49. Got a case of the Bundys

Episode Transcript
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(00:15):
Hello everybody, Welcome back to Blonde, Blues and Bullshite. I'm Courtney and
I'm Davin, and welcome back,Welcome back. How are you non blonde?
I now, how's how's it goingwith the non blonde? Honestly love
it? Yeah, I'm still superinto it. I washed it so it's
like a little red brown, likenot super red, but like it's a

(00:35):
little bit lighter and not as dark. But I still love it. Not
going back, I've never I don'tknow, it'd be a long time before
I may be dead. But yeah, right now, I'm gonna have to
change our name. I know,Like, what is it? It's just
it's a it's a weird bar joke. Now like one Blonde, one Brunette
talked about true crime one Blonde,like it doesn't roll off the tongue.

(00:57):
We can't rebrand at this point.This is just our name forever and bitches,
blue booze and bullshit bullshite. MI don't know how Apple would feel
about that. May take a littlebit together, right but beaches, Yeah,

(01:18):
they're gonna be like this is atrue crime podcast. This I know
I'll see you. Yeah, butnope, no more blonde goodbye. How
are you. I'm bye. Nothingnew, No, no, nope,
not at all. Yeah. Boringweek, boring week. Yeah, I
didn't I didn't do anything. That'ssometimes good though. Yeah. It was

(01:40):
a weird week with Labor Day.Yeah comes out actually a week and yeah
Labor Day was a week ago.Yeah when this comes out. Yeah,
yeah, so fun stuff. Yeah, I didn't do it. I haven't
done really anything. I've kind ofI've just been, um, I've been
doing a little bit more reading.Oh. I did order a couple of
books, which ones I always say, I forget her name. It's like

(02:06):
Glendone Doyle, Oh, Glenn andDoyle. Did you get untamed? I
did? I did. I heardher. I heard her talk um on.
I was introduced to her by myeditor at the magazine I used to
um write for. And she wasa beg Glenn and Doyle fan and you
know Abby Wambach and everyone um andI she was Reese Weatherspoon made her that

(02:30):
book their book of the month,yea. And I watched her talk for
that and she was talking about somethingand I was just like, you're so
fucking right, Like it's she's sogreat. Yeah, I really you have
to let me know how that is, because I'm really wanting to read that
one. Oh cool, So whenI'm done with it, I'll just I'll
just hand it over to Yeah,of course. Yeah. My friend.

(02:50):
My friend introduced me to her,and she was like, when you get
ready, just listen to this interviewthat she does. Yeah, and it's
like a forty three minute interview orso. And so I listened to it
and I was like, I gotta, I gotta get this book. I
gotta I gotta read more into it. Yeah, I really, I really
dig it. She's yeah, Ireally dig it. So I got that

(03:13):
one, and then I pre ordered, Um, Candice Owen's Blackout. Oh
okay, let me know how that'sgonna be. Yeah, So that one
comes out on the fifteenth. Um, so it's the thirteenth today, so
it comes out in a couple ofdays. So I already pre ordered it,
so it should come I don't wheneverAmazon ships it out. But um,

(03:34):
I think she's a I think she'sa really powerful woman, has a
really great voice. I think thatshe is she. I just love listening
to her talk and the way shejust articulates everything that she says. Um
in my book, she's just she'sjust a very strong woman. Um.
She has a lot of people goingup against her, and especially in this
world, I mean just right now. How how how aggressively mean people can

(04:00):
be Mum, yeah, it takesit takes an incredible strong person to keep
going. Um. I do havea couple of book RECs again though,
oh yes, of course, didyou order any more books? I don't
want to cut off. No,no, no, I just ordered my
two for for now, because,um, that will last me for the
next couple of months easily. WhenI say a couple of months, I

(04:23):
mean six. I know, Iknow, crazy to me, I'm not,
I mean, but you know what, Honestly, if I do get
into this book, there is onehundred percent chance that I will finish it
within two days. Once I getinto a book like when I read,
when I read, um, um, a couple of books like even that
Holly Madison one I read, Iread in like two days. Yeah,

(04:44):
sometimes once once I get into abook. And and since it is like
a motivational book, and since thesearen't um especially Canadas owns, I'll probably
do that one. Because she getsinto history in it too, she gets
into a lot of history, right, which is so your jam is sad.
It's political history, yeah, whichis very political history is just a

(05:06):
sweet spot and so um yeah.So I'll probably I'll probably finish that one
in a couple of days. Sointeresting. Yeah. Well I do have
a little news. You know,remember how I talked about that ghost story.
I think it was last week.It'll just be us Well, little
kudos to the author because it's onlybeen out for at this point, maybe
two weeks a week or something.Yeah, and it's already optioned for film,

(05:29):
and I'm so fucking exciting. Really, congratulations to them, the people
who do it's like some game ofThrone start production company picked it up.
Oh just like if you don't doit, justice heads are going to roll
because this whole thing is she's alreadygot names glorious, right, I don't

(05:49):
have like yeah, like I knowwho's producing it. So if you fuck
it up, like I'll find you. I'm kidding, that's a threat.
We're canceling you. Second book,recommen Nation. I've been really into young
adult like horror mystery books recently andI read this series or i'm reading it.
It's called Stalking Jack the Ripper.I just finished that book yesterday.

(06:12):
I finished it in twenty four hours. Super fucking good. It's by Carrie
Mannis Kulco and there's four books inthe series, in one novella and the
second one is Hunting Prince Dracula.So I'm just saying they're pretty fucking good,
and they're perfect for spooky season,yeah, Halloween and everything. So
pick those up. That would befun. Oh yeah, no, that

(06:34):
was the only one book reck DearChild by Romie Hossman October six, Dear
Child, super fucked up, verygood. People are comparing it to Gone
Girl in the Room and so farsince Gone Girl came out, this is
the only book that deserves to becompared to Gone Girl in my opinion.
Like ever, it's just it's reallygood. So okay, check that out.

(06:57):
That'll be fun. As I onmy chords, as you as you
make the sound affairs, Yeah,I pick it up, pick it up,
pick it up. Well, wehave um a pretty ranty case today.
Her mic just totally fucking fell totallyfell off the goddamn thing. We
have a pretty ranty case where hermicrophone is not in is like, I'm

(07:23):
not doing this, What the hell. It's probably because it doesn't want to
hear any more of your fucking Bundytalk. Is this fundy here to haunt
me? I fucking is please?Hold well? Damn welcome back? Now
we're back. Fuck Okay, Wellthat was fun. That was fun that

(07:46):
the struggle was real watching you tryto get it get that going? Was
Are you just having fun? Slipin your beer? I mean, I
had no idea the show was herelike just me, We're just hanging out.
Yep, we'll fuck that up.Well we, like I said before,
my microphone decided to rudely drop dropon me. Hey you literally mic

(08:09):
dropped. I did. Wow,Thank you for putting it in a better
perspective. Good for you. Nowyou can find I've done a mic drop.
So um, we decided to coverthe sunset strip killers. So I
want to try to maybe do thisin a more struck short way, because

(08:31):
I know we're gonna have a lotof rants, so we should try to
not skip ahead just a little bitif we can help it. Rus is
not going to make sense. Fine, if we're gonna have I'll try to
be my best. But I guaranteenothing at this no promise, no promise
has but I will definitely try.It's all we can ask. So I

(08:54):
was at first, like we talkedabout not like super were excited to cover
them. After I did more researchbecause it just seemed like another small case,
and then we found the interview thatwe're going to talk a lot about.
I think the interview is probably thebest part of this because it just
broke it open for me. Wellyeah, because it like, anyways,

(09:16):
go on, Yeah, we can'ttalk about it yet. Okay, I
mean you did hinted it, butanyways, moving on. So the Sunset
Strip Killers. This refers to serialkiller Douglas Daniel Clark and his accomplice Carol
M. Bundy. So to startwith, Douglas. Douglas was born May
tenth, nineteen forty eight, toFranklin Clark, who was a naval intelligence

(09:37):
officer and because of his job,of course, you know, he was
an army brat. So he's likemilitary brat whatever they call him. And
he's moving around all the time,so he was just always on the go.
He claimed to have lived in thirtyseven countries in nineteen fifty eight.
His father does leave the Navy,I mean ends up taking a engineer job
for shit. Sorry, and nowyou do it. I know. So

(10:01):
he takes a job for the TransportCompany of Texas, but for some reason,
the family keeps moving. I don'tknow what his job entailed. Why
they keep moving all around. Theygo from Marshall Islands, they go to
San Francisco to India. Clark wassent to an exclusive school in Geneva,
Switzerland. What's that? Like?That would be cool? I know,

(10:24):
Switzerland is a beautiful like come on. And then he goes to Culver Military
Academy and he was basically just leftthere while his father kept moving around the
world. He graduates in sixty sevenand lists in the Air Force and he
ends up being stationed in Colorado atone point. Then he goes to Ohio
and eventually he's discharged. I don'tthink it was honorable either. Did you

(10:46):
see anything about that? And Ijust knew he was discharged. I I
don't know if it was really dishonorableor honorable. I think maybe it was.
Maybe he was just went up hisfour years charged. Yeah, it
could be um Surprisingly for his serialkiller, it seems like a normal childhood.

(11:09):
I mean, there was talks thathe was like really sexually active and
like would boast his friends about hisconquest. But like that doesn't seem out
of the ordinary to me for aguy that age, Like not really nothing
where. I'm like, that's themoment that you should have known, like
there's nothing here which will tie innot real. He was just um,

(11:31):
I mean just yeah, he waskind of kind of kind of normal type
of guy. I mean he was, I have I think I think it
was his freak flag didn't fly yetand that's why I think that he just
kept that. Yeah, I thinkhe just kept that hibernated and that's why
where it was. Yeah, yeah, but it was so Once he's discharged,

(11:52):
he becomes a drifter for about tenyears and he most of the time
as he's going around. He takesjob as a mechanic, and eventually he
goes to La which is where hisfreak flag really flies, and he gets
employed as a steam plant operator forthe Los Angeles Department of Water and Power

(12:15):
and he just abruptly quits no reallyreason for it. So he has a
bad habit of not being able tohold down a job pretty early on,
and he then works at Jurgen's soapfactory down in Burbank. However, he
does get fired after naturwing up towork, but also making violent threats to
his co workers. And this iscould maybe be considered a turning point because

(12:37):
if you like look into serial killers, there's always a trigger, there's something
that happens, and then they startkilling because of that reason. So maybe
it was this this is you know, he's out of work again, he
was fired, and who knows,he did frequent a bar called a Little
Nashville and it's here that he meets, unfortunately, Carol and Bundy. And

(12:58):
this is sometime in nineteen eight,and up until this point he was kind
of living the bachelor life. Hecalled himself the quote King of one night
Stands, and he obviously got arounda lot. But then something changes when
he meets Carol, according to thisnarrative that we know, which is going
to get thrown out the window inabout forty minutes. Anyways, not too
long after, he moves in withher, as one does, and they

(13:22):
realize that together they have these darksexual fantasies, and that's where it kind
of kicks off. But we dohave to talk about Carol and Bundy to
really understand what the hell he's gettinginto, because Carol is a character very
interesting. Yeah, I mean,honestly, in my opinion, Carol didn't

(13:43):
have a chance. She didn't havea chance in hell life. Not saying
like, I'm not trying to justifywhat she did. That's not what I'm
doing. But she I think evenif she didn't do this, there was
still nothing gonna fortunately happened for herat all. So she was born August
twenty sixth of nineteen forty two,and she had saying she had a tough

(14:07):
childhood as an understatement. What's interestingthough, is apparently for a long time
she really idolized her parents and herchildhood. She thought, she said,
she had this great childhood and itwas fine, and she only remembered the
happy times, and it took alot of therapy before she could really assess
her childhood and be like, ohno, I didn't have a good childhood

(14:30):
at all. Her both her parentswere alcoholics and abusive, and her mother
dies when she was young, andunfortunately, her father starts sexually abusing her.
After this, he rapes her atthe age of eleven, and this
is when it starts, apparently,but even before that her mom was very

(14:52):
unhinged, Like I don't know whather mom's deal was, but she did
not like Carol, which is superweird not to like her own child like
that. To me, Um,it's it could be a lot of jealousy.
I'm pretty sure that you know.You know what this reminded me of.
Um that movie Precious. I neversaw that. Oh that movie Precious

(15:16):
was eerie similar in a sense.But she but in that movie she had
like two kids by her father.But um, dear god, yeah,
that movie is like, whenever Ihear stuff like that, my heart just
heard. That movie was the hardestmovie I've ever had to watch. Um,
because this is detailed. It's detailed. It's it's very good for them.

(15:37):
But yeah, that anyways, that'sa whole another round on that one.
Um. But yeah, she hermom, and it could be that
she was jealous of whatever was goingon, or the mom was just she
was an alcoholic. She was justunhappy and um, not just And not

(16:03):
every mother is supposed to be amother. Um, not every mother gets
in a maternal instinct. And justbecause you have a kid doesn't mean that
it's going to be loved. Andshe shunned away from her a lot big
time, like she just wouldn't lether come close. They never really probably

(16:25):
had a bond, so it waslike living with a stranger right for now
ten years or have a right one. And then as soon as she died,
what she died from? What wasa stroke? You know, I
didn't read what it was. Ithink it was a stroke. She died
of a stroke and it was kindof sudden. Um. And then that
night her father was like, allright, come on into bed. Well

(16:51):
now you're now mom. It wasbetween her and her sister. So what
happens that they had to play agame and whoever quote won the game was
He was like, I need oneof you guys to sleep in my bed
tonight, and it was Carol.Carol won this quote game and her father
started raping her at eleven. Um. What's weird though, is like he

(17:11):
gets remarried and then he puts herin a bunch of foster homes. Yeah,
and I don't know that much aboutwhere her sister was during these times.
Um. Yeah. They didn't reallytouch on that one, no,
And you know, I only foundit in murder Pedia. I never saw
it in another place, So Ididn't really go too deep into their backgrounds.
Um, but you know her.One of her sister's names is Vicky.

(17:33):
I think there she had two siblings. Um, but Vicky really talked
extensively about the abuse and was like, this is what we went through.
This is what Carol went through becauseof her mom. She her mom or
her dad would not let the momhit the kids and I maybe just even
in a like a spanking kind ofway because she would go berserk and would

(17:56):
just lose it and they would.Yeah. So he was like nope,
but there was this, in myopinion, this really telling quote and murder
Pedia about Carol, and it says, quote, Carol had already discovered the
superior position of being the victim whocould forgive the transgressions and weaknesses of her
abuser, a position in which shewould learn to thrive, which is like

(18:21):
big, like you look at it. She definitely did that. She's like
this little like subtle mastermind. Andnot to give her credit for anything,
but like she's very sneaky. Soat seventeen, she marries a fifty six
year old man and it was saidshe did this to get away from her
father because what ends up happening isafter apparently her ann Vickie were put into

(18:44):
foster care. Then they went tolive with their grandma. And then first
the dad was like, I kindof want to be a dad again,
quote unquote, and so he wantsthem back, and Carol's like, okay,
I'm not fucking doing that again.Carol's like, I don't think so,
bro, I am not your wife. So when Carol Carol was thirty
seven years old when she meets Dougan. By this point she had loved her

(19:07):
third husband. He was abusive.According to her, she did have two
cents with this third husband. Herfirst husband was a drunk who wanted her
to prostitute herself, and she waslike, I don't know if if that's
what ended her marriage, because shelater does prostitute herself from it sounds like
maybe her own choices. I reallydon't know. There's so much with her.

(19:29):
Her second marriage was to a thirtytwo year old great combination of a
porno and science fiction writer. Sonot pornographic science fiction, but maybe they
did, we don't know, anda lot of alien six I'm not even
gonna make the joke never mind thatsex is out of this world. I

(19:51):
was going to say, there's toomany holes. But ah, black dark,
black hole, just swallow grown men. Oh dear fuck. But what's
interesting is I think it was herthis second husband that she remains friends with
for most of her life even afterthe divorce, So something was right there.

(20:11):
In nineteen sixty two, her fatherdoes pass away from suicide, and
it's believed by her husband at thetime, which I think is the weird
writer. She took responsibility for herfather's death and his abuse, which the
abuse, I think that's kind ofnormal from them a little bit I've seen,

(20:32):
so that's not too surprising. Alot of trauma, not to downplay
that. Yeah. Yeah, Soshe did turn to sex a lot,
which is also not surprising. Thisis probably just a coping thing for her.
So she would have sex with menand women, and it was said
that she would, you know,kind of swaps, so she would go

(20:52):
to a man after maybe a womanhurt her, or go to a woman
after a man her like. Shewould just kind of interchange people. And
at some point she does get avoice. I don't know what that word
is. It's divorced. Whoa Igot one of those one. She gets
divorced from husband number two and meetsa nurse who was husband three, and

(21:14):
this is who she leaves, andshe goes to a battered woman shelter for
a little bit of time. Nowshe has her own apartment and has an
affair with the apartment block manager whois also a part time country musician or
maybe full time musician, but healso runs this apartment complex, and that's
Jack Murray. And she is soobsessed with Jack Murray for the rest of

(21:38):
her life or I'm not even gonnasay the other one. No, So
she's completely obsessed and they are havingan affair. You know, he would
use her for sex all the timetoo. It was a mutually kind of
thing. But she was so inlove with him that she went up to
his wife and was like, hey, I'll pay this much to leave him.

(22:02):
And she is like, okay,no, first off, I get
way more an alimony. Yeah,like this, no um. And so
this really backfires on her because thewife convicts of Jack to victor and so
she has to leave. But well, I mean, I don't blame her,

(22:22):
but and you know what, thisis where she realized. I feel
that she realized that she was like, oh fuck, I can't I can't
manipulate everybody. Oh maybe because shemanipulates everybody else, like she would throw
sex or money or whatever at ateverybody else to get them to bend and
do what she wants to do.She literally thought she could pay this woman

(22:45):
off and that. So do youthink it made her really angry that this
happened. Yeah, okay, ohfor sure because he how many times did
he probably tell her I'm going toleave my wife. I'm gonna leave my
wife. He totally convinced her thatI'm gonna leave my wife. Then when
she came to and realized maybe he'snot gonna leave it, it's been four

(23:08):
months, Like, yeah, it'sbeen it's been a long time, he's
not gonna leave his wife. Shewas like, okay, I'll just go
ahead and I'm going to proposition herto go ahead, and hey, i'll
give you fifteen hundred dollars for youto leave your husband. Well, she
probably didn't take in an account thatshe was going to be like all right,

(23:30):
no, you're gonna kick this womanout and that's going to be the
end of that. And good Ibid you would do, I bid you
would do. Good bye. Yeah, so it doesn't it doesn't work.
Um, but this doesn't deter Carol. Carol just it's like I was like,
this is just not her baby.Yeah, I'm gone, I'm gonna

(23:52):
go there. So that's why that'swhy she's at Little Nashville because she was
She was his groupie. Basically,she would follow him around to all his
performances. And that's why she wasat Little Nashville that night, was because
Jack Murray was there, or that'swhat I'm assuming. Maybe she just also
went there a lot for fun,but that's kind of what I've seen.

(24:15):
He did perform, by all Isaw was that's why she went there though.
Okay, it was just to bea support system. Whatever can you
bear me. We're about to getinto some shit and I need another one,
Yes, get it, fill itup because it's gonna get fucking wild.
So what's really important to know this. We're gonna go the start of
it all. So they've met,right, these two, one more fucked

(24:38):
up than the other. I don'tknow how they connected really, but this
is where everything goes to shit forboth of them, more so Douglass.
It's and they've only known like whata month two months before this all shit
happens. It's like no time atall, And this is happening while her
kids are in the house, bythe way, And I couldn't figure that

(25:03):
out at first because no one talkedabout it there. It's like, yeah,
she has three kids or two kids, moved out, like divorced her
husband. And I'm like, butwhat about the kids, Like why are
we talking about where they're at rightnow? Because that just makes it that
much more sinister to me that thekids are there. Um. Yeah,
but I mean that's just part forthe course. She doesn't and she does
not know how to be a goodmother. She does. She does not

(25:26):
know how to be a good parentalReggie whatsoever. So yeah, the kids
are probably running left and right,probably doing whatever the hell they want to
do. Um, they're probably seeingthe most heinous shit. Um. But
she's not raping them, so she'sbetter parent, you know what I mean.

(25:47):
It's not no, she's raping otherkids though, Oh yeah, no,
she is raping other kids, butlike with her kids, like her
kids not of course they're they're inthe background. But it's like she's not
thinking of them, no, becauseand probably her mind, she's the fact
that she's not touching them and doingall that stuff. She's she's doing a

(26:08):
damn good job, right, yeah, exactly. So basically what kind of
starts happening is Clark starts bring backprostitutes and they would have threesomes. Unfortunately,
it does progress further when Clark quotetakes an interest in an eleven year
old neighbor of Carol Bundy's um grossum. Yeah, but she didn't see

(26:36):
anything really too, but she didn'tthink that. I mean, she probably
knew that it wasn't exactly right,but she was like it happened to me,
like it's fine. Yeah. Itwas probably a weird mix of I
know it's not right, like thisisn't normal, or but yeah, there's

(26:56):
a big butt to her. Yeah, but it's like, but I want
to please this man. That's whatit was. Yeah, I want to
make sure. I don't want tobe alone. I want a love interest.
I want that companionship, and they'renot getting it from the kid.
It's fine, and it's fine,yeah, because they're going to do this,
and she could have been in herown denial, you know, of

(27:17):
what it was, where this issupposed to happen, like it's it's fine,
I'm not going to give Carol Bundycredit for anything. Oh I'm not
giving her credit for shitt either,Like you knew it was wrong. There's
no way you didn't know this iswrong. Sorry, but all at pedophiles
your life doesn't like goodbye by Idon't. I don't really care like what
happens to you, So I'm sorry. But even nowadays, the pedophile is

(27:41):
not a sexual orientation in any fuckingbook. We're not even going to get
into that right now, because that'sjust the whole other episode, because it's
not that's disgusting, and consent iseight should be eighteen. Anyways, Bundy
lures this eleven year old girl toher condo and they take pornographic photos of

(28:02):
this little girl. She may haveeven taken photos of Clark raping children as
well. There's not really a setnumber of we don't know how many kids
they abused together or later if howthis happened. Based on how this case
goes later, I would like topoint out that you cannot have sex with

(28:26):
children history dot Com. It's calledrape, so we should just call it
that and move on. This doesescalate though, when Clark is like,
okay, like this is all cooland fun and I got my kicks off,
but I want to take it furtherby murdering a woman while having sex.
This is what I want to do. That was his like prime sexual

(28:48):
fantasy. Yeah, and so heconvinces Bundy to buy two automatic pillstols to
use. Wikipedia, where did thisreally elegantly by saying, quote he wanted
to reportedly seeking to fulfill his fantasiesof killing a woman during sex and feeling
her vaginal contractions during death spasms descriptgood bye whoever wrote that? Now what

(29:17):
I've had, Well, I meanthat's exactly what he was probably aiming for.
So, I mean, it's notwrong, No, I know,
it's not. It's just disgusting,hard to read. Yeah, I'm like,
okay, now, so I'm sureI'm going to ask you this question
later, but we're gonna hint atit now. There's a lot of speculation
and inconsistent narratives around how much involvementCarol actually had in the murders that are

(29:40):
about to take place. And Iknow me and you were both in the
same page just by that look,I know, And we're gonna leave it
there for a second. And someinstances she's in the car while these murders
are happening. In some instances,these women are brought back to the condo
and murdered there. In some cases, Clark murders them, disposes of the

(30:00):
bodies, and then comes home totell Carol. Yeah, which sounds very
familiar, by the way. Soon a night in June of nineteen eighty,
Clark comes home and it's like,hey, Carol, guess what I
did today. He's like, Isaw these two teenage girls, which was

(30:22):
fifteen year old Gina Narano and sixteenyear old Cynthia Chandler, and I murdered
them. Yep. So he picksthem up on the sunset strip. He
would normally target prostitutes, so I'massuming these were prostitutes, these women,
or they were runaways young girls.Yeah, no, they were well,
I mean, for argument's sake,yes, they were prostitutes. Okay,

(30:45):
So they are giving him a blowjob when he shoots them in the head,
and I don't know how this worksbecause they can't both be doing that.
So like, did you just threatenthe other girl too? Like did
you get a hold of her intime? And I'm just interesting how that
dynamic works, which sounds really disturbingto want to know. But that's just

(31:07):
really complex if Carol's not in thecar right right, because you have one
girl here with Clark, she's youknow, fulfilling whatever he paid for and
bam shoots her. Yeah, obviously, no one's ever going to know unless
you're in that situation, how youwill react as a like in that situation,

(31:29):
as someone who just witnessed their friendget murdered. It's just I don't
know, because it's then it's wordedthat they both gave him a blowjob.
I mean, it could be thatthey were both down there like and they're
like they both whipping swap and hewent boom boom maybe and then that's it
where you know Carol was in thecar and actually did it too. On

(31:52):
this one, I don't think Carolwas in the car. Sure, we'll
say that, um now other timesthen I do think so, yes,
But this one I don't think thathe I don't think that he did that
they did because I think this wasjust the start, Because I don't think
that I think that she was justlike she was such a man pleaser right

(32:15):
that, Um yeah, I don'tthink that this one is the one that
she was she was there with Ithink that, Um, he was having
them both do their thing. Um, and then he just did what he
did with them both in a vulnerablesituation or okay, because right yeah,
yea yeah, um, so that'sthe cleanness I can do it. We're

(32:39):
trying to be respectful to the youngI am who I am because that's that's
because they're very young, and I'mnot trying to their children. These are
still children, yeah to me,and should be to the law, like
this is I don't care what youdo for a living, because it's probably
not. It's California. It's aCalifornia. Oh yeah, that is California,

(32:59):
accorniymore, we're covering the Census stripkiller, right, I don't know.
I don't know where I was thinkingwith that one, because I was
just I was thinking, honestly rightnow, because remember how a couple episodes,
Um, I went through all theones where it's some of our sixteen
summer seventeen. Yes, yes,and that's where I was going with it.
Yeah. I was like, becauseyeah, I was like going on

(33:21):
which state it was, and Iwas like, wait, what state are
we endoing? And it's still eighteenWith this one, so it doesn't matter.
Nope, it doesn't um And soin this narrative, what happens is
that he picks them up there intheir car, he murders them, and
he dumps the bodies near Ventura Freewayand their discovered the next day. However,
there's also the possibility by snake hunters. Really I think they were.

(33:45):
There were these guys and they wereout looking for snakes and they like turned
over like this wood thing and theywere like that's not a snake, Like
that's that's not normal. How bigis the rock? Oh? It was
like a body. No no,no, not a rock like a flyboard
thing or like okay, you knowit was like not something wasn't it wasn't
hidden well, but it was hiddenlike enough where you're not going yeah,

(34:08):
like you'd have to lift something upto see it. So there was these
snake hunters that were out and that'swho the found bodies. So narrative too
is that there is a possibility thathe did bring these two girls home to
the conjo he shares with Carol andthis all took place there, which does

(34:30):
beg the question again how involved isCarol Bundy? And again, yet again
Oxygen. Me and Oxygen are juston the save wave length because they publish
an article that explores this and it'squote. It's titled quote was Carol Bundy
a victim or the mastermind behind theSunset Killers? And I'm going to link

(34:51):
that below. It's really short,but it was interesting, and early on
I cut onto that. I waslike, something does not make sense my
leaving something out my theory for this. For that I should say, is
um, I do think that sheI don't. I think that she is
feeding into his own narrative if thatmakes sense, Like she's like, yeah,

(35:15):
go ahead and do that. Yeah, that is a good idea.
Yeah you should like almost in anuncover him, Like I could see that
like leading him in the way thatshe wants him to go. That make
We're gonna get into that more asecond, Yes, because that goes into
with my theory or the interview thatOkay, I'm so excited. Okay,

(35:38):
I've been so excited to cover thiscase all week. So Bundy, Remember,
she's all cool with pedophilia. It'sfine, We'll take naked pictures of
you raping child like children. It'sfine. Um, it's nothing. She
hasn't gone through, but at thedisclosure of this double murder, she is
just very unsettled, right, that'sokay. So she caused the police and

(36:01):
is like, hey, I haveinformation on these murders, but I'm not
going to tell you anything. Likeshe just makes this call like it's she
called calls the whoever. I don'tknow what she is dealt if it's ben
Tura who's handling this. Because she'sbeen in the system, she has dealt

(36:21):
with police, she has dealt withsocial workers, she knows how to talk
to them. I feel like ina way like I'm not going to tell
you everything, but I am goingto tell you this. Well, It's
like I wonder because I know shenever gave up Clark's name, so I
wonder how much she did given becauseof certain things that are said in the
interview. I tried to find evenbefore that interview, I tried to find

(36:43):
police records and I can't find shitfor this at all. I couldn't find
anything. I did find. I'mnot even going to mention it because people
shouldn't google it. But I foundphotos of things and not great. That's
all I could find. But again, this should sound familiar to people who
are very into true crime. BecauseI read that, I'm like, uh

(37:04):
huh, okay, this goes intowhat we talked about later. Yeah,
So, twelve days after this initialdouble murder, Clark does murder two additional
prostitutes, and that is Karen Jonesand exc Wilson. He lures them again
into the car, he does shootthem and dumps their bodies in plain sight.
But before he dumps both bodies,he does decapitate Wilson. He does

(37:27):
take her head back home puts itin the fridge. Bundy instead, who
just by the way, called thecops and was like, hey, I
know something about this double murder,finds the head and the fridge Clark had
already or is about to commit necrophiliawith said head, and Carol's like,

(37:50):
you know, it's going to bea really cool idea and makes perfect sense
going off of what I already did. I'm gonna put makeup on this head.
So you're so unsettled by the ideathat this man just killed someone not
somewhat two girls stand by, yo, man, Like that does not make

(38:10):
sense, Carol, You're not avictim, You're not in this scenario in
your childhood. Yes, you weresuch a victim, and I'm so sorry
you think that victims. Like,if somebody has a victim mentality, they're
a victim from the birth the Idon't know her personally, I can't comment

(38:30):
on that. I can only goon this fact. No, no,
I know, but I don't know. But when when somebody has a victim
mentality, it's they're they're a victimfrom birth. Okay, maybe they're a
victim from from day one to onehundred and seventy five million day Like they're
they're a victim first breath to lastbreath. Yeah, no, they are.

(38:52):
They're a victim everything has because oftheir childhood. They are a victim
of that, which makes them avictim of who they are today. Like
no matter what, the blanket,it's the blanket thing. But it's just
like I I like, I understandyou have a traumatic childhood, but happiness
is a choice, and being agood person is a choice. You can

(39:17):
still like, I understand if youhave a horrible childhood and like you were
completely victimized from age first breath toeighteen, I understand them. But after
that fact, you're not a victimanymore unless you play victim and she allways
played victim because victims always get sympathy. That kind of thinks she wants name.

(39:42):
Yeah, you can name anybody thathas ever been in a victim situation
and all they get is sympathy.I'm sorry you went through them, I'm
sorry that happened to you. Andpeople love that and it's stipulation is best
served and victim, well, look, well look at a Munchausen's by proxy
Gypsy Rose. That's why her momdid her mom, you know, severely

(40:07):
abused her for the attention and again, and it happens. And unfortunately this
as they learned that attention and that'swhat they want. That's their fix,
that's what they need. Um,It's just it doesn't work with the narrative
that Carol Bundy is trying to weefor herself. Later. Yeah, accountability
and a victim mentality is like waterand men. But what sucks is the

(40:29):
police also buy into this. Theysupposedly, either they buy into this or
it's a conspiracy, which we'll getinto based on how this goes, because
then, like I mean, Iguess you really can't. I don't know
how they found out. She didend up calling the police that first time,
because I'm assuming she didn't give hername. Maybe she did tell them
that first time, like I don'tknow, but it just thought she admitted

(40:51):
that, and like a interview.I couldn't find any interviews with her at
all. Oh, I didn't findany interviews. I was looking, and
I didn't find any additional info onthat. But she does admit a lot
during those police interviews, which isfunny because he said that she did exactly,
and that's why it was like,then why can't I find one?
Because I wanted her interview more thanyours? But now I'm glad I found

(41:13):
that interview. But um, yeah, anyways, um so they have the
head. Um, she puts makeupon it and it's totally fine. Apparently,
um they put it in a cleanbox and then they dump it in
an alley. Three days after this, another victim is found in the wood
kemper or someone else that I'm tryingto hint at subtly, very I'm very

(41:37):
subtle. I know. If youguys don't get this, I sort of
fucking god, podcast is over?Do you even know her? Have you
even been listening? Do you knowthis podcast? Um? So? Three
days after um, the like theydispose of the head. I'm assuming,
um, there is another victim foundin the San Fernando Valley in the wood

(41:59):
they around that area. This victimwas later idd as Marnette Comber, and
she was a runaway who had beenkilled about three weeks earlier, so this
would actually make her Clark's first victim. Throughout all of this, Bundy is
still obsessed with John Murray. Likewe said earlier, this never fucking dies.
Nope, at all. She stillattends his performances, and after these

(42:21):
performances she would have drinks with him, and the conversation. She got very
loose lipped during these conversations, andshe was like, hey, you want
to know what I've been doing.She tells Murray that her and Clarks are
trying to threaten this motherfucker, likeyou want to know what I've been up
to because you don't get a chance. I don't think so because of what

(42:44):
happens next, I don't think shewas trying to threaten him. I think
she was just thinking she could confidein him and oh, maybe he'll think
I'm cool. Maybe, you know, because she doesn't have like the standard
for a normal anything, so toher this is like, like it's it's
probably the same as if she likeJack Murray was telling her about a song

(43:05):
he wrote, and She's like,yeah, well I killed someone today,
that's what it is. Oh,that's a nice song. I murdered somebody.
You murdered that track. I murderedthat human. Shut the fuck up.
Oh my god. So she tellsMurray this, and I don't know

(43:25):
like how much she told, butshe at least told him enough to where
he either told her to go tothe cops or he was going to go
to the cops. And Carol's like, god, damn it, Like that's
what you get Carol for. Openup your stupid mouth. Now, stupid
Carol, I gotta fucking murder him, exactly. So now I gotta love

(43:47):
him and murder him at the sametime. I gotta kill my lover,
god love of her life. I'mtelling you, that's the hardest decision you
gotta make. But sometimes when youhave to do it, sometimes the situation
arises. It comes down you're them, always them, always them. They

(44:07):
got to go. So what happenstwo people have a secret, don't We're
not doing that again. We're notdoing that again. Um. She Lurie's
Laure's um murray to his van onthe pretense of having sex, which like,

(44:29):
you're also some Boyama suck that day. She's like, He's like,
okay, okay, you're not goingto talk to my wife again, are
you? And she's like, no, trust me, nobody's talking to your
wife. But I want to knowhow this works, because it literally went
from hey, I murdered someone,Hey, let's get it on in your
van like that. You're obviously notto say that. That should sum up

(44:54):
what a man thinks when you tellthem, hey, I killed somebody,
did this heinous crime. But listenwhat I'm gonna do for you? So
when I cut his her head off, so this tells you exactly you didn't
say anything to a man. Andhe's still ready to go because she told

(45:15):
him some crazy shit. And thenshe's like, hey, you want to
go in the back, and yeah, do you will. I wonder if
it was along the lines of ya, I'm just joking. I was kidding,
like, like, we don't really, we only have this conversation.
But seriously, if he I wouldhave to first of all, I would

(45:38):
know because this we have to takein consideration. This chick already bribe freaking
the wife. So is that givingher too much credit to say? Yeah,
okay, okay, yeah, that'sway too much credit because he knows
that she's a psychopath. But youknow, it's always attached to good psychopaths,
good genitalia. I'm not even lying. If you are an asshole or

(46:00):
you're a crazy bitch, you haveyou probably give the best sex in your
life. And I I know thereis a whole bunch of people right now
probably listening to this, nodding theirhead, going yeah, why is the
best always attached to the worst?Yeah? Bullshit, but yeah, I

(46:21):
think that. He was like,I think here's what I think. Okay,
hit me with it. She toldhim all this hand is shit,
right, And he was like,oh my gosh, she's crazy, but
she's offered because where did they doit? In his man? Exactly?
Where at at the venue? Rightexactly. He wasn't digging her home,

(46:42):
he wasn't digging her anywhere. Hewas just like, I'm gonna get my
rocks off, I'm gonna leave heralone. Like she can't kill me here,
What is she gonna do to mehere? In all sense of reality?
Because she's like crazy over him,right, Like he's probably like,
listen, I'm the last person she'sgonna You're She's the first person she confessed
to me. I'm like, oh, she's she's slaughtering your ass. Like

(47:06):
there's no way as there's no questionof mind. Oh hey, I yeah,
no, there's no fucking way.Because once inside the van, she
not only shoots him, she stabshim twenty six times and decapitates him aggressive
the van. Like and she alsoshe was so killed, umbastard, poor

(47:27):
guy. He was like dressed inpeace. But fuck that. I mean,
I mean, poor poor guy.That's all I'm saying is like this
guy was just trying to he wasjust he was just trying to have a
good night. Yeah. So whathappens is Carol, after committing this murder,
which by the way, like shewas super messy, she left um

(47:47):
showcasings in the van. This wasn'tplanned, so she didn't really probably have
an idea of what she would doafter. There was only the moment.
And she calls Clark after apparently andit's like, hey, I'm bringing my
lover home and he's like not happyabout it, until she's like, by
the way, it's just his head. And so she drove down the road,
which is Homeboy's head chilling on thepassenger side. Well, she picks

(48:15):
up him first. They nothing.Yeah, she picks him up, and
they have the head and they're tryingto find somewhere to dispose of it,
and they end up just like throwingit into a trash ban but the head
was never found apparently. Yeah,that's what I thought was like. And
I was like, you go tothe dump site then, but yeah,

(48:37):
and that's what what you would goto the dump site. You would go
to where the trash collects, andthen you would just find the remain And
that's why I was like, Idon't believe that. I don't believe that
one. For some reason, Idon't believe that that they just threw it
away. I think they just didn'tknow what to do or say and then
they were just like, oh,I just threw it away. I think
that they did something else with it. Interesting. I could see, yeah,

(48:59):
I could see that, just becauseI mean, I feel in the
eight and this is in the eighties, so this isn't like in the thirties
where they were just like fuck it. You know, there was no you
can get fingerprints. This was morein the eighties when they were like,
actually, like okay, we gottado something. And this is when serial
killers were crazy in California. Imean, we had a ton of fun.

(49:21):
You had Kemper, you had Zodiac, you had you had you know.
Golden State was also his Rain ofTerror was ending around this time as
well, so California and Man said, like California is just rampant. But
also so like we're still learning aboutserial killers. You know this this investigation

(49:42):
it's back, yeah, because thisis when serial killers started to get an
actual name, we start identifying,starting to identify them. And I when
I when I was reading over thiscase, I didn't um, I didn't
subscribe to that theory that they threwit away. That's interesting because I had
a different thought looking into that case. This case. Oh, we're going

(50:05):
to get to it in a second, because I'm gonna ask you the same
question. We would probably take abreak though. You are so right,
because I was going to keep going. Let's take a break because we still
have a lot more to cover.So grab the bottle of whatever you're drinking.
You will need it, all right, Welcome back. So this is
where in my opinion, things Ialso get even more interesting because after they

(50:30):
throw the head away, apparently twodays later, Bundy was quote about to
psychological pressure, and so she confessesto a co worker what happened that she
killed Murray so far that's it,and together they call the cops and confess,
and then she confesses to what herand Clark had been doing. And

(50:51):
at one point she says, hehas quote this nasty habit of picking up
underage victims of sex trafficking and killingthem. And however, when she's asked
later at some point, horrible habit, like you're just a terrible oh my
god. So he has this habitof like picking up fuck you. Sorry,
but that makes me up so upsetlike that that, right, there's

(51:15):
so upset because that's yeah, you'redownplaying it. You're you're you're a bad
habit too much? Or I haveI have a bad habit of every time
I passed by McDonald, I goget French fries, yeah, or I
get a coke. Everything. That'sa bad habit. Yes, that's a
bad habit. Not murdering young girlsand raping children. No, that's just

(51:37):
a legal activity and just disgusting andalso, you're no better because you're helping
him supply, you're supplying him withwomen. Glenn Maxwell, thank you for
bringing that up, because that's exactlyso I wasn't I wasn't going to say
anything because you know me and Iget ranty on that ship. But I

(51:59):
thought of that exact same thing whenI was going over this um, going
over this case, because I waslike, how dare you you? And
this is where that victim mentality,I'm like, I'm sorry, I can't
subscribe to that when you are thisold because you're supplying what you were where

(52:21):
you don't feel like, oh mygod. I would hate for anybody else
to be in this position where youare literally supplying people in your position where
I under okay, and this guy, I don't know if tell me if
this sounds weird or bad. Whenit's your father, it's like okay,
Like when it's in your family,it's like, wow, that's really sad.

(52:43):
But she went out and targeted.There's a whole different that's a different
see for me, that's a differentbeast. What's also different because you're taking
these children back and you know what'sgoing to happen. Yeah, yeah,
And that's what I know. Youknow how you know how that yes,
And that's what I mean. Whereif it was like he was like he

(53:04):
brought an eleven year old, you'dbe like, oh my god, I
know exactly how that feels. It'shorrible when she's supplying them, Yes,
she is putting them in a positionwhere I'm just like, but that's what's
so weird about this case is becausethen she goes on again to play victim
and exactly and exactly, that's whyI can't with this. Yeah, so

(53:27):
can't. Later in some other interview, because I believe she was interviewed extensively,
she was asked if she felt remorsefor participating in the murders, and
she said, quote, the honesttruth is it's fun to kill people.
Oh my god, that is quoteit's fun to kill people, which is
shitty when you think about when whenwe'll get to the convictions. The difference

(53:51):
between the two is like wild andbecause I mean, I know why it
happened. But anyways, so shesaid she was quote overwhelmed by his dominance
and charm. But despite that,you know, and murdering people, she
fell in love with him, whichagain is just negating what her participation in
said acts. M clark is arrestedand during the search as they do find

(54:13):
the two murder weapons, which werethe two pistols at his workplace in his
desk or something, and Bundy endsup there was a podcast that I was
listening to and they were like,it's the same type of pistol that Jody
arish and I was like, Iwas like, I just appreciate you for
the thanks for the facts. That'swhat we want. I did like that

(54:37):
one. I was like, thatis really interesting. I was like,
I mean, you're right, andI appreciate that you just linked that one.
Thanks five out of five, highout of five. We'll listen again.
So she ends up being charged withtwo counts of murder. One is
for Jack Murray and the other isfor an unidentified woman. I believe she's

(54:57):
referred to as Jane Doe eighteen thecase and even to this day, no
one knows who this woman was.No, they don't or this girl,
I don't know her age. Sothese are the two murders that Bundy did
confess to having witness or actually likekilled these people herself. So the Jane
Joe eighteen their body was discovered Augusttwenty sixth of nineteen eighty and they died

(55:21):
of a gunshot wound to the backof the head. They do have they
did facial reconstruction of the victim.So there is a if you look at
the Wikipedia page for either one ofClark or Bundy, it is going to
come up and unfortunately, still nothing. So Clark is charged with six counts
of murder and at his own trial, Clark does defend himself after his really

(55:45):
shitty attorney really fucks up his case. This guy was basically drunk in court
half the time and literally he Clarkwas on the stand and this guy fell
asleep, which is like, youdon't want to be asleep at all for
a trial, especially not when yourwitnesses being cross examined by the prosecution.

(56:08):
Are you fucking joking? I youknow what? Like, okay, so
everybody has a right to fair trial. I'm gonna let that out. Okay,
whatever, don't care par for thecourse, like go fuck yourself like
this, he had the perfect attorneybecause he did not deserve proper representation.

(56:29):
In my book, I don't okay, I'm sorry if you if you rape
an eleven year old willingly. Yes, I'm sorry, but you don't in
my book now at anybody else's youcan. You can argue and battle with
me, and that's fine. I'mnot even going to argue with on it.
But in my own personal opinion,I'm so glad you got this attorney,

(56:51):
like I couldn't pick a better onefor you, Like I good for
you, Good for you for onegetting this attorney, because this right here
is a little thing I like tocall I need. You're gonna say that
because you're an asshole. Oh forsure. You are one of the most

(57:15):
horrible people in the world. AndI'm sorry. Don't care about your life
at all, right and your freedom, especially when you do that, I
don't care. You took one victimrevictimize them, which I am loosely giving
her that. Oh no, shewas not revictimized. I feel like,

(57:37):
nope, hard pass. They manipulatedeach other on both senses. Where she
thought he was manipulous, she wasmanipulating him, he thought he was manipulating
her, and it's just got fuckedup. But yeah, I'm glad he
got this attorney to fall asleep ashe is being girls examine point. So

(58:00):
he does when he's defending himself,he does try to prove that it wasn't
him that was partnering with Bundy andnot doing these murders. It was Murray
and he was or that he wasmanipulated, like he is the biggest piece
of shit ever. Um Bundy.Okay, So I don't know if I
just read this wrong, if thearticle was wrong, but basically what happens

(58:22):
is like I'm assuming Bundy gets somesort of immunity because she does. She
is charged with two counts of murderherself, but she could be charged with
way more for everything else she witnessand participated in. I feel like because
she was a woman, they wenteasier on her. Okay maybe, Um,

(58:42):
But what's weird is because usually inthose cases, if you are giving
immunity, that means your estate's witnessand you testify for persecution. Apparently she
didn't testify for the prosecution. IfI think that they gave her, I
fully believe that they gave her alittle bit more of a pass just because
she was a woman, because they'relike, why would I don't want to

(59:06):
do that? Why would a womando this? And why you know they
should have investigated harder. Yeah,but it's a woman, so they're like,
hmmm, he probably did this andthat, like yeah, they would
give yeah, maybe. So atthe end of the day, though,
Clark was convicted of all six murders, and he's convicted or he's sentenced to

(59:27):
death in nineteen eighty three, andas of twenty fifteen, he's still on
death row as far as I know. There is a belief amongst authorities though,
that he may have killed more thanwhat we currently know and is attributed
to him. On the other side, Bundy is given a sentence of twenty
five years for the murder of Murrayand twenty seven years for the second murder

(59:50):
of Jane Doe eighteen on December ninthof two thousand and three. She does
die of heart failure at sixty oneyears old, so she is out of
the picture. Now. What wasreally nagging at me as I was doing
the research is that every nothing linedup at all with what she was saying.
Because the reason we know what weknow is because of Carol Bundy and

(01:00:13):
what she was talking about. Buteverything is very conflicting. Where oh,
he murdered these two women and toldme and then I called the cops and
then I put makeup on ahead andthen I helped dispose of bodies, and
then I murdered someone. But itwasn't me like there. But I'm a
victim too. There is too muchwilling participation in this for me to be

(01:00:35):
like, It's not like a childstark Weather and Carol Carol fugate kind of
thing where she was literally abducted andwas trying to save her family and was
on this rampage. No, youwillingly sought out victims for your boyfriend or
whatever. You guys were too rapeand then you helped you are she is
made out to be. Okay,Well she only killed two people. She

(01:00:58):
did so much more. I donot believe that she was sitting there like,
oh my god, I'm so scaredand oh my god, he killed
these two women, like no,yeah, there's no fucking way. Yeah
you she manipulated the fuck the fuckis Carol? Is she the mastermind?
Yes? In my opinion, shestaged this shit so much. Yeah,

(01:01:20):
no, I agree with you.I agree with you, but it's it's
uh, but that was not whatshe was ever going to get like charged
with. Yeah, I mean,I mean, you can't charge her for
the murders, but you can chargeas an accomplice. Oh for sure.
She was. Yeah, created abody. Yeah, I feel ye,
that's what. Yeah, I'm withyou. So what's interesting is there is

(01:01:43):
doubt on Clark's conviction. So there'sa criminologist by the name of Christopher Barry
d and he's gone on record sayingthat Clark has an alibi four five out
of the seven murders he's convicted of. There are banking documents that apparently exonerate
him of the murder of Wilson,which doesn't make sense because x C.
Wilson was also killed the same dayas Karen What Karen Johnson. I need

(01:02:07):
to go back and find her lastname, But it doesn't make sense if
he's only exonerated of that one becausethey're both killed that day. Bundy's testimony
as well, was very inconsistent.She once said that Clark murdered Jane Doe
eighteen two weeks before her interview onit was August eleventh, and this does

(01:02:29):
not line up because Clark had analibi for that date. So police tell
her that, like, there's nochance that he could have done this,
They allow her to change her storyand provide even more details on the same
murder, of the location and differentdate to make it fit that Clark did
it, which, like, asidefrom changing the date, like giving new

(01:02:51):
details, like it's really nothing new, but like it, I don't know,
it's just weird. Apparently a policeallowed Bundy to withdraw three thousand dollars
cash from John Murray's bank account.And remember, at this point, he's
already dead. She murdered him,but she says the police took the money
because like there, I don't know, there's not a lot of evidence.
So basically Bundy was really the onlyhope of getting him convicted at this point.

(01:03:16):
I don't really know how else theycould have tied it, you know,
I don't know if semen was lefton a scene to do blood type
you know, matching or whatever itis. I don't think they got that.
Yeah, I didn't read any ofthat. But he's also maintained his
innocence since the beginning, which reallyisn't like indicative of anything because so many

(01:03:36):
killers do. Yeah, but it'sjust another thing to throw in there.
There's a high possibility. Again,like I said, she was in the
car with him as he was pickingup and then murdering these prostitutes and disposing
of their bodies. So she gota huge She got a huge deal for
what sixty years little less than sixtyin prison to where I mean obviously she

(01:03:58):
did pass away, but she didhave the chance ends up getting out,
maybe not for a long life again, but yeah, I think it was
like two thousand and twelve she died. No, I was like, no,
no, she didn't three but no, in two thousand and twelve,
I think she was going to beup for parole you and um, but
yeah, obviously she didn't. Shedidn't make it till then she died nine

(01:04:21):
years earlier from that, but good. Um, but yeah she did on
two thousand and twelve, that's whenshe was able for parole or yeah,
probably parole. Now we have toget in to this interview. Should take
a break again before the interview inthis rant or no, um, yeah,
let's go ahead and take a break, um, even though we took

(01:04:42):
one pretty like probably, Um,yeah, we're gonna take a break because
we are going to get probably prettyinto this one. So go ahead and
fill up your glasses and then comeback to us because they're ready to put
on they're ready to get excited.Yeah, or go ahead and go on
YouTube, but look up. Iwill include the link so you guys can
watch this interview as well. Youhave to watch that. It's a fifty

(01:05:04):
six minute I believe it's fifty sixminutes or so, give or take a
little, um, but it's alittle less than an hour. Yeah,
it's it's a really funny interview.Okay, welcome back. UM. I
hope everybody clicked on that interview maybehad some time to actually watch it and
then came back to us or whatever. But we're gonna go ahead and get

(01:05:25):
into this interview that was and nowthis interview wasn't done here and in the
States it was done. Um theyhad to have flown in British documentary.
Yeah, yeah, that's what Imean. No, I don't mean that
it was it was he was gone. I mean like this was done for
um. Sorry I didn't say that. It wasn't American television, right,

(01:05:45):
um whatever whatever the British um thatstation was doing. I don't know if
they were doing like a true crimetype of thing or if they were just
doing interviews or digging. I haveno idea I did it was funny listening
to this thing, because the guywas like, Okay, I'm not saying
all of that, but you canedit this however you want. I'm gonna

(01:06:10):
finish my let me finish. Sothis basically, if we didn't, if
I didn't find this interview or thisepisode would be over, this would be
it. You know, we canspeculate all day about how, you know,
we think Carol Bundy was more involved, but this is what really took
this to the next level for me. And he's expensive, by the way,

(01:06:30):
how much should he get paid forthis? May I'd like a twenty
five dollars up front thing, butbecause like he forgot, he said,
I forgot, I forgot to haveyou sign this thing. So I'm gonna
waive it because you didn't know.It's my fault, my fault. I'm
like, listen to this fucking businessman. Yeah. So basically, so the
interview was with Douglas Clark and ohmy god, I just you guys,

(01:06:56):
it's gold. Even just watched thefirst ten twenty minutes of it. Really
the last like the last twenty minutesreally don't matter. And he starts off
this interview megapist, and he saysthat he and Bundy are housed under the
same kind of guidelines, so they'reboth under a level for security and which
but because he's on death row,he you know, is treated like quote

(01:07:19):
unquote an animal and he has tohave these shackles and it's this whole thing,
whereas she gets to do all theseinterviews and make herself look good because
she's a pun of the government orsomething. Weirds where I'm like, yeah,
the media fucking lies you, youdumb dick. Of course they're gonna
be all nice to you, butyou're a fucking criminal. You're not a

(01:07:40):
celebrity, Okay, just because yousee her maybe have all these interviews and
you see all this other stuff.You are a man, okay, and
in kind of the justice system andthat like they they'll throw the book at
you and they don't really give afuck, right, and when you're a
woman like they are a little bitmore, you know whatever. Sometimes And

(01:08:04):
you know, her story is becauseI'm sorry, but we've had a lot
of male killers. We don't havea lot of female killers. So her
side of the story is she couldhave then yours because we know it sells
more like this is the he's talkingabout interviews he's talking about all this media
coverage where it's like, that's cute. You thought that you were going to

(01:08:27):
be like this murderer that like gotall this attention, like Bundy and Kemper
and all of that, and youdid it because nobody gives a shit about
you because you're a murderer. You'reat the bottom of the barrel. I
would be a little interested just toknow a little bit more of his backstory,
because we really don't have that muchon his childhood and like really indicators

(01:08:48):
that he would go the way hedid right from what we know, and
whether that's just because he hasn't beenable to get his interviews are like,
we don't know. So that's theonly reason I'd be more interested in maybe
some of his interviews. But despitewhat he said, I couldn't find but
Carol Bundy. But even his interviewsare not like, Okay, so here's

(01:09:08):
where here's what I did wrong,and here's where I fucked up. It
was like, I don't even saythe theory yet, we're not saying it
yet. No one he was saying, damn, I just was saying that
he didn't Anyways, He's still maintaininghis innocence. He's not. He still
says that he was not a partof this, like he was on a

(01:09:29):
bit. He was just this innocentfuck standard m correct. So this is
where we get into a plausible theoryin some sense. And this to me,
and this is where it clicked forme when I was like, holy
shit, what he says is CarolBundy. And if you didn't put this

(01:09:51):
together yet, I mean I didn'ttell this interview, so I really can't
like criticize anyone else. But hesays she copied Ted by to a t.
Yeah, and when he laid itout, and when you think about
it, there are x like there'sa shockingly amount of like there's so many

(01:10:11):
parallels that it's could be true,could be true. So he bases a
lot of his theory on the nineteenseventy nine novel called Ted Bundy The Killer
next Door by Stephen Wynn and DavidMerrill. So as a brief overview some
of the similarities there is similar likesome decapitations where the head was left.

(01:10:34):
The dates of the crimes. That'swhat gets me is the dates and the
amount of victims killed on specific dates. Oh, I agree. The fact
that she idolized somebody in this sense, I think she did. Yeah,
she idolized him. She even wroteto him in prison. And you have
to remember this is three years beforehe's going to be executed, so he's

(01:10:58):
still alive. Like this is stillvery very fresh in the media consciousness,
not because of also like because oneof how brutal his murders were, but
because of but he is so hot, how can he be a killer?
Like he didn't look like a killer, you know, so there was this
is still it's not surprising to me. So he kind of starts off by

(01:11:18):
saying he being Clark, that hewas quote a happy go lucky bachelor chasing
skirts in La and he said hewas sharing a condominium his words, not
mine, with a quote homicidal butchlesbian. And then he later calls her
a quote sadistic lesbian serial killer andthat, you know, no one really

(01:11:39):
tries to understand lesbian serial killers,and so that's why he's charged. Like
it's I don't know, I don'tget it. I think they he was
just trying to describe her as aman hater. Y, yes, and
that's what that's what he was tryingto go off of. And at the
time period, um, yeah,gay wasn't okay being being being gay or

(01:12:03):
lesbian was definitely something that was closeted. So so it was definitely a narrative
that he could pitch and it wouldtake off. It would take off,
for sure. And like if hetried to pitch this narrative as of now,
um, people would be like,I'm gonna need some more evidence of
that, like just because okay,she was she looked like a lesbian,

(01:12:27):
that's it. No, no,no, no, but back the first
side of the But then it was, um, I mean, it was
definitely a talking point that he couldhave went off of, and he did
for sure, Yeah he did.So, he claims again, Jack Murray
and Carol Bundy were partners and atone point they it wasn't him not did
this. It was Jack and Carrolthat were raping an eleven year old chi

(01:12:50):
a girl. It was a younggirl in Murray's van. And apparently this
young girl may have testified at somepoint in some sort of hearing, and
if she did, like, kudosto her, and we are going to
come back to this young girl,So keep a pin in that. He
says that they were also murdering womenin his car. There may have been

(01:13:13):
blood evidence or blonde hair to provethat in Murray's car. Again, I
didn't see that. I did notsee any besides the shell casings at Murray's
murder, I did not see anywhat was left forensic wise at all.
So we really can't We can't backthat up. This is all just based
off the interview. Blood evidence mayalso show that some of the murders happened

(01:13:35):
in Carol's car. Now, inthe night she murdered Jack, Clark was
at home and apparently there was thisgo go girl who was staying with them
for some reason I don't know,folks for the night or what. But
she's in Carol's bed. She hasan epileptic seizure that night, and the
cops and ambulance came and they givehim an alibi the night of Jack's death.

(01:13:57):
However, we already know you're notinvolved, So I don't know why
this is relevant, Like you weren'tcharged with this. We know at most
you were not a composed because hedidn't turn her in after. But I
think in the interview, I thinkthis is just his like foundation. I
think that he was just trying toallude to this to just be a foundation
of like, you know, likethe concreteive it. It's like I didn't
do it. Well, yeah,this for the other Yeah. I think

(01:14:20):
that he was just trying to laydown the structure of the fact that like
this couldn't be him, do youknow what I mean, we didn't think
this one was you. Yeah,so pointless. Yeah, And I think
that's what he was trying to alludeto. I don't think that it was
because I know what I thought thesame thing. It's like, Okay,
we're random facts, nobody gives afuck. But I think that that's what

(01:14:41):
he was trying to do. Ishe's just trying to to place a structure.
Yeah, and what Yeah. Butwhat's also a little confusing is he
is a little wishy washy on timelinesand how he talks about and we're going
to get into specifics because he startsone thought and then blends it with another.
And I'm like, this doesn't makesense if you're trying to claim she
was murdering as a copycat of TedBundy, right, you know, there's

(01:15:04):
a specific one. So there wasthis whole thing about how she told Clark
or someone else that after a certainperiod basically before the murders, that her
and Murray weren't seeing each other becauseremember she tries to bribe his wife to
leave him. She says, fuckyou. Carol gets evicted and that's that.
And according to Carol, that wasthat, and she had no contact

(01:15:28):
with him. Right, of course, we know differently that she was still
going to his shows and was superobsessed and everything. So apparently even there
were letters that Murray's wife handed overin which and these are from Carol to
Jack where he calls where she callsJack her quote lord and master. So

(01:15:51):
she not to say that Murray didanything. I don't think he did in
the murder skate like murder aspect things. But that's that. Now onto the
part that I've been dying to talkabout the specifics and how she copied Ted
Bundy. So on June first,Brenda Ball goes missing and this is later

(01:16:13):
linked to Ted Bundy. June first, Manette Comer is the quote unquote first
or she is the first victim identifiedas being murdered by the Sunset Strip killers,
and she's lasting on June first aswell. However, Clark is like,
well, um it actually happened onthe thirty first, which is not
going a long way to like excludeyou from anything. By the way,

(01:16:39):
however, I did go back tomy Ted Bundy notes from months ago jokes
on you, sir. I didalso see when I was doing notes for
that that Brenda Ball either went missingon May thirty first or June first,
no matter what it fucking fits.Next, this is where it gets confusing
in Clark's sense, where he doesn'tline up things correctly in his mind or

(01:17:00):
how he says it. So onJune eleventh, Georgian Hawkins does disappear.
This is another one of Ted Bundy'svictims. Now on June eleventh, according
to Clark, who is getting thisinformation from apparently police recordings of the interviews
with Carol, which I could notfind, she says she drove to Hollywood,
finds this girl. But this girlisn't alone. This girl has a

(01:17:23):
friend with her, so she ormaybe Jack shoe away one girl take the
other. And this is like noon, so is in California. It's brightest
fuck daylight. Everyone can see something. Right again, you have the whole
bisand or effect. But still itdoesn't make sense if this is what they're
saying happened. Yea. The girlthey end up taking is Exy Wilson,

(01:17:46):
and according to Clark, per theseinterviews that no one can fucking hear,
they drive her to Vintura, theymurder her, and they decapitate her.
We know that. However, theythen turned back to Hollywood again, right,
which if you and I don't knowhow far apart these are, but
that's a long fucking drive. Soit's Ventura somewhere. It's the Ventura Freeways

(01:18:08):
where one of the bodies were left, and then back to Hollywood. But
again, I'm pretty sure both bodieswere in Ventura, So there's not that.
Okay, I don't that fun now, Okay, I'm going to give
you in the eighties, maybe thefreeways are not as convenient as possible.
Okay, I don't know. Andyou know what, this is the one

(01:18:29):
that I wish I would ask mydad about because we're California natives and I
was born there and and my dad, yeah, and I should have asked
him a little bit like, hey, we're we're was the the freeways accessible
as they are now? Because Ican totally see that in the eighties being

(01:18:51):
a little bit longer of a drivethan right now. Right now, probably
in the middle of the night,twenty minute drive. But at noon,
this is when this is happening.It's during I'm sorry, at noon.
It was probably like a twenty minutedrive in the middle of the day when
everybody's at work. And again I'mnot I haven't looked this up, so

(01:19:12):
I'm just saying, I'm just makingthis a comparison, as in, like
maybe back in the eighties it couldhave been like a half hour I mean,
like a forty five to an hourdrive. And also but where where
it wouldn't be plausible, But it'snot plausible in this sense that you're murdering
someone and you're like, you're doingall this work should go point A to

(01:19:33):
point bight back to point A,and you're also banking on Karen being there
as well, which is the otherwoman that is unfortunately murdered as well,
Karen Jones. It doesn't it doesn'twork right at all, which is where
I think his story does start tofall apart. While the dates are convenient
and to me, I think it'sinteresting because there's even more parallels than just

(01:19:56):
the dates of the murders that lendto the theory that she did copy ted
Bundy in a sense, right,so she has already murdered in decabitated Xie
will send. She does drive backto Hollywood, picks up Karen, who
again was already with her, alreadythere when Exe was picked up, and
they of course murder her, andaccording to him, they drop off Karen's

(01:20:20):
body around NBC studios. I thoughtboth were Bibentura Freeway. So I don't
know, because that's all that wassaid. Yeah, in research of when
bodies were found. Yeah, Ithought it was always the freeway. So
yeah, I mean too, Soagain something to do? I don't have
anything. Yes, apparently they tryto pick up a third girl. Doesn't

(01:20:41):
work. Now he's trying to comparethis, so he first he says,
okay, yeah, so you knowBrenda Ballum, Marnette Comber Bam, same
dates. Give him that because itis the same dates. Okay. June
eleventh, Georgian Hawkins, okay,June eleventh, two women. Okay.
However, then he goes on athing of where he says that he doesn't

(01:21:06):
finish. He said June eleventh,Georgian Hawkins, June eleventh. She drove
here here and here and then shewas really trying to copy Lakes of Amish.
I'm like you, these are fourgirls, what where's the other girl?
Right? You're missing someone. Thisdoesn't match. You don't not have
anyone to match Georgian Hawkins yea,or this theory because now you have to

(01:21:30):
come up with three of the murdersthat makes sense in this situation based on
book, based on a book whichis a mass market paperback in seventy nine.
So again, also who knows howcredible that is and who knows what
Bundy was saying at the time andwhat evidence they're going off of exactly because
Bundy was trying to if a manwas so inclined to them. Yes,

(01:21:53):
so, and this is a nofault of the writers at all. They're
working with what they had. Butalso the writers trying to make a story
and get money and get money,so there was a lot of things that
was not And again say they wereinterviewing Bundy, and Bundy was trying to
elude that he was like this guywho was just killing all these people,

(01:22:15):
or wasn't killing all these people?Whatever it was, they still had to
you know, it's always like youknow, those lifetime movies where it was
like based on actual events, whereit's just it's just blown out of proportion
because like you only have so muchentertainment value exactly keeping them be like,
oh my god, how how couldthey ever be from this point to this

(01:22:40):
point to this point and all inone day where it's not and we could
also kill somebody and then dispose ofthe body and then to do all this
and not not even factor in anytype of air. But you're also having
to you also have to consider becauseso this could make sense if you consider

(01:23:03):
the fact that he said, accordingto these police tapes, which is really
all we have to go off of, we're going out of his word,
off of her words, right,Okay, she kills we know Exie Wilson,
Karen Jones, and fortunately we're murdered. Right if you if this is
true, say Carol did drive backand forth or they drove back and forth
because he was complicit in these murdersand they did go try to pick up

(01:23:27):
a third victim in this timeframe,it could match because he's trying to compare
to three different murders. See ifyour Dren Hawkins and then he's like,
okay, well, Ted Bundy murderedJanice and Denise Nasland in like sam Amish.
And this was crazy because he abductedthem, yes, from the same
location again checkpoint she was trying todo that. They these women were objected

(01:23:50):
by Bundy at different times checkpoint okay, So and it happened three days later.
This was on July fourteenth. That'sa whole month later, right,
So that doesn't make sense. ActuallyI thought it was the same month,
So that's a discrepancy. So inthe book that Clark refers to a lot,

(01:24:10):
they hadn't named Liz Kendall yet,apparently as being the girlfriend and the
one the woman who helped turn Bundyin, because in the book they were
referring they gave her a pseudonym ofMelanie. If you watch the interview,
they said, you know the girlfriendMelanie called and so yeah, so obviously
we know that it was Liz Kendall. It was like, I think my

(01:24:31):
boyfriend is the killer, which aslistening to this interview, I almost bought
yet again the Phantom Prince still don'thave it. I was like, oh
my god, I want to getit. So close to buying the Phantom
Bruns Anyways, but does that soundfamiliar, Hey, my boyfriend is the
killer. Yeah, because guess what, Carol Bunny did the same fucking thing.

(01:24:53):
Right. She calls and it's like, hey, I have information on
these double murders. She did notname her boyfriend, but she still called
the police. Again, another nodto this case. Now that one's there's
also there's a yeah, that's theone because when I and I didn't connect
the dots at first, but whenI heard that, you know, she

(01:25:13):
called the police to confess and arelike, you know, mention that and
I'm like, okay, like that'sweird like that. Yeah. Anyways,
So in August eleventh, they're drivingaround with Exie Wilson's head in a wooden
box. Um, so they're lookingfor a location to drop the head,
right, well, apparently, andI could not corroborate this. I did

(01:25:34):
check. According to this book,or according to clark Um, Bundy did
decapitate Denise Nasland. We do knowhe decapitated a lot of victims, or
a few victims. He did dothis, so it's not out of the
realm of possibility. I just don'tknow if one of them was Nasland.
Now, according to the book,Bundy drops off Naslin's head at the scene

(01:25:56):
of a prior murder, which againI couldn't back up. So he dumps
the head at a murder scene.Well, according to him, that's what
Carol did with the head of exteWilson. Was she'd also dropped the head
off at a murder scene, soagain it would lend its to there now.
Clark also says that police have ontape Carol calling that eleven year old

(01:26:21):
girl who him and her and Murraywould rape as a quote delicious little twelve
year old. Okay, one fuckingnasty two. Two, She's not twelve,
so what's up? Well, Ted, Bundy's last known victim was Kimberly

(01:26:42):
Leech, who was twelve years old. Yeah, so she may have been
a future victim if you want tobelieve this theory, as I talked about
in our Bundy episode, which youshould definitely go listen to if you haven't
listened to, because that is likea one information over there, really fucking
favorite Episodever, one of the thingsthat always gets me that is not talked
about episode. Yes, it wasfour, we did it right before Ramirez,

(01:27:09):
I'm pretty sure. Twenty fourth,Yeah, we did I'm pretty sure
we did it before Ramiraz, Ohno we didn't. We did after,
You're right, and then we didthat home was Bundy. Yes, you're
right. Ignore me. I don'tknow my own content. That's why I'm
here. It's we all have ourstrengths. Um. Yeah, okay.

(01:27:30):
So what's not talked about enough about? Um Bundy? And my opinion is
when he calls his lawyer and islike, hey, where where exactly where
can I murder? Where I'm goingto get the death penalty? And they
were like Texas or Florida, Andhe goes to Florida and that's where.
That's exactly where what she did too, right? Correct? So what happened

(01:27:53):
is um? And this is accordingto Clark, she apparently Carol calls a
friend in or Again, a mannamed Dick Guys, and tells them she
is scared because her lover's a serialkiller and lies UM and according to her,
he says, leave to Florida.Why do that? Dick Guys first

(01:28:16):
is like, this never fucking happened. Never talked to her, I never
said that, But I also saythat you did why Florida? Yeah,
Ted Bundy, right exactly? Sookay, you were so right after hearing
this interview, Okay, So okay, looking over the the um what's it
called as a whole? The caseas a whole, and then look and

(01:28:39):
then listening yes to this one.If he didn't do this interview, I
don't know if I would have puttwo and two together though, so so
I would either. So here ismy thing. I'm like, Okay,
is this what they talked about andhe's finally talking about or did he just

(01:29:00):
see the crazy similarities and then fitit to his narrative? And I don't
know, because I mean it's notI could see a bit of both.
No, it's not all the way, but I mean the eerie similarities are
there's too many. There is toomany. There is too many. There

(01:29:21):
is too many to dismiss. Okay, but I'm pretty sure he did this
interview after her demise, right,I m the quality wise, I would
say maybe a year after a coupleof years before. I don't think they
mentioned. No, I think shewas still alive because they was it.

(01:29:43):
I think because he says, becauseshe's pretty kissed about interviews and she gets
six hours interviews, so I thinkshe may have still been alive okay,
because that's where I was like,all right, because she didn't have the
ability to one defend herself, tobe like, I don't even know what
he's talking about. Three, thiscould be subconsciously like she did read this
book and then she just it wasjust like her baseline like I that's where

(01:30:09):
my question is. Yeah, soI grew not my question, just my
eyebrow raisal sims right, Yeah so, and I agree because when I was
doing, when I was doing thiswhole thing, it was just too neatly
wrapped up to me, and youknow, her calling the police but then
providing children for him to rape andbeing complicit in that and then participating in

(01:30:29):
murders like that phone call was justso out of place, right, it
makes no fucking sense because guess whatif he goes down? Yeah, I
think I think I read where theyhad this whole thing if when they bought
that when he could quote unquote convincedher to buy these pistols, right,
he was like, if I evergo down for this, if we ever
get caught, I'll take the blame. Okay, well one probably not.

(01:30:53):
So the moment he's arrested, youeither are very ignorant to assume that he's
not going to turn you over orI don't know right, or you you
did this and you're fully complicit andyou're making that call to fit this weird
fantasy obsession you have with Ted Bundyagain because she's a man pleaser for sure.

(01:31:14):
And you know, I was tryingto find more stuff and you know,
I think I can't find interviews abouther. Is because Ted Bundy's wife
was also named Carol Bam. Maybeif we put Carol m Bundy doesn't work.
I tried, I did try.Oh I didn't try that one.
That's why I was so trying tryingto find him. And I was like,
oh, you know what, Ireally and you're right because I didn't
put M Bundy. I put CarolBundy, and I always got yeah,

(01:31:38):
you get it, um. Butalso that's another thing. Maybe she saw,
oh, well, my name's Carol, his wife was named Carol blah
blah blah, like and you knowwhat I feel like you're right, is
she could idolize that point where shewas like, I'm Carol Bundy and it's
similarities and blah blah blah. There'sjust so many ample opportunities for her to

(01:31:59):
lie drawn to this case because youknow, we're forty years removed from this
now and we're still talking about thisand fascinated by this and all the ins
and outs. But she was init in the sense that she was alive
when it was breaking and these murdershappened. So whether or not she heard
about it by following the news orhappened to read this book because it came
out in seventy nine, their murdersstart in mid eighties in the summer,

(01:32:24):
so they are ready, Like,she has some time to read this book,
if that's where it came from,but she's also working with a set
amount of months to really try tofigure out how the fuck to line this
up right, you know what Imean? So to me, I think
she was copying Ted Bundy, Okayto an extent, because there's and that's
fair, that's a fair point,just because there's too much similarities where she

(01:32:46):
because she could have been fading offof them. Yeah, for sure.
Yeah, I think that's my funfact she was friends with Dorothea Puente,
just so you know, correct,According to this interview, interesting according to
Clark. Clark also mentioned it wasfunny because Clark was like, yeah,
Manson gets to do all these interviewsand oh yeah, no, he was
like pissed the fact that he waslike this high profile killer that didn't get

(01:33:11):
the quote unquote media attention that hewanted. And that also lends it again,
you're a narcissist and you want theattention. So you're mad. You're
either mad because you're a narcissist andyou're not getting the attention that all these
other quote unquote big guys are oryour piss because you didn't do it.
Yeah, those are the only twopossibilities, and you didn't. Like,
there's no other nothing, there's anythingelse. A little I guess more information,

(01:33:38):
Like so about the decapitation it specifically, Apparently it was very articulate.
It was done by the same bladeum sert at one point ended another.
It was very clean, apparently accordingto Clark. Again, so take that
with a grain of saul if youwant. Obviously, like we said,
it lends itself to maybe it wasa medical professional. Don't know. Jack

(01:33:59):
Murray may have also been a sexualstatist. Apparently there were many women who
came forward to testify against this,so you know, these are sexually motivated
crimes. Right, someone like thatcould be involved. Yeah, if you
want to believe that. But Ithink Clark did it. Yeah, me
too, I think Clark did it. I think he's mad that Carol got
a lesser sentence and all these Ithink, yes, and I do.

(01:34:21):
I do believe that Clark kind ofgot into a little bit um um in
over his head. And yeah,yeah for sure, right, he are
also not over He was just like, well, fuck, why don't I
get that attention too? Yeah,where's my my movie? Interview? It

(01:34:43):
was where's my book? Yeah,like I think they're a match made in
hill. Truthfully, I agreed,Wow, that is a sense that strip
killers of trip. I'm glad itturned out that. I'm glad we found
the interview. Roles's episode would haveI would have not been happy about it
would have been a little bit Yeah, it would have been a little bit
like Okay, well who heard haveYeah those are the facts? Um.

(01:35:06):
Yeah, so that's our case.Um, tune in next week because we're
going a little bit back to ourold ways only for the episode, and
we're each covering our own case.Yes, and it's both true crime.
Yes. The one thing um,I know that like in the beginning of
this, I always did like Hollywood, true Hollywood, as we like to
uncorrectly call it. Both of usare guilty of this. Anyway, continue

(01:35:30):
I was not even going to readIt's so funny because like you said it
too, and I was like,I don't know if she's just in support
of me. No, I didnot even really just like just because yeah,
but anyways, in uh for truetrue Hollywood, um so in old
Hollywood, I mean, I feellike I've covered a lot of people that
I really liked back then, butum, I just I can't jive with

(01:35:55):
what Hollywood is now. Um tocontinue doing it right? Okay, where
maybe I might touch on old Hollywoodagain, um if I do try to
find somebody that I really like,really really really really really want to talk
about, But yeah, I'm goingto kind of stray away from there just
because as maybe the more that I'mgrowing and maybe the more that I'm learning,

(01:36:20):
I'm just realizing that it's just sofucked up. Not that it's fucked
up. I mean it was notthat I'm not intrigued with old Hollywood,
because I still do love history.M It's just I just don't I to
be honest, with you. I'vejust not loved it as much as the

(01:36:42):
more research I did into it,the less passion I find into it.
So if you're interested, you know, follow along for next week. Wherever
you're listening, Please rate, review, subscribe, share us with your friends.
It does really help us and wedo notice when you do rate,
review and subscribe. All of that. Um. You can follow us on
Instagram Boozy blonds, pod our,Twitter is at boozy Blondes, emails at

(01:37:04):
boozy Blondes at gmail dot com,give us like on Facebook at blondes,
booze and bullshite. And that's itfor this week. Don't forget to like
your noise. And if you're goingto tap at wrap it, we're just
gonna stick to you a little

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