BPS 443: Breaking the Mold: Lily Yasuda and Michael Wolfe’s Journey to Crafting the Anti-Rom-Com

On today’s episode, we welcome the dynamic duo, Lily Yasuda and Michael Wolfe, two inspiring filmmakers who have decided to take the road less traveled by creating their own feature film, Like Love. Their journey is one of collaboration, determination, and creativity—filled with moments of laughter and the occasional unexpected hurdle.From the outset, you’ll sense the chemistry between Lily and Michael. They first crossed paths during their time at Chapman University, bonding over vulnerable and humorous writing assignments in a creative writing class. Their shared passion for storytelling sparked not only a friendship but also a creative partnership. This partnership culminated in the idea for Like Love, a project born out of their desire to challenge traditional romantic comedy tropes.

“We wanted to tell a story that feels real and honest,” Lily shares, “about friendships and the complexities of human connection.”At its heart, Like Love is what they call an “anti-romantic comedy.” Drawing inspiration from classics like When Harry Met Sally, Lily and Michael aim to flip the script on the genre. Instead of perpetuating the myth that friendship between men and women inevitably leads to romance, their film explores the beauty of platonic relationships. As Michael explains, “It’s about two friends trying to fall in love and realizing they’re better off as friends. That’s the kind of story we don’t see enough.”Their filmmaking journey hasn’t been without its challenges. Crowdfunding has been a pivotal part of bringing Like Love to life. Lily and Michael describe the process as “a full-time job in itself,” requiring not only meticulous planning but also a willingness to be vulnerable and open about their creative vision. They’ve leaned heavily on their network for support, finding generosity in unexpected places.

“The community in Boise has been incredible,” says Lily. “People here are so supportive, offering locations, resources, and even homemade meals for the crew.”Despite the logistical hurdles, their passion for storytelling shines through. Michael, the film’s director, admits that directing a micro-budget feature comes with unique pressures. “We’re all wearing multiple hats,” he notes, “but it’s an amazing experience to work so closely with a team that believes in the project.” Lily, who also stars as the film’s lead, balances her roles as actor, writer, and producer with grace, emphasizing the importance of collaboration in every aspect of the project.As they reflect on their experiences, one thing becomes clear: Like Love is more than just a film; it’s a testament to the power of community and perseverance. Lily and Michael hope their story inspires other aspiring filmmakers to take the leap. “Making a movie isn’t easy,” Lily acknowledges, “but if you’re passionate about your story, you’ll find a way to make it happen.”

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
You are listening to the IFAH podcast Network.

Speaker 2 (00:06):
For more amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, Episode number four forty three.
Your dream doesn't have an expiration date, Take a deep
breath and try again. KT Whitten broadcasting from a dark,
windowless room in Hollywood.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
When we really should be working on that next draft.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
It's the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft and
business of screenwriting while teaching you how to make your
screenplay bulletproof.

Speaker 3 (00:36):
And here's your host, Alex Ferrari.

Speaker 1 (00:41):
Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast.

Speaker 4 (00:44):
I am your humble host Alex Ferrari.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
Now, today's show is sponsored by Bulletproof Script Coverage.

Speaker 5 (00:50):
Now.

Speaker 6 (00:51):
Unlike other script coverage services, Bulletproof Script Coverage actually focuses
on the kind of project you are in the goals
of the project you are, so we actually break it
down by three categories micro budget, indie film, market, and
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(01:13):
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(01:34):
Enjoy today's episode with guest host Dave Bullis.

Speaker 4 (01:39):
Under this week's episode, I have three people who decided
to self produce their own movie because they sold it
as the only alternative They wanted to go out there
and make something. They wanted to go out there and
actually see something be made and not just talk about
it and not just write about it. You know, you
actually want to see things get made. My first guest,
because there's two of them. My first guest is a writer, actor,
and filmmaker from Boise, Idaho. She got sduated summa cum

(02:00):
laude from Chapman University, and we'll be making your on
screen debut in the movie Like Love. My other guest
is a writer, producer, director who's made his slew of
short films and documentaries. He graduated with a PFA and
film production from Chapman University. He is currently interning, I
believe at Scott Ruden Productions and he's actually a full

(02:22):
Bright semi finalist, which is actually pretty cool. So we're
going to talk all about, you know, going to production companies.
We're going to talk about film school hangover, We're going
to talk about self production and their new project which
is on Seeden Spark right now called Like Love, with
guests Villi, Yasuda and Michael Wolf No.

Speaker 5 (02:41):
Only good things. Marty's super great. He's actually more of
Michael's friend than mine. You had him as a professor, Yeah.

Speaker 7 (02:48):
No, he Marty.

Speaker 4 (02:49):
So.

Speaker 3 (02:49):
Marty was the production coordinator at Chapman University, where Willie
and I both went to school and met for the project,
and he has a lot of experience with crowdfunding, which
is something we're doing for the movie we're making. And
I had gotten to know him through the school and
we were putting together a team of advisors for the project.

(03:12):
And since he has experienced with crowdfunding, he seems like
a logical bet. And one of the things we were
talking to was Marty, who do you know that we
can tell more people about this kind of thing that
we're doing. And he was more than happy to help
because Marty's just the nicest guy on the planet. But
he did talk a lot of smack on you.

Speaker 5 (03:29):
He was like, whatever you do, don't talk to Dave
because he's terrible. So we went to you immediately, and
here we are, so we hope we don't get in
trouble with Marty.

Speaker 4 (03:37):
But exactly, you have to outsmart him. You do the
exact opposite of what he suggests.

Speaker 5 (03:44):
Exactly, that is exactly what we learned in film school.
And here we are making a movie. So I don't
know what could go wrong, but so far, so good.

Speaker 4 (03:52):
Yeah, I know Marty for years, and Marty is a
really great guy, and I'm actually happy that, you know, you,
you were able to be taught by somebody who not
just talks to talk but also walks the walk because
Marty's actually made films. He's actually crowdfund of things before.
For for listeners of the podcast, they they kind of

(04:13):
know my history of you know, I didn't go to
film school, but I did teach film school stuff. And
what happens is I have a kind of a love
hate relationship with that because oftentimes they hire these colleges
hire professors who don't know what they're doing. That that
that that's the black mark of a lot of a
lot of colleges. That's a dirty little secret they don't

(04:33):
need to know about. But anyways, I'm sorry what we're
about to say.

Speaker 3 (04:36):
Oh no, that's that's absolutely that's absolutely true, and just
like it's a I think I think it's partially because
film is just so it's still very new to the world.
You know, like a lot of like really only the
private colleges have caught on to it. And even then,
like a lot of the people they get to teach
it are like you know, they're they're people who have

(04:58):
tried and decided like I can't do this full time,
so I just want to, like you know, help other people.
And it's it's easier for them because they're proud they're
not as hot in the industry anymore. But it's just
such a new concept. It's very it's very touch and
go where you like you really have to do your research,
and the Hollywood Reporter, which is like the go to
for a lot of people, like that's how we found Chapman, Like, yeah,

(05:21):
totally that that's just like you know, staff by people
who all come from USC and the bigger schools, and
so they're just going to promote their own and it's.

Speaker 5 (05:32):
Like and I think coming from a you know, Chapman
is certainly an up and coming, certainly a recognized school,
but you know a little bit a little bit newer
on the sort of film school scale.

Speaker 7 (05:42):
You know.

Speaker 5 (05:42):
I think it's been great for us to you know,
obviously Michae when I met through school, and so that
in and of itself, I think the fact that we're
making this movie proves that film school does provide a
degree of network and then could be really helpful. But
we're also just trying to move forward with you know,
having a net of advisors, people like Marty, but we
also have you know, some other people on our list.
You know, Dave Line as a friend of my dad's,
who's a DP on Homeland and True Blood has worked

(06:05):
with Kevin Smith, you know, and.

Speaker 7 (06:09):
Clerks together.

Speaker 5 (06:10):
Yeah, yeah, Dave and Kevin Shock Clerks when they were
like like twenty one or twenty two, like our age,
you know. But having some people outside of the faculty
sphere that can also provide some support and some guidances
is really important. So it's definitely about about cultivating that network.

Speaker 4 (06:26):
So you one of the questions I was about to
ask too was where did you guys meet? And you
just you just mentioned in film school. So I wanted
to ask that because I thought maybe you guys, you know,
you two were friends before film school and you decided
to go there at Chapman together. So let me ask
you this. When you both decided to go to Chapman,
when did you actually meet each other? And then, you know,
how did you start working together like you are? Now?

Speaker 5 (06:51):
Do you want to do it? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (06:53):
Well, so it turns out we lived on the same
floor freshman year. But yeah, well we didn't find that
out until like a year late because we didn't really
talk to each other.

Speaker 7 (07:02):
We met in a.

Speaker 5 (07:03):
Like I knew that you existed, but I don't think
i'd ever actually spoken to you.

Speaker 3 (07:07):
Yeah, I think that's what it was. But we met
in this creative writing class outside of the BUILD program
because you you just like, you have to take electeds
and you want to like fill in those something this
general education, so it's something that's fun and sustains you.
And we Willy and I both just standed up like
we had to write like a memoir piece, and Willy

(07:29):
and I both ended up tackling topics about like our
like sexual history, like I've told the story of like
my first blow job.

Speaker 5 (07:37):
They were Yeah, they were like very unfortunate, they were
they're very unfortunate, very humorous like material, and we just
we just bonded. Yeah, we like we had to read
them out loud, and it was like super uncomfortable because like, oh,
who wants to go first? And Michael went first, and
Michael Starr was like, so ethically like we'll say vulnerable
in like an artsy way, we'll go with embarrassing in
like a more literal way. That I was like, okay,

(07:58):
then I have to share. And we like talked after class, yeah,
and like had mutual friends. And then he sent me
an email like I don't know a few weeks later
pretty much s tootally out of the blue and was like,
I want to I want to produce a feature when
I graduate. I want you to write me something. And
I was like, cool, what do you want it to be?
And he was like it can be whatever you want.
And I was like that's really nice, but that's not

(08:19):
what you mean, Like what what's the movie that you
want to make, and he you had a ton of
ideas you sent me, like a doc. They were like
eight or ten things on that list, but one of
them was a story about a girl that he was
friends with in high school. He was really close with
and he was super into her and she was not
super into him, and sort of I guess the fallout

(08:42):
of that and like sort of the like weird price
you pay for one sided reciprocation. But then it became
this conversation but like the friend zone, you know, and
sort of what relationships look like now, and that seemed
like an interesting place for us to start. So it
was a pretty loose pitch when I started it, and
Discres has been through a lot in the last few years,

(09:04):
so yeah, it's definitely evolved, but it was Yeah, it
was Michael's pitch, and I think that that coming together,
I think, not as friends but like worries more about
like being collaborators.

Speaker 3 (09:13):
Yeah, edit hers well. And it was important to me
because I am more of a director than a writer.
Like I like writing and I like to talk about writing,
but the actual writing is so difficult. And what's great
about Lily is she just is She's really prolific, like
she's always writing something and she has to finish it,
and you know, you usually you just start stuff and

(09:35):
you don't finish it, and that's me.

Speaker 7 (09:37):
In a nutshell it.

Speaker 3 (09:38):
So I approached Lily because she was the person who
I knew it could finish it.

Speaker 5 (09:46):
And that's kind of what you want when you ask
someone to write you a movie. You want to make
sure you have at least all the movie. So that's
what that's what we're trying to do as we move forward.

Speaker 4 (09:56):
So when you mentioned the person who would never reciprocate.

Speaker 1 (10:01):
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
and now back to the show.

Speaker 4 (10:10):
Is that one of those typical people you kind of
meet not only in film school but in all types
of like colleges, in the workplace, where they're always there
when they when they need something, and then whenever you
need something from them there you know you can never
find them.

Speaker 5 (10:22):
I think that's probably true. I don't think that's unique
to film school. But I think the story that Michael
brought to the table, you know, is less about I
don't know, feeling jilted or like like being taken advantage
of by someone who doesn't reciprocate your feelings, but just
the idea that, you know, romantic comedies have spun this
idea that like, oh, well, if you're a boy and
a girl who like each other's company, you're destined to

(10:44):
be in love. And I don't know, if you've ever
existed in the world, you've probably found that that's not true.
And I think just sort of mining the story within
that about yeah, sort of the realities of attraction and
intimacy and what that means, and that you can love
someone and not be destined to be their partner was

(11:04):
sort of the underlying ideology.

Speaker 4 (11:08):
Yeah, yeah, I know, I see exactly what you mean.
I just you know, I've again when I when I
used to work at different universities and teach film stuff,
there's always you know, there's always a little friction sometimes
and usually that's like the type of person you know
what I mean. It was always like, you know, needed neat,
very needy, and then when they when you need something,
they're just never there. It just as a side question,

(11:29):
have you ever met, like, I guess, the the the stereotype,
which is basically the what I like to call the
art school, uh, the art school reject. And what I
mean by that is there the person who is just
you know, makes everything they want they want to make
is like avant garde that you know what I mean?
And they and they and I dare I say they

(11:49):
almost wear they want to wear a beret.

Speaker 5 (11:52):
That this literally honestly not even the metaphorical bray.

Speaker 4 (11:57):
Like, yeah, the.

Speaker 7 (11:59):
Love people, but they have no idea.

Speaker 3 (12:01):
They they when it comes time and you help them
out on their project, they have no idea like how
to communicate what it is they want. They just kind
of just bark at things that you and you're just
you just kind of you're just kind of scrambling. And
they usually like you know, especially in film school and
in the industry as and when you're starting out like this,

(12:22):
you want to trade as many favors as you can.

Speaker 7 (12:24):
Like that's my biggest thing totally.

Speaker 3 (12:27):
That's the kind of person where like they can't trade,
they can't trade, they can't do anything. They've never even
been on a set before, Yeah, they weren't even Like
they don't know how to be a boom up and
why it's important to be good at boom opping and
motivate a person who's going to boom off for you someday.

Speaker 5 (12:42):
Totally.

Speaker 4 (12:43):
Yeah, we know people. I usually have a saying, if
you were in a class, you know, and you're in
film school and you can't find that person, chances are
you might actually be that person.

Speaker 5 (12:58):
Definitely if you're like I don't know anyone like that, like,
oh other people, other people know that person, and I'm
sure they could point you in the right direction.

Speaker 4 (13:07):
When I when I was, you know, working at different places,
there was a student project that this person made and
they were kind of you know, in that sense, they
were in that regard, and they were they would constantly
quote you know, you know, they talk about Krosawa films
and this and that. Oh yes, and now I'm a
huge movie nerd, so obviously I'll talk about that too.

(13:29):
But but it's just they kind of you know how
I mean, they they they shoot one thing and it's like, oh,
this is exactly like Crosa would do it. Oh my god.
So anyways, the project they handed in, uh was so
badly done. Like I could I could do a whole
podcast about what had happened, but essentially aspect ratios didn't

(13:52):
match from scene to scene, and I at first, I
was like is this an artistic choice of why you're
going from you know, all these different aspect creator she
was maybe maybe this is just something that I'm not
aware of, And no, it wasn't a artistic choice. And
there was there was a lot of that. There was
a lot of sound issues you're speaking of boom like operator,

(14:12):
there was, and there was something else. I want to say,
there was something wrong with the coloring. And I can't
remember what it was, but I think the color correction
on the scene was so blown out. It was just
like everything. It was like a hodgepodge of everything not
to do in film school. But if I said to you, like, hey,
come up with every stereotype of film school, that's what

(14:33):
this was awesome?

Speaker 5 (14:35):
Awesome. Yeah, well, and I think so much of that is,
you know, particularly as young as young filmmakers, as student filmmakers,
you know, there's a desire to do something really big.
Everybody wants to be Chris Nolan or everybody wants to
be Tarantino, right, people want to oh god, and with
all due respect to Edgar Wright, but you know, I
think there's a diire to tell really big stories. And

(14:56):
I know that, you know, I get off a little
bit easier because I operate more on the writing side
than the production side. But you know, I like to
tell really small stories, and that's good news for me
because small stories are really producible. And that's very much
how we approach this movie, like love, that we wanted
to tell a small story both that would not kill
our our pocket book when it came time to pay

(15:20):
for it, but that we could really focus on telling
the story well and not getting too hung up on
lens flares and car chases and all that.

Speaker 4 (15:29):
Oh yeah, and we've all been there too, where where
you know they were going to make some movie that
we absolutely passively can't make, like you know, a car
chase movie or a time travel movie, stuff like that.
And that's why, you know, it's just when people do that,
it's always like godspeed, but you know you're probably going
to end up we're hating every single second when you're like, oh,

(15:53):
making a time travel movie where we're going back to
eighteen hundred and oh there's cars in the background, or
if you walking, you know what I mean.

Speaker 5 (16:00):
You're like, Oh, it can't be that hard. We'll just
need a few cars, and you're like, those cars are
really expensive. Though like a few cars can be most
of your budget.

Speaker 7 (16:08):
Well that was me. That was me with my thesis film.

Speaker 3 (16:11):
It was a superhero movie, which I now like because
I had done the smaller stuff and I was like,
I want to challenge myself, So I'll make a superhero
movie with like six locations, like it had the effects
sequences and how big was your crew? Our crew we
had like crew of like eighty people, and it was
as a student filmmaker, you're leading a crew of like
eighty people and you're just like that's a lot to manage.

(16:33):
And you're also like there's so many elements that you're
trying to get into place. You can't even make the movie.
You're trying spending so much time trying to make the
movie happen that you don't make it good.

Speaker 7 (16:45):
You don't even Yeah, you don't make the movie.

Speaker 3 (16:46):
You just you just kind of like assembled, You just
kind of throw a bunch of stuff.

Speaker 7 (16:50):
On screen and call it a movie. Yeah, at that point.

Speaker 5 (16:53):
And also for the record, I would just like to say,
there will not even be eighty people on our set
in total, including extras, on this feature, So we're really
scaling back.

Speaker 4 (17:05):
On this on this project.

Speaker 3 (17:06):
That was that was a crash course and like what
what not to do? Yeah, but I learned you do
learn how to stretch your budget really quickly when you're trying.

Speaker 5 (17:14):
To assemble all those things. Goldfish for everybody, fruit snacks,
that's true pro tip aspiring filmmakers. Everybody loves fruit snacks and.

Speaker 3 (17:24):
It has to be it has to be welches. It
can't be the off friend.

Speaker 5 (17:27):
Yes, exactly, that's our advice.

Speaker 4 (17:31):
That's like the Lloyd Kaufin brain of doing things. You know,
the goldfish crackers and dale old bagels. That that's the
old Lloyd Kaufman special.

Speaker 5 (17:38):
That's the two major food groups. Honestly, Like you get
something crispy and something with cream cheese.

Speaker 3 (17:42):
On it, and like you'll be fine. For my for
my thesis, we had a night shoot and uh marpur
Chucer she's a wonderful, wonderful person, but she's from China
and she got bagels and instead of cream cheese, she
got sour cream. Like three in the morning, and you're
you just want to go to sleep, you know, and

(18:03):
you just try to work and so and so you're
not reading the labels. You just see what looks to
be cream cheese and you're putting sour cream on bagels
and they spread them because they thought it was they
thought it was cream cheese and nikes. Yeah, talk about
a way to wake up though coffee.

Speaker 5 (18:21):
That's rough.

Speaker 4 (18:23):
That that yeah, that's that is that is pretty rough.
I I don't know. Uh did she was? She able
to sort of save herself, meaning that like she did
she realize the mistakes she made and and she tried
to to make amends.

Speaker 3 (18:36):
She did, she did, she went out crafty for everybody.

Speaker 4 (18:40):
Oh good good.

Speaker 7 (18:41):
Uh you gotta you gotta.

Speaker 3 (18:42):
Feed your crews. Well, yes, that's important.

Speaker 4 (18:45):
Yeah, absolutely, you know. Uh. And before we start talking
more about like love, I just wanted to ask, you know,
when when when both of you are shooting, you know,
your student projects throughout you know, your your four years,
did you ever when you were out out shooting did
you ever get you know, maybe somebody coming to ask
you questions about hey, what are you doing? H and
you kind of were able to pull the whole Hey,

(19:06):
I'm a student filmmaker. Card Wait, I'm sorry, repeat the
question real quick. Did you ever, like when you were
out filming, did you ever get to pull the whole hey,
I'm a student filmmaker card. Like like if you're ever
out somewhere shooting and somebody asks you like, hey, what
are you doing here? Like, hey, what are students? We're
making a movie?

Speaker 5 (19:26):
I think I think that's hard in California, especially in
Orange where Chapman is located, because everybody does like everyone
is on set all the time. Like the residents of
Orange hate student filmmakers, which like is probably not unwarranted,
you know, but for this, for this feature, we're shooting
in Boise, Idaho, and even like today, like we did

(19:46):
a couple of location scouts and like people are just
so stoked, like there, what are you doing? And you're like,
we're making a movie. And they're like wow, could we
be in the movie? And you're like yeah, potentially, Like
people just think it's so fun. So I think there's
a higher sort of like novelty.

Speaker 1 (20:01):
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
and now back to the show.

Speaker 3 (20:10):
Well yeah, well in Orange, you was like you downplay
the student aspect and you just go for the we're
young and hungry and.

Speaker 5 (20:18):
Chat enter kind of thing. You do, not say you
go to Chapman, the people, the residents of Warrens. You
do not want to help you as a Chapman student.

Speaker 4 (20:27):
See and that that there's the those are the pro
tips that see that that that are like you know,
you have to be in the note to get them.
Oh sorry, I just hit the microphone so I was
See I was so excited about that pro tip. I
hit the microphone with my hand. Uh but no, but see,
those are the types of things that you kind of
have to you know, ebb and flow out of because
you get you don't want to say you're you're you know,
going to Chapman, but you're also you're always want to

(20:49):
be able to say, hey, look, you know if you're
if you're out somewhere and you're shooting without a permit
and you're you're doing a gorilla style, you want to
be able to say, hey, I'm I'm I mean, I've
done it too where I'd like, hey, I'm just a
student making a film. What's going on here? I didn't
know an it's sumfer.

Speaker 3 (21:03):
Yeah, well that's why that's why we're in Boise in particular.

Speaker 5 (21:06):
It's because they don't they don't like need filming permits.

Speaker 3 (21:10):
Yeah, there's not an emphasis on like in I think
in La, what is it like if you if I
don't know if this is a rumor or not, but
I've heard horror stories where like people will build film
guerrilla style and then in La they find out you
didn't have a permit. Afterwards it can lead to huge
fines and like you can't use your footage like without

(21:32):
being sued by the city. It's it's a yeah, it's
like a big it's a big deal just because they
have so much production fatigue, whereas in you come out
to this small place like like Boiser, like a significantly
smaller where there's no where there's hardly any film and infrastructure.
I think I think they don't even have like film incentives.

Speaker 5 (21:50):
Right, So maybe this is really just an elaborate plug
for people to come shoot films in Idaho, Like surprise
you got us. Like, if you're looking to shoot an
independent film, maybe should come do it in in Boise.
It's it's hot and dry and people are nice and
we like to deep fries steak like it's a pretty
good time truth be told. Yeah, awesome, boom. We have

(22:12):
one convert that is our that is our mention.

Speaker 4 (22:16):
I'm here in Philadelphia and uh, there was a point
where production fatigue started to kind of sort of set in.
But then you know, all the productions left the Pittsburgh
and now the only thing we have left there's Creed
two is here right now, and that's it. Uha. So
it's like.

Speaker 5 (22:31):
That's so bad that you take it take cream two.

Speaker 4 (22:35):
Yeah, Well, it's just funny because there used to be
so many other things going on here and now there's
like nothing and is just like it has become just
you know, it's you know, the people were, you know,
wondering where all the all the productions went. So apparently
they've all gone to either Pittsburgh or and now as
I find out, boysyadah, Yeah.

Speaker 5 (22:53):
Surprise, we're stealing them from you, you know.

Speaker 4 (22:56):
And I wondered too if there is you know, if
there even is there a film commission in Idaho?

Speaker 5 (23:02):
Like, is there one there is?

Speaker 4 (23:04):
Okay?

Speaker 5 (23:05):
Cool, We tell you almost nothing else about it except
that it exists, but we do have one.

Speaker 3 (23:10):
I think they're waiting for their big their big opportunity.

Speaker 7 (23:13):
La La Land too.

Speaker 5 (23:14):
That could be us.

Speaker 4 (23:15):
Well we see see if I was I mean, I mean,
and and Mike, you know, you you being a you
know a producer on the project. I imagine my my,
my producer hat starts to go off here, and I
imagine there's a lot of empty buildings in in Idaho,
not just around the Boise area. And what I mean
my empty buildings is you know farms, old warehouses, old

(23:36):
uh you know, kind of like dairy silos, all those
types of places. And I kind of wonder, you know,
if they could be utilized more, you know what I mean.

Speaker 5 (23:45):
Sure, maybe not in our movie, but if you need
a good like serial killer film, maybe this is the
good place to do it.

Speaker 7 (23:53):
Well, they absolutely could.

Speaker 3 (23:55):
And the the nice thing too, is like when you
don't have a town that has all the production can
league is people will just open up and they're happy
to have it. The the trick though, and this is
a discussion like when I visited New York, I went
they the city has a like the Mayor's Office for
Film and Television, and they're very big on educating to
so many shows shooting New York. Uh, They're very big

(24:18):
on educating the city about why film is great and
TV is great and how it supports everything.

Speaker 7 (24:24):
And one of the things that they do is they
train a lot.

Speaker 3 (24:27):
Of the the they have a program that trains a
lot of people who want to get involved in the
industry to create the infrastructure there really and yeah, and well,
and that's the challenge with Boise is there's there are
there is a small team people who are willing to
do it, but there's just a small team, sure, you know.
And so we are we're bringing out some crew from
California and we do have the community support and a

(24:49):
lot of people who are very interested in the arts
stepping us out. But the people with the skill sets,
for sure, are.

Speaker 7 (24:55):
There's a there's only so many.

Speaker 3 (24:57):
There's there's so many of them, and there's like they're
either on other projects that you're doing other things. So
you can find these places to shoot, but the project
that you're making still is going to cost somebody because
you have to bring you have to bring do you
have to bring? Yeah, you get to bring in the
support network for it for sure.

Speaker 4 (25:16):
Yeah, and that is true. And but I you know,
I still think you know again that that filming in
in you know, the small towns and stuff like that,
it's always you know, it's it's always an advantage if
you can use it as an advantage. And what I
mean by that is, you know where towns where they're
not actually you know, fatigue from filming, whethery're not, fatigue
for people asking for favors or you know whatever else.

Speaker 7 (25:38):
You know.

Speaker 4 (25:38):
That's why if you do live in Middle America or
even in a small town in in California, whatever, you
can actually because again you know people you know and
you and the people are willing to help you. Because
if you live in a small town, most of the
time you all know each other, you know what I mean. Yeah,
other than living in like New York or LA where
as soon as you walk in you go, hey, hey,
you know, hey, Lily, I want to film in your restaurant.

(25:59):
You'll like just get no, exactly exactly.

Speaker 5 (26:02):
And that was ultimately, I mean, I'm from Boise, So
that's sort of the short reason why we're here for production.
But yeah, just the generosity and just people are so
freaking nice. And you know, when you're poor and you're young,
and this is both of our first feature and you're
starting at I mean, you just need that infrastructure of
support and not even I mean, yes, professional support of

(26:24):
talented people that are willing to work for not a
lot of money on set, but just people that are
willing to bring you food, people that are willing to
house your crew, people that are willing to you know,
we were freaking out. We didn't have our we're prepping
our crowdfunding campaign on seed and Spark, and we realized
like two and a half weeks out that we didn't
have graphics, like we needed a thumbnail for the video,
we need reward stuff. And we were like, oh no.

(26:45):
We're like, okay, well we need to hire someone basically
today who can start work tomorrow. We can't pay them,
and we need them to deliver like a bunch of
stuff in like ten days. And we were like who
could we talk to And we were like, literally, no one,
Like like students aren't going to do that, Like professionals
aren't going to work for free. We were freaking out.
I talked to my dad, Davey Suda, who works like

(27:08):
in marketing. He works in e commerce at a company
that sells meat, but like he's done some stuff and
like sort of the commercial in film space and has
directed and produced and done some stuff like that, but
has done a lot of work in the advertising sphere,
and reached out to his friend Paul Carew, who runs
a local ad agency and was like, hey, Paul, will
you designed for my daughter for free?

Speaker 4 (27:27):
And Paul was like sure, And so.

Speaker 5 (27:28):
We got like a whole team of people to like
do our graphics for literally no pay, you know. And
you're not going to get that in LA, or I'm not.
Maybe if you're maybe, if you had better better friends,
but you're really well connected, you're really if you're not me, basically,
maybe LA would play out for you.

Speaker 4 (27:44):
So better friends. Yeah, I like that.

Speaker 5 (27:50):
Yeah, Michael, get out.

Speaker 4 (27:53):
Yeah, Mike, come on, No, it's true.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
She's literally like she's bringing all the resources to the
project and I'm just kind of coming in and going, yeah,
let's do this.

Speaker 7 (28:02):
Let's not do this.

Speaker 5 (28:04):
He provides moral support, moral support. I like that.

Speaker 4 (28:08):
So let's talk about like love. You know, I'm interested
because you know, I can just tell what you're you're
you know, both you're wearing a lot of different hats
for this project. So you know, you know, Lily, you're
from Boise, so you're shooting it in Boise, Idaho. You know, Mike,
you're you're coming along for the ride, so uh, you know,
and Lily, you wrote this correct, that's correct. And then

(28:29):
and Michael you're directing it, I am yes, And then
now are you both staring in it?

Speaker 5 (28:36):
I am Michael will be making a small appearance as
gas station attendant, but I'm playing the lead role.

Speaker 4 (28:43):
Correct, Okay? Cool? So, so just to talk more about
like love, you know, Lily, since you wrote it, could
you sort of give us the log line or synopsis
about the film?

Speaker 5 (28:53):
Yeah, for sure. So it's heavily inspired by When Harry
Met Sally, as I suppose most romantic comedies are, but
we wanted to take that sort of a step further
and very directly, honor, you know, the interviews of One
Harry Met Sally. For those of you who've seen the film,
you know, and for those of you who don't, I'll
fill you in real fast, you know. So When Harry
Mett Sally is like the classic rom com gout two

(29:13):
friends who eventually fall in love over the course of
like thirteen years or whatever being together. But the backbone
of the story is a series of interviews of like
old sort of crotchety couples telling the stories of how
they met and how they fell in love. And I
love One Harry Met Sally, but I think the.

Speaker 3 (29:29):
Interview the tension of it is that, like, yeah, the
tension of it is is there these two people who
are friends that fall in love, but it's like men
and women can't be be friends because the sex and
the traction always gets in the way, right, And.

Speaker 5 (29:43):
At the end of the movie it turns out that's
true because of course they get together. So the interviews
being all these various elderly couples telling the stories of
how they met, how they fell in love, and I
think the interviews have aged really badly, Like if you
watch them now, they're all of these like sort of
sad stories of where it's.

Speaker 1 (29:59):
Like, we'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
and now back to the show.

Speaker 5 (30:10):
The guy is like, well, I saw this woman and
she was so fine that I just had to have her.
And we'd been married for one hundred years, and you're like,
I don't know if that's like cute, you know, like
and obviously the interviews are intended to be funny, but
they just I don't know, like, if you wanted to
go there, there may be a little bit misogynistic, but
they just reflect I think this very outdated sort of

(30:31):
idea of like love at first sight like, then being
together forever is more important than like being happy or
supporting each other in a meaningful way. So that was
sort of the impetus for the story. So Like Love is,
as we've been pitching it, an anti romantic comedy about
two friends who try to fall in love and can't
and what that then means for their friendships for them individually,

(30:55):
and trying to overcome the can men and women actually
just be friends and have that be a meaning full
prize at the end.

Speaker 3 (31:02):
And it particularly plays on the gender dynamic because it's
from the woman's perspective and how she's not he's into her,
but she's not into him, and what like, like how
she feels precious because she thought she has this really
awesome friend and he wants something more.

Speaker 5 (31:20):
And she doesn't want to jeopardize the friendship and it's
easier for her to try and be in love with
him than for her to tell him that she's just
not interested.

Speaker 4 (31:29):
I say, so the old friend zone I plays I'm
familiar with very very often. No, I'm just kidding, nod, but.

Speaker 5 (31:36):
You're like, I've been there. I feel that I think
we all have.

Speaker 4 (31:39):
So the story of my life. No, but but you know.
So when you were talking about the interviews, Lily, let
me what kind of like I say, I always think
there's there's generation gaps because I think each generation, you know,
they have a different idea of relationships and love and
all these sort of things. And uh, you know, I
fall into the millennial category. I guess are you millennial

(32:03):
or generation why? I don't know or how far are
you on the cutoff?

Speaker 3 (32:06):
We're on the cut We're so we're both like you're
twenty one one, I'm twenty two. Like we're both on
that like cutoff where like I think the New York
Times even had like a whole thing about it where
they're like they ask people our age specifically, are we millennial? Yeah,
because the cutoff is supposed to be like some people
say the cutoff is two thousand and two thousand and one,

(32:26):
and some people are like, no, it's nineteen ninety and that's.

Speaker 5 (32:30):
A significant difference.

Speaker 3 (32:32):
But we're like right in the middle of Like it's
weird because like the Parkland teams that are so big
for their activism or even called gen Z or whatever,
and yeah, yeah, and we're like we're like not that
much older than them, Like they would have been freshman
when we were seniors in high school.

Speaker 5 (32:49):
So unclear. Well, I feel like millennial sounds snappier, so
we'll go with that.

Speaker 7 (32:53):
We're in that.

Speaker 3 (32:53):
Weird middle gap of like I remember what it was
like to play outside and I did that, and I
remember life, but I remember life were cell phones, Yeah,
but definitely we've grown up with them, and for sure
what the expectation that smartphones and all that stuff?

Speaker 5 (33:10):
Sure and online dating and all of that stuff.

Speaker 3 (33:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (33:14):
So I mean I think on what probably like eight
the nine years older than both of you because I'm
I'm thirty one, so it's kind of like I'm, well, yeah,
so basically like about ten years older than you guys.
So I'm kind of like the because I've read somewhere
that that the millennial coff was like nineteen eighty to nineteen,
like ninety two. I think it was, so like I,

(33:35):
you know, I fall into that category there, and I
always sort of go back and I and I see how,
you know, these different generation gaps in this country kind
of view different things because each generation kind of is
a lot different than the one before it. I mean,
you have the you have the the once in the
nineteen forty, which are called the Greatest generation. And then
you have the they gave birth to the Baby Boomers,

(33:56):
and they they were totally different in a lot of
different ways. And then you have the Generation xers, which
you know, which are even more you know, different than
their parents. I mean, it's just you know, I I
don't think there's any country in the world that has
such generation gaps as we do here in America.

Speaker 5 (34:12):
Definitely. And I think, you know, sort of the evolution
of the romantic comedy or just maybe how people see
romance in general is a good time capsule of that
that gap.

Speaker 4 (34:23):
Yes, yeah, And that's why I think with the with
those uh uh interviews, I think that's a good you know,
time capsule to have because I think you know, you're,
you know, you're looking and saying, look, you know this
is you know, they they they dated. I mean, look
look at how finding jobs are so different now, you know.
Back you know, you hear a lot of baby boomers talking,
they go, oh, you know, I asked the old uh
Fred to have the steel mill for a job, and

(34:43):
I got a job. And we're like, what the hell
are you talking about? Like, you know, there's no there's
no steel mills. And and if you go to a
place right now and say hey, can I talk to somebody,
They're gonna say, no, you have to make an appointment,
you have to apply, blah blah blah. Definitely, you know
what I mean. So it's like it's all it's all
so different now. But but that's why, you know, again,
just going back to the generational gaps. But you know

(35:03):
when you're so you're you're on Seed and Spark right now,
or you're going to be on Scene Spark correct, you're
going to be launching.

Speaker 5 (35:10):
We are live as of two days ago. So this
is day or is this day three? This is day three,
day three of our campaign? So we have twenty seven
days to go.

Speaker 4 (35:20):
So, so what are some of the you know, the
things that you've encountered. We're you're playing this crowd funny campaign.
Have you Have you been encountered a lot of you know,
unexpected things that have sort of come up.

Speaker 5 (35:30):
I guess just that it's really hard, Like I would say,
nobody tells you, but everybody tells you that, oh it'll
be really hard, and you're like, oh, but it won't
be that hard, and then you start doing it and
you're like, this is in fact very hard.

Speaker 3 (35:41):
Yes, it's a it's a full time job and en of.

Speaker 5 (35:44):
Itself, but you don't get paid. You hope that other
people pay the campaign. So no, but we have a
great team and like we have a we have a
social media advisor, and our producers have been involved as well.
So you know, again it's pretty early on and we've
made good progress given where we're at, but it's a long,
a long and windy road.

Speaker 4 (36:05):
Ahead of us, i'd imagine. So, so what is your
goal right now?

Speaker 3 (36:10):
We're trying to raise a little over thirty one thousand
dollars and then the.

Speaker 7 (36:16):
Budgets a little bit higher than that.

Speaker 3 (36:17):
We also received a generous grant from the Alexa Rose
Foundation in Idaho sports Idaho based artists.

Speaker 7 (36:23):
Like Lily So uh, but the thirty one thirty one.

Speaker 3 (36:27):
K is the is roughly the goal on the platform.

Speaker 7 (36:30):
Yeah, yeah, on the platform.

Speaker 4 (36:32):
So before the you know, the the launch of this,
I'm sure you know, Marty was probably working with you
on this. So did did you know if there's any
advice you would give to anybody out there? What would
what would it be that you maybe you wish you
would have done differently or you know, maybe just you know,
is it more time, did you wish you have something else?
Is there anything you would have you know that that
you wish you knew that you know now before we launched.

Speaker 3 (36:57):
Well, I mean, you know, it's it's kind of it's
kind of in a way like the pro it's not.
It's similar to the process of preparing for just to
make a movie in general, Like you know, you really
do have to plan, Like there's the crowd funding campaign
has its own separate reproduction. You have to pitch video
that needs to really reflect the movie because people are

(37:20):
watching that and they're expecting and when they see that
that they're going to see what they're going to see
when you make the actual movie.

Speaker 5 (37:25):
Yeah, and visual consistency and fonts and colors and graphics
and all that. You know. I feel like we I
think we did everything we could, which is not to
say we couldn't have done more. You know, again, We're
only three days in and I'm already like, oh my god,
we haven't done enough. But I think it's just giving
yourself time to fully prepare and just really going through

(37:46):
all these specifics with your team, and ultimately I guess
it's about cultivating a cohesive message of like, so what
is the project, why does it matter? And who would
watch it? And Michael and I we had sort of
a turbulent road producers, and so like we've gone through
a lot of stages of pitching the project, of selling
the project of you know, who are we and why
should we tell this?

Speaker 4 (38:06):
And why this story?

Speaker 5 (38:07):
And why now? And I think once you've done that work,
I mean, yes, you need to think about what you're
going to post on Twitter and whatever, but it's more
about that branding of what you're selling is what I
would advise people to think about.

Speaker 3 (38:20):
Yeah, and making sure that your your team in particular,
is very consistent in that message.

Speaker 7 (38:25):
And because you.

Speaker 3 (38:27):
Have your friends and your family who are going to donate,
and that makes up a large part of it. But
then if your movie is geared towards a very specific
audience like ours, which is well, you know, young millennials,
then how do you market a movie to your friends
and family so that they donate, but then also make
that message so that it plays to the people I

(38:49):
would watch your movie?

Speaker 5 (38:50):
Yeah, Like your grandma would probably donate to your movie,
but your grandma is probably not your ideal audience member,
you know.

Speaker 4 (38:58):
I mean, I love my Grandma's don't get me wrng.

Speaker 3 (39:00):
But and then your ideal audience member isn't exactly someone
who's rich and has a lot of money, So how
do you find them?

Speaker 7 (39:06):
Get them?

Speaker 3 (39:06):
And so it's been a costed back and forth of
like where are we going online to find these?

Speaker 5 (39:11):
Yeah, so maybe the point is you should just make
a movie that only really rich people would want to watch.
I think that's your ideal, and then the audience just
takes care of itself, you know.

Speaker 4 (39:23):
I think that is excellent advice. I think just having
rich friends and just saying, hey, this movie will be
for you.

Speaker 7 (39:30):
You know.

Speaker 4 (39:31):
And the weird part is only I, you know, because
I get to talk to so many that one of
the benefits of doing this podcast is I get to
talk to so many different people, not only in America
but also you know, all over the world. And sometimes
it actually happens where somebody has a very rich friend
who bling is a lot of money to projects and
I'm just like, you, son of a bitch? How that hell?

(39:53):
You know, how do can I get that? Because you know,
I'm just some schmuck here in Philly.

Speaker 1 (39:57):
But you know, come on, we'll be right back after
a word from our sponsor and now back to the show.

Speaker 4 (40:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (40:10):
Well, And I think it's also about remembering and I
say this, I'm really bad at implementing it, but in
theory remembering that as an independent filmmaker, especially if you're
if you're like Michael or I, where you're willing to
wear a lot of hats. I mean I can barely
see for all of the hats that I'm wearing. But
you know, where you're wearing a lot of hats, you're
doing a lot of work that you need to love

(40:31):
doing the work because ninety nine percent of the work
is not being on set. It's not being on set,
and it's not shooting the movie, and it's not like
getting a beautiful shot right, it's like you're gonna you're like, hey,
today's the day we're going to hire a production designer,
and that needs to be really interesting to you, or like,
today's the day we're gonna come up with a mock poster,
and that needs to be really exciting to you, because
like that is your that is most of your job.

Speaker 7 (40:53):
It's not out of people, out of people.

Speaker 3 (40:55):
See that yeah, fathe you love doing the work, then
they're more interested in Like you've got to be You've
got to be really open and like vulnerable about everything
that it is you're doing, which is really hard when
you're a filmmaker who's telling a story. Like usually you know,
you're a little cagey because you're putting you're putting art
out into the world, and you know there's a good

(41:16):
chance a lot of people everyone has an opinion about
that's for sure.

Speaker 7 (41:19):
Sure, And but if you're.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
Willing to just like what I've been discovering is you've
just got to be willing to be.

Speaker 7 (41:26):
Very open about it, definite.

Speaker 3 (41:28):
Like when so like we shared like our campaigns, like
our film's tone reel, we're sharing like the actual process
of like the nitty green of power creating race and
it's about you.

Speaker 5 (41:39):
Get Yeah, you get to watch Michael and I eat
like nineteen frozen waffles, which is a pretty good time.
Which in case you were wondering, like, don't eat frozen
waffles when they're warm from the sun, Like, I wouldn't
advise that. It's a terrible idea. So that's the kind
of stuff that you just can't learn in film school.

Speaker 4 (41:59):
I don't want to you don't worry you about the waffles. Yeah,
it's just, uh, some of the things you learn in
FILLM school and some of the things you can't, and
that's one of them. Don't eat don't eat the waffles
that are that? Are that are? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (42:13):
I beg that a T shirt? You can have that.

Speaker 4 (42:16):
Oh, thank you, Lely, thank you. I know we're running
out of time. I know you both have to run,
so I'm going to link to everything in the show
notes everybody. But just in closing, Lily and Michael, is
there anything you want to say to sort of put
a period at the end of this whole conversation.

Speaker 3 (42:35):
Yeah, Well, thank you so much for you know, having
us on the show. It's great just to know the
talk and talk about the project just so other people
can hear about it. And you know, we're happy to
uh if anybody who's listening. I know a lot of
your listeners are very interested in working professionals, and you know,
we're happy to connect and whatever way we can with project,

(42:57):
but also to help them because the reason we the
reason I'm doing this and the reason I'm in film
the generals, because I love working with other people and
tying that into Like Love. I'm very excited about the crew.
We've got a trap young crew, micro budget of ten people, homeless.

Speaker 4 (43:14):
Micro budget, so micro.

Speaker 7 (43:15):
You know, we're all wearing multiple hats.

Speaker 3 (43:17):
And I'm so excited for you, for for everyone to
get to see the work that we're doing.

Speaker 7 (43:22):
And I think, what's what's true about this movie?

Speaker 3 (43:26):
And it becomes a cliche, But you know, we're here
because we value working with each other and we value
the story that we feel like we haven't seen for Yeah,
and Like Love has been.

Speaker 5 (43:37):
Very collaborative, very very collaborative, and I think, you know,
in the spirit of collaboration of working with other people,
I think my takeaway for for listeners or I don't know,
just other people out in the art industry. Like I
was telling Michael, nothing makes you want to be generous
to other people who make art, like desperately asking people
to give you money, Like again, we're only a day

(44:00):
free of our campaign, and you know, I think it's
easy as you know, whether whether you are a working
artist or you're just someone who likes art, you know
that you see other people making stuff and they're like, hey,
like we need extra, Hey, we need five dollars or hey,
and it's kind of like, oh, that's nice, but it's
easy for that to sort of sto the background of
your life and not then it. You owe it to
everyone you meet to give them five dollars or spend
your really to become an extra. But you know, just

(44:21):
little things of there are people in your life or
your community who are writing a play and need a
place to stage it, or if there are people like
you know, I think making art intrinsically requires the help
and support of ours and I think if you're in
a place to support people, you have an oblation to
do so. And I know that's something I was not
very good at before starting this movie, and even on
a very small level. Just like I was at a

(44:43):
play the other night at Homegrown Theater in Boise, and
you know, they were like really looking for people to
help the sponsors, right for five bucks a month, but
you can become a sponsor, And I was like, you
know what, I want to be a sponsor because like
I've spent literally my whole day sending emails trying to
get people to give me five dollars and it is
so hard, and I think, like you at that moment,
I was like, the at least I can do is like,
you know, help them keep the power on so.

Speaker 3 (45:04):
Well, and that's that's what's cool about supporting like love
is like love is being supported by a community like boys. Yeah,
so it's like it so like would people come and
support us. They're supporting Boise general, sure, and you know
we're supporting them in tandem. It's it's a win win
in that way. So it's it's really great to be
a part of a project like that. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (45:24):
So I think to anyone out there, if you can
help us out, that would be awesome. But really, truly,
there's any way we can help anyone out there if
you're looking for advice or help or maybe five dollars.
I have exactly five dollars to give, so hit me up.
You can find us on our site.

Speaker 7 (45:38):
We could give it to ourselves.

Speaker 5 (45:40):
We could give it to ourselves. No, no, this five
dollars is only reserved for someone who's not you, Michael.
So yeah, but Daz, thank you so much for having us.
We really appreciate it. Yeah, if you have any questions
or comments for us, like, feel free to feel free
to let us know.

Speaker 3 (45:55):
And you can find the links to our social and
everything in our seat spark at like clubmovie dot com.

Speaker 5 (46:00):
And that should all be in the show notes.

Speaker 7 (46:01):
So and that will be thank you so much for having.

Speaker 4 (46:05):
Oh no, no, no, no album, No problem, Mike, Mike and
Dully and uh yes everyone, everything will be at the
show notes because I know a lot you know, everybody
died or I'm sorry everyone ingests a podcasts of really
sometimes they're you know, riding in their car, or they're
walking to work, or they're at the gym, so so
they can always check those show notes. That's one thing.
That's one tip I've always learned about podcasts is that

(46:27):
you should if you're are going to give you know,
you know, like links and stuff like that, it's always
you have to you have to do the one two
accommodation of putting them in the show notes because people people,
you know, people are busy. They're not like, oh my god,
I got you know what I mean, it's adestley out
of mine.

Speaker 5 (46:39):
So uh, I don't think I've ever listened to a
podcast not in my car.

Speaker 4 (46:43):
So that is that is sage advice.

Speaker 5 (46:45):
As man I'm going to test to I do like
to text while I am driving the car, but that
is not safe. I would not recommend that, so please
please haul at your motor vehicle before checking the show notes.

Speaker 4 (46:57):
Yeah, don't, don't click and drive, you know, so just
put the phone down. Lilly Michael, I want to say
thank you so much for coming on.

Speaker 5 (47:05):
Thank you so much, Dave, thank you, thank you.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
And I have to give Marty another thank you for
introducing us because it's a great conversation.

Speaker 5 (47:11):
Big shout out to Marty.

Speaker 1 (47:13):
I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
a great job on this episode. If you want to
get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
head over to the show notes at Bulletproof Screenwriting dot tv.
Forward slash for forty three. Thank you so much for listening. Guys,
As always, keep on writing no matter what. I'll talk
to you soon.

Speaker 2 (47:30):
Thanks for listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at Bulletproofscreenwriting
dot tv.