to
do clinical trials. We have always wanted to open some
sites up in Canada from the fact that there are
Canadian researchers there, investigators who share our passion and also
have patients that we really want to access, particularly like
(09:15):
a patacellular carcinoma. We haven't done a great job recruiting
HCC patients so far, and part of it is is
the sites we currently have are not big HCC sites.
Where in Canada. There are a couple that we plan
to join, but just getting Health Canada on board, there's
lots of questions. We're still having conversations with them, but
(09:36):
they gave us the green light a few weeks ago,
and what we hope to do is start when we
start enrolling here in the combination study later this year,
that we'll be able to access these Canadian sites and
get that patacellular carsonoma patients quickly.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Has become one of our favorite guests, of course. Oh
he's the favorite. He's the favorite, and you'll see him again.
Speaker 4 (09:58):
I'm making him come on there every week with us
so we can have the least you're gonna come back
in San Diego.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
He is Jeff Meckler, CEO in Depthess Therapeutics. They're techt
symbol and I am excuse me.
Speaker 9 (10:07):
D I want to come show show dot Com.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
De Big B Show rolls on in over one hundred
(11:14):
and seventy five countries, all.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
The ships at sea.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
As always we say a special thank you to the
right men and women of the United States Armed Forces.
We always thank the DTT as well. Day Trader Trio.
Back here at the bar, Mike Haryburg Godwin, Greg Tadarov
our executive producer, of course, Sully And we.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Have a special guest right here in the biotech biopharma
center of the universe.
Speaker 7 (11:35):
We do.
Speaker 5 (11:36):
He might be watching us in New York City, may
be listening to us in Texas.
Speaker 4 (11:39):
You might be watching us in Dubai because of American
forces networking one hundred and seventy five countries and.
Speaker 5 (11:44):
All the ships at sea.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
But you're probably watching us on biz TV one hundred
and twenty five million TV holls every night.
Speaker 5 (11:49):
And Mike, what do you got here?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Mister Jim Joyce who has been a friend, a former neighbor.
That's how much of a friend he has been to
before you were evicted or the fun he.
Speaker 5 (12:00):
Had Kicknai was the one that called the cop.
Speaker 4 (12:05):
Uh ceo, Hey, you gotta talk you about your partner
on the air.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
CEO of Seaking Therapeutics Incorporated their ticker symbol of course
s I G Y. He is also an inventor man
a former Denver Bronco. Are you really sure did one
of the best ever come out of the University of Maryland?
I'm done blowing Sunshine.
Speaker 5 (12:26):
Was a Raider fan. I can't believe you even mentioned
it well.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Once once he found out I was a Raider fan
when you moved up, yeah, a little bit so so.
Speaker 10 (12:34):
Mike lived across the street from us, and uh during
during the pandemic, I welcomed him to the world headquarters
of Seagin Therapeutics.
Speaker 5 (12:44):
We started.
Speaker 10 (12:45):
It was and it was it was a plastic costco
table and people walk by, Welcome, Welcome to the world
headquarters of Seagan Therapy.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
It is. I would go down.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
I would go down our street with our leaf blower,
and they look in there. Jim was seeking deal when
you're out there in a perfect time now looking at
now in the Big BIS show.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
Bio Farmas has taken quite a journey in the last
few year twenty twenty three twenty three really hard for
biopharma companies. JP Morgan comes back last year being your
twenty twenty.
Speaker 5 (13:17):
Four and says, this is the year, but you're not
gonna raise money the first quarter.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
Sure enough, you could raise money to the second quarter
last year, and then the whole thing once again started
waning again and had a really tough twenty twenty four.
It seems as though capital markets are open for biotech.
Biopharma seems like things are looking good now.
Speaker 10 (13:33):
It seems through the worst of it starting to open up.
But you know, if you're an investor in small cap
or microcap, you better know your CEO.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
Well yeah, well, well listen. But I'm talking about as
a group. I think you're in the right place at
the right time.
Speaker 4 (13:45):
Now you come to be twenty middle of twenty twenty three,
I'm thinking, man, you had to we were swimming through cement.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
Everyone was in your don't you.
Speaker 10 (13:52):
Think, No, I that's very much the case. But I
think there's a transition in our industry as it relates
to therapeutics, you know, against the merger, infectious disease disorders
or sepsis or things of that nature, where there's a
trend that you know, trend towards medical technologies, blood purification technology.
Speaker 5 (14:11):
Well, and I think that's and you're in the new
frontier here.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Hence hence the word sepsis heard about. And I have
an antheesy that is going through that right like as
we speak, as we're interviewing here here, talk about the problem,
talk about the solution, talk about this new industry that's
emerging that you guys even announced in the press.
Speaker 10 (14:29):
Really if you do. Yeah, it's an emerging new industry,
like twenty years into making.
Speaker 5 (14:33):
Yeah, that's how it always works.
Speaker 10 (14:34):
So right, that is that's how it works.
Speaker 5 (14:35):
We just thought out about Today's what it started today.
Speaker 10 (14:38):
So sepsis, this is a disregulated immune response to infection.
So it's the transition if somebody is suffering from a
life threatening viral infection like COVID nineteen. You know, when
it becomes a serious severe infection, it transitions into sepsis.
Sepsist in general number one killer in US hospitals, one
in three.
Speaker 5 (14:58):
Deaths because because it's an't about a resistant is it.
Speaker 10 (15:00):
Not in many cases? Yes, But something that's fascinating about
sepsis in general, and this was learned, you know, as
devastating as COVID was, sometimes we learned things that really
weren't known before. But there was a study of individuals
that was severe COVID infection at George Washington University Hospital
(15:22):
and they enrolled ninety six individuals in this study and
they quantified that these individuals, ninety five of ninety six
had circulating bacterial toxin called endotoxin.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
And in this circulating back that means it's circulating it's
I mean, it's not here anymore over here now.
Speaker 5 (15:39):
It's in the bloodstream, man.
Speaker 10 (15:41):
But it's one of those riddled me this moment because
only three of the ninety five people diagnosed to have
circulating bacterial toxins actually had a bacterial infection. So one
of the things we learned with COVID is that when
you have an infectious response, the immune system response, it
produces pro and flatlammatory cytokines. The overproduction of pro inflammatory
(16:03):
side of kinds called the cytokine storm, and a lot
of people heard about that phenomenon with COVID, but what
they didn't recognize is that inflammatory process creates permeability in
the intestinal wall and it leaks out. You're leaking bacterial
yep and and this is the potent activator of sepsis.
(16:23):
And we didn't know this. We were I was involved
in a Darper program for five years to develop devices
to treat sepsis for wounded warfighters. We didn't have any
idea that this was an important component of sepsis.
Speaker 5 (16:37):
So now we know.
Speaker 10 (16:40):
Damp and down pro inflammatory side of kines addressed the
pathogen source of inflammation, but also address these bacterial toxic.
Speaker 4 (16:47):
So what is Sigin doing is segan have a do
we have the do we have a pathway here for
a treatment, do we have a candidate?
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Are we on the way there?
Speaker 10 (16:55):
Or yeah, we're getting ready to head into human studies.
We've done that's yeah, since since Mike I waved to
him in the morning.
Speaker 5 (17:04):
How was the catalyst?
Speaker 10 (17:05):
By the way, we conducted a whole series of studies
at the University of Michigan to demonstrate the ability to
address these bacterial toxins broad spectrum viral clearance as well
as being able to dampen down excessive you know, inflammatory
cytokine production. Then we moved into animal studies and now
we're getting ready to submit what's called an Investigational Device
(17:26):
Exemption UH to FDA to initiate studies to address this endotoxemia.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
And can I make the assumption that since as you
mentioned in the beginning, that it's the leading cause of
hospital mortality a scepsis that your addressable market is endless for.
Speaker 5 (17:42):
Something like this.
Speaker 10 (17:43):
It's large, but we also have a strategy from a
clinical standpoint. We have an early clinical and commercialization strategy
to start off in dialysis patients. These are end stage
renal disease patients who are being treated three times a
week four hours of treatment. These individuals suffer from endotoxemia
(18:07):
that's created created by the inflammatory response to the regular
dialysis and it shortens their life. Average lifespan once it
on dialysis is five years. It's the same, it's the
same markers we're looking at in STEPSIS, but in this indication,
we don't have to wait for anybody to come into
the ICU.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
They're already.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
This is good news. You said we're going to be scared.
I think this is good. Good about what I'm hearing.
There's part completely different book.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Joyce is the CEO of Seeking Therapeutics. Their ticker symbol
is s I G Y JIM. To the point that
Greg talked about the next big pandemic or what's going
on over in.
Speaker 5 (18:46):
The what's the next coutie going to be?
Speaker 10 (18:49):
I don't know. There's all kinds of stuff floating.
Speaker 5 (18:50):
Over I'm going to get my mask. I'll be right there.
Speaker 10 (18:57):
It used to be like, okay, you know bird Lieu
of two thousand and nine, and that'd be a concern
for a few years, and then there'd be the next
thing ze could pop up or whatever it might be.
But now everything's just like looming at the same time,
and the ability to monitor these diseases is getting.
Speaker 5 (19:14):
More and more. You're not going anywhere. This is like
the mop. We're keeping your hair. We want to make
Greg cry.
Speaker 4 (19:20):
So Chapter two is here. Greg's I could be part
of the show until next week. Marry's out there buying
maps because this me Mike.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Jim all right, Jim joy CEO of Seeking Therapeutics. Much
more to come. We hope the news is better as
a big V show rolls on.
Speaker 5 (19:33):
Keep it here.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
We continue, put the loft one hundred studios, wherever you're watching,
wherever you're listening, Appreciate the riot. That's the day Trader
Trio here at the bar Costa Maryburg Godwin.
Speaker 5 (20:14):
Our executive producer is Grig Totterov.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
Sully's here and Jim Joyce CEO inventor CEO of Seeking Therapeutics.
Speaker 5 (20:22):
Their ticker symbol is s I g Y. You go
to Seeking Therapeutics dot com.
Speaker 4 (20:27):
You see there on the screen here for a radio
audience is go to our website a Big Biz show
dot Com. You've wanted to find out you want to
find out how to get a hold of these guys
and take a look at the eleven most remarkable advances
in healthcare, which is what you invented here?
Speaker 5 (20:41):
Is that the same thing as user that's something different.
Speaker 10 (20:43):
It was previously we started off in previously, I founded
a company here in San Diego, took it from single
shareholders start up to over ten thousand shareholders on nas
deck and we developed the first in industry blood purification device.
That was the first therapy of its approved to treat
a pandemic virus by FDA. And that was a bowl
(21:03):
of virus and that was, you know, awarded with a
multitude of awards, drop invention at BI magazine, Top eleven
Medical Breakthrough. But that was the first generation product that
was limited to broad spectrum clearance of viral pathogens. What
we're developing now with Seagan Therapy is a device that
(21:24):
can have broad spectrum clearance of viral pathogens, address these
translocated bacterial toxins and dampen down the excessive inflammatory response.
Speaker 4 (21:35):
The inflammatory sides seems to be a buzzwords like sepsis
is these days. Not to minimize what you guys are treating,
but you know when it gets to the radar population.
Now it's a buzzword some of you been working on
for fifteen years talk about. With respect to the sepsis
response and the next pandemic that we talk about, it
all sort of falls into one thing because you've got sepsis,
you've got pandemic. We got information, we got cancer, we
(21:56):
got so I mean it's kind of one long tree
and this is the bad news.
Speaker 10 (22:00):
They're all connected. Yeah, they're all connected. And something that
was remarkable with COVID nineteen was the ability to have
vaccines developed within a year prevented it.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
Let's stop down in for a second, because what I
think many people don't know is that vaccines are a
recipe where you plug in the coudie.
Speaker 5 (22:20):
So it's not you're not redoing the wheel every time. Correct?
Speaker 4 (22:22):
Is am I excer in saying when vaccines come out,
we don't have to reinvent from the start, because I
think I think one of the big mis numbers during
COVID was that the we rushed to a vaccine when
in reality, you might correct me if I'm wrong, didn't
those vaccine companies just get to skip the line and
get That's how it was done so quickly or was
it rushed?
Speaker 5 (22:41):
Because I think the FDA, what.
Speaker 4 (22:42):
FDA is a long, arduous process just because of the
amount of NDA sill was out there.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
So what really happened?
Speaker 10 (22:48):
So I was in a program I mentioned earlier, this
darker program to advance Blood purification Therapies Parallel. DARPO was
a program to accelerate vaccine production vaccine development production based
on mRNA vaccines.
Speaker 5 (23:03):
And acceleration does that mean rushed or does that just mean.
Speaker 10 (23:06):
Accelerat It means accelerated development.
Speaker 5 (23:07):
Okay, is that a bad thing potentially?
Speaker 10 (23:10):
Well, if you look at the journal Lancet, they had
a publication on the advancement of the MODERNA vaccine and
then the other vaccine and they projected that in the
first year of the availability of that vaccine worldwide, it's
saved between fourteen to eighteen million lives.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
Good.
Speaker 10 (23:26):
Thanks, so very powerful. But what it changed was the
environment vaccines preventative what are post exposure therapies. So historically
the fastest vaccine development history prior to this was four years,
and so you would never know if a vaccine would
be developed or not. So they were always competitive with
(23:47):
antiviral drugs.
Speaker 5 (23:48):
So there's the question.
Speaker 4 (23:49):
Four years for vaccine development versus eight months is what
we've witness and.
Speaker 10 (23:55):
Coach putting the vaccine in people's arms within the year.
Speaker 4 (23:58):
Was that because the FDA was able to assess this,
or was that because the science was solid, or we
just don't know yet.
Speaker 10 (24:06):
I don't think you can say definitively the problem you
have when you have a new outbreak. You use the
perfect word assess, So how do you treat it? If
you have a post exposure therapy? How do you like
we're developing? How do you run a controlled study? You
can't uh and and the government legislation says there's a
reliance on animal models, but for most of these emerging
(24:29):
pandemic threats there is no animal model s s so
well challenge.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
So it's on that subject we don't know, You don't
know during that problem, that's correct. Now you're the guy
to ask this question to Okay, five years post COVID,
five years post the beginning of COVID, Okay, what would
you do differently now, knowing what you know now in
your own business, knowing what you know, what we've all
experienced and you seeing and you have you have a
you have a unique seat in the stadium on this one.
(24:55):
What would you do different? What do you think we
should have done this? What would we do different next time?
To make this more I can't say the word paleatee well,
but make.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
It so well.
Speaker 10 (25:02):
I think there's some basic things like have mask available.
That's probably a good start right the But you know,
as it relates to responding, you know, vaccine development I
think is critical. But with the ability to develop vaccines
at a rapid pace, you know, the whole concept historically
(25:25):
of trying to also develop an anti viral drug which
starts when a new virus emerges, and that can take
five or more years, you know, that's no longer an
appropriate exposure strategy right now. Post exposures are predicated on
what we're doing with blood purification technologies, and they're also
(25:46):
important because they can not only be first line countermeasures
and be available right at the outset of an outbreak,
but they also have commercialized, commercial applications in mainstream medicine.
So it's not a countermeasure that you worry about being
put in the stockpile and then expiring and have to
be repurchased every three years. This is something that is
(26:07):
there's an inventory. It can be used for mainstream so
medical indications.
Speaker 4 (26:11):
So what's gonna be so is that therevens what's the
treatment strategy going to be in your in your opinion?
And the next is it you're just talked about having
a stockpile, but then maybe not knowing that we can
depend on that stockpile.
Speaker 5 (26:22):
What's the treatment strategy?
Speaker 10 (26:23):
Well, I'll replay what happened with COVID nineteen. First four
therapies approved to treat COVID nineteen. They were not a vaccine,
not an anti viral drug. They were all four blood
purification technologies. One was for pathogen cont.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
I forget the name of that beause I remember that
it was called Do you recall the name of the of.
Speaker 10 (26:42):
The path The pathway was called Emergency Use Authorization Pathway
UH And the first four therapies under this pathway were
blood purification technologies, one to control infection that addressed the
pathogen itself. The other three were designed to dampen down
excessive pro inflammatory cytokine production. Our device performs all of
(27:05):
those functions, plus it addresses the bacterial toxins that locate
from the gut leak into the bloodstream and cause a
very disregulated immune response to infection. So and that was
not known as being a primary target at that says
that would be.
Speaker 5 (27:20):
We're a better spot now we are where we were.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
I'd like to think, So, okay, what about the back
to chapter one?
Speaker 2 (27:25):
What about the plexiglass shields and restaurants? Do we go
back to those two for the next well, because you know,
the bacteria would stop at the past, would never go
higher than the plexiglass either.
Speaker 4 (27:37):
Joy Well, seeking therapeutics, I've been a question for you
because I did some research and this also goes into
chemo chemotherapy. What you guys were talking about with with
your with the therapy in terms of delivery method.
Speaker 10 (27:52):
Correct, yeah, this is this is a pipeline product. But
we were dismayed, you know, we had we initiate a
relationship with some researchers who were trying to improve the
delivery of chemotherapy as well as immunotherapeutic antibodies, and we
were dismayed at how poorly these compounds are delivered. In
both cases chemotherapy, you know, typically less than three percent
(28:17):
of the drug is actually delivered to tumor cell targets.
The rest is also with all.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
This targeted tumor therapy all hear about and you know
the well on the TV, commercials, in the radio and
so on and so forth.
Speaker 10 (28:28):
Well, the targeted therapy. You know, then all of a
sudden you have an antibody component that can selectively target
where it's going to get to. But antibodies bind exquisitely
to receptor targets that are on the cancer target. But
these receptor targets are oftentimes in a lot of other
places that aren't the targets, and those those act as
decoys that intercept.
Speaker 5 (28:48):
You're putting in the drug advilace that doesn't belong.
Speaker 10 (28:50):
Yeah, so so yeah, so we we've we've developed intellectual
property to take immunotherapeutic antibodies, attach them to a bead,
put them in a blood purification device, and sweep out
these decoys prior to the delivery of the drug itself.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
What are you most excited about for the rest of
this year, as much as you can share with us
as a SECO of a public company in the next
five years, What are you most topping up and down
about right now?
Speaker 10 (29:13):
Well, I think what we're doing in cancer is very executable.
But the clinical study we're getting ready to kick off
with our lead products seegan therapy.
Speaker 5 (29:22):
That's a.
Speaker 10 (29:24):
That's a real value driver for us because this is
a small feasibility study twelve to fifteen subjects, and we
successfully navigate through this, then we can bridge into multiple
pivotal studies as a device for approval in the indications
such as the SRD indication I mentioned earlier, emerging infectious
disease and sepsis.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
So in the capital information problem that we saw in
biofarmer the last couple of years.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
You guys have a runway for your studies and stuff.
You feel pretty good about.
Speaker 10 (29:53):
Your Yeah, our cost of running the study is pretty minimal,
and we have a good collaborator from the Diete also
this industry, one of the leaders in the industry there,
and uh, you know, we've always been very cognizant of
being uh you know, keeping our burn rates so we
can have flexibility to do things.
Speaker 5 (30:12):
Well, it's kids, I'm feeling better and better, but I
still feel better. Greg, you feel okay, Well, I'm all.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Right, Jim joy CEO Seeking Therapeutics. Of course, their ticker
symbol s I G Y. I was there on day
one in his garage for all.
Speaker 5 (30:32):
Right, keep it here. A lots more to come with
the big biz.
Speaker 10 (30:42):
H m m.
Speaker 2 (31:09):
Hmm.
Speaker 4 (31:13):
You have potato skins, we have treatments.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Is the big miss show.
Speaker 5 (31:23):
Potato skins and six Jared's Apple Beans.
Speaker 4 (31:28):
Applebee's is the Little elson Or of TJ Fridays, just
like Tinder is the Lake Elsner Bumble okay of online dating.
Speaker 5 (31:35):
Remember that I agree. He wrote the book Future Business
and the Naked Entrepreneurs. You're listen, you're marketing genius. Mister. Listen.
Speaker 4 (31:45):
We we are brought to you by outback Seakhouse with
the authentic Australian food.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
They've got blue and onions growing down the sides of
the roads.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
And and he is the son of a son of
a son of a son of a son of some
from Pearth.
Speaker 5 (31:57):
Have you ever seen a blue on onion down there
in Australia? You know?
Speaker 4 (32:04):
Have you ever said do not say shrimp Barbie or
good day? I will all right, Hey, I want to
talk to you mister. You are an expert in goal setting,
an expert in avoiding disasters in business and personal life
from unplanning, and one way you do it you and
I've talked about this off the heere is you do
(32:25):
bottom up goals versus top down goals?
Speaker 5 (32:27):
Talk about that?
Speaker 11 (32:28):
Yeah, yeah, So for about thirty years I've been coaching, mentoring,
working with entrepreneurs, sitting on their boards of directors and
helping them navigate what's next. And the typical psyche of
an entrepreneur is that they have these rainbows that they
have in their head, and I'm going to try and
match that with some sort of reality. Here's what you
think you can do, here's what we're likely to be
able to do, and somewhere in the middle will meet.
(32:50):
And then the second big thing I'm going to deal
with is that most of them are squirrels. They're running
off to different things at different times. Not that you
know about that, Sally.
Speaker 3 (32:58):
Fish.
Speaker 5 (33:00):
We are. This is the reason why we're fish. We
are we are fish in a barrel. We are squirrel.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
It's so so continued. So how does the bottom up
thing work? Because I think that's interesting.
Speaker 11 (33:09):
So we start by creating three separate strategies with three
separate sets of financial so it's a good better best format.
Good is budget for the year, which is typically a
little bit more than last year, and then we've got better,
which is a stretch target, so we get on the
line that they could actually achieve that if everything worked
out for us as.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
It should do for the year. And then best is
the rainbows.
Speaker 11 (33:30):
Now, rainbows only happen if it snows in Florida, dogs
and cats start playing together, and men start understanding women.
Speaker 3 (33:37):
And if these think the line, then.
Speaker 11 (33:40):
We can hit that that best budget, that best strategy.
But aligne the rainbows top down doesn't always work. We've
got to set our goals bottom up so they match
somewhere in the middle.
Speaker 5 (33:52):
All of this, all of.
Speaker 4 (33:53):
This comes down to just finding another way to plan ahead, correct, Yeah,
a little bit.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Yeah, So you can trage like the three of them.
Speaker 11 (34:00):
When things go sideways as they will when the world
changes as it does as the year goes on, then
you can easily pick a different lane and go all right,
that's not working for us, but this might. Let's adjust
it up and down so we don't surprise ourselves or
to support ourselves in the process, because if we've got
to catch that halfway through the year, you're never going
to pick it up because the rest of the year
you're always behind the eight ball, and it just never
(34:23):
quite aligns for you at all, leads to is disappointment.
Speaker 5 (34:26):
Okay tooy.
Speaker 6 (34:27):
That actually brings up a good point because I know
I fall into the trap of I might do some strategizing.
I think we talked about this last time you sat
for Google docking ball. There is absolutely Google docs and sheets.
Speaker 5 (34:37):
I love them both.
Speaker 6 (34:38):
I'll set them all up, it's all pretty, I'll send
them out to the people that need to know, and
then maybe I file it away and I completely forget
to come back to it. So you look the part
I love the strategy and is this a problem and
how can you help people like me?
Speaker 3 (34:53):
So there's two parts to that.
Speaker 11 (34:54):
Once you've got the plan in places, it's kind of crazy,
but we all do it. We put it in draw
and don't refer to it, just like you to explaining.
So the second thing we're going to do is just
go back and keep checking it. And for us, that
means we're going to look at the bottom up goals
and the unit economics of the business. So dissect a transaction,
a sale, a department, a region you work in, a
(35:15):
product that you're trying to launch, and understand that the
micro economics of the business will match the macro strategy
you put in place. The only way to do that
is to keep coming back and referring to it on
a regular basis.
Speaker 5 (35:26):
So I was thinking.
Speaker 4 (35:27):
The other thing, too, is couldn't you attach it to
Because they're always spinning multiple plates, it seems like couldn't
you attach it like the last thing on your list
there as you plan to another thing that you're actively
working on, which kind of forces you.
Speaker 5 (35:39):
To do that.
Speaker 4 (35:39):
I'll tell you what I've been doing with regards to
making plans to do something is I email it to
myself and I use my email as my to do list.
Speaker 5 (35:48):
I want to get down to like six or ten emails.
Speaker 4 (35:50):
A night, and there's and and there is that sort
of time where I've had that same damn email and
then you start adopting that feared thing first process.
Speaker 5 (35:57):
I'm not doing that.
Speaker 4 (35:58):
I'm doing that thing first because once you get into it,
it's much like anything else, working out or doing chores
or planning. It's not as bad as you think it's
going to be when you're avoiding.
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Right, No, it's not.
Speaker 11 (36:08):
And I do exactly the same thing. So I send
myself email so it comes back to top of my box.
But it really means you've got to create a habit
and a rhythm and a routine that has you check
it every day, every week, every month, every quarter, as
I do every Monday. Every Monday, I sit down and
go through the same routine and make sure that the
economics bottom up goals, I'm matching the top down strategy
(36:29):
and the rainbows that I've gone to my head that
I think I can create for the Okay, so I want.
Speaker 5 (36:33):
To ask you guy, you guess your cephones list this? Listen?
Speaker 4 (36:35):
Yeah, okay, front page of the cell phone. I tell
you that I told my mom to hit the message goes.
I don't have that like the message, but like every house,
I don't.
Speaker 5 (36:42):
If you want to Apple, start to get it. So
if you'll notice, let me see you se your face is?
I have go to your email section because this is
you don't want to see my don't I want to
see it? This is twenty seventy eighty nine on there.
It has no I want to know. I want to see, like,
what's the number? Oh, it's a lot? What is let's
see mine's twelve? What's yours? What am I looking for?
The number?
Speaker 6 (37:02):
My kids, set up something fancy so you can't see.
Speaker 4 (37:05):
Okay, So what I'm saying is if I see a
person that has three thousand emails on their phone and oh,
oh geez, that strategy doesn't work because they're getting nothing done,
and listen, I know that it's it's I know I'm
wasting my time because I unsubscribe to to crap that
I get all the time jest or whatever.
Speaker 5 (37:23):
But and then you can get.
Speaker 4 (37:24):
It to her for a day or so, oh you
got six new messages. When I wake up, I get
one hundred messages. Is most of it's crap. But if
you're disciplined about it, honestly, it works for me because
when I tell you or you or you email it
to me, because I know that i'll because I've got
I'm so o c d about getting that number down.
I don't want to see those little red dots. I
think that's part of it.
Speaker 6 (37:41):
About this news feature on your you don't have to
email yourself. You can snooze an email.
Speaker 5 (37:46):
What is this?
Speaker 6 (37:47):
This is amazing?
Speaker 5 (37:48):
Do you utilize this? Try you snooze an email?
Speaker 3 (37:50):
I've a bit of a disconnect on this one.
Speaker 11 (37:53):
Is there a reason you don't respond to my emails.
Speaker 5 (38:03):
It's too much reading. So tell me what this snooze
you can.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
Let's say I send something to you and I know
you're not going to give back to me. I'm going
to snooze it until maybe four days from now and
hits you again.
Speaker 2 (38:16):
Yeah, it's called an embargoes when you were gone for
six weeks, that's true.
Speaker 5 (38:23):
Tight, Troy.
Speaker 4 (38:25):
I want to take next week, on Tuesday or Thursday,
whenever you can come back and talk about the reality.
When you do your reality checks on your forecast, something
we haven't really talked about. Because it's easy to make goals,
like's like nine pounds today, learning to surf tomorrow.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
I mean when you're making.
Speaker 4 (38:44):
Yeah, I will be CEO of the company by Thursday,
when you don't check the reality of your goals, because
oftentimes is when you're doing those things.
Speaker 5 (38:52):
I know when I need.
Speaker 4 (38:53):
Spreadsheets, were to be rich by thursday, But you're just planning.
They're just thoughts at this point, and at some point
you got to give some spacer and check the reality, right.
I want to spend some time with that. His name
is Troy Hazard.
Speaker 5 (39:04):
Of course, there's two books, Future trooping 'priduous to day
and after Troy Haaser dot com.
Speaker 4 (39:08):
All this talk of rainbows in bottom makes me hungry
for potato, potatoes.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
Peata can.
Speaker 8 (39:15):
I'm gonna starting now.
Speaker 5 (39:20):
Remember the time when I landed the Texans to record
that album, and I said
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce
Football’s funniest family duo — Jason Kelce of the Philadelphia Eagles and Travis Kelce of the Kansas City Chiefs — team up to provide next-level access to life in the league as it unfolds. The two brothers and Super Bowl champions drop weekly insights about the weekly slate of games and share their INSIDE perspectives on trending NFL news and sports headlines. They also endlessly rag on each other as brothers do, chat the latest in pop culture and welcome some very popular and well-known friends to chat with them. Check out new episodes every Wednesday. Follow New Heights on the Wondery App, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to new episodes early and ad-free, and get exclusive content on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And join our new membership for a unique fan experience by going to the New Heights YouTube channel now!